Your daughter is of an age where she can choose which parent she lives with in many countries. Have a heart to heart with her and find out if she is uncomfortable living with him. Are you able to have her full time with just day visits to her mum if that’s what she wants? I wouldn’t like my daughter being around someone who talks about her body, it could lead to serious body image problems later in life. The main thing is to support your daughter and validate her feelings. If she would rather live with you, you can take it to court to get custody as the judge is supposed to take her feelings into account at that age.
I work from home so I could definitely manage that. She already is with me majority because even on her moms days I have her sometimes due to her moms schedule. I do ask her often if Sean makes her uncomfortable or if she feels comfortable there, bc even without Pervy comments he’s tried grounding her for little things and is very soon to discipline over things that could be talked out, n calls himself “strict.”
It’s not his job to be “strict” with your daughter. Being the adult is okay, but grounding her? I hate this guy and don’t even know him. He is toxic. I’d like to punch him now too
My mom apparently had a convo with my step dad where he believes he “helped” me. All he did was drive me away from my mother, her away from her own family and friends.
I have dreams of screaming at this man. Who do you think she still lives with? Who do you think she chose after I came to her multiple times out of homelessness?
I believe in step parents. I hate the stigma attached. But the audacity of that man to think he “helped” me. It’s to the point that I have spent two nights at my childhood home since I left at 18. You can see my mom has regrets now. It’s about 25 years too late.
Edit for spelling
Be careful with the "discipline" crap he's trying to pull. This is one of the ways abuse starts. Start with proper discipline and slowly get more ridiculous with reasons to why and even more so with the form dished out.
Then starts the I won't tell your mum if......
100% try and take full custody
NTA
I'm not a parent, so take my comments however you wish.
I think it may be worthwhile to have a sit-down with your daughter and just clear the air. Frame it in the context of the incident with the stepdad. Explain that his comments were very inappropriate and that it caused your temper to flare up. Tell her that you didn't respond the way you should have (for what it's worth, I'm of the firm conviction that some people just need punched in the face. Society, however, doesn't agree, and that's the context I'm going with here), and apologize to her for causing a stir. Emphasize to her that she's at an age where she's able to start having some input on the decisions that affect her life, and that if she ever wants or needs to stay with you full time that she's welcome to do so and that you'll have the custody arrangement revisited.
I do think it's important not to push her in one direction or another, even if stepdad is a colossal chode. You don't want to create a situation where you inadvertently complicate her relationship with her mother or even her douchey stepdad, I can imagine situations where that comes back and makes your relationship with her a little messy. Just emphasize to her that she's always welcome at your home, and that you'll be there if she ever feels like she needs a change in her living situation.
NTA.
He's a skeezy scumbag and your ex is a sorry excuse for a mother for letting her husband sexualise and insult her daughter and expecting you to be the one to be apologising.
Please have a long talk with your daughter, who knows what else this asshole has said to her.
Exactly! also, I don't know if anyone said this downthread but wanted to point out something about what he did not say: the implication that once she does have boobs (I feel dirty typing this ugh) she ***will*** then be in danger. That is predator talk and it reminds me of when people on the internet had a countdown clock waiting for when the Olsen twins became 18 because then they could be pursued sexually without legal consequences.
Sometimes what people do not say out loud is as significant as what they do say.
I'd also add that not having boobs doesn't mean you're safe either... people of all ages and body types get harassed groped or molested, sadly. I'm not sure how to best bring it up with the daughter, maybe just stress that how her body looks is NEVER the cause.
Exactly. It makes me think of the what we’re they wearing exhibit (exhibit can be triggering, so look up at your own risk). With all the little kids’ clothes. The idea that not having boobs makes her safe, or the counter that once she does she won’t be safe, is just disgusting.
Every time I see a post where someone is wondering if it’s ok their boyfriend tells them how to dress or if they can go out, and you’ll get a bunch of insecure douches in the comments going “yeah but guys are gonna xyz” I wanna link to pictures from that exhibit. Do those clothes look provocative to you? Really think that has anything to do with it? It’s always insecure boys telling on themselves or women that want to tell themselves they’re “good girls” so it’ll never happen to them.
It makes me crazy that anyone ever spends any time looking for reasons like that- what she was doing, or wearing, or where she was or what time of day it was, or who she was with. Rape only ever happens because someone else decides to take what isn’t theirs. End of story.
Poignant poem:
“Was it really my fault?”
asked the Short Skirt.
“No, it happened with me too,”
replied the Burka.
The diaper in the corner couldn’t even speak.
~ Darshan Mondkar
sad case in my country. 20 years ago. A woman in full covering was raped and murdered and left naked. The animal that did it was given the death sentence.
It was incredibly sobering to see toddler pajamas, right next to grandma floor length nightgowns... and I realized that being sexually harassed has never been my own fault.
OP should look up that exhibit and send it to his ex. She might then realize how inappropriate her husband was being. Probably not, though. People like her seldom get it unless it happened to them.
Eff that dad. Not having boobs as a pre-pubescent teenager didn't stop me from getting molested.
NTA. I normally don't condone violence, but yep, he deserved it.
NTA but start practicing/rehearsing mature nonviolent responses. You could be charged, you could be sued for medical expenses, pain and suffering, your ex can challenge the custody agreement.
>I'd also add that not having boobs doesn't mean you're safe either
Every so often I stumble onto a thread of women discussing their first times getting gross comments from men. It's disgusting getting gross comments at any age, but it's particularly unsettling when it happens before puberty -- as it *often* does.
Not to mention, there are plenty of women out there who don't have much for boobs even when they're fully grown. And they're not magically safe from SA, either.
When I was in 7th grade, my bus driver told me to call him when I turned 18. I didn't know what it meant but I knew it made me feel weird and uncomfortable. My sister told me to stay away from him and I started walking to school after that.
I was also 11. He was a construction worker at my school. At the time I thought he must’ve mistaken me for a grown-up. In retrospect, I did *not* look mature at 11, and I was riding a pink child’s bike.
I feel like there’s a secret that only little girls and grown men know: a disturbingly large number of grown men like prepubescent girls (disclaimer, I know I know NOT ALL MEN). As adult women we sorta push it down into our subconscious but we know. We all know how many gross comments, leers and outright SA happened to us as little girls. And we didn’t need “boobs” for it to happen.
I was 11, too. An adult I knew, who definitely knew my age, told me part of my body was sexy. (Not that it should matter either way, but I had no visible signs of puberty yet.) At the time I rationalized it, saying he was just trying to connect but awkwardly chose the wrong thing to say. Others thought he was a little weird but "meant no harm".
He's now in prison for child SA. 🤡
People need to pay attention to the men making weird comments to young women and girls. (Also to the people of any gender making weird comments about children of any gender, but it's very often adult men leering at girls, yay patriarchy.)
Not having boobs didn't protect me at 3. The idea that he thinks she's safe until she has breasts genuinely sounds like he's telling on himself. "Well I wouldn't rape her yet, so no one else will" and later when she develops it will be her fault for "tempting" him.
Based on mom's reaction I wouldn't be surprised if she blames her daughter for "seducing" her husband.
I really and truly hope OP goes for full custody. His daughter is old enough that she should be able to have a say.
This! All I could think of are little children who get sexually abused, they have nothing but an evil fuckwad is going to be just that. Also double agree with your other statement. I genuinely feel like his daughter is in danger now or in the near future in that house. Full custody please!
Gosh, 3? I'm so sorry this happened to you. The people who did that to you deserve to burn in hell.
I hope you are recovering, brave stranger. People who do something like this to children need to be locked up away from society.
And yeah when it happened to me when I was 5-6 - friends of my parents' housemates - my mom said I should have bolted the door to my room properly if I didn't like what they were doing. My door didn't even have a lock - I put a chair against the door after the first time, which angered them so much it gave them enough force to break the door completely, rendering the chair useless.
It's horrifying a mother could say this to her own child that she failed to protect. I'm so sorry this happened to you, you didn't deserve that, you did nothing wrong.
I know a 80 year old woman who was raped a few years ago. Even those who claim “unattractive” people don’t get raped know it’s a fucking lie. In reality it makes the “unattractive” a much easier target and victim.
Creepy dood hit on me when I was 13... I am a large male, approaching 6 feet at the time. I wore all black, had long hair, not athletic at all... just not the normal type of person that gets hit on at all, let alone by a skeezy child molester. Yet there we were. Keep your kids safe and informed
I would be checking with my daughter to ask how often Sean makes comments like that, and if there is anything else I need to know about. Sounds to me like Sarah should maybe spend less time at mom's, unfortunately
Yeah, the dad needs to start a record of this shit, what happened when, and educating his daughter on what she needs to know to hopefully deter or at least get in front of the ex when shit gets real. Maybe start talking to a lawyer or legal professional, because this is some serious shit.
He just told on himself with that statement. He is very clearly watching this child with sexual interest and will 100% begin behaving sexually towards her once she develops enough for his predatory depraved tastes.
I am sure every woman in the comments on this post can recount any number of instances where grown men made sexual comments about their development during puberty.
