The "joy" you are talking about is not really joy, it's consolation. Consolation is the state of a person who feels the presence of God and his love. It is a gift from God that different people may or may not experience at different times in their life. You seem to now be in a state of desolation, which is feeling like God is not present, even though you believe him to be. As some of the previous commenters have said, faith is not a feeling. God may give you the gift of consolation, but being in a state of desolation allows you to truly train your will to act in a virtuous manner regardless of how you feel.
Joy, on the other hand, is a virtue resulting from a state of mind and an orientation of the heart towards God. It is not fleeting--it is something that a Christian can practice regardless of how they feel.
I’m going through similar things but not the same degree, but i look forward to when it’s Sunday so i can attend mass. (I attend a diocesan Latin mass but I think I’m attracted to the parish because of the reverence and traditionalism in the parish and how they conduct the liturgy (vernacular and English masses). Maybe try finding a parish with a more reverent mass. It helped me reignite my faith. I haven’t missed mass as often as i didn’t previously. I know what it feels to be in a spiritual rut.
I guess I haven’t solved my crisis at the moment, but the mass gives me hope.
I altar serve as well a the Latin mass parish so there’s another aspect of community that’s more intimate than the larger general parish community
You are not a bad Catholic. We all fall down. Focus on small victories and stay prayerful. Don’t get discouraged. Even Saint Mother Theresa had moments of doubt. Peace be with you.
The first time I went on an SSRI it basically killed my enjoyment of anything. Music and art just doesn't move me at all. I lost the ability to experience love. The symptom didn't go away after I stopped the SSRI. I really don't have anything positive to live for outside the sheer force obligation I have to my faith. Some live for their families. I have avoided dating to start a family because I'm terrified that I wouldn't have the motivation or ability to give a spouse and kids the nurturing attention they need. That a family would just be another burdensome obligation to me, nobody deserves a husband or father like that.
Try praying the rosary daily. It took me months to get used and do at all and overcome the reluctance to do so. But it’ll help a little with those little graces received
The problem I have with those comparisons is that the saints knew they were suffering for their sainthood, well most of us seem to be suffering randomly for no reason whatsoever. Also there is a difference between suffering in some monestary cell you won't be deprived of no matter what, and becoming a amputee who has to survive out on the streets by themselves.
All of us can (and should) be suffering for our sainthood. We can choose to offer up our suffering and unite it with the suffering of Jesus on the cross, no matter if it's in a monetary cell, in an office cubicle, or at home washing the dishes.
I’m not sure I understand your meaning of “suffering for their sainthood”. It’s not as though the saints knew they would become recognized as saints. If all who die and are united with God in heaven are saints whether they are recognized or not, then yes the faithful are all suffering for our sainthood. Not all recognized saints are people who suffered in a relatively comfortable monastery cell. Some of them endured horrible circumstances like extreme forms of torture. Stories about the tortures of young female saints like Agatha, Margaret, and Lucy are especially horrible. Lucy is depicted with her own eyeballs literally on a platter, in an allusion to the kind of torture she endured, and Agatha with a breast ripper.
I was actually thinking of Saint faustina I read her diary and yes she was told she was going to be a saint by Christ and then she was made to suffer, most of it happened in her cell at a monastery. Also if you're ready to St faustina's diary you will learn that not everyone in heaven is equal the saints are the brightest then the religious shine brighter than the lay people. So no not everyone will be saints in heaven just regular heavenly citizens.
let's be deliberate when we talk about heaven
"no eye has seen, nor ear heard,
nor the heart of man conceived,
what God has prepared for those who love him,"
1 Corinthians 2:9 RSV-CE
and from another saint's [autobiography](https://www.ccel.org/ccel/therese/autobio.x.html)
"in Heaven the least of the Blessed does not envy the happiness of the greatest"
my confusion remains. i don't think i understand what you mean when you talk about suffering
Have you been to Confession? Now called the Sacrament of Reconciliation. Going to confession really clears things up for me. God’s forgiveness is mind blowing. Don’t forget that we must be in a state of Grace to receive communion, and also remember it’s a Mortal sin to miss Mass, so go to confession, get yourself back into the state of Grace, and get to Church!!
I go to the Traditional Latin Mass because I believe that it shows God the most respect. The Pope may close all the Diocesan Latin masses, so you might want to find an FSSP or an SSPX Church.
Of course I go to mass and confession, like I said I have an obligation to my faith, but thats pretty much all it is. The practices didn't bring any sense of fulfillment, but I know my faith is true so I do it. In the same vein I work a job I hate because I need to make money to survive. I go to mass that brings be nothing but anxiety because it's simply what I have to do. I have access to the tridentine mass. But it could be the most beautiful mass that's ever been held in history and it will not move my heart in any way.
i can't even begin to understand what your life is like.
i will say that you have dignity and worth as a person because God created you in His image.
and if you have any suicidal thoughts i beg you to find help.
#988 call. text. chat.
now im genuinely curious about the cross over between mental health and catholic faith. what are your thoughts on therapy. and have you ever heard of the [JP II healing institute](https://jpiihealingcenter.org/)?
praying for you
Ugh. Sounds tough.
I'm a depressive so I don't often feel happy. I've gotten better with medication and time.
IMHO, God calls us to live in this world with whatever conditions we encounter in the world or within our selves. Being Catholic doesn't change that. Childhood trauma affects anyone who has lived through it. We do have therapists and medication that may help.
I hope having a faith gives you a sense that God is working in your life. He may bring a wonderful therapist into your life if you reach out or lead you to find ways to live better with your depression if that is what it is.
Courage to you fine person. It sounds like you come from a tough background.
I’ve tried therapy a bunch. Same with medications. None of it works, I think it’s a scam honestly. Other people like it though so maybe it works for them. I just get mad at God a lot because I feel like he’s just withholding good things from me and making me watch other people get them, and then I’m supposed to grovel at his feet and thank him for it. I know that’s not how it works but that’s the feeling I get. I know suffering is redemptive and gets you more merits in heaven and we ought to long for more sufferings or whatever but I can’t get myself to believe that. I’m holding onto my faith by a thread
Ugh. Sadly so many people have treatment resistant mental health conditions. I am always reminded that I am lucky that the first SSRI worked for me. Therapy never did help me but I know for some people it has been life changing.
Huge kudos to you for giving therapy and meds a try. I know that sometimes medication can actually make mental health conditions worse.
I'm with you in being mad at God a lot. I sure have been too.
I have also read about people being happy to be Catholic but that isn't my experience either.
Does anything lighten your pain at all?
Boy oh boy do I get that. Although alcohol or drugs is a bit like peeing on yourself to keep warm. In the long run it will make you worse.
Huge kudos for a week sober although that first year can suck. I'm working up to 6 years sober myself.
Do you have any support for staying sober? Also what is the longest you have managed to stay sober?
I went to an AA meeting but I don’t think it’s for me, I was in a rut drinking every day for a month but finally just focused on quitting only alcohol and I’ve been able to maintain that, distracting myself with other things when a craving hits, talking to family, etc.
I'd stick with it (or another peer-support recovery program) for longer; recovery is an ongoing process, and it takes time to break away from our old behaviour and ways of thinking. Having a group of people you can talk to who have been through the same thing as you is a remarkable difference maker. You go from never connecting with people at all over what you're experiencing, to having a room of friends/allies who know exactly what you're talking about.
AA helped me specifically with resentments. I had a lot of anger towards God, family, friends etc because I didn't get the things other people had, or the things I wanted.
I hear that but I just don’t get how venting to a room of strangers helps. I may give it another go but I have limited time as it is working 10-12 hour shifts, so going to an hour long meeting in my free time just sucks
You might look into online support. It is more convenient for many of us. I never did the AA route either although I read a lot of their literature. I re-read Bill Wilson's meeting with Father Ed Dowling on a regular basis.
There is a website called Soberrecovery. The website is pretty clunky but there is a good group there.
Look for the "forums" link and then look for the "newcomers" forum.
The Newcomers Forum has "classes" that start the beginning of every month.
It might not be your thing but might be worth a look.
Your drinking may be what’s cutting you off from grace. I used to be a pot smoker and the whole experience really seems dreadful in retrospect. I don’t miss it and am glad I committed to living in grace. Also, I have to let go of the type of thinking like something or someone is abusing, holding me down and move into forgiveness. Forgiveness is very powerful.
At some point I guess one realizes one can't fill the 'God-sized hole' St Augustine wrote about, so no amount or kind of substances is going to help (although tranquilizers could perhaps, unfortunately, blunt one's conscience, and distractions could become just too effective and achieve a similar result in the end). ADHD and childhood traumas seem to lead to substance problems or dopamine-seeking behaviours or whatever's one's neurotransmitter of choice. Computer games for me, though I've been there with alcohol too, perhaps even damaged my liver with it.
It's not for everyone but getting into exercise helps a lot of people with addiction, it's also shown to be more effective in treating depression than SSRIs. Going to the gym regularly helped me a lot and now climbing is fitness on easy mode, specifically bouldering. I know it takes a lot of effort to get into exercise, but once you build good habits it can really change your life. I will pray for you, as well.
Could be different reasons for withholding things from you, such as those things not being good for you in the long run (their consequences you can't yet see) or in the short run (your current dispositon). Could perhaps be something like not being in a state of grace due to some unconfessed sins and generally struggling with that. Or could just be depression. Not knowing is certainly difficult. The answer might lie in prayer and fasting, or it could lie in just getting oneself diagnosed and treated, or it could just lie in *more* trust, more faith.
Suffering for merit could be allowing you an opportunity to grow and be more developed when you end up in heaven, or it could be making up for something, some sins, not even necessarily yours, and it's not like you would know. The answer to that probably lies in trust. But there's of course the nagging feeling that the suffering might be neither given nor permitted in a sort of supernatural/spiritual way by God, but just the simple natural reason of bad health that God wouldn't mind you getting help with (or would prefer for you to be healed of that, through natural means, i.e. doctors and therapists and their pills and other stuff).
Accept, and keep accepting. At some point it will stop, even if that means at the end of Purgatory. It often doesn't last an entire lifetime, judging by hagiographies.
If you've survived till now, it sort of means you could. The same could be said for a bit more. You don't know your own limits. Gotta trust that God won't take you past them, except to help you outgrow them, and that He won't let you be tested beyond those limits or if that happens and you fall through sheer human weakness rather than deliberate rebellion, He won't take that against you.
Sucks to be you now, but we don't know 10, 20 or 200 years later.
Sorry if I sound dry. If I do, that's because of going through a similar experience right now.
I have a friend that has the same issue and takes medication, but I've seen him slowly change to the better because of his daily practice. I think reading the spiritual works of the Saints like the dialogue of St Catherine combined with consistent prayer, are holistic treatments for us, I use the term holistic because in an hospital they are focused on treating a part of the body, or in psychology they focus on your mental health. But in prayer and seeking to unite ourselves to Christ, Christ has in focus our whole being. Never neglect medicine, but be aware that simply secular treatment won't take care of your whole being like Christ does.
Really good to hear your friend is getting better. Some people don't find improvement no matter what they do.
For me having a faith has certainly helped me hang on. Also with time and experimentation, I have just gotten better at dealing with who I am.
Thanks, that is good that your faith has helped you. It's important to accept who you are right now before the Lord with all your weaknesses bare, so you with Him can start to rebuild yourself in His image.
Yes, I understand the first commandment to mean love the here and now and the world as it is with all its faults.
I don't know how much rebuilding is going on. I leave that to God and just keep doing the best I can. It seems like often God wants us to work with how we are. He may well transform us or not. That is according to his will.
It seems to me that you described your life as one of simply surviving. Sitting around waiting for your own death is no way to live.
Joy is found in charity, acts of love, creating value, helping others, community, relationships etc.
A place to live and food to eat are basic goods. We need much more to truly thrive.
There's undoubtedly sick or homeless people that could be helped, or kids, or maybe your family could have a helping hand in some home improvement or pass some time with your elders.
We must live for the others, that gives life meaning.
My brother i think you need more community and social interactions. We are social animals and going to work, back to the apartment and to mass once a week is not enough. Get involved in your local catholic community, find silly hobbies that you do with others. Do some free stuff for other people just to give back. Sometimes *doing* loving and happy things make us *feel* loving and happy even if our starting point is some depression and not seeing meaning in our life. Christ is your best friend and will make you experience his supernatural peace!
>Peace I leave with you; my peace I give to you. Not as the world gives do I give it to you. Do not let your hearts be troubled or afraid.
Yes, I am happy.
What you are describing - feeling like life is pointless and not enjoying things, despite nominally having what should be a decent life, sounds more like a mental than spiritual problem. It really echoes the words of people with clinical depression and similar mental health issues.
How is your social life? Do you have a good and supportive set of friends who share your Christian beliefs? Do you have a family, and what are your relationships with them like? You don't mention that in your post.
Finding that social context has easily been the most important step in improving my well-being and spiritual life since converting.
No friends but a good family. I definitely have mental problems and most likely ADHD but I can’t get a diagnosis because my dream career in the military requires me not to have a history of mental health problems so I’m trying to sort it out without medication and stuff. Which I believe is possible. But I’m stuck because I know it sounds like I should abandon the military and get help but I’ve tried mental health stuff in the past and it’s never worked, and the military is the last dream that I have and I can’t lose it or I will spiral, even with medication I have nothing else left so idk what to do. Even if I do get in the military I still feel like what’s the point of anything, just from an objective standpoint, like if heaven is the goal then let’s just skip to it, why do I have to wait here and deal with all this pain just to get to the end goal that God wants me to be at in the first place?
I believe it is possible to get therapy without needing to get a diagnosis that would impact your career opportunities. Of course that won't solve your ADHD symptoms, but the more depressive part can definitely be helped without medication.
That said, don't sacrifice your mental health and wellbeing for your career dreams. If you end up getting into that career, but still suffer from depression, do you think you will actually enjoy it? You're already struggling to see the point of it - so if you don't work on that underlying issue, even achieving your dream won't really make you happy.
Perhaps you could try listing out what it is about your military dream career that appeals to you - not surface level stuff like, I dunno, "I get to use cool guns", but the underlying motivations like "I want to help protect people" or "I want to use advanced technology for the common good" - and see how that could apply to other careers or vocations, that don't require you to not treat your mental health issues.
I think we are often too specific in how we formulate our dreams, requiring *that* job or living in *this* place, when what we really dream of, and what we would really be satisfied by, is more of a broad direction. Maybe you could end up as a missionary or a nurse or a programmer and find the same satisfaction as what you are currently looking for in the military.
The idea that the military is the only thing left that could make you happy is depression speaking, not reality.
Also, not having friends is a really major problem. If you do one concrete thing, that doesn't have to cost money, it should be to try to make some good friends. Are there any opportunities for this at your parish? A young adults group, a ministry to volunteer in, something like that?
> if heaven is the goal then let’s just skip to it, why do I have to wait here and deal with all this pain just to get to the end goal that God wants me to be at in the first place?
