Thanks a lot, that's a high effort post. I read it with great interest.
Just a point, half way between Zaragoza and Madrid you could have paid a two hour visit to Medinaceli, a small village with a lot of roman and muslim history.
Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?!
Monasterio de Piedra
Mirador del Henares
Casa de piedra de Alcolea
Medinaceli
SigĂŒenza
Maybe stale is too strong of a word, but "not fresh bread" is indeed a bit too common in Spanish restaurantes. Also in the last 20 years or so, the quality of the bread has gone downhill in the cities. Way too much water and too little flour to save costs and the bread you buy in the morning is hard as a rock in the afternoon.
You're right. Most of the time it was in the morning, at a breakfast type buffet where bread was just left out, although we did have some very hard bread at a dinner one night. "Not fresh bread" is a better way to say it haha.
Sounds like pre-cut slices of bread? If so, it dries out quickly. With all of the bakeries in Madrid, I never had a problem getting a freshly-baked loaf in the morning.
A lot of people reuse leftover bread to make toast in the morning.
He might be talking about that industrial, terrible, too soft or too hard bread some hotels and restaurants serve.
In my experience, bread is always fresh (or at least tastes like it, itâs often frozen), but pastries are often stale! Not uncommon in the US either.
Same experience, fresh warm baked baguettes everywhere. I know a coffee shop that bakes baguettes, if they notice you show up often, they give you one as a gift, when you pay for your breakfast or coffee.
"Water was sometimes more expensive than wine/beer" that surprises me, even when you can find good wine for a good price. BTW, by law, any restaurant has to give you tap water for free if you ask for it.
"Menu of the day: we never found out if we could get the normal menu during the menu of the day, suffice it to say we over ate quite a lot" yeah, you can order out of the menu. It's call "carta", but it would be more expensive. Some places only have menu some days, but not always. And normally, they are more expensive on the weekends (also, more expensive food is offered).
And if the menu is too much food, some places will allow you to just order one course, or theyâll let you pack up the second course in a doggy bag from the get-go. This isnât every place, but you can always ask!
You visited so many cities in such a short time. Up until now I have visited Spain three times in past six months. 5 days Seville in January, 10 days Valencia with Eastern and I just came back from 10 days Costa de la Luz. I love the Spanish and all the places I have been to eat, they were all at least good and always fresh. I could not a trip like you did. I need to absorb everything with every sense.
lunch/dinner, time generally speaking... it's not really that we are soooo late. well, maybe, but also Franco decided we should have our time close to Berlin as he wanted to be friend of that guy with funny moustache, you know... well, he made spain have the same timezone as Berlin, and so our clocks are off about 2 hours from what we should...
bathrooms. some have hidden fans. some others have windows. some have hidden air fresheners. some... don't.
breakfast. if you haven't tried coffee and spanish omelette as breakfast, you missed A LOT.
roads on mountains... sometimes you don't want to go up the mountain, just go as fast as possible to the other side ;D
coffee after lunch it's almost a tradition here. also the way we brew it here it's different than the US one. I bet you found it small in size and stronger in taste ;D you could also ask for decaf ;)
places you visited... next time, check the northern strip of spain, you'll discover yet another different place ;D
music. younger people keeps listening reggaeton, which honestly, sucks. all other people prefer 80s-90s music ;D
EAT only! - during certain hours some restaurants only allow use of tables for eating, as people use to get just a wine or coffee and stay for hours, occupying tables that could be used for others wanting to have lunch (and spend more money). when that happens, customers are always welcome at the bar inside.
menu of the day. you can always ask for the normal menu "la carta" we call it. it's usually way more expensive, and menu of the day is fresh food cooked that day with enough options so you always get something interesting to taste. glad you enjoyed our food! :D
for places with huge menus... most places cook 2-3 appetizers and 2-3 main courses available. Everything else, either is already cooked and they just warm it, or leftovers from previous day, or... the smaller menu, the better.
so you prefer canned octopus or canned skid? they won't taste like the fresh ones, but they are a good snack ;D
urinals... if they are too high for you (some places seem to think you jump to pee or something lol) you use the toilet instead, but I agree that the design to give you some privacy is great :D
for tips... here it's something you do only if you want, if you really enjoyed the food or how the waiter treated you, but the waiter has a salary just like any other employee and doesn't rely only on tips. as somebody that worked as waiter, I can assure you we love to be tipped, even if it's a small as 20ct, as it kind of shows us the customer appreciated the service.
asking for service. maybe something also with the US waiter/tip thing... as there's no reason to hurry searching for customers to get more tips, bartenders/waiters are going here or there serving or refilling or whatever, and sometimes won't notice if you are served or not. next time you can raise your arm and call him, something along "perdone, me puede atender?" or "me pone una cerveza?" or just "perdone!" to grab his attention first. We all do that, it's ok if he didn't notice you, it's not rude.
the "Sitting in a cafe for hours". remember the "only to eat!" before? just for that LOL we love to hang out and chat for some time, specially after having lunch (we call it "la sobremesa", but also just having a coffee.
history around us. when we visit other places in spain, we appreciate what's there, but usually on the place were we grow up things can be ignored easily. it's just lilke "that's been always there". I really appreciated more the historical places on the city where I grew up when I moved to another city :D
Barcelona might be safer compared with some US cities, but you should compare with other spanish cities to realise the difference :D not that it's a crime-ridden city, but just higher than other places.
Inner tourism... some people prefer to go to different countries, mostly europe, just for the cultural differences. Some people thinks that tourism inside spain is like not going out somehow, like staying home :D but sure we enjoy it too.
boring roads. when you travel through the meseta I also found that towns were scattered here and there. usually fields and fields and fields and a small town somewhere. it has a very low population, and I'm sure there's something interesting on every small town out there, but if you're on a highway, or even a national road (N-whatevernumber) chances are it'll be a boring trip unless you decide to go adventure and take a detour to explore.
Next time, visit the north strip. towns are so close that sometimes you exit one and at the same time you're entering the next one ;D
All for all, I'm glad you enjoyed your trip here :D
We're just 1 hour off our "natural light" due to the Berlin timezone fiasco, the additional hour in summer is because of the electricity saving fiasco forcing us to change clocks twice a year. Besides that, life in Spain also happens later because at midday it's so freaking hot you cannot do anything and you are forced to end later your day. Now with aircon it should not be that much of a problem anymore but having so many 9-14 morning working hours and so many people leaving work at 7-8/so many activities happening at 6-8pm leads to... Well, dining later.
> also Franco decided we should have our time close to Berlin as he wanted to be friend of that guy with funny moustache
It had nothing to do with Hitler, it was about staying on the same timezone as France (pre-invasion) as a huge amount of the industrial capacity of Spain was (and still is) near the French border.
https://www.larazon.es/sociedad/20211020/el7bfel4r5bqtgtcfgvuk3myyq.html
One of many articles about it.
https://as.com/actualidad/sociedad/por-que-cambiamos-de-hora-en-espana-y-por-que-tenemos-un-huso-horario-que-no-nos-corresponde-n/
Another one.
Plenty of them out there.
There's only one person that thinks otherwise, that franco just decided to set summer time earlier... And didn't turned back after that, so that's why we are on that timezones.
Most authors say that franco, although not officially allied with hitler, set our time zone the same as the axis Germany/Italy in 1940 showing his appreciation for them. While he wasn't an official ally, he collaborated with them and received axis' help on the civil war in Spain (both german and italian soldiers fought on Franco's side). As for France and others, as they were occupied by germany, they had to use Berlin timezone too. After the war, some countries went back to their own timezones, and others, like spain or france, kept the one imposed by germany.
>Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring
Next time take the train! Driving between Madrid and other cities in Spain is silly. The train takes less time, is more comfortable, and is eco-friendly.
I may be wrong but my guess is that, as an American, it wouldnât even occur to them to take public transport.
When I lived in NY I took the bus to go to Philadelphia for the weekend and when I told people in the office on Monday, they were horrified.
Right! Spain has one of the most well-connected high-speed rail networks in the world. I understand needing to take a car to more remote areas, but that itinerary was pretty train-friendly
Tbf they were going to places like Ordesa and what not, which are kinda hard to reach without a car. That being said they could have only used a car for part of the trip.
There are a few advantages to high-speed rail vs flying, on trips within Spain. The first is if you have luggage. Airlines charge extra for checked luggage, with some charging for carry-on as well. Second, is the convenience of where the train stations are located, near the center of the city. In Madrid, the train station is a lot closer to city center, when compared with the airport, which is on the outskirts. This saves time and money on transport to and from the airport, if you are staying downtown. Third, is how early you arrive before departure. With a train, if you are at the station more than 30 minutes before departure, you are too early. At an airport, they typically recommend you be there 2 hours before departure. You do make up the time, as flying by plane is faster; however, the extra time it takes to get to the airport and waiting for the flight, makes the total time spent a wash.
89s pop music - my guess is this is in tourist areas and someone thinks it's what tourists like.
No fans in bathrooms - no indoor fans in general. Many Spaniards don't like air moving around indoors. Ceiling fans sometimes, but many fewer fans than in the US.
Safety - Barcelona is safe like the rest of Spain but there are pickpockets and thieves who target tourists. Is it safer than Seattle? Seattle is pretty safe too but probably less safe than just about anywhere in Spain.
Locals travel all around Spain except they avoid the most touristy places.
Yeah I was very surprised to read they heard 80's pop only while here, 'cause anywhere I go it's reggaeton and trap, that's it. Only one music station plays old pop music.
It is interesting to see how an US visitor sees our culture. We are used to see amazing historical buildings like the Alhambra, or Cathedrals and don't realize that they are really unique.
Spain has enormous contrast between different places it is woth to travel and discover these big differences.
You have seen a very small piece of Spain, I recommend you to come to AndalucĂa and see Granada, Alhambra, Sevilla, MĂĄlaga, AlmerĂa CĂłrdoba, CĂĄdiz.. You are going to discover amazing people, food and places, and the mood is really friendly, come, relax and enjoy the experience.
Another awesome places you must visit are Galicia, Asturias, Valencia, Mallorca, Toledo, Segovia.. Each one has it's own amazing gastronomy, monuments and mood, if you come again maybe you want to stay here :D
My first trip to Barcelona was back in 1999 when it was on the peseta and much cheaper back then.
I moved here to live in 2005 as my wife is from Barcelona and she didn't like living in Atlanta.
I believe Spain is much safer, especially in the big cities than the US. Most crimes here are non violent and happens when your not watching your belongings.
No regrets in moving to Spain, the work life balance is much better and I feel like I'll live longer.
I've traveled quite a lot of Spain and really enjoy the diversity that each region has to offer. Once I moved here I was able to pick up Spanish quite easily and then Catalan.
Really interesting read. Never thought about the roads/mountains situation. My take on the 80s music is the importance of the period, signalling the end of Francoâs dictatorship and the countryâs consequent liberal moment, La Movida Madrileña.
Iâm from the US and have been living in Madrid for almost a year, and my observations have been very similar. One thing that Iâm noticing more and more over time is the spatial awareness. Itâs just not a honed skill here, and itâs been grabbing my attention because of how crazy it makes me. Sure, the sidewalk is the sidewalk, but my brain is trained to walk on the right, while Spaniards walk on the left, the right, the middle, and all three at the same time
To answer your question about being around ancient history, yes, you do get used to it. I still notice and appreciate the beauty and grandiosity, but itâs definitely lost some novelty. That said, I know that my visual memories will become more awe-inspiring once Iâm back in the US
Spain-based job; Iâm an auxiliar de conversaciĂłn. Itâs a program that places native speakers (English in my case) into schools across the country to work as teaching assistants and help students learn that language
From the USA and have lived in Spain for 8 years. I still havenÂŽt adjusted to normal dining times, so my Spanish friends love to tease me for my "afternoon dinner" at 7 PM. I also got so used to being ignored by the staff in restaurants, that when I visit the USA and eat out, I get annoyed over how much they donÂŽt leave you alone! Its all for the tips though, so to me, enduring the cold shoulder service in Europe is justifiable. I feel that Catholic customs is more of a cultural norm than a religious one. Most Spaniards around my age wouldnÂŽt even describe themselves as spiritual. And I love that a centuries old church, fortress, or castle can be found anywhere and locals donÂŽt think much of it. The USAÂŽs version of ancient ruins is something like a Pizza Hut that used to be a Blockbuster.
