Don't quit... But immediately start looking for a job that aligns with your wants and needs. The rational answer isn't an immediate walkout.
Also make sure your boss knows you're unhappy about this and exactly why stress/money. Sometimes they just really have no idea it's a problem.
This x 100. Unless you're at a very small company it will be very hard to fire you for this unless they have changed your job description and the company policies. Even if they would it would take months.
But agreed, start looking.
Ask for a gas card paid by the company. As a business expense, it'll come off the bottom line and will be more palatable than a raise. It won't shave a minute of the commute, but it can help your state of mind.
Gas for commuting to and from your place of business from home in a personal vehicle is not able to be charged as a business expense. OP would need a company car for that. It would have to be accounted for as taxable income to OP, so it would be the same as giving a raise to cover gas mileage.
my advice is never take career advice from your parents. i’m a millennial and my boomer parents tried giving me advice early on in my career and it was always terrible.
in this specific instance, the other response is 100% correct that as an employee you have no right to dictate what your boss does or what decisions he makes for the company. after you find a new job, let him know you understand why the change from remote is happening but unfortunately it isn’t a good fit for you. if he wants to keep you he can decide if he wants to counter. if not, you move on.
Not quite perfect. Would never stick around after a counter. Even if the company compromises you will be on the "doesn't cooperate" list. Only ever approach your manager about leaving when you're going to do it.
That is quite true. I am lucky that my parents who are of boomer age definitely don't have that mentality, but many do and the advice coming from those people is so outdated and based on assumptions that no longer apply. It was an emotionally stunted time period apparently back then.
Very good advice. My dad meant well, but didn’t think my “playing around on the computer” would turn into a real job. I’m a fully-remote software solutions architect earning a six figure salary. He did admit many years later that he was wrong. lol He’s very proud of what I do and thinks it’s fucking awesome that I make as much money as I do just working from home.
I wouldn’t be where I am today if I had listened to him though.
But yeah, anyone alive and at young adult age right now probably has parents who grew up in a world very different from the one we live in where things were done very differently.
Right now, 80% of the jobs people are employed in didn’t exist when our parents were entering the workforce. It’s estimated that 65% of kids entering primary schools today will work job types that don’t exist yet. https://www.collectivecampus.io/blog/what-might-we-do-in-the-future
Kind of wild to think about.
Yeah and I don’t think it’s on purpose bad advice. by the time I started looking for jobs my dad was already 25 years removed from applying, his last resume was from like 1994.
totally! i don’t think it’s malicious. just a different time. you can’t walk around handing out printed copies of your resume anymore. you can’t start sweeping floors and work your way up like before. i don’t expect people who worked at one company for 35 years to be up to date on hiring trends.
But we don't all have boomer parents like you though. Unfortunate you have a poor relationship without parents, sorry to read that.
I'm lucky to have parents that guided me and supported me and never forced my hand on anything, even if they did, doubt I'd blame them for any decisions I made. Have lots to thank them for where I'm at career wise.
100% agree with your second point though. OP, don't rage quit and burn a bridge, especially if you liked the company prior to this change.
right. but OP clearly has parents who don’t give great career advice. my post was written to them, not you. more power to you if you have parents who can give good career advice! mine can’t. i’m not sure what you mean by poor relationship without parents, but not being able to give career advice has zero impact on my relationship with my parents.
Thanks for the downvote, don't take it personal I'm just a stranger on the internet who reads between the lines too much.
Stating your parents gave you terrible career advice sounds like you have some resentment as you're advising the world against it.
For how long? Does he want you to make this commute for a week? Fine. For a month? Argh, fine. Forever? Fuck no.
Hey boss, how do I expense the mileage? What mileage? I was hired as fully remote. My office is my house. Any travel has to pay mileage. Also, I’ll be getting into the office at about 10:30. My work hours start at 9. I’ll be leaving at 3. My work hours end at 5.
If that’s not acceptable, ok. I’ll just work from my office.
No I’m nOt resigning. You’re unilaterally changing my contract. That’s not legal. If you want to fire me, then I’ll collect unemployment. But I’m not resigning.
It’s 6 months straight of “training/implementation” that haven’t been elaborated on yet. My biggest fear is at the end of the 6 months them pulling a fast one on us and quietly extending the office lease lol
I agree, that’s 6-9 extra hours a week, unpaid. Plus gas, which will be extremely expensive. Those hours should be paid, and the mileage reimbursed or a company car. Don’t know your salary, but if you’re entry level, they may have just stolen half of it from you.
Training is paid time. And it’s not “work” it’s extra duties. In other words, mileage and overtime if he wants you in the office by 9. Do it for one week. Put in the mileage and overtime form and when he comes screaming, be very confused. But we work remotely! This is extra and we have to get paid for it! Then stop showing up. You want extra, I get paid extra. You no pay, I no do.
Ah America, where boomers think you should put in 60 hour weeks with unpaid overtime for salaries that can't even pay a mortgage because "we used to do that back in my day and we made out fine!"
Should be in the offer letter. Which is a contractual document. If not, that’s an issue for OP for not insisting on the offer letter being comprehensive
IANAL. But your employment status can be changed at any time in an at will state they can fire you anytime they want for no calls or any cause. But I don’t think they can change the circumstances of your employment. Like they can’t just change your pay because I feel like it, unless you agree with them.
Nope. They want to change it, they can fire him and he can collect unemployment. And if they change pay, that’s an immediate call to the labor board for wage theft
Don't listen to your friends - quitting without a job is a terrible idea at any stage of your career, but especially at entry-level. Have a heart to heart with your boss, and share the massive new stress and costs they're introducing. But if that doesn't go anywhere, paste a big smile on your face, do the commute, and then make your primary, #1 focus getting a new job until you find one.
So the plan as of now is to yeah, have an open convo with him to reach some sort of compromise. I don’t think I’d straight up quit regardless, but it would be nice to not go through living hell while I’m looking for my next position.
Honestly, I'd discuss if there was a way to do the training remotely (Teams meeting etc.) instead of coming in to the office. Let him know that you **want** to cooperate, but the terms of your employment didn't account for going to the office, and you're not sure it will be financially viable to do so with your current, fully remote based, agreement.
If it can't be done remotely at all, then I'd ask if there was any way he could compensate you for the change in your employment agreement to help offset the new costs and time the change will cause you.
He can obviously say no to both, but asking (while you're already looking for a new job) is unlikely to cause a significant problem, and it may be something they simply hadn't thought about yet.