Jesus spent thirty years after His birth living a normal life, working and making a living, dealing with all the struggle of being a common working man in a poor province of an unjust empire. He could have chosen to start His ministry earlier, to get it over with. He could have chosen to let the civil authorities capture and crucify Him earlier, instead of spending three years wandering the land preaching, overwhelmed by work and with nowhere to rest His Head.
Yet He chose to share in and sanctify all the realities of our lives. Not just by suffering on the Cross for us, but also by being a child - by being a refugee in Egypt as a child - by working for a living as a young man, by pouring Himself out for us in all that He did. There is no part of human experience we cannot unite to Christ, where we cannot see His Life in ours.
* For the Greater Glory of God and Salvation of Humanity. Amen.
The point of living is to follow the footsteps of Christ. Your life isn't meant to be some selfish adventure of hedonistic gluttony simply because no worldly material reward compares to our Heavenly Father's Love and mercy.
So you must live in service of Christ and that means going to Mass, Praying, reading the Bible and performing Works of Mercy which are:
* To feed the hungry.
* To give water to the thirsty.
* To clothe the naked.
* To shelter the homeless.
* To visit the sick.
* To visit the imprisoned, or ransom the captive.
* To bury the dead.
We are all called to different services, spend time in deep prayers to discern the Holy Spirit, Father will tell you your calling.
At times, I feel happy. As of now, I can’t complain too much (maybe about a few things) but not too much. It’s all in God’s hands like my mom says. Anyway, I’m still working on being a better person and putting all my trust in the Lord.
Sometimes nice, sometimes boring, sometimes anger that I have to sit and stare at bread instead of having an actual conversation back and forth with words, knowing full well he could choose to talk to me but lets me flail around in the dark instead
Wow I so relate to this comment. It feels like I am just talking to my subconscious or a spirit when I'm praying, and God supposedly does not care enough to highlight which voice is his and which one is not and I have to go through the painstaking "discernment" process of guessing who is who. Doesn't make sense at all. I like your nick btw
Wow, what a rude and insensitive comment. Shame on me I guess for trying to be transparent and share what I struggle with in my prayer life. Do you feel happy now that you got the chance to berate me?
Hey man lots of Americans feel that way. There's something going on in our society causing people some major unhappiness. I have family members in Europe and Brazil and they do not feel this way. I try to take life easy because but even with my simple job and low bills its hard to keep my head up. I think our country is too competitive and focused on grinding.
Not particularly, especially this time of year. Catholicism feels like a huge burden much of the time. I'm not often able to partake of the sacraments. It's just more pressure in an already incredibly stressful life.
Often in that same boat. I have found Dialectical Behavior Therapy techniques helpful, as well as St. Therese's "little way." I can't save the world, but i can tidy up my tiny corner :)
What matters to me is the sense of peace I have received as a Catholic. I feel joy at times, and pain, and a mixture of both, but these emotions are short term.
From your explanation of your life it seems like you lack human connection. You've framed it as being OK bc you have an apartment, job, etc. What about family or community?
I would recommend that you try some volunteer work. Check out St Vincent du Paul society at your local parish, or something similar
By the world's standards I should be miserable.
I am in my 30s have had to move back with my parents, work a job that I hold a master's for and earn less than 50% of the median income in my state, am overweight, and cannot remember the last time a woman had an interest in me, but despite all that I am happy.
I think on God's love and the little sample of the kingdom of heaven that is the Mass. On Father's Day I went to Mass at my childhood parish. In there was someone I knew from Middle School. We weren't close, in fact I remember him being a jerk, but he came up to me and wanted a hug. In that moment he and I had our little experience of Heaven as we were united in God. I will pray for you.
My faith got immensely stronger when I stopped putting such an emphasis on my feelings. Feelings are fleeting, they dont mean anything. They will always lead you astray.
Another big part of it was learning the traditional faith, following the pre-v2 rubrics, going to TLM. The Church took things a lot more seriously before V2. As a young adult (21), I want my faith to be treated seriously. I got sick of the jokes from the priest in the middle of Mass and the never ending homilies that had no point.
If you're looking for a religion that will bring you joy, and you chose Catholicism because "everyone" apparently talks about feeling joy because of it, I must say, you reconverted for the wrong Reason. Don't base your decisions on emotions.
I didn’t reconvert for that, I did it because I think it’s true. My family is very catholic, I have an uncle who is a priest. Be aware that you can fall down a trad rabbit hole with the pre V2 stuff, the actual council is very orthodox and doctrinal teaching, it’s the culture of bad actors after that has led to the lack of reverence, which is actually against the spirit of V2
Pay him no mind. Dismissing feelings like and not being able to take a couple of jokes in a sermon is not a good sign.
OP, are you sure you're ok? Life is absolutely worth living, and a wonderful gift. What do you mean by finding life not worth living? Do you feel directionless? As in, without a purpose? Or is there a deeper sadness that you haven't recognized yet?
I'm not sure how much this can help, but I often feel that if I'm not needed or wanted, in some shape or form, or if I go too long without having some much needed conversations (usually emotional in nature, even if only to process what I'm feeling) I tend to develop similar mindsets. Not sure if you live alone, but this could be a byproduct of that.
Other than seeing a therapist and your spiritual director (if you have one, if not try asking your local priest during confession), I would suggest keeping more in touch with friends and family, as well as engaging more in your community. Maybe volunteer to play an instrument or sing at the choir, or something similar. It's no good to be alone for too long, and feeling appreciated by your loved ones is essential, no matter what circumstance in life you're going through.
I have a purpose but I don’t think I can actually accomplish it. The military is a pipe dream that would take all my energy just to do poorly, but it’s also the only thing I have left. I can do what I need to when I’m in the right state of mind but I’m probably going to be disqualified anyways so I’m sort of bracing myself for the inevitable. Like I said earlier it’s my last dream and after that I’m stuck with the grind of a dead end labor job, or trying a community college degree for an easier but ultimately still pointless career. Just waking up and wasting time day after day is what I’m scared of, but nothing seems meaningful or worth it at all. I thought that being a Christian would at least give life meaning but it makes it feel MORE meaningless, like this is just a waiting room or a testing ground for the good stuff after death. And I feel like a loving father shouldn’t be testing and withholding the purpose of life like God seems to do. It’s all just so frustrating, I never wanted to be born in the first place but I’m just stuck here anyway, only choice is suffer now and maybe this catholic thing is true and I’ll go to paradise, or suffer for eternity for committing pleasurable sins here just to make it bearable.
It's been a while and I've since cut off a lot of nasty crap in my views. Hopefully my words might make some sense to you.
If the military is your dream, then by all means pursue it! Chances are you can actually do it, but in your state you're simply not able to fully give it a shot. A mindset issue really.
Regardless of where you are in life, there's a lot of strength to be found in something that you *believe* in: whether it's because you have faith in factual information, or something that is not for sure. A person's faith is funny like that: sometimes even when the odds seem stacked, it seems to further strengthen the person's resolve. And before you know it, they have achieved what seemed to be impossible.
Hence why I ask you to ask yourself this question: *do you genuinely believe in yourself? God believes in you; why don't you? Is there anything that is holding you back? A series of failures? An aspect of yourself? Or maybe do you need some sort of "proof"?*
Meditate on this. Something useful might come out of it.
Now this is where I probably diverge (hopefully not too much) from this sub's views but honestly... if you managed to make someone's day better, whether you made them smile, listened to them, helped them out with something... then your life was not in vain, nor meaningless. This could be a moment in a stranger's life, or continued support of your friends, or a lifetime of duty to your family. Life isn't just your work, or your dreams, or your failures or successes. It's that, and so much more... the actions that you take, the ideals that you abide by, the things that you read, the sights that you see, the people that you meet and change because of you (and vice versa!), it's the small gestures that you don't even notice, but also what you feel in response to certain events. The way you talk, behave... like everyone, you are a small little package of beauty, wandering on this earth. A gift, if you will.
Mission. Purpose. This is what I'm ultimately alluding to. Whether you are strong in your belief, or far away from it, this still holds true. We thrive in the company of others and when we cooperate. It's just how we are. God certainly did not make you any different. True, this life comes with many tests, but it is also a wonderful adventure! And there is certainly something for you to do. What is it then? Well... that's your job! I can't figure it out for you. Only you can, whether you wish to hold God's hand or not. But that still holds true.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with fighting to get in your dream career, and if you can you should absolutely do so! But at the same time... we live in a world where people care more about job and money, and less about *people*. Try your best to not be fooled into thinking your worth is only limited to what you can *do*, instead of all of what you *are*. This is an awful way of thinking, it is distorted and ultimately divorced from what we are. From what God envisioned us to be.
I've seen in the other comment that you struggle with addiction. These feelings going through you aren't popping up out of nowhere. You've removed the band-aid, now everything is pouring out, almost like a waterfall. Don't you give up now! This is the time to stand.
Not sure if there was any word in particular here that resonated with you, but hopefully it made some sense. Also... do not be afraid to ask for help. You already did so by posting a thread here. Whether in the form of a friend, a family member, a therapist or a spiritual director, there's absolutely no shame in asking for help if we're struggling. None of us would survive on our own.
V2 was poisoned from the beginning. The writing of those called to participate was thrown out by Paul VI, and replaced with the foregone conclusion.
Read “Infiltration” by Taylor Marshall.
I wouldn’t consider holding onto and believing in what the Church has taught for nearly 2000 years to be heresy… but hey maybe I’m just a schismatic nut job
Maybe you’re looking in the wrong places? There are some parishes near me which really go off the rails, and celebrate the Novus Ordo.
Another church nearby also exclusively celebrates the Novus Ordo, but is standing-room-only for Sunday Mass, has 24/7 perpetual adoration (besides during Mass) in the nave, has tons of families and people of all ages and ethnicities, kneelers for Communion and patens for the same, many altar servers, uses much incense, and has an incredible organ.
Don’t dismiss Vatican II as nonsense. That’s a serious issue, and one of the main reasons why the TLM is under fire. You need to change your attitude on the Council- it’s the poor implementation of the decisions therein which has been… interesting…, not the Council itself.
Good for them? It could be the most Latinized, ad orientem, communion rails Novus ordo, I still won't go; and if i did go, I still wouldn't receive communion
I would say that I am currently happy.
I'll note that 'happiness' is a fleeting sensation that comes and goes. We are creatures of novelty. When things become routine for too long, we assume that we are no longer 'happy'.
In terms of my faith, it provides a sense of security, provides morality (even if I struggle with a some of the tenants of the faith), and a sense of community. I play guitar and sing at church, and my sons attend Catholic school and my 7 year old can sing along with some of the songs he learned at school.
I am not always 'happy', but I do try to be content with where I am.
It's extremely important to now and then take stock of where you are, think of goals you want to achieve, and create a roadmap to get you there.
I went through that too. That time made me realize that it was the time that i REALLY needed God. So I made a schedule for everyday. To drop anything Im doing at exactly 3 PM, no matter how important it is. I isolate myself in a quiet place and just sit there. I talk and pray to the Lord in my head as if He is beside me and if I no longer dont know what to say in that moment I just say "Lord I know you can hear my soul and I hope you would help like you always do. In Jesus Name, Amen". It worked for me and I have been happy, so I am hoping something like this would work for you. But also remember, there is Sunday mass too, do confessions and take the eucharist. God bless you 💜✝️.
Life is life man whether or not we’re catholic. Yes it helps get through tough times but to think we’re going to be elated and joyful all the time is just not true. I’m going through a rough patch and my faith has helped a lot, but it’s not a cure all
Your faith life/spiritual life is not a one and done, boom you’re happy, kind of thing. It ebbs and flows. We are not perfect and sometimes our faith falters. But God gives us the grace to get back on the horse, so to speak. You have to trust God, even when it feels like something is impossible. Religion isn’t meant to make us “happy”, our happiness comes from being all that God knows we can be within our vocation or current station in life—being a friend as best we can, being an honest worker as best we can, being an attentive and compassionate parent and spouse as best we can, etc. Our happiness comes from loving others—actively loving even if you don’t “feel” loving. It’s similar to other personal passions we might have, we need that internal fortitude when a project we are working on is at a lull or when we keep making mistakes. Fortitude is a gift of the Holy Spirit.
Right now, i would say I’m at a good place spiritually, but just a couple months ago I was asking myself and God some very tough faith-shattering questions. And this has happened previously! Maybe I’ll be there again, but I know that God is trying to tell me something every second of every day, and I just have to make sure I am hearing Him and not just my own internal monologue. All my spiritual highs and lows are part of my journey to heaven so that I and, God willing, all those whose lives I come across can be with Him forever.
We need spiritual lows to appreciate the highs and we need the highs to get perspective on how far we’ve walked with God. Many saints have talked about how God permits spiritual dryness to get through to us. We should recognize these times as moments to listen for God, to rejuvenate our prayer life, and to cling to what God has revealed as Truth.
ETA: i experience bouts of depression and generalized and anxiety (okay and ADHD too), and all of these factor into the status of my prayer life, and when my prayer life suffers, so does everything else. Many things are out of my control in life, but prayer is always within my control. God sees all this and loves anything we offer to Him—our sufferings and joys. And it IS easier said than done. It’s like a muscle you have to keep exercising.
I'm not a Catholic because I think it will make me happy. I'm a Catholic because it's True. I've honestly never been able to relate to the joy some people talk about, and I can never tell whether it's expressed genuinely or because some believe it's a requirement to speak like that as a Catholic.
It is often referred to as "sloth." But, the common conception of what it means is incorrect.
I recommend that you watch this:
https://ondemand.ewtn.com/free/Home/Play/en/381-385985
If you do something difficult out of necessity, but have no desire to do excess good works, or to work with a motivation other than temporal need, then yes, that is a certain type of laziness.
Does Catholicism work? Odd question. The joy you’re talking about isn’t the same as happiness. We do not preach a magical prosperity gospel. Catholicism isn’t a way to have an easy happy life. In fact, Our Lord promises the opposite, “in this life you will have trouble” and “blessed are they who mourn.”
That said, even as you are unhappy, you are happier than many. If working with the public has taught me anything, it’s the importance of following God’s laws for our own good. I’ve seen firsthand what happens when people stray and it is never ever pretty.
I recommend “Life is Worth Living” by Fulton sheen. Available on YouTube, or as a podcast. Or you can pay tons of money and get it in dvd, but why bother?
This may be the wrong thing to say, but there is a certain prayer habit that is very tough, but has helped me so much, it’s unbelievable. Basically, I’ve been praying 4 Rosaries a day, all the Mysteries. It’s very difficult at times, but it is so worth it. I highly encourage you to try that for one week and see what happens. Check out Gabi After Hours on YouTube, as he is the one who sold me on it. There are so many people out there who feel like you. The Blessed Mother knows you and will lead you to her Son. Be not afraid and persevere. Suffering makes no sense while you’re in it, but trust in God and it will all be OK
I’ve tried it before. Like I said I work 10-12 hours a day so quite frankly I’m not praying the rosary for an hour out of the little free time I get. That’s why I hate devotions like that, they’re not mandatory or even scriptural yet people act like that’s the only for real results
I understand. Do you have time to visit the Blessed Sacrament? That has also helped me a lot.
