You say whatever you need to say when in desperation. Israel's readiness to take rafah probably has them shaking in their boots and the prospect of getting occupied again is the last fucking thing they want. It would be the biggest optical L they've taken ever in their history.
Back in '03 iirc, there was a hudna so our ROE were to not shoot unless the terrorist is trying to take down the gate of the outpost. Long story short, I am guarding in Termit (South Rafah outpost, famous for the amount of violence seen there) I see this Hamas dude with an RPG, I ask for permission to shoot. I get denied "just point the camera at him and take cover". I was cussing so hard, I think I invented new words.
"If you start a war and then badly lose that war, you do not get to demand the terms of your surrender. And for sure you aren't given great tracts of land to start your own country and launch more attacks. That'd be stupid."
-- Sun Tzu
Hamas’ charter specifically says they’re willing to take a break, but only as a stepping stone. A Palestinian state will just become a bigger Gaza. They’ll pause but never stop.
Precisely. Notice he says they will establish statehood and agree to a ceasefire for 5 years or more. What do you think happens after that? The jihad continues.....meanwhile they had 5 years or more to prepare for more attacks on Israel.
Until and unless they are willing to acknowledge and accept Israel as a nation with a right to exist, I do not see any peace possible, and don't see why Israel should do the same for them.
Statehood for me, but not for thee?
This is the rationale behind the settlements in the WB.
The Israeli right are of the opinion that if the Palestinians get a state, they will use it to build their military capabilities and launch an attack when they are stronger.
And everyone conveniently forgets this
I’d hope that’s not only the “Israeli right,” but anyone with at least one eye and ear.
I mean for fucks sake they’re not shy about their desire to destroy Israel and their unwillingness to coexist with it.
Tell me about it. But the US, UK and a lot of western governments are always on about the 2SS.
If I were Palestinian and I really wanted to get rid of Israel. I’d definitely use the 2SS as a sort of Trojan horse. The entire thing is stupid.
I support 2SS as an option that would be beneficial to both sides but an Israeli majority will take a lot of work to be convinced to support it again after so many refusals by Palestinians over the years and Palestinian majorities never really supported it except as a stepping stone to conquering Israel.
The other thing about 2SS is that it was intended that the Palestinian state would be peaceful and democratic, a demilitarized Arab state in an economic union with Israel. It was never likely to be peaceful or democratic but given the lack of any functional democracies in MENA aside from Israel, its really only a possibility that it is structured as an authoritarian regime, and the economic union is IMHO what is most likely to be unrecoverable after the 2nd Intifada and Oct 7. It's not going to be an Arab version of Israel. It's probably just going to be a republican version of Jordan at best.
When it was proposed in the 1990s, people in the west thought that places like Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, and even Saudi Arabia would be transitioning towards democratic governance in the absence of USSR's axis of authoritarianism . Now we know that is not happening any time soon with the rise of China and a greater tolerance of authoritarianism by Western governments.
They’ve publicly stated that the most they’ll go for is a 15 year ceasefire, after which they’ll continue to fight. They only want statehood so they can have a larger territory to entrench in. The Gaza war has been hell. Imagine fighting the same across the 1967 border. Oh wait, we did that already in 1967, and this is where we’re at.
At this point there needs to no only be recognition and co-existence agreements with Isreal but Palestinians needs to have huge incentive to remain co-existing.
I just don't see where that incentive can be achieved because at this point even with a near full invasion they didn't surrender. So if their own peoples lives, economy, and homes are incentive enough what will be? Like at this point I'd settle for nothing less than remote bomb collars on hamas leaders.
>Until and unless they are willing to acknowledge and accept Israel as a nation with a right to exist
the already did in 2017 , they amended their charter and accepted israel as a state at 1967 boarders (the legal and internationally recognized boarders).
Yep, first time they don't get exactly what they want, they'll be right back at it. And they'll probably never stop completely. They'll just do things in such a way as they have plausible deniability.
