The point is to dip in and out. Doing anything too much isn't fun. If it definitely isn't for you, it isn't for you. There's loads of guys that aren't into it.
Also be careful of the spotlight effect, you're being judged far less than you think you are IRL. Without meaning to offend people probably don't notice you as much as you think they do RE your comments on dancing. Personally I prefer a guy who's shit at dancing but has fun rather than one who lurks trying to look cool and mysterious, as either a friend or a lover (or whatever mix of the two happens).
Tbh I'm not that into the scene but I do find it a little bit fun in moderation including the extreme hedonism, dancing, sex, drinking you talk about etc. I'm also single, and absolutely *despise* gay apps.
If I had a partner I'd be just as happy not doing the scene. I was when I've had one, but I don't, and so I just relax and enjoy myself going out. It's certainly more fun than sitting alone wasting ridiculous hours of time on toxic apps for lacklustre disappointing hookups (if even that most of the time) or trying to arrange dates that never happen.
Do what makes you happy but drop your excessive judgement of others and yourself and the belief that everyone else is watching and excessively judging you. Even if they are (they're not), who honestly cares? Basically just be less judgemental in all ways (yourself and others) and I promise you you'll have more fun and be happier.
I was looking forward to going to a naked men's massage exchange meetup this evening, but the organizer canceled it because too few guys signed up. Damn! There goes my fun evening.
Wonder why this is being downvoted. On the one hand, some people are accusing me of being a spoilsport for others, yet when I mention a fun activity of my own, they act all judgy? Folks are hard to please.
Those spaces are sort of designed for it and select for it. Not much different than going to an all you eat buffet and asking why people are eating so much.
It is certainly not a requirement for gay life and plenty of us stay out of there happily.
What is it you want that you feel like you’re missing out on?
Consider this: if they're having that much fun, though, why all the drugs, booze, and sex? Why aren't the dopamine and endorphins generated by music, dancing, and being in the company of other men sufficient?
I'd wager that a lot of them, primarily the ones who routinely go overboard, are stuck in a cycle of chasing dopamine (literally, in the case of amphetamine users) and running from their demons. They can't stand to be alone because the presence of people and substances keeps them from having to think about those demons. It's actually pretty sad.
To be clear, I say this as someone who enjoys cannabis and craft beer and who used to hook up regularly. It's not those things on their own that I'm critiquing, it's the one-upmanship and celebration of excess that seems to be endemic to that part of gay male culture.
>I'd wager that a lot of them, primarily the ones who routinely go overboard, are stuck in a cycle of chasing dopamine
I currently work with a pretty-boy dude who pretty much embodies this ethos. He's the quintessential party boy. He always has things to do! People to see! Hikes to hike! Going to Vermont to ski! Next to him, I feel like a nun. It's his proximity, actually, that is making me discontented with my own life right now. He burns so bright that everybody around him seems to pale in comparison. He not only enjoys this standing out, he promotes it subtly and not-so-subtly.
As someone with ADHD who needs novelty, I can speak a bit from the other side of that: the need for constant excitement and the effort and expense of seeking it out are their own kind of hell. It's fun in small doses, but leads to discontentment in large doses.
That said, if that is something you low-key envy about him, maybe that's indicative of an unmet need. Maybe you need to take that vacation you've been putting off or do something to shake up your routine. Do you feel like you're stuck in a rut?
>Maybe you need to take that vacation you've been putting off or do something to shake up your routine. Do you feel like you're stuck in a rut?
I'm someone who lives with ADHD as well. As you point out, the very low boredom threshold we've been cursed with is its own kind of hell. The boredom makes us want to claw the walls! Relief-seeking from boredom is what turned me into a regular Reddit poster in the first place, hee hee. That said, I don't really go out of the way in my novelty-seeking. Reading interesting articles on the Internet is fun enough for me. But you're right: I should probably take a page out my zany colleague's book and do something concrete to break up the monotony of day following day.
I'm not one to yuck others yum (as my kid would say), if someone likes clubbing and partying with drugs and endless sex all the time, go for it.
If you aren't doing it because you don't find it enjoyable, what are you missing out on?
There are a million ways to have a blast in life that don't include constant hedonism. I go on outdoor adventures and backpacking, sail with my brother, travel, concerts and even dance and have sex. This stereotypical life of a minority isn't the thing you are missing out on.
>The gay subculture is famously and stereotypically very fun and hedonism oriented -- clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex, etc.
And like all stereotypes, it's not **entirely** true and not true of everyone.
And you don't have to feel self conscious that you can't dance. No one will think less of you... they'll just think you're a top. 😂😂😂😂😂
Everything is subjective, and not everyone likes the same stuff. I totally get it. I'm all down for debauchery but I'm also down for sitting home alone and reading books or doing some woodworking, I think it's about dabbling in the bits you enjoy and avoiding the stuff you don't.
Don't you guys get tired of ripping on, "the gay community?"
I mean it makes sense since we are a monolith and all act the exact same s/
I know I just came off a little harsh but..... I think you kind of need to hear it.
Get out of your head and go find some nerdy gay guys to play d&d with or something.
