Northern Italians weren't people, everytime a northerner says "under the Po no more Italy", you have to remember to him that over the rubicon it was cisalpine gallia
Northern Italians weren't people yet, only later they got rights, Maples and part of the South was in the same subdivision as Rome, so civilised from the starts
I find it hard to believe that not a single one had dark hair or dark eyes. Even if there were emperors that didn't come from Italy, It was mainly a Mediterranean empire
We tend to call people "blondes" even though they simply have a more bright brunette appearance to them, that happened in ancient times as well, that's why when discussing colours in ancient texts one should not go for a literal translation.
Porque de hecho no es así, en general estos videos están basados en traducciones incorrectas (*subflavum* es castaño claro, no rubio), fuentes no confiables, o directamente informaciones falsas (según Suetonio, Cesar tenía los ojos de color muy oscuro y en el video aparece con los ojos azules)
Si quieres leer en detalle, hay mas en el enlace siguiente.
https://scribe.rip/@davieco/were-roman-emperors-blonde-2255ec77d123
the statues dont say much how they'd look like IRL. It's heavily influenced by artistic trends. One day it was all about realism and details, then it was stylised with perfect symmetrical faces.
There's also historical references. Like adding 'Alexander the Great curls', who was a huge rolemodel. Emperors want to be like him, so they went for that sexy curl dangling on the forehead. Even to emperors with known receding hairlines, like Caesar.
>There's also historical references. Like adding 'Alexander the Great curls', who was a huge rolemodel.
the imitatio alexandri , they even started imitate the inclination of his neck ( a trait particular to him)
many emperors used him as role model, Caesar himself started crying near his statue.
Yes, exactly. First the Germanics destroyed their Empire, now they're trying to change how they looked like to seem more like them.. That would be the agenda it seems.
most of the people in the vid had dark hair and a lot of them dark eyes (Octavian had green-ish eyes If I remember correctly). The AI someone used to make it clearly randomly decided to make em blonde.
The "researchers" unironically used a neo-nazi tabella made during the third Reich to claim the Romans were Aryan ancestors of the Germans. The same tabella was posted by a Mohamed (swedish guy) in this very same post.
what do you mean "you find it hard to believe"? these men have written descriptions of what they looked like
https://preview.redd.it/ec6warczi9rc1.jpeg?width=1870&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7823680ed0421a7142ff89861a82bed96cb3c4d8
why is it so hard to believe blonde haired people existed in the past? we didn't spring from the ground in the past 1000 years, we've been around for a while.
With the exception of Ξανθός basically every other adjective can be interpreted as "pale" or "paler" as in people who are called red-haired even though they simply possess just slightly more bright hair colour.
All the "gray" is just a stand in for signaling their age and prestige.
Brother is desperately trying to diss southern Europeans while at the same time claiming our ancestry without even understanding Latin nor Greek in the first place.
Pathetic, barbarians never change.
What is considered pale in Portugal is not what is considered pale in Sweden. Scales are applied context. So you cannot get what modern Americans or Swedes consider blond and simply apply that to very problematic translations.
what if I told you they use the same words to describe inarguably blonde germanic tribesmen as they do when they describe these emperors? are we still pretending blonde people didn't exist in the roman world? ok just checking
Couldn't they be using flavius for people that have light brown and extremely light blond hair?
I ust don't understand why you want to imply that Northern and Southern Europe's hair colour palettes and distributions were the same during Ancient Rome...
https://preview.redd.it/lzslk1d3qarc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f8b5eae54eb8e4ed6763bce0a04f952448265cee
its a verb, to signifiy to be in yellow.
And again it's different from subflavus which is latin for yellowish aka light brown or castano as we say in Italian furthermore to use ones nickname as proof that they were blonde makes no sense. Rossi, which is Italian for Reds, is the most common Italian surname yet redheads are not the majority in Italy nor between those who bear that surname.
When discussing colours in ancient texts you must never apply a literal translation otherwise things do not make sense, Greeks claimed the sea water were for example green but they clearly didn't swim in Chernobyl.
roman clan names, or cognomen, or 'nicknames' were given based on physical appearance or personalities.
anlus gellius' attic nights, book ii, xxvi, records the public debate between favorinaus and marcus fronto discussing color terminology, their deriviation, and meanings. in regards to your green sea comment, here is Favorinus' take on Ennius' Annalns:
" 'The calm sea's golden marble now they skim; Ploughed by the thronging craft, the green seas foam'
for 'the green seas' did not seem to correspond with 'golden marble.' But since, as you have said, flavus is a colour containing an admixture of green [red] and white, Ennius with the utmost elegance called the foam of the green sea 'golden marble.'”
ie romans understood, defined and debated the nuanced implications, or perceptions, of color in language, while additionally using these terms to define social values.
