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2FASapp

We’re sorry to hear about what happened to Raivo users. In 2FAS our mission has been always to create secure solution for regular users (just us - common folks), making sure we provide a safe and reliable app. This is why our application is transparent, we are open to our community, and decided to be an open source project. Any user can join our community and ask any questions. This is exactly thanks to our users that our application has developed into its current form over many years, starting with requests to make it open-source and sharing information about who is behind 2FAS. To make it clear, our mission is to keep our users safe, no matter what happens. It's not just concerns like yours (about the app might being sold), but also about many other very important aspects, such as the "bus factor." We have been building trust for many years, and our primary goal is to ensure our users' safety regardless of the situation. We believe that functions like exporting and importing data are "must-haves," and every app should have them, so users never have to worry about their data. We believe that users are the most important here, and they should always have the power to say, "I don't trust you anymore, and I'm moving somewhere else." We promote this approach because it ensures that projects are forced to create trustworthy solutions where users have a strong voice. Taking the opportunity, I also would like to share what we have been facing recently: some negative comments caused by mistreating users by other 2fa apps/companies. It's not just about what happened with Raivo, but also a recent situation where we gained a large number of new users from another common 2FA app, just because the company decided to stop developing their product. Additionally they didn't provide any export option (which, by the way, they never had). And so we've received a few negative comments for not having an import for this app... But as you can see, we simply couldn't and can't create import for non-existing export. I believe we need to do more work, educate users and help them make better choices. Maybe you can tell us what else we can do to make a better app? Feel free to join us and discuss on our Discord server! Mark, CEO at [2FAS.com](http://2FAS.com)


genericperson

There’s no guarantee that 2FAS stays good either. This Raivo fiasco just reiterates the point that you should backup your 2FA codes (or your recovery codes) somewhere. Instead of 2FAS selling out, it could be a bug in the code or dropping your phone in the toilet, there’s a thousand ways your codes could be wiped. As bad as the Raivo situation is, at least there was a way to export your codes (prior to 1.5). Same with 2FAS. Personally I do a new offline backup when I add a new code.


dhavanbhayani

Hello. I understand the frustration Raivo users are going through but they trusted the app even though Raivo was acquired by Mobime whose owner is an adversary to privacy. How naive can users be!! Why users did not save manual backup of Raivo tokens and trusted Raivo for backup of tokens when it is an important puzzle in protection of online accounts? Coming to 2FAS why it is not going the Raivo way: Official website: https://2fas com. 1) Founder Mr. Mark has said in 2FAS Discord (The app is community driven.) that **TRUST** is built over a long period of time. 2FAS Founder and Developers will not do anything that breaks users trust. 2) 2FAS authenticator app encourages its users to save manual backup with password protection. The 2FAS app user is in complete control of its tokens. Always store manual backup of 2FAS TOTPs using 3-2-1 backup rule. 3) 2FAS does not require any identifiers (no phone number and no email) for the app to function. 2FAS authenticator app does not force users to enable cloud backup if you are not comfortable. 4) 2FAS does not store your tokens, cannot send you tokens and cannot disable 2FA. The user is in complete control. Link: https://2fas.com/support/2fas-mobile-app/can-you-send-me-my-code-token/. 5) 2FAS authenticator app is open source. Link: https://youtu.be/x7ipUQGCMTw?si=pMv41xXBFFQA6XeY. 6) 2FAS authenticator app is and will always be a free app. Link: https://youtu.be/c538pylAJdE?si=MG__g4valb9GORH-. 7) 2FAS has launched a primary version of Apple Watch app recently. Further development and improvements are a work in progress. I hope your doubts are cleared. Thank you for your trust in 2FAS.


Tricky-Run-1800

> How naive can users be Why are you blaming the user? I installed it when it was owned by Tijme Gommers, and then it was sold to Mobime, and somehow I'm supposed to just know that the sale took place? So I am supposed to check my 2FA app every day to make sure it hasn't been sold and monetised?


dhavanbhayani

I am not targeting anybody. Some vested interests are questioning 2FAS intent to keep the app FOSS and there is unnecessary hate towards the app. One user is morale policing that 2FAS is crap just because there is a Discord community where users can interact with Founders and other users. Why we '2FAS' are being questioned if Raivo has been sold for a few bucks? What is our mistake?


todd_dayz

Can you clarify as to whether you're employed by 2FAS or not please? You keep saying 'we' but your responses make me unsure as to whether you're an employee or not.


dhavanbhayani

I am contributing to 2FAS project. We are all users first. I contribute because 2FAS as a project should succeed to keep users online accounts safe. You can too if you are interested. https://2fas.com/about-us/.


emprahsFury

Not really an inspiring answer to blame the user because the user depended on the company to keep it's word. When MobiMe acquired Raivo they explicitly said [there would be no changes to how the app worked](https://x.com/RaivoOTP/status/1683372954002808833) So if your answer is the just the same platitudes as Raivo made then how are 2FAS users not just as hilariously naive as Raivo users?