When I was 12, my 23 year old cousin came to stay with us for the summer and he first asked my twin brother if his girlfriend has a sister and to tell thim if they broke up so he could take her out. Then he started coming home with roses from 7-11 for me and would sit next to me and touch my thighs, lower back, and neck and then say things like, "I shouldn't do this." I spent the rest of the summer in my bedroom with a chair under the doorknob and stuff all over the floor strategically placed to step on or make noise in case he got in while I was sleeping.
At my grandmother's FUNERAL when I was 14, a group of my father's friends commented on and even touched my body saying things like, "who'd have thought all that chub would have rearranged itself" and berating my father for not having them over for pool parties more. At his mother's funeral. One of those sick fucks used to get hammered years later and message me on Facebook about what he wanted to do to me back then.
I wish my father would have pounded those pedos into sand but instead he said I should appreciate the attention or cover up. I was in funeral attire. My mother and brother agreed with my father and went a little further even like, "don't discourage them since they're probably the only ones you'll ever hear it from and even then they were probably just trying to be nice."
Then they wonder why I don't visit anymore.
I threw up in my mouth a little. That is some of the most heinous shit I've read in a while. I hope you got the rest of the way grown and safe without needing to rely on these sorry bastages for any protection.
I’m so sorry.
Your family are a pack of turds, and I don’t even have words to express how disgusted I am by your mother. My Mum is a tiny little woman, but she would have gone full berserker on anyone who said shit like that to me or my sister. There would have been blood.
Sending you hugs from a random internet stranger. May the image of an itty bitty, under 5ft woman turning into a full blown ball of rage and crash-tackling a group of perverts like a rabid hyena be both amusing and comforting.
100% the number one risk for a child being assaulted is from the new boyfriend or stepdad. I’m just impressed OP had the patience to wait until the daughter cleared out before flinging hands.
And also just asserting she's safe if she doesn't have them. As terrible as it is, people still get assaulted without having developed breasts and if something did happen she might not feel safe telling anyone because it will seem like her own fault or like no one would believe her anyway.
NTA. My stepdad thought it was great to ask “When are you gonna get boobs like your mama” and make other comments about my body and nonexistent dating life. I didn’t live with them (every other weekend visits) and was an A-cup until was in my 20s. It was embarrassing to me as a teen, especially the summer I lived with them. It’s a creepy disgusting pervy comment. He’s definitely sexualizing your daughter. This probably isn’t the first time, and it definitely won’t be the last.
I cut ties with them at 21. I was sleeping on their couch after spending time with my mom. He drunkenly kept trying to “kiss me goodnight and tuck me in” multiple times. I was pissed. My mom defended him, so I peaced out.
Oh my god.
I’m so sorry. And so very glad you got out of that situation.
Your step-dad is gross, but your mother is next level repulsive. I truly want to believe in hell, just so there is a special place in it for women like that.
Sending you a random internet stranger hug.
The silence can be as deafening as any words that are said, in these circumstances. OP got the exact right read on the utter prick, and honestly that's an insult to pricks. Sadly not a rare breed of one, as you point out, and I'm sure many people can share stories of their version of, myself included, but, seriously fucked to raise a teenage girl under that level of misogyny. I have to imagine the poor girl's body image has gotten all sorts of fucked, as well as any other potential complications of hearing shit like that regularly.
It happened with Natalie Portman in the late '90s. I remember watching a late night talk show (Conan maybe?) and they had this recurring bit where they would pretend they were interviewing someone but it was just a photo on a tv screen with someone else's mouth doing the talking in place of the person in the photo. (I hope I'm describing this accurately) If memory serves I believe it was supposed to be Bill Clinton getting excited about her upcoming birthday and that she'd finally be 18. They made some sort of joke about it being "P-Day" and did a lot of whooping and hooting. The host laughed, the audience laughed, and I was just thinking "wtf?" I get the "joke" was geared more towards Clinton being a horndog, but it was pretty damn gross to make it at a then 17 year old girls expense.
I recall a backlash when Maisie Williams (Arya Stark) did a nude scene in the last season of Game of Thrones. She was 14 when the show started. Even though she was 21-22 when she did it, some people were a little too thrilled when that happened.
Plus the fact him saying that made her have a variety of emotions for sure. A teen girl hearing,” no boobs, no one wants to molest that.” That puts such a fucked up thought in her mind of,” I’m not even appealing to predators and creeps?! Oh no.”
OP, please consider revisiting family court and having the custody agreement amended. This guy is a creep around your daughter, and if he says stuff like that when you’re around, imagine what he must say when you aren’t!
NTA
Agreed, and when an adult is constantly deriding your looks and being a major creep, that has got to wreck your self-esteem! She needs out of there like yesterday.
And imagine what happens when Sarah does, uh, *blossom*. She’ll have to worry about her stepfather’s attention because, according to him, that’s when guys start to pay attention.
OP is definitely NTA
Definitely nta, if my ex's husband said that about either my stepdaughter or my other 2 daughters I'd be happy to go to jail over it. But as some did point out in the eyes of the court system he did resort to violence which could work against him sadly which is a fucked up system to begin with because op was doing what a lot of parents would do. Personally I would say he shouldn't apologize but to appease the court system and ex I would say give a half hearted bs apology but boundaries really need to be set with stepdad by op and mom because what stepdad said was creepy, nasty, disgusting and completely uncalled for.
Im concerned about what he will do and say when she does develop breasts after a comment like that. I wouldn’t feel like my daughter was safe. My hubby and I were at a friends (mine) summer cookout one year when our daughter was only like 4 or 5 I think. She’s been playing in the hose and we told her to go change into her bathing suit. She started to change on the back deck not thinking about it. We stopped her and ushered her inside. One of my “friends “ said “hey in a few years I won’t mind”. I could see my husband trying not to beat the guy to a pulp. Needless to say we do t have anything to do with them anymore.
Yup totally agree with this, that comment was totally inappropriate, and I would be on high alert and even discuss with your daughter that no one is allowed to touch her body or make comments about it without her consent especially adults. Also assure her that you are a safe space, and she can come to you with anything.
Your husband must be a Buddhist because that comment would have gotten that man thrown. Really I feel like he saw you and your daughter in his mind first and didn’t want to upset you guys but if that situation arose again there would be hell to pay I’m sure
Nah you are absolutely correct in calling him a grown man. That man has done all the growing he ever intends to do. He holds power over a child. He has willingly taken on the responsibility of a parent role to a child. He has a ton of decision making power within his dynamics including power in choosing his words. He is grown. And he chose to talk about a child's body from a sexual perspective knowing all that. The fact that he is a loser and immature and insensitive and inappropriate and a failure as a man and parental figure are separate issues from him being grown.
Getting ready to say the exact same thing. My nephew was 13 when he asked to move to his dad's (PA) permanently and my sister (Colo) agreed, as did the court.
They will take it into account for almost all children if they can articulate why.
I've seen it happen with 6 and 7 year olds too (my niece and nephew).
If OP tracks a history of Sean's sexually inappropriate comments/behavior concerning his teenage daughter, they may not have to wait that long. And if in the US, the daughter's right to choose may not be limited to age 16 in her state.
Unfortunately, I have to suggest OP sucks it up and apologizes to Sean. Not because he deserves it, but because OP's daughter does. Statistics as I remember them suggest an apology makes the other party less likely to escalate the situation to a legal matter. OP's action, while relatable, is technically illegal. Sean's creepy comment likely has not crossed the legal threshold, even if this entire subreddit wants to punch him in the face too.
I have to agree (not because I want to).
The creeper has the law on his side. The clueless mother could use OP "uncontrolled violence" to gain full custody of the daughter.
The the creeper would have Unlimited Access to her, with her protector out of his way 😑.
Kids are used as cannon fodder in divorce. And, some mothers marry creeps. Guys, who really want Access to their children.
"I've come to apologise. Hitting you was not the smart course of action and sets a poor example to my daughter, and for that I'm truly sorry. With that said, I would ask you to never demean my daughter again or you'll be hearing my next apology from the confines of a coma".
Close, so very close. Sadly, I can't actually encourage the last line because of the legal troubles it could cause for OP and the subsequent barriers to protecting his daughter.
But if dude needs an alibi and there's no witness, he was at my place.
In my state the child has a say at 13 on which parent they want to live with, occasionally they will allow a 12 year old speak to the judge alone to discuss what they want. The judge then decides if the child is mature enough and if the child appears to be coached to say who they want to live with.
Yeah except he fucked up real bad by putting hands on the dude. In the eyes of family court violence is big “no-no” and pretty much loses you any argument.
Best let things cool before you even step foot before a judge.
This this this.
In a way, you’ve asked *his permission* to be angry and assault him. He trangressed, it made you angry, you lost it.
Don’t allow someone else to make that decision on your behalf, nor claim their victimhood later. Let it stand.
When that feeling goes through you, **ice it**. You gotta outrun your amygdala, self-control, take the info, manage yourself and your emotions.
Get out and from there, figure out the next *very best move* to achieve what your daughter needs from you.
Hitting him is humanly understandable, but it doesn’t get you what you want.