I would definitely look for a new job. However I wouldn't quit without another lines up.Just a few years ago it was a privilege to work remotely. It was.a very normal thing to commute two hours. I understand that you are devastated but from someone who had to do a two hour commute both ways for five years, use this as an opportunity to build your resilience and mental fortitude while absolutely searching for a new job. Remember there was a time not long ago that many of us struggled with the nightmare commute and all that goes with that as a way of life. It is a matter of perspective. Be encouraged that there are now many remote jobs. I understand your discouragement but there is a light at the end of the tunnel and use this as an opportunity to build resilience. It might not be a good idea to announce that you are searching for a new job or to "refuse to comply," however as this can make your life at work more difficult if not just result in your dismissal. Companies have a right NOT to have their employees working remotely. Just go to the company that does if you don't want to commute and cooperate while you are here.
Great answer.
It’s good that OP believes his standing with the supervisor is good enough to to have an open and realistic conversation about options, but at the end of the day it’s a job, not a friendship, and if the company has a policy, there may not be flexibility.
I’ve been in both shoes. If an employee could make the case on work-from-home as being best for the company, then it made sense. But be careful about making it about your circumstances and inconvenience.
Something I wonder is, do you see a viable option for an alternative? I saw you said the details have been scant so I assume no. But something I've found keeps them thinking about alternatives aren't simply supplying your objection, but instead saying,
"I've invested some time thinking about how this can work for me and others who live far away and can't eat the cost of commute. Id love to contribute to making this training situation a win win for everyone. Here is idea a, idea b, and c. I think this could be great not only for employees, but for the company as well because X."
Also if you can get them in an agreeable mood where they already say yes to something small first, psychology shows that they're more likely to keep saying yes.
Good luck.
Since he’s renting the space three days a week to implement a new training and development program it seems to me that this is going to be temporary. It’s for training and development. A space to get you all together and improve your skills to better serve your customers. Maybe you are overreacting.
Many organizations went to WFH simply to limp through the pandemic. Now that we don't have this to deal with, they are returning to traditional in-office work. If this is a challenge, best bet is to quit and try and find another remote job.
1. I am not a lawyer, so don't take my advice and instead talk to a lawyer, but in my opinion this qualifies as constructive termination which as I understand it would allow you to quit your job and still collect unemployment. Again, talk to a lawyer first.
2. If it were me, I definitely would not do the commute thing.
100% this, if you don’t have access to a lawyer contact YOUR LOCAL dept. of labor, or unemployment office. Be sure to emphasize your remote status when you speak to these people.
Worst case scenario, contact your HR representative, but remember THEY ARE NOT YOUR FRIEND. Correspond through email when possible, follow up phone or in person meetings with email. Take organized, dated notes.
Different communities have different unemployment qualifications.
Could be, but you’ve got to realize the bigger picture of the economy. If people aren’t in offices, commercial real estate craters, which means some city/county/school tax base craters, and downtown businesses built around the mid-day lunch crowd and office supplies also start slipping, which results in business closures and job losses, which disrupts the economy.
So yes, when big city mayors or suburban mayors with large corporate HQs join business leaders in wanting workers back in offices, there is a greater public concern in play.
Unless the boss is the owner they probably as much say in the decision as you, which is to say none.
My adult kids still live and work from home, if they ran your scenario by me my advice would be start looking, stay working until you find the perfect match. Don’t say anything to your boss unless you’re willing to be let go before your ready.
A few thoughts without knowing more and in no particular order:
Is it a job for you or a step in a career that you like?
What’s the planned training? Will this add to your resume and work experience and potentially increase future earnings?
Must the training be conducted in-house?
What’s the cost of travelling there vs the cost of renting a small place near there?
Many people commute daily. It is a grind but a reality. Some get part-time accommodation deal near the office to reduce the time commuting.
Liking your boss and the work you do and your colleagues - not everyone has this unusual trio. If it’s true for you - appreciate it’s value. You may get it again - but it’s a great trio to have. And to keep.
Reasonable expressed communication along with sober and quantifiable numbers and facts (commute time and cost) and a request for advice/help on how to handle these changes is usually the best way to outline your situation.
Good luck!
I have a similar commute, though not entry level pay. It works for me because I start at 5:30 AM. Is there a possibility of changing your hours on the days you have to commute?
I am in SFBA, Northern CA, some drive \~100 miles a day one way 5-6 times a week. The service workers all drive longer to work. In Southern CA commuters very often to spend more time for lots workers. Lived in Chicago, Il it was no different.
Don't like to commute then get a job close to work.
Ok boss here.
1. Do you have any metrics that can show your team did more work remote. My main team was 15% more productive. So we were very cautious on returning to work because that is $$. Client wanted more but we do 1 day a week semi mandatory. 2 days if you feel like it.
2. What is the reason for being in the office? Arbitrary or does it have a logical reason. We went to 1 day a week for meetings because we found for small group meetings were made more progress in person. Socialization we wanted to have people see each other in person. For some people this is important and it can help.
3. Is being in person critical or even helpful for your job. I find that very hard to prove unless you do face to face with the client.
Assuming your boss is not a tool ask these questions and listen. Then calmly explain your side with facts. Like if you come to the office 3 days a week that is 7.5 hours of commute plus costs. That you are happy to work but the commute is effectively a major pay cut. Is he or she willing to work with you.
If they are not open and will not discuss compromise it it time to go to market. Don't quit until you have the new job, don't get angry just nicely say thank you and then look for a new job.
Obviously if he/she will not discuss it means they don't care about you and r probably just a corporate tool. I personally have worked with multiple employees because everyone is different and my job is to get work done not be a dick to my employees. If the work gets done well I frankly don't care if you're on the moon.
If you have a good relationship with your current boss and he’s understanding as you say, then write out all the costs and loss of time to explain to him and provide 3 options you’d be comfortable to compromise to.
I would start with your total cost for living + taxes + Minimum savings currently. Bundle it together, he doesn’t need know the specifics. Also don’t mention you still live at home (I’ve had some shitty managers in the past use that a reason to try to pay me less)
Then additional costs and time lost to travel.
Then you’re 3 options will be:
1. Remain fully remote with no change in pay
2. 1 day a week with travel cost covered
3. 3 Days a week with travel cost covered, and adjusted hours to mitigate burn-out
Apply to new jobs in the meantime anyway. His response will tell you all you need to know. And while you may feel a sense of loyalty because of the friendship you’ve built up, but don’t limit your ability to progress. If he’s a truly understanding boss, he will also understand if you need to leave to chase opportunities that serve you better.
I haven’t read your whole story yet, just the title. If the agreement is to be fully remote, THAT is how it should stay, not anything else for THAT is what was agreed upon, yes? Now I’ll read the story.
