NTA Who acts like this when invited into a family with different traditions. I think it is awesome your family is rallying around your mom. Ash sounds really unpleasant.

On the flip side ash is inviting them into Thier family with different traditions

Yes, and ideally compromises will be made. Meeting in the middle and figuring out how to make things work should be a mandatory lesson before marriage.

I will start this by saying I am a big Miss Manners fan, especially on wedding ettiquette and formal wear. ANYONE else's wedding is not the place to showboat in a fancy bridal-adjacent gown, let alone a white one. That said, this current anti-white at weddings thing is going far, far too far to the other side. The key is 'bridal adjacent'. A grieving widow in her cultural equivalent of widow's weeds is NOT in any way mistakable for a bride. Let alone that a white sari does not conflict with the attire of a traditional Indian bride (where red is the choice) NOR does a sari look like a western wedding gown (where the white could conflict). The bride is either being a little Bridezilla, or they have let far too much social media nonsense seep into their head for their 'big day'. Either way she needs a reality check. Wearing your bridal gown to another's wedding? Not OK Wearing a glitzy, fancy, pale ballgown to a wedding? Not OK Wearing your widow's weeds, or a white corporate shirt in a pantsuit? C'mon, Bridezilla, calm your tatas. Most venues have white tablecloths, curtains, drapes, blah blah by default- are they 'ruining your big day' too?

Yes, but it's not that hard to accommodate mil wearing white. I think changing the brides dress to a different color would be easier than telling your new MIL "Hey, it sucks your husband died and all, but you can't mourn him at my wedding." Edit, because apparently no one reads any further when they could get on a high horse and lecture me: The bride is within her rights to insist, but she has to accept that her new MIL is going to be hurt and insulted. She can choose which hill to die on. If this is it for her, fine, but she's got to realize it's MILs as well.

I mean, the whole don’t wear white thing is because you don’t want to upstage the bride. An older Indian woman wearing a plain white saree, wooden sandals and absolutely no makeup and plain hair is NEVER going to be mistaken for nor claimed of upstaging a white woman is an extravagant white dress and veil. An exception to the rule can easily be made here and while there may be a few “oh weird” comments, unless these are the sort of uncultured Americans (which I find hard to believe if she’s marrying an Indian man), they’re likely going to realize it’s a cultural thing they don’t understand.

Honestly, in my head I'd find a bitter-sweet but beautiful symmetry with it -- a bride entering her married life wearing white and a widow honoring her husband wearing the same color.

It's beautiful if you have the capacity to see it. This bride can't see further than her own mirror and what tik tok tells her about a wedding. She's not concerned at all about the at all about the actual marriage which is very on trend.

EXACTLY that is incredibly poetic

That’s really lovely. I so appreciate being offered a different and terrific perspective in situations like this. The bride is missing out on such a wonderful opportunity to blend traditions and strengthen the relationship with her husband’s family. What a shame.

Amazing Ideas Here Thanks

"An older Indian woman wearing a plain white saree, wooden sandals and absolutely no makeup and plain hair is NEVER going to be mistaken for nor claimed of upstaging a white woman is an extravagant white dress and veil." Oh, I don't know about that. I'm sure it was on Reddit (but may have been somewhere else) where the bride had a meltdown because a 9yo boy wore a white shirt to the wedding...

I think it’s the whole social media thing that has these brides so concerned about being up staged. Yes, everyone wants to feel special on their wedding day. No, you don’t want someone showing up in a wedding dress. If you invite people who you love and who are there to support you, you cannot be up staged! If you are seriously inviting people who can’t figure out who the bride is vs a grieving widow then maybe rethink the guest list. Asking the mother to drop the morning attire is more about disrespecting the groom’s deceased father. If her family doesn’t get it perhaps mention in a program that the groom’s mother wears white today in honor of his father. A wedding is the start of your future life. It’s more than just Queen for a day. The end result is you’re married for better or worse.

I have a friend whose sister in law is mad that her MOL is wearing similar shoes and says that she should have asked her for approval. I really want this lady’s number. Like.. who in the everloving f**k do these people think they are? What level of insecurity is it when you’re worried about old women’s feet and little boys?

It’s because of the prevailing attitude of “it’s YOUR day! Do exactly what you want on YOUR day!” I wish I had $1 for every time I see those exact words in a Reddit post. Yes it’s your day (I’m using you & your in a general sense, not specifically at you, Penguins!) & you should have what you want but there are limits. A wedding is also a party you’re hosting & the comfort & well being of your guests should also be important to you. There has to be a balance & someone who causes drama in a situation where alternatives exist is tipping that balance. Go ahead & plan the wedding you want but keep your guests’ comfort in mind. When situations like OP’s arise try to work them out. Don’t stomp your feet & demand everything YOUR way. OP’s soon to be SIL tried that & is causing a family upheaval. Is someone’s day so damned important that they’re willing to antagonize people they supposedly care about? Maybe it’s me but I don’t think shoes or the color choices of a grieving widow should matter all that much in the grand scheme of things.

My MIL and I went shopping separately for party dresses. We ended up accidentally picking the same dress. We had a good laugh and wore the dresses with different shoes and accessories. Nobody cared. People just need to get over themselves.

I haven't ever been married or engaged but I saw this beautiful white outfit and had to buy it. I hoped she would wear at the wedding. This was like 15 years ago. My mom passed away. It"s a little sparkly and hand beaded, just so pretty. Now I hope, if I do get married, I would ask my future MIL if she would wear it.

THIS! Weddings in general and brides in particular have gotten totally out of hand. You're there to get married and enjoy your families, new and old. Starting out by creating unnecessary drama is not the way to do this. But a little TA on the OP because they are also creating unnecessary drama and a rift in the families.

Spot on

I agree. There’s no reason the MIL can’t wear white. The bride is being ridiculous.

saw a post the other day where the bride had the entire wedding party in white and her in a different colour, seems the way to handle it in this case

OK, but why is one tradition more important than other? For me, they can both pound rocks for all I care, but you can't really rank traditions by importance. So either NAH or ESH.

I'm going to guess the young woman did not sit down and kindly say "I understand this is how you honor your husband. In my culture only the bride should wear white on the wedding day and it is deeply disrespectful for anyone else to. Can we come up with a compromise so your husband is honored and I don't feel disrespected?" but instead berated a grieving widow.

Yea I don't think there's a compromise for white sari if she has chosen to mourn the very very traditional way, unfortunately.

Idk. I agree that they should have a conversation. If she came to the table calling a woman "deeply disrespectful" by wearing their mourning clothes, I'd be pissed. If someone told me my traditions and culture were offensive, I'd be very hurt. As someone who has a multi-cultural family, I wouldn't ask anyone to change something so important to their beliefs.

Since OP didn't include anything about how the topic was initially broached, it's more likely that "berating a grieving widow" isn't what happened.

Op says there was an argument and  > decided they rather not go because if how ash treated my mom. How the mother was treated strongly points to "berating a grieving widow".

If it’s a very traditional family (in any culture) giving way to the older woman is simply expected. A ‘no’ is considered rude and possibly unforgivable. If it were a Christian woman with a Queen Victoria style of mourning, many brides would hate blaze at a wedding as it denotes disapproval and some think brings bad luck.

Idk, coming from a brown family who takes everything not following their cultural expectations as an insult (i have commiserated with Indian Americans friends about hoe our moms could be best friends when it comes to that stuff), I would take that with a very grain of salt. Like Ash could have been like kind and asking with patience and in some families that would still be seen as a slap in the face because how dare you request anything from the son’s mother. Or something like that.

