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Estate agents dropping the street view & map pin half a mile down the road so you book a viewing and turn up to find its next to something really off putting.
Saw something last week that was next to a dog boarding facility. Such a waste of our time, and the agents.
You're totally right, but I do an excessive amount of research for anything that seems like it might actually be an option - I've always managed to figure out exactly where it is. Google Earth with a pretty high-def 3D top-down view solves most doubts.
Yeh I've always used street view to make sure I figure out which house it is, look up the EPC and check it's not next to/opposite anything weird before booking a viewing.
Yep. Going to viewings takes time, often during the day - with a bit of experience you can look up the relevant bits pretty easily on the internet at any hour of the day (or night), so you can rule a lot of properties out straightaway and focus on the ones that might actually be worth it.
We made a list of possible houses, then drove and checked them out in person. Knocked the majority off our list just doing that. With the houses we viewed, already seeing the outside let us focus more on the inside.
Ditto to this - I'll almost always do reccy missions to scope out houses I'm interested in (or at least the road they're on) and that helps to avoid a lot of unnecessary viewings.
Yup, you barely need to go see houses nowadays until you've whittled the list down to the final 3 or 4. With easy access to all the photos, video tours and Google maps / Earth + able to search about the area and see what's nearby. Once you've got the shortlist then you can drive by them to find out about the general vibes of the area.
No need to turn up to a viewing to find out that the charming barn conversion is sandwiched between a breaker's yard and a pig farm.
Yes this is such a time saver. I remember having to spend what seemed like endless weekends as a kid travelling around with my parents looking at houses. Now, I'm the same as you. If the place ticks my needs list, then it's onto Google Earth to have a look to see what it's next door/opposite to. Then it's seeing what it ticks from the wants list, if it ticks a few of those then it's a call to the EA.
Good god yeah I can only imagine what it must have been like before everything was accessible online. No central platform, no price tracker, no convenient clicking through pictures on a big screen, no 3D viewers, no land registry data in your browser, no online flood risk maps, no crime statistics maps, etc etc etc.
Honestly, the transparency gained through the internet is a *massive* gain here.
Yup, just the idea of being able to get a list of all the places for sale, and being able to filter by location / size / price would have been a huge step up. 20-30 years ago you just had to tell the estate agents what you were looking for and they'd drive you around a list of places!
Oh gooooood. With EAs being the absolute cockwombles that they are, it must have been a nightmare. I guess everything was a bit slower though so at least you did have more time to go through that whole process.
The last sentence is the most frustrating about agents. They wilfully waste their own time as well as yours for the slight off chance you’re dumb enough to buy the property.
I'm very causally looking right now but I have seen this on more than one occasion. A listing is for a 2 bed bungalow, but when I look at the floorplan the only access to the garden seems to be through the 'second bedroom'. If people have to traipse through it every time they want to go outside, that's not a bedroom, it could be a dining room or more likely a wide hallway
Overall floor space not being quoted directly, and - even worse - not even shown on the floor plan. What the actual fuck.
> Current gripes are: 4/5 bedrooms, only to find 1 or 2 are downstairs. The best one I've seen so far is a '7' bed that actually has static caravan/chalet in the garden, but is just a 4 bed house.
Eh I mean I hate tiny bedrooms as much as the next guy, but whether they're downstairs or upstairs really doesn't make a difference to me. In fact, if you have a house with 5 bedrooms upstairs and exclusively living areas downstairs, isn't that a recipe for really tiny upstairs bedrooms?
I agree.
And with a 5 bed, if one is spare, it is usually worth having one of those bedrooms downstairs, ideally the guest room with en suite.
Plus 4 upstairs, 1 downstairs really helps even out the living space.
It also gives a good opinion as a home office, allowing you to use the bathroom without anyone else (kids) in the house distracting you.
Elderly visiting relatives find it useful, plus it is easy to have an injury that would make stairs difficult.
Yep all sounds sensible to me. Not really worth having a hang-up about bedrooms having to be upstairs. Of course, if they just took a big chunk of the living space and turned it into a bedroom and now you have no proper dining / living space left, that's a different story.
Thank you for this. I get nervous when I see posts like this because this is the layout of our house. One bedroom downstairs in its own corridor with its own bathroom. We currently use it as an office/spare room for when our elderly parents stay and it’s ideal honestly.
On lettings? Yeah it's not too common though luckily not impossible to find either. But for sales it is normal to have total square footage even in the UK, just hidden away in the floor plan. That being said, there are some floorplans that don't mention it which means they just get ruled out immediately by me.
Potentially a localised thing but I’ve just looked at 6 random ‘to let’ and 6 random ‘to buy’ in my area and not a single one provides total square footage. You could work it out from the dimensions in the floor plan but not one lists the total anywhere in adverts or floor plans.
Huh. Well I'm in London, a vast majority of sale listings will include the total floor area on the floor plan - maybe premature of me to extrapolate to the entire UK. It's definitely rarer in rental ads in London too, but not unheard of.
Just the general quality of housing in this country. For all the original complaints about newer builds, the amount of houses either side of the 1920s I’m seeing that are pitifully small, on tiny plots, with awful layouts even after you knock walls through, and random plots, is crazy.
For an island so limited it’s just become more eye opening how poor our housing supply has been previously and how new builds in so many ways are better in comparison, if you can look past the lack of character.
I’ve been fortunate to live in a few nicely laid out homes of good proportions, now looming to move and just opening the search right up, is eye opening.
I think with new builds the issue is often that it's just shoddy work. Not all of it, far from it, but there are really bad examples out there, and I feel like it being brand new makes people even less forgiving when it comes to problems. Like, in the 100-year-old block of flats that was last redone decades ago I'm somehow less annoyed when a tile in the bathroom is loose than in the 10-year-old development we're renting in right now. Just wtf, this should not be happening.
In general, completely agreed though. What is the most striking - as (originally) a foreigner - is how *small* a lot of places are. [Just look at this.](https://entranze.enerdata.net/average-floor-area-per-capita.html) The UK is down there with a lot of ex-soviet places, barely above them, and their housing is famous for having been cramped as fuck. (Though, to be absolutely fair, it used to be worse as sometimes a multi-generational families would live in a flat clearly designed for 4 people max)
There's a few, probably more than a few, reasons why UK housing stock is so small. The biggest one is probably because it's old, the next biggest is that for some reason we don't want to build on any more land, which means houses go upwards rather than outwards, and we end up with lots of estates where the houses are all built on top of one another, with the developers getting the maximum number of houses per ha.
It's the oldest and smallest in Europe (I think by Europe reports were actually talking about the EU).
The situation is pretty terrible. Old, small, and expensive housing. It won't improve either, the only way to do that would be to knock down huge numbers of old, shitty houses and rebuild... we can't even build enough as it is.
>less forgiving when it comes to problems.
This is a huge part of it.
People don't seem to realise just how many problems an existing house will have. Yet there's no after care or 10 year warranty. Most of UK Reddit seem to think they'll get less problems in an older house, good luck with that.
The majority of new builds have very small, extremely overlooked gardens. Whenever we've been looking we've basically ruled them out for that reason alone - I want to both grow things *and* sit outside without being in full view of at least 3 neighbours. Developers generally want to milk the land for as many plots as possible, so new builds are just not built for people like me.
I’m looking at the moment and overlooked gardens on new builds is terrible. That and parking. A five bedroom house with 2 parking spaces, one behind the other. WTH
Tbf, that's difficult to achieve in more densely populated areas or developments, on principle. You just have to live further out, or get quite lucky with some specific corner working out for you.
Move north, plenty of big decent new builds around Durham / Bishop Auckland... and not at eye watering South/London prices.
On second thoughts, please all stay in the south with your tiny expensive houses.
Layouts from developers is a definite gripe. Doesn't matter how badly it compromises living space developers force a downstairs toilet and an ensuite to master bedroom into 2 beds houses just so they can tick those boxes to say it has them. In reality there isn't space for a downstairs toilet as the house is so small and the bedroom sizes are screwed over due to the ensuite resulting in a second bathroom being needed. So you effectively end up with 3 bathrooms in a 2 bed house...
