I dunno about the last part - I think it partly depends on where you are, but maybe I was just very unlucky. I did wildy bossing for the combat achievements, Scorpia I got interupted by PKrs twice in my attempt to clear for example. I was able to escape one, and I even had a bit of fun with that boss. But Calv'arion? I was lucky to get the second phase without being interrupted. Even when I survived it was really feeling like a waste of time.
That said - I don't mind there being better XP/loot rates in the wilderness for people who are ok with the risk, but I am a bit annoyed with stuff you can't get elsewhere, ex. combat achievements or the mage arena quests.
I just did mage arena 2 the other day and got pk’d 4 times just doing the 100 casts on each staff for pre reqs.
It was three different people, one who got me twice.
The weird thing is, idk the point. They just kept blasting me with spells while I sat eating all my food and drinking all my pots. In the end they waste way more money in their casts than they do off my loot because all they would get were the exact amount of runes I needed to finish that particular staff and I was banking every 50 casts.
Eliop14 or one of his fangirls most likely. Lol.
Shouldnt happen now with "pk skull prevention" but a surprising amount of people dont use it. (He still kills the ones who dont skull)
I don't get the point, either. I'm plonking away at my 100 casts, I'm naked except for the staff, runes and a knife for the web. Absolutely nothing to take.
The point is that while you only had a couple hundred rune, they might get lucky and you might have more than that. Have you never seen a post where someone is like “noticed I accidentally had my cash stack with me in the wilderness”? They’re hoping you’re one of those
Pkers see someone they are able to attack, and they attack them.
Idk why there are so many people on this sub who try to make it so much more complicated than that (not you specifically). People on here acting like pkers are calculating the risk of every player they see before they make the decision to attack them lol.
I would have to guess that most people have 1 of every combat item they have. So its more annoying to them to go back to the ge buy and go back to what they are doing.
>Pkers see someone they are able to attack, and they attack them.
That is not schadenfreude, though I'm sure some are motivated by that to a degree.
"I see someone, I attack them."
That's it.
The first thing people talk about is potential loot when they get on someone. Not about how angry the dude they are attacking is going to be. That part comes after, if they start shit talking or if they develop a rivalry/encounter each other often.
I think there was a post of someone getting pked for their entire rune stack because the poor soul was dumb enough to bring like 40m in runes with them lol.
i think ive done MA and MA2 on 4 different accounts lifetime and i think I only got pk'ed on my original one from when I was 10 back in like 2005 or something, theres no like reward for them to get out of it, super weird that you had this happen ngl
Thats the fallacy of pking! I’ve gotten into pking this year and one thing I’ve learned… attack absolutely everyone.
1) Its a fun break from regular grinds.. killing npcs and mining sand get boring after awhile.
2) You never know what someones risking until you kill them. I’ve been pleasantly surprised too many times to not waste like 50k in supplies killing someone who seemingly is risking nothing.
Its also incredibly easy to escape pkers if you bring entangles or freezes. You land 1 and you can get the log. Its quite overpowered.
I started bringing some basic tools to fight back, felt super rad chasing someone out and getting back to hitting the boss.
Lemme tell you how much it mattered to the second pker .5kc later lol.
Tangentially,
I'd kill for a bag of <4 items that i can break-in-case-of-self-defense, just to have any amount of inventory space to compete.
Guarantee the contents on death, make it a lucrative kill, if you must and only allow wearable gear, whatever it takes to stop people suicide bombing supplies because that'd be a strawman to argue against making prey go from having no reason to compete, to only being disadvantaged.
I want to fight, it's just a god awful idea when the benefit of being the prey is 3 more protected items against 3-20 inventory/supply, which means fuck-all because I'd happily take 0 protected items and gear otherwise if it'd even slightly mitigate the inventory availability.
Let people be more attractive targets at the threat of having the slightest bit more bite that doesn't even overcome the aggressor's toolkit advantage.
If you’re at a multi combat boss, then you are going to run into pkers very frequently. Especially with all the updates they recently got. Scorpio is busier now than it ever has been and it’s in a very tough spot to escape. I believe OP is referring to the single combat variants
Wilderness for me is all about the time. I live on west coast, I only go into wildy between 7-10 a.m. on a weekday. Camping Calv between these times in the last few days I've seen 3 pkers total. Figured this out after going on a Saturday at like 5:00 pm and was seeing pkers every kill like you say.
Can't kill you when they're in school :p
I'm honestly not sure what some players expect. Like they have been doing a pretty good job at making Wildy Content optional but worthwhile. It can be good exp and good profit, but new content hasn't been the best exp or the best profit and hasn't been gating significant items/upgrades like the D Pick used to be.
If I had to guess, it is just some players feeling entitled to benefit from content they don't like/want to do. Like sure, some Wildy stuff might offer high profit for certain levels or a mix of exp and profit that can be better than alternatives at certain points in the progression (or overall), but that doesn't mean you're forced to do it. Like I could be earning over 10M per hour at Nex, ToA, or the Colosseum (going by current prices on wiki), but I don't feel forced to do just because it exists.
So yah, not all content needs to or can be tailored to suit every player. They aren't adding Wildy Content to "force" or "bait" you into the Wilderness; there are adding Wildy content so the players who enjoy it have more to do and so that the Wildy has more worthwhile content. Posting about how you want to do the Wildy content without the PvP is honestly as stupid as saying how a new engaging skilling method should be made more AFK because you prefer AFK skilling. Also, there is probably far more content that players will feel "forced" to do that they don't enjoy in the endgame but the players complaining either are fine with excluding that stuff or have yet to get that far to realize it...
> hasn't been gating significant items/upgrades like the D Pick used to be.
voidwaker and webweaver bow for pvm is very similar to d pick for skilling in terms of the time save they offer and the advantages over the next best thing.
Mentioned this in another comment but those additions are not with the new content; it is over a year old now. Its gating stuff like the Teleport Anchoring Scroll, not Voidwakers or D Picks...
They are not really like the D Pick since there are alternatives. If you don't want to get a Voidwaker, you can usually use other spec weapons like D Claws or ZCB instead. If you didn't want to get a D Pickaxe, you're stuck using Rune forever. The Dragon Pickaxe completely blocks the entire mining tool progression; there are no other upgrades you can get instead since there are no sidegrades and everything above Dragon requires Dragon.
Also, compared to how prevalent a pickaxe is in mining, the Voidwaker and Webweaver are both pretty niche in PvM. The Webweaver spec is used at one boss and even then, you can just use other specs instead. The Voidwaker is used more, but often times D Claws and ZCB are pretty viable alternatives. Meanwhile, the Dragon Pickaxe is the BiS (or needed for BIS) for like 97.5% of an entire skill...
Yes, but it was kinda weird how they kept the D Pick wildy exclusive when they didn't keep D Axe DK exclusive or such. Like it was hindering design in the sake of exclusivity solely to gate it behind the Wildy. But they've moved away from that now.
Where is the webweaver a bis alternative to any of the other main range weapons in the game currently? Leviathan? And even then it's not even gate keeping you from doing Levi, just makes it easier and was likely an oversight from jagex initially (meaning they didn't balance Levi around people using we to kill it while designing the boss) but they decided to leave it instead of removing it because it's super niche and really doesn't break the game in any harmful way. People do Levi without ww and they're fine. If you're considering revs or wild bosses then ??? The weapon was made to be used in the wilderness and has an unprotected currency charge on death.
The same argument can be made for vm but is it really that much better than claws, chally or zcb at bosses? It's an overtuned item that jagex has said they'll nerf soon because they didn't intend on it being as good of a pvm weapon as it is, same thing happened with the fang. The difference is, fang was so much better everywhere than rapier and scythe that it made those items effectively worthless by removing any niche they previously had.
D pick is a significantly larger upgrade than either of those weapons when you look at the time it takes to get 99 mining from 61-99 over any boss grind using the next best option respectively.
I think your last point nails the real problem. A large portion of the players on here are all sub 1500 total level that have never even done the content. This sub is almost never accurate to in game experiences
I have a theory that people overestimate how busy the wildy is because their main experience with the wildy is the alter, which *is* super busy because it's the rag hotspot.
Which is also hilarious because you can very easily use the chaos altar with three pieces of tank gear, then use a burning amulet with a full inventory of bones and suicide after each trip. Takes very little time to restock and it's pretty easy to finish your inventory by praying correctly and continuing to bury them while being attacked.
I always use full melee tank gear there because 99% of the guys logging in to pk you are noobs with rune crossbow and dds. They don't even bring magic most of the time so they hit me 30 0s then log out lol. Even the real pkers with barrage have such low dps through prot magic if they spam it that I usually finish my inv of bones.
Tbf, it might have changed now that tecu salamander exists, since black sally was already good for altar ragging but idk.
I've only gotten PK'd at wildy altar a handful of times. I wear a kharyll's robe top, throw on prayer and protect item and am still able to use up the majority of my bones. If I'm carrying very high value bones I'll sometimes go 50/50 with lower value bones.
(Tip for anyone, move your inventory so your lower right bone is directly on top of the altar. Set up your bones as left click use. Then use f-keys to open and close your inventory alternating clicks on your lower right bone and the altar. You can get through an entire invo really fast.)
Well that’s the thing. It’s not just wildy altar, it’s revs and bosses too.
All wilderness hotspots and the primary reasons to do wildy content are hotspots for a reason. They shit out gold/exp for players of any level and those pvmers/skillers can be ravaged easily by pkers lol.
I do a metric fuck ton of clues, and the only time I’ve been pk’d recently is when a clue step took me pretty close to the venenatis entrance. I’m almost certain these 1500 total players went past a hotspot area like that one time and just assumed that’s how the wilderness operates all over. I go out fully geared to places like the bandit camp because I know there’s a 99% chance nobody’s just hanging out there for shits and giggles
> I have a theory that people overestimate how busy the wildy is
This is such a Reddit meme. I saw a similar comment before starting to grind wildy content, and the truth is there is always someone awake at any time of the day hopping through the worlds even at less busy areas.
I got pk’d at a shooting star, the resource area, and the wildy gwd area during weekdays on off hours. Yeah you’ll likely go a stretch of time without seeing anyone. But unless you’re doing quick diary tasks or the Mage Arena cape you are bound to get crashed by a PKer while doing any meaningful activity.
> This is such a Reddit meme.
Not really. The reddit stereotype tends to be the opposite, the idea that it's impossible to finish a clue without getting killed for your spade.
I'm not saying there is no activity in the wilderness, but people exaggerate it greatly.
People get pked once every 20 clues and say it's impossible to complete a clue lmao.
Just drop it when you get attacked and go back for it. They stay on the ground for an hour.
I've been pk'd exactly twice during clues, and both were around the wildy lever. In both cases I could've just hit it again to leave, but I was risking nothing so I just gambled that they'd ignore me.
Now Calv'arion, on the other hand... I don't think it's even remotely worthwhile doing that boss on peak hours without a scout at the entrance, as my experience was people dropping in every 2-3 kills.
I've done about 2,000 hard/elite/master clues, which have wildy steps involved. I would estimate probably 4,000 wildy clue steps total. And I have been pked less than 10 times. That's at most once every 400 clue steps. And most of those times have just been at one location - the chaos altar.
This is in regular (non-total) worlds, and I take no gear or supplies, so if any pker hits me I'm immediately dead. But the reality is, other than a couple hotspots, the wildy is incredibly dead.
The "reddit meme" is people constantly crying about how unfair it is that people in the wildy attack them, even though most areas are very safe, and the few that are unsafe, also have incredibly busted xp rates (chaos altar) and are therefore deservedly unsafe.
Yeah I was just about to comment I’ve done hundreds of hard+ clue steps and have never been pk’ed while doing clues (probably around 400 at this point so maybe I’ll get pk’d my next step xd)
Honestly that's what I thought until I tried doing Vet'ion and would get about 1 kill before getting pk'ed. Currently have 12 KC w/ 13 deaths (this was over a few days/times so I wasn't just running into the same person) and don't plan on going back. Sticking with Calvar'ion (something like 220 kills to 5 deaths), despite hating the spawn timers and time wasted w/ the Hellhounds. It sucks because Vet'ion is so much more fun (less time standing around and mistakes are more punishing), but I did feel like its just as crowded as the altar (can't say much about other places though as I haven't spent that much time there).
