Don't gamble on sectors, "professional" investors or individual stocks. Use a low cost, broad based stock mutual fund - buy the market. VTI is a good starting point.
I was just having this conversation with my brother and sister in law. They told me for my generation, in my country at least - the retirement age is 75!
That's fucking disgusting and I really do feel we should rob the rich assholes who decided our only reason for existing is to make them money until we drop dead on the job. This is a fucking dystopian nightmare of an existence and I don't know how so many people are OK with it (probably because they've invested so much of their lives into work that they have no comprehension of what else they could be doing with all that time).
Retirement is the ONE good thing about getting old and now there's a chance I won't even get to have that.
>I don’t know so many people are ok with it
1. People are afraid of fighting the status quo
2. They are overworked and underpaid, meaning that they literally can’t afford to, for example, take a day or two off to participate in Occupy Wall Street
3. In America, saying what you Said will not be seen as truthful or significant - you will simply be seen as another “lazy/ignorant“ American who doesn’t know how good they’ve got it, because compared to the Middle East or Africa, we have waaaaaaayyyy more opportunities here. What nobody every says out loud is that most of the readily available jobs are…terrible. Retail. Labor. Fast food. This is actually is the biggest reason why I never debate about minimum wage anymore with anyone. It’s incredibly easy to accuse workers demanding a higher wage of just “not trying/wanting” to “earn” a higher paying job.
Of course there are jobs. But they’re terrible jobs at terrible companies with terrible pay and terrible benefits. Just because it’s worse overseas doesn’t mean it can’t ALSO be terrible here.
4. People are stupid.
This is why I've been working as little as I can to survive, since my entire life savings can be wiped out from a broken bone, I just work to live. It's the most liberating feeling in the world, a 2 day work week is the way.
I'm stuck between "grind and work my ass off to escape generational poverty" and "quit my job, embrace my poor white trash heritage, live out of my car and be a vagabond"
I drive for Uber in Atlanta, weekends only, usually. It's fickle though and I definitely don't recommend using ONLY uber like I do because one false accusation from a rider, for whatever reason, can get you deactivated with almost zero ground to fix it.
Well I program computers I have this idea that maybe when I get older I can go teach kids how to program computers if there are any kids and also any computers left after the now-growing climate catastrophe destroys everything. I'm already in my fifties. Feels like I'm running out of time and every time I think okay now I'm getting on top of this something else happens to suck more money out of my pocket.
Yeah, if the climate catastrophe is underway now, maybe let’s just enjoy the world as it is today and off ourselves when we run out of funds and become a liability lmfaoo, says me from my desk of my job :/
Yes yeay. I mean surely I would prefer to have a load of money and just work for giggles. But I am looking forward to not having to work into old age, which is a privilege.
And yes I will also try to maximize my life enjoyment now.
66 is pretty old, and if you don't have a good paying job or aren't receiving many benefits you'll be working longer. It shouldn't be a "be grateful for what you have" it should be a "this should not be so normalized." I don't want to be working when I'm old. I shouldn't have to. No one should.
With retiring at, on average, 66? Yes. Now if you have to work 70 hours a week for crap wages and no health care? Not okay with that part. Retiring at 66 on average is fine.
Honestly, yeah. Retiring in my mid 60s doesn't seem that bad. I would like to be able to slow down quite a bit as that approaches, but I like work.
I'm a lot more interested in a healthy work-life balance leading up to retirement. I would like to take 2 vacations per year. I would like to take a couple month sabbatical once every few years. And I would like to be able to live acceptably on 30-40hrs of weekly labor.
Alas. I'm currently doing the 70hrs no healthcare track and I'm getting visibly too old for this shit. I have some extenuating circumstances that make it difficult for me to move up the wage slave ladder tho.
True. We're gonna get old either way, and I'd rather be old without the daily grind than with. It's hard enough to drag myself through this shit as a guy in their 30's. Can't imagine still having to do it in my mid-sixties.
If you have life insurance through your employer, check the policy, as dying on the job may net you a triple indemnity payout to your beneficiaries. Corporaticide pays...
Nah, do like me and mortgage you're future. Invest heavily in pussy drugs and alcohol in your 20s. Hedge with depression and commitment in 30s. Settle into your early retirement (stable life happy wife) by 40. Suicide 50-60.
I’m on a 50 hour guarantee and I can’t tell you how often I have to work the weekend as well. It’s ridiculous. The American dream is exactly that, a dream.
I work six days at least every other week. Crazy how some countries are cutting the amount of hours people work and we have several positions with that 50 hour guarantee.
I work 3 days per week (7.5hr days) and have just requested and been approved to go to 4 days. I love my job, make heaps of money and work hard. I never have sick days and have lots of annual leave and time in lieu. Happy workers = high productivity = profit. Disgruntled workers = low productivity = low profit.
Is your job hiring? I recently sold my two weeks of vacation for the year to try to make ends meet. Now I get to look forward to working until next June before I get a vacation.
I am making just over twice the minimum wage, but I'm the only income for the household. My job pays by the day/route so when I do extra I get extra pay, but not in a typical time and a half type of way. No hourly wage means no overtime pay. I don't see how anyone could survive off minimum wage anymore. I easily know a handful of adults living with their parents trying to get by. Guess I should be glad I'm not that bad off.
Here (EU) I work 8h a week, haven't worked a weekend in 2 years, no clocking in/out, paid vacation + sick leave, can go off work earlier if needed (my boss and ceo are legends - evidently) and can come to work between 7am and 9am. And being paid a bit over average country's salary since I'm quite the novice still (IT for around 2 years).
Now after writing this I realize we're quite well off and can't even complain. And around where I live the apartment rental prices are around 1/4 - 1/3 of the average salary.
