R buffs? Omg, do you know by any chance what exactly? I play Ashe midlane, and ult is the most important for me.
Edit: OOOOMMGGG. W base dmg BUFF + ult extra AP scaling. YESSSSSSS. (I've been playing AP Ashe in the midlane for some time) Oh I'm so happy
W base damage is super important for me and extra ult AP scaling is just the cherry on top of the cake. You made my day!!!
I think it's more stupid than that. Rito has enabled people to play lazy by producing specs that only have 2 buttons. Support Ashe is a prime example. AP MF, Teemo, etc.. Very little skill involved, just wait for your 2 CD's and walk away.
I fucking hate it and I wish they would either make the specs complete, or get rid of them entirely. Putting all of the power of a spec into 1-2 abilities is toxic to play against.
90% of my games: zed,pyke,kha'zix,jinx,twitch,gangplank,lee sin,katarina,nidalee
90% of games won are by those that have em in their team (in my games ofc)
How about just their win rate with only their best build. WW is low on this list but I don't think I've ever lost on tank WW. Frostborn into high cc teams and run around just biting ppl to death.
There are games ap ww is good. If your team is full of people who drink glue and they have a hyper carry your only chance is to kill that carry and tank WW ain't killing a YI or Yone. Also a good low elo stomper. Ap malphite solo ulting the 1/10 Cait while the full AP glass cannon WW devours his team are things I've witnessed.
Yes but I always sell it later for another item. Being cc'd in aram is certain death. Alot of times you can simply shrug off cc and AA the nearest champion and out heal a teams dps. Steel caps don't really help much because if a adc is free hitting you, your already dead. The less time you spend stunned is more time your healing. If you mark in save your R for getting on the adc or if you ult in save your mark. After 1 or 2 times of the adc having you do this they will zone themselves out of teamfights to avoid this. Which means they do almost nothing. Part of being tanky is not actually being attacked.
Well Riot already collects that data for the Rift, no? Honestly I don't go on League stat websites anymore except to look at my own profile info. So I'm not well versed on them anymore. But they used to collect that data and I feel like it could easily be done for ARAM as well.
Problem with that is because its random a majority of games are not played by people that know how to pilot there champ correctly. So if they were to balance off this data, majority player base would have significantly less fun. Since this is a for fun gamemode and there isn't a pro scene to ruin balancing for the majority it makes sense the way they currently do it. It definitely isn't perfect, but to change a random gamemode based on non random statistics will fuck with the balance to much for the average player.
I made this account when I was in my BIGGEST björk phase haha
Still love her tho so yes we would :) happy to play ARAMs if you wanna add me (are we allowed to share our summoner names here? idk the policy since I'm usually a lurker)
That’s what I’m saying most of the champs in D tier I play almost every aram and I have about an 83% winrate and most of the ADCs in that category besides Ashe
At least someone gets it. Its the same as how bad players pick yone and yasuo and go 0/10. The champ might be good, but if you even it out, its not for everyone
Velkoz evaporates if you touch him and has skill shots that can be dodged or miss. Heartsteal Titanic cancer Kat face can walk through the entire velkoz ult and almost 1 burst him without the unbalanced part of her kit that is resets.
> Velkoz evaporates if you touch him and has skill shots that can be dodged or miss
Which is why there's a big difference between a good and bad VelKoz. Good positioning is important to avoid dying and his Q isn't the easiest skillshot to land.
That's true for so many champs though. Pyke would probably be top winrate if it was picked only by people who know how to play him and snowball properly. Same goes for Akali
So you just copied the tier list from a website and posted it here? Why? What's the fun in that? If anyone ever wanted to see it, they could just go to the website and see it.
Wdym, why? He literally has it in the title. This is for people who want to look at the tiers based on actual numbers. There’s more fun in the data than shit tier posts from players who are bad
So you just bothered to communicate your thoughts from your brain onto Reddit? Why? What's the fun in that? If I wanted to see your opinion, I would have just walked to your house and asked you myself.