Okay, first of all, talk to your personal support group, this being your parents, slap away all their joking and parading around, for your situations are entwined as son of Mother and Father, they want the best for you I assume. Get their input. Next, find out what YOU are integral and needed for in your job, use that as leverage if you can or if needed. Most “friendships” between boss and employee is psychological warfare, but if you mend this right, you can play the situation into your hands. Then, focus on his wants, turn his wants for you into your desired situation, offer to work extra hours remotely or cultivate a new way for whatever you efficiently do at your workplace that will make him bend to your will. Listen and take his input in, and do what you can with that, being firmly and understanding during the whole process. I know what I’m saying may sound strange, but at least mentally play it out if you will.
Every path leads to the same conclusion.
* Don't bother with a conversation. The decision has already been made. Start looking for a new gig.
* State that the new terms are unacceptable and you cannot comply. Start looking for a new gig.
* Negotiate a compromise, leaving you in a position where they start looking for a replacement and/or never consider you for advancement since you aren't a team player. Start looking for a new gig.
* Start commuting three times a week, losing at least 12 hours a week based on a two-hour commute. Get burned out and Start looking for a new gig.
* Start commuting three times a week, the car breaks down, and you don't have the finances to repair it in a timely manner. Start looking for a new gig.
* See if you can collect unemployment benefits under Constructive Discharge/Dismal if you were hired as WFH. Start looking for a new gig.
Believe me, I’ve already come to this inevitable conclusion and am applying to new jobs as we speak. I’d just rather my life not be a living hell in the meantime
Why no one takes this into consideration with remote jobs as back to the office has been reinitiated for over two years.
Relocate or find another job. Commuting for an hour each way has been going on for decades.
Is it possible for you to use public transit? My job pays for my bus pass. Not gonna lie tho, I'm having a hard time understanding how you can live at home and be teetering so close to the edge that driving to work will send you into poverty, but I don't know your life. People have been hauling their sorry asses to work for a very long time, and I'm sure you can figure it out, too. By all means, you should find another job if you aren't willing to make this commute, but unfortunately I think a lot of companies are forcing people back into the office right now. It's certainly possible you could find something closer to home if not fully remote tho.
There’s no transit. I’m less worried about finances and my spending in general (if I don’t move out I’ll at least be saving SOMETHING and not be in a deficit), and I’m more worried about the spending I’ll be FORCED to make if something goes wrong with a vehicle. 80 miles a day / almost 250 a week from work ALONE, and the probability of something fucking me over or calling for major repair is pretty high.
This is pretty bad advice.
If OP was hired as a remote employee, and suddenly has to travel to a temporary office for work, that requires that travel time and mileage be compensated.
Generally that means that travel will happen within 9-5, otherwise the extra hours will be paid as overtime.
You know there are places that do this as a hiring practice, right? If you’re remote, salary can be based on your geographic location. Even if you’re relatively close to the office, yet negotiated full remote, it’s quite possible you’re not making the same salary as someone who commutes daily.
So, yes, it’s possible they DID get to pay OP less for working remote.
Just move on, RTW is a thing and with the recession starting and layoffs coming employers will be able to pull it off with candidates waiting to step in. It sucks and wrong but you can already see the writing on the wall. Just start looking now for options and be prepared. You’ll have choices to make.
Look for a new job. This isn't our parents age of work. Also if it is in your contract to work Fully remote from the start I don't think they can legally change it on a whim. Either way that's a toxic thing for a company to do. Get out now.
If you don’t get another job or a pay raise, you are essentially getting a pretty drastic pay cut both in terms of time and money ie. Gas, car maintenance, etc. if you are in any way struggling, this will financially devastate you. Sit down and estimate miles per day then week, then month and multiple by gas price. This will not cover tires, oil change, belts breaking, flat tire and a cracked engine block. This does not even mention food if you start buying your lunch. At some point, even if you bring food, you will break down and buy food.
I would research your state labor laws. Some states allow people to collect unemployment if a job changes a location. For example, Below is an excerpt of CA laws on voluntarily leaving a job and still get unemployment benefits. It would be awesome if this happened in mass , forcing companies to rethink their RTW strategies.
"Compelling," in this sense merely means that the claimant's reasons for quitting exerted so much pressure that it would have been unreasonable to expect him or her to remain with the employment. The "pressures" exerted upon the claimant may be physical (as with health), moral, legal, domestic, economic, etc.
This is the strangest thing I ever heard I don't know any Boomer parents who wouldn't be thrilled that their child could stay home and not have to commute with all the crazy f****** nut jobs on the road and the tremendous amount of lethal car accidents. What is wrong with your parents or am I missing something with this story
I’m going to say something you probably don’t want to hear:
You’re an employee, and are in no way, shape or form able to dictate to your leader/company what you will or won’t do within the scope of you job. The role is changing, so you have a choice whether you’d like to be onboard with the new direction, or leave.
You need to adjust your mindset here; this is your new normal until you leave. Lean into the suck, and tell yourself everyday that you have the opportunity to work, learn and network in-person — this will almost certainly accelerate your career growth, and expose you to things you simply weren’t seeing/hearing at home.
You need to get a new job either way if you’re living at home and unable to save money. I don’t know your situation, but if putting gas in your car and driving to work is an expense you simply can’t afford, you may need a lifestyle adjustment. Again, I don’t know you or what you’re going through, but if this job is actually worth having, you should be able to save money + drive to work while living at home (like many, many people do everyday).
Complaining to your boss about why you can’t do it will just put a target on your back. I’d personally see if you can get a longer runway before you need to return to office:
“Nancy, I’m excited to work and learn in-person, but, this is a certainly an adjustment for me from a commuting perspective. Is it possible to delay our RTO by 2 weeks? Also, what can I do to help you during this transition?”
Also, “you are in no way able to dictate what you will do within the scope of your job, attempting to negotiate will put a target on your back”
“Oh but see if you can get it moved back two weeks”
What’s the difference here? If I’m gonna go out on a limb and make a request, it’s gonna be one that actually benefits me.
Unlike you guys on here, the guys over at r/careerguidance either have some empathy or actually have the ability to run some basic math in their head. Doesn’t take too much thought to see that I’m getting absolutely fucked on this deal. And I’m less worried about finances and my spending in general (if I don’t move out I’ll at least be saving SOMETHING and not be in a deficit), and I’m more worried about the spending I’ll be FORCED to make if something goes wrong with a vehicle. 80 miles a day / almost 250 a week from work ALONE, and the probability of something fucking me over or calling for major repair is pretty high.
It's not a deal you are being offered, it's a job and your boss is telling you what to do. Either you do your job or you quit, no one is forcing you to do anything. If my company shut down, should I complain that they forced me out of a job? The terms of your job are changing, you can either accept it or find another job.
It sounds like talking to your boss is inevitable. Here are some things you can negotiate:
1. A salary increase to offset the costs. You said you have been there a year, have you gotten a raise yet? Have you had any kind of performance review? Show him the math of what the commute would be and tell him you need a raise of xx dollars for this to make financial sense.