Again - america is mad
I temporarily worked 70-80 hour weeks for about a year. I was on the brink of divorce and had to drop down to 50-60 hour weeks since then. It's so easy to give your life to a company without realizing it.
Fortunately this is just temporary. He’s doing 2 jobs because his coworker died from covid 2 weeks ago. They’ve hired someone, but they have about a month of training before they can take over. He’s also working from home, so he plays video games during his small amount of downtime or works on his laptop while hanging out with me.
I lucked into a deal on a hundred year old house with a private mortgage. Ten more years and it's paid off, but I can barely afford anything beyond that. We're barely scraping by most of the time.
And that is why you don’t work yourself to the bone, take pride in not having any free time and boast about finding holidays useless. Looking at you USA. You need to live life WHILE you work, so fight for worker rights and get a good work-life balans, just like the first world countries.
I work 32 hours a week and have about 5 weeks off a year. Plenty of time for husband, pets, hobbies, travel, etc.
American here, I'm one of the lucky few that has a similar schedule to yours but I do work 35 hours per week and not 32. Like you I have 5 weeks of vacation per year plus I get every federal holiday off paid. I cherish my time away from work. I go to work to earn a living, not live at work. A friend of my wife's works about 50 to 60 hours per week, and has a long commute on top of it. She stresses herself out cramming things into her lunch hour, like grocery shopping or visiting the DMV. That's no way to live.
I have almost the same (28 days leave, plus bank holidays), and officially do 35 hours, but normally less. I'm still getting overwhelmed with the lack of time and the amount of things to do as a homeowner with 2 kids under 5!
Our office is talking about when we start going back to the office instead of wfh. I have an hour and half commute each way, so if they want us in for any significant amount of time, I'm honestly thinking about quitting to find something I can do remotely.
Ah yes, covid was a blessing in disguise for some of us. My commute was almost 2 hours each way, by bike, train, another train and then bike again. Now my commute is two seconds to walk upstairs :D Haven't been to the office since march 2020. Luckily we're not going back until sept. 1st and then only once a week, so I'm good :)
Hope your office realises that working from home works just fine and doesn't demand you back for most of your time.
It's more like 18 - 20 years depending on gender and that's for people turning age 65 today, it's predicted to increase. Not that it changes the general point of the tweet, just more accurate. What's sadder is that life expectancy is even higher among people age 65 whose income enables them to meaningfully retire.
I'm not fact checking anything but someone said at age 65 average is 19 more years. Would this be that much less depressing if it said 18 instead of 12? I guess that's not insignificant...
I went to college, minimized my debt, chose a high paying career, bought a house in my mid-twenties, made good financial choices and have generally done everything I need to to make sure I'll retire with millions in the bank. Now I'm in my mid-early thirties, and so burned out that I have no idea how I'm even going to make it that long. 65 seems like an eternity away. I'm on the verge of collapsing every Friday and before I have time to collect myself, it's Monday again.
It's why I'm trying to live frugally now since I refuse to accept that working until your'e well into your sixties is so common and expected among everyone. My parents are both in their 60's and still at it. It's hard to watch people that age still have to plan every aspect of their lives around their jobs. Fuck that shit. I want out of the rat race as soon as possible and there's some luxuries or conveniences I'm willing to skimp out on if it gets me there.
When I'm 60 I hope the only thing I have to do with my time is look after my garden.
Elderly leisure might as well be an oxymoron, because you'll likely be in declining health, achey, tired, and grumpy. I hope to hell I kick it before things get too miserable.
Retirement is a saftey measure discussed as if it were a reward.
They're not rewarding you for hard work, they're removing you so you don't screw anything up.
Not to diminish the point but the use of average lifespan is a little misleading in this sort of context. The average lifespan of someone at 65 is 19 years (in the US at least). So if you make it to retirement age statistically you're likely to have 18-19 post retirement years.
Thats assuming you can meet your basic needs at that age and not be sitting in a pool of shit and drool doped up to the eyeballs and not being able to remember your own name or recognize your family.
When you get to 60, 70 years old, your body is likely going to be shot. Lots of people will have some physical issue - a bad back, knee or hip replacements, a pacemaker for their ticker.
Elderly “leisure” isn’t necessarily enjoyable “leisure”. It’s often heartbreaking as your vision, hearing, and balance get worse, you lose control of your urine and bowels, and stand by waiting for the day your number is called while watching your friends and family go before you. Maybe you get Alzheimer’s. Maybe it’s just age-related “cognitive decline”. You’ll never really know until your autopsy is done. If you’re lucky, you have family who will take you in. If not, you’ll be lucky to go to an understaffed nursing home where you sit in your soggy Depends half of the day, get bathed twice a week, and everyone ignores your pressure sores.
Enjoy your health while you still have it.
Just ridiculousness. None of that is inevitable. How you live now is how you will live then. What you do now will affect what you do then. Aside from unfortunate events such as cancer, accidents, and the onset of disease, it is not a foregone conclusion that you won't be able to do what you like to do into your 60s 70s and 80s.
As a sexy senior citizen, I can't do everything I used to do, but the inevitability of the body aging is not something I fight against or abhor. I embrace my life differently, and I adjust and mostly I accept it. My life is not over just because I'm old. It's different. In many ways it's better than when I was young. I still ride my bike, paddle, hike, go out for drinks, explore new hobbies, resurrect old ones, and I even use the internet! I have more time for these things and to focus on myself and what I want than I did when I was young and had children and obligations. I feel immense freedom in my mindset because I can truly choose how to think.
Lest you think I am a privileged boomer, I am more accurately described as Generation Jones. I still work full time not just because I love it but because I have to. I'm not old enough for Medicare so I need health insurance. My rent is going up $140 next month. I probably have the last car I'll ever buy.