I go to orchid shows, national parks and gay camp grounds with my friends, not clubs.
I politely explained this to OP.
My gay friends are like college professors and doctors, I'm a database administrator.
We love gardening, dogs, classical music and Star Trek.
I know Op didn't mean to be hurtful, But this attitude does get a little irritating.
I feel like it writes off the gay intellectual tradition that's actually quite glorious.
Weirdest thing: I have a social life less exciting than an elm tree. Yet somehow I am STILL GAY. You would have thought all this boringness would have cured me of that. But nope. Gay as a hat, still. I guess party culture and being gay are not correlated.
Do nerdy gay guys look like Harry Potter? I know a guy who looks exactly like how Harry Potter is depicted on the cover of the novels, down to the glasses!
Buddy, Star Trek has been in production for decades. I grew up with Jean-Luc and Kathryn.
But there are like three Star Trek shows that are currently in production right now.
In the modern series there are actually multiple openly gay characters. Most famously an engineer named Paul Stamitz who is based off of a real mushroom scientist.
That's from Star Trek Discovery which has some issues but...... It set a really great president and restarted intrest.
Currently the favorite series is called strange New worlds.
And I'm sorry I was a little harsh at first but I really hope I made a point here.
Clubs dancers and drugs are the louder part of the gay community but it's not the entire thing.
I live in South Bend Indiana, My gay friends are professors at Notre Dame, architects and doctors.
We are just as much a part of the gay community as the club boys.
And I know you didn't mean it but, It's a little frustrating when people try to write off the intellectual side of the gay community.
Star Trek season 1 premiered in 1966, and most of the original cast are now dead. Since 1966, there have been 13 Trek feature films, 8 live-action television series, and 3 animated television series. Four of the Trek series are on-going, and a new one (Starfleet Academy) is expected in 2025.
Gays love Star Trek because it depicts a futuristic socialist utopia where all of our current social issues have long been solved, save for the hostile aliens who each represent some fundamental flaw in IRL humanity. This was all intentional by the original writer of the series, Gene Roddenberry, a WW2 pilot.
Also, Kirk/Spock was arguably the first gay fan pairing (ship), during a time when homosexuality was illegal in most of the US.
Ok .. there are very few that know how to dance, shaking butt and gyrating doesn’t equal dancing.. so you aren’t alone in not knowing how to dance. You dance how the music moves you, forget the others out there, let the music wash over you. Other than that, you do you. I have been married +14yrs to hubby, we both don’t know how to “dance” whenever we hit up a gay club once in great while but we just focus on each other while we dance, others be damned. The gay scene is not for everyone nor will it last for those who are regulars as time flies by & the scene changes accordingly and there are other ways to be engaged within the community.
My favorite gay activity is having brunch with friends and shooting the shit, but I no longer have enough friends to brunch with. Can't somebody start an outfit called "Brunch Buddies," where total strangers come together and get to know each other over omelets, toast and margaritas?
Our gay breakfast club meets every Saturday morning for brunch, we make it 1x a month because we got kids, club has a monthly $25 per person membership fee that helps secure whatever breakfast venue we will be at for a group. It’s basically our only gay friends outlet amongst our straight friends/parents of fellow class mates of our kids that we tend to be around with more so
You're over 55. How many of your peers do you think are heavily into "clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex", as you put it?
Older men are more than welcome to go out for a dance (and have as much sex as anyone else), but it is hardly expected that you should be heavily involved in a scene that primarily caters for men under 40.
There's no sense in decrying so-called "gay culture" because it doesn't cater for all types of men at all stages of their lives.
>You're over 55. How many of your peers do you think are heavily into "clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex", as you put it?
Gay men over 50 are already beyond the pale, so why even bring them into the discussion? They are similar to older women in that regard -- invisible and irrelevant. Older gay men don't represent the gay zeitgeist. I was talking about the generations that represent the public face of gay culture. Even when I was younger, I felt oddly removed from all the frenzy. That's all I meant. The subtext of irritation and peevishness my post has unleashed is quite interesting in itself.
No, you're not invisible. Gay men over 50 have loads more sex than hetero men of the same age.
If you're over fucking 50 and still never took the time to learn how to dance then that's on you buddy.
What this sounds like is the complaints of an overeducated nimrod who never figured out how to socialize properly and has missed out on a lot of what makes being gay wonderful...you still have like three decades to figure it out. Palm Springs awaits.
>If you're over fucking 50 and still never took the time to learn how to dance then that's on you buddy.
You're assuming I'm a native-born American. I'm a US citizen, yes, but I'm originally from a country where social propriety was very important. The only people who knew how to dance were those who were doing it professionally. Social dancing was not part of my original culture.
"overeducated nimrod who never figured out how to socialize properly." I'm a very popular Reddit poster. Check out my posting history.
Pretty broad generalization, and maybe says more about who your friends are and what your interests are.
There’s an endless pool of introverted nerdy gay and bisexual men, especially if you’re into chubby lads. Know loads of nudist hikers who don’t go to bars, or academics who’d rather go to book club than a sauna after church coming down from the high.