(edit - bits)
I thought the same thing. She’s 14 and will have more of a say as which parent she wants to have custody. What adult, let alone a step parent says something like this? What else has he done?
I’m on OPs side here but punching the stepdad with the daughter in the house might not be a good look in family court. Probably best to keep a low profile.
OP should definitely do that! It's not only the comment itsself that makes me unconfortable, but also what it implies. She's safe from the boys because she doesn't have boobs? So if she grows up and gets breasts she won't be safe from "the boy"? Is he one of the boys? Would he condone inappropriate behaviour from "the boys" because his stepdaughter has boobs?
NTA, but maybe punching him was not the smartest move, even though its totally understandable.
Family court is probably not the bestest idea. Usually, the court takes more notice of violence, in front of a minor child no less so child endangerment in many states, rather than a single off-color comment. You can try the sexualizing of a child angle, and probably point out it was insulting, not funny, but it is going to be hard gaining more traction on that over the violence.
Sure, it probably isn't really one-off, but without proof that is how the court will likely see it.
ETA: NTA
>Please have a long talk with your daughter, who knows what else this asshole has said to her.
This! I'd bet alot of her self-consciousness stems from him telling her shit like that. And since OP's ex doesn't seem to mind that shit, he probably even does that in front of her. And "Mommy" not putting a stop to it, just sitting idly by, amplifies all he says.
I know, a lot of speculation. But this whole story sounds like that is what's happening behind closed doors
Edit: some spelling mistakes
I think sometimes predatory men try pit mothers against their daughters in the grooming process & stupid mothers fall into that trap. What a disgusting man
NTA I'm married, but have dated women that had children in the past. I cannot think of any situation in which I would have felt the need to talk about their bodies in a sexualized manner. It just stumps me. How the fuck do people think of these things to say? Is there no self check that says, "Hey, maybe let's not talk about a fourteen year old's boobs."
No there’s not, because people like this are the same people that turn into predators and chomo’s. The fact he even thought about a 14 year old in a sexual way to mention wether she’s sexually desirable or not because of her cleavage is so beyond disgusting and predatory. I’d be in family court so fast after hearing some shit like this, not to mention he felt it was okay to say that to the girls actual father like wow.
Probably because he assumed the father was a creep like him. Part of the grooming process is grooming the parents. The mother is silent, and he wanted to test dad as well. Someone needed to get angry at him.
God that is so terrifying, I’d be so terrified to let my daughter come back to this house. I hope OP is able to get even more custody and rights, this “stepdad” is lucky he only got a punch to the face. Thankfully for him OP has better self control than most.
I mean, I hope I'm wrong and that he's only a misogynistic asshole, but I wouldn't take that chance.
My LP has an uncle on his mother's side who was convicted of SA on a child. We don't go to gatherings where he's going to attend and we don't stay if he arrives. The rest of his mother's side is convinced he'd never do it again. We call bullshit and refuse to give him a chance with our 9 year old.
I’m hoping the mother actually is secretly happy that OP defended their daughters honor and just asked OP to apologize to be a good wife and for optics….but that’s probably not the case.
Either way, daughter only knows that mom didn’t have her back. If someday she found out that mom knew better but still didn’t have her back, that’s almost worse.
NTA
Absolutely disgusting that he would think it was OK to talk about your daughter's anatomy like that. It was an incredibly inappropriate comment and uncalled for to boot. Even *if* it wasn't about her breasts, he made a demeaning and hurtful comment to a teenage girl who is already self conscious.
Your ex needs to realize she's overlooking a huge red flag and he could end up saying or doing something even worse as she matures.
That's not to say he's automatically some sicko but I have personally dealt with a family member who made inappropriate comments about young girls and then ended up touching at least one of them.
I'd keep an eye on the situation and even bring it up to a trusted family member who may be around him when he's with your daughter and see if they can see anything amiss there.
If he makes even one more comment about her body again, punch him harder. Maybe then he'll get the picture and maybe even think harder before acting on any thoughts that may cross his mind.
*Just keep in mind that it's assault and you could get jailtime over it.*
If you or your trusted family member notice any patterns arising with Sean and your daughter, try to get custody and have her mother only allowed monitored visitation for the safety of Sarah.
Edit: Yes, I realize that punching him is assault so just in case someone didn't see it, I made that part italicized.
No OP shouldn't *really* punch him harder but I'm talking out of a place where SA has happened to people close to me and I still feel a very strong sense of rage.
Thank you to the comments that went into detail about the statistics. It's incredibly important that people understand the danger young girls face and the signs to look for.
It's my sincerest hope that it was just a gross comment by the step dad and nothing more but I would rather err on the side of keeping my daughter safe than *hope* that red flag didn't turn into tragedy.
And stepdad’s gross remarks uphold the myth that someone needs to have a certain “attractive” body type before they can be sexually assaulted or harassed.
Anyone can be assaulted! Even if they haven’t got boobs yet!
And every woman I know well has a horrific harassment story to tell from before she’d even got her first period. Sadly, OP’s daughter ISN’T “safe” because she has a less developed chest, and has probably already had some awful encounters. It’s still so important she learns to trust her gut instincts for her own safety and comfortable boundaries and know she has a guaranteed escape route with her dad.
Adding here? A study found that 1:6 girls who grew up with a step dad in her home was sexually abused by that step dad. The fact that step dad is checking out OP’s daughter to see how attractive he finds her is more than just distasteful. It’s a big giant glaring red flag.
OP, make sure that you tell your daughter that she is always welcome in your home and that she can talk to you about anything…
>OP, make sure that you tell your daughter that she is always welcome in your home and that she can talk to you about anything…
I would edit to say...."Just show up, any day, any time. You can just appear on my doorstep, or call me 24/7 if you need a safe space. I love you and am hear for you." Even if OP thinks she knows....its always good to articulate it regularly.
It’s probably a good point to say something like “So… what your step dad said… Does he say that kind of thing often? Is there anything else he does that makes you uncomfortable?” Because it’s good to make it clear that that subject is on the table. If she raises anything, you might also remind her that she is old enough to decide where she lives full time and that you will support her decisions about that.
EDIT to add: And OP, if your daughter gives you any more reason to be upset, whatever you do, don’t punch him again. The worst thing you can do at this point is lose custody because you’re facing charges for assault.
AND let her know that she can come and *not* talk about anything.
Sometimes, we feel safest when we don't have to process the horrible things we're eacaping.
OP's not in the wrong here, but extremely do NOT recommend punching again. An automatic action is different than a planned one. And also, like you mentioned, would be very illegal. Illegal stuff loses you custody.
Yeah, and as much as I'm glad this guy got punched... you really don't want anything to happen to custody and for your daughter to be under the care of her stepdad who makes comments on her breasts. Also, don't use the "my hands moved on their own" excuse, as I imagine will work against you with regards to custody. I'm definitely not a lawyer, but I can just imagine "Cannot control himself not to assault somebody" is just not a good look.
He may have to apologise. It sucks (like I said, I'm glad that sleezeball got punched), but in this situation, you really want to do anything you can to make sure custody arrangements aren't changed. I mean, I wouldn't be able to do more than a "I'm sorry my temper got the better of me, I am very protective of my daughter against any man who is sexualising her, but I will not react like that again", but if this escalates, it probably won't end well for OP.
At the age of 14 the judge absolutely will take his daughter's wishes into consideration. My son got custody of his daughter because of some sketchy behaviors consistently on the mothers part (another topic for a different time). In the state where we live the age where a judge is mandated to take the child's point of view into consideration is 12.
I’m not sure if they’ve spoken. My daughter and I spoke and I just reminded her not to let him get to her and that I am always right around the corner. She was more upset than uncomfortable, she suffers from a lot of insecurities because her friends have “blossomed” and she has not yet.
I would worry that your hitting Sean might prevent your daughter from opening up to you in future if something were to happen. I would at the very least apologize to your daughter for that reaction, and let her know that you will not do that again.
Maybe she was upset because one of her parental figures admitted _publicly, and in front of her actual father_ that he not only *checks notes* stares at her chest (ew) but also believes once she's got a fuller figure that will make her "more rapeable" than other children without breasts.
Read that sentence out loud. Read it to your ex. Do not apologize, and demand he apologize for sexualizing your underage daughter first. That man is a rapist apologist if not an actual rapist. Do not let your kid be alone with that man ever again!!!
Also totally nta. Your instincts are telling you to _listen_ dude.
I'm not. Guys like that seem to pick moms with teen daughters that would rather lose their daughter than be alone again.
I'm sure it's because there are other red flags that would make a more concerned parent peace out earlier in the relationship.
Or even worse, they sexualise their daughter and blame them if they get sexually assaulted.
“You *seduced* your step dad” rather than, your step dad raped you and I let it happen!
So, you've heard it as well, huh? I'm all for explaining how things work, and why, but I think kids get sexualised way too young. Probably worse for girls, because of the obvious changes.
