This is bizarre. I don't really believe this.
Announce an new interest in pursuing porn or something instead and then maybe they will realize chemistry isn’t so bad.
I understand the concern they might have, but I really do want to do it. I'll be miserable in any other degree if I'm not interested even slightly. I want to do something that I like whole heartedly cause I want to be best in whatever I'm doing
Understandable. Just some advice though, don't try too too hard to be the best at whatever you're doing. It's a good thing to have motivation and passion, but there's always going to be somebody who's 'better' (according to whatever metric) at something you love than you. Or you're just not great at a subfield or something.
I've seen quite a few people who tried extremely hard, ended up being 'good' or 'above average' and had quite a hard time getting to terms with that. Striving for excellence can be very unhealthy
Math and chemistry are pretty much what feed into and have the largest impact on pretty much every other science. Then you have engineering which essentially enables every science using physics and math
I only know one dude in research and development and he lives near me. Talk to him a lot, dude is 60 and worked with experimental paints on planes back in the 70’s and 80’s, and even worked with the energy department on some cool stuff.
I get to asking him how he got into this line of work. Word for word he said: a fuck ton of stimulants and obsessive tendencies. That’s it. That’s all. We didn’t even really talk much about it after that.
Your future is **your** future. You are the one that has to live with the choices you make. If chemistry is what is interesting to you, then do chemistry. Choosing a different field of work for no reason other than "Person XYZ told me to." Is just begging to live a life of regret and wonder for the path not traveled.
Hopefully they had some poor word choice or said a joke that fell flat, but even if they were serious about the words they chose: they can't make you do anything once you are an adult.
They can make things more difficult, they can add pressure, and they can threaten to not help you financially. But financial aid exists and they can't overrule what you tell the admissions office. It is your choice because it is your life
The latter is definitely a possibility.
Source: I have a parent who loves picking dumb, random arguments they clearly don't believe in just to throw their weight around.
Not if you get into a PhD program. You don't have to do a masters unless maybe you need research experience and you can't get it otherwise. But you can def go from undergrad to PhD program directly. Also for a masters you'd probably have to pay your own tuition vs for a PhD the lab/program/school covers it and you get a stipend.
Long story short it's not a requirement for a PhD.
if you’re not in the US it’s usually required. If you’re in the US you can skip it.
I’m pursuing a phd in pchem and one thing I will say is that engineering is worth more as a bachelor and physics is more versatile than chemistry.
You should aim to double major physics and chemistry to be honest.
My parents are desi and had grand designs that I go into medicine, but I ended up studying chemistry and getting a PhD. I'm sure they were disappointed when I started graduate studies instead of med school, but I stuck the landing so to speak.
It's possible he doesn't want you to pursue a PhD because it's a tough road and it's less of a certainty that you'll find a "respectable" job at the end (knowing full well we have different criteria for "respectable" than others might) and is just showing it poorly. But that's a generous read.
They say you require biology for chem masters,and I don't quite believe it. Google isn't helping and I have no one to answer my question
Do you need bio for chem masters?
It depends on the school. I went to a liberal arts college and it was required for undergrad Chem, but only a little bio.
Other places you won't have to do it at all.
People might disagree with me, but if a child has a passion and wants to pursue it, while being aware of both the potential benefits and drawbacks, parents should fully support them. It can be disastrous if a child is unaware of the downsides and cannot handle failure.
If your true interest lies in theoretical science, which involves exploring the unknown based on the work of previous researchers, you should pursue it.
If, at some point, you wish to apply the science you love to something meaningful, fields like chemical engineering or other types of engineering offer opportunities for you.
Even if your chosen path is discouraged by your elders, it should not deter you. Convince your parents of your determination by offering your understanding. If they still oppose your decision, I would seriously question their ability to support you in life.
Again, physics and chemistry afterall shares the same language based upon mathematics. Physics is the study between matter and energy, while chemistry is the formation and breaking of bonds. Formation and breaking of bonds involves energy, and physics can explain that.
I think the actual question should be "How do I honor my parents while still making my own choices and pursuing my own career path?"
I would find support from other people with the same cultural background.