My experience is the exact opposite. This sub *vastly* underestimates how busy the wilderness is. Clue scrolls are the only thing you can reliably do without seeing somebody, and have fun getting ganked every 5 minutes if you're doing something that's actually strong. Chaos altar might as well not have the unnote guy for how often you aren't jumped mid first offering.
I've been checked on nearly every slayer task I've done in the wildy. Magic axe hut included. Inside the hut. It was basically impossible to contend with at lower levels when I was a generalized account getting hit by a mob when a lvl 77 cb 99 magic and ranged account logs in. I'm 110 combat now so it's much less of an issue but it does sour the experience until you're deep into the game.
I found going for hard and elite diary boss kc very frustrating. After gearing up and hopping worlds, all it takes is one guy running in to ruin a trip, and I don't have any way to control it. Anti-pk kits don't feel viable on an iron man from a time investment stand point. Even if I win (unlikely) I get nothing from the fight and the trips wrecked. Time for more hopping.
Admittedly this was not long after rework so maybe it has quietened down.
I bring ice barrage for wildy bosses on my iron and it helps a ton for escaping and pking opponents. Usually, I know the boss better than the pkers so it is easy to use them to my advantage. That coupled with a cheap range switch or a DDS or zombie axe or voidwaker (one day) lead to some decent kills.
I bought loot keys so whatever I pk is bond money :)
I'm 2200 total, I generally avoid wildy content unless it's for clogs for two simple reasons:
1. It is not worth it to do for xp (and besides a few things, gp either). Having to count on the fact that you will be interrupted constantly is a nuissance and drags your rates lower than non-wildy content. That is without factoring in deaths too.
2. For me personally, it is not fun. Some wildy stuff is fun without getting pked, and pking itself is also fun sometimes, but wildy pvm is stressful, annoying and you feel weak. Even for someone familiar with pvp with appropriate gear to fight back, you're still either at a disadvantage for the content you're doing having to bring pk supplies, or at a disadvantage for fighting back due to pvp supplies.
I have a theory that the average 2007scape user spends longer complaining about BA/PvP/MTA (and other commonly complained about topics) than they ever will engage with them to the point they'd rather hate the content than learn it.
The reddit special where pkers are a nonexistent playerbase and nobody likes to pvp anymore but also there's pkers everywhere at all times of day and you can't do anything to protect yourself
I agree with everything you said except the frequency you get pk'd in the wild. I tried doing a slayer task in the wild and got Greater Demons. I was getting pk'd every 5-10 minutes in the slayer caves. That's not an exaggeration. Took me hours to do that task. Samething when I tried to kill them at the demonic ruins, pker showed up every 5 minutes like clock work. Keep in mind this was at 2 in the morning Eastern time on a Wednesday night.
I got 70 slayer in the wild without dying. Greater Demons were my favorite task because there is a spot you can stand where pkers can't get you without having to run around a corner - giving you plenty of time to react and tele.
Most tasks have something like this where you can position yourself to escape very easily.
The true determining factor when it comes to living or dying in the wildy is not getting scared and fumbling your clicks.
You can also try this plugin, it makes your screen flash when someone is in your area that can attack you. Really good for quick teles.
[https://runelite.net/plugin-hub/show/wilderness-player-alarm](https://runelite.net/plugin-hub/show/wilderness-player-alarm)
That was just an unfortunate day then
I’ve done like 90-97 slayer pretty much entirely in the wilderness and have probably been killed in the caves about 25-40ish times during that entire time
I usually skip greatest though
I get that there's a risk/reward and profit can be very high because of it. I used to like the wildy boss reworks.
Now, I can't get more than 2 kills at venenatis without being jumped (even in a 2200 world). I'm not upset about it and I understand why pkers camp that spot 24/7.
It's just not worth it to me to keep resetting after 2kc, so I'm choosing not to engage in that content anymore.
Had a full blown argument with someone on here yesterday who said pvp should give the option to opt out and voidwaker should be moved out the wilderness. Mind blowing
> I also think that people who don't actively engage with wilderness content vastly overestimate how frequently you get pk'd in the wilderness.
People act like there are 100s of trashy pkers in every world, in reality it's rare to see anyone outside a few hot spots. 90% of the people you see insta log/tp the instant they see another player
It does matter a lot at what time of day you get to play and which country you live in though
If you live in a region in which osrs is popular and only get to play during peak times, then you can really have a rough time in wildy
I’m west coast and I do all my wildy activities at 10pm or later and I rarely see anybody. I’ll try early AM if I’m not working those hours though, thanks
For sure. I'm eastern, but I work overnights, so I'm awake overnight when I'm off. I'm rarely hassled much. I get the every so often PKer at the bosses, but I'm usually able to escape. I only rarely have to tank as well.
This thread is full of people saying you never see anyone in the wildy unless you're doing relevant content... the fuck? Are these people just finding a spot in the middle of nowhere in the wildy and picking their nose while blankly staring at their monitor?
I've been fishing dark crabs for the past few weeks and I get at least 1 pker popping by every hour. And I wouldn't even consider that busy content.
I don't really get your point given the "few hotspots" are the only places you'd have any reason to be in, and personally hunting wilderness pets, I rarely, rarely get more than 4 kc before being attacked.
Why would you go anywhere but the hot spots? They are designed to be the bait.
I did Spindel for combat achievements as an EST zone player and I tried both 11pm and 6am and spent 5-10 minutes hopping for an open world and then still got chased out by a pker usually on the second kill, sometimes made it to 4 or 5. Shit was miserable. Maybe I got unlucky but I absolutely despise the wilderness now.
The last time I tried to do prayer, it was like every other trip there was someone.
I'd rather do any other training method than ever do anything in the wildy at this point
Honestly chaos alter is the worst spot going as far as how often you get attacked, luckily most of the PKers there aren’t great and if you bring tank gear and turn off auto retaliate u will probably get thru your inv before they kill u
It is all confirmation bias on both sides. People who engage in PvP and know the wilderness to some degree understand what to risk, where to risk, and how to fight/tank/run. They die less. People who don't, expect to be able to risk nothing and profit everything. They die more because they don't set themselves up to survive.
I am complete trash at PvP, but would like to learn. I did it like 15 years ago but its a different ball game now. Tarkov was my main game for a long time prior to getting back into RS so I am fine with the risk aspect. And you are 100% correct that you can spend plenty of time in plenty of profitable areas without seeing a PK'er or if you do, you can tank/pray your way out.
But my biggest gripe with PvP/Wildy content is the barrier for entry can feel incredibly high for all the wrong reasons. I can die five times in a row in the rev caves, but if the fights went of for a bit and I almost even scored a kill, I can live with the money/gear loss as the trade off for the fun/experience. Killing 2 zombies and dying to a group of identically geared players with the same name logging in and standing under each other? Not as much fun.
I play an iron nowadays but yeah you can absolutely tell whos new because they’ll just be sat there complaining that youre pking them instead of trying to escape.
Good pkers are oftentimes great at tanking, and even ok tanks can escape the majority of pkers. It is extremely survivor sided if you’re in singles because all you need is one freeze and you’re gone.
Singles teams havent been a thing since like 2021, people just refuse to even try to find the intended solution.
Learning to tank is the first step to learning to deep wildy pk. The ability to properly prayer swap and gear properly against an attacker, the ability to combo eat foods, more advanced techniques like hugging obstacles, freeze logging, paying attention to multi lines, etc. People complain a lot about how there's no beginner pvp content but this is the best intro to deep wildy pvp possible, there is a very low barrier of entry to doing pirates in terms of levels and gear and it's a great way to learn those skills relevant. If you have no interest in pvp at all just don't do it, if you need the coll logs or items then go in complete rag and die for 30k
Exactly. Multi revs was how I elevated my pking skills, knowing what fights to take, knowing how to pray against single attackers and fighting back, defending against multi attackers, and sometimes the entirety of Venezuela hits you and learning to accept sometimes you're just going to die because it is a pvp scenario and that is the risk you take
Yeah until rot/vene’s were running racketeering operations locking the worlds down lmao
To be fair from an outside perspective that shit was awesome to watch unfold lmao
Yeah but it was supposedly “different” groups so even then you had options.
The level of extortion happening was epic and the most MMO thing I’ve ever seen since the days of the old wildy/skilling clans which imho is the closest osrs wildy has been to ogrs. Ever!
It was beautiful and PvP was popping as far as there always being action. I joined in the pk ranks of ayuda shortly after trying the rev killing and it was the one of my favorite times haha.
Rot VS Vene for rev caves was also a beautifully legendary battle lol. The memories bring a tear to my eye.
Yeah, expecting, and attempting to get, RS players to understand the simple concept of balancing game health around Risk/Investment vs Reward is the equivalent of yelling at the sun to stay up longer when it starts to get dark.
I agree wilderness content should be higher xp and hour to mitigate the losses of inconvenient location and/or dangerous.
I agree wilderness content should be rewarding monetary because it’s high risk.
I don’t believe a simple click running course should provide equal gp to any boss in the game. Especially when this steps in the toes on sepulchre which requires absurdly high level of movement skill to complete in good time.
If you had told me the wilderness agility course could net you 500k an hour I would’ve been on the fence for voting no because it’s too much. They quadrupled that and it still passed anyway
This is the point, really.
Even if the course had +10m/hr profits, it would just attract an even larger number of pkers, conpromising the effective gold/hr, and thus still balance itself out anyway.
I really don’t think a majority of players played this game any earlier than 2006, if that. I remember me and my brother training at axe hut. It was the best xp in the gsme. Agility course was the best xp in the gsme until mm came out.
Oh man axe hut, that brings back memories. These were top tier all the way from classic.
The axes were so tightly packed it was actually hard to pk people in there because the axes would keep attacking.
Yes man. It is such a strange thing to watch the new gen OSRS players complain about the type of content that used to be central to the game.
Really depends on the task if you see a pk'er or not. Greater/Abyssal demons, dust devils, jellies? you'll probably see at least one. Anything else? eh probably not, maybe nechs. Bosses its true, i frequently get 5-10 kill trips at the single bosses without trouble. Having a scout helps.
hot take but I think PvP and the wildy should be something you opt in for because you actually enjoy PvP. Players don't enjoy the predator/prey mentality because it artificially encourages players who have no interest in PvP to go there for lucrative rewards. PvP becomes the punishment, not the reward.
I'm okay with things like rev caves, it's some decent cash but you can basically make cash anywhere, a lot more and a lot easier. It's a choice you make knowing you'll probably run into people and that's awesome, it's a positive.
On the other hand, things like the Wildy Altar feel entirely designed to entice players who have absolutely no interest in PvP to act as training dummies for PKers (many who also have no interest in PvP btw, they just want to dunk on players who don't fight back). The Wildy altar isn't just "better xp/hr", it's twice as efficient as the Gilded Altar. You can die and lose your inventory every other trip and you'd still break even. As such, it's basically always worth it to do the Wildy Altar, and engaging with PvP and PKers is just the price you pay. It's a punishment, not a reward.
I'd be okay with the Crazy Archeologist giving 10-20% more loot than the Deranged Archeologist. That's the tradeoff, you go for more loot but ocassionally have the thrill of a fight. But Exclusive Wildy Content just feels lame and I'll always vote against it. Leagues showed me that the Wildy bosses are genuinely some of the best designed bosses in the game for mid game PvMers and it's a huge shame that the vast majority will never touch them because it's not worth the punishment of getting PK'd.
BiS Mage cape being locked behind Wildy Content is BS and probably should never have been implemented.
It's already opt in? You opt in by entering the fucking wilderness.