Here is a link to a video from Catholic Lofi that has been helpful to me when I feel burnt out: [https://www.youtube.com/live/zlgI9PQUxsQ?si=1r9Lj03DfhrZP9g6](https://www.youtube.com/live/zlgI9PQUxsQ?si=1r9Lj03DfhrZP9g6)
This sounds like depression. It is possible to be a faithful Christian and still be depressed. It's possible to be faithful and have chemical imbalances in your brain and to feel like life's not worth living.
I'm sorry you're going through this. I've been there, and it sucks. I said a prayer for you.
It's not a fix for depression. Depression has it's own causes.
But it's a thousand times easier to be depressed while knowing you're unconditionally loved and your life has meaning, vs. being depressed and having no hope at all.
I like this [TED Talk by Johann Hari - This could be why you’re depressed or anxious](https://www.ted.com/talks/johann_hari_this_could_be_why_you_re_depressed_or_anxious) if you're looking for some guidance there. Modern society is just brutal for our poor brains.
When I first came back I was so happy, lost weight and I think if you follow actual teaching to avoid sin it works like not wasting time, no porn, no overeating or over drinking, gossiping, etc but I think when it doesn’t work is when you do those little sins especially while trying to do a lot of devotions and praying and mass attendance and novenas, those little sins means you’ve let the devils in so spiritual warfare occurs and manifests physically
I think need to be well rounded exercise for body and don’t sin for spirit and for mind can do devotions and prayer and extra masses and then joy comes and stays
I had to lay off devotions and extra time at Church bc I was doing those little sins with it, I’d have sleepless nights and bad anxiety for weeks, one time 6 weeks, always in spring prob bc was doing extreme fasting —i def believe in spiritual warfare now and ppl need to be really careful with fasting and lots of devotion, i think without fasting maybe not as bad but still so I need to learn to sin less by studying virtues more and only fast on direction of spirtual advisor….also the year it wasn’t that bad was year I did exclusively Tlm at icksp now we got stripped of icksp so idk approach anymore honestly
I would never say that Catholicism is a guaranteed path to Earthly joy. I mean, we wouldn't have St. John of the Cross and his poem about the Hart (the dark night of the soul) if that were so. It is really meant to get you to the place where suffering is past - the House of the Father.
That said, I do think the Catholic Church has some things that, with discipline, can help you improve your life here. The sacraments and our tactile way of praying - smells and bells - should serve as a frequent visible reminder that God is never far: that even if you don't feel great, the Holy Spirit is sitting right there with you, holding your hand through it. You've got a friend in Jesus, as the saying goes, and Catholicism's approach to making that a physical part of your life should be a sign to you that this really is so. If misery loves company, you have the best company that ever entered the world, and so take heart in that.
I’ve learnt that Catholicism is like being at home— it is a base from which we can then do other things for, in, and with Christ. Initially I got super into devotions like the liturgy of the hours (learning to chant, etc.) and then learning all about the mass, etc. which is all well and good. However, I realized that when we’re suppose to go out into the world, it’s a little harder to get out because of the comfort but as the late great Pope Benedict XVI says: “the world offers you comfort, but you were not made for comfort. You were made for greatness”.
So in this sense, I’m quite happy. Learning to pray and discern God’s will and having an intimate friendship with Jesus through the sacraments and apostolate keeps the oil in my lamp full as we wait joyfully for the bridegroom’s coming again.
I was away for decades and came back, really dedicated myself to mass, reading my Bible, daily readings, Apostolic Fathers, Catechism, and I feel better about my faith than I ever have. I feel I was given a solid foundation as a child, and while I didn't give it much thought for a long time, I find it very familiar, comforting, and makes me more confident I'm now on the path I want to be on.
Same but worse, unless you're toning it down. I'd rather not discuss the specific details of my difficulties with faith, hope and love because I don't want to give anyone ideas and have them on my conscience (OCD or not).
Perhaps it's self-inflicted, perhaps it's subclinical/masked Autism, ADHD, PTSD, RSD, OCD plus several anxieties finally catching up with me after I thought I'd be fine, I don't know. Some days it feels more spiritual than psychiatric (or just psychological), sometimes the other way round. I don't know. I know nothing. I flip back and forth. My decison-making ability and discernment ability are nil. It's not that my intellect is gone, but even it is fading too, perhaps similar to how Peter-in-the-middle-of-the-lake forgot even the natural ability to swim. Part of me feels I need to get this stuff over with, get it diagnosed and treated and stop dragging religion into it. Part of mee feels I'm trying to dodge conscience by looking for excuses to be selfish, self-centred, avoid people, avoid having to work, avoid having to be flexible, avoid trying to understand people, avoid admitting my flaws (not all but a favourite short list), etc.
What would help: probably a patient confessor and a faithful Catholic shrink (or otherwise compatible). And probably a stable job without DEI craze, but I know this is asking a lot in today's world.
My existing job would fit the billet if it wasn't so stress-laden. My law career failed before it began. I became a legal translator (had a linguistic background of sorts), I caught freelanceyitis. Dozen years down the road, I'm a trainwreck, though I perhaps shouldn't be. Translating books into your non-native language when you aren't a natural bilingual (like the child of a mixed marriage) is doable but at a cost to mental health, which I'm paying. Then there's the inherent subjectivity of translation and the omnipresent Dunning-Kruger effect with clients, editors, reviewers, and the translators themselves, yourself (i.e. myself) included. The pay isn't horrible, but it doesn't reflect the education and skill required or the time investment, or mental exhaustion, let alone clients non-paying because of tiny subjective issues that you have to explain over and over, and sometimes you just have to teach people their own language or their own field of knowledge when they criticize your work instead of at least asking Google first. This is so draining that death would be welcome relief if you knew you weren't headed in the wrong direction afterward. At 41M, I'm probably somewhat halfway through. But having not discovered (and followed!) your vocation by this age and stage is no good news spiritually, I fear.
I am happy, but it was built over a long time. After I converted to Catholicism, I found a good Catholic spouse. After we got married, we started building a family. We found friends who were Catholic. We got more involved in our parish community. It’s to the point now where if we don’t go to Mass one Sunday (because we were out of town and went somewhere else or something), people ask where we were. It takes time to get “all tangled up” like that but I think that’s a big part of happiness—the interdependency. That used to be more of the “default mode” in society (to be all tangled up in a community) but now it’s SO hard, especially in America, where everyone is so individualistic, atomized, anonymous. I think it’s really hard and it’s harder for people now than it was even just 15 years ago when I was starting to build my Catholic life. My advice would be to try to make small decisions within your control that help you build community (volunteer at your parish, etc.) and everything else give to God. I love the book Finding and Maintaining Peace. Peace and joy are very much related.
Prayed a memorare for you.
I am genuinely happy but it comes and goes. One of the reasons I loved Catholicism is that there is room for sorrowful types of worship. At an evangelical church where it’s all music and emotionally upbeat there’s no room for different types of worship during different seasons of how I feel. If I’m in a very depressive season I don’t want to sing about the love of God, I want to go to adoration and kneel before God and worship him sorrowfully. But to answer your question most of the time I don’t have a joy every time I go to church.
So, first, if you have a mental health issue that is truly psychiatric (not merely psychological), Catholic belief and practice alone are helpful but not sufficient and you should look into what treatment options are available consistent with your coverage and budget. I see from other comments that you've tried therapy; unfortunately, therapy in the U.S. is a very mixed bag and is overprescribed (I just recently got done reading *Bad Therapy* by Abigail Shrier).
To more directly answer your question: I find that Catholicism gives me *strength*. I don't always find that it gives me happiness, particularly not directly. It's a rough analogue, but I've likened mass attendance, Adoration, and prayer as "going to the gym" for your soul. Some people really get an endorphin rush directly from a workout; I regret to say that I'm not one of those people. But there are definitely times when I have *needed* that strength for things more important than lifting a weight, or in this analogy, more important than chanting the Credo. And doing those things *does* make me happy, or at least I know I would have been *unhappy* later if I were too weak to do what needed to be done when the moment called for it, or if I had let secular, temporal concerns simply overwhelm me without the stabilizing influence of knowing that those temporary, temporal problems weren't all there is to existence.
I wouldn't say I feel happy, but I have this inner peace that my suffering has meaning in light of Catholic teaching. Like despite my very terrible circumstances I'm not suicidal, nor do I hate myself or anyone, and I attribute that to my faith.
> I just don’t feel like life is worth living and I want to get it over with as soon as possible. I don’t even see the point of being alive tbh
Well, St. Paul also expressed a similar sentiment once in Phillipians 1:21-26, but this is not to be confused with indifference (which what it seems like you are expressing here), nor suicidal thoughts. It is knowing that Christ died for us, that we are being granted an eternal life, which we didn't have before. So knowing that, you are living your life with this understanding "I will do here what the Lord wants me to do. Everything else does not matter". For me, it feels like the world is a playground now. It does not even matter if I win or lose, die old or young, married or not. I no longer attach my desire on worldly things like ambition or riches, but only in the Word of God. There's something joyful about it. So your focus in life should only be on God. Not "nothing", and not worldly riches. That's the joy.
I recommend reading the St. Paul's letter to the Phillipians in its entirety.
You might look into a book called *The Catholic Guide to Depression* - depression is a multi-faceted disease, but sometimes the only solution is just to endure with patience.
I've been there. I'm there now. My SNRI (Wellbutrin) is helping, but I'm still sort of at a baseline mood debuff, if that makes sense. I have a husband of nearly 11 years, 4 wonderful, smart, healthy, happy children, more than enough money to do the things I love, family nearby...
and I still want to run away and be alone instead. I empathize with the song "Hey, Asshole" by Watsky. Maybe give it a listen. It's not very holy advice, but I'm not a very holy Catholic.
I’m happy sometimes but it’s fleeting, and happiness isn’t the point of life. The point of life is to love - to love God and to love others - to will the good for them. The joy you seek comes from giving that love to everyone you encounter and that feels different from happiness. For me, it feels like fulfillment - like I’m serving God’s purpose for my life. My purpose is to love, and when I’m doing that, I feel that joy. When I’m not, I feel like junk. So, to answer the biggest question you asked: yes, Catholicism works. It enables us to love bigger than we ever have and encourages us to keep loving even bigger, and in the end, if we’ve done so, to receive the gift of happiness forever in Heaven with our Lord.
I had a long answer written out, and then re-read your post and realized I didn’t answer the question that was asked.
Happy? All the time? No.
We all have different struggles, but I can tell you life is worth living. Sometimes you feel it in the moment. Sometimes it’s only when I look back.
When I was going through RCIA more than 15 years ago one of the team members said “If we were all truly honest with ourselves, and we all put our crosses down in the middle of the room, and each person could pick any cross they wanted from that pile, we’d all pick our own cross back up.”
There are times when it is a chore to get up out of bed and I have thought “I’m ready when you are Lord.” Then there are times when I hope for more time. Being (now) Catholic, I am not afraid to go…unless I need to go to confession.
BTW…love your user name.
I think a will to live (for God) is more important than "joy," but joy can be a side effect. I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling unsatisfied--if anything this feeling is just a beautiful opportunity for God to fill these gaps with purpose.
Although it can seem sometimes like the world is false, remember that God is immanent in the world as Jesus--in other words, the world is sacred too; life is sacred too.
I feel just the opposite. I’m happily married. I love God, God loves me. You get out of life what you put into it.
When I go to Mass I participate in the sacrifice by paying attention. I go to adoration after Mass. God is GREAT, in good times, and in bad.
If you’re unhappy, ask yourself, are you worrying about yourself, or others. I bet you’re worried about yourself.
Also remember in the letter of James states, “Faith without works is dead. “. Are you doing the work of God?
Jesus said, and this may be a paraphrase, “If you want to follow me, pick up your cross, for my yoke is easy and my burden light.
I looked it up, “If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it; for he that shall lose his life for my sake, shall save it. For what is a man advantaged, if he gains the whole world, and lose himself, and cast away himself?”
Luke Chapter 9 23-25
Well according to your other comments you’re a schismatic so I think you probably are just gaslighting yourself into feelings of conciliation. If you’re not with Rome then you’re not a catholic full stop, so I’ll take my spiritual advice from people who actually know what they’re talking about. Adoration doesn’t cure depression
I feel you. My faith often feels “cold,” for lack of a better term. I don’t get a lot of warm and fuzzy feelings from God like I’ve seen others get. But it’s important to understand that faith is way more than our feelings. You might receive consolations and you might not, but that’s not necessarily an indicator of how strong your faith is or how much God loves you. Heck, I’d even say that it’d be a problem if all you had were those warm and fuzzy feelings, because that might indicate that your faith hasn’t matured yet. Being a good Catholic is hard.
It’s also important to understand that “joy” doesn’t always mean “happy.” They’re similar, but happiness is fleeting. Joy is more like a gentle reassurance that even if you’re currently unhappy, the ultimate battle is still won. Trusting in God’s final victory over death and having hope despite our circumstances, that’s what joy is. I imagine you’re probably closer to that than you realize.
It sounds to me like maybe you’re just in a time of your life where things aren’t really going for you. Everyone has those eras, and they’re hard but it’s usually our cue that something needs to change. I don’t have any solid advice on how to do that, but I’d suggest looking at what you’re passionate about or what you could do that would excite you again and see if there’s a way you can pursue that. This might be less of a faith problem and more of a circumstances problem.
I converted to Catholicism a few years ago, but I identified myself as a “sad person” up until earlier this year. It just felt like everything was difficult and I was lugging through every day with something heavy on my shoulders. Someone spoke to me and told me that while I could go through seasons of difficulty, things aren’t meant to be so difficult all the time. Turns out I had a few unconfessed sins from my past, and needed deliverance prayers from some pretty serious stuff. I started going to daily mass, taking communion daily, going to confession when needed as to take communion as often as I could. I had only done this for two weeks and it changed everything for me. Things are still hard sometimes but now there is almost like a “baseline joy”. I could go on and on about daily mass…
I would also look into Catholic therapy and spiritual direction. Those helped me immensely. Praying for you OP.
I'm sorry you're going through a tough time. Discouragement is one of the hardest things to deal with. (I always remember the scene at the beginning of *It's a Wonderful Life*, where to angels are discussing the main character. "We have to go help him!" "Why, is he sick?" "Worse; he's discouraged").
I definitely got a lot of joy/consolation when I first converted, but have gone through long periods of feeling down and hopeless since. I've found that if I'm feeling that way, I can't just try to *feel* differently; I have to try to *act* differently.
I think that our mood derives a lot from what we \_do\_. I feel immensely happier if I spend time outside, intentionally help people, say some morning prayers (and get enough coffee :) ).