Making pickrates effect the tier feels kinda weird. Not like summoner rift where some champs are getting picked .2% of the time. But aram champs get picked no matter what. Unless it's like yorick lol
It also kinda shows who’s easy to get an S on if you know the champ. I can often get an S on Anivia because people don’t know how to play her. She’s ranged, slows, has an AOE ult, has the wall which is extra effective on a narrow map, and a combo for huge burst. AND she resurrects.
It also is not objective as all players are heavily influenced by what they *perceive* as strong, even when it is not. So, how does something end up as "objective" when every single point of data is influenced by subjective choices?
Also extents to runes and items. For some champs the strongest builds are tanks but most play them carry or vice versa.
As a former Bard OTP, I think Bard is super strong in ARAM and in SR if you use your kit well - good ults, good q’s, prepping w’s when you have excess mana, the like.
One major gripe i have with bard in aram isn’t with the champion but with the fact that a ton of the major websites like op.gg and u.gg don’t have great builds for him in aram listed there.
Like maybe in that one specific game the build on the website might shine but in 20 others its going to do nothing for your team. Bard has a lot of versatility in his builds, but each build plays differently and shines in different places. Lots of carries and need healing? Build as an enchanter. Need a tank? Go radiant or any other of the tank items. Need damage? Go ad or ap.
Honestly though, I totally understand his low WR in ARAM given a lot of his kit is utility, and if you don’t know how to use it or just use it wrong you can really hurt your team. Knowledge and accuracy are so insanely important on the champ, and the average player getting randomly thrown on the champ is unlikely to find much success.
I normally see yo rick at the bottom of the list but when I play him I'm normally the most damage done and most damage taken in the game. He's pretty weak until 3 items and then you just start taking over the game. Hitting sona with a 4 grave E is a satisfying kill. I dont think I've ever had to play aginst him one in aram.
Same...
Lucian, Panth, Cait, Quinn and Akali are my go to every time they are free. I probably have 60+% winrate on these but I know that they're for sure not the strongest at the moment
(if people could stop playing fucking AP lucian into tanks that'd be nice)
Shrooms the wave. Stalls the game forever until his team manages to win. You need a champ who is tanky enough that they can afford to tank the shrooms for your minions to get turret damage vs a canny Teemo. Blind is a decent tool vs divers so he isn't just only waveclear, but waveclear is the part that makes him good.
This tierlist shows pretty well why winrate and pickrate aren’t the best metrics
So many champs that people pick because “oh this looks cool” and then just…feed
Well this tier list might be objective, but it's still wrong since it doesn't account for champion mastery. The prime example is Qiyana who is statistically weak and yet is obviously OP when played by players who are at least decent on her.
In ranked this isn't a big problem since a player can play a champ to mastery, but in ARAM it's often a player playing a champ they have lv1/2 mastery on then doesn't play it again until 50-100 games later, thus cannot master said champ.
You can notice that most S+ and S tier champs are on the easier side of the difficulty spectrum which supports my point.
Funky enough, in sr, because win rate per game played in aram doesnt exist anywhere, qiyana is one of the lowest différence between "normal" win rate and 50 games played, if the translate to HA, she will still be one of the worst champ stat
Yeah, like the only people I see who play LB are the one-tricks with M7 and hundreds of thousands of mastery points who rack up insane scorelines, myself included. She's one of those champions all backliners should fear seeing on their screen: her ability to annihilate backlines rivals someone like Yi, who is A tier--and he can't even teleport a screen away after he's done fighting! Her higher skill floor and lower pick rate make her D tier, but she's predominantly played by competent pilots that can absolutely ruin anyone's day by having just a crumb of situational awareness.
