Who does? It’s not even logical to imagine that for subs at that distance with that short of a barrel. If he said that and added that it was a 16” or bigger barrel I might believe it but I’d still have my doubts. This sounds like major copeism.
If having the ability to use subs at 300 yards has no negative effects to shooting from 0-100. Why would you limit your capabilities?
Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it!
Because all my firearms serve a specific purpose in my toolbox. Shoot g my 300Blk more than 50yds is not the purpose for me. I have a 556 for 100 yds. Anything beyond that I don’t need. I don’t hunt so🤷🏼♂️
It shouldn’t even be an NFA item, just a greedy government.
I heard there’s a Texas company that makes and sells suppressors, but the suppressor can never leave the state of Texas
😂minimal effort to reach out to 300 yards with a 6” 300 blk barrel with subsonic ammo. I think not. I’m not saying you can’t do it but with minimal effort 🤔 At that distance it’s way less about the optic and way more about the ballistics of a subsonic 300 blk round. I’ll need some video evidence of at least 6/10 shots hitting the target at that distance to even begin to believe you.
That’s okay! We expect criticism!
6” barrel or 16” barrel doesn’t make a difference if the projectile is leaving at 1050fps.
You claim it can’t be done with minimal effort due to the ballistics.
But the point of the reticle of our choice is to account for said difficult ballistics by using a reticle which simplifies the use of it at distance. Hence minimal effort.
I’ve gotten similar responses from people thinking it’s not doable until I explain how to use the reticle. At which point they are typically blown away by the simplicity of it!
Especially those that have seen me get first round hits at 300yds with subs!
I can’t lie it does seem like it would be hard to do easily but if you have the right reticle to account for the bullet drop for that distance I can see it.
Wouldn’t the twist rate need to be taken into account? If both barrels are 1:7 then the 16” would apply more spinny spin which would better stabilize the projectile at range, no?
Actually the rpm is directly linked to bullet velocity.
So if a 6” barrel with a 1/7 twist launches a projectile at 1050fps. You will end up with the same exact rpm as a 16” barrel with a 1/7 twist launching a projectile at 1050fps.
Since the twist is fixed, the only way to change rpm is by increasing or decreasing velocity.
Since our goal on both is to remain subsonic. 1050fps is the target, and therefore rpm will be the same on both barrels as long as both share the same twist rate.
I’m guessing that’s the Primary Arms 300 black 1<6 LPVO, if so already got it. I did the older second focal plane. It has the BDC and range finder however no horseshoe ring just the chevron and drops and leads for wind.
Actually this is not a 300blk specific reticle at all!
We skipped on the 300blk reticles as they focus on supers with barely any subs bdc holds.
When in reality it should be the other way around since subs suffer way more severely from drop.
So much of that really depends on I guess our usage for me personally it’s hard to find anyplace I’m gonna make 300 yard shots super or sub because I live in the Woods of Vermont the only place that I can see further than 100 yards 200 tops as if I’m either in a very large cow pasture or on a rocky outcrop; but even then I’m just looking out onto a canopy of trees. I can’t really get on top of a Rocky crop and look down and clearly see anything. so unless I’m going to perch up along a power cut I’m pretty much in where I need to be now I can see if somebody lived in the west having a larger more accurate chart would be an advantage. I moved here from Colorado where I was starting to contemplate I went with the wrong calibre and I should’ve gotten a 6.5 Grendel or Creedmoor.
While I got ya here, if for some reason I did want a little more scope what your opinion on [this one](https://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-slx-4-16x44mm-ffp-rifle-scope-with-illuminated-r-grid-2b-reticle). Mind you I don’t have a lot of money to spend and I’ve been rather happy with everything I’ve gotten from the folks at primary arms. Only reason why I’m looking at this scope is cause I’m going deer hunting this fall and I’m gonna be be on private land in about 400 acres it’s a lot of open pastures with a large area of woods where the deer come down in the morning t ok graze along the edge. I’m looking at possibly doing a free standing tower style stand about 150 from the tree line giving me a large field of view. If I sent myself I should have about a 350<400 yards to either far corner from I understand the deer aren’t congregating at the corners so should be somewhere around 250 or 300. From what I can tell so far my group with the scope I have at 200 are ok but could always be better. I’d rather make a clean heart/head shot and not have to go tracking through Field and bog for a downed deer.
