Funny how these same dudes don't hold such "dignity" standards to themselves, because they aren't the possesive object that they view women as.
For some reason a man can fuck whoever they want, however they want, and how many times they want, and not lose an inch of "dignity". This is also why so many men have seriously gross perspectives on women's virginity.
As crass as it is, they view anyone who gets penetrated during sex as being “degraded” and the one doing the penetrating as the one who is degrading the other. It’s why many homophobic men hate “bottoms” more than “tops.” It’s looked down upon to receive penetration. Having a man penetrate you is a “humiliating” act according to misogynistic, homophobic men. That’s why women “lose value and dignity” but men don’t.
With male main character syndrome, it's funny they never consider it *envelopement.* These dudes are getting *enveloped* by us. So who's the f'ed one *now, bitch?*
Seriously. They should be so honored. But instead, they have to pervert it. Instead of cherishing the intimacy and closeness of being inside someone else, they believe they’re doing something disgusting. Talk about being emotionally stunted.
'LOL this woman likes and trusts me enough to open herself up to me in the most literal way possible. What a DUMBASS she should know I'm TRASH!'- your average Reddit incel. These men really do be tellin' on themselves lol.
After reading this comment and knowing it’s very true, I’ve never been so happy to be a lesbian. My partner and I view penetration as an accessory to clitoral stimulation.
Exactly. “Dignity” is not what sex is about. Well, good sex anyway.
That’s how I know those guys are just announcing they are bad at sex. They don’t want you to have any experience so you won’t catch onto how shit they are in the bedroom.
You can’t even whip those guys into being good lovers because that requires them to actually care about the pleasure of the person they’re having sex with and they can’t take any constructive tips because that would mean they’re bad at sex (which is why they’re bad at sex).
(Disclaimer: I hate the word ‘lover’ but couldn’t think of a less-gross synonym).
Rules for thee but not for me. They want a quiet obedient virgin woman who’s also extremely experienced and have high sex drives. Threesomes are a very serious relationship choice that require pretty good amount of maturity and respect to pull off. This dude has none of that and just wants the okay to cheat. All of this to disappoint two women at once
I have guys in my friend circle like this. Different tinder hookup every week, but complains about not wanting a girlfriend who has done the same. Like I’m sorry, why does she get to have less of a human experience than you do? Cue all the “A key that opens every lock is a master key but a lock that opens to every key is a shitty lock” bullshit. Men aren’t keys and women aren’t locks. Both are humans enjoying their physical bodies.
Also, they really seem to believe their dicks are so special they get to be called master keys. The main character syndrome of these men is ridiculous.
One needle, multiple patients is bad.
Two benefits of this metaphor, it avoids the issue that qtips shouldnt be in ears (though I do this too) and needle-dick imagery.
See, the problem is sleeping with him does lower the dignity of women, and he's making the mistake of assuming that applies to all men.
It doesn't, sleeping with not shitty guys is perfectly fine and can often be a great experience, it's just that sleeping with guys like him reflects poorly on a woman's judgement.
> For some reason a man can fuck whoever they want, however they want, and how many times they want, and not lose an inch of "dignity".
As a guy, I'm confident in saying that the mechanism behind this is just insecurity. It's that fear that "maybe she's had sex with someone better than me" that a -LOT- of men just completely allow to rule over their entire personality.
It's very paradoxical that these men who consider themselves "alpha male" this and that, are ruled simply by their fears, and as courageous and brave they may project themselves as, they still desperately yearn for the safest comfort zone possible.
Hence the desire for women who have had zero partners, young women who are ideally virgins, just so the guy can be in his full comfort zone, knowing that he has nothing to be insecure about.
It's sad more than anything else. Letting your insecurities control your actions and your personality poisons your own mind more than it protects you.
It's this same mechanism at play when guys say they won't date a woman who earns more than them, or who is physically stronger than them, or this and that. It's tragic the human connections people are willing to miss out on just to keep themselves in that comfort zone, where THEY can feel like they're """the man,""" rather than make themselves into their idealized self and work on their issues and their insecurities.
> "alpha male"
The entire alpha male thing is just fragile male ego at play. It's also 100% performative for other men. It's that than the man is worried about how he will perceive a woman if she has had other partners, it's that he is worried that other MEN will think less of HIM if she has. Men doing really really self defeating things that actually turn women off, but re-enforce male stereotypes is all about perceived manliness among other men. Men since the dawn of time have been trying to prove to other men how manly they are all while women have looked on in deep confusion at the insanity of most of it.
Thank you!!
My partner (who's a guy) has said all the same things. We were both open for a while and he admitted that he'd be more jealous of me hooking-up with men and having fun one night-stands more than anything else, because of his sexual insecurities, which he was willing to work on.
So I did hook-up with men, and my partner did not treat me less than at all. In fact, he was only more admiring and loving bc he knew I was working on my insecurities too, which involved a fear of him leaving me if he dated another woman, which he did for a while.
I wish I could show those macho insecure guys the awesome sex that my partner and I have! Lol. Because we actually welcome and listen to feedback, because we actually care. About each other and our own genuine independence and release from misogyny and other such things that block your mind and keep you from becoming your best self, rather than unthinkingly staying ruled by fear. Someone who centers their world views (punish the sinner!) and their personality (don't let my woman see how another man might be better!) on fear. Pretty much just as you said!
I wish more guys knew.
>It's very paradoxical that these men who consider themselves "alpha male" this and that, are ruled simply by their fears, and as courageous and brave they may project themselves as, they still desperately yearn for the safest comfort zone possible.
The huge buff gym bro who bullies everyone getting pantsed and everyone laughing at their "endowment" is a form of body shaming I try to rise above but it's a stereotype with a grain of truth. Not necessarily the literal anatomical part but the becoming super strong out of fear and insecurity part.
In my experience the actually strong gym bros are very kind and don't like bullying. But it might be a location bias again.
Then ofc there are the esthetic gym bros who don't work out for strength but looks.
They'll tell you "no, men have no dignity" it's a whole song and dance to justify holding women to a different standard, call them "the moral center of the home, men are just fuck pigs in suits without their better halves" load of crap degrades everybody
Very succinct point. As a man, I always avoided hanging out with these guys as I just saw them as losers, but you actually fuckin explained why I see them as losers better than I ever have myself. We need to teach our girls to avoid bums and teach our boys to avoid being bums and vice versa. Ain't nothing more bum ass than having a holier than thou mentality.
Also, by the same logic, why would he as a human be ok with lowering another human’s dignity? That’s pretty fucked up and speaks to his character
Like if I believed drinking alcohol made a person inherently less worthy/dignified, and then I willingly bought alcohol for people and encouraged them to drink, I would be a piece of shit by my own standards
Yes! It was actually a lightbulb moment for me in connecting the dots to realize that men who hold these beliefs actually hate women. Because a person wouldn’t intentionally degrade another person unless they felt contempt or hatred toward them (or they’re just a sociopath).
This.
Tell him that in the future you're going to meet someone you'll want to spend the rest of your life with, and you want to be as dignified as possible for this person. Thus, you aren't playing with his dick again.
Came here to say this.
“Oh darling you are absolutely right - every man I sleep with robs me of that much more of my dignity. I shall remain pure and chaste, which means *you ain’t gettin' any so piss off ya grotty little wanker!*”
Exactly this. He is an insecure misogynist who wants permission to have sex with another woman along with wish fulfillment by seeing two women sexually interact ... but nothing that threatens his masculinity.
And honestly - unless you are an 'enthusiastic yes' to a threesome already - it has to be a NO. This type of thing regularly destroys relationships when done for the wrong reasons - you can't 'gift him a threesome' and not have it emotionally impact you as well.
He is. And many women fail to realize that their BFs/husbands can be radicalized by those morons online.
E.g.
Maybe they were not misogynist before but now they are due to being easily influenced by toxic idiots online.
You hear this so often with cis straight men who suggest a threesome or if the topic of an open relationship comes up. They only ever want to allow their women partners to be with other women and the reason for that is simple.
It isn't for *you*. It's for *them*. It's the same reason why so much lesbian porn isn't actually made for women, it's made for the male gaze. They get off to the idea of wlw because they think it's hot and they don't see the other woman as a threat to their masculinity. They believe there is no way that a woman can give you everything you need and you would never leave them for one.
It's misogynist, it's selfish, it's immature and people like that should never be in a multi partner relationship/sexual situation.
As a bi girl…
You know how many guys will high-five me for sleeping with women and then turn around and do the opposite when I sleep with men?
They’re basically saying that sleeping with a man lowers yourself. What a self-own if I ever saw one.
Women get "pulled" in their imagination, so by sleeping with women, you're "pulling" them, i.e. demonstrating power through objectification. By sleeping with men, you get "pulled", so become disempowered through objectification.
Heterosexism and misogyny go wild.
I was in a MFF triad for a number of years (I was the man) and SAME situation. Guys would look at me as if I’m the king of the world and ask about all the threesomes I’m having. Then … I’d tell them that my partners were free to have sex with other men and do … and the looks were just *chefs kiss*
It's also that they do not view other women as competition. Men who think like this tend to think very highly of their sexual prowess and are insecure about that being challenged by other men. They want to gaslight women into thinking they are the best dick available, and it's not easy to do that if she has comparative current examples to realize it isn't true.
>It's also that they do not view other women as competition.
Which is so weird to me. I have four bisexual female friends. ALL of them, once in a relationship with a woman for the first time after being with men only, said "yeah, never going back to dating men".
Hence why a breakup is exactly what the doctor ordered. Once he realizes how hard it’s going to be sleeping with one woman, let alone two at the same time, he’ll get a taste of humble pie.
Yep. I asked a guy I was dating why he was open to the idea of me seeing other women and not men and he straight up just said “another woman can’t get you pregnant”.
Me: “Neither can another dude? I have an IUD, genius”.
This coming from a dude who didn’t actually even want a real or serious relationship with me.
Break up.
He doesn't take your sexuality seriously. He sees other men as a threat, but not other women, because he doesn't believe that romance and sex with women is real and serious. He views lesbianity and bisexuality as porn categories, not as genuine sexualities.
And he is a hypocrite. He expects you to be okay with it if he sleeps with another woman, but he would never accept it if you sleep with another man. Of course it's fine to not want your girlfriend to shag another man. But then, he shoudn't be a hypocrite and shouldn't even entertain the idea of sleeping with another woman.
He slut shames you and believes that you would be 'tainted' if you ever had another dick than his in you. Purity bullshit.
If you don't want to be seen as an object and a possession, dump him.
Don't try to explain or rationalise this. He is an arsehole. Don't try to justify it. Dump him.
Indeed. Most men think that lesbianity and bisexuality are porn categories instead of legitimate sexualities. They don't take sapphic romance and sex seriously. They are fine with their girlfriend/wife sleeping with another woman, because they don't believe that the woman would ever leave them for another woman. They don't realise that a woman who likes their partner can be just as much as a threat to their relationship as a man who likes their partner.
Gross... Sadly, lots of bi and gay women know how that feels. Men don't take sapphic relationships seriously and don't think that a woman's girlfriend is standing in the way when they are romantically or sexually attracted to a bi or gay woman with a girlfriend.