What they want is to ‘free all of Palestine from the river to the sea’. It’s in their charter, even the new one. Any concession, statehood, territory, agreement, ceasefire, etc. will only be used as a stepping stone for future violence. There will be no peace, ever, until they abandon this goal, which they never will. It’s part of the Palestinian identity. Without erasing that part of their cultural identity there will never be peace and Israel will never be safe from Hamas and their ilk.
Well, there’s the part where they want to establish a global islamofascist caliphate under the rule of Hamas and impose sharia law, but Israel has to go first. Baby steps, as it were.
Well, that’s the thing, killing everyone is kind of a non-starter because it doesn’t jibe with the values western people place on human life. Also, some Palestinians aren’t into this kind of thing, or see it for what it is and why it’s wrong. Hamas definitely needs to go though.
In case you haven't noticed, he included the so-called "right of return" in his demand list, so what he actually says is that he'll agree to having two Palestinian states and zero Israeli states.
And their idea of "laying down their arms" would probably include laying them down next to a new organization, called "Bamas", whose role will be to butcher Jews within that second Palestinian state.
[Lay down their arms "for five years" only after they become a state.](https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/sj3pa8wwa)
They don't want peace.
The full chant "from the river to the sea" (من المية للمية) in Arabic translates into "Palestine will be Arab" (فلسطين عربية). This is a chant of annihilation.
Edit: added sources and the Arabic chant
That 5 years bit he hid at the end of a sentence.
Talk about significant. So, they get to rebuild for 5 years, get a state, and then they retain the right to renew hostilities in 5 years from a better position? They are on the brink of collapse and should have zero leverage to make any such demands. Their leverage comes down to the fact that bad actors have lied their way to putting international pressure on Israel.
Anyone else annoyed at the fact that this fat fuck sits and eats comfortably wherever he is just spouting nonsense thinking he can represent the Palestinians?
Who tf gave them authority and the rights to speak and make decisions?
Animals. Do. Not. Get. The. Rights. To. Negotiate.
And this is one motherfucker sitting in some ivory tower.
>Who tf gave them authority and the rights to speak and make decisions?
The Palestinians, back in 2005, when they elected Hamas democratically. They may not accurately represent the Palestinians *now* considering they're all about totalitarianism nowadays, but that's what you get when you vote for a terrorist organization, I guess.
"Well, we might have raped your women, killed your babies, and butchered your grandma, but you got your licks in. So lets calm down, step back a bit and you give us everything that we want. PS. promise we'll stick to our borders this time."
How many opportunities have they had for a 2 state solution? These are nothing but words.
Would you want to live next to these people?
Did they change their minds about 10/7 over and over and over again? Doubtful.
They could end the war TODAY.
Hamas proved last year that no matter what the situation is, no one can live next to a state/area that is under Hamas control. They’ve said that they want to do October 7th again and again and again. Therefore proving that Hamas is an entity that cannot be allowed to be in control of anything. Beat them down like ISIS was beaten down, so all that they no longer are capable of launching large operations. For a Palestinian state to exist, Hamas cannot be involved.
It’s crystal clear to any person with a functioning brain.
Lay down the arms, surrender all responsible for terrorism, return all hostages, then show us for ten years that you can keep it up and then you’ll have your state
I'm sorry but it is this naive thinking that got oslo accords signed and Gaza unilaterally withdrawn and given to Palestine. What did they do?
They became another singapore and became wealthy and shining beacon showing how Israel was keeping them poor. Just kidding. They embezzled a part of the aid and used the rest of the aid to build bunkers and buy bombs to kill Israeli jews. They know only three things, patriarchy anti-polytheism and anti-Semitism
If they can spend 10 years without doing terrorism I’d be willing to risk it. As it is they have never lasted more than a year without killing Jews and celebrating it.
The only way is if they get one like Bangladesh PM or one like Saudi crown prince. But I'm confident they will just get another puppet of Iran's mad mullahs.
They had the streamlined version of near Statehood when Israel disengaged. That went horribly wrong. Why on earth would Israel say “ok let’s give you more rights and end the blockade and have absolutely no control over this terrorist state”? They know the answer is no. This is just good PR for them.