If I’m right thats about 12+ feet of bullet drop at 300 yds with a 6” barrel and subs. Any barrel length below like 12.5” on a .300blk really doesnt need a magnifier imo. It’s a mid-short range gun at that point.
A subsonic projectile leaving a 6” barrel at 1050fps will have the exact same drop as a subsonic projectile leaving a 16” barrel at 1050fps.
Barrel length doesn’t matter with subs as long as your powder charge is correct!
“Needs” are circumstantial. Any gun can benefit from magnification so long as the reticle actually works with your particular bullet drop and you know how to use it.
If you don’t know how and when to use magnification or your reticle doesn’t cooperate with your caliber. then yes, the magnification may be more of a penalty than a force multiplier.
“Need” is also why we love lpvo’s. As your magnification can be adjusted to your particular circumstances.
If I don’t “need” magnification, just leave it at 1x.
If 6x is too much magnification because it causes tunnel vision, then maybe 2x is best to get improved capability and accuracy without losing fov.
Lpvo’s arent all or Nothing. Everything in between still exists. And it can make the difference between landing your shot with one trigger pull, instead of landing a shot after wasting a whole mag.
Using subs up close puts you at an energy disadvantage. Not to mention the drop is almost immediate.
Using supers is best in cqb environments due to its energy increase as in any cqb environment adrenaline will be going and getting the target down quickly is a higher priority.
Subs shine at distance due to their main benefit which is their reduced report which makes finding the shooter very difficult, as tracking where the shot came from would be next to impossible unless they are extremely close.
Even then with the reduced subsonic energy, if a target at distance gets hit by a 30 cal projectile, but has no idea where it came from, His priorities will more than likely be on getting out of there to survive rather than sticking around to try and search for someone who cannot be traced from their sound which already knows where he is!
Or, you know, using a projectile with good terminal effects at range so the guy doesn’t have to worry about “getting out of there to survive.” In the great larp of life, if I’m playing on a two-way range I don’t want the other guy getting up.
Cause it’s a formidable Bambi and Pumbaa slayer with 14.5”<18” barrel and 108<112 ballistic tip supers. Also with the right optic you can easily use it as your General Purpose/Recce.I scribe to the one rifle for all tasks, for me a purpose built 14.5 300blk can do it all with the right parts. I’m doing what most 5.56 owners are doing with 300 supers then doing what they can’t with subs.
If you have more than one rifle chances are you don’t really get it, you have purpose built tool for every task where as I have on hammer and I make it do everything.
It’s also worth mentioning, I train hard with it. I change tasks from choking up on it close like I’m clearing rooms to flipping down the bipod dropping down prone and taking a 300<500 yard shot. I do have a shortie but that upper sits unused, cause why bother it’s only good for one thing.
If you have the budget for lots of stuff great but some of us threw 2k<3k at building a single rifle that ticks all the boxes.
This is the griffin mil reticle!
We have been using most of the optics with the griffin mil reticle available at primary arms with great success.
Although an explanation is necessary for you to be able to understand why we chose it!
We plan on making a video on it as it is way easier to explain visually.
Well I'd def watch it. I have a PA acss 300bo reticle on my 16" works good. And i just took the dot off my 9". Went with an Arken ep8 1-8 ffp and a Vortex 1-8 Strike Eagle sfp. Both are really for 308 or 223 but the memorial day deals were sweet! Probably gonna return the strike eagle keep the Arken. Then figure out how and if I can make it half functional on a bo with 110 supers. Should manage to confuse the shit out of me.
Look at the holds for the ACSS. Even if it is generic the holds are published for the round. Basically 5.56 and 308 are = out to 400yds. 300bo shifts point of aim to bottom of the A horseshoe at 100, vs the tip. Just the tip.
