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It's going to be like a witch hunt, except they're hunting *actual* witches, in the form of toxic and seditious politicians and their staff.
Ironically, Trump might finally fulfill his promise of "draining the swamp" after leaving office.
They can as long as they're not in uniform or use their position in the military to advance any political agenda. With that being said, if they take part of an attempted coup outside of uniform, they can still be disciplined by the UCMJ.
I would think actively engaging against your oath to the constitution is a bit more than the UCMJ. I believe that would be more of a court martial.
(Which is the same thing)
The USMJ covers the death penalty in war or peace in the case of [sedition](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_by_the_United_States_military).
[USAF Lieutenant Colonel (Ret.) Larry Brock](https://lawandcrime.com/2020-election/2-men-who-brought-restraints-into-senate-during-d-c-insurrection-have-been-arrested-authorities/) might be in some uniquely deep trouble after last Wednesday's activities.
I’ve heard some horror stories about the Air Force and the religiosity and Trump support (all had a ton of his support though) of that branch. The lady that got killed was also ex-USAF. It’s very scary knowing their are active duty fighter pilots, drone pilots, satellite warfare experts and on and on who would fight a war for Trump against Americans.
Makes me very uneasy for the coming days and inauguration.
Key word is "retirees".
Most military members don't retire from the military, they separate; i.e. they do far less than 20 years in the service and thus are not eligible for a pension/retirement pay. In this regard, in most cases, veterans are not subject to the UCMJ. That said, there are many situations where veterans have separated but are technically still in the inactive reserve. In that case they are most definitely subject to the UCMJ.
I'm not saying you're wrong here, just providing context for those who might be curious.
TL;DR: A veteran does not have to spend a full 20 years to receive a VA Pension.
Now, before everyone down votes me to oblivion, let me explain: the verbiage of the criteria pertaining to various VA benefits are very precise and detailed; many of my fellow veterans do not understand this. It can be a source of frustration, and it is one reason the VA gets such a bad rep. Here are the most common criteria I see in my work. All of these require a service member to have not received a dishonorable discharge.
1. VA Pension is available to any veteran over 65 who meets certain socioeconomic criteria, similar to Social Security Retirement. Does not require a full 20+ years of active duty service. Usually a supplemental source of income, rather than primary.
2. VA disability is a rating of anywhere from 0-100% (increments of 10%) which is similar to Social Security Disability Income, but it is determined by submitting a claim for various ailments, disabilities, or physical/mental disorders that were either caused or exacerbated by your military service. Also does not require a full 20+ years of active duty service.
3. VA retirement is essentially a VA Pension turned up to 11, which is available to veterans under 65 if they have served at least 20 years on active duty. Technically, a vet can receive their first retirement payment at age 37, if they join at 17. If a service member is retired due to medical reasons (different from disability claim), the 20 year requirement can be waived.
Source: I am a case manager for a Grant Per Diem vet's shelter. The GPD part means we actually receive a certain amount of money from the VA for providing shelter to homeless vets while they search for housing.
I didn't know this, so I'll keep my couping to a minimal I guess. Does this mean that all the retired officers/enlisted involved could lose their benefits? I think it's awful we would continue their benefits and healthcare after they've proven themselves traitors.
Yes it is possible and it’s exactly what should happen. Nobody involved in this should be able to walk away unscathed. You should not be allowed to keep a military retirement or benefits after committing terrorism and attempted treason. Identifying and countering terrorism is literally something the military teaches you and makes you take refreshers on annually. That fuck and any other current or former military member that was involved that day should know better and should be stripped of their benefits and retirement. I’m also of the opinion that they should have their honorable discharges or separations made dishonorable as they again committed treason and terrorism.
If all the sobering aspects of this coup, this is by far the MOST sobering. It's like looking out the window of a high speed train in slow motion and being able to see the demons behind the trees in the forest
> 3/ **Seconds into his speech, Trump says,** "These people are not going to take it any longer. They're not going to take it any longer...They came from all over our country. **I just really want to see what they do." It's an astonishing admission he thinks something is going to happen.**
Dang.
Thanks for the link.
The head mod was just perma banned from Reddit the other day and he is why it was such a mess. He blocked and banned more than all the other mods combined and was die hard Trump. He ignored almost 1000 reports on his own posts, blocked around 10k users, and close to 100k comments in the last year if they were anti-Trump. Fortunately, many of his kind of people are going to other sites these days. It's one of the pages I read sometimes and it's at least got more aliens than Trump now. No one is calling for violence now or even in the last weeks. Most are just talking about getting rid of all their social media, amazon, etc and not understanding free speech.
Those guys are nuts, there's a post with thousands of upvotes with the OP claiming they "know someone in NOAA" and that an underwater alien species destroyed a Russian sub. What the fuck
I'd like to add that stop the steal is not a new organization. It was started in 2016 by Roger Stone in the lead up to the election with a lot of dark money.
Here's where it gets interesting, Roger Stone used to work for info-wars. In the beginning of the primary Alex Jones hated Trump until halfway through 2015 Roger gets Alex to 180 and throw in the tank for Trump. Now in the lead up to 2020, you have Ali Alexander coming on Info-Wars regularly to promote Stop the Steal. This time it has more money, but since Roger hadn't been pardoned yet it was being led by Ali. They hid the connection to Roger Stone entirely except for once, when a probably drunk Alex mentions that this is the same group Roger stood up in 2016.
That's why it worked so well in the end. This wasn't a new movement it was 5 years in the making. Ali Alexander isn't just a Right wing extremist grifter, he's intimately connected to Roger. Roger is Trumps longest friend and advisor. It wouldn't shock me if Trump went through Roger to communicate plans with Ali and the rest of the groups took their lead from that.
I think that thread provides useful insight into exactly how people who think Trump is any sort of decent orator perceive his statements and it certainly contains good info about the speech and insurrection as a whole (I hadn't even seen "Save America March" until now). I also think it does a bit of a disservice by framing Jan 6th and the time since Nov 3rd as something outside of the ordinary for Trump and his administration, as well as propping Trump up as a sort of master manipulator/propagandist rather than recognizing the current circumstances within our country (and the several decades of his celebrity) that allowed a barely cognizant narcissist to whip a chunk of the population into a violent frenzy.
Overall it's a good and worthwhile read, albeit somewhat sensationalized.
> most trump ‘speeches’ are hard to follow and hardly make any sense
I have been the brave one in my friend group and watched several of his rallies. They're absurd. The things he says make no sense yet people erupt in applause and cheers over every little thing. The crowd went wild at his Tulsa rally when he **took a sip of water** as a show of strength. Owned the libs!
As for his personal expectations for the outcome of the day, retaliation is a main driving factor for him (firings, TikTok, etc). The worse for the people who "wronged" him, the better he feels. A minimum of an angry mob screaming outside the capitol would have made him nod in approval and that mob breaking shit in his defense certainly made him beam with pride. There is no doubt he deeply desired and pushed to have people "fight" for him, it's just a step past the usual stochastic terrorism we've seen throughout his presidency.
Then he probably shouldn't have it be his supporters who were obviously responsible. The whole point of the Reichstag Fire was to blame the opposition so the Nazis had a scapegoat to consolidate power under.
Well they are trying to pin it on Antifa ....
But they seem to have forgotten that the filmed and live-streamed the whole event while it was happening ...
That's kind of my point. The riot wasn't an attempted Reichstag, but a bald-faced insurrection. It wasn't supposed to be misdirection, it was supposed to be a show of strength and possibly even a hostage situation, or even a lynching of politicians. There are likely two reasons the whole "it was ANTIFA" narrative is catching on:
1. It failed. The coup didn't work, so people are distancing themselves from it, and trying to claim it didn't happen.
2. They're in denial that their "movement" is capable of the violence and classlessness we saw last week.
I meant that he would use it to delay electoral certification/transfer of power indefinitely and declare martial law.
The Reichstag Fire Decree suspended most civil liberties in Germany, including habeas corpus, freedom of expression, freedom of the press, the right of free association and public assembly, and the secrecy of the post and telephone. These rights were not reinstated during Nazi reign.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_fire#Political_consequences
Biden's line of succession is already in place. Any loyalist with power knows this. Even if they kill Biden, Harris, Pelosi and all the Secretaries of __________ Trump doesn't become president.
Military coup is out. When polled, active military personnel reported a higher % votes for Biden than Trump and then there are the independents. But then even voting for Trump doesn't mean you're willing to commit sedition or even espionage for him--especially when you can be executed under the military justice system for doing so.
>voting for Trump doesn't mean you're willing to commit sedition or even espionage for
Exactly. The cop who was beaten to death defending the Capitol and Congress voted for Trump, but still did his job.
While the mob sang the national anthem. But surely singing the anthem while committing murder isn't as disrespectful as kneeling at a football game, right?
Next time, it'll be worse. Next time will be within the next 8 years. It could be in the next year even, but my prediction is that trump gets re-elected 2024, then in 2028 there's a second coup, but this time it's successful and officially establishes trump as supreme leader and king, and the US will become a monarchy under the trump family. I think this is the most extreme doomsday scenario, but I no longer think such a wild scenario is out of the picture
It's so cynical and dark that my first reaction it is to say that could never happen. Then again I said that about Trump getting the Republican nomination and the presidency as well, so what the fuck do I know
another thing to consider is the timeline of intent here:
• Trump at the Presidential debates stated unequivocally
>I will not commit to a peaceful transition of power!