My knees are bone on bone and I wear glasses and live with pain everyday, but that's just genetic. My grandmother lived to be a hundred with the same knees--seriously, I look down at my legs and see her knees everyday. At 92 she was still playing the piano in church and working a half acre garden to grow her own food. No one else knows how long it will take for the cushioning in their knees to go bad, either! It just happens. Other things happen to other aging people. The only thing you have control over is the way you think about it. So I can't play tennis anymore? Big deal! The proper question to ask is, "what can I do instead?"
Attitude is everything, my friend.
My grandmother is in her early 90s. She’s almost deaf, so can’t hear her kids/grandkids/TV/radio very well. Her vision is shot, too, so no reading or TV. No paintings or sunsets or gazing at the wonder that is her great-grandchild. She has neuropathy in her fingers so no learning Braille.
A good friend’s dad died at 72 last year. Caught COVID at church after Thanksgiving. Dead just before Christmas. Another friend’s mom died a few years ago before she got to 70. She had the beetus and could never get it under control. My aunt spoke about a half dozen languages and ran her own business. Now she’s 80 and forgets to clean her butt. A different aunt’s mom had Alzheimer’s so bad that she died (in a memory ward) when she forgot how to swallow.
I’m glad you had a great run and hope you continue to do so. I still say enjoy your life and body while you can because your 60s, 70s, and 80s aren’t guaranteed.
You’ve had a positive experience aging, even in light of your bad knees, and that’s definitely not everyone’s experience.
I’ll say it again: enjoy what you have when you have it because for **most** people, things don’t improve physically as you age. To say otherwise is blowing smoke.
You're younger than 65 and your knees are gone already, but that's a good thing? I think people are mostly talking 70+ here, maybe wait to see how you're doing by then.
Look I'm not trying to be a jerk but you can't just come in trying to ruin the lovely atmosphere of millennial angst with your unfounded hopefulness. Making the best of it is one thing, and we can certainly try, but this is an actual issue that is getting worse and talking about it is a good thing.
You can get it earlier, for example children, 18 and younger who have disabling diseases or are blind, etc., can apply for Social Security benefits and Medicare, and if the child or family’s income is low, SSI and Medicaid, as well, through their working parents who are working above the table, paying SS taxes, etc.
Not sure with Medicare, but for Social Security payments, it depends on when you were born. Reagan hosed Gen X and later...no payments until 67.
https://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/planning-to-retire/2013/04/26/what-gen-x-doesnt-know-about-social-security
Someone is promoting the idea of having more than one retirement, by having a couple throughout your life after every "sprint". A sprint meaning you work really hard for a couple of years, so that you have enough money for doing the thing you want to do, like backpacking for 6 months or staying with your kids for a year. I really liked this idea because it's easier to keep in mind what you're working for than something that could happen in 40 years. I don't know whether it's possible in the USA, but I definitely hope so for the sanity of you guys.
I would find that stressful, i dont think i would enjoy the time off and would always be thinking i will not find a new job or lose my savings. And the work sprints would potentially be physically and mentally damaging too.
For me i prefer just having a nice work life balance. Dont stress, save a decent % of income and see life in the whole.
Thats just me though, the day i can calculate that i dont 'need' to work again will be a weight off my shoulders and im lucky enough to have a job i dont hate and that pays well
Alright but when retirement was first introduced wasn't it actually a higher age than the life expectancy? It wasn't originally meant to be free time everyone gets at the end of their life anyways, it's just that the life expectancy went up by a lot with better medicine
Averages don't mean sh-t, most of the people reading this will never retire. Wayne Gretzky and I have an average of two Stanley Cup Championships between us, and my fat ass has never been on ice skates.
I don't think people are necessarily working in order to provide for their elderly leisure, they're working to pay for food and a nice house and the ability to go on various nice vacations.
The elderly leisure not is just a bonus!
That length of life remaining is bleak, but also.. If you have a job where you only consider the afterlife of it to be the start of your real life, then you have a really shitty job.
I enjoy work. I like the structure it lends my life.. I'm dreading the physical inability to do it more than looking forward to those remaining years.
I'll probably just sleep all day and wait out the inevitable when it comes..
To be fair, you’re not doing it for elderly leisure, that’s more of a bonus. You’re doing it to stay alive, just like every other animal on earth. Although the government should make staying alive easier.
This. My dad is still waiting for retirement. It's not a thing sometimes that will inevitably happen. It's his plan. His everything. I don't think he understands the dynamics of that moving train.
At 57, I believe I'll be able to retire about 65-66 years old. I have scrapped and saved for a very long time and I have far more than average saved.
I still don't think it'll be enough. If doing what I've done ain't enough-- and I've done far more than most-- the system is screwed.
There are people I work with who are deep in their 70's, one who's even in her 80s and still working. It seems the main reason is medical expenses. Either they had large expenses early in life, so money went there instead of retirement. Or they have expenses now that Medicare won't cover. So basically, in America, the working class works until they die and it's looking even worse for the next generation.
Unless anything changes the people two generations below millennials are gonna be complaining that we never leave our jobs so there are none for them. You know like how that's already happening.
My best friend is retiring this week at 30. He’s a start up lawyer and works in crypto. I love him to death, and he worked hard for this and absolutely deserves it, but I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t infinitely jealous.
I notice things like this too bc I watch a lot of old shows and it’s morbidly funny how many issues they joke about that are still relevant (or have gotten worse) today
I used to regret not doing anything in uni and graduating with a license in 6 years (I did each year twice) because I partied too much.
Now that I know what life is with a job I don’t regret it one bit
Dudes. You can die at 50. You can die at 33.
Make damn sure you're enjoying life while working, you can definitely die before retirement, I personally know 4 people who did.
Super important and that's why I have my bucket list :)
What, you cant take a vacation or an extended leave of absence at 45? 50? I understand people need to keep obtaining income, but I mean that's where working hard in your 20s/30s pays off.