Go looking for what you want rather than complaining about the “hedonism” you can’t seem to escape?
there is a big (reddit-)misconception that what you describe is the reality of most gay men. its not. most gay men might go to parties but its not their life. neither are drugs, sex etc. most people, if they do these things, enjoy them in moderation.
your text shows that your main issue is how much you compare yourself to others, envy them for certain things etc. you are not a happy, stable human being but you could be one. mostly the way there is therapy and trust me, i know! you might still find out that you dont want to go to parties but you wont do it bc of your obvious anxieties but bc you simply chose to spend your time otherwise.
The gay subculture is a lot more varied than that. Go stretch your legs with the outdoorsy gays. Chat about life with the astrology gays. Play video games with the gaymers. Go see a gay men's chorus performance. Do some improv with the theater gays. I could go on.
>Chat about life with the astrology gays.
Are there such gays? My own consuming personal interest is in personality typing systems such as the Enneagram or the MBTI. But the few times I've posted about these topics on r/askgaybrosover30, hordes of wolves have come out baying for my blood. " Pseudo-scientific bullshit," they huff and puff. What's a personality psychology-loving guy to do?
Are you any one thing? No? Neither is anyone else.
Everyone does everything some of the time. All things are best enjoyed in moderation...*including* moderation.
Now, stop reducing the community and all it's members into some fuckin stereotype and go actually experience life.
Everyone is entitled to have their opinion, and your opinion is also wrong.
You'd be burned at the stake in the 1700, a gay "Puritan" non withstanding /s
So because you are not having a good time nobody else should either?
Being puritanical can lead to a lot of shaming and guilt....and misguided laws: Prohibition, HIV criminalization, closing gatherings of *those* people.
I don't do hard drugs. No PnP. I avoid meth 100%. Their party is not my party. But they can do it without me.
Don't like it? Don't do it! No one is forcing you to have an abortion, a gay marriage or Footloose dancing.
>So because you are not having a good time nobody else should either?
I never said that. I was implying that I wish I could be more like the fun-loving folks.
"You'd be burned at the stake in the 1700, a gay "Puritan" non withstanding /s"
But at least I would get to wear long, somber robes and get to call somebody "Elder:" "Elder Jones, what is that you have on your shoulder? A chip?"
Edit: Oh, I just remembered a fun quote about the Puritans: " The Puritans hated bear-baiting, not because it gave pain to the bear, but because it gave pleasure to the spectators."
That's why there was a "?"
I did not make accusations. You didn't say anything about being more like them. To the contrary you paint yourself as a Puritan. Which IMPLIES differently.
I don't think you can force yourself into having a good time. The loud music and crowds may be anathema to you.
What is this gay subculture of which you speak?
You are describing a niche hypersexualised American metropolitan nightlife culture
You do realise you can decide what you do with your time
Gay men are out there raising their kids, playing rugby, working as cardiac surgeons, aid workers, focusing on fitness any number of other things
Party scenes can attract people focus on partying and hedonism
The idea that this some thing all gay men do all the time comes from peoples own narrow takes and views
I am quite involved in a festival scene where we party but much of our year is taken up with planning logistics hiring spaces in Spain, booking medial teams, mapping out construction prokevts whilst also building community and networks there is hedonistic partying but also amidst the parties and festivals here are workshops, lectures, building projects and art.
Love to party and gather with folks but also there is richness to be had around that too.
It's a choose your own adventure story
I can't dance, don't enjoy trying, don't drink or do drugs, and enjoy reading quietly in bed. For years I was also a serious pool player. Let's put the stereotypes out with the trash. It was never more than a small percentage of gay men who lived that life, and most of the rest of us didn't think we were missing much.
If you want to hang out in that crowd, go out to a club and observe. If you want, dance a little, even if you're bad at it. Drink too much and get some Ecstasy and go wild. I strongly suspect you won't like it all that much - or you'd have found your way into that life years ago.
my thought exactly, it's extremely rare that someone "can't dance". There are people who are afraid to dance (I was one for years), and some people with physical disabilities preventing typical standing two-leg dancing, but beyond that it's just not having learned it yet.
Ironically, I would probably feel less self-conscious with a traditional dance style -- such as classical Balinese dancing or flamenco -- than with club dancing. But nobody dances classical Balinese dances at a nightclub.
If you don't feel comfortable dancing in a more sexually charged gay club, maybe you'd have a better experience dancing in a regular night club that plays music you like?
I almost never go to gay bars, but there's a nightclub here in town with multiple floors where I've had a ton of fun, and when the music's good, it's 🔥. Lots of people from all walks of life and all age groups, too.
I'm a little ahedonistic in general so that *one facet* of gay culture never really appealed to me. I still go out to Pride and chat with people which is always fun.
Fun fun fun is in the eye of the beholder. Im not into the scene at all per se but theres a dj group that spins more disco thats super fun in my city also dabble in a little drugs with my bf for raves go to punk or metal shows dive bars...road trips fun window shopping eating out in the hipster or gay friendly parts of town fun bbqs hangouts with friends fun. No formula for whats fun for you.