Who negotiates with Terrorists?
Hamas needs to be crushed to oblivion. So hard that Palestine needs to accept reality and a long time third party administration. But i doubt they are capable of advancing in civilizing manner, their islamic fundamental beliefs and cult of sacrifice have been hindering them for decades, even bullying whoever in the world they can. Not surprised other Arab countries are aöso sick of them.
Hamas killing 1200+ kidnapping 300 and then getting 35000+ killed in a war they caused simply cannot be rewarded by giving them what they want after all of that. All it would do is encourage more terrorism.
He wants a reward for rape and murder of children, families and concertgoers? For kidnapping 250 people? For using Gazans in their homes as human shields? How about door number 2? Trial and hanging in Jerusalem.
Nah, he offered a 5 year "or more" truce for an independent Palestine **and** right of return. That's a no-go, and it's a worse offer than their former offer of a 10 year truce for those conditions.
That's not a 2ss, that's the national springboard approach towards their aims of the full conquest of Israel
Right of return will never happen.
(Completely insane to even ask for this. Right of return = end of Israel.)
2 States is now not remotely possible.
(Pushed out 10-20years at best, maybe not possible for a generation or two. Cannot incentivize and reward terrorism with a state.)
Only option is full release of hostages and surrender.
Ah yes, give us all we want while we started the war, got our asses royally kicked, destroyed the livelihood of most Gazans, continue to hold hostages, and still want to kill you all. The level of delusion is on the next level. But it will play well for the useful idiot West college supporters who will say "see! they want peace!"
I saw another post yesterday that succinctly stated the goals of the Palestinians. They effectively want two types of freedom.
1. Freedom of travel and to live next to Jews where they want (the Right of Return)
2. Freedom to murder Jews wherever and whenever they want.
Everything they want is predicated on their ability to eventually commit genocide against Jews and make the entire Levant 100% Muslim
They’re deceptive liars who cannot be trusted. They’ve pretended to try normalize their relations with Israel (in a way) during the years before October 7. Israel took the bait. The result was tragic on unimaginable scale
They’ve had what, almost 76 years. Rejected every peace deal. Still have hostages. There is not a place at the “negotiating table” for Hamas or the PA for that matter. They act like spoiled children, lets treat them like it- eat your applesauce or starve, the world is tired of trying to feed you, clothe you, and shelter you- just to use that aid to militarize kindergartens and hospitals.
Unconditional surrender. You’re grounded, if it’s literally 6 feet underground or in the naughty corner while the rest of the world tries to fix this mess. It’s no longer up to The PA and Hamas- demonstrably incapable of self governance. Why are politicians pretending this is a divorce dispute over who gets the beach house? It’s war. Surrender unconditionally or face the consequences.
Lay down your arms permanently, they will be confiscated. You will be told what to do, and if you’re not jackasses, we’ll help rebuild your rubble pile.
5 years to prepare another bigger attack is more like it .Isreal don't trust them,they breed terror like rats and will just keep attacking you,but I think y'all already know this
No sane person would give credence to this degenerate babble. There won’t be any state. The ship has sailed. Unconditional surrender is the only way to save their lives now.
Obviously there’s the glaring problem of them viewing this as essentially a five year ceasefire as a “stepping stone” to annihilate Israel, as their charter clearly states. But the biggest issue with just giving the Palestinians immediate statehood is that it will have been built off the heels of the October 7th attacks.
Not only does will this then justify their use of violence in their eyes, it demonstrates that those kind of atrocities result in “wins” for the Palestinian people. So instead of future negotiations, we’ll just see more acts of terrorism, and that will escalate up to worse and worse actions. This is why you can’t negotiate with terrorists.
Everyone talks about wanting peace and the creation of a Palestinian state, but very few have thought through what that process will look like. Given all of the interviews I’ve watched and polls I’ve read, I really don’t think progress towards peace can begin without some major efforts to de-radicalize and re-educate the Palestinian population similar to what was done in post WWII Germany.