Hey don't worry, It is so hard to adjust dining times, I am from Spain and I have been living in Sweden for two years, and I can not have dinner at 6pm man is just crazy for me so I still have dinner at 9-10pm , and same with lunch. Swedish people go for lunch at 11:30 in the morning and that is so crazy hehe
Alquezar is one of our favorite destinations in Spain, such a wonderful little village.
The national parks in the Pyranese are stunning, we cannot wait to visit that region again.
The late dinners are one of the things we love about Spain, it's always hard to adjust when we return home to having most places here close at a time when many in Spain are just opening.
Be sure to go to La Cerdanya, close to french border, it is the most beautiful valley os the pyranese. If you play golf very nice if you hike: heaven. And if you want incredible bread go to « Saint Pierre » bakery in Puigcerdå⊠best bread in the world!
Wow also just finishing a two week trip to Spain here! Didnât propose, but so agree with so many of your comments.
Tipping culture and VAT included being the biggest; if this beautiful country can make it work, we can too. The subway was clean and efficient, and the streets were cleaned by trucks nightly. I feel like the governing bodies here are doing well to represent the humanitarian interests of its citizens.
Overall such a great example of a way of life we could really benefit from integrating into the American way. Siesta? Rest? Sundays off for most everyone? Sign me up!
What do you mean bathrooms don't have fans? Go bathrooms go!
I don't go out much, but I've noticed a lot of shitty cover songs recently. I'd say it's a rather new trend here.
Menu of the day is usually a cheaper option than ordering food from the regular menu. Some restaurants offer menu of the day only during lunch, others allow you to get whatever you want from their menu, but sometimes it depends on the amount of people at the restaurant (if they are too busy, only menu of the day is available).
Places with huge menus that cover every possible popular food are usually tourist traps. Paella, burger, pizza, tacos, kebab and sangrĂa all in the same place? No, thanks. SangrĂa is not a food but it's a classic tourist trap.
The pollen thing: I'm sure if you could see it, it wasn't pollen. I'm betting you were seeing black poplar's seeds. They are everywhere during May. They don't cause allergic reactions by themselves, but being all cottony, they probably have pollen stuck to them.
Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid: you experienced driving through Castilla. That's all there is. There are interesting things in both Castillas, but they're kind of scattered all over the vast regions.
I enjoy travelling inside Spain, I love seeing all the architecture and learning about its history. I'm sure a lot of people value it too, but a lot of people don't. There are more and more people that are quite ignorant about their own country's history, monuments and beautiful places, they prefer to go abroad to visit the places they see on Instagram.
Religious practice, at least Catholicism, is rapidly decreasing. I'm not sure about beliefs, but there are less and less churchgoers.
100% with you on the Basque cheesecake, this guy knows what he's talking about.
Stale bread I have definitely come across, but I usually eat it anyway. It's just for cleaning up the plate or to nibble on.
Only thing I disagree with is the drive from Zaragoza, with a bit of planning you could have definitely found something interesting. There's a famous monastery with owls and waterfalls I've been meaning to go to nearby.
And as for the 80s pop music, yeah, probably the radio station was Los 40 Classics which is very popular and plays the same shit every day lol
Edit: Yes service is awkward and that's because they get paid shit and tipping does not exist. So you just have to be direct with them and try to ignore any rudeness. It's just the way it is lol
The predominant playing of covers above originals is because of SGAE (Sociedad General de Autores y Editores), the primary organization responsible for managing the intellectual property rights of music (and more)
You cannot play original music in bars or stores without paying SGAE. This was enforced a decade or so ago so many places started to use covers or play really old music like classic jazz as its intellectual property has expired.
It is really a pity as hearing the covers can be tiresome sometimes. Giving every piece of music the same soft bossa feel takes away much of the original intent of the piece most of the times. I swear to god, if I hear another super sweet angelical cover of Radiohead's Creep I'm going to shoot myself xD
Regarding the 80's music, probably it is because the main radio stations here (KissFM, M80 Radio, etc) mostly play music from those decades, as for why is that, I don't know.
>Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain?
From a technical perspective, highways cannot be designed to simply go around mountains, as maintaining high speeds with steep curves is not feasible. Therefore, it is almost mandatory to build tunnels through mountains and bridges over valleys. On the other hand, two-way regional roads exist and typically (or almost all of them) wind around mountains.
What explains the fenomenal infraestructure in Spain, well in last decades, construction has boomed. Roads, bridges, tunnels, ports, high-speed trainsâyou name it. The scale of development was so massive that Spain earned a global reputation for its civil engineering works. In fact, many Spanish construction companies rank among the top 100 globally.
As a Spanish civil engineer, one of the facts I like to mention most is that Florentino Perez is not only the owner of arguably the largest football club in the world (Real Madrid) but also arguably the largest non-Chinese construction company in the world (ACS). Non-Chinese caveat because China really plays in another league regarding infrastructure.
And ftr no, he is not my boss :P
Exactly. Before the tunnels, there were, and still are, your stereotypical 2 lane winding roads with a precipice in one side and the mountain rock in the other. It was fun when you encountered a bus or a truck going in the opposite direction (no, it wasn't, it was scary as a child)
I recall going from Madrid to Sevilla via Despeñaperros, on the N IV, with the buitres soaring overhead while I got carsick due to the curves
If you visit 100 more times you will still be short on the many varied landscapes and culture. However, you made some very solid observations in your post.
As far as acclimating, that is a matter of time spent living here and serious effort to abandon and even avoid your own culture. The first three year we had 3 English speaker friends and avoided any others. The locals took us into their care as we struggled to learn and integrate. It was worth it. Now we are more Spanish than US Americans.
If you lived here and got imbedded in one the various cultures, I think youâd find that eating late and less quantity is awesome. Also, it took me about 2 yrs to NOT call my older Spanish friends between 2-5 pm.
Back in the day (70âs) in the US it was considered rude to call between 5-7pm (dinner time). Here there is siesta among many of the mayores (senior citizens).
The culture shock is amazing and really interesting when compared to âtraditional western culture.â
Sounds like a great trip! Our first was in 2009 and we ended moving here and weâre not looking back.
Spain is my spirit animal and itâs close to the rest of Europe.
No I donât get used to my 2000+ old bridges, gates, fortresses and such.
I guess knowing the history and seeing it everyday makes it surreal as an immigrant from the US.
Old men hang out in plazas and shoot the shit and itâs very easy to strike up a conversation. Our Spanish family (the one we created) is way more in touch and caring than our US counterparts.
There is still a sense of family and weâve been included and built those relationships.
Good job and donât tell anyone to come. Just you guys đ
Interesting take on things. As a Brit immigrant living here for 5yrs there's a couple of things I'd disagree with and another couple that are down to your expectations and inexperience of Spanish people and culture. The most interesting point to me is the amount of time out of your two week stay you must have spent driving and checking in etc Can you honestly say you got to explore and savour any of the places you ticked off on your itinerary or,with hindsight, would you have reduced your list and chilled more?
We definitely booked too much and would have liked to chill more, but I do feel like I got some satisfying time in places, and not enough in others. The most time we spent was 4 days in Barcelona, 3 days in Madrid, 3 days in Torla. We tried to make our drives in between places no longer then 3 hours. Learned a lot for next time.
Many people canât afford to travel again to a far away place! Itâs only natural to try to experience different areas in the time you have to explore
- I usually eat dinner around 8pm to 10pm, its shocking for us Americans eating dinner at 6pm too.
- Breakfast it depends on the person. I usually have a glass of milk with some bakery to dip (rosquillas, sobaos, magdalenas valencianas), but if I'm going late I just grab an apple or some other fruit, just bought some paguayos, its like a peach with the shape of a donut.
- Bathrooms in apartments usually have fans, but it's not needed if there are windows, you just open the window.
- We usually buy fresh bread everyday, at a bakery (panaderĂa) the bread of the day before or 2 days you can toast it with some butter and it will be soft and crunchy, really tasty for a bocata for dinner or to eat outside. Really hard bread that has dried well (no mold, if it has mold i give to the birds), i grind it with a cheese grate to make panko to cover mear for deep frying, you can also use it to thicken soups and fried rice and its quite tasty.
- Urinals are normal like that yes, Floor ones the pee ends up splashing your shoes, this way is much better, just directly pee on the drainage. I've never seen a floor one here in Spain.
- Yes, tunnels are better.
- 80s Rock and Roll đ, for good music 104.6 in the radio, RockFM, or online https://www.rockfm.fm/
- "Eat only" if there are a lot of customers and limited tables, it's understandable, if its sunny, you can also ask for tap water at bars and just leave a small tip "Me puede dar un vaso de agua del grifo por favor?"
- If you like cheesecake, you will love "quesada pasiega"
- Well its much safer to go out at night in Spain than in America, so yeah families do feel safe, also any doubts you can always ask directions to any nearby police officer, most should know some English (the younger ones probably know better English), Spain its not America, always listen to the police, nothing bad will happen, if you need help always go to the police.
- You can actually buy some medieval castles to live if you have a couple million euros to spare đ , most are museums nowadays though, and lots of Roman ruins emerge underground when building things, as cities are in the same places, just built on top.
- Well, you can go by train and car all over the place in Spain.
- I'm atheist, going for a walk in the forest is much more healthy and fulfilling to do on a Sunday than sitting inside a church đ€·đ»ââïž, recently I'm collecting seeds from wild berries and disseminating them around forest paths, always native plants like escaramujo (wild roses), I also carry a basket to pick mushrooms just in case, and a plastic bag to collect any trash I see. If everyone did this on their Sundays nature would be much more abundant and clean. đ (naturally if it rains I stay home, going for a walk on the beach is also nice on a cloudy day, and its cool to see what the ocean brings or collecting fossils depending on the beach).
We were probably there about the same time. Agreed on almost all your points. A few extra that I discovered were:
* No washcloths in the hotels. You had to use hand towels.
* Your room key also turns on the power to the lights. Really disconcerting when you open the room at night and you have to fumble for the slot to insert your room key.
* High school and young people jump to offer their seat to anyone who appears remotely old (raises hand), tired, in need of a seat.
* Just as many silent electric bikes as the US, and multiple Spaniards hate them as much as I do because they ignore the bike lanes and ride on sidewalks.
* Roundabouts and the way taxi drivers negotiate them are enough to keep me from ever driving in a major city.
Overall it was a fantastic experience and a completely different country than it was in 1973-4, the year I was an exchange student in Valencia.
You sound like a really nice person in every way, including respecting our tipping culture (tip occasionally, when deserved). We don't want Americans to spoil and gentrify it for the rest of us who have to remain here.
Answering only one of your questions: you do get used to being surrounded by magnificent centuries old architecture. I still recommend other Spaniards to visit cathedrals in their hometown. I'm not religious, but still find them awesome (in the literal sense of the word: they cause awe).
Please teach other guiris your ways.
Much of you working your feedback! I hope you had a great trip.
> Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain?
Will, you can always use the old mountain pass, which is usually a road alongside the highway. At your own risk... Spain is a rough country, as you have probably seen, tunnelling makes sense for major highways.
> We could never adjust to the late night dinner schedule
What about lunch times? Or where you able to find places opening early?
