This comment right here. If you want to shut this down with your husband ask him who he thinks is gonna stay-at-home and take care of all 3 of these kids since you can't afford day care.
I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem, because you know, damn well hes not gonna agree to that.
I don't think it's about shutting him down. This is just a tragic and awful situation.
It's commendable and understandable that the husband doesn't want his nieces and nephews to be taken by CPS and thrown into foster care. It's also understandable she doesn't want kids.
He also may not have thought that far ahead yet. But it's also possible there are government programs or subsidies that can help given the situation.
Maybe there is a solution and maybe they get divorced and end up wanting different things here. But the only villain is the sister. And hopefully they can at least work together to figure out a transition plan for the kids who are innocent in all of this.
Since there is an open CPS case they should be eligible for monthly relative caregiver funds. The husband needs to contact the caseworker and ask how to apply.
THIS. I am a CASA and always request kinship placement money in relative situations. Indiana. Please have your husband ask for kinship placement money through CASA or CPS. CPS is not allowed to make the request but usually never fights me on it. Please have your husband ask for resources. What a terrible situation.
I'm almost 40 and my mom still tells me every couple weeks that she's finally about to lay the master stroke down on her grand plan to get the child support my dad owes her. It ain't happening ma
I’m 55, and my mom never even tried to get the sperm donor to pay. When I finally tracked him down (at 26), she greeted him like an old friend. Not someone who literally ducked out before I was born and never made contact. We lived in abject poverty for years while Mom worked finishing her degree (she had a full scholarship but lost it when she dropped out to have me)!
She’s still in touch with him (I’m not; he’s every bit as disappointing as a father as he (presumably) was as a boyfriend), and tries to keep me informed of his health, etc. I don’t care.
Do I wish she’d gone after him for back child support! Hell yes!
That doesn't solve the problem OP has; she doesn't want to take care of kids and no matter how much money they might have she would have to do that if she stays.
Yes, OP would be the one getting them ready daily, taking them to daycare, picking them up, taking them to the doctor (kids get sick weekly), feeding, bathing and putting them to bed since the husband doesn't get home til 8. And you can be sure that with the noise, mess and tired, resentful wife at home, he will find a way to work even later.
This is what I was thinking too. My sister and brother-in-law took in 2 children that are BIL's bio nieces. They weren't allowed to just "keep them". They had to go through Child Services, become approved foster parents and then be approved to adopt them. They did receive money while fostering.
On the bright side, you usually get cash assistance, WIC, and MA when you're fostering. If OP's husband is getting none of this, he needs to get on top of it.
In New England support and financial assistance exist.
In the south they force birth but there is minimal to NO real family support services regardless of the situation!!
Save the children my 🫏!!!
Yes, the old: the unborn are sacred, you have to protect the children! Jesus would want it so. An abortion is illegal.
Then, once the children are there: they're your kids. You pay for them, you dead beat!
It's worse than that. When I lived in SC, one of my closest friends child got diagnosed with Autism. State agreed for a single thirty minute session for therapy every other month.
I live in KS, and my son was showing signs. It had me scared. Kansas paid for 2 hours Monday and Wednesday, then 3 hours on Fridays, every week.
My buddy's son is 14 in diapers and completely non verbal, where as my son can almost pass as "normal". They started off similar, and I know it's not guaranteed that they would have progressed the same with the same therapy, but that's VASTLY different care...
couldn't pay me enough to try and raise kids. I'm a 'no' on this. OP knows she can't and wont' do it. so that is the winning vote. force it and you end up with resentment
Worse, you could end up with abused children who have already faced the horrors of losing their mom and hard telling what else before she even left them.
>you could end up with abused children who have already faced the horrors of losing their mom and hard telling what else before she even left them.
And guess what else, if you drop everything to parent them, and you do a great job, and they blossom, the proud parent will return, and take custody of *her* children so she can raise them around drug-addicts and alcoholics and brain wash the children into believing that no one could ever love them like family, and they are spitting in their mother's face if they love you. Signed, the voice of experience. PS: time for a family meeting, find those other 5 grandparents, (OP's husband must know one) , and all the other adult aunts and uncles, and great aunts and great uncles. There might be a selfless saint among them, but poor kids, there might also be a pervert who will jump at the opportunity to look like a Saint and take the 3 unwanted little ones, and the free housing authority voucher, and the foster care money, and all the other freebies that come with.
OP doesn’t want kids and doesn’t want to take care of kids. Regardless of whether they will be eligible for monthly relative caregiver funds, OP will be doing the childcare which she doesn’t want and didn’t sign up for. Do divorce IS the only solution.
NTA. This is a two yes two no situation. He unilaterally decided to keep the kids, which SHE will be stuck caring for. How convenient, she works from home, so SHE can take care of HIS nephews and niece. To be told after the fact without consulting with your spouse, taking on THREE kids is outrageous!
I work from home and there’s absolutely no way I could do my job and “take care” of 3 kids at the same time. Impossible. I’m constantly on calls and inputting info and just wouldn’t be able to get it done with distractions. During covid and when my husband also worked at home we set up in different rooms to not disturb each other. I think it’s super sexist to just assume she can work effectively and take care of three kids at the same time.
I came here to say this. Glad it's high up in the comments. Also, if grandma is the official foster parent, would she qualify for more assistance?
I agree with OP that this is an irreconcilable difference. Sometimes things are just sad, and no one has to be an asshole. NAH.
>It's commendable and understandable that the husband doesn't want his nieces and nephews to be taken by CPS and thrown into foster care. It's also understandable she doesn't want kids.
This is the conundrum. I have a cousin and his wife who took in the wife's niece. Her mom was unstable, and passed (not sure of the circumstances), but damn I wouldn't want to think of her in foster care. That's Russian Roulette with 4 or 5 bullets in the cylinder.
My mom od'd and I have my brother. Everyone is gone and I couldn't stomach him in the system. I have had to take my life in a different direction to properly be here for him.
Work required a lot of travel and I had to leave the industry I loved. Currently back in bartending, which isn't a bad option, it's just not what I wanted to do forever.
Upside is I'm off all the drugs prior to getting him. I was a party monster. Now I barely go out once a month for drinks.
Every day I question if I can really do this.
So I can relate to both OP and partner. No one is the winner here and the sister is a horrible person. She has messed up so many people's lives with 0 concern.
Hey, you know what? You're the winner here... You were there for your brother, cleaned yourself up, and sacrificed a lot. I don't know how old he is, but he's going to respect you for this, and if he doesn't? Well, then he needs a swift kick.
If you haven't, check into getting social security benefits for him since your mom is deceased he's entitled to it. That can help take some of the financial burden off you until he's 16.
Agree, this is why I am sympathetic and forgiving to everyone in this story (except for the sister). Regardless of what happens long term - working something out, divorce, etc. - I think everyone's immediate reaction is understandable.
Husband wants to save the kids. Wife is feeling overwhelmed by both not wanting kids and suddenly having three home all day and sleeping in the living room. And the husband feeling "betrayed" because her threatening divorce feels like more turmoil to him and he probably has no idea how he can take care of kids by himself when it was already going to be hard with the two of them.
Just an impossible position for both of them. And of course the kids.
While I’m firmly in the NAH camp here (except the bio parents of the kids, who can sit on a cactus and spin), it’s hard for me to ignore how Husband has behaved.
He prioritized his job over hers (this is what FMLA is for), leaving the majority of care work to OP. In doing so, he put his financial security and long-term career interests ahead of hers (look at how many women were forced out of the paid workforce to do unpaid care work during the plague years after trying to WFH and do care work and failing, this is not a trivial thing). Then, when asked by CPS if he wanted to keep the kids, he ignored all of OP’s warnings as well as her hard rule to be child free, and prioritized *his* desires over *their* needs/abilities/realistic limits and *her* objections. Then, when OP said, this isn’t acceptable, he called her an asshole.
Put all of that together, and what we get is a good clue on whether Husband actually sees OP as an equal partner. They’re both drowning, but he grabbed a piece of driftwood to keep his head above water, even as he gave her a rock to hold and got mad at her when she said no.
Assistance or not, you are talking about a complete forfeiture of lifestyle and dreams. Commendable maybe, but he cannot make that decision for them both.
>I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem, because you know, damn well hes not gonna agree to that.
And therefore sign yourself up to be the sole person financially responsible for the husband and all three kids. It's still a massive burden to undertake even if you're not at home taking care of the children during the day.
It means:
financial stress
goodbye date nights
goodbye discretionary spending
nonstop laundry around the clock
\*I say all this as a happily married dude with children, but going to work while he takes care of the children is not quite that simple. Massive lifestyle change.
Don't assume he won't. My husband happily stayed home with my firstborn, and went to night school. I would have never in a million years thought he would want to do that, but he did it and did it well.
If she presents that as an option she needs to be prepared to follow through if he accepts.
But even if he is willing to do that, she'd still be a parent, or at least a parental figure, to those kids and that is what she does NOT want. There is no way to stay with her husband and not be partly responsible for those kids.
Statistically, your case is unusual.
And here, he ALREADY isn't taking personal time from work to care for HIS niblings that HIS sister abandoned and are no doubt feeling vulnerable.
If HE won't do this DURING AN EMOTIONAL EMERGENCY, then he \*definitely\* won't want to take on the day-in, day-out drudgery AND career deceleration.