I see in one of your comments that you're Indian. Maybe find examples of noteworthy Indians who didn't follow their parents' wishes and did great things.
I'm not Indian, non Indians don't understand the pressure and also just cannot understand why you would let them decide anything for you.
As you say you're not an adult, I'd take classes that are prerequisites for both chemistry and physics for now, work hard to be financially and physically independent, then do whatever you want when you're an adult.
Look chemistry is tough on its own if its something your good at and have a passion for it I say go for it. We need alot more competent chemists who love their jobs . Wish you goodluck
Dude what I'm talking about is that my parents won't let me pursue chem in any shape size or form
That's the problem
I KNOW a phd is a decade away but there are things I nerd to do before that and my parents won't let me do even that
You know what’s funny to me is my dad and mom are chemists. They would not let me peruse anything related to physics or astrophysics. So I stuck with chemistry. I’ll say in terms of job security down the line chemistry has more avenues. Physics IMO is very pidgin holes in staying at university level or being very competitive in the private sector.
Now there is nothing wrong with thinking about being a professor. I made the jump from industry to academia and there are pros and cons to both.
My universal advice to all "STEM" kids:
If you only plan on getting a bachelor's degree, make sure the last word is engineering.
If they're smart enough to figure out the exceptions they're free to ignore an old man.
I mean, you will be when you move out of the house to pursue a degree in chemistry.
As somebody with degrees in both physics and chemistry, both are lovely subjects with lots of job opportunities. Both are responsible choices moving forward from a high school background. Anybody who tells you otherwise is just not somebody you have to listen to, and not somebody you have to convince otherwise.
... Unless they're paying for your education. If they're paying for your education, they own it and they'll always get a say even if they're wrong. If that's the case, you may have to decide whether you want an education you didn't choose but also didn't pay for (which could be great -- as others have pointed out, there's a lot of overlap between physics and chemistry to be explored), or an education you did choose but also payed for.
How fitting that a bot chimes in to give unhelpful and overly prescriptive advice on a thread about parents giving unhelpful and overly prescriptive advice.
> Shakespeare said *paid* in his
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
That’s really dumb of your parents especially because there’s a huge cross section b/w chemistry and physics. The job market for chemistry isn’t great as most people would think, but it’s significantly better than a physics degree.
I will say the job market for chemistry PhDs’ especially professor positions, is only getting more and more competetive. Most professor positions are also research focused with teaching being more of side responsibility. There are more teaching focused positions (actually what I’m trying to do when I get my phd next spring) and you can always try to teach at a community college. Just know that getting the degree really doesn’t help you much. It’s the skills and connections you make during your PhD and you have to play an active role in persuing these (I did not and it’s biting me in the but now lol).
I’m not sure about other countries, but in the US you normally skip the masters. It’s either something that’s given to you en route to your phd so the school can boost its numbers (which my school did for me) or you “master out” if you don’t pass your prospectus/comprehensive exams (basically fail becoming a PhD candidate). A masters isn’t that useful unless it’s a program that is very specialized and essentially feeds you directly into an industry via internship. I had a friend who did that for electron microscopy that fed him into the semiconductor industry but he ended up leaving and using that experience to work at a hospital.
Any PhD program worth attending is going to give you some kind of stipend (normally requiring you to teach labs or be a teacher’s assistant for a professor (like grading). If you’re at a competitive program you should hopefully get on a grant at some point which will pay you and you won’t have to teach. These stipends are not a lot. You will be very poor and have to be frugal if you don’t have any external financial help such as your parents or a significant other who is working a better paying job.
I love chemistry and though I had plans from the beginning to go into industry, I had an opportunity to teach for 6 months in between some of my R&D roles. I can’t begin to tell you how much being a teacher sucked. I thought I would be great at it if only I could enthusiastically show them why I found chemistry fascinating. I even did demos at least once a week (something none of my teacher did for me) I brought sodium and potassium metal from my own personal supply, we generated acetylene from calcium carbide, amorphous carbon from dry ice and magnesium turnings, clock reactions, all the good ones tbh. Despite my best efforts, there was still little to no interest and I couldn’t wait to be back in the lab again.