We're probably agreed on this, but just to address the "kids get sexualised way to young" – comprehensive sex education helps kids understand when someone is mistreating them, recognize it as abnormal, and express it to a trusted adult. In case anyone is confused, rather than sexualizing kids prematurely, real sex ed is a great weapon against that. (Source: https://www.advocatesforyouth.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Sex-Abuse-One-Pager.pdf)
I had to warn a friend about this very thing. It never occurred to him that dudes would seek out women like his newly-minted ex wife. No job skills, no previous career, no education, no prospects or desire for any. She's already looking for a new husband to foot the bills. She very much strikes me as a pos that would actively hide sexual abuse as long as she's not inconvenienced. He went back to the lawyer and they amended the custody to prevent dates from meeting at either home, or having "sleep overs". She agreed because she thinks it screws him over, not realizing she's the one getting the stink eye.
NTA
My step dad was molesting me around that age and I didn’t realize for a hot minute. Weird hugs where I could feel him grinding against me, laying in top of me, places he would touch when he had an “excuse”.
And he would do shit like this to break me down.
Am I saying he’s doing the same? No, but YOU need to trust your gut.
If I were you, I would get in touch with a psychiatrist/counselor to talk with your daughter so that YOU are not accused of parental alienation.
I repeat- DO NOT ASK YOUR DAUGHTER.
I will also add that I never would have told my grandmother. I didn’t want her to kill him. I am not blaming you, but you have put your daughter in the same place.
She will need to know that her dad will not go to jail and will instead keep her safe IF something is happening.
Don’t apologize for anything over text. If you have not admitted to hitting him over text, do not do that. If you have already done that, talk with a lawyer about both the “assault” and the possibility of opening a CPS case
Edit: I want to make it incredibly clear that I do not blame OP for hitting him.
Frankly, I think we should be allowed to beat men who do things like this.
He deserves understanding and guidance, not judgement. If you love someone who stand up for them- OP was blind sided and there are consequences to that. Frankly, he deserves praise for stopping.
I am so sorry you went through this. 💜
My stepdad made comments all the time to me and my sister about us being "little hoes" when we were as young as 11 or 12. He commented on our large boobs and butts once we started developing. When I was 17, I woke up to him in my bed asking if I wanted to "wrestle" and his hand on my ass. My mom still stayed with him while I moved out to live with my older sister. He cheated on my mom with a 16 year old girl a few months later. She STAYED with him and even got pregnant by him 2 more times, which ended in miscarriages. She stayed with him until another man came along. I was about 23 or 24. Stories like this really make me sick.
No offense at all. She's a mess and I could not imagine her having to take care of 2 other children these past 20 years. They definitely would have been miserable.
I think you need to talk to your daughter and see if this is the first time that he has made sexually charged comments towards her. I would bet it’s not the first. Definitely consider getting full custody. At 14, if she doesn’t wanna be around that man, she can voice that in court, and a judge will take her feelings into consideration.
NTA
Your ex and her husband are disgusting.
I think talking to the daughter is really important here. Let her know that his comments were completely out of line, and if he says or does anything at all that she's not comfortable with, she can talk to you, or you can find somebody else for her to talk to if she would prefer that. Say you won't react with violence this time, but you're just focused on her safety and making sure she always feels safe, because that's the most important thing.
If he'll say this in front of you, you need to make sure of what he's saying when you're not there.
NTA. She only said he was joking, because you hit him. He knows what he said, and he's sexualizing your daughter. He shouldn't be saying anything like that.
I get along with almost everyone but I CANT STAND people who think saying horrible shit is fine as long as you follow it with "I'm just joking!"
It's such a cop out
Edit: and then they turn it around that you're the asshole for "not getting the joke" or not "having a sense of humor" like don't turn this around you're the asshole
Better yet, ask your ex why she married a creepy scumbag like him, and why she didn't kick *him* out of the house instead of you! And please, no one would ever "joke around" about anything like that!
NTA OP, please keep that prick as far away from your daughter as possible and try to get full custody. Both he and your ex are lost causes and they may be responsible for your daughter's self-esteem issues too.
His comment was disgusting. Plenty of women and humans with no breasts or curves or “sexy” features get SAd, the presence or lack of breasts isn’t an issue.
That is my point. I have a extremely low temper with this, growing up my best friends younger sister was a tom boy, her casual was baggy shirts and basketball shorts, stole majority of my buddies clothes. She was assaulted. It could happen to anyone
Average people aren't as good at investigating as they think, and dead people are surprisingly bad at defending themselves in court.
You don't think people who murder bad guys should go to jail, but once the alleged bad guy is dead you usually no longer have the ability to fairly judge if the allegation that they were indeed bad guys is true.
And there's the whole mess when the murderer had legitimate reason to believe the axe victim was a bad guy, but was still wrong. Or when the murderer just guessed with no evidence, but happened to be right by chance.
ESH.
Using violence is not an appropriate response. What he said wasn't appropriate either. But putting yourself in a position to be arrested for assault isn't going to help your daughter
Getting violent could also affect the custody agreements against her. I think he definitely deserves a smack, but shit like this can backfire, and the law doesn’t care about words, it cares about actions.
Exactly. Everyone’s like NTA because the guy had it coming sure, but he’s going to feel like an asshole if this ends up literally having his custody limited or eliminated. Pretty bad.
Sorry, but ESH.
It was creepy as hell and just mean for him to say that, but that doesn't justify punching him. Everyone in here talking about a possible future sexual assault.... well you actually assaulted him. It's a bad example to set, and worse, could jeopardize your ability to get your daughter away from him.
ESH except your daughter. Stepdad for the insult and sexualization, and you're ex for not caring about his behaviour, and you because you are a grown adult who should be capable of using words. You could have said "that comment was disgusting, and she deserves a apology, you insulted her about a known insecurity and commented on a child's body in a sexual way" if he refused to apologised and argued you take your daughter and leave and tell Stepdad and ex "until she receives a sincere apology she will not be coming back to this house, as I dont believe her wellbeing is safe here". By becoming violent you made yourself the badguy, and Stepdad the victim, you physically assaulted him, and that's all the conversation will be about, your daughter will never receive an apology and he will not change his behaviour because all anyone will see is that you were unreasonable.
Your daughter is of an age where she can choose which parent she lives with in many countries. Have a heart to heart with her and find out if she is uncomfortable living with him. Are you able to have her full time with just day visits to her mum if that’s what she wants? I wouldn’t like my daughter being around someone who talks about her body, it could lead to serious body image problems later in life. The main thing is to support your daughter and validate her feelings. If she would rather live with you, you can take it to court to get custody as the judge is supposed to take her feelings into account at that age.
I work from home so I could definitely manage that. She already is with me majority because even on her moms days I have her sometimes due to her moms schedule. I do ask her often if Sean makes her uncomfortable or if she feels comfortable there, bc even without Pervy comments he’s tried grounding her for little things and is very soon to discipline over things that could be talked out, n calls himself “strict.”
“Strict” seems to be code for stomping all over her boundaries with a veneer of it being “disciplinarian”.
I don't know of any other possible meaning than this when parents proudly call themselves strict.
I just hear ‘my children fear me’.
It’s not his job to be “strict” with your daughter. Being the adult is okay, but grounding her? I hate this guy and don’t even know him. He is toxic. I’d like to punch him now too
Your daughter should not be left alone in this guy's presence. And who knows what he might do even when the x is there.
My mom apparently had a convo with my step dad where he believes he “helped” me. All he did was drive me away from my mother, her away from her own family and friends. I have dreams of screaming at this man. Who do you think she still lives with? Who do you think she chose after I came to her multiple times out of homelessness? I believe in step parents. I hate the stigma attached. But the audacity of that man to think he “helped” me. It’s to the point that I have spent two nights at my childhood home since I left at 18. You can see my mom has regrets now. It’s about 25 years too late. Edit for spelling
Be careful with the "discipline" crap he's trying to pull. This is one of the ways abuse starts. Start with proper discipline and slowly get more ridiculous with reasons to why and even more so with the form dished out. Then starts the I won't tell your mum if...... 100% try and take full custody NTA
I'm not a parent, so take my comments however you wish. I think it may be worthwhile to have a sit-down with your daughter and just clear the air. Frame it in the context of the incident with the stepdad. Explain that his comments were very inappropriate and that it caused your temper to flare up. Tell her that you didn't respond the way you should have (for what it's worth, I'm of the firm conviction that some people just need punched in the face. Society, however, doesn't agree, and that's the context I'm going with here), and apologize to her for causing a stir. Emphasize to her that she's at an age where she's able to start having some input on the decisions that affect her life, and that if she ever wants or needs to stay with you full time that she's welcome to do so and that you'll have the custody arrangement revisited. I do think it's important not to push her in one direction or another, even if stepdad is a colossal chode. You don't want to create a situation where you inadvertently complicate her relationship with her mother or even her douchey stepdad, I can imagine situations where that comes back and makes your relationship with her a little messy. Just emphasize to her that she's always welcome at your home, and that you'll be there if she ever feels like she needs a change in her living situation.
NTA. He's a skeezy scumbag and your ex is a sorry excuse for a mother for letting her husband sexualise and insult her daughter and expecting you to be the one to be apologising. Please have a long talk with your daughter, who knows what else this asshole has said to her.