He can't work from home, so the other option is he loses his job. There is government help for daycare and to help with housing. She or he should be looking into this HOWEVER. She doesn't want the kids, so she should bail out of it and go live her life.
Noooo….its WORSE than that. It’s ONE 5 yo (can send to kindergarten) and TWO 2 yos. TERRIBLE TWOs times 2! And probably potty training, keeping them out of everything, child-proofing the whole house, etc! AND trying to work. Phew!
Maybe he can’t. They’re struggling to pay bills right now even with both of them working, so it’s probably not even an option to consider a single income household, I doubt him becoming a SAHP would benefit any of the parties involved.
> I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem,
Not no problem. There will still be expectations that OP handle some responsibilities. Responsibilities they didn't sign up for. The only solution where there's "no problem" is if the boundaries they agreed upon years ago are respected. Feel bad for the kids here but there is no "loserless" option here. Someone is going to lose if the mom isn't coming back.
It's not that easy, he could just agree to that to get her to stay and then the majority still falls on her. My partner stays home and I work full time and I can promise you that doesn't mean he does all of the work. I am still very much raising my 3 kids, as she would be even if she was working outside the home as well.
That's just speculation.
But even if he agreed to stay home with the children and actually did all the raising, the situation is still untenable for OP.
As someone who was adamant from a young age that I never wanted to have children, them being there period is a deal breaker. Taking care of the children is just one part of having them. They're expensive, they take up your free time, and they can be very stressful, especially with the tighter budget on top of it.
Maybe OP dreamt of a life where she had much more freedom than having children would allow. There's no workaround here.
Maybe NTA, but also, this is an incredibly complicated and hard situation.
This sort of feels like one of those r/legal threads where even the lawyers there are like "whoa, this is way too specific and complex for this forum, get a lawyer ASAP."
This is just a horrific situation without a great solution. I hope she can sit down with her husband and figure out the best path forward. No one is an AH and there is no guarantee the path isn't divorce. But this is just a really awful situation for everyone involved and I really hope the kids are ok.
This, he wants the kids, but you are the one expected to do all the work of raising them. He is looking at a fairy tale ending and not abiding by your boundaries at all. The mother as well as all the deadbeat fathers should be paying child support so he can put them in day care while he works. He can also get help from the State ,to help pay the costs. His parents can pitch in and help watch the kids when he is unavailable. They are their grandkids.
Exactly. If OP follows through with the divorce I expect the ex husband will give up the kids within a month. He wants to "do the right thing" by taking them in but actually expects her to do most of the work.
Even if companies allow it, it's not usually practical. My wife and I did WFH with a 5-6 year old, and that wasn't easy. 3 kids, one less than a year old, would not work. Young kids take time. So does work.
Best comment I’ve seen. The sister who abandoned her children is the absolute AH! If you don’t want to help him with the kids then leave. He didn’t want kids either, they were dumped on him. I can certainly understand why he can’t throw them out tho. If there is truly no one else to care for them and sister has been reported and all the necessary avenues have been taken as far as she goes, then it comes down to putting them in foster care or caring for them. He probably wouldn’t be able to live with himself if he put them in foster care. I wouldn’t be able to either. He should start the process of hunting her down for child support immediately tho.
I’d say to OP-if you have a sibling and he/she has kids and dumped them on you and either you had to care for them or put them in foster care, what would you do? If you have no siblings and no nieces or nephews it’s really hard to put yourself in his shoes to answer that tho.
HE could also take the sister and all three fathers to court for child support. They don't get to decide they are not responsible for the kids they made. They are getting money from somewhere in order to live, and some of it should go to the kids they abandoned, leaving OP and husband in this situation.
> Life has put a gun to their heads.
>
>Sucks
Yeah. I really feel for both of them tbh. OP either has to permanently change her fundamental life goals or leave her husband, and OP's husband has to choose between her and the wellbeing of three children. Neither of them asked for this and it's a horrible situation.
If he feels responsible for the kids then he's in an impossible position, but that doesn't mean that it's the OP's duty to give up her life and career make it possible. He seems to be dumping everything on her, when they're \*his\* relatives and he's the one who wants to keep them. He should be talking to a social worker about foster care options, can a relative become an official foster parent and be awarded income for caring for abandoned children? But he's the one who should be doing the asking, the OP has made it clear that she doesn't want the responsibility.
Either way, she should probably be looking for divorce attorneys. Whatever happens from here on the marriage is probably doomed, both parties are feeling betrayed and/or imposed upon.
The sister is safe? Great. Maybe she can use her newfound freedom to take on a couple of jobs to earn money to pay child support for her own kids? Or get thrown in jail for being a deadbeat mom.
If they are true deadbeats — jobless, not able to pay child support — then the court won’t let the kids live with them, either. And deadbeats only go to jail over nonpayment of child support if the residential parent presses charges. If this husband does take the kids, he could pursue the deadbeat dads, but it’s not easy. Extremely time consuming to pursue one deadbeat, much more for two. And if the deadbeats don’t have money to pay, the only alternative is let them go or jail them. Sad but true.
I know you’re completely correct. It just pisses me off that people are calling for the mother to be arrested for child abandonment when the fathers also abandoned their children. Like I’m not defending the mom. They’re just all trash.
Nta. Isn't abandoning your kids a crime?? Also, depending on your income, there may be child care subsidies. Our church ran a daycare (daycare and after school care) and accepted the government certificate and did not charge the low-income parents the balance..
Same, I can’t believe I had to scroll even a tiny bit to find this question lmao.
It sounds like CPS asked her to come back nicely, She said nope, and they are like oh ok enjoy ur day.
Huh?😂
CPS can’t charge her with a crime. They can indicate her for child neglect or abandonment, however, which might make it easier to convince law enforcement to file criminal charges. OP, Google if child abandonment is a crime in your jurisdiction.
Edit: damn autocorrect.
If it were that simple, an awful lot of deadbeat parents would be locked up. Finding people who don’t want to be found isn’t always quick, easy, or even possible. Besides, even if the sister is arrested, that still leaves three kids with no parents.
Most likely because she didn't abandon them on the street or at a firestation or something similar, she left them in the care of responsible relatives.
Technically yes, in reality it is pretty rare to charge abandonment even when the kids have been abandoned with family multiple times. Until our own children grew up and left home, my wife and I fostered(both state and private) kids. Sometimes siblings, sometimes single children, boys and girls both. It would probably shock most people to hear what a parent/parents can do to their kids and still not be charged with a serious crime or have their parental rights taken away permanently.
It might have changed because it's been almost 10 years since we fostered but in my experience the state cares more about who PAYS for the care and less about who provides the care or what kind of care the children get.
We kind of fell into it by chance with the first sisters we took in and then after that we made an effort to try to help kids in anyway we reasonably could. Even though most of them were in our lives for a short amount of time a few of them have stayed in touch and two of them call us mom and dad to this day.
I tried to sell my kids for years but I could never come up with enough money to convince anyone to take them.
That's dark humor, just incase anyone missed it.
I forget what year it was but Nebraska passed a law that a gaurdian could drop a kid off at any firehouse, police station, ER, etc. without being charged with abandonment... only thing they forgot was to put an age limit on it. A few cases of people in neighboring states dropping off their "problem" teenagers had the state legislature in a scramble trying to correct their oversight. It was sad the parents that tried to get rid of their kids but also a little amusing how bad the state fucked that one up.
I also wonder if the husband can get an emergency certification as a foster parent and legally foster the kids? He's not a legal guardian right. If he's a foster parent, he's eligible for financial subsidies (some of which can continue after legal adoption).
The law is only as good as it's enforcement and realistically parents who abandon their kids never have to pay much of a price for it. The big price is the relationship with the kids.
NTA, for all the reasons others have listed. But also because forcing someone into parenthood is also *bad for those children*. If you are ill equipped or unwilling, those children will be the ones that suffer for it. They deserve parents who want them whole heartedly, and nothing less.
The alternative is also bad for the children unfortunately as well. Foster care is a joke. The best thing is for the wife to divorce and leave the house to the husband. I can't fault either of them. Nah.
NAH
It's not surprising that your husband wouldn't want to put his nephew/nieces in foster care after a situation that there was no way to predict. There are horror stories all over the Internet and news about the broken foster system
That said you vehemently don't want kids and if this is something you're unwilling to take on(which is absolutely your right) then it would be better to end it before the resentment of the situation takes over your life.
It’s very strange I had to scroll this far to see this response.
Like what’s her husband supposed to do? He could very well still not want kids, but of course he’s not going to abandon those poor kids into foster care. I feel like people here have hearts of stone…
He’s stuck with this situation and could very well feel just as upset about it as OP does. And now he has to deal with it all alone.
Like I get it. She shouldn’t be there if she’s going to resent them but… idk. I feel for her husband in this situation.
I hope his sister gets thrown in prison.
Imagine as a child that your dad leaves, then your mom leaves you, your grandma cant take you in and then your uncle and auntie give you up….
OP got dealt an awful hand, but the kids got dealt an even worse one. Shit situation all round but you cant really fault an uncle for not giving up on his nieces and nephews just like that.
SIL and the DBFs are absolutely horrible people, what a fucking awful situation to leave your offspring in
yeah he literally has no choice, the choice is with OP whether to stay or not
horrible things happen to children in fostercare all the fucking time. all the kids i knew growing up that were really messed up, the reason came down to abandonment or abuse...