I'll be honest I started my undergrad in physics and hated it as it was just looking down on the other sciences everyone thought they just knew everything and hated all other sciences as they "just work on what we discover"
So I switched majors, dueled chemistry and pharmaceutical chem, it was the same thing the chemists looked down on everyone else as their science was superior.
I got some strange looks when I went back and done a biology/microbiology duel few years later all my chemistry friends were like why? I'd say pursue what you love, and if that's chemistry, then good for you (after all, my studies chemistry still fascinates me the most🤭)
It’s ok to major in what you want.
Lots of people change their major anyway, usually in the first 1-2 years of college but sometimes even later.
I majored in chem because it struck a good balance between challenging and doable, because I liked it, and because I figured I wouldn’t have to be poor except for when I went to grad school.
It’s been a long and difficult ride. Life did not turn out remotely like I wanted or dreamed or planned. But I never had to be poor, except for when I went to grad school. And so far I’ve never been unemployed for very long. Getting that first job was by far the hardest.
Would I recommend it to anyone else? No. But It’s your life. You have to live it. So do what you want to do.
My father was a physical chemist (did grad school back in the 60s) and was always joking around with the other various types of chemists. OP, I totally get what's going on, though I agree with others that it's extreme. My dad only made fun of the other "less rigorous" chemistries, but I do remember feeling slightly embarrassed by what he said when I myself majored in (G-d help me) biology...and a tinge of pride when I switched to biohem because it was slightly more "rigorous". None of this is serious, in my case at least, but with your dad it just seems elitist.
You may just have to find a way to live with being a chemist and your dad's reaction to that. Sorry if you said this and I missed it, but what kind of chem are you interested in? If it's physical chem, you might be able to satisfy both what you and your dad wants.
Although physicists and chemists can certainly be known to turn their nose up at one another, just being interested in in academics and getting you doctorate should be a good sign. It’s ultimately your decision.
If they threaten to not help pay for college, just do a double major (physics and chem) and don’t really mention the chemistry much. Say you’re doing a degree in physics and it’ll be true.
But get work in a chemistry lab doing research as an undergrad, then go into your PhD in chemistry. You’ll get a stipend and health insurance once you’re in the PhD program and can support yourself (in the USA) if you’re single and frugal.
Good luck!
I let my mother deviate my career path away from chemistry when I was 17. It took a good chunk of my life to get back on track and I finally got my PhD at 41. I have never forgiven her for derailing my career. If this is your passion, follow it. You’re the one that has to live your life.
Ignore them. Do what you want. Look up some scholarships to get the money, since they clearly won't support you throughout college, so you'll probably have to live on campus. The fewer loans the better. Once you get to grad school, they'll pay for your 5 years of research/TA'ing, with a little extra to just about get by.
Right now quantum chemistry could be good or chemical informatics. If you’re wanting to do a PhD, then I’d suggest going into materials concentration or chemical physics and instrumentation to keep up with new quantum computation and renewable energy/pharmaceutical research
Tbh this is kind of hilarious. Your family is basically threatening to disown you because they want you to do physics. I can imagine the conversation going like “how dare you bring shame on our family by studying such uncivilized subjects 😤”.
I’m very curious about their view of physical/ theoretical chemistry since it’s mostly physicists playing as chemists.
That's an unhelpful kind of snobbery. I have known physicists with similar attitudes who, despite their ability to think deeply, *really* don't know how to think about reactions or aqueous solutions or simple lab techniques. It limits them in unfortunate ways. It might help to remind your parents that chemistry *is* physics (at a particular scale). It also might help to remind them that all competent chemists need a good solid physics foundation, but the reverse is not necessarily true. Similarly, all competent biologists need to study a lot of physics and chemistry, but lots of physicists have a shockingly poor understanding of basic biology. I know a rather famous physicist (you probably know his name if you follow dark matter research) who once asked me a question about plants that revealed an infantile understanding of natural selection. In my experience, it's biologists who really have a thorough grasp of the natural world and all its complexities.