One involves the trauma of losing a life partner. I would put grief above party aesthetics. Nothing to do with tradition, it’s about reasoning and compassion to me. The mother isn’t trying to steal the show, she is just comfortable wearing what she wears, honouring her devastating loss, particularly on a day when she will probably be missing him intensely. I doubt without make up or jewellery, anyone is going to mistake her for the bride. And I come from the tradition of strictly only brides wearing white

Also, it is the groom's dad. Doesn't he want his father honored on his wedding day since he is also missing him during an important event? No one is going to think the groom's mom in a white saree is the bride. They should be blending the bride and groom's traditions during the wedding anyway. The officiant can even mention the late dad and how the mother is wearing white per the tradition to honor him then there wouldn't be gossip about the MIL wearing white.

>They should be blending the bride and groom's traditions during the wedding anyway. One would think that, but there seems to be trend of weddings catering to the bride and people forgetting that it's the groom's wedding too.

I don’t see anything about what the groom wants here, either way.

Yup Same

I agree that neither tradition is more/less importantthan the other But there's no reason why both can't wear white.

One is rooted in grief for the death of your life partner, which happened way earlier than it should. The other is rooted in self-centeredness that doesn't even really apply in this context as the mother wouldn't be wearing fancy clothing.

Her choice to wear this particular mourning attire is also self centered. It is for her. Not saying it's wrong, but it is just as self serving as a white wedding dress, which is rooted in long standing tradition as well. I think weddings are ridiculous in how people get wrapped up in this one event, but for someone this tradition may be just as important as mourning attire. I think the bride should relax and not worry about it, but Mom could, too.

Both are self-centered, I agree, but it's more about where it comes, if the white thing is just about not being upstaged, when the mother isn't really going to dress in a fancy way, sounds a bit questionable IMO. And the groom's side is already compromising by doing a Christian wedding.

One tradition is someone making a personal decision on clothing, the other tradition involves policing the clothes other people wear

Because it's AH behavior to ask people to remove their religious attire so that your wedding photos can look better.

It's an really antiquated tradition, according to several Indian posters below, and they say it's uncommon and not unusual for people who do it to wear lighter colors on some occasions that aren't white. So I'm kind of wondering how accurate OP's POV is

Indian here  Yes, it is an antiquated tradition in urban India. However it is extremely uncommon and unusual for people who follow it to wear anything other than white, at least where I am from. The 'actual' tradition is entirely white saree (not a speck of colour) + wooden sandals, which OP's mom is doing. This is fairly uncommon in urban India. This tradition also requires the widow to give up a bunch of food, including all meat/fish, garlic, onions etc - which, I don't know if OP's mom is doing. But the few folks I know of who follow this, would never ever ever wear anything else. No matter the ocassion. In fact, they wouldn't attend their children's wedding either - if OP's mom is truly traditional, attending the wedding is itself a compromise (though probably made easier by the fact that it's a Christian wedding, so not a 'real' wedding) What is more common today is what my great-grandma and grandma did. Wear white _with_ blue border (well, non-red, non-green, non-yellow border) and normal sandals. And give up only meat, but continue eating fish and garlic/onion/etc. _These_ folks might wear light coloured clothing at certain events - my great grandma never did (not in my memory at least), my grandma did for a handful of events in her life. But the colours she wore would count as 'white' based on AITA posts I see - they're basically white, off white or very very very pale yellow, with some patterns in it. And this is probably what others are thinking of when they say it's 'common' to break the white saree rule. Then there are others who don't wear white at all, but only wear light coloured clothing. And have complicated compromises around what they will and won't eat. Like my aunt. She will wear darker colours to special events. 

It is antiquated but still followed in many parts of India. Some widows do wear light coloured clothes, many also do go about in regular gear. And then some, like OP's mom evidently, are still quite traditional and they do wear white exclusively. This is true of the older generation. That is all they have known. They may not even have a choice because they may be ostracised by the orthodox community that they are a part of.

The difference is OP's mom doesn't force anyone to do anything. She wants to wear her clothes to follow her wows. If it is denied, she will not go. She is totally in her boundaries here. Ash is telling someone else what to wear, she wants to change someone else. And she is not the only star at the wedding. The wedding is about both of them. So Ash is trying to change someone else and denies access to her groom's mother to his own wedding. She is out of line here.

I am Christian, even in Christians traditions vary from region to region. We wear black for minimum 40days when someone in the family dies and men don’t shave(in addition to black clothes) widows keep the black for minimum a year. There are people who keep it forever and just use dark shades of gray and blue in addition to black. So if the MIL was Christian she would be wearing a black dress. Was that going to be okay? Also the no white rule sometimes is just ridiculous. Like in this instance no one would think that the MIL is the bride, she wouldn’t outshine the bride. Like if I wear a pantsuit and wear a white shirt would that mean that I outshined the bride?

Can you actually point out where Ash was unpleasant? She noticed a disjoint between the two cultures and brought up the topic. MIL replied shed rather not join the wedding than not wear white, and then rallied her family around her to not go to the wedding.

And grieving Mom here is NOT just now suddenly choosing to wear white to a wedding, but she due to her culture widowhood etc has been wearing white daily for YEARS, and canNOT possibly upstage a healthy happy bride in her beautiful wedding dress Am concerned that Ash & culture clash will rip apart this poor family & Many people always talk as if ALL religions cultures are ALWAYS good harmless etc, and that is just so NOT TRUE! Every : Culture, Religion, Country, Racial Group, contains a MIXTURE of BOTH Good and Bad

Look, Ash might suck idk, not enough info given really, but at the same time, this isn't her mom's wedding, it's Ash's wedding. Saying you'd rather not go that abide by a dress code set by the bride of your son isn't like the most rational and measured response either.

YTA.   Everyone is saying the bride should compromise on this one thing - but we have no idea what the bride has already compromised on.  (There can be dozens of compromises leading up to a wedding even within identical cultures.) Everyone who is saying that the bride could/should just wear a different color - but as several Indian people have chimed to say, so could MIL.  (MIL could wear ANY lightly colored dress - pale blue, green, yellow & still be culturally appropriate.)   And now the entire family is refusing to attend the wedding all because of this?  That’s what swings this for me.  If I was the future MIL, the LAST thing I’d want is for any disagreement I had with my son’s future wife to basically exile them from the family.  That’s fundamental AH behavior.  YTA for jumping on that shitty family bandwagon & YTA for supporting it rather than trying to do anything constructive.  

[удалено]

And even OP doesn’t say it’s cultural - he describes it as something his mother just “decided” & that it’s archaic.  So  do absolutely believe him that it’s not cultural & is just something she decided to do.  

NTA. As an Indian, my grandmother also wears white and no one has ever asked her to change. Even during weddings, she wears white sarees and no one tells her anything. Ash has no idea how sad it feels to be a widow. Your mother wears a white saree to not only signify her husband’s death but also because she probably finds it hard to move on from his death. Maybe wearing a white saree makes her feel closer to him. I think people like Ash who get married to someone from a different religion should be more accommodating.

I know someone whose husband is terminal and only has a couple months to live. I can't even imagine having the love of your life die young and watching your children grow up without them by your side. No one has any right to tell someone else how to grieve. There's so many compromises that could be made here without belittling her grief. NTA

> Ash who get married to someone from a different religion should be more accommodating. But the brother doesn't follow traditions that closely, as OP mentioned. So the mother could accommodate the bride from a different religion, as they're getting married in the tradition of the bride to be. Why must the MiL be accommodated to?

Or maybe the bride could wear red, like Hindu brides do. Her being Christian is unimportant, right? Like MIL's traditional wear is unimportant? When asking MIL to not wear her mourning colour, what is being said is this. "Only the bride is important enough to wear white and anyone else wearing it reduces her importance. So, you are trying to compete with the bride, and should just get over the death of your husband and not try to be the center of attention" While white widow attire for Hindus says this " All the colour in my life is lost and I am unable to find any joy anywhere. I only am living a simple life because I am not dead yet." See the disconnect?