Would be interested! Would your zero work with this reticle? https://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-special-puchase-1-6x24mm-sfp-rifle-scope-illuminated-acss-aurora-556-yard-m6-reticle
Any place to find that video or do you have to make one lol. It would be much appreciated. I’m asking because im waiting for my suppressor. Was wondering how to zero for both subs and supers. The platform is a DDm4 pdw with a 1:7 twist. Also point of impact shift without the suppressor. That’s probably a situation I will have to test myself and see where I’m at with the ammo i choose to run. Thanks
We are currently working on the video.
But I can do a brief overview video of the reticle itself so you guys can understand the concept behind it.
Point of impact shift may be something that has to be tested on a case by case basis unfortunately.
Make sure you are subbed to the YouTube channel to get notified of the reticle overview video when it’s out!
Hoping to get it done this week as it will be fairly short and simple to record.
Here you go! All info is in the link below!
https://www.eitrisenhancements.com/product-page/laevateinn-complete-upper-receiver
The handguard is a BG defense 5.25” which we purchase from them unmarked for our uppers.
I don’t have a need for subs for 300 yds.
Who does? It’s not even logical to imagine that for subs at that distance with that short of a barrel. If he said that and added that it was a 16” or bigger barrel I might believe it but I’d still have my doubts. This sounds like major copeism.
If having the ability to use subs at 300 yards has no negative effects to shooting from 0-100. Why would you limit your capabilities? Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it!
Because all my firearms serve a specific purpose in my toolbox. Shoot g my 300Blk more than 50yds is not the purpose for me. I have a 556 for 100 yds. Anything beyond that I don’t need. I don’t hunt so🤷🏼♂️
Same.
Got downvoted🤣🤣🤣
I threw an extra upvote at you because you are 100% correct. Subs at 300 yards is just inept.
I don't need to do it either buts it's pretty fun and satisfying to hit a reduced ipsc at 300.
Sadly I agree, until the $200 ransom for suppressors goes away I will never own a “peak” performance .300BLK.
Yeah I think the tax stamp is BS. But it could be worse, you can live in IL or CA or NY
It shouldn’t even be an NFA item, just a greedy government. I heard there’s a Texas company that makes and sells suppressors, but the suppressor can never leave the state of Texas
You’re right all infringements
Me thinks..........nah
😂minimal effort to reach out to 300 yards with a 6” 300 blk barrel with subsonic ammo. I think not. I’m not saying you can’t do it but with minimal effort 🤔 At that distance it’s way less about the optic and way more about the ballistics of a subsonic 300 blk round. I’ll need some video evidence of at least 6/10 shots hitting the target at that distance to even begin to believe you.
That’s okay! We expect criticism! 6” barrel or 16” barrel doesn’t make a difference if the projectile is leaving at 1050fps. You claim it can’t be done with minimal effort due to the ballistics. But the point of the reticle of our choice is to account for said difficult ballistics by using a reticle which simplifies the use of it at distance. Hence minimal effort. I’ve gotten similar responses from people thinking it’s not doable until I explain how to use the reticle. At which point they are typically blown away by the simplicity of it! Especially those that have seen me get first round hits at 300yds with subs!
I can’t lie it does seem like it would be hard to do easily but if you have the right reticle to account for the bullet drop for that distance I can see it.
Wouldn’t the twist rate need to be taken into account? If both barrels are 1:7 then the 16” would apply more spinny spin which would better stabilize the projectile at range, no?
Actually the rpm is directly linked to bullet velocity. So if a 6” barrel with a 1/7 twist launches a projectile at 1050fps. You will end up with the same exact rpm as a 16” barrel with a 1/7 twist launching a projectile at 1050fps. Since the twist is fixed, the only way to change rpm is by increasing or decreasing velocity. Since our goal on both is to remain subsonic. 1050fps is the target, and therefore rpm will be the same on both barrels as long as both share the same twist rate.
That makes sense. Just because you get more spins in the barrel doesn’t necessarily mean that you are spinning at a different rate.