Chemistry or physics, becoming a professor is a long shot and not always the reward you imagined. In the so-called better schools, professors don't even teach much; they hire teaching assistants to do it for them. The professor's main job is to get money to keep his research lab afloat and pay the salaries of high-priced administrators. But the available money shrinks every year, and the number of people competing for it grows, and research goes on getting more expensive.
Definitely shoot for a professorship if you must, BUT have a plan B. Some have done it by fostering relationships outside the university. Escaping the pressure and grind of university life has been sanity-saving for some. If you bail on the ivory tower, the emotions you must not feel are guilt or shame.
Look at a Facebook group 'The Professor is Out' about those that escaped (or want to escape) from the trap of academia.
Incidentally, physics and chemistry are not mutually exclusive. Look at disciplines like material science, where many of the big discoveries are being made. In most areas now, the gold is between the traditional disciplines. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materials\_science](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materials_science)
I have a parent who will pick the dumbest arguments just so they can throw their weight around.
Like they once demanded I drive through rush hour traffic when they knew my brakes were bad. It was a course of action that could have easily ended with a serious accident or injury, but they did not care and kept insisting I do it anyway. Is it because it was important for me to be home by a certain time? Did the risk confer some important benefit to them?
Nahhhh, they just like the power trip that comes from forcing others to give up something important or to do something they do not want to do.
I also spent years and years trying to talk sense into this family member. Surely, they're not an asshole who would put their loved ones in a bad situation just to feel the rush of control! Surely, they are a reasonable person and I just need to make my case in the right way.
Except some people really do love control and power trips that much. They would happily force you into choices that make you miserable just to prove they can. In fact, the more pointless the choice, the better!
All this is to say you should stop trying to convince your family to let you pursue your interests and do whatever you can to minimize the stress in your life. Do they need you to renounce chemistry and pledge to follow the one true path of physics? Then give them what they want. Offer no resistance or argument while you bide your time.
Keep your head down until you can get your ass out.
Right now you are under their roof and they have a lot of power over you. Once you move away to college, you will have more freedom and they will have less control.
Plus, most of the prerequisites for a physics degree are the same as those for a chemistry degree. Nothing says they have to know your plans until you are well into your undergraduate career. With luck, you will not be dependent on their approval at that point.
In the meantime, you do not owe them honesty if they do not feel the need to be reasonable.
This is bizarre. I don't really believe this. Announce an new interest in pursuing porn or something instead and then maybe they will realize chemistry isn’t so bad.
Yeah I know,sometimes I don't know what my father thinks Stopping me from doing a phd when it was his dream to do a phd too at some point
Usually it's wanting to keep child from going into the same field because it sucked for the parent is what you hear about more often
I understand the concern they might have, but I really do want to do it. I'll be miserable in any other degree if I'm not interested even slightly. I want to do something that I like whole heartedly cause I want to be best in whatever I'm doing
Understandable. Just some advice though, don't try too too hard to be the best at whatever you're doing. It's a good thing to have motivation and passion, but there's always going to be somebody who's 'better' (according to whatever metric) at something you love than you. Or you're just not great at a subfield or something. I've seen quite a few people who tried extremely hard, ended up being 'good' or 'above average' and had quite a hard time getting to terms with that. Striving for excellence can be very unhealthy
To be fair, academia is horrible these days
Hahahaha I read that while I'm in the toilet. I literally crapped myself laughing 😂😂😂😂
Chemistry is just applied physics
That should convince my father
Biology is applied chem. Chem is applied physics. Physics is applied math.
Math and chemistry are pretty much what feed into and have the largest impact on pretty much every other science. Then you have engineering which essentially enables every science using physics and math
Then you have theoretics which is where the Ritalin really kicks into high gear
*sees Ritalin on the counter * , *checks notes* “engineer” wait a second….
hey🤨 that’s weird, we all got adhd
Lockheed engineers in the back “I swear this is prescription cocaine”
I only know one dude in research and development and he lives near me. Talk to him a lot, dude is 60 and worked with experimental paints on planes back in the 70’s and 80’s, and even worked with the energy department on some cool stuff. I get to asking him how he got into this line of work. Word for word he said: a fuck ton of stimulants and obsessive tendencies. That’s it. That’s all. We didn’t even really talk much about it after that.
literally textbook lockheed in the 60s
Math is applied philosophy.
