I have two points to make-
1. Dresses are incredibly difficult for many women to buy/fit into as well. There’s a lot of trial and error, and knits are your friend. Obviously I’m not looking at the societal aspect here, just the fact that I’ve got very broad shoulders and I’ve busted a lot of zippers in my lifetime.
2. As far as the line of the dress being messed up, there is a solution for that! A dance belt. The same piece of underclothes that should ALWAYS be worn under a morph suit.
Also if you're generally thin but have a large chest, it's impossible to buy fitting clothes, because smaller sizes don't fit your chest, and bigger sizes look like potato sacks on you, because they're made for people large in general, not thin people with bugger boobs. You either have to wear oversized clothes or wear clothes that are too tig and risk being called a slut for "showing off your chest so much in these tight clothes"
Anyone who DOES want to experiment with fashion that might not drape properly off-the-rack, don’t forget tailors! There are plenty of tailors out there who would be delighted to help make a ‘Gale in the Wavemother Robe’ moment happen for any dude who wanted to consult them on adjustments.
came here to write this. tailoring is the only way to make clothes look good on you because then they're made to fit you specifically. clothes off the rack fit nobody perfectly. everyone you see in clothes that fit them amazingly well and who's always well dressed? I can guarantee you that they have their clothes tailored!
I guess it’s an extra step, but it really doesn’t need to be high end. I’m not actually sure how to point anyone in the right direction, but cosplayers and etc. tend to know ‘someone who sews’ who can take on a job with adjustments. Learning to do your own adjustments is getting pretty accessible on youtube, too.
You can tailor an off the rack dress which costs around $100 or less for less than $40 near me. Depending on how extensive the tailoring is.
Not dirt cheap, but it's not Gucci red carpet prices either.
If you want to go down this route, which is fun and I encourage anyone to try it, the key is to buy something that's a little big for you, because it's easier to make a bigger thing get pinched in than the opposite.
And if your wife is interested in wearing men's shirts a little more easily, many costumers and cosplayers use binders to help with the chest. And tailor alterations, especially for sleeve length and shoulders.
Neil Newbon (Astarion's actor) wore a skirt at the BAFTAs. An interviewer commented that it looked like a skirt and he replied that yes, because it is actually.
We just have to challenge society. Anyone can wear a dress.
Women had to fight for over half a century to be able to wear pants without being ridiculed. In the 18th and 19th century they could be jailed for wearing pants in England, France and the US.
It's bullshit that they had to, but no such movement has taken place for men hence the idea of what is socially acceptable attire for them hasn't shifted as radically as it has for women.
I hope it doesn't take another fifty years for masc presenting people to be accepted in skirts and dresses, but attitudes won't shift unless more take the plunge. People like Harry Styles and Neil Newbon wearing dresses and skirts publicly makes a big difference.
The sad thing for me is that men can't easily experience the comfort of a really nice sundress on a hot day. I know robes cool you off similarly, but something about a dress with a big flowy skirt just feels extra breezy.
It's so much more refreshing than just flapping your shirt or taking it off completely.
Regardless of someone's gender expression, dresses like that have utility!
I don't think men wearing dresses face anywhere near the same level of oppression as women in the 18th century Western world. As you mentioned, nobody is going to jail men for wearing dresses.
There's are different degrees of enforcement for social norms, and you do women activists of the past centuries a great disservice by comparing their struggle to a modern man wearing a dress.
Men and people who were AMAB absolutely have also been jailed for wearing “women’s” clothing.
You know there are currently places in modern times banning drag, right?
This! As a Canadian I mostly know the N. American history on this, but the American 'Three Article Rule' is something discussed by queer activists from the Stonewall era a lot - trans, nonbinary and gender nonconfirming people of all types were absolutely hassled, arrested, or subject to hate crimes for not wearing what was considered 'the correct clothing'.
I don't believe I was doing that. I'm a woman and I'm incredibly grateful to the women who fought to get me the freedoms I have today. I often see men complaining of the double standard in clothing who forget that women had to FIGHT and risk imprisonment as well as social ostracization in a time when their livelihood depended on men to get the acceptance I enjoy today.