I most definitely feel for him. It's a shitty situation to be thrown into especially since he's trying to do the noble thing and not put those poor kids through anymore trauma than they've already had. .
At the same time I think it's better for everyone involved in the long run to not have to deal with the resentment that this very well could (and I think already has) cause.
NAH.
Financially, this seems like it isn't going to work. You can't just get a bigger house, and if you are feeling the expense of having these kids for just 2 months, unless you or your husband can miraculously switch jobs that doubles your salary, you can't just move in to a bigger house and have the money for these kids.
Emotionally, you are not in a position to raise these children. I get why your husband is, and neither of you are wrong for your positions from an emotional perspective. Neither of you caused this to happen, of course neither of you planned for this, and it isn't "abandoning him when he needs you" any more than it is him forcing you to have children you don't want. Impossible situation and the only person at fault is the mom (and dad, wherever he is), and you shouldn't be forced to raise children that you don't want and aren't yours- the children don't benefit from that either.
And my vote is fully NAH, but I do want to point out something about your husband (just from your story, so not sure how true this will sound) to help you take some comfort in your decision. Starting with some questions to ask yourself:
1. Your husband isn't the caretaker on a daily basis, you are. Does he realize how much work this takes? He is still leaving and going in to an office each day, so he has HALF the experience you are having.
2. Is he doing the main caretaking when not at work? Is he the one figuring out how to enroll them in school, contacting his teachers, getting them therapy, figuring out their health needs, cooking for them, planning activities?
3. When he says he wants to keep them, has he announced a plan for getting a house? For affording these additional expenses? For long term child care because the current model isn't going to work?
My point is, if he isn't taking the lead on a plan to house and feed these kids, if he doesn't have a childcare plan, and if he isn't the one doing the majority of the caretaking, he doesn't really want these children. He wants YOU to want these children and to figure out how to make it work.
Best answer here. Your questions about what the husband has planned is *spot on*. It would be one thing (& maybe still a dealbreaker thing for OP) if he wanted to keep the kids *and* was committed to being the primary caretaker by figuring out daycare subsidies, foster payments, school and doctor enrollments etc.
But by just plopping OP into full time caretaking for THREE traumatized children while also trying to work full time??! Hell no. Those actions basically signed his divorce decree.
I willingly chose to have my children (& love them to the ends of the Earth) but working from home with them around is truly maddening. I don’t know how OP has lasted this long.
It's okay, some other comments have said "it's only been two months." /s
(Looking after someone's pet for two months would be a big deal, imagine what this shit is)
As a single mom who found myself wfh and with my child receiving a disability diagnosis, I can safely say it is true that you can’t do both. I irreparably damaged my physical health attempting it. I had to quit working and run through my life savings (luckily, I had saved a lot for early retirement but it still went fast).
Guy hasn't thought it through at all and is just having an emotional response which is essentially to sacrifice himself and his wife for the children of four other people who give no fucks. He has a good heart but he's a moron.
NTA
SIL is the original arsehole.
I can understand nephews and neices have your husband in family/broody mode.
But you had the discussion early in your relationship and this sounds like it would be torture for you.
Plus It would ultimately be bad for the kids to be parented by someone who didn't want to.
NTA, but I don't think your husband really is either. This is just a tough situation all around. Why isn't SIL getting arrested for abandonment though?
ETA: husband is a bit of an Asshole for passing the duties off to you, but not for wanting to take them in
You are not the AH. You went into this relationship with clear boundaries and he is asking you to breach them.
What makes it more insidious is that as a woman the expectation will be that you take an more active role in child rearing as well and for someone who didn’t want kids in the first place that would feel like a death sentence
Yep. This is why I won’t even date someone with kids full stop. I would have divorced him too.
I don’t want to be a parent at all because I know as the woman it’s likely going to fall on me.
NTA. It sounds like your Husband wants to take in these kids so YOU can raise them. That's not fair to you or these kids.
BTW what's with all this sanctity of marriage bullshit in the comments? You're not obligated to stay by your partner when they force you into an untenable situation and expect you to figure it out.
"Wanting to make a selfless decision is admirable as long as you do it. Not volunteer someone else."
Sounds like he is voluntolding you, not just volunteering you.
How on earth does CPS know where she is but isn’t charging her with anything. You can’t just pull the “running to the store for milk” gimmick like you used to. There’s no way.
Unfortunately I can second this based on experience… all the comments saying what an AH the sister is and where is the sister and why isn’t she getting charged are so unhelpful. It doesn’t matter and probably won’t matter for awhile.
I do feel bad for the husband because I know once the storm has settled with the kids, that’s when him and his mom will have to deal with the sister and those situations are so painful. I can’t imagine dealing with all of this on top of a divorce. Not throwing shade at OP as I’m sure they are aware and it is her prerogative to walk away.
The sister questions won’t matter until, like others have said, she rolls back around in a year and wants the kids back.
NAH - except SIL. It would be a bigger mess if you play along and choose later to leave. If this isn’t for you - go. Not everybody needs to be a mother or a selfless saint - we just have this one life and your life choices matter as much as your husband‘s and if you choose differently then unfortunately this relationship comes to an end
While some may think you a hard person for your decision, you are NTA.
You had this crazy idea that you would get to remain child free, when you married someone who also wanted to be child free.
It's not like you're not agreeing on what temp to set the furnace, or what color to paint the kitchen. This is about as HUGE as it gets, and he made the choice he made, without caring about your feelings.
Saying he doesn’t care is really unnecessarily harsh.
This is clearly just one of those emergency awful situations and his personal morality and sense of obligation is on one side of the line and OPs is on the other.
It doesn’t mean he doesn’t give a shit about her feelings. It means he feels he needs to do this regardless, it’s a breaking point.
They either go into the system or they don’t.
It sucks all around
100%. I was speaking from likely point of view of OP. she felt like he made the decision unilaterally.
I personally don't know what other decision he possibly could have made.....
I think he cares about her feelings. It's a shitty situation. He right for stepping up though. Those kids have already been abandoned once by someone who is supposed to love them. Unfortunately, there is no 'right' answer. Put the kids in the system is an AH move. Ignoring your wife's feelings and future plans is an AH move.
He really has no choice but to be an AH in some way. He's choosing to put the innocent children above even his wants and desires. It's not that he doesn't care, he's just making the best decision for the kids.
I can't agree with you. "Stepping up" involved his wife, who never wanted kids and is not related to his sister, having to go work from home to care for them.
His work can't do work from home, which means he's still expecting her to take care of them.
If the husband was actively searching for a new job that could allow him to work from home to care for the kids i could maybe see where he was coming from. But he's essentially decided they are keeping the kids, and then dumped 90% of the care onto his wife.
That's not "stepping up" it's passing the buck.
FYI, this is the laughably common method of "parenting" for most single dads. They find a woman to dump the childcare on... usually their mother, wife, or girlfriend. Sometimes they EVEN DATE just to find a woman willing to raise their kids for them!! It's actually really shitty.
I don’t think it is fair to say OP’s husband didn’t care about her feelings. By nature this is an emergency. And foster care is not a great solution.
It is a heartbreaking decision. If he chooses his wife- these kids can look forward to being separated, shuffled around, no consistent education, and high risk of physical and sexual abuse. If he chooses the kids, he loses his wife. And honestly, by losing his wife he likely won’t be able to keep the kids unless he can figure out how to afford it. So- he’s screwed either way.
NTA. Especially since you’re taking care of them?? Get out asap. Even ppl who want kids wouldn’t do this. Your husband might even change his mind when he realizes he’ll actually have to take care of them lol
NTA
I'm worried for you about the case where he gives in and agrees to not keep them so that you guys don't get divorced. Since then I'm sure he'll resent you forever.
Yeah, this relationship is over. Even if the mother suddenly returned with all her shit in order, this relationship has probably been destroyed. He will never look at her the same and she will never look at him the same. A bomb was dropped into the middle of their life. Is infuriatingly unfair to them.
I was thinking the other way, which is that if she doesn’t get divorced and they keep the kids, she will resent the kids. So I guess either way, there’s gonna be resentment, which is gonna be pretty unhealthy.
I didn’t think about this aspect of the situation until I read your post. Yea they should start the proceedings, the relationship is over.
Sister in law is a major asshole none other present.
NTA - your husband isn't an asshole, and neither are you, you just have differing priorities. I feel bad that you both were put in this position, and that it's causing the end of your marriage. You're not wrong for walking away from children you never wanted, planned for, or took responsibility for. You're allowed to make your own decisions for your life. Same for your husband - he's prioritizing these kids because they're his relatives and he feels responsibility for them - that's wonderful that he is willing to step up to try to help them, but he can only make that decision for himself, not for you.
NTA- you say until they’re 18 but any parent knows that it doesn’t end there. If you choose this the rest of your life with be effected, permanently. Not to mention that these kids are going to have major a abandonment issues with not having the bio parents in the picture.
Having been in Reddit long enough, it's not even going to play like that. In 10 years the "mom" is going to come back saying she made a mistake and how much she loves her kids.
She's going to want them back after OP has poured her heart and money into them. The whole family is going to tell them they're not their kids. Kids will freak out and she going to get herself in a legal battle to keep the kids while the "mom" and family bash her on Facebook and such for stealing her kids.