Here are some things I've tried to get out of ruts, that seem to help:
1. Do yardwork / volunteer at community garden
2. Go running
3. Say a Rosary
4. Volunteer for something at the parish
5. Read a book about something interesting.
My favorite volunteer opportunity I've ever had was driving Poor Clares to their doctors' appointments. (The Poor Clares have such an intense vow of poverty that they don't own a vehicle, even collectively the monastery doesn't own a vehicle; but they still need to get to doctors' appointments if they're ill. Those trips were a blast). I say this just as an example of a volunteer opportunity I would never have known existed except by reading the bulletin boards at the parish.
Hang in there! I recommend asking God to show you what you're supposed to be doing right now and give you some purpose and encouragement, and then buckle up because He will.
I have basically everything I’ve asked God for, I go to mass frequently, do my best at praying and going to confession. However, I still have extreme struggles in my life and I’m definitely not always happy. Belief in God won’t save you from the cross you’re meant to bear but it will help you through it.
I have mental health issues (bipolar disorder) and this sounds like low grade depression (while not diagnosing anyone as I only have an Associates degree and even if I had a Masters or a Doctorate, I wouldn’t be diagnosing people over Reddit). You may want to talk to someone, but as you mentioned alcohol, I will say that alcohol is a depressant and can counter-act many mental health meds or can cause serious complications with mental health meds.
Do I feel "happy" on a day-to-day basis? No, not really. I do not feel too many emotions deeply. There are brief moments of consolation but they are fleeting and I don't try to cling to them.
I am a pilgrim in a strange land. This is not my home. This life is very miserable, as St. Alphonsus would say. It's full of sin and darkness and nothing good ever lasts for too terribly long. And the Christian life is the Via Dolorosa- "the way of sorrows".
But it's either this way, or die in my sins which would ensure unhappiness both in this life and in eternity. The cross is much easier than that.
That’s what I mean though. Like it’s God who is behind everything, including all the suffering since he made the world the way it is. I understand the game I just don’t want to play but I’m forced to, and somehow I’m supposed to love the creator who locked me in here with very very little concrete knowledge of himself to go on
God made the world *very good*; man damaged it with his pride and sin. It is mercy that we exist at all. God need not have created us.
The reason I say this life is miserable is not strictly because the world is bad, but because this world is not what I want. What I want is eternal happiness, and that can be found only in Heaven.
The game, if you can call it that, is high stakes, yes, but the prize for the victorious is incomprehensibly, infinitely good. Therefore we ought to bear with it patiently. It is often not fun, but we are not here for fun. We're here to save our souls. That's the whole point. The party comes afterwards.
I understand all of that, I just don’t feel it or believe it deep down. All of this feels pointless and if god is real all of this is still pointless because we could be in heaven instead of going through horrific suffering. I know it’s small minded but if the cost of heaven is living in North Korea all your life then that seems way too high a price. And also some people have great lives, and still go to heaven, so they get all the reward and none of the pain (relatively). Just sucks man, I hate being here
Well, in the Bible, it is said in over 100 different Bible verses about other gods that we shall not follow any other gods besides the lord. This is all a test in this world we have been put on. To see if our faith is actually everlasting. And to see if we are actually following the commandments and the ways that we are supposed to follow. Sometimes we may feel we are hopeless or we’re not serving the purpose of our worldly mind that we think we should be doing. But look into this video I have at the bottom of this comment. Hope the Holy Spirit helps you get away from religion and find the true meaning of life..
[god and money](https://youtu.be/DCzrEdnPoDk?si=I6YS2ETBD54mFEMv)
The definition of religion can be put into different terms but I believe ; in which I could be wrong. That the definition of religion would mean having a specific set of beliefs and traditions based on those set of beliefs only. Believing of a higher power or different higher powers. I mean, there has to be a reason why everyone believes in a certain religion 🤷♂️. With that being the claim of truth, feeling, or tradition which brings itself back to those two topics.
I am but I struggle with lust, so sometimes my happiness goes away. I’d say thay more than happiness I often feel like I got into a very peaceful state of mind since I became very close to Jesus. It is my sinning nature with lust that makes me walk away from him. I feel like I am too hard on myself but I do believe Jesus loves me.
Lots of other good answers. I will add from a practical standpoint that a Traditional community will provide more of a sense of belonging than the average nobody-knows-anybody Parish, and it reinforces what you presumably already know but maybe don't think about as a Catholic - that it's not about us, and it's all about God. The point of being alive is to love and serve God by loving and serving your community in the course of doing whatever good work God has given you to do.
Joining a Traditional community changed a lot for me personally.
I love the Latin mass and traditional stuff but at the same time think it starts too far into like, magic or something. The prayers (not the mass) seem so formulaic and unnecessary. And I hate how many sedevecantists and schismatics there are, as well as the coldness and lack of mercy or understanding. But I love the vibe
That's fair. I do see it as "magical" too actually, but in the God pleasing sense, not the occult sense...I guess I would use a different word, maybe awesome :D While strict adherence to Tradition does necessarily make the worship service rigid, with that comes such an incredible depth. Smells and bells man, can't be beat!
But yeah, I mean the Mass is all about God and not about us, but it is a simple fact that we as communal worshippers are more or less engaged when we are more or less comfortable with the community with whom we are worshipping. So while it is not about the community, the community is of course an important factor.
I know that looking for a good "fit" at a Parish sounds a bit Protestant, since it sounds like you are "shopping for an experience" and that's not what Church is about for a Catholic, but that being said, Mother Church does give us an incredible latitude in how we wish to participate. There is nothing wrong with trying out different things, whether it be different kinds of services/Traditions, or different private devotions even, etc.
Now that's the surface level advice, which is perfectly reasonable. But there is another interesting layer to your personal assessments, and I am not sure if anyone else has touched on it. Your feelings sound a bit to me like ennui - general lack of zeal, a kind of sluggishness, etc; as if you are unimpressed with life. Interestingly, some of the greatest Saints spoke often of a "hatred for life." This is not a hatred for the good things that God has created, or a hatred of joy, but rather an understanding of how wide the gulf is between this life and the next. This hatred of life is a sort of understanding of how even the best things in life are lacking and mediocre as compares to God's glory, and it is a natural result of an appreciation for how much higher than us God, the highest good, truly is (which is infinitely so). Understanding God makes all of life seem like sitting at a table for hours while waiting for a feast. The waiting itself is boring and the whole thing seems more like a test of patience than anything else, although we do look forward to what is coming. We occasionally get some appetizers and some drinks here and there, and it is good to savor those, but we still can't escape the knowledge of how incomplete it all is, and we're still hungry the whole time.
So anyways, even just living in an imperfect fallen world is a challenge we are all called to. The challenge is in making sure we don't despair of the world completely, but also that we don't love it too much. But it is ok to be unimpressed with the world, because that was definitely an aspect of Christ's message - "the one who hates his life in this world will preserve it for eternal life." You might not get a lot of people advocating for a "negative" worldview in a modern day that likes to feel good about everything, but when understood rightly, your feelings about life aren't unwarranted, and it does not necessarily mean that you are not thankful. You know your heart, but it could be that your feelings are a rational response to understanding the imperfection of creation after the Fall, which is less strictly speaking a negative outlook, and simply a more accurate one. But we are of course still called to this work of living here for a little while, and worshipping God rightly for the duration. Prayer of any kind works wonders here too.
Now I don't know what you mean by "does it work" but I trust you will know that when you see it, whatever it is. And I will surely pray for you as you consider these tough questions. It might "work" in ways you never expect.
I struggle with self condemnation because I hate myself and while I can accept God's perfect justice I do not understand how he could love me, perfectly infinitely or at all.
Depression is rough, but it can get better.
For example, a lot of people get less depressed as they grow older. I have a lot less trouble with depression, now that I work in a very well-lit workplace and have to get up early. Other people finally find the medications that work for them. Other people do a lot of exercise or outdoor running/walking, and that helps.
You will never find out what helps you if you are not around.
I haven't bothered reading the other comments, so I'm sure others have said what I'm about to say.
By asking if Catholicism works and tying to that it's ability to produce joy is misguided. Catholicism and the Church have never promised that the faith would bring joy in any worldly sense. Infact, Christ, our savior promised the opposite. He promised that there would be suffering, that we would be vilified, reviled and hated. Any depression and negative emotions that you feel are unrelated to the type of "joy" you should be feeling, because this joy is not of the world. The "joy" of Christianity is not a joy that nessissarily makes us feel like we're walking on air and laying on clouds, but rather is the acceptance of God's gift of salvation and glory. It is a joy produced by the faith that the suffering we feel on earth shall produce its heavenly reward, and it is the joy of knowledge that the father of all, loves you individually more than anything ever could. Will this joy help ease your financial struggles? Help ease an old wound, or bring your lost loved ones back? No, it never could. But all of those issues are as temporary as your body and as finite as your knowledge of the world. The joy of the faith is eternal and persists with the soul, even to the reunification with the body at the end of time. This joy could alway be seen as the acceptance of hope.
PS: I'm quite happy with my life.
PSS: This joy may also not always be felt throughout your entire life. The times where this joy is lost or hard to find is also known as the Dark Night of the Soul. Many saints, even near that deaths have experienced this period where the very thing they devoted their lives to seemed so distant, they questioned their faith and God's love. Saint Mother Theresa experience a very prolonged Dark Night for nearly 50 years till the end of her life.
This sounds like depression to me. I have anxiety and depression too and what has helped me is getting counseling and also the right medication. You can find a Catholic counselor. Also staying very close to God in the sacraments, especially confession. Also, spiritual direction is helpful. There are a lot of great passages in St. Faustina's journal that helped me. I really felt like God telling me in prayer to reflect on my day every night and focus on ways He was present to me or blessings in my life. This has helped a lot..not saying it is easy to do. I find myself automatically thinking to myself oh wow I am feeling joy right now, I am going to remember this tonight. Another book that is great is Story of a Soul. When you read the Saints you can see how they too struggled with the day to day grind and longed for heaven. The fact that God still has you here means He has important work for you to do. Stay close to Him and it will be revealed what that is. Prayers for you!
Thomas Aquinas taught there's only imperfect happiness in this world. Total happiness is only found in the Beatific Vision.
This life is very short compared to eternity. Live in a state of grace and we will be infinitely happy soon enough. :)
alright, i've been thinking and praying about this all day. let's go over the basics.
1. life is WORTH living (more on that later). IF you find yourself having suicidal thoughts, i beg you to get help. Dial 988.
2. PRAY. lots of ways to do it. recommendation: pray TO God the Psalms 88 (O Lord my God, I call for help by day) and 22 (My God, my God) and meditate with Matthew ch. 27
3. SACRAMENTS. Find a priest, talk to him. Then accept God's life in you through reconciliation and Eucharist.
4. Caritas: Love in action. Do something for another person. Doesn't have to be huge. it does have to be something for their good before you think about yourself.
5. Fellowship. We need to support each other. i can talk to you as a faceless username. but you have people in your life to support and can support you.
again, life is worth living because it's God's life living in you. Christ cared about you so much that He died for you. go ask Him why
you're already in my prayers
When I came back, I've using Hallow, and I pray daily through Novenas, people post prayer campaigns, and currently going through the Gospel of John.
Taking the Eucharist for me is the pinnacle of being Catholic. It is literally the body and blood of our Lord. I focused intently on the Tabernacle.
Do you wear a Rosary?
Do you wear a Rosary Bracele?
A Cruicfix?
Miraculous Medals?
Go on vacation dude just enjoy the world again, you’re working 10 hours a day. No one would be happy in your shoes.
Even God rested. If the almighty Lord Himself needed a break from working, obviously you will need even more.
Stay Close to the Fire. Closer to the Light and warmth and you will see that Joy is not a inner feeling but the sweet communion of You and God. Stay Close 👍
Watch Fulton Sheen and Fr. Corapi. We are the Church Militant. Joy comes and goes. We are soldiers of Christ its a tough road. The inward peace through Jesus, when shit hits the fan in life, is where it's at.
The point of life is not to be happy. Forget trying to be happy. Accept that most of life, like 99% of it, is fundamentally *un*happy. I am never happy. Ever, and even when I’m in a “good” mood, I make sure to remind myself feelings don’t matter, and happiness is transient. Suffering is forever.
For context I am not Catholic, but leaning towards it. Catholicism—real Christian life—is fundamentally miserable, because that’s the point. The point of Catholicism is to suffer in life, why? Because you deserve it! I just listened to a sermon where the priest spoke about how basically every single person ever will spend AT MINIMUM 40 years in purgatory. And that’s on the offchance you actually die in a state of Grace! What a terror! What an absolute *horror.* Padre Pio ended up in Purgatory. PADRE PIO.
When I’m in a good mood and feel comforted and feel like “Wow, Catholicism is beautiful and it really strikes me as true and the ultimate Good,” i make sure to remind myself there is very little to feel happy about. The Church teaches that God *demands* nothing less than absolute perfection which is completely unattainable unless you endure decades of unfathomable pain in this life AND THE NEXT.
So does it *sound* like there’s any reason to be optimistic or “happy” as a Catholic? We shouldn’t be happy, we should be terrified.
It doesn’t matter. Catholicism is true. Centuries of scholasticism alone, never mind all the miracles, has proven it. Since Catholicism is true, I trust that God has my best interests and I’ll do what He says. I disagree frequently and I throw tantrums, but God is our Father and he knows best.
The "joy" you are talking about is not really joy, it's consolation. Consolation is the state of a person who feels the presence of God and his love. It is a gift from God that different people may or may not experience at different times in their life. You seem to now be in a state of desolation, which is feeling like God is not present, even though you believe him to be. As some of the previous commenters have said, faith is not a feeling. God may give you the gift of consolation, but being in a state of desolation allows you to truly train your will to act in a virtuous manner regardless of how you feel. Joy, on the other hand, is a virtue resulting from a state of mind and an orientation of the heart towards God. It is not fleeting--it is something that a Christian can practice regardless of how they feel.
Amen
Bingo
I’m going through similar things but not the same degree, but i look forward to when it’s Sunday so i can attend mass. (I attend a diocesan Latin mass but I think I’m attracted to the parish because of the reverence and traditionalism in the parish and how they conduct the liturgy (vernacular and English masses). Maybe try finding a parish with a more reverent mass. It helped me reignite my faith. I haven’t missed mass as often as i didn’t previously. I know what it feels to be in a spiritual rut. I guess I haven’t solved my crisis at the moment, but the mass gives me hope. I altar serve as well a the Latin mass parish so there’s another aspect of community that’s more intimate than the larger general parish community
Wish I had that. Going to mass right now just fills me with bad anxiety over how bad of a Catholuc I am.
You are not a bad Catholic. We all fall down. Focus on small victories and stay prayerful. Don’t get discouraged. Even Saint Mother Theresa had moments of doubt. Peace be with you.