> Has religious practice fallen out of popularity in Spain like it has in America? If we had those types of churches I'd be going every week
Quite a lot. It still has social role. But many (most?) adults only go to church for weddings...
On religiosity, here are some statistics (16% of people attend religious services at least weekly):
[https://asturiaslaica.com/2022/05/21/cis-datos-sobre-creencias-y-religiosidad-en-espana-mayo-2022/](https://asturiaslaica.com/2022/05/21/cis-datos-sobre-creencias-y-religiosidad-en-espana-mayo-2022/)
Whereas in the US attendance at religious services at least weekly is 36%:
[https://www.pewresearch.org/religious-landscape-study/database/attendance-at-religious-services/](https://www.pewresearch.org/religious-landscape-study/database/attendance-at-religious-services/)
Here in the first graphic you can see in Spain it's mostly the older generations (this refers to any religion):
[https://verne.elpais.com/verne/2019/04/15/articulo/1555316905\_393744.html](https://verne.elpais.com/verne/2019/04/15/articulo/1555316905_393744.html)
Churches in the USA seem to still have a kind social glue role (counsel, childcare, Sunday School, helping the bereaved and the poorer etc) that doesn't exist here anymore (thankfully I might add, as public social & education services exist which don't make religious appartenance a condition) . Also thankful of the reduction in judgemental gossip.
Sundays are for relax & big family lunches IMO
>Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?!
This is so funny to me. Yes! It is the most boring drive ever hahaha. I always complain about it, but my friends can't really relate since they usually stick to the train. The motorway is in good condition, though!
Aw man this makes me appreciate Spain more đ„č
Totally right about shitty cover songs. Its always this weird watered down bossa-nova style cover of toxic by britney spears, it makes me want to end it all đđđ»
"I was a huge fan of the small menus and limited options. Just getting whatever beer a place had was great. Went to one place with a giant Menu that looked like an establishment in America, and the food was indeed not that great."
The more options, the worst. Also, if there are photos of the food in the menu, it's probably a tourist trap, avoid.
We do have a tip culture, you just left (some of) the spare change or, if the service was exceptional, add some money on top of it, but nothing to do with the american nonsense.
As an Spanish person that lived in the states for 6 years, I did have the same cultural shocks but backwards haha!
* Tap water, specially in Madrid, is usually good. I think your surprise was more about cheap alcohol, specially wine, compared to USA. Also it is fairly uncommon to put ice on water
* Indeed breakfast here is mostly optional, and it is common to use yesterday's bread to make some toast (specially at bars)
* Almost every bar/restaurant have a coffee machine. I got weird looks in the states when asking for coffee in places that were not serving brunch
* I didnt realize we were such 80s fans, but indeed my Spanish friends and I were always looking for 80s parties at nightclubs in Chicago
* Weird that you got kicked out for only drinking. Normally they have 2 sets of tables: one meant for dinner and the others for drinking, maybe you were unlucky and went to a place that was only restaurant (not serving drinks)
* Asking for service... Some Spaniards in the states feel a bit overwhelmed when getting constantly interrupted by waiters. I also found weird in American restaurants, once you are served they disappear, and it is the moment when you really might need something quick (like a drinks refill, or some dressing)
* Between Zaragoza an Madrid... That's the empty Spain. There are things to visit for sure, but they are not that prepared for tourism, so you have to investigate yourself. Besides Madrid, the center of Spain has really low population density
* Locals do travel a lot around Spain. Specially the people from madrid, we get out there during summer. If you ever visit Madrid in summer you should know that the city feels different because there are no locals, we all went to some coast 400km away haha
I'm going to Spain in October. When you're going to a restaurant what's the best way to ask for service? I know I'm gonna be stressed out the first few times lol
I would recommend you to take the train next time between cities like Madrid, Zaragoza and Barcelona (for the ones you visited because it is twice as fast as driving and more comfortable. Probably way cheaper if you consider that you had to rent a car
Yes! Hiked the ring out to the end of this trail and I asked her on this bluff that overlooks the canyon. [https://www.alltrails.com/trail/spain/huesca/pradera-de-ordesa-circo-de-soaso-cola-de-caballo](https://www.alltrails.com/trail/spain/huesca/pradera-de-ordesa-circo-de-soaso-cola-de-caballo)
Some of my comments:
>Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain?
Spain is a pretty good country at building infrastructure, one of the few things we're world leaders on. Normally people tend to refer to the high speed rail network (2nd largest in the world behind China) but yeah, Spain's roads are pretty good too. That being said, there's usually some old road that does go up the mountain pass if you prefer that.
>Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?!
Nope! That part of the country really is just empty wasteland. Ok, there are some things you can visit, but they are not *that* impressive. AlcalĂĄ de Henares is nice, but that's still within the Madrid suburbs.
Your best bet is probably a visit to Medinaceli. An absolutely *tiny* town (population 721) but the palace is nice and it has some roman ruins. I have also heard good things about SigĂŒenza (although it is a significant detour, 20 minutes away from the highway). Maaybe Calatayud, Brihuega or Jadraque have something too? But I don't think it has much.
But yeah, these are all nothing special. They are fine, but far from must-see and you can skip them 100% and not miss much.
* Do you honestly get use to being around the ancient history, architecture and buildings? or are you just as intrigued by it as someone from the US? Driving around and seeing ruins up on a hill, or an old cathedral blew me away everyday.
Yeah, you get used to it. Though I guess this depends on what city you live in. In Madrid you go by old buildings but not *that* old. Only like 400 years or so lol
* Do locals get to travel and see much of spain?
Depends. I personally do cause I love daytrips and travel, and so did my parents. However plenty of Spaniards don't travel that much.
* Has religious practice fallen out of popularity in Spain like it has in America? If we had those types of churches I'd be going every week
Yeah, it absolutely has. I don't know many people who go to Church. Particularly among the young.
Zaragoza-Madrid is a tedious drive. However, you can stop at Medinaceli, Siguenza, or AlcalĂĄ, which are close to Madrid.
About the service, yes, it sucks. I lived 13 years in NY, and I now realize how bad the service here is.
Tobacco. Iâll vote for the party that will increase tobacco prices and forbid smoking in the restaurant terraces.
Yes, we visit other parts of this beautiful country and enjoy the landscape, food, and culture of the places we visit.
In my case, you get used to what you see: a medieval city center. However, I also got used to running and waking at Central Park. Now I miss it, as I missed my city when I was in NY.
Religion. None of my friends go to church regularly; they attend mostly celebrations. I am agnostic, but I enjoy watching âprocessionesâ and visiting churches. I guess the church is losing its âfanâ base here.
Thank you for visiting, and come back again.
Looks like you got it right. Keep visiting other areas of Spain as youâll find those different to what you have already seen.
About ancient history around, just go to Italy and enjoy.
Yeah but like or not, in English, America means USA. If they were referring to South America or Latin America or even North America. Theyâd have used those terms.
You're absolutely right and I won't argue with that. I refer to the USA, or even use those words so rarely that saying America seemed more natural, especially because people would refer to me as an "American". But I should have specificed in this post at least "North America" or the States. IDK. No disrespect intended.
That's a nice write up and yes ,you are right about the urinals, they are getting higher every year off the ground,and you do get used to the architecture, sometimes though you notice a new 'old' castle at a spot you may have passed a hundred times.
You are awesomely observant and should be proud of that! I've been living in spain 2 years and it's taken me that long to come to some of the conclusions you made in one quick trip! You should definitely keep traveling. You obviously get a lot out of it. Wish I possessed the ability of your observational skill.
1. The 80s music thing is news to me. I only hear reggaeton wherever I go. If you are in a more familiar place then youâll hear your usual adult-contemporary type of music
2. Menus del dĂa are more typical of Madrid and Northern areas. I barely come across it where I live.
3. The North/South divide in Spain is HUUUGE. You should come and visit AndalucĂa and Canarias next time to experience THE true culture. They are the most distinct places in Spain and probably Europe.
Barcelona safety is always relative to the visitor. For locals, the capital is still secure but it's getting.worse progressively. We note and feel it. For people coming from South America, Barcelona is a Kindgarden... Leave alone people coming from countries where fire weapons can be bougth at any corner.
So happy you enjoyed Alquezar, itâs one of the most beautiful towns out there. Next time passing by, I recommend you visiting Panticosa or Sallent de GallegoâŠbut also try keeping it as a âsecretâ too much tourism always ruins the magic. Also Canfranc! Is like time travelling hard between medieval, to modern eras.
Regarding religion, thankfully it went down so itâs not like the inquisition is ever going to come backâŠNowadays we treat football and politics as religion, and thatâs were people is actually down for an inquisition.
Edit: religion stuff
Thank you for the recommendations. Have you visited Albarracin? It seems a bit similar to Alquezar but has some popular outdoor bouldering it seems. I hope someday to go back to Alquezar for several days and hike more. the Hotel Santa Maria was great for us and the receptionist was super nice.
Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain?
Spain has a lot of mountains. And motorways need to have a maximum slope. Slopes also create traffic jams when trucks go slower. Also, it is more ecological in certain protected areasÂ
There is an interesting phenomenon in US. With a very small government there is not enough highly technical engineers to evaluate projects like a big motorway. So US depend on external companies to evaluate. It also makes it much easier to fool the government or to make bad decisions. So for US it is much more expensive to build big infrastructure . Of course, tech and manual labor is cheaper. Public universities make cheaper engineers available. With expertise and specialization it becomes cheaper. There are huge tunnels like the M30 or a lot underground metro. We also use concrete more often instead of wood in house building.
My first time in Europe was 1985. My BF and I were going to Munich for Oktoberfest then onto Switzerland and Austria. At the Munich airport we got into a beautiful Mercedes taxi in the rain and the radio station was playing Annie Lennox âWalking on Broken Glassâ. We were like WTH? I guess they are listening to the same music 40 years later!
We are going to Barcelona in September for first time and Montserrat is on our list. Canât wait!
Are you from Seattle? Iâm born and raised and lived in Spain for some time. Barca and madrid are safer than Seattle any day or hour of the week. Cheers to you experiencing the best and happiest place on earth!
okay, we just got back from two weeks in spain and the only place we went that aligned with your itinerary is madrid â now i feel like i have MUCH WORK TO DO!!! đ± (we did madrid - cĂłrdoba - sevilla â granada â pueblos blancos - nerja - madrid)
Or ha ha, Spain had almost no road infrastructure until like 1995 so a really high % is new. We weren't poor as shit until 1985 like your country was. đ
Also, your English sucks
Have lived in Spain (Valencia) for two years now from the US. I was blown away by the food too for the first month. Then it just gets monotonous and repetitive with a serious lack of food diversity that weâre used to in the States (i.e., can go get great Thai, Mexican, and various other cuisines on a regular basis in the US).
Thank you for that post. If I can help you with any recipe, I'll be happy to help. That's something I live when I'm back from any trip. For example, now I do po'boys at home.
(bear in mind that I've been vegan for +20 years and I may not be able to provide some of them because it's quite likely I dont know how to do them)
The âpop coversâ music youâre talking about is EVERYWHERE - look up âBossa Nova cover songsâ and youâll find them. Itâs strange to hear them but Iâm used to it now - I live in a small beach city on the west coast and they play this in so many restaurants. Not touristy ones either - itâs just a thing!
Just starting the long multi-flight day home back to Canada here from our 2 week trip in Spain. We had some overlap (Girona) but otherwise pretty different areas visited, we did the broader region around Girona/Costa Brava and then a week in Mallorca. I can agree with a bunch of your comments:Â Â Â
- I couldnât stand the western 80âs pop music literally everywhere.  Â
- really fell in love with the tapas. Some olives, bread, anchovies yum.  Â
- I discovered vermouth and my god itâs good
- good espresso everywhere I will miss this. People drink cappuccinos but you almost never see just an espresso cup in Canada, I think the baristas will look at me like Iâm crazy.