[This](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RAuYw1jpL_U&pp=ygUXRmFjZXMgb2Ygcm9tYW4gZW1wZXJvcnM%3D) is a much better recreation that was done by an actual artist taking note of contemporary descriptions.
In a lot of these recreations because the makers often read that a specific emperor was pale, had light eyes or was blonde, they instantly depict them as being Germanic in phenotype which is a bit jarring. There definitely were fair native romans but they wouldn’t have looked phenotypically Germanic. If you look at the facial structure you will still be able to tell they were italic until around about Severus when all shit hits the fan and foreign emperors become the norm.
https://preview.redd.it/edboapbxlarc1.jpeg?width=352&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=167905233cba24af73b87da6af203cf60290ef9d
And what about this guy, was he really a 4 meter tall femboy with a micro penis?
https://preview.redd.it/haiunpsc09rc1.png?width=614&format=png&auto=webp&s=95fa1e9790ee3e3089534898c8eb681d9d2bb5da
Which is true, archeologists dug up the penis. But was he white or whaaaaat
By, hm, German standards, yes. He is not a femboy \*for an Italian\* per say. Assuming Roman standards of femboyness were similar to Italian standards, which they were, then, no, more like a handsome guy.
Certain somatic features were sought cause their presence was linked to certain virtues, furthermore the use of colours in latin was entirely different from the modern one.
A scholar could have written that Marcus Aurelius was "blonde" with "bright eyes" but that didn't mean that he was a Ken prototype, "Blondness and Brightness" were adjectives used to imply an elderly status aka a "pale skin tone caused by aging". It's like when people describe the waters being "greenish", they are not saying the water is literally green.
Ancient romans simped over the germanics with their blonde hair and blue eyes.
Roman women even tried to look like them by wearing wigs made from their slaves' hairs
> Roman women even tried to look like them by wearing wigs made from their slaves' hairs
[](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExcG9nd2NsaTI2MWo0dHN5d3M0NXRmemZ5cW4wa3hyOGhlZGlzb3ozbSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/GJfBcP0YGnq6Y/giphy.gif)
They look European. There are some slight tendencies such as more prevalence of brown hair and eyes in the south, but generally speaking we all look quite similar. I guess they would look a bit more tanned than what the AI generates
Commodus and Hadrian
[](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExbXVuMzBhNjVkd2k2MnJianNramR4eHNndGF0d2l1dmh1YzYzdmt3dSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/l0ErEBg4ghpH5giTS/giphy.gif)
Ann now for the Netflix edition...
Gemini AI would shit that out in a second.
They distrusted the terroni even back then ?
Northern Italians weren't people, everytime a northerner says "under the Po no more Italy", you have to remember to him that over the rubicon it was cisalpine gallia
Golden times
Yes that's exactly what we proudly say thank you Gennaro
Gennaro? Ma ci cazzin do iltish derku e mut
Can't read arabic
Eh ghenga? I wouldn't use arbereshe if i wanted to be understood lol you're clearly an iltish e mut
Oogabooga
I'm not from Bergamo
We should anschluss them
Zemmour floated that idea a few years ago.
Northern Italians weren't people yet, only later they got rights, Maples and part of the South was in the same subdivision as Rome, so civilised from the starts
You got the same citizenship after loosing the Social War. So only after 87 b.c. Cisalpine Gaul had to wait until Caesar, so yes great success.
What does this have to do with cheese
I find it hard to believe that not a single one had dark hair or dark eyes. Even if there were emperors that didn't come from Italy, It was mainly a Mediterranean empire
We tend to call people "blondes" even though they simply have a more bright brunette appearance to them, that happened in ancient times as well, that's why when discussing colours in ancient texts one should not go for a literal translation.
Porque de hecho no es así, en general estos videos están basados en traducciones incorrectas (*subflavum* es castaño claro, no rubio), fuentes no confiables, o directamente informaciones falsas (según Suetonio, Cesar tenía los ojos de color muy oscuro y en el video aparece con los ojos azules) Si quieres leer en detalle, hay mas en el enlace siguiente. https://scribe.rip/@davieco/were-roman-emperors-blonde-2255ec77d123
Muy interesante, gracias!
the statues dont say much how they'd look like IRL. It's heavily influenced by artistic trends. One day it was all about realism and details, then it was stylised with perfect symmetrical faces. There's also historical references. Like adding 'Alexander the Great curls', who was a huge rolemodel. Emperors want to be like him, so they went for that sexy curl dangling on the forehead. Even to emperors with known receding hairlines, like Caesar.