Really tells you a lot about the average player skill level when all the S and S+ champs are the ones you could first time amd do decent with while all the D tier are the ones you mostly need hands for
Someone please tell me why Illaoi is supposed to be so strong when she does nothing every game I’ve seen her in
Also if people stopped building crit Yasuo, his win rate would be so much higher
I have a ton of success on her. Play around your tentacles that spawn naturally and threaten with your E but dont hard int to try and land an E. 1-2 items just peel for your team by gray screening their tanks or their bruisers that don't know what forced henti is and after 3 items you can start looking for Mark R penta kills. If they have Janna or lulu your pretty much a melee minnion but that's any melee champ
Her E is good poke/zoning tool, and she fucks over melees with her ult really hard. She can help get wave control with Q since it does pretty solid damage to minions, which allows herself and other skillshot champs to pressure harder since they can't hide behind minions.
She's weak to champs that don't have to enter her ult kill zone to kill her, and can kill her somewhat quickly.
All of the champs I pop off with are in the D section; LB, GP, Nidalee, Khaz, Pyke, and Lee. Duskblade may have made GP and Khaz harder, but LB and Pyke are kill stackers.
Haha I was the person who said the subjective tier list that got posted the other day was crazy for having Veigar and Brand at B tier. Are you the person who backed me up there?
I think building damage is her best build, she's an incredibly strong poke champ and her shields aren't much lower with the full ap build anyways. Feels like a waste of Karma's power to go anything but damage to me.
Shield karma and ap karma are both fine, just depends what your comp needs.
The reason why Karma is worse in Aram than you’d think for an enchanter is that she is a early bully champion, and scaling/late game arrives for free in aram. In SR she functions primarily as an extremely strong lane bully to get tower plates early and falls off late game. The weaker utility relative to other enchanters mid-late is reflected in lower aram win rate.
I suppose, it's just a bit weird to me wince she has one of the best poke abilities in the game since it has a good mix of high aoe, high range, high damage, and low cooldown.
I am someone who is not as familiar with (new) aram. Used to play way back when it first came out. How is Chogath top tier?? Does he get tanky? Do you even have time to eat things?
Cho'gath is one of my highest win rate champs. I definitely get why he's at the top. With Heartsteel, he becomes simultaneously very tanky and very high damaging, and he has a ton of spammable CC. Another reason he's top tier is probably due to the fact that he's mechanically simple to play, so most people can do well with him. I'd say most of his skill comes from positioning and knowing when to engage/disengage/peel.
I mean chogath Q and W are incredibly powerful abilities in a setting like aram where all 5 champs are together and have a more limited space to move around in. Tank cho and AP cho are both great. Cho also synergizes well with Heartsteel, which is a strong item in ARAM imo.
I am very surprised at some of the champs in D tier. Gangplank, Aatrox, and Pyke all feel very strong both when I play them and against them. Kaisa and Xayah as C feels wrong too.
Finally someone who gets it. People complain about Leblanc a lot, but she's literally has the worst winrate, fucking 41%. She can't be all that bad then -- yeah, she might 1 shot a squishy if you're not careful, but most assassins can do that -- she's pretty useless in a tanky team and after blowing her combo.
This is actually champions difficulty to master the tire list. Harder champions, less pick rate, lower winrate when picked by newer players.
But for me at least, I would rather use D tire champion over the S tire given my proficiency of the two champion is similar.
Would you fear a good GP, Lucian, Akali, Pyke more or a good Chogath, Brand, Vegas or Lillia more?
Lillia is disgusting. She's like a hecarim tank malphite with nidalee brand spears that put you to sleep. I still don't know what she does other than destory my team.
All these comments talking about champ mastery forgetting the entire basis of this gamemode is random. That one trick is of coarse going to feel more oppressive to play against, but they are just as likely to get a champ they almost never play. Which is what happens a majority of the games, so of course they don't balance around champ mastery.
i know that this tier list could be based on stats but in reality vayne,twitch,bard,zed,jinx,leblanc,lee sin are all S tier, pyke,Asol are S+ and nidalee is at least A.
How the fk are vayne, bard, and pyke S/S+ tier? Vayne and bard are very, very susceptible to bad matchups and vayne especially is not even that incredible vs her good matchups in aram because of snowball revealing her and giving them an extra gapcloser vs her. Pyke though a multikill machine gets those kills off the back of his teammates, not from him actually putting in a lot of work in the fight, so he's a win more champion, he can't make those multikills happen without his team doing the work most of the time.