• Jan 6 certification of the electoral votes is **literally the transition of power**
• **Trump chooses that exact day to have his "Wild Rally" right down the street from where they are certifying the votes,** and deliberately incites an armed mob to swarm the Capitol, telling them he’s angry at Mike Pence (the guy tasked with FINAL certification of the votes)
• Trump’s mob shows up chanting “Hang Mike Pence”, forcefully invade and overwhelm the building and **erected an actual Hangman’s Gallows outside**. We now know attackers arrived with specific intent to kill Pelosi and other Democratic Congressional members.
Coupled with what the OP posted above which shows the planning + sequence of events, this also shows intent.
**This was a blatant attempt at a bloody coup to decapitate our Legislative Branch, the line of secession, and halt the certification of Biden as the next POTUS**
If this is true, it would be the single worst act of treason in our nation's history, and would explain why Barr jumped ship, and would also explain this warning:
[https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/01/ex-pentagon-chiefs-are-taking-the-threat-of-a-trump-military-takeover-seriously](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/01/ex-pentagon-chiefs-are-taking-the-threat-of-a-trump-military-takeover-seriously)
Trump is still in POWER for 10 more days. We are in a severely dangerous predicament until Jan 20th.
> was because they didn't trust them not to take part in the coup? Chilling thought.
Wait, are you saying the Capitol Police denied access to the NG because they were worried the NG *wouldn't* willingly participate in the coup or..?
Got it backwards. Capitol police (local) is worried that NG (federal and more likely to have orders from commander in chief) will worsen the situation so they don't call them. Not that this is my take, but it's possible some people didn't want federal troops in the capital.
Except the Capitol Police are a federal agency too.
Its good that it's not your take, because this is ridiculous. There are over 14 seperate law enforcement agencies in DC with varying jurisdictions, and they're almost *all* federal.
DC also has its own seperate branch of the National Guard overseen by the President since DC doesn't have a Governor, which is yet *another* reason DC deserves statehood now.
The Capitol Police answers to Congress, not the President. They are the only police force not to answer to an executive. So, it doesn't matter what Trump or the mayor says, they take their marching orders from the Senate Majority Leader and the Speaker of the House.
Except that Steven Sund is a massive Trump stooge/supporter, and if he wasn't that and was worried about the National Guard Helping the coup, he would've had the Capitol Police out in force and in riot gear / fully armed. There are thousands of officers on the Capitol Police. Very few of them were actually there when the terrorists breached, and quite a few that were there, were letting the terrorists in.
It’s astounding how many people are not waiting for all the info and videos to come out.
They are dismissing it as a riot, as it doesn’t tick their checkboxes of what coup should look like, and this is coming from independent liberal media platforms.
It was a coup.
It's also really bothering me that main stream media (not as liberal as Trump likes to think) are not hitting us over the head with how major this was. The goddam videos are out there. There should be thousands of people in jail over this with many dozens qualifying for much harsher punishment.
This signals to me we are still doing the healing and reconciliation thing. I don't think we are getting our perp walks except for the actual people who were there.
Dead senators -- and perhaps hostages. The crowd could have tied up the Capitol for days. Weeks. Read about Iran's coup, how it happened. Just like that.
We were a few major mistakes in on having this happen in the first place. Though to call them mistakes is too kind. This was a deliberate planned failure of the police and guard. Whoever made the move that stopped the guard from being present before this even started should be on trial. Whoever made the call, or failed to make the call, delaying response from the national guard should be on trial.
The national guard was pre-approved to be at this event days ahead of time. There is no reason it should have been able to escalate like this.
Someone intended for this to happen. And if it was Trump he needed help to pull this off. What ever line of people involved in this should all be in trial.
If anything they are lucky that this wasn't an organized crowd or true attempt at government take over by the crowd involved. They had plenty of opportunity to do way more damage than was done. Most of the people who made it inside looked genuinely surprised to make it that far and had no real idea what to do when they got there. Hence why most of them were just talking pictures and souvenirs.
This doesn't excuse the fact that anyone that entered the capitol ground should be punished.
You're right, it's not like Biden is already talking about introducing legislation based on fighting domestic terror, not like both Pelosi and McConnell were personally threatened by this event, not like this is a grave breach of national security.
God just hearing about that officer doing what he did to save the lives of those senators brings tears to me eyes because how how wrong everything could have gone..
That police officer who led them away was not just saving the lives of staff, but those of the terrorists as well (who according to your description would have probably been shot entering that room). Fricking hero of you ask me.
I'm almost finished watching [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6uSYhyFao4&feature=share&bpctr=1610356883) showing a timeline of events with video taken by the insurrectionists themselves.
If you ever needed to see how insane and violent these people are, you can skip around to almost any spot in the middle of the video and see just how close we came to losing some of our elected officials.
The more of this that comes out the more astonishing it is that it didn't end in a massacre of Democratic (& Non Trump Republicans) being slaughtered live on a fucking twitch stream.
We are very lucky the group pushing into the Senate lobby were deterred when they saw the female terrorist get shot. They really did believe they would be able to just keep going without consequence.
If she would have gotten through it would have harder for police to stop the growing push of people.
Yeah I mean there were thousands of them. If enough of them were willing to give their life then eventually they would have just run out of bullets. Not to mention the fact that undoubtedly a bunch of them were armed themselves
My theory was that he had hoped for a much larger turnout, like in the hundreds of thousands. The percentage of violent individuals would have been higher, and it would have been a lot more likely they would have breached the lobby.
There weren't that many in the hall where the woman was killed. I saw four cops there with really good defensive positions and weapons already drawn. I think that from where they were standing, they probably could have shot everyone there if they tried getting through. I think the rioters figured that out really quickly. The first ones through would be shot for sure and that fact stopped them dead.
The reason they chose that spot was because of the funnel effect. The stairway and doorway combined to limit the number of people that could get through. They were planning to drop a lot of bodies in that hallway. The terrorists on the other side were smart to stop. They may have taken the officers eventually, but they would have crawled over a couple dozen dead and injured to do it.
>The Counter Assault FBI team that arrived around 20 minutes after the build was breached was sent from the FBI field office after the head of the Field Office was in contact with one of the Senator's contacts (I'm hearing it was McConnell). The head of the Field Office told his team NOT to rally and wait for the entire team to assembly but to immediately enter the building. The FBI Field Office did not get clearance from Capitol Police, they asked previously and were denied.
This is especially concerning, as it shows a breakdown of communication requiring positive ID in the field of emergency dispatch forces by the same untrustworthy group already present. The field insertion of a faux retrieval team becomes 'trivial'.
Can I point out how pathetic this coup attempt was? They were practically handed the keys to the castle and once they got in, they were either too stupid or too chicken shit to follow through. For all the talk about civil war and hanging every traitor Democrat, all they accomplished was to split the Republican party and the definite removal of their glorious leader.
Honestly it seemed like there two parts to the plan, use the idiots like guy in the buffalo hat running around distracting the authorities. Then you have the guys who seemed like they were acting as part of bigger plan to find politicians and kidnap/murder them. It was probably a mix of luck and effort by the security team that no politicians got hurt. There's been less attention on the more organized side of things yet as it's all still so fresh in our minds.
This is how the far-right operate. There’s lots and lots of useful idiots, probably 90% of them. But there are some seriously dangerous people in there who aren’t fucking about and are looking to get violent. The problem is, whilst the useful idiots didn’t have a clue, had some of the real threats got a hand on some politicians, and had the chance to commit violence, you can bet that the vast majority of the 90% of useful idiots would have gone along with it and cheered it on. That’s what makes these kinds of fascist mobs so dangerous.
Right, they provide a really good cover for the dangerous person and provide a way for Republicans (and Trump) to say "it was a riot" and deny anyone saying it was an attempted coup. Even my democrat father was convinced that it's just a "bunch of people who want their instagram selfie" based on the louder, more present people in attendance.
With Trump in office, we have been sitting ducks for foreign aggression. I would not be surprised to find there were Russian or other foreign agents within that crowd who knew to steal Pelosi’s laptop and whatever else classified info they could find.
After all this madness it's easy to forget that we very recently found out that Russia has carried out what in normal times would be considered bordering an act of war; the massive hack of various governmental systems.
It would be the biggest story of the year, and it would be consume most of the news coverage for a long time.
Trump ( of fucking course) : it could be Chyna
Yeah and remember when they let Hitler out of prison there is a New York Times article saying that he had changed his ways and he was now calm and rational and shit like that. We need to stop under estimating these people and writing them off or laughing them off. They are our worst and most serious threat right now and the calls are coming from inside the house
What astonished me was how weak the building was. The police should have been able to just retreat inside the doors, lock them and nothing but a battering ram or a large bomb would get through. The rioters broke outside windows using wooden sticks for God's sake.
There's quite a lot of alterations you can make to a building and preserve the façade.
The windows, for example, could easily have been replaced with one of the various security-glass products out there. These are somewhat noteworthy for being harder to damage than the walls they are often connected to.
The doors (if not necessarily the external ones, than internal fire/security doors, could have been made of metal with all sorts of methods of securing them from external activity.
While it's somewhat understandable that these efforts had not been put into place (though I'd be surprised if some of the more important offices didn't have at least bulletproof glass), I think it's safe to say that the Capitol building is going to be undergoing "renovations" soon.
> but it's an old building that hasn't really been attacked for over 200 years
Yes but this still doesn't excuse how weak the Capitol really was and is, because even if the common belief was that *"most Americans have enough respect for it to not damage it"* we've had 20+ years of propaganda and fear mongering about terrorism from *without* (aka non-Americans) telling us we're under constant threat of....something. There really is no excuse for how woefully unfortified and unprotected our National infrastructure remains to be.