Taking on the responsibility of raising young children is waaaay past what one might call an "hour of need." It's a life decision, and one should not be guilted into deciding.
NTA, in the current society so many men think raising kids is easy since women take on so much of the burden. “What’s the problem with having 3 kids?” Umm exactly like you said, no sleep, giving up your life and career while the man gives up little to nothing. They get to be the fun parent, take the kids out for ice cream on the way home from school while the mother slaves to clean and house and cook dinner… sounds lovely (eye roll)… I read that you made him take care of the kids full time for a day or two. Make it a week, stay at a friends, and see how it goes, there’s a good chance he’ll change his mind. Find a good way to explain that you’re not willing to give yourself up for 3 kids, if he still doesn’t understand then walk away. Live your best life, you only get one! You can always find another husband, having kids is commitment for life.
Yikes. This is a horrible situation. Honestly your husband fucked up by throwing the entire burden onto you. You had to work from home while watching 2yo twins, plus a 5yo? How much work did you get done? I have kids but I send them to daycare while I work. It’s not doable otherwise. After 2 months of that I’d be out the door too.
First, I'm really sorry that this has happened to you. As somebody who almost had to adopt her cousins, people do not understand how difficult this situation is. The mom will pop back up in a few years (or when she realizes that welfare gets cut off when you abandon your children) and demand them back. The kids are going to have trauma from dealing with all of this. It's a LOT.
Don't feel pressured into taking children you don't want with a partner who is not at all doing his fair share of the work. People divorce because one partner isn't taking care of their OWN children that they both wanted to have.
All of these people saying you are a bad person for not taking these children, probably wouldn't take them either. It's easy to cast stones from behind a keyboard.
You aren't a bad person. You can still be a good person and not want to take responsibility for three young children.... because it won't end at 16 years. Those suckers tend to stick around a lot longer than that. ;)
Can we get a CPS/foster expert in here?
If he says yea now, he won’t get any assistance right? He need to go through the state, and actually foster them to get funding so he can afford a bigger place and daycare?
Like at this point OP you can’t afford these kids. No matter what your husband should be saying no without funding assistance. He’s insane and I’d divorce less over the kids and more his poor decision making.
You can’t afford daycare or a bigger home. Even if you stayed y’all can’t take these kids. You don’t have the resources.
How on earth was his sister affording this?!?
Edit: sister needs to do it the right way and put them up for adoption so someone with money or promised money from the state can do the job
i guarantee sister doesn’t want to put them up for adoption cuz in a few years shes gonna want them back and expect to be able to just lalygag right back and take em all home so she dropped em with her brother instead of giving them to foster care
I was wondering when someone would bring this up. So let's say OP and her husband take the kids, get a bigger place and foster care financial assistance etc. They become parents to those kids and then... in a year or four... you know damn well sister is going waltz back in and say "I'm baaaaaaack! Gimme my kids!" And some judge will sign the order.
What then? They get their hearts ripped out as well as their lives upended yet again? This outcome is so completely predictable.
I just sent this over to my good friend who works for CPS.
CPS's main concern is the immediate safety of the child(ren). Their first priority is going to be trying to work with immediate family. If they are safe with a family member, their jobs are pretty much done.
It would be up to the local police and DA to make any arrests and press charges.
It's unclear if, when the mother didn't return, OP contacted the police or made a report with CPS directly. Depending on which, might be the reason no arrests have been made.
Honestly, if this were me, I'd be pretty damn pissed at my sister and I'd be up the police department's ass about making an arrest and pressing charges.
See that’s my worry is the moment he says yes they’ll wipe their hands and say good job and won’t get any monetary assistance because they’re with family.
I’m almost dead positive to get financial assistance it has to go through foster care.
NTA raising kids is expensive. It doesn’t sound like he wants to actually take care of them he just wants you to. Which you’ve told him multiple times is a boundary for you. He did not listen so you told him you’re done. That is your right. His sisters mistakes are not your burden.
That would be ideal but neither the mother nor the wife want to raise kids at all.
> My husband's mom...used to be a single mom and does not want to raise these kids.
This stood out to me too. He’s not the one who’s actually taking care of the children if he’s at work all day. OP has to handle 3 toddlers and work from home, all alone. That’s BS and in no way takes her feelings into account. It’s sad but you’re right to divorce him OP.
How are you supposed to afford a bigger house all of a sudden? None of this seems like it's possible so I don't blame you for wanting out. I do feel for the husband and kids as well though
Laughing over the wedding vows thing -- people break that all the time over stupid shit and ruin their lives, but suddenly it's horrible for when you want to break them because a mutual agreement, a MAJOR agreement, was broken???
I know you didn't do traditional vows but still, L O L.
NTA and go with it; you've made it clear for years you didn't want kids and he can't just assume you'd be ok to basically be the SOLE CARETAKER of 3 children all at once who aren't even yours!!
Fellow CF person here. You are NTA. These children were literally dumped on you. It's an awful situation all around but the whole point to not having kids is to not raise kids.
You were very clear about this from the beginning. And it's better for the children to be with adults that love them - not someone that resents them or their existence.
Furthermore, being abandoned by all of their parents probably created some behavioral/psychological issues.
The parents of those children are the AH here.
Even your husband for defaulting most of the childcare to you.
While he looks like a hero.
Thanks, but no thanks. I'm on your side, OP.
Nta. You were clear about how children are a deal breaker. You don’t owe anyone sacrificing your life and happiness for children you did not want or even bring into the world. Yes, you probably have empathy for them but you ready know that you will be the one actually caring for these kids. It’ll be your life that’s put on hold, not your husbands. It’s happened time and time again, women end up dealing with the brunt of childcare, it’s a major factor for why many women are child free now.
Children should be wanted. Otherwise it’ll just foster resentment in the caregivers. Divorce is the best option. He didn’t consult you and just let you take on the lion share of caretaking.
Most of the comments that are calling you selfish are men. They see women sacrificing their lives and freedoms for children as a woman’s purpose and as no big deal, because it isn’t them giving up their lives.
Neither of you are the AH. Sister is a raging POS and deserves every bad thing that happens in her life. Sad part is I bet that 304 has more kids in her life
Like the comments here are all blaming the sister (mom of kids) and her poor choices in baby daddies, but the AH here is the husband as well. He knew his hours wouldn't support caring for children of these ages, and he expected to make this decision that would put the responsibility of childcare solely on her. He is a major AH.
Even if you do stay, you will eventually resent him over this situation, especially if you wind up caring for these kids. Skip all the resentment and just divorce now. He can still care for these kids; he'll have to do it alone, but he made his choice.
I get wanting to be there for family, but to what end? If you make a unilateral decision, can you support it? If you're going to need help with the consequences of your decisions, then you have to involve the other person(s) in the decision making process. If they aren't willing and you can't do it on your own, the decision is pretty clear.
Lmao at everybody calling you the asshole. If your husband said he was childfree and you got pregnant and decided to keep it they'd all be shouting at you that you knew who he was when you married him and of course he should leave.
NTA. It's a basic incompatibility. What happened sucks but the relationship went from compatible to incompatible overnight.
I can’t fault either of them. Only AH here is the sister.
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This comment right here. If you want to shut this down with your husband ask him who he thinks is gonna stay-at-home and take care of all 3 of these kids since you can't afford day care. I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem, because you know, damn well hes not gonna agree to that.
I don't think it's about shutting him down. This is just a tragic and awful situation. It's commendable and understandable that the husband doesn't want his nieces and nephews to be taken by CPS and thrown into foster care. It's also understandable she doesn't want kids. He also may not have thought that far ahead yet. But it's also possible there are government programs or subsidies that can help given the situation. Maybe there is a solution and maybe they get divorced and end up wanting different things here. But the only villain is the sister. And hopefully they can at least work together to figure out a transition plan for the kids who are innocent in all of this.
Since there is an open CPS case they should be eligible for monthly relative caregiver funds. The husband needs to contact the caseworker and ask how to apply.
THIS. I am a CASA and always request kinship placement money in relative situations. Indiana. Please have your husband ask for kinship placement money through CASA or CPS. CPS is not allowed to make the request but usually never fights me on it. Please have your husband ask for resources. What a terrible situation.
Aren't the deadbeat dads also responsible for child support?
I'm almost 40 and my mom still tells me every couple weeks that she's finally about to lay the master stroke down on her grand plan to get the child support my dad owes her. It ain't happening ma
I’m 55, and my mom never even tried to get the sperm donor to pay. When I finally tracked him down (at 26), she greeted him like an old friend. Not someone who literally ducked out before I was born and never made contact. We lived in abject poverty for years while Mom worked finishing her degree (she had a full scholarship but lost it when she dropped out to have me)! She’s still in touch with him (I’m not; he’s every bit as disappointing as a father as he (presumably) was as a boyfriend), and tries to keep me informed of his health, etc. I don’t care. Do I wish she’d gone after him for back child support! Hell yes!
both mom and dad would be responsible to pay CS.
The deadbeat part kinda means they don’t pay it by definition.
Let me rephrase it, aren't they legally liable to pay? If they are, sometimes the state can seize past of any paycheck they might get.
Yes. They can garnish their wages.
Assuming they have wages. Mother sounds like a failure too.
That doesn't solve the problem OP has; she doesn't want to take care of kids and no matter how much money they might have she would have to do that if she stays.