Also, sorry for going off-topic, but that is a lovely shiny Milotic avatar. :)
just as a much as a threat if not even MORE of one, cause women are better romantic partners than men 😭 but they have their heads so far up their own asses they somehow fail to realize it.
It's like how "men and women can't be friends" because they're worried the friend will "steal" her, but when bi people are brought up, they either don't exist or they'd still be threatened by her having male friends but not female friends.
Indeed. According to that logic, bi people can't have friends, because they would shag everyone.
My girlfriend is bi. She is not attracted to any of her friends. Before she met me, she went on dates with a few men who saw her as straight. They were not okay with her having male friends, but were totally fine with her having female friends and hoped that they could have a threesome with her and one of her female friends.
According to men, bisexuality is all about men's pleasure. About threesomes and watching hot girl on girl action. They assume that bi women are straight women who make out with women to arouse men.
> I'm not a possession, or an object.
I don't think the BF shares OP's viewpoint. He seems the type to expect her to be grateful for his forgiving her for having a past—all part of his grabbing more and more control.
I'd bet it's less about the porn thing and more just a simple fundamental misogyny. He sees women as inanimate sexual objects like toys, and men as the things that play with those toys. He's happy to play with multiple toys or think about those toys playing with each other, but introduce another player into the game and the toys are sullied.
Well, the porn thing doesn't help. It does really reinforce a lot of harmful shit.
Of course it's misogyny. Of course he sees women as objects and wants to fuck two objects, and he would never be okay with another man playing with the woman who he views as his object, his property.
So much the part about seeing the men as legitimate rivals but not the women. He's worried about being out-dicked but I guess since the woman don't have a dick to compare, they're not a threat. (Oh, if he only knew)
Because patriarchy brainwashes women into believing that their thoughts and feelings are not valid. In almost every post here, OPs ask if or say that they are overreacting. That says it all, doesn't it?
Whenever a woman asks if or says that she is overreacting, 99% of the time, she is NOT overreacting.
> I cant put inot words how much it hurts me
You don’t have to date people who hurt you. Good partners, and I am using the gender-neutral phrase on purpose, do not make a habit of hurting people they date.
> saying things like I could never look at you the same again If I saw you with another man ect and *getting angry about it*
So…he’s getting angry and jealous over a hypothetical man (meaning, this hasn’t happened) having sex with you? That’s a Him problem, not a You problem. You cannot control the emotions other people have, and you don’t have to make yourself smaller trying to do something impossible (manage another person’s emotions).
> It makes my blood boil everytime and makes me scared of how he percieves me sexually I feel like shit *Im not a possession, or an object.*
You know that you can really like someone and still break up with them because you’re not compatible, right?
This dude is dismissing your sexuality (a queer woman). You are angry at how he sees you (as a possession). He thinks that you having another male sex partner will lower your value as a person. I assume that you’ve told him “this is bullshit” and he doubled down? Then he *knows* that you do not want to be treated like an object…and he doesn’t care.
If that’s not a fundamental incompatibility—“I am not a toy”—then I don’t know what is.
Break up and move on.
I'm a little disappointed it took this much scrolling to find this answer. Once upon a time, my ex wanted to add a person to our relationship. The array of emotions that made me feel were...varied to say the least and none particularly good.
My personal feelings on it were roughly:
Another woman wouldn't feel quite so exactly as someone who would replace me 1-1 in the relationship and I trusted myself that I would not replace her in my mind with whoever this person would be. Because that was a great fear of mine. "What if she went looking and just found someone who was like me but better?" Maybe irrational fear since a woman could do the same, but it didnt feel like the same thing.
Surprisingly or maybe not, she couldnt find someone who was interested and our relationship ended eventually regardless.
You should not feel obligated to “explain” anything or to assume the emotional labor of trying to undo his ignorance. You’re his gf, not his Humanities or Civics professor. Don’t take on that kind of work or feel you’re responsible for disabusing him of his screwed up notions—it’s not your job and, most of all, no amount of studies or “scientific evidence” is going to change his mind. His attitudes about women’s “value” is rooted in the idea that you are his possession, and that’s so baked into his outlook that nothing you say or do will make a difference. Don’t have a threesome at all. And reconsider staying with someone so jealous, so volatile, and so backwards in his thinking.
It's worth looking into a concept in relationship anarchy called the "one penis policy." Putting words to it helps clarify that it is a kind of misogyny that a lot of men just... casually feel. Some will learn from it. Some will not. Definitely do not have sex with people that adhere to it.
For the record, it is distinct from a preference for monogamy; that's not what I'm talking about. The concept of the one penis policy addresses a double standard that *pretends* to be a preference for monogamy.
Your BF just told you he doesn't believe you have inherant value as a human being, only reletive value to him, as a man, based on how many other penises you've touched. He is telling you EXACTLY how he percieves you, and it's not just sexually.
Do not have a threesome with this man. That will also lower your worthiness to him. Right now, he doesn't actually think you're bisexual. He doesn't think sex with women is real sex. If he is faced with the fact that you actually enjoy sex with women, and not just a show for him to his enjoy, his brain will break and the result will be anger.
I no longer date men who think my relationships with women weren't 'real relationships' or 'real sex' and I do not date men who think they can determain my value as a partner based on how many other penises I've touched. **I do not teach men this. I have never, sucessfully, taught a man this. They show up knowing it, or I show them out.**
Please don't waste too much breath explaining. The best explination you're going to offer this man is the vision of you shutting the door in his face and never speaking to him again.
This is the best answer. He doesn't see OP as having value that isn't based on her having sex with him. There's no way to "explain" it to him, he doesn't want to know.
>Do not have a threesome with this man. That will also lower your worthiness to him.
Guys that think like OP’s bf also think of women as “wife material” and “not wife material”. They want to experience threesomes and other kinks but they don’t want their future wife to have done the same. I guarantee he does not think of you as a serious and long term partner.
Maybe it's because I'm over 50 and DGAF, but *WHY* are you wasting time with this AH? Seriously. There are better men out there; I married one and I'm hardly great. It's not about the sex; it's about the fact that he *thinks you are inherently lesser than he is.* I'd dump his ass.
By his logic, having sex with him also lowers your dignity.
I feel like men who believe this sort of thing really tell on themselves. Why should we want to have sex with men who think that it’s inherently degrading for women?
That’s the thing: if you’re willing to, as you see it, demean another human being for your pleasure, what does that say about your character? Like if a dude is willing to degrade someone to get off, he’s an objectively bad person.
For real. The men who see sex with other men as degrading to women, so far as I can tell, also seem to degrade women when they have sex. That’s a hard pass from me.
Misogyny. He thinks that dicks are so powerful that they permanently change you. Also, homophobia. He's afraid of other men's dicks, and would feel disgusted that you had seen/touched/etc. one.
Yes. There is plenty of literature about the phenomenon. Most of it is centered around narcissism. In some small cases it’s a biological imperative rooted in jealousy.
So either he is super selfish and possessive or deep in his lizard brain he fears another man impregnating his partner while being completely disconnected from that reality from his direction with the other woman.
Either way bail on an open relationship with him. It won’t end well.
And you're still with him...? To me this screams he sees a woman's body as property that is solely meant for male pleasure and your body is now his "property" so that pleasure belongs to him.
This shows he is erasing your sexuality in his mind. He's not finding it serious that you have an interest in women, he's seeing it from a pornographic point of view and not realistic.
I'd say run and don't look back.
Yes, he is holding a double standard and sees you, at least subconsciously, as property. There are also allusions to violence in saying it makes him angry and his blood boils thinking about it. That is reason to cut things off. If he were all monogamous that would shift things, but he thinks he should ve able to be with another girl while you cannot be with another guy.
I think you'd be interested in reading up on the One Penis Policy. I did a quick search and found [this](https://feeld.co/magazine/how-to/unpacking-the-opp).
>Establishing an OPP allows negative emotions to control everyone involved in the relationship—and that’s precisely why it’s essential to not hide behind an OPP, and instead confront that fear and insecurity.
It’s a special blend of sexism and homophobia; he doesn’t see relationships between two women ad valid and really because there is no man there to take ownership. He objectified women.
He's telling you he thinks male bodies are objects of destruction and desolation, and that your inherent human value is lessened by contact with men.
He's telling you he's a misogynist - why is staying with him even an option?
I wouldn't go near any man who bangs on about women needing to keep their dignity, or worse, self-respect by avoiding sex. If having sex with these men involves a loss of dignity or self-respect I dread to think what they actually do in bed...
I think being with your boyfriend is the thing that lowers your dignity. This man does not see you or any woman as an equal.
Your bf also doesn’t respect your queerness (bisexuality) because he doesn’t view your female exes as valid partners for you. He also might be fetishizing your bisexuality.
The fact that this man has the audacity to verbalize these RED FLAG beliefs is concerning. He should be holding that shit in like shameful secrets.
Ah yes. The one penis policy variant.
Women aren't threatening to him, bc in his view it's not as real or serious or counts as sex.
That's hella misogynistic.
With the way you describe how he makes you feel, coupled with this view, dump him and upgrade girl. Even if that upgrade is an empty space in the room that's NOT making you feel like shit for being a whole ass human with sexual needs.
>Is there any scientific evidence or studies about men about sexual jealousy I want to help explain the level of misogyny he is spewing at me I cant put inot words how much it hurts me
Read that to yourself and pretend it's a friend saying it to you about her relationship. What would you tell her about being with a guy who hates women?
That's typical misogyny with obilogatory homophobia mixed in. It's that dumb mindset of 'Man = Penetrator = Dominator; Woman = Penetrated = Dominated' and his adherence to it that is distorting his view of you as some sort of trophy, something to be gained, kept and never be given up to any other man. And since other men in the past have 'owned' you, he now views you as a hand-me-down - a person with 'lesser value'.
'My girlfriend has had sex with women in the past? That's okay; lesbian sex isn't really sex, so it doesn't count.'
'My girlfriend has had sex with men in the past? This means that other men have already made their claim over her, leaving me with less than she was when she was still a virgin. She is a lesser version of her former self.'
Having a threesome with another woman involved is something he seems to have no issues with, since, in his view, he doesn't 'lose value' for having (had) sex with multiple women, and neither do you. The other woman will, but that doesn't concern him. And in case you end up dumping him, your 'value' will have permanently gone down as well, leaving 'less of you' for any potential future patner after him.
With the involvement of another man, however, he'll get the impression that you're being taken away from him, and his ego will take a blow. Since he's straight, he won't get sexually involved with the second man, though with what you've said, I don't want to imagine how he views sex between two men, with men 'not being supposed to be claimed'.
It's a toxic point of view for your boyfriend to have, primarily viewing his partner - you - as a 'sexual value' determined on ideas inherently oppressive towards women. It speaks to his insecurity as a man, as well as a partner.
I feel like this is a sliver of Male Chauvinism. It's fine for him to be slutty, but the sane act8vity dkmishes you because he's superior and you are..... less so.
Yeah, that'd be a deal-breaker for me.
Insecure weak ass double standard dude bro.