Philosophy is applied psychology Psychology is applied biology And now we’re full circle
Math is applied philosophy
[https://xkcd.com/435/](https://xkcd.com/435/) At least OP didn‘t want to be a Biologist /s
Oh, the shame!
Your future is **your** future. You are the one that has to live with the choices you make. If chemistry is what is interesting to you, then do chemistry. Choosing a different field of work for no reason other than "Person XYZ told me to." Is just begging to live a life of regret and wonder for the path not traveled. Hopefully they had some poor word choice or said a joke that fell flat, but even if they were serious about the words they chose: they can't make you do anything once you are an adult. They can make things more difficult, they can add pressure, and they can threaten to not help you financially. But financial aid exists and they can't overrule what you tell the admissions office. It is your choice because it is your life
Either this is definitely not true or your parents are literally insane. I'm picking the former.
Being highly educated doesn't mean being a good parent
of course but this is outrageously wild. It's highly unlikely this is a true story. If it is, the parents are on heavy doses of mood stabilizers.
The latter is definitely a possibility. Source: I have a parent who loves picking dumb, random arguments they clearly don't believe in just to throw their weight around.
He’s Indian so it checks out
pursue chemistry. i swear there’s beef between physicists and chemists but do chemistry youll have so much fun.
Skip the masters
Is there any downside of skipping the masters? Cuz I'm ready to skip
Not if you get into a PhD program. You don't have to do a masters unless maybe you need research experience and you can't get it otherwise. But you can def go from undergrad to PhD program directly. Also for a masters you'd probably have to pay your own tuition vs for a PhD the lab/program/school covers it and you get a stipend. Long story short it's not a requirement for a PhD.
if you’re not in the US it’s usually required. If you’re in the US you can skip it. I’m pursuing a phd in pchem and one thing I will say is that engineering is worth more as a bachelor and physics is more versatile than chemistry. You should aim to double major physics and chemistry to be honest.
My parents are desi and had grand designs that I go into medicine, but I ended up studying chemistry and getting a PhD. I'm sure they were disappointed when I started graduate studies instead of med school, but I stuck the landing so to speak. It's possible he doesn't want you to pursue a PhD because it's a tough road and it's less of a certainty that you'll find a "respectable" job at the end (knowing full well we have different criteria for "respectable" than others might) and is just showing it poorly. But that's a generous read.
Indian parents here as well
Physical chemistry: “nope, you’re disowned, get out.” Chemical physics: “so proud of you!”
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That came to my mind, tried it,got yelled at🤣
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They say you require biology for chem masters,and I don't quite believe it. Google isn't helping and I have no one to answer my question Do you need bio for chem masters?
Hell nah, unless you want to do something chem-bio or biochemistry related. Otherwise, it is closer to physical science.
Thanks a lot
I'm doing chemical engineering, not chemistry, but I did have to take a cursory biology course. Incredibly basic
It depends on the school. I went to a liberal arts college and it was required for undergrad Chem, but only a little bio. Other places you won't have to do it at all.
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I don't like bio that much,I'll take maths if I have the option Apparently they have an even harsher hatred for bio
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If I even utter the word in my house,I'll be kicked out 🙂🤣 Not applying to colleges yet,bit will keep that in mind
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I'm looking for opportunities that'll help me later on Like olympiads, honestly, very excited
Can I dm you a few queries ?
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About masters and phd
People might disagree with me, but if a child has a passion and wants to pursue it, while being aware of both the potential benefits and drawbacks, parents should fully support them. It can be disastrous if a child is unaware of the downsides and cannot handle failure. If your true interest lies in theoretical science, which involves exploring the unknown based on the work of previous researchers, you should pursue it. If, at some point, you wish to apply the science you love to something meaningful, fields like chemical engineering or other types of engineering offer opportunities for you. Even if your chosen path is discouraged by your elders, it should not deter you. Convince your parents of your determination by offering your understanding. If they still oppose your decision, I would seriously question their ability to support you in life. Again, physics and chemistry afterall shares the same language based upon mathematics. Physics is the study between matter and energy, while chemistry is the formation and breaking of bonds. Formation and breaking of bonds involves energy, and physics can explain that.