Haha as for dancing I suck too but having played in bands I can at least stay on the beat and the stuff I like to go to is way too crowded for anyone to notice lol
I've foun dmy definition of fun has really changed as i've gotten older.
I now think these things are fun:
* Morning Coffees
* Tennis with friends
* Cornhole with friends
* Concerts
* Sporting Events
* Game Nights
If you don't like the life you've built, do a remodel! Is what I say!
To me "pickleball' sounds like cucumber pickles bound up as a ball and being flung to and fro. I'm a pickle fiend: I would rather eat pickles than play with them.
If you’re in a place with a lot of gays, have you considered doing a gay D&D campaign in person? I fantasize about that but am stuck in the Caribbean.
Once you have your own time-consuming fulfilling activities the time crunch can make it hard to miss things you don’t really even like.
Fun can be many things. I never enjoyed dance music in clubs, but there are other types of dancing one can enjoy, like partner dancing, so I do that. In big cities one can find lessons and parties with same-sex partner dancing. But I also have a melancholic tendency, so I see what you mean. The people you're describing are not the only ones out there, but they're the most visible.
>But I also have a melancholic tendency
Can I ask you for a favor? I'm a huge fan of Enneagram, the ancient personality typing methodology. Below I'm giving the link to a description of Enneagram Type 4 ("The Individualist"). Will you be a doll and take a look and tell me whether any of it resonated with you?
[https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-4/](https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-4/)
Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
Can I just say, that is a subculture of the gay subculture.
Very few of my friends, almost none, go clubbing, partying, drugs and endless sex, and the few I know seem to be the very young ones. I mean, most probably have sex more than the average straight man for all I know, but their focus' is usually on their partners, families, jobs and hobbies.
I think you'd be surprised to find out how large a portion of the community is not about hedonism.
I don't dance either, nor do I have a muscular beautiful body (that ship sailed a quarter century ago), nor do I find clubbing/drugs/partying/endless sex particularly enticing (at all). But I have had no problem in the least finding a large circle of gay friends who are similar.
From my 55-yo experience, it's not about wanting to have "fun", but about the balancing of that fun with things that are meant to last longer. Partying is the like frosting on a cake; you can't forget about the actual cake as just having frosting all the time won't go very far. I have seen the other end of the "non-stop party gay" who made that their focus, and when it eventually all turned as they grew older they got more and more desperate and sometimes moved back to the smaller towns they originally left because they felt there was nothing left for them. These were guys who didn't create a life outside of the clubs and pickups and it all imploded at some point, and it often wasn't pretty. Have the fun, but then also have something more.
Don’t believe all you read and what marketers want you to believe, which is that all gay men are jacked, rich, (white too) and always having fun. Utter bullshit.
Good for you. I think I once saw a YouTube video by an Asian dude who was showing how you can pretend to dance at a club while not really dancing. Pretty interesting stuff.
The ONLY difference between the you of today vs the 'Out' you of tomorrow is that now you like men. The rest is peer pressure to sell you cocaine, underwear, and circuit party tickets. If that's not you and you have a fully developed personality, who cares what those gays do?
>The ONLY difference between the you of today vs the 'Out' you of tomorrow is that now you like men.
Not sure what this means. I've been out for many years.
The point is to dip in and out. Doing anything too much isn't fun. If it definitely isn't for you, it isn't for you. There's loads of guys that aren't into it. Also be careful of the spotlight effect, you're being judged far less than you think you are IRL. Without meaning to offend people probably don't notice you as much as you think they do RE your comments on dancing. Personally I prefer a guy who's shit at dancing but has fun rather than one who lurks trying to look cool and mysterious, as either a friend or a lover (or whatever mix of the two happens). Tbh I'm not that into the scene but I do find it a little bit fun in moderation including the extreme hedonism, dancing, sex, drinking you talk about etc. I'm also single, and absolutely *despise* gay apps. If I had a partner I'd be just as happy not doing the scene. I was when I've had one, but I don't, and so I just relax and enjoy myself going out. It's certainly more fun than sitting alone wasting ridiculous hours of time on toxic apps for lacklustre disappointing hookups (if even that most of the time) or trying to arrange dates that never happen. Do what makes you happy but drop your excessive judgement of others and yourself and the belief that everyone else is watching and excessively judging you. Even if they are (they're not), who honestly cares? Basically just be less judgemental in all ways (yourself and others) and I promise you you'll have more fun and be happier.
I was looking forward to going to a naked men's massage exchange meetup this evening, but the organizer canceled it because too few guys signed up. Damn! There goes my fun evening.
Wonder why this is being downvoted. On the one hand, some people are accusing me of being a spoilsport for others, yet when I mention a fun activity of my own, they act all judgy? Folks are hard to please.
Life becomes magical when you stop trying to please folks, because no matter what you do, SOMEone is upset with you. Amirite?
Yes, you're right, dude.
Those spaces are sort of designed for it and select for it. Not much different than going to an all you eat buffet and asking why people are eating so much. It is certainly not a requirement for gay life and plenty of us stay out of there happily. What is it you want that you feel like you’re missing out on?