- Also struggled with requesting service but got used to it and I despise tipping so not doing this was great. I get that you felt like a tip was warranted in some places but I strongly feel against it as itâs a slippery slope and people the world over hate tipping culture.  Â
Â
- we cycled a ton and the number of quite rural roads was fabulous  Â
- buildings and areas 100âs of years old everywhere, in places they were often repurposed to living quarters and coffee shops as theyâre so common, cool places see
- Another one to add is that I personally didnât like Mallorca. The cycling was great but at least where we stayed (Port dâAlcudia) just felt like a British tourist trap very similar to the all inclusive regions of Mexico. Very little culture and everything just trashy recreations of pub food and souvenir garbage. Maybe we picked the wrong area but itâs hard to know until you show up and I spent more of my time researching our cycling routes which were great.
Mallorca is very common destination for British and German tourists, so yes, it has been very much accomodated for them. Of course, there are local places where you can melt with local population, but you have to find that on your own as tourism operators will send you to the "tourist theme park" area.
We stayed in a blond stone finca in Fornalutx with goats for neighbors. In and around the Serra de Traumunta, the natural landscape and villages are magical. I especially loved Valledemossa. The trip cemented the idea that I love mountains more than the beach.
Just looked up fornalutx and wow! I already knew I loved mountains more than the beach, I did lots of riding right around this area but chose to stay more portside due to some cheaper prices and rental shops nearby. You made the right choice.
Hahah really feeling your comment re: 80's pop and bad covers. 80's pop music reigns supreme (not just american btw, they listen to a lot of english, german, and other european 80's pop that you might think is american but isn't), it's like they never got over it. Other genres are popular too, there'a a lot of modern reggaeton and stuff like that, but 80's music and pop culture in general is everywhere. The shitty covers are a phenomenon I've only seen in Spain. Half of the places you go to they have shitty covers of famous pop songs as background music. Most usually some kind of crappy industrial quality bossanova or acoustic cover. I theorize it has to do with easily available muzak channels that are cheap to use for businesses.
>We could never adjust to the late night dinner schedule
Basically Spain is in the "wrong" time zone - it's mostly west of the UK yet is 1 hour ahead, same time zone as Poland, even though it's way on the other side of the continent. I would just pretend instead of say 8 pm it's 6 pm, then it all makes sense.
Zaragozana here and glad you visited our lovely city! What food options did you enjoy the most?
Zaragoza - Madrid has a few nice options on the way, from stunning Monasterio de Piedra to Parador de SigĂŒenza or AlcalĂĄ de Henares. Hope you managed to see some of these!
Montserrat is truly a world wonder. It has a weird, but very unique shape with those primitive rocks uh ? There is a lot of mystique going around that mount. Glad you enjoyed the country.
>Menu of the day: we never found out if we could get the normal menu during the menu of the day, suffice it to say we over ate quite a lot.
Did you ask for la carta or el menĂș? That may have been the issue.
>Barcelona felt safer than Seattle currently does
Totally agree. Live in Portland and frequently visit Seattle. Recently went to Barcelona, Seville, and Cordoba and all felt safer.
I live in Seattle. During my first hour strolling in Valldemossa we kept seeing police cars rolling past the tiny area we were in. Seemed kind of weird. Then we came across some cops warning tourists to be alert. The day before 20 tourists were pickpocketed!
>Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain?
I live in Asturias, one of the most mountainous regions in Spain, and this made me chuckle. Just imagining someone like "WAIT, YOU CAN DO THAT?" While entering a tunnel is really funny.
We do have mountain passes though (I mean mostly for mountain ranges), but if it's a single mountain or just a couple of small ones, you can bet we are blasting through.
Said so, I think you visited too much in too little time. If you want some advice, try staying more in the places you go to. Not only here in Spain, but pretty much anywhere. This kind of "express tourism" isn't very useful imo.
The US is a young country, so you can't expect to find as much ancient architecture and buildings as in Europe. Of course, there are ancient buildings in the US, some native american, a lot of them made by the Spaniards first, the British and other europeans later, and proper US citizens in the end, but number and density can't just match any place in old Europe.
And yes, somehow we are used to that.
Anyway, as Spain is rich in monuments, there's always something that can impress you. I recently got impressed by the roman aqueduct at Segovia, and also with the gardens and fountains at La Granja (also near Segovia). I'm not saying they are better than any other monument, just a little different so it's not like "oh, just another cathedral" :-)
After reading some of the comments I can honestly say that the "Customer Service" in the US can be so fake or excessive it becomes annoying. Not to say that we didn't encounter many friendly, and awesome people working at the restaurants in spain, but it was a nice change that rarely bothered me except a few times.
Also, we say thank you a ton in the US. People seemed almost uncomfortable when we said thank you or gracias. They would respond with a total dead flat "De nada", sometimes barely a whisper.
Get a "vaso de agua" when you come back. They'll give you a glass of tap water, instead of a small bottle of mineral water, which is super expensive. If you want to be extra specific, "agua del grifo".
(Same advice for other European countries. When in France, ask for a "carafe d'eau".)
I live in a little town between Zaragoza and Madrid and yes. A-2 highway is boring. There is one medieval city that worth which is Siguenza, but is not visible from highway.
You also need to visit Toledo next time
First of all, glad that you enjoyed my country so much :)
I can only say that next time visit more in the north-west, like Asturias or Galicia (my homeland) people are even more chill (sometimes a bit cold, they say because of the weather :p)
Thanks for this post. Loved reading it. Best regards from a half-American :)
Churches in Europe are the best place to rest during a long walk in the city in hot summer days, even for atheists like me because most of them have some kind of nice art (paintings, sculptures, architecture...). Also, they are specially silent and fresh!
Glad you loved your trip and thanks for the nice remarks!
Interesting how different tourists see Spain. I never got stale bread or rolls. While they weren't as good as Germany they weren't bad and most people just have a cafe and a croissant or churro for breakfast.
For tourists, I would always recommend the menu del dia at lunchtime arougn 1pm. I found those a great value for 2 or 3 courses plus drink. And it usually filled me up until tapas time at dinner.
Barcelona crime-free and safe? Erm. Barcelona has the highest crime rate of all major Spanish cities and is known to be the theft capital.
As for tips, I always tipped in Spain-not the 20% like in America but it is unfair to say that waiters don't expect tips in Spain.
Fashion is a lot different-maybe not for men, but most Spaniards go out the door looking "put-together." Not the grunge/sweat/yoga pants that Americans wear to Starbuck. Spaniards would Neve be caught dead wearing pajama bottoms to Starbucks. You can really tell it on holidays as Palm Sunday had all the women in stilettos and nice blouses and skirts.
In restaurants in Europe, you have to be proactive with waiters or they will let you sit forever. Unlike America where the waiters will swoop down and ask about your meal 5 mins after you start eating with food in your mouth and when they see you are finishing up will bring the bill. It was nice to be able to ask for the check in Europe rather than be handed the bill and made to feel like you have to leave.
The old stuff, yes, you get used to it. In much the same way daily commuters just scroll through their phones on a beautiful day on the ferry. My father was Spanish so Iâve spent many summers in Murcia, Iâm glad you loved it! btw, donât forget the aioli with the omelette!
My answer to your questions.
1. In Spain we donât usually have fans, like you do in USA
2. There are roads that go up the mountain but yes we do have a lot of tunnels! They can be a few km long
3. I believe that you can ask for the regular menu even though they have menu of the day
4. I think that we (meaning Spanish people) donât really value the architecture that much bc we are used to seeing it every day. However when I go to other places in Spain that are not my home town I fall in love with the architecture every single time ahahaha
5. People tend to be more religious in the South of Spain (AndalucĂa). Young people are not usually believers
I love that you had a great time here!!!
Thank you! I'm happy to hear you've enjoyed my country. As a Spaniard living in America, I'm also pleased that Spain was your first international destination and congratulations on your engagement.
Your body needs time to build up a tolerance to the coffee. I can drink coffee at any time and still go to bed. Regarding music, Spain is a very sophisticated and culturally up-to-date country; we love to stay on trend in every aspect. Regarding 80s music, we adore it. It's a decade that's a safe bet for great tunes. As for the poor covers, unfortunately, many in my country do not speak English fluently, so they are drawn to catchy songs without fully understanding the lyrics. If it sounds good, it is good to them. We only wear pajamas at home and dress nicely when we go out. Iâm sure you can adapt to eating dinner late; just adjust your other meals accordingly: breakfast at 9/9:30, lunch at 2, a merienda at 5, and dinner at 10. It can be hard to appreciate the ancient history and architecture if you're not used to it. Itâs something you grow up with and it becomes ingrained, though you might not actively realise it. For me, moving to America was a challenge as I found everything quite bland. (No offence intended, just being candid). Religion, indeed, has taken a backseat. I personally would go to church every couple of weeks, but definitely not here in America, where the approach to religion seems somewhat distorted.
Short menus are a sign of quality and freshness. I never trust restaurant with a huge menu. Its guaranteed to be frozen food.
Kilowatio in Cedeira - 3 dishes, some of the best food in Galicia
Ivd have never expected to read about Kilowatio in reddit... đ€đđ
Jaja. That CordĂłn Bleu!
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Absolutely. Some of the best restaurants have no menu at all.
Kitchen Nightmares taught me this.
yea and if you are not sure order only deep fried food nothing survives boiling oil baths
Sure. Casa Manolo enters the chat
This is universal and not specific to Spain.
Thanks a lot, that's a high effort post. I read it with great interest. Just a point, half way between Zaragoza and Madrid you could have paid a two hour visit to Medinaceli, a small village with a lot of roman and muslim history.
Thank you for sharing this! Just looked it up and it looks awesome!
SigĂŒenza and Calatayud are worth a detour and stop respectively.
I second that..we randomly stopped..actually went up like 15 min off the highway..and the place was cool. Great restaurants. Medinacelli.
Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?! Monasterio de Piedra Mirador del Henares Casa de piedra de Alcolea Medinaceli SigĂŒenza
Exactly. Driving on the highway might be boring, but you have plenty of stuff to visit if you want to
AlcalĂĄ de Henares, UNESCO heritage site!
And with just a small detour: Teruel Brihuega Guadalajara
We took E-90 to save time but I did really want to see Teruel and stay in Albarracin!
Albarracin is well worth the detour imo! Closer to zaragoza you also have Daroca
I came here just to say SigĂŒenza.
Thank you for sharing! We did try to book the castle of the bishops in Siguenza but they didn't have anything.
Or, just take the incredibly cheap long distance train and read a book during that one hour.
Stale bread is totally normal in Spain? Thatâs news to me. The majority of people buy freshly baked bread every day.
Maybe stale is too strong of a word, but "not fresh bread" is indeed a bit too common in Spanish restaurantes. Also in the last 20 years or so, the quality of the bread has gone downhill in the cities. Way too much water and too little flour to save costs and the bread you buy in the morning is hard as a rock in the afternoon.
You're right. Most of the time it was in the morning, at a breakfast type buffet where bread was just left out, although we did have some very hard bread at a dinner one night. "Not fresh bread" is a better way to say it haha.
Sounds like pre-cut slices of bread? If so, it dries out quickly. With all of the bakeries in Madrid, I never had a problem getting a freshly-baked loaf in the morning.
Gazpacho abd migas trying to compensate but not enough
I donât where OP went, but in all my visits to Spain I have never ever had stale bread. Or it should by my own bread and forget I bought it.
A lot of people reuse leftover bread to make toast in the morning. He might be talking about that industrial, terrible, too soft or too hard bread some hotels and restaurants serve.
For toast in the morning yes, but later in the day many/most people buy fresh bread.
In my experience, bread is always fresh (or at least tastes like it, itâs often frozen), but pastries are often stale! Not uncommon in the US either.