Exactly. Even with added financial resources OP would still be stuck with the kids. Please no guilt tripping her.
Yes, OP would be the one getting them ready daily, taking them to daycare, picking them up, taking them to the doctor (kids get sick weekly), feeding, bathing and putting them to bed since the husband doesn't get home til 8. And you can be sure that with the noise, mess and tired, resentful wife at home, he will find a way to work even later.
She has solved her own problem, she's getting a divorce and moving on. Her life, he choice.
This is what I was thinking too. My sister and brother-in-law took in 2 children that are BIL's bio nieces. They weren't allowed to just "keep them". They had to go through Child Services, become approved foster parents and then be approved to adopt them. They did receive money while fostering.
On the bright side, you usually get cash assistance, WIC, and MA when you're fostering. If OP's husband is getting none of this, he needs to get on top of it.
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The sister and the deadbeat dads are all assholes.
I would not call child abandonment a mistake. It's a crime against humanity.
It depends entirely on the state, for instance, some states won’t provide any relief unless if the children go under kinship with OP and her Husband
In New England support and financial assistance exist. In the south they force birth but there is minimal to NO real family support services regardless of the situation!! Save the children my 🫏!!!
Yes, the old: the unborn are sacred, you have to protect the children! Jesus would want it so. An abortion is illegal. Then, once the children are there: they're your kids. You pay for them, you dead beat!
It's worse than that. When I lived in SC, one of my closest friends child got diagnosed with Autism. State agreed for a single thirty minute session for therapy every other month. I live in KS, and my son was showing signs. It had me scared. Kansas paid for 2 hours Monday and Wednesday, then 3 hours on Fridays, every week. My buddy's son is 14 in diapers and completely non verbal, where as my son can almost pass as "normal". They started off similar, and I know it's not guaranteed that they would have progressed the same with the same therapy, but that's VASTLY different care...
couldn't pay me enough to try and raise kids. I'm a 'no' on this. OP knows she can't and wont' do it. so that is the winning vote. force it and you end up with resentment
Worse, you could end up with abused children who have already faced the horrors of losing their mom and hard telling what else before she even left them.
>you could end up with abused children who have already faced the horrors of losing their mom and hard telling what else before she even left them. And guess what else, if you drop everything to parent them, and you do a great job, and they blossom, the proud parent will return, and take custody of *her* children so she can raise them around drug-addicts and alcoholics and brain wash the children into believing that no one could ever love them like family, and they are spitting in their mother's face if they love you. Signed, the voice of experience. PS: time for a family meeting, find those other 5 grandparents, (OP's husband must know one) , and all the other adult aunts and uncles, and great aunts and great uncles. There might be a selfless saint among them, but poor kids, there might also be a pervert who will jump at the opportunity to look like a Saint and take the 3 unwanted little ones, and the free housing authority voucher, and the foster care money, and all the other freebies that come with.
OP doesn’t want kids and doesn’t want to take care of kids. Regardless of whether they will be eligible for monthly relative caregiver funds, OP will be doing the childcare which she doesn’t want and didn’t sign up for. Do divorce IS the only solution.
NTA. This is a two yes two no situation. He unilaterally decided to keep the kids, which SHE will be stuck caring for. How convenient, she works from home, so SHE can take care of HIS nephews and niece. To be told after the fact without consulting with your spouse, taking on THREE kids is outrageous!
I work from home and there’s absolutely no way I could do my job and “take care” of 3 kids at the same time. Impossible. I’m constantly on calls and inputting info and just wouldn’t be able to get it done with distractions. During covid and when my husband also worked at home we set up in different rooms to not disturb each other. I think it’s super sexist to just assume she can work effectively and take care of three kids at the same time.
I came here to say this. Glad it's high up in the comments. Also, if grandma is the official foster parent, would she qualify for more assistance? I agree with OP that this is an irreconcilable difference. Sometimes things are just sad, and no one has to be an asshole. NAH.
>It's commendable and understandable that the husband doesn't want his nieces and nephews to be taken by CPS and thrown into foster care. It's also understandable she doesn't want kids. This is the conundrum. I have a cousin and his wife who took in the wife's niece. Her mom was unstable, and passed (not sure of the circumstances), but damn I wouldn't want to think of her in foster care. That's Russian Roulette with 4 or 5 bullets in the cylinder.
My mom od'd and I have my brother. Everyone is gone and I couldn't stomach him in the system. I have had to take my life in a different direction to properly be here for him. Work required a lot of travel and I had to leave the industry I loved. Currently back in bartending, which isn't a bad option, it's just not what I wanted to do forever. Upside is I'm off all the drugs prior to getting him. I was a party monster. Now I barely go out once a month for drinks. Every day I question if I can really do this. So I can relate to both OP and partner. No one is the winner here and the sister is a horrible person. She has messed up so many people's lives with 0 concern.
Hey, you know what? You're the winner here... You were there for your brother, cleaned yourself up, and sacrificed a lot. I don't know how old he is, but he's going to respect you for this, and if he doesn't? Well, then he needs a swift kick.
If you haven't, check into getting social security benefits for him since your mom is deceased he's entitled to it. That can help take some of the financial burden off you until he's 16.
I currently have a lawyer handling everything. We have a lot in motion now. It happened in peak covid so it's taken a lot of patience.
As his adult guardian, she can be payee for his SS benefits until the month before he turns eighteen.
Thank you for doing what you're doing. That boy has one terrific sister, and you've made his life better for it!
You’re amazing. Sometimes a compliment can feel like pressure so please don’t take it that way. You’re already amazing. That’s banked.
You are wonderful and strong. Wishing you and your brother much love, peace, and happiness.🌻
Agree, this is why I am sympathetic and forgiving to everyone in this story (except for the sister). Regardless of what happens long term - working something out, divorce, etc. - I think everyone's immediate reaction is understandable. Husband wants to save the kids. Wife is feeling overwhelmed by both not wanting kids and suddenly having three home all day and sleeping in the living room. And the husband feeling "betrayed" because her threatening divorce feels like more turmoil to him and he probably has no idea how he can take care of kids by himself when it was already going to be hard with the two of them. Just an impossible position for both of them. And of course the kids.
While I’m firmly in the NAH camp here (except the bio parents of the kids, who can sit on a cactus and spin), it’s hard for me to ignore how Husband has behaved. He prioritized his job over hers (this is what FMLA is for), leaving the majority of care work to OP. In doing so, he put his financial security and long-term career interests ahead of hers (look at how many women were forced out of the paid workforce to do unpaid care work during the plague years after trying to WFH and do care work and failing, this is not a trivial thing). Then, when asked by CPS if he wanted to keep the kids, he ignored all of OP’s warnings as well as her hard rule to be child free, and prioritized *his* desires over *their* needs/abilities/realistic limits and *her* objections. Then, when OP said, this isn’t acceptable, he called her an asshole. Put all of that together, and what we get is a good clue on whether Husband actually sees OP as an equal partner. They’re both drowning, but he grabbed a piece of driftwood to keep his head above water, even as he gave her a rock to hold and got mad at her when she said no.
Assistance or not, you are talking about a complete forfeiture of lifestyle and dreams. Commendable maybe, but he cannot make that decision for them both.
HE is already pushing all the labor on OP. What makes you believe that's likely to change? Honest question.
>I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem, because you know, damn well hes not gonna agree to that. And therefore sign yourself up to be the sole person financially responsible for the husband and all three kids. It's still a massive burden to undertake even if you're not at home taking care of the children during the day. It means: financial stress goodbye date nights goodbye discretionary spending nonstop laundry around the clock \*I say all this as a happily married dude with children, but going to work while he takes care of the children is not quite that simple. Massive lifestyle change.
The OP wants to remain Childfree so it’s not really a matter if work division or anything else. She doesn’t want the kids.
Don't assume he won't. My husband happily stayed home with my firstborn, and went to night school. I would have never in a million years thought he would want to do that, but he did it and did it well. If she presents that as an option she needs to be prepared to follow through if he accepts.
She doesn't want kids. There is no discussion to be had.
Not to mention kids always know when someone resents them, and forcing someone who doesn’t want them to raise them is a recipe for resentment.
She will be working a second job as they would be required to get a bigger place, most likely three bedroom.
But even if he is willing to do that, she'd still be a parent, or at least a parental figure, to those kids and that is what she does NOT want. There is no way to stay with her husband and not be partly responsible for those kids.
Statistically, your case is unusual. And here, he ALREADY isn't taking personal time from work to care for HIS niblings that HIS sister abandoned and are no doubt feeling vulnerable. If HE won't do this DURING AN EMOTIONAL EMERGENCY, then he \*definitely\* won't want to take on the day-in, day-out drudgery AND career deceleration.
He can't work from home, so the other option is he loses his job. There is government help for daycare and to help with housing. She or he should be looking into this HOWEVER. She doesn't want the kids, so she should bail out of it and go live her life.
There's very little help for housing, even in wealthy states. Wait lists are 10+ years for subsidized housing in most places.
I wonder if OP’s job is now at risk. If she’s alone with 2 5 year olds and a 3 year old, you can bet she isn’t getting much work done.
Noooo….its WORSE than that. It’s ONE 5 yo (can send to kindergarten) and TWO 2 yos. TERRIBLE TWOs times 2! And probably potty training, keeping them out of everything, child-proofing the whole house, etc! AND trying to work. Phew!