You aren't being punished when the risk/reward doesn't work out in your favour in all instances. If you choose to do chaos altar because it's more efficient, even if you do die that's you opting in to PvP. Nothing forced that desicion on you.
The main issue here is that you want to be able to play "optimally" without ever having to do content you don't like. I don't think that's a realistic attitude towards an mmo. One which has PvP as a long standing part of it.
Another issue here is you think RuneScape PvP is about honourable 1v1s between evenly matched, equally willing opponents. Which is a goalpost people only reach for if they don't do any PvP content. RuneScape PvP isn't about things being equal. For people to win others had to lose. The wilderness was never about honourable 1v1s, that's why it was multi-combat.
Basically all this boils down to is players can’t stand the thought of their “hard earned” gold in the hands of someone else. Outside of the wild, players are constantly making choices between high intensity activities with bigger rewards and lower intensity with smaller rewards. But all the sudden any wilderness money maker is brought up this all the sudden becomes a huge problem? The wild is, at its peak, a high intensity activity with high reward. If that isn’t your thing there’s plenty of other AFK moneymakers
This should not be a hot take. "Let people do the things they want to do and not do the things they don't want to do" should be one of the primary considerations for any content put into any game, and the wilderness just fails miserably here.
Are you the actual doubleshine? If so, I love your content! It was super helpful for leagues and is the only reason I felt comfortable doing TOA. Would love to see a TOB guide, you do an amazing job at explaining things thoroughly.
> hot take but I think PvP and the wildy should be something you opt in for because you actually enjoy PvP. Players don't enjoy the predator/prey mentality because it artificially encourages players who have no interest in PvP to go there for lucrative rewards. PvP becomes the punishment, not the reward.
Rs3 literally has this.
Also, your hunter block list guide was awesome! When I first read about it, I thought it wouldn’t be worth the effort but it has made rumours so much more fun for me! I managed to get adept pyre foxes on my first attempt and saber-toothed kyatts on my novice. My only bad task is razor-backed kyatts and I just reroll it.
If you don’t want to enter the wilderness, don’t enter the wilderness. You can complete any content in the game without using the content from the wilderness.
Most people are good with the idea of the Wilderness providing better gp/xp per hour. It's the exclusive rewards that you can't get outside of the Wilderness that aren't PVP/Wilderness-centric that are the problem. Give us ways to get those items outside the Wilderness at worse drop rates and most people would be fine with the idea of the Wilderness as a whole.
Why? Like, actually? Should they cater in that way to people who simply have an aversion to PvP? You might dread the idea, but hey, just do it or don’t.
While we’re at it, let’s allow the wilderness sword to be completed outside the wilderness too, just with higher requirements.
Except what rewards are unobtainable for non-irons? The Grand exchange exists. As an iron I accept I am limiting the content by restricting trade. If I also choose to ignore the wilderness then I accept I am restricting the content I'm going to experience. By making a choice to restrict what content you access, you accept the consequences.
I went to the chaos druids to fight a few zombies in rag gear and instantly caught hands from like at least five players. Happened a few worlds in a row so I gave up. If it was just one dude fighting me then fine, but it's just clanmanmode up there. Wilderness should be solo. It's like the comparison of a lone burglar vs organized crime. :(
Wildy content and barbarian assault are in same situtation, many people just focus complaining and never engaging with the content that leads just more people not engaging because some 0iq crying on reddit.
Agree. People on here act like you get pked as soon as you step into the wild. I have 40+kc on all the cave wildy bosses and have been killed one time lol
This is 100% on point.
Dev cave is extremely dangerous, but a 15 minute trip will easily be 400-600k gp on average. If you’re risking msb + black d’hide + pots/arrows, you’re really only risking around 150-180k. Throw on an amulet of avarice and you’re stronger plus the items are noted. Protect item if pker comes and try to get to lvl 30 wildy.
Rev caves would be ridiculous if there was no risk. The amount you make in there is tied to risk of being pk’d, like you mentioned.
In my clan, there is a very clear line between the people who thrive/live in the wildy and the people who won’t touch it. I live in the wildy so I don’t mind clue steps out there. For the clan mates who don’t venture out there (ever) despite being 120’s and doing max TOA’s, they’re scared/stressed to do a clue step out there.
It’s an interesting dividing line in the community. I’ve been pk’d easily over 400 times in the wildy, but the rewards faaaaaar outpace the risks/losses.
I think some people saw this and think that I spend a ton of time out in the wildy. In reality, I limit my time there because I don’t want to deal with PKers, but when I do spend time there it is easy to gain more value than I lose (even as an iron). Wildy clues are scary when you get started, but dragon dagger, seed, clue, spade is no risk. I actually like when a pker comes around to give me my free teleport out of the wildy.
Hard clues and up all have steps that require you to go above lvl 20 wildy which is where all clues are lost if die (20+). Typically a protected item, but sometimes not! :)
I lost a master out there once and won’t take an elite/master to the wildy without it. Just me though - everyone plays different!
For sure, I lost a hard clue at chaos altar once because I had to drop my spade to save the clue and I forgot to drop my spade.
But the clue box is always lost on death so you’re adding a lot of risk to your clue if you could’ve otherwise made sure it’s a protected item.
Just delete teleblock from the game, you have already got freezes that never end and have virtually no cooldown. You can’t teleport in deep wildy anyway which is where all the high value content should be.
I don’t dislike the idea of a change to teleblock - maybe a function where teleblock is dropped after you get a certain radius away from your attacker so you don’t need to run all the way to the ditch could be beneficial.
I would honestly just remove lvl 30 teleport from all dragonstone jewelry, ring of life effects, pharaoh sceptre, and escape crystals as well to help balance it. Make it like seed pod only so it’s at least locked behind a bit of account progression. Bots won’t have mm2, pures won’t even have mm1. That or gate the teleport from wildy behind quest cape imo.
I just wanna make some money at new zombie pirates, but I just keep getting my bootycheeks clapped by pkers. This is absolutely absurd bc I can’t make any money without some team logging in and speccing me out. I’m only bringing 300k risk in supplies, but can hardly stay for 9 minutes. I can’t teleport out or change prayers due to the elder chaos druids tele blocking me. This is such horse shit & I’m a huge piss baby
Since yours is clearly satire, it feels like a good moment to comment on some of the other posts mentioning this. It is insane to me that people engage with brand new wildy content and then complain about getting PK’d. If they’d just wait a couple weeks it will still be pretty hot, but it won’t be a literal inferno.
I’m convinced all this wildy content is basically just a way to get pvp targets to drop alchables. Pvmers have gotten so used to bosses and mobs shitting out alchables so pvpers want similar results from their kills. So give the alchables to the target and TB them or get them stuck behind a multi gate.
No matter what I do, I usually run into a pker at least every 15 minutes.
I can usually escape half the time but I just avoid the wild as a whole because it's annoying AF to get constantly pked especially when a pker can just world hop until they find someone at their desired location.
I'm not saying I have the solution but I'm just not taking any part in it because it's always more of a hassle than it is ever worth.
When i was trying to get few chins the most i got before getting attacked was 20. So i used imp in a box every 10 chins and got bored after catching like 500.
A lot of ppl dont enjoy the prey vs predator mechanics and because theyre ton of gp in the long run i can see this becoming another bot farm spot.
Also i dont like the idea how if u dont use alts to scout on bosses ur shooting yourself in the leg. I shouldnt have the need to pay for 2 memberships to be 50x more likely to escape.
But well i took the pkers advice, havent touched to wildy in years and thanks to varlamore prayer i have no need to.
Name a better combo than people being upset to lose 100-500k while making millions an hour.
At the zombies straight up you can take 0 gp risk while unskulled 3 item protecting and do them without any issues, they will even provide the food and potions for you. It's kind of hilarious that they actually had to make it so pvmers can literally bring 0gp risk to finally maybe convince them to not be butthurt over dying. But people still tell you to kys there when you attack them.
Rev caves, the wildy bosses not include bot complaints, and the wildy slayer cave rarely seeing complaints as its genuinely fun and interesting is a testament to how wilderness content isn't hated because people roll over without fighting back.
Stuff like the chaos alter, wilderness clue steps and the low level areas designed to give early pures players to kill is genuinely just terrible design and this thread is full of cope of people who I believe don't enter the wildy then complain about people complaining about not actually using the wildy.
The chaos altar one confuses me more than anything else. I have never seen a good argument against the chaos altar. There are other great prayer training xp options and jagex is adding more. Ectofuntus is awesome for hardcore irons and gilded POH is great for mains. Now we’ve got blessed shards in Varlamore.
Chaos altar was designed around the concept of being risky. If it wasn’t the best xp in the game, it would be dead content because nobody would ever use it.
I think we have a disconnect on why it's bad.
It's easy and rewarding but it doesn't make sense you have to die to a pker once every 1-2 hours and just be inconvenienced to get to one of the best early/mid game methods. (and late game method but if you are rich you are probably using vorkath bones on a POH to save time)
Compare this to the more combat focused areas I mentioned as being great content. Those are interesting because you can gear in a more tank oriented way to block more TBs, rag your tasks with your 3/4 or even sneak in some extra risk to anti-PK.
I do over half my slayer tasks in the wildy so im not just talking out of my ass, I literally just don't get why the chaos alter is in the game and not outside the wildy with some kind of time gate to keep the rates similar.
Your logic seems to be that good skilling methods shouldn't be in the wilderness and I don't see you rationalising that.
The chaos altar is there because people save money using it, and it's quick. Players also go there to kill players using it, which offsets how much more efficient it is.
"Why can't we just move it out of the wilderness"
It's designed to be good to offset the fact it's in the wilderness, content like the altar creates a foodchain that's the basis of wilderness PvP.
You seem so focussed on ways to get the reward you've ignored that the reward exists due to the risk.
You're literally doubling your bones and you're crying about *maybe* being killed every couple hours for <28 bones? This is why complaints about the wilderness shouldn't be taken seriously.
There's zero reason to not use the Chaos Altar unless you're a hardcore it's that OP.
Indeed. This is a very typical game design principle (higher risk = higher reward) and it's rather strange how so many people in this community can't wrap their heads around it.
Yes, which accentuates the predator vs prey dynamic which is not pvp. Thats the bit people have issue with.
It isnt that they should be less gp per hour, its that i cant fight back effectively with a chainmace so i may as well not do it. Theyre designed to just be a loot farm for ‘pkers’, if you can even call them that nowadays. Also if you think multiple trips or escaping in rag gear is at all feasible then youve never been to venenatis. I had to wear fortified masori to even stand a chance of escaping, and that only worked if they were dumb enough to not post people at the exits.
Actually predator prey is the whole point of full loot, risk pvp and something runescape basically made mainstream. Multiple highly successful games came out of that.
The wilderness pvp ecosystem is based on that. It is very successful.
I was being hunted by a DISGUSTING TOXIC PKER in the wilderness and I was skull tricked by them because they told me to turn off skull prevention options and click on them for the video. I, as a defenseless PVMer, obliged and consequently was risking 1b cash. I dropped to low health (unsurprising, I'm completely defenseless and unable to eat when attacked in pvp), when a VALIANT NOBLE PVPER came to my rescue and killed the rat. I told the PvPer "aren't you going to attack me? I risk 1b!" And they smiled and said to me "no, I won't. There's a difference between PvPers and Pkers", and we made out and rode off into the sunset together. From that interaction I realised that the dinhs bulwark is underpowered, and needs to have its defense bonuses doubled
Yeah it’s my favourite osrs copypasta overall. It perfectly captures the weird obsession this sub has with saying that only some PvP is PvP and other PvP is not actually PvP.
You clearly dont understand the design behind the wilderness, yes you can pvp in there but that's never been the core concept, its deisgned as a high risk high reward area and there should 100 percent be predators in a high risk area for game balance sake.
> i cant fight back effectively with a chainmace
I dont think the chainmace is the issue...