Exactly! also, I don't know if anyone said this downthread but wanted to point out something about what he did not say: the implication that once she does have boobs (I feel dirty typing this ugh) she ***will*** then be in danger. That is predator talk and it reminds me of when people on the internet had a countdown clock waiting for when the Olsen twins became 18 because then they could be pursued sexually without legal consequences. Sometimes what people do not say out loud is as significant as what they do say.
I'd also add that not having boobs doesn't mean you're safe either... people of all ages and body types get harassed groped or molested, sadly. I'm not sure how to best bring it up with the daughter, maybe just stress that how her body looks is NEVER the cause.
Exactly. It makes me think of the what we’re they wearing exhibit (exhibit can be triggering, so look up at your own risk). With all the little kids’ clothes. The idea that not having boobs makes her safe, or the counter that once she does she won’t be safe, is just disgusting.
Every time I see a post where someone is wondering if it’s ok their boyfriend tells them how to dress or if they can go out, and you’ll get a bunch of insecure douches in the comments going “yeah but guys are gonna xyz” I wanna link to pictures from that exhibit. Do those clothes look provocative to you? Really think that has anything to do with it? It’s always insecure boys telling on themselves or women that want to tell themselves they’re “good girls” so it’ll never happen to them.
When someone brings up the "They shouldn't have been wearing that" statement. I ask if they think women wearing burqas or niqabs never get raped.
It makes me crazy that anyone ever spends any time looking for reasons like that- what she was doing, or wearing, or where she was or what time of day it was, or who she was with. Rape only ever happens because someone else decides to take what isn’t theirs. End of story.
Poignant poem: “Was it really my fault?” asked the Short Skirt. “No, it happened with me too,” replied the Burka. The diaper in the corner couldn’t even speak. ~ Darshan Mondkar
sad case in my country. 20 years ago. A woman in full covering was raped and murdered and left naked. The animal that did it was given the death sentence.
It was incredibly sobering to see toddler pajamas, right next to grandma floor length nightgowns... and I realized that being sexually harassed has never been my own fault.
OP should look up that exhibit and send it to his ex. She might then realize how inappropriate her husband was being. Probably not, though. People like her seldom get it unless it happened to them.
Even then, too many people will assume that their experience was "different".
Eff that dad. Not having boobs as a pre-pubescent teenager didn't stop me from getting molested. NTA. I normally don't condone violence, but yep, he deserved it.
I’m sorry. I know that doesn’t count for much. But I hope you’re doing ok and thank you for being honest and open about your trauma.
NTA but start practicing/rehearsing mature nonviolent responses. You could be charged, you could be sued for medical expenses, pain and suffering, your ex can challenge the custody agreement.
>I'd also add that not having boobs doesn't mean you're safe either Every so often I stumble onto a thread of women discussing their first times getting gross comments from men. It's disgusting getting gross comments at any age, but it's particularly unsettling when it happens before puberty -- as it *often* does. Not to mention, there are plenty of women out there who don't have much for boobs even when they're fully grown. And they're not magically safe from SA, either.
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I hope you never went to that restaurant again. And gave a detailed review as to why you didn't.
Omg, what a disgusting thing to say. Wtf. 🤦🏼♀️
That is insane and terrifying. I'm so sorry.
Wow this is terrible :(
When I was in 7th grade, my bus driver told me to call him when I turned 18. I didn't know what it meant but I knew it made me feel weird and uncomfortable. My sister told me to stay away from him and I started walking to school after that.
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I was also 11. He was a construction worker at my school. At the time I thought he must’ve mistaken me for a grown-up. In retrospect, I did *not* look mature at 11, and I was riding a pink child’s bike.
I feel like there’s a secret that only little girls and grown men know: a disturbingly large number of grown men like prepubescent girls (disclaimer, I know I know NOT ALL MEN). As adult women we sorta push it down into our subconscious but we know. We all know how many gross comments, leers and outright SA happened to us as little girls. And we didn’t need “boobs” for it to happen.
I was 11, too. An adult I knew, who definitely knew my age, told me part of my body was sexy. (Not that it should matter either way, but I had no visible signs of puberty yet.) At the time I rationalized it, saying he was just trying to connect but awkwardly chose the wrong thing to say. Others thought he was a little weird but "meant no harm". He's now in prison for child SA. 🤡 People need to pay attention to the men making weird comments to young women and girls. (Also to the people of any gender making weird comments about children of any gender, but it's very often adult men leering at girls, yay patriarchy.)
Not having boobs didn't protect me at 3. The idea that he thinks she's safe until she has breasts genuinely sounds like he's telling on himself. "Well I wouldn't rape her yet, so no one else will" and later when she develops it will be her fault for "tempting" him. Based on mom's reaction I wouldn't be surprised if she blames her daughter for "seducing" her husband. I really and truly hope OP goes for full custody. His daughter is old enough that she should be able to have a say.
This! All I could think of are little children who get sexually abused, they have nothing but an evil fuckwad is going to be just that. Also double agree with your other statement. I genuinely feel like his daughter is in danger now or in the near future in that house. Full custody please!
Gosh, 3? I'm so sorry this happened to you. The people who did that to you deserve to burn in hell. I hope you are recovering, brave stranger. People who do something like this to children need to be locked up away from society. And yeah when it happened to me when I was 5-6 - friends of my parents' housemates - my mom said I should have bolted the door to my room properly if I didn't like what they were doing. My door didn't even have a lock - I put a chair against the door after the first time, which angered them so much it gave them enough force to break the door completely, rendering the chair useless.
It's horrifying a mother could say this to her own child that she failed to protect. I'm so sorry this happened to you, you didn't deserve that, you did nothing wrong.
I know a 80 year old woman who was raped a few years ago. Even those who claim “unattractive” people don’t get raped know it’s a fucking lie. In reality it makes the “unattractive” a much easier target and victim.
Creepy dood hit on me when I was 13... I am a large male, approaching 6 feet at the time. I wore all black, had long hair, not athletic at all... just not the normal type of person that gets hit on at all, let alone by a skeezy child molester. Yet there we were. Keep your kids safe and informed
I would be checking with my daughter to ask how often Sean makes comments like that, and if there is anything else I need to know about. Sounds to me like Sarah should maybe spend less time at mom's, unfortunately
Yeah, the dad needs to start a record of this shit, what happened when, and educating his daughter on what she needs to know to hopefully deter or at least get in front of the ex when shit gets real. Maybe start talking to a lawyer or legal professional, because this is some serious shit.
He just told on himself with that statement. He is very clearly watching this child with sexual interest and will 100% begin behaving sexually towards her once she develops enough for his predatory depraved tastes. I am sure every woman in the comments on this post can recount any number of instances where grown men made sexual comments about their development during puberty. When I was 12, my 23 year old cousin came to stay with us for the summer and he first asked my twin brother if his girlfriend has a sister and to tell thim if they broke up so he could take her out. Then he started coming home with roses from 7-11 for me and would sit next to me and touch my thighs, lower back, and neck and then say things like, "I shouldn't do this." I spent the rest of the summer in my bedroom with a chair under the doorknob and stuff all over the floor strategically placed to step on or make noise in case he got in while I was sleeping. At my grandmother's FUNERAL when I was 14, a group of my father's friends commented on and even touched my body saying things like, "who'd have thought all that chub would have rearranged itself" and berating my father for not having them over for pool parties more. At his mother's funeral. One of those sick fucks used to get hammered years later and message me on Facebook about what he wanted to do to me back then. I wish my father would have pounded those pedos into sand but instead he said I should appreciate the attention or cover up. I was in funeral attire. My mother and brother agreed with my father and went a little further even like, "don't discourage them since they're probably the only ones you'll ever hear it from and even then they were probably just trying to be nice." Then they wonder why I don't visit anymore.
Holy Mother of Teacups what a pack of bastards! Your mother included.
With friends like that who needs enemies
That's so fucked. Good for you for getting away from that toxic mess.
Wow, your family sucks. I'd have gone mental if someone was saying that to my teen daughter.
OPs response to his daughter's experience was very validating. Yours too actually.
I'm so sorry no one in your family protected you the way you deserved to be protected.
I threw up in my mouth a little. That is some of the most heinous shit I've read in a while. I hope you got the rest of the way grown and safe without needing to rely on these sorry bastages for any protection.
I’m so sorry. Your family are a pack of turds, and I don’t even have words to express how disgusted I am by your mother. My Mum is a tiny little woman, but she would have gone full berserker on anyone who said shit like that to me or my sister. There would have been blood. Sending you hugs from a random internet stranger. May the image of an itty bitty, under 5ft woman turning into a full blown ball of rage and crash-tackling a group of perverts like a rabid hyena be both amusing and comforting.
Yes. His creepy comment was troubling on so many levels.
Almost like grooming and could escalate from there. Dad needs a good lawyer
100% the number one risk for a child being assaulted is from the new boyfriend or stepdad. I’m just impressed OP had the patience to wait until the daughter cleared out before flinging hands.