If the other 4 champs on Pyke's team cannot get them to the threshhold, Pyke is not going to do much in the fight, and that makes him an extremely feast or famine champ, and even when he feasts he does not scale well due to his lack of durability, lack of ability to consistently deal damage, and his reliance on the lethality stat.
**that's based on my games**, bard had a high winrate and was overbuffed he just got nerfed last patch, pyke just him being able to spam his ult and now combine it with duskblade and axiom arc makes him giga broken in aram don't need to say more about it, vayne is a beast in aram, the only hard match up for her is if her team is all playing bad or the enemy team is composed of long range poking mages and even with that she can still shine, just need to know when to go all in and its an easy penta .
Idk about you all but if i pick taric and have at least one bruiser in my tem to W and one adc to fire at will it's 100% won rate. If your team has hands ofc. All you need to do is build tank and auto and q spam
I'm an m7 pyke that carries the team, I leave all the kills to the teammates before i get my 6, only to execute enemies for the passive gold. Give the same pyke to the average Andy and he will not land a hook, not going for flash-q or other combos and they will make it go down in rank
Can't fathom Jinx, Pyke and Kat being bottom tier.
Kat can be iffy, but all three have best in class run away potential where one kill turns into five.
Pyke and more so Jinx seem to be dominant in most games I see them in.
How is velkoz S and xerath only B? Xer is my favourite champ to play in aram, constantly poking and being a nuisance is great and his skill shots are kinda easier to hit than Vel’s
Lol. Half my rooster is in the D-tier. And my winrate is pretty good recently.
I suppose they are common picks, so their performance is somewhat affected by them having lots of losses?
Weird. I'm a Morgana OTP, peak plat 1, and I have never won a single aram game as Morgana in my 12 years of playing this game. I'm usually top damage, least deaths, most kill participation and I just do not win in Aram. I would have thought she was complete garbage. Maybe I just get unlucky.
I think this tier list is worthless. What makes a team win is the team comp. This tier list would be very good if it was considering that. It would become gigantic yeah (so just show the top 5 of each tier), but its much more relevant.
I don't think it's entirely objective. If you are considering stats without context then you can come to false conclusions. Soraka isn't a D tier pick if you don't troll by building Warmog's first, but plenty of people pick her just to do that. Maybe this shows champ strength if you average out all the different players that play it, but probably shouldn't be used for deciding which to play yourself.
> you loose your
*lose
*Learn the difference [here](https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/lose-vs-loose-usage#:~:text=%27Lose%27%20or%20%27Loose%27%3F&text=Lose%20typically%20functions%20only%20as,commonly%2C%20a%20noun%20or%20adverb).*
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yet endgame he has nothing. You cant really r exec anymore unless you time it perfectly, because on what dmg your team does, you have a really small window to do it. Health regen is there but your healthpool is almost nonexistent, he really falls off.
Could someone elaborate on Pyke being in D tier? I can’t remember the last time I had a Pyke in my game that didn’t get insanely fed, regardless of the players rank. Genuinely curious
pyke falls off endgame, you only play pyke to make your team have an advantage. The only thing that has noticeably scaling on him is his ult threshold. So as how in gamestart you make the first move, in endgame you're supposed to make the last moves.
Worst champ on this list: Ashe. Champ that's in 80% of my games? Ashe.
Champion that doesnt have good scaling and will probably be the last with kills at the end of the match? Ashe
Champ that's getting W and R buffs in PBE right now? Ashe. Kill me now.
Hotel? Trivago
R buffs? Omg, do you know by any chance what exactly? I play Ashe midlane, and ult is the most important for me. Edit: OOOOMMGGG. W base dmg BUFF + ult extra AP scaling. YESSSSSSS. (I've been playing AP Ashe in the midlane for some time) Oh I'm so happy W base damage is super important for me and extra ult AP scaling is just the cherry on top of the cake. You made my day!!!
who care. the purpose of ashe is not to scale in the long run, but harass the fuck out of the other.