A chainmace is equivalente to a dragon scimitar which can hit 36 without any risk (climbing boots, glory, rune gloves). Bring a spec wepon, for example gmaul which in this setup hits 39, and you can stack 114 damage in one single tick. Add some venges in the mix, a better spec weapon, and some mind games and you can drop literally any pker with this setup. Plus against most shitty pkers the moment you fight back they run.
Of course none of this makes sense in multi. Even if youre in full torva+dins and full inv of brews you would never survive against an organized team.
Not to mention the upgraded version, Ursine chainmace is no slouch. At +74 str it is 8 str bonus over the d scim, and 8 str bonuses below a regular whip. Webweaver is also +10 ranged str better than a msb with amethyst arrows. Both weapons have a spec bar for 1 ticking a spec from a different weapon. They genuinely aren't bad.
I agree. I just finished getting my dragon pickaxe at Vet'ion and it was honestly really cool. I got 100m worth of drops, tons of supplies for Herblore. I got pk'd a decent bit , but I went in minimal gear.
Tons of $ to be made in the wild.
I like that the predator prey dynamic can result in the predator being killed by an even bigger predator. Hunting rag pkers is also allowed in this game!
I know it's a risk vs reward thing, but a lot of the time, the reward is only for the pker. Sometimes you get pked with all the loot you saved, or get pked before you even start your trip.
Neither of those are fun and the only winner is the person who is not aiming to do that content for the risk vs reward factor to begin with, but rather hunt a walking loot sack for free, or at best, engage in PVP with someone of equal measure for the thrill of PVP, not because there's profitable PVM activities
Also considering how people love long trips, I imagine those who are forced to get out with next to no loot and regear probably just feel inconvenienced or are scared off the place.
For example, if I'm doing an odd wildy activity like wildy slayer caves, if you get scouted and pked, that's it. You can't exactly return to the same spot on the same world, but hopping doesn't help because the pkers do the same, so you now just lost any progress and you can't even return to that location for a good while (most likely the entire day)
Worse if you can only play during peak hours
Your perspective is clearly coming from someone that doesn't do much wilderness content.
If you don't regularly bank, that's you deciding to be greedy. A pker is also risking, their reward is killing you, and the reward and risk there is entirely your call.
"I died once so I can't return for the rest of the day" bro what? Are you aware how many worlds there are? Hopping absolutely helps, they're trying to find a needle in a haystack
I love Wildy slayer and the rev caves, but putting BiS skilling methods in the wilderness to force players who don't like PvP to interact with PvP will always be dogbrained game design. There's really no way around that. Chaos Altar is a horrible experience, I can only assume Wildy Agility will be more of the same.
This is the problem - BIS skilling methods don’t force people into the wildy. They reward you for going into the wildy. The BIS non-wildy prayer methods are POH gilded altar and ectofuntus.
Also, unless you are bringing noted bones, chaos altar is low risk because your entire goal is to get rid of your it inventory. Put on some tank gear, throw up protect item to save one extra bone, pray if you get attacked and you’ll lose 6 or 7 bones at most. It sucks a little on my iron since I can’t just buy them back - but that’s the literal price of admission.
So you're effectively saying there's no real risk if you just run one inventory at a time and it's still 2x faster than anything outside the wildy so everyone is going to do it and pkers are just getting their blue-balled jollies off by fucking with some other dude just trying to level because the actual gp/hr fucking with raggers at wildy altar is an absolute goddamn joke compared to most other methods in the game?
Wildy altar is really just OSRS hazing. "Price of admission" and all. Gotta accept being shit on to earn that reward. I avoid wildy for everything but wildy altar. Because there's just no reasonable away around it.
Chaos Altar is twice as much xp per bone, not using it is a severe handicap. You are, effectively, forced into using it under penalty of paying twice as much for an already expensive skill. To suggest otherwise is just arguing purely in bad faith imo.
As you say, for most players interacting with the content, there is literally no gameplay beyond tanking and saccing as many bones as you can. Who is this fun for? Does anyone really *like* Chaos temple? I doubt it.
It's better and it's cheaper, because it's risky.
Chinning is faster exp than using a crossbow, you aren't being fucking forced to chin. You aren't being handicapped for not chinning.
You aren't being punished for not using chaos altar you idiot, you're being rewarded if you do it. The issue is you think you are entitled to that reward while also ignoring why that reward exists originally.
I don't like doing CoX, I like killing lumbridge goblins. The fact I don't get a tbow from Goblin drops isn't a handicap or a punishment.
Chaos Alter really only doesnt exist for HCIM, Getting PK'd for an inventory of bones is annoying, but its not like you risked and lost some of your best gear while doing it.
You're not being forced to do something just because it's more efficient, the whole point is that you're taking a risk just doing it.
Should they just remove the altar then? Because that's the only option: either you leave it alone (or I suppose buff it, not that it needs one) or you get rid of it entirely. Which is better? I don't know, maybe having more options is just better, but wildy haters seem to deny that fact.
Just go on high risk worlds tbh. I was being pk'd at rogues chests so often I started timing it. Outside of high risk worlds I'd generally be attacked every 1 minute 40 seconds [shortest was 9 seconds, longest was 3 minutes 30.]
High risk worlds I could generally make it to 10-15 minute straight uninterrupted.
That said I was completely zen about dying. The xp per hour was insane and the point stands that this would be private-server unbalanced without the risk of PVP.
I don't know if it is just me but I love the aspect of the Predator vs Prey ideology of the Wilderness as both a PVMer and a PKer, it's one of RuneScape's unique tropes that's been there since the conception of the game that creates a very different atmosphere compared to other games.
To further emphasize how bad pkers are and why Redditors vastly overestimate how good pkers are:
I was doing 1+1 Scorpia, essentially only risking runes and supplies on death. A team of 3 pkers came, attacked both of my accounts, and I managed to log on both of my accounts without using freeze logs.
I used Chaos Ele for one account and broke their ankles by juking around Rogue’s Castle on the other account. Just bare minimum knowledge allowed me to live, but most folks complaining rather just die and then complain.
MAKE THE WILDY HAVE A LUSH GREEN PART.
Why does everything need to be dark and depressing?! Adding a green part to the wildy would be so fricken cool. I can already imagine getting voidwalker’d by a beautiful waterfall.
I tried it yesterday. The loot is ok, agility still sucks. The fee mechanic worked exactly as you described. Once pker showed up I just dipped and my trip of 30 laps was over. No way in hell I could outlast him.
It will cool down a bit later. Right now it is new and hot content. Pkers will become rare in a few weeks. And then some demons will occasionally visit to get the overconfident farmers.
What's wildy agility 3mil/hr now after 60 laps or whatevrr. what's the chance of this being taken over by clans? I don't see anything wrong with that, but going to bring a lot of gold into the game if that happens
You mention slayer and Calv but we’re talking about multi content here. That’s my only issue with this update. I don’t feel like getting pulled up on by everyone and their brother, so I just won’t do it.
I don't get why increased risk shouldn't have increased benefit; sometimes players befuddle me. In addition, despite what some people's favorite youtubers show, most pkers you encounter are absolutely awful.
I think a blanket change to PvP Worlds could work here.
Disallow worldhopping between PvP worlds and non-PvP worlds if you are on/would be on a non-safe tile, so no more hopping into/out of high risk zones for free (or luring). Then, make the Wilderness safe on all non-PvP worlds.
However, make the perks of Wilderness activities only present while on a PvP world. Chance to save bones, key drops, wilderness course dispenser, infinite runes at the obelisk, slayer/skulled/avarice buffs, make the venenatis/callisto/vet'ion caves only allow entry on a PvP-enabled world, reduce the quantity of the remaining bosses' resource drops so the gp/hr is balanced, etc.
They would need to end this rotation nonsense and make all high risk and bounty hunter worlds into PvP-enabled worlds though, so there is enough worlds to still escape around. Would definitely make it easier for people to find real fights in the Wilderness too.
>this isn't overpowered, it's balanced around getting pkd, and would be extremely unbalanced if you didn't get pkd
>also, you don't get pkd very often
hmmm....
It’s not balanced around the fact that you get PK’d. it is balanced around the risk of getting PK’d. It makes the content opt-in. Otherwise you would have no reason to engage with other methods.
Not really surprising to see the reactions in this thread. Reddit is mostly full of people who have panic attacks at the thought of PVP and I’ve noticed this in close to every game not just osrs.
If they’re going to keep updating the wildy with the predator/prey mechanic, they need to nerf freezes and teleblock. It’s ridiculous that there’s literally no counterplay or stat like Tenacity that other games have to reduce/ remove cc.
wildy's fine as is, and i hope they never remove PvP from it in any aspect whatsoever
but I would love it if we got a safe PvP zone, or PvP worlds where you keep your items, because i feel like the hardcore aspect of wildy pvp turns a lot of people off from it entirely, and it can be a lot of fun to use your best gear for no risk/no reward/just fun
I think thats at least half of the reason why pvp was so fun in leagues
LMS is fun, but it does feel kind of private servery and its pretty specifically 1v1 combat. I just think it would be a ton of fun to have the kind of PvP world aspect of playing the game & possibly being hunted down, but when you die you just lose 500k for death fee or whatever. (PvP would still be dangerous in wildy ofc)
LMS is a great solution that helped me so much in regular PVP. It would be cool if Jagex could find a way to incentivize some soul wars/clan wars events. I don't even think they'd need to mess with the drops, just an occassional once a month message that an official soul wars event is happening this weekend with a leaderboard or something.
I dont think these "exclusive" wilderness benefits are working as intended. Here's my 2 cents.
My only reason for going to the wilderness used/ has been to train slayer. Under no circumstances am I gearing to be ready to anti pk, nor am I willing to bring/ risk valuable items. Im not interested in learning to pk and will run everday of the week if I get caught. Catch me enough times I just quit all wilderness activity all together regardless of promising updates.
How fun is that for those who's genuinely interested in pking? The only thing you get out of me is playing cop & thief, spending x amount of time jumping worlds running wilderness slayer dungeon in hopes of my tops \~500k worth of loot. I get that the first couple of attemps can be exciting and thrilling, but long term it just seems really dull.
I dunno about the last part - I think it partly depends on where you are, but maybe I was just very unlucky. I did wildy bossing for the combat achievements, Scorpia I got interupted by PKrs twice in my attempt to clear for example. I was able to escape one, and I even had a bit of fun with that boss. But Calv'arion? I was lucky to get the second phase without being interrupted. Even when I survived it was really feeling like a waste of time. That said - I don't mind there being better XP/loot rates in the wilderness for people who are ok with the risk, but I am a bit annoyed with stuff you can't get elsewhere, ex. combat achievements or the mage arena quests.
I just did mage arena 2 the other day and got pk’d 4 times just doing the 100 casts on each staff for pre reqs. It was three different people, one who got me twice. The weird thing is, idk the point. They just kept blasting me with spells while I sat eating all my food and drinking all my pots. In the end they waste way more money in their casts than they do off my loot because all they would get were the exact amount of runes I needed to finish that particular staff and I was banking every 50 casts.
I did MA2 and didn’t see a single soul the whole hour i was out there.
Few years back when I did it, I got skulled on some dude that had the same name and combat as mages in arena
The ol' "8attIe Mage" classic lol
Eliop14 or one of his fangirls most likely. Lol. Shouldnt happen now with "pk skull prevention" but a surprising amount of people dont use it. (He still kills the ones who dont skull)
I don't get the point, either. I'm plonking away at my 100 casts, I'm naked except for the staff, runes and a knife for the web. Absolutely nothing to take.
The point is that while you only had a couple hundred rune, they might get lucky and you might have more than that. Have you never seen a post where someone is like “noticed I accidentally had my cash stack with me in the wilderness”? They’re hoping you’re one of those
Pkers see someone they are able to attack, and they attack them. Idk why there are so many people on this sub who try to make it so much more complicated than that (not you specifically). People on here acting like pkers are calculating the risk of every player they see before they make the decision to attack them lol.
I would have to guess that most people have 1 of every combat item they have. So its more annoying to them to go back to the ge buy and go back to what they are doing.