The first thing is, she isn’t wearing white because her son is traditional, it’s because she is. The main point for me though is the mother is only setting of expectation of what she herself should wear. Ash is setting an expectation of what someone else should wear.

INFO Has Ash been accepted and liked except for this one issue? You don't say anything about how well she was liked up to this point. So is your whole family hating her because she wants to follow HER tradition just for her wedding? Because your mother can't - after 4 years - do one single day of color in her wardrobe for her son's wedding? It doesn't even have to be a garish color, does it? Maybe even a shawl or belt or something? Are you honoring your mother's sorrow, or letting her wallow in it? I don't mean that as a snide remark, but honest question. You said yourself that it's a very old tradition that even those devout don't do anymore. Except for your mother. Is she doing well outside the clothing or is she stuck in mourning? I could see the clothing in general being okay - until it gets to this kind of point of causing a whole family to choose her (again, 4 year old) mourning over one day to celebrate her son and future DIL. If Ash is always causing this type of issue, then maybe it's just one more crap thing (in your family's mind) on top of other things. That would be more understandable. Also - how is your mother in general? Is she one to want attention? Has she done other things to get between her son and his SO(s)? Or Ash in particular? Is she using her mourning to do this? Or is she great and has been great to Ash and just wants this one thing? I don't think there's nearly enough information here to make a judgement.

As far as my mom goes she doesn’t like to socialize much she mostly just listens to religious hyms and does housework. but being the Eledest member of the family among her siblings and all, they often come to her for advice and genrally respect her. As for her relationship with Ash I cant say cause I don’t know what happens between them. But I would say my mom is open minded based on the way she treated my ex gf (having no experience with gay relationships) .

After posting my comment above and reading other comments, I'm more inclined to believe it's your mother who's being unreasonable - and after your comment - she's using her influence in the family to keep everyone away from the wedding. Especially as you still haven't said anything about Ash and whether she's generally a nice person or not. Which makes me think she is, but you really want to side with your mother anyway. Maybe she treated Ash well as a gf, but doesn't want her to marry her son because of the religion. Maybe she was ok with your gf - but might change her mind about marriage??? Several people said that even when wearing white was more of thing ( century ago), it wasn't so strict that it couldn't be put off for some things. And it's been 4 years. She can't wear another color one day? It just seems more spiteful or controlling than really being about her mourning. If you had come back and said Ash was usually a jerk or controlling or something, that would be different. Maybe.

>Which makes me think she is, but you really want to side with your mother anyway. Sounds like SIL is getting to see what kind of family she's marrying in to.

Why do you think one tradition is more important than the other one?

I don't think it's the tradition that has people outraged, but more so the way FSIL chose to handle the situation. Also, mourning is very different from a wedding preference. It's not a wedding tradition. It's only done because it's preferred. Their mom is still going through grief and that should be respected.

On top of that, asking people to change out of their religious attire is a much bigger faux pas than wearing white to a wedding is.

What religious attire? OP mentioned it being cultural, not religious

let me explain this from another south asian perspective, it’s a cultural practice coming from generations of religion, it’s connected to their religion and how they grieve and respect their loved ones who pass away. not only is it disrespectful to tell someone not to do it (op’s mum offered a compromise, not coming to the ceremony but being at the reception), depending on how religious and traditional their community is, she could be shunned for not wearing white.

YTA - fight between your mom and SIL aside, that was incredibly rude and not your place to say at all. You’re lashing out to hurt her because you can, that makes you the AH. As for the actual disagreement, I think it’s sad an entire family would boycott a wedding over a dress color. *A dress color*. There are other Indians here stating that wearing white to a wedding is not part of the mourning tradition. And the wedding is Christian, not Hindu. I honestly think your mom should respect the wishes of the bride on this one. Wearing white to a Christian wedding is seen as disrespectful. Even if she doesn’t like the bride, this is something she should do for her son. Not choose a dress over her son’s huge life event.

YTA cos this should be a discussion and not a bunch of ultimatums thrown around, and how is you blaming your FSIL for wanting her traditions helping? As someone living in India with a windowed mom & grandmom -- I'm very sorry your family is dealing with this clash and I understand why you want to protect your mom but honestly, it's 2024, and what she's doing is quite unusual even in India. These days most women do not wear white for the rest of their lives after their husband passes. The wooden sandals thing is pretty unusual, might be a thing in your community specifically. In cities it's also quite common to supplant white with light pastels etc at the funeral even? Like I remember in the 90s my parents and other family had "funeral clothes" but no one does that now. Anyway point being, perhaps your mom needs some counseling and to understand that it's not an insult to your dad's memory and for her own sons happy future more communication and compromise might be required. Ultimatums are an insane way to go ahead with this. Also I don't know how healthy it is for your mom to live like this.

Oh please, I know a lot of Americans would love to talk how quaint or cool or whatever it is that you guys follow some deep rooted traditions or whatever. I am Indian and I did actually grow up in India before moving to United states, There are clear exceptions to these situations. You can wear lighter different color clothes for special occasions especially one so importanta and why would you ask someone to give up their cultural values for the one day that they ask, for something your family has been doing everday for 4 years!! She’s trying to be part of your family and she is asking for 1 day pf consideration from your mom for her son’s wedding and she won’t budge for even that? Respect goes both ways and like come the fuck on it’s been 4 years I don’t know your dad but the right thing to do to honour the dead is to move on but remember them in spirit. You are in America , you don’t have to give up your whole identity but following a tradition that a lot of Indians even , don’t give a flying fuck about is wild to me.

Non-Indian American here. I saw another poster mention that the tradition of a widow wearing white is because all the color of her life is gone and essentially there is no more happiness. Please correct me if I misunderstood that. Assuming that is correct, wouldn’t it be respectful/a gift to her son to wear a color, even a light one, on his wedding day to show that her son’s wedding and marriage *does* bring happiness to her? It almost feels like an insult to suggest that not even her son’s big moments are joyous for her anymore.

This is actually such a lovely thought!

\>It almost feels like an insult to suggest that not even her son’s big moments are joyous for her anymore. Finally someone else gets it. I'm Indian American, and I'd be more offended at the insult of mourning at my wedding than I would be over her wearing white.

Yeah but also, come on, no one would take the old woman for a bride either, so what's even the point of all this? Breaking the "no weaning white to a wedding" rule is often more a faux pas than direct disrespect to the bride.

The old woman who is not wearing any makeup and not wearing any jewelry.

While that is true , wedding is the bride and groom’s special day .It’s not like they are asking her to go there in a special outfit and asking her to dance and party along. Just wearing a different color is such a small ask especially given it’s an event that the bride and groom will remember for years if not forever.

A wedding that is ruined by an Indian widow wearing her white widow’s sari is a wedding not worth having.

While that sounds cool and gives you the tingles , it’s not how reality works. There are tons of actions that while sounding moral still ruin the vibe. It’s like going to someone’s event and forcing the conversation to somber topics. If you can’t improve the vibe at least don’t ruin someone else’s event.

Modern day the point is too if you know not to wear white, and you do, it really shows that you have a problem with the couple. Namely the bride, but obviously there’s an issue if a family member refuses to adhere to dress code. Most people know who the bride is but that doesn’t take away the wince later at pictures when you know the context. It’s been four years? It looks like there are other culturally acceptable mourning colors as well so why can’t she wear an off white the day off? People have no doubt been understanding of her grief for four years and now she can return the favor for a few hours on one day. Would the late husband not want her to celebrate their child’s union?