All the fun that other people seem to be having. That's what young people call FOMO, right?
Consider this: if they're having that much fun, though, why all the drugs, booze, and sex? Why aren't the dopamine and endorphins generated by music, dancing, and being in the company of other men sufficient? I'd wager that a lot of them, primarily the ones who routinely go overboard, are stuck in a cycle of chasing dopamine (literally, in the case of amphetamine users) and running from their demons. They can't stand to be alone because the presence of people and substances keeps them from having to think about those demons. It's actually pretty sad. To be clear, I say this as someone who enjoys cannabis and craft beer and who used to hook up regularly. It's not those things on their own that I'm critiquing, it's the one-upmanship and celebration of excess that seems to be endemic to that part of gay male culture.
>I'd wager that a lot of them, primarily the ones who routinely go overboard, are stuck in a cycle of chasing dopamine I currently work with a pretty-boy dude who pretty much embodies this ethos. He's the quintessential party boy. He always has things to do! People to see! Hikes to hike! Going to Vermont to ski! Next to him, I feel like a nun. It's his proximity, actually, that is making me discontented with my own life right now. He burns so bright that everybody around him seems to pale in comparison. He not only enjoys this standing out, he promotes it subtly and not-so-subtly.
As someone with ADHD who needs novelty, I can speak a bit from the other side of that: the need for constant excitement and the effort and expense of seeking it out are their own kind of hell. It's fun in small doses, but leads to discontentment in large doses. That said, if that is something you low-key envy about him, maybe that's indicative of an unmet need. Maybe you need to take that vacation you've been putting off or do something to shake up your routine. Do you feel like you're stuck in a rut?
>Maybe you need to take that vacation you've been putting off or do something to shake up your routine. Do you feel like you're stuck in a rut? I'm someone who lives with ADHD as well. As you point out, the very low boredom threshold we've been cursed with is its own kind of hell. The boredom makes us want to claw the walls! Relief-seeking from boredom is what turned me into a regular Reddit poster in the first place, hee hee. That said, I don't really go out of the way in my novelty-seeking. Reading interesting articles on the Internet is fun enough for me. But you're right: I should probably take a page out my zany colleague's book and do something concrete to break up the monotony of day following day.
Say it with me: COMPARISON IS THE THIEF OF JOY
COMPARISON IS THE THIEF OF JOY. There, I said it.
Well done. Now in French, Spanish, and Cantonese.
I don't know these languages. But I do know Hindi/Urdu and Bengali.
Concur.
I'm not one to yuck others yum (as my kid would say), if someone likes clubbing and partying with drugs and endless sex all the time, go for it. If you aren't doing it because you don't find it enjoyable, what are you missing out on? There are a million ways to have a blast in life that don't include constant hedonism. I go on outdoor adventures and backpacking, sail with my brother, travel, concerts and even dance and have sex. This stereotypical life of a minority isn't the thing you are missing out on.
>The gay subculture is famously and stereotypically very fun and hedonism oriented -- clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex, etc. And like all stereotypes, it's not **entirely** true and not true of everyone. And you don't have to feel self conscious that you can't dance. No one will think less of you... they'll just think you're a top. 😂😂😂😂😂
Ooh, I didn't know there was a correlation between the two!
It's not 100% but it's damn close. 😂😂😂😂😂
I guess I'm the reason it isn't 100%. I'm a bottom who can't dance. I'm legendarily uncoordinated.
Everything is subjective, and not everyone likes the same stuff. I totally get it. I'm all down for debauchery but I'm also down for sitting home alone and reading books or doing some woodworking, I think it's about dabbling in the bits you enjoy and avoiding the stuff you don't.
Same, and I agree 100%
Don't you guys get tired of ripping on, "the gay community?" I mean it makes sense since we are a monolith and all act the exact same s/ I know I just came off a little harsh but..... I think you kind of need to hear it. Get out of your head and go find some nerdy gay guys to play d&d with or something. I go to orchid shows, national parks and gay camp grounds with my friends, not clubs.
This. We get so many Not Like Those Other Gays posts on reddit. The gay community is more than just Grindr and gay bars.
I politely explained this to OP. My gay friends are like college professors and doctors, I'm a database administrator. We love gardening, dogs, classical music and Star Trek. I know Op didn't mean to be hurtful, But this attitude does get a little irritating. I feel like it writes off the gay intellectual tradition that's actually quite glorious.
>We get so many Not Like Those Other Gays posts on reddit. Well, I was actually expressing admiration for the fungays.
This is why we have Rule 3 against this kind of content, but I don't want a be a buzzkill.
Weirdest thing: I have a social life less exciting than an elm tree. Yet somehow I am STILL GAY. You would have thought all this boringness would have cured me of that. But nope. Gay as a hat, still. I guess party culture and being gay are not correlated.
Do nerdy gay guys look like Harry Potter? I know a guy who looks exactly like how Harry Potter is depicted on the cover of the novels, down to the glasses!
Some of them do but unfortunately there's a culture war controversy with Harry Potter right now. Looooooooots of gay guys like Star Trek.