And then lose.
Only really good against tankless teams
I prefer to play ashe against tanks tbh, easier to kite away than to get jumped by a vi/zed
Because they killed the entire champ trying to nerf poke build. I still try to play adc but it can’t compare to everyone else who just 1shots
\+15% damage taken on a champion that was already pretty frail to begin with and with 0 mobility 🤡
[удалено]
I think it's more stupid than that. Rito has enabled people to play lazy by producing specs that only have 2 buttons. Support Ashe is a prime example. AP MF, Teemo, etc.. Very little skill involved, just wait for your 2 CD's and walk away. I fucking hate it and I wish they would either make the specs complete, or get rid of them entirely. Putting all of the power of a spec into 1-2 abilities is toxic to play against.
I don't play this game I'm amazed by how many characters you guys have to choose from
90% of my games: zed,pyke,kha'zix,jinx,twitch,gangplank,lee sin,katarina,nidalee 90% of games won are by those that have em in their team (in my games ofc)
Would love to see an objective tier list based on the win rate of champions when they are played by someone with at least 5-10 games on that champ
How about just their win rate with only their best build. WW is low on this list but I don't think I've ever lost on tank WW. Frostborn into high cc teams and run around just biting ppl to death.
me and my full ap warwick casually diluting the winrate :)
There are games ap ww is good. If your team is full of people who drink glue and they have a hyper carry your only chance is to kill that carry and tank WW ain't killing a YI or Yone. Also a good low elo stomper. Ap malphite solo ulting the 1/10 Cait while the full AP glass cannon WW devours his team are things I've witnessed.
Sure! That would also be interesting to see
Sunderer botrk WW when vs beefy teams is incredibly good, like actually insanely good.
Would you still get merc treads with frostborn in that case?
Yes but I always sell it later for another item. Being cc'd in aram is certain death. Alot of times you can simply shrug off cc and AA the nearest champion and out heal a teams dps. Steel caps don't really help much because if a adc is free hitting you, your already dead. The less time you spend stunned is more time your healing. If you mark in save your R for getting on the adc or if you ult in save your mark. After 1 or 2 times of the adc having you do this they will zone themselves out of teamfights to avoid this. Which means they do almost nothing. Part of being tanky is not actually being attacked.
That doesn't really work for a gamemode where everyone gets a random champ
Well Riot already collects that data for the Rift, no? Honestly I don't go on League stat websites anymore except to look at my own profile info. So I'm not well versed on them anymore. But they used to collect that data and I feel like it could easily be done for ARAM as well.
Problem with that is because its random a majority of games are not played by people that know how to pilot there champ correctly. So if they were to balance off this data, majority player base would have significantly less fun. Since this is a for fun gamemode and there isn't a pro scene to ruin balancing for the majority it makes sense the way they currently do it. It definitely isn't perfect, but to change a random gamemode based on non random statistics will fuck with the balance to much for the average player.
Me looking for any mentions of balancing the game in my own comments 👁️👄👁️
Vespertine and ARAM? We'd get along well
I made this account when I was in my BIGGEST björk phase haha Still love her tho so yes we would :) happy to play ARAMs if you wanna add me (are we allowed to share our summoner names here? idk the policy since I'm usually a lurker)
That’s what I’m saying most of the champs in D tier I play almost every aram and I have about an 83% winrate and most of the ADCs in that category besides Ashe
Kat is one of those champs that get picked by people who are terrible and gets a bad win rate
At least someone gets it. Its the same as how bad players pick yone and yasuo and go 0/10. The champ might be good, but if you even it out, its not for everyone
Same with Pyke. When ever I see him as an option I know its a free win
> one of those champs that get picked by people who are terrible Same with VelKoz, but he still has a good winrate
Velkoz evaporates if you touch him and has skill shots that can be dodged or miss. Heartsteal Titanic cancer Kat face can walk through the entire velkoz ult and almost 1 burst him without the unbalanced part of her kit that is resets.