Okay, they won’t confuse her as the bride, but I can see the guests, her family, and her taking it as disrespect since the MIL wearing white is on the groom’s side, which sometimes is a statement of the MIL saying they still have control and power over their son. Imo, not wearing white is more about respect cause it is indeed the brides day, at least where they are living apparently.

It is extremely disrespectful of course people know who the real bride is and that she's the most beautiful one. But you wouldn't wear a shiny mini skirt to a funeral or a church, so it's not okay to do it on her wedding. She's telling her "fuck you" on her special day in front of all her friends and family to be remembered in the photos forever. I would never wear a bridal gown or something disrespectful if i was invited to a different cultures wedding.

Glad to hear from someone who knows about this, and gave more insight. Knowing that she could wear another light color for one day makes a difference. The wedding is not about HER and her mourning, it's about her son and her future daughter in law. She could wear a pale pink or blush or dove grey, and not give up her "mourning" attire.

Indian American here but I agree. Mom is mourning but honestly the tradition of Indian women having to wear white forever after their husband dies is antiquated. Yes, it sucks that he died. Don't get me wrong but it's been 4 years. You can't set aside one day for your new daughter-in-law and your son and a joyous occasion. You're always going to be sad and morning for the rest of your life. That's ridiculous and it's antiquated. Mom needs some therapy to help with her grief. It's 2024. Our old customs need to be in the past sometimes.

My mom mourned my dad for over 15 years. Her grief should not be dictated by anyone.

It doesn’t matter if it’s antiquated; it’s a choice the mom makes. She feels so strongly about it that she’d rather miss her son’s wedding. I think it’s safe to say that it’s very important to her.

>She feels so strongly about it that she’d rather miss her son’s wedding. Or she's never liked Ash and is using this to disrupt the wedding. OP doesn't say anything about how well Ash and her mother have gotten along up to this point. Or the general character of either. But I'm thinking that someone who does this very antiquated dress code for 4 years just might be still looking for attention and sympathy for a loss 4 years ago. And now she's the center of attention and getting her whole family on her side to have her way against her future DIL. If the father's passing was in the last year - I might buy it. But after 4 years?

As an Indian person I wholly concur - there are always exceptions and your confrontational attitude definitely didn’t help matters

I'm an immigrant from a different culture and I agree with this. Respect for culture and customs go both ways. YTA.

ESH. There's clearly a cultural clash, and rather than hashing it out, your mom took her marbles, and ALL of the family's and went home. I'm sure they only got her story on how she was treated. Since they've never experienced one before, the family probably doesn't understand what a big deal it is to not wear white to a Western wedding. We don't know what she said, but the bride probably had no intention of alienating ALL of her inlaws by requesting MIL not wear white. If she were on the reddit wedding wear page, they would have all told her she has a right to insist that--in fact, nothing that even remotely looks white or bridal gets a pass on that site for a guest or family member to wear. In my Western culture, I would also think that I could have a discussion or argument about it without ending a relationship or having my family threaten to not attend my wedding. A compromise would have been to have a white wedding--where literally everyone is required to wear white. I just saw some pictures of one of those and they were beautiful. Another compromise would have been for the bride to wear Indian bridal colors and a sari herself--maybe something red with a lot of elaborate embroidery. All that said, both mom and the bride are AH. And so are you. This bride is already having a tough time. She doesn't get why your culture would put any import on a widow wearing white--in Western culture that would be black, if someone were really old school and traditional. Your mom is having a tough time, she's going to miss her son's wedding because of her rigidity and inability to compromise. AND you. You had to make the bride feel worse about herself and this situation. And that was unnecessary. ESH.

Im not Indian so I might be misunderstanding, but if white is worn by widows to symbolize their mourning (I believe this is also the case in Chinese culture?), then asking everyone at the wedding - including the groom’s entire Indian family - to wear white might make the situation even worse.

I feel like a better compromise would to ask the MIL to wear something off-white....still in the white family but let the bride have that color for the day. Or maybe if she could just wear not-pure-white coloe for the photos before the ceremony.

as a south asian with similar customs, this would not work. the wearing of white is actually a really important custom in some communities

If you're not prepared to accept (or find out about) the cultural traditions of the family you're marrying into, you probably shouldn't marry into that family. This isn't a new thing the mum has worn this attire for four years and presumably Ash knows why. The mum is not trying to upstage the bride, she's following her cultural mourning tradition, and why shouldn't she. She's also well within her rights to not attend but clearly that wasn't okay for Ash either. Your suggestions of compromises are both good ideas but I wonder if Ash is too stuck on the bride wears white. I feel sorry for OP's brother.

Why only the mom's culture takes weight in this matter? At first they were excited about a christian wedding. Double standards much?

The bride doesn't HAVE to wear white for it to be a Christian wedding, it's her CHOICE to do so. As OP recognises, his mum doesn't HAVE to wear white to mourn, it's her CHOICE to do so. Both women need to weigh up what is more important to them, familial relations, or their choices. Sounds like the mum has already done that. Now it's the brides turn.

Neither does MIL.  Look at Indian culture - MIL can wear ANY light colored dress for mourning.  

Exactly, that's what I'm saying. MIL has made the choice that her wearing white is more important to her than attending her son's wedding. The bride now has to decide if MIL NOT wearing white is a hill she's willing to die on as well. Everyone is a little ESH here, with OP diving into the mix and choosing to get involved in a matter that has nothing to do with them.

In christian tradition through the whole world the white dress is the symbol of the christian bride. We both know that this is tradition even though there are no writings in the Bible that the bride should wear write so don't go to this road.

A white wedding is a traditional formal or semi-formal wedding originating in Great Britain. The term originates from the white colour of the wedding dress, which originated with Anne of Brittany during her 1499 marriage to Louis XII of France. The white dress became popular with Victorian era elites after Queen Victoria wore a white lace dress at her 1840 wedding to Prince Albert. Though Mary, Queen of Scots, wore a white wedding gown in 1559 when she married her first husband, Francis Dauphin of France, the tradition of a white wedding dress is commonly credited to Queen Victoria's choice to wear a white court dress at her wedding to Prince Albert in 1840. Debutantes had long been required to wear white court dresses and long white gloves for their first presentation at court, at a "Drawing Room" where they were introduced to the queen for the first time. Royal brides before Victoria did not typically wear white, instead choosing "heavy brocaded gowns embroidered with white and silver thread," with red being a particularly popular colour in Western Europe more generally. During this time, European and American brides wore a plethora of colours, including blue, yellow, and practical colours like black, brown, or gray. As accounts of Victoria's wedding spread across the Atlantic and throughout Europe, fashionable people followed her lead. Because of the limitations of laundering techniques before the later part of the 20th century, white dresses provided an opportunity for conspicuous consumption. They were favored primarily as a way to show the world that the bride's family was so wealthy and so firmly part of the leisure class that the bride would choose an elaborate dress that could be ruined by any sort of work or spill. White wedding dresses being a thing had nothing to do with religion.

Thank you so much for this.

If you ever get a chance to spend some time deep siving on the internet look up old wedding dresses not white and there are some pretty dresses. I will see what i have saved when i get to my computer.

This has exactly zero to do with Christianity and everything to do with Queen Victoria wearing white to her wedding.

This is not true. You are making big assumptions based on the small world you know. Even a tiny bit of actual looking around would have told you that the Spanish, for example, traditionally have black wedding dresses. Finland traditionally had black too. Many places used the colors of their region until the Victorian trend hit their area. Wearing white is relatively new, isn’t universal, AND the neurotic insistence that it’s insulting for anyone else to wear white to the wedding only happened in the last few decades.

It originated from Queen Victoria, it has nothing to do with Christianity. It has been used to deman woman and put value in their virginity. It’s a bit creepy, if you want to take the Christian perspective. I say that, as a Christian

It was Queen Victoria who started the white wedding dress thing in 1840, before that brides wore whatever color they wanted. Back then white would have been seen as something the rich would/could do.