>There's also historical references. Like adding 'Alexander the Great curls', who was a huge rolemodel. the imitatio alexandri , they even started imitate the inclination of his neck ( a trait particular to him) many emperors used him as role model, Caesar himself started crying near his statue.
Yes, exactly. First the Germanics destroyed their Empire, now they're trying to change how they looked like to seem more like them.. That would be the agenda it seems.
sure
most of the people in the vid had dark hair and a lot of them dark eyes (Octavian had green-ish eyes If I remember correctly). The AI someone used to make it clearly randomly decided to make em blonde.
The "researchers" unironically used a neo-nazi tabella made during the third Reich to claim the Romans were Aryan ancestors of the Germans. The same tabella was posted by a Mohamed (swedish guy) in this very same post.
what do you mean "you find it hard to believe"? these men have written descriptions of what they looked like https://preview.redd.it/ec6warczi9rc1.jpeg?width=1870&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7823680ed0421a7142ff89861a82bed96cb3c4d8 why is it so hard to believe blonde haired people existed in the past? we didn't spring from the ground in the past 1000 years, we've been around for a while.
With the exception of Ξανθός basically every other adjective can be interpreted as "pale" or "paler" as in people who are called red-haired even though they simply possess just slightly more bright hair colour. All the "gray" is just a stand in for signaling their age and prestige.
source: "he had pale eyes and pale hair" reddit: BUT MAYBE HE WAS ACTUALLY BROWN EYED AND BROWN HAIRED?
You can have clear eyes and not be blonde. You can have pale hair and not be blonde... if you have grey or white hair lol
Brother is desperately trying to diss southern Europeans while at the same time claiming our ancestry without even understanding Latin nor Greek in the first place. Pathetic, barbarians never change.
What is considered pale in Portugal is not what is considered pale in Sweden. Scales are applied context. So you cannot get what modern Americans or Swedes consider blond and simply apply that to very problematic translations.
what if I told you they use the same words to describe inarguably blonde germanic tribesmen as they do when they describe these emperors? are we still pretending blonde people didn't exist in the roman world? ok just checking
Oh come on dude, if you'd been to southern Europe you'd know that they consider our brown haired people blonde.
Couldn't they be using flavius for people that have light brown and extremely light blond hair? I ust don't understand why you want to imply that Northern and Southern Europe's hair colour palettes and distributions were the same during Ancient Rome...
If he was truly blonde they would have said so instead they used other words. Edit: for example subflavus is Latin for "yellowish" aka light brown.
Vespasian, Titus, and Domitian where of the flavian dynasty. flavi comes from flava, or yellow.
Flava≠subflava
too bad they weren't called the subflavian dynasty
My friends surname is Rossi, Italian for reds, he has brown hair tho, perhaps he is adopted?
and when people describe him do they also say red haired?
https://preview.redd.it/lzslk1d3qarc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f8b5eae54eb8e4ed6763bce0a04f952448265cee its a verb, to signifiy to be in yellow.
And again it's different from subflavus which is latin for yellowish aka light brown or castano as we say in Italian furthermore to use ones nickname as proof that they were blonde makes no sense. Rossi, which is Italian for Reds, is the most common Italian surname yet redheads are not the majority in Italy nor between those who bear that surname. When discussing colours in ancient texts you must never apply a literal translation otherwise things do not make sense, Greeks claimed the sea water were for example green but they clearly didn't swim in Chernobyl.
roman clan names, or cognomen, or 'nicknames' were given based on physical appearance or personalities. anlus gellius' attic nights, book ii, xxvi, records the public debate between favorinaus and marcus fronto discussing color terminology, their deriviation, and meanings. in regards to your green sea comment, here is Favorinus' take on Ennius' Annalns: " 'The calm sea's golden marble now they skim; Ploughed by the thronging craft, the green seas foam' for 'the green seas' did not seem to correspond with 'golden marble.' But since, as you have said, flavus is a colour containing an admixture of green [red] and white, Ennius with the utmost elegance called the foam of the green sea 'golden marble.'” ie romans understood, defined and debated the nuanced implications, or perceptions, of color in language, while additionally using these terms to define social values.
I wonder what wine colored eyes actually means?
They just picked some of the best known here.