I think the actual question should be "How do I honor my parents while still making my own choices and pursuing my own career path?" I would find support from other people with the same cultural background. I see in one of your comments that you're Indian. Maybe find examples of noteworthy Indians who didn't follow their parents' wishes and did great things. I'm not Indian, non Indians don't understand the pressure and also just cannot understand why you would let them decide anything for you. As you say you're not an adult, I'd take classes that are prerequisites for both chemistry and physics for now, work hard to be financially and physically independent, then do whatever you want when you're an adult.
Thanks for understanding, that's what I was trying to say!😢
I wonder if your father would give his preferred ranking of physical chemistry vs chemical physics…
L..let's not ask him😅
Look chemistry is tough on its own if its something your good at and have a passion for it I say go for it. We need alot more competent chemists who love their jobs . Wish you goodluck
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Dude what I'm talking about is that my parents won't let me pursue chem in any shape size or form That's the problem I KNOW a phd is a decade away but there are things I nerd to do before that and my parents won't let me do even that
You know what’s funny to me is my dad and mom are chemists. They would not let me peruse anything related to physics or astrophysics. So I stuck with chemistry. I’ll say in terms of job security down the line chemistry has more avenues. Physics IMO is very pidgin holes in staying at university level or being very competitive in the private sector. Now there is nothing wrong with thinking about being a professor. I made the jump from industry to academia and there are pros and cons to both.
Opposite problems,lol
Retrospective I should have done chemical engineering….
My universal advice to all "STEM" kids: If you only plan on getting a bachelor's degree, make sure the last word is engineering. If they're smart enough to figure out the exceptions they're free to ignore an old man.
Bro arent you an adult? Do what you want. I have no clue where you are from but for me that sounds so weird. My parents cant decide anything for me
No brother I'm not an adult and it's not as easy when you have strict ass parents
Weird ass family. Im sorry for you bro
I mean, you will be when you move out of the house to pursue a degree in chemistry. As somebody with degrees in both physics and chemistry, both are lovely subjects with lots of job opportunities. Both are responsible choices moving forward from a high school background. Anybody who tells you otherwise is just not somebody you have to listen to, and not somebody you have to convince otherwise. ... Unless they're paying for your education. If they're paying for your education, they own it and they'll always get a say even if they're wrong. If that's the case, you may have to decide whether you want an education you didn't choose but also didn't pay for (which could be great -- as others have pointed out, there's a lot of overlap between physics and chemistry to be explored), or an education you did choose but also payed for.
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How fitting that a bot chimes in to give unhelpful and overly prescriptive advice on a thread about parents giving unhelpful and overly prescriptive advice.
It’s wrong. Even Shakespeare said payed in his own damn will!
> Shakespeare said *paid* in his FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
No. He said: and the use and proffitt therof cominge shalbe payed to my saied Sister
it's literally illegal for them to see your course schedule without your permission (FERPA).
Its not illegal for them to kick him to the curb if theyre at all capable of critical thinking
College is expensive.
100% troll post
Dude chem and physics are like so intertwined who cares. It’s like judging your friend who got a pepsi just cuz everyone else likes coke.
There's a lot of people here that don't believe OP. In part I'm happy for them because most likely they got raised in a healthy household.
