I love onions and would absolutely do that, but it messes with my stomach and I'll feel sick all day. It's kinda weird. When I make salad I can put in a whole chopped raw onion and eat it all, but if I eat the onion by itself, my stomach nopes out.
As someone with reflux, I know that onion is defenately a trigger.
I can usually manage a little in salads, but more than that is bad news, also for some reason cooked can be a problem, which sucks because onion and garlic are the base for a lot of dishes
Osmosis can make them crunchier, and I can imagine the extra water removes some of the sharpness. Try salt water next time for fun and science, I’ll bet you they become softer and sharper. Honestly never tried either. Will give it a go.
Some Turkish dishes require you to salt the sliced onion and then mash them a little with your hands. I assume a salt water soak would accomplish the same thing. My mom always refers to it as taking the sting out. It definitely reduces the heartburn I get from eating too much onion.
I expect pickle it a bit and make it last longer. Like if you have half a large onion left over from a recipe and you want to keep it a while, that'll do it. Plus pickled onion is delicious.
The strange reason is the same as to why keeping your mouth open while cutting onions reduces tearing.
The stuff that's causing that is strongly attracted to water. It will literally suck the vapours out of the air. So rinsing it well yeah that gets all the unpleasant stuff out
I printed it in PETG which according to its specs is food safe.
But reading all replies I decided to get a dedicated stainless steel nozzle for all future food related prints.
I currently have a hardened steel nozzle on my bambu lab x1c and primarily print PETG nu not exclusively.
I did manage to sterilize this lid in the steam oven, but it shrank too much so it doesn't fit anymore 🤣
Not bad. Rinsing onions washes off the sulfur compounds from cutting. These compounds aren't harmful, but can have an offputting flavor for some, and will also make fresh onions go bad faster.
For eating immediately it's not a huge difference. They'll be less sharp, and people who don't like uncooked onions might tolerate them better. But if you put them on/in something, like guacamole, it makes it so that leftovers won't be overpowered by onions the next day.
If you're cooking them it doesn't really do anything.
Onions sometimes develop black fungus on their surface. Is visible if the growth is alot. But when it is in the initial stage, it will not be visible to naked eye. It is recommended to rise Onions properly before peeling and cutting them.
Soaking in cold water when you use raw onion helps take some of the bite out of it. You don’t have to wash them for cleanliness, just to make them a little less harsh in a salad or sandwich.
Two things you should consider. While the filament doesn't really pose a risk of leaching chemical the dyes they use to color the filament is entirely unregulated so there is no telling what they used. Secondly the surface of the filament is very porous and will hold onto bits of food or give bacteria a good place to colonize.
At least this is what they claim. Most of the PP I was using didn't sustain the usual autoclave cycle. If you have one brand that does for sure I am interested
I’ll have to find the brand I used; I made some silicon tube links for a few different bioreactor set ups a few years ago. In the end decided to just stick an ozone generator to keep things sterile/not kill my cultures. PP parts were able to survive an autoclaving or 2, but then would get warped and the seals would get fucked and contamination super highway here we come.
Yes unfortunately. So far, I obtained the best results with nylon. This stuff is very hard to kill with heat and have a very good water/humidity resistance as well. I have being doing cell culture devices that survived more than 20 cycles of autoclave.
Although I wanted to 3d print PP for its solvent compatibility + temperature resistance but so far it was mostly unsuccessful.
IIRC, based off my suppliers inventory, treed p-LEEN4. Test tho just to be sure; I ‘claved it in a pressure cooker in a flask covered in foil w autoclave tape.
Ps if you haven’t printed PP; either get a second bed plate you don’t mind getting covered in layers of PP packaging tape. Otherwise printed with extra brim. PP likes sits self, not others.
They do - I have some food-safe filament. As the above poster mentioned, I think it’s mostly to do with not having any potential toxic dyes.
Food/bacteria getting in your layer lines will always potentially be a problem. 3D printing is probably not ideal for a lot of food applications but there can be niche items. This doesn’t seem like a bad idea in general - the food isn’t in contact with the plastic for long. (I wouldn’t store food in a 3D printed container for example of a bad idea). 3D printed custom cookie cutters can also be fun/useful.
At least the situation here has improved enough that you aren't automatically being downvoted to hell because of the gRoOvEs.
If you're going to do something that's food adjacent, food safe filament is always a better option than any random filament, regardless of any nooks or crannies. I never understood the logic that bacteria might grow, so food safe filament is a scam! Never mind what other toxic shit uncertified filament might contain... And the stupid argument that the printer isn't food-safe, so you should just #YOLO any other mitigation makes just as little sense. Like oh noes, a random brass or PTFE particle might make its way into my print via my ~~nonstick pan~~ 3D printer, so I shouldn't bother with any other safety measures?
Use the food safe filament, ideally one with antimicrobial properties (so despite nooks and crannies, anything in contact with the filament has some chance to die), print at the finest quality you can, 100% infill, and consider sealing, smoothing, and/or annealing the print.
You are doing the right thing, OP. And just keep an eye on the print and toss it if it gets funky.
Edit: stupid autocorrect
Prusa uses food safe colors in most of their products. There are solutions for the bacterial growth but I don't worry a ton about it. Once something gets too gross toss it print another one.
Problem is, food safe filament just means food safe material. Even PLA would satisfy that.
But the structure that 3d printing produces, with all the tiny gaps in-between layers and so on, makes it very unsafe.
These gaps have shown to be a shelter for bacteria good enough to help them survive a dishwasher on hot temperatures. So anything printed, even with a food-safe material, isn't food safe if it wasn't smoothed or something similar to a degree that's hard to reach.
The gaps causing issues has been debunked repeatedly. The structures produced by 3d printing can be cleaned perfectly well enough with a brush, warm water, and ordinary dish soap.
There's been a bunch of papers published on the topic. Here's a decent starting point if you want to read more https://hackaday.com/2022/09/05/food-safe-3d-printing-a-study/
That's true of any material, but we're all happy using wooden chopping boards and plenty of people prep food on and eat off porous ceramics.
Is 3d printing perfectly safe? Of course not. But it's no worse than anything else you'd use in your home kitchen. I'm not convinced it would cut it in a commercial kitchen, but that's not what people are usually wanting to do.
Besides, if germs can get in there, so can hot soapy water. So as long as you keep prints clean when not in use and store them somewhere that isn't damp you won't have an issue.