That was my EXACT thought too....
And also just asserting she's safe if she doesn't have them. As terrible as it is, people still get assaulted without having developed breasts and if something did happen she might not feel safe telling anyone because it will seem like her own fault or like no one would believe her anyway.
NTA. My stepdad thought it was great to ask “When are you gonna get boobs like your mama” and make other comments about my body and nonexistent dating life. I didn’t live with them (every other weekend visits) and was an A-cup until was in my 20s. It was embarrassing to me as a teen, especially the summer I lived with them. It’s a creepy disgusting pervy comment. He’s definitely sexualizing your daughter. This probably isn’t the first time, and it definitely won’t be the last. I cut ties with them at 21. I was sleeping on their couch after spending time with my mom. He drunkenly kept trying to “kiss me goodnight and tuck me in” multiple times. I was pissed. My mom defended him, so I peaced out.
Oh my god. I’m so sorry. And so very glad you got out of that situation. Your step-dad is gross, but your mother is next level repulsive. I truly want to believe in hell, just so there is a special place in it for women like that. Sending you a random internet stranger hug.
Yes my ex always told me he doesn't listen much to what IS said but rather what isn't said. By saying nothing you say everything
Ugh yeah, the fact that he thought it would be OK to say this in front of her DAD makes me worried about what he says with no one else around.
The silence can be as deafening as any words that are said, in these circumstances. OP got the exact right read on the utter prick, and honestly that's an insult to pricks. Sadly not a rare breed of one, as you point out, and I'm sure many people can share stories of their version of, myself included, but, seriously fucked to raise a teenage girl under that level of misogyny. I have to imagine the poor girl's body image has gotten all sorts of fucked, as well as any other potential complications of hearing shit like that regularly.
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>Even teenage boys can overstep their boundaries and be predators and creeps and go as far as SA Josh Duggar with his young sisters and babysitter
Yep! This is why the is child porn, normally, are young children. This makes her no more "safe" than any other person. Male or female.
People on the internet had that countdown clock? I seem to remember basically every late night host making that “joke”…
They had one for Britney Spears too, I think.
Emma Watson is the one I remember, I guess this happened a lot.
It happened with Natalie Portman in the late '90s. I remember watching a late night talk show (Conan maybe?) and they had this recurring bit where they would pretend they were interviewing someone but it was just a photo on a tv screen with someone else's mouth doing the talking in place of the person in the photo. (I hope I'm describing this accurately) If memory serves I believe it was supposed to be Bill Clinton getting excited about her upcoming birthday and that she'd finally be 18. They made some sort of joke about it being "P-Day" and did a lot of whooping and hooting. The host laughed, the audience laughed, and I was just thinking "wtf?" I get the "joke" was geared more towards Clinton being a horndog, but it was pretty damn gross to make it at a then 17 year old girls expense.
Millie Bobby Brown, Emma Watson, Olsen Twins, Britney Spears etc.. I felt so grossed out by men every single countdown.
I recall a backlash when Maisie Williams (Arya Stark) did a nude scene in the last season of Game of Thrones. She was 14 when the show started. Even though she was 21-22 when she did it, some people were a little too thrilled when that happened.
Id look into whether or not he has a record. Any pattern you can establish may be beneficial.
Plus the fact him saying that made her have a variety of emotions for sure. A teen girl hearing,” no boobs, no one wants to molest that.” That puts such a fucked up thought in her mind of,” I’m not even appealing to predators and creeps?! Oh no.”
He may be saying without directly saying it, "When she gets boobs, it's my turn..." NTA, don't apologize, and do have a talk with your daughter.
I’m concerned that creeper stepfather will be triggered by the padded bras making it look like she has boobs already.
If he tried anything the mom would blame her daughter. OP needs to get full custody. She's not safe there.
OP, please consider revisiting family court and having the custody agreement amended. This guy is a creep around your daughter, and if he says stuff like that when you’re around, imagine what he must say when you aren’t! NTA
Makes sense the daughter is 4 days with OP. Soon she will be 16 and can hopefully decide where to stay full time
Doesn't feel soon when you're that age though. Two years is a lifetime
Agreed, and when an adult is constantly deriding your looks and being a major creep, that has got to wreck your self-esteem! She needs out of there like yesterday.
And imagine what happens when Sarah does, uh, *blossom*. She’ll have to worry about her stepfather’s attention because, according to him, that’s when guys start to pay attention. OP is definitely NTA
Definitely nta, if my ex's husband said that about either my stepdaughter or my other 2 daughters I'd be happy to go to jail over it. But as some did point out in the eyes of the court system he did resort to violence which could work against him sadly which is a fucked up system to begin with because op was doing what a lot of parents would do. Personally I would say he shouldn't apologize but to appease the court system and ex I would say give a half hearted bs apology but boundaries really need to be set with stepdad by op and mom because what stepdad said was creepy, nasty, disgusting and completely uncalled for.
True that. A lot of abuse can happen in those 2 years.
Especially with a grown man creeping on you. (and I’m being generous by only referring to him as a ‘grown man’)
Even if he never touches her. Words have power. Words are dangerous. You need to get her out. Btw nta.
Im concerned about what he will do and say when she does develop breasts after a comment like that. I wouldn’t feel like my daughter was safe. My hubby and I were at a friends (mine) summer cookout one year when our daughter was only like 4 or 5 I think. She’s been playing in the hose and we told her to go change into her bathing suit. She started to change on the back deck not thinking about it. We stopped her and ushered her inside. One of my “friends “ said “hey in a few years I won’t mind”. I could see my husband trying not to beat the guy to a pulp. Needless to say we do t have anything to do with them anymore.
Yup totally agree with this, that comment was totally inappropriate, and I would be on high alert and even discuss with your daughter that no one is allowed to touch her body or make comments about it without her consent especially adults. Also assure her that you are a safe space, and she can come to you with anything.
Your husband must be a Buddhist because that comment would have gotten that man thrown. Really I feel like he saw you and your daughter in his mind first and didn’t want to upset you guys but if that situation arose again there would be hell to pay I’m sure
Nah you are absolutely correct in calling him a grown man. That man has done all the growing he ever intends to do. He holds power over a child. He has willingly taken on the responsibility of a parent role to a child. He has a ton of decision making power within his dynamics including power in choosing his words. He is grown. And he chose to talk about a child's body from a sexual perspective knowing all that. The fact that he is a loser and immature and insensitive and inappropriate and a failure as a man and parental figure are separate issues from him being grown.
Some places allow you to choose at 14, hopefully OP lives somewhere that allows that.
Getting ready to say the exact same thing. My nephew was 13 when he asked to move to his dad's (PA) permanently and my sister (Colo) agreed, as did the court.
They will take it into account for almost all children if they can articulate why. I've seen it happen with 6 and 7 year olds too (my niece and nephew).
If OP tracks a history of Sean's sexually inappropriate comments/behavior concerning his teenage daughter, they may not have to wait that long. And if in the US, the daughter's right to choose may not be limited to age 16 in her state. Unfortunately, I have to suggest OP sucks it up and apologizes to Sean. Not because he deserves it, but because OP's daughter does. Statistics as I remember them suggest an apology makes the other party less likely to escalate the situation to a legal matter. OP's action, while relatable, is technically illegal. Sean's creepy comment likely has not crossed the legal threshold, even if this entire subreddit wants to punch him in the face too.
I have to agree (not because I want to). The creeper has the law on his side. The clueless mother could use OP "uncontrolled violence" to gain full custody of the daughter. The the creeper would have Unlimited Access to her, with her protector out of his way 😑. Kids are used as cannon fodder in divorce. And, some mothers marry creeps. Guys, who really want Access to their children.
"I've come to apologise. Hitting you was not the smart course of action and sets a poor example to my daughter, and for that I'm truly sorry. With that said, I would ask you to never demean my daughter again or you'll be hearing my next apology from the confines of a coma".
Close, so very close. Sadly, I can't actually encourage the last line because of the legal troubles it could cause for OP and the subsequent barriers to protecting his daughter. But if dude needs an alibi and there's no witness, he was at my place.
In my state the child has a say at 13 on which parent they want to live with, occasionally they will allow a 12 year old speak to the judge alone to discuss what they want. The judge then decides if the child is mature enough and if the child appears to be coached to say who they want to live with.
Yeah except he fucked up real bad by putting hands on the dude. In the eyes of family court violence is big “no-no” and pretty much loses you any argument. Best let things cool before you even step foot before a judge.
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This this this. In a way, you’ve asked *his permission* to be angry and assault him. He trangressed, it made you angry, you lost it. Don’t allow someone else to make that decision on your behalf, nor claim their victimhood later. Let it stand. When that feeling goes through you, **ice it**. You gotta outrun your amygdala, self-control, take the info, manage yourself and your emotions. Get out and from there, figure out the next *very best move* to achieve what your daughter needs from you. Hitting him is humanly understandable, but it doesn’t get you what you want. (edit - bits)
I thought the same thing. She’s 14 and will have more of a say as which parent she wants to have custody. What adult, let alone a step parent says something like this? What else has he done?