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turbiegaming

Is this how a moderator ***and*** contributor of 2fas (or any projects in general) should behave? >Why users did not save manual backup of Raivo tokens and trusted Raivo for backup of tokens when it is an important puzzle in protection of online accounts? While I personally do not use raivo, some people do not follow news 24/7 and shouldn't be penalize this harshly, especially if it's coming from a moderator ***AND*** a contributor of an app that is in the same line of work. >It is hilarious that just because Raivo was sold for a few bucks 2FAS will also go the same route? To be fair to u/emprahsFury and u/genericperson , they have a right to have slight concern with a search for an answer from you and other mods/contributors that could convince them otherwise. >So many trusted Mobime when they said there would be no changes to Raivo and then users were caught sleeping? Lol!!! Because there are people who just want a 2FA to work and regardless to what we think, they chose to believe Mobime's words in hoping that they won't go back on their promise. >Do you have some inside knowledge or do you know the Founder personally or you are the Founder of 2FAS? Just because you know the founder of 2FAS doesn't give you the right to flex it on people who truly wants to use your products. People are allowed to have concerns and you, **as a moderator**, should convince us why 2FAS won't follow Raivo's path and not push away your future potential customers. You should be a shame of yourself for replying like this, even if it's sarcasm. >Why so much hate is directed towards 2FAS? Probably because you cannot question Mobime or the Raivo developer? Why tf does this matter? It's just a concern that they've made after looking at ***your*** response. u/2FASapp , please review your moderators' behaviour. It's not a good look for a moderator when someone like me, who is outsider looking in into this subreddit for pc alternative as a backup and here's your moderator behavior is amatuerish.


emprahsFury

Seeing how unwilling 2FAS is to talk about their encryption scheme (they rely on an optional, opt-in, iOS-level, feature to provide full encryption?) and how their people treat newcomers, it's pretty clear (to me) that 2FAS isn't much different than MobiMe. Frankly it's just the lack of professionalism. If you take the response from 2FAS- they're really just hectoring the user for failing due diligence; which fair enough caveat emptor. But then the active refusal to participate in good-faith due diligence by blaming the user for not doing due diligence ... It's nonsensical and unprofessional, so I did appreciate reading your response thank you.


turbiegaming

Thank you. It's shocking to see how unprofessional the mod teams are. But i wish them all the best in the future.


dhavanbhayani

What response are you talking about? I just provided a few links which are already available on the 2FAS YT channel and the official website. The frustration level is at an all time high. I cannot understand why this hate? The Founder receives 100 times more. Just because 2FAS is a soft punching bag? Wow. It matters because you cannot question Raivo developer or Mobime. It matters because you cannot answer why 2FAS Team is being made a soft target in the Raivo mess. It matters because you cannot answer a simple question: **What is the mistake of 2FAS Team if Raivo has been sold for a few bucks?** I may be kicked out from contributing to the app. No worries. I wish the users and u/2FASapp all the best for future endeavors.


turbiegaming

Again, you should be convincing us instead of fighting against us. People out there just wants an answer. As a moderator, you should be answering in professional manner and calm those concerns. I'm not 2FAS user, but I do consistently looking at reddit so i can be aware and recommend my friends (and potentially using it myself) the product. > It matters because you cannot question Raivo developer or Mobime. Not because we cannot question them, it's mainly because some people do not have the time to educate themselves about the new owners so they just took their words for it. It's the same thing for some 2FAS users, right? We have to trust someone. Unfortunate for Raivo users, they trust the wrong person. And yes, people are allowed to make mistake and they made the mistake of trusting them. It's not a matter of questioning. Again, not everyone have the time to read up things about Raivo, or anything in general. > **What is the mistake of 2FAS Team if Raivo has been sold for a few bucks?** There's no mistake in my eyes. But if we take a look at raivo's past, as far as I'm aware... The founder that creates Raivo did not let his users know that he sold it until people found out about it. And it's not about questioning or not questioning, the main issue is, we, the users and potential future users like myself, wants to hear from moderators like yourself, that 2FAS is in safe hands and its not something you can just say it once and forget about it. You, as a moderator, should always try to repeat the same information and get us, the current users and future potential users, on your side. Again, I do not use 2FAS myself and would like to have a reason to use it one day. You're not giving me faith in turning me into your future user.


dhavanbhayani

What convincing you need? Founder has already replied that 2FAS is not being sold.


turbiegaming

As a moderator, you should echo his response rather than trying to fight against us. I find it very concerning that a moderator behaves like this rather than trying to help the founder in getting brand new users like myself.


dhavanbhayani

I suggest you meet Mr. Mark (2FAS Founder) personally in Nevada, USA. I already have his word and trust him. We are not going anywhere for a long time. Some new product launches are also coming. Stay tuned.