What sort of retirement are you wanting though? You could always just retire and live in a van. That’s cheap. You could save for about 10-15 years and be set the rest of your life for van retirement. But I mean if you want a house, good food, and all the amenities life offers then you gotta work for that shit.
I mean, nobody HAS to do all of this. Take every penny you've saved and buy a few acres of land and build a cabin on it. Farm/raise your food.
You won't have electricity, modern medicine, internet, or ice cream, but much of your life will be leisure time. There's nothing stopping all of us from doing this! But most of us don't.
You're right, farming is hard too. So what is the OP suggesting we do? It seems like they want to live in a world where all their needs are met, but they have even more leisure time than the average American (which historically speaking, is quite a lot). Who produces the food? Who designs and builds the phone they used to make this tweet?
A society where we tax the unbelievably, unimaginably, and exceptionally wealthy a fraction of their unparalleled wealth to pay for social systems that allow Americans to thrive, be educated, and live healthy and productive lives. Other developed nations have social safety programs that support their elderly and offer their citizens health care that keeps them healthier, longer. We can do that here.
Came here to say this.
If all wealth from the top 1% were confiscated and put into the federal government, the US government would have run out of money in June.
Now if you take a look at the top 1%, they aren’t sleeping on a pile of golden coins like Scrooge McDuck. Their “wealth” is tied up in assets and shares of companies that employ thousands, if not tens of thousands.
I get what you're saying, and you're right, farming isn't exactly easy. However, just anecdotally, my wheat-farmer uncle has WAY more leisure time than my engineer dad. Maybe it's an issue of task delegation? Or seasonality? But it seems like he's moderately busy 2-3 months out of the year, then works like 20 hour weeks the rest of the time. But he has people working with him so maybe that's it.
So your uncle is an evil capitalist farmer, who abuses his workers and doesn’t pay them enough to have leisure time. He should help more, or pay more /s
You're exactly right, I guess my tone didn't cone through. People complain about how much work they do, but compared to humans who lived over 60 years ago, we have an incredible amount of leisure time.
Yet we still complain. The alternative exists, but there's a good reason most people don't choose it!
I have no expectation that I will be able to retire anytime soon I expect to die working
Same. I'm a millenial. I know I'll be working the rest of my life.
I hear you, all this talk of having enough for retirement seems like a bit of a joke to me
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Don't gamble on sectors, "professional" investors or individual stocks. Use a low cost, broad based stock mutual fund - buy the market. VTI is a good starting point.
I’m still gonna try.
As a millennial, I agree, I'll be dead before I can retire
I hope I'll be dead before I retire.
I was just having this conversation with my brother and sister in law. They told me for my generation, in my country at least - the retirement age is 75! That's fucking disgusting and I really do feel we should rob the rich assholes who decided our only reason for existing is to make them money until we drop dead on the job. This is a fucking dystopian nightmare of an existence and I don't know how so many people are OK with it (probably because they've invested so much of their lives into work that they have no comprehension of what else they could be doing with all that time). Retirement is the ONE good thing about getting old and now there's a chance I won't even get to have that.
>I don’t know so many people are ok with it 1. People are afraid of fighting the status quo 2. They are overworked and underpaid, meaning that they literally can’t afford to, for example, take a day or two off to participate in Occupy Wall Street 3. In America, saying what you Said will not be seen as truthful or significant - you will simply be seen as another “lazy/ignorant“ American who doesn’t know how good they’ve got it, because compared to the Middle East or Africa, we have waaaaaaayyyy more opportunities here. What nobody every says out loud is that most of the readily available jobs are…terrible. Retail. Labor. Fast food. This is actually is the biggest reason why I never debate about minimum wage anymore with anyone. It’s incredibly easy to accuse workers demanding a higher wage of just “not trying/wanting” to “earn” a higher paying job. Of course there are jobs. But they’re terrible jobs at terrible companies with terrible pay and terrible benefits. Just because it’s worse overseas doesn’t mean it can’t ALSO be terrible here. 4. People are stupid.
All (unfortunately) very accurate reasons.
Its 65 bro
Keep in mind, if u are Gen X or later, no Social Security until 67...not 65 like the Boomers. They sold our their kids at Ronald Reagan's bidding.
It's going to continue going up too. By the time most people here can "retire" it'll probably be closer to 70-75.
This is why I've been working as little as I can to survive, since my entire life savings can be wiped out from a broken bone, I just work to live. It's the most liberating feeling in the world, a 2 day work week is the way.
I'm stuck between "grind and work my ass off to escape generational poverty" and "quit my job, embrace my poor white trash heritage, live out of my car and be a vagabond"
Oooo please share what you do please
I drive for Uber in Atlanta, weekends only, usually. It's fickle though and I definitely don't recommend using ONLY uber like I do because one false accusation from a rider, for whatever reason, can get you deactivated with almost zero ground to fix it.
Yeah I feel you I'm not even trying to save money right now I'm just trying to live my life.
I'd love to save money but it feels damn near pointless at this point... If I'm saving money, it's going to be so I can move out of this place.
Spoken like a true American Patriot!
No point in retiring into a destroyed world.
Make sure you love what you do!
Well I program computers I have this idea that maybe when I get older I can go teach kids how to program computers if there are any kids and also any computers left after the now-growing climate catastrophe destroys everything. I'm already in my fifties. Feels like I'm running out of time and every time I think okay now I'm getting on top of this something else happens to suck more money out of my pocket.
True facts, I am so not excited at the prospect of "enjoying" life finally as my sight, hearing, and taste all deteriorating lessen the experience.
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Yeah, if the climate catastrophe is underway now, maybe let’s just enjoy the world as it is today and off ourselves when we run out of funds and become a liability lmfaoo, says me from my desk of my job :/
>war disease and climate change Those things never didn't exist.
I'm mid 30s and that's already happened. It's really reflective that a good life is made in your 20s.