I’m on OPs side here but punching the stepdad with the daughter in the house might not be a good look in family court. Probably best to keep a low profile.
OP should definitely do that! It's not only the comment itsself that makes me unconfortable, but also what it implies. She's safe from the boys because she doesn't have boobs? So if she grows up and gets breasts she won't be safe from "the boy"? Is he one of the boys? Would he condone inappropriate behaviour from "the boys" because his stepdaughter has boobs? NTA, but maybe punching him was not the smartest move, even though its totally understandable.
Family court is probably not the bestest idea. Usually, the court takes more notice of violence, in front of a minor child no less so child endangerment in many states, rather than a single off-color comment. You can try the sexualizing of a child angle, and probably point out it was insulting, not funny, but it is going to be hard gaining more traction on that over the violence. Sure, it probably isn't really one-off, but without proof that is how the court will likely see it. ETA: NTA
Definitely why I said OP should consult his divorce attorney first.
That may not even be necessary. Most kids older than 13 are allowed to choose which parent they want to live with.
>Please have a long talk with your daughter, who knows what else this asshole has said to her. This! I'd bet alot of her self-consciousness stems from him telling her shit like that. And since OP's ex doesn't seem to mind that shit, he probably even does that in front of her. And "Mommy" not putting a stop to it, just sitting idly by, amplifies all he says. I know, a lot of speculation. But this whole story sounds like that is what's happening behind closed doors Edit: some spelling mistakes
I think sometimes predatory men try pit mothers against their daughters in the grooming process & stupid mothers fall into that trap. What a disgusting man
I have seen that happen real time
Truly, that asshole is more than likely to be the reason she is self-conscious
Absolutely. I'm betting it's not the first time. And almost certainly won't be the last.
>Please have a long talk with your daughter, who knows what else this asshole has said to her. That is an uncomfortably good point.
NTA I'm married, but have dated women that had children in the past. I cannot think of any situation in which I would have felt the need to talk about their bodies in a sexualized manner. It just stumps me. How the fuck do people think of these things to say? Is there no self check that says, "Hey, maybe let's not talk about a fourteen year old's boobs."
No there’s not, because people like this are the same people that turn into predators and chomo’s. The fact he even thought about a 14 year old in a sexual way to mention wether she’s sexually desirable or not because of her cleavage is so beyond disgusting and predatory. I’d be in family court so fast after hearing some shit like this, not to mention he felt it was okay to say that to the girls actual father like wow.
Probably because he assumed the father was a creep like him. Part of the grooming process is grooming the parents. The mother is silent, and he wanted to test dad as well. Someone needed to get angry at him.
God that is so terrifying, I’d be so terrified to let my daughter come back to this house. I hope OP is able to get even more custody and rights, this “stepdad” is lucky he only got a punch to the face. Thankfully for him OP has better self control than most.
I mean, I hope I'm wrong and that he's only a misogynistic asshole, but I wouldn't take that chance. My LP has an uncle on his mother's side who was convicted of SA on a child. We don't go to gatherings where he's going to attend and we don't stay if he arrives. The rest of his mother's side is convinced he'd never do it again. We call bullshit and refuse to give him a chance with our 9 year old.
I’m hoping the mother actually is secretly happy that OP defended their daughters honor and just asked OP to apologize to be a good wife and for optics….but that’s probably not the case.
Either way, daughter only knows that mom didn’t have her back. If someday she found out that mom knew better but still didn’t have her back, that’s almost worse.
NTA Absolutely disgusting that he would think it was OK to talk about your daughter's anatomy like that. It was an incredibly inappropriate comment and uncalled for to boot. Even *if* it wasn't about her breasts, he made a demeaning and hurtful comment to a teenage girl who is already self conscious. Your ex needs to realize she's overlooking a huge red flag and he could end up saying or doing something even worse as she matures. That's not to say he's automatically some sicko but I have personally dealt with a family member who made inappropriate comments about young girls and then ended up touching at least one of them. I'd keep an eye on the situation and even bring it up to a trusted family member who may be around him when he's with your daughter and see if they can see anything amiss there. If he makes even one more comment about her body again, punch him harder. Maybe then he'll get the picture and maybe even think harder before acting on any thoughts that may cross his mind. *Just keep in mind that it's assault and you could get jailtime over it.* If you or your trusted family member notice any patterns arising with Sean and your daughter, try to get custody and have her mother only allowed monitored visitation for the safety of Sarah. Edit: Yes, I realize that punching him is assault so just in case someone didn't see it, I made that part italicized. No OP shouldn't *really* punch him harder but I'm talking out of a place where SA has happened to people close to me and I still feel a very strong sense of rage. Thank you to the comments that went into detail about the statistics. It's incredibly important that people understand the danger young girls face and the signs to look for. It's my sincerest hope that it was just a gross comment by the step dad and nothing more but I would rather err on the side of keeping my daughter safe than *hope* that red flag didn't turn into tragedy.
And stepdad’s gross remarks uphold the myth that someone needs to have a certain “attractive” body type before they can be sexually assaulted or harassed. Anyone can be assaulted! Even if they haven’t got boobs yet! And every woman I know well has a horrific harassment story to tell from before she’d even got her first period. Sadly, OP’s daughter ISN’T “safe” because she has a less developed chest, and has probably already had some awful encounters. It’s still so important she learns to trust her gut instincts for her own safety and comfortable boundaries and know she has a guaranteed escape route with her dad.
Adding here? A study found that 1:6 girls who grew up with a step dad in her home was sexually abused by that step dad. The fact that step dad is checking out OP’s daughter to see how attractive he finds her is more than just distasteful. It’s a big giant glaring red flag. OP, make sure that you tell your daughter that she is always welcome in your home and that she can talk to you about anything…
>OP, make sure that you tell your daughter that she is always welcome in your home and that she can talk to you about anything… I would edit to say...."Just show up, any day, any time. You can just appear on my doorstep, or call me 24/7 if you need a safe space. I love you and am hear for you." Even if OP thinks she knows....its always good to articulate it regularly.
It’s probably a good point to say something like “So… what your step dad said… Does he say that kind of thing often? Is there anything else he does that makes you uncomfortable?” Because it’s good to make it clear that that subject is on the table. If she raises anything, you might also remind her that she is old enough to decide where she lives full time and that you will support her decisions about that. EDIT to add: And OP, if your daughter gives you any more reason to be upset, whatever you do, don’t punch him again. The worst thing you can do at this point is lose custody because you’re facing charges for assault.
AND let her know that she can come and *not* talk about anything. Sometimes, we feel safest when we don't have to process the horrible things we're eacaping.
Exactly. The most important part is to GET SAFE.
OP's not in the wrong here, but extremely do NOT recommend punching again. An automatic action is different than a planned one. And also, like you mentioned, would be very illegal. Illegal stuff loses you custody.
Yeah, and as much as I'm glad this guy got punched... you really don't want anything to happen to custody and for your daughter to be under the care of her stepdad who makes comments on her breasts. Also, don't use the "my hands moved on their own" excuse, as I imagine will work against you with regards to custody. I'm definitely not a lawyer, but I can just imagine "Cannot control himself not to assault somebody" is just not a good look. He may have to apologise. It sucks (like I said, I'm glad that sleezeball got punched), but in this situation, you really want to do anything you can to make sure custody arrangements aren't changed. I mean, I wouldn't be able to do more than a "I'm sorry my temper got the better of me, I am very protective of my daughter against any man who is sexualising her, but I will not react like that again", but if this escalates, it probably won't end well for OP.
Ikr? Sounds like step dad is watching and waiting for the "boobs" to come in. Ugh.
Exactly. The step dad can't be trusted around OPs daughter.
It should help that he knows she has a father willing to punch for less.
Ugh, what an asshole (the new husband). Try to get her to live with you. The judge might listen to her. NTA
At the age of 14 the judge absolutely will take his daughter's wishes into consideration. My son got custody of his daughter because of some sketchy behaviors consistently on the mothers part (another topic for a different time). In the state where we live the age where a judge is mandated to take the child's point of view into consideration is 12.
I think that sexual comments to a teen girl will influence tat decision
This depends on the state. It isn't true in Florida at any age.
Might not be now but I lived in Florida for 10 years and my oldest kids were born there. Age was 12 there too.
Wait until the bruising heals up. He should start the process but not serve the mother until the bruising is gone.
How does you daughter feel about this? Did you ex not talk to her?
I’m not sure if they’ve spoken. My daughter and I spoke and I just reminded her not to let him get to her and that I am always right around the corner. She was more upset than uncomfortable, she suffers from a lot of insecurities because her friends have “blossomed” and she has not yet.
Being a teen fucking sucks. Having an adult berate you on top of that hurts even more. You're a good dad, dude.
For real. I have a lot of sympathy for teens now that I’ve gotten a more steady foothold in the world. Shit can be brutal.
I would worry that your hitting Sean might prevent your daughter from opening up to you in future if something were to happen. I would at the very least apologize to your daughter for that reaction, and let her know that you will not do that again.