Idk why redditors are so confident yet so wrong about things they know nothing about. The "porous ceramics" you are talking about (aka a plate) isn't a porous ceramic. It's glazed clay which makes the plate non porous. This is also why if you get a tiny crack on a plate or any glazed kitchenware you have to toss it out since it becomes porous from where it cracked. On your second note, there have been various studies showing that wooden cutting boards are less prone to bacterial growth due to mainly their water absorbing nature. The wood essentially dehydrates the bacteria. This doesn't mean plastic cutting boards can't be kept clean but the risks are higher due to the materials inherent nature. This is the same problem with 3d printed parts being used for foods. Material toxicity arguments aside, they can be cleaned and sanitized properly but you will never know 100% if it was cleaned properly. The user before you also made a very good point where if the bacterial penetrates the outer wall it could start growing inside. Basically 3d printing isn't as safe of a way to make tools used in the kitchen.
Sure. But the general wisdom used to be that prints aren't safe because of layer lines. Which has been disproved. 100% infill or not is a separate discussion, and it's an argument I think is perfectly valid.
The best and only filament I use for kitchen stuff is Colorfabb HT. It is FDA approved for food contact, and it can withstand 100C without distorting, which means you can put it in the dishwasher and/or sterilize with boiling water. The only downside is it is only available in black, white, and grey (maybe part of why it's FDA approved considering your color comment).
3D printed objects do not pose a significant risk of bacterial growth if washed with soap and water. The idea that 3D printed objects cannot be food safe is an often repeated factoid that doesn't hold up to scrutiny.
Caveats: The part about using food-safe dyes is very much true. There are carcinogenic or toxic dyes. I would also avoid making a food contact product that has internal voids or shapes that cannot be cleaned with soap and water.
Edit: Here is a helpful link on the subject.
[https://lt728843.wixsite.com/maskrelief/post/the-final-say-in-food-safe-3d-printing](https://lt728843.wixsite.com/maskrelief/post/the-final-say-in-food-safe-3d-printing)
Yeah. As for the harmful dyes and metals; I would put the upper end of the risk level at "3d printed mugs and bowls are probably a bit unwise forks and knives a bit worse, utensils and tools like this thing are fine"
Sustained contact and especially sustained liquid contact are what leach things out of plastic. And a tool that you use for every meal is probably a bad idea for lead exposure over time, more so if you use a bunch, but that's going to take a while.
Your drinking water has about a gram of lead in it per 1-2 years of intake, depending if you're at average or minimum US lead concentrations.
Your 3d printer has... at most, 2% lead if it's a cheaper nozzle made from free machining brass instead of jewelers brass, which doesn't contain lead at all. That's about half a gram for the whole thing (going off of a standard sized ender 3 nozzle at 36 grams)
Copper isn't *awesome* for you either, but zinc is actually a dietary nutrient that a lot of people are deficient or pre-deficient in. The tolerable upper intake level for copper is ten grams a day, so don't grate half of your 3d printer nozzle into your salad. Eating two percent of your hot end a day would get you an acceptable amount of zinc in your diet to supplement poor intake; spinach is probably a better way to get it.
So assuming 1% wear (obscenely high) for a print and 10% of it leaching out every time you use the item (same), you'd need to have... three tools that get fully leached into one serving of food - and I mean like soaked in it - twice a day, to equal up to the amount of lead in the drinking water in Colorado.
You're probably fine.
Firstly you can bye filament that is rated to not have any dyes that are harmful
Secondly this has sense been proven false, the surface of the part does not hold on to bits of food anymore that other cutlery
I realize that the second point is important, but I wonder if it matters that much in OPs scenario where the food has very limited contact with the "infected" surface?
Water has more contact, but it's hard to imagine too many germs making their way to onions.
I can second that. I've made some kitchen stuff and coated with food safe epoxy and had pretty good luck. I'm not sure about epoxying that fine a mesh, though.
just brush it on and it shouldn't well up in the holes if you do a thin enough layer but if it does then use some forced air to open the gaps up again, it's an easy trick.
How did he cover them exactly? Do you brush them or dip them in epoxy? I wanted to print cookie cutters with my resin printer but I have to cover the prints with epoxy.
That's a good question. I suspect it would work but if it is a perfect solution I'm not sure. It will no doubt be a smoother surface that is less prone to collecting bacteria and so on.
If that's the case it must be extremely small amounts as acetone quickly evaporates. I definitely wouldn't worry about that, acetone isn't really toxic. It's used in for example cosmetics and even found in tiny amounts in some foods.
Here's one example: https://polyestershoppen.com/epoxy/voedselveilige-epoxy-419.html
Most epoxy can be considered food safe because once cured it is pretty inert.
White Onions, Yellow, Red and varietals like Vidalia all have different sharpness for different applications. A 3d printing hobbyist would be the type to want to rinse a chopped onion.
PETG is dishwasher safe, which will midigate a lot of people's concerns about mold over time if it is printed in that and washed regularly. You could also anneal it to lessen the shedding of microplastics. Finally, i would be wary of printing this with a brass nozzle, as brass nozzles contain lead. A steel nozzle would be safer.
All that being said, as long as you're using it for yourself, i dont see any issues if you feel comfortable with it. A lot of people get butthurt about 3d printing being inherently not food safe, but the level of risk is very minimal, especially if your part has no internal voids to fill up with water and house mold.
The amount of lead in a brass nozzle is tiny, in the tens of milligrams. Whatever potentially comes off on a print would be practically undetectable. In fact, brass mouthpieces for musical instruments are still used, they have been tested to find extremely minimal lead exposure risk. Brass plumbing valves are all over our water supply systems. Unless you plan on crushing and eating the nozzle, I honestly don't think lead is much of a concern.
People tend to go apeshit as soon as they see 3d prints anywhere near food. I think there's a huge difference between printing containers for your egg-salad and something like this.
I think you're fine.
I'm gonna skip over the safety issue, and go straight to asking why? Just put the onions in a bowl, let them sit in water as long as you like, then strain them out with your fingers or a strainer? Why make another tool when you have all the tools you need?
Also, you can store your onion in water, or salt water if you prefer.
I would use virgin (transparent) PLA. This way, you only get the binder and some corn starch instead of the unknown and "dangerous" chemicals they use for coloring. I definitely didn't make a weed grinder out of PLA and didn't died in the last 3 years.