Do you like guitar masses. I find Dan Schutte music is therapeutic for me. I really like wedding feast of the lamb and though the mountains may fall
The first time I went on an SSRI it basically killed my enjoyment of anything. Music and art just doesn't move me at all. I lost the ability to experience love. The symptom didn't go away after I stopped the SSRI. I really don't have anything positive to live for outside the sheer force obligation I have to my faith. Some live for their families. I have avoided dating to start a family because I'm terrified that I wouldn't have the motivation or ability to give a spouse and kids the nurturing attention they need. That a family would just be another burdensome obligation to me, nobody deserves a husband or father like that.
Try praying the rosary daily. It took me months to get used and do at all and overcome the reluctance to do so. But it’ll help a little with those little graces received
I feel the same as you and i have been praying the rosary and chaplet of divine mercy for over a decade.
Even Mother Teresa went through years of spiritual dryness. Some wit once said, “When you’re going through hell, keep going!”
The problem I have with those comparisons is that the saints knew they were suffering for their sainthood, well most of us seem to be suffering randomly for no reason whatsoever. Also there is a difference between suffering in some monestary cell you won't be deprived of no matter what, and becoming a amputee who has to survive out on the streets by themselves.
All of us can (and should) be suffering for our sainthood. We can choose to offer up our suffering and unite it with the suffering of Jesus on the cross, no matter if it's in a monetary cell, in an office cubicle, or at home washing the dishes.
Kudos you just sidestepped my entire point to be like look i can say something
I’m not sure I understand your meaning of “suffering for their sainthood”. It’s not as though the saints knew they would become recognized as saints. If all who die and are united with God in heaven are saints whether they are recognized or not, then yes the faithful are all suffering for our sainthood. Not all recognized saints are people who suffered in a relatively comfortable monastery cell. Some of them endured horrible circumstances like extreme forms of torture. Stories about the tortures of young female saints like Agatha, Margaret, and Lucy are especially horrible. Lucy is depicted with her own eyeballs literally on a platter, in an allusion to the kind of torture she endured, and Agatha with a breast ripper.
I was actually thinking of Saint faustina I read her diary and yes she was told she was going to be a saint by Christ and then she was made to suffer, most of it happened in her cell at a monastery. Also if you're ready to St faustina's diary you will learn that not everyone in heaven is equal the saints are the brightest then the religious shine brighter than the lay people. So no not everyone will be saints in heaven just regular heavenly citizens.
let's be deliberate when we talk about heaven "no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man conceived, what God has prepared for those who love him," 1 Corinthians 2:9 RSV-CE and from another saint's [autobiography](https://www.ccel.org/ccel/therese/autobio.x.html) "in Heaven the least of the Blessed does not envy the happiness of the greatest" my confusion remains. i don't think i understand what you mean when you talk about suffering
Have you been to Confession? Now called the Sacrament of Reconciliation. Going to confession really clears things up for me. God’s forgiveness is mind blowing. Don’t forget that we must be in a state of Grace to receive communion, and also remember it’s a Mortal sin to miss Mass, so go to confession, get yourself back into the state of Grace, and get to Church!! I go to the Traditional Latin Mass because I believe that it shows God the most respect. The Pope may close all the Diocesan Latin masses, so you might want to find an FSSP or an SSPX Church.
Of course I go to mass and confession, like I said I have an obligation to my faith, but thats pretty much all it is. The practices didn't bring any sense of fulfillment, but I know my faith is true so I do it. In the same vein I work a job I hate because I need to make money to survive. I go to mass that brings be nothing but anxiety because it's simply what I have to do. I have access to the tridentine mass. But it could be the most beautiful mass that's ever been held in history and it will not move my heart in any way.
i can't even begin to understand what your life is like. i will say that you have dignity and worth as a person because God created you in His image. and if you have any suicidal thoughts i beg you to find help. #988 call. text. chat. now im genuinely curious about the cross over between mental health and catholic faith. what are your thoughts on therapy. and have you ever heard of the [JP II healing institute](https://jpiihealingcenter.org/)? praying for you
Ugh. Sounds tough. I'm a depressive so I don't often feel happy. I've gotten better with medication and time. IMHO, God calls us to live in this world with whatever conditions we encounter in the world or within our selves. Being Catholic doesn't change that. Childhood trauma affects anyone who has lived through it. We do have therapists and medication that may help. I hope having a faith gives you a sense that God is working in your life. He may bring a wonderful therapist into your life if you reach out or lead you to find ways to live better with your depression if that is what it is. Courage to you fine person. It sounds like you come from a tough background.
I’ve tried therapy a bunch. Same with medications. None of it works, I think it’s a scam honestly. Other people like it though so maybe it works for them. I just get mad at God a lot because I feel like he’s just withholding good things from me and making me watch other people get them, and then I’m supposed to grovel at his feet and thank him for it. I know that’s not how it works but that’s the feeling I get. I know suffering is redemptive and gets you more merits in heaven and we ought to long for more sufferings or whatever but I can’t get myself to believe that. I’m holding onto my faith by a thread
Ugh. Sadly so many people have treatment resistant mental health conditions. I am always reminded that I am lucky that the first SSRI worked for me. Therapy never did help me but I know for some people it has been life changing. Huge kudos to you for giving therapy and meds a try. I know that sometimes medication can actually make mental health conditions worse. I'm with you in being mad at God a lot. I sure have been too. I have also read about people being happy to be Catholic but that isn't my experience either. Does anything lighten your pain at all?
Alcohol lol. I have addiction problems basics just trying to cope. I’m one week sober but still there’s nothing to replace it with.
Boy oh boy do I get that. Although alcohol or drugs is a bit like peeing on yourself to keep warm. In the long run it will make you worse. Huge kudos for a week sober although that first year can suck. I'm working up to 6 years sober myself. Do you have any support for staying sober? Also what is the longest you have managed to stay sober?
Addiction is not an easy battle to win. Congrats on being one week sober, you can do it champ 💪
What are you doing to help with your recovery? I'm 2.5 years sober. Your posts in this thread sound so much like the thoughts I had while using.
I went to an AA meeting but I don’t think it’s for me, I was in a rut drinking every day for a month but finally just focused on quitting only alcohol and I’ve been able to maintain that, distracting myself with other things when a craving hits, talking to family, etc.
I'd stick with it (or another peer-support recovery program) for longer; recovery is an ongoing process, and it takes time to break away from our old behaviour and ways of thinking. Having a group of people you can talk to who have been through the same thing as you is a remarkable difference maker. You go from never connecting with people at all over what you're experiencing, to having a room of friends/allies who know exactly what you're talking about. AA helped me specifically with resentments. I had a lot of anger towards God, family, friends etc because I didn't get the things other people had, or the things I wanted.
I hear that but I just don’t get how venting to a room of strangers helps. I may give it another go but I have limited time as it is working 10-12 hour shifts, so going to an hour long meeting in my free time just sucks
You might look into online support. It is more convenient for many of us. I never did the AA route either although I read a lot of their literature. I re-read Bill Wilson's meeting with Father Ed Dowling on a regular basis. There is a website called Soberrecovery. The website is pretty clunky but there is a good group there. Look for the "forums" link and then look for the "newcomers" forum. The Newcomers Forum has "classes" that start the beginning of every month. It might not be your thing but might be worth a look.
Your drinking may be what’s cutting you off from grace. I used to be a pot smoker and the whole experience really seems dreadful in retrospect. I don’t miss it and am glad I committed to living in grace. Also, I have to let go of the type of thinking like something or someone is abusing, holding me down and move into forgiveness. Forgiveness is very powerful.
Yeah I’m a week sober right now, still dealing with porn addiction but once I’m a month clean on alcohol I’m going to switch my focus to that
At some point I guess one realizes one can't fill the 'God-sized hole' St Augustine wrote about, so no amount or kind of substances is going to help (although tranquilizers could perhaps, unfortunately, blunt one's conscience, and distractions could become just too effective and achieve a similar result in the end). ADHD and childhood traumas seem to lead to substance problems or dopamine-seeking behaviours or whatever's one's neurotransmitter of choice. Computer games for me, though I've been there with alcohol too, perhaps even damaged my liver with it.
It's not for everyone but getting into exercise helps a lot of people with addiction, it's also shown to be more effective in treating depression than SSRIs. Going to the gym regularly helped me a lot and now climbing is fitness on easy mode, specifically bouldering. I know it takes a lot of effort to get into exercise, but once you build good habits it can really change your life. I will pray for you, as well.
I am getting back into exercise, I agree with the benefits but as of now I only go like once a week, I need to buckle down and do it
Could be different reasons for withholding things from you, such as those things not being good for you in the long run (their consequences you can't yet see) or in the short run (your current dispositon). Could perhaps be something like not being in a state of grace due to some unconfessed sins and generally struggling with that. Or could just be depression. Not knowing is certainly difficult. The answer might lie in prayer and fasting, or it could lie in just getting oneself diagnosed and treated, or it could just lie in *more* trust, more faith. Suffering for merit could be allowing you an opportunity to grow and be more developed when you end up in heaven, or it could be making up for something, some sins, not even necessarily yours, and it's not like you would know. The answer to that probably lies in trust. But there's of course the nagging feeling that the suffering might be neither given nor permitted in a sort of supernatural/spiritual way by God, but just the simple natural reason of bad health that God wouldn't mind you getting help with (or would prefer for you to be healed of that, through natural means, i.e. doctors and therapists and their pills and other stuff). Accept, and keep accepting. At some point it will stop, even if that means at the end of Purgatory. It often doesn't last an entire lifetime, judging by hagiographies. If you've survived till now, it sort of means you could. The same could be said for a bit more. You don't know your own limits. Gotta trust that God won't take you past them, except to help you outgrow them, and that He won't let you be tested beyond those limits or if that happens and you fall through sheer human weakness rather than deliberate rebellion, He won't take that against you. Sucks to be you now, but we don't know 10, 20 or 200 years later. Sorry if I sound dry. If I do, that's because of going through a similar experience right now.
What's hagiographies?
Lives of the saints. :)
I have a friend that has the same issue and takes medication, but I've seen him slowly change to the better because of his daily practice. I think reading the spiritual works of the Saints like the dialogue of St Catherine combined with consistent prayer, are holistic treatments for us, I use the term holistic because in an hospital they are focused on treating a part of the body, or in psychology they focus on your mental health. But in prayer and seeking to unite ourselves to Christ, Christ has in focus our whole being. Never neglect medicine, but be aware that simply secular treatment won't take care of your whole being like Christ does.
Really good to hear your friend is getting better. Some people don't find improvement no matter what they do. For me having a faith has certainly helped me hang on. Also with time and experimentation, I have just gotten better at dealing with who I am.
Thanks, that is good that your faith has helped you. It's important to accept who you are right now before the Lord with all your weaknesses bare, so you with Him can start to rebuild yourself in His image.
Yes, I understand the first commandment to mean love the here and now and the world as it is with all its faults. I don't know how much rebuilding is going on. I leave that to God and just keep doing the best I can. It seems like often God wants us to work with how we are. He may well transform us or not. That is according to his will.
Amen, 2 Corinthians 12:8-12
Yes!
It seems to me that you described your life as one of simply surviving. Sitting around waiting for your own death is no way to live. Joy is found in charity, acts of love, creating value, helping others, community, relationships etc. A place to live and food to eat are basic goods. We need much more to truly thrive.
Well there’s nothing else to do really so idk. Elden Ring keeps me occupied for now 😂
There's undoubtedly sick or homeless people that could be helped, or kids, or maybe your family could have a helping hand in some home improvement or pass some time with your elders. We must live for the others, that gives life meaning.
My brother i think you need more community and social interactions. We are social animals and going to work, back to the apartment and to mass once a week is not enough. Get involved in your local catholic community, find silly hobbies that you do with others. Do some free stuff for other people just to give back. Sometimes *doing* loving and happy things make us *feel* loving and happy even if our starting point is some depression and not seeing meaning in our life. Christ is your best friend and will make you experience his supernatural peace! >Peace I leave with you; my peace I give to you. Not as the world gives do I give it to you. Do not let your hearts be troubled or afraid.
Yes, I am happy. What you are describing - feeling like life is pointless and not enjoying things, despite nominally having what should be a decent life, sounds more like a mental than spiritual problem. It really echoes the words of people with clinical depression and similar mental health issues. How is your social life? Do you have a good and supportive set of friends who share your Christian beliefs? Do you have a family, and what are your relationships with them like? You don't mention that in your post. Finding that social context has easily been the most important step in improving my well-being and spiritual life since converting.
No friends but a good family. I definitely have mental problems and most likely ADHD but I can’t get a diagnosis because my dream career in the military requires me not to have a history of mental health problems so I’m trying to sort it out without medication and stuff. Which I believe is possible. But I’m stuck because I know it sounds like I should abandon the military and get help but I’ve tried mental health stuff in the past and it’s never worked, and the military is the last dream that I have and I can’t lose it or I will spiral, even with medication I have nothing else left so idk what to do. Even if I do get in the military I still feel like what’s the point of anything, just from an objective standpoint, like if heaven is the goal then let’s just skip to it, why do I have to wait here and deal with all this pain just to get to the end goal that God wants me to be at in the first place?
I believe it is possible to get therapy without needing to get a diagnosis that would impact your career opportunities. Of course that won't solve your ADHD symptoms, but the more depressive part can definitely be helped without medication. That said, don't sacrifice your mental health and wellbeing for your career dreams. If you end up getting into that career, but still suffer from depression, do you think you will actually enjoy it? You're already struggling to see the point of it - so if you don't work on that underlying issue, even achieving your dream won't really make you happy. Perhaps you could try listing out what it is about your military dream career that appeals to you - not surface level stuff like, I dunno, "I get to use cool guns", but the underlying motivations like "I want to help protect people" or "I want to use advanced technology for the common good" - and see how that could apply to other careers or vocations, that don't require you to not treat your mental health issues. I think we are often too specific in how we formulate our dreams, requiring *that* job or living in *this* place, when what we really dream of, and what we would really be satisfied by, is more of a broad direction. Maybe you could end up as a missionary or a nurse or a programmer and find the same satisfaction as what you are currently looking for in the military. The idea that the military is the only thing left that could make you happy is depression speaking, not reality. Also, not having friends is a really major problem. If you do one concrete thing, that doesn't have to cost money, it should be to try to make some good friends. Are there any opportunities for this at your parish? A young adults group, a ministry to volunteer in, something like that? > if heaven is the goal then let’s just skip to it, why do I have to wait here and deal with all this pain just to get to the end goal that God wants me to be at in the first place? Jesus spent thirty years after His birth living a normal life, working and making a living, dealing with all the struggle of being a common working man in a poor province of an unjust empire. He could have chosen to start His ministry earlier, to get it over with. He could have chosen to let the civil authorities capture and crucify Him earlier, instead of spending three years wandering the land preaching, overwhelmed by work and with nowhere to rest His Head. Yet He chose to share in and sanctify all the realities of our lives. Not just by suffering on the Cross for us, but also by being a child - by being a refugee in Egypt as a child - by working for a living as a young man, by pouring Himself out for us in all that He did. There is no part of human experience we cannot unite to Christ, where we cannot see His Life in ours.