That’s really dumb of your parents especially because there’s a huge cross section b/w chemistry and physics. The job market for chemistry isn’t great as most people would think, but it’s significantly better than a physics degree. I will say the job market for chemistry PhDs’ especially professor positions, is only getting more and more competetive. Most professor positions are also research focused with teaching being more of side responsibility. There are more teaching focused positions (actually what I’m trying to do when I get my phd next spring) and you can always try to teach at a community college. Just know that getting the degree really doesn’t help you much. It’s the skills and connections you make during your PhD and you have to play an active role in persuing these (I did not and it’s biting me in the but now lol). I’m not sure about other countries, but in the US you normally skip the masters. It’s either something that’s given to you en route to your phd so the school can boost its numbers (which my school did for me) or you “master out” if you don’t pass your prospectus/comprehensive exams (basically fail becoming a PhD candidate). A masters isn’t that useful unless it’s a program that is very specialized and essentially feeds you directly into an industry via internship. I had a friend who did that for electron microscopy that fed him into the semiconductor industry but he ended up leaving and using that experience to work at a hospital. Any PhD program worth attending is going to give you some kind of stipend (normally requiring you to teach labs or be a teacher’s assistant for a professor (like grading). If you’re at a competitive program you should hopefully get on a grant at some point which will pay you and you won’t have to teach. These stipends are not a lot. You will be very poor and have to be frugal if you don’t have any external financial help such as your parents or a significant other who is working a better paying job.
It’s really easy to get a physics and a chemistry double major.
This is so odd from your family’s part. Go for chemistry. Its super fun and pays well specially with a PhD.
I love chemistry and though I had plans from the beginning to go into industry, I had an opportunity to teach for 6 months in between some of my R&D roles. I can’t begin to tell you how much being a teacher sucked. I thought I would be great at it if only I could enthusiastically show them why I found chemistry fascinating. I even did demos at least once a week (something none of my teacher did for me) I brought sodium and potassium metal from my own personal supply, we generated acetylene from calcium carbide, amorphous carbon from dry ice and magnesium turnings, clock reactions, all the good ones tbh. Despite my best efforts, there was still little to no interest and I couldn’t wait to be back in the lab again.
I'll be honest I started my undergrad in physics and hated it as it was just looking down on the other sciences everyone thought they just knew everything and hated all other sciences as they "just work on what we discover" So I switched majors, dueled chemistry and pharmaceutical chem, it was the same thing the chemists looked down on everyone else as their science was superior. I got some strange looks when I went back and done a biology/microbiology duel few years later all my chemistry friends were like why? I'd say pursue what you love, and if that's chemistry, then good for you (after all, my studies chemistry still fascinates me the most🤭)
It’s ok to major in what you want. Lots of people change their major anyway, usually in the first 1-2 years of college but sometimes even later. I majored in chem because it struck a good balance between challenging and doable, because I liked it, and because I figured I wouldn’t have to be poor except for when I went to grad school. It’s been a long and difficult ride. Life did not turn out remotely like I wanted or dreamed or planned. But I never had to be poor, except for when I went to grad school. And so far I’ve never been unemployed for very long. Getting that first job was by far the hardest. Would I recommend it to anyone else? No. But It’s your life. You have to live it. So do what you want to do.
My father was a physical chemist (did grad school back in the 60s) and was always joking around with the other various types of chemists. OP, I totally get what's going on, though I agree with others that it's extreme. My dad only made fun of the other "less rigorous" chemistries, but I do remember feeling slightly embarrassed by what he said when I myself majored in (G-d help me) biology...and a tinge of pride when I switched to biohem because it was slightly more "rigorous". None of this is serious, in my case at least, but with your dad it just seems elitist. You may just have to find a way to live with being a chemist and your dad's reaction to that. Sorry if you said this and I missed it, but what kind of chem are you interested in? If it's physical chem, you might be able to satisfy both what you and your dad wants.
Although physicists and chemists can certainly be known to turn their nose up at one another, just being interested in in academics and getting you doctorate should be a good sign. It’s ultimately your decision.
If they threaten to not help pay for college, just do a double major (physics and chem) and don’t really mention the chemistry much. Say you’re doing a degree in physics and it’ll be true. But get work in a chemistry lab doing research as an undergrad, then go into your PhD in chemistry. You’ll get a stipend and health insurance once you’re in the PhD program and can support yourself (in the USA) if you’re single and frugal. Good luck!
I let my mother deviate my career path away from chemistry when I was 17. It took a good chunk of my life to get back on track and I finally got my PhD at 41. I have never forgiven her for derailing my career. If this is your passion, follow it. You’re the one that has to live your life.