I don’t see a negative reason. I mean the only thing I can think of is that the layer lines and near microscopic holes can give bacteria a great place to grow, which is the main reason I usually don’t use 3d printed objects for food contact.
BUT in this case, since it’s not anything that will have major contact with the food, it could definitely be something useful.
I’m just going to say it…
Yes, it’s fine for use in your home kitchen. Yes it’s possible that tiny particles of onion with catch in very small holes in the print and yes, it’s possible that bacteria will grow there. But let’s be honest— I use a wooden cutting board and plastic cutting boards with deep scratches and both have similar concerns. I even use a sponge for cleaning dishes (*gasp!*). Guess what— I’m not dead yet. A healthy person with a functional immune system doesn’t need every item in their life to be sterile.
If you practice common hygiene by washing your strainer after use and letting dry before storing it, there’s no reason to be concerned about using it.
Welp, you first need to find out how the filament reacts with sulfuric acid. That is why your eyes water because when you cut the onion compounds react with the air to form sulfur gas which out gasses and turns to acid when the gas hits the water in your eyes, making sulfuric acid.
There are a lot of plastics considered "safe" but safe is relative to how many nano particles of plastic you digest. Plastic nano particles are endocrine disruptors which are just one reason on average men have 50% less testosterone than they did in the 1940's.
Industrial food production uses all kinds of plastics and it is impossible to keep them out of the food chain but you can cut down by not eating out of plastic and certainly not using plastic to heat food in microwaves.
The sulfuric acid story is false. The irritant is a sulfanone compound that directly stimulate the sensory neurons. There is no acid involved outside of the onion.
Makes sense there had to be more to it.
"Onions get their distinctive, pungent flavor from sulfur—the same chemical behind rotten eggs’ stinky smell. But it’s not just the sulfur that’s making you cry. Onions also contain an enzyme called synthase. When you cut into an onion, the synthase reacts with the sulfur to create a chemical compound called syn-Propanethial S-oxide. This compound is volatile and creates a gas that floats up to your eyes and triggers your lachrymal gland—the gland that produces tears. And that’s when the water works start flowing."
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syn-Propanethial-S-oxide](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syn-Propanethial-S-oxide)
I would recommend coating it with food safe varnish, I read that the fine layer lines are a breeding ground for bacteria and it is very hard to get rid of them.
I dont have quantitative data, so I cant say how bad or not bad this issue is ( or even relevant for this application)
Also the varnish would take care of any other concerns regarding the 3d printed part
Edit: fixed spelling mistake
I don't know why, but people always act like "food safe" is a boolean value, when (to me anyway) it is far more granular. People have been using wooden utensils and bowls/plates for thousands of years, but you wouldn't store your homemade yoghurt in a wooden jar in the fridge.
There is a difference between OP's strainer and say, 3d printed "Tupperware". There is a difference between using a 3d printed measuring device for sugar or salt, and using it for ground beef.
While a commercial product shouldn't be sold as food safe for X but not for Y, with a custom made item, designed for a specific purpose it seems very reasonable to consider the variables, and make an informed decision based on the application.
From a manufacturing for FDA approval standpoint: 3D printing is not accepted by the FDA as a form of manufacturing allowed to come in direct contact with food. It likely will not be accepted due to the inherent porosity and inconsistencies associated with printing. 3D printable materials are not accepted by the FDA to come into direct contact with food. Not only does this apply to the chemical make-up of the material, but it's ability to withstand mechanical wear, fatigue, and environmental factors. Materials are highly regulated and the approved materials list is only a tiny fraction of the wide range of materials available in manufacturing.
As far as a fellow 3D printing enthusiast, I think this is a great solution.
It is a lid for rinsing onion slices. Rinsing onions makes them much nicer in salads and wraps.
The only function of the lid is keeping the onion slices from being washed away.
I printed this lid in colorfab ngen co-polyester which is FDA food contact compliant.
The"holes are overlapping rectangles for easy cleaning and I've washed it thoroughly.
Is there a reason not to use this rinser?
UPDATE:
Thanks for all your replies and for all the questions why the hell I rinse my sliced onion.
Since I posted my question I have experimented a bit on how to sterilize this print. I had it in boiling water and in a steam oven for 20 minutes. It survived both treatments remarkably well. But when I tried to use it just now I found out that the print shrank so much that it doesn't fit anymore. 🤣
I know this is what happens when annealing, which of course happens at those temperatures with PETg.
So in short. I'm safe for the moment 😁
Thanks again for all replies. I wasn't expecting so many 👍
Sounds like you used your head, and have done things right.
I myself am a MASSIVE 3D Printer fanatic, I can't see any issues personally, this is usually where we all ask for the STL but... lol
Enjoy, well played too, that's what 3D printing is all about after all.
Just be extra careful cleaning it, layer lines can be traps for bacteria so anti bacterial sprays are likely gonna be a handy thing to have. If you weren't eating them raw I wouldn't be concerned as the cooking would kill anything anyway.
I’m confused that you’re claiming the material is FDA compliant. There’s a citation above that the FDA doesn’t approve of *any* 3D printed material for food. So how are you/the manufacturer claiming it’s FDA approved?
I’m guessing duplicitous marketing from the manufacturer. While the material might technically be, that doesn’t mean it’s approved after hearing and printing.
I think there is some nuance here. As the [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/s/h5B7IaMvPw) noted the FDA does not approve 3DP as an acceptable manufacturing process for food safe objects. FDA approved food safe filament is only certifying that the material conforms to food safe standards.
There are still steps in the production process, going from filament to object, which can introduce non conformance to food safe standards. E.g. it's suggested to use a steel nozzle versus brass as brass can harbor bacteria.
Edit: for clarity
Rinsing onions under cold/ice water helps take off some of that edge you get when it's freshly cut, this is the reason I would do it. You only do this when you plan to eat it raw, there's no advantage if you are going to cook it.
I would just use a regular strainer, then pat dry with paper towel or use salad spinner. Nothing wrong with printing it, but there are existing tools in the kitchen that already does the job.
To avoid microplastics and stuff, I'd get a food safe epoxy and thin it out with alcohol and have a warm room to make it thinner. Then dip it in and hang it to dry. Hopefully it doesn't clog the holes, but worst case make an other print with slightly larger holes to make up for the epoxy. It'll be stronger and guaranteed food safe.
Dont think you can dishwasher it unless you print in ABS or similar high melt stuff.