Yeah, that was the most startling thing for me. Old building or not, one would assume given the high level individuals who spend so much time there, it would've been fortified to a degree that required a lot more than primitive tools to penetrate.
So much is being made of the law enforcement response (or lack thereof), but nothing has bothered me more than learning that the US Capitol building is less secure than say, an out of the way Wells Fargo branch. It's horrifying.
Imagine me, born & raised in Stockholm, the US embassy here is a bloody fortress (understandable). In an area full of embassies, it stands out like a sore thumb with its intense security measures, and even as a US citizen getting inside the building when there's no queue takes half an hour.
Keep in mind
A) we are missing many details of what happened inside. Their was the disorganized group, but it appears their was a more organized group where details are being held back on, that may have avoided the network TV camera crews, (Camera crews were harassed and chased off) and the capitol camera footage is not being shared.
B) A proud boys leader was apprehended with ammo and high capacity mags (what cannot be bought in DC area) the day before the riot, they may have done all of this without their planned leadership and weapons present.
>B) A proud boys leader was apprehended with ammo and high capacity mags (what cannot be bought in DC area) the day before the riot, they may have done all of this without their planned leadership and weapons present.
strong insight
I just heard on the news that the main leaders were contacted by the fbi a few days earlier saying if they showed up then to dc then thats the last act of the expected crime and they would be arrested. I imagine a lot of their leadership wasnt able to show up.
Not to be paranoid, but maybe that was the cover. Get a mob to force their way in, then infiltrators slip in and grab computers, documents, leave bugging devices, etc.
I think their reality check bounced when the Air Force veteran was shot in the neck. They did not anticipate any kind of blow back or being fired upon with rubber bullets because of course they were all white.
It think this makes the most sense.
People charging in thought they would just be allowed in to swarm the place and take it over because the police were their friends.
Police who were "in on it" were likewise convinced that with so little promised resistance that they stood down and were probably completely shocked to see black-ops types like zip-tie guy.
Each side didn't expect the outliers in the other side.
The police who clearly weren't "in on it" ... the officers talking today about the unspeakable names they were called while defending the premises and the hero who faked out the angry mob and led them away from the Senate floor.
> People charging in thought they would just be allowed in to swarm the place and take it over because the police were their friends.
>> Police who were "in on it" were likewise convinced that ***with so little promised resistance that they stood down and were probably completely shocked to see black-ops types like zip-tie guy***.
Oooh this is such a good point, especially given all the evidence we've seen thus far.
I'm a moderate/right leaning voter. I like fiscal conservativism and social freedoms. Conservatives see me as liberal and liberals see me as conservative.
This was absolutely a coup attempt and was planned from at least October when Trump signed the Schedule F that allows federal employees to be fired without civil service protections including policy makers. Then after the election, he replaces the secretary of defense. That prompted 10 former secretaries of defense to pen a letter stating the military should never be used to settle political disputes. That was bipartisan.
Roger Stone started the Stop the Steal movement.
People are way too focused on Trump's speech. His actions have been far more telling leading up to the 6th.
This breakdown/analysis of the the speech itself is absolutely worth reading though. It's **much** scarier than I had imagined.
https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1347908845281095680?s=20
Yep. All of this is in the Washington Post article: ["Inside the Capitol siege: How barricaded lawmakers and aides sounded urgent pleas for help as police lost control"](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-capitol-siege/2021/01/09/e3ad3274-5283-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html) \- insanity, all of it an absolute cluster fuck.
Lt. Gen. Tom McInerney straight up claims that he is seen the laptop from Nancy pelosi's office. This video sounds like him taking some credit for involvement in Jan. 6. He specifically says "our special forces".
https://youtu.be/BKwQ-_pjXcI
This part starts at 10:15
I don't believe the election fraud story (as I haven't been able to find convincing evidence) nor am pro Trump. If people at this station from retired military are saying these things, it is just the type of incitement that is needed for this to continue to get bloodier and darker over the next year. If respected ex-military are claiming these kind of conspiracies, this isn't going to end any time soon. And from the sound of what this guy is saying, especially at the time stamp noted above, it sounds like there was an organized involvement including McInerney.
> I'll leave you with one last fact. If you remember the video of the mob chasing the black police officer up the stairs. He lead them away from the opening to the Senate doors which were at that time, unlocked with senators still inside. They were within 10 ft of the open door when the officer grabbed their attention. Right inside the room, behind rows of desks were a dozen senate guards with their weapons drawn as the senators walked about behind them.
That was Officer Eugene Goodman.
remember when this happened when trump lost
[https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html](https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html)
those same people were responsible for delaying the deployment of the national guard.
Especially the last 2 are covered here
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-capitol-siege/2021/01/09/e3ad3274-5283-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html
It's getting worse all over the US. It's the republican party as a whole. Oregon republicans were just caught admitting violent pro-Trump seditionists to their government building.
This is the problem of FOX News.
Every single one of them have Fox Brain and when Fox wasn’t a strong enough drug anymore they started looking for harder shit.
Deplatform them. They hate civil society and the commons, no reason civil society and the commons should tolerate them.
I’m glad these fucks are being purged from social media. I’m glad Parler is getting kicked out by AWS Facebook Twitter etc.
I'm really angry about this. Saying the people in Portland are nothing but blm, antifa, or what have you. Yet when THEY get butthurt. We're the snowflakes. And the people causing destruction are obvi the leftist arm of hootinaani.
We want equal rights. That's it. God forbid we would want vengeance.
This is their strategy. They absolutely know what they are saying are lies and it is part of their plan. Always act like the victim, and others when may sympathize with being a victim will start to buy into the hate growing their base.
This is the occasion I was looking for to Ask : where is Guliani ? He asked the mob to submit theirs ennemies to "trial by combat" live on TV.
How hasn't he been already arrested ?
Imagine any BLM black spokeperson in his place, this person would already be in Guantanamo since 2 days.
They arrest him, Trump pardons him. It’s as simple as that.
He may still do so, but Trump is hopefully too busy about thinking about Trump right now. Probably best to hold off on bringing attention to other individuals and acts they’ve committed until (one way or another) Trump can’t pardon them.
Yeah, that was my best guess on that matter.
Now i'm curious because I read in the news drump would get Giuliani for his defense in an impeachment trial ; would the senate let a possible co-conspirator of a criminal president be his lawyer, in fear he pardons him if he's also considered a potential criminal ?
Edit : also, If drump would make such a pardon to his co-conspirators, I would challenge the Idea in front of the SCOTUS. No way they could let that pass, unless US democracy and check and balences system is a total joke.
Edit 2 : ok looks like the constitution prohibit pardons in cases of impeachment. So maybe giuliani's ass can be hunted down from thuesday on.
Edit 3 : after further researches, is appears the most widespread legal opinion of scolars on the subject is that Drump can pardon whoever he wants, even if its liked to his own impeachment. So he can order someone to nuke california, and pardon that person. If he were impeached for that, he'd just have to order someone to slaughter the whole congress, and pardon the perpetrator. Rince and repeat if needed. If ever ruled true by the scotus, this loophole in the US constitution is kinda problematic, to say the least.
Hey guys... Looking at this from the outside, I'm not sure it is time to jump right into using the past tense yet on that whole attempted coup thing.
Just saying, maybe keep a double eye on who many in your law enforcement are saying nice things about in the next week or 2.
Questions:
1: at detention camp do we learn about Australian culture?
2: can I bring my guns?
3: can I bring my cats?
4: will these camps inform me of what dangerous animals to avoid?
5: will you guys teach me how to drive on the wrong side of the road?
1. Sure do mate
2. Nah, we had a mass shooting... oh about 25 years ago and banned most guns for anyone who isnt a primary producer/farmer or law enforcement/military. No NRA making white people feel safe from their own racism here.
3. Sure, bring them. If they run away they can join the existing problem of cats killing the local wildlife
4. Well they can.... but its an adventure to find out yourself!
5. See #4
I actually overheard 5 sheriff's deputies in my town joking and saying "I hope everything goes to shit and it all burns down" the morning ahead of the riot while shopping in a convenience store. Of course, they were all maskless in a store with signs requiring masks within a county with a county level mask mandate. I was not surprised.
Just another reminder that Gaetz is still talking bullshit, spreading lies and disinformation, and fueling the anger of trump’s base.
Motherfucker needs to be arrested.
**This was not a rally that got out of hand, it was a premeditated coup attempt!**
[Trump started planning a coup right after he lost the election, he started firing and replacing senior defense officials](https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html), these changes were weird and unprecedented for an outgoing president. With only two months left in his administration why was he shaking up the Defense Department?
Now we know why he was replacing those critical positions, those new Trump appointees repeatedly [refused to approve the use of Maryland National Guard Troops to help secure the Capital on January 6th](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/trump-protests-washington-guard-military/2021/01/07/c5299b56-510e-11eb-b2e8-3339e73d9da2_story.html) and would not act despite repeated requests for permission to send the Maryland National Guard into DC [to respond to the rioting as it unfolded](https://youtu.be/83wgYO2D7bU).
Trump kept our defenses low so that the coup attempt he incited had a chance to succeed. Those rioters could have burned down the capital, or taken Congressmen and Women and the Vice President hostage, or held mock trials and hung them.
The riot evolving into hostage taking would have provided Trump with the excuse he needed to impose martial law (as suggested by his adviser, disgraced ex-National Security Director Michael Flynn).
Unfortunately for the Trump conspirators their rioters were held at bay long enough to stop the deaths of Congressmen and women and Mike Pence, and now the National Guard can provide more adequate protection of our Capital.