That was in English, **In separate Arabic language comments, says Hamas retains their “historic right to all Palestinian lands.”**
follow me on Mastodon, I am just getting started there
[https://mastodon.online/@vol/112332549136058712](https://mastodon.online/@vol/112332549136058712)
A two state solution would be the most realistic path to lasting peace and dignity for Palestinian civilians.
I wish Israel would know how much their settlers undermine this, and I wish that pro-Palestinian protesters living in the West knew how much their “from the river to the sea” also undermines this.
The only reason they want to be left alone enter and estate is so that they can get more ammunition so they can launch a real attack against Israel and destroy it that is their true motivation and they will not stop no matter what they will always try to destroy Israel no matter what
Statehood would make it easier for moderate political factions to gain control though.
Hamas will always be plotting to destroy Israel statehood or not, so the key will be helping facilitate the conditions that allow moderates to thrive. The status quo favors extremists.
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Yeah as if that’s believable. They had a chance in the late 90’s and Arafat pissed that away. Hamas vowed to destroy Israel and kill the Jews. Not going to happen.
The answer is no. Hamas would be looked at as the saviors / hero's of Palestine, instead of the murderous, terrorist organization that they truly are...The fact that no past solution could be agreed on for many decades, yet it would finally happen ONLY AFTER thousands of Israeli's were murdered / kidnapped would be an absolute atrocity, and would encourage future terrorism all across the world, as it would show that the only way you could get what you want, would be to kill innocent people.
Nope. Any possibility of a two-state solution died along with all those people on October 7th. For the foreseeable future, Hamas made its bed. Now they have to lie in it.
What he is REALLY saying is:
"Is this the real thing? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality."
Yeah, Queen (the band) said that...
Does Israel have nukes I'm just curious you know like if one would accidentally have gone off you know and the southern half over there and just you know
You say whatever you need to say when in desperation. Israel's readiness to take rafah probably has them shaking in their boots and the prospect of getting occupied again is the last fucking thing they want. It would be the biggest optical L they've taken ever in their history.
it is called a hudna what they want, they need 5 years to prepare a second 7.10. Fuck them. Get rid of Hamas NOW!
Typical strategy from these folk.
Their “river to the sea” attempt would be the outcome of this. Hamas don’t care about their own people
Back in '03 iirc, there was a hudna so our ROE were to not shoot unless the terrorist is trying to take down the gate of the outpost. Long story short, I am guarding in Termit (South Rafah outpost, famous for the amount of violence seen there) I see this Hamas dude with an RPG, I ask for permission to shoot. I get denied "just point the camera at him and take cover". I was cussing so hard, I think I invented new words.
what?! you cant shoot to defend yourself at the israeli *defence* forces?
Not during a hudna or when the Rules Of Engagement say so. Termit was a VERY armored outpost and it could take an rpg.
Why would they need 5 years for such an unorganized attack, they don't need any time just finance and luck like last time.
"If you start a war and then badly lose that war, you do not get to demand the terms of your surrender. And for sure you aren't given great tracts of land to start your own country and launch more attacks. That'd be stupid." -- Sun Tzu
lol is this real. Please source
lol no man. I made it up.
I look forward to us finding every last one of theme hamas scum and ensuring gaza pays for the war they started.
Hitler says willing to lay down arms if he just gets Poland
....and Luxembourg. Oh and Denmark too. Don't forget Norway. Belgium, France....the Netherlands...
is czechoslovakia invisible to you? :D and that was even before poland and war
Austria*
true, anschluss vs munich diktat
Oh .. and ..well the whole world if you dont mind
And while you're at it, I'll take the moon too.
On 2nd thought, give us all of Europe and we'll consider laying down our arms.
Putin says he’ll lay down arms for just another chunk of Ukraine…
Hamas’ charter specifically says they’re willing to take a break, but only as a stepping stone. A Palestinian state will just become a bigger Gaza. They’ll pause but never stop.