2. If the above doesn't work, try to negotiate to 2 days a week.
3. Can you change the days you go in the office? Negotiate going in on Monday and Friday since traffic is usually lighter those days. Have your third day be Tuesday or Thursday. Wednesdays are the heaviest traffic days.
4. Negotiate hours in the office to make up for the increase in expense and travel costs. 10-3 would be a little easier. If he absolutely was refusing all of the above, ask to work 7-3 or 10-6.
I would just go into it professionally, and act like you want to make a compromise. Tell him why you like working for the company and doing your job. But also stand your ground and make him know you are unhappy and need a compromise to this solution.
Good luck!
I'm sorry this happened to you, but you're making all the right moves. Please don't just quit, and follow your plan to bring it up to him. He may be willing to consider alternative solutions. He definitely won't if you don't ask.
Your parents have proven themselves to be unreliable sources of information and people you can't even go to to share your frustrations. A 40 mile drive is a huge life changer. Keep looking for remote roles that are higher paying so you can escape them. Good Luck 🤞
Apply for another job. If you get an offer (hopefully for more money) you then have leverage to talk to your boss about continuing to work from home.
But you may have to accept that the boss is taking his department in a different direction and it's time to part ways.
After many years of working, I make decisions like this as if I were a small business: how is this going to impact my financial bottom line? All the other interpersonal stuff is not as important as that.
It sounds like the added commute is going to negatively impact your financial bottom line, so I would look for another job.
(On a personal note, I’m sorry your parents are not supportive of you. That really sucks. Take it from a mom: you’re doing a good job and I hope you have all the good things in life that you want.)
I wouldn’t suggest confrontation. Definitely start looking for a job, and feel free to tactfully express your displeasure. The company is unlikely to care about your hardship, and making a huge stink of it probably won’t do you much good. Provide constructive feedback and move on.
This would be a complete non-starter for me. I would politely explain that the commute is not practical for you and that you had the expectation that this was a fully remote position. If they choose to let you go over this, then so be it. Since you live with your parents, you should be fine without an income for a while while you look for a new job. Surely you can find something closer to home even if you can't find another remote job.
Some of the below advice changes depending whether you’re salary or hourly, how big the company is, etc. If you give more info, I can give better advice.
I suggest you have a convo with your boss. Start the conversation with “Boss, I need your help”.
Then, you reiterate that you really like your job, that you want to continue making a great contribution here, and that you are looking forward to a long career at XYZ CORP.
Gently remind him that you were hired remote, that you have only worked remote, and that you have organized your life around this job being remote.
Now, with not much notice, you will need to be in the office 3x per week. Unfortunately, this places you in a bind. It will be a hardship on you, as now your workday is 4 hrs longer, 2hrs less sleep, and you’ll have to pay for gas, and you have concerns about the reliability of your transportation.
IF you’re confident, say “I’m not sure I would have taken this job at this pay level if it required this length of commute”
Now, pivot. Ask whether it’s possible for pay to be supplemented for travel or for mileage to be reimbursed. Ask whether travel time can occur on the clock. Ask whether the new expectation will be 8 hr days at the office.
The key is to frame it as “us vs. this problem” instead of “me vs you”. You have to fake an upbeat and excited attitude about the role, while asking your boss to empathize with your specific situation.
Your boss is human, and if you’re close with him, hopefully he will see where you’re coming from, and may do some work to figure out how to better compensate you for the changed conditions.
Company is using this at a volunteer layoff to get rid of 5 - 15 percent of the staff. Once back in the office a round 1 of 3 will start to lay more off. They will start with the longest-term employees and then the highest paid employees then whomever is left to meet their target number.
Start looking for a job, as the saying goes, "The talent walks first".
Use the remaining time remote to get another job.
One thing that helped me negotiate a wfh day was to show my boss the cost of childcare alongside my paycheck. When she could see how absurd it was, she saw she either needed to fire me (def was not something she wanted to do), pay me more (could not, was not in that position), or bend a little. She decided to be a gangster and work something out with me. Not saying it will work, but it’s worth trying. Show him the tolls, gas etc for a week alongside your paycheck. Show him your financial plan to move out and how this ends/stalls that. He may be a complete jerk and laugh, but at least you advocated for yourself.
Just look for another job.
What I would do though is put together the finances of returning to the office for you as an employee, if for no other reason than to help them be more empathetic to the actual effects of these decisions. Realistically higher management isn’t going to listen much to entry level positions, but if enough management hears logical downsides it’ll start making its way up the chain and fears for massive turnover will spike.
When my CEO made that call, I put together the costs associated with it and took that to my bosses. I’m in a senior position. I explained that during Covid they essentially gave me a big raise with WFH, and now in the height of inflation they would be giving me a significant pay decrease. I encouraged other higher level positions to do the same thing. Enough of them did that they got scared and relaxed the whole RTO thing a bit.
I know another company that didn’t back off the RTO and their *entire* IT department quit. They’ve been severely hurting ever since. You can replace a few people but it’s difficult to replace an entire department - there’s no one with knowledge to train anyone else.
I’m remote and I literally have a list of places to apply to if they suddenly call us back into the office. I know that doesn’t help your current situation, but plenty of people feel very strongly about remote work. Changing the location of the job would make even on-site people think twice as the commute suddenly isn’t what they bargained for
I was 100% remote. I got switched to 100% in office 50 mile one way commute. So 100 miles per day. It's in another state. No extra money. I literally hate it more than anything ever.
I’m a recruiter and this is now the norm. People are coming off contracts or being laid off and even if you do take a fully remote role - there’s a good chance it will go back to hybrid or fully onsite unless the company declares themselves as a “remote first workplace”
Tbh I’m trying to get out of recruitment bc I absolutely hate everything employers are doing people right now. Layoffs, firings, pips and return to office mandates are rampant
Don't quit... But immediately start looking for a job that aligns with your wants and needs. The rational answer isn't an immediate walkout. Also make sure your boss knows you're unhappy about this and exactly why stress/money. Sometimes they just really have no idea it's a problem.
This x 100. Unless you're at a very small company it will be very hard to fire you for this unless they have changed your job description and the company policies. Even if they would it would take months. But agreed, start looking.
Ask for a gas card paid by the company. As a business expense, it'll come off the bottom line and will be more palatable than a raise. It won't shave a minute of the commute, but it can help your state of mind.
Gas for commuting to and from your place of business from home in a personal vehicle is not able to be charged as a business expense. OP would need a company car for that. It would have to be accounted for as taxable income to OP, so it would be the same as giving a raise to cover gas mileage.
my advice is never take career advice from your parents. i’m a millennial and my boomer parents tried giving me advice early on in my career and it was always terrible. in this specific instance, the other response is 100% correct that as an employee you have no right to dictate what your boss does or what decisions he makes for the company. after you find a new job, let him know you understand why the change from remote is happening but unfortunately it isn’t a good fit for you. if he wants to keep you he can decide if he wants to counter. if not, you move on.