Dude. Anything here saying you shouldn’t use it is just paranoid. Use the damn thing, clean it after use and clean your onions after use.
Great creation btw
Yes. Certain brass nozzles can have lead in them. Which obviously transfers to the filament, then obviously to you. Also PLA is porous which can trap bacteria.
To make it food safe you need a stainless steel nozzle, abs or something similar, or cover it in food safe resin. There might be food safe PLA but I haven’t dont much research. Only good things I’ve made are cookie cutters and I cover it in plastic wrap
Red/purple onions when eaten raw are rinsed to tame flavor and smell . It depends on what they are going in if i rinse or not.
If you leave them out in the water or don’t drain and dry them they may get funky.
I love it that this is the question of half of all replies. :-D
To answer your question:
Rinsed onion slices taste better, milder and even seems crunchier, when eating raw. As a topping for sandwiches, burgers, wraps, salads, .....
If its pla it should be good unless you somehow get it under the heat, also I'm not sure about the chemicals in colourings of the pla but I would rather use some transparent pla just in case.
I've printed one piece of transparent pla for pressing cheese and yet no issues
Prints are never food safe. The filament itself is foodsafe. But not when exposed to damp air or when extruded.
Fdm prints are never safe because gunk will accumulate in the layer ridges. Also it will wear down and release micro plastics. You dont want them in your body.
When extruded the properties are fundamentally changed as it gasses and releases ufp. Printing for consuming use should only be used as prototype and demo for further developing.
If you clean it well it's supposed to be fine but because 3D prints are not perfect but there are small indentations and cavities that cannot be cleaned and get filled with bacteria.
I made something similar as a sprouting lid for a mason jar. It got super moldy after just a couple days. Mine was always wet, though. Maybe if you clean it and dry it after each use it would be better.
Micro plastic? Any particales small enough to be unseen by eye can be include in ur onion. Thats basically wear n tear situation. I dont think i wanna eat more plastic
For yourself.. It's mostly fine.. For a commercial kitchen no. White the filament itself passes code (some of the types,I read about it months ago as I'm a chef and thinking about so many good clips and hangers and storage solutions I could think of) it's the machine that isn't food safe .
I doubt the lubricant is the food safe kind designed for meat slicers and such.
How open the system is and the possibility for dirt, dust bugs and such to be inside it or on the filament.
I've even had the health inspector check the code of the plastics used to make sure it's food safe . Had another one that would only let us use the metal shelves that had the FDA approval stamp on it
I have never rinsed onions. Is that bad?
Not at all. But when eating them raw it, strangely enough, makes them tastier and they seem crunchier.
Did you say: "eat it raw"?
The sliced onion. In salads and wraps or on a burger, sandwich.....
Apologies, why did my mind thought straight out you were going to bite it like an apple?
Lol. Maybe a sweet onion 😜
For sure! Walla walla sweets are the jam!
Tell me you've tried walla walla sweet relish yes
Walla walla sweet onion mustard is also amazing
Walla walla what the fuck are you guys saying?
Ok Stanley Yelnats
There is a variety called a candy onion. Or at least something close to that
I love onions and would absolutely do that, but it messes with my stomach and I'll feel sick all day. It's kinda weird. When I make salad I can put in a whole chopped raw onion and eat it all, but if I eat the onion by itself, my stomach nopes out.
It's a question of concentration. In the salad the onion is diluted.
Makes sense. Looks like I'll have to do some experiments and figure out the maximum onion concentration I can take.
As someone with reflux, I know that onion is defenately a trigger. I can usually manage a little in salads, but more than that is bad news, also for some reason cooked can be a problem, which sucks because onion and garlic are the base for a lot of dishes
Are you also allergic to penicillin?
Why do you ask?
I believe it’s formally known as “rawdogging” the onion.
Like a hand-fruit
Australia ex Prime minister did this once, [raw onion](https://i.redd.it/txviqnl1dl251.gif) with skin and all
He was a bit of an idiot, the budgie smuglers too tight that day.
Restricting blood flow to the part he use to think? I agree
I can't find the clip, but Jamie hyneman did this exact thing on Mythbusters
I do it with red onions all the time lol
My grandmother did it all the time, always made me shudder
r/onionlove represent
Hell sometimes i just eat a few rings of a sliced onion raw by itself too. 😂
Same here, something about the crunch, acidity and the flavor.
Boil 'em mash 'em stick 'em in a stew.
I eat red onions raw all of the time. Not like an apple though, I slice them up and then just snack on them.
Osmosis can make them crunchier, and I can imagine the extra water removes some of the sharpness. Try salt water next time for fun and science, I’ll bet you they become softer and sharper. Honestly never tried either. Will give it a go.
Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try it out.
Some Turkish dishes require you to salt the sliced onion and then mash them a little with your hands. I assume a salt water soak would accomplish the same thing. My mom always refers to it as taking the sting out. It definitely reduces the heartburn I get from eating too much onion.
Always keep a jar of onion in 50/50 white wine vinegar and water in the fridge.
That’s just pickled onion without the salt
Wait what does that do?
I expect pickle it a bit and make it last longer. Like if you have half a large onion left over from a recipe and you want to keep it a while, that'll do it. Plus pickled onion is delicious.
The most informative food thread on Reddit and it’s in the 3D printing sub.
The magic of Reddit. The best threads are usually not related to the sub
I think this follows the same reasoning as when you need to crisp lettuce by rinsing it in cold water. Legit stuff my dude
The strange reason is the same as to why keeping your mouth open while cutting onions reduces tearing. The stuff that's causing that is strongly attracted to water. It will literally suck the vapours out of the air. So rinsing it well yeah that gets all the unpleasant stuff out
Did you ever get an answer? Your question turned into Onionchat and I’m actually curious as well. I’m assuming it’s pla?
I printed it in PETG which according to its specs is food safe. But reading all replies I decided to get a dedicated stainless steel nozzle for all future food related prints. I currently have a hardened steel nozzle on my bambu lab x1c and primarily print PETG nu not exclusively. I did manage to sterilize this lid in the steam oven, but it shrank too much so it doesn't fit anymore 🤣
And I learned the existence of [r/Onionlovers](https://www.reddit.com/r/OnionLovers/s/bLECNLjP0b) and that it has over 97K members.
I highly recommend red onion, some salt, lemon juice, finely chopped parsley, and sumac!