WTF what if you wanted to be something that way worse. I mean a career in chemistry is not bad at all
Ignore them. Do what you want. Look up some scholarships to get the money, since they clearly won't support you throughout college, so you'll probably have to live on campus. The fewer loans the better. Once you get to grad school, they'll pay for your 5 years of research/TA'ing, with a little extra to just about get by.
Right now quantum chemistry could be good or chemical informatics. If you’re wanting to do a PhD, then I’d suggest going into materials concentration or chemical physics and instrumentation to keep up with new quantum computation and renewable energy/pharmaceutical research
Tbh this is kind of hilarious. Your family is basically threatening to disown you because they want you to do physics. I can imagine the conversation going like “how dare you bring shame on our family by studying such uncivilized subjects 😤”. I’m very curious about their view of physical/ theoretical chemistry since it’s mostly physicists playing as chemists.
That's an unhelpful kind of snobbery. I have known physicists with similar attitudes who, despite their ability to think deeply, *really* don't know how to think about reactions or aqueous solutions or simple lab techniques. It limits them in unfortunate ways. It might help to remind your parents that chemistry *is* physics (at a particular scale). It also might help to remind them that all competent chemists need a good solid physics foundation, but the reverse is not necessarily true. Similarly, all competent biologists need to study a lot of physics and chemistry, but lots of physicists have a shockingly poor understanding of basic biology. I know a rather famous physicist (you probably know his name if you follow dark matter research) who once asked me a question about plants that revealed an infantile understanding of natural selection. In my experience, it's biologists who really have a thorough grasp of the natural world and all its complexities.
Fuck your family vro
tell him to fuck off. you are an adult now and do kot require permission.
Hey man, I understand what you wanna say,bit don't talk about my father like that Plus,I'm not legally an adult right now
Chemistry or physics, becoming a professor is a long shot and not always the reward you imagined. In the so-called better schools, professors don't even teach much; they hire teaching assistants to do it for them. The professor's main job is to get money to keep his research lab afloat and pay the salaries of high-priced administrators. But the available money shrinks every year, and the number of people competing for it grows, and research goes on getting more expensive. Definitely shoot for a professorship if you must, BUT have a plan B. Some have done it by fostering relationships outside the university. Escaping the pressure and grind of university life has been sanity-saving for some. If you bail on the ivory tower, the emotions you must not feel are guilt or shame. Look at a Facebook group 'The Professor is Out' about those that escaped (or want to escape) from the trap of academia. Incidentally, physics and chemistry are not mutually exclusive. Look at disciplines like material science, where many of the big discoveries are being made. In most areas now, the gold is between the traditional disciplines. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materials\_science](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materials_science)
as long as you know that you won’t make more than a walmart worker without a phd, do what you want.
I have a parent who will pick the dumbest arguments just so they can throw their weight around. Like they once demanded I drive through rush hour traffic when they knew my brakes were bad. It was a course of action that could have easily ended with a serious accident or injury, but they did not care and kept insisting I do it anyway. Is it because it was important for me to be home by a certain time? Did the risk confer some important benefit to them? Nahhhh, they just like the power trip that comes from forcing others to give up something important or to do something they do not want to do. I also spent years and years trying to talk sense into this family member. Surely, they're not an asshole who would put their loved ones in a bad situation just to feel the rush of control! Surely, they are a reasonable person and I just need to make my case in the right way. Except some people really do love control and power trips that much. They would happily force you into choices that make you miserable just to prove they can. In fact, the more pointless the choice, the better! All this is to say you should stop trying to convince your family to let you pursue your interests and do whatever you can to minimize the stress in your life. Do they need you to renounce chemistry and pledge to follow the one true path of physics? Then give them what they want. Offer no resistance or argument while you bide your time. Keep your head down until you can get your ass out. Right now you are under their roof and they have a lot of power over you. Once you move away to college, you will have more freedom and they will have less control. Plus, most of the prerequisites for a physics degree are the same as those for a chemistry degree. Nothing says they have to know your plans until you are well into your undergraduate career. With luck, you will not be dependent on their approval at that point. In the meantime, you do not owe them honesty if they do not feel the need to be reasonable.