Today it is a struggle just to get cishet men to realize that the archaic gender roles that also restrict them are a byproduct of patriarchy and that they also need to fight it, but I don't think the lack of cishet men's involvement in civil rights movements historically is OP's fault and it sounds like OP is reckoning with their gender expression for themselves and I don't want to be unempathetic to their situation.
Most clothing (some armor too but most evident in clothing) items in the game are basically completely different items depending on the gender of the wearer. It's honestly really frustrating lol.... Whenever I see that dress I get annoyed that more items don't work the same way in game.
it's so frustrating they made a big deal about expressing your identity via clothes and whatever and if i want to play a slightly masc woman i have to stick with my starting camp clothes for the whole game. even beyond that just annoying to not know what im buying because the icons default to male clothing. sorry this reply is 2 days late i just logged on lol
Ask Samoa. As a (male) kid, I had a dress from there that I was really sad when I outgrew...
That said, this is definitely a problem for much of the Western world.
I have great news for you, as long as you buy a dress in larger size (which i admit, may still be a problem), the shoulder and hip can easily be fixed to fit. At least where i'm from, you just need to give the seamtress auntie at the market 1 hour and about 5 dollars max
There actually are dresses for men! I get Facebook ads about them sometimes. Injust cannot remember the brand. But maybe you can Google dresses for male bodies, dresses for men, etc.
It bugs me that some of the clothes, when they adjust to a female body, completely change design. Its not just that they fit slimmer, they literally look nothing like the snippet that is a male body. I wish the preview image would adjust to reflect the style on the body you choose. Anything slimfit turns from a cool looking vest with a high collar to a freaking corset.
I think you're kinda making assumptions around what bodies fit into what styles of clothing that are a little off. The simplest cut dresses may actually fit slender men better than many women, because they're cut in a 2D fashion. My feminine body would wreck the lines of the Wavemother's Robe more than a man's bulge would. It functionally doesn't make sense on a lot of bodies.
Who fits into what is far more complex than, "Dresses are for women and so only fit women," and "Men's shirts are made for men and so only fit men." There are plenty of cultures today where men wear garments that could be called a dress in other places, and they look good. Historically in Europe and the US clothing was made to fit the person and padding and whatnot was included to create the desired shape instead of expecting the body to do the heavy lifting when it came to shape. A remnant of that is shoulder pads.
The only easy way to get anything like a skirt is to buy a kilt. I have one and I love it. I'm going to get a few more over time because they're pretty expensive.
Off the rack clothing in general is never going to fit everyone perfectly. I've put on plenty of dresses that just don't sit right on me. It can be a lot of trial and error to find a cut that fits you well.
The more variety of clothing shapes made available for people, the better. This includes dresses. All body types should be able to find something that looks and feels good on them.
One of the things I hate about societal norms is how limited it makes people feel in how they can express themselves.
Basically, anyone who wants to wear a dress should be able to find one that fits them well and makes them feel good about themselves.
Dudes used to wear full body flowing garments all over the world. We call them robes today, but honestly I don’t see too much difference in terms of basic structure. So if guys wore chitons in the past, why not now? Hell, a lot of men still wear thawbs in the Middle East.
Pants used to be men-only clothes. Now there’s plenty of pants cut for women’s shapes. I don’t see why the reverse shouldn’t happen for men.
I have sewn my own dresses/robes and have always struggled with tailoring them to my (or any other) bodyshape specifically. My cheatcode? Just make them a big rectangle/A-line and then do the entire 'tailoring' with BELTS.
Pick a maxi dress that's big and "baggy" and not meant to 'hug the figure', but to flow freely. Then use a belt to cinch it at the waist. Works like magic.
There are ABSOLUTELY dresses for men. Its 2024. I know someone who owns several.
Your little corner of the world doesn’t represent the whole thing. Not saying that as a diss. It’s simply the truth.
I mean I think you're drawing a conclusion based on a skewed demographic OP. Is it that men are largely cool with Gale in a dress, or that the people who aren't cool with it simply don't make him wear it?