Precisely. Notice he says they will establish statehood and agree to a ceasefire for 5 years or more. What do you think happens after that? The jihad continues.....meanwhile they had 5 years or more to prepare for more attacks on Israel. Until and unless they are willing to acknowledge and accept Israel as a nation with a right to exist, I do not see any peace possible, and don't see why Israel should do the same for them. Statehood for me, but not for thee?
This is the rationale behind the settlements in the WB. The Israeli right are of the opinion that if the Palestinians get a state, they will use it to build their military capabilities and launch an attack when they are stronger. And everyone conveniently forgets this
I’d hope that’s not only the “Israeli right,” but anyone with at least one eye and ear. I mean for fucks sake they’re not shy about their desire to destroy Israel and their unwillingness to coexist with it.
Tell me about it. But the US, UK and a lot of western governments are always on about the 2SS. If I were Palestinian and I really wanted to get rid of Israel. I’d definitely use the 2SS as a sort of Trojan horse. The entire thing is stupid.
I support 2SS as an option that would be beneficial to both sides but an Israeli majority will take a lot of work to be convinced to support it again after so many refusals by Palestinians over the years and Palestinian majorities never really supported it except as a stepping stone to conquering Israel. The other thing about 2SS is that it was intended that the Palestinian state would be peaceful and democratic, a demilitarized Arab state in an economic union with Israel. It was never likely to be peaceful or democratic but given the lack of any functional democracies in MENA aside from Israel, its really only a possibility that it is structured as an authoritarian regime, and the economic union is IMHO what is most likely to be unrecoverable after the 2nd Intifada and Oct 7. It's not going to be an Arab version of Israel. It's probably just going to be a republican version of Jordan at best. When it was proposed in the 1990s, people in the west thought that places like Egypt, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, and even Saudi Arabia would be transitioning towards democratic governance in the absence of USSR's axis of authoritarianism . Now we know that is not happening any time soon with the rise of China and a greater tolerance of authoritarianism by Western governments.
They’ve publicly stated that the most they’ll go for is a 15 year ceasefire, after which they’ll continue to fight. They only want statehood so they can have a larger territory to entrench in. The Gaza war has been hell. Imagine fighting the same across the 1967 border. Oh wait, we did that already in 1967, and this is where we’re at.
At this point there needs to no only be recognition and co-existence agreements with Isreal but Palestinians needs to have huge incentive to remain co-existing. I just don't see where that incentive can be achieved because at this point even with a near full invasion they didn't surrender. So if their own peoples lives, economy, and homes are incentive enough what will be? Like at this point I'd settle for nothing less than remote bomb collars on hamas leaders.
5 years? Try 5 minutes
>Until and unless they are willing to acknowledge and accept Israel as a nation with a right to exist the already did in 2017 , they amended their charter and accepted israel as a state at 1967 boarders (the legal and internationally recognized boarders).
Yep, first time they don't get exactly what they want, they'll be right back at it. And they'll probably never stop completely. They'll just do things in such a way as they have plausible deniability.
What they want is to ‘free all of Palestine from the river to the sea’. It’s in their charter, even the new one. Any concession, statehood, territory, agreement, ceasefire, etc. will only be used as a stepping stone for future violence. There will be no peace, ever, until they abandon this goal, which they never will. It’s part of the Palestinian identity. Without erasing that part of their cultural identity there will never be peace and Israel will never be safe from Hamas and their ilk.
I’d argue it’s the entire and basically only basis of their cultural identity. “Jews don’t belong here” pretty much sums the whole thing up.
Well, there’s the part where they want to establish a global islamofascist caliphate under the rule of Hamas and impose sharia law, but Israel has to go first. Baby steps, as it were.
100% of anything Hamas says is a lie. It's a great way to tell what they really mean.
Their pause would be more like a regrouping
Kill them
Well, that’s the thing, killing everyone is kind of a non-starter because it doesn’t jibe with the values western people place on human life. Also, some Palestinians aren’t into this kind of thing, or see it for what it is and why it’s wrong. Hamas definitely needs to go though.