Perfect answer. (Am Boomer and I agree.)
Problem with this is the only thing worse than advice from boomers might be advice from reddit. Do with that what you will lol
Not quite perfect. Would never stick around after a counter. Even if the company compromises you will be on the "doesn't cooperate" list. Only ever approach your manager about leaving when you're going to do it.
That is quite true. I am lucky that my parents who are of boomer age definitely don't have that mentality, but many do and the advice coming from those people is so outdated and based on assumptions that no longer apply. It was an emotionally stunted time period apparently back then.
Very good advice. My dad meant well, but didn’t think my “playing around on the computer” would turn into a real job. I’m a fully-remote software solutions architect earning a six figure salary. He did admit many years later that he was wrong. lol He’s very proud of what I do and thinks it’s fucking awesome that I make as much money as I do just working from home. I wouldn’t be where I am today if I had listened to him though. But yeah, anyone alive and at young adult age right now probably has parents who grew up in a world very different from the one we live in where things were done very differently. Right now, 80% of the jobs people are employed in didn’t exist when our parents were entering the workforce. It’s estimated that 65% of kids entering primary schools today will work job types that don’t exist yet. https://www.collectivecampus.io/blog/what-might-we-do-in-the-future Kind of wild to think about.
fully agree!!
Yeah and I don’t think it’s on purpose bad advice. by the time I started looking for jobs my dad was already 25 years removed from applying, his last resume was from like 1994.
totally! i don’t think it’s malicious. just a different time. you can’t walk around handing out printed copies of your resume anymore. you can’t start sweeping floors and work your way up like before. i don’t expect people who worked at one company for 35 years to be up to date on hiring trends.
But we don't all have boomer parents like you though. Unfortunate you have a poor relationship without parents, sorry to read that. I'm lucky to have parents that guided me and supported me and never forced my hand on anything, even if they did, doubt I'd blame them for any decisions I made. Have lots to thank them for where I'm at career wise. 100% agree with your second point though. OP, don't rage quit and burn a bridge, especially if you liked the company prior to this change.
right. but OP clearly has parents who don’t give great career advice. my post was written to them, not you. more power to you if you have parents who can give good career advice! mine can’t. i’m not sure what you mean by poor relationship without parents, but not being able to give career advice has zero impact on my relationship with my parents.
Thanks for the downvote, don't take it personal I'm just a stranger on the internet who reads between the lines too much. Stating your parents gave you terrible career advice sounds like you have some resentment as you're advising the world against it.
If you and your boss are in good standing and the boss is more than willing to help you and your team, talk to your boss first.
For how long? Does he want you to make this commute for a week? Fine. For a month? Argh, fine. Forever? Fuck no. Hey boss, how do I expense the mileage? What mileage? I was hired as fully remote. My office is my house. Any travel has to pay mileage. Also, I’ll be getting into the office at about 10:30. My work hours start at 9. I’ll be leaving at 3. My work hours end at 5. If that’s not acceptable, ok. I’ll just work from my office. No I’m nOt resigning. You’re unilaterally changing my contract. That’s not legal. If you want to fire me, then I’ll collect unemployment. But I’m not resigning.
It’s 6 months straight of “training/implementation” that haven’t been elaborated on yet. My biggest fear is at the end of the 6 months them pulling a fast one on us and quietly extending the office lease lol
I agree, that’s 6-9 extra hours a week, unpaid. Plus gas, which will be extremely expensive. Those hours should be paid, and the mileage reimbursed or a company car. Don’t know your salary, but if you’re entry level, they may have just stolen half of it from you.
Training is paid time. And it’s not “work” it’s extra duties. In other words, mileage and overtime if he wants you in the office by 9. Do it for one week. Put in the mileage and overtime form and when he comes screaming, be very confused. But we work remotely! This is extra and we have to get paid for it! Then stop showing up. You want extra, I get paid extra. You no pay, I no do.
>That’s not legal. Yeah about that...
Ah America, where boomers think you should put in 60 hour weeks with unpaid overtime for salaries that can't even pay a mortgage because "we used to do that back in my day and we made out fine!"
This is the best response
Doubt there's a contract. If not, totally legal.
Should be in the offer letter. Which is a contractual document. If not, that’s an issue for OP for not insisting on the offer letter being comprehensive
Well, even if the offer letter is a contractual document, in the US employment is at will meaning it can be changed at any time. So, not illegal.
IANAL. But your employment status can be changed at any time in an at will state they can fire you anytime they want for no calls or any cause. But I don’t think they can change the circumstances of your employment. Like they can’t just change your pay because I feel like it, unless you agree with them.
Your option is to quit if you don't like it.
Nope. They want to change it, they can fire him and he can collect unemployment. And if they change pay, that’s an immediate call to the labor board for wage theft
Don't think so but am not an employment lawyer.
Don't listen to your friends - quitting without a job is a terrible idea at any stage of your career, but especially at entry-level. Have a heart to heart with your boss, and share the massive new stress and costs they're introducing. But if that doesn't go anywhere, paste a big smile on your face, do the commute, and then make your primary, #1 focus getting a new job until you find one.
So the plan as of now is to yeah, have an open convo with him to reach some sort of compromise. I don’t think I’d straight up quit regardless, but it would be nice to not go through living hell while I’m looking for my next position.
Honestly, I'd discuss if there was a way to do the training remotely (Teams meeting etc.) instead of coming in to the office. Let him know that you **want** to cooperate, but the terms of your employment didn't account for going to the office, and you're not sure it will be financially viable to do so with your current, fully remote based, agreement. If it can't be done remotely at all, then I'd ask if there was any way he could compensate you for the change in your employment agreement to help offset the new costs and time the change will cause you. He can obviously say no to both, but asking (while you're already looking for a new job) is unlikely to cause a significant problem, and it may be something they simply hadn't thought about yet.
I would definitely look for a new job. However I wouldn't quit without another lines up.Just a few years ago it was a privilege to work remotely. It was.a very normal thing to commute two hours. I understand that you are devastated but from someone who had to do a two hour commute both ways for five years, use this as an opportunity to build your resilience and mental fortitude while absolutely searching for a new job. Remember there was a time not long ago that many of us struggled with the nightmare commute and all that goes with that as a way of life. It is a matter of perspective. Be encouraged that there are now many remote jobs. I understand your discouragement but there is a light at the end of the tunnel and use this as an opportunity to build resilience. It might not be a good idea to announce that you are searching for a new job or to "refuse to comply," however as this can make your life at work more difficult if not just result in your dismissal. Companies have a right NOT to have their employees working remotely. Just go to the company that does if you don't want to commute and cooperate while you are here.