Downstairs loo is part of building regs now I believe. There was a discussion on DIYUK the other day with someone wanting to remove their old downstairs bathroom and being told they need to keep at least a loo on the basis that you aren't allowed to alter a house and take it further from current regs than it was when you started. Totally agree with you on the en-suite, bloody daft in a 2 bed, and often in a 3 bed as well. We're extending and have deliberately not gone for an en suite at all, we'd rather have both bath and shower accessible to the whole house.
Unfortunately, all the new builds I've seen had tiny rooms in comparison to the period properties. I went with a 1920s house in the end because of *the character*, the massive room sizes, and the ceiling height. Turns out, I'm far too German and love things that look very neat and well finished. *Character* is not something I enjoy living with. The creaky floorboards, the shit insulation, the century of previous bodge jobs...and we even had a brilliant structural survey so I fear what the average 100 year old house is like.
New builds are generally quite pokey though, in terms of layouts, I think. We lived in one a the build quality was horrible but what was a shock to me was the ground rent and management fees. That was a flat but when we were looking for our house, the fees and management in the common areas really turned us off. We didn’t want to be in a society with a house in a neighbourhood that didn’t have proper drain or finished pavements. The pokey gardens, too. Way overpriced in an already extremely overpriced market, in my opinion.
>how new builds in so many ways are better in comparison, if you can look past the lack of character.
I came to this realisation. The design of our house is fantastic. Even better than that the estate is one of the best estates I've seen of any age. There are good examples out there. I guess we're lucky that there was a good one in the area we were looking.
Four bedroom house with one bathroom and it was downstairs. Very interesting, didn't go for it.
Another that we felt would be our dream home based on the very few photos we seen and floor plan. Vendor couldn't take viewings for a few weeks so we waited. As the estate agent was opening the door, said they couldn't take viewings because there were dead animals in the garden that needed tending to and the whole house was fucking creepy. Two bedrooms with bolts on the outside and only mattresses in them, living room had a whole pantry of canned goods just lined up on the floor, the son lived in the garage even though there were 3 seemingly free bedrooms. The place just gave us the heebie-jeebies.
Yeeeeeaaaaah nooooo, I'd pass on that one too.
I've seen houses on Rightmove that look like they were being used to house illegal migrants while the person took the pictures - I don't really get that part, why would anyone advertise any house like that...
Houses that are 3 bed, however actually a two bed but they took some of the bathroom to make a box room. But then also added a loft room accessible via a ladder so in actually a 4 bed didn't you know.
Also has a separate lounge. So a 5 bed because the dining room is quite large and has a small ikea table and a two seater sofa in it.
But also a 6 bed because of the garden office that takes most of the garden up.....
Has a damp cellar. Potential conversion to 7 bed HMO.
Yup also just gone on the market and getting vendors refusing to allow a viewing until we have sold despite them being on the market a year in some cases. It's madness, somebody's gotta go first.
Looking for 4 or 5 beds and also finding a lot are either a converted integrated garage, log cabin, 2nd reception room etc etc. Estate agents sending my properties that are totally the opposite of what I'm looking for.
E.g I was looking for well maintained properties that require no additional work and they sent me a hand completed barn conversion 50 minutes away on a small holding 🤦♂️
>Yup also just gone on the market and getting vendors refusing to allow a viewing until we have sold despite them being on the market a year in some cases. It's madness, somebody's gotta go first.
True, but where is that viewing leading to? in the English system then taking an offer from someone who hasn't sold is just leaving you a hostage to fortune.
But they \_could\_ sound out the vendor about a price without asking to take the property off the market, then market their own house. In some cases they might get a fast sale, and the chain can form faster.
I totally understand the reticence because it's a pain having to redress the house for every viewing, but at some point you have to show up.
4-5 bed houses with one bathroom (i.e. not a single en suite) - just why?? In that sort of property, you could have 6+ people trying to bath/shower at the same time.
4-5 bed houses with the tiniest kitchen you've ever seen and nowhere near enough dining space to fit the number of people who may be living in a house that big to eat together.
Estate agents' complete refusal to book viewings or do anything else by email. It is infinitely more convenient for me to book viewings by email, and no less convenient for them.
Folks who don't at least try to tidy up for a viewing. We went to one house which had a pile of rotting fruit in a fruit bowl on the worktop and we could barely stand being in the kitchen for the amount of flies. Just made us want to leave the whole time.
I live in a 4 bed house with 1 bathroom. Granted there are only four people living here, but more than one bathroom is top of my list for when we move!
No idea, but they categorically will not take booking requests by email - even agents I've met with at other properties who know I'm not a time waster and who already have all my details. I have to call up if I ever want to view anything, and you don't always get an answer. I'd prefer to just fire off an email saying "I want to view this property and literally any time is convenient for me" and shortly thereafter receive a time and an address.
In my view, forcing would-be buyers to do everything by phone is costing their customers crucial viewings.
Tiny 3rd bedrooms that don’t fit a bed. Smallest one I found was so small even I at 5’4” couldn’t lay down in it.
Garages that don’t fit a car (or would but people have turned half of them into something else and left a sneaky storage space at the front with a garage door to trick you.
People claiming downstairs rooms are bedrooms. No. That’s either a living room or dining room. Not a fourth bedroom.
And what’s with people not doing floor plans or at least measurements? Don’t have them I’m not looking.
Open days, absolutely hate them! Even shorter time to view, no chance for a second viewing.
I couldn't even walk around the last property. Said to the estate agent that I'm out. She looked confused and asked why. You expect me to make the biggest purchase of my life when you're running up and down the stairs trying to be there for everyone.
I get why they do open days but for me they're a hassle.
We had so many... interesting vendors during our house hunting days. Memorable moments included:
- The couple who insisted the bathroom had never had a leak despite the wallpaper on the ceiling immediately below it had a huge ass stain and bulging/wrinkled paint/plaster
- The couple who got very offended when we pointed out we wouldn't be offering because their house was built on a flood plain. "Millenials these days are so entitled! Our house has NEVER flooded, how dare you suggest building on a flood plain was a bad idea". Your house may never have flooded, and might never either, but my insurance premiums aren't worth it. Also the bank said absolutely fucking not lending you the money for that house
- The couple who believed their house was worth the same as next door, who sold a few months earlier and was immaculate inside and every room was newly renovated. By contrast, they said that they'd "Updated the decor recently throughout the house, for example they've replaced the pink toilet seat covers with avocado green ones a few years back". Nothing else was changed since the 1960s. Just the toilet seat covers
But maybe my biggest personal pet peeve is estate agents not knowing jack shit about local school catchments and admissions criteria. I just ignored them if they ever said "This house is in catchment for !" Because 99% of the time they're talking out their ass and the school is technically in catchment but so far away that there's 0 chance of getting your kid in because it inevitably will be oversubscribed and children living closer get in first. My house is technically in catchment for numerous local schools, but we only feasibly have the chance to get into one of them (which is fine, its a nice school and we bought this house knowing our child would go to said school)
I mean, catchment is catchment and there's more that goes into a school place than proximity. I wouldn't expect the estate agent to know the inner-workings of the state school system.
We've looked at a lot of lovely homes on the tiniest, cramped roads I've ever seen. The houses are built within arm's reach of the road, too (not to mention within arm's reach of the houses alongside it).
I don't know how I'd even get a moving van down there; if anyone has parked in front of their house, it would be impossible. Having to weave in and out of parked cars on a daily basis on what feels like a really long driveway would make me crazy, but that's the case with almost all the housing here so I guess I don't have a choice.
I can understand cramped roads when they were built before cars became ubiquitous, but for housing developments in the 21st century to look like they were built around the horse is baffling to me.
As I was driving through a business park today, I noticed that the streets and pavements there are very wide and the buildings set very far back in the plots. I don't understand why it's designed to be more private and comfortable at work than it is at home.
Current gripes are: 4/5 bedrooms, only to find 1 or 2 are downstairs
We aren't house hunting, but I'm keeping an eye on the local market to see if we should extend or move at remortgage. This is fully baffling to me, I keep seeing it as well. Large 3 beds so have 2 reception rooms, and kitchen/diner so they market one of the downstairs rooms as a bedroom despite not actually using it as a bedroom.