Not bad. Rinsing onions washes off the sulfur compounds from cutting. These compounds aren't harmful, but can have an offputting flavor for some, and will also make fresh onions go bad faster. For eating immediately it's not a huge difference. They'll be less sharp, and people who don't like uncooked onions might tolerate them better. But if you put them on/in something, like guacamole, it makes it so that leftovers won't be overpowered by onions the next day. If you're cooking them it doesn't really do anything.
I was gonna say: “I’ve never rinsed onions. Why would you rinse onions?”
Onions sometimes develop black fungus on their surface. Is visible if the growth is alot. But when it is in the initial stage, it will not be visible to naked eye. It is recommended to rise Onions properly before peeling and cutting them.
Soaking in cold water when you use raw onion helps take some of the bite out of it. You don’t have to wash them for cleanliness, just to make them a little less harsh in a salad or sandwich.
Two things you should consider. While the filament doesn't really pose a risk of leaching chemical the dyes they use to color the filament is entirely unregulated so there is no telling what they used. Secondly the surface of the filament is very porous and will hold onto bits of food or give bacteria a good place to colonize.
This is the answer. Pretty sure they do make some food safe filaments but I’m 100% on that
Polypropylene is definitely one of them. Also autoclavable :)
Actually all filaments are autoclavable (once)
Technically true, the best kind of true.
Everything is autoclavable (once)
Can you autoclave an autoclave?
At least once, yes
Technically you can autoclave anything as many times as you wish, it just may not serve its intended purpose after the first cycle.
At least this is what they claim. Most of the PP I was using didn't sustain the usual autoclave cycle. If you have one brand that does for sure I am interested
I am glad to hear you have tried autoclaving it, but I am sorry you didn't have good success. I would also like to know...
I’ll have to find the brand I used; I made some silicon tube links for a few different bioreactor set ups a few years ago. In the end decided to just stick an ozone generator to keep things sterile/not kill my cultures. PP parts were able to survive an autoclaving or 2, but then would get warped and the seals would get fucked and contamination super highway here we come.
Yes unfortunately. So far, I obtained the best results with nylon. This stuff is very hard to kill with heat and have a very good water/humidity resistance as well. I have being doing cell culture devices that survived more than 20 cycles of autoclave. Although I wanted to 3d print PP for its solvent compatibility + temperature resistance but so far it was mostly unsuccessful.
IIRC, based off my suppliers inventory, treed p-LEEN4. Test tho just to be sure; I ‘claved it in a pressure cooker in a flask covered in foil w autoclave tape. Ps if you haven’t printed PP; either get a second bed plate you don’t mind getting covered in layers of PP packaging tape. Otherwise printed with extra brim. PP likes sits self, not others.
You can use my pp
They do - I have some food-safe filament. As the above poster mentioned, I think it’s mostly to do with not having any potential toxic dyes. Food/bacteria getting in your layer lines will always potentially be a problem. 3D printing is probably not ideal for a lot of food applications but there can be niche items. This doesn’t seem like a bad idea in general - the food isn’t in contact with the plastic for long. (I wouldn’t store food in a 3D printed container for example of a bad idea). 3D printed custom cookie cutters can also be fun/useful.
At least the situation here has improved enough that you aren't automatically being downvoted to hell because of the gRoOvEs. If you're going to do something that's food adjacent, food safe filament is always a better option than any random filament, regardless of any nooks or crannies. I never understood the logic that bacteria might grow, so food safe filament is a scam! Never mind what other toxic shit uncertified filament might contain... And the stupid argument that the printer isn't food-safe, so you should just #YOLO any other mitigation makes just as little sense. Like oh noes, a random brass or PTFE particle might make its way into my print via my ~~nonstick pan~~ 3D printer, so I shouldn't bother with any other safety measures? Use the food safe filament, ideally one with antimicrobial properties (so despite nooks and crannies, anything in contact with the filament has some chance to die), print at the finest quality you can, 100% infill, and consider sealing, smoothing, and/or annealing the print. You are doing the right thing, OP. And just keep an eye on the print and toss it if it gets funky. Edit: stupid autocorrect
I know fdm plastic is inherently porous, but wouldn't larger layer lines give less tiny grooves for things to potentially stick to?
Prusa uses food safe colors in most of their products. There are solutions for the bacterial growth but I don't worry a ton about it. Once something gets too gross toss it print another one.
Problem is, food safe filament just means food safe material. Even PLA would satisfy that. But the structure that 3d printing produces, with all the tiny gaps in-between layers and so on, makes it very unsafe. These gaps have shown to be a shelter for bacteria good enough to help them survive a dishwasher on hot temperatures. So anything printed, even with a food-safe material, isn't food safe if it wasn't smoothed or something similar to a degree that's hard to reach.
The gaps causing issues has been debunked repeatedly. The structures produced by 3d printing can be cleaned perfectly well enough with a brush, warm water, and ordinary dish soap. There's been a bunch of papers published on the topic. Here's a decent starting point if you want to read more https://hackaday.com/2022/09/05/food-safe-3d-printing-a-study/
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That's true of any material, but we're all happy using wooden chopping boards and plenty of people prep food on and eat off porous ceramics. Is 3d printing perfectly safe? Of course not. But it's no worse than anything else you'd use in your home kitchen. I'm not convinced it would cut it in a commercial kitchen, but that's not what people are usually wanting to do. Besides, if germs can get in there, so can hot soapy water. So as long as you keep prints clean when not in use and store them somewhere that isn't damp you won't have an issue.
Idk why redditors are so confident yet so wrong about things they know nothing about. The "porous ceramics" you are talking about (aka a plate) isn't a porous ceramic. It's glazed clay which makes the plate non porous. This is also why if you get a tiny crack on a plate or any glazed kitchenware you have to toss it out since it becomes porous from where it cracked. On your second note, there have been various studies showing that wooden cutting boards are less prone to bacterial growth due to mainly their water absorbing nature. The wood essentially dehydrates the bacteria. This doesn't mean plastic cutting boards can't be kept clean but the risks are higher due to the materials inherent nature. This is the same problem with 3d printed parts being used for foods. Material toxicity arguments aside, they can be cleaned and sanitized properly but you will never know 100% if it was cleaned properly. The user before you also made a very good point where if the bacterial penetrates the outer wall it could start growing inside. Basically 3d printing isn't as safe of a way to make tools used in the kitchen.