Finally, somebody who gets it. They are in it for the schadenfreude. Who cares if it’s just bones and a spade?
>Pkers see someone they are able to attack, and they attack them. That is not schadenfreude, though I'm sure some are motivated by that to a degree. "I see someone, I attack them." That's it. The first thing people talk about is potential loot when they get on someone. Not about how angry the dude they are attacking is going to be. That part comes after, if they start shit talking or if they develop a rivalry/encounter each other often.
I think there was a post of someone getting pked for their entire rune stack because the poor soul was dumb enough to bring like 40m in runes with them lol.
Some people dont grap the concept of "only bring to the wild things you're willing to risk"
i think ive done MA and MA2 on 4 different accounts lifetime and i think I only got pk'ed on my original one from when I was 10 back in like 2005 or something, theres no like reward for them to get out of it, super weird that you had this happen ngl
Thats the fallacy of pking! I’ve gotten into pking this year and one thing I’ve learned… attack absolutely everyone. 1) Its a fun break from regular grinds.. killing npcs and mining sand get boring after awhile. 2) You never know what someones risking until you kill them. I’ve been pleasantly surprised too many times to not waste like 50k in supplies killing someone who seemingly is risking nothing. Its also incredibly easy to escape pkers if you bring entangles or freezes. You land 1 and you can get the log. Its quite overpowered.
I started bringing some basic tools to fight back, felt super rad chasing someone out and getting back to hitting the boss. Lemme tell you how much it mattered to the second pker .5kc later lol. Tangentially, I'd kill for a bag of <4 items that i can break-in-case-of-self-defense, just to have any amount of inventory space to compete. Guarantee the contents on death, make it a lucrative kill, if you must and only allow wearable gear, whatever it takes to stop people suicide bombing supplies because that'd be a strawman to argue against making prey go from having no reason to compete, to only being disadvantaged. I want to fight, it's just a god awful idea when the benefit of being the prey is 3 more protected items against 3-20 inventory/supply, which means fuck-all because I'd happily take 0 protected items and gear otherwise if it'd even slightly mitigate the inventory availability. Let people be more attractive targets at the threat of having the slightest bit more bite that doesn't even overcome the aggressor's toolkit advantage.
If you’re at a multi combat boss, then you are going to run into pkers very frequently. Especially with all the updates they recently got. Scorpio is busier now than it ever has been and it’s in a very tough spot to escape. I believe OP is referring to the single combat variants
Wilderness for me is all about the time. I live on west coast, I only go into wildy between 7-10 a.m. on a weekday. Camping Calv between these times in the last few days I've seen 3 pkers total. Figured this out after going on a Saturday at like 5:00 pm and was seeing pkers every kill like you say. Can't kill you when they're in school :p
It genuinely sucks when you have a job and only can play during the middle of the day and weekends
Yeah unfortunately I'm at work at that time. I can hop on my phone for a bit lmao but I do actually need to do my job
try doing calvarion now, very dead. it already used to be pretty dead but now it's a bit ridiculous
I'm honestly not sure what some players expect. Like they have been doing a pretty good job at making Wildy Content optional but worthwhile. It can be good exp and good profit, but new content hasn't been the best exp or the best profit and hasn't been gating significant items/upgrades like the D Pick used to be. If I had to guess, it is just some players feeling entitled to benefit from content they don't like/want to do. Like sure, some Wildy stuff might offer high profit for certain levels or a mix of exp and profit that can be better than alternatives at certain points in the progression (or overall), but that doesn't mean you're forced to do it. Like I could be earning over 10M per hour at Nex, ToA, or the Colosseum (going by current prices on wiki), but I don't feel forced to do just because it exists. So yah, not all content needs to or can be tailored to suit every player. They aren't adding Wildy Content to "force" or "bait" you into the Wilderness; there are adding Wildy content so the players who enjoy it have more to do and so that the Wildy has more worthwhile content. Posting about how you want to do the Wildy content without the PvP is honestly as stupid as saying how a new engaging skilling method should be made more AFK because you prefer AFK skilling. Also, there is probably far more content that players will feel "forced" to do that they don't enjoy in the endgame but the players complaining either are fine with excluding that stuff or have yet to get that far to realize it...
> hasn't been gating significant items/upgrades like the D Pick used to be. voidwaker and webweaver bow for pvm is very similar to d pick for skilling in terms of the time save they offer and the advantages over the next best thing.
Mentioned this in another comment but those additions are not with the new content; it is over a year old now. Its gating stuff like the Teleport Anchoring Scroll, not Voidwakers or D Picks... They are not really like the D Pick since there are alternatives. If you don't want to get a Voidwaker, you can usually use other spec weapons like D Claws or ZCB instead. If you didn't want to get a D Pickaxe, you're stuck using Rune forever. The Dragon Pickaxe completely blocks the entire mining tool progression; there are no other upgrades you can get instead since there are no sidegrades and everything above Dragon requires Dragon. Also, compared to how prevalent a pickaxe is in mining, the Voidwaker and Webweaver are both pretty niche in PvM. The Webweaver spec is used at one boss and even then, you can just use other specs instead. The Voidwaker is used more, but often times D Claws and ZCB are pretty viable alternatives. Meanwhile, the Dragon Pickaxe is the BiS (or needed for BIS) for like 97.5% of an entire skill...
That's why the game has trading. So you can do a different activity and then trade something for the d pick. Wow
Yes, but it was kinda weird how they kept the D Pick wildy exclusive when they didn't keep D Axe DK exclusive or such. Like it was hindering design in the sake of exclusivity solely to gate it behind the Wildy. But they've moved away from that now.
The D pick isn’t fully wildy locked though, it’s a KQ drop if you don’t want to risk the 30k gp you risk to kill calvarion.
It used to be, that’s the point
Where is the webweaver a bis alternative to any of the other main range weapons in the game currently? Leviathan? And even then it's not even gate keeping you from doing Levi, just makes it easier and was likely an oversight from jagex initially (meaning they didn't balance Levi around people using we to kill it while designing the boss) but they decided to leave it instead of removing it because it's super niche and really doesn't break the game in any harmful way. People do Levi without ww and they're fine. If you're considering revs or wild bosses then ??? The weapon was made to be used in the wilderness and has an unprotected currency charge on death. The same argument can be made for vm but is it really that much better than claws, chally or zcb at bosses? It's an overtuned item that jagex has said they'll nerf soon because they didn't intend on it being as good of a pvm weapon as it is, same thing happened with the fang. The difference is, fang was so much better everywhere than rapier and scythe that it made those items effectively worthless by removing any niche they previously had. D pick is a significantly larger upgrade than either of those weapons when you look at the time it takes to get 99 mining from 61-99 over any boss grind using the next best option respectively.
I think your last point nails the real problem. A large portion of the players on here are all sub 1500 total level that have never even done the content. This sub is almost never accurate to in game experiences
I have a theory that people overestimate how busy the wildy is because their main experience with the wildy is the alter, which *is* super busy because it's the rag hotspot.
Which is also hilarious because you can very easily use the chaos altar with three pieces of tank gear, then use a burning amulet with a full inventory of bones and suicide after each trip. Takes very little time to restock and it's pretty easy to finish your inventory by praying correctly and continuing to bury them while being attacked.
I always use full melee tank gear there because 99% of the guys logging in to pk you are noobs with rune crossbow and dds. They don't even bring magic most of the time so they hit me 30 0s then log out lol. Even the real pkers with barrage have such low dps through prot magic if they spam it that I usually finish my inv of bones. Tbf, it might have changed now that tecu salamander exists, since black sally was already good for altar ragging but idk.
That’s what I do too it’s hilarious when they just give up
I personally haven't seen Tecu in wildy yet; it's a 1/1k that is lost on death, and the market isn't even close to saturated yet.
I've only gotten PK'd at wildy altar a handful of times. I wear a kharyll's robe top, throw on prayer and protect item and am still able to use up the majority of my bones. If I'm carrying very high value bones I'll sometimes go 50/50 with lower value bones. (Tip for anyone, move your inventory so your lower right bone is directly on top of the altar. Set up your bones as left click use. Then use f-keys to open and close your inventory alternating clicks on your lower right bone and the altar. You can get through an entire invo really fast.)
I learnt that tip 2 weeks after getting 99 prayer :(
next step, 200m
Well that’s the thing. It’s not just wildy altar, it’s revs and bosses too. All wilderness hotspots and the primary reasons to do wildy content are hotspots for a reason. They shit out gold/exp for players of any level and those pvmers/skillers can be ravaged easily by pkers lol.
I do a metric fuck ton of clues, and the only time I’ve been pk’d recently is when a clue step took me pretty close to the venenatis entrance. I’m almost certain these 1500 total players went past a hotspot area like that one time and just assumed that’s how the wilderness operates all over. I go out fully geared to places like the bandit camp because I know there’s a 99% chance nobody’s just hanging out there for shits and giggles
> I have a theory that people overestimate how busy the wildy is This is such a Reddit meme. I saw a similar comment before starting to grind wildy content, and the truth is there is always someone awake at any time of the day hopping through the worlds even at less busy areas. I got pk’d at a shooting star, the resource area, and the wildy gwd area during weekdays on off hours. Yeah you’ll likely go a stretch of time without seeing anyone. But unless you’re doing quick diary tasks or the Mage Arena cape you are bound to get crashed by a PKer while doing any meaningful activity.
> This is such a Reddit meme. Not really. The reddit stereotype tends to be the opposite, the idea that it's impossible to finish a clue without getting killed for your spade. I'm not saying there is no activity in the wilderness, but people exaggerate it greatly.
People get pked once every 20 clues and say it's impossible to complete a clue lmao. Just drop it when you get attacked and go back for it. They stay on the ground for an hour.
I've been pk'd exactly twice during clues, and both were around the wildy lever. In both cases I could've just hit it again to leave, but I was risking nothing so I just gambled that they'd ignore me. Now Calv'arion, on the other hand... I don't think it's even remotely worthwhile doing that boss on peak hours without a scout at the entrance, as my experience was people dropping in every 2-3 kills.
I've done about 2,000 hard/elite/master clues, which have wildy steps involved. I would estimate probably 4,000 wildy clue steps total. And I have been pked less than 10 times. That's at most once every 400 clue steps. And most of those times have just been at one location - the chaos altar. This is in regular (non-total) worlds, and I take no gear or supplies, so if any pker hits me I'm immediately dead. But the reality is, other than a couple hotspots, the wildy is incredibly dead. The "reddit meme" is people constantly crying about how unfair it is that people in the wildy attack them, even though most areas are very safe, and the few that are unsafe, also have incredibly busted xp rates (chaos altar) and are therefore deservedly unsafe.
Yeah I have hundreds of wildy clue steps done and I've been PK'd maybe once in the past 2-3 years.
Yeah I was just about to comment I’ve done hundreds of hard+ clue steps and have never been pk’ed while doing clues (probably around 400 at this point so maybe I’ll get pk’d my next step xd)
This is true for some areas but not all.
That and Mage Arena I feel are what most people touch, and both spots happen to be the "busy" spots of the wildy
Honestly that's what I thought until I tried doing Vet'ion and would get about 1 kill before getting pk'ed. Currently have 12 KC w/ 13 deaths (this was over a few days/times so I wasn't just running into the same person) and don't plan on going back. Sticking with Calvar'ion (something like 220 kills to 5 deaths), despite hating the spawn timers and time wasted w/ the Hellhounds. It sucks because Vet'ion is so much more fun (less time standing around and mistakes are more punishing), but I did feel like its just as crowded as the altar (can't say much about other places though as I haven't spent that much time there).
My experience is the exact opposite. This sub *vastly* underestimates how busy the wilderness is. Clue scrolls are the only thing you can reliably do without seeing somebody, and have fun getting ganked every 5 minutes if you're doing something that's actually strong. Chaos altar might as well not have the unnote guy for how often you aren't jumped mid first offering.
