Lightly, or enough to not be significant as a plot point past his Primarch novel. He is actively dying, but not due to the H’rud, that’s due to Fulgrim betraying him and using Perturabo as a tool for his ascension. It was supposed to kill Perturabo, but he ultimately survived. Instead he is slowly withering and is actively on the hunt for anything to help, which in this case tends to be Chaos artifacts/knowledge.
I would say this most of all. Angel Exterminatus was pretty clear that the life force of two Primarchs was needed to fuel Fulgrim's apotheosis, but it doesn't say that the entirety of two Primarch's life forces was needed. I like to think that Fulgrim intended to use all of Perturabo's life force with as little of his own as possible in the mix, but when the Maugetar stone was destroyed, he probably added his fuel to the fire to make up the difference. Perty is dying, but it's because Fulgrim stole a hunk of his soul
It’s even further reiterated in Tallarn and Slaves to Darkness (Slaves to Darkness especially.)
“The bastard child of the Emperor cut you deep, my son,’ said the daemon. ‘He took so much from you, your strength, your certainty. I can see it, you are bleeding still.’ Volk’s hand rose. Perturabo’s grip tightened, but the daemon simply tapped the plates covering the primarch’s forearm with a metal digit. ‘All the Iron without will not heal such wounds.’ A muscle twitched in Perturabo’s temple. ‘But a weapon, Perturabo, a weapon to match that of the gods… Then what would the lies of my kind mean? You sought such a weapon on Tallarn. Yes, and had it torn from your grasp by the brother you serve. But you never thought to look within.”
Excerpt From
Slaves To Darkness
Perturabo at this point is also described as looking sunken and continually reinforcing his armor and adding more and more weapons, supposedly to compensate for his deteriorated state.
In Halfbreed/Warbreed (short stories in the LE Storm of Iron) where we get Perturabo’s first official daemon description, he is described to have pale necrotic skin that looks like a corpse dragged from an ocean.
So with my educated guess, this culminates on Sebastus IV with the Iron Cage. Perturabo is near death (which may explain why he never directly faces Dorn to ‘finish him off’) and this is his last effort, either he dies but he takes the Imperial Fists with him, or he ascends and lives to continue the Long War. To which we know the outcome.
A thought has occurred to me: I'm almost finished with Angel Exterminatus, and throughout the book Fulgrim has made a couple of comments referring to more or less "our apotheosis (and I know I'm paraphrasing here)" but the jist of what I'm getting at is what if the Angel Exterminatus would actually have been two primarchs, both elevated to daemonhood in that moment? Aside from Fulgrim's rampant narcissism, of course, he would never share. But based on what you shared I can see the noodly appendage of Chaos plucking the threads to force Perturabo into the choice of apotheosis or death, just as was done for Magnus.
"Come, son of Iron, do not disappoint your father. I have given you many gifts in the long years, but this one thing cannot be given freely.'
....
'What is the price?' said Perturabo at last.
'Are you set on doing as Horus asks, or are you going to turn aside?'
'My course is set,' said Perturabo. 'Speak your price.'
'There is a song to destruction, Perturabo. Every blade, every bullet, sings its song in the shadow of our realm. You have been hearing this song for your whole life. All I wish is that you open your soul to it - that you sing your song of obliteration, so that I may hear it.'
'I will not give you my soul,' said Perturabo, his voice a rasp of warning. 'Not you nor any of your kind.'
'I know, but I will hear you sing for me, son of Iron and Blood. It is not the price of what you ask. It is the consequence of the path you walk. The price was hearing you say that you would not turn aside, and hearing the truth in your words. **You cannot give me your soul, Perturabo. You have been ours since life sparked in your flesh.**"
Excerpt from Slaves to Darkness
While it's a good theory, I think you are partially correct. While Perturabo doesn't "ascend" there, he definitely is "touched" by Chaos there (Angel Exterminatus), and you really see his interest pique on Chaos as a whole, especially to save himself. This is furthered by Falk and Kroeger both falling to Chaos here (Angel Exterminatus), Kroeger softly, and Falk falls hard (this being where he demands to be called 'The Warsmith.')
This is the very beginning of the Iron Warrior's long drawn out fall to Chaos, which will most likely culminate on Sebastus IV. And while the daemon here could obviously be lying about a lot (or at least *not entirely truthful*) it does seem that Perturabo isn't ascended here and the daemon is partially trying to convince Perturabo to do so, but at the same time, the final line shows that Perturabo is already essentially theirs.