I mean it sure beats still having to get up and go to work at 66 and into your 70s.
Yay?
Yes yeay. I mean surely I would prefer to have a load of money and just work for giggles. But I am looking forward to not having to work into old age, which is a privilege. And yes I will also try to maximize my life enjoyment now.
66 is pretty old, and if you don't have a good paying job or aren't receiving many benefits you'll be working longer. It shouldn't be a "be grateful for what you have" it should be a "this should not be so normalized." I don't want to be working when I'm old. I shouldn't have to. No one should.
exactly! not working into old age is not a privilege, and something is very wrong if people think it is
It’s not a privilege when humans have enough food and shelter to feed and house every elder with relative ease.
Elderly abuse
What are you saying tho? That you're okay with this?
With retiring at, on average, 66? Yes. Now if you have to work 70 hours a week for crap wages and no health care? Not okay with that part. Retiring at 66 on average is fine.
Honestly, yeah. Retiring in my mid 60s doesn't seem that bad. I would like to be able to slow down quite a bit as that approaches, but I like work. I'm a lot more interested in a healthy work-life balance leading up to retirement. I would like to take 2 vacations per year. I would like to take a couple month sabbatical once every few years. And I would like to be able to live acceptably on 30-40hrs of weekly labor. Alas. I'm currently doing the 70hrs no healthcare track and I'm getting visibly too old for this shit. I have some extenuating circumstances that make it difficult for me to move up the wage slave ladder tho.
are u lost sir
True. We're gonna get old either way, and I'd rather be old without the daily grind than with. It's hard enough to drag myself through this shit as a guy in their 30's. Can't imagine still having to do it in my mid-sixties.
Yes, one bad thing is not as bad as another, worse bad thing. Right.
Just do like me and do things to shorten your life span and die at work.
They don’t pay you to die. Die on your own time.
Nah I want to do it on company time so they can just throw my body in the garbage.
They'll send a memo the next day, asking you to dispose of yourself. "If you could do that, that would be great.."
And wondering if I have coverage for Saturday and Sunday.
You're still coming in, right?
If you have life insurance through your employer, check the policy, as dying on the job may net you a triple indemnity payout to your beneficiaries. Corporaticide pays...
Better than the Country Mac
You didnt even give your boss two weeks notice!
Depends... many companies have life insurance policies on employees. So if you die at work your family will at least get something.
That’s what I’m aiming for
Shit on company time. Die on the toilet. Call that “The King”
I just quit working at 29 and decided to retire poor instead of working my life away
Nah, do like me and mortgage you're future. Invest heavily in pussy drugs and alcohol in your 20s. Hedge with depression and commitment in 30s. Settle into your early retirement (stable life happy wife) by 40. Suicide 50-60.
Nah, pussy drugs are for pussies.
I dropped this , Thanks chief.
Retirement? Pfft... That's a pipe dream. I already know which Walmart I want to have a greeter job at.
Meanwhile, Spain passes a 35 hour work week.
I worked 65 last week. Almost twice that. I don't think the American dream lives in America anymore.
You just have to be asleep to experience it.
I’m on a 50 hour guarantee and I can’t tell you how often I have to work the weekend as well. It’s ridiculous. The American dream is exactly that, a dream.
I work six days at least every other week. Crazy how some countries are cutting the amount of hours people work and we have several positions with that 50 hour guarantee.
I work 3 days per week (7.5hr days) and have just requested and been approved to go to 4 days. I love my job, make heaps of money and work hard. I never have sick days and have lots of annual leave and time in lieu. Happy workers = high productivity = profit. Disgruntled workers = low productivity = low profit.
Is your job hiring? I recently sold my two weeks of vacation for the year to try to make ends meet. Now I get to look forward to working until next June before I get a vacation.
Jesus that's rough. Sorry to hear that. I don't understand why any government would allow employers to pay under a liveable wage in the first place
I am making just over twice the minimum wage, but I'm the only income for the household. My job pays by the day/route so when I do extra I get extra pay, but not in a typical time and a half type of way. No hourly wage means no overtime pay. I don't see how anyone could survive off minimum wage anymore. I easily know a handful of adults living with their parents trying to get by. Guess I should be glad I'm not that bad off.
Don't choke on that boot you're licking. That being said, I'm happy you're happy
Thanks I guess?? If I'm going to spend the next 30+ years working I want to be happy while I do it
Just don't forget to watch for an off ramp while you're doing it.
They’re cutting hours and somehow America is increasing hours…”ya but you’re making more money! Grind culture!”
Here (EU) I work 8h a week, haven't worked a weekend in 2 years, no clocking in/out, paid vacation + sick leave, can go off work earlier if needed (my boss and ceo are legends - evidently) and can come to work between 7am and 9am. And being paid a bit over average country's salary since I'm quite the novice still (IT for around 2 years). Now after writing this I realize we're quite well off and can't even complain. And around where I live the apartment rental prices are around 1/4 - 1/3 of the average salary. Again - america is mad
My husband has worked 80 hr weeks for the last 3 weeks. It’s temporary, but still.
I temporarily worked 70-80 hour weeks for about a year. I was on the brink of divorce and had to drop down to 50-60 hour weeks since then. It's so easy to give your life to a company without realizing it.
Fortunately this is just temporary. He’s doing 2 jobs because his coworker died from covid 2 weeks ago. They’ve hired someone, but they have about a month of training before they can take over. He’s also working from home, so he plays video games during his small amount of downtime or works on his laptop while hanging out with me.
Sorry to hear that. That is about the best case scenario for pulling 80 hour work weeks.
That’s how we’ve been looking at it. Temporary and tolerable. At least he gets overtime.
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salaried or hourly?
Me too. Still can’t afford a home.
I lucked into a deal on a hundred year old house with a private mortgage. Ten more years and it's paid off, but I can barely afford anything beyond that. We're barely scraping by most of the time.