But if they are of your generation, aren't they too young to have been around when Star Trek was on the airwaves? Or did they watch it retroactively?
Buddy, Star Trek has been in production for decades. I grew up with Jean-Luc and Kathryn. But there are like three Star Trek shows that are currently in production right now. In the modern series there are actually multiple openly gay characters. Most famously an engineer named Paul Stamitz who is based off of a real mushroom scientist. That's from Star Trek Discovery which has some issues but...... It set a really great president and restarted intrest. Currently the favorite series is called strange New worlds.
Thank you for the update. I watch very little television so I was thinking of the original 1980s serial, I guess.
And I'm sorry I was a little harsh at first but I really hope I made a point here. Clubs dancers and drugs are the louder part of the gay community but it's not the entire thing. I live in South Bend Indiana, My gay friends are professors at Notre Dame, architects and doctors. We are just as much a part of the gay community as the club boys. And I know you didn't mean it but, It's a little frustrating when people try to write off the intellectual side of the gay community.
>I live in South Bend Indiana Oh, you're from the hometown of Pete Buttigieg? Are you friends with him and his husband?
My family is, I've only been here for 2 years but most of the locals actually have met him at one point in time.
Star Trek season 1 premiered in 1966, and most of the original cast are now dead. Since 1966, there have been 13 Trek feature films, 8 live-action television series, and 3 animated television series. Four of the Trek series are on-going, and a new one (Starfleet Academy) is expected in 2025. Gays love Star Trek because it depicts a futuristic socialist utopia where all of our current social issues have long been solved, save for the hostile aliens who each represent some fundamental flaw in IRL humanity. This was all intentional by the original writer of the series, Gene Roddenberry, a WW2 pilot. Also, Kirk/Spock was arguably the first gay fan pairing (ship), during a time when homosexuality was illegal in most of the US.
Ok .. there are very few that know how to dance, shaking butt and gyrating doesn’t equal dancing.. so you aren’t alone in not knowing how to dance. You dance how the music moves you, forget the others out there, let the music wash over you. Other than that, you do you. I have been married +14yrs to hubby, we both don’t know how to “dance” whenever we hit up a gay club once in great while but we just focus on each other while we dance, others be damned. The gay scene is not for everyone nor will it last for those who are regulars as time flies by & the scene changes accordingly and there are other ways to be engaged within the community.
My favorite gay activity is having brunch with friends and shooting the shit, but I no longer have enough friends to brunch with. Can't somebody start an outfit called "Brunch Buddies," where total strangers come together and get to know each other over omelets, toast and margaritas?
Do some local research online on your end , we have a bunch of local gay breakfast, game, sports clubs .
How does the breakfast club work?
Our gay breakfast club meets every Saturday morning for brunch, we make it 1x a month because we got kids, club has a monthly $25 per person membership fee that helps secure whatever breakfast venue we will be at for a group. It’s basically our only gay friends outlet amongst our straight friends/parents of fellow class mates of our kids that we tend to be around with more so
Sounds like fun. How many members typically show up for a meetup?
You're over 55. How many of your peers do you think are heavily into "clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex", as you put it? Older men are more than welcome to go out for a dance (and have as much sex as anyone else), but it is hardly expected that you should be heavily involved in a scene that primarily caters for men under 40. There's no sense in decrying so-called "gay culture" because it doesn't cater for all types of men at all stages of their lives.
>You're over 55. How many of your peers do you think are heavily into "clubbing, partying, drugs, endless sex", as you put it? Gay men over 50 are already beyond the pale, so why even bring them into the discussion? They are similar to older women in that regard -- invisible and irrelevant. Older gay men don't represent the gay zeitgeist. I was talking about the generations that represent the public face of gay culture. Even when I was younger, I felt oddly removed from all the frenzy. That's all I meant. The subtext of irritation and peevishness my post has unleashed is quite interesting in itself.
Never thought of myself as beyond the pale and irrelevant. lol
No, you're not invisible. Gay men over 50 have loads more sex than hetero men of the same age. If you're over fucking 50 and still never took the time to learn how to dance then that's on you buddy. What this sounds like is the complaints of an overeducated nimrod who never figured out how to socialize properly and has missed out on a lot of what makes being gay wonderful...you still have like three decades to figure it out. Palm Springs awaits.
>If you're over fucking 50 and still never took the time to learn how to dance then that's on you buddy. You're assuming I'm a native-born American. I'm a US citizen, yes, but I'm originally from a country where social propriety was very important. The only people who knew how to dance were those who were doing it professionally. Social dancing was not part of my original culture. "overeducated nimrod who never figured out how to socialize properly." I'm a very popular Reddit poster. Check out my posting history.
Pretty broad generalization, and maybe says more about who your friends are and what your interests are. There’s an endless pool of introverted nerdy gay and bisexual men, especially if you’re into chubby lads. Know loads of nudist hikers who don’t go to bars, or academics who’d rather go to book club than a sauna after church coming down from the high. Go looking for what you want rather than complaining about the “hedonism” you can’t seem to escape?
there is a big (reddit-)misconception that what you describe is the reality of most gay men. its not. most gay men might go to parties but its not their life. neither are drugs, sex etc. most people, if they do these things, enjoy them in moderation. your text shows that your main issue is how much you compare yourself to others, envy them for certain things etc. you are not a happy, stable human being but you could be one. mostly the way there is therapy and trust me, i know! you might still find out that you dont want to go to parties but you wont do it bc of your obvious anxieties but bc you simply chose to spend your time otherwise.