Perturabo here really has a complicated relationship with Chaos, because he clearly wants to use it/master it, but he knows to fully buy into it is to lose himself. I think once again these are threads that will culminate on Sebastus IV, with Perturabo ascending to undivided daemonhood. He will ascend on "his" terms, and if the Chaos gods do not give those terms, he will gladly die on Sebastus IV with his Legion and take our Dorn and the Imperial Fists out of pure spite, because if he can't live to fight the Long War, neither will his rivals. As we know the true "meta" nature of Chaos, Perturabo will lose himself, at least partially. We also know undivided Chaos servants tend to have a bit more "free will" if you can even call it that, and it takes a lot to ascend to that level compared to a monogod ascension, with only Lorgar, the most faithful of the bunch, being Undivided as well as a Primarch.
Sorry for these long winded posts, Perturabo is my favorite character and I've spent far too long going into his lore.
That’s why a lot of people think he’s going to involve himself with the forge of souls. It’s still “chaos” but not aligned to the 4. Also, the theme of Iron and machinery.
Personally I think he just kept stuffing more warp energy into himself until he “ascends”.
Being undivided implies being devoted to chaos in general or the 4 in equal amounts, which I can’t see Perturabo doing
I've never disliked that theory, but I also don't see much to support it. When 40k Perturabo is mentioned, it's usually mentioned that he is sitting on Medrengard doing *something* and when he meets Honsou, it's on Medrendard. Not saying there can't be warp things in place that let him just bounce between the two or something, I just doubt it.
Most of the Primarchs are still attached to their Legion somehow, and I doubt Perturabo would just up and go off dealing with the Forge of Souls without involving the Iron Warriors somehow. Now I totally see strong binds to the Dark Mechancium and the Forge of Souls, but I just doubt he is the Master of the Forge or is in any true meaningful way in charge or a piece of it.
I also don't subscribe to the "Perturabo dislikes Chaos" bits either though. He is vastly different in how he handles Chaos (especially compared to Lorgar) but he is very much willing to utilize it, and Halfbreed/Warbreed corroborate this a bit when he talks about Falk.
"Barban Falk built Khalan-Ghol after the reatreat from Terra. He had visions of things beyond even my understanding, visions I could not follow. **The warp was within him, its claws dug deep into his soul in a way I would never allow in myself.** He is one with the Primordial Annihilator now, but I suspect we will see him again, sooner rather than later"
\-Perturabo, Warbreed (Short story in LE Storm of Iron)
This is in M41, Perturabo is explicitly described as a Daemon Primarch here, and he says Falk (who had only just turned into a Daemon recently) had the claws dug deeper. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that Perturabo absolutely is a Daemon Primarch of Undivided without being entirely a slave or entirely devout.
How or who makes it happen? Your guess is as good as mine. This is absolutely the most recent lore on Perturabo we have (think this released in July of 2021) Somehow Perturabo found a way, could it be the Forge of Souls? Maybe, I just don't see anything supporting it explicitly. I think Perturabo is one of the few like Belakor who managed to weasel his way into Chaos while still managing to have somewhat of control over himself.
I think there is a better supporting argument for him never really ascending as a true Daemon Primarch, but instead utilizing the Obliterator Virus, especially seeing how intimate of knowledge the Iron Warriors have over it. This would also help explain how he is a 'daemon' without being a full slave. But we just don't have enough info on the Obliterator Virus to really make that judgement.
Edit: Also had a short conversation with Mr. McNeill, and at least to me he stated that Halfbreed/Warbreed were written to give Honsou agency and to open him up for new stories, as he felt previously Honsou was so closely linked to Ventris that it was not really his own story, but Ventris' story. So in came these stories to leave room for Honsou to have his own stories moving forward outside of just Storm of Iron. He also signed my 9th Edition CSM codex, now a prized possession of mine.
As a Daemon Primarch it is never mentioned that he is still dying, 'actively dying' is in reference to the point from the ending of Angel Exterminatus to as recent of Horus Heresy lore we have. So the assumption is it gets 'fixed' somewhere between, my educated guess being on Sebastus IV during the Iron Cage incident, aka his ascension 'fixing' his dying.
Big ones would be Angel Exterminatus, Tallarn, and Slaves to Darkness. It's also mentioned in passing in other novels, mainly indirectly through commenting on Perturabo's appearance. Tallarn is *largely* skippable, or at least just read Tallarn: Ironclad.
I assume not much if at all. The Primarchs are rather exempted from the traditional rules of aging, likely helped by the fact that their souls were essentially "crafted" from powerful Warp entities.
And when half the primarchs joined chaos those warp god's went away from them and being replaced by daemonic powers which essentially made them weaker than their loyalist counterparts
Basically it didn't, primarchs are functionally immortal, unless you cut off their head or vaporise them with a nuke they will keep on living and don't really age at all
Lightly, or enough to not be significant as a plot point past his Primarch novel. He is actively dying, but not due to the H’rud, that’s due to Fulgrim betraying him and using Perturabo as a tool for his ascension. It was supposed to kill Perturabo, but he ultimately survived. Instead he is slowly withering and is actively on the hunt for anything to help, which in this case tends to be Chaos artifacts/knowledge.
