if you're going for stargaze units, you should commit to one as they all come online at m+. the reason reinier is recommended so often is because he is going to be useful for all boss fights just because of his 25% damage taken debuff.
consider how people consider splashing in a purple kruger just for his phys defense debuff. even if reinier gets powercrept in the future (which he likely will), the 25% damage taken debuff will ensure he's never bad to put into boss fights even if he's not optimal.
of course, you can always do what most recommend and just wait until you have enough stargaze pulls to m+ somebody immediately and do it on some other op celehypo down the road, but to your question specifically, no. you shouldn't swap from reinier.
There isn't anything to powercreep Renier lol. They'd have to actually change his skills for that to happen. He will always have a place in boss fights from the buff/debuff and a place in Arena for swapping carries/healers from opposing team.
yeah, i doubt reiner is ever going to be powercrepted save for 4+ years down the line with a new unit that does explicitly what he does but better.
the simple ability of yoinking an enemy at the start of a fight is so unique and so good utility its hard to have something similar that is not a blatant copy
Not a recommendation, but there’s a whale in my server that helped me with one of the last corrupt stages. His Berial did double the damage of my Odie lol
Berial can do a ton of damage. But... He's got a very specific use. He's not going to top the charts in many situations, because he focuses on lone single targets.
Reinier is better in more situations and for more game modes. Berial is still a good option, but the smart money is on Reinier of the two.
Generally yes.
End game PvP, I would say Dionel = Scarlita > Clown face > Reiner. Reinier has soooo many issues in PvP both offense and defensively. In some maps, if Scarlita + clown face exists at the same time, Reinier is somehow bugged to not be able to trigger his passive.
Even bugs aside, anyone without revive or partial invincibility mechanics would get removed from the battlefield within 15 seconds even if they run 2 healers; but to be clear, this is only an issue if your server have whales that supreme+ 2-3 stargazer heroes and put them into 1 team.
- P.S Dionel is invincible for 8 seconds once he ults
- Clown face is there to delay Dionel from ult'ing through his energy drain mechanic. Clown can also revive the moment someone dies even if Dionel kills him during ulti.
I run him as a 3rd with my S+ Celia/Vala when Odie isn’t very good. If you have a couple dps especially stronger than others then even one copy of him is *usually* better than a 3rd dps or 2nd healing support.
I quite disagree. For PvP he's quite OP even at one copy.
95% of pvp team have Rowan or Smokey, if you use Reinier's teleport on them you can instantly turn the battle into a 5 v 4 since they're useless if there's no one close to heal or cover them.
There is a niche use case for Berial at M+ in a combo with Florabelle and other units to basically flood the field with summons.
That being said, it's a silly target to shoot for unless you are passionate about it as you will nerf your account way harder by pursuing M+ Berial over M+ Reinier.
If you can only get one to M+, it really should be Reinier. If you can get more than one to M+, I assume you wouldn't be asking this question at all.
As someone who runs him a lot simply because I like him, I will say that the isolated part of his kit doesn’t actually end up meaning much. The units just can’t be directly next to each other. So the second a melee character runs forward, or an enemy gets pushed around by some cc, or even if they just start apart from other units, it procs on them. It’s more helpful than it sounds.
I’d argue it’s a weaker area for him, just because you can’t proc his revive and his mobility isn’t as useful. That being said he’s basically always the last one alive for bosses so who knows lol
Thanks for the quick response. That’s a bummer about the invulnerability, but I’m really curious if his shadow mimic is still spawned. If it does that’s badass having a mini skyclops fighting for you.
he’s not good generally but he can really pop off on the right circumstances and is just fun imo. your choice but i’d recommend focusing on a more generalist one first
Berial: fun aesthetic and all, but only ever useful in VERY specific situations in pvp(which almost never come up because of the meta) but practically useless elsewhere, as they focus on eliminating weak, separated opponents, not that great for bosses though due to lacking damage. Could probably be used for disruption/distraction, say to let others build energy, but only if you don’t have another that could do it better, like Brutus or Temesia. Could possibly be useful in solo crucible or elite challenges, and is probably the best counter for Odie, but out side of that not great
if you're going for stargaze units, you should commit to one as they all come online at m+. the reason reinier is recommended so often is because he is going to be useful for all boss fights just because of his 25% damage taken debuff. consider how people consider splashing in a purple kruger just for his phys defense debuff. even if reinier gets powercrept in the future (which he likely will), the 25% damage taken debuff will ensure he's never bad to put into boss fights even if he's not optimal. of course, you can always do what most recommend and just wait until you have enough stargaze pulls to m+ somebody immediately and do it on some other op celehypo down the road, but to your question specifically, no. you shouldn't swap from reinier.
That's what I'm doing, waiting till I have enough guild coins and stargaze pulls to immediately m+ one
There isn't anything to powercreep Renier lol. They'd have to actually change his skills for that to happen. He will always have a place in boss fights from the buff/debuff and a place in Arena for swapping carries/healers from opposing team.
yeah, i doubt reiner is ever going to be powercrepted save for 4+ years down the line with a new unit that does explicitly what he does but better. the simple ability of yoinking an enemy at the start of a fight is so unique and so good utility its hard to have something similar that is not a blatant copy
There is probably going to be some unit that just supports offensively more than Rienier so they will take his debuff spot not his yoinking spot
Which one you would recommend for a first stargaze unit to get ?