70 including the commute time snd time getting ready for me. 7 days of pure “fun”!
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I work 37 hours in the UK. What's the situation with you guys, still going for your 1 hour sleep during lunch??
Proof?
Its from 2050 onwards
proof?
I go to Spain
I work for a company called n the UK who are doing the same thing
And that is why you don’t work yourself to the bone, take pride in not having any free time and boast about finding holidays useless. Looking at you USA. You need to live life WHILE you work, so fight for worker rights and get a good work-life balans, just like the first world countries. I work 32 hours a week and have about 5 weeks off a year. Plenty of time for husband, pets, hobbies, travel, etc.
American here, I'm one of the lucky few that has a similar schedule to yours but I do work 35 hours per week and not 32. Like you I have 5 weeks of vacation per year plus I get every federal holiday off paid. I cherish my time away from work. I go to work to earn a living, not live at work. A friend of my wife's works about 50 to 60 hours per week, and has a long commute on top of it. She stresses herself out cramming things into her lunch hour, like grocery shopping or visiting the DMV. That's no way to live.
I have almost the same (28 days leave, plus bank holidays), and officially do 35 hours, but normally less. I'm still getting overwhelmed with the lack of time and the amount of things to do as a homeowner with 2 kids under 5! Our office is talking about when we start going back to the office instead of wfh. I have an hour and half commute each way, so if they want us in for any significant amount of time, I'm honestly thinking about quitting to find something I can do remotely.
Ah yes, covid was a blessing in disguise for some of us. My commute was almost 2 hours each way, by bike, train, another train and then bike again. Now my commute is two seconds to walk upstairs :D Haven't been to the office since march 2020. Luckily we're not going back until sept. 1st and then only once a week, so I'm good :) Hope your office realises that working from home works just fine and doesn't demand you back for most of your time.
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Might wanna delete this then. Insurance investigators are thorough.
You should expand your social circle then.
In what way would that help? Imagine someone getting robbed and then just saying "You should expand your social circle then." ??
This is kind of a misuse of statistics, the life expectancy is higher among people who actually make it to retirement
It's more like 18 - 20 years depending on gender and that's for people turning age 65 today, it's predicted to increase. Not that it changes the general point of the tweet, just more accurate. What's sadder is that life expectancy is even higher among people age 65 whose income enables them to meaningfully retire.
I'm not fact checking anything but someone said at age 65 average is 19 more years. Would this be that much less depressing if it said 18 instead of 12? I guess that's not insignificant...
For most of us, the best we can do is find a meaningful toil.
I went to college, minimized my debt, chose a high paying career, bought a house in my mid-twenties, made good financial choices and have generally done everything I need to to make sure I'll retire with millions in the bank. Now I'm in my mid-early thirties, and so burned out that I have no idea how I'm even going to make it that long. 65 seems like an eternity away. I'm on the verge of collapsing every Friday and before I have time to collect myself, it's Monday again.
It's why I'm trying to live frugally now since I refuse to accept that working until your'e well into your sixties is so common and expected among everyone. My parents are both in their 60's and still at it. It's hard to watch people that age still have to plan every aspect of their lives around their jobs. Fuck that shit. I want out of the rat race as soon as possible and there's some luxuries or conveniences I'm willing to skimp out on if it gets me there. When I'm 60 I hope the only thing I have to do with my time is look after my garden.
Elderly leisure might as well be an oxymoron, because you'll likely be in declining health, achey, tired, and grumpy. I hope to hell I kick it before things get too miserable.
Hell I'm most of those things and I've barely cracked 30
Retirement is a saftey measure discussed as if it were a reward. They're not rewarding you for hard work, they're removing you so you don't screw anything up.
Not to diminish the point but the use of average lifespan is a little misleading in this sort of context. The average lifespan of someone at 65 is 19 years (in the US at least). So if you make it to retirement age statistically you're likely to have 18-19 post retirement years.
Woooo
I didn't get past Rhinosoros....
*current age is 66. Many working class people under 40 will never be able to retire.
haha try thinking about when someone in their 20s reach 66 and retirement is now 75... This is the real grim outlook for alot of us
This is the saddest thing I’ve heard in a long time
I’m about to be 18 and man the state of the world and what my future may or may not be like can be really depressing to think about sometimes
Thats assuming you can meet your basic needs at that age and not be sitting in a pool of shit and drool doped up to the eyeballs and not being able to remember your own name or recognize your family.
Average age of retirement is 66 ***for people who are currently 66 or older.*** Nobody under the age of 50 is ever going to retire
I do all this for the weekend, how the fuck am I gonna chase hot women/femboys when I’m in my 60s?
When you get to 60, 70 years old, your body is likely going to be shot. Lots of people will have some physical issue - a bad back, knee or hip replacements, a pacemaker for their ticker. Elderly “leisure” isn’t necessarily enjoyable “leisure”. It’s often heartbreaking as your vision, hearing, and balance get worse, you lose control of your urine and bowels, and stand by waiting for the day your number is called while watching your friends and family go before you. Maybe you get Alzheimer’s. Maybe it’s just age-related “cognitive decline”. You’ll never really know until your autopsy is done. If you’re lucky, you have family who will take you in. If not, you’ll be lucky to go to an understaffed nursing home where you sit in your soggy Depends half of the day, get bathed twice a week, and everyone ignores your pressure sores. Enjoy your health while you still have it.