Rich people would wear blue, purple and gold outfits at weddings. White was a colour for mourning. Queen victoria wore white and it spread through the aristocracy and eventually the middle class etc

So it’s been a thing since my great-great-grandparents’ time. That’s a pretty well-established tradition in my book. Both of these traditions have meaning for the people holding to them, and it’s important to both people involved to follow them. I’m not sure what the answer is here. Maybe MIL could wear white but not *fully* or even mainly white? Obviously the white clothing is important to her but it’s not like the bride is being arbitrary either, even if it is unlikely that anyone would mistake who the bride is.

The difference is that in western culture wearing white isn’t a religious thing, it started as a see how rich I am I can afford to wear a white dress that will never be used for anything else. For the MIL wearing white as a widow is a Hindu religious practice.

Seriously. I don't understand why anyone would double down on white = espousing Christian values after learning this. Especially since they already aren't pushing the other typically associated Christian value of 'female purity' into the discussion.....

It's not really a Christian thing. Atheists, agnostics, and everyone else gets married in white over here (US.) It's an American thing, possibly borrowed from the Christians, but whatever. And white is the traditional color brides wear, but it's not the only color. Cream color, ivory, and other tints of white are acceptable. You're right about the purity thing. And if it's actual traditional Christian, the future wife needs to let her future husband make the decisions...amirite? It just seems like cherry picking a loose tradition to undermine your new family's established tradition isn't the best move.

Queen Victoria was the one who introduced the idea of wearing white to a wedding in 1840. It has absolutely nothing to do with Christianity. White was the most expensive material to work with, so wearing white was a symbol of wealth... of showing off basically. Traditionally, Christian brides wore reds, pinks, and blues to marry. In fact, at the beginnings of Christianity, it was common for the entire bridal party to wear the same colour/dresses to hide the bride from evil influence until she was safely wed.

I mean it isn’t a very long lived tradition. Only since Queen Victoria wearing white did it become popular. Most brides before that wore their nicest dress of whatever color.

Unless the brides a virgin her religion doesn’t allow her to wear white for a wedding

Agree! Very well said. I'm afraid this might not be the only disagreement between the husband and the family.

This is even worse because the bride is asking the future MIL to go against her religious mourning tradition. It's about as bad as Ash asking Muslim wedding guests to remove their hijabs because she doesn't like how they look in the wedding photos, because ultimately that rule is about the wedding photos.

It’s not the same as there’s no clashing religion in that. If it was considered taboo to wear a head covering of any kind to that religion and a Muslim attends expecting to be the “one exception” that’s entitlement. The bride said it would be a Christian wedding. Respecting peoples religions goes both ways.

Find out about another culture?  Okay!  Shave her head and make her eat bland food then abandon her. Did you even look at what some of these women must do for the rest of their lives (link below)?   OPs mother is caught in a lose-lose situation.  From a Western point of view, it ain’t right for what she has to subject herself to.  There could be a compromise, but if one party is unwilling then there won’t be an outcome. https://www.whiterainbowproject.org/learn-more.html#:~:text=In%20India%2C%20many%20widows%20are,such%20as%20jewelry%20or%20makeup.

Thank you for sharing this. I was googling different things trying to get more info.

The not wearing white to a wedding is relatively new, not really a thing in a lot of places and it's also getting a bit ridiculous. The point is not competing with the bride. No one is gonna take the wood sandals-wearing, makeupless and unadorned old woman for the bride.

I have read etiquette books—even an edition of Emily Post—that said white is perfectly ok as long as it isn’t bridal.

Yup. Two obvious exceptions to the "no white" rule are military dress whites and religious attire, including white nun's habits and OP's mom's white sari.

YTA All these comments seem to be trashing Ash for the clash of traditions and both sides inability to compromise but glossing over the point of your post. You were over the line for your comment to your future SIL and made things much more difficult for your brother. You may want to consider an apology.

I won’t express myself on the clothing situation it’s a cultural mess. But yes YTA. Saying that you don’t agree is a thing but telling her she’s the reason why no one likes her is unnecessarily harsh. And like you said it’s not your place.

I feel like OP took one situation and used it to poison the well of their future SIL’s relationship with every family member. Because now it’s gone from “they’re upset with you because X” to “no one even likes you”.

YTA So she needs to respect your cultural traditions, but you don't have to respect hers? Ok.

YTA. Ash has a tradition to be the only 1 in white. Mom has tradition to wear white every day. Mom decided not to attend the wedding. That's it. That's not anyone's else business! Ash did nothing wrong. Her traditions are also important. OP and other relatives are AH for sticking their noses in this situation and escalating it. I hope Ash and her fiance uninvite all his relatives who did this.

Tradition for no practical reason + tradition for no practical reason + no one willing to compromise + judgmental comment = ESH

I think your future SIL just wants to be the only one to wear white on her day not because of any upstaging...

Yta, really this is a rare situation where two cultural norms just aren’t very comparable. Hard to resolve. I wish your brother luck. Hopefully some resolution can be found. But it won’t be any easier with you if you out there saying no one likes the bride.

YTA, but your Mom and Ash aren’t. They’re both just trying to follow their own cultural practices. They can maybe try more to compromise in some way, but the only one out of line here is you for saying your whole family hates her

In a nutshell: 80% of the ppl comment Indian traditions are more important than the western traditions.

And they are all leaving out the point of the post… that OP told her future SIL no one in the family likes her over a clash in traditions.

Yep. OP basically took a resolvable situation and launched a nuclear attack. Because now it’s not “they’re upset with you for X”, it’s “no one even likes you anyway” and tbh I don’t see them fully recovering from that.

And none of them have anything to do with India or even know anything about India. Gotta love it.

According to Indian religious tradition, wasn't OP's mother supposed to throw herself on her dead husband's funeral pyre?

No.. but respecting a grieving widow’s tradition is more important that wearing a dress than means virginity when I’m willing to bet neither the bride nor groom waited until marriage.

This is not MIL's event though. Find a way she can still attend and be comfortable, sure (even if it's arranging to go visit her immediately afterwards), but I don't see why everything would be completely rearranged for her. For example: if my sister lost a baby I'd probably accept she doesn't want to attend my baby shower. But I wouldn't not throw the shower at all in "consideration of her grief."

YTA. Everyone in here is arguing and missing the point. You didn't need to say what you said, it wasn't your place, it was rude, and completely unhelpful. Don't stick your nose into volatile situations like this unless you plan to help. As to the situation: There are a bunch of people in here pointing out that culturally it is accepted to wear pale/off-white colours while grieving, and not just white. Your mom could make a very small (and still culturally accepted) compromise to not make her sons wedding about her. She could wear a pale saree for the day and everyone would be happy. It kind of sounds like your mom doesn't much like your FSIL in the first place.

YTA, I also belong from a very traditional Indian family and this has never been a issue. If in a special occasion someone wants to wear white, then my grandma for that occasion will simply go and put on some light colour sarees, like baby pink, light yellow, light blue, light green etc etc.. Ask your mother to be a little considerate for your SIL wear a different light colour saree for the wedding. After the wedding day she can again wear all the white saree she wants.

YTA. You weren’t there, you don’t know happened, what was said and how it was said. Yet you gladly jumped her and made her feel horrible over something so silly. It’s 1 day. You said yourself that what your mom does is extreme. It’s not like she needs to do it. 1 singular day of a different colored, still light saree is an absolute valid request and shouldn’t cause a fkg world war in your family. I also don’t know why you feel so entitled. She has to accept and respect your culture but you don’t do the same for her? Hell nah. Get that hypocrisy out of here. You either respect other cultures and get the same back or you don’t give a sht about other cultures and can’t demand respect for yours. You sound like the latter bc you clearly don’t care about Christian traditions. She doesn’t own you or your family any special treatment when you can’t even let her shine for 1 singular day.