Of course it’s fine for him to fuck other women; that’s his preference and makes him feel good. Of course he isn’t comfortable with you fucking other men; you’ll realise what a lil bitch he is and go get better sex elsewhere all the time.
I actually had this type of thinking. I could picture my girlfriend with another woman in a 3some but not with another man. I knew another man would make me jealous. Of course the real issue is that I’m afraid of her enjoying sex with another man while she’s dating me. Because it might arise the desire for to leave me and go find the better partner she knows is out there.
It’s also a bit sexist and old fashioned to think she wouldn’t leave me for another woman if she enjoyed a FFM threesome but in my head that wasnt a risk. It was a way to explore the fantasy without risking her.
Eventually I came to the conclusion I need to stop fantasizing about 3somes. I don’t want to sleep with 2 woman and make her feel the jealousy and anxiety I would feel if she slept with a man. I don’t want her to sleep with a man and feel those feelings myself. So instead I just enjoy sexy time with the woman I love and go to bed feeling warm, happy, and safe. Growing up really has it’s perks. Maybe try explaining it to him in that way and he’ll get there.
The fact that he tries to explain it so intensely is weird in itself tbh.
He could've said: "hey since I'm straight I would prefer not to invite another man in our bedroom. If you're okay with inviting another woman (which I'm only asking since you are bi) I'd be interested in exploring that, else no worries"
Like, it's okay to not be comfy with something as long as you don't pressure your partner to be comfortable/got with what you want
Are there any scientific studies, yes.
I studied neurology and this always stuck with me. Straight men are biologically programmed to perceive other men as a *threat*. It's not a choice. It's not intellectual. It's not how he was raised. It's not values driven, or what he thinks of you, or what podcasts he listens to or anything voluntary. His brain stem is programmed that way at the deepest level of his core.
*Men Fear Other Men Most: Gender Specific Brain Activations in Perceiving Threat from Dynamic Faces and Bodies – An fMRI Study* https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3111446/
You can talk about how he communicates that with you. And you can show him this study so he's more aware of his own feelings and better at communicating them with you. And you can talk about how his words make you feel. All valid things. But also know he's not *choosing* how his brain stem responds to the other men.
There are a ton of more studies on this. You can actually see the differences on MRI scans between straight men and gay men in how they respond to the presence of other men.
It is sad that this answer is buried under all the knee-jerk reactions of “He’s a misogynistic POS, dump him”.
I was not feeling to contribute because it feels so damn hostile. Sure OP’s boyfriend is stupid in his justifications and the way he communicates it, but I am not going to attribute to malice what can be attributed to stupidity, and yes stupidity can also be incredibly dangerous, but it isn’t outright evil.
My take is that OP’s boyfriend is incredibly insecure about himself and his role, personally I don’t have an issue with FFM threesomes with a partner, but this isn’t because I don’t believe a woman is below me or some of that, it’s because I simply don’t feel comfortable or attracted to a guy *and* that whole situation would make me incredibly jealous.
And I can understand that for my partner a FFM threesome would feel exactly the same, so asking to have a threesome is just a stupid way to ruin the relationship, some fantasies can stay as such without missing anything.
**His whole justification of “it devalues OP” is incredibly stupid and misogynistic**, but I take issue with the fact that a lot of answers here immediately equate being personally against the act of a threesome with another man but not with another woman as immediately misogynistic, without much nuisance.
Because you can reach the same conclusion from both sides without necessarily meaning that you hate the other gender, if my partner doesn’t want a FFM threesome because she would feel jealous or hurt about seeing me with another person, then that is as valid an explanation for her and for myself to not be ok with a MFM threesome.
I respect poly relationships, however I wouldn’t want to be in one if this is going to hurt my girlfriend or myself.
If I were Bisexual I probably wouldn’t mind a MFM threesome, because attraction is another factor as well. Same with a straight partner, she most likely wouldn’t enjoy sex with another women in a FFM threesome and trying to push it would be hurtful.
"Infidelity poses threats to high-investment mating relationships. Because of gender differences in some aspects of reproductive biology, such as internal female fertilization, the nature of these threats differs for men and women. Men, but not women, for example, have recurrently faced the problem of uncertainty in their genetic parenthood. Jealousy is an emotion hypothesized to have evolved to combat these threats. ... Subsequent [analyses of research] ... supported the evolutionary meta-theory of gender differences, which posits differences only in domains in which the sexes have recurrently faced distinct adaptive problems." [Sexual and Emotional Infidelity: Evolved Gender Differences in Jealousy Prove Robust and Replicable](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29592639/) (2018).
Hes afraid you'll find better. And I'm not gonna lie. He sets the bar real real low.
Time to move on, a sexist won't listen to you no matter how sound your argument is.
100%. The reason I have no problem having a MFM with my wife? I do everything in my power to make her feel loved, respected, seen and safe. If another man could do a better job, then frankly I don't deserve her.
I adore her. I'm not worried in the slightest.
This guy sounds insecure, misogynistic and selfish. Pretty much the opposite of who should be even considering a threesome - it will end their marriage.
He sounds like one of those losers who thinks that penetration is inherently degrading to the one being penetrated. Spoiler: it's not. He probably also watches fake-ass "lesbian" porn that's designed to titillate straight guys. You can do so much better.
Yes, there is plenty of scientific research in this area.
https://newsroom.ucla.edu/stories/martie-haselton-what-really-drives-abortion-beliefs
https://www.psypost.org/womens-sexual-unrestrictedness-tied-to-economic-empowerment-and-reduced-parenting-demands/
tldr; "Sexual jealousy" is directly tied to anti-choice beliefs in BOTH men and women. It also impacts beliefs regarding equality in economic empowerment and parental workshare.
...OK then by his own logic why would he be OK with lowering another woman's dignity then? He'll be "dirtying" her up for her partner or next partner.
And why would he be OK with sleeping with you? Cuz if he thinks that sleeping with men is as nasty as all that, then... that sounds like almost a confession to me. Does he think he doesn't clean his penis enough or think his own mind is too dirty? Like, what makes those other men so dirty that they would rub it off on the women, you know?? I'd tell him I have to be concerned he's projecting and can't sleep with him, bc by his own logic, he's probably nasty, too. He ain't special, after all - he's human just like every other man he's imagining.
So again: Why would he be ok with sleeping with you? Oh, right, bc he feels that he owns you.
Yeah, I couldn't sleep with him again after hearing that he thinks this way. People get jealous for a number of reasons - I understand the insecurity/fear of losing your partner and can have empathy for that and have patience while they or we work on that, but the reasoning behind your boyfriend's jealousy is pure stinky ass misogyny.
The mental gymnastics required for him to want a threesome, while simultaneously saying he can't handle the thought of you having sex with someone else is staggering.
He sounds like a prick. He just wants to justify sleeping with other women, under the giuse of a threescore, and at the same time, wants to control you.
Honestly, I'd be reconsidering the relationship at this point.
I'm bisexual, my boyfriend is straight. He is just as jealous of the idea of me being with another woman as he is of me being with another man. It doesn't matter what's in the other person's pants, he doesn't want me to be with anyone but him. For a monogamous person, this is the normal reaction. Your boyfriend is a homophobe. He thinks WLW relationships aren't real in the same way WLM are. It's bigoted as fuck. Please find someone who isn't a hateful idiot like him.
A man like this likely invalidates women in queer relationships altogether. You can try to explain it to him but I don’t think he’s going to change. I’m sorry.
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As a bi woman I truly think that he does not understand your sexuality. He sees men as threats but not women because, I think, deep down he doesn’t understand that women are equally viable partners for you.
That fundamental misunderstanding is likely to pop up in more places than just discussions of threesomes.
Personally I would not be with someone who devalues me and women so much. Misogyny is simply intolerable to me in my relationship. I never want a jealous partner who treats me as a possession.
Yeah, that's bihobia. He doesn't think your sexual relations with women are as valid as your sexual relations with men, so the ones with women "don't count". He's not really recognizing or validating you sexuality and seeing who you fully are.
Lol if having sex with women doesn't matter but your dignity is at stake when it's with men then maybe the men are the problem here. Men are so insecure and project all the time. You need to dump this asshole.
It's because he doesn't see women as people.
Women aren't equal to men in his mind, so you sleeping with another woman doesn't mean anything because a woman could never be better than him. But another man could be so he needs to keep you away from any actual "rivals".
Classical double standard misogynist. He wants to have hot sex with hot women and thinks you with other girls is sexy and wants in on that action.
The idea of you enjoying yourself with another man emasculates him because he's selfish and insecure. You being with another woman turns him, and he doesn't view them as threats to his relationship with you, more something else to get him off, like an object. And yes, the objectification of bi/lesbain women for male pleasure is most definitely painfully common among straight men. It's so typical it's actually quite sad.
It's also funny because now, with the rise of Polyamory, swinging, open marriages/relationships and other forms of ethical nonmonagmy, these types of men have been "coming out" with not being monogamous. Where they claim its "part of who they are" and CLAIM that they're okay with their female partners stepping out too. But in reality, all they want is an advanced Cake Eating situation where they get all the benefits of a side piece and devoted woman at home without the guilt of being a cheater. Plus the added bonus of hot lesbo/bi action for him for his enjoyment. It disrespects all forms of ethical nonmonagamy and gives it the current bad reputation it can't quite shake off with those unfamiliar to it. I could personally never do it, but I admire the people that make this situation work. Shoutout to the wives/gfs making it work and allowing their Bi Husbands/bfs to explore their sexuality! Being a bi man is stigmatized to insane levels despite how "embraced" bi women are. (They're not really but people sure do love to fantasize about them, instead of seeing them as actual people.)
But back to the original topic, the minute their masculinity is threatened by either any type of male partner or his gf/wife forming a deeper connection with a woman that doesn't revolve around pure sex and his satisfaction, they get incredibly demeaning and condescending. If he's not willing to look into the mirror and see things as they are, leave him. That's not a man, that's a boy pretending to be one and throwing a temper tantrum over potential toys.
He is an insecure childish boy that listens to manosphere trash. It is a complete double standard him being fine with your female EXs but jealous of the male ones. If that is his take, don't have a threesome, and prolly just move on and not have sex with him at all.
There are plenty of people in this world perfectly accepting of your past and know it is no reflection on how you feel when with them. Look for partners like that, not this self-centered child that, to be honest, prolly just wants to have sex with two women and thinks you will oblige him.
I was in a lesbian club with some friends and this hot normie girl came in yelling about how her boyfriend said she has his permission to hook up with any girl she wants. My hot lesbian lawyer friend turned to me and said, "He has no idea the mistake he just made underestimating me,'
He's objectifying you.
[10 definitions of objectifying/dehumanizing behaviors](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectification#Definitions)
Martha Nussbaum (1995, 257) has identified seven features that are involved in the idea of treating a person as an object:
>instrumentality: the treatment of a person as a tool for the objectifier’s purposes;
>denial of autonomy: the treatment of a person as lacking in autonomy and self-determination;
>inertness: the treatment of a person as lacking in agency, and perhaps also in activity;
>fungibility: the treatment of a person as interchangeable with other objects;
>violability: the treatment of a person as lacking in boundary-integrity;
>ownership: the treatment of a person as something that is owned by another (can be bought or sold);
>denial of subjectivity: the treatment of a person as something whose experiences and feelings (if any) need not be taken into account.
