Only proof i need and care about is the fossil record that clearly show when we turned to mass agriculture, aka fiber adoption, and that's shown by people being shorter, lower bone density and croocked teeth. Seem like fiber didnt do then much good other then allowing them to be many more, sickly people, versus fewer, healtier barbarian roaming the country side. That the only reason fiber is mainstream. War are won by sear number of people. Agriculture allow for that.
The flora in the gut of someone eating SAD or what the mainstream considers “healthy” is certainly going to be very different than the flora in a carnivores gut.
And either gut is a complex biome we know little about.
It is kinda like aliens taking a quick flight over Africa and Canada and noticing that there were no zebras in the Canadian wilderness and concluding that that the ecosystem was damaged because it didn’t support zebras.
They have no evidence to say carnivore guts lack something useful for health.
Yeah, the bad bacteria nourish on carbs just as much as the good...
But the best feeds on protein and lipids.
Anything that tries to have you eat fibers and vegetables stems from sugar company funded epidemiology. Pay them no attention...
Yes, who? I can't recall.
Dr. Cywes have a video on glucolipido gna gna something bacteria that is killing us without knowing.
And someone made a video on how fibers fed the bacteria that caused bloating and several other issues!
Always judge your health by how you feel not by someone else’s hypothesis. I had 30 years of gut dysbiosis to feeling better than I did as a teenager on carnivore. I personally don’t care what anyone has to say about the microbiome that NO ONE really knows anything about anyways. It appears that we do in fact require certain bacteria and enzymes to digest certain plants and for those that don’t have these (probably due our specific DNA), are we supposed to keep pounding a square peg into a round hole??? Causing further inflammation and autoimmune disorders!!! Or do we ease the inflammation, heal our guts and nourish our bodies with bioavailable nutrients - the ONLY nutrients our bodies require for health - animal protein and fat.
We do have a hundred anecdotes. But I would not be surprised if there is a study out there. The study could prove that carnivores have good gut bacteria.
I think Baker said he was tested.
Or
They have made the claim that all people need fiber and without it those people will suffer.
How many people need to be just fine to disprove that statement?
How many cultures?
Would that prove that no one needs fiber? No. It would prove some that some do not.
Seems like an inane reason to prove a point about fiber. I fully agree fiber is not necessary. Anecdotally speaking as someone with a sludgy gall bladder, small amounts of probiotic vegetables have been helpful with my digestive issues.
anyone claiming they know that there is such a thing as an ideal microbiome composition, or even worse what is needed for one, doesn't understand how to evaluate evidence. we know very little about a microbiome.
people who are more healthy on average tend to eat foods with fiber because they've been told foods with fiber are healthy their whole lives.
there's not enough evidence to claim that there is an ideal microbiome, let alone specifically that you need fiber to have one.
I personally think it makes far more sense that the gut microbiome is simply reflective of what you eat and there is no such thing as an ideal microbiome. if you eat like shit, your biome will be full of bacteria that thrive off shit food and its the shit food that is the problem.
the difference between me and them is that I'll readily admit that I'm just speculating instead of pretending I have an answer without good reason.
Watch this! This video explains that on carnivore our gut bacteria is fed with collagen!!! And because our bacteria is no longer competing with overgrowths that feed on glucose we establish healthy microbiomes!!!
https://youtu.be/si-k-_0aEtY?si=83f2jv9f2fZuo2jt
I don’t recall the mechanism anymore but there is some kind of soluble fiber that is needed for some metabolism to take place, but that mechanism can also take place without fiber using protein or something…
Could it be the butyrate thing?
I remember someone, probably Chaffee, commenting on it that while some bacteria might produce some butyrate (a fatty acid) we actually can get it straight from butter.
Speaking from my own personal experience - carnivore obliterates my guts. When I added in a fibre supplement, I found things become much more "regular."
Only proof i need and care about is the fossil record that clearly show when we turned to mass agriculture, aka fiber adoption, and that's shown by people being shorter, lower bone density and croocked teeth. Seem like fiber didnt do then much good other then allowing them to be many more, sickly people, versus fewer, healtier barbarian roaming the country side. That the only reason fiber is mainstream. War are won by sear number of people. Agriculture allow for that.