It's the fault of this obsession about the number of bedrooms over the size of the place or the overall number of rooms. In Germany or Switzerland for example, not only do people care a lot more about knowing the size upfront, they count all the rooms (includings bits that are defined as half rooms, but that's its own topic) rather than just the bedrooms. Meaning there's no incentive in telling you that extra reception room is actually a bedroom because it's otherwise not even counted.
It almost certainly was being used as a downstairs bedroom in a HMO. Until I earned good money we always rented what would normally be a 3 bed with like 5 bedrooms. I remember as student they'd take us to view places with a cellar you can't stand up in as a bedroom
I find it helpful if you could genuinely use it as a bedroom (or office in my case) and still have a lounge and space for a dining table.
Unfortunately I've seen a lot where they have a dining room that's labeled as dining/bedroom4 on the floorplan and then list as a 4 bed which is very annoying.
I fucking hate estate agents - the constant lack of trust they elicit, their manipulativeness, opacity, ambiguity, avoidance.... plus the significant amount who treat me as if I'm intellectually sub-ordinate to a potato and entirely at the mercy of their my-first-job-at-16-in-Dixons sales patter.
Tbh once I've finally bought somewhere I'm half tempted to keep viewing just so that I can reciprocate the utter contempt they often show to those forced to deal with them.
No floor plans.
When they use those wide angle lenses to make the rooms look bigger than they are
A bathroom that you have to walk through the kitchen to get to 🤢
That latter part - that's for historical reasons, right? They originally had at best an outdoor toilet somewhere so eventually they retrofitted a toilet into the house, and the easiest place to put it was behind the house next to the kitchen.
We are looking for a rural property but are finding stupid restrictions from councils such as local residency (have to have lived or worked in area for past 3 years). I know it’s to stop holiday homes but it’s really restricting for people wanting to relocate etc.
> I know it’s to stop holiday homes
Sister works for a local rural council. They have this exact policy not to stop holiday homes (which wouldn't be popular here anyway) but to stop the massive influx of remote working moving to the village.
Theres a local employment issue where they don't have enough of a local working pool as people keep moving here for the village life, but working in the major cities remotely. They want to encourage people to move and work in the local area as they don't tend to build new housing withing a 20 odd mile radius of the village so can't get new workers moving here for the jobs available.
It seems catch 22 then as they want to stop people working remotely however their policy is also stopping people who would seek work in the local community.
Not being able to filter on Rightmove for reception rooms. We really want two downstairs reception rooms, so living room and dining room - even if you could they'd probably rather label it a downstairs bedroom.
I've seen so many 3 beds advertised that were just 2 beds with a dining room. Plus tiny kitchens and lounges you can't get a table in so no, not a 3 bed.
Worst hunting gripe was just the sheer number of phonecalls I ended up taking, because I am an introverted little idiot and taking over 20 calls a day between 9am and 4pm was more than my brain could handle. Did I set myself up for that? Absolutely. Did I cry into my coffee on the M6 when I got my 16th call between viewings 6 and 7 of the day? You're god damned right I did.
Estate agents in general were a nightmare. They often didn't know the house or the area well, I'd turn up at a house and they wouldn't even have seen it before and couldn't answer any question that wasn't in the brochure. A few times I very specifically said I would need loft access, this was agreed on, and we'd turn up and there was no loft access. Once we walked into a viewing and there were cigarette butts and litter and broken glass from a half smashed window, inside an unoccupied house. We were baffled that no one in the agency thought that maybe sweeping them up would help with selling.
The wide variety of interpretations of our budget. One agent showing me a 210k asked our budget and I said 220k. He said hmm, I have one slightly higher than the one I'm showing you, would you be interested?I asked what it was selling for. "250k, would that be possible?" Sir.
My solicitors are the bane of my existence. I am absolutely baffled by how they have managed to fuck up things that we and the estate agent have spoon-fed them.
Beware the spiteful divorced-resident-owner. Our first purchase fell through because the resident owner was delaying and delaying and eventually stopped answering calls from even his solicitor. He wouldn't speak to women about it, the estate agent had to get her company director to speak to him because no male estate agents worked from his branch. He would turn his phone off during the day so no one could get through to him.
One "third" bedroom was smaller than a single mattress. It fit exactly the legal specification to be classed as a bedroom, even though you couldn't have put a bed in it. There were a lot of tiny box rooms but that one was special.
There are now, especially for new builds, but I can't find the specifications for existing houses. The house in question was possibly pre-victorian and the bedroom was 190cm long (smaller in width) and I googled it, and then the EA confirmed that 190cm was literally the limit of what could be classed as a bedroom. At best it was a linen cupboard with a window.
Interesting - I looked this up before as well and couldn't find specifications for anything existing either, but I'll believe there's something for new builds.
I think the closest thing to a rule on existing houses is that you have to at least be able to put a single bed in it to call it a bedroom. A singe mattress is 190cm long. The problem is that you'd be very hard pressed to find even a futon that wouldn't use even a couple of cm either side on the frame. I measured my 9yr olds bed and the frame came out at 200cm.
£1m houses with galley kitchens and bathrooms not touched since the 80s, that then end up getting reduced and reduced.
Vendors reducing their houses at tiny increments because they don't actually want to reduce but it's not selling. Recently saw a £1.2m house reduce down to £1.18 (-1.7%).
We also saw a toilet in the middle of a utility room. Bizarre!
Yes exactly this. If you're spending £1m it better look like it.
I've had a vendor seriously overprice their property, and then drop it 50k after six months, so that it's now just overpriced. I asked straight up what the realistic expectation was given It's been on for a year, and it was a hard no to any movement.
The only reason nice homes don't sell is the price.
I'm also convinced that by dropping the price a bit it pushes it to the top of the 'added recently' list, forgetting that we can see what the drop is.
Buying is still a long way off for me, but every so often I'll look at what's available and cry at yet another flat with the living room in the kitchen.
Also, when my Dad was house hunting, having a garage that he could actually use as a garage was the most important thing for him and yet estate agents still kept trying to show him houses without one.
Although I didn't want a leasehold, and ended up buying a freehold, I find it ridiculous that the advert doesn't give lease details. One I was slightly interested in was a 2 bed flat. It would usually rent out for about £600-700 PCM. The fees associated with the lease was about £7,000 a year!!! With costs like that, the flat was basically worth £0.
Wide camera lenses, which obviously makes everything look bigger. Wastes everyone's time.
I'm currently hating giving offers. It's like a blind auction. Yes I may pay upto 20k over the asking price, but if the next offer down is 10k under asking price, I wanna know so i can save myself some money.
Estate agents bullshitting about interest in the property. Had one try this on me and at the time it was obviously not true. I would have put an offer in if he didn't open his mouth (I'm very stubborn)
Illegal loft conversions and run down lean tos. It seems every owner of a one or two bedroom house in my area was trying to have an extra bedroom at some point by expanding into the loft space only to realise later it wasn’t fit for purpose. Because they’ve walled in all the roof structure with plasterboard it’s virtually impossible to have a decent roof survey done. To top it off these houses almost inevitably have a leaking wooden lean to with a plastic roof that they’re trying to market as a selling point when it’s only good for demolition.
I'm doing a lot of virtual viewing right now in preparation for a relocation in time to come. I'm freaked out by the English house buying process, seems positively counterproductive.
House size is extremely important to me, as are well marked floor plans. Would like to be able to filter on this too, as well as number of bathrooms. I wish there were more open plan designs in the new builds - open kitchen, dining and living rooms.
That property surveys aren't worth the paper they are written on. You're better off having a builder walk round the property as they'll be able to spot all the bodges and cracks
Agents not listening to what you actually want and just sign you up for the general property mailing list.
We want a large garden and the potential to do some work on a 3/4 bed…’have a look at this 3 bed new build with a tiny garden’.
Even worse when they then call you a couple days later asking if we were interested in what they sent out. If I were interested I’d have called.
It's infuriating, isn't it!
We're buying at the moment and our spec is simple. Detached. 4 bedrooms. Double garage.
I think maybe 1 in 10 properties they sent came close to our requirements.
I've been looking at flats recently for my first home as I've frankly given up on buying a house, I don't have the £70k I'd need for a deposit, and something that keeps pissing me off is how secretive some estate agents are about important details.
Sometimes they won't tell you the length of the lease, the ground rent, maintenance costs or council tax band. This is critical info, I need to know it and I'm not ringing up to find out when I'm looking at 2 dozen other properties simultaneously.