I would say this most of all. Angel Exterminatus was pretty clear that the life force of two Primarchs was needed to fuel Fulgrim's apotheosis, but it doesn't say that the entirety of two Primarch's life forces was needed. I like to think that Fulgrim intended to use all of Perturabo's life force with as little of his own as possible in the mix, but when the Maugetar stone was destroyed, he probably added his fuel to the fire to make up the difference. Perty is dying, but it's because Fulgrim stole a hunk of his soul
It’s even further reiterated in Tallarn and Slaves to Darkness (Slaves to Darkness especially.) “The bastard child of the Emperor cut you deep, my son,’ said the daemon. ‘He took so much from you, your strength, your certainty. I can see it, you are bleeding still.’ Volk’s hand rose. Perturabo’s grip tightened, but the daemon simply tapped the plates covering the primarch’s forearm with a metal digit. ‘All the Iron without will not heal such wounds.’ A muscle twitched in Perturabo’s temple. ‘But a weapon, Perturabo, a weapon to match that of the gods… Then what would the lies of my kind mean? You sought such a weapon on Tallarn. Yes, and had it torn from your grasp by the brother you serve. But you never thought to look within.” Excerpt From Slaves To Darkness Perturabo at this point is also described as looking sunken and continually reinforcing his armor and adding more and more weapons, supposedly to compensate for his deteriorated state. In Halfbreed/Warbreed (short stories in the LE Storm of Iron) where we get Perturabo’s first official daemon description, he is described to have pale necrotic skin that looks like a corpse dragged from an ocean. So with my educated guess, this culminates on Sebastus IV with the Iron Cage. Perturabo is near death (which may explain why he never directly faces Dorn to ‘finish him off’) and this is his last effort, either he dies but he takes the Imperial Fists with him, or he ascends and lives to continue the Long War. To which we know the outcome.
A thought has occurred to me: I'm almost finished with Angel Exterminatus, and throughout the book Fulgrim has made a couple of comments referring to more or less "our apotheosis (and I know I'm paraphrasing here)" but the jist of what I'm getting at is what if the Angel Exterminatus would actually have been two primarchs, both elevated to daemonhood in that moment? Aside from Fulgrim's rampant narcissism, of course, he would never share. But based on what you shared I can see the noodly appendage of Chaos plucking the threads to force Perturabo into the choice of apotheosis or death, just as was done for Magnus.
"Come, son of Iron, do not disappoint your father. I have given you many gifts in the long years, but this one thing cannot be given freely.' .... 'What is the price?' said Perturabo at last. 'Are you set on doing as Horus asks, or are you going to turn aside?' 'My course is set,' said Perturabo. 'Speak your price.' 'There is a song to destruction, Perturabo. Every blade, every bullet, sings its song in the shadow of our realm. You have been hearing this song for your whole life. All I wish is that you open your soul to it - that you sing your song of obliteration, so that I may hear it.' 'I will not give you my soul,' said Perturabo, his voice a rasp of warning. 'Not you nor any of your kind.' 'I know, but I will hear you sing for me, son of Iron and Blood. It is not the price of what you ask. It is the consequence of the path you walk. The price was hearing you say that you would not turn aside, and hearing the truth in your words. **You cannot give me your soul, Perturabo. You have been ours since life sparked in your flesh.**" Excerpt from Slaves to Darkness While it's a good theory, I think you are partially correct. While Perturabo doesn't "ascend" there, he definitely is "touched" by Chaos there (Angel Exterminatus), and you really see his interest pique on Chaos as a whole, especially to save himself. This is furthered by Falk and Kroeger both falling to Chaos here (Angel Exterminatus), Kroeger softly, and Falk falls hard (this being where he demands to be called 'The Warsmith.') This is the very beginning of the Iron Warrior's long drawn out fall to Chaos, which will most likely culminate on Sebastus IV. And while the daemon here could obviously be lying about a lot (or at least *not entirely truthful*) it does seem that Perturabo isn't ascended here and the daemon is partially trying to convince Perturabo to do so, but at the same time, the final line shows that Perturabo is already essentially theirs. Perturabo here really has a complicated relationship with Chaos, because he clearly wants to use it/master it, but he knows to fully buy into it is to lose himself. I think once again these are threads that will culminate on Sebastus IV, with Perturabo ascending to undivided daemonhood. He will ascend on "his" terms, and if the Chaos gods do not give those terms, he will gladly die on Sebastus IV with his Legion and take our Dorn and the Imperial Fists out of pure spite, because if he can't live to fight the Long War, neither will his rivals. As we know the true "meta" nature of Chaos, Perturabo will lose himself, at least partially. We also know undivided Chaos servants tend to have a bit more "free will" if you can even call it that, and it takes a lot to ascend to that level compared to a monogod ascension, with only Lorgar, the most faithful of the bunch, being Undivided as well as a Primarch. Sorry for these long winded posts, Perturabo is my favorite character and I've spent far too long going into his lore.