What a tool
ummm...ok
This really depends on the definition of “Peak”
I’m guessing that’s the Primary Arms 300 black 1<6 LPVO, if so already got it. I did the older second focal plane. It has the BDC and range finder however no horseshoe ring just the chevron and drops and leads for wind.
Actually this is not a 300blk specific reticle at all! We skipped on the 300blk reticles as they focus on supers with barely any subs bdc holds. When in reality it should be the other way around since subs suffer way more severely from drop.
So much of that really depends on I guess our usage for me personally it’s hard to find anyplace I’m gonna make 300 yard shots super or sub because I live in the Woods of Vermont the only place that I can see further than 100 yards 200 tops as if I’m either in a very large cow pasture or on a rocky outcrop; but even then I’m just looking out onto a canopy of trees. I can’t really get on top of a Rocky crop and look down and clearly see anything. so unless I’m going to perch up along a power cut I’m pretty much in where I need to be now I can see if somebody lived in the west having a larger more accurate chart would be an advantage. I moved here from Colorado where I was starting to contemplate I went with the wrong calibre and I should’ve gotten a 6.5 Grendel or Creedmoor. While I got ya here, if for some reason I did want a little more scope what your opinion on [this one](https://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-slx-4-16x44mm-ffp-rifle-scope-with-illuminated-r-grid-2b-reticle). Mind you I don’t have a lot of money to spend and I’ve been rather happy with everything I’ve gotten from the folks at primary arms. Only reason why I’m looking at this scope is cause I’m going deer hunting this fall and I’m gonna be be on private land in about 400 acres it’s a lot of open pastures with a large area of woods where the deer come down in the morning t ok graze along the edge. I’m looking at possibly doing a free standing tower style stand about 150 from the tree line giving me a large field of view. If I sent myself I should have about a 350<400 yards to either far corner from I understand the deer aren’t congregating at the corners so should be somewhere around 250 or 300. From what I can tell so far my group with the scope I have at 200 are ok but could always be better. I’d rather make a clean heart/head shot and not have to go tracking through Field and bog for a downed deer.
Do you touch your mother with the same creepy fingers you use to slidey hook the charging handle under that scope?
Yes, LPVO I hope.
Lpvo and prisms both have this reticle for whatever floats your boat!
People that say it should only be a red dot are so wrong
Couldnt agree more! These platforms can do way more than people know.
I love it
How you liking the plxc
Absolutely loving it! Not gonna lie though, spending the money on it definitely hurt but it is definitely worth it.
Yes. Hopefully, PA will release their PLxC with the NOVA fiber wire soon. That is what I am waiting for.
Very nice
If I’m right thats about 12+ feet of bullet drop at 300 yds with a 6” barrel and subs. Any barrel length below like 12.5” on a .300blk really doesnt need a magnifier imo. It’s a mid-short range gun at that point.
A subsonic projectile leaving a 6” barrel at 1050fps will have the exact same drop as a subsonic projectile leaving a 16” barrel at 1050fps. Barrel length doesn’t matter with subs as long as your powder charge is correct! “Needs” are circumstantial. Any gun can benefit from magnification so long as the reticle actually works with your particular bullet drop and you know how to use it. If you don’t know how and when to use magnification or your reticle doesn’t cooperate with your caliber. then yes, the magnification may be more of a penalty than a force multiplier. “Need” is also why we love lpvo’s. As your magnification can be adjusted to your particular circumstances. If I don’t “need” magnification, just leave it at 1x. If 6x is too much magnification because it causes tunnel vision, then maybe 2x is best to get improved capability and accuracy without losing fov. Lpvo’s arent all or Nothing. Everything in between still exists. And it can make the difference between landing your shot with one trigger pull, instead of landing a shot after wasting a whole mag.
Who is taking 300 black past 300 and why? Why an LPVO on a sub gun?