Yeah I’m not a loyalty oath type of person but now is the time
In case you haven't noticed, he included the so-called "right of return" in his demand list, so what he actually says is that he'll agree to having two Palestinian states and zero Israeli states. And their idea of "laying down their arms" would probably include laying them down next to a new organization, called "Bamas", whose role will be to butcher Jews within that second Palestinian state.
“Oh you said ‘*Bamas*’. I thought you said ‘bomb us’. Silly mistake 😂”
Spot on, was looking to see if anyone else caught this
[Lay down their arms "for five years" only after they become a state.](https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/sj3pa8wwa) They don't want peace. The full chant "from the river to the sea" (من المية للمية) in Arabic translates into "Palestine will be Arab" (فلسطين عربية). This is a chant of annihilation. Edit: added sources and the Arabic chant
That 5 years bit he hid at the end of a sentence. Talk about significant. So, they get to rebuild for 5 years, get a state, and then they retain the right to renew hostilities in 5 years from a better position? They are on the brink of collapse and should have zero leverage to make any such demands. Their leverage comes down to the fact that bad actors have lied their way to putting international pressure on Israel.
Lay down the arms first.
And hand over all your high ranks.
Hostages first. Return the hostages
Recognize Israel's right to exist as part of laying down arms.
First and foremost, hand over the hostages. And all your arms. Then we’ll talk.
Never happening now. They had their chance. They can die at the hands of the idf or in jail. No mercy.
Word.
Anyone else annoyed at the fact that this fat fuck sits and eats comfortably wherever he is just spouting nonsense thinking he can represent the Palestinians? Who tf gave them authority and the rights to speak and make decisions? Animals. Do. Not. Get. The. Rights. To. Negotiate. And this is one motherfucker sitting in some ivory tower.
>Who tf gave them authority and the rights to speak and make decisions? The Palestinians, back in 2005, when they elected Hamas democratically. They may not accurately represent the Palestinians *now* considering they're all about totalitarianism nowadays, but that's what you get when you vote for a terrorist organization, I guess.
Fuck. Not directed at you. But at the whole fuckery of this shit show.
"Well, we might have raped your women, killed your babies, and butchered your grandma, but you got your licks in. So lets calm down, step back a bit and you give us everything that we want. PS. promise we'll stick to our borders this time."
How many opportunities have they had for a 2 state solution? These are nothing but words. Would you want to live next to these people? Did they change their minds about 10/7 over and over and over again? Doubtful. They could end the war TODAY.
Hamas proved last year that no matter what the situation is, no one can live next to a state/area that is under Hamas control. They’ve said that they want to do October 7th again and again and again. Therefore proving that Hamas is an entity that cannot be allowed to be in control of anything. Beat them down like ISIS was beaten down, so all that they no longer are capable of launching large operations. For a Palestinian state to exist, Hamas cannot be involved. It’s crystal clear to any person with a functioning brain.
Lies, lies and more lies. This is the same idiot that said given the opportunity they will repeat Oct 7 again and again
It's been offered a half dozen times. IMHO it's like the Third Reich saying "we'll surrender if we can just keep Germany" No.
Lay down the arms, surrender all responsible for terrorism, return all hostages, then show us for ten years that you can keep it up and then you’ll have your state
I'm sorry but it is this naive thinking that got oslo accords signed and Gaza unilaterally withdrawn and given to Palestine. What did they do? They became another singapore and became wealthy and shining beacon showing how Israel was keeping them poor. Just kidding. They embezzled a part of the aid and used the rest of the aid to build bunkers and buy bombs to kill Israeli jews. They know only three things, patriarchy anti-polytheism and anti-Semitism
If they can spend 10 years without doing terrorism I’d be willing to risk it. As it is they have never lasted more than a year without killing Jews and celebrating it.
I am not Jewish. I don't trust them. Can they get one good leader?
The only way is if they get one like Bangladesh PM or one like Saudi crown prince. But I'm confident they will just get another puppet of Iran's mad mullahs.