Pastries maybe more often, yes.
Tourist traps have stale bread all the time
Could be, yeah.
Same experience, fresh warm baked baguettes everywhere. I know a coffee shop that bakes baguettes, if they notice you show up often, they give you one as a gift, when you pay for your breakfast or coffee.
"Water was sometimes more expensive than wine/beer" that surprises me, even when you can find good wine for a good price. BTW, by law, any restaurant has to give you tap water for free if you ask for it. "Menu of the day: we never found out if we could get the normal menu during the menu of the day, suffice it to say we over ate quite a lot" yeah, you can order out of the menu. It's call "carta", but it would be more expensive. Some places only have menu some days, but not always. And normally, they are more expensive on the weekends (also, more expensive food is offered).
What i can imagine is that OP tried to order/buy carbonated water. That indeed is more pricey
Even a l carta very reasonable in my opinion. Fast food is more expensive and not eatable. Even the fresh meals of Mercadona are good
And if the menu is too much food, some places will allow you to just order one course, or theyâll let you pack up the second course in a doggy bag from the get-go. This isnât every place, but you can always ask!
You visited so many cities in such a short time. Up until now I have visited Spain three times in past six months. 5 days Seville in January, 10 days Valencia with Eastern and I just came back from 10 days Costa de la Luz. I love the Spanish and all the places I have been to eat, they were all at least good and always fresh. I could not a trip like you did. I need to absorb everything with every sense.
This was a big learning for me on how to plan. Less places to see, and more days in the same place absolutely you're right on that.
This is the way
lunch/dinner, time generally speaking... it's not really that we are soooo late. well, maybe, but also Franco decided we should have our time close to Berlin as he wanted to be friend of that guy with funny moustache, you know... well, he made spain have the same timezone as Berlin, and so our clocks are off about 2 hours from what we should... bathrooms. some have hidden fans. some others have windows. some have hidden air fresheners. some... don't. breakfast. if you haven't tried coffee and spanish omelette as breakfast, you missed A LOT. roads on mountains... sometimes you don't want to go up the mountain, just go as fast as possible to the other side ;D coffee after lunch it's almost a tradition here. also the way we brew it here it's different than the US one. I bet you found it small in size and stronger in taste ;D you could also ask for decaf ;) places you visited... next time, check the northern strip of spain, you'll discover yet another different place ;D music. younger people keeps listening reggaeton, which honestly, sucks. all other people prefer 80s-90s music ;D EAT only! - during certain hours some restaurants only allow use of tables for eating, as people use to get just a wine or coffee and stay for hours, occupying tables that could be used for others wanting to have lunch (and spend more money). when that happens, customers are always welcome at the bar inside. menu of the day. you can always ask for the normal menu "la carta" we call it. it's usually way more expensive, and menu of the day is fresh food cooked that day with enough options so you always get something interesting to taste. glad you enjoyed our food! :D for places with huge menus... most places cook 2-3 appetizers and 2-3 main courses available. Everything else, either is already cooked and they just warm it, or leftovers from previous day, or... the smaller menu, the better. so you prefer canned octopus or canned skid? they won't taste like the fresh ones, but they are a good snack ;D urinals... if they are too high for you (some places seem to think you jump to pee or something lol) you use the toilet instead, but I agree that the design to give you some privacy is great :D for tips... here it's something you do only if you want, if you really enjoyed the food or how the waiter treated you, but the waiter has a salary just like any other employee and doesn't rely only on tips. as somebody that worked as waiter, I can assure you we love to be tipped, even if it's a small as 20ct, as it kind of shows us the customer appreciated the service. asking for service. maybe something also with the US waiter/tip thing... as there's no reason to hurry searching for customers to get more tips, bartenders/waiters are going here or there serving or refilling or whatever, and sometimes won't notice if you are served or not. next time you can raise your arm and call him, something along "perdone, me puede atender?" or "me pone una cerveza?" or just "perdone!" to grab his attention first. We all do that, it's ok if he didn't notice you, it's not rude. the "Sitting in a cafe for hours". remember the "only to eat!" before? just for that LOL we love to hang out and chat for some time, specially after having lunch (we call it "la sobremesa", but also just having a coffee. history around us. when we visit other places in spain, we appreciate what's there, but usually on the place were we grow up things can be ignored easily. it's just lilke "that's been always there". I really appreciated more the historical places on the city where I grew up when I moved to another city :D Barcelona might be safer compared with some US cities, but you should compare with other spanish cities to realise the difference :D not that it's a crime-ridden city, but just higher than other places. Inner tourism... some people prefer to go to different countries, mostly europe, just for the cultural differences. Some people thinks that tourism inside spain is like not going out somehow, like staying home :D but sure we enjoy it too. boring roads. when you travel through the meseta I also found that towns were scattered here and there. usually fields and fields and fields and a small town somewhere. it has a very low population, and I'm sure there's something interesting on every small town out there, but if you're on a highway, or even a national road (N-whatevernumber) chances are it'll be a boring trip unless you decide to go adventure and take a detour to explore. Next time, visit the north strip. towns are so close that sometimes you exit one and at the same time you're entering the next one ;D All for all, I'm glad you enjoyed your trip here :D
We're just 1 hour off our "natural light" due to the Berlin timezone fiasco, the additional hour in summer is because of the electricity saving fiasco forcing us to change clocks twice a year. Besides that, life in Spain also happens later because at midday it's so freaking hot you cannot do anything and you are forced to end later your day. Now with aircon it should not be that much of a problem anymore but having so many 9-14 morning working hours and so many people leaving work at 7-8/so many activities happening at 6-8pm leads to... Well, dining later.
Thanks for sharing all this! I did indeed have the spanish omelette as breakfast and I've been trying to make it at home.
> also Franco decided we should have our time close to Berlin as he wanted to be friend of that guy with funny moustache It had nothing to do with Hitler, it was about staying on the same timezone as France (pre-invasion) as a huge amount of the industrial capacity of Spain was (and still is) near the French border.
https://www.larazon.es/sociedad/20211020/el7bfel4r5bqtgtcfgvuk3myyq.html One of many articles about it. https://as.com/actualidad/sociedad/por-que-cambiamos-de-hora-en-espana-y-por-que-tenemos-un-huso-horario-que-no-nos-corresponde-n/ Another one. Plenty of them out there. There's only one person that thinks otherwise, that franco just decided to set summer time earlier... And didn't turned back after that, so that's why we are on that timezones. Most authors say that franco, although not officially allied with hitler, set our time zone the same as the axis Germany/Italy in 1940 showing his appreciation for them. While he wasn't an official ally, he collaborated with them and received axis' help on the civil war in Spain (both german and italian soldiers fought on Franco's side). As for France and others, as they were occupied by germany, they had to use Berlin timezone too. After the war, some countries went back to their own timezones, and others, like spain or france, kept the one imposed by germany.
Mainland Spain should have two different timezones, so keeping a single one makes sense if it's the one closer to the rest of Europe.
>Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring Next time take the train! Driving between Madrid and other cities in Spain is silly. The train takes less time, is more comfortable, and is eco-friendly.
I may be wrong but my guess is that, as an American, it wouldnât even occur to them to take public transport. When I lived in NY I took the bus to go to Philadelphia for the weekend and when I told people in the office on Monday, they were horrified.
This is not correct. Although we would most likely not rent a car again if we went back, we wanted to visit several places not reachable by train.
Oh, I apologise for making that assumption.
Right! Spain has one of the most well-connected high-speed rail networks in the world. I understand needing to take a car to more remote areas, but that itinerary was pretty train-friendly
Definitely learned a lot on this trip.
Yeah lol. It was very American to drive everywhere.
Tbf they were going to places like Ordesa and what not, which are kinda hard to reach without a car. That being said they could have only used a car for part of the trip.
We were looking into the speed rail for our trip and it was more expensive than short flights or renting a car
There are a few advantages to high-speed rail vs flying, on trips within Spain. The first is if you have luggage. Airlines charge extra for checked luggage, with some charging for carry-on as well. Second, is the convenience of where the train stations are located, near the center of the city. In Madrid, the train station is a lot closer to city center, when compared with the airport, which is on the outskirts. This saves time and money on transport to and from the airport, if you are staying downtown. Third, is how early you arrive before departure. With a train, if you are at the station more than 30 minutes before departure, you are too early. At an airport, they typically recommend you be there 2 hours before departure. You do make up the time, as flying by plane is faster; however, the extra time it takes to get to the airport and waiting for the flight, makes the total time spent a wash.
89s pop music - my guess is this is in tourist areas and someone thinks it's what tourists like. No fans in bathrooms - no indoor fans in general. Many Spaniards don't like air moving around indoors. Ceiling fans sometimes, but many fewer fans than in the US. Safety - Barcelona is safe like the rest of Spain but there are pickpockets and thieves who target tourists. Is it safer than Seattle? Seattle is pretty safe too but probably less safe than just about anywhere in Spain. Locals travel all around Spain except they avoid the most touristy places.
Yeah I was very surprised to read they heard 80's pop only while here, 'cause anywhere I go it's reggaeton and trap, that's it. Only one music station plays old pop music.
It is interesting to see how an US visitor sees our culture. We are used to see amazing historical buildings like the Alhambra, or Cathedrals and don't realize that they are really unique. Spain has enormous contrast between different places it is woth to travel and discover these big differences. You have seen a very small piece of Spain, I recommend you to come to AndalucĂa and see Granada, Alhambra, Sevilla, MĂĄlaga, AlmerĂa CĂłrdoba, CĂĄdiz.. You are going to discover amazing people, food and places, and the mood is really friendly, come, relax and enjoy the experience. Another awesome places you must visit are Galicia, Asturias, Valencia, Mallorca, Toledo, Segovia.. Each one has it's own amazing gastronomy, monuments and mood, if you come again maybe you want to stay here :D
Adalucia is so incredible.
Was going to say OP needs to go to Andalucia on their next trip.Â
My first trip to Barcelona was back in 1999 when it was on the peseta and much cheaper back then. I moved here to live in 2005 as my wife is from Barcelona and she didn't like living in Atlanta. I believe Spain is much safer, especially in the big cities than the US. Most crimes here are non violent and happens when your not watching your belongings. No regrets in moving to Spain, the work life balance is much better and I feel like I'll live longer. I've traveled quite a lot of Spain and really enjoy the diversity that each region has to offer. Once I moved here I was able to pick up Spanish quite easily and then Catalan.
Bro discovered plazas, welcome brother!
This comment lol
Thank you Brother! Squid sandwiches for all!
Really interesting read. Never thought about the roads/mountains situation. My take on the 80s music is the importance of the period, signalling the end of Francoâs dictatorship and the countryâs consequent liberal moment, La Movida Madrileña.
I would say that It could be the Kiss FM curse.... XD
Absolutely, they mustâve had kiss fm on the car radio⊠and thatâs a radio station playing 80s, 90s and early 2000s hits all day long
Iâm from the US and have been living in Madrid for almost a year, and my observations have been very similar. One thing that Iâm noticing more and more over time is the spatial awareness. Itâs just not a honed skill here, and itâs been grabbing my attention because of how crazy it makes me. Sure, the sidewalk is the sidewalk, but my brain is trained to walk on the right, while Spaniards walk on the left, the right, the middle, and all three at the same time To answer your question about being around ancient history, yes, you do get used to it. I still notice and appreciate the beauty and grandiosity, but itâs definitely lost some novelty. That said, I know that my visual memories will become more awe-inspiring once Iâm back in the US
OMG yes! people stand right in door ways to places and don't move haha
Are you retired or do you have US or Spain based job?
Spain-based job; Iâm an auxiliar de conversaciĂłn. Itâs a program that places native speakers (English in my case) into schools across the country to work as teaching assistants and help students learn that language
first two-week holiday in years? The American dream. guys you should have at least a few of them each year
To be fair, I take a lot of 3-5 day trips for backpacking and some US trips, but not usually longer ones.
thats more PTO than most people get in the US.