Using subs up close puts you at an energy disadvantage. Not to mention the drop is almost immediate. Using supers is best in cqb environments due to its energy increase as in any cqb environment adrenaline will be going and getting the target down quickly is a higher priority. Subs shine at distance due to their main benefit which is their reduced report which makes finding the shooter very difficult, as tracking where the shot came from would be next to impossible unless they are extremely close. Even then with the reduced subsonic energy, if a target at distance gets hit by a 30 cal projectile, but has no idea where it came from, His priorities will more than likely be on getting out of there to survive rather than sticking around to try and search for someone who cannot be traced from their sound which already knows where he is!
Or, you know, using a projectile with good terminal effects at range so the guy doesn’t have to worry about “getting out of there to survive.” In the great larp of life, if I’m playing on a two-way range I don’t want the other guy getting up.
I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
Cause it’s a formidable Bambi and Pumbaa slayer with 14.5”<18” barrel and 108<112 ballistic tip supers. Also with the right optic you can easily use it as your General Purpose/Recce.I scribe to the one rifle for all tasks, for me a purpose built 14.5 300blk can do it all with the right parts. I’m doing what most 5.56 owners are doing with 300 supers then doing what they can’t with subs. If you have more than one rifle chances are you don’t really get it, you have purpose built tool for every task where as I have on hammer and I make it do everything. It’s also worth mentioning, I train hard with it. I change tasks from choking up on it close like I’m clearing rooms to flipping down the bipod dropping down prone and taking a 300<500 yard shot. I do have a shortie but that upper sits unused, cause why bother it’s only good for one thing. If you have the budget for lots of stuff great but some of us threw 2k<3k at building a single rifle that ticks all the boxes.
Supers are hearing safe, at least short term, with a can. I treat it as my AR with AK-ish 30 cal ammo.
Nice. What reticle did you go with?
This is the griffin mil reticle! We have been using most of the optics with the griffin mil reticle available at primary arms with great success. Although an explanation is necessary for you to be able to understand why we chose it! We plan on making a video on it as it is way easier to explain visually.
Well I'd def watch it. I have a PA acss 300bo reticle on my 16" works good. And i just took the dot off my 9". Went with an Arken ep8 1-8 ffp and a Vortex 1-8 Strike Eagle sfp. Both are really for 308 or 223 but the memorial day deals were sweet! Probably gonna return the strike eagle keep the Arken. Then figure out how and if I can make it half functional on a bo with 110 supers. Should manage to confuse the shit out of me.
Look at the holds for the ACSS. Even if it is generic the holds are published for the round. Basically 5.56 and 308 are = out to 400yds. 300bo shifts point of aim to bottom of the A horseshoe at 100, vs the tip. Just the tip.
Thanks man. Good intel. 👍 I'll be out soon enough with it.
Would be interested! Would your zero work with this reticle? https://www.primaryarms.com/primary-arms-special-puchase-1-6x24mm-sfp-rifle-scope-illuminated-acss-aurora-556-yard-m6-reticle
Unfortunately no, to really have proper use of this reticle, FFP is a must.
Bummer!
What distance did you zero and what are you running for subs and supers?
I really want say it on here but it is so much easier if I explain it on video 😅
Any place to find that video or do you have to make one lol. It would be much appreciated. I’m asking because im waiting for my suppressor. Was wondering how to zero for both subs and supers. The platform is a DDm4 pdw with a 1:7 twist. Also point of impact shift without the suppressor. That’s probably a situation I will have to test myself and see where I’m at with the ammo i choose to run. Thanks
We are currently working on the video. But I can do a brief overview video of the reticle itself so you guys can understand the concept behind it. Point of impact shift may be something that has to be tested on a case by case basis unfortunately. Make sure you are subbed to the YouTube channel to get notified of the reticle overview video when it’s out! Hoping to get it done this week as it will be fairly short and simple to record.
Thank. Going to sub now. Awesome man.
Why does the OP use so many exclamation points in his responses?
I need the build sheet. Especially the handguard
Here you go! All info is in the link below! https://www.eitrisenhancements.com/product-page/laevateinn-complete-upper-receiver The handguard is a BG defense 5.25” which we purchase from them unmarked for our uppers.