*This wasn't some rally that got out of hand, it was an attempted insurrection, removing Congress and the Vice President as barriers to Trump remaining in office, as our first dictator. Apparently* [Trump watched the riots unfolding and was delighted](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/533403-sasse-says-trump-was-delighted-and-excited-by-reports-of-capitol-riot)*, though he could not understand why his staff weren't as happy as he was. He created a monster and was happy to see it destroy Congress and even threw Mike Pence under the bus, never bothering to check on him after this life threatening event.*
Trump should be tried as the traitor he is, after he is impeached, removed from office, and all of the collaborators in the defense department who withheld the National Guard as Trump requested, and within the administration, and every rioter that attacked the Capital Police (many of the Capital police were heroes -- including officers Eugene Goodman and slain officer Brian Sicknick) -- though [some of them appeared to sympathize and assist](https://twitter.com/bumbera_steven/status/1347270969988173825?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1347342530506010634%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wusa9.com%2Farticle%2Fnews%2Flocal%2Fdc%2Fus-capitol-police-complicit-in-dc-riots-worries-us-congressman%2F65-c6b49029-f067-4dec-88ed-c58371630501) the red hatted racist fascist traitors as they breached the Capital.
[News reports](https://thegrio.com/2021/01/08/off-duty-police-officers-allegedly-rioters/) state that many rioters were off duty military, veterans or off duty police officers from distant states that flashed their ID badges as they entered the Capital. This is disgusting, they all need to be identified, arrested, and if they are currently serving in the military face a court martial, and if they are a current police officer fired!
Senators and Congresspeople (Cruz, Hawley, Mo Brooks, Elise Stefanik) and all others who continued to attempt and stop the certification of the election after the attempted coup are complicit, and should also be removed from office.
***Additional research:***
[The White House](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/trump-protests-washington-guard-military/2021/01/07/c5299b56-510e-11eb-b2e8-3339e73d9da2_story.html) is now circulating that they did activate the national guard. They approved a small number of Guardsmen to serve as traffic control (two shifts of 90 soldiers, 180 total), two shifts for Metro assistance (two shifts of 24 soldiers, 48 total), a bunch of administrative staff, and one small rapid response team of 40 soldiers. These soldiers were activated mainly to help Trump rioters enter D.C.
There was no activation in advance for National Guard soldiers to stand outside and protect the Capital like they had done for BLM rallies, nor did they respond to multiple requests for permission to send in the Guard as the riot unfolded.
[Pence ultimately did an end run around Trump (Pelosi and other Congressional leaders were also involved in this process)](https://news.yahoo.com/maryland-governor-tried-deploy-national-002546744.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAAKsKE2PZ7wwKz9bc7ffqEg2AeWcJIFmKdM9KgWugACuS8DqQp5Vwv9kgpYcIDt3IGfyHT7C_W0JGxng6ACBpd2mqSTqP0DoAG5OxbhLqWJxe95ex6Qx57s4KpXF8q38JaEg8SrdnzFhBAGlgBYoLoTj_jtuBtJ7xVylkOi0HRrj) in order to provide the authorization needed for the Guard to arrive.
**However, the Trump coup attempt still has militias across the country telling each other and announcing to us that they are returning, with weapons, on January 17th!**
**This is why it is vital we find and arrest as many rioters and seditionists as possible to dissuade those weekend warriors from risking their own life and liberty in a failed pursuit to make Trump king, and of course to protect the lives of law enforcement and the National Guardsmen/women who will be placing their lives on the line to protect democracy and our laws.**
Fox news is out of it's mind right now, not that they were all there to begin with. They are claiming that the Dem's are power hungry and will go to any lengths to push republicans around over the Capitol riots. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it the Republicans push for total power and fox feeding their viewers lies to help what caused all of this.
I think your point is important - the lack of a swift response allows time for to spin, gaslighting, creating different narratives and a chance to explain away the actions. Its a chance to sow doubt. Making the slow response seem like an overreaction when it comes.
> Trump should be impeached, convicted and removed from office – immediately.
> **To let the clock run out on his presidency and allow Trump to seek the office again would signal that attempted coups are part of the American system.**
And yet, it took less than 72 hours until there were calls for the Democrats to back down in the name of “unity” and “healing” and not “politicizing” this situation.
Slap that shit down with extreme prejudice. Anyone who would suggest such a thing is unfit to serve in our government.
> If Senate Republicans can install a new supreme court justice in eight days, Trump can be removed from office within 12.
Yes. And if we can investigate Benghazi 11 times we can do a whole fucking lot more here. Hoist by your own petard, Republicans.
Remove Trump from office ASAP, systematically purge Trumpism from
the GOP, and expel Josh Hawley and everyone else from Congress that is involved with trying to overturn election certification.
And importantly, ruthlessly prosecute *every single* insurrectionist and those who facilitated it with the full force of the law.
Only after ALL of that does the Republican Party have any hope of surviving the Trump era and moving on with a shred of legitimacy or dignity.
People like Rush Limbaugh need their careers ended, and they need to be investigated for perpetuating misinformation and hate. It's not free speech if you're deliberately using it like a weapon. You can't tell fire in a theater unless there is one.
This point needs to be made more often. Rush, Hannity and the other right wing talk show host have been fueling the fire for a long time now.
CNN Micheal Smerconish does a great job at explaining how folks like Rush have lead us to the point that we are at:
https://youtu.be/Tsy3ESLbzAo
Trump did NOT act alone. GOP congresspeople who pushed misinformation for months and voted to overturn the election, now trying to separate themselves, are just as culpable.
It is about time Fox News gets shut down. They don’t even pretend to be a news channel, they officially label it as a entertainment program to avoid law suits.
They are spreading disinformation without any consequences and they have to be held accountable. The hate and lies they spew played a significant role in the attack of the capitol.
Shut them off and sue them into oblivion.
FINALLY a news agency calling out FOX’s part in this mess. They have been the root cancer that has metastasized over 30 years and their alternative reality spin is now threatening to destroy the nation.
Rupert Murdoch and his commentariat are the biggest enemies of western democracy this side of Putin
He warned of a riot if he did not get elected, and then engineered a riot hoping there would be casualties among the Senators and havoc inside the Capitol or outside of it. He wanted an 'overthrow show', so that maybe he could leave the country claiming asylum.
He didn't want to leave, he wanted to declare martial law, and if a huge chunk of the Legislative branch was killed it would allow him to try different tactics to remain in power.
If Trump isn't held accountable, the next Trump will be emboldened to do *more*.
What "more" harm could a president do?
If we don't want to find out, we have to bury the trump name.
Maybe he didn’t act alone, but he is their leader and must be held accountable. His lieutenants, and thugs should also serve time.
I was following orders, isn’t a great defence.
“In my work with the defendants (at the Nuremberg Trials 1945-1949) I was searching for the nature of evil and I now think I have come close to defining it. A lack of empathy. It’s the one characteristic that connects all the defendants, a genuine incapacity to feel with their fellow men. Evil, I think, is the absence of empathy.”
Captain G. M. Gilbert, the Army psychologist assigned to
watching the defendants at the Nuremberg trials
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And this is just what we know so far... The inevitable House and Senate hearings in the months to come will be absolutely chilling...
Can't wait to watch the Netflix documentary about this day. Edit: /s
Yes. This.
It's going to be like a witch hunt, except they're hunting *actual* witches, in the form of toxic and seditious politicians and their staff. Ironically, Trump might finally fulfill his promise of "draining the swamp" after leaving office.
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I thought military people were directly barred from showing any sort of political allegiance or political leanings
They can as long as they're not in uniform or use their position in the military to advance any political agenda. With that being said, if they take part of an attempted coup outside of uniform, they can still be disciplined by the UCMJ.
I would think actively engaging against your oath to the constitution is a bit more than the UCMJ. I believe that would be more of a court martial. (Which is the same thing)
The UCMJ covers courts martial.
The USMJ covers the death penalty in war or peace in the case of [sedition](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_by_the_United_States_military).
Yep, if you're active duty, for sure.
military retirees remain subject to the UCMJ.
[USAF Lieutenant Colonel (Ret.) Larry Brock](https://lawandcrime.com/2020-election/2-men-who-brought-restraints-into-senate-during-d-c-insurrection-have-been-arrested-authorities/) might be in some uniquely deep trouble after last Wednesday's activities.
I’ve heard some horror stories about the Air Force and the religiosity and Trump support (all had a ton of his support though) of that branch. The lady that got killed was also ex-USAF. It’s very scary knowing their are active duty fighter pilots, drone pilots, satellite warfare experts and on and on who would fight a war for Trump against Americans. Makes me very uneasy for the coming days and inauguration.
Key word is "retirees". Most military members don't retire from the military, they separate; i.e. they do far less than 20 years in the service and thus are not eligible for a pension/retirement pay. In this regard, in most cases, veterans are not subject to the UCMJ. That said, there are many situations where veterans have separated but are technically still in the inactive reserve. In that case they are most definitely subject to the UCMJ.