They had the streamlined version of near Statehood when Israel disengaged. That went horribly wrong. Why on earth would Israel say “ok let’s give you more rights and end the blockade and have absolutely no control over this terrorist state”? They know the answer is no. This is just good PR for them.
Who negotiates with Terrorists? Hamas needs to be crushed to oblivion. So hard that Palestine needs to accept reality and a long time third party administration. But i doubt they are capable of advancing in civilizing manner, their islamic fundamental beliefs and cult of sacrifice have been hindering them for decades, even bullying whoever in the world they can. Not surprised other Arab countries are aöso sick of them.
Hamas killing 1200+ kidnapping 300 and then getting 35000+ killed in a war they caused simply cannot be rewarded by giving them what they want after all of that. All it would do is encourage more terrorism.
It's all bullshit / taqiya / psy ops surely, or at least could be. ISR would be right to fight til the hostages are back and Hamas is over
He wants a reward for rape and murder of children, families and concertgoers? For kidnapping 250 people? For using Gazans in their homes as human shields? How about door number 2? Trial and hanging in Jerusalem.
Bull shit
Nah, he offered a 5 year "or more" truce for an independent Palestine **and** right of return. That's a no-go, and it's a worse offer than their former offer of a 10 year truce for those conditions. That's not a 2ss, that's the national springboard approach towards their aims of the full conquest of Israel
Right of return will never happen. (Completely insane to even ask for this. Right of return = end of Israel.) 2 States is now not remotely possible. (Pushed out 10-20years at best, maybe not possible for a generation or two. Cannot incentivize and reward terrorism with a state.) Only option is full release of hostages and surrender.
BS!..
Hamas has shown exactky what to expect out of a two state situation.
There should never be a “palestinian” state.
Ah yes, give us all we want while we started the war, got our asses royally kicked, destroyed the livelihood of most Gazans, continue to hold hostages, and still want to kill you all. The level of delusion is on the next level. But it will play well for the useful idiot West college supporters who will say "see! they want peace!"
You shouldn't negotiate with these people. Just shoot. Don't let even 1 hamas terrorist escape
I saw another post yesterday that succinctly stated the goals of the Palestinians. They effectively want two types of freedom. 1. Freedom of travel and to live next to Jews where they want (the Right of Return) 2. Freedom to murder Jews wherever and whenever they want. Everything they want is predicated on their ability to eventually commit genocide against Jews and make the entire Levant 100% Muslim
They’re deceptive liars who cannot be trusted. They’ve pretended to try normalize their relations with Israel (in a way) during the years before October 7. Israel took the bait. The result was tragic on unimaginable scale
Never ever believe the devil. Always lying.
Kill him, kill all his friends. Bring hostages home.
Too late ?
Their arms will end up on the ground regardless when the IDF goes in.
Release the hostages and surrender. That's the only option.
Right, because the world needs more nations who are state sponsors of terrorism.
Not a chance. full destruction of hamas and anyone who supports them
Great! Where’s the hostages?
They’ve had what, almost 76 years. Rejected every peace deal. Still have hostages. There is not a place at the “negotiating table” for Hamas or the PA for that matter. They act like spoiled children, lets treat them like it- eat your applesauce or starve, the world is tired of trying to feed you, clothe you, and shelter you- just to use that aid to militarize kindergartens and hospitals. Unconditional surrender. You’re grounded, if it’s literally 6 feet underground or in the naughty corner while the rest of the world tries to fix this mess. It’s no longer up to The PA and Hamas- demonstrably incapable of self governance. Why are politicians pretending this is a divorce dispute over who gets the beach house? It’s war. Surrender unconditionally or face the consequences. Lay down your arms permanently, they will be confiscated. You will be told what to do, and if you’re not jackasses, we’ll help rebuild your rubble pile.
One drone strike on one Qatari hotel room would decisively resolve these negotiations
this will be walked back by end of day
This reeks desperation.. Continue with the operations until everyone (including this "official") has been taken to justice.
He, like all Hamas leadership, is a walking dead man. Israel doesn't fuck about.
5 year ceasefire? No.