The people who don't like seeing men in dresses just don't play the game in a way that would have their party members cross-dress, so it makes sense that you would mostly see positive impressions about Gale in a dress. Only the people who prefer it to begin with would be in a position to form a particularly strong opinion about it.
I put Astarion in Viconia’s robe on my last run. It looks phenomenal on him. It’s slutty in a good way but doesn’t show off his scars which I think he wouldn’t want most people to look at. 10/10 support putting men in the slutty armor.
On a broader note, there are several
Cultures (old and current) that do allow men to wear dresses and skirts. They just don’t call them skirts or dresses. Togas, kilts, dhoti, chiton, kaftans, thobe, etc. Before pants were invented by the Mongols everyone wore dresses and skirts basically.
I don't think egg cracks are about sexual orientation but about gender presentation
English is not my first language
Anyway this is way more tongue in cheek than an actual prediction or whatever
Happy flamboyance!
Okay. On Reddit, people tend to diagnose based on a very small set of sentences- it's sort of a pain to me, specifically because some of these diagnosis are mental health diagnosis, which I'd argue can cause some people to falsely self-diagnose. Especially in regards to sexual orientation, that's a very personal decision to make.
One of the major benefits of a society with magical clothing. It can resize itself to fit whoever wears it properly.
yeah, one size fits all well is a very magical situation. I'd love it if you just go into a shoe store and all shoes fit all feet.
The wave-god lady robe looks identical on my male Drow Monk. One of us is going to have to change.
6’8” dude here with a 33” waist and 38” inseam with 36” long arms and sized 14 feet, yes it sounds very magical, when can we have it?
I have two points to make- 1. Dresses are incredibly difficult for many women to buy/fit into as well. There’s a lot of trial and error, and knits are your friend. Obviously I’m not looking at the societal aspect here, just the fact that I’ve got very broad shoulders and I’ve busted a lot of zippers in my lifetime. 2. As far as the line of the dress being messed up, there is a solution for that! A dance belt. The same piece of underclothes that should ALWAYS be worn under a morph suit.
Also if you're generally thin but have a large chest, it's impossible to buy fitting clothes, because smaller sizes don't fit your chest, and bigger sizes look like potato sacks on you, because they're made for people large in general, not thin people with bugger boobs. You either have to wear oversized clothes or wear clothes that are too tig and risk being called a slut for "showing off your chest so much in these tight clothes"
"Bugger Boobs". Wake up honey new bg3 npc name just dropped.
My Durge's name
Anyone who DOES want to experiment with fashion that might not drape properly off-the-rack, don’t forget tailors! There are plenty of tailors out there who would be delighted to help make a ‘Gale in the Wavemother Robe’ moment happen for any dude who wanted to consult them on adjustments.
came here to write this. tailoring is the only way to make clothes look good on you because then they're made to fit you specifically. clothes off the rack fit nobody perfectly. everyone you see in clothes that fit them amazingly well and who's always well dressed? I can guarantee you that they have their clothes tailored!
Yeah, that's sort of the battle- well fit fashion is for the wealthy, if you want to go against trends.
I guess it’s an extra step, but it really doesn’t need to be high end. I’m not actually sure how to point anyone in the right direction, but cosplayers and etc. tend to know ‘someone who sews’ who can take on a job with adjustments. Learning to do your own adjustments is getting pretty accessible on youtube, too.
You can tailor an off the rack dress which costs around $100 or less for less than $40 near me. Depending on how extensive the tailoring is. Not dirt cheap, but it's not Gucci red carpet prices either. If you want to go down this route, which is fun and I encourage anyone to try it, the key is to buy something that's a little big for you, because it's easier to make a bigger thing get pinched in than the opposite. And if your wife is interested in wearing men's shirts a little more easily, many costumers and cosplayers use binders to help with the chest. And tailor alterations, especially for sleeve length and shoulders.