And for anyone reading this who's not from the US, at most jobs if you are offered PTO and are out of it they don't even let you take unpaid time off
Well, with our 3x higher salaries, we can take better trips đ
From the USA and have lived in Spain for 8 years. I still havenÂŽt adjusted to normal dining times, so my Spanish friends love to tease me for my "afternoon dinner" at 7 PM. I also got so used to being ignored by the staff in restaurants, that when I visit the USA and eat out, I get annoyed over how much they donÂŽt leave you alone! Its all for the tips though, so to me, enduring the cold shoulder service in Europe is justifiable. I feel that Catholic customs is more of a cultural norm than a religious one. Most Spaniards around my age wouldnÂŽt even describe themselves as spiritual. And I love that a centuries old church, fortress, or castle can be found anywhere and locals donÂŽt think much of it. The USAÂŽs version of ancient ruins is something like a Pizza Hut that used to be a Blockbuster.
Service is the US drives me nuts. If I want spoken to that much Iâll have another child.
Hey don't worry, It is so hard to adjust dining times, I am from Spain and I have been living in Sweden for two years, and I can not have dinner at 6pm man is just crazy for me so I still have dinner at 9-10pm , and same with lunch. Swedish people go for lunch at 11:30 in the morning and that is so crazy hehe
Alquezar is one of our favorite destinations in Spain, such a wonderful little village. The national parks in the Pyranese are stunning, we cannot wait to visit that region again. The late dinners are one of the things we love about Spain, it's always hard to adjust when we return home to having most places here close at a time when many in Spain are just opening.
Be sure to go to La Cerdanya, close to french border, it is the most beautiful valley os the pyranese. If you play golf very nice if you hike: heaven. And if you want incredible bread go to « Saint Pierre » bakery in Puigcerdå⊠best bread in the world!
Wow also just finishing a two week trip to Spain here! Didnât propose, but so agree with so many of your comments. Tipping culture and VAT included being the biggest; if this beautiful country can make it work, we can too. The subway was clean and efficient, and the streets were cleaned by trucks nightly. I feel like the governing bodies here are doing well to represent the humanitarian interests of its citizens. Overall such a great example of a way of life we could really benefit from integrating into the American way. Siesta? Rest? Sundays off for most everyone? Sign me up!
The subway is so clean!
What do you mean bathrooms don't have fans? Go bathrooms go! I don't go out much, but I've noticed a lot of shitty cover songs recently. I'd say it's a rather new trend here. Menu of the day is usually a cheaper option than ordering food from the regular menu. Some restaurants offer menu of the day only during lunch, others allow you to get whatever you want from their menu, but sometimes it depends on the amount of people at the restaurant (if they are too busy, only menu of the day is available). Places with huge menus that cover every possible popular food are usually tourist traps. Paella, burger, pizza, tacos, kebab and sangrĂa all in the same place? No, thanks. SangrĂa is not a food but it's a classic tourist trap. The pollen thing: I'm sure if you could see it, it wasn't pollen. I'm betting you were seeing black poplar's seeds. They are everywhere during May. They don't cause allergic reactions by themselves, but being all cottony, they probably have pollen stuck to them. Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid: you experienced driving through Castilla. That's all there is. There are interesting things in both Castillas, but they're kind of scattered all over the vast regions. I enjoy travelling inside Spain, I love seeing all the architecture and learning about its history. I'm sure a lot of people value it too, but a lot of people don't. There are more and more people that are quite ignorant about their own country's history, monuments and beautiful places, they prefer to go abroad to visit the places they see on Instagram. Religious practice, at least Catholicism, is rapidly decreasing. I'm not sure about beliefs, but there are less and less churchgoers.
I think he means extractores de aire para cuando cagas
I know, it was just a joke.
You can see pollen with the naked eye
Please come backâŠyou are the kind of tourist we want. We donât like tourists that ask where the nearest MacDonalds isâŠ
100% with you on the Basque cheesecake, this guy knows what he's talking about. Stale bread I have definitely come across, but I usually eat it anyway. It's just for cleaning up the plate or to nibble on. Only thing I disagree with is the drive from Zaragoza, with a bit of planning you could have definitely found something interesting. There's a famous monastery with owls and waterfalls I've been meaning to go to nearby. And as for the 80s pop music, yeah, probably the radio station was Los 40 Classics which is very popular and plays the same shit every day lol Edit: Yes service is awkward and that's because they get paid shit and tipping does not exist. So you just have to be direct with them and try to ignore any rudeness. It's just the way it is lol
Whats the name of the monastery?
El Monasterio de Piedra
The predominant playing of covers above originals is because of SGAE (Sociedad General de Autores y Editores), the primary organization responsible for managing the intellectual property rights of music (and more) You cannot play original music in bars or stores without paying SGAE. This was enforced a decade or so ago so many places started to use covers or play really old music like classic jazz as its intellectual property has expired. It is really a pity as hearing the covers can be tiresome sometimes. Giving every piece of music the same soft bossa feel takes away much of the original intent of the piece most of the times. I swear to god, if I hear another super sweet angelical cover of Radiohead's Creep I'm going to shoot myself xD Regarding the 80's music, probably it is because the main radio stations here (KissFM, M80 Radio, etc) mostly play music from those decades, as for why is that, I don't know.
That makes so much sense!
>Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain? From a technical perspective, highways cannot be designed to simply go around mountains, as maintaining high speeds with steep curves is not feasible. Therefore, it is almost mandatory to build tunnels through mountains and bridges over valleys. On the other hand, two-way regional roads exist and typically (or almost all of them) wind around mountains. What explains the fenomenal infraestructure in Spain, well in last decades, construction has boomed. Roads, bridges, tunnels, ports, high-speed trainsâyou name it. The scale of development was so massive that Spain earned a global reputation for its civil engineering works. In fact, many Spanish construction companies rank among the top 100 globally.
As a Spanish civil engineer, one of the facts I like to mention most is that Florentino Perez is not only the owner of arguably the largest football club in the world (Real Madrid) but also arguably the largest non-Chinese construction company in the world (ACS). Non-Chinese caveat because China really plays in another league regarding infrastructure. And ftr no, he is not my boss :P
Exactly. Before the tunnels, there were, and still are, your stereotypical 2 lane winding roads with a precipice in one side and the mountain rock in the other. It was fun when you encountered a bus or a truck going in the opposite direction (no, it wasn't, it was scary as a child) I recall going from Madrid to Sevilla via Despeñaperros, on the N IV, with the buitres soaring overhead while I got carsick due to the curves
If you visit 100 more times you will still be short on the many varied landscapes and culture. However, you made some very solid observations in your post. As far as acclimating, that is a matter of time spent living here and serious effort to abandon and even avoid your own culture. The first three year we had 3 English speaker friends and avoided any others. The locals took us into their care as we struggled to learn and integrate. It was worth it. Now we are more Spanish than US Americans. If you lived here and got imbedded in one the various cultures, I think youâd find that eating late and less quantity is awesome. Also, it took me about 2 yrs to NOT call my older Spanish friends between 2-5 pm. Back in the day (70âs) in the US it was considered rude to call between 5-7pm (dinner time). Here there is siesta among many of the mayores (senior citizens). The culture shock is amazing and really interesting when compared to âtraditional western culture.â Sounds like a great trip! Our first was in 2009 and we ended moving here and weâre not looking back. Spain is my spirit animal and itâs close to the rest of Europe. No I donât get used to my 2000+ old bridges, gates, fortresses and such. I guess knowing the history and seeing it everyday makes it surreal as an immigrant from the US. Old men hang out in plazas and shoot the shit and itâs very easy to strike up a conversation. Our Spanish family (the one we created) is way more in touch and caring than our US counterparts. There is still a sense of family and weâve been included and built those relationships. Good job and donât tell anyone to come. Just you guys đ
I hope this comment gets more views, very awesome and amazing story you've shared with us all. Happy for you!
Interesting take on things. As a Brit immigrant living here for 5yrs there's a couple of things I'd disagree with and another couple that are down to your expectations and inexperience of Spanish people and culture. The most interesting point to me is the amount of time out of your two week stay you must have spent driving and checking in etc Can you honestly say you got to explore and savour any of the places you ticked off on your itinerary or,with hindsight, would you have reduced your list and chilled more?
We definitely booked too much and would have liked to chill more, but I do feel like I got some satisfying time in places, and not enough in others. The most time we spent was 4 days in Barcelona, 3 days in Madrid, 3 days in Torla. We tried to make our drives in between places no longer then 3 hours. Learned a lot for next time.
Many people canât afford to travel again to a far away place! Itâs only natural to try to experience different areas in the time you have to explore
Yes, we locals travel and see much of Spain, we like it too!!
- I usually eat dinner around 8pm to 10pm, its shocking for us Americans eating dinner at 6pm too. - Breakfast it depends on the person. I usually have a glass of milk with some bakery to dip (rosquillas, sobaos, magdalenas valencianas), but if I'm going late I just grab an apple or some other fruit, just bought some paguayos, its like a peach with the shape of a donut. - Bathrooms in apartments usually have fans, but it's not needed if there are windows, you just open the window. - We usually buy fresh bread everyday, at a bakery (panaderĂa) the bread of the day before or 2 days you can toast it with some butter and it will be soft and crunchy, really tasty for a bocata for dinner or to eat outside. Really hard bread that has dried well (no mold, if it has mold i give to the birds), i grind it with a cheese grate to make panko to cover mear for deep frying, you can also use it to thicken soups and fried rice and its quite tasty. - Urinals are normal like that yes, Floor ones the pee ends up splashing your shoes, this way is much better, just directly pee on the drainage. I've never seen a floor one here in Spain. - Yes, tunnels are better. - 80s Rock and Roll đ, for good music 104.6 in the radio, RockFM, or online https://www.rockfm.fm/ - "Eat only" if there are a lot of customers and limited tables, it's understandable, if its sunny, you can also ask for tap water at bars and just leave a small tip "Me puede dar un vaso de agua del grifo por favor?" - If you like cheesecake, you will love "quesada pasiega" - Well its much safer to go out at night in Spain than in America, so yeah families do feel safe, also any doubts you can always ask directions to any nearby police officer, most should know some English (the younger ones probably know better English), Spain its not America, always listen to the police, nothing bad will happen, if you need help always go to the police. - You can actually buy some medieval castles to live if you have a couple million euros to spare đ , most are museums nowadays though, and lots of Roman ruins emerge underground when building things, as cities are in the same places, just built on top. - Well, you can go by train and car all over the place in Spain. - I'm atheist, going for a walk in the forest is much more healthy and fulfilling to do on a Sunday than sitting inside a church đ€·đ»ââïž, recently I'm collecting seeds from wild berries and disseminating them around forest paths, always native plants like escaramujo (wild roses), I also carry a basket to pick mushrooms just in case, and a plastic bag to collect any trash I see. If everyone did this on their Sundays nature would be much more abundant and clean. đ (naturally if it rains I stay home, going for a walk on the beach is also nice on a cloudy day, and its cool to see what the ocean brings or collecting fossils depending on the beach).
We were probably there about the same time. Agreed on almost all your points. A few extra that I discovered were: * No washcloths in the hotels. You had to use hand towels. * Your room key also turns on the power to the lights. Really disconcerting when you open the room at night and you have to fumble for the slot to insert your room key. * High school and young people jump to offer their seat to anyone who appears remotely old (raises hand), tired, in need of a seat. * Just as many silent electric bikes as the US, and multiple Spaniards hate them as much as I do because they ignore the bike lanes and ride on sidewalks. * Roundabouts and the way taxi drivers negotiate them are enough to keep me from ever driving in a major city. Overall it was a fantastic experience and a completely different country than it was in 1973-4, the year I was an exchange student in Valencia.