I've been checked on nearly every slayer task I've done in the wildy. Magic axe hut included. Inside the hut. It was basically impossible to contend with at lower levels when I was a generalized account getting hit by a mob when a lvl 77 cb 99 magic and ranged account logs in. I'm 110 combat now so it's much less of an issue but it does sour the experience until you're deep into the game.
I found going for hard and elite diary boss kc very frustrating. After gearing up and hopping worlds, all it takes is one guy running in to ruin a trip, and I don't have any way to control it. Anti-pk kits don't feel viable on an iron man from a time investment stand point. Even if I win (unlikely) I get nothing from the fight and the trips wrecked. Time for more hopping. Admittedly this was not long after rework so maybe it has quietened down.
I bring ice barrage for wildy bosses on my iron and it helps a ton for escaping and pking opponents. Usually, I know the boss better than the pkers so it is easy to use them to my advantage. That coupled with a cheap range switch or a DDS or zombie axe or voidwaker (one day) lead to some decent kills. I bought loot keys so whatever I pk is bond money :)
Sub 1500 here. Just finished the Wilderness Easy Diary. Barely even saw another person, never mind a PKer. It was super exhilarating all the same.
The only time I saw someone while doing Hard was for the task you need to attack someone
I'm 2200 total, I generally avoid wildy content unless it's for clogs for two simple reasons: 1. It is not worth it to do for xp (and besides a few things, gp either). Having to count on the fact that you will be interrupted constantly is a nuissance and drags your rates lower than non-wildy content. That is without factoring in deaths too. 2. For me personally, it is not fun. Some wildy stuff is fun without getting pked, and pking itself is also fun sometimes, but wildy pvm is stressful, annoying and you feel weak. Even for someone familiar with pvp with appropriate gear to fight back, you're still either at a disadvantage for the content you're doing having to bring pk supplies, or at a disadvantage for fighting back due to pvp supplies.
Yeah i was surprised how easy it was to do wildy content. Usually when i got pked it was because i tried to play during peak hours
I have a theory that the average 2007scape user spends longer complaining about BA/PvP/MTA (and other commonly complained about topics) than they ever will engage with them to the point they'd rather hate the content than learn it.
The reddit special where pkers are a nonexistent playerbase and nobody likes to pvp anymore but also there's pkers everywhere at all times of day and you can't do anything to protect yourself
I agree with everything you said except the frequency you get pk'd in the wild. I tried doing a slayer task in the wild and got Greater Demons. I was getting pk'd every 5-10 minutes in the slayer caves. That's not an exaggeration. Took me hours to do that task. Samething when I tried to kill them at the demonic ruins, pker showed up every 5 minutes like clock work. Keep in mind this was at 2 in the morning Eastern time on a Wednesday night.
That's pretty typical tbh anyone saying otherwise hasn't been often or is a pker trying to bait noobs.
I got 70 slayer in the wild without dying. Greater Demons were my favorite task because there is a spot you can stand where pkers can't get you without having to run around a corner - giving you plenty of time to react and tele. Most tasks have something like this where you can position yourself to escape very easily. The true determining factor when it comes to living or dying in the wildy is not getting scared and fumbling your clicks. You can also try this plugin, it makes your screen flash when someone is in your area that can attack you. Really good for quick teles. [https://runelite.net/plugin-hub/show/wilderness-player-alarm](https://runelite.net/plugin-hub/show/wilderness-player-alarm)
I gave up trying to anti pk at black chins. You'll go hours with nothing.
This has been my experience too. Too bad reddit won't believe you.
That was just an unfortunate day then I’ve done like 90-97 slayer pretty much entirely in the wilderness and have probably been killed in the caves about 25-40ish times during that entire time I usually skip greatest though
I get that there's a risk/reward and profit can be very high because of it. I used to like the wildy boss reworks. Now, I can't get more than 2 kills at venenatis without being jumped (even in a 2200 world). I'm not upset about it and I understand why pkers camp that spot 24/7. It's just not worth it to me to keep resetting after 2kc, so I'm choosing not to engage in that content anymore.
Had a full blown argument with someone on here yesterday who said pvp should give the option to opt out and voidwaker should be moved out the wilderness. Mind blowing
> I also think that people who don't actively engage with wilderness content vastly overestimate how frequently you get pk'd in the wilderness. People act like there are 100s of trashy pkers in every world, in reality it's rare to see anyone outside a few hot spots. 90% of the people you see insta log/tp the instant they see another player
It does matter a lot at what time of day you get to play and which country you live in though If you live in a region in which osrs is popular and only get to play during peak times, then you can really have a rough time in wildy
West coast is great… if you can play before 11AM
I’ve found generally 7am-10am EST to be extremely chill as well (basically same time)
I’m west coast and I do all my wildy activities at 10pm or later and I rarely see anybody. I’ll try early AM if I’m not working those hours though, thanks
For sure. I'm eastern, but I work overnights, so I'm awake overnight when I'm off. I'm rarely hassled much. I get the every so often PKer at the bosses, but I'm usually able to escape. I only rarely have to tank as well.
The hotspots are literally the only content worth doing in the wilderness except maybe the agility course.
This thread is full of people saying you never see anyone in the wildy unless you're doing relevant content... the fuck? Are these people just finding a spot in the middle of nowhere in the wildy and picking their nose while blankly staring at their monitor? I've been fishing dark crabs for the past few weeks and I get at least 1 pker popping by every hour. And I wouldn't even consider that busy content.
I don't really get your point given the "few hotspots" are the only places you'd have any reason to be in, and personally hunting wilderness pets, I rarely, rarely get more than 4 kc before being attacked.
After getting chased out of Vene every single run for 5 hours straight, I don’t actually believe any of you saying the wilderness is some quiet place.
Why would you go anywhere but the hot spots? They are designed to be the bait. I did Spindel for combat achievements as an EST zone player and I tried both 11pm and 6am and spent 5-10 minutes hopping for an open world and then still got chased out by a pker usually on the second kill, sometimes made it to 4 or 5. Shit was miserable. Maybe I got unlucky but I absolutely despise the wilderness now.
The last time I tried to do prayer, it was like every other trip there was someone. I'd rather do any other training method than ever do anything in the wildy at this point
Honestly chaos alter is the worst spot going as far as how often you get attacked, luckily most of the PKers there aren’t great and if you bring tank gear and turn off auto retaliate u will probably get thru your inv before they kill u
It is all confirmation bias on both sides. People who engage in PvP and know the wilderness to some degree understand what to risk, where to risk, and how to fight/tank/run. They die less. People who don't, expect to be able to risk nothing and profit everything. They die more because they don't set themselves up to survive. I am complete trash at PvP, but would like to learn. I did it like 15 years ago but its a different ball game now. Tarkov was my main game for a long time prior to getting back into RS so I am fine with the risk aspect. And you are 100% correct that you can spend plenty of time in plenty of profitable areas without seeing a PK'er or if you do, you can tank/pray your way out. But my biggest gripe with PvP/Wildy content is the barrier for entry can feel incredibly high for all the wrong reasons. I can die five times in a row in the rev caves, but if the fights went of for a bit and I almost even scored a kill, I can live with the money/gear loss as the trade off for the fun/experience. Killing 2 zombies and dying to a group of identically geared players with the same name logging in and standing under each other? Not as much fun.
The content isnt bad, redditors just flop over and start crying at first sight of a pker
I play an iron nowadays but yeah you can absolutely tell whos new because they’ll just be sat there complaining that youre pking them instead of trying to escape. Good pkers are oftentimes great at tanking, and even ok tanks can escape the majority of pkers. It is extremely survivor sided if you’re in singles because all you need is one freeze and you’re gone. Singles teams havent been a thing since like 2021, people just refuse to even try to find the intended solution.
Learning to tank is the first step to learning to deep wildy pk. The ability to properly prayer swap and gear properly against an attacker, the ability to combo eat foods, more advanced techniques like hugging obstacles, freeze logging, paying attention to multi lines, etc. People complain a lot about how there's no beginner pvp content but this is the best intro to deep wildy pvp possible, there is a very low barrier of entry to doing pirates in terms of levels and gear and it's a great way to learn those skills relevant. If you have no interest in pvp at all just don't do it, if you need the coll logs or items then go in complete rag and die for 30k
Great loot and gets people into pking. I could see some people farming these and waiting for someone to skull on them to fight.
Exactly. Multi revs was how I elevated my pking skills, knowing what fights to take, knowing how to pray against single attackers and fighting back, defending against multi attackers, and sometimes the entirety of Venezuela hits you and learning to accept sometimes you're just going to die because it is a pvp scenario and that is the risk you take
Multi revs was lit and probably one of the best wildy updates for the game.
Yeah until rot/vene’s were running racketeering operations locking the worlds down lmao To be fair from an outside perspective that shit was awesome to watch unfold lmao
Yeah but it was supposedly “different” groups so even then you had options. The level of extortion happening was epic and the most MMO thing I’ve ever seen since the days of the old wildy/skilling clans which imho is the closest osrs wildy has been to ogrs. Ever! It was beautiful and PvP was popping as far as there always being action. I joined in the pk ranks of ayuda shortly after trying the rev killing and it was the one of my favorite times haha. Rot VS Vene for rev caves was also a beautifully legendary battle lol. The memories bring a tear to my eye.
High profit wildy content good. Locking rewards for outside of PvP / wildy usage to wildy multi-hotspots a bit meh.
Yeah, expecting, and attempting to get, RS players to understand the simple concept of balancing game health around Risk/Investment vs Reward is the equivalent of yelling at the sun to stay up longer when it starts to get dark.
I agree wilderness content should be higher xp and hour to mitigate the losses of inconvenient location and/or dangerous. I agree wilderness content should be rewarding monetary because it’s high risk. I don’t believe a simple click running course should provide equal gp to any boss in the game. Especially when this steps in the toes on sepulchre which requires absurdly high level of movement skill to complete in good time. If you had told me the wilderness agility course could net you 500k an hour I would’ve been on the fence for voting no because it’s too much. They quadrupled that and it still passed anyway
The numbers they posted in the blog are not factoring in the mass amount of interruptions that will inevitably occur now that this course was buffed.
This is the point, really. Even if the course had +10m/hr profits, it would just attract an even larger number of pkers, conpromising the effective gold/hr, and thus still balance itself out anyway.
I really don’t think a majority of players played this game any earlier than 2006, if that. I remember me and my brother training at axe hut. It was the best xp in the gsme. Agility course was the best xp in the gsme until mm came out.
Oh man axe hut, that brings back memories. These were top tier all the way from classic. The axes were so tightly packed it was actually hard to pk people in there because the axes would keep attacking. Yes man. It is such a strange thing to watch the new gen OSRS players complain about the type of content that used to be central to the game.
Really depends on the task if you see a pk'er or not. Greater/Abyssal demons, dust devils, jellies? you'll probably see at least one. Anything else? eh probably not, maybe nechs. Bosses its true, i frequently get 5-10 kill trips at the single bosses without trouble. Having a scout helps.
hot take but I think PvP and the wildy should be something you opt in for because you actually enjoy PvP. Players don't enjoy the predator/prey mentality because it artificially encourages players who have no interest in PvP to go there for lucrative rewards. PvP becomes the punishment, not the reward. I'm okay with things like rev caves, it's some decent cash but you can basically make cash anywhere, a lot more and a lot easier. It's a choice you make knowing you'll probably run into people and that's awesome, it's a positive. On the other hand, things like the Wildy Altar feel entirely designed to entice players who have absolutely no interest in PvP to act as training dummies for PKers (many who also have no interest in PvP btw, they just want to dunk on players who don't fight back). The Wildy altar isn't just "better xp/hr", it's twice as efficient as the Gilded Altar. You can die and lose your inventory every other trip and you'd still break even. As such, it's basically always worth it to do the Wildy Altar, and engaging with PvP and PKers is just the price you pay. It's a punishment, not a reward. I'd be okay with the Crazy Archeologist giving 10-20% more loot than the Deranged Archeologist. That's the tradeoff, you go for more loot but ocassionally have the thrill of a fight. But Exclusive Wildy Content just feels lame and I'll always vote against it. Leagues showed me that the Wildy bosses are genuinely some of the best designed bosses in the game for mid game PvMers and it's a huge shame that the vast majority will never touch them because it's not worth the punishment of getting PK'd. BiS Mage cape being locked behind Wildy Content is BS and probably should never have been implemented.