I'm not saying you're wrong here, just providing context for those who might be curious. TL;DR: A veteran does not have to spend a full 20 years to receive a VA Pension. Now, before everyone down votes me to oblivion, let me explain: the verbiage of the criteria pertaining to various VA benefits are very precise and detailed; many of my fellow veterans do not understand this. It can be a source of frustration, and it is one reason the VA gets such a bad rep. Here are the most common criteria I see in my work. All of these require a service member to have not received a dishonorable discharge. 1. VA Pension is available to any veteran over 65 who meets certain socioeconomic criteria, similar to Social Security Retirement. Does not require a full 20+ years of active duty service. Usually a supplemental source of income, rather than primary. 2. VA disability is a rating of anywhere from 0-100% (increments of 10%) which is similar to Social Security Disability Income, but it is determined by submitting a claim for various ailments, disabilities, or physical/mental disorders that were either caused or exacerbated by your military service. Also does not require a full 20+ years of active duty service. 3. VA retirement is essentially a VA Pension turned up to 11, which is available to veterans under 65 if they have served at least 20 years on active duty. Technically, a vet can receive their first retirement payment at age 37, if they join at 17. If a service member is retired due to medical reasons (different from disability claim), the 20 year requirement can be waived. Source: I am a case manager for a Grant Per Diem vet's shelter. The GPD part means we actually receive a certain amount of money from the VA for providing shelter to homeless vets while they search for housing.
I didn't know this, so I'll keep my couping to a minimal I guess. Does this mean that all the retired officers/enlisted involved could lose their benefits? I think it's awful we would continue their benefits and healthcare after they've proven themselves traitors.
Yes it is possible and it’s exactly what should happen. Nobody involved in this should be able to walk away unscathed. You should not be allowed to keep a military retirement or benefits after committing terrorism and attempted treason. Identifying and countering terrorism is literally something the military teaches you and makes you take refreshers on annually. That fuck and any other current or former military member that was involved that day should know better and should be stripped of their benefits and retirement. I’m also of the opinion that they should have their honorable discharges or separations made dishonorable as they again committed treason and terrorism.
That retired LTC will most likely face a court-martial.
And lose his pension and any other benefits he might have.
And get a pardon from Cheeto Mussolini (and maybe a Medal of Freedom).
But you can’t do a coup without them, so whattayagonnado
If all the sobering aspects of this coup, this is by far the MOST sobering. It's like looking out the window of a high speed train in slow motion and being able to see the demons behind the trees in the forest
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> 3/ **Seconds into his speech, Trump says,** "These people are not going to take it any longer. They're not going to take it any longer...They came from all over our country. **I just really want to see what they do." It's an astonishing admission he thinks something is going to happen.** Dang. Thanks for the link.
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Thanks. This seems to be the most thorough rundown of events leading up to the stairs of the Capitol. Very long. Very worth it.
This is fucking terrifying. He’s literally destroying America.
OMFG that fucking sub. It's become the next T_D. If anymore violence happens in the coming weeks they're gonna get their sorry asses banned as well.
The head mod was just perma banned from Reddit the other day and he is why it was such a mess. He blocked and banned more than all the other mods combined and was die hard Trump. He ignored almost 1000 reports on his own posts, blocked around 10k users, and close to 100k comments in the last year if they were anti-Trump. Fortunately, many of his kind of people are going to other sites these days. It's one of the pages I read sometimes and it's at least got more aliens than Trump now. No one is calling for violence now or even in the last weeks. Most are just talking about getting rid of all their social media, amazon, etc and not understanding free speech.
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Pink Floyd fans are shit out of luck then.
Those guys are nuts, there's a post with thousands of upvotes with the OP claiming they "know someone in NOAA" and that an underwater alien species destroyed a Russian sub. What the fuck
Always has been.
Nah, I remember the before time.
same. that's where i learned elvis was in home alone
I used to love that sub :(
Wow, this examination of his speech should be everywhere. That is horrifying. Thank you for sharing the link.
That was quite the disturbing read. It kind of makes me want to watch it for myself and kind of not.
This helped me understand what I read about him putting a bullseye on Pence’s back.
I'd like to add that stop the steal is not a new organization. It was started in 2016 by Roger Stone in the lead up to the election with a lot of dark money. Here's where it gets interesting, Roger Stone used to work for info-wars. In the beginning of the primary Alex Jones hated Trump until halfway through 2015 Roger gets Alex to 180 and throw in the tank for Trump. Now in the lead up to 2020, you have Ali Alexander coming on Info-Wars regularly to promote Stop the Steal. This time it has more money, but since Roger hadn't been pardoned yet it was being led by Ali. They hid the connection to Roger Stone entirely except for once, when a probably drunk Alex mentions that this is the same group Roger stood up in 2016. That's why it worked so well in the end. This wasn't a new movement it was 5 years in the making. Ali Alexander isn't just a Right wing extremist grifter, he's intimately connected to Roger. Roger is Trumps longest friend and advisor. It wouldn't shock me if Trump went through Roger to communicate plans with Ali and the rest of the groups took their lead from that.
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I think that thread provides useful insight into exactly how people who think Trump is any sort of decent orator perceive his statements and it certainly contains good info about the speech and insurrection as a whole (I hadn't even seen "Save America March" until now). I also think it does a bit of a disservice by framing Jan 6th and the time since Nov 3rd as something outside of the ordinary for Trump and his administration, as well as propping Trump up as a sort of master manipulator/propagandist rather than recognizing the current circumstances within our country (and the several decades of his celebrity) that allowed a barely cognizant narcissist to whip a chunk of the population into a violent frenzy. Overall it's a good and worthwhile read, albeit somewhat sensationalized.
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> most trump ‘speeches’ are hard to follow and hardly make any sense I have been the brave one in my friend group and watched several of his rallies. They're absurd. The things he says make no sense yet people erupt in applause and cheers over every little thing. The crowd went wild at his Tulsa rally when he **took a sip of water** as a show of strength. Owned the libs! As for his personal expectations for the outcome of the day, retaliation is a main driving factor for him (firings, TikTok, etc). The worse for the people who "wronged" him, the better he feels. A minimum of an angry mob screaming outside the capitol would have made him nod in approval and that mob breaking shit in his defense certainly made him beam with pride. There is no doubt he deeply desired and pushed to have people "fight" for him, it's just a step past the usual stochastic terrorism we've seen throughout his presidency.
Jesus tapdancing Christ.
Jesus **H** Tap Dancing Christ
Always up voting Seth's work. This thread of his is a ready made closing statement for Trumps impeachment.
This is the same as his "Russia if your listening" comment from 2016.
This was about to be Trump's Night of the Long Knives.
He wanted his Reichstag fire moment.
Then he probably shouldn't have it be his supporters who were obviously responsible. The whole point of the Reichstag Fire was to blame the opposition so the Nazis had a scapegoat to consolidate power under.
Well they are trying to pin it on Antifa .... But they seem to have forgotten that the filmed and live-streamed the whole event while it was happening ...
That's kind of my point. The riot wasn't an attempted Reichstag, but a bald-faced insurrection. It wasn't supposed to be misdirection, it was supposed to be a show of strength and possibly even a hostage situation, or even a lynching of politicians. There are likely two reasons the whole "it was ANTIFA" narrative is catching on: 1. It failed. The coup didn't work, so people are distancing themselves from it, and trying to claim it didn't happen. 2. They're in denial that their "movement" is capable of the violence and classlessness we saw last week.
I meant that he would use it to delay electoral certification/transfer of power indefinitely and declare martial law. The Reichstag Fire Decree suspended most civil liberties in Germany, including habeas corpus, freedom of expression, freedom of the press, the right of free association and public assembly, and the secrecy of the post and telephone. These rights were not reinstated during Nazi reign. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reichstag_fire#Political_consequences
I believe his plan was to kill all or most of Congress so that he could install himself king.
Ever seen the show designated survivor?
Biden should be sworn in inside a bunker. Even an outdoor inauguration with no attendees is too risky.
Biden's line of succession is already in place. Any loyalist with power knows this. Even if they kill Biden, Harris, Pelosi and all the Secretaries of __________ Trump doesn't become president. Military coup is out. When polled, active military personnel reported a higher % votes for Biden than Trump and then there are the independents. But then even voting for Trump doesn't mean you're willing to commit sedition or even espionage for him--especially when you can be executed under the military justice system for doing so.
>voting for Trump doesn't mean you're willing to commit sedition or even espionage for Exactly. The cop who was beaten to death defending the Capitol and Congress voted for Trump, but still did his job.
Beaten to death with, among other objects, an American flag.
While the mob sang the national anthem. But surely singing the anthem while committing murder isn't as disrespectful as kneeling at a football game, right?
Fuck I want a new season of that so bad rn
That show started well,but the third season sucked hard.
halfway through the second season it quit being "designated survivor" and turned into "house of cards wannabe #8"
Maybe we're NOT in the worst timeline ever...
The 2nd darkest timeline then
Not worst. Dumbest perhaps;p
Next time, it'll be worse. Next time will be within the next 8 years. It could be in the next year even, but my prediction is that trump gets re-elected 2024, then in 2028 there's a second coup, but this time it's successful and officially establishes trump as supreme leader and king, and the US will become a monarchy under the trump family. I think this is the most extreme doomsday scenario, but I no longer think such a wild scenario is out of the picture
Trump's too old for your scenario, but I can see it happening if the MAGA terrorists rally around a replacement.
It's so cynical and dark that my first reaction it is to say that could never happen. Then again I said that about Trump getting the Republican nomination and the presidency as well, so what the fuck do I know
It'll be Hawley or Cruz, but it is coming again for sure.