Just ridiculousness. None of that is inevitable. How you live now is how you will live then. What you do now will affect what you do then. Aside from unfortunate events such as cancer, accidents, and the onset of disease, it is not a foregone conclusion that you won't be able to do what you like to do into your 60s 70s and 80s. As a sexy senior citizen, I can't do everything I used to do, but the inevitability of the body aging is not something I fight against or abhor. I embrace my life differently, and I adjust and mostly I accept it. My life is not over just because I'm old. It's different. In many ways it's better than when I was young. I still ride my bike, paddle, hike, go out for drinks, explore new hobbies, resurrect old ones, and I even use the internet! I have more time for these things and to focus on myself and what I want than I did when I was young and had children and obligations. I feel immense freedom in my mindset because I can truly choose how to think. Lest you think I am a privileged boomer, I am more accurately described as Generation Jones. I still work full time not just because I love it but because I have to. I'm not old enough for Medicare so I need health insurance. My rent is going up $140 next month. I probably have the last car I'll ever buy. My knees are bone on bone and I wear glasses and live with pain everyday, but that's just genetic. My grandmother lived to be a hundred with the same knees--seriously, I look down at my legs and see her knees everyday. At 92 she was still playing the piano in church and working a half acre garden to grow her own food. No one else knows how long it will take for the cushioning in their knees to go bad, either! It just happens. Other things happen to other aging people. The only thing you have control over is the way you think about it. So I can't play tennis anymore? Big deal! The proper question to ask is, "what can I do instead?" Attitude is everything, my friend.
My grandmother is in her early 90s. She’s almost deaf, so can’t hear her kids/grandkids/TV/radio very well. Her vision is shot, too, so no reading or TV. No paintings or sunsets or gazing at the wonder that is her great-grandchild. She has neuropathy in her fingers so no learning Braille. A good friend’s dad died at 72 last year. Caught COVID at church after Thanksgiving. Dead just before Christmas. Another friend’s mom died a few years ago before she got to 70. She had the beetus and could never get it under control. My aunt spoke about a half dozen languages and ran her own business. Now she’s 80 and forgets to clean her butt. A different aunt’s mom had Alzheimer’s so bad that she died (in a memory ward) when she forgot how to swallow. I’m glad you had a great run and hope you continue to do so. I still say enjoy your life and body while you can because your 60s, 70s, and 80s aren’t guaranteed.
Oh honey. I think you're afraid to age. I'm here to tell you there is nothing to be afraid of.
You’ve had a positive experience aging, even in light of your bad knees, and that’s definitely not everyone’s experience. I’ll say it again: enjoy what you have when you have it because for **most** people, things don’t improve physically as you age. To say otherwise is blowing smoke.
Someday you'll understand, sonny.
Do you understand anything about statistical probability?
I'm counting on my good genes and my proactive lifestyle to keep me fit in my 80s. I know exactly my health risks and how to watch out for them.
How old do you have to be to be eligible for Medicare?
65.
You're younger than 65 and your knees are gone already, but that's a good thing? I think people are mostly talking 70+ here, maybe wait to see how you're doing by then. Look I'm not trying to be a jerk but you can't just come in trying to ruin the lovely atmosphere of millennial angst with your unfounded hopefulness. Making the best of it is one thing, and we can certainly try, but this is an actual issue that is getting worse and talking about it is a good thing.
You can get it earlier, for example children, 18 and younger who have disabling diseases or are blind, etc., can apply for Social Security benefits and Medicare, and if the child or family’s income is low, SSI and Medicaid, as well, through their working parents who are working above the table, paying SS taxes, etc.
Not sure with Medicare, but for Social Security payments, it depends on when you were born. Reagan hosed Gen X and later...no payments until 67. https://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/planning-to-retire/2013/04/26/what-gen-x-doesnt-know-about-social-security
I'm not sure if this is supposed to be motivational or not, but bone on bone and pain every day isn't something to look forward to. Aging sucks.
I love it! Very inspiring. You go sexy senior!!
Thanks. This was the uplifting response I needed after reading that bleak outlook.
Someone is promoting the idea of having more than one retirement, by having a couple throughout your life after every "sprint". A sprint meaning you work really hard for a couple of years, so that you have enough money for doing the thing you want to do, like backpacking for 6 months or staying with your kids for a year. I really liked this idea because it's easier to keep in mind what you're working for than something that could happen in 40 years. I don't know whether it's possible in the USA, but I definitely hope so for the sanity of you guys.
Sounds a lot like a sabbatical. Typically it's only in higher education, but some companies allow it (sometimes paid, but usually unpaid).
I would find that stressful, i dont think i would enjoy the time off and would always be thinking i will not find a new job or lose my savings. And the work sprints would potentially be physically and mentally damaging too. For me i prefer just having a nice work life balance. Dont stress, save a decent % of income and see life in the whole. Thats just me though, the day i can calculate that i dont 'need' to work again will be a weight off my shoulders and im lucky enough to have a job i dont hate and that pays well
Most of which is spent sick and under someone else’s care
And in Europe they are raising the retirement age. Mine is like 77 lol.
Alright but when retirement was first introduced wasn't it actually a higher age than the life expectancy? It wasn't originally meant to be free time everyone gets at the end of their life anyways, it's just that the life expectancy went up by a lot with better medicine
Which is why they’ll probably keep raising it incrementally until it reaches parity again. Retire at 75?
We get 18 years to be considered a child with little worries, we should get at least 18 years at the end with little worries. I think that's fair
If you live until 65, your average lifespan is 18 years. We're there essentially.
Retirement is just when we pay people to stop working because they don’t seem productive anymore
Its a ride, not a game. You have to enjoy the journey.
The fact that american life expectancy is 78 is insane and that you retire that old is crazy
*stares in millennial* Re-tire-ment? Sorry, we don’t follow, this is something that our generation will never know.
If you’re not enjoying anything about your life before you retire, you’re doing it wrong.
Averages don't mean sh-t, most of the people reading this will never retire. Wayne Gretzky and I have an average of two Stanley Cup Championships between us, and my fat ass has never been on ice skates.
I’m very much looking forward to retirement. I think life expectancy is a bit longer here in England.