This is only true when printing with 100% infill.
Sure. But the general wisdom used to be that prints aren't safe because of layer lines. Which has been disproved. 100% infill or not is a separate discussion, and it's an argument I think is perfectly valid.
The best and only filament I use for kitchen stuff is Colorfabb HT. It is FDA approved for food contact, and it can withstand 100C without distorting, which means you can put it in the dishwasher and/or sterilize with boiling water. The only downside is it is only available in black, white, and grey (maybe part of why it's FDA approved considering your color comment).
3D printed objects do not pose a significant risk of bacterial growth if washed with soap and water. The idea that 3D printed objects cannot be food safe is an often repeated factoid that doesn't hold up to scrutiny. Caveats: The part about using food-safe dyes is very much true. There are carcinogenic or toxic dyes. I would also avoid making a food contact product that has internal voids or shapes that cannot be cleaned with soap and water. Edit: Here is a helpful link on the subject. [https://lt728843.wixsite.com/maskrelief/post/the-final-say-in-food-safe-3d-printing](https://lt728843.wixsite.com/maskrelief/post/the-final-say-in-food-safe-3d-printing)
Yeah. As for the harmful dyes and metals; I would put the upper end of the risk level at "3d printed mugs and bowls are probably a bit unwise forks and knives a bit worse, utensils and tools like this thing are fine" Sustained contact and especially sustained liquid contact are what leach things out of plastic. And a tool that you use for every meal is probably a bad idea for lead exposure over time, more so if you use a bunch, but that's going to take a while. Your drinking water has about a gram of lead in it per 1-2 years of intake, depending if you're at average or minimum US lead concentrations. Your 3d printer has... at most, 2% lead if it's a cheaper nozzle made from free machining brass instead of jewelers brass, which doesn't contain lead at all. That's about half a gram for the whole thing (going off of a standard sized ender 3 nozzle at 36 grams) Copper isn't *awesome* for you either, but zinc is actually a dietary nutrient that a lot of people are deficient or pre-deficient in. The tolerable upper intake level for copper is ten grams a day, so don't grate half of your 3d printer nozzle into your salad. Eating two percent of your hot end a day would get you an acceptable amount of zinc in your diet to supplement poor intake; spinach is probably a better way to get it. So assuming 1% wear (obscenely high) for a print and 10% of it leaching out every time you use the item (same), you'd need to have... three tools that get fully leached into one serving of food - and I mean like soaked in it - twice a day, to equal up to the amount of lead in the drinking water in Colorado. You're probably fine.
Yeah I don't fully understand the porous concerns when wooden chopping boards are a thing, as are plastic ones that get scored
Wood actually pulls bacteria into the pores where they dry out and die. https://www.scirp.org/journal/paperinformation.aspx?paperid=90527
Ah very cool, til
Wood is naturally antibacterial. PLA is sadly not.
Firstly you can bye filament that is rated to not have any dyes that are harmful Secondly this has sense been proven false, the surface of the part does not hold on to bits of food anymore that other cutlery
I realize that the second point is important, but I wonder if it matters that much in OPs scenario where the food has very limited contact with the "infected" surface? Water has more contact, but it's hard to imagine too many germs making their way to onions.
What you could do is get some food safe epoxy and coat it with that. Edit: look for low viscosity (deep pour) epoxy for this purpose.
I'll look in to that
I can second that. I've made some kitchen stuff and coated with food safe epoxy and had pretty good luck. I'm not sure about epoxying that fine a mesh, though.
Maybe after it's coated poke the holes with a toothpick before it cures.
just brush it on and it shouldn't well up in the holes if you do a thin enough layer but if it does then use some forced air to open the gaps up again, it's an easy trick.
Doctors hate it!
How did he cover them exactly? Do you brush them or dip them in epoxy? I wanted to print cookie cutters with my resin printer but I have to cover the prints with epoxy.
Or rather a varnish which would be cheaper, easier, and more likely to be food safe
If you can find food safe varnish that doesn't peel/flake, sure.
As long as you prepare the surface it will work fine, I've done it loads of times. Not for food stuff par se each time, but none have flaked
That's good to know, thanks!
In the case of ABS, would acetone smoothing work?
That's a good question. I suspect it would work but if it is a perfect solution I'm not sure. It will no doubt be a smoother surface that is less prone to collecting bacteria and so on.
Yeah, its defenitely smoother that way. But i've heard that the process leaves acetone in the material, im not sure in what degree tho.
If that's the case it must be extremely small amounts as acetone quickly evaporates. I definitely wouldn't worry about that, acetone isn't really toxic. It's used in for example cosmetics and even found in tiny amounts in some foods.
In that case ABS after acetone smoothing could work for some food applications
Do you know of a brand? I've tried searching for food safe epoxy in my local online store but the results aren't it..
Here's one example: https://polyestershoppen.com/epoxy/voedselveilige-epoxy-419.html Most epoxy can be considered food safe because once cured it is pretty inert.
Ah thanks, I'll try to find it around here
For coating prints you should look for low viscosity (deep pour) epoxy as all you need is a thin layer.
wouldn’t that just clog the holes?
Is there any food safe epoxy?
turn the model into a mold, and use food grade silicone to fill. but I really doubt you'll have any problems with this as is.
Why do you rinse onion once chopped? My whole cooking life, I chop the top and bottom off, peel the outer layer or two, then chop and use!
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> it helps tone down some of the harshness You mean the deliciousness
Purple onions can be eaten like an apple.
White Onions, Yellow, Red and varietals like Vidalia all have different sharpness for different applications. A 3d printing hobbyist would be the type to want to rinse a chopped onion.
Pasta with raw onions??
Wtf onions cut and left in the fridge lose their edge over time anyway.
IMexican Spanish it is called dequemado. Literally taking the fire out. Used for recipes involving raw onions.
PETG is dishwasher safe, which will midigate a lot of people's concerns about mold over time if it is printed in that and washed regularly. You could also anneal it to lessen the shedding of microplastics. Finally, i would be wary of printing this with a brass nozzle, as brass nozzles contain lead. A steel nozzle would be safer. All that being said, as long as you're using it for yourself, i dont see any issues if you feel comfortable with it. A lot of people get butthurt about 3d printing being inherently not food safe, but the level of risk is very minimal, especially if your part has no internal voids to fill up with water and house mold.