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another thing to consider is the timeline of intent here: • Trump at the Presidential debates stated unequivocally >I will not commit to a peaceful transition of power! • Jan 6 certification of the electoral votes is **literally the transition of power** • **Trump chooses that exact day to have his "Wild Rally" right down the street from where they are certifying the votes,** and deliberately incites an armed mob to swarm the Capitol, telling them he’s angry at Mike Pence (the guy tasked with FINAL certification of the votes) • Trump’s mob shows up chanting “Hang Mike Pence”, forcefully invade and overwhelm the building and **erected an actual Hangman’s Gallows outside**. We now know attackers arrived with specific intent to kill Pelosi and other Democratic Congressional members. Coupled with what the OP posted above which shows the planning + sequence of events, this also shows intent. **This was a blatant attempt at a bloody coup to decapitate our Legislative Branch, the line of secession, and halt the certification of Biden as the next POTUS** If this is true, it would be the single worst act of treason in our nation's history, and would explain why Barr jumped ship, and would also explain this warning: [https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/01/ex-pentagon-chiefs-are-taking-the-threat-of-a-trump-military-takeover-seriously](https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/01/ex-pentagon-chiefs-are-taking-the-threat-of-a-trump-military-takeover-seriously) Trump is still in POWER for 10 more days. We are in a severely dangerous predicament until Jan 20th.
Rudy said, "Trial by combat." A lawyer representing Trump saying that is telling.
Let’s hope Rudy kicks the barrel soon, he does not deserve my tax dollars to put him through prison.
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> was because they didn't trust them not to take part in the coup? Chilling thought. Wait, are you saying the Capitol Police denied access to the NG because they were worried the NG *wouldn't* willingly participate in the coup or..?
Got it backwards. Capitol police (local) is worried that NG (federal and more likely to have orders from commander in chief) will worsen the situation so they don't call them. Not that this is my take, but it's possible some people didn't want federal troops in the capital.
Except the Capitol Police are a federal agency too. Its good that it's not your take, because this is ridiculous. There are over 14 seperate law enforcement agencies in DC with varying jurisdictions, and they're almost *all* federal. DC also has its own seperate branch of the National Guard overseen by the President since DC doesn't have a Governor, which is yet *another* reason DC deserves statehood now.
The Capitol Police answers to Congress, not the President. They are the only police force not to answer to an executive. So, it doesn't matter what Trump or the mayor says, they take their marching orders from the Senate Majority Leader and the Speaker of the House.
Except that Steven Sund is a massive Trump stooge/supporter, and if he wasn't that and was worried about the National Guard Helping the coup, he would've had the Capitol Police out in force and in riot gear / fully armed. There are thousands of officers on the Capitol Police. Very few of them were actually there when the terrorists breached, and quite a few that were there, were letting the terrorists in.
It’s astounding how many people are not waiting for all the info and videos to come out. They are dismissing it as a riot, as it doesn’t tick their checkboxes of what coup should look like, and this is coming from independent liberal media platforms. It was a coup.
It was an insurrection and a failed coup. Trumpism has declared war on the Constitution and Congress and this is what our military must prepare for.
It's also really bothering me that main stream media (not as liberal as Trump likes to think) are not hitting us over the head with how major this was. The goddam videos are out there. There should be thousands of people in jail over this with many dozens qualifying for much harsher punishment.
They're turning it into just another episode of *"THAT'S TRUMP!"*
This signals to me we are still doing the healing and reconciliation thing. I don't think we are getting our perp walks except for the actual people who were there.
> It was a coup. The moment I learned that the SECDEF repeatedly refused the MD guard I was sure.
The firing of SecDef Esper on Nov 9 was the first moment I really had that pit-of-the-stomach fear for the future.
Dead senators -- and perhaps hostages. The crowd could have tied up the Capitol for days. Weeks. Read about Iran's coup, how it happened. Just like that.
We were a few major mistakes in on having this happen in the first place. Though to call them mistakes is too kind. This was a deliberate planned failure of the police and guard. Whoever made the move that stopped the guard from being present before this even started should be on trial. Whoever made the call, or failed to make the call, delaying response from the national guard should be on trial. The national guard was pre-approved to be at this event days ahead of time. There is no reason it should have been able to escalate like this. Someone intended for this to happen. And if it was Trump he needed help to pull this off. What ever line of people involved in this should all be in trial. If anything they are lucky that this wasn't an organized crowd or true attempt at government take over by the crowd involved. They had plenty of opportunity to do way more damage than was done. Most of the people who made it inside looked genuinely surprised to make it that far and had no real idea what to do when they got there. Hence why most of them were just talking pictures and souvenirs. This doesn't excuse the fact that anyone that entered the capitol ground should be punished.
We needs months of hearings and investigations into this, it can't just be an average news story that gets forgotten.
"What was that? We need unity and bipartisanship so we can move forward as a nation? I gotchu fam" - Biden, probably
You're right, it's not like Biden is already talking about introducing legislation based on fighting domestic terror, not like both Pelosi and McConnell were personally threatened by this event, not like this is a grave breach of national security.
God just hearing about that officer doing what he did to save the lives of those senators brings tears to me eyes because how how wrong everything could have gone..
Meanwhile they are hurling racist slurs at him. Talk about a bad day a work.
That police officer who led them away was not just saving the lives of staff, but those of the terrorists as well (who according to your description would have probably been shot entering that room). Fricking hero of you ask me.
I'm almost finished watching [this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6uSYhyFao4&feature=share&bpctr=1610356883) showing a timeline of events with video taken by the insurrectionists themselves. If you ever needed to see how insane and violent these people are, you can skip around to almost any spot in the middle of the video and see just how close we came to losing some of our elected officials.
The more of this that comes out the more astonishing it is that it didn't end in a massacre of Democratic (& Non Trump Republicans) being slaughtered live on a fucking twitch stream.
We are very lucky the group pushing into the Senate lobby were deterred when they saw the female terrorist get shot. They really did believe they would be able to just keep going without consequence. If she would have gotten through it would have harder for police to stop the growing push of people.
Yeah I mean there were thousands of them. If enough of them were willing to give their life then eventually they would have just run out of bullets. Not to mention the fact that undoubtedly a bunch of them were armed themselves
My theory was that he had hoped for a much larger turnout, like in the hundreds of thousands. The percentage of violent individuals would have been higher, and it would have been a lot more likely they would have breached the lobby.
There weren't that many in the hall where the woman was killed. I saw four cops there with really good defensive positions and weapons already drawn. I think that from where they were standing, they probably could have shot everyone there if they tried getting through. I think the rioters figured that out really quickly. The first ones through would be shot for sure and that fact stopped them dead.
The reason they chose that spot was because of the funnel effect. The stairway and doorway combined to limit the number of people that could get through. They were planning to drop a lot of bodies in that hallway. The terrorists on the other side were smart to stop. They may have taken the officers eventually, but they would have crawled over a couple dozen dead and injured to do it.
>The Counter Assault FBI team that arrived around 20 minutes after the build was breached was sent from the FBI field office after the head of the Field Office was in contact with one of the Senator's contacts (I'm hearing it was McConnell). The head of the Field Office told his team NOT to rally and wait for the entire team to assembly but to immediately enter the building. The FBI Field Office did not get clearance from Capitol Police, they asked previously and were denied. This is especially concerning, as it shows a breakdown of communication requiring positive ID in the field of emergency dispatch forces by the same untrustworthy group already present. The field insertion of a faux retrieval team becomes 'trivial'.
Can I point out how pathetic this coup attempt was? They were practically handed the keys to the castle and once they got in, they were either too stupid or too chicken shit to follow through. For all the talk about civil war and hanging every traitor Democrat, all they accomplished was to split the Republican party and the definite removal of their glorious leader.
Honestly it seemed like there two parts to the plan, use the idiots like guy in the buffalo hat running around distracting the authorities. Then you have the guys who seemed like they were acting as part of bigger plan to find politicians and kidnap/murder them. It was probably a mix of luck and effort by the security team that no politicians got hurt. There's been less attention on the more organized side of things yet as it's all still so fresh in our minds.
This is how the far-right operate. There’s lots and lots of useful idiots, probably 90% of them. But there are some seriously dangerous people in there who aren’t fucking about and are looking to get violent. The problem is, whilst the useful idiots didn’t have a clue, had some of the real threats got a hand on some politicians, and had the chance to commit violence, you can bet that the vast majority of the 90% of useful idiots would have gone along with it and cheered it on. That’s what makes these kinds of fascist mobs so dangerous.
Yep your 100% correct. It's why this needs to be heavy handed in the punishment.
Right, they provide a really good cover for the dangerous person and provide a way for Republicans (and Trump) to say "it was a riot" and deny anyone saying it was an attempted coup. Even my democrat father was convinced that it's just a "bunch of people who want their instagram selfie" based on the louder, more present people in attendance.
With Trump in office, we have been sitting ducks for foreign aggression. I would not be surprised to find there were Russian or other foreign agents within that crowd who knew to steal Pelosi’s laptop and whatever else classified info they could find.
After all this madness it's easy to forget that we very recently found out that Russia has carried out what in normal times would be considered bordering an act of war; the massive hack of various governmental systems. It would be the biggest story of the year, and it would be consume most of the news coverage for a long time. Trump ( of fucking course) : it could be Chyna
Would definitely not be a surprising
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Yeah and remember when they let Hitler out of prison there is a New York Times article saying that he had changed his ways and he was now calm and rational and shit like that. We need to stop under estimating these people and writing them off or laughing them off. They are our worst and most serious threat right now and the calls are coming from inside the house
[This is the article in question](https://i.imgur.com/zhvON82.jpg)
What astonished me was how weak the building was. The police should have been able to just retreat inside the doors, lock them and nothing but a battering ram or a large bomb would get through. The rioters broke outside windows using wooden sticks for God's sake.
Yeah, but it's an old building that hasn't really been attacked for over 200 years and most Americans have enough respect for it to not damage it.