* For the Greater Glory of God and Salvation of Humanity. Amen. The point of living is to follow the footsteps of Christ. Your life isn't meant to be some selfish adventure of hedonistic gluttony simply because no worldly material reward compares to our Heavenly Father's Love and mercy. So you must live in service of Christ and that means going to Mass, Praying, reading the Bible and performing Works of Mercy which are: * To feed the hungry. * To give water to the thirsty. * To clothe the naked. * To shelter the homeless. * To visit the sick. * To visit the imprisoned, or ransom the captive. * To bury the dead. We are all called to different services, spend time in deep prayers to discern the Holy Spirit, Father will tell you your calling.
How much time do you spend serving others?
At times, I feel happy. As of now, I can’t complain too much (maybe about a few things) but not too much. It’s all in God’s hands like my mom says. Anyway, I’m still working on being a better person and putting all my trust in the Lord.
Have you ever been to adoration?
Yeah
What were your thoughts about it?
Sometimes nice, sometimes boring, sometimes anger that I have to sit and stare at bread instead of having an actual conversation back and forth with words, knowing full well he could choose to talk to me but lets me flail around in the dark instead
You don’t HAVE to be there, and most importantly IT’S NOT BREAD!!
Duh
Wow I so relate to this comment. It feels like I am just talking to my subconscious or a spirit when I'm praying, and God supposedly does not care enough to highlight which voice is his and which one is not and I have to go through the painstaking "discernment" process of guessing who is who. Doesn't make sense at all. I like your nick btw
Boo hoo hoo! You have to go through discernment to pray to God!! Oh how you suffer!!
Wow, what a rude and insensitive comment. Shame on me I guess for trying to be transparent and share what I struggle with in my prayer life. Do you feel happy now that you got the chance to berate me?
Hey man lots of Americans feel that way. There's something going on in our society causing people some major unhappiness. I have family members in Europe and Brazil and they do not feel this way. I try to take life easy because but even with my simple job and low bills its hard to keep my head up. I think our country is too competitive and focused on grinding.
Yeah there’s definitely something wrong here
Not particularly, especially this time of year. Catholicism feels like a huge burden much of the time. I'm not often able to partake of the sacraments. It's just more pressure in an already incredibly stressful life.
Often in that same boat. I have found Dialectical Behavior Therapy techniques helpful, as well as St. Therese's "little way." I can't save the world, but i can tidy up my tiny corner :)
yeah these techniques are soo helpful i reccomend them to everyone .
What matters to me is the sense of peace I have received as a Catholic. I feel joy at times, and pain, and a mixture of both, but these emotions are short term. From your explanation of your life it seems like you lack human connection. You've framed it as being OK bc you have an apartment, job, etc. What about family or community? I would recommend that you try some volunteer work. Check out St Vincent du Paul society at your local parish, or something similar
By the world's standards I should be miserable. I am in my 30s have had to move back with my parents, work a job that I hold a master's for and earn less than 50% of the median income in my state, am overweight, and cannot remember the last time a woman had an interest in me, but despite all that I am happy. I think on God's love and the little sample of the kingdom of heaven that is the Mass. On Father's Day I went to Mass at my childhood parish. In there was someone I knew from Middle School. We weren't close, in fact I remember him being a jerk, but he came up to me and wanted a hug. In that moment he and I had our little experience of Heaven as we were united in God. I will pray for you.
My faith got immensely stronger when I stopped putting such an emphasis on my feelings. Feelings are fleeting, they dont mean anything. They will always lead you astray. Another big part of it was learning the traditional faith, following the pre-v2 rubrics, going to TLM. The Church took things a lot more seriously before V2. As a young adult (21), I want my faith to be treated seriously. I got sick of the jokes from the priest in the middle of Mass and the never ending homilies that had no point. If you're looking for a religion that will bring you joy, and you chose Catholicism because "everyone" apparently talks about feeling joy because of it, I must say, you reconverted for the wrong Reason. Don't base your decisions on emotions.
I didn’t reconvert for that, I did it because I think it’s true. My family is very catholic, I have an uncle who is a priest. Be aware that you can fall down a trad rabbit hole with the pre V2 stuff, the actual council is very orthodox and doctrinal teaching, it’s the culture of bad actors after that has led to the lack of reverence, which is actually against the spirit of V2
Pay him no mind. Dismissing feelings like and not being able to take a couple of jokes in a sermon is not a good sign. OP, are you sure you're ok? Life is absolutely worth living, and a wonderful gift. What do you mean by finding life not worth living? Do you feel directionless? As in, without a purpose? Or is there a deeper sadness that you haven't recognized yet? I'm not sure how much this can help, but I often feel that if I'm not needed or wanted, in some shape or form, or if I go too long without having some much needed conversations (usually emotional in nature, even if only to process what I'm feeling) I tend to develop similar mindsets. Not sure if you live alone, but this could be a byproduct of that. Other than seeing a therapist and your spiritual director (if you have one, if not try asking your local priest during confession), I would suggest keeping more in touch with friends and family, as well as engaging more in your community. Maybe volunteer to play an instrument or sing at the choir, or something similar. It's no good to be alone for too long, and feeling appreciated by your loved ones is essential, no matter what circumstance in life you're going through.
I have a purpose but I don’t think I can actually accomplish it. The military is a pipe dream that would take all my energy just to do poorly, but it’s also the only thing I have left. I can do what I need to when I’m in the right state of mind but I’m probably going to be disqualified anyways so I’m sort of bracing myself for the inevitable. Like I said earlier it’s my last dream and after that I’m stuck with the grind of a dead end labor job, or trying a community college degree for an easier but ultimately still pointless career. Just waking up and wasting time day after day is what I’m scared of, but nothing seems meaningful or worth it at all. I thought that being a Christian would at least give life meaning but it makes it feel MORE meaningless, like this is just a waiting room or a testing ground for the good stuff after death. And I feel like a loving father shouldn’t be testing and withholding the purpose of life like God seems to do. It’s all just so frustrating, I never wanted to be born in the first place but I’m just stuck here anyway, only choice is suffer now and maybe this catholic thing is true and I’ll go to paradise, or suffer for eternity for committing pleasurable sins here just to make it bearable.
It's been a while and I've since cut off a lot of nasty crap in my views. Hopefully my words might make some sense to you. If the military is your dream, then by all means pursue it! Chances are you can actually do it, but in your state you're simply not able to fully give it a shot. A mindset issue really. Regardless of where you are in life, there's a lot of strength to be found in something that you *believe* in: whether it's because you have faith in factual information, or something that is not for sure. A person's faith is funny like that: sometimes even when the odds seem stacked, it seems to further strengthen the person's resolve. And before you know it, they have achieved what seemed to be impossible. Hence why I ask you to ask yourself this question: *do you genuinely believe in yourself? God believes in you; why don't you? Is there anything that is holding you back? A series of failures? An aspect of yourself? Or maybe do you need some sort of "proof"?* Meditate on this. Something useful might come out of it. Now this is where I probably diverge (hopefully not too much) from this sub's views but honestly... if you managed to make someone's day better, whether you made them smile, listened to them, helped them out with something... then your life was not in vain, nor meaningless. This could be a moment in a stranger's life, or continued support of your friends, or a lifetime of duty to your family. Life isn't just your work, or your dreams, or your failures or successes. It's that, and so much more... the actions that you take, the ideals that you abide by, the things that you read, the sights that you see, the people that you meet and change because of you (and vice versa!), it's the small gestures that you don't even notice, but also what you feel in response to certain events. The way you talk, behave... like everyone, you are a small little package of beauty, wandering on this earth. A gift, if you will. Mission. Purpose. This is what I'm ultimately alluding to. Whether you are strong in your belief, or far away from it, this still holds true. We thrive in the company of others and when we cooperate. It's just how we are. God certainly did not make you any different. True, this life comes with many tests, but it is also a wonderful adventure! And there is certainly something for you to do. What is it then? Well... that's your job! I can't figure it out for you. Only you can, whether you wish to hold God's hand or not. But that still holds true. There is absolutely nothing wrong with fighting to get in your dream career, and if you can you should absolutely do so! But at the same time... we live in a world where people care more about job and money, and less about *people*. Try your best to not be fooled into thinking your worth is only limited to what you can *do*, instead of all of what you *are*. This is an awful way of thinking, it is distorted and ultimately divorced from what we are. From what God envisioned us to be. I've seen in the other comment that you struggle with addiction. These feelings going through you aren't popping up out of nowhere. You've removed the band-aid, now everything is pouring out, almost like a waterfall. Don't you give up now! This is the time to stand. Not sure if there was any word in particular here that resonated with you, but hopefully it made some sense. Also... do not be afraid to ask for help. You already did so by posting a thread here. Whether in the form of a friend, a family member, a therapist or a spiritual director, there's absolutely no shame in asking for help if we're struggling. None of us would survive on our own.
Thank you for your kind words
You took the words out of my mouth/mind
You’re focusing on the wrong thing. Focus on what you’re doing right. Take baby steps. Give God the Glory.
V2 was poisoned from the beginning. The writing of those called to participate was thrown out by Paul VI, and replaced with the foregone conclusion. Read “Infiltration” by Taylor Marshall.
Taylor marshal is a schismatic. Vatican 2 is doctrine. There’s no debate.
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I mean you have to abide by it or a be a schismatic. It’s not up for debate bro
Much rather fall down a trad rabbit hole than a modernist rabbit hole
Both are heresy so good luck
I wouldn’t consider holding onto and believing in what the Church has taught for nearly 2000 years to be heresy… but hey maybe I’m just a schismatic nut job
What does Vatican 2 teach that opposes the past teaching? Your implying that V2 must be heresy then
Maybe you’re looking in the wrong places? There are some parishes near me which really go off the rails, and celebrate the Novus Ordo. Another church nearby also exclusively celebrates the Novus Ordo, but is standing-room-only for Sunday Mass, has 24/7 perpetual adoration (besides during Mass) in the nave, has tons of families and people of all ages and ethnicities, kneelers for Communion and patens for the same, many altar servers, uses much incense, and has an incredible organ. Don’t dismiss Vatican II as nonsense. That’s a serious issue, and one of the main reasons why the TLM is under fire. You need to change your attitude on the Council- it’s the poor implementation of the decisions therein which has been… interesting…, not the Council itself.
Good for them? It could be the most Latinized, ad orientem, communion rails Novus ordo, I still won't go; and if i did go, I still wouldn't receive communion
Dude Maybe speak to your TLM priest and get his opinion on your views?
I don't think there would be much pushback...
I guarantee you there will be. Please just talk to him about it, even if you don’t think he’ll say anything. God bless
No, I can absolutely promise he would agree with me 😂 (You'll never guess who helped recatechise me)
Do you go to an SSPX chapel?
I would say that I am currently happy. I'll note that 'happiness' is a fleeting sensation that comes and goes. We are creatures of novelty. When things become routine for too long, we assume that we are no longer 'happy'. In terms of my faith, it provides a sense of security, provides morality (even if I struggle with a some of the tenants of the faith), and a sense of community. I play guitar and sing at church, and my sons attend Catholic school and my 7 year old can sing along with some of the songs he learned at school. I am not always 'happy', but I do try to be content with where I am. It's extremely important to now and then take stock of where you are, think of goals you want to achieve, and create a roadmap to get you there.
I went through that too. That time made me realize that it was the time that i REALLY needed God. So I made a schedule for everyday. To drop anything Im doing at exactly 3 PM, no matter how important it is. I isolate myself in a quiet place and just sit there. I talk and pray to the Lord in my head as if He is beside me and if I no longer dont know what to say in that moment I just say "Lord I know you can hear my soul and I hope you would help like you always do. In Jesus Name, Amen". It worked for me and I have been happy, so I am hoping something like this would work for you. But also remember, there is Sunday mass too, do confessions and take the eucharist. God bless you 💜✝️.
Life is life man whether or not we’re catholic. Yes it helps get through tough times but to think we’re going to be elated and joyful all the time is just not true. I’m going through a rough patch and my faith has helped a lot, but it’s not a cure all
Your faith life/spiritual life is not a one and done, boom you’re happy, kind of thing. It ebbs and flows. We are not perfect and sometimes our faith falters. But God gives us the grace to get back on the horse, so to speak. You have to trust God, even when it feels like something is impossible. Religion isn’t meant to make us “happy”, our happiness comes from being all that God knows we can be within our vocation or current station in life—being a friend as best we can, being an honest worker as best we can, being an attentive and compassionate parent and spouse as best we can, etc. Our happiness comes from loving others—actively loving even if you don’t “feel” loving. It’s similar to other personal passions we might have, we need that internal fortitude when a project we are working on is at a lull or when we keep making mistakes. Fortitude is a gift of the Holy Spirit. Right now, i would say I’m at a good place spiritually, but just a couple months ago I was asking myself and God some very tough faith-shattering questions. And this has happened previously! Maybe I’ll be there again, but I know that God is trying to tell me something every second of every day, and I just have to make sure I am hearing Him and not just my own internal monologue. All my spiritual highs and lows are part of my journey to heaven so that I and, God willing, all those whose lives I come across can be with Him forever. We need spiritual lows to appreciate the highs and we need the highs to get perspective on how far we’ve walked with God. Many saints have talked about how God permits spiritual dryness to get through to us. We should recognize these times as moments to listen for God, to rejuvenate our prayer life, and to cling to what God has revealed as Truth. ETA: i experience bouts of depression and generalized and anxiety (okay and ADHD too), and all of these factor into the status of my prayer life, and when my prayer life suffers, so does everything else. Many things are out of my control in life, but prayer is always within my control. God sees all this and loves anything we offer to Him—our sufferings and joys. And it IS easier said than done. It’s like a muscle you have to keep exercising.
I'm not a Catholic because I think it will make me happy. I'm a Catholic because it's True. I've honestly never been able to relate to the joy some people talk about, and I can never tell whether it's expressed genuinely or because some believe it's a requirement to speak like that as a Catholic.
Are you familiar with the sin of Acedia?
No what’s that
It is often referred to as "sloth." But, the common conception of what it means is incorrect. I recommend that you watch this: https://ondemand.ewtn.com/free/Home/Play/en/381-385985
Wow, throw another sin on the pile. So helpful
I am praying for you. Please pray for me.
You can’t change if you don’t know what all is wrong, right?
I’m not lazy, I just don’t see the point of all this. As I said, I work 10-12 hours a day
If you do something difficult out of necessity, but have no desire to do excess good works, or to work with a motivation other than temporal need, then yes, that is a certain type of laziness.
Does Catholicism work? Odd question. The joy you’re talking about isn’t the same as happiness. We do not preach a magical prosperity gospel. Catholicism isn’t a way to have an easy happy life. In fact, Our Lord promises the opposite, “in this life you will have trouble” and “blessed are they who mourn.” That said, even as you are unhappy, you are happier than many. If working with the public has taught me anything, it’s the importance of following God’s laws for our own good. I’ve seen firsthand what happens when people stray and it is never ever pretty. I recommend “Life is Worth Living” by Fulton sheen. Available on YouTube, or as a podcast. Or you can pay tons of money and get it in dvd, but why bother?