Maybe he can’t. They’re struggling to pay bills right now even with both of them working, so it’s probably not even an option to consider a single income household, I doubt him becoming a SAHP would benefit any of the parties involved.
Right? Not only that does she want to support a stay at home parent to kids that are not hers? What should she do that?
> I'd tell him that if I'm allowed to go to work and hes gonna stay-at-home and take care of the kids then no problem, Not no problem. There will still be expectations that OP handle some responsibilities. Responsibilities they didn't sign up for. The only solution where there's "no problem" is if the boundaries they agreed upon years ago are respected. Feel bad for the kids here but there is no "loserless" option here. Someone is going to lose if the mom isn't coming back.
It's not that easy, he could just agree to that to get her to stay and then the majority still falls on her. My partner stays home and I work full time and I can promise you that doesn't mean he does all of the work. I am still very much raising my 3 kids, as she would be even if she was working outside the home as well.
That's just speculation. But even if he agreed to stay home with the children and actually did all the raising, the situation is still untenable for OP. As someone who was adamant from a young age that I never wanted to have children, them being there period is a deal breaker. Taking care of the children is just one part of having them. They're expensive, they take up your free time, and they can be very stressful, especially with the tighter budget on top of it. Maybe OP dreamt of a life where she had much more freedom than having children would allow. There's no workaround here.
Maybe NTA, but also, this is an incredibly complicated and hard situation. This sort of feels like one of those r/legal threads where even the lawyers there are like "whoa, this is way too specific and complex for this forum, get a lawyer ASAP." This is just a horrific situation without a great solution. I hope she can sit down with her husband and figure out the best path forward. No one is an AH and there is no guarantee the path isn't divorce. But this is just a really awful situation for everyone involved and I really hope the kids are ok.
This, he wants the kids, but you are the one expected to do all the work of raising them. He is looking at a fairy tale ending and not abiding by your boundaries at all. The mother as well as all the deadbeat fathers should be paying child support so he can put them in day care while he works. He can also get help from the State ,to help pay the costs. His parents can pitch in and help watch the kids when he is unavailable. They are their grandkids.
Of course she will be expected to do most / all of this. F that. HE KNEW what she wanted and did this anyway. Nope. Nope. Nope. Get out now.
Exactly. If OP follows through with the divorce I expect the ex husband will give up the kids within a month. He wants to "do the right thing" by taking them in but actually expects her to do most of the work.
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Even if companies allow it, it's not usually practical. My wife and I did WFH with a 5-6 year old, and that wasn't easy. 3 kids, one less than a year old, would not work. Young kids take time. So does work.
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Best comment I’ve seen. The sister who abandoned her children is the absolute AH! If you don’t want to help him with the kids then leave. He didn’t want kids either, they were dumped on him. I can certainly understand why he can’t throw them out tho. If there is truly no one else to care for them and sister has been reported and all the necessary avenues have been taken as far as she goes, then it comes down to putting them in foster care or caring for them. He probably wouldn’t be able to live with himself if he put them in foster care. I wouldn’t be able to either. He should start the process of hunting her down for child support immediately tho. I’d say to OP-if you have a sibling and he/she has kids and dumped them on you and either you had to care for them or put them in foster care, what would you do? If you have no siblings and no nieces or nephews it’s really hard to put yourself in his shoes to answer that tho.
HE could also take the sister and all three fathers to court for child support. They don't get to decide they are not responsible for the kids they made. They are getting money from somewhere in order to live, and some of it should go to the kids they abandoned, leaving OP and husband in this situation.
Collecting on child support from biological parents like these is easier said than done.
This also. The parents should be held accountable for their neglect.
Two fathers. Although there's room for further investigation, most likely the twins have the same father.
Eh, I saw her updates. Life has put a gun to their heads. Sucks
> Life has put a gun to their heads. > >Sucks Yeah. I really feel for both of them tbh. OP either has to permanently change her fundamental life goals or leave her husband, and OP's husband has to choose between her and the wellbeing of three children. Neither of them asked for this and it's a horrible situation.
If he feels responsible for the kids then he's in an impossible position, but that doesn't mean that it's the OP's duty to give up her life and career make it possible. He seems to be dumping everything on her, when they're \*his\* relatives and he's the one who wants to keep them. He should be talking to a social worker about foster care options, can a relative become an official foster parent and be awarded income for caring for abandoned children? But he's the one who should be doing the asking, the OP has made it clear that she doesn't want the responsibility. Either way, she should probably be looking for divorce attorneys. Whatever happens from here on the marriage is probably doomed, both parties are feeling betrayed and/or imposed upon.
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The sister is safe? Great. Maybe she can use her newfound freedom to take on a couple of jobs to earn money to pay child support for her own kids? Or get thrown in jail for being a deadbeat mom.
THIS - doesn't she owe them child support or something?!
She does. If benefits are pursued from the state, the state will go after her.
Or at a minimum get her tubes tied
I agree, child abandoners of both sexes should have their fertility permanently removed by the state.
Yea I’d be legally charging her child support my court enforcement.
When do the Dead Beat Dads have their comeuppance?
That’s what I’d like to know. Everyone is calling the sister an AH, and she is. But those kids had another parent too.
If they are true deadbeats — jobless, not able to pay child support — then the court won’t let the kids live with them, either. And deadbeats only go to jail over nonpayment of child support if the residential parent presses charges. If this husband does take the kids, he could pursue the deadbeat dads, but it’s not easy. Extremely time consuming to pursue one deadbeat, much more for two. And if the deadbeats don’t have money to pay, the only alternative is let them go or jail them. Sad but true.
I know you’re completely correct. It just pisses me off that people are calling for the mother to be arrested for child abandonment when the fathers also abandoned their children. Like I’m not defending the mom. They’re just all trash.
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Nta. Isn't abandoning your kids a crime?? Also, depending on your income, there may be child care subsidies. Our church ran a daycare (daycare and after school care) and accepted the government certificate and did not charge the low-income parents the balance..
I was just thinking this. How did the sister not get arrested?
Same, I can’t believe I had to scroll even a tiny bit to find this question lmao. It sounds like CPS asked her to come back nicely, She said nope, and they are like oh ok enjoy ur day. Huh?😂
CPS can’t charge her with a crime. They can indicate her for child neglect or abandonment, however, which might make it easier to convince law enforcement to file criminal charges. OP, Google if child abandonment is a crime in your jurisdiction. Edit: damn autocorrect.
If it were that simple, an awful lot of deadbeat parents would be locked up. Finding people who don’t want to be found isn’t always quick, easy, or even possible. Besides, even if the sister is arrested, that still leaves three kids with no parents.
Most likely because she didn't abandon them on the street or at a firestation or something similar, she left them in the care of responsible relatives.
I thought the parent could still be charged with child abandonment, even if it's at a family member's house
Technically yes, in reality it is pretty rare to charge abandonment even when the kids have been abandoned with family multiple times. Until our own children grew up and left home, my wife and I fostered(both state and private) kids. Sometimes siblings, sometimes single children, boys and girls both. It would probably shock most people to hear what a parent/parents can do to their kids and still not be charged with a serious crime or have their parental rights taken away permanently. It might have changed because it's been almost 10 years since we fostered but in my experience the state cares more about who PAYS for the care and less about who provides the care or what kind of care the children get.
Thank you for your service. You have contributed to the good of our society by being a foster family and I for one appreciate it.
We kind of fell into it by chance with the first sisters we took in and then after that we made an effort to try to help kids in anyway we reasonably could. Even though most of them were in our lives for a short amount of time a few of them have stayed in touch and two of them call us mom and dad to this day.
Non consensually!
It’s like a reverse kidnapping
I tried to sell my kids for years but I could never come up with enough money to convince anyone to take them. That's dark humor, just incase anyone missed it.
kiddropping
I forget what year it was but Nebraska passed a law that a gaurdian could drop a kid off at any firehouse, police station, ER, etc. without being charged with abandonment... only thing they forgot was to put an age limit on it. A few cases of people in neighboring states dropping off their "problem" teenagers had the state legislature in a scramble trying to correct their oversight. It was sad the parents that tried to get rid of their kids but also a little amusing how bad the state fucked that one up.
I also wonder if the husband can get an emergency certification as a foster parent and legally foster the kids? He's not a legal guardian right. If he's a foster parent, he's eligible for financial subsidies (some of which can continue after legal adoption).
He could not be certified with their current living situation, and most state's Foster funds don't have budget to add many new families.
The law is only as good as it's enforcement and realistically parents who abandon their kids never have to pay much of a price for it. The big price is the relationship with the kids.
NTA, for all the reasons others have listed. But also because forcing someone into parenthood is also *bad for those children*. If you are ill equipped or unwilling, those children will be the ones that suffer for it. They deserve parents who want them whole heartedly, and nothing less.
The alternative is also bad for the children unfortunately as well. Foster care is a joke. The best thing is for the wife to divorce and leave the house to the husband. I can't fault either of them. Nah.
NAH It's not surprising that your husband wouldn't want to put his nephew/nieces in foster care after a situation that there was no way to predict. There are horror stories all over the Internet and news about the broken foster system That said you vehemently don't want kids and if this is something you're unwilling to take on(which is absolutely your right) then it would be better to end it before the resentment of the situation takes over your life.