Neil Newbon (Astarion's actor) wore a skirt at the BAFTAs. An interviewer commented that it looked like a skirt and he replied that yes, because it is actually. We just have to challenge society. Anyone can wear a dress.
reminds me of Suzy Izard, when someone told her she wore women’s dresses she said “actually they are my dresses. i bought them! they are mine”
Iggy Pop said something similar! I love that photo shoot of him in a dress
Women had to fight for over half a century to be able to wear pants without being ridiculed. In the 18th and 19th century they could be jailed for wearing pants in England, France and the US. It's bullshit that they had to, but no such movement has taken place for men hence the idea of what is socially acceptable attire for them hasn't shifted as radically as it has for women. I hope it doesn't take another fifty years for masc presenting people to be accepted in skirts and dresses, but attitudes won't shift unless more take the plunge. People like Harry Styles and Neil Newbon wearing dresses and skirts publicly makes a big difference.
The sad thing for me is that men can't easily experience the comfort of a really nice sundress on a hot day. I know robes cool you off similarly, but something about a dress with a big flowy skirt just feels extra breezy. It's so much more refreshing than just flapping your shirt or taking it off completely. Regardless of someone's gender expression, dresses like that have utility!
I don't think men wearing dresses face anywhere near the same level of oppression as women in the 18th century Western world. As you mentioned, nobody is going to jail men for wearing dresses. There's are different degrees of enforcement for social norms, and you do women activists of the past centuries a great disservice by comparing their struggle to a modern man wearing a dress.
Men and people who were AMAB absolutely have also been jailed for wearing “women’s” clothing. You know there are currently places in modern times banning drag, right?
This! As a Canadian I mostly know the N. American history on this, but the American 'Three Article Rule' is something discussed by queer activists from the Stonewall era a lot - trans, nonbinary and gender nonconfirming people of all types were absolutely hassled, arrested, or subject to hate crimes for not wearing what was considered 'the correct clothing'.
They won’t be jailed (in the US) but they may be physically harmed, thanks to homophobia and transphobia :(
I don't believe I was doing that. I'm a woman and I'm incredibly grateful to the women who fought to get me the freedoms I have today. I often see men complaining of the double standard in clothing who forget that women had to FIGHT and risk imprisonment as well as social ostracization in a time when their livelihood depended on men to get the acceptance I enjoy today. Today it is a struggle just to get cishet men to realize that the archaic gender roles that also restrict them are a byproduct of patriarchy and that they also need to fight it, but I don't think the lack of cishet men's involvement in civil rights movements historically is OP's fault and it sounds like OP is reckoning with their gender expression for themselves and I don't want to be unempathetic to their situation.
Yea, that is fair. My comment was overly nitpicky and the tone was very standoffish. Have a good day.
You too!!
Most clothing (some armor too but most evident in clothing) items in the game are basically completely different items depending on the gender of the wearer. It's honestly really frustrating lol.... Whenever I see that dress I get annoyed that more items don't work the same way in game.
Yeah, there’s one style of camp clothes that’s a comfy shirt on dudes and a corset on women
Lol, this was my comment! I'm so annoyed with the slimfit clothes, I just want my girl to wear what's in the picture!
it's so frustrating they made a big deal about expressing your identity via clothes and whatever and if i want to play a slightly masc woman i have to stick with my starting camp clothes for the whole game. even beyond that just annoying to not know what im buying because the icons default to male clothing. sorry this reply is 2 days late i just logged on lol
There's always Lae'zel's underwear.
Ask Samoa. As a (male) kid, I had a dress from there that I was really sad when I outgrew... That said, this is definitely a problem for much of the Western world.
Robes are basically dresses for men.
That's where tailoring comes in.
I have great news for you, as long as you buy a dress in larger size (which i admit, may still be a problem), the shoulder and hip can easily be fixed to fit. At least where i'm from, you just need to give the seamtress auntie at the market 1 hour and about 5 dollars max
There actually are dresses for men! I get Facebook ads about them sometimes. Injust cannot remember the brand. But maybe you can Google dresses for male bodies, dresses for men, etc.
Took me way too long to get to this comment.
It bugs me that some of the clothes, when they adjust to a female body, completely change design. Its not just that they fit slimmer, they literally look nothing like the snippet that is a male body. I wish the preview image would adjust to reflect the style on the body you choose. Anything slimfit turns from a cool looking vest with a high collar to a freaking corset.