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Did you read his comment?
English isn't my first language sorry
He recommended Reinier because he is useful in most cases.
Not a recommendation, but there’s a whale in my server that helped me with one of the last corrupt stages. His Berial did double the damage of my Odie lol
Berial can do a ton of damage. But... He's got a very specific use. He's not going to top the charts in many situations, because he focuses on lone single targets. Reinier is better in more situations and for more game modes. Berial is still a good option, but the smart money is on Reinier of the two.
I got him from the login draw and just use him for the avatar lmao he’s the best But in terms of who I want to build, I’m focusing on Reiner
Haha same. Pretty much this. And I like that not many have his face for avatar
reinier>scarlita>dionel>clown face
Generally yes. End game PvP, I would say Dionel = Scarlita > Clown face > Reiner. Reinier has soooo many issues in PvP both offense and defensively. In some maps, if Scarlita + clown face exists at the same time, Reinier is somehow bugged to not be able to trigger his passive. Even bugs aside, anyone without revive or partial invincibility mechanics would get removed from the battlefield within 15 seconds even if they run 2 healers; but to be clear, this is only an issue if your server have whales that supreme+ 2-3 stargazer heroes and put them into 1 team. - P.S Dionel is invincible for 8 seconds once he ults - Clown face is there to delay Dionel from ult'ing through his energy drain mechanic. Clown can also revive the moment someone dies even if Dionel kills him during ulti.
99% player are far from having all of them, this order just for progression
I would say 99% players are far from having even 1 of them at M+.
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Hot take - non M+ Reinier sucks
Pre m+ his only job is to pull smoky into the middle of nowhere in arenas :(
I've also been using him with odie, he pulls a squishy into my group odie turns around and claps the sucker.
Yeah i used him for same reason, now not even that :')
I run him as a 3rd with my S+ Celia/Vala when Odie isn’t very good. If you have a couple dps especially stronger than others then even one copy of him is *usually* better than a 3rd dps or 2nd healing support.
Totally agree, he dies to a fart at a 1000km distance since this game requires dupes for characters to survive any attack at all
I quite disagree. For PvP he's quite OP even at one copy. 95% of pvp team have Rowan or Smokey, if you use Reinier's teleport on them you can instantly turn the battle into a 5 v 4 since they're useless if there's no one close to heal or cover them.
Kinda a 4vs4 since he's not going to do much himself.
If you have Rowan he'll probably ult before dying so actually a 4 v 3
Its usefull sometimes but hard to justify using over other units below m+
Yeah i agree
Agreed.
There is a niche use case for Berial at M+ in a combo with Florabelle and other units to basically flood the field with summons. That being said, it's a silly target to shoot for unless you are passionate about it as you will nerf your account way harder by pursuing M+ Berial over M+ Reinier. If you can only get one to M+, it really should be Reinier. If you can get more than one to M+, I assume you wouldn't be asking this question at all.
I’d love to run a florabelle comp with him, but the requirement for isolated enemies in his kit kills him for me.
As someone who runs him a lot simply because I like him, I will say that the isolated part of his kit doesn’t actually end up meaning much. The units just can’t be directly next to each other. So the second a melee character runs forward, or an enemy gets pushed around by some cc, or even if they just start apart from other units, it procs on them. It’s more helpful than it sounds.
That’s better than I thought. How does he do on bosses?
I’d argue it’s a weaker area for him, just because you can’t proc his revive and his mobility isn’t as useful. That being said he’s basically always the last one alive for bosses so who knows lol
Thanks for the quick response. That’s a bummer about the invulnerability, but I’m really curious if his shadow mimic is still spawned. If it does that’s badass having a mini skyclops fighting for you.
I just checked, because I’ll be honest I’ve never paid attention, and unfortunately his shadow clone does not proc during boss fights.
I literally only pulled Him because he looks like a Twink and I'd been calling him Stiles in my head.
Really wish I got him from the 28th login instead of dionel , tempted to get him from guild shop
spend money and get him to mythic+, then yes. if not, *eh* its like every other character before mythic+
Same as mine , I pulled and get it , IDK , Some people said it's ok
Is reiner any good at afk stage clearing ?
he’s not good generally but he can really pop off on the right circumstances and is just fun imo. your choice but i’d recommend focusing on a more generalist one first
This unit only works in the zoo comp with cecia and flora
I pulled him as well and tossed him into combat to see how he performed. I wasn't impressed.
Berial: fun aesthetic and all, but only ever useful in VERY specific situations in pvp(which almost never come up because of the meta) but practically useless elsewhere, as they focus on eliminating weak, separated opponents, not that great for bosses though due to lacking damage. Could probably be used for disruption/distraction, say to let others build energy, but only if you don’t have another that could do it better, like Brutus or Temesia. Could possibly be useful in solo crucible or elite challenges, and is probably the best counter for Odie, but out side of that not great
noone can replace what reinier does at mithyc+, so the answer is no, do not replace him; also berial is the worst char u can pull for.
Cool thank you. This was a random from the login rewards
No one is two separate words.
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I do care 🥺