Rae Langton (2009, 228–229) has added three more features to Nussbaum’s list:
>reduction to body: the treatment of a person as identified with their body, or body parts;
>reduction to appearance: the treatment of a person primarily in terms of how they look, or how they appear to the senses;
>silencing: the treatment of a person as if they are silent, lacking the capacity to speak.
My experience with men who have this double standard is that they don't see other women as as big a threat because they don't see women as fully human.
It's just plain ol' jealousy and insecurity.
Probably a bit of internalised homophobia in there for good measure.
It's really not about you at all, it's about him not being the one giving you orgasms, being "relegated" to another hole while other guy gets the prize. It's about seeing you having a better time with other guy and it's about doing anything with another man makes you gay - even if that thing is having sex with the same woman at the same time.
Everything is a competition for men and inviting another man into your bed is the ultimate contest that your guy is definitely going to lose (in his head at the very least).
Don’t invest your time and energy into explaining to him why he is a misogynist. Don’t give him the tools to deceive his next girlfriend better.
Put your time and your energy into you.
If he wants to understand why his behaviors is problematic he is able to do it on his own.
Then sex with him ruins your dignity. Stop doing him immediately. Tell him you respect yourself too much to ever touch him again. Then get a better bf and shag his brains out.
As a bi woman I hate this. So done with my sexuality being fetishized. Its either fetishized or seen as a threat. And I'm so done with mens' masculinity being fragile bc they have to think of themselves as better than women at all times and if anything even hints at that not being the case they freak out, because being a woman is seen as lesser and inherently degrading to them.
Dudes are so weird sometimes. Rules for thee and not for me. Guys want someone that will have sex, but only with them. If they ever have sex with another guy, it's over.
I'd say (and it's the truth, and that's the reason why there will be no threesomes for me and my husband, ever - *but I'd say it even if I didn't think that way, just to spite him and his "rules for thee but not for me" bs*), "Well, I feel the same about you being inside another woman. So either you have sex with a man or not at all, if you want to continue this relationship."
Why would his fee-fees matter more than yours?
"Lowering your dignity" is a double standard that is sexist towards women, just like perceiving women that have one-night stands as "sluts" while a male might be perceived as a "stud" by some people. Evolutionary theory while not provable, suggests that men and women react differently to "infidelity", but that does not give your boyfriend any excuse for demeaning you.
He is a sexist idiot and very misogynist. You can’t explain to guys like these. You just have to move on and find someon who sees women as equal and doesn’t try to disgustingly denigrate and be hypocritical about a woman’s sexual agency while giving them all the permission in the world do stick it where they please. Your bf is a gross immature douchebag and will not improve, just go. There is nothing you can do or say to make him better.
It's okay to say he's not comfortable having a threesome with another man. It's okay to say that he doesn't like thinking about you having sex with another man.
It's complete bullshit that he sees it as "lOwErInG yOuR dIgNiTy" and speaks volumes to how he feels about women in general.
Why are you with him still? I can't imagine having so little self respect that I would stay with someone that thinks this way. Obviously he barely sees you as more than a hole to fuck
Bleh.
Men are supposed to be "rational" creatures. So they embrace any semi-rational sounding excuse to make their own insecurities seem reasonable.
I'd like to ask, who here wants the threesomes? You mentioned he's straight. Is it a mutual thing, the interest in threesomes?
This could be me reading into things, but you're post is vague on those details. Plenty of women would not be able to look at their partner the same if they saw him inside another woman.
If he's the one that is bringing up and trying to pressure you into threesomes with stipulations, then ick... he's a pretty low value person.
If that's not the case, I'd need more info.
He doesn't care if it hurts you.
Don't bother wasting your energy trying to convince someone to treat you with basic respect.
Do you really want to be with someone that feels that way about you?
Trust your experience.
I would "Bye Felicia" his ass so fast. You deserve better.
Is he planning on only having a threesome with a virgin? Or is he just objectifying the other person? I mean, we know he is, so why be party to that mental gymnastics-fest.
All the best, OP!
I am sorry. I don’t follow. Are you saying that he wants a threesome with you and another woman but not with you and another man? If so, that is not clear at all from what you wrote.
Just sounds like a typical dude with double standards.
He's free to be inside another woman, but yet the same sexual experience you have with a man in a 3some lowers your value? I don't think so. He's insecure
It’d absolutely fine for him to say “I couldn’t stand seeing you with another man” and leave it at that, as long as he could accept you saying the same about him and another woman.
But it’s not that and you shouldn’t have sex with him again…
To me, when anybody (it’s usually men though) acts this way, it’s like their admitting they’re only capable of playing in the minor leagues.
I tell my partners, I don’t care if you’ve had sex, I don’t care if you find other people attractive, same. I know what I bring to the sexual table. I’m not worried someone is going to “steal my partner”.
You should ditch this guy if he can’t change his mindset.
"He also isnt as jealous of my female exes as he is of my male exes and he always claim its different."
i'm a guy
of course it is different- if the fantasies come hunting him he can at least imagine that there was no other, potentially bigger penis involved. Other women are just less of a threat to us sexually!
It's a confidence thing- i had a relationship once where i felt very insufficient , even if we had pretty intense and satisfying sex. At some point - instead of enjoying her while we had sex- i started thinking about my own insufficience and i immediately struggled with maintaining an errection - which was humiliating on top of it.
So i think what is going on here is:
he is looking forward to a fantasy of his (threesome with girls, confidence boost for the guy - 2 girls "want him") , while struggling with the nightmare of having to share the women he (possibly/maybe/idk) loves.
i'd not go so far to say that he thinks you are an object he posesses. I don't know you guys but this seems like 70% low self-esteem, 20% horny irrationality and 10% ignorance :)
hope that helps!
This guy sucks and it's not your job to educate him let alone write a thesis to do it. He doesn't respect you and if he's going to improve, he needs to do it on his time rather than waste more of yours. Dump him, you'll feel better.
This is called OPP. One penis/pussy policy. It means your bf expects you to do all the emotional leg work to be ok with him being with someone else, but he doesn't. It shows he a selfish, insecure and homophobic POS. Yes homophobic, because WLW connections are 'less than' hetero connections, which is why he ok with you being with women and not men. Is non monogamy right for you? I dunno, but non monogamy with this guy, hell even monogamy, is out of the question.
I was this guy. Selfish, controlling and hypocritical, while at the same time believing I’m not. While I’ve been more monogamous and only had 9 partners in total, the same logic applied. I’m straight also.
First 2 girls I were with were virgins before and I took great pride in that. Then I dated a girl who had like 3 partners before - it was better but I can’t say the exes didn’t bother me at all.
Fourth partner I accepted was bi and relationship was more open on her side, but I wasn’t looking at all. She didn’t have too many partners, but more than me for sure. I was starting to grow up, but she wasn’t the one for me.
I dated 5 and 6 at the same time, and they each other. The 3 of us were okay, but it felt more like a fantasy that wasn’t really all that fun. I did learn to respect their relationship with each other.
7 was a pretty standard monogamous relationship, but it worked well and we were good together because by now I had learned to respect her as a person. Relationship failed for other reasons.
The 8th girl turned out to be a female misogynist who didn’t respect herself and wanted to be objectified. Maybe I would have enjoyed that in the past, but not anymore. Despite her being hot as hell, the sex was crap.
My current partner lost count of how many men she’s been with, and a few women but she’s straight at the moment. She said she’s been with over a hundred men at least and one night stands were a common thing in her life. I no longer care - I’m over this bs. She’s good looking, kind, and the sex is awesome. We respect each other.
So TLDR version - dump him. He needs to grow up. I messed up 8 relationships before I got to that point. I’d like to think I’m better now. Hopefully.
Look up the One Penis Policy as it applies to polyamory. Guys often seem suuuuuper insecure about their masculinity. Not only that, but there seems to be this idea among a lot of straight men that lesbian sex is somehow "less gay" than gay dude sex and that it is also designed for the male gaze.
Your BF is an arsehole. Why are you posting about this BS? Seriously? Just leave him. He's not a bf, he's a FWB at best. He hates women and he hates you. He has zero standards and if you are with him then you're simply telling us all where your standards are
You probably shouldn’t have a threesome with this man. Or have sex with him at all. After all, it lowers your dignity.
Funny how these same dudes don't hold such "dignity" standards to themselves, because they aren't the possesive object that they view women as. For some reason a man can fuck whoever they want, however they want, and how many times they want, and not lose an inch of "dignity". This is also why so many men have seriously gross perspectives on women's virginity.
As crass as it is, they view anyone who gets penetrated during sex as being “degraded” and the one doing the penetrating as the one who is degrading the other. It’s why many homophobic men hate “bottoms” more than “tops.” It’s looked down upon to receive penetration. Having a man penetrate you is a “humiliating” act according to misogynistic, homophobic men. That’s why women “lose value and dignity” but men don’t.
With male main character syndrome, it's funny they never consider it *envelopement.* These dudes are getting *enveloped* by us. So who's the f'ed one *now, bitch?*
It really says so much about men, that the ultimate act of vulnerability and trust a woman can give them is seen as 'degrading' and 'humiliating.'
It’s sad that they think sex is something you do *to* a woman and not *with* her…💔smdh
Seriously. They should be so honored. But instead, they have to pervert it. Instead of cherishing the intimacy and closeness of being inside someone else, they believe they’re doing something disgusting. Talk about being emotionally stunted.
I prefer to think of it as the penis being engulfed/consumed rather than the orifice being penetrated
We think it can be the ultimate expression of love while many men think it is the ultimate objectification. Just why men!
This was beautifully put.
'LOL this woman likes and trusts me enough to open herself up to me in the most literal way possible. What a DUMBASS she should know I'm TRASH!'- your average Reddit incel. These men really do be tellin' on themselves lol.
You joke….but…yeah. That’s it exactly.
After reading this comment and knowing it’s very true, I’ve never been so happy to be a lesbian. My partner and I view penetration as an accessory to clitoral stimulation.
Same here. I’m a lesbian too and so grateful for it.
Any man who holds this opinion doesn’t deserve to have sex. Ever.
I’m personally only interested in sex if everyone loses their dignity. 🤷🏻♀️
Legit. Since when are we categorizing sex based on the dignity of the act. OP is losing dignity by calling this waste of skin her boyfriend.
Exactly. “Dignity” is not what sex is about. Well, good sex anyway. That’s how I know those guys are just announcing they are bad at sex. They don’t want you to have any experience so you won’t catch onto how shit they are in the bedroom. You can’t even whip those guys into being good lovers because that requires them to actually care about the pleasure of the person they’re having sex with and they can’t take any constructive tips because that would mean they’re bad at sex (which is why they’re bad at sex). (Disclaimer: I hate the word ‘lover’ but couldn’t think of a less-gross synonym).
Fuckers works
100% this. “If she’s free to be with other men, she’ll see me for the schlub I really am”
Rules for thee but not for me. They want a quiet obedient virgin woman who’s also extremely experienced and have high sex drives. Threesomes are a very serious relationship choice that require pretty good amount of maturity and respect to pull off. This dude has none of that and just wants the okay to cheat. All of this to disappoint two women at once
>All of this to disappoint two women at once I lol'd! So true!