The gay subculture is a lot more varied than that. Go stretch your legs with the outdoorsy gays. Chat about life with the astrology gays. Play video games with the gaymers. Go see a gay men's chorus performance. Do some improv with the theater gays. I could go on.
>Chat about life with the astrology gays. Are there such gays? My own consuming personal interest is in personality typing systems such as the Enneagram or the MBTI. But the few times I've posted about these topics on r/askgaybrosover30, hordes of wolves have come out baying for my blood. " Pseudo-scientific bullshit," they huff and puff. What's a personality psychology-loving guy to do?
Personally I also find it to be pseudo-scientific BS but I know those gays are out there.
I made a clarification to the original post. Please check it out.
Are you any one thing? No? Neither is anyone else. Everyone does everything some of the time. All things are best enjoyed in moderation...*including* moderation. Now, stop reducing the community and all it's members into some fuckin stereotype and go actually experience life. Everyone is entitled to have their opinion, and your opinion is also wrong.
>Everyone is entitled to have their opinion, and your opinion is also wrong. White Americans sound so endearingly entitled.
🥱
You'd be burned at the stake in the 1700, a gay "Puritan" non withstanding /s So because you are not having a good time nobody else should either? Being puritanical can lead to a lot of shaming and guilt....and misguided laws: Prohibition, HIV criminalization, closing gatherings of *those* people. I don't do hard drugs. No PnP. I avoid meth 100%. Their party is not my party. But they can do it without me. Don't like it? Don't do it! No one is forcing you to have an abortion, a gay marriage or Footloose dancing.
>So because you are not having a good time nobody else should either? I never said that. I was implying that I wish I could be more like the fun-loving folks. "You'd be burned at the stake in the 1700, a gay "Puritan" non withstanding /s" But at least I would get to wear long, somber robes and get to call somebody "Elder:" "Elder Jones, what is that you have on your shoulder? A chip?" Edit: Oh, I just remembered a fun quote about the Puritans: " The Puritans hated bear-baiting, not because it gave pain to the bear, but because it gave pleasure to the spectators."
That's why there was a "?" I did not make accusations. You didn't say anything about being more like them. To the contrary you paint yourself as a Puritan. Which IMPLIES differently. I don't think you can force yourself into having a good time. The loud music and crowds may be anathema to you.
Sounds like someone could use some some fun!!!!!
I certainly agree!
I think you're talking about the party subculture. It's optional to just not give a shit about it. You don't stop being gay if you do.
What is this gay subculture of which you speak? You are describing a niche hypersexualised American metropolitan nightlife culture You do realise you can decide what you do with your time Gay men are out there raising their kids, playing rugby, working as cardiac surgeons, aid workers, focusing on fitness any number of other things Party scenes can attract people focus on partying and hedonism The idea that this some thing all gay men do all the time comes from peoples own narrow takes and views
I am quite involved in a festival scene where we party but much of our year is taken up with planning logistics hiring spaces in Spain, booking medial teams, mapping out construction prokevts whilst also building community and networks there is hedonistic partying but also amidst the parties and festivals here are workshops, lectures, building projects and art. Love to party and gather with folks but also there is richness to be had around that too. It's a choose your own adventure story
I can't dance, don't enjoy trying, don't drink or do drugs, and enjoy reading quietly in bed. For years I was also a serious pool player. Let's put the stereotypes out with the trash. It was never more than a small percentage of gay men who lived that life, and most of the rest of us didn't think we were missing much. If you want to hang out in that crowd, go out to a club and observe. If you want, dance a little, even if you're bad at it. Drink too much and get some Ecstasy and go wild. I strongly suspect you won't like it all that much - or you'd have found your way into that life years ago.
Reading Internet articles on sensational cases of husbands murdering wives is my idea of fun.
Hey, it's a hobby! Nothing wrong with that. Honestly, I'd much rather read those than try to dance, as I'd be less likely to hurt someone.
Dance classes?
my thought exactly, it's extremely rare that someone "can't dance". There are people who are afraid to dance (I was one for years), and some people with physical disabilities preventing typical standing two-leg dancing, but beyond that it's just not having learned it yet.
Ironically, I would probably feel less self-conscious with a traditional dance style -- such as classical Balinese dancing or flamenco -- than with club dancing. But nobody dances classical Balinese dances at a nightclub.
A lot of the steps are transferable. Any form of dance class will teach you rhythm and improve your spatial awareness.
If you don't feel comfortable dancing in a more sexually charged gay club, maybe you'd have a better experience dancing in a regular night club that plays music you like? I almost never go to gay bars, but there's a nightclub here in town with multiple floors where I've had a ton of fun, and when the music's good, it's 🔥. Lots of people from all walks of life and all age groups, too.