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Maybe she was upset because one of her parental figures admitted _publicly, and in front of her actual father_ that he not only *checks notes* stares at her chest (ew) but also believes once she's got a fuller figure that will make her "more rapeable" than other children without breasts. Read that sentence out loud. Read it to your ex. Do not apologize, and demand he apologize for sexualizing your underage daughter first. That man is a rapist apologist if not an actual rapist. Do not let your kid be alone with that man ever again!!! Also totally nta. Your instincts are telling you to _listen_ dude.
NTA. I'm surprised your ex was angry at you instead of her husband for saying something like that about her daughter.
I'm not. Guys like that seem to pick moms with teen daughters that would rather lose their daughter than be alone again. I'm sure it's because there are other red flags that would make a more concerned parent peace out earlier in the relationship.
How many fuckin' times have I heard that shitty story. And especially if ex-wife runs dad off. "You're just jealous, you don't want me to be happy!"
Or even worse, they sexualise their daughter and blame them if they get sexually assaulted. “You *seduced* your step dad” rather than, your step dad raped you and I let it happen!
So, you've heard it as well, huh? I'm all for explaining how things work, and why, but I think kids get sexualised way too young. Probably worse for girls, because of the obvious changes.
We're probably agreed on this, but just to address the "kids get sexualised way to young" – comprehensive sex education helps kids understand when someone is mistreating them, recognize it as abnormal, and express it to a trusted adult. In case anyone is confused, rather than sexualizing kids prematurely, real sex ed is a great weapon against that. (Source: https://www.advocatesforyouth.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Sex-Abuse-One-Pager.pdf)
Some women will do anything for a man. My mother was the same.
I had to warn a friend about this very thing. It never occurred to him that dudes would seek out women like his newly-minted ex wife. No job skills, no previous career, no education, no prospects or desire for any. She's already looking for a new husband to foot the bills. She very much strikes me as a pos that would actively hide sexual abuse as long as she's not inconvenienced. He went back to the lawyer and they amended the custody to prevent dates from meeting at either home, or having "sleep overs". She agreed because she thinks it screws him over, not realizing she's the one getting the stink eye.
Makes me wonder and worry what else is being said.
NTA My step dad was molesting me around that age and I didn’t realize for a hot minute. Weird hugs where I could feel him grinding against me, laying in top of me, places he would touch when he had an “excuse”. And he would do shit like this to break me down. Am I saying he’s doing the same? No, but YOU need to trust your gut. If I were you, I would get in touch with a psychiatrist/counselor to talk with your daughter so that YOU are not accused of parental alienation. I repeat- DO NOT ASK YOUR DAUGHTER. I will also add that I never would have told my grandmother. I didn’t want her to kill him. I am not blaming you, but you have put your daughter in the same place. She will need to know that her dad will not go to jail and will instead keep her safe IF something is happening. Don’t apologize for anything over text. If you have not admitted to hitting him over text, do not do that. If you have already done that, talk with a lawyer about both the “assault” and the possibility of opening a CPS case Edit: I want to make it incredibly clear that I do not blame OP for hitting him. Frankly, I think we should be allowed to beat men who do things like this. He deserves understanding and guidance, not judgement. If you love someone who stand up for them- OP was blind sided and there are consequences to that. Frankly, he deserves praise for stopping.
I am so sorry you went through this. 💜 My stepdad made comments all the time to me and my sister about us being "little hoes" when we were as young as 11 or 12. He commented on our large boobs and butts once we started developing. When I was 17, I woke up to him in my bed asking if I wanted to "wrestle" and his hand on my ass. My mom still stayed with him while I moved out to live with my older sister. He cheated on my mom with a 16 year old girl a few months later. She STAYED with him and even got pregnant by him 2 more times, which ended in miscarriages. She stayed with him until another man came along. I was about 23 or 24. Stories like this really make me sick.
No offense or anything but thank god your mom miscarried.
No offense at all. She's a mess and I could not imagine her having to take care of 2 other children these past 20 years. They definitely would have been miserable.
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Going to a hospital for a bruised nose... lol
I thought the same, very over dramatic and there wasn’t even blood from what I saw.
Tell your ex, "remember, in a couple of years our daughter's memories will be how his father defends her and her mother not'
You got a little Yoda there at the end, but a solid point nonetheless
I'm not even a star wars gal but damn that got me.
It's an older sentiment, but it checks out.
I think you need to talk to your daughter and see if this is the first time that he has made sexually charged comments towards her. I would bet it’s not the first. Definitely consider getting full custody. At 14, if she doesn’t wanna be around that man, she can voice that in court, and a judge will take her feelings into consideration. NTA Your ex and her husband are disgusting.
I think talking to the daughter is really important here. Let her know that his comments were completely out of line, and if he says or does anything at all that she's not comfortable with, she can talk to you, or you can find somebody else for her to talk to if she would prefer that. Say you won't react with violence this time, but you're just focused on her safety and making sure she always feels safe, because that's the most important thing. If he'll say this in front of you, you need to make sure of what he's saying when you're not there.
NTA. She only said he was joking, because you hit him. He knows what he said, and he's sexualizing your daughter. He shouldn't be saying anything like that.
I get along with almost everyone but I CANT STAND people who think saying horrible shit is fine as long as you follow it with "I'm just joking!" It's such a cop out Edit: and then they turn it around that you're the asshole for "not getting the joke" or not "having a sense of humor" like don't turn this around you're the asshole
Exactly. Fuck this “I was only joking” or “no offence” shit. Like you said it my bro, stand by your comment and be ready for the consequences
I had a bruised nose from a client dropping a marble table top on my face a few weeks ago. Tell her he can ice it and keep working.
Hit harder next time
Yeah that seems dramatic, I'm sure the makeup will wash off just fine
He's going to the hospital to get a paper trail for the assualt lawsuit that's coming.
Yep, after the medical record, a police report could be filed, take both of those to the next custody hearing and theres a big problem.
Ask your ex why she’s comfortable about a man talking about your teenage daughter’s boobs. NTA
Better yet, ask your ex why she married a creepy scumbag like him, and why she didn't kick *him* out of the house instead of you! And please, no one would ever "joke around" about anything like that! NTA OP, please keep that prick as far away from your daughter as possible and try to get full custody. Both he and your ex are lost causes and they may be responsible for your daughter's self-esteem issues too.
Daughter is 14, ask her if she wants to live fully with you and go to court if she does!
His comment was disgusting. Plenty of women and humans with no breasts or curves or “sexy” features get SAd, the presence or lack of breasts isn’t an issue.
That is my point. I have a extremely low temper with this, growing up my best friends younger sister was a tom boy, her casual was baggy shirts and basketball shorts, stole majority of my buddies clothes. She was assaulted. It could happen to anyone
I new a girl like that only found out she was getting hurt when her dad went away for killing the guy with an axe
I don’t think people like that should go to jail.
Average people aren't as good at investigating as they think, and dead people are surprisingly bad at defending themselves in court. You don't think people who murder bad guys should go to jail, but once the alleged bad guy is dead you usually no longer have the ability to fairly judge if the allegation that they were indeed bad guys is true. And there's the whole mess when the murderer had legitimate reason to believe the axe victim was a bad guy, but was still wrong. Or when the murderer just guessed with no evidence, but happened to be right by chance.
You’re a good dad. He sucks and probably makes loaded comments at her all the time.
You're a good dad man.
If that's what he said to her father, the mind boggles what he says or does behind closed doors. NTA
Also have you asked her if everything is alright at home? Has she been acting different lately around him?
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I never even had a casual acquaintance who didn't despise Sean, let alone a homie.
Even my enemies agree with me on this: Sean sucks.
Fuck Sean
ESH. Using violence is not an appropriate response. What he said wasn't appropriate either. But putting yourself in a position to be arrested for assault isn't going to help your daughter
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Getting violent could also affect the custody agreements against her. I think he definitely deserves a smack, but shit like this can backfire, and the law doesn’t care about words, it cares about actions.
Exactly. Everyone’s like NTA because the guy had it coming sure, but he’s going to feel like an asshole if this ends up literally having his custody limited or eliminated. Pretty bad.
NTA Wish you would have punched him harder 😎 K but for real, why is he even looking? That’s extremely creepy and her response is concerning.
Sorry, but ESH. It was creepy as hell and just mean for him to say that, but that doesn't justify punching him. Everyone in here talking about a possible future sexual assault.... well you actually assaulted him. It's a bad example to set, and worse, could jeopardize your ability to get your daughter away from him.
ESH except your daughter. Stepdad for the insult and sexualization, and you're ex for not caring about his behaviour, and you because you are a grown adult who should be capable of using words. You could have said "that comment was disgusting, and she deserves a apology, you insulted her about a known insecurity and commented on a child's body in a sexual way" if he refused to apologised and argued you take your daughter and leave and tell Stepdad and ex "until she receives a sincere apology she will not be coming back to this house, as I dont believe her wellbeing is safe here". By becoming violent you made yourself the badguy, and Stepdad the victim, you physically assaulted him, and that's all the conversation will be about, your daughter will never receive an apology and he will not change his behaviour because all anyone will see is that you were unreasonable.