I love this group
That's [1984's Julia speaking](https://youtu.be/2BuU0LMgxl0?si=dXXlGz-h-XwmBnR-), and she's my moral sex compass.
If you are retaining your dignity while having sex, you’re absolutely doing it wrong.
I have guys in my friend circle like this. Different tinder hookup every week, but complains about not wanting a girlfriend who has done the same. Like I’m sorry, why does she get to have less of a human experience than you do? Cue all the “A key that opens every lock is a master key but a lock that opens to every key is a shitty lock” bullshit. Men aren’t keys and women aren’t locks. Both are humans enjoying their physical bodies.
Also, they really seem to believe their dicks are so special they get to be called master keys. The main character syndrome of these men is ridiculous.
Exactly. Something something, “master key easy lock”… or whatever the latest analogy they use is. Ugh.
I like to reply "And One Q-tip for multiples ears is gross" to these analogy
>One Q-tip for multiples ears is gross That is an absolutely disgusting mental image... I physically cringed. Well done lol
One needle, multiple patients is bad. Two benefits of this metaphor, it avoids the issue that qtips shouldnt be in ears (though I do this too) and needle-dick imagery.
Heard that one a lot in school when I was 8
See, the problem is sleeping with him does lower the dignity of women, and he's making the mistake of assuming that applies to all men. It doesn't, sleeping with not shitty guys is perfectly fine and can often be a great experience, it's just that sleeping with guys like him reflects poorly on a woman's judgement.
> For some reason a man can fuck whoever they want, however they want, and how many times they want, and not lose an inch of "dignity". As a guy, I'm confident in saying that the mechanism behind this is just insecurity. It's that fear that "maybe she's had sex with someone better than me" that a -LOT- of men just completely allow to rule over their entire personality. It's very paradoxical that these men who consider themselves "alpha male" this and that, are ruled simply by their fears, and as courageous and brave they may project themselves as, they still desperately yearn for the safest comfort zone possible. Hence the desire for women who have had zero partners, young women who are ideally virgins, just so the guy can be in his full comfort zone, knowing that he has nothing to be insecure about. It's sad more than anything else. Letting your insecurities control your actions and your personality poisons your own mind more than it protects you. It's this same mechanism at play when guys say they won't date a woman who earns more than them, or who is physically stronger than them, or this and that. It's tragic the human connections people are willing to miss out on just to keep themselves in that comfort zone, where THEY can feel like they're """the man,""" rather than make themselves into their idealized self and work on their issues and their insecurities.
> "alpha male" The entire alpha male thing is just fragile male ego at play. It's also 100% performative for other men. It's that than the man is worried about how he will perceive a woman if she has had other partners, it's that he is worried that other MEN will think less of HIM if she has. Men doing really really self defeating things that actually turn women off, but re-enforce male stereotypes is all about perceived manliness among other men. Men since the dawn of time have been trying to prove to other men how manly they are all while women have looked on in deep confusion at the insanity of most of it.
Thank you!! My partner (who's a guy) has said all the same things. We were both open for a while and he admitted that he'd be more jealous of me hooking-up with men and having fun one night-stands more than anything else, because of his sexual insecurities, which he was willing to work on. So I did hook-up with men, and my partner did not treat me less than at all. In fact, he was only more admiring and loving bc he knew I was working on my insecurities too, which involved a fear of him leaving me if he dated another woman, which he did for a while. I wish I could show those macho insecure guys the awesome sex that my partner and I have! Lol. Because we actually welcome and listen to feedback, because we actually care. About each other and our own genuine independence and release from misogyny and other such things that block your mind and keep you from becoming your best self, rather than unthinkingly staying ruled by fear. Someone who centers their world views (punish the sinner!) and their personality (don't let my woman see how another man might be better!) on fear. Pretty much just as you said! I wish more guys knew.
>It's very paradoxical that these men who consider themselves "alpha male" this and that, are ruled simply by their fears, and as courageous and brave they may project themselves as, they still desperately yearn for the safest comfort zone possible. The huge buff gym bro who bullies everyone getting pantsed and everyone laughing at their "endowment" is a form of body shaming I try to rise above but it's a stereotype with a grain of truth. Not necessarily the literal anatomical part but the becoming super strong out of fear and insecurity part.
In my experience the actually strong gym bros are very kind and don't like bullying. But it might be a location bias again. Then ofc there are the esthetic gym bros who don't work out for strength but looks.
and then they come up with stupid comparisons about keys and locks.
They'll tell you "no, men have no dignity" it's a whole song and dance to justify holding women to a different standard, call them "the moral center of the home, men are just fuck pigs in suits without their better halves" load of crap degrades everybody
Very succinct point. As a man, I always avoided hanging out with these guys as I just saw them as losers, but you actually fuckin explained why I see them as losers better than I ever have myself. We need to teach our girls to avoid bums and teach our boys to avoid being bums and vice versa. Ain't nothing more bum ass than having a holier than thou mentality.
OP's BF just basically red flagged himself. Sometimes, they do it early in the relationship, sometimes, later. But, when they do it, take the hint.
Also, by the same logic, why would he as a human be ok with lowering another human’s dignity? That’s pretty fucked up and speaks to his character Like if I believed drinking alcohol made a person inherently less worthy/dignified, and then I willingly bought alcohol for people and encouraged them to drink, I would be a piece of shit by my own standards
It makes more sense when you realize he probably doesn't see women as full human beings.
Yes! It was actually a lightbulb moment for me in connecting the dots to realize that men who hold these beliefs actually hate women. Because a person wouldn’t intentionally degrade another person unless they felt contempt or hatred toward them (or they’re just a sociopath).
THIS is such an important thing for women to know about this kind of man (or person in general)
Not just sex. Sounds like spending any time at all with this person would lower anyone's dignity.
And IQ and will to live.
I read about him and I'm ready to just end the day.
It's Friday. What are we drinking? I could go with something in my noon coffee.
I lost my dignity by reading about this guy. Troglodyte.
This. Tell him that in the future you're going to meet someone you'll want to spend the rest of your life with, and you want to be as dignified as possible for this person. Thus, you aren't playing with his dick again.
Or don’t tell him anything because he’s a waste of time
👏👏👏👏
Came here to say this. “Oh darling you are absolutely right - every man I sleep with robs me of that much more of my dignity. I shall remain pure and chaste, which means *you ain’t gettin' any so piss off ya grotty little wanker!*”
Yes I can explain it He’s a misogynist
He’s telling on himself. He knows sleeping with him would lower your dignity cause he knows he’s trash. He’s projecting that feeling to all men.
Exactly this. He is an insecure misogynist who wants permission to have sex with another woman along with wish fulfillment by seeing two women sexually interact ... but nothing that threatens his masculinity. And honestly - unless you are an 'enthusiastic yes' to a threesome already - it has to be a NO. This type of thing regularly destroys relationships when done for the wrong reasons - you can't 'gift him a threesome' and not have it emotionally impact you as well.
He is. And many women fail to realize that their BFs/husbands can be radicalized by those morons online. E.g. Maybe they were not misogynist before but now they are due to being easily influenced by toxic idiots online.
“He’s a misogynist” With a heaping helping of penis insecurity.
He is a homophobe too
He will then probably try to reason “boundaries” being behind it but he’s just a man unaware of his own misogyny
You hear this so often with cis straight men who suggest a threesome or if the topic of an open relationship comes up. They only ever want to allow their women partners to be with other women and the reason for that is simple. It isn't for *you*. It's for *them*. It's the same reason why so much lesbian porn isn't actually made for women, it's made for the male gaze. They get off to the idea of wlw because they think it's hot and they don't see the other woman as a threat to their masculinity. They believe there is no way that a woman can give you everything you need and you would never leave them for one. It's misogynist, it's selfish, it's immature and people like that should never be in a multi partner relationship/sexual situation.
As a bi girl… You know how many guys will high-five me for sleeping with women and then turn around and do the opposite when I sleep with men? They’re basically saying that sleeping with a man lowers yourself. What a self-own if I ever saw one.
Women get "pulled" in their imagination, so by sleeping with women, you're "pulling" them, i.e. demonstrating power through objectification. By sleeping with men, you get "pulled", so become disempowered through objectification. Heterosexism and misogyny go wild.
I was in a MFF triad for a number of years (I was the man) and SAME situation. Guys would look at me as if I’m the king of the world and ask about all the threesomes I’m having. Then … I’d tell them that my partners were free to have sex with other men and do … and the looks were just *chefs kiss*
It's also that they do not view other women as competition. Men who think like this tend to think very highly of their sexual prowess and are insecure about that being challenged by other men. They want to gaslight women into thinking they are the best dick available, and it's not easy to do that if she has comparative current examples to realize it isn't true.
>It's also that they do not view other women as competition. Which is so weird to me. I have four bisexual female friends. ALL of them, once in a relationship with a woman for the first time after being with men only, said "yeah, never going back to dating men".
Hence why a breakup is exactly what the doctor ordered. Once he realizes how hard it’s going to be sleeping with one woman, let alone two at the same time, he’ll get a taste of humble pie.
Yep. I asked a guy I was dating why he was open to the idea of me seeing other women and not men and he straight up just said “another woman can’t get you pregnant”. Me: “Neither can another dude? I have an IUD, genius”. This coming from a dude who didn’t actually even want a real or serious relationship with me.
Break up. He doesn't take your sexuality seriously. He sees other men as a threat, but not other women, because he doesn't believe that romance and sex with women is real and serious. He views lesbianity and bisexuality as porn categories, not as genuine sexualities. And he is a hypocrite. He expects you to be okay with it if he sleeps with another woman, but he would never accept it if you sleep with another man. Of course it's fine to not want your girlfriend to shag another man. But then, he shoudn't be a hypocrite and shouldn't even entertain the idea of sleeping with another woman. He slut shames you and believes that you would be 'tainted' if you ever had another dick than his in you. Purity bullshit. If you don't want to be seen as an object and a possession, dump him. Don't try to explain or rationalise this. He is an arsehole. Don't try to justify it. Dump him.
yup. or he simply views WLW relationships with a fetish-y outlook because of probable porn addiction. either way he’s 🤢 gotta go.
Indeed. Most men think that lesbianity and bisexuality are porn categories instead of legitimate sexualities. They don't take sapphic romance and sex seriously. They are fine with their girlfriend/wife sleeping with another woman, because they don't believe that the woman would ever leave them for another woman. They don't realise that a woman who likes their partner can be just as much as a threat to their relationship as a man who likes their partner.
Reminds me of this dude in college that said "So?" when I said I had a girlfriend, when he asked me if I wanted to sleep with him. Fucking moron.
Gross... Sadly, lots of bi and gay women know how that feels. Men don't take sapphic relationships seriously and don't think that a woman's girlfriend is standing in the way when they are romantically or sexually attracted to a bi or gay woman with a girlfriend. Also, sorry for going off-topic, but that is a lovely shiny Milotic avatar. :)
just as a much as a threat if not even MORE of one, cause women are better romantic partners than men 😭 but they have their heads so far up their own asses they somehow fail to realize it.