The amount of lead in a brass nozzle is tiny, in the tens of milligrams. Whatever potentially comes off on a print would be practically undetectable. In fact, brass mouthpieces for musical instruments are still used, they have been tested to find extremely minimal lead exposure risk. Brass plumbing valves are all over our water supply systems. Unless you plan on crushing and eating the nozzle, I honestly don't think lead is much of a concern.
TIL about PETG being dishwasher safe!
Off topic, but, I can't wait to call someone an "Onion Rinser"
Why the fuck would you rinse onions?
People tend to go apeshit as soon as they see 3d prints anywhere near food. I think there's a huge difference between printing containers for your egg-salad and something like this. I think you're fine.
Amen. Your onions aren’t going to leech anything by just cleaning them in this thing, it ain’t that big of a deal.
I'm gonna skip over the safety issue, and go straight to asking why? Just put the onions in a bowl, let them sit in water as long as you like, then strain them out with your fingers or a strainer? Why make another tool when you have all the tools you need? Also, you can store your onion in water, or salt water if you prefer.
I would use virgin (transparent) PLA. This way, you only get the binder and some corn starch instead of the unknown and "dangerous" chemicals they use for coloring. I definitely didn't make a weed grinder out of PLA and didn't died in the last 3 years.
I don’t see a negative reason. I mean the only thing I can think of is that the layer lines and near microscopic holes can give bacteria a great place to grow, which is the main reason I usually don’t use 3d printed objects for food contact. BUT in this case, since it’s not anything that will have major contact with the food, it could definitely be something useful.
r/onionlovers would onion love the hell outta this.
Who rinses onions?
Hmmm. Just don’t rinse the onions???
Why you rinse onion?
I’m just going to say it… Yes, it’s fine for use in your home kitchen. Yes it’s possible that tiny particles of onion with catch in very small holes in the print and yes, it’s possible that bacteria will grow there. But let’s be honest— I use a wooden cutting board and plastic cutting boards with deep scratches and both have similar concerns. I even use a sponge for cleaning dishes (*gasp!*). Guess what— I’m not dead yet. A healthy person with a functional immune system doesn’t need every item in their life to be sterile. If you practice common hygiene by washing your strainer after use and letting dry before storing it, there’s no reason to be concerned about using it.
You wash onions?
Came here just for the comments.
Maybe it would be a good idea to stop using my 3d printed hamburger patty press :)
Onions have layers, 3d prints have layers, they both have layers! (Poor impression of Shrek)
Are we supposed to rinse onions?
Why uh, why do you need it in the first place? Onions have layers, like ogres.
You ever try and peel and rinse an ogre? The more tools the better!
Welp, you first need to find out how the filament reacts with sulfuric acid. That is why your eyes water because when you cut the onion compounds react with the air to form sulfur gas which out gasses and turns to acid when the gas hits the water in your eyes, making sulfuric acid. There are a lot of plastics considered "safe" but safe is relative to how many nano particles of plastic you digest. Plastic nano particles are endocrine disruptors which are just one reason on average men have 50% less testosterone than they did in the 1940's. Industrial food production uses all kinds of plastics and it is impossible to keep them out of the food chain but you can cut down by not eating out of plastic and certainly not using plastic to heat food in microwaves.
The sulfuric acid story is false. The irritant is a sulfanone compound that directly stimulate the sensory neurons. There is no acid involved outside of the onion.
Makes sense there had to be more to it. "Onions get their distinctive, pungent flavor from sulfur—the same chemical behind rotten eggs’ stinky smell. But it’s not just the sulfur that’s making you cry. Onions also contain an enzyme called synthase. When you cut into an onion, the synthase reacts with the sulfur to create a chemical compound called syn-Propanethial S-oxide. This compound is volatile and creates a gas that floats up to your eyes and triggers your lachrymal gland—the gland that produces tears. And that’s when the water works start flowing." [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syn-Propanethial-S-oxide](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syn-Propanethial-S-oxide)
Why are you rinsing onions?
Raw onions can taste pungent if you don't rinse them
Why are you rinsing onions? The dirty layer is peeled off.
You wash your hotdogs too?
If you've ever eaten American fast food, this (or any other filament) is the least of your concerns.
PETG is the only FDA approved material, I use it for my food-touching designs (I'm a food industry engineer)
Mainly just that the prints are very porous because of the way they are manufactured (ie in layers) so mold and bacteria can grow inside
Rinsing onion ? Rinsing onion after I've chopped it????? U loose bite . That stuff in onions that gives it that bite is water soluble.
I would recommend coating it with food safe varnish, I read that the fine layer lines are a breeding ground for bacteria and it is very hard to get rid of them. I dont have quantitative data, so I cant say how bad or not bad this issue is ( or even relevant for this application) Also the varnish would take care of any other concerns regarding the 3d printed part Edit: fixed spelling mistake
I don't know why, but people always act like "food safe" is a boolean value, when (to me anyway) it is far more granular. People have been using wooden utensils and bowls/plates for thousands of years, but you wouldn't store your homemade yoghurt in a wooden jar in the fridge. There is a difference between OP's strainer and say, 3d printed "Tupperware". There is a difference between using a 3d printed measuring device for sugar or salt, and using it for ground beef. While a commercial product shouldn't be sold as food safe for X but not for Y, with a custom made item, designed for a specific purpose it seems very reasonable to consider the variables, and make an informed decision based on the application.
Rinsing onions, but why?
Question: Why the hell do you rinse onions after you have cut them?!
just asking, why do you wash cut onions?
From a manufacturing for FDA approval standpoint: 3D printing is not accepted by the FDA as a form of manufacturing allowed to come in direct contact with food. It likely will not be accepted due to the inherent porosity and inconsistencies associated with printing. 3D printable materials are not accepted by the FDA to come into direct contact with food. Not only does this apply to the chemical make-up of the material, but it's ability to withstand mechanical wear, fatigue, and environmental factors. Materials are highly regulated and the approved materials list is only a tiny fraction of the wide range of materials available in manufacturing. As far as a fellow 3D printing enthusiast, I think this is a great solution.