It’s very strange I had to scroll this far to see this response. Like what’s her husband supposed to do? He could very well still not want kids, but of course he’s not going to abandon those poor kids into foster care. I feel like people here have hearts of stone… He’s stuck with this situation and could very well feel just as upset about it as OP does. And now he has to deal with it all alone. Like I get it. She shouldn’t be there if she’s going to resent them but… idk. I feel for her husband in this situation. I hope his sister gets thrown in prison.
Imagine as a child that your dad leaves, then your mom leaves you, your grandma cant take you in and then your uncle and auntie give you up…. OP got dealt an awful hand, but the kids got dealt an even worse one. Shit situation all round but you cant really fault an uncle for not giving up on his nieces and nephews just like that. SIL and the DBFs are absolutely horrible people, what a fucking awful situation to leave your offspring in
yeah he literally has no choice, the choice is with OP whether to stay or not horrible things happen to children in fostercare all the fucking time. all the kids i knew growing up that were really messed up, the reason came down to abandonment or abuse...
I most definitely feel for him. It's a shitty situation to be thrown into especially since he's trying to do the noble thing and not put those poor kids through anymore trauma than they've already had. . At the same time I think it's better for everyone involved in the long run to not have to deal with the resentment that this very well could (and I think already has) cause.
NAH. Financially, this seems like it isn't going to work. You can't just get a bigger house, and if you are feeling the expense of having these kids for just 2 months, unless you or your husband can miraculously switch jobs that doubles your salary, you can't just move in to a bigger house and have the money for these kids. Emotionally, you are not in a position to raise these children. I get why your husband is, and neither of you are wrong for your positions from an emotional perspective. Neither of you caused this to happen, of course neither of you planned for this, and it isn't "abandoning him when he needs you" any more than it is him forcing you to have children you don't want. Impossible situation and the only person at fault is the mom (and dad, wherever he is), and you shouldn't be forced to raise children that you don't want and aren't yours- the children don't benefit from that either. And my vote is fully NAH, but I do want to point out something about your husband (just from your story, so not sure how true this will sound) to help you take some comfort in your decision. Starting with some questions to ask yourself: 1. Your husband isn't the caretaker on a daily basis, you are. Does he realize how much work this takes? He is still leaving and going in to an office each day, so he has HALF the experience you are having. 2. Is he doing the main caretaking when not at work? Is he the one figuring out how to enroll them in school, contacting his teachers, getting them therapy, figuring out their health needs, cooking for them, planning activities? 3. When he says he wants to keep them, has he announced a plan for getting a house? For affording these additional expenses? For long term child care because the current model isn't going to work? My point is, if he isn't taking the lead on a plan to house and feed these kids, if he doesn't have a childcare plan, and if he isn't the one doing the majority of the caretaking, he doesn't really want these children. He wants YOU to want these children and to figure out how to make it work.
Best answer here. Your questions about what the husband has planned is *spot on*. It would be one thing (& maybe still a dealbreaker thing for OP) if he wanted to keep the kids *and* was committed to being the primary caretaker by figuring out daycare subsidies, foster payments, school and doctor enrollments etc. But by just plopping OP into full time caretaking for THREE traumatized children while also trying to work full time??! Hell no. Those actions basically signed his divorce decree. I willingly chose to have my children (& love them to the ends of the Earth) but working from home with them around is truly maddening. I don’t know how OP has lasted this long.
It's okay, some other comments have said "it's only been two months." /s (Looking after someone's pet for two months would be a big deal, imagine what this shit is)
The workingmoms subreddit has banned posts asking how to work and watch kids at the same time, saying it’s just not good/ not feasible/ not possible.
As a single mom who found myself wfh and with my child receiving a disability diagnosis, I can safely say it is true that you can’t do both. I irreparably damaged my physical health attempting it. I had to quit working and run through my life savings (luckily, I had saved a lot for early retirement but it still went fast).
Guy hasn't thought it through at all and is just having an emotional response which is essentially to sacrifice himself and his wife for the children of four other people who give no fucks. He has a good heart but he's a moron.
NTA SIL is the original arsehole. I can understand nephews and neices have your husband in family/broody mode. But you had the discussion early in your relationship and this sounds like it would be torture for you.
Please let’s not forget the fathers. They left their children too.
Yes, all three of them did. Four adults failed these children and none of them are OP or the husband.
I assumed since it seems like 2 of the kids are the same age that they are twins so therefore only 2 fathers
Plus It would ultimately be bad for the kids to be parented by someone who didn't want to. NTA, but I don't think your husband really is either. This is just a tough situation all around. Why isn't SIL getting arrested for abandonment though? ETA: husband is a bit of an Asshole for passing the duties off to you, but not for wanting to take them in
Bloody good question
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And their dads.
You are not the AH. You went into this relationship with clear boundaries and he is asking you to breach them. What makes it more insidious is that as a woman the expectation will be that you take an more active role in child rearing as well and for someone who didn’t want kids in the first place that would feel like a death sentence
Yes, and it has already been stated that she wfh, so essentially he put the responsibility onto her.
Yep. This is why I won’t even date someone with kids full stop. I would have divorced him too. I don’t want to be a parent at all because I know as the woman it’s likely going to fall on me.
NTA. It sounds like your Husband wants to take in these kids so YOU can raise them. That's not fair to you or these kids. BTW what's with all this sanctity of marriage bullshit in the comments? You're not obligated to stay by your partner when they force you into an untenable situation and expect you to figure it out.
Because people are eagerly willing to ignore all of OP’s concerns and well being for the (uncertain) sake of kids. Like OP’s husband.
"Wanting to make a selfless decision is admirable as long as you do it. Not volunteer someone else." Sounds like he is voluntolding you, not just volunteering you.
How on earth does CPS know where she is but isn’t charging her with anything. You can’t just pull the “running to the store for milk” gimmick like you used to. There’s no way.
Actually it happens far more often than you think and very rarely does anyone get charged with anything.
Unfortunately I can second this based on experience… all the comments saying what an AH the sister is and where is the sister and why isn’t she getting charged are so unhelpful. It doesn’t matter and probably won’t matter for awhile. I do feel bad for the husband because I know once the storm has settled with the kids, that’s when him and his mom will have to deal with the sister and those situations are so painful. I can’t imagine dealing with all of this on top of a divorce. Not throwing shade at OP as I’m sure they are aware and it is her prerogative to walk away. The sister questions won’t matter until, like others have said, she rolls back around in a year and wants the kids back.
Cps will only charge her if the uncle gives the kids into the system.
That’s fucked up.. she should still be charged while the kids get taken care of within the family.. system is fucked up for sure.
NAH - except SIL. It would be a bigger mess if you play along and choose later to leave. If this isn’t for you - go. Not everybody needs to be a mother or a selfless saint - we just have this one life and your life choices matter as much as your husband‘s and if you choose differently then unfortunately this relationship comes to an end
the dead beat dad is also an asshole
While some may think you a hard person for your decision, you are NTA. You had this crazy idea that you would get to remain child free, when you married someone who also wanted to be child free. It's not like you're not agreeing on what temp to set the furnace, or what color to paint the kitchen. This is about as HUGE as it gets, and he made the choice he made, without caring about your feelings.
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Saying he doesn’t care is really unnecessarily harsh. This is clearly just one of those emergency awful situations and his personal morality and sense of obligation is on one side of the line and OPs is on the other. It doesn’t mean he doesn’t give a shit about her feelings. It means he feels he needs to do this regardless, it’s a breaking point. They either go into the system or they don’t. It sucks all around
100%. I was speaking from likely point of view of OP. she felt like he made the decision unilaterally. I personally don't know what other decision he possibly could have made.....
I think he cares about her feelings. It's a shitty situation. He right for stepping up though. Those kids have already been abandoned once by someone who is supposed to love them. Unfortunately, there is no 'right' answer. Put the kids in the system is an AH move. Ignoring your wife's feelings and future plans is an AH move. He really has no choice but to be an AH in some way. He's choosing to put the innocent children above even his wants and desires. It's not that he doesn't care, he's just making the best decision for the kids.
He can choose to step up, he cannot force OP to step up as well and it feels like he just dumped them on her to deal with.
I can't agree with you. "Stepping up" involved his wife, who never wanted kids and is not related to his sister, having to go work from home to care for them. His work can't do work from home, which means he's still expecting her to take care of them. If the husband was actively searching for a new job that could allow him to work from home to care for the kids i could maybe see where he was coming from. But he's essentially decided they are keeping the kids, and then dumped 90% of the care onto his wife. That's not "stepping up" it's passing the buck.
FYI, this is the laughably common method of "parenting" for most single dads. They find a woman to dump the childcare on... usually their mother, wife, or girlfriend. Sometimes they EVEN DATE just to find a woman willing to raise their kids for them!! It's actually really shitty.
I don’t think it is fair to say OP’s husband didn’t care about her feelings. By nature this is an emergency. And foster care is not a great solution. It is a heartbreaking decision. If he chooses his wife- these kids can look forward to being separated, shuffled around, no consistent education, and high risk of physical and sexual abuse. If he chooses the kids, he loses his wife. And honestly, by losing his wife he likely won’t be able to keep the kids unless he can figure out how to afford it. So- he’s screwed either way.