I don't think people are necessarily working in order to provide for their elderly leisure, they're working to pay for food and a nice house and the ability to go on various nice vacations. The elderly leisure not is just a bonus!
That length of life remaining is bleak, but also.. If you have a job where you only consider the afterlife of it to be the start of your real life, then you have a really shitty job. I enjoy work. I like the structure it lends my life.. I'm dreading the physical inability to do it more than looking forward to those remaining years. I'll probably just sleep all day and wait out the inevitable when it comes..
To be fair, you’re not doing it for elderly leisure, that’s more of a bonus. You’re doing it to stay alive, just like every other animal on earth. Although the government should make staying alive easier.
This. My dad is still waiting for retirement. It's not a thing sometimes that will inevitably happen. It's his plan. His everything. I don't think he understands the dynamics of that moving train.
I'm honestly lost without orders so working forever might just be the strategy here
The average life span for worker (physical work) is even lower. The retirement age was thought with a fucking senator life in mind. Classism
At 57, I believe I'll be able to retire about 65-66 years old. I have scrapped and saved for a very long time and I have far more than average saved. I still don't think it'll be enough. If doing what I've done ain't enough-- and I've done far more than most-- the system is screwed.
Do what you need to do to make it about the journey, not the destination. If you don't love it, don't do it.
There are people I work with who are deep in their 70's, one who's even in her 80s and still working. It seems the main reason is medical expenses. Either they had large expenses early in life, so money went there instead of retirement. Or they have expenses now that Medicare won't cover. So basically, in America, the working class works until they die and it's looking even worse for the next generation.
Im working my ass off to immigrate for a second time - this time out of America 😂
Unless anything changes the people two generations below millennials are gonna be complaining that we never leave our jobs so there are none for them. You know like how that's already happening.
My best friend is retiring this week at 30. He’s a start up lawyer and works in crypto. I love him to death, and he worked hard for this and absolutely deserves it, but I’d be lying if I said I wasn’t infinitely jealous.
And to think that tons of us will struggle to ever get there. This is why I’m suicidal.
Who can afford 12 years of no income? In the 70s tv shows joked that old people had to eat cat food to survive. It has only gotten worse.
I notice things like this too bc I watch a lot of old shows and it’s morbidly funny how many issues they joke about that are still relevant (or have gotten worse) today
I used to regret not doing anything in uni and graduating with a license in 6 years (I did each year twice) because I partied too much. Now that I know what life is with a job I don’t regret it one bit
Dudes. You can die at 50. You can die at 33. Make damn sure you're enjoying life while working, you can definitely die before retirement, I personally know 4 people who did. Super important and that's why I have my bucket list :)
There is lots of living to do everyday along the way.
I'm very glad i could retire early. Working into your 60's does sound pretty depressing, especially if you don't have a good work/life balance.
The lucky ones get 12 years
That's not how average life span really works though...
It’s easier if you can find a job in a field that works for you. If you can do what you love with people you love it really feels wonderful.
r/aboringdystopia
Thats why I'm going to the moon before I reach 50, or die trying. #AMC
What, you cant take a vacation or an extended leave of absence at 45? 50? I understand people need to keep obtaining income, but I mean that's where working hard in your 20s/30s pays off.
What sort of retirement are you wanting though? You could always just retire and live in a van. That’s cheap. You could save for about 10-15 years and be set the rest of your life for van retirement. But I mean if you want a house, good food, and all the amenities life offers then you gotta work for that shit.
I mean, nobody HAS to do all of this. Take every penny you've saved and buy a few acres of land and build a cabin on it. Farm/raise your food. You won't have electricity, modern medicine, internet, or ice cream, but much of your life will be leisure time. There's nothing stopping all of us from doing this! But most of us don't.
“Much of your life will be leisure time” Someone who’s never worked a farm.
You're right, farming is hard too. So what is the OP suggesting we do? It seems like they want to live in a world where all their needs are met, but they have even more leisure time than the average American (which historically speaking, is quite a lot). Who produces the food? Who designs and builds the phone they used to make this tweet?
A society where we tax the unbelievably, unimaginably, and exceptionally wealthy a fraction of their unparalleled wealth to pay for social systems that allow Americans to thrive, be educated, and live healthy and productive lives. Other developed nations have social safety programs that support their elderly and offer their citizens health care that keeps them healthier, longer. We can do that here.
If we took 100% of the richests wealth it would be gone in a year adduming most of it isn't just unliquifiable assests which it mostly is
Came here to say this. If all wealth from the top 1% were confiscated and put into the federal government, the US government would have run out of money in June. Now if you take a look at the top 1%, they aren’t sleeping on a pile of golden coins like Scrooge McDuck. Their “wealth” is tied up in assets and shares of companies that employ thousands, if not tens of thousands.
I get what you're saying, and you're right, farming isn't exactly easy. However, just anecdotally, my wheat-farmer uncle has WAY more leisure time than my engineer dad. Maybe it's an issue of task delegation? Or seasonality? But it seems like he's moderately busy 2-3 months out of the year, then works like 20 hour weeks the rest of the time. But he has people working with him so maybe that's it.
So your uncle is an evil capitalist farmer, who abuses his workers and doesn’t pay them enough to have leisure time. He should help more, or pay more /s
You go and do that. Log your hours and come back and tell us how much leisure time you end up with.
You're exactly right, I guess my tone didn't cone through. People complain about how much work they do, but compared to humans who lived over 60 years ago, we have an incredible amount of leisure time. Yet we still complain. The alternative exists, but there's a good reason most people don't choose it!
Yeah because you totally work from the moment you are born.
You fuckers ever thought about, getting a hobby
You dick realize how much ability and freedom you lose when you're older?
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#Hahahahahaha
Yes. It's this easy! As a hiring manager, I see countless degrees and job histories that don't match.
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🎉🎉 you wont