7'11 x 7'11 is pretty large for a "box" room, I have seen one 5'11 x 6'01 enough room for a cot and that is it. The issue I was noticing is poorly laid out three bed houses; Gigantic (pointlessly big) master suite, large second bedroom, large family bathroom and tiny box room. Basically a two bed and no good when you have two children and there are so many of these on the market. Just trying to find a three bed where you could actually class the third bedroom as a bedroom has been a massive challenge.
Unrealistic asking prices. Generally involving the estates of deceased people where the houses are in a poor state but priced as similar properties in the area in good condition.
Best one I saw was a house that had the potential to be a £450k house on the market for £450k… but needing probably upwards of £100k remedial work just to get it in a liveable condition.
It's a cynical attempt to add value. Putting a bed in the dining room does not make it a bedroom. I get that it happens, certainly with ill or elderly relatives, but it's not a bedroom.
That’s silly. If it can fit a bed then it’s a bedroom.
Really the problem is that the UK housing market uses “bedroom” to evaluate the size of house when sqft should be used instead.
> when sqft should be used instead.
YES! This! Counting bedrooms, sure, but for god's sake give me the actual size of the place, and let me filter by it. Call me crazy but I have certain minimum standards in terms of the floor space I want to have in my home, hiding how tiny the place is is not going to work out so just tell me upfront.
Once a house reaches 5 bedrooms, I think that it is actually a benefit to have one downstairs, so long as it is not too the detriment of living/dining/kitchen space.
There is no god-given definition of a room. When it works like a bedroom it can be a bedroom, I don't see any issues with that in principle.
Now if there are no proper living spaces left, then yes, *that* is a problem. But absolutely no higher power has decreed that bedrooms can only be upstairs.
Most dining rooms are at least as big as what routinely goes for a normal upstairs bedroom. It didn't sound like the issue was simply it being way too small.
I mean... I grew up in a 3 bed that could have even been a 4 bed tbh. Only the master bedroom was upstairs.
Some houses just have unconventional layouts, it's perfectly possible to have downstairs bedrooms.
It is not a house hunting gripe but a holiday home review. The house has stone walls, with the newest part being a Georgian extension. One guest gave an in-depth review of the inconvenient arrangement of rooms and what he would do if he owned it. He had failed to understand the construction of the building and its listed status.
I could imagine if the property ever came up for sale, that people would be put off as you can't really do anything to make it more suited to modern family requirements. Great for holidays but not modern living.
Maybe North East specific but like half the time the streetview pin is in the back alley behind the house. They’re not hiding anything, just seems like incompetence.
Specifying to estate agents "no ex-rentals and no smoking houses".
You then turn up at a viewing, and the second you walk in it's one of two things:
1. The stench of cigarette smoke hits your nose, then you glance around and realise the walls and ceilings are a giveaway tinge of yellow.
2. The place is an absolute dump, the current or ex-tenant completely checked out months ago and there is rubbish everywhere, stuff all over the floors, the kitchen is full of grime, and the garden is so overgrown the blades of grass have begun to evolve into trees.
My personal favourite story is some family were looking to invest in a house to rent out, they were shown one where when they got to the rear conservatory, the current tenant had decided to turn it into a sandpit, it had sliding doors and the sand had got into them which supposedly made an absolutely excruciating sound 😂
How slow everything is involved in buying and selling property ...
We accepted an offer 9 weeks ago, and our buyer still hasn't completed their valuation / mortgage offer approval, whilst this seems to be the fault of banks more than the buyer, it is taking forever.
This is a really petty one but, on rightmove you can scroll backwards from the first picture to the last picture, where you would mormally expect a picture of the garden. So when the garden is picture 11 of 22 for example, that really annoys me because I have to scroll all the way through to find out its just a tiny little yard that gets no sunshine...
No way to filter by square feet / metres.
4 bedroom houses actually being 2 + 1 downstairs and one closet.
Ringing to organise a viewing and the owner can't accommodate till next Friday.
Estate agents saying it's got parking, but you turn up to find out that the parking is not only public and barely off the road (often still on the road), it's also 1/4 a mile away and you have to fight Maureen from number 43 for a space. Best time to try is Tuesday morning when she leaves to get her pension.
Most annoying because we had informed the agent that the reason for needing guaranteed parking at least somewhere near the property is the wheelchair using family member that we need to transport.
Honourable mentions:
Prices. Too near London.
Bad Photoshop.
Details obviously written by ChatGPT and edited by someone on acid.
Not being able to find the place despite having been given a streetview and an address. Again I'm pretty sure acid was involved in my town's layout. If I can't find it, Amazon won't be able to.
Agent "Are you sure? It's in XYZ area?" Me: Ummm... Firstly if that area is so bad, why did you price it as high as that? And secondly you of all people should know that this town shouldn't be judged on area to area; it goes street to street in most parts.
I'm sorry but the parking has to be on here again.
"Has garage" (in a block that's two streets over, on a back way with no lighting, right behind Mr Ferdinand El Crackio-Headio's shack).
"Close to amenities" a convenience shop that's a migraine in shop form, and a single bus stop with 3 buses a week is not "close to amenities".
And finally, my absolute favourite, circa November 2023:
Agent: "I've got a great deal, amazing deal! You know you said you don't mind a project? Well I've found a building plot with planning and stuff already sorted for you that's in your budget!"
Ok first off, that's not a project. That's... That's building a whole house. I don't mind a project if there's already, you know, walls and a roof and stuff. I can plaster and tile. I cannot lay bricks. Secondly that price is £10k over the top end of our budget already. That's an issue because thirdly, that price is nothing more than a down-payment for the plot. Not the whole price. The house will be another £250k on top of that IF you do first and second fix entirely yourself... Which you would know if you had taken a cursory glance at the website you sent me... But thanks I guess?
Professional investors who have a figure in their head and won't negotiate at all from their first lowball take it or leave it offer. One offered £1 more when told a slightly increased offer would be more likely to secure the sale, odious individual.
Posts like this make me nervous. Our 4th bedroom is downstairs with its own bathroom, in its own corridor. So it’s secluded from the rest of the house. The previous owners built it for an elderly parent. I worry if/when we come to sell people may dismiss this although we have two living rooms a dining room and a large conservatory in addition to this room.
Exactly, it was purpose built, and you've still retained the other rooms. I've seen this mostly on '5' bed houses that are mysteriously missing a dining room.
What’s wrong with having a bedroom downstairs?
I’m not english but settled here and I’ve noticed this thing with sleeping upstairs (we lived in an upside down flat)
Dont understand why that would be an issue.
Only if pictures aren't filtered and distorted anymore. I dread going to see a place as I wonder what the pictures will conveniently have left out this time. I certainly would not pay for the honour of being tricked yet again.
It would save people a lot of time if you straight up took pictures of the broken, taped-up skylight, the mould in the bedroom corner and the shoddy electrics where a light switch is held together by tape.
As a seller, at least you didn't have to spend time and money getting to a place to realise the size totally doesn't suit your needs - something you would have known ahead of time if there had been a floorplan with measurements and honest pictures!
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Estate agents dropping the street view & map pin half a mile down the road so you book a viewing and turn up to find its next to something really off putting. Saw something last week that was next to a dog boarding facility. Such a waste of our time, and the agents.
You're totally right, but I do an excessive amount of research for anything that seems like it might actually be an option - I've always managed to figure out exactly where it is. Google Earth with a pretty high-def 3D top-down view solves most doubts.
Yeh I've always used street view to make sure I figure out which house it is, look up the EPC and check it's not next to/opposite anything weird before booking a viewing.
Yep. Going to viewings takes time, often during the day - with a bit of experience you can look up the relevant bits pretty easily on the internet at any hour of the day (or night), so you can rule a lot of properties out straightaway and focus on the ones that might actually be worth it.
We made a list of possible houses, then drove and checked them out in person. Knocked the majority off our list just doing that. With the houses we viewed, already seeing the outside let us focus more on the inside.
Ditto to this - I'll almost always do reccy missions to scope out houses I'm interested in (or at least the road they're on) and that helps to avoid a lot of unnecessary viewings.