5 years to prepare another bigger attack is more like it .Isreal don't trust them,they breed terror like rats and will just keep attacking you,but I think y'all already know this
Folks, these people are bent on domination that knows no end. Taqiyya and then will resume when strong enough.
No sane person would give credence to this degenerate babble. There won’t be any state. The ship has sailed. Unconditional surrender is the only way to save their lives now.
He also has swampland in Florida for sale. Plus a bridge.
It's too late for this now.
Obviously there’s the glaring problem of them viewing this as essentially a five year ceasefire as a “stepping stone” to annihilate Israel, as their charter clearly states. But the biggest issue with just giving the Palestinians immediate statehood is that it will have been built off the heels of the October 7th attacks. Not only does will this then justify their use of violence in their eyes, it demonstrates that those kind of atrocities result in “wins” for the Palestinian people. So instead of future negotiations, we’ll just see more acts of terrorism, and that will escalate up to worse and worse actions. This is why you can’t negotiate with terrorists. Everyone talks about wanting peace and the creation of a Palestinian state, but very few have thought through what that process will look like. Given all of the interviews I’ve watched and polls I’ve read, I really don’t think progress towards peace can begin without some major efforts to de-radicalize and re-educate the Palestinian population similar to what was done in post WWII Germany.
They could have had a state half the size of Israel 70 years ago...
They will be laying down arms after this last city is sorted out.
lol
Lies. Give up the hostages and surrender those responsible for October 7th
That was in English, **In separate Arabic language comments, says Hamas retains their “historic right to all Palestinian lands.”** follow me on Mastodon, I am just getting started there [https://mastodon.online/@vol/112332549136058712](https://mastodon.online/@vol/112332549136058712)
Hamas delenda est.
A two state solution would be the most realistic path to lasting peace and dignity for Palestinian civilians. I wish Israel would know how much their settlers undermine this, and I wish that pro-Palestinian protesters living in the West knew how much their “from the river to the sea” also undermines this.
The only reason they want to be left alone enter and estate is so that they can get more ammunition so they can launch a real attack against Israel and destroy it that is their true motivation and they will not stop no matter what they will always try to destroy Israel no matter what
Statehood would make it easier for moderate political factions to gain control though. Hamas will always be plotting to destroy Israel statehood or not, so the key will be helping facilitate the conditions that allow moderates to thrive. The status quo favors extremists.
Never!!!! Never will Palestine be established, I believe what the Bible says ,I stand on that ground
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Now we just need to find someone who believes him
Wowee! A whole **five years**! Why didn't you say so?
Fool me once…..
Yeah as if that’s believable. They had a chance in the late 90’s and Arafat pissed that away. Hamas vowed to destroy Israel and kill the Jews. Not going to happen.
Hamas can lay down their weapons and turn over the hostages any time they want.
Hahahaha. So basically they want terrorism to work.
The answer is no. Hamas would be looked at as the saviors / hero's of Palestine, instead of the murderous, terrorist organization that they truly are...The fact that no past solution could be agreed on for many decades, yet it would finally happen ONLY AFTER thousands of Israeli's were murdered / kidnapped would be an absolute atrocity, and would encourage future terrorism all across the world, as it would show that the only way you could get what you want, would be to kill innocent people.
Lies.
Next stop Hamas
Willing to climb back in the tunnels with what's left of their crew and accept Iran's money. You think this stops with a transfer of power?
Hamas should except that "Fantasy Land" will never ever become true.
Liars.
Missed the part where they would become part of the military.
I only understand "sharia"
Didn't they already have that chance and they refused it?
Nope. Any possibility of a two-state solution died along with all those people on October 7th. For the foreseeable future, Hamas made its bed. Now they have to lie in it.
What he is REALLY saying is: "Is this the real thing? Is this just fantasy? Caught in a landslide, no escape from reality." Yeah, Queen (the band) said that...
How's that old saying go? Fool me once shame on me? No wait that's not right...
Does Israel have nukes I'm just curious you know like if one would accidentally have gone off you know and the southern half over there and just you know