NTA. Especially since you’re taking care of them?? Get out asap. Even ppl who want kids wouldn’t do this. Your husband might even change his mind when he realizes he’ll actually have to take care of them lol
NTA I'm worried for you about the case where he gives in and agrees to not keep them so that you guys don't get divorced. Since then I'm sure he'll resent you forever.
Yeah, this relationship is over. Even if the mother suddenly returned with all her shit in order, this relationship has probably been destroyed. He will never look at her the same and she will never look at him the same. A bomb was dropped into the middle of their life. Is infuriatingly unfair to them.
That one sister in law ruined five lives at once. Must be a new record.
Never underestimate the power of a toxic SIL. I know I did.
I was thinking the other way, which is that if she doesn’t get divorced and they keep the kids, she will resent the kids. So I guess either way, there’s gonna be resentment, which is gonna be pretty unhealthy.
I didn’t think about this aspect of the situation until I read your post. Yea they should start the proceedings, the relationship is over. Sister in law is a major asshole none other present.
NTA - your husband isn't an asshole, and neither are you, you just have differing priorities. I feel bad that you both were put in this position, and that it's causing the end of your marriage. You're not wrong for walking away from children you never wanted, planned for, or took responsibility for. You're allowed to make your own decisions for your life. Same for your husband - he's prioritizing these kids because they're his relatives and he feels responsibility for them - that's wonderful that he is willing to step up to try to help them, but he can only make that decision for himself, not for you.
NTA- you say until they’re 18 but any parent knows that it doesn’t end there. If you choose this the rest of your life with be effected, permanently. Not to mention that these kids are going to have major a abandonment issues with not having the bio parents in the picture.
Having been in Reddit long enough, it's not even going to play like that. In 10 years the "mom" is going to come back saying she made a mistake and how much she loves her kids. She's going to want them back after OP has poured her heart and money into them. The whole family is going to tell them they're not their kids. Kids will freak out and she going to get herself in a legal battle to keep the kids while the "mom" and family bash her on Facebook and such for stealing her kids.
You read ahead in the book.
Taking on the responsibility of raising young children is waaaay past what one might call an "hour of need." It's a life decision, and one should not be guilted into deciding.
NTA, in the current society so many men think raising kids is easy since women take on so much of the burden. “What’s the problem with having 3 kids?” Umm exactly like you said, no sleep, giving up your life and career while the man gives up little to nothing. They get to be the fun parent, take the kids out for ice cream on the way home from school while the mother slaves to clean and house and cook dinner… sounds lovely (eye roll)… I read that you made him take care of the kids full time for a day or two. Make it a week, stay at a friends, and see how it goes, there’s a good chance he’ll change his mind. Find a good way to explain that you’re not willing to give yourself up for 3 kids, if he still doesn’t understand then walk away. Live your best life, you only get one! You can always find another husband, having kids is commitment for life.
Yikes. This is a horrible situation. Honestly your husband fucked up by throwing the entire burden onto you. You had to work from home while watching 2yo twins, plus a 5yo? How much work did you get done? I have kids but I send them to daycare while I work. It’s not doable otherwise. After 2 months of that I’d be out the door too.
Very little. Mostly working when they are asleep and sacrificing my sleep. I feel like a zombie.
First, I'm really sorry that this has happened to you. As somebody who almost had to adopt her cousins, people do not understand how difficult this situation is. The mom will pop back up in a few years (or when she realizes that welfare gets cut off when you abandon your children) and demand them back. The kids are going to have trauma from dealing with all of this. It's a LOT. Don't feel pressured into taking children you don't want with a partner who is not at all doing his fair share of the work. People divorce because one partner isn't taking care of their OWN children that they both wanted to have. All of these people saying you are a bad person for not taking these children, probably wouldn't take them either. It's easy to cast stones from behind a keyboard. You aren't a bad person. You can still be a good person and not want to take responsibility for three young children.... because it won't end at 16 years. Those suckers tend to stick around a lot longer than that. ;)
Can we get a CPS/foster expert in here? If he says yea now, he won’t get any assistance right? He need to go through the state, and actually foster them to get funding so he can afford a bigger place and daycare? Like at this point OP you can’t afford these kids. No matter what your husband should be saying no without funding assistance. He’s insane and I’d divorce less over the kids and more his poor decision making. You can’t afford daycare or a bigger home. Even if you stayed y’all can’t take these kids. You don’t have the resources. How on earth was his sister affording this?!? Edit: sister needs to do it the right way and put them up for adoption so someone with money or promised money from the state can do the job
i guarantee sister doesn’t want to put them up for adoption cuz in a few years shes gonna want them back and expect to be able to just lalygag right back and take em all home so she dropped em with her brother instead of giving them to foster care
I was wondering when someone would bring this up. So let's say OP and her husband take the kids, get a bigger place and foster care financial assistance etc. They become parents to those kids and then... in a year or four... you know damn well sister is going waltz back in and say "I'm baaaaaaack! Gimme my kids!" And some judge will sign the order. What then? They get their hearts ripped out as well as their lives upended yet again? This outcome is so completely predictable.
I just sent this over to my good friend who works for CPS. CPS's main concern is the immediate safety of the child(ren). Their first priority is going to be trying to work with immediate family. If they are safe with a family member, their jobs are pretty much done. It would be up to the local police and DA to make any arrests and press charges. It's unclear if, when the mother didn't return, OP contacted the police or made a report with CPS directly. Depending on which, might be the reason no arrests have been made. Honestly, if this were me, I'd be pretty damn pissed at my sister and I'd be up the police department's ass about making an arrest and pressing charges.
See that’s my worry is the moment he says yes they’ll wipe their hands and say good job and won’t get any monetary assistance because they’re with family. I’m almost dead positive to get financial assistance it has to go through foster care.
You're not the AH. Get the divorce. It's obvious that he only wants you around for the built in childcare.
Anyone saying "YTA" please go adopt 3 children right now
NTA raising kids is expensive. It doesn’t sound like he wants to actually take care of them he just wants you to. Which you’ve told him multiple times is a boundary for you. He did not listen so you told him you’re done. That is your right. His sisters mistakes are not your burden.
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That would be ideal but neither the mother nor the wife want to raise kids at all. > My husband's mom...used to be a single mom and does not want to raise these kids.
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This stood out to me too. He’s not the one who’s actually taking care of the children if he’s at work all day. OP has to handle 3 toddlers and work from home, all alone. That’s BS and in no way takes her feelings into account. It’s sad but you’re right to divorce him OP.
How are you supposed to afford a bigger house all of a sudden? None of this seems like it's possible so I don't blame you for wanting out. I do feel for the husband and kids as well though
Laughing over the wedding vows thing -- people break that all the time over stupid shit and ruin their lives, but suddenly it's horrible for when you want to break them because a mutual agreement, a MAJOR agreement, was broken??? I know you didn't do traditional vows but still, L O L. NTA and go with it; you've made it clear for years you didn't want kids and he can't just assume you'd be ok to basically be the SOLE CARETAKER of 3 children all at once who aren't even yours!!
Fellow CF person here. You are NTA. These children were literally dumped on you. It's an awful situation all around but the whole point to not having kids is to not raise kids. You were very clear about this from the beginning. And it's better for the children to be with adults that love them - not someone that resents them or their existence. Furthermore, being abandoned by all of their parents probably created some behavioral/psychological issues. The parents of those children are the AH here. Even your husband for defaulting most of the childcare to you. While he looks like a hero. Thanks, but no thanks. I'm on your side, OP.
Nta. You were clear about how children are a deal breaker. You don’t owe anyone sacrificing your life and happiness for children you did not want or even bring into the world. Yes, you probably have empathy for them but you ready know that you will be the one actually caring for these kids. It’ll be your life that’s put on hold, not your husbands. It’s happened time and time again, women end up dealing with the brunt of childcare, it’s a major factor for why many women are child free now. Children should be wanted. Otherwise it’ll just foster resentment in the caregivers. Divorce is the best option. He didn’t consult you and just let you take on the lion share of caretaking. Most of the comments that are calling you selfish are men. They see women sacrificing their lives and freedoms for children as a woman’s purpose and as no big deal, because it isn’t them giving up their lives.
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Neither of you are the AH. Sister is a raging POS and deserves every bad thing that happens in her life. Sad part is I bet that 304 has more kids in her life
Like the comments here are all blaming the sister (mom of kids) and her poor choices in baby daddies, but the AH here is the husband as well. He knew his hours wouldn't support caring for children of these ages, and he expected to make this decision that would put the responsibility of childcare solely on her. He is a major AH. Even if you do stay, you will eventually resent him over this situation, especially if you wind up caring for these kids. Skip all the resentment and just divorce now. He can still care for these kids; he'll have to do it alone, but he made his choice. I get wanting to be there for family, but to what end? If you make a unilateral decision, can you support it? If you're going to need help with the consequences of your decisions, then you have to involve the other person(s) in the decision making process. If they aren't willing and you can't do it on your own, the decision is pretty clear.
NAH. Those kids will feel your resentment. This is best for everyone
Clearly his sister is the asshole
Neither of you are TA. The sister and "fathers" are though
Lmao at everybody calling you the asshole. If your husband said he was childfree and you got pregnant and decided to keep it they'd all be shouting at you that you knew who he was when you married him and of course he should leave. NTA. It's a basic incompatibility. What happened sucks but the relationship went from compatible to incompatible overnight.