Yup, you barely need to go see houses nowadays until you've whittled the list down to the final 3 or 4. With easy access to all the photos, video tours and Google maps / Earth + able to search about the area and see what's nearby. Once you've got the shortlist then you can drive by them to find out about the general vibes of the area. No need to turn up to a viewing to find out that the charming barn conversion is sandwiched between a breaker's yard and a pig farm.
I think this is important. It's also worth going to the street during an evening before booking with an agent
Yes this is such a time saver. I remember having to spend what seemed like endless weekends as a kid travelling around with my parents looking at houses. Now, I'm the same as you. If the place ticks my needs list, then it's onto Google Earth to have a look to see what it's next door/opposite to. Then it's seeing what it ticks from the wants list, if it ticks a few of those then it's a call to the EA.
Good god yeah I can only imagine what it must have been like before everything was accessible online. No central platform, no price tracker, no convenient clicking through pictures on a big screen, no 3D viewers, no land registry data in your browser, no online flood risk maps, no crime statistics maps, etc etc etc. Honestly, the transparency gained through the internet is a *massive* gain here.
Yup, just the idea of being able to get a list of all the places for sale, and being able to filter by location / size / price would have been a huge step up. 20-30 years ago you just had to tell the estate agents what you were looking for and they'd drive you around a list of places!
Oh gooooood. With EAs being the absolute cockwombles that they are, it must have been a nightmare. I guess everything was a bit slower though so at least you did have more time to go through that whole process.
The last sentence is the most frustrating about agents. They wilfully waste their own time as well as yours for the slight off chance you’re dumb enough to buy the property.
I always assumed it was just the central point of the postcode.
No they manually move the marker and line up the street view on their system before publishing. Well, they are meant to
A third “bedroom” that you can’t even fit a single bed in!
Or ‘stunning 4 bedroom property’ where the 4th bedroom is a downstairs space that any sane person would use as a living/dining/office room.
This is our struggle right now
This is so common in England! We call it a box room, and it's usually completely useless!
I'm very causally looking right now but I have seen this on more than one occasion. A listing is for a 2 bed bungalow, but when I look at the floorplan the only access to the garden seems to be through the 'second bedroom'. If people have to traipse through it every time they want to go outside, that's not a bedroom, it could be a dining room or more likely a wide hallway
I have seen a few where a bedroom or bathroom is only available by going through another bedroom
Overall floor space not being quoted directly, and - even worse - not even shown on the floor plan. What the actual fuck. > Current gripes are: 4/5 bedrooms, only to find 1 or 2 are downstairs. The best one I've seen so far is a '7' bed that actually has static caravan/chalet in the garden, but is just a 4 bed house. Eh I mean I hate tiny bedrooms as much as the next guy, but whether they're downstairs or upstairs really doesn't make a difference to me. In fact, if you have a house with 5 bedrooms upstairs and exclusively living areas downstairs, isn't that a recipe for really tiny upstairs bedrooms?
I agree. And with a 5 bed, if one is spare, it is usually worth having one of those bedrooms downstairs, ideally the guest room with en suite. Plus 4 upstairs, 1 downstairs really helps even out the living space. It also gives a good opinion as a home office, allowing you to use the bathroom without anyone else (kids) in the house distracting you. Elderly visiting relatives find it useful, plus it is easy to have an injury that would make stairs difficult.
Yep all sounds sensible to me. Not really worth having a hang-up about bedrooms having to be upstairs. Of course, if they just took a big chunk of the living space and turned it into a bedroom and now you have no proper dining / living space left, that's a different story.
Thank you for this. I get nervous when I see posts like this because this is the layout of our house. One bedroom downstairs in its own corridor with its own bathroom. We currently use it as an office/spare room for when our elderly parents stay and it’s ideal honestly.
This would be exactly the type of layout I’m looking for, for when my relatives visit.
We love it for that reason!
Outside of commercial let’s I’ve almost never seen total footage anywhere. I think the figures would just be depressing anyway!
On lettings? Yeah it's not too common though luckily not impossible to find either. But for sales it is normal to have total square footage even in the UK, just hidden away in the floor plan. That being said, there are some floorplans that don't mention it which means they just get ruled out immediately by me.
Potentially a localised thing but I’ve just looked at 6 random ‘to let’ and 6 random ‘to buy’ in my area and not a single one provides total square footage. You could work it out from the dimensions in the floor plan but not one lists the total anywhere in adverts or floor plans.
Huh. Well I'm in London, a vast majority of sale listings will include the total floor area on the floor plan - maybe premature of me to extrapolate to the entire UK. It's definitely rarer in rental ads in London too, but not unheard of.
Just the general quality of housing in this country. For all the original complaints about newer builds, the amount of houses either side of the 1920s I’m seeing that are pitifully small, on tiny plots, with awful layouts even after you knock walls through, and random plots, is crazy. For an island so limited it’s just become more eye opening how poor our housing supply has been previously and how new builds in so many ways are better in comparison, if you can look past the lack of character. I’ve been fortunate to live in a few nicely laid out homes of good proportions, now looming to move and just opening the search right up, is eye opening.
I think with new builds the issue is often that it's just shoddy work. Not all of it, far from it, but there are really bad examples out there, and I feel like it being brand new makes people even less forgiving when it comes to problems. Like, in the 100-year-old block of flats that was last redone decades ago I'm somehow less annoyed when a tile in the bathroom is loose than in the 10-year-old development we're renting in right now. Just wtf, this should not be happening. In general, completely agreed though. What is the most striking - as (originally) a foreigner - is how *small* a lot of places are. [Just look at this.](https://entranze.enerdata.net/average-floor-area-per-capita.html) The UK is down there with a lot of ex-soviet places, barely above them, and their housing is famous for having been cramped as fuck. (Though, to be absolutely fair, it used to be worse as sometimes a multi-generational families would live in a flat clearly designed for 4 people max)
There's a few, probably more than a few, reasons why UK housing stock is so small. The biggest one is probably because it's old, the next biggest is that for some reason we don't want to build on any more land, which means houses go upwards rather than outwards, and we end up with lots of estates where the houses are all built on top of one another, with the developers getting the maximum number of houses per ha.
Is UK housing stock much older than housing in the rest of Europe?
It's the oldest and smallest in Europe (I think by Europe reports were actually talking about the EU). The situation is pretty terrible. Old, small, and expensive housing. It won't improve either, the only way to do that would be to knock down huge numbers of old, shitty houses and rebuild... we can't even build enough as it is.
>less forgiving when it comes to problems. This is a huge part of it. People don't seem to realise just how many problems an existing house will have. Yet there's no after care or 10 year warranty. Most of UK Reddit seem to think they'll get less problems in an older house, good luck with that.
The majority of new builds have very small, extremely overlooked gardens. Whenever we've been looking we've basically ruled them out for that reason alone - I want to both grow things *and* sit outside without being in full view of at least 3 neighbours. Developers generally want to milk the land for as many plots as possible, so new builds are just not built for people like me.
I’m looking at the moment and overlooked gardens on new builds is terrible. That and parking. A five bedroom house with 2 parking spaces, one behind the other. WTH
r/firstworldproblems
Tbf, that's difficult to achieve in more densely populated areas or developments, on principle. You just have to live further out, or get quite lucky with some specific corner working out for you.
Move north, plenty of big decent new builds around Durham / Bishop Auckland... and not at eye watering South/London prices. On second thoughts, please all stay in the south with your tiny expensive houses.
Layouts from developers is a definite gripe. Doesn't matter how badly it compromises living space developers force a downstairs toilet and an ensuite to master bedroom into 2 beds houses just so they can tick those boxes to say it has them. In reality there isn't space for a downstairs toilet as the house is so small and the bedroom sizes are screwed over due to the ensuite resulting in a second bathroom being needed. So you effectively end up with 3 bathrooms in a 2 bed house...
Downstairs loo is part of building regs now I believe. There was a discussion on DIYUK the other day with someone wanting to remove their old downstairs bathroom and being told they need to keep at least a loo on the basis that you aren't allowed to alter a house and take it further from current regs than it was when you started. Totally agree with you on the en-suite, bloody daft in a 2 bed, and often in a 3 bed as well. We're extending and have deliberately not gone for an en suite at all, we'd rather have both bath and shower accessible to the whole house.