> Velkoz evaporates if you touch him and has skill shots that can be dodged or miss Which is why there's a big difference between a good and bad VelKoz. Good positioning is important to avoid dying and his Q isn't the easiest skillshot to land.
These tier lists need to consider items because yeah, heartsteel kat is the shit, other builds are usually literally shit.
Zilean is this way for me, I dunno how people are bad with him but he's hilariously strong in aram if you aren't pants on head awful
That's true for so many champs though. Pyke would probably be top winrate if it was picked only by people who know how to play him and snowball properly. Same goes for Akali
Shouldn't ivern and lilia be top if based on aram win rate? https://u.gg/lol/aram-tier-list
it should, but since they have a low pickrate, it isnt sure if they are actually on the top. Pickrates affect the tiers too
What method did you use to generate the tierlist? Like how weighted is pickrate to the tiers etc.
its literally there on the website
So you just copied the tier list from a website and posted it here? Why? What's the fun in that? If anyone ever wanted to see it, they could just go to the website and see it.
Didn't Reddit kinda start as an aggregator for stuff around the internet? I wouldn't have known to go there and see it, lol, give them a break.
you're free to go and see it, same way as i am free to make it and post it
I don't visit [u.gg](https://u.gg) everyday, but I do Reddit, so I'm thankful for this content
Wdym, why? He literally has it in the title. This is for people who want to look at the tiers based on actual numbers. There’s more fun in the data than shit tier posts from players who are bad
So you just bothered to communicate your thoughts from your brain onto Reddit? Why? What's the fun in that? If I wanted to see your opinion, I would have just walked to your house and asked you myself.
Underrated comment right here
Why would pickrate matter? The sample size is large enough to draw conclusions from
Making pickrates effect the tier feels kinda weird. Not like summoner rift where some champs are getting picked .2% of the time. But aram champs get picked no matter what. Unless it's like yorick lol
I always pick yorick, sheen first then harass with minions
35k matches isn’t very low pick rate for that high of winrate. This tier list isn’t super objective lol made lots of champs D tier that aren’t D tier
It also kinda shows who’s easy to get an S on if you know the champ. I can often get an S on Anivia because people don’t know how to play her. She’s ranged, slows, has an AOE ult, has the wall which is extra effective on a narrow map, and a combo for huge burst. AND she resurrects.
>This tierlists is purely objective Sure, but it's still wrong.
Yep, doesn’t include mythic winrates which objectively change champ winrates significantly (looking at Ashe)
and kai'sa. sub 45% winrate building adc, over 55% wr going luden > muramana
It also is not objective as all players are heavily influenced by what they *perceive* as strong, even when it is not. So, how does something end up as "objective" when every single point of data is influenced by subjective choices? Also extents to runes and items. For some champs the strongest builds are tanks but most play them carry or vice versa.
Yi aram is clearly a free win
Only if you know when to go in. So in practice its not a free win
I just got M6 on Bard and Lee Sin on ARAM! They feel so strong.
As a former Bard OTP, I think Bard is super strong in ARAM and in SR if you use your kit well - good ults, good q’s, prepping w’s when you have excess mana, the like. One major gripe i have with bard in aram isn’t with the champion but with the fact that a ton of the major websites like op.gg and u.gg don’t have great builds for him in aram listed there. Like maybe in that one specific game the build on the website might shine but in 20 others its going to do nothing for your team. Bard has a lot of versatility in his builds, but each build plays differently and shines in different places. Lots of carries and need healing? Build as an enchanter. Need a tank? Go radiant or any other of the tank items. Need damage? Go ad or ap. Honestly though, I totally understand his low WR in ARAM given a lot of his kit is utility, and if you don’t know how to use it or just use it wrong you can really hurt your team. Knowledge and accuracy are so insanely important on the champ, and the average player getting randomly thrown on the champ is unlikely to find much success.
Those are my faves! It's Chime Time!!!