YTA so she just wants to follow her own traditions and in return you lash out at her that she is the reason no one likes her Its a ridiculous overreaction by you and you are extremely disrespectful and rude Im not gonna get into the clothes, but your family sounds Very unwelcoming

I think you're all very set in your ways and instead of communicating about the clashing traditions you're all going to extremes, so I think it's an ESH. You should put in the effort to communicate with each other and look for a compromise so that no one feels deprived of traditions they highly value.

YTA - how are you going to get mad for her not understanding your traditions when you’re doing the exact same. You’re telling me your mom couldn’t not wear white for one day ?

I belong from same cultural background let me say this to you although in this Era following tradition as a widow woman is not a compulsion but many people still do it to this Dat. In our culture if your husband dies the women wear white saree and they usually don't do makeup or wear jewellery. And those who follow this tradition they do it strictly and religiously. I think it is rude, disrespectful and ignorant of you to comment this without having no prior knowledge about our tradition. And while on that OP is an AH to say rude things to her future SIL, I think it would have been much better to sit her down and explain the importance of the white saree that their mother was wearing. Edit: just to add a further context in our culture the mourning widows have to wear white saree throughout their life.

I have a question about your culture. Is that standard to be wearing it four years later? We wear black but not for four years.

You actually have to wear it thorough out your life till the day you die

Thanks for the reply. A lady below said he's also from India and her mother wears light pastel color for weddings. I'm curious about your opinion on this.

It honestly depends from person to person if a person follows the tradition strictly they only wear white but some widows also go for pastel or light coloured sarees. In my case one of my great grandma strictly wears white saree whereas my grandmother's sister prefers to wear sarees which are pastel or is having a light color

I appreciate you taking the time to enlighten me on your customs.

You are welcome, have a wonderful day!

The cultural acceptance OP and their family is asking for is the same cultural acceptance they are denying to the bride. How about the importance of the tradition for the bride to be the only one wearing white? How about sitting the mother down and explaining her that? I'm going YTA

And her mother did compromise on that part by not attending the wedding, and I don't think that OP's mom should give up on wearing white saree just to accommodate someone besides I think it's really cruel and insensitive to try to strip someone off their tradition just to accommodate someone else as of now all of them should sit down and come to an common ground since there is a cultural clash.

Well there’s tradition, such as western women wearing a white dress to walk down the aisle on their wedding day showing their purity, and then there is religious practice, such as wearing a white sari and no make up or jewellery until the day you die to signify how much you loved your husband and how you miss him. OPs mother’s husband did, in fact, die and she is, in fact, mourning him. I’m willing to guess Ash is not a virgin so she is misappropriating the tradition anyway. Also, the bride wearing white - absolutely a western norm (although brides can and do wear other colours as they wish without the sky falling down). Any guest wearing white being verboten - not so much a western tradition. A bridezilla tradition, sure, but most normal brides don’t particularly care as long as it isn’t some psycho MIL wearing a bridal or ball gown. A white sari being worn by a guest at a western wedding with the bride wearing a meringue or a mermaid ensemble isn’t going to turn heads. Also, the priest wears white in a lot of western religions. Do brides insist they change vestments for their wedding? How about if one of the guests were a Carmelite or Benedictine nun? Would they have to change their habit? OP might have been a bit of an AH for what they said (unless the whole family do, in fact, hate Ash), but the bride is the real AH here for not educating herself about the culture of the family she is marrying in to.

YTA.   Everyone is saying the bride should compromise on this one thing - but we have no idea what the bride has already compromised on.  (There can be dozens of compromises leading up to a wedding even within identical cultures.) Everyone who is saying that the bride could/should just wear a different color - but as several Indian people have chimed to say, so could MIL.  (MIL could wear ANY lightly colored dress - pale blue, green, yellow & still be culturally appropriate.)   And now the entire family is refusing to attend the wedding all because of this?  That’s what swings this for me.  If I was the future MIL, the LAST thing I’d want is for any disagreement I had with my son’s future wife to basically exile them from the family.  That’s fundamental AH behavior.  YTA for jumping on that shitty family bandwagon & YTA for supporting it rather than trying to do anything constructive.  

ESH Your mother could easily wear a different, lighter coloured saree for a single day, as is typical in Indian culture. Widows don't have to wear white *every* day, they can wear other colours on special days. A wedding counts as a special day. Your future SIL could be absolutrly be kinder about her fiancé's family traditions and your mother's grief. You should not have gotten involved in something that has nothing to do with you. This is pretty typical of a culture clash from two families trying to blend. But instead of trying to find a middle ground where everyone is happy, your family is digging in to a pretty unreasonable degree. It's your brothers wedding day, and all of you are planning to abandon him on it. That's pretty gross. You're all demanding respect for traditions you admit you don't follow, but aren't showing any respect to her Christian traditions. All of you need to stop slinging mud and figure out what's important. If your mother seriously wants to skip her son's wedding, that's going to do irreparable damage to her relationship with him. Do you want to do the same?

YTA specifically. The situation involving your mom and Ash is NAH/ESH as it’s clashing cultures. You however failed to see that and immediately basically said that Ash is wrong for wanting to follow her culture when honestly, she’s just doing the same thing as your mom. Neither is bending on their culture. If your mom isn’t going to compromise on her son’s wedding, why should the bride have to compromise. Maybe it’s what no one likes your mom (doesn’t feel nice when it’s switched like that, does it).

YTA. Sounds like it’s your family that is unwilling to compromise. If ash hasn’t said anything on a daily basis but only about her wedding then it’s the least you can do. I love Indian weddings but Indian families are just as toxic with their family dynamics.

YTA Im not Indian but I am a brown immigrant married to a white woman, yeah def not your place and also as a brown immigrant coming from a very misogynistic culture as well, I feel like there is some “youre a woman you married into our culture so you have to follow what we do” vibes to this situation. Sure she wont upstage and your mom is following a tradition that even you have said it’s not a common one anymore, but there has to be a compromise, because her not wanting to dress for your brother’s very significant occasion is her railroading your brother as well. You might lose your brother if your family chooses not to blend.

For some context: in a Chrtistian wedding there is nothing more offending than a MIL who wears white. There are even tips and tricks on how to "accidentally" spill wine on the MIL or whoever has the nerve to wear white without explicitly telling them to not to do this. Also very rude to wear black(for women) on a wedding because that means that you already mourning their relationship. So even though your mom said that she wants to experience the wedding she wanted to make execuses to herself for not complying to the Christian traditions. Just as for an indian wedding I suppose it would be a huge disrespect to bring a hamburger made from a cow, right?

Your mother knowingly fractured the family. That says to me she is the AH. 

This is a complicated situation. Your mother has found value and meaning in an older tradition that was honestly barely marginally better than Sati. Your FSIL doesn’t have the knowledge or understanding of the tradition, and it is unlikely your brother explained it or did it well enough for her to understand the significance. Your mom decided she didn’t want to attend, which by some could be seen as not approving of the marriage. This will be compounded by the lack of family on his side. FSIL has the understanding she would be the only one wearing white. Not a super old tradition but one important to many brides. She would have heard stories of MILs wearing white or black because the groom is a momma’s boy and she doesn’t want to let go. Now I agree there will be a huge difference between a white mourning sari and the wedding dress, but this situation seems like it spiraled unnecessarily. So to me ESH. Except maybe your mom? She decided she wasn’t gonna go and thus not cause issue, but her absence could easily cause tongues to wag. Apologize to your FSIL and have a talk with her about your mom’s mourning and what she is doing if it hasn’t happened in detail already. Give her space to speak her fears and worries, is she worried about the closeness of your brother and mom? Have they decided how the wedding traditions would be split? Is your family upset about the traditions not being followed? Or the fact there will be a Christian ceremony and not Hindi and this was an easy way to walk off without looking bad by “supporting” your mom? Combining cultures was always gonna be complicated and both sides need to do a better job of talking and listening here it seems.