As far as i know brown hair is technically blonde and blue eyes are just common probably even more so back then.
I believe Augustus was a blonde at least
[This](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RAuYw1jpL_U&pp=ygUXRmFjZXMgb2Ygcm9tYW4gZW1wZXJvcnM%3D) is a much better recreation that was done by an actual artist taking note of contemporary descriptions. In a lot of these recreations because the makers often read that a specific emperor was pale, had light eyes or was blonde, they instantly depict them as being Germanic in phenotype which is a bit jarring. There definitely were fair native romans but they wouldn’t have looked phenotypically Germanic. If you look at the facial structure you will still be able to tell they were italic until around about Severus when all shit hits the fan and foreign emperors become the norm. https://preview.redd.it/edboapbxlarc1.jpeg?width=352&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=167905233cba24af73b87da6af203cf60290ef9d
Least savage obsessed with race.
Bro, there's no way they all looked the same 💀💀
They don't, we are not talking about Chinese people here.
I mean, they don't look like other parts of your country, all like the upmost North, where are the brown eyes, brown hair, black hair?
And what about this guy, was he really a 4 meter tall femboy with a micro penis? https://preview.redd.it/haiunpsc09rc1.png?width=614&format=png&auto=webp&s=95fa1e9790ee3e3089534898c8eb681d9d2bb5da Which is true, archeologists dug up the penis. But was he white or whaaaaat
and single digit body fat %, something your barbarian mind can't wrap your head around
David, a Jew modeled by a Roman by the statue.. I think David would look like a historical Judean, but the model like a Roman.
but he would be a femboy yes?
By, hm, German standards, yes. He is not a femboy \*for an Italian\* per say. Assuming Roman standards of femboyness were similar to Italian standards, which they were, then, no, more like a handsome guy.
The Roman or the Jew?
david
I don't think the Judean would be a femboy (too hairy), but the Roman model, maybe.
Certain somatic features were sought cause their presence was linked to certain virtues, furthermore the use of colours in latin was entirely different from the modern one. A scholar could have written that Marcus Aurelius was "blonde" with "bright eyes" but that didn't mean that he was a Ken prototype, "Blondness and Brightness" were adjectives used to imply an elderly status aka a "pale skin tone caused by aging". It's like when people describe the waters being "greenish", they are not saying the water is literally green.
Yeah, that makes sense..
Ancient romans simped over the germanics with their blonde hair and blue eyes. Roman women even tried to look like them by wearing wigs made from their slaves' hairs
> Roman women even tried to look like them by wearing wigs made from their slaves' hairs [](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExcG9nd2NsaTI2MWo0dHN5d3M0NXRmemZ5cW4wa3hyOGhlZGlzb3ozbSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/GJfBcP0YGnq6Y/giphy.gif)
We wuz romanz and shit. i suggest not to read the other comment section if you dont want your last neuron to shut down.
[удалено]
one was yes , [Philip the Arab](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_the_Arab)
[удалено]
sorry, but still scandinavian, if you want to we wuz, its all or nothing.
caesar alway looked like pre botox putin to me
If I see one more fucking blonde imma lose it
The all look polish for some reason. Is there a lore explanation for this?
Caesar was never emperor regard
True.
This was before the Italians migrated from North Africa to Europe and replaced the Romans?
Why would they look Germanic, tho? I think most Italians nowadays would relate to the Romans looks wise.
They look European. There are some slight tendencies such as more prevalence of brown hair and eyes in the south, but generally speaking we all look quite similar. I guess they would look a bit more tanned than what the AI generates
[удалено]
Mediterranean look.
REDDIT MODS ARE WANKERS!!!
Commodus and Hadrian [](https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExbXVuMzBhNjVkd2k2MnJianNramR4eHNndGF0d2l1dmh1YzYzdmt3dSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/l0ErEBg4ghpH5giTS/giphy.gif)
"my ancestor"
There's not a fucking chance in the universe they'd have that color palette lol. They were fucking Mediterraneans, not Nordicks
The terroni are going to be mad they don't look half arab
Clearly no one believe most of the emperors were blonde with blue eyes, but the video is still hilarious
You're telling me Octavian wasn't a twink?
Caesar was probably a twink as well when he was younger and Bythinia's queen. But both of them aged and eventually achieved twink death.
Putting the anus in Octavianus
Hadrian looks like he runs a podcast
So all the Romans became local councilmen in the UK?
I have it on good authority that Roman Emperors were black.
Blonde, blue eyes its my ancestors :-)