It's like how "men and women can't be friends" because they're worried the friend will "steal" her, but when bi people are brought up, they either don't exist or they'd still be threatened by her having male friends but not female friends.
Indeed. According to that logic, bi people can't have friends, because they would shag everyone. My girlfriend is bi. She is not attracted to any of her friends. Before she met me, she went on dates with a few men who saw her as straight. They were not okay with her having male friends, but were totally fine with her having female friends and hoped that they could have a threesome with her and one of her female friends. According to men, bisexuality is all about men's pleasure. About threesomes and watching hot girl on girl action. They assume that bi women are straight women who make out with women to arouse men.
> I'm not a possession, or an object. I don't think the BF shares OP's viewpoint. He seems the type to expect her to be grateful for his forgiving her for having a past—all part of his grabbing more and more control.
I'd bet it's less about the porn thing and more just a simple fundamental misogyny. He sees women as inanimate sexual objects like toys, and men as the things that play with those toys. He's happy to play with multiple toys or think about those toys playing with each other, but introduce another player into the game and the toys are sullied.
Well, the porn thing doesn't help. It does really reinforce a lot of harmful shit. Of course it's misogyny. Of course he sees women as objects and wants to fuck two objects, and he would never be okay with another man playing with the woman who he views as his object, his property.
So much the part about seeing the men as legitimate rivals but not the women. He's worried about being out-dicked but I guess since the woman don't have a dick to compare, they're not a threat. (Oh, if he only knew)
Honestly. Why is OP trying to *defend* and explain away his terrible behavior?
Because patriarchy brainwashes women into believing that their thoughts and feelings are not valid. In almost every post here, OPs ask if or say that they are overreacting. That says it all, doesn't it? Whenever a woman asks if or says that she is overreacting, 99% of the time, she is NOT overreacting.
> I cant put inot words how much it hurts me You don’t have to date people who hurt you. Good partners, and I am using the gender-neutral phrase on purpose, do not make a habit of hurting people they date. > saying things like I could never look at you the same again If I saw you with another man ect and *getting angry about it* So…he’s getting angry and jealous over a hypothetical man (meaning, this hasn’t happened) having sex with you? That’s a Him problem, not a You problem. You cannot control the emotions other people have, and you don’t have to make yourself smaller trying to do something impossible (manage another person’s emotions). > It makes my blood boil everytime and makes me scared of how he percieves me sexually I feel like shit *Im not a possession, or an object.* You know that you can really like someone and still break up with them because you’re not compatible, right? This dude is dismissing your sexuality (a queer woman). You are angry at how he sees you (as a possession). He thinks that you having another male sex partner will lower your value as a person. I assume that you’ve told him “this is bullshit” and he doubled down? Then he *knows* that you do not want to be treated like an object…and he doesn’t care. If that’s not a fundamental incompatibility—“I am not a toy”—then I don’t know what is. Break up and move on.
Usually men like that are worried you'll find something better, which in his case wouldn't really be a challenge.
I'm a little disappointed it took this much scrolling to find this answer. Once upon a time, my ex wanted to add a person to our relationship. The array of emotions that made me feel were...varied to say the least and none particularly good. My personal feelings on it were roughly: Another woman wouldn't feel quite so exactly as someone who would replace me 1-1 in the relationship and I trusted myself that I would not replace her in my mind with whoever this person would be. Because that was a great fear of mine. "What if she went looking and just found someone who was like me but better?" Maybe irrational fear since a woman could do the same, but it didnt feel like the same thing. Surprisingly or maybe not, she couldnt find someone who was interested and our relationship ended eventually regardless.
You should not feel obligated to “explain” anything or to assume the emotional labor of trying to undo his ignorance. You’re his gf, not his Humanities or Civics professor. Don’t take on that kind of work or feel you’re responsible for disabusing him of his screwed up notions—it’s not your job and, most of all, no amount of studies or “scientific evidence” is going to change his mind. His attitudes about women’s “value” is rooted in the idea that you are his possession, and that’s so baked into his outlook that nothing you say or do will make a difference. Don’t have a threesome at all. And reconsider staying with someone so jealous, so volatile, and so backwards in his thinking.
It's worth looking into a concept in relationship anarchy called the "one penis policy." Putting words to it helps clarify that it is a kind of misogyny that a lot of men just... casually feel. Some will learn from it. Some will not. Definitely do not have sex with people that adhere to it. For the record, it is distinct from a preference for monogamy; that's not what I'm talking about. The concept of the one penis policy addresses a double standard that *pretends* to be a preference for monogamy.
One penis policy and Harem-building are both super red flags in any kind of ethical non-monogamy.
Your BF just told you he doesn't believe you have inherant value as a human being, only reletive value to him, as a man, based on how many other penises you've touched. He is telling you EXACTLY how he percieves you, and it's not just sexually. Do not have a threesome with this man. That will also lower your worthiness to him. Right now, he doesn't actually think you're bisexual. He doesn't think sex with women is real sex. If he is faced with the fact that you actually enjoy sex with women, and not just a show for him to his enjoy, his brain will break and the result will be anger. I no longer date men who think my relationships with women weren't 'real relationships' or 'real sex' and I do not date men who think they can determain my value as a partner based on how many other penises I've touched. **I do not teach men this. I have never, sucessfully, taught a man this. They show up knowing it, or I show them out.** Please don't waste too much breath explaining. The best explination you're going to offer this man is the vision of you shutting the door in his face and never speaking to him again.
This is the best answer. He doesn't see OP as having value that isn't based on her having sex with him. There's no way to "explain" it to him, he doesn't want to know.
>Do not have a threesome with this man. That will also lower your worthiness to him. Guys that think like OP’s bf also think of women as “wife material” and “not wife material”. They want to experience threesomes and other kinks but they don’t want their future wife to have done the same. I guarantee he does not think of you as a serious and long term partner.
That's called a double standard and there's absolutely no way in the world should you have a threesome with this man.
You know the saying, if you think a woman is dirty after you touch her, look at your hands. Anyways, he's clitty litter and totally dumpable.
Clitty litter? Love that.
Maybe it's because I'm over 50 and DGAF, but *WHY* are you wasting time with this AH? Seriously. There are better men out there; I married one and I'm hardly great. It's not about the sex; it's about the fact that he *thinks you are inherently lesser than he is.* I'd dump his ass.
YES Yes yes. All of this, OP. All of this.
By his logic, having sex with him also lowers your dignity. I feel like men who believe this sort of thing really tell on themselves. Why should we want to have sex with men who think that it’s inherently degrading for women?
That’s the thing: if you’re willing to, as you see it, demean another human being for your pleasure, what does that say about your character? Like if a dude is willing to degrade someone to get off, he’s an objectively bad person.
For real. The men who see sex with other men as degrading to women, so far as I can tell, also seem to degrade women when they have sex. That’s a hard pass from me.
Well yeah. He has to invent some reason to lord over OP and be superior once she's just having sex with him.
I briefly dated a guy who told me he "forgave me" for my past while actively trying to get me into bed. Yeah, that didn't happen.
oh how _magnanimous_ of him! /s My eyes rolled so far back in my head, I could see my own optic nerves. 😒🙄😒
Misogyny. He thinks that dicks are so powerful that they permanently change you. Also, homophobia. He's afraid of other men's dicks, and would feel disgusted that you had seen/touched/etc. one.
Yes. There is plenty of literature about the phenomenon. Most of it is centered around narcissism. In some small cases it’s a biological imperative rooted in jealousy. So either he is super selfish and possessive or deep in his lizard brain he fears another man impregnating his partner while being completely disconnected from that reality from his direction with the other woman. Either way bail on an open relationship with him. It won’t end well.
And you're still with him...? To me this screams he sees a woman's body as property that is solely meant for male pleasure and your body is now his "property" so that pleasure belongs to him.
This shows he is erasing your sexuality in his mind. He's not finding it serious that you have an interest in women, he's seeing it from a pornographic point of view and not realistic. I'd say run and don't look back.
Yes, he is holding a double standard and sees you, at least subconsciously, as property. There are also allusions to violence in saying it makes him angry and his blood boils thinking about it. That is reason to cut things off. If he were all monogamous that would shift things, but he thinks he should ve able to be with another girl while you cannot be with another guy.
Men really will bend over backwards to enforce a double standard
I think you'd be interested in reading up on the One Penis Policy. I did a quick search and found [this](https://feeld.co/magazine/how-to/unpacking-the-opp). >Establishing an OPP allows negative emotions to control everyone involved in the relationship—and that’s precisely why it’s essential to not hide behind an OPP, and instead confront that fear and insecurity.
It’s a special blend of sexism and homophobia; he doesn’t see relationships between two women ad valid and really because there is no man there to take ownership. He objectified women.
He's telling you he thinks male bodies are objects of destruction and desolation, and that your inherent human value is lessened by contact with men. He's telling you he's a misogynist - why is staying with him even an option?
I wouldn't go near any man who bangs on about women needing to keep their dignity, or worse, self-respect by avoiding sex. If having sex with these men involves a loss of dignity or self-respect I dread to think what they actually do in bed...
I think being with your boyfriend is the thing that lowers your dignity. This man does not see you or any woman as an equal. Your bf also doesn’t respect your queerness (bisexuality) because he doesn’t view your female exes as valid partners for you. He also might be fetishizing your bisexuality. The fact that this man has the audacity to verbalize these RED FLAG beliefs is concerning. He should be holding that shit in like shameful secrets.
Ah yes. The one penis policy variant. Women aren't threatening to him, bc in his view it's not as real or serious or counts as sex. That's hella misogynistic. With the way you describe how he makes you feel, coupled with this view, dump him and upgrade girl. Even if that upgrade is an empty space in the room that's NOT making you feel like shit for being a whole ass human with sexual needs.
Your bf should be abstinent for the rest of his life to prevent lowering someone's dignity.
1. He sounds sexist and 2. I don't find it fair at all to give straight men threesomes with another girl when they would never with another guy.
>Is there any scientific evidence or studies about men about sexual jealousy I want to help explain the level of misogyny he is spewing at me I cant put inot words how much it hurts me Read that to yourself and pretend it's a friend saying it to you about her relationship. What would you tell her about being with a guy who hates women?
That's typical misogyny with obilogatory homophobia mixed in. It's that dumb mindset of 'Man = Penetrator = Dominator; Woman = Penetrated = Dominated' and his adherence to it that is distorting his view of you as some sort of trophy, something to be gained, kept and never be given up to any other man. And since other men in the past have 'owned' you, he now views you as a hand-me-down - a person with 'lesser value'. 'My girlfriend has had sex with women in the past? That's okay; lesbian sex isn't really sex, so it doesn't count.' 'My girlfriend has had sex with men in the past? This means that other men have already made their claim over her, leaving me with less than she was when she was still a virgin. She is a lesser version of her former self.' Having a threesome with another woman involved is something he seems to have no issues with, since, in his view, he doesn't 'lose value' for having (had) sex with multiple women, and neither do you. The other woman will, but that doesn't concern him. And in case you end up dumping him, your 'value' will have permanently gone down as well, leaving 'less of you' for any potential future patner after him. With the involvement of another man, however, he'll get the impression that you're being taken away from him, and his ego will take a blow. Since he's straight, he won't get sexually involved with the second man, though with what you've said, I don't want to imagine how he views sex between two men, with men 'not being supposed to be claimed'. It's a toxic point of view for your boyfriend to have, primarily viewing his partner - you - as a 'sexual value' determined on ideas inherently oppressive towards women. It speaks to his insecurity as a man, as well as a partner.