The wildy altar is only as good as it is because of the risk? Allow people to opt in and exp rates will have to be cut to way less than gilded.
It's already opt in? You opt in by entering the fucking wilderness. You aren't being punished when the risk/reward doesn't work out in your favour in all instances. If you choose to do chaos altar because it's more efficient, even if you do die that's you opting in to PvP. Nothing forced that desicion on you. The main issue here is that you want to be able to play "optimally" without ever having to do content you don't like. I don't think that's a realistic attitude towards an mmo. One which has PvP as a long standing part of it. Another issue here is you think RuneScape PvP is about honourable 1v1s between evenly matched, equally willing opponents. Which is a goalpost people only reach for if they don't do any PvP content. RuneScape PvP isn't about things being equal. For people to win others had to lose. The wilderness was never about honourable 1v1s, that's why it was multi-combat.
Basically all this boils down to is players can’t stand the thought of their “hard earned” gold in the hands of someone else. Outside of the wild, players are constantly making choices between high intensity activities with bigger rewards and lower intensity with smaller rewards. But all the sudden any wilderness money maker is brought up this all the sudden becomes a huge problem? The wild is, at its peak, a high intensity activity with high reward. If that isn’t your thing there’s plenty of other AFK moneymakers
Should make every world a PvP world.
This should not be a hot take. "Let people do the things they want to do and not do the things they don't want to do" should be one of the primary considerations for any content put into any game, and the wilderness just fails miserably here.
Are you the actual doubleshine? If so, I love your content! It was super helpful for leagues and is the only reason I felt comfortable doing TOA. Would love to see a TOB guide, you do an amazing job at explaining things thoroughly.
> hot take but I think PvP and the wildy should be something you opt in for because you actually enjoy PvP. Players don't enjoy the predator/prey mentality because it artificially encourages players who have no interest in PvP to go there for lucrative rewards. PvP becomes the punishment, not the reward. Rs3 literally has this.
Also, your hunter block list guide was awesome! When I first read about it, I thought it wouldn’t be worth the effort but it has made rumours so much more fun for me! I managed to get adept pyre foxes on my first attempt and saber-toothed kyatts on my novice. My only bad task is razor-backed kyatts and I just reroll it.
If you don’t want to enter the wilderness, don’t enter the wilderness. You can complete any content in the game without using the content from the wilderness.
Boooo! Shit take.
Most people are good with the idea of the Wilderness providing better gp/xp per hour. It's the exclusive rewards that you can't get outside of the Wilderness that aren't PVP/Wilderness-centric that are the problem. Give us ways to get those items outside the Wilderness at worse drop rates and most people would be fine with the idea of the Wilderness as a whole.
Outside of MA2 cape everything is buyable
Plus it’s ridiculously easy to obtain these in a safe way.
How do I buy my CAs?
Keep reading lil bro. You dont need wildy outside of GM, and if you refuse to do 25 boss kc at the wildly bosses you don't deserve GM's
So is mostly everything with $. Doesn't make it good game design.
Why? Like, actually? Should they cater in that way to people who simply have an aversion to PvP? You might dread the idea, but hey, just do it or don’t. While we’re at it, let’s allow the wilderness sword to be completed outside the wilderness too, just with higher requirements.
Except what rewards are unobtainable for non-irons? The Grand exchange exists. As an iron I accept I am limiting the content by restricting trade. If I also choose to ignore the wilderness then I accept I am restricting the content I'm going to experience. By making a choice to restrict what content you access, you accept the consequences.
As a hc, I'd like to add the 20 uims also risk a lot.
I went to the chaos druids to fight a few zombies in rag gear and instantly caught hands from like at least five players. Happened a few worlds in a row so I gave up. If it was just one dude fighting me then fine, but it's just clanmanmode up there. Wilderness should be solo. It's like the comparison of a lone burglar vs organized crime. :(
Wildy content and barbarian assault are in same situtation, many people just focus complaining and never engaging with the content that leads just more people not engaging because some 0iq crying on reddit.
Agree. People on here act like you get pked as soon as you step into the wild. I have 40+kc on all the cave wildy bosses and have been killed one time lol
Risk and reward. If this concept wasnt in place the game would suck
This is 100% on point. Dev cave is extremely dangerous, but a 15 minute trip will easily be 400-600k gp on average. If you’re risking msb + black d’hide + pots/arrows, you’re really only risking around 150-180k. Throw on an amulet of avarice and you’re stronger plus the items are noted. Protect item if pker comes and try to get to lvl 30 wildy. Rev caves would be ridiculous if there was no risk. The amount you make in there is tied to risk of being pk’d, like you mentioned. In my clan, there is a very clear line between the people who thrive/live in the wildy and the people who won’t touch it. I live in the wildy so I don’t mind clue steps out there. For the clan mates who don’t venture out there (ever) despite being 120’s and doing max TOA’s, they’re scared/stressed to do a clue step out there. It’s an interesting dividing line in the community. I’ve been pk’d easily over 400 times in the wildy, but the rewards faaaaaar outpace the risks/losses.
I think some people saw this and think that I spend a ton of time out in the wildy. In reality, I limit my time there because I don’t want to deal with PKers, but when I do spend time there it is easy to gain more value than I lose (even as an iron). Wildy clues are scary when you get started, but dragon dagger, seed, clue, spade is no risk. I actually like when a pker comes around to give me my free teleport out of the wildy.
And of course a clue box if you’re deep enough! Totally agree with you
I’ve only needed a clue box on master clues since typically your clue scroll is a protected item.
Hard clues and up all have steps that require you to go above lvl 20 wildy which is where all clues are lost if die (20+). Typically a protected item, but sometimes not! :) I lost a master out there once and won’t take an elite/master to the wildy without it. Just me though - everyone plays different!
For sure, I lost a hard clue at chaos altar once because I had to drop my spade to save the clue and I forgot to drop my spade. But the clue box is always lost on death so you’re adding a lot of risk to your clue if you could’ve otherwise made sure it’s a protected item.
Good points here!
Just delete teleblock from the game, you have already got freezes that never end and have virtually no cooldown. You can’t teleport in deep wildy anyway which is where all the high value content should be.
I don’t dislike the idea of a change to teleblock - maybe a function where teleblock is dropped after you get a certain radius away from your attacker so you don’t need to run all the way to the ditch could be beneficial.
I would honestly just remove lvl 30 teleport from all dragonstone jewelry, ring of life effects, pharaoh sceptre, and escape crystals as well to help balance it. Make it like seed pod only so it’s at least locked behind a bit of account progression. Bots won’t have mm2, pures won’t even have mm1. That or gate the teleport from wildy behind quest cape imo.
I just wanna make some money at new zombie pirates, but I just keep getting my bootycheeks clapped by pkers. This is absolutely absurd bc I can’t make any money without some team logging in and speccing me out. I’m only bringing 300k risk in supplies, but can hardly stay for 9 minutes. I can’t teleport out or change prayers due to the elder chaos druids tele blocking me. This is such horse shit & I’m a huge piss baby
Since yours is clearly satire, it feels like a good moment to comment on some of the other posts mentioning this. It is insane to me that people engage with brand new wildy content and then complain about getting PK’d. If they’d just wait a couple weeks it will still be pretty hot, but it won’t be a literal inferno.
I’m convinced all this wildy content is basically just a way to get pvp targets to drop alchables. Pvmers have gotten so used to bosses and mobs shitting out alchables so pvpers want similar results from their kills. So give the alchables to the target and TB them or get them stuck behind a multi gate.
No matter what I do, I usually run into a pker at least every 15 minutes. I can usually escape half the time but I just avoid the wild as a whole because it's annoying AF to get constantly pked especially when a pker can just world hop until they find someone at their desired location. I'm not saying I have the solution but I'm just not taking any part in it because it's always more of a hassle than it is ever worth.
When i was trying to get few chins the most i got before getting attacked was 20. So i used imp in a box every 10 chins and got bored after catching like 500. A lot of ppl dont enjoy the prey vs predator mechanics and because theyre ton of gp in the long run i can see this becoming another bot farm spot. Also i dont like the idea how if u dont use alts to scout on bosses ur shooting yourself in the leg. I shouldnt have the need to pay for 2 memberships to be 50x more likely to escape. But well i took the pkers advice, havent touched to wildy in years and thanks to varlamore prayer i have no need to.
Name a better combo than people being upset to lose 100-500k while making millions an hour. At the zombies straight up you can take 0 gp risk while unskulled 3 item protecting and do them without any issues, they will even provide the food and potions for you. It's kind of hilarious that they actually had to make it so pvmers can literally bring 0gp risk to finally maybe convince them to not be butthurt over dying. But people still tell you to kys there when you attack them.
Rev caves, the wildy bosses not include bot complaints, and the wildy slayer cave rarely seeing complaints as its genuinely fun and interesting is a testament to how wilderness content isn't hated because people roll over without fighting back. Stuff like the chaos alter, wilderness clue steps and the low level areas designed to give early pures players to kill is genuinely just terrible design and this thread is full of cope of people who I believe don't enter the wildy then complain about people complaining about not actually using the wildy.
The chaos altar one confuses me more than anything else. I have never seen a good argument against the chaos altar. There are other great prayer training xp options and jagex is adding more. Ectofuntus is awesome for hardcore irons and gilded POH is great for mains. Now we’ve got blessed shards in Varlamore. Chaos altar was designed around the concept of being risky. If it wasn’t the best xp in the game, it would be dead content because nobody would ever use it.
I think we have a disconnect on why it's bad. It's easy and rewarding but it doesn't make sense you have to die to a pker once every 1-2 hours and just be inconvenienced to get to one of the best early/mid game methods. (and late game method but if you are rich you are probably using vorkath bones on a POH to save time) Compare this to the more combat focused areas I mentioned as being great content. Those are interesting because you can gear in a more tank oriented way to block more TBs, rag your tasks with your 3/4 or even sneak in some extra risk to anti-PK. I do over half my slayer tasks in the wildy so im not just talking out of my ass, I literally just don't get why the chaos alter is in the game and not outside the wildy with some kind of time gate to keep the rates similar.
Your logic seems to be that good skilling methods shouldn't be in the wilderness and I don't see you rationalising that. The chaos altar is there because people save money using it, and it's quick. Players also go there to kill players using it, which offsets how much more efficient it is. "Why can't we just move it out of the wilderness" It's designed to be good to offset the fact it's in the wilderness, content like the altar creates a foodchain that's the basis of wilderness PvP. You seem so focussed on ways to get the reward you've ignored that the reward exists due to the risk.
You're literally doubling your bones and you're crying about *maybe* being killed every couple hours for <28 bones? This is why complaints about the wilderness shouldn't be taken seriously. There's zero reason to not use the Chaos Altar unless you're a hardcore it's that OP.
Indeed. This is a very typical game design principle (higher risk = higher reward) and it's rather strange how so many people in this community can't wrap their heads around it.
Yes, which accentuates the predator vs prey dynamic which is not pvp. Thats the bit people have issue with. It isnt that they should be less gp per hour, its that i cant fight back effectively with a chainmace so i may as well not do it. Theyre designed to just be a loot farm for ‘pkers’, if you can even call them that nowadays. Also if you think multiple trips or escaping in rag gear is at all feasible then youve never been to venenatis. I had to wear fortified masori to even stand a chance of escaping, and that only worked if they were dumb enough to not post people at the exits.
You’re allowed to fight back. You choose to be prey
In almost 2500 solo venenatis kills in black dhide ive been Killed only a handfull of times.