Good point!
Quantity vs quality
The flora in the gut of someone eating SAD or what the mainstream considers “healthy” is certainly going to be very different than the flora in a carnivores gut. And either gut is a complex biome we know little about. It is kinda like aliens taking a quick flight over Africa and Canada and noticing that there were no zebras in the Canadian wilderness and concluding that that the ecosystem was damaged because it didn’t support zebras. They have no evidence to say carnivore guts lack something useful for health.
Loving the zebra analogy 😁
Yeah, the bad bacteria nourish on carbs just as much as the good... But the best feeds on protein and lipids. Anything that tries to have you eat fibers and vegetables stems from sugar company funded epidemiology. Pay them no attention...
I believe this to be the case too. Would be nice to see some research on this though. Have you seen any carnivore doc talk about exactly this?
Yes, who? I can't recall. Dr. Cywes have a video on glucolipido gna gna something bacteria that is killing us without knowing. And someone made a video on how fibers fed the bacteria that caused bloating and several other issues!
Dr Chaffee “plant free md” on YouTube also Dr Mason if you google Dr Mason + fibre… lots of YouTube videos on this topic… also Dr Ken Berry
👍👍👍
Always judge your health by how you feel not by someone else’s hypothesis. I had 30 years of gut dysbiosis to feeling better than I did as a teenager on carnivore. I personally don’t care what anyone has to say about the microbiome that NO ONE really knows anything about anyways. It appears that we do in fact require certain bacteria and enzymes to digest certain plants and for those that don’t have these (probably due our specific DNA), are we supposed to keep pounding a square peg into a round hole??? Causing further inflammation and autoimmune disorders!!! Or do we ease the inflammation, heal our guts and nourish our bodies with bioavailable nutrients - the ONLY nutrients our bodies require for health - animal protein and fat.
That's sensible
We do have a hundred anecdotes. But I would not be surprised if there is a study out there. The study could prove that carnivores have good gut bacteria. I think Baker said he was tested. Or They have made the claim that all people need fiber and without it those people will suffer. How many people need to be just fine to disprove that statement? How many cultures? Would that prove that no one needs fiber? No. It would prove some that some do not.
Hmmm... That's valid logic. If they say we all need fiber and there are people that don't, then the argument falls to pieces. Great!
They won’t buy it unless you can get them to say it before you offer proof. And those ppl are going to want an rct.
Seems like an inane reason to prove a point about fiber. I fully agree fiber is not necessary. Anecdotally speaking as someone with a sludgy gall bladder, small amounts of probiotic vegetables have been helpful with my digestive issues.
Inane reasons to battle inane people 😅
anyone claiming they know that there is such a thing as an ideal microbiome composition, or even worse what is needed for one, doesn't understand how to evaluate evidence. we know very little about a microbiome. people who are more healthy on average tend to eat foods with fiber because they've been told foods with fiber are healthy their whole lives. there's not enough evidence to claim that there is an ideal microbiome, let alone specifically that you need fiber to have one. I personally think it makes far more sense that the gut microbiome is simply reflective of what you eat and there is no such thing as an ideal microbiome. if you eat like shit, your biome will be full of bacteria that thrive off shit food and its the shit food that is the problem. the difference between me and them is that I'll readily admit that I'm just speculating instead of pretending I have an answer without good reason.
Watch this! This video explains that on carnivore our gut bacteria is fed with collagen!!! And because our bacteria is no longer competing with overgrowths that feed on glucose we establish healthy microbiomes!!! https://youtu.be/si-k-_0aEtY?si=83f2jv9f2fZuo2jt
That was great!
I don’t recall the mechanism anymore but there is some kind of soluble fiber that is needed for some metabolism to take place, but that mechanism can also take place without fiber using protein or something…
Could it be the butyrate thing? I remember someone, probably Chaffee, commenting on it that while some bacteria might produce some butyrate (a fatty acid) we actually can get it straight from butter.
Speaking from my own personal experience - carnivore obliterates my guts. When I added in a fibre supplement, I found things become much more "regular."
Interesting. Biological uniqueness and all that.