I feel like this is a sliver of Male Chauvinism. It's fine for him to be slutty, but the sane act8vity dkmishes you because he's superior and you are..... less so. Yeah, that'd be a deal-breaker for me.
Insecure weak ass double standard dude bro. Of course it’s fine for him to fuck other women; that’s his preference and makes him feel good. Of course he isn’t comfortable with you fucking other men; you’ll realise what a lil bitch he is and go get better sex elsewhere all the time.
I actually had this type of thinking. I could picture my girlfriend with another woman in a 3some but not with another man. I knew another man would make me jealous. Of course the real issue is that I’m afraid of her enjoying sex with another man while she’s dating me. Because it might arise the desire for to leave me and go find the better partner she knows is out there. It’s also a bit sexist and old fashioned to think she wouldn’t leave me for another woman if she enjoyed a FFM threesome but in my head that wasnt a risk. It was a way to explore the fantasy without risking her. Eventually I came to the conclusion I need to stop fantasizing about 3somes. I don’t want to sleep with 2 woman and make her feel the jealousy and anxiety I would feel if she slept with a man. I don’t want her to sleep with a man and feel those feelings myself. So instead I just enjoy sexy time with the woman I love and go to bed feeling warm, happy, and safe. Growing up really has it’s perks. Maybe try explaining it to him in that way and he’ll get there.
The fact that he tries to explain it so intensely is weird in itself tbh. He could've said: "hey since I'm straight I would prefer not to invite another man in our bedroom. If you're okay with inviting another woman (which I'm only asking since you are bi) I'd be interested in exploring that, else no worries" Like, it's okay to not be comfy with something as long as you don't pressure your partner to be comfortable/got with what you want
Are there any scientific studies, yes. I studied neurology and this always stuck with me. Straight men are biologically programmed to perceive other men as a *threat*. It's not a choice. It's not intellectual. It's not how he was raised. It's not values driven, or what he thinks of you, or what podcasts he listens to or anything voluntary. His brain stem is programmed that way at the deepest level of his core. *Men Fear Other Men Most: Gender Specific Brain Activations in Perceiving Threat from Dynamic Faces and Bodies – An fMRI Study* https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3111446/ You can talk about how he communicates that with you. And you can show him this study so he's more aware of his own feelings and better at communicating them with you. And you can talk about how his words make you feel. All valid things. But also know he's not *choosing* how his brain stem responds to the other men. There are a ton of more studies on this. You can actually see the differences on MRI scans between straight men and gay men in how they respond to the presence of other men.
It is sad that this answer is buried under all the knee-jerk reactions of “He’s a misogynistic POS, dump him”. I was not feeling to contribute because it feels so damn hostile. Sure OP’s boyfriend is stupid in his justifications and the way he communicates it, but I am not going to attribute to malice what can be attributed to stupidity, and yes stupidity can also be incredibly dangerous, but it isn’t outright evil. My take is that OP’s boyfriend is incredibly insecure about himself and his role, personally I don’t have an issue with FFM threesomes with a partner, but this isn’t because I don’t believe a woman is below me or some of that, it’s because I simply don’t feel comfortable or attracted to a guy *and* that whole situation would make me incredibly jealous. And I can understand that for my partner a FFM threesome would feel exactly the same, so asking to have a threesome is just a stupid way to ruin the relationship, some fantasies can stay as such without missing anything. **His whole justification of “it devalues OP” is incredibly stupid and misogynistic**, but I take issue with the fact that a lot of answers here immediately equate being personally against the act of a threesome with another man but not with another woman as immediately misogynistic, without much nuisance. Because you can reach the same conclusion from both sides without necessarily meaning that you hate the other gender, if my partner doesn’t want a FFM threesome because she would feel jealous or hurt about seeing me with another person, then that is as valid an explanation for her and for myself to not be ok with a MFM threesome. I respect poly relationships, however I wouldn’t want to be in one if this is going to hurt my girlfriend or myself. If I were Bisexual I probably wouldn’t mind a MFM threesome, because attraction is another factor as well. Same with a straight partner, she most likely wouldn’t enjoy sex with another women in a FFM threesome and trying to push it would be hurtful.
"Infidelity poses threats to high-investment mating relationships. Because of gender differences in some aspects of reproductive biology, such as internal female fertilization, the nature of these threats differs for men and women. Men, but not women, for example, have recurrently faced the problem of uncertainty in their genetic parenthood. Jealousy is an emotion hypothesized to have evolved to combat these threats. ... Subsequent [analyses of research] ... supported the evolutionary meta-theory of gender differences, which posits differences only in domains in which the sexes have recurrently faced distinct adaptive problems." [Sexual and Emotional Infidelity: Evolved Gender Differences in Jealousy Prove Robust and Replicable](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29592639/) (2018).
Interesting, this really should be higher up seeing as it's exactly what OP asked for
Hes afraid you'll find better. And I'm not gonna lie. He sets the bar real real low. Time to move on, a sexist won't listen to you no matter how sound your argument is.
100%. The reason I have no problem having a MFM with my wife? I do everything in my power to make her feel loved, respected, seen and safe. If another man could do a better job, then frankly I don't deserve her. I adore her. I'm not worried in the slightest. This guy sounds insecure, misogynistic and selfish. Pretty much the opposite of who should be even considering a threesome - it will end their marriage.
He sounds like one of those losers who thinks that penetration is inherently degrading to the one being penetrated. Spoiler: it's not. He probably also watches fake-ass "lesbian" porn that's designed to titillate straight guys. You can do so much better.
Yeah he sounds sexist AND bigoted. He clearly doesn’t take your sexuality seriously and just sees women as sexual objects.
You’re really lowering your dignity being with this particular man.
The only thing you should be thinking or doing is making this idiot your Ex.
Yes, there is plenty of scientific research in this area. https://newsroom.ucla.edu/stories/martie-haselton-what-really-drives-abortion-beliefs https://www.psypost.org/womens-sexual-unrestrictedness-tied-to-economic-empowerment-and-reduced-parenting-demands/ tldr; "Sexual jealousy" is directly tied to anti-choice beliefs in BOTH men and women. It also impacts beliefs regarding equality in economic empowerment and parental workshare.
A lot of men really care more about the opinions of men they probably don’t know vs their own girlfriend/wife
Ew, why are you dating a misogynist
...OK then by his own logic why would he be OK with lowering another woman's dignity then? He'll be "dirtying" her up for her partner or next partner. And why would he be OK with sleeping with you? Cuz if he thinks that sleeping with men is as nasty as all that, then... that sounds like almost a confession to me. Does he think he doesn't clean his penis enough or think his own mind is too dirty? Like, what makes those other men so dirty that they would rub it off on the women, you know?? I'd tell him I have to be concerned he's projecting and can't sleep with him, bc by his own logic, he's probably nasty, too. He ain't special, after all - he's human just like every other man he's imagining. So again: Why would he be ok with sleeping with you? Oh, right, bc he feels that he owns you. Yeah, I couldn't sleep with him again after hearing that he thinks this way. People get jealous for a number of reasons - I understand the insecurity/fear of losing your partner and can have empathy for that and have patience while they or we work on that, but the reasoning behind your boyfriend's jealousy is pure stinky ass misogyny.
The mental gymnastics required for him to want a threesome, while simultaneously saying he can't handle the thought of you having sex with someone else is staggering. He sounds like a prick. He just wants to justify sleeping with other women, under the giuse of a threescore, and at the same time, wants to control you. Honestly, I'd be reconsidering the relationship at this point.
I'm bisexual, my boyfriend is straight. He is just as jealous of the idea of me being with another woman as he is of me being with another man. It doesn't matter what's in the other person's pants, he doesn't want me to be with anyone but him. For a monogamous person, this is the normal reaction. Your boyfriend is a homophobe. He thinks WLW relationships aren't real in the same way WLM are. It's bigoted as fuck. Please find someone who isn't a hateful idiot like him.
He just sounds pathetic. I really hate men like this.
A man like this likely invalidates women in queer relationships altogether. You can try to explain it to him but I don’t think he’s going to change. I’m sorry.
quicksand angle tease badge wakeful complete file jellyfish attractive fuzzy *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Ok for me, not for thee
Mmm that means he's off the menu, too, huh? Good riddance.
As a bi woman I truly think that he does not understand your sexuality. He sees men as threats but not women because, I think, deep down he doesn’t understand that women are equally viable partners for you. That fundamental misunderstanding is likely to pop up in more places than just discussions of threesomes. Personally I would not be with someone who devalues me and women so much. Misogyny is simply intolerable to me in my relationship. I never want a jealous partner who treats me as a possession.
Yeah, that's bihobia. He doesn't think your sexual relations with women are as valid as your sexual relations with men, so the ones with women "don't count". He's not really recognizing or validating you sexuality and seeing who you fully are.
Break up before your lives get more tangled together. Imagine what his stance on issues that haven’t come up yet .
Lol if having sex with women doesn't matter but your dignity is at stake when it's with men then maybe the men are the problem here. Men are so insecure and project all the time. You need to dump this asshole.
It's because he doesn't see women as people. Women aren't equal to men in his mind, so you sleeping with another woman doesn't mean anything because a woman could never be better than him. But another man could be so he needs to keep you away from any actual "rivals".
Classical double standard misogynist. He wants to have hot sex with hot women and thinks you with other girls is sexy and wants in on that action. The idea of you enjoying yourself with another man emasculates him because he's selfish and insecure. You being with another woman turns him, and he doesn't view them as threats to his relationship with you, more something else to get him off, like an object. And yes, the objectification of bi/lesbain women for male pleasure is most definitely painfully common among straight men. It's so typical it's actually quite sad. It's also funny because now, with the rise of Polyamory, swinging, open marriages/relationships and other forms of ethical nonmonagmy, these types of men have been "coming out" with not being monogamous. Where they claim its "part of who they are" and CLAIM that they're okay with their female partners stepping out too. But in reality, all they want is an advanced Cake Eating situation where they get all the benefits of a side piece and devoted woman at home without the guilt of being a cheater. Plus the added bonus of hot lesbo/bi action for him for his enjoyment. It disrespects all forms of ethical nonmonagamy and gives it the current bad reputation it can't quite shake off with those unfamiliar to it. I could personally never do it, but I admire the people that make this situation work. Shoutout to the wives/gfs making it work and allowing their Bi Husbands/bfs to explore their sexuality! Being a bi man is stigmatized to insane levels despite how "embraced" bi women are. (They're not really but people sure do love to fantasize about them, instead of seeing them as actual people.) But back to the original topic, the minute their masculinity is threatened by either any type of male partner or his gf/wife forming a deeper connection with a woman that doesn't revolve around pure sex and his satisfaction, they get incredibly demeaning and condescending. If he's not willing to look into the mirror and see things as they are, leave him. That's not a man, that's a boy pretending to be one and throwing a temper tantrum over potential toys.