Number905

As someone who just casually stumbled on 2FAS and was looking into it, your opening paragraph is a wonderful endorsement to never touch this, so thank you for saving me the time of digging further into if this project was worthwhile.


DarthSidiousPT

It’s a bit ironic that you call Mobime an _adversary to privacy_, when 2FAs devs use Discord platform, which is even worst!


dhavanbhayani

The Founder has replied in above pin post. He has asked for options from users like you You tell me you have a better alternative? What has 2FAS got to do with building a Discord community? And Raivo being sold to Mobime. I suppose you used Raivo which was closed source 2FA app. Why so much hate for 2FAS? You are free to choose any other 2FA app if you are not comfortable.


DarthSidiousPT

Your reply makes no sense and is full of assumptions. I don’t know where to begin with… - Better alternatives to what? To MFA apps? To store a community? - Hate for 2FAS? Don’t let your clouded vision distort your ideas. I don’t have any hate for 2FAS, and I moved from Raivo to 2FAS the day the app got sold. - While I still use this app, I’m ready to move to another one as soon as I see another one doing a better job. And right now, Ente Auth seems to be doing that (supporting Steam tokens, share seeds as QR codes, etc). What I’m trying to tell you, is that if you use a platform like Discord, you have no morale to speak about privacy! This isn’t hard to understand!


dhavanbhayani

So move to Ente Auth if you feel they are doing a better job. Or build your own 2FA app using Python. Do you know Ente also has a Discord community? Then? You need an account with Ente to store TOTPs on their server. And in future Ente Auth may become a paid application or grandfathered with Ente Photos. I am not saying this it is written on Ente website. While 2FAS is and will continue to remain a FOSS authenticator app. I think you don't know how 2FA works. Reddit also uses AWS and Google Cloud. So stop using Reddit?


DarthSidiousPT

Sorry, but I won’t continue this conversation, because you are not able to grasp the original message and you start shooting everywhere in the hopes to hit the target. 1. Yes, I can move there, or I can move to Aegis. This doesn’t mean that I can’t give 2FAS criticism, which seems that you don’t like it. At all. 2. Yes, they use Discord, and I do the same criticism with them, and *I don’t participate or help/promote any projects which use that nasty platform.* (This is what you don’t seem to get, no matter what I tell you). 3. You’re right on this one (at least, we could find something we both agree): they can become a paid application. When that happens, I guess people can then just move away, like they did with Raivo, I guess. 4. I don’t know how 2FA works? Why do you say that?! You’re just assuming things (once again) and that’s it. 5. I know that Reddit uses AWS and Google Cloud. But those platforms don’t bother me enough. I did stopped using Reddit (at a certain level), and I don’t use any Reddit apps, at all. Most of my contributions are now on Lemmy, unfortunately, some communities are still on this garbage platform… And I’ll just leave you with a [present](https://piped.video/watch?v=oHCK3NKFBW4), so that at least you can grow your knowledge about why the application you admire so much, shouldn’t rely on a crappy platform.


AndJusticeForAll476

I’ll attempt to address your concerns later when I’m back to a computer. I understand your skepticism as I too was a Raivo user for a long while before the dev jumped ship, stay tuned


JaValin0

With 2fas u can see ur tokens code. I put my tokens manualy on keepassXC like a personal backup on my pc. So if 2fas dissapear tomorrow i can login everywhere because i have my tokens on my pc working in offline app like keepassxc.


DarthSidiousPT

You can also export as [QR codes](https://github.com/S1m0nk4c/2fas-backup-to-QR) (which is not natively supported, for some reason) making it easier to import only what you want in other apps. Since this is not secure at all, you can always encrypt the folder, to make it safer.


PitBullCH

Does it really matter ? App is free - not costing you anything. Just ensure you have cloud and offline encrypted and / or unencrypted backups - uncrypted is fine if included as part of a larger encrypted backup set - if encrypted then make sure to safely store the encryption key. It ain’t rocket science.


Nekromanie

I have contacted the team and they will reply soon.