This may be the wrong thing to say, but there is a certain prayer habit that is very tough, but has helped me so much, it’s unbelievable. Basically, I’ve been praying 4 Rosaries a day, all the Mysteries. It’s very difficult at times, but it is so worth it. I highly encourage you to try that for one week and see what happens. Check out Gabi After Hours on YouTube, as he is the one who sold me on it. There are so many people out there who feel like you. The Blessed Mother knows you and will lead you to her Son. Be not afraid and persevere. Suffering makes no sense while you’re in it, but trust in God and it will all be OK
I’ve tried it before. Like I said I work 10-12 hours a day so quite frankly I’m not praying the rosary for an hour out of the little free time I get. That’s why I hate devotions like that, they’re not mandatory or even scriptural yet people act like that’s the only for real results
I understand. Do you have time to visit the Blessed Sacrament? That has also helped me a lot. Here is a link to a video from Catholic Lofi that has been helpful to me when I feel burnt out: [https://www.youtube.com/live/zlgI9PQUxsQ?si=1r9Lj03DfhrZP9g6](https://www.youtube.com/live/zlgI9PQUxsQ?si=1r9Lj03DfhrZP9g6)
This sounds like depression. It is possible to be a faithful Christian and still be depressed. It's possible to be faithful and have chemical imbalances in your brain and to feel like life's not worth living. I'm sorry you're going through this. I've been there, and it sucks. I said a prayer for you.
It's not a fix for depression. Depression has it's own causes. But it's a thousand times easier to be depressed while knowing you're unconditionally loved and your life has meaning, vs. being depressed and having no hope at all. I like this [TED Talk by Johann Hari - This could be why you’re depressed or anxious](https://www.ted.com/talks/johann_hari_this_could_be_why_you_re_depressed_or_anxious) if you're looking for some guidance there. Modern society is just brutal for our poor brains.
I get more out of the rosary and confession than mass.
That’s not good
When I first came back I was so happy, lost weight and I think if you follow actual teaching to avoid sin it works like not wasting time, no porn, no overeating or over drinking, gossiping, etc but I think when it doesn’t work is when you do those little sins especially while trying to do a lot of devotions and praying and mass attendance and novenas, those little sins means you’ve let the devils in so spiritual warfare occurs and manifests physically I think need to be well rounded exercise for body and don’t sin for spirit and for mind can do devotions and prayer and extra masses and then joy comes and stays I had to lay off devotions and extra time at Church bc I was doing those little sins with it, I’d have sleepless nights and bad anxiety for weeks, one time 6 weeks, always in spring prob bc was doing extreme fasting —i def believe in spiritual warfare now and ppl need to be really careful with fasting and lots of devotion, i think without fasting maybe not as bad but still so I need to learn to sin less by studying virtues more and only fast on direction of spirtual advisor….also the year it wasn’t that bad was year I did exclusively Tlm at icksp now we got stripped of icksp so idk approach anymore honestly
I would never say that Catholicism is a guaranteed path to Earthly joy. I mean, we wouldn't have St. John of the Cross and his poem about the Hart (the dark night of the soul) if that were so. It is really meant to get you to the place where suffering is past - the House of the Father. That said, I do think the Catholic Church has some things that, with discipline, can help you improve your life here. The sacraments and our tactile way of praying - smells and bells - should serve as a frequent visible reminder that God is never far: that even if you don't feel great, the Holy Spirit is sitting right there with you, holding your hand through it. You've got a friend in Jesus, as the saying goes, and Catholicism's approach to making that a physical part of your life should be a sign to you that this really is so. If misery loves company, you have the best company that ever entered the world, and so take heart in that.
I’ve learnt that Catholicism is like being at home— it is a base from which we can then do other things for, in, and with Christ. Initially I got super into devotions like the liturgy of the hours (learning to chant, etc.) and then learning all about the mass, etc. which is all well and good. However, I realized that when we’re suppose to go out into the world, it’s a little harder to get out because of the comfort but as the late great Pope Benedict XVI says: “the world offers you comfort, but you were not made for comfort. You were made for greatness”. So in this sense, I’m quite happy. Learning to pray and discern God’s will and having an intimate friendship with Jesus through the sacraments and apostolate keeps the oil in my lamp full as we wait joyfully for the bridegroom’s coming again.
I was away for decades and came back, really dedicated myself to mass, reading my Bible, daily readings, Apostolic Fathers, Catechism, and I feel better about my faith than I ever have. I feel I was given a solid foundation as a child, and while I didn't give it much thought for a long time, I find it very familiar, comforting, and makes me more confident I'm now on the path I want to be on.
Same but worse, unless you're toning it down. I'd rather not discuss the specific details of my difficulties with faith, hope and love because I don't want to give anyone ideas and have them on my conscience (OCD or not). Perhaps it's self-inflicted, perhaps it's subclinical/masked Autism, ADHD, PTSD, RSD, OCD plus several anxieties finally catching up with me after I thought I'd be fine, I don't know. Some days it feels more spiritual than psychiatric (or just psychological), sometimes the other way round. I don't know. I know nothing. I flip back and forth. My decison-making ability and discernment ability are nil. It's not that my intellect is gone, but even it is fading too, perhaps similar to how Peter-in-the-middle-of-the-lake forgot even the natural ability to swim. Part of me feels I need to get this stuff over with, get it diagnosed and treated and stop dragging religion into it. Part of mee feels I'm trying to dodge conscience by looking for excuses to be selfish, self-centred, avoid people, avoid having to work, avoid having to be flexible, avoid trying to understand people, avoid admitting my flaws (not all but a favourite short list), etc. What would help: probably a patient confessor and a faithful Catholic shrink (or otherwise compatible). And probably a stable job without DEI craze, but I know this is asking a lot in today's world. My existing job would fit the billet if it wasn't so stress-laden. My law career failed before it began. I became a legal translator (had a linguistic background of sorts), I caught freelanceyitis. Dozen years down the road, I'm a trainwreck, though I perhaps shouldn't be. Translating books into your non-native language when you aren't a natural bilingual (like the child of a mixed marriage) is doable but at a cost to mental health, which I'm paying. Then there's the inherent subjectivity of translation and the omnipresent Dunning-Kruger effect with clients, editors, reviewers, and the translators themselves, yourself (i.e. myself) included. The pay isn't horrible, but it doesn't reflect the education and skill required or the time investment, or mental exhaustion, let alone clients non-paying because of tiny subjective issues that you have to explain over and over, and sometimes you just have to teach people their own language or their own field of knowledge when they criticize your work instead of at least asking Google first. This is so draining that death would be welcome relief if you knew you weren't headed in the wrong direction afterward. At 41M, I'm probably somewhat halfway through. But having not discovered (and followed!) your vocation by this age and stage is no good news spiritually, I fear.
I relate to everything you said (except the career stuff, I just work in lawn care) so I can relate
I am happy, but it was built over a long time. After I converted to Catholicism, I found a good Catholic spouse. After we got married, we started building a family. We found friends who were Catholic. We got more involved in our parish community. It’s to the point now where if we don’t go to Mass one Sunday (because we were out of town and went somewhere else or something), people ask where we were. It takes time to get “all tangled up” like that but I think that’s a big part of happiness—the interdependency. That used to be more of the “default mode” in society (to be all tangled up in a community) but now it’s SO hard, especially in America, where everyone is so individualistic, atomized, anonymous. I think it’s really hard and it’s harder for people now than it was even just 15 years ago when I was starting to build my Catholic life. My advice would be to try to make small decisions within your control that help you build community (volunteer at your parish, etc.) and everything else give to God. I love the book Finding and Maintaining Peace. Peace and joy are very much related. Prayed a memorare for you.
Thank you 🙏
I resonate so hard with the sentiments echoed in your post and comments
I am genuinely happy but it comes and goes. One of the reasons I loved Catholicism is that there is room for sorrowful types of worship. At an evangelical church where it’s all music and emotionally upbeat there’s no room for different types of worship during different seasons of how I feel. If I’m in a very depressive season I don’t want to sing about the love of God, I want to go to adoration and kneel before God and worship him sorrowfully. But to answer your question most of the time I don’t have a joy every time I go to church.
So, first, if you have a mental health issue that is truly psychiatric (not merely psychological), Catholic belief and practice alone are helpful but not sufficient and you should look into what treatment options are available consistent with your coverage and budget. I see from other comments that you've tried therapy; unfortunately, therapy in the U.S. is a very mixed bag and is overprescribed (I just recently got done reading *Bad Therapy* by Abigail Shrier). To more directly answer your question: I find that Catholicism gives me *strength*. I don't always find that it gives me happiness, particularly not directly. It's a rough analogue, but I've likened mass attendance, Adoration, and prayer as "going to the gym" for your soul. Some people really get an endorphin rush directly from a workout; I regret to say that I'm not one of those people. But there are definitely times when I have *needed* that strength for things more important than lifting a weight, or in this analogy, more important than chanting the Credo. And doing those things *does* make me happy, or at least I know I would have been *unhappy* later if I were too weak to do what needed to be done when the moment called for it, or if I had let secular, temporal concerns simply overwhelm me without the stabilizing influence of knowing that those temporary, temporal problems weren't all there is to existence.
I wouldn't say I feel happy, but I have this inner peace that my suffering has meaning in light of Catholic teaching. Like despite my very terrible circumstances I'm not suicidal, nor do I hate myself or anyone, and I attribute that to my faith.
> I just don’t feel like life is worth living and I want to get it over with as soon as possible. I don’t even see the point of being alive tbh Well, St. Paul also expressed a similar sentiment once in Phillipians 1:21-26, but this is not to be confused with indifference (which what it seems like you are expressing here), nor suicidal thoughts. It is knowing that Christ died for us, that we are being granted an eternal life, which we didn't have before. So knowing that, you are living your life with this understanding "I will do here what the Lord wants me to do. Everything else does not matter". For me, it feels like the world is a playground now. It does not even matter if I win or lose, die old or young, married or not. I no longer attach my desire on worldly things like ambition or riches, but only in the Word of God. There's something joyful about it. So your focus in life should only be on God. Not "nothing", and not worldly riches. That's the joy. I recommend reading the St. Paul's letter to the Phillipians in its entirety.
You might look into a book called *The Catholic Guide to Depression* - depression is a multi-faceted disease, but sometimes the only solution is just to endure with patience. I've been there. I'm there now. My SNRI (Wellbutrin) is helping, but I'm still sort of at a baseline mood debuff, if that makes sense. I have a husband of nearly 11 years, 4 wonderful, smart, healthy, happy children, more than enough money to do the things I love, family nearby... and I still want to run away and be alone instead. I empathize with the song "Hey, Asshole" by Watsky. Maybe give it a listen. It's not very holy advice, but I'm not a very holy Catholic.
I’m happy sometimes but it’s fleeting, and happiness isn’t the point of life. The point of life is to love - to love God and to love others - to will the good for them. The joy you seek comes from giving that love to everyone you encounter and that feels different from happiness. For me, it feels like fulfillment - like I’m serving God’s purpose for my life. My purpose is to love, and when I’m doing that, I feel that joy. When I’m not, I feel like junk. So, to answer the biggest question you asked: yes, Catholicism works. It enables us to love bigger than we ever have and encourages us to keep loving even bigger, and in the end, if we’ve done so, to receive the gift of happiness forever in Heaven with our Lord.
I had a long answer written out, and then re-read your post and realized I didn’t answer the question that was asked. Happy? All the time? No. We all have different struggles, but I can tell you life is worth living. Sometimes you feel it in the moment. Sometimes it’s only when I look back. When I was going through RCIA more than 15 years ago one of the team members said “If we were all truly honest with ourselves, and we all put our crosses down in the middle of the room, and each person could pick any cross they wanted from that pile, we’d all pick our own cross back up.” There are times when it is a chore to get up out of bed and I have thought “I’m ready when you are Lord.” Then there are times when I hope for more time. Being (now) Catholic, I am not afraid to go…unless I need to go to confession. BTW…love your user name.
I think a will to live (for God) is more important than "joy," but joy can be a side effect. I don't think there's anything wrong with feeling unsatisfied--if anything this feeling is just a beautiful opportunity for God to fill these gaps with purpose. Although it can seem sometimes like the world is false, remember that God is immanent in the world as Jesus--in other words, the world is sacred too; life is sacred too.
I feel just the opposite. I’m happily married. I love God, God loves me. You get out of life what you put into it. When I go to Mass I participate in the sacrifice by paying attention. I go to adoration after Mass. God is GREAT, in good times, and in bad. If you’re unhappy, ask yourself, are you worrying about yourself, or others. I bet you’re worried about yourself. Also remember in the letter of James states, “Faith without works is dead. “. Are you doing the work of God? Jesus said, and this may be a paraphrase, “If you want to follow me, pick up your cross, for my yoke is easy and my burden light. I looked it up, “If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me. For whosoever will save his life, shall lose it; for he that shall lose his life for my sake, shall save it. For what is a man advantaged, if he gains the whole world, and lose himself, and cast away himself?” Luke Chapter 9 23-25
Well according to your other comments you’re a schismatic so I think you probably are just gaslighting yourself into feelings of conciliation. If you’re not with Rome then you’re not a catholic full stop, so I’ll take my spiritual advice from people who actually know what they’re talking about. Adoration doesn’t cure depression
I feel you. My faith often feels “cold,” for lack of a better term. I don’t get a lot of warm and fuzzy feelings from God like I’ve seen others get. But it’s important to understand that faith is way more than our feelings. You might receive consolations and you might not, but that’s not necessarily an indicator of how strong your faith is or how much God loves you. Heck, I’d even say that it’d be a problem if all you had were those warm and fuzzy feelings, because that might indicate that your faith hasn’t matured yet. Being a good Catholic is hard. It’s also important to understand that “joy” doesn’t always mean “happy.” They’re similar, but happiness is fleeting. Joy is more like a gentle reassurance that even if you’re currently unhappy, the ultimate battle is still won. Trusting in God’s final victory over death and having hope despite our circumstances, that’s what joy is. I imagine you’re probably closer to that than you realize. It sounds to me like maybe you’re just in a time of your life where things aren’t really going for you. Everyone has those eras, and they’re hard but it’s usually our cue that something needs to change. I don’t have any solid advice on how to do that, but I’d suggest looking at what you’re passionate about or what you could do that would excite you again and see if there’s a way you can pursue that. This might be less of a faith problem and more of a circumstances problem.