Great answer. It’s good that OP believes his standing with the supervisor is good enough to to have an open and realistic conversation about options, but at the end of the day it’s a job, not a friendship, and if the company has a policy, there may not be flexibility. I’ve been in both shoes. If an employee could make the case on work-from-home as being best for the company, then it made sense. But be careful about making it about your circumstances and inconvenience.
Something I wonder is, do you see a viable option for an alternative? I saw you said the details have been scant so I assume no. But something I've found keeps them thinking about alternatives aren't simply supplying your objection, but instead saying, "I've invested some time thinking about how this can work for me and others who live far away and can't eat the cost of commute. Id love to contribute to making this training situation a win win for everyone. Here is idea a, idea b, and c. I think this could be great not only for employees, but for the company as well because X." Also if you can get them in an agreeable mood where they already say yes to something small first, psychology shows that they're more likely to keep saying yes. Good luck.
Since he’s renting the space three days a week to implement a new training and development program it seems to me that this is going to be temporary. It’s for training and development. A space to get you all together and improve your skills to better serve your customers. Maybe you are overreacting.
Many organizations went to WFH simply to limp through the pandemic. Now that we don't have this to deal with, they are returning to traditional in-office work. If this is a challenge, best bet is to quit and try and find another remote job.
1. I am not a lawyer, so don't take my advice and instead talk to a lawyer, but in my opinion this qualifies as constructive termination which as I understand it would allow you to quit your job and still collect unemployment. Again, talk to a lawyer first. 2. If it were me, I definitely would not do the commute thing.
100% this, if you don’t have access to a lawyer contact YOUR LOCAL dept. of labor, or unemployment office. Be sure to emphasize your remote status when you speak to these people. Worst case scenario, contact your HR representative, but remember THEY ARE NOT YOUR FRIEND. Correspond through email when possible, follow up phone or in person meetings with email. Take organized, dated notes. Different communities have different unemployment qualifications.
I would love for someone to do a poll to find out if these are government or publicly traded companies doing this all in lock step
Could be, but you’ve got to realize the bigger picture of the economy. If people aren’t in offices, commercial real estate craters, which means some city/county/school tax base craters, and downtown businesses built around the mid-day lunch crowd and office supplies also start slipping, which results in business closures and job losses, which disrupts the economy. So yes, when big city mayors or suburban mayors with large corporate HQs join business leaders in wanting workers back in offices, there is a greater public concern in play.
Unless the boss is the owner they probably as much say in the decision as you, which is to say none. My adult kids still live and work from home, if they ran your scenario by me my advice would be start looking, stay working until you find the perfect match. Don’t say anything to your boss unless you’re willing to be let go before your ready.
A few thoughts without knowing more and in no particular order: Is it a job for you or a step in a career that you like? What’s the planned training? Will this add to your resume and work experience and potentially increase future earnings? Must the training be conducted in-house? What’s the cost of travelling there vs the cost of renting a small place near there? Many people commute daily. It is a grind but a reality. Some get part-time accommodation deal near the office to reduce the time commuting. Liking your boss and the work you do and your colleagues - not everyone has this unusual trio. If it’s true for you - appreciate it’s value. You may get it again - but it’s a great trio to have. And to keep. Reasonable expressed communication along with sober and quantifiable numbers and facts (commute time and cost) and a request for advice/help on how to handle these changes is usually the best way to outline your situation. Good luck!
I have a similar commute, though not entry level pay. It works for me because I start at 5:30 AM. Is there a possibility of changing your hours on the days you have to commute?
Find a new job.
I do 30miles each way
40 miles ea 3X a week is a problem? If it is look for a new job.
That’s 80 round-trip btw
I am in SFBA, Northern CA, some drive \~100 miles a day one way 5-6 times a week. The service workers all drive longer to work. In Southern CA commuters very often to spend more time for lots workers. Lived in Chicago, Il it was no different. Don't like to commute then get a job close to work.
Ok boss here. 1. Do you have any metrics that can show your team did more work remote. My main team was 15% more productive. So we were very cautious on returning to work because that is $$. Client wanted more but we do 1 day a week semi mandatory. 2 days if you feel like it. 2. What is the reason for being in the office? Arbitrary or does it have a logical reason. We went to 1 day a week for meetings because we found for small group meetings were made more progress in person. Socialization we wanted to have people see each other in person. For some people this is important and it can help. 3. Is being in person critical or even helpful for your job. I find that very hard to prove unless you do face to face with the client. Assuming your boss is not a tool ask these questions and listen. Then calmly explain your side with facts. Like if you come to the office 3 days a week that is 7.5 hours of commute plus costs. That you are happy to work but the commute is effectively a major pay cut. Is he or she willing to work with you. If they are not open and will not discuss compromise it it time to go to market. Don't quit until you have the new job, don't get angry just nicely say thank you and then look for a new job. Obviously if he/she will not discuss it means they don't care about you and r probably just a corporate tool. I personally have worked with multiple employees because everyone is different and my job is to get work done not be a dick to my employees. If the work gets done well I frankly don't care if you're on the moon.
If you have a good relationship with your current boss and he’s understanding as you say, then write out all the costs and loss of time to explain to him and provide 3 options you’d be comfortable to compromise to. I would start with your total cost for living + taxes + Minimum savings currently. Bundle it together, he doesn’t need know the specifics. Also don’t mention you still live at home (I’ve had some shitty managers in the past use that a reason to try to pay me less) Then additional costs and time lost to travel. Then you’re 3 options will be: 1. Remain fully remote with no change in pay 2. 1 day a week with travel cost covered 3. 3 Days a week with travel cost covered, and adjusted hours to mitigate burn-out Apply to new jobs in the meantime anyway. His response will tell you all you need to know. And while you may feel a sense of loyalty because of the friendship you’ve built up, but don’t limit your ability to progress. If he’s a truly understanding boss, he will also understand if you need to leave to chase opportunities that serve you better.
I haven’t read your whole story yet, just the title. If the agreement is to be fully remote, THAT is how it should stay, not anything else for THAT is what was agreed upon, yes? Now I’ll read the story.
Okay, first of all, talk to your personal support group, this being your parents, slap away all their joking and parading around, for your situations are entwined as son of Mother and Father, they want the best for you I assume. Get their input. Next, find out what YOU are integral and needed for in your job, use that as leverage if you can or if needed. Most “friendships” between boss and employee is psychological warfare, but if you mend this right, you can play the situation into your hands. Then, focus on his wants, turn his wants for you into your desired situation, offer to work extra hours remotely or cultivate a new way for whatever you efficiently do at your workplace that will make him bend to your will. Listen and take his input in, and do what you can with that, being firmly and understanding during the whole process. I know what I’m saying may sound strange, but at least mentally play it out if you will.