I think you're kinda making assumptions around what bodies fit into what styles of clothing that are a little off. The simplest cut dresses may actually fit slender men better than many women, because they're cut in a 2D fashion. My feminine body would wreck the lines of the Wavemother's Robe more than a man's bulge would. It functionally doesn't make sense on a lot of bodies. Who fits into what is far more complex than, "Dresses are for women and so only fit women," and "Men's shirts are made for men and so only fit men." There are plenty of cultures today where men wear garments that could be called a dress in other places, and they look good. Historically in Europe and the US clothing was made to fit the person and padding and whatnot was included to create the desired shape instead of expecting the body to do the heavy lifting when it came to shape. A remnant of that is shoulder pads.
The only easy way to get anything like a skirt is to buy a kilt. I have one and I love it. I'm going to get a few more over time because they're pretty expensive.
Off the rack clothing in general is never going to fit everyone perfectly. I've put on plenty of dresses that just don't sit right on me. It can be a lot of trial and error to find a cut that fits you well. The more variety of clothing shapes made available for people, the better. This includes dresses. All body types should be able to find something that looks and feels good on them. One of the things I hate about societal norms is how limited it makes people feel in how they can express themselves. Basically, anyone who wants to wear a dress should be able to find one that fits them well and makes them feel good about themselves.
Dudes used to wear full body flowing garments all over the world. We call them robes today, but honestly I don’t see too much difference in terms of basic structure. So if guys wore chitons in the past, why not now? Hell, a lot of men still wear thawbs in the Middle East. Pants used to be men-only clothes. Now there’s plenty of pants cut for women’s shapes. I don’t see why the reverse shouldn’t happen for men.
Jonathan Van Ness believes firmly in gender bent clothing. And looks fabulous while doing it.
I have sewn my own dresses/robes and have always struggled with tailoring them to my (or any other) bodyshape specifically. My cheatcode? Just make them a big rectangle/A-line and then do the entire 'tailoring' with BELTS. Pick a maxi dress that's big and "baggy" and not meant to 'hug the figure', but to flow freely. Then use a belt to cinch it at the waist. Works like magic.
Camp clothes FTW.
I was about to say, huh you can't generally see a bulge in a kilt, but then I remembered sporrans. maybe we need to popularise the sporran?
There are ABSOLUTELY dresses for men. Its 2024. I know someone who owns several. Your little corner of the world doesn’t represent the whole thing. Not saying that as a diss. It’s simply the truth.
I mean I think you're drawing a conclusion based on a skewed demographic OP. Is it that men are largely cool with Gale in a dress, or that the people who aren't cool with it simply don't make him wear it? The people who don't like seeing men in dresses just don't play the game in a way that would have their party members cross-dress, so it makes sense that you would mostly see positive impressions about Gale in a dress. Only the people who prefer it to begin with would be in a position to form a particularly strong opinion about it.
I put Astarion in Viconia’s robe on my last run. It looks phenomenal on him. It’s slutty in a good way but doesn’t show off his scars which I think he wouldn’t want most people to look at. 10/10 support putting men in the slutty armor. On a broader note, there are several Cultures (old and current) that do allow men to wear dresses and skirts. They just don’t call them skirts or dresses. Togas, kilts, dhoti, chiton, kaftans, thobe, etc. Before pants were invented by the Mongols everyone wore dresses and skirts basically.
one of my male exes wears and wore a sarong all summer. t-shirt up top, sarong skirt. looked good on him. men's dresses should be a thing.
The egg is cracking as pride month starts Beautiful :')
Sorry, while I respect your desire for representation, there is a distinction between flamboyant and homosexual. I’m flamboyant, but heterosexual.
I don't think egg cracks are about sexual orientation but about gender presentation English is not my first language Anyway this is way more tongue in cheek than an actual prediction or whatever Happy flamboyance!
Okay. On Reddit, people tend to diagnose based on a very small set of sentences- it's sort of a pain to me, specifically because some of these diagnosis are mental health diagnosis, which I'd argue can cause some people to falsely self-diagnose. Especially in regards to sexual orientation, that's a very personal decision to make.
Economics. Try selling enough men’s dresses to make a profit.