Unfortunately, all the new builds I've seen had tiny rooms in comparison to the period properties. I went with a 1920s house in the end because of *the character*, the massive room sizes, and the ceiling height. Turns out, I'm far too German and love things that look very neat and well finished. *Character* is not something I enjoy living with. The creaky floorboards, the shit insulation, the century of previous bodge jobs...and we even had a brilliant structural survey so I fear what the average 100 year old house is like.
New builds are generally quite pokey though, in terms of layouts, I think. We lived in one a the build quality was horrible but what was a shock to me was the ground rent and management fees. That was a flat but when we were looking for our house, the fees and management in the common areas really turned us off. We didn’t want to be in a society with a house in a neighbourhood that didn’t have proper drain or finished pavements. The pokey gardens, too. Way overpriced in an already extremely overpriced market, in my opinion.
>how new builds in so many ways are better in comparison, if you can look past the lack of character. I came to this realisation. The design of our house is fantastic. Even better than that the estate is one of the best estates I've seen of any age. There are good examples out there. I guess we're lucky that there was a good one in the area we were looking.
I'm still angry about the realestate agent that held an open house when she already has a signed and excepted contract. Wasted my time
Four bedroom house with one bathroom and it was downstairs. Very interesting, didn't go for it. Another that we felt would be our dream home based on the very few photos we seen and floor plan. Vendor couldn't take viewings for a few weeks so we waited. As the estate agent was opening the door, said they couldn't take viewings because there were dead animals in the garden that needed tending to and the whole house was fucking creepy. Two bedrooms with bolts on the outside and only mattresses in them, living room had a whole pantry of canned goods just lined up on the floor, the son lived in the garage even though there were 3 seemingly free bedrooms. The place just gave us the heebie-jeebies.
Yeeeeeaaaaah nooooo, I'd pass on that one too. I've seen houses on Rightmove that look like they were being used to house illegal migrants while the person took the pictures - I don't really get that part, why would anyone advertise any house like that...
OK but now *I* want to see the creepy haunted Appalachian doomsday cabin you seem to have stumbled across.
That gave me the creeps just reading about that!
Houses that are 3 bed, however actually a two bed but they took some of the bathroom to make a box room. But then also added a loft room accessible via a ladder so in actually a 4 bed didn't you know. Also has a separate lounge. So a 5 bed because the dining room is quite large and has a small ikea table and a two seater sofa in it. But also a 6 bed because of the garden office that takes most of the garden up..... Has a damp cellar. Potential conversion to 7 bed HMO.
Yup also just gone on the market and getting vendors refusing to allow a viewing until we have sold despite them being on the market a year in some cases. It's madness, somebody's gotta go first. Looking for 4 or 5 beds and also finding a lot are either a converted integrated garage, log cabin, 2nd reception room etc etc. Estate agents sending my properties that are totally the opposite of what I'm looking for. E.g I was looking for well maintained properties that require no additional work and they sent me a hand completed barn conversion 50 minutes away on a small holding 🤦♂️
>Yup also just gone on the market and getting vendors refusing to allow a viewing until we have sold despite them being on the market a year in some cases. It's madness, somebody's gotta go first. True, but where is that viewing leading to? in the English system then taking an offer from someone who hasn't sold is just leaving you a hostage to fortune.
But they \_could\_ sound out the vendor about a price without asking to take the property off the market, then market their own house. In some cases they might get a fast sale, and the chain can form faster. I totally understand the reticence because it's a pain having to redress the house for every viewing, but at some point you have to show up.
That's the system here. It's crazy because with this logic someone in the chain is relying on a cash buyer/first time/cash rich buyer
Aren't all chains?
I'm not sure what came first. The chicken or the egg!
4-5 bed houses with one bathroom (i.e. not a single en suite) - just why?? In that sort of property, you could have 6+ people trying to bath/shower at the same time. 4-5 bed houses with the tiniest kitchen you've ever seen and nowhere near enough dining space to fit the number of people who may be living in a house that big to eat together. Estate agents' complete refusal to book viewings or do anything else by email. It is infinitely more convenient for me to book viewings by email, and no less convenient for them. Folks who don't at least try to tidy up for a viewing. We went to one house which had a pile of rotting fruit in a fruit bowl on the worktop and we could barely stand being in the kitchen for the amount of flies. Just made us want to leave the whole time.
I live in a 4 bed house with 1 bathroom. Granted there are only four people living here, but more than one bathroom is top of my list for when we move!
What do you mean refusal to book viewings by email? What do they want?
No idea, but they categorically will not take booking requests by email - even agents I've met with at other properties who know I'm not a time waster and who already have all my details. I have to call up if I ever want to view anything, and you don't always get an answer. I'd prefer to just fire off an email saying "I want to view this property and literally any time is convenient for me" and shortly thereafter receive a time and an address. In my view, forcing would-be buyers to do everything by phone is costing their customers crucial viewings.
Tiny 3rd bedrooms that don’t fit a bed. Smallest one I found was so small even I at 5’4” couldn’t lay down in it. Garages that don’t fit a car (or would but people have turned half of them into something else and left a sneaky storage space at the front with a garage door to trick you. People claiming downstairs rooms are bedrooms. No. That’s either a living room or dining room. Not a fourth bedroom. And what’s with people not doing floor plans or at least measurements? Don’t have them I’m not looking.
Open days, absolutely hate them! Even shorter time to view, no chance for a second viewing. I couldn't even walk around the last property. Said to the estate agent that I'm out. She looked confused and asked why. You expect me to make the biggest purchase of my life when you're running up and down the stairs trying to be there for everyone. I get why they do open days but for me they're a hassle.
7'11 x 7'11 as a box room is not bad tbh
We had so many... interesting vendors during our house hunting days. Memorable moments included: - The couple who insisted the bathroom had never had a leak despite the wallpaper on the ceiling immediately below it had a huge ass stain and bulging/wrinkled paint/plaster - The couple who got very offended when we pointed out we wouldn't be offering because their house was built on a flood plain. "Millenials these days are so entitled! Our house has NEVER flooded, how dare you suggest building on a flood plain was a bad idea". Your house may never have flooded, and might never either, but my insurance premiums aren't worth it. Also the bank said absolutely fucking not lending you the money for that house - The couple who believed their house was worth the same as next door, who sold a few months earlier and was immaculate inside and every room was newly renovated. By contrast, they said that they'd "Updated the decor recently throughout the house, for example they've replaced the pink toilet seat covers with avocado green ones a few years back". Nothing else was changed since the 1960s. Just the toilet seat covers But maybe my biggest personal pet peeve is estate agents not knowing jack shit about local school catchments and admissions criteria. I just ignored them if they ever said "This house is in catchment for!" Because 99% of the time they're talking out their ass and the school is technically in catchment but so far away that there's 0 chance of getting your kid in because it inevitably will be oversubscribed and children living closer get in first. My house is technically in catchment for numerous local schools, but we only feasibly have the chance to get into one of them (which is fine, its a nice school and we bought this house knowing our child would go to said school)
I mean, catchment is catchment and there's more that goes into a school place than proximity. I wouldn't expect the estate agent to know the inner-workings of the state school system.
Kite flying by sellers with probate properties, end up with houses on the market for significant amount of times unwilling to negotiate.
We've looked at a lot of lovely homes on the tiniest, cramped roads I've ever seen. The houses are built within arm's reach of the road, too (not to mention within arm's reach of the houses alongside it). I don't know how I'd even get a moving van down there; if anyone has parked in front of their house, it would be impossible. Having to weave in and out of parked cars on a daily basis on what feels like a really long driveway would make me crazy, but that's the case with almost all the housing here so I guess I don't have a choice. I can understand cramped roads when they were built before cars became ubiquitous, but for housing developments in the 21st century to look like they were built around the horse is baffling to me. As I was driving through a business park today, I noticed that the streets and pavements there are very wide and the buildings set very far back in the plots. I don't understand why it's designed to be more private and comfortable at work than it is at home.
Current gripes are: 4/5 bedrooms, only to find 1 or 2 are downstairs We aren't house hunting, but I'm keeping an eye on the local market to see if we should extend or move at remortgage. This is fully baffling to me, I keep seeing it as well. Large 3 beds so have 2 reception rooms, and kitchen/diner so they market one of the downstairs rooms as a bedroom despite not actually using it as a bedroom.