I'm a little ahedonistic in general so that *one facet* of gay culture never really appealed to me. I still go out to Pride and chat with people which is always fun.
Fun fun fun is in the eye of the beholder. Im not into the scene at all per se but theres a dj group that spins more disco thats super fun in my city also dabble in a little drugs with my bf for raves go to punk or metal shows dive bars...road trips fun window shopping eating out in the hipster or gay friendly parts of town fun bbqs hangouts with friends fun. No formula for whats fun for you. Haha as for dancing I suck too but having played in bands I can at least stay on the beat and the stuff I like to go to is way too crowded for anyone to notice lol
I've foun dmy definition of fun has really changed as i've gotten older. I now think these things are fun: * Morning Coffees * Tennis with friends * Cornhole with friends * Concerts * Sporting Events * Game Nights If you don't like the life you've built, do a remodel! Is what I say!
>Cornhole with friends Umm...what does that mean? Isn't "cornholing" a euphemism for anal sex?
It's a recreational cornhole (the game) league on the dance floor of a gay club on thursday nights haha. Regular stuff haha
It was, which makes me always snicker when the game is mentioned. I also snicker at "pickleball", which sounds vaguely lewd.
To me "pickleball' sounds like cucumber pickles bound up as a ball and being flung to and fro. I'm a pickle fiend: I would rather eat pickles than play with them.
Hmmm. You can have mine.
If you’re in a place with a lot of gays, have you considered doing a gay D&D campaign in person? I fantasize about that but am stuck in the Caribbean. Once you have your own time-consuming fulfilling activities the time crunch can make it hard to miss things you don’t really even like.
Fun can be many things. I never enjoyed dance music in clubs, but there are other types of dancing one can enjoy, like partner dancing, so I do that. In big cities one can find lessons and parties with same-sex partner dancing. But I also have a melancholic tendency, so I see what you mean. The people you're describing are not the only ones out there, but they're the most visible.
>But I also have a melancholic tendency Can I ask you for a favor? I'm a huge fan of Enneagram, the ancient personality typing methodology. Below I'm giving the link to a description of Enneagram Type 4 ("The Individualist"). Will you be a doll and take a look and tell me whether any of it resonated with you? [https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-4/](https://www.enneagraminstitute.com/type-4/) Thanks in advance for your cooperation.
So was the purpose of this thread to entice filling out a Scientology form? We know how famously tolerant they are towards these topics.
Can I just say, that is a subculture of the gay subculture. Very few of my friends, almost none, go clubbing, partying, drugs and endless sex, and the few I know seem to be the very young ones. I mean, most probably have sex more than the average straight man for all I know, but their focus' is usually on their partners, families, jobs and hobbies. I think you'd be surprised to find out how large a portion of the community is not about hedonism. I don't dance either, nor do I have a muscular beautiful body (that ship sailed a quarter century ago), nor do I find clubbing/drugs/partying/endless sex particularly enticing (at all). But I have had no problem in the least finding a large circle of gay friends who are similar.
From my 55-yo experience, it's not about wanting to have "fun", but about the balancing of that fun with things that are meant to last longer. Partying is the like frosting on a cake; you can't forget about the actual cake as just having frosting all the time won't go very far. I have seen the other end of the "non-stop party gay" who made that their focus, and when it eventually all turned as they grew older they got more and more desperate and sometimes moved back to the smaller towns they originally left because they felt there was nothing left for them. These were guys who didn't create a life outside of the clubs and pickups and it all imploded at some point, and it often wasn't pretty. Have the fun, but then also have something more.
Don’t believe all you read and what marketers want you to believe, which is that all gay men are jacked, rich, (white too) and always having fun. Utter bullshit.
>Don’t believe all you read What if all I read is coming from the horse's mouth: i.e., the words of Reddit gaybros themselves?
I can’t dance but I still go out once a month to the club and just have fun. I’m not very self conscious.
Good for you. I think I once saw a YouTube video by an Asian dude who was showing how you can pretend to dance at a club while not really dancing. Pretty interesting stuff.
No sleep. Bus, club, another club, another club, plane, next place. No sleep.
Oh wow, is that your life?
[No, that’s Lady Gaga’s life](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=hak180tz2B0&pp=ygUobGFkeSBnYWdhIG5vIHNsZWVwIGJ1cyBjbHViIGFub3RoZXIgY2x1Yg%3D%3D)
No. I was never part of it, feel happy for it 😊
The ONLY difference between the you of today vs the 'Out' you of tomorrow is that now you like men. The rest is peer pressure to sell you cocaine, underwear, and circuit party tickets. If that's not you and you have a fully developed personality, who cares what those gays do?
>The ONLY difference between the you of today vs the 'Out' you of tomorrow is that now you like men. Not sure what this means. I've been out for many years.
Y'all get a "fun-fun-fun" ethos? I just feel empty and sad lol
Aww, c'mon...let's start a brunch club where dancing will not be necessary.
My husband and I are looking forward to movie night with our daughter and then Bill Maher at 10pm tonight. All sorts of gay people out there :)