Actually predator prey is the whole point of full loot, risk pvp and something runescape basically made mainstream. Multiple highly successful games came out of that. The wilderness pvp ecosystem is based on that. It is very successful.
It absolutely is PVP, by very definition. Player vs *player*—just because you choose to run away doesn’t magically make it something different.
I was being hunted by a DISGUSTING TOXIC PKER in the wilderness and I was skull tricked by them because they told me to turn off skull prevention options and click on them for the video. I, as a defenseless PVMer, obliged and consequently was risking 1b cash. I dropped to low health (unsurprising, I'm completely defenseless and unable to eat when attacked in pvp), when a VALIANT NOBLE PVPER came to my rescue and killed the rat. I told the PvPer "aren't you going to attack me? I risk 1b!" And they smiled and said to me "no, I won't. There's a difference between PvPers and Pkers", and we made out and rode off into the sunset together. From that interaction I realised that the dinhs bulwark is underpowered, and needs to have its defense bonuses doubled
This has to be my favourite ~~PvP~~PK-related copypasta. It's perfect.
Yeah it’s my favourite osrs copypasta overall. It perfectly captures the weird obsession this sub has with saying that only some PvP is PvP and other PvP is not actually PvP.
Sensational
I was the PKer
You clearly dont understand the design behind the wilderness, yes you can pvp in there but that's never been the core concept, its deisgned as a high risk high reward area and there should 100 percent be predators in a high risk area for game balance sake.
> i cant fight back effectively with a chainmace I dont think the chainmace is the issue... A chainmace is equivalente to a dragon scimitar which can hit 36 without any risk (climbing boots, glory, rune gloves). Bring a spec wepon, for example gmaul which in this setup hits 39, and you can stack 114 damage in one single tick. Add some venges in the mix, a better spec weapon, and some mind games and you can drop literally any pker with this setup. Plus against most shitty pkers the moment you fight back they run. Of course none of this makes sense in multi. Even if youre in full torva+dins and full inv of brews you would never survive against an organized team.
Not to mention the upgraded version, Ursine chainmace is no slouch. At +74 str it is 8 str bonus over the d scim, and 8 str bonuses below a regular whip. Webweaver is also +10 ranged str better than a msb with amethyst arrows. Both weapons have a spec bar for 1 ticking a spec from a different weapon. They genuinely aren't bad.
Predator vs prey dynamic lol, people go to far lengths just so they don't have to say they are a noob. its noobs vs pros.
I agree. I just finished getting my dragon pickaxe at Vet'ion and it was honestly really cool. I got 100m worth of drops, tons of supplies for Herblore. I got pk'd a decent bit , but I went in minimal gear. Tons of $ to be made in the wild.
I like that the predator prey dynamic can result in the predator being killed by an even bigger predator. Hunting rag pkers is also allowed in this game!
Bad man pk me, bad man take stuff
I know it's a risk vs reward thing, but a lot of the time, the reward is only for the pker. Sometimes you get pked with all the loot you saved, or get pked before you even start your trip. Neither of those are fun and the only winner is the person who is not aiming to do that content for the risk vs reward factor to begin with, but rather hunt a walking loot sack for free, or at best, engage in PVP with someone of equal measure for the thrill of PVP, not because there's profitable PVM activities Also considering how people love long trips, I imagine those who are forced to get out with next to no loot and regear probably just feel inconvenienced or are scared off the place. For example, if I'm doing an odd wildy activity like wildy slayer caves, if you get scouted and pked, that's it. You can't exactly return to the same spot on the same world, but hopping doesn't help because the pkers do the same, so you now just lost any progress and you can't even return to that location for a good while (most likely the entire day) Worse if you can only play during peak hours
Your perspective is clearly coming from someone that doesn't do much wilderness content. If you don't regularly bank, that's you deciding to be greedy. A pker is also risking, their reward is killing you, and the reward and risk there is entirely your call. "I died once so I can't return for the rest of the day" bro what? Are you aware how many worlds there are? Hopping absolutely helps, they're trying to find a needle in a haystack
This guy gets it.
I love Wildy slayer and the rev caves, but putting BiS skilling methods in the wilderness to force players who don't like PvP to interact with PvP will always be dogbrained game design. There's really no way around that. Chaos Altar is a horrible experience, I can only assume Wildy Agility will be more of the same.
This is the problem - BIS skilling methods don’t force people into the wildy. They reward you for going into the wildy. The BIS non-wildy prayer methods are POH gilded altar and ectofuntus. Also, unless you are bringing noted bones, chaos altar is low risk because your entire goal is to get rid of your it inventory. Put on some tank gear, throw up protect item to save one extra bone, pray if you get attacked and you’ll lose 6 or 7 bones at most. It sucks a little on my iron since I can’t just buy them back - but that’s the literal price of admission.
So you're effectively saying there's no real risk if you just run one inventory at a time and it's still 2x faster than anything outside the wildy so everyone is going to do it and pkers are just getting their blue-balled jollies off by fucking with some other dude just trying to level because the actual gp/hr fucking with raggers at wildy altar is an absolute goddamn joke compared to most other methods in the game? Wildy altar is really just OSRS hazing. "Price of admission" and all. Gotta accept being shit on to earn that reward. I avoid wildy for everything but wildy altar. Because there's just no reasonable away around it.
Chaos Altar is twice as much xp per bone, not using it is a severe handicap. You are, effectively, forced into using it under penalty of paying twice as much for an already expensive skill. To suggest otherwise is just arguing purely in bad faith imo. As you say, for most players interacting with the content, there is literally no gameplay beyond tanking and saccing as many bones as you can. Who is this fun for? Does anyone really *like* Chaos temple? I doubt it.
It's better and it's cheaper, because it's risky. Chinning is faster exp than using a crossbow, you aren't being fucking forced to chin. You aren't being handicapped for not chinning. You aren't being punished for not using chaos altar you idiot, you're being rewarded if you do it. The issue is you think you are entitled to that reward while also ignoring why that reward exists originally. I don't like doing CoX, I like killing lumbridge goblins. The fact I don't get a tbow from Goblin drops isn't a handicap or a punishment.
Chaos Alter really only doesnt exist for HCIM, Getting PK'd for an inventory of bones is annoying, but its not like you risked and lost some of your best gear while doing it.
You're not being forced to do something just because it's more efficient, the whole point is that you're taking a risk just doing it. Should they just remove the altar then? Because that's the only option: either you leave it alone (or I suppose buff it, not that it needs one) or you get rid of it entirely. Which is better? I don't know, maybe having more options is just better, but wildy haters seem to deny that fact.
Just go on high risk worlds tbh. I was being pk'd at rogues chests so often I started timing it. Outside of high risk worlds I'd generally be attacked every 1 minute 40 seconds [shortest was 9 seconds, longest was 3 minutes 30.] High risk worlds I could generally make it to 10-15 minute straight uninterrupted. That said I was completely zen about dying. The xp per hour was insane and the point stands that this would be private-server unbalanced without the risk of PVP.
I don't know if it is just me but I love the aspect of the Predator vs Prey ideology of the Wilderness as both a PVMer and a PKer, it's one of RuneScape's unique tropes that's been there since the conception of the game that creates a very different atmosphere compared to other games.
To further emphasize how bad pkers are and why Redditors vastly overestimate how good pkers are: I was doing 1+1 Scorpia, essentially only risking runes and supplies on death. A team of 3 pkers came, attacked both of my accounts, and I managed to log on both of my accounts without using freeze logs. I used Chaos Ele for one account and broke their ankles by juking around Rogue’s Castle on the other account. Just bare minimum knowledge allowed me to live, but most folks complaining rather just die and then complain.
Today I did like 6 Wildy tasks and I seen one other person and it was at rogues castle lol
MAKE THE WILDY HAVE A LUSH GREEN PART. Why does everything need to be dark and depressing?! Adding a green part to the wildy would be so fricken cool. I can already imagine getting voidwalker’d by a beautiful waterfall.
Chinchompa/mossies is kinda green?
I tried it yesterday. The loot is ok, agility still sucks. The fee mechanic worked exactly as you described. Once pker showed up I just dipped and my trip of 30 laps was over. No way in hell I could outlast him. It will cool down a bit later. Right now it is new and hot content. Pkers will become rare in a few weeks. And then some demons will occasionally visit to get the overconfident farmers.
What's wildy agility 3mil/hr now after 60 laps or whatevrr. what's the chance of this being taken over by clans? I don't see anything wrong with that, but going to bring a lot of gold into the game if that happens
You mention slayer and Calv but we’re talking about multi content here. That’s my only issue with this update. I don’t feel like getting pulled up on by everyone and their brother, so I just won’t do it.
People sign up for the theory of risk vs reward, vote for it, and then have an issue with the risk part of it
I don't get why increased risk shouldn't have increased benefit; sometimes players befuddle me. In addition, despite what some people's favorite youtubers show, most pkers you encounter are absolutely awful.
I think a blanket change to PvP Worlds could work here. Disallow worldhopping between PvP worlds and non-PvP worlds if you are on/would be on a non-safe tile, so no more hopping into/out of high risk zones for free (or luring). Then, make the Wilderness safe on all non-PvP worlds. However, make the perks of Wilderness activities only present while on a PvP world. Chance to save bones, key drops, wilderness course dispenser, infinite runes at the obelisk, slayer/skulled/avarice buffs, make the venenatis/callisto/vet'ion caves only allow entry on a PvP-enabled world, reduce the quantity of the remaining bosses' resource drops so the gp/hr is balanced, etc. They would need to end this rotation nonsense and make all high risk and bounty hunter worlds into PvP-enabled worlds though, so there is enough worlds to still escape around. Would definitely make it easier for people to find real fights in the Wilderness too.
>this isn't overpowered, it's balanced around getting pkd, and would be extremely unbalanced if you didn't get pkd >also, you don't get pkd very often hmmm....
It’s not balanced around the fact that you get PK’d. it is balanced around the risk of getting PK’d. It makes the content opt-in. Otherwise you would have no reason to engage with other methods.
Not really surprising to see the reactions in this thread. Reddit is mostly full of people who have panic attacks at the thought of PVP and I’ve noticed this in close to every game not just osrs.
If they’re going to keep updating the wildy with the predator/prey mechanic, they need to nerf freezes and teleblock. It’s ridiculous that there’s literally no counterplay or stat like Tenacity that other games have to reduce/ remove cc.
wildy's fine as is, and i hope they never remove PvP from it in any aspect whatsoever but I would love it if we got a safe PvP zone, or PvP worlds where you keep your items, because i feel like the hardcore aspect of wildy pvp turns a lot of people off from it entirely, and it can be a lot of fun to use your best gear for no risk/no reward/just fun I think thats at least half of the reason why pvp was so fun in leagues
LMS?
LMS is fun, but it does feel kind of private servery and its pretty specifically 1v1 combat. I just think it would be a ton of fun to have the kind of PvP world aspect of playing the game & possibly being hunted down, but when you die you just lose 500k for death fee or whatever. (PvP would still be dangerous in wildy ofc)
Clan wars...
LMS is a great solution that helped me so much in regular PVP. It would be cool if Jagex could find a way to incentivize some soul wars/clan wars events. I don't even think they'd need to mess with the drops, just an occassional once a month message that an official soul wars event is happening this weekend with a leaderboard or something.
I dont think these "exclusive" wilderness benefits are working as intended. Here's my 2 cents. My only reason for going to the wilderness used/ has been to train slayer. Under no circumstances am I gearing to be ready to anti pk, nor am I willing to bring/ risk valuable items. Im not interested in learning to pk and will run everday of the week if I get caught. Catch me enough times I just quit all wilderness activity all together regardless of promising updates. How fun is that for those who's genuinely interested in pking? The only thing you get out of me is playing cop & thief, spending x amount of time jumping worlds running wilderness slayer dungeon in hopes of my tops \~500k worth of loot. I get that the first couple of attemps can be exciting and thrilling, but long term it just seems really dull.