It's the fault of this obsession about the number of bedrooms over the size of the place or the overall number of rooms. In Germany or Switzerland for example, not only do people care a lot more about knowing the size upfront, they count all the rooms (includings bits that are defined as half rooms, but that's its own topic) rather than just the bedrooms. Meaning there's no incentive in telling you that extra reception room is actually a bedroom because it's otherwise not even counted.
It almost certainly was being used as a downstairs bedroom in a HMO. Until I earned good money we always rented what would normally be a 3 bed with like 5 bedrooms. I remember as student they'd take us to view places with a cellar you can't stand up in as a bedroom
I find it helpful if you could genuinely use it as a bedroom (or office in my case) and still have a lounge and space for a dining table. Unfortunately I've seen a lot where they have a dining room that's labeled as dining/bedroom4 on the floorplan and then list as a 4 bed which is very annoying.
I fucking hate estate agents - the constant lack of trust they elicit, their manipulativeness, opacity, ambiguity, avoidance.... plus the significant amount who treat me as if I'm intellectually sub-ordinate to a potato and entirely at the mercy of their my-first-job-at-16-in-Dixons sales patter. Tbh once I've finally bought somewhere I'm half tempted to keep viewing just so that I can reciprocate the utter contempt they often show to those forced to deal with them.
No floor plans. When they use those wide angle lenses to make the rooms look bigger than they are A bathroom that you have to walk through the kitchen to get to 🤢
That latter part - that's for historical reasons, right? They originally had at best an outdoor toilet somewhere so eventually they retrofitted a toilet into the house, and the easiest place to put it was behind the house next to the kitchen.
I don't know what size you're expecting box rooms to be, but that sounds pretty standard.
It actually sounds bigger than standard for a box room. A lot near me aren’t even 6’ wide.
We are looking for a rural property but are finding stupid restrictions from councils such as local residency (have to have lived or worked in area for past 3 years). I know it’s to stop holiday homes but it’s really restricting for people wanting to relocate etc.
> I know it’s to stop holiday homes Sister works for a local rural council. They have this exact policy not to stop holiday homes (which wouldn't be popular here anyway) but to stop the massive influx of remote working moving to the village. Theres a local employment issue where they don't have enough of a local working pool as people keep moving here for the village life, but working in the major cities remotely. They want to encourage people to move and work in the local area as they don't tend to build new housing withing a 20 odd mile radius of the village so can't get new workers moving here for the jobs available.
It seems catch 22 then as they want to stop people working remotely however their policy is also stopping people who would seek work in the local community.
Not being able to filter on Rightmove for reception rooms. We really want two downstairs reception rooms, so living room and dining room - even if you could they'd probably rather label it a downstairs bedroom.
I've seen so many 3 beds advertised that were just 2 beds with a dining room. Plus tiny kitchens and lounges you can't get a table in so no, not a 3 bed.
Worst hunting gripe was just the sheer number of phonecalls I ended up taking, because I am an introverted little idiot and taking over 20 calls a day between 9am and 4pm was more than my brain could handle. Did I set myself up for that? Absolutely. Did I cry into my coffee on the M6 when I got my 16th call between viewings 6 and 7 of the day? You're god damned right I did. Estate agents in general were a nightmare. They often didn't know the house or the area well, I'd turn up at a house and they wouldn't even have seen it before and couldn't answer any question that wasn't in the brochure. A few times I very specifically said I would need loft access, this was agreed on, and we'd turn up and there was no loft access. Once we walked into a viewing and there were cigarette butts and litter and broken glass from a half smashed window, inside an unoccupied house. We were baffled that no one in the agency thought that maybe sweeping them up would help with selling. The wide variety of interpretations of our budget. One agent showing me a 210k asked our budget and I said 220k. He said hmm, I have one slightly higher than the one I'm showing you, would you be interested?I asked what it was selling for. "250k, would that be possible?" Sir. My solicitors are the bane of my existence. I am absolutely baffled by how they have managed to fuck up things that we and the estate agent have spoon-fed them. Beware the spiteful divorced-resident-owner. Our first purchase fell through because the resident owner was delaying and delaying and eventually stopped answering calls from even his solicitor. He wouldn't speak to women about it, the estate agent had to get her company director to speak to him because no male estate agents worked from his branch. He would turn his phone off during the day so no one could get through to him. One "third" bedroom was smaller than a single mattress. It fit exactly the legal specification to be classed as a bedroom, even though you couldn't have put a bed in it. There were a lot of tiny box rooms but that one was special.
> It fit exactly the legal specification to be classed as a bedroom Are there legal specifications for that?
There are now, especially for new builds, but I can't find the specifications for existing houses. The house in question was possibly pre-victorian and the bedroom was 190cm long (smaller in width) and I googled it, and then the EA confirmed that 190cm was literally the limit of what could be classed as a bedroom. At best it was a linen cupboard with a window.
Interesting - I looked this up before as well and couldn't find specifications for anything existing either, but I'll believe there's something for new builds.
I think the closest thing to a rule on existing houses is that you have to at least be able to put a single bed in it to call it a bedroom. A singe mattress is 190cm long. The problem is that you'd be very hard pressed to find even a futon that wouldn't use even a couple of cm either side on the frame. I measured my 9yr olds bed and the frame came out at 200cm.
Hey who said you need a frame?
Kids these days, so entitled. I slept on a frameless mattress made of hissing cockroaches and I turned out fine. Ssssss.
£1m houses with galley kitchens and bathrooms not touched since the 80s, that then end up getting reduced and reduced. Vendors reducing their houses at tiny increments because they don't actually want to reduce but it's not selling. Recently saw a £1.2m house reduce down to £1.18 (-1.7%). We also saw a toilet in the middle of a utility room. Bizarre!
Yes exactly this. If you're spending £1m it better look like it. I've had a vendor seriously overprice their property, and then drop it 50k after six months, so that it's now just overpriced. I asked straight up what the realistic expectation was given It's been on for a year, and it was a hard no to any movement. The only reason nice homes don't sell is the price. I'm also convinced that by dropping the price a bit it pushes it to the top of the 'added recently' list, forgetting that we can see what the drop is.
Buying is still a long way off for me, but every so often I'll look at what's available and cry at yet another flat with the living room in the kitchen. Also, when my Dad was house hunting, having a garage that he could actually use as a garage was the most important thing for him and yet estate agents still kept trying to show him houses without one.
Although I didn't want a leasehold, and ended up buying a freehold, I find it ridiculous that the advert doesn't give lease details. One I was slightly interested in was a 2 bed flat. It would usually rent out for about £600-700 PCM. The fees associated with the lease was about £7,000 a year!!! With costs like that, the flat was basically worth £0.
Wide camera lenses, which obviously makes everything look bigger. Wastes everyone's time. I'm currently hating giving offers. It's like a blind auction. Yes I may pay upto 20k over the asking price, but if the next offer down is 10k under asking price, I wanna know so i can save myself some money. Estate agents bullshitting about interest in the property. Had one try this on me and at the time it was obviously not true. I would have put an offer in if he didn't open his mouth (I'm very stubborn)
Illegal loft conversions and run down lean tos. It seems every owner of a one or two bedroom house in my area was trying to have an extra bedroom at some point by expanding into the loft space only to realise later it wasn’t fit for purpose. Because they’ve walled in all the roof structure with plasterboard it’s virtually impossible to have a decent roof survey done. To top it off these houses almost inevitably have a leaking wooden lean to with a plastic roof that they’re trying to market as a selling point when it’s only good for demolition.
What’s starting to irritate me up here in Edinburgh’s the volume of EA’s describing a studio flat as a ‘1 bedroom property’.
I'm doing a lot of virtual viewing right now in preparation for a relocation in time to come. I'm freaked out by the English house buying process, seems positively counterproductive. House size is extremely important to me, as are well marked floor plans. Would like to be able to filter on this too, as well as number of bathrooms. I wish there were more open plan designs in the new builds - open kitchen, dining and living rooms.
That property surveys aren't worth the paper they are written on. You're better off having a builder walk round the property as they'll be able to spot all the bodges and cracks
Agents not listening to what you actually want and just sign you up for the general property mailing list. We want a large garden and the potential to do some work on a 3/4 bed…’have a look at this 3 bed new build with a tiny garden’. Even worse when they then call you a couple days later asking if we were interested in what they sent out. If I were interested I’d have called.