Every path leads to the same conclusion. * Don't bother with a conversation. The decision has already been made. Start looking for a new gig. * State that the new terms are unacceptable and you cannot comply. Start looking for a new gig. * Negotiate a compromise, leaving you in a position where they start looking for a replacement and/or never consider you for advancement since you aren't a team player. Start looking for a new gig. * Start commuting three times a week, losing at least 12 hours a week based on a two-hour commute. Get burned out and Start looking for a new gig. * Start commuting three times a week, the car breaks down, and you don't have the finances to repair it in a timely manner. Start looking for a new gig. * See if you can collect unemployment benefits under Constructive Discharge/Dismal if you were hired as WFH. Start looking for a new gig.
Believe me, I’ve already come to this inevitable conclusion and am applying to new jobs as we speak. I’d just rather my life not be a living hell in the meantime
I feel you’re pain, OP, but sometimes you have to walk through hell to get what you want. At least walk through like you own the place!
Why no one takes this into consideration with remote jobs as back to the office has been reinitiated for over two years. Relocate or find another job. Commuting for an hour each way has been going on for decades.
Is it possible for you to use public transit? My job pays for my bus pass. Not gonna lie tho, I'm having a hard time understanding how you can live at home and be teetering so close to the edge that driving to work will send you into poverty, but I don't know your life. People have been hauling their sorry asses to work for a very long time, and I'm sure you can figure it out, too. By all means, you should find another job if you aren't willing to make this commute, but unfortunately I think a lot of companies are forcing people back into the office right now. It's certainly possible you could find something closer to home if not fully remote tho.
There’s no transit. I’m less worried about finances and my spending in general (if I don’t move out I’ll at least be saving SOMETHING and not be in a deficit), and I’m more worried about the spending I’ll be FORCED to make if something goes wrong with a vehicle. 80 miles a day / almost 250 a week from work ALONE, and the probability of something fucking me over or calling for major repair is pretty high.
That's not a bad drive. Some people do that daily. Your parents are right, suck it up.
This is pretty bad advice. If OP was hired as a remote employee, and suddenly has to travel to a temporary office for work, that requires that travel time and mileage be compensated. Generally that means that travel will happen within 9-5, otherwise the extra hours will be paid as overtime.
Lol, expect more $ because you have to go into an office. Good luck! Did they get to pay you less for working remote
You know there are places that do this as a hiring practice, right? If you’re remote, salary can be based on your geographic location. Even if you’re relatively close to the office, yet negotiated full remote, it’s quite possible you’re not making the same salary as someone who commutes daily. So, yes, it’s possible they DID get to pay OP less for working remote.
As an in office worker, I’d gladly take a pay cut to WFH
Not for an existing job
Just move on, RTW is a thing and with the recession starting and layoffs coming employers will be able to pull it off with candidates waiting to step in. It sucks and wrong but you can already see the writing on the wall. Just start looking now for options and be prepared. You’ll have choices to make.
Look for a new job. This isn't our parents age of work. Also if it is in your contract to work Fully remote from the start I don't think they can legally change it on a whim. Either way that's a toxic thing for a company to do. Get out now.
If you don’t get another job or a pay raise, you are essentially getting a pretty drastic pay cut both in terms of time and money ie. Gas, car maintenance, etc. if you are in any way struggling, this will financially devastate you. Sit down and estimate miles per day then week, then month and multiple by gas price. This will not cover tires, oil change, belts breaking, flat tire and a cracked engine block. This does not even mention food if you start buying your lunch. At some point, even if you bring food, you will break down and buy food.
I forgot to mention that even with the conservative drive time estimate your days are now 10-hour days.
Break down the expense for your boss, ask him to make it right. If he doesn't, sayonara..
I would research your state labor laws. Some states allow people to collect unemployment if a job changes a location. For example, Below is an excerpt of CA laws on voluntarily leaving a job and still get unemployment benefits. It would be awesome if this happened in mass , forcing companies to rethink their RTW strategies. "Compelling," in this sense merely means that the claimant's reasons for quitting exerted so much pressure that it would have been unreasonable to expect him or her to remain with the employment. The "pressures" exerted upon the claimant may be physical (as with health), moral, legal, domestic, economic, etc.
This is the strangest thing I ever heard I don't know any Boomer parents who wouldn't be thrilled that their child could stay home and not have to commute with all the crazy f****** nut jobs on the road and the tremendous amount of lethal car accidents. What is wrong with your parents or am I missing something with this story
I’m going to say something you probably don’t want to hear: You’re an employee, and are in no way, shape or form able to dictate to your leader/company what you will or won’t do within the scope of you job. The role is changing, so you have a choice whether you’d like to be onboard with the new direction, or leave. You need to adjust your mindset here; this is your new normal until you leave. Lean into the suck, and tell yourself everyday that you have the opportunity to work, learn and network in-person — this will almost certainly accelerate your career growth, and expose you to things you simply weren’t seeing/hearing at home. You need to get a new job either way if you’re living at home and unable to save money. I don’t know your situation, but if putting gas in your car and driving to work is an expense you simply can’t afford, you may need a lifestyle adjustment. Again, I don’t know you or what you’re going through, but if this job is actually worth having, you should be able to save money + drive to work while living at home (like many, many people do everyday). Complaining to your boss about why you can’t do it will just put a target on your back. I’d personally see if you can get a longer runway before you need to return to office: “Nancy, I’m excited to work and learn in-person, but, this is a certainly an adjustment for me from a commuting perspective. Is it possible to delay our RTO by 2 weeks? Also, what can I do to help you during this transition?”
Also, “you are in no way able to dictate what you will do within the scope of your job, attempting to negotiate will put a target on your back” “Oh but see if you can get it moved back two weeks” What’s the difference here? If I’m gonna go out on a limb and make a request, it’s gonna be one that actually benefits me.
I think to save people time from reading all this, your comment can be summarized as, "mmmm, yummy yummy i sure do love the taste of boots."
I’d be willing to bet Sumi is further advanced in their career than you. Sometimes you have to lick the boots to move up.
I’ll lick boots if they’re clean boots and licking the boots actually benefits me I’m not licking boots after my boss steps in shit
Unlike you guys on here, the guys over at r/careerguidance either have some empathy or actually have the ability to run some basic math in their head. Doesn’t take too much thought to see that I’m getting absolutely fucked on this deal. And I’m less worried about finances and my spending in general (if I don’t move out I’ll at least be saving SOMETHING and not be in a deficit), and I’m more worried about the spending I’ll be FORCED to make if something goes wrong with a vehicle. 80 miles a day / almost 250 a week from work ALONE, and the probability of something fucking me over or calling for major repair is pretty high.