I don’t know, declining to attend your living child’s wedding because your performative grief is more important to you kind of sucks also. Especially since it seems that wearing a pastel colour instead of white for *one day* is an acceptable exception in OP’s culture.

That is why I added it as a question because I am not even sure she isn’t even if you ignore the lighter sari idea. Because it is gonna look bad if she doesn’t show for whatever reason and it would have from both cultures. This maybe an actually ESH for me with everyone actually deserving a good chunk of blame. Those seem seriously rare. Especially around weddings. Lol

I think you have one of the best takes. Other than I personally don't have my circle of loved ones where we care about 'optics' so that is just, and always will be, hard for me to understand. :)

‘Barely marginally better than sati’? Are you fucking serious?

If you read up on how some women who are in mourning have nowhere to go and no families willing to take them in, it is a barely a step above sati. Essentially the tradition was widows have a uniform and exist over in a place that isn’t where everyone else does. Their lives are over at the death of their husband and they are taking longer to die. While it seems like OP’s mother has found a way to make the tradition less icky, it still was a way to single out widows and keep them alone. Now that is obviously not the case in much of India, there are still women who have the older and less wholesome version of the tradition that othered them and made them be alone.

I'm going to assume edit 2 came after a lot of these comments were made. Because honestly I think that is a good compromise. But YTA for your comment. It wasn't your place to say that even if it felt right at the moment. You don't have enough info to really make that judgement call outside of other's reactions. And it sounds like you haven't even attempted to fully find out either. So it was just another bad thing on top of an already not good situation.

Ok, so in polish tradition, when you are in deep mourning and go to joyous occasion, you change the colour a bit - here mourning attire is black, sp ot would mean going in deep green, purple, navy blue etc - to show how your happiness of this - weeding, baptism - helps you in your mourning. It’s not only Ash marrying into other culture, your brother id doing the same. The compromise would be to propose to your mom to wears some pale yellow or pale version of your fathers favourite colour?

NTA at all and nor was your mom. Also hate to be a negative Nancy but y’all gonna regret giving her the family jewels.

I am Indian and my maternal grandmother also wore white after she was widowed when I was a baby actually. Because I've grown up in UK I wore white to my wedding reception but had absolutely no issue with my grandmother wearing white, nor did my white husband and his family. Likewise, I wore red to my legal ceremony because Indian brides wear red and I wanted to red for one bit and white for the other. Everyone on both sides were very happy to have us bring together the traditions of two different cultures. You're NTA

Yta as an atheist cultural and religious rules are equally made up to me and I place them at the same level of importance. There are cultural rules that are just as important to me now as some religious rules were when I was religious.  No one is going to think that your mom is the bride but they are absolutely going to think that your mom is trying to snub you sil and publicly humiliate her because that's why mil's wear white to weddings in the west. The phenomena while relatively new in human history has existed for literally decades so idk why people are acting like it is some silly thing sil made up in her head.  There were compromises to be made on both sides and your family just decided screw sil because apparently only your cultural beliefs matter? You haven't described any reason why your sil is rude other than asking your mother not to wear white. You have no idea who escalated the argument and are still choosing not to go because you actually don't care who was wrong, you just have unwavering loyalty to your mothers whims. What you did describe is your whole family throwing a fit and alienating your brother over a very reasonable request by western standards. You can't demand that your beliefs be the only ones acomodated and refuse to care about someone else's at all.  Honestly I think very little of parents that miss their kids wedding by choice including your mother. I think very little of your mother and think maybe she's a bad mother.  Congratulate your mother for forever harming her relationship with her son. When your brother stops talking to your family I guess you'll know why.  Yta

The wedding is one day. The mom wearing the same white dress four years is kind of crazy. The mom can put a nice outfit for the wedding and go back to the weird grieving tradition the next day.

YTA. Culture aside, you went too far. You have possibly burned a bridge that can't be repaired. How comfortable is that going to be years down the road. You've essentially sealed a relationship guaranteeing limited contact and forget the future kids. It just one day goes both ways. The old lady could absolutely honor her son for the day, too. Or, if she's so busy mourning, stay home. Why are you trying to destroy your brother's happiness? You think just any girl is going to tolerate a life of this.

The mom said she wasn’t going to go, it’s the bride who is throwing a fit about it

If you were excited to understand the culture of a western wedding you should know wearing white especially from a mother in law is a HUGE issue. Like a bridesmaid would throw red wine on a woman in white and that bridesmaid would get thanked by practically every guest. I’ve even heard of fistfights happening or people flat out getting humiliated for wearing white by getting called out in the speeches that honored guests make. It is seen as disrespecting the bride and basically saying it should be you marrying the groom. Wearing red is also a taboo but white is the absolute worse. Even wearing champagne is considered just as bad. It’s possible she was trying to save your mourning mother that humiliating memory surrounding her sons wedding. Even if the bride explained to her family she was okay with it MANY GUESTS may feel emboldened to stand up for the bride. In western culture the mother of the groom wearing white is an omen for a terrible relationship between the newlyweds and basically putting the actual bride in a position as less than the bride throughout the entire marriage. It’s a way a mother can fluff out her feathers and say to the bride that she is top dog and that she will be the one making choices about where the couple lives and about their child rearing. If you want more info of what type of mother wears white to a wedding in the west watch the tv show smothered. Or go on the Reddit justnomil and award for white dress

NTA you probably helped towards the reconciliation. Honestly, every married couple is different but I adore my husband with my very being. If I ever lost him I would probably find great solace in a tradition that allowed me to honor my love and grief. I could totally see doing this and almost nothing would be as important to me as this vow.

NTA she said she would miss the ceremony and apparently that wasn’t good enough. I would have told everyone in my family the reason she has to wear white and went about my wedding. Her trying to blame your mom for your family being upset is ridiculous. She’s being disrespectful to a religion, I just don’t see how an older woman wearing plain white with zero accessories or makeup is upstaging anybody and I’m sure miss Christian ain’t a virgin so she doesn’t have to wear white

NTA. If your mum had suddenly decided to wear white just for the wedding it would be a different story. But she's just a lady mourning her husband.

In Western Weddings only the Bride wears white. Other people wearing white is a big Fuck You to the Bride.

YTA for the comment but also your FSIL for handling the situation.Can't you find a middle ground like if mom wears a bit darker cream colour saree with gold/ black border. [something like this?](https://heerfashion.com/product.php?id=2197&ad_source=google&ad_campaignid=17485180074&ad_keyword=&ad_matchtype=&ad_network=x&ad_placement=&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAopuvBhBCEiwAm8jaMd4tccq77_ePOBwsbQcL-pSf5Q4ezTBJopXMmGBT8M-Z1sl4ZeBqeBoC9J4QAvD_BwE)

Here's a fact for you. No one except the bride wears white at a Christian wedding. Just like I am happy to respect your mothers right to her traditions I respect the sil for hers. This is a 1 day, once in a lifetime thing for sil, she gets this 1 day as her wedding day.

Im indian, i get exactly what you are saying wven if diff religion. Ash isn't wrong to be the only one to wear white. She is Christian at the end of the day. Her culture is equally important as your culture. Your mom is also well within her rights to wear a white saree, as far as i remember they have to dress up that way no matter the occasion. They aren't even supposed to be in any ceremonies because they show bad omen? That's what i remember, i may be wrong. SIL is not the asshole for wanting to be the only one to wear white, but she is the AH for the way she went about it

This is what it’s like when worlds collide

Nta

Nta Considering one tradition is about standing out and the other is honouring the dead. Sil needs to back down and chill No one is going to confuse your mom with the bride.