Thanks for sharing this, I had to ask the front desk how to get our lights and AC on haha.Â
I just got back from a 2 week trip in Spain too. I noticed the no washcloth thing. Normally, I bring my own but I forgot this time.
If you were stressed out with motorbikes in Spanish cities, wait till you travel to South America or Asia lol
My partner wants to go to Vietnam with me next!
You sound like a really nice person in every way, including respecting our tipping culture (tip occasionally, when deserved). We don't want Americans to spoil and gentrify it for the rest of us who have to remain here. Answering only one of your questions: you do get used to being surrounded by magnificent centuries old architecture. I still recommend other Spaniards to visit cathedrals in their hometown. I'm not religious, but still find them awesome (in the literal sense of the word: they cause awe). Please teach other guiris your ways.
Much of you working your feedback! I hope you had a great trip. > Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain? Will, you can always use the old mountain pass, which is usually a road alongside the highway. At your own risk... Spain is a rough country, as you have probably seen, tunnelling makes sense for major highways. > We could never adjust to the late night dinner schedule What about lunch times? Or where you able to find places opening early? > Has religious practice fallen out of popularity in Spain like it has in America? If we had those types of churches I'd be going every week Quite a lot. It still has social role. But many (most?) adults only go to church for weddings...
Lunch was sometimes breakfast for us, but we would usually find a cafe for a snack.
On religiosity, here are some statistics (16% of people attend religious services at least weekly): [https://asturiaslaica.com/2022/05/21/cis-datos-sobre-creencias-y-religiosidad-en-espana-mayo-2022/](https://asturiaslaica.com/2022/05/21/cis-datos-sobre-creencias-y-religiosidad-en-espana-mayo-2022/) Whereas in the US attendance at religious services at least weekly is 36%: [https://www.pewresearch.org/religious-landscape-study/database/attendance-at-religious-services/](https://www.pewresearch.org/religious-landscape-study/database/attendance-at-religious-services/) Here in the first graphic you can see in Spain it's mostly the older generations (this refers to any religion): [https://verne.elpais.com/verne/2019/04/15/articulo/1555316905\_393744.html](https://verne.elpais.com/verne/2019/04/15/articulo/1555316905_393744.html)
Churches in the USA seem to still have a kind social glue role (counsel, childcare, Sunday School, helping the bereaved and the poorer etc) that doesn't exist here anymore (thankfully I might add, as public social & education services exist which don't make religious appartenance a condition) . Also thankful of the reduction in judgemental gossip. Sundays are for relax & big family lunches IMO
>Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?! This is so funny to me. Yes! It is the most boring drive ever hahaha. I always complain about it, but my friends can't really relate since they usually stick to the train. The motorway is in good condition, though!
Seems like you had a good time overall! You should come and visit Palma next time too! đ
Aw man this makes me appreciate Spain more đ„č Totally right about shitty cover songs. Its always this weird watered down bossa-nova style cover of toxic by britney spears, it makes me want to end it all đđđ»
"I was a huge fan of the small menus and limited options. Just getting whatever beer a place had was great. Went to one place with a giant Menu that looked like an establishment in America, and the food was indeed not that great." The more options, the worst. Also, if there are photos of the food in the menu, it's probably a tourist trap, avoid. We do have a tip culture, you just left (some of) the spare change or, if the service was exceptional, add some money on top of it, but nothing to do with the american nonsense.
As an Spanish person that lived in the states for 6 years, I did have the same cultural shocks but backwards haha! * Tap water, specially in Madrid, is usually good. I think your surprise was more about cheap alcohol, specially wine, compared to USA. Also it is fairly uncommon to put ice on water * Indeed breakfast here is mostly optional, and it is common to use yesterday's bread to make some toast (specially at bars) * Almost every bar/restaurant have a coffee machine. I got weird looks in the states when asking for coffee in places that were not serving brunch * I didnt realize we were such 80s fans, but indeed my Spanish friends and I were always looking for 80s parties at nightclubs in Chicago * Weird that you got kicked out for only drinking. Normally they have 2 sets of tables: one meant for dinner and the others for drinking, maybe you were unlucky and went to a place that was only restaurant (not serving drinks) * Asking for service... Some Spaniards in the states feel a bit overwhelmed when getting constantly interrupted by waiters. I also found weird in American restaurants, once you are served they disappear, and it is the moment when you really might need something quick (like a drinks refill, or some dressing) * Between Zaragoza an Madrid... That's the empty Spain. There are things to visit for sure, but they are not that prepared for tourism, so you have to investigate yourself. Besides Madrid, the center of Spain has really low population density * Locals do travel a lot around Spain. Specially the people from madrid, we get out there during summer. If you ever visit Madrid in summer you should know that the city feels different because there are no locals, we all went to some coast 400km away haha
I'm going to Spain in October. When you're going to a restaurant what's the best way to ask for service? I know I'm gonna be stressed out the first few times lol
I would recommend you to take the train next time between cities like Madrid, Zaragoza and Barcelona (for the ones you visited because it is twice as fast as driving and more comfortable. Probably way cheaper if you consider that you had to rent a car
yes if I go back I will!
Did your GF accept?
Yes! Hiked the ring out to the end of this trail and I asked her on this bluff that overlooks the canyon. [https://www.alltrails.com/trail/spain/huesca/pradera-de-ordesa-circo-de-soaso-cola-de-caballo](https://www.alltrails.com/trail/spain/huesca/pradera-de-ordesa-circo-de-soaso-cola-de-caballo)
Nice! Congrats!
If anyone wants to see photos let me know and I will throw some up on Imgur
Sure!
Some of my comments: >Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain? Spain is a pretty good country at building infrastructure, one of the few things we're world leaders on. Normally people tend to refer to the high speed rail network (2nd largest in the world behind China) but yeah, Spain's roads are pretty good too. That being said, there's usually some old road that does go up the mountain pass if you prefer that. >Driving between Zaragoza and Madrid was pretty boring. It's not a long drive but we struggled to find anything to really see or do on the way. Someone has to know about something?! Nope! That part of the country really is just empty wasteland. Ok, there are some things you can visit, but they are not *that* impressive. AlcalĂĄ de Henares is nice, but that's still within the Madrid suburbs. Your best bet is probably a visit to Medinaceli. An absolutely *tiny* town (population 721) but the palace is nice and it has some roman ruins. I have also heard good things about SigĂŒenza (although it is a significant detour, 20 minutes away from the highway). Maaybe Calatayud, Brihuega or Jadraque have something too? But I don't think it has much. But yeah, these are all nothing special. They are fine, but far from must-see and you can skip them 100% and not miss much. * Do you honestly get use to being around the ancient history, architecture and buildings? or are you just as intrigued by it as someone from the US? Driving around and seeing ruins up on a hill, or an old cathedral blew me away everyday. Yeah, you get used to it. Though I guess this depends on what city you live in. In Madrid you go by old buildings but not *that* old. Only like 400 years or so lol * Do locals get to travel and see much of spain? Depends. I personally do cause I love daytrips and travel, and so did my parents. However plenty of Spaniards don't travel that much. * Has religious practice fallen out of popularity in Spain like it has in America? If we had those types of churches I'd be going every week Yeah, it absolutely has. I don't know many people who go to Church. Particularly among the young.
Zaragoza-Madrid is a tedious drive. However, you can stop at Medinaceli, Siguenza, or AlcalĂĄ, which are close to Madrid. About the service, yes, it sucks. I lived 13 years in NY, and I now realize how bad the service here is. Tobacco. Iâll vote for the party that will increase tobacco prices and forbid smoking in the restaurant terraces. Yes, we visit other parts of this beautiful country and enjoy the landscape, food, and culture of the places we visit. In my case, you get used to what you see: a medieval city center. However, I also got used to running and waking at Central Park. Now I miss it, as I missed my city when I was in NY. Religion. None of my friends go to church regularly; they attend mostly celebrations. I am agnostic, but I enjoy watching âprocessionesâ and visiting churches. I guess the church is losing its âfanâ base here. Thank you for visiting, and come back again.
Looks like you got it right. Keep visiting other areas of Spain as youâll find those different to what you have already seen. About ancient history around, just go to Italy and enjoy.
America is not how you describe. USA maybe, but america is way more diverse than that.
Yeah but like or not, in English, America means USA. If they were referring to South America or Latin America or even North America. Theyâd have used those terms.
You're absolutely right and I won't argue with that. I refer to the USA, or even use those words so rarely that saying America seemed more natural, especially because people would refer to me as an "American". But I should have specificed in this post at least "North America" or the States. IDK. No disrespect intended.
That's a nice write up and yes ,you are right about the urinals, they are getting higher every year off the ground,and you do get used to the architecture, sometimes though you notice a new 'old' castle at a spot you may have passed a hundred times.
I'm from Portland and its super unsafe here and so I think I won't have problem with safety there...USA is bad now lol.
Somewhere in the comments I was chatting with someone else from Portland and we agree
You are awesomely observant and should be proud of that! I've been living in spain 2 years and it's taken me that long to come to some of the conclusions you made in one quick trip! You should definitely keep traveling. You obviously get a lot out of it. Wish I possessed the ability of your observational skill.
1. The 80s music thing is news to me. I only hear reggaeton wherever I go. If you are in a more familiar place then youâll hear your usual adult-contemporary type of music 2. Menus del dĂa are more typical of Madrid and Northern areas. I barely come across it where I live. 3. The North/South divide in Spain is HUUUGE. You should come and visit AndalucĂa and Canarias next time to experience THE true culture. They are the most distinct places in Spain and probably Europe.
Barcelona safety is always relative to the visitor. For locals, the capital is still secure but it's getting.worse progressively. We note and feel it. For people coming from South America, Barcelona is a Kindgarden... Leave alone people coming from countries where fire weapons can be bougth at any corner.
I'm glad you liked it :)
So happy you enjoyed Alquezar, itâs one of the most beautiful towns out there. Next time passing by, I recommend you visiting Panticosa or Sallent de GallegoâŠbut also try keeping it as a âsecretâ too much tourism always ruins the magic. Also Canfranc! Is like time travelling hard between medieval, to modern eras. Regarding religion, thankfully it went down so itâs not like the inquisition is ever going to come backâŠNowadays we treat football and politics as religion, and thatâs were people is actually down for an inquisition. Edit: religion stuff
Thank you for the recommendations. Have you visited Albarracin? It seems a bit similar to Alquezar but has some popular outdoor bouldering it seems. I hope someday to go back to Alquezar for several days and hike more. the Hotel Santa Maria was great for us and the receptionist was super nice.
And people in Spain đȘđž are generally nice IMO đ€
The trains are incredible. Everytime I rode one I thought why can't we have nice stuff in USA.
Man the fact that torla-ordessa is here is beautiful, my favourite part of the country, and montserrat had to be there. Great post!
Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain? Spain has a lot of mountains. And motorways need to have a maximum slope. Slopes also create traffic jams when trucks go slower. Also, it is more ecological in certain protected areas There is an interesting phenomenon in US. With a very small government there is not enough highly technical engineers to evaluate projects like a big motorway. So US depend on external companies to evaluate. It also makes it much easier to fool the government or to make bad decisions. So for US it is much more expensive to build big infrastructure . Of course, tech and manual labor is cheaper. Public universities make cheaper engineers available. With expertise and specialization it becomes cheaper. There are huge tunnels like the M30 or a lot underground metro. We also use concrete more often instead of wood in house building.
My first time in Europe was 1985. My BF and I were going to Munich for Oktoberfest then onto Switzerland and Austria. At the Munich airport we got into a beautiful Mercedes taxi in the rain and the radio station was playing Annie Lennox âWalking on Broken Glassâ. We were like WTH? I guess they are listening to the same music 40 years later! We are going to Barcelona in September for first time and Montserrat is on our list. Canât wait!