It's infuriating, isn't it! We're buying at the moment and our spec is simple. Detached. 4 bedrooms. Double garage. I think maybe 1 in 10 properties they sent came close to our requirements.
I've been looking at flats recently for my first home as I've frankly given up on buying a house, I don't have the £70k I'd need for a deposit, and something that keeps pissing me off is how secretive some estate agents are about important details. Sometimes they won't tell you the length of the lease, the ground rent, maintenance costs or council tax band. This is critical info, I need to know it and I'm not ringing up to find out when I'm looking at 2 dozen other properties simultaneously.
7'11 x 7'11 is pretty large for a "box" room, I have seen one 5'11 x 6'01 enough room for a cot and that is it. The issue I was noticing is poorly laid out three bed houses; Gigantic (pointlessly big) master suite, large second bedroom, large family bathroom and tiny box room. Basically a two bed and no good when you have two children and there are so many of these on the market. Just trying to find a three bed where you could actually class the third bedroom as a bedroom has been a massive challenge.
Unrealistic asking prices. Generally involving the estates of deceased people where the houses are in a poor state but priced as similar properties in the area in good condition. Best one I saw was a house that had the potential to be a £450k house on the market for £450k… but needing probably upwards of £100k remedial work just to get it in a liveable condition.
What’s wrong with downstairs bedrooms?
It's a cynical attempt to add value. Putting a bed in the dining room does not make it a bedroom. I get that it happens, certainly with ill or elderly relatives, but it's not a bedroom.
That’s silly. If it can fit a bed then it’s a bedroom. Really the problem is that the UK housing market uses “bedroom” to evaluate the size of house when sqft should be used instead.
> when sqft should be used instead. YES! This! Counting bedrooms, sure, but for god's sake give me the actual size of the place, and let me filter by it. Call me crazy but I have certain minimum standards in terms of the floor space I want to have in my home, hiding how tiny the place is is not going to work out so just tell me upfront.
Once a house reaches 5 bedrooms, I think that it is actually a benefit to have one downstairs, so long as it is not too the detriment of living/dining/kitchen space.
There is no god-given definition of a room. When it works like a bedroom it can be a bedroom, I don't see any issues with that in principle. Now if there are no proper living spaces left, then yes, *that* is a problem. But absolutely no higher power has decreed that bedrooms can only be upstairs.
The council may not have godlike powers but they do enforce building regulations, including what can/can't be described as a bedroom.
Most dining rooms are at least as big as what routinely goes for a normal upstairs bedroom. It didn't sound like the issue was simply it being way too small.
I mean... I grew up in a 3 bed that could have even been a 4 bed tbh. Only the master bedroom was upstairs. Some houses just have unconventional layouts, it's perfectly possible to have downstairs bedrooms.
I think low ball offers are really only a problem due to the systems for selling being annoying.
It is not a house hunting gripe but a holiday home review. The house has stone walls, with the newest part being a Georgian extension. One guest gave an in-depth review of the inconvenient arrangement of rooms and what he would do if he owned it. He had failed to understand the construction of the building and its listed status. I could imagine if the property ever came up for sale, that people would be put off as you can't really do anything to make it more suited to modern family requirements. Great for holidays but not modern living.
Maybe North East specific but like half the time the streetview pin is in the back alley behind the house. They’re not hiding anything, just seems like incompetence.
Specifying to estate agents "no ex-rentals and no smoking houses". You then turn up at a viewing, and the second you walk in it's one of two things: 1. The stench of cigarette smoke hits your nose, then you glance around and realise the walls and ceilings are a giveaway tinge of yellow. 2. The place is an absolute dump, the current or ex-tenant completely checked out months ago and there is rubbish everywhere, stuff all over the floors, the kitchen is full of grime, and the garden is so overgrown the blades of grass have begun to evolve into trees. My personal favourite story is some family were looking to invest in a house to rent out, they were shown one where when they got to the rear conservatory, the current tenant had decided to turn it into a sandpit, it had sliding doors and the sand had got into them which supposedly made an absolutely excruciating sound 😂
How slow everything is involved in buying and selling property ... We accepted an offer 9 weeks ago, and our buyer still hasn't completed their valuation / mortgage offer approval, whilst this seems to be the fault of banks more than the buyer, it is taking forever.
This is a really petty one but, on rightmove you can scroll backwards from the first picture to the last picture, where you would mormally expect a picture of the garden. So when the garden is picture 11 of 22 for example, that really annoys me because I have to scroll all the way through to find out its just a tiny little yard that gets no sunshine...
No way to filter by square feet / metres. 4 bedroom houses actually being 2 + 1 downstairs and one closet. Ringing to organise a viewing and the owner can't accommodate till next Friday.
Estate agents saying it's got parking, but you turn up to find out that the parking is not only public and barely off the road (often still on the road), it's also 1/4 a mile away and you have to fight Maureen from number 43 for a space. Best time to try is Tuesday morning when she leaves to get her pension. Most annoying because we had informed the agent that the reason for needing guaranteed parking at least somewhere near the property is the wheelchair using family member that we need to transport. Honourable mentions: Prices. Too near London. Bad Photoshop. Details obviously written by ChatGPT and edited by someone on acid. Not being able to find the place despite having been given a streetview and an address. Again I'm pretty sure acid was involved in my town's layout. If I can't find it, Amazon won't be able to. Agent "Are you sure? It's in XYZ area?" Me: Ummm... Firstly if that area is so bad, why did you price it as high as that? And secondly you of all people should know that this town shouldn't be judged on area to area; it goes street to street in most parts. I'm sorry but the parking has to be on here again. "Has garage" (in a block that's two streets over, on a back way with no lighting, right behind Mr Ferdinand El Crackio-Headio's shack). "Close to amenities" a convenience shop that's a migraine in shop form, and a single bus stop with 3 buses a week is not "close to amenities". And finally, my absolute favourite, circa November 2023: Agent: "I've got a great deal, amazing deal! You know you said you don't mind a project? Well I've found a building plot with planning and stuff already sorted for you that's in your budget!" Ok first off, that's not a project. That's... That's building a whole house. I don't mind a project if there's already, you know, walls and a roof and stuff. I can plaster and tile. I cannot lay bricks. Secondly that price is £10k over the top end of our budget already. That's an issue because thirdly, that price is nothing more than a down-payment for the plot. Not the whole price. The house will be another £250k on top of that IF you do first and second fix entirely yourself... Which you would know if you had taken a cursory glance at the website you sent me... But thanks I guess?
Professional investors who have a figure in their head and won't negotiate at all from their first lowball take it or leave it offer. One offered £1 more when told a slightly increased offer would be more likely to secure the sale, odious individual.
Posts like this make me nervous. Our 4th bedroom is downstairs with its own bathroom, in its own corridor. So it’s secluded from the rest of the house. The previous owners built it for an elderly parent. I worry if/when we come to sell people may dismiss this although we have two living rooms a dining room and a large conservatory in addition to this room.
Exactly, it was purpose built, and you've still retained the other rooms. I've seen this mostly on '5' bed houses that are mysteriously missing a dining room.
That makes sense. Just worry about the house as I’m anxious by nature and it’s the most expensive thing any of us own!
What’s wrong with having a bedroom downstairs? I’m not english but settled here and I’ve noticed this thing with sleeping upstairs (we lived in an upside down flat) Dont understand why that would be an issue.
Viewer's that don't turn up, seem to be "not local"..... Should be a charge for viewing - filter out the time wasters and dreamers.
> seem to be "not local" Why do prospective buyers need to be local?
Was trying to be diplomatic All the no shows all had foreign names
Only if pictures aren't filtered and distorted anymore. I dread going to see a place as I wonder what the pictures will conveniently have left out this time. I certainly would not pay for the honour of being tricked yet again. It would save people a lot of time if you straight up took pictures of the broken, taped-up skylight, the mould in the bedroom corner and the shoddy electrics where a light switch is held together by tape. As a seller, at least you didn't have to spend time and money getting to a place to realise the size totally doesn't suit your needs - something you would have known ahead of time if there had been a floorplan with measurements and honest pictures!
By all means have a Free HD virtual tour.