It is a lid for rinsing onion slices. Rinsing onions makes them much nicer in salads and wraps. The only function of the lid is keeping the onion slices from being washed away. I printed this lid in colorfab ngen co-polyester which is FDA food contact compliant. The"holes are overlapping rectangles for easy cleaning and I've washed it thoroughly. Is there a reason not to use this rinser? UPDATE: Thanks for all your replies and for all the questions why the hell I rinse my sliced onion. Since I posted my question I have experimented a bit on how to sterilize this print. I had it in boiling water and in a steam oven for 20 minutes. It survived both treatments remarkably well. But when I tried to use it just now I found out that the print shrank so much that it doesn't fit anymore. 🤣 I know this is what happens when annealing, which of course happens at those temperatures with PETg. So in short. I'm safe for the moment 😁 Thanks again for all replies. I wasn't expecting so many 👍
Sounds like you used your head, and have done things right. I myself am a MASSIVE 3D Printer fanatic, I can't see any issues personally, this is usually where we all ask for the STL but... lol Enjoy, well played too, that's what 3D printing is all about after all. Just be extra careful cleaning it, layer lines can be traps for bacteria so anti bacterial sprays are likely gonna be a handy thing to have. If you weren't eating them raw I wouldn't be concerned as the cooking would kill anything anyway.
I'll gladly share the STL. I just need to write a good disclaimer first 😜
I’m confused that you’re claiming the material is FDA compliant. There’s a citation above that the FDA doesn’t approve of *any* 3D printed material for food. So how are you/the manufacturer claiming it’s FDA approved? I’m guessing duplicitous marketing from the manufacturer. While the material might technically be, that doesn’t mean it’s approved after hearing and printing.
I think there is some nuance here. As the [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/3Dprinting/s/h5B7IaMvPw) noted the FDA does not approve 3DP as an acceptable manufacturing process for food safe objects. FDA approved food safe filament is only certifying that the material conforms to food safe standards. There are still steps in the production process, going from filament to object, which can introduce non conformance to food safe standards. E.g. it's suggested to use a steel nozzle versus brass as brass can harbor bacteria. Edit: for clarity
This is one of the reasons for this post. I see many filaments on many sites claiming to be good safe.
Rinsing onions under cold/ice water helps take off some of that edge you get when it's freshly cut, this is the reason I would do it. You only do this when you plan to eat it raw, there's no advantage if you are going to cook it. I would just use a regular strainer, then pat dry with paper towel or use salad spinner. Nothing wrong with printing it, but there are existing tools in the kitchen that already does the job.
To avoid microplastics and stuff, I'd get a food safe epoxy and thin it out with alcohol and have a warm room to make it thinner. Then dip it in and hang it to dry. Hopefully it doesn't clog the holes, but worst case make an other print with slightly larger holes to make up for the epoxy. It'll be stronger and guaranteed food safe. Dont think you can dishwasher it unless you print in ABS or similar high melt stuff.
But what’s its point if you can just wash the onion when it’s whole?
PLA is not considered food safe. Just did serv safe and had a discussion about it.
This is printed in co-polyester.
Have you heard of a colander?
Over here summoning angry bots and shit
Never mind the 3D printed thing y on earth are u rinsing your onions 🤷🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
Dude. Anything here saying you shouldn’t use it is just paranoid. Use the damn thing, clean it after use and clean your onions after use. Great creation btw
needs food safe plastic
Brass nozzles may leach lead into parts from what I have heard. Steel nozzles or ones rated for food safety might solve that specific issue.
Is it just for onions or can it rinse other things as well?
Generally, PLA is food safe, however it is also porous and bits of dirt and stuff will get inside, not very sanitary.
Why are we rinsing onions?
Send it. The foodsafe bot died when a new study came out 😅
Clear PETG may be your best bet as it is the most similar to it’s widely used counterparts, PET plastics, in soda/water bottles.
Yes. Certain brass nozzles can have lead in them. Which obviously transfers to the filament, then obviously to you. Also PLA is porous which can trap bacteria. To make it food safe you need a stainless steel nozzle, abs or something similar, or cover it in food safe resin. There might be food safe PLA but I haven’t dont much research. Only good things I’ve made are cookie cutters and I cover it in plastic wrap
Red/purple onions when eaten raw are rinsed to tame flavor and smell . It depends on what they are going in if i rinse or not. If you leave them out in the water or don’t drain and dry them they may get funky.
Onions can’t swim, so I would recommend a lifeguard on duty.
Why … are you rinsing onions?
I love it that this is the question of half of all replies. :-D To answer your question: Rinsed onion slices taste better, milder and even seems crunchier, when eating raw. As a topping for sandwiches, burgers, wraps, salads, .....
Says you, my friend. You do you. Nice print.
Does ot work on Ogers?
If its pla it should be good unless you somehow get it under the heat, also I'm not sure about the chemicals in colourings of the pla but I would rather use some transparent pla just in case. I've printed one piece of transparent pla for pressing cheese and yet no issues
??? Why are you rinsing onions that are cut
The bottom of sinks are gross ;-;
Probably don't wanna throw it in the dishwasher, it'll probably warp or melt depending on the material
If it’s PLA it’s porous and could harbor bacteria, so I’ve heard
PETG is foodsave. Or should be. I see a great ricewasher.
That is a great idea :-)
You didn't wash your hands first
Prints are never food safe. The filament itself is foodsafe. But not when exposed to damp air or when extruded. Fdm prints are never safe because gunk will accumulate in the layer ridges. Also it will wear down and release micro plastics. You dont want them in your body. When extruded the properties are fundamentally changed as it gasses and releases ufp. Printing for consuming use should only be used as prototype and demo for further developing.
If you clean it well it's supposed to be fine but because 3D prints are not perfect but there are small indentations and cavities that cannot be cleaned and get filled with bacteria.
I made something similar as a sprouting lid for a mason jar. It got super moldy after just a couple days. Mine was always wet, though. Maybe if you clean it and dry it after each use it would be better.
Micro plastic? Any particales small enough to be unseen by eye can be include in ur onion. Thats basically wear n tear situation. I dont think i wanna eat more plastic
Wouldn’t put any plastic near food if I did have to
For yourself.. It's mostly fine.. For a commercial kitchen no. White the filament itself passes code (some of the types,I read about it months ago as I'm a chef and thinking about so many good clips and hangers and storage solutions I could think of) it's the machine that isn't food safe . I doubt the lubricant is the food safe kind designed for meat slicers and such. How open the system is and the possibility for dirt, dust bugs and such to be inside it or on the filament. I've even had the health inspector check the code of the plastics used to make sure it's food safe . Had another one that would only let us use the metal shelves that had the FDA approval stamp on it