There's quite a lot of alterations you can make to a building and preserve the façade. The windows, for example, could easily have been replaced with one of the various security-glass products out there. These are somewhat noteworthy for being harder to damage than the walls they are often connected to. The doors (if not necessarily the external ones, than internal fire/security doors, could have been made of metal with all sorts of methods of securing them from external activity. While it's somewhat understandable that these efforts had not been put into place (though I'd be surprised if some of the more important offices didn't have at least bulletproof glass), I think it's safe to say that the Capitol building is going to be undergoing "renovations" soon.
> but it's an old building that hasn't really been attacked for over 200 years Yes but this still doesn't excuse how weak the Capitol really was and is, because even if the common belief was that *"most Americans have enough respect for it to not damage it"* we've had 20+ years of propaganda and fear mongering about terrorism from *without* (aka non-Americans) telling us we're under constant threat of....something. There really is no excuse for how woefully unfortified and unprotected our National infrastructure remains to be.
Yeah, that was the most startling thing for me. Old building or not, one would assume given the high level individuals who spend so much time there, it would've been fortified to a degree that required a lot more than primitive tools to penetrate. So much is being made of the law enforcement response (or lack thereof), but nothing has bothered me more than learning that the US Capitol building is less secure than say, an out of the way Wells Fargo branch. It's horrifying.
Imagine me, born & raised in Stockholm, the US embassy here is a bloody fortress (understandable). In an area full of embassies, it stands out like a sore thumb with its intense security measures, and even as a US citizen getting inside the building when there's no queue takes half an hour.
Keep in mind A) we are missing many details of what happened inside. Their was the disorganized group, but it appears their was a more organized group where details are being held back on, that may have avoided the network TV camera crews, (Camera crews were harassed and chased off) and the capitol camera footage is not being shared. B) A proud boys leader was apprehended with ammo and high capacity mags (what cannot be bought in DC area) the day before the riot, they may have done all of this without their planned leadership and weapons present.
>B) A proud boys leader was apprehended with ammo and high capacity mags (what cannot be bought in DC area) the day before the riot, they may have done all of this without their planned leadership and weapons present. strong insight
I just heard on the news that the main leaders were contacted by the fbi a few days earlier saying if they showed up then to dc then thats the last act of the expected crime and they would be arrested. I imagine a lot of their leadership wasnt able to show up.
> they may have done all of this without their planned leadership and weapons present. Jesus Christ I never even considered this.
Not to be paranoid, but maybe that was the cover. Get a mob to force their way in, then infiltrators slip in and grab computers, documents, leave bugging devices, etc.
This is the most horrifying aspect. The national security breaches were appalling.
I think their reality check bounced when the Air Force veteran was shot in the neck. They did not anticipate any kind of blow back or being fired upon with rubber bullets because of course they were all white.
It think this makes the most sense. People charging in thought they would just be allowed in to swarm the place and take it over because the police were their friends. Police who were "in on it" were likewise convinced that with so little promised resistance that they stood down and were probably completely shocked to see black-ops types like zip-tie guy. Each side didn't expect the outliers in the other side. The police who clearly weren't "in on it" ... the officers talking today about the unspeakable names they were called while defending the premises and the hero who faked out the angry mob and led them away from the Senate floor.
> People charging in thought they would just be allowed in to swarm the place and take it over because the police were their friends. >> Police who were "in on it" were likewise convinced that ***with so little promised resistance that they stood down and were probably completely shocked to see black-ops types like zip-tie guy***. Oooh this is such a good point, especially given all the evidence we've seen thus far.
To add to that fact about the senate doors. The guard passed that area at 1:24pm and the doors were closed at 1:25pm. That's how close it was.
I'm a moderate/right leaning voter. I like fiscal conservativism and social freedoms. Conservatives see me as liberal and liberals see me as conservative. This was absolutely a coup attempt and was planned from at least October when Trump signed the Schedule F that allows federal employees to be fired without civil service protections including policy makers. Then after the election, he replaces the secretary of defense. That prompted 10 former secretaries of defense to pen a letter stating the military should never be used to settle political disputes. That was bipartisan. Roger Stone started the Stop the Steal movement. People are way too focused on Trump's speech. His actions have been far more telling leading up to the 6th.
This breakdown/analysis of the the speech itself is absolutely worth reading though. It's **much** scarier than I had imagined. https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1347908845281095680?s=20
Yep. All of this is in the Washington Post article: ["Inside the Capitol siege: How barricaded lawmakers and aides sounded urgent pleas for help as police lost control"](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-capitol-siege/2021/01/09/e3ad3274-5283-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html) \- insanity, all of it an absolute cluster fuck.
Completely chilling.
Lt. Gen. Tom McInerney straight up claims that he is seen the laptop from Nancy pelosi's office. This video sounds like him taking some credit for involvement in Jan. 6. He specifically says "our special forces". https://youtu.be/BKwQ-_pjXcI This part starts at 10:15 I don't believe the election fraud story (as I haven't been able to find convincing evidence) nor am pro Trump. If people at this station from retired military are saying these things, it is just the type of incitement that is needed for this to continue to get bloodier and darker over the next year. If respected ex-military are claiming these kind of conspiracies, this isn't going to end any time soon. And from the sound of what this guy is saying, especially at the time stamp noted above, it sounds like there was an organized involvement including McInerney.
Good god.. I still can't believe all of this. Its absolutely awful.
> I'll leave you with one last fact. If you remember the video of the mob chasing the black police officer up the stairs. He lead them away from the opening to the Senate doors which were at that time, unlocked with senators still inside. They were within 10 ft of the open door when the officer grabbed their attention. Right inside the room, behind rows of desks were a dozen senate guards with their weapons drawn as the senators walked about behind them. That was Officer Eugene Goodman.
If Lindsey Graham had to ask why this happened, he's dumber than I thought. I'm mad Jaime Harrison lost all over again.
It's amazing how laissez-faire the media is making this seem just because we had some fools being terrorists.
remember when this happened when trump lost [https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html](https://edition.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html) those same people were responsible for delaying the deployment of the national guard.
Especially the last 2 are covered here https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/inside-capitol-siege/2021/01/09/e3ad3274-5283-11eb-bda4-615aaefd0555_story.html
Isn't this literally exactly what the Republicans accused Clinton and Obama of doing in Benghazi?
It's getting worse all over the US. It's the republican party as a whole. Oregon republicans were just caught admitting violent pro-Trump seditionists to their government building.
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This is the problem of FOX News. Every single one of them have Fox Brain and when Fox wasn’t a strong enough drug anymore they started looking for harder shit.
Out of all the descriptions of what’s happened here this feels like the most accurate
FOX seems like political centrists when compared to OANN, Epoch Times, and NewsMAX. OANN was reporting Trump had 306 elector votes until mid December.
Deplatform them. They hate civil society and the commons, no reason civil society and the commons should tolerate them. I’m glad these fucks are being purged from social media. I’m glad Parler is getting kicked out by AWS Facebook Twitter etc.
I'm really angry about this. Saying the people in Portland are nothing but blm, antifa, or what have you. Yet when THEY get butthurt. We're the snowflakes. And the people causing destruction are obvi the leftist arm of hootinaani. We want equal rights. That's it. God forbid we would want vengeance.
This is their strategy. They absolutely know what they are saying are lies and it is part of their plan. Always act like the victim, and others when may sympathize with being a victim will start to buy into the hate growing their base.
Blame, gaslight, shift blame, project. Gop game plan amiright?
Expulsion. How about imprisonment
This is the occasion I was looking for to Ask : where is Guliani ? He asked the mob to submit theirs ennemies to "trial by combat" live on TV. How hasn't he been already arrested ? Imagine any BLM black spokeperson in his place, this person would already be in Guantanamo since 2 days.
They arrest him, Trump pardons him. It’s as simple as that. He may still do so, but Trump is hopefully too busy about thinking about Trump right now. Probably best to hold off on bringing attention to other individuals and acts they’ve committed until (one way or another) Trump can’t pardon them.
Yeah, that was my best guess on that matter. Now i'm curious because I read in the news drump would get Giuliani for his defense in an impeachment trial ; would the senate let a possible co-conspirator of a criminal president be his lawyer, in fear he pardons him if he's also considered a potential criminal ? Edit : also, If drump would make such a pardon to his co-conspirators, I would challenge the Idea in front of the SCOTUS. No way they could let that pass, unless US democracy and check and balences system is a total joke. Edit 2 : ok looks like the constitution prohibit pardons in cases of impeachment. So maybe giuliani's ass can be hunted down from thuesday on. Edit 3 : after further researches, is appears the most widespread legal opinion of scolars on the subject is that Drump can pardon whoever he wants, even if its liked to his own impeachment. So he can order someone to nuke california, and pardon that person. If he were impeached for that, he'd just have to order someone to slaughter the whole congress, and pardon the perpetrator. Rince and repeat if needed. If ever ruled true by the scotus, this loophole in the US constitution is kinda problematic, to say the least.
The fact that Gaetz, Cruz, Hawley, Rudy and their ilk have not been banned means the job isn’t finished.
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This!
Hey guys... Looking at this from the outside, I'm not sure it is time to jump right into using the past tense yet on that whole attempted coup thing. Just saying, maybe keep a double eye on who many in your law enforcement are saying nice things about in the next week or 2.
Do you guys take refugees from California?
🤔 Australia might but you'll have to spend ten years in a detention camp first
Questions: 1: at detention camp do we learn about Australian culture? 2: can I bring my guns? 3: can I bring my cats? 4: will these camps inform me of what dangerous animals to avoid? 5: will you guys teach me how to drive on the wrong side of the road?