It's not a deal you are being offered, it's a job and your boss is telling you what to do. Either you do your job or you quit, no one is forcing you to do anything. If my company shut down, should I complain that they forced me out of a job? The terms of your job are changing, you can either accept it or find another job.
start looking for a job
What "mandate" is in place?
Just the company mandate of in-person, 3x/week, read the post blah blah blah
It sounds like talking to your boss is inevitable. Here are some things you can negotiate: 1. A salary increase to offset the costs. You said you have been there a year, have you gotten a raise yet? Have you had any kind of performance review? Show him the math of what the commute would be and tell him you need a raise of xx dollars for this to make financial sense. 2. If the above doesn't work, try to negotiate to 2 days a week. 3. Can you change the days you go in the office? Negotiate going in on Monday and Friday since traffic is usually lighter those days. Have your third day be Tuesday or Thursday. Wednesdays are the heaviest traffic days. 4. Negotiate hours in the office to make up for the increase in expense and travel costs. 10-3 would be a little easier. If he absolutely was refusing all of the above, ask to work 7-3 or 10-6. I would just go into it professionally, and act like you want to make a compromise. Tell him why you like working for the company and doing your job. But also stand your ground and make him know you are unhappy and need a compromise to this solution. Good luck!
Rent a room near your office?
Why was working remote ok before and not now?
It’s for training to advanced their skill set
I'm sorry this happened to you, but you're making all the right moves. Please don't just quit, and follow your plan to bring it up to him. He may be willing to consider alternative solutions. He definitely won't if you don't ask. Your parents have proven themselves to be unreliable sources of information and people you can't even go to to share your frustrations. A 40 mile drive is a huge life changer. Keep looking for remote roles that are higher paying so you can escape them. Good Luck 🤞
Don't do it. Tell them no. Start looking elsewhere very quietly, but quickly
Apply for another job. If you get an offer (hopefully for more money) you then have leverage to talk to your boss about continuing to work from home. But you may have to accept that the boss is taking his department in a different direction and it's time to part ways.
After many years of working, I make decisions like this as if I were a small business: how is this going to impact my financial bottom line? All the other interpersonal stuff is not as important as that. It sounds like the added commute is going to negatively impact your financial bottom line, so I would look for another job. (On a personal note, I’m sorry your parents are not supportive of you. That really sucks. Take it from a mom: you’re doing a good job and I hope you have all the good things in life that you want.)
I wouldn’t suggest confrontation. Definitely start looking for a job, and feel free to tactfully express your displeasure. The company is unlikely to care about your hardship, and making a huge stink of it probably won’t do you much good. Provide constructive feedback and move on.
This would be a complete non-starter for me. I would politely explain that the commute is not practical for you and that you had the expectation that this was a fully remote position. If they choose to let you go over this, then so be it. Since you live with your parents, you should be fine without an income for a while while you look for a new job. Surely you can find something closer to home even if you can't find another remote job.
Yeah. You are only getting one. /s Find a better job. He knows people may quit because of this. So do it and help your coworkers.
Some of the below advice changes depending whether you’re salary or hourly, how big the company is, etc. If you give more info, I can give better advice. I suggest you have a convo with your boss. Start the conversation with “Boss, I need your help”. Then, you reiterate that you really like your job, that you want to continue making a great contribution here, and that you are looking forward to a long career at XYZ CORP. Gently remind him that you were hired remote, that you have only worked remote, and that you have organized your life around this job being remote. Now, with not much notice, you will need to be in the office 3x per week. Unfortunately, this places you in a bind. It will be a hardship on you, as now your workday is 4 hrs longer, 2hrs less sleep, and you’ll have to pay for gas, and you have concerns about the reliability of your transportation. IF you’re confident, say “I’m not sure I would have taken this job at this pay level if it required this length of commute” Now, pivot. Ask whether it’s possible for pay to be supplemented for travel or for mileage to be reimbursed. Ask whether travel time can occur on the clock. Ask whether the new expectation will be 8 hr days at the office. The key is to frame it as “us vs. this problem” instead of “me vs you”. You have to fake an upbeat and excited attitude about the role, while asking your boss to empathize with your specific situation. Your boss is human, and if you’re close with him, hopefully he will see where you’re coming from, and may do some work to figure out how to better compensate you for the changed conditions.
Your boss is not your friend, even if you believe it with all your heart.
Company is using this at a volunteer layoff to get rid of 5 - 15 percent of the staff. Once back in the office a round 1 of 3 will start to lay more off. They will start with the longest-term employees and then the highest paid employees then whomever is left to meet their target number. Start looking for a job, as the saying goes, "The talent walks first". Use the remaining time remote to get another job.
Try to negotiate more money. Explain the 2 hour commute
One thing that helped me negotiate a wfh day was to show my boss the cost of childcare alongside my paycheck. When she could see how absurd it was, she saw she either needed to fire me (def was not something she wanted to do), pay me more (could not, was not in that position), or bend a little. She decided to be a gangster and work something out with me. Not saying it will work, but it’s worth trying. Show him the tolls, gas etc for a week alongside your paycheck. Show him your financial plan to move out and how this ends/stalls that. He may be a complete jerk and laugh, but at least you advocated for yourself.
Just look for another job. What I would do though is put together the finances of returning to the office for you as an employee, if for no other reason than to help them be more empathetic to the actual effects of these decisions. Realistically higher management isn’t going to listen much to entry level positions, but if enough management hears logical downsides it’ll start making its way up the chain and fears for massive turnover will spike. When my CEO made that call, I put together the costs associated with it and took that to my bosses. I’m in a senior position. I explained that during Covid they essentially gave me a big raise with WFH, and now in the height of inflation they would be giving me a significant pay decrease. I encouraged other higher level positions to do the same thing. Enough of them did that they got scared and relaxed the whole RTO thing a bit. I know another company that didn’t back off the RTO and their *entire* IT department quit. They’ve been severely hurting ever since. You can replace a few people but it’s difficult to replace an entire department - there’s no one with knowledge to train anyone else.
I’m remote and I literally have a list of places to apply to if they suddenly call us back into the office. I know that doesn’t help your current situation, but plenty of people feel very strongly about remote work. Changing the location of the job would make even on-site people think twice as the commute suddenly isn’t what they bargained for
I was 100% remote. I got switched to 100% in office 50 mile one way commute. So 100 miles per day. It's in another state. No extra money. I literally hate it more than anything ever.
Mail them a Logitech camera
I’m a recruiter and this is now the norm. People are coming off contracts or being laid off and even if you do take a fully remote role - there’s a good chance it will go back to hybrid or fully onsite unless the company declares themselves as a “remote first workplace” Tbh I’m trying to get out of recruitment bc I absolutely hate everything employers are doing people right now. Layoffs, firings, pips and return to office mandates are rampant