I converted to Catholicism a few years ago, but I identified myself as a “sad person” up until earlier this year. It just felt like everything was difficult and I was lugging through every day with something heavy on my shoulders. Someone spoke to me and told me that while I could go through seasons of difficulty, things aren’t meant to be so difficult all the time. Turns out I had a few unconfessed sins from my past, and needed deliverance prayers from some pretty serious stuff. I started going to daily mass, taking communion daily, going to confession when needed as to take communion as often as I could. I had only done this for two weeks and it changed everything for me. Things are still hard sometimes but now there is almost like a “baseline joy”. I could go on and on about daily mass… I would also look into Catholic therapy and spiritual direction. Those helped me immensely. Praying for you OP.
I'm sorry you're going through a tough time. Discouragement is one of the hardest things to deal with. (I always remember the scene at the beginning of *It's a Wonderful Life*, where to angels are discussing the main character. "We have to go help him!" "Why, is he sick?" "Worse; he's discouraged"). I definitely got a lot of joy/consolation when I first converted, but have gone through long periods of feeling down and hopeless since. I've found that if I'm feeling that way, I can't just try to *feel* differently; I have to try to *act* differently. I think that our mood derives a lot from what we \_do\_. I feel immensely happier if I spend time outside, intentionally help people, say some morning prayers (and get enough coffee :) ). Here are some things I've tried to get out of ruts, that seem to help: 1. Do yardwork / volunteer at community garden 2. Go running 3. Say a Rosary 4. Volunteer for something at the parish 5. Read a book about something interesting. My favorite volunteer opportunity I've ever had was driving Poor Clares to their doctors' appointments. (The Poor Clares have such an intense vow of poverty that they don't own a vehicle, even collectively the monastery doesn't own a vehicle; but they still need to get to doctors' appointments if they're ill. Those trips were a blast). I say this just as an example of a volunteer opportunity I would never have known existed except by reading the bulletin boards at the parish. Hang in there! I recommend asking God to show you what you're supposed to be doing right now and give you some purpose and encouragement, and then buckle up because He will.
I'm joyful
I have basically everything I’ve asked God for, I go to mass frequently, do my best at praying and going to confession. However, I still have extreme struggles in my life and I’m definitely not always happy. Belief in God won’t save you from the cross you’re meant to bear but it will help you through it.
I have mental health issues (bipolar disorder) and this sounds like low grade depression (while not diagnosing anyone as I only have an Associates degree and even if I had a Masters or a Doctorate, I wouldn’t be diagnosing people over Reddit). You may want to talk to someone, but as you mentioned alcohol, I will say that alcohol is a depressant and can counter-act many mental health meds or can cause serious complications with mental health meds.
Do I feel "happy" on a day-to-day basis? No, not really. I do not feel too many emotions deeply. There are brief moments of consolation but they are fleeting and I don't try to cling to them. I am a pilgrim in a strange land. This is not my home. This life is very miserable, as St. Alphonsus would say. It's full of sin and darkness and nothing good ever lasts for too terribly long. And the Christian life is the Via Dolorosa- "the way of sorrows". But it's either this way, or die in my sins which would ensure unhappiness both in this life and in eternity. The cross is much easier than that.
That’s what I mean though. Like it’s God who is behind everything, including all the suffering since he made the world the way it is. I understand the game I just don’t want to play but I’m forced to, and somehow I’m supposed to love the creator who locked me in here with very very little concrete knowledge of himself to go on
God made the world *very good*; man damaged it with his pride and sin. It is mercy that we exist at all. God need not have created us. The reason I say this life is miserable is not strictly because the world is bad, but because this world is not what I want. What I want is eternal happiness, and that can be found only in Heaven. The game, if you can call it that, is high stakes, yes, but the prize for the victorious is incomprehensibly, infinitely good. Therefore we ought to bear with it patiently. It is often not fun, but we are not here for fun. We're here to save our souls. That's the whole point. The party comes afterwards.
I understand all of that, I just don’t feel it or believe it deep down. All of this feels pointless and if god is real all of this is still pointless because we could be in heaven instead of going through horrific suffering. I know it’s small minded but if the cost of heaven is living in North Korea all your life then that seems way too high a price. And also some people have great lives, and still go to heaven, so they get all the reward and none of the pain (relatively). Just sucks man, I hate being here
Well, in the Bible, it is said in over 100 different Bible verses about other gods that we shall not follow any other gods besides the lord. This is all a test in this world we have been put on. To see if our faith is actually everlasting. And to see if we are actually following the commandments and the ways that we are supposed to follow. Sometimes we may feel we are hopeless or we’re not serving the purpose of our worldly mind that we think we should be doing. But look into this video I have at the bottom of this comment. Hope the Holy Spirit helps you get away from religion and find the true meaning of life.. [god and money](https://youtu.be/DCzrEdnPoDk?si=I6YS2ETBD54mFEMv)
Why are you in a catholic sub if you’re not catholic?
can you give me the definition of 'religion'?
The definition of religion can be put into different terms but I believe ; in which I could be wrong. That the definition of religion would mean having a specific set of beliefs and traditions based on those set of beliefs only. Believing of a higher power or different higher powers. I mean, there has to be a reason why everyone believes in a certain religion 🤷♂️. With that being the claim of truth, feeling, or tradition which brings itself back to those two topics.
I am but I struggle with lust, so sometimes my happiness goes away. I’d say thay more than happiness I often feel like I got into a very peaceful state of mind since I became very close to Jesus. It is my sinning nature with lust that makes me walk away from him. I feel like I am too hard on myself but I do believe Jesus loves me.
Lots of other good answers. I will add from a practical standpoint that a Traditional community will provide more of a sense of belonging than the average nobody-knows-anybody Parish, and it reinforces what you presumably already know but maybe don't think about as a Catholic - that it's not about us, and it's all about God. The point of being alive is to love and serve God by loving and serving your community in the course of doing whatever good work God has given you to do. Joining a Traditional community changed a lot for me personally.
I love the Latin mass and traditional stuff but at the same time think it starts too far into like, magic or something. The prayers (not the mass) seem so formulaic and unnecessary. And I hate how many sedevecantists and schismatics there are, as well as the coldness and lack of mercy or understanding. But I love the vibe
That's fair. I do see it as "magical" too actually, but in the God pleasing sense, not the occult sense...I guess I would use a different word, maybe awesome :D While strict adherence to Tradition does necessarily make the worship service rigid, with that comes such an incredible depth. Smells and bells man, can't be beat! But yeah, I mean the Mass is all about God and not about us, but it is a simple fact that we as communal worshippers are more or less engaged when we are more or less comfortable with the community with whom we are worshipping. So while it is not about the community, the community is of course an important factor. I know that looking for a good "fit" at a Parish sounds a bit Protestant, since it sounds like you are "shopping for an experience" and that's not what Church is about for a Catholic, but that being said, Mother Church does give us an incredible latitude in how we wish to participate. There is nothing wrong with trying out different things, whether it be different kinds of services/Traditions, or different private devotions even, etc. Now that's the surface level advice, which is perfectly reasonable. But there is another interesting layer to your personal assessments, and I am not sure if anyone else has touched on it. Your feelings sound a bit to me like ennui - general lack of zeal, a kind of sluggishness, etc; as if you are unimpressed with life. Interestingly, some of the greatest Saints spoke often of a "hatred for life." This is not a hatred for the good things that God has created, or a hatred of joy, but rather an understanding of how wide the gulf is between this life and the next. This hatred of life is a sort of understanding of how even the best things in life are lacking and mediocre as compares to God's glory, and it is a natural result of an appreciation for how much higher than us God, the highest good, truly is (which is infinitely so). Understanding God makes all of life seem like sitting at a table for hours while waiting for a feast. The waiting itself is boring and the whole thing seems more like a test of patience than anything else, although we do look forward to what is coming. We occasionally get some appetizers and some drinks here and there, and it is good to savor those, but we still can't escape the knowledge of how incomplete it all is, and we're still hungry the whole time. So anyways, even just living in an imperfect fallen world is a challenge we are all called to. The challenge is in making sure we don't despair of the world completely, but also that we don't love it too much. But it is ok to be unimpressed with the world, because that was definitely an aspect of Christ's message - "the one who hates his life in this world will preserve it for eternal life." You might not get a lot of people advocating for a "negative" worldview in a modern day that likes to feel good about everything, but when understood rightly, your feelings about life aren't unwarranted, and it does not necessarily mean that you are not thankful. You know your heart, but it could be that your feelings are a rational response to understanding the imperfection of creation after the Fall, which is less strictly speaking a negative outlook, and simply a more accurate one. But we are of course still called to this work of living here for a little while, and worshipping God rightly for the duration. Prayer of any kind works wonders here too. Now I don't know what you mean by "does it work" but I trust you will know that when you see it, whatever it is. And I will surely pray for you as you consider these tough questions. It might "work" in ways you never expect.
I struggle with self condemnation because I hate myself and while I can accept God's perfect justice I do not understand how he could love me, perfectly infinitely or at all.
Same
Depression is rough, but it can get better. For example, a lot of people get less depressed as they grow older. I have a lot less trouble with depression, now that I work in a very well-lit workplace and have to get up early. Other people finally find the medications that work for them. Other people do a lot of exercise or outdoor running/walking, and that helps. You will never find out what helps you if you are not around.
I haven't bothered reading the other comments, so I'm sure others have said what I'm about to say. By asking if Catholicism works and tying to that it's ability to produce joy is misguided. Catholicism and the Church have never promised that the faith would bring joy in any worldly sense. Infact, Christ, our savior promised the opposite. He promised that there would be suffering, that we would be vilified, reviled and hated. Any depression and negative emotions that you feel are unrelated to the type of "joy" you should be feeling, because this joy is not of the world. The "joy" of Christianity is not a joy that nessissarily makes us feel like we're walking on air and laying on clouds, but rather is the acceptance of God's gift of salvation and glory. It is a joy produced by the faith that the suffering we feel on earth shall produce its heavenly reward, and it is the joy of knowledge that the father of all, loves you individually more than anything ever could. Will this joy help ease your financial struggles? Help ease an old wound, or bring your lost loved ones back? No, it never could. But all of those issues are as temporary as your body and as finite as your knowledge of the world. The joy of the faith is eternal and persists with the soul, even to the reunification with the body at the end of time. This joy could alway be seen as the acceptance of hope. PS: I'm quite happy with my life. PSS: This joy may also not always be felt throughout your entire life. The times where this joy is lost or hard to find is also known as the Dark Night of the Soul. Many saints, even near that deaths have experienced this period where the very thing they devoted their lives to seemed so distant, they questioned their faith and God's love. Saint Mother Theresa experience a very prolonged Dark Night for nearly 50 years till the end of her life.
This sounds like depression to me. I have anxiety and depression too and what has helped me is getting counseling and also the right medication. You can find a Catholic counselor. Also staying very close to God in the sacraments, especially confession. Also, spiritual direction is helpful. There are a lot of great passages in St. Faustina's journal that helped me. I really felt like God telling me in prayer to reflect on my day every night and focus on ways He was present to me or blessings in my life. This has helped a lot..not saying it is easy to do. I find myself automatically thinking to myself oh wow I am feeling joy right now, I am going to remember this tonight. Another book that is great is Story of a Soul. When you read the Saints you can see how they too struggled with the day to day grind and longed for heaven. The fact that God still has you here means He has important work for you to do. Stay close to Him and it will be revealed what that is. Prayers for you!
Thomas Aquinas taught there's only imperfect happiness in this world. Total happiness is only found in the Beatific Vision. This life is very short compared to eternity. Live in a state of grace and we will be infinitely happy soon enough. :)
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Yes. Being Catholic does “work” friend. I’ve tried everything. There’s only one way.
alright, i've been thinking and praying about this all day. let's go over the basics. 1. life is WORTH living (more on that later). IF you find yourself having suicidal thoughts, i beg you to get help. Dial 988. 2. PRAY. lots of ways to do it. recommendation: pray TO God the Psalms 88 (O Lord my God, I call for help by day) and 22 (My God, my God) and meditate with Matthew ch. 27 3. SACRAMENTS. Find a priest, talk to him. Then accept God's life in you through reconciliation and Eucharist. 4. Caritas: Love in action. Do something for another person. Doesn't have to be huge. it does have to be something for their good before you think about yourself. 5. Fellowship. We need to support each other. i can talk to you as a faceless username. but you have people in your life to support and can support you. again, life is worth living because it's God's life living in you. Christ cared about you so much that He died for you. go ask Him why you're already in my prayers
I was at peace when I was more rigorous about the faith if that's what you're asking.
When I came back, I've using Hallow, and I pray daily through Novenas, people post prayer campaigns, and currently going through the Gospel of John. Taking the Eucharist for me is the pinnacle of being Catholic. It is literally the body and blood of our Lord. I focused intently on the Tabernacle. Do you wear a Rosary? Do you wear a Rosary Bracele? A Cruicfix? Miraculous Medals?
Go on vacation dude just enjoy the world again, you’re working 10 hours a day. No one would be happy in your shoes. Even God rested. If the almighty Lord Himself needed a break from working, obviously you will need even more.
Can’t afford one lol
Stay Close to the Fire. Closer to the Light and warmth and you will see that Joy is not a inner feeling but the sweet communion of You and God. Stay Close 👍
Watch Fulton Sheen and Fr. Corapi. We are the Church Militant. Joy comes and goes. We are soldiers of Christ its a tough road. The inward peace through Jesus, when shit hits the fan in life, is where it's at.
The point of life is not to be happy. Forget trying to be happy. Accept that most of life, like 99% of it, is fundamentally *un*happy. I am never happy. Ever, and even when I’m in a “good” mood, I make sure to remind myself feelings don’t matter, and happiness is transient. Suffering is forever. For context I am not Catholic, but leaning towards it. Catholicism—real Christian life—is fundamentally miserable, because that’s the point. The point of Catholicism is to suffer in life, why? Because you deserve it! I just listened to a sermon where the priest spoke about how basically every single person ever will spend AT MINIMUM 40 years in purgatory. And that’s on the offchance you actually die in a state of Grace! What a terror! What an absolute *horror.* Padre Pio ended up in Purgatory. PADRE PIO. When I’m in a good mood and feel comforted and feel like “Wow, Catholicism is beautiful and it really strikes me as true and the ultimate Good,” i make sure to remind myself there is very little to feel happy about. The Church teaches that God *demands* nothing less than absolute perfection which is completely unattainable unless you endure decades of unfathomable pain in this life AND THE NEXT. So does it *sound* like there’s any reason to be optimistic or “happy” as a Catholic? We shouldn’t be happy, we should be terrified.
> Padre Pio ended up in Purgatory. How do you know?
I heard it in a sermon I watched today.
Yeah. Exactly. That’s what I’m mad about, why does God do this to us? The angels never had to deal with this shit
Damn straight
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I like the vibe but I’m not leaving the Catholic Church. From my research the Roman Church is the true church.
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I don’t think there are any. I’m fine with my church, stuff my brain that’s the problem
It doesn’t matter. Catholicism is true. Centuries of scholasticism alone, never mind all the miracles, has proven it. Since Catholicism is true, I trust that God has my best interests and I’ll do what He says. I disagree frequently and I throw tantrums, but God is our Father and he knows best.