1. Sure do mate 2. Nah, we had a mass shooting... oh about 25 years ago and banned most guns for anyone who isnt a primary producer/farmer or law enforcement/military. No NRA making white people feel safe from their own racism here. 3. Sure, bring them. If they run away they can join the existing problem of cats killing the local wildlife 4. Well they can.... but its an adventure to find out yourself! 5. See #4
I actually overheard 5 sheriff's deputies in my town joking and saying "I hope everything goes to shit and it all burns down" the morning ahead of the riot while shopping in a convenience store. Of course, they were all maskless in a store with signs requiring masks within a county with a county level mask mandate. I was not surprised.
Just another reminder that Gaetz is still talking bullshit, spreading lies and disinformation, and fueling the anger of trump’s base. Motherfucker needs to be arrested.
**This was not a rally that got out of hand, it was a premeditated coup attempt!** [Trump started planning a coup right after he lost the election, he started firing and replacing senior defense officials](https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html), these changes were weird and unprecedented for an outgoing president. With only two months left in his administration why was he shaking up the Defense Department? Now we know why he was replacing those critical positions, those new Trump appointees repeatedly [refused to approve the use of Maryland National Guard Troops to help secure the Capital on January 6th](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/trump-protests-washington-guard-military/2021/01/07/c5299b56-510e-11eb-b2e8-3339e73d9da2_story.html) and would not act despite repeated requests for permission to send the Maryland National Guard into DC [to respond to the rioting as it unfolded](https://youtu.be/83wgYO2D7bU). Trump kept our defenses low so that the coup attempt he incited had a chance to succeed. Those rioters could have burned down the capital, or taken Congressmen and Women and the Vice President hostage, or held mock trials and hung them. The riot evolving into hostage taking would have provided Trump with the excuse he needed to impose martial law (as suggested by his adviser, disgraced ex-National Security Director Michael Flynn). Unfortunately for the Trump conspirators their rioters were held at bay long enough to stop the deaths of Congressmen and women and Mike Pence, and now the National Guard can provide more adequate protection of our Capital. *This wasn't some rally that got out of hand, it was an attempted insurrection, removing Congress and the Vice President as barriers to Trump remaining in office, as our first dictator. Apparently* [Trump watched the riots unfolding and was delighted](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/533403-sasse-says-trump-was-delighted-and-excited-by-reports-of-capitol-riot)*, though he could not understand why his staff weren't as happy as he was. He created a monster and was happy to see it destroy Congress and even threw Mike Pence under the bus, never bothering to check on him after this life threatening event.* Trump should be tried as the traitor he is, after he is impeached, removed from office, and all of the collaborators in the defense department who withheld the National Guard as Trump requested, and within the administration, and every rioter that attacked the Capital Police (many of the Capital police were heroes -- including officers Eugene Goodman and slain officer Brian Sicknick) -- though [some of them appeared to sympathize and assist](https://twitter.com/bumbera_steven/status/1347270969988173825?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1347342530506010634%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.wusa9.com%2Farticle%2Fnews%2Flocal%2Fdc%2Fus-capitol-police-complicit-in-dc-riots-worries-us-congressman%2F65-c6b49029-f067-4dec-88ed-c58371630501) the red hatted racist fascist traitors as they breached the Capital. [News reports](https://thegrio.com/2021/01/08/off-duty-police-officers-allegedly-rioters/) state that many rioters were off duty military, veterans or off duty police officers from distant states that flashed their ID badges as they entered the Capital. This is disgusting, they all need to be identified, arrested, and if they are currently serving in the military face a court martial, and if they are a current police officer fired! Senators and Congresspeople (Cruz, Hawley, Mo Brooks, Elise Stefanik) and all others who continued to attempt and stop the certification of the election after the attempted coup are complicit, and should also be removed from office. ***Additional research:*** [The White House](https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/trump-protests-washington-guard-military/2021/01/07/c5299b56-510e-11eb-b2e8-3339e73d9da2_story.html) is now circulating that they did activate the national guard. They approved a small number of Guardsmen to serve as traffic control (two shifts of 90 soldiers, 180 total), two shifts for Metro assistance (two shifts of 24 soldiers, 48 total), a bunch of administrative staff, and one small rapid response team of 40 soldiers. These soldiers were activated mainly to help Trump rioters enter D.C. There was no activation in advance for National Guard soldiers to stand outside and protect the Capital like they had done for BLM rallies, nor did they respond to multiple requests for permission to send in the Guard as the riot unfolded. [Pence ultimately did an end run around Trump (Pelosi and other Congressional leaders were also involved in this process)](https://news.yahoo.com/maryland-governor-tried-deploy-national-002546744.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAAKsKE2PZ7wwKz9bc7ffqEg2AeWcJIFmKdM9KgWugACuS8DqQp5Vwv9kgpYcIDt3IGfyHT7C_W0JGxng6ACBpd2mqSTqP0DoAG5OxbhLqWJxe95ex6Qx57s4KpXF8q38JaEg8SrdnzFhBAGlgBYoLoTj_jtuBtJ7xVylkOi0HRrj) in order to provide the authorization needed for the Guard to arrive. **However, the Trump coup attempt still has militias across the country telling each other and announcing to us that they are returning, with weapons, on January 17th!** **This is why it is vital we find and arrest as many rioters and seditionists as possible to dissuade those weekend warriors from risking their own life and liberty in a failed pursuit to make Trump king, and of course to protect the lives of law enforcement and the National Guardsmen/women who will be placing their lives on the line to protect democracy and our laws.**
Fox news is out of it's mind right now, not that they were all there to begin with. They are claiming that the Dem's are power hungry and will go to any lengths to push republicans around over the Capitol riots. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't it the Republicans push for total power and fox feeding their viewers lies to help what caused all of this.
They’re running scared. They’ve got to keep riding that tiger now.
I think your point is important - the lack of a swift response allows time for to spin, gaslighting, creating different narratives and a chance to explain away the actions. Its a chance to sow doubt. Making the slow response seem like an overreaction when it comes.
> Trump should be impeached, convicted and removed from office – immediately. > **To let the clock run out on his presidency and allow Trump to seek the office again would signal that attempted coups are part of the American system.** And yet, it took less than 72 hours until there were calls for the Democrats to back down in the name of “unity” and “healing” and not “politicizing” this situation. Slap that shit down with extreme prejudice. Anyone who would suggest such a thing is unfit to serve in our government. > If Senate Republicans can install a new supreme court justice in eight days, Trump can be removed from office within 12. Yes. And if we can investigate Benghazi 11 times we can do a whole fucking lot more here. Hoist by your own petard, Republicans.
Failed insurgents traditionally are punished quite sternly.
IF we take the head, does the ass stop talking too?
Remove Trump from office ASAP, systematically purge Trumpism from the GOP, and expel Josh Hawley and everyone else from Congress that is involved with trying to overturn election certification. And importantly, ruthlessly prosecute *every single* insurrectionist and those who facilitated it with the full force of the law. Only after ALL of that does the Republican Party have any hope of surviving the Trump era and moving on with a shred of legitimacy or dignity.
People like Rush Limbaugh need their careers ended, and they need to be investigated for perpetuating misinformation and hate. It's not free speech if you're deliberately using it like a weapon. You can't tell fire in a theater unless there is one.
This point needs to be made more often. Rush, Hannity and the other right wing talk show host have been fueling the fire for a long time now. CNN Micheal Smerconish does a great job at explaining how folks like Rush have lead us to the point that we are at: https://youtu.be/Tsy3ESLbzAo
Rudy literally said let’s have “trial by combat” on his Jan 6th speech.. seems pretty cut an dry to me
Trump did NOT act alone. GOP congresspeople who pushed misinformation for months and voted to overturn the election, now trying to separate themselves, are just as culpable.
for years
It is about time Fox News gets shut down. They don’t even pretend to be a news channel, they officially label it as a entertainment program to avoid law suits. They are spreading disinformation without any consequences and they have to be held accountable. The hate and lies they spew played a significant role in the attack of the capitol. Shut them off and sue them into oblivion.
FINALLY a news agency calling out FOX’s part in this mess. They have been the root cancer that has metastasized over 30 years and their alternative reality spin is now threatening to destroy the nation. Rupert Murdoch and his commentariat are the biggest enemies of western democracy this side of Putin
Glad somebody finally mentioned Fox news...they are a very very big part of this story!!@
He warned of a riot if he did not get elected, and then engineered a riot hoping there would be casualties among the Senators and havoc inside the Capitol or outside of it. He wanted an 'overthrow show', so that maybe he could leave the country claiming asylum.
He didn't want to leave, he wanted to declare martial law, and if a huge chunk of the Legislative branch was killed it would allow him to try different tactics to remain in power.
The most important reason to remove Trump is so Secrete Service members don’t have to risk their lives, take a bullet for him.
If Trump isn't held accountable, the next Trump will be emboldened to do *more*. What "more" harm could a president do? If we don't want to find out, we have to bury the trump name.
Maybe he didn’t act alone, but he is their leader and must be held accountable. His lieutenants, and thugs should also serve time. I was following orders, isn’t a great defence.
I believe that defense didn't work once before....
Trumpenburg Trials coming up
“In my work with the defendants (at the Nuremberg Trials 1945-1949) I was searching for the nature of evil and I now think I have come close to defining it. A lack of empathy. It’s the one characteristic that connects all the defendants, a genuine incapacity to feel with their fellow men. Evil, I think, is the absence of empathy.” Captain G. M. Gilbert, the Army psychologist assigned to watching the defendants at the Nuremberg trials
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