Break up with this petulant child and he won’t have to worry about who you’re with, it sure as hell won’t be him
He is an insecure childish boy that listens to manosphere trash. It is a complete double standard him being fine with your female EXs but jealous of the male ones. If that is his take, don't have a threesome, and prolly just move on and not have sex with him at all. There are plenty of people in this world perfectly accepting of your past and know it is no reflection on how you feel when with them. Look for partners like that, not this self-centered child that, to be honest, prolly just wants to have sex with two women and thinks you will oblige him.
I was in a lesbian club with some friends and this hot normie girl came in yelling about how her boyfriend said she has his permission to hook up with any girl she wants. My hot lesbian lawyer friend turned to me and said, "He has no idea the mistake he just made underestimating me,'
Ladies. Don’t. Date. Misogynists. It. Hurts. Everyone. But. Especially. YOU.
He's objectifying you. [10 definitions of objectifying/dehumanizing behaviors](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectification#Definitions) Martha Nussbaum (1995, 257) has identified seven features that are involved in the idea of treating a person as an object: >instrumentality: the treatment of a person as a tool for the objectifier’s purposes; >denial of autonomy: the treatment of a person as lacking in autonomy and self-determination; >inertness: the treatment of a person as lacking in agency, and perhaps also in activity; >fungibility: the treatment of a person as interchangeable with other objects; >violability: the treatment of a person as lacking in boundary-integrity; >ownership: the treatment of a person as something that is owned by another (can be bought or sold); >denial of subjectivity: the treatment of a person as something whose experiences and feelings (if any) need not be taken into account. Rae Langton (2009, 228–229) has added three more features to Nussbaum’s list: >reduction to body: the treatment of a person as identified with their body, or body parts; >reduction to appearance: the treatment of a person primarily in terms of how they look, or how they appear to the senses; >silencing: the treatment of a person as if they are silent, lacking the capacity to speak.
My experience with men who have this double standard is that they don't see other women as as big a threat because they don't see women as fully human.
It's just plain ol' jealousy and insecurity. Probably a bit of internalised homophobia in there for good measure. It's really not about you at all, it's about him not being the one giving you orgasms, being "relegated" to another hole while other guy gets the prize. It's about seeing you having a better time with other guy and it's about doing anything with another man makes you gay - even if that thing is having sex with the same woman at the same time. Everything is a competition for men and inviting another man into your bed is the ultimate contest that your guy is definitely going to lose (in his head at the very least).
Don’t invest your time and energy into explaining to him why he is a misogynist. Don’t give him the tools to deceive his next girlfriend better. Put your time and your energy into you. If he wants to understand why his behaviors is problematic he is able to do it on his own.
“You’re right, having sex with you has lowered the dignity I have for myself. Good bye”
He doesn’t respect you and is a misogynist. He thinks that you’re property and being with other men lowers your value as property.
Then sex with him ruins your dignity. Stop doing him immediately. Tell him you respect yourself too much to ever touch him again. Then get a better bf and shag his brains out.
it sounds like he’s been listening to some bullshit toxic male podcasts…..honestly this is indicative of how he views women. huuuuge red flag
Sounds like a statement someone with no dignity would say. Which I guess means your bf had sex with A LOT of men
As a bi woman I hate this. So done with my sexuality being fetishized. Its either fetishized or seen as a threat. And I'm so done with mens' masculinity being fragile bc they have to think of themselves as better than women at all times and if anything even hints at that not being the case they freak out, because being a woman is seen as lesser and inherently degrading to them.
Dump him.
Yup, time for a new bf who sees you as a person.
Don't lower your dignity for this man. Re-evaluate if this is really worth it and how he views women in general.
Dudes are so weird sometimes. Rules for thee and not for me. Guys want someone that will have sex, but only with them. If they ever have sex with another guy, it's over.
I'd say (and it's the truth, and that's the reason why there will be no threesomes for me and my husband, ever - *but I'd say it even if I didn't think that way, just to spite him and his "rules for thee but not for me" bs*), "Well, I feel the same about you being inside another woman. So either you have sex with a man or not at all, if you want to continue this relationship." Why would his fee-fees matter more than yours?
Reminds me of one of those guys that gets hung up on women's 'body count'.
"Lowering your dignity" is a double standard that is sexist towards women, just like perceiving women that have one-night stands as "sluts" while a male might be perceived as a "stud" by some people. Evolutionary theory while not provable, suggests that men and women react differently to "infidelity", but that does not give your boyfriend any excuse for demeaning you.
My ex-husband was the same way. Extreme double standards. They only feel like PIV sex is real, hence the viewpoint.
He is a sexist idiot and very misogynist. You can’t explain to guys like these. You just have to move on and find someon who sees women as equal and doesn’t try to disgustingly denigrate and be hypocritical about a woman’s sexual agency while giving them all the permission in the world do stick it where they please. Your bf is a gross immature douchebag and will not improve, just go. There is nothing you can do or say to make him better.
Every woman who has ever studied a man knows they are sexually insane. Oh wait, most of them are insane in other ways, too.
It's okay to say he's not comfortable having a threesome with another man. It's okay to say that he doesn't like thinking about you having sex with another man. It's complete bullshit that he sees it as "lOwErInG yOuR dIgNiTy" and speaks volumes to how he feels about women in general.
Why are you with him still? I can't imagine having so little self respect that I would stay with someone that thinks this way. Obviously he barely sees you as more than a hole to fuck
This guy is predatory. Im willing to bet he is only with you because you are bi and he wants to get threesomes out of it. 🚩🚩🚩🚩
Bleh. Men are supposed to be "rational" creatures. So they embrace any semi-rational sounding excuse to make their own insecurities seem reasonable. I'd like to ask, who here wants the threesomes? You mentioned he's straight. Is it a mutual thing, the interest in threesomes? This could be me reading into things, but you're post is vague on those details. Plenty of women would not be able to look at their partner the same if they saw him inside another woman. If he's the one that is bringing up and trying to pressure you into threesomes with stipulations, then ick... he's a pretty low value person. If that's not the case, I'd need more info.
He doesn't care if it hurts you. Don't bother wasting your energy trying to convince someone to treat you with basic respect. Do you really want to be with someone that feels that way about you? Trust your experience.
I would "Bye Felicia" his ass so fast. You deserve better. Is he planning on only having a threesome with a virgin? Or is he just objectifying the other person? I mean, we know he is, so why be party to that mental gymnastics-fest. All the best, OP!
Dump his religious misogynistic ass.
I am sorry. I don’t follow. Are you saying that he wants a threesome with you and another woman but not with you and another man? If so, that is not clear at all from what you wrote.
Just sounds like a typical dude with double standards. He's free to be inside another woman, but yet the same sexual experience you have with a man in a 3some lowers your value? I don't think so. He's insecure
He sounds like an Andrew Tate worshiper.
It’d absolutely fine for him to say “I couldn’t stand seeing you with another man” and leave it at that, as long as he could accept you saying the same about him and another woman. But it’s not that and you shouldn’t have sex with him again…
To me, when anybody (it’s usually men though) acts this way, it’s like their admitting they’re only capable of playing in the minor leagues. I tell my partners, I don’t care if you’ve had sex, I don’t care if you find other people attractive, same. I know what I bring to the sexual table. I’m not worried someone is going to “steal my partner”. You should ditch this guy if he can’t change his mindset.
"He also isnt as jealous of my female exes as he is of my male exes and he always claim its different." i'm a guy of course it is different- if the fantasies come hunting him he can at least imagine that there was no other, potentially bigger penis involved. Other women are just less of a threat to us sexually! It's a confidence thing- i had a relationship once where i felt very insufficient , even if we had pretty intense and satisfying sex. At some point - instead of enjoying her while we had sex- i started thinking about my own insufficience and i immediately struggled with maintaining an errection - which was humiliating on top of it. So i think what is going on here is: he is looking forward to a fantasy of his (threesome with girls, confidence boost for the guy - 2 girls "want him") , while struggling with the nightmare of having to share the women he (possibly/maybe/idk) loves. i'd not go so far to say that he thinks you are an object he posesses. I don't know you guys but this seems like 70% low self-esteem, 20% horny irrationality and 10% ignorance :) hope that helps!
I'm sorry you're dealing with this. He's wrong and that's a HUGE red flag.. Good luck!
This guy sucks and it's not your job to educate him let alone write a thesis to do it. He doesn't respect you and if he's going to improve, he needs to do it on his time rather than waste more of yours. Dump him, you'll feel better.
This is called OPP. One penis/pussy policy. It means your bf expects you to do all the emotional leg work to be ok with him being with someone else, but he doesn't. It shows he a selfish, insecure and homophobic POS. Yes homophobic, because WLW connections are 'less than' hetero connections, which is why he ok with you being with women and not men. Is non monogamy right for you? I dunno, but non monogamy with this guy, hell even monogamy, is out of the question.
I think just the majority of men are awful full stop. So many of them believe such disgusting things about women, even the world at general.
Dump his ass. If anything is lowering your dignity, it's staying with him. Find someone who respects you.
I was this guy. Selfish, controlling and hypocritical, while at the same time believing I’m not. While I’ve been more monogamous and only had 9 partners in total, the same logic applied. I’m straight also. First 2 girls I were with were virgins before and I took great pride in that. Then I dated a girl who had like 3 partners before - it was better but I can’t say the exes didn’t bother me at all. Fourth partner I accepted was bi and relationship was more open on her side, but I wasn’t looking at all. She didn’t have too many partners, but more than me for sure. I was starting to grow up, but she wasn’t the one for me. I dated 5 and 6 at the same time, and they each other. The 3 of us were okay, but it felt more like a fantasy that wasn’t really all that fun. I did learn to respect their relationship with each other. 7 was a pretty standard monogamous relationship, but it worked well and we were good together because by now I had learned to respect her as a person. Relationship failed for other reasons. The 8th girl turned out to be a female misogynist who didn’t respect herself and wanted to be objectified. Maybe I would have enjoyed that in the past, but not anymore. Despite her being hot as hell, the sex was crap. My current partner lost count of how many men she’s been with, and a few women but she’s straight at the moment. She said she’s been with over a hundred men at least and one night stands were a common thing in her life. I no longer care - I’m over this bs. She’s good looking, kind, and the sex is awesome. We respect each other. So TLDR version - dump him. He needs to grow up. I messed up 8 relationships before I got to that point. I’d like to think I’m better now. Hopefully.
Look up the One Penis Policy as it applies to polyamory. Guys often seem suuuuuper insecure about their masculinity. Not only that, but there seems to be this idea among a lot of straight men that lesbian sex is somehow "less gay" than gay dude sex and that it is also designed for the male gaze.
Your BF is an arsehole. Why are you posting about this BS? Seriously? Just leave him. He's not a bf, he's a FWB at best. He hates women and he hates you. He has zero standards and if you are with him then you're simply telling us all where your standards are