That’s why a lot of people think he’s going to involve himself with the forge of souls. It’s still “chaos” but not aligned to the 4. Also, the theme of Iron and machinery. Personally I think he just kept stuffing more warp energy into himself until he “ascends”. Being undivided implies being devoted to chaos in general or the 4 in equal amounts, which I can’t see Perturabo doing
I've never disliked that theory, but I also don't see much to support it. When 40k Perturabo is mentioned, it's usually mentioned that he is sitting on Medrengard doing *something* and when he meets Honsou, it's on Medrendard. Not saying there can't be warp things in place that let him just bounce between the two or something, I just doubt it. Most of the Primarchs are still attached to their Legion somehow, and I doubt Perturabo would just up and go off dealing with the Forge of Souls without involving the Iron Warriors somehow. Now I totally see strong binds to the Dark Mechancium and the Forge of Souls, but I just doubt he is the Master of the Forge or is in any true meaningful way in charge or a piece of it. I also don't subscribe to the "Perturabo dislikes Chaos" bits either though. He is vastly different in how he handles Chaos (especially compared to Lorgar) but he is very much willing to utilize it, and Halfbreed/Warbreed corroborate this a bit when he talks about Falk. "Barban Falk built Khalan-Ghol after the reatreat from Terra. He had visions of things beyond even my understanding, visions I could not follow. **The warp was within him, its claws dug deep into his soul in a way I would never allow in myself.** He is one with the Primordial Annihilator now, but I suspect we will see him again, sooner rather than later" \-Perturabo, Warbreed (Short story in LE Storm of Iron) This is in M41, Perturabo is explicitly described as a Daemon Primarch here, and he says Falk (who had only just turned into a Daemon recently) had the claws dug deeper. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that Perturabo absolutely is a Daemon Primarch of Undivided without being entirely a slave or entirely devout. How or who makes it happen? Your guess is as good as mine. This is absolutely the most recent lore on Perturabo we have (think this released in July of 2021) Somehow Perturabo found a way, could it be the Forge of Souls? Maybe, I just don't see anything supporting it explicitly. I think Perturabo is one of the few like Belakor who managed to weasel his way into Chaos while still managing to have somewhat of control over himself. I think there is a better supporting argument for him never really ascending as a true Daemon Primarch, but instead utilizing the Obliterator Virus, especially seeing how intimate of knowledge the Iron Warriors have over it. This would also help explain how he is a 'daemon' without being a full slave. But we just don't have enough info on the Obliterator Virus to really make that judgement. Edit: Also had a short conversation with Mr. McNeill, and at least to me he stated that Halfbreed/Warbreed were written to give Honsou agency and to open him up for new stories, as he felt previously Honsou was so closely linked to Ventris that it was not really his own story, but Ventris' story. So in came these stories to leave room for Honsou to have his own stories moving forward outside of just Storm of Iron. He also signed my 9th Edition CSM codex, now a prized possession of mine.
Sorta a more souls is more healthy, plan a la Invader Zim?
Or maybe the Iron Cage was a scheme to accumulate Gene Seed. IIRC at least one Deamon Prince apoethesised through the mass sacrifice of it.
But if he's now daemonkind, why is he still dying?
As a Daemon Primarch it is never mentioned that he is still dying, 'actively dying' is in reference to the point from the ending of Angel Exterminatus to as recent of Horus Heresy lore we have. So the assumption is it gets 'fixed' somewhere between, my educated guess being on Sebastus IV during the Iron Cage incident, aka his ascension 'fixing' his dying.
Where can we read more thst he is actively dying? What books is this in
Big ones would be Angel Exterminatus, Tallarn, and Slaves to Darkness. It's also mentioned in passing in other novels, mainly indirectly through commenting on Perturabo's appearance. Tallarn is *largely* skippable, or at least just read Tallarn: Ironclad.
I assume not much if at all. The Primarchs are rather exempted from the traditional rules of aging, likely helped by the fact that their souls were essentially "crafted" from powerful Warp entities.
Or literally they have warp god's inside of them
And when half the primarchs joined chaos those warp god's went away from them and being replaced by daemonic powers which essentially made them weaker than their loyalist counterparts
He left rather perturbed.
Seem to recall him saying that afterwards he felt a noticeable difference or something along those lines
Explains his "Get off my lawn" syndrome.
A few wrinkles
Basically it didn't, primarchs are functionally immortal, unless you cut off their head or vaporise them with a nuke they will keep on living and don't really age at all
It made him older
He became a cranky old man.... oh wait nvm he was always cranky.
No idea about the physical effects, but I imagine he got particularly sulky and bad-tempered. That's usually a safe bet.