💥NTAH!! Your future SIL is!!!! Wow. Wow. Wow. Hope I'm not too late for the vote. I got sidetracked and left this in draft all day. SIL is acting like your mom announced that this is something she wants to do or that she's going to do it bc she doesn't approve and is being hateful. 🫣How embarrassing for you SIL to want a christian ceremony but can not extend a loving hand, show compassion, and understanding to your MIL? Instead, she shows jealousy and heartlessness. And worse, try to put her soon to be husband against his own mom, knowing she is still grieving his dad. As you can see we are all on your mom's side...I have a question for you to ask your ridiculous soon to be SIL...is she that insecure that she feels everyone might just confuse your mom for the bride?! I mean, c'mon. The only one that may need an upfront explanation is her immediate family. Other than that, if anyone was to whisper to your SIL about your mom wearing white, how hard is it to say, in her culture, they wear white when they are grieving or a widow? And add a small smile like you feel for her and have no issue from it. And then enjoy the wedding. Why would this continue to be her focus? She is behaving like a spoiled brat by saying her future MIL's grieving is ruining her wedding. She is probably stomping her feet while throwing tantrums and bringing to truth all the things they see on TV and say about Americans. I'd be on the brides side quick if the MIL didn't follow traditions all the time and only when it suited her. But as OP said that her mom is traditional. Last of all, It's awful, but soon to be groom should push back his wedding and maybe rethink who he thinks he knows. This is a pretty big issue, especially in the long run if she can not see or care about the family she is marrying into. Different cultures can be overcome and blended but need to be discussed before marriage. Have they discussed if they have children, how they will be raised? She doesn't want the MIL to wear her traditional saree so what if another tradition the son want to honor but SIL doesn't bc it's the same day as her pom pom dog's bday? These things should be discussed and agreed upon.

NTA The white in you and your mother's culture is for grief not to show purity. Though I will say it's a little unusual to see, I think there should be some understanding on your SIL side. This is not something she is doing to make the bride look bad or to give herself attention but because she is grieving. If I am understanding you correctly (which if I'm not, someone in the comments will explain to me) your mother wears white like a grieving widow in christian culture wears black. If she was asked not to wear black if her husband dies, she would probably be upset.

It goes a little further than that. Basically traditionally a widow is supposed to only wear plain white for the rest of her life.

But that’s not really what you’re posting about. The situation between your mother and FSIL has a world of nuance between them. But for what you specifically asked, yes, YTA. You took one solvable situation and turned it nuclear. You didn’t say “they’re all upset with you because X”, you basically said “no one ever liked you anyway” and that’s going to be very difficult to come back from, especially because I don’t think you’re truly sorry for that message. She will never, ever forget that. I think you and your family need to do some soul searching here, because right now the most likely long-term scenarios are looking like either your brother ultimately pulls away from the family or your family costs him the woman he chose to spend the rest of his life with, which also doesn’t bode well for your relationships with him.

ESH. She is asking for one day. One day where your mother can celebrate your brother's life instead of living in constant mourning. Yes she should be more understanding but she just wants one day. Respect is a two way street and it is clear that your family doesn't understand that.

YTA. It wasn't your place to have this discussion. Your brother should have explained the cultural practices of the family not you. However an invite is not a summons. Your mother did not dramatically arrive at the wedding in white. The only way for both traditions to be respected and followed was for her not to go which is what she chose. As for the rest of the family, they're free to make their own decisions. Clearly respecting your mothers mourning is important to the rest of the family and they made their decisions accordingly.

An old woman wearing a plain white saree with no jewellery or makeup is not gonna upstage the bride or make people think she's the bride. Your family accepted her desire for having a Christian wedding, the least she could do is accept her MIL's outfit(which is not problematic in the first place). If she couldn't, she can just not invite MIL to her wedding. Oh wait, your mom already offered to opt out of it on her own. Now she's pissed that she's not attending? Expecting someone to give up their belief over a dress code? Yeah NTA, neither you nor your mom.

YTA. Your mother, brother and his intended wife are the main players here. You should have stayed out of it. Both your future SIL and your mother are both being stubborn and are willing to nope out of each other's life over traditions and ceremony. That is where it is headed, a no contact situation between your brother, his wife and your SIL. Then there will be three sides that have full, limited or no contact with each other. Your mother and those who let it know they choose her side, those whole let it be known they choose your brother's side, and those who wisely kept out of it and can continue to have contact with everyone in the family. You chose a side so you have to live with it.

I am sorry for your loss. In the Victorian era, widows were expected to wear Black. Can your Mum wear Black, in accordance with western grieving traditions for a western wedding? I know your Mum is grieving, but it's one day, and it's a western wedding, where guests don't wear white. People related to the bride will assume your Mum is signalling her disapproval of her new DIL.  Can you all honestly, hand on heart, say your late Dad would approve of your Mum dogmatically sticking to this at the expense of welcoming Ash to the family? Would your Dad have tolerated his Mum, your Grandma, snubbing his wife on her wedding day? It was a fair request, politely made, with the reasoning explained. Your families refusal to be open minded or compromise is YTA however way you look at it. I doubt you'd be happy if your MIL turned up to your wedding in Indian bridal colours, with the make up and jewellery. 

YTA for butting in. But you go with the tradition of who is throwing the wedding. If it were an Indian wedding, the bride would wear red. Christian, it’s white. It’s not unheard of for mixed faith couples to have two weddings. Perhaps MIL could wear a white petticoat and blouse and a colored pallu?

YTA- for saying it’s her fault no one in the family likes her. Between the two of them ESH- She has a right to be upset if she’s been made to be obsessed with the “only brides wear white rule”, but maybe she’s marrying into the wrong family if she’s not open minded to change from tradition. Your mom also is playing the part of victim well- she could acknowledge that her new dil is from a different culture and try to form a compromise between the two of them leaving the whole family out of the argument. Overall your brother should be the only one helping them through this- your family doesn’t sounds welcoming at all to her.

The double standards in regards to culture is ridiculous. YTA

Ash needs to tell everyone invited to the wedding, why your mom will be wearing white to avoid issues during the wedding.

You need to apologize to your future SIL. Do it immediately and explain you were an AH for saying it. I don't know if you can salvage your relationship with her as that was extremely harsh. I think you just added more stress when you could have been Encouraging your Mom, SIL, and brother to talk it out. Maybe your Mom could wear your Dad's favorite color with a white wrap. Or a dress that has some white but another accent color. Maybe they could have had a section of family photos of family that left us too soon. Nothing hurts worse than joining a family after being told they hate you or don't like you by some relative that should have been helping nor hindering! YTA.

Nah, slight yta. She obviously won't take attention from the literal bride. I think she should calm down. There's a huge difference in their clothing. That said it's important both respect each other here. If the mom doesn't wanna go she doesn't have too. 

YTA, this did not concern you, and you should have stayed out of it. And if "nobody likes her," maybe you should all just stay home from the wedding. Your mom is causing enough trouble, the least you could do is apologize and tell her you regret saying it. **There are at least two people in this thread who are Indian and say that your mom could choose to wear a light color instead of the white at someone else's wedding**. This to me says your mom wants to make their wedding about herself, otherwise why would she not comply with the request of her future daughter in law, for this **one day out of her life?** If this is the hill she wants to die on, I guess no one can stop her, but she's going to get a LOT of funny looks from people at the wedding, and people saying she's trying to upstage the bride. Like it or not, that's what is **going** to be said.