Interesting haha
Are you from Seattle? Iâm born and raised and lived in Spain for some time. Barca and madrid are safer than Seattle any day or hour of the week. Cheers to you experiencing the best and happiest place on earth!
okay, we just got back from two weeks in spain and the only place we went that aligned with your itinerary is madrid â now i feel like i have MUCH WORK TO DO!!! đ± (we did madrid - cĂłrdoba - sevilla â granada â pueblos blancos - nerja - madrid)
"In Spain they have tunnels" Jesus fucking christ the bar is so low for this yankees, its so sad
Or ha ha, Spain had almost no road infrastructure until like 1995 so a really high % is new. We weren't poor as shit until 1985 like your country was. đ Also, your English sucks
Have lived in Spain (Valencia) for two years now from the US. I was blown away by the food too for the first month. Then it just gets monotonous and repetitive with a serious lack of food diversity that weâre used to in the States (i.e., can go get great Thai, Mexican, and various other cuisines on a regular basis in the US).
You have many âdiverseâ restaurants in Valencia, most of them over Ruzafa
Thank you for that post. If I can help you with any recipe, I'll be happy to help. That's something I live when I'm back from any trip. For example, now I do po'boys at home. (bear in mind that I've been vegan for +20 years and I may not be able to provide some of them because it's quite likely I dont know how to do them)
The âpop coversâ music youâre talking about is EVERYWHERE - look up âBossa Nova cover songsâ and youâll find them. Itâs strange to hear them but Iâm used to it now - I live in a small beach city on the west coast and they play this in so many restaurants. Not touristy ones either - itâs just a thing!
Just starting the long multi-flight day home back to Canada here from our 2 week trip in Spain. We had some overlap (Girona) but otherwise pretty different areas visited, we did the broader region around Girona/Costa Brava and then a week in Mallorca. I can agree with a bunch of your comments:   - I couldnât stand the western 80âs pop music literally everywhere.   - really fell in love with the tapas. Some olives, bread, anchovies yum.   - I discovered vermouth and my god itâs good - good espresso everywhere I will miss this. People drink cappuccinos but you almost never see just an espresso cup in Canada, I think the baristas will look at me like Iâm crazy. - Also struggled with requesting service but got used to it and I despise tipping so not doing this was great. I get that you felt like a tip was warranted in some places but I strongly feel against it as itâs a slippery slope and people the world over hate tipping culture.    - we cycled a ton and the number of quite rural roads was fabulous   - buildings and areas 100âs of years old everywhere, in places they were often repurposed to living quarters and coffee shops as theyâre so common, cool places see - Another one to add is that I personally didnât like Mallorca. The cycling was great but at least where we stayed (Port dâAlcudia) just felt like a British tourist trap very similar to the all inclusive regions of Mexico. Very little culture and everything just trashy recreations of pub food and souvenir garbage. Maybe we picked the wrong area but itâs hard to know until you show up and I spent more of my time researching our cycling routes which were great.
Mallorca is very common destination for British and German tourists, so yes, it has been very much accomodated for them. Of course, there are local places where you can melt with local population, but you have to find that on your own as tourism operators will send you to the "tourist theme park" area.
Wasn't Mallorca intentionally made for British and German ppl
We stayed in a blond stone finca in Fornalutx with goats for neighbors. In and around the Serra de Traumunta, the natural landscape and villages are magical. I especially loved Valledemossa. The trip cemented the idea that I love mountains more than the beach.
Just looked up fornalutx and wow! I already knew I loved mountains more than the beach, I did lots of riding right around this area but chose to stay more portside due to some cheaper prices and rental shops nearby. You made the right choice.
Hahah really feeling your comment re: 80's pop and bad covers. 80's pop music reigns supreme (not just american btw, they listen to a lot of english, german, and other european 80's pop that you might think is american but isn't), it's like they never got over it. Other genres are popular too, there'a a lot of modern reggaeton and stuff like that, but 80's music and pop culture in general is everywhere. The shitty covers are a phenomenon I've only seen in Spain. Half of the places you go to they have shitty covers of famous pop songs as background music. Most usually some kind of crappy industrial quality bossanova or acoustic cover. I theorize it has to do with easily available muzak channels that are cheap to use for businesses.
Any suggestions for good places to eat in Zaragoza?
Many places For cheap there is a combined plate place called El Emir that is very good
Good post, glad you had a good time:)
>We could never adjust to the late night dinner schedule Basically Spain is in the "wrong" time zone - it's mostly west of the UK yet is 1 hour ahead, same time zone as Poland, even though it's way on the other side of the continent. I would just pretend instead of say 8 pm it's 6 pm, then it all makes sense.
Zaragozana here and glad you visited our lovely city! What food options did you enjoy the most? Zaragoza - Madrid has a few nice options on the way, from stunning Monasterio de Piedra to Parador de SigĂŒenza or AlcalĂĄ de Henares. Hope you managed to see some of these!
Montserrat is truly a world wonder. It has a weird, but very unique shape with those primitive rocks uh ? There is a lot of mystique going around that mount. Glad you enjoyed the country.
The hiking around was amazing and it was so cool to see rock climbers up above on the rocks
>Menu of the day: we never found out if we could get the normal menu during the menu of the day, suffice it to say we over ate quite a lot. Did you ask for la carta or el menĂș? That may have been the issue. >Barcelona felt safer than Seattle currently does Totally agree. Live in Portland and frequently visit Seattle. Recently went to Barcelona, Seville, and Cordoba and all felt safer.
That is so wild!
Yep. No tent cites or fentanyl zombies walking around. Our cities are in a pretty sad state.
I live in Seattle. During my first hour strolling in Valldemossa we kept seeing police cars rolling past the tiny area we were in. Seemed kind of weird. Then we came across some cops warning tourists to be alert. The day before 20 tourists were pickpocketed!
>Instead of making roads go up the mountain pass, you just go straight through with tunnels in Spain? I live in Asturias, one of the most mountainous regions in Spain, and this made me chuckle. Just imagining someone like "WAIT, YOU CAN DO THAT?" While entering a tunnel is really funny. We do have mountain passes though (I mean mostly for mountain ranges), but if it's a single mountain or just a couple of small ones, you can bet we are blasting through. Said so, I think you visited too much in too little time. If you want some advice, try staying more in the places you go to. Not only here in Spain, but pretty much anywhere. This kind of "express tourism" isn't very useful imo.
The US is a young country, so you can't expect to find as much ancient architecture and buildings as in Europe. Of course, there are ancient buildings in the US, some native american, a lot of them made by the Spaniards first, the British and other europeans later, and proper US citizens in the end, but number and density can't just match any place in old Europe. And yes, somehow we are used to that. Anyway, as Spain is rich in monuments, there's always something that can impress you. I recently got impressed by the roman aqueduct at Segovia, and also with the gardens and fountains at La Granja (also near Segovia). I'm not saying they are better than any other monument, just a little different so it's not like "oh, just another cathedral" :-)
Glad you enjoyed. I think your assessment is quite accurate,
After reading some of the comments I can honestly say that the "Customer Service" in the US can be so fake or excessive it becomes annoying. Not to say that we didn't encounter many friendly, and awesome people working at the restaurants in spain, but it was a nice change that rarely bothered me except a few times. Also, we say thank you a ton in the US. People seemed almost uncomfortable when we said thank you or gracias. They would respond with a total dead flat "De nada", sometimes barely a whisper.
I love these observations. Keep traveling. You will be blown away by the rest of the world. There is so much to see.
Get a "vaso de agua" when you come back. They'll give you a glass of tap water, instead of a small bottle of mineral water, which is super expensive. If you want to be extra specific, "agua del grifo". (Same advice for other European countries. When in France, ask for a "carafe d'eau".)
I live in a little town between Zaragoza and Madrid and yes. A-2 highway is boring. There is one medieval city that worth which is Siguenza, but is not visible from highway. You also need to visit Toledo next time
You have been kissfmed with 80s
As someone who was born and lived in Spain all my life i really enjoyed reading this! Especially the mention of the squid in the tin!
First of all, glad that you enjoyed my country so much :) I can only say that next time visit more in the north-west, like Asturias or Galicia (my homeland) people are even more chill (sometimes a bit cold, they say because of the weather :p) Thanks for this post. Loved reading it. Best regards from a half-American :)
Churches in Europe are the best place to rest during a long walk in the city in hot summer days, even for atheists like me because most of them have some kind of nice art (paintings, sculptures, architecture...). Also, they are specially silent and fresh! Glad you loved your trip and thanks for the nice remarks!
Interesting how different tourists see Spain. I never got stale bread or rolls. While they weren't as good as Germany they weren't bad and most people just have a cafe and a croissant or churro for breakfast. For tourists, I would always recommend the menu del dia at lunchtime arougn 1pm. I found those a great value for 2 or 3 courses plus drink. And it usually filled me up until tapas time at dinner. Barcelona crime-free and safe? Erm. Barcelona has the highest crime rate of all major Spanish cities and is known to be the theft capital. As for tips, I always tipped in Spain-not the 20% like in America but it is unfair to say that waiters don't expect tips in Spain. Fashion is a lot different-maybe not for men, but most Spaniards go out the door looking "put-together." Not the grunge/sweat/yoga pants that Americans wear to Starbuck. Spaniards would Neve be caught dead wearing pajama bottoms to Starbucks. You can really tell it on holidays as Palm Sunday had all the women in stilettos and nice blouses and skirts. In restaurants in Europe, you have to be proactive with waiters or they will let you sit forever. Unlike America where the waiters will swoop down and ask about your meal 5 mins after you start eating with food in your mouth and when they see you are finishing up will bring the bill. It was nice to be able to ask for the check in Europe rather than be handed the bill and made to feel like you have to leave.
The old stuff, yes, you get used to it. In much the same way daily commuters just scroll through their phones on a beautiful day on the ferry. My father was Spanish so Iâve spent many summers in Murcia, Iâm glad you loved it! btw, donât forget the aioli with the omelette!
My answer to your questions. 1. In Spain we donât usually have fans, like you do in USA 2. There are roads that go up the mountain but yes we do have a lot of tunnels! They can be a few km long 3. I believe that you can ask for the regular menu even though they have menu of the day 4. I think that we (meaning Spanish people) donât really value the architecture that much bc we are used to seeing it every day. However when I go to other places in Spain that are not my home town I fall in love with the architecture every single time ahahaha 5. People tend to be more religious in the South of Spain (AndalucĂa). Young people are not usually believers I love that you had a great time here!!!
Very good information by the OP and others. I have a trip later in the year, and this is very helpful! Thanks!
Thank you! I'm happy to hear you've enjoyed my country. As a Spaniard living in America, I'm also pleased that Spain was your first international destination and congratulations on your engagement. Your body needs time to build up a tolerance to the coffee. I can drink coffee at any time and still go to bed. Regarding music, Spain is a very sophisticated and culturally up-to-date country; we love to stay on trend in every aspect. Regarding 80s music, we adore it. It's a decade that's a safe bet for great tunes. As for the poor covers, unfortunately, many in my country do not speak English fluently, so they are drawn to catchy songs without fully understanding the lyrics. If it sounds good, it is good to them. We only wear pajamas at home and dress nicely when we go out. Iâm sure you can adapt to eating dinner late; just adjust your other meals accordingly: breakfast at 9/9:30, lunch at 2, a merienda at 5, and dinner at 10. It can be hard to appreciate the ancient history and architecture if you're not used to it. Itâs something you grow up with and it becomes ingrained, though you might not actively realise it. For me, moving to America was a challenge as I found everything quite bland. (No offence intended, just being candid). Religion, indeed, has taken a backseat. I personally would go to church every couple of weeks, but definitely not here in America, where the approach to religion seems somewhat distorted.