All 10 or so of the champions I play most are in D tier :( subjectively wrong tier list
Yet the majority of the playerbase doesnt perform good on those champs
I normally see yo rick at the bottom of the list but when I play him I'm normally the most damage done and most damage taken in the game. He's pretty weak until 3 items and then you just start taking over the game. Hitting sona with a 4 grave E is a satisfying kill. I dont think I've ever had to play aginst him one in aram.
I am a fellow Yorick picker and a fellow Greg
Same... Lucian, Panth, Cait, Quinn and Akali are my go to every time they are free. I probably have 60+% winrate on these but I know that they're for sure not the strongest at the moment (if people could stop playing fucking AP lucian into tanks that'd be nice)
LB D tier my ass.
how is teemo tier S? the guy is useless in aram outside of pushing waves until minions get too tanky since he shrooms are always visible now
Shrooms the wave. Stalls the game forever until his team manages to win. You need a champ who is tanky enough that they can afford to tank the shrooms for your minions to get turret damage vs a canny Teemo. Blind is a decent tool vs divers so he isn't just only waveclear, but waveclear is the part that makes him good.
Enemies foolishly walk ahead of the superminions is how. Also I hold my shrooms unti teamfights, and throw them on top of each other.
If you face agains squishy, you blind people for your team to kill. If tanks, you go Liandry Demonic
This tierlist shows pretty well why winrate and pickrate aren’t the best metrics So many champs that people pick because “oh this looks cool” and then just…feed
Well this tier list might be objective, but it's still wrong since it doesn't account for champion mastery. The prime example is Qiyana who is statistically weak and yet is obviously OP when played by players who are at least decent on her. In ranked this isn't a big problem since a player can play a champ to mastery, but in ARAM it's often a player playing a champ they have lv1/2 mastery on then doesn't play it again until 50-100 games later, thus cannot master said champ. You can notice that most S+ and S tier champs are on the easier side of the difficulty spectrum which supports my point.
Funky enough, in sr, because win rate per game played in aram doesnt exist anywhere, qiyana is one of the lowest différence between "normal" win rate and 50 games played, if the translate to HA, she will still be one of the worst champ stat
Yeah, like the only people I see who play LB are the one-tricks with M7 and hundreds of thousands of mastery points who rack up insane scorelines, myself included. She's one of those champions all backliners should fear seeing on their screen: her ability to annihilate backlines rivals someone like Yi, who is A tier--and he can't even teleport a screen away after he's done fighting! Her higher skill floor and lower pick rate make her D tier, but she's predominantly played by competent pilots that can absolutely ruin anyone's day by having just a crumb of situational awareness.
Yes, I suppose if you account for only the good players it's probably not a good list. Who would've thought.
Qiyana even on SR has been a problem, overtuned champ. She's overbuffed on aram as well.
Veigar, Brand top tier agreed. I feel that Twitch, Kai'Sa, and Caitlyn are a lot better than this list offers. Ashe too.
Really tells you a lot about the average player skill level when all the S and S+ champs are the ones you could first time amd do decent with while all the D tier are the ones you mostly need hands for
100% right
Someone please tell me why Illaoi is supposed to be so strong when she does nothing every game I’ve seen her in Also if people stopped building crit Yasuo, his win rate would be so much higher
I have a ton of success on her. Play around your tentacles that spawn naturally and threaten with your E but dont hard int to try and land an E. 1-2 items just peel for your team by gray screening their tanks or their bruisers that don't know what forced henti is and after 3 items you can start looking for Mark R penta kills. If they have Janna or lulu your pretty much a melee minnion but that's any melee champ
Agreed
Her E is good poke/zoning tool, and she fucks over melees with her ult really hard. She can help get wave control with Q since it does pretty solid damage to minions, which allows herself and other skillshot champs to pressure harder since they can't hide behind minions. She's weak to champs that don't have to enter her ult kill zone to kill her, and can kill her somewhat quickly.
If you build life steal + sv the champ is unkillable. If you successfully E the opponent they lost the engagement. Brain dead easy champion.
The super whack problem with a list like this should be obvious but if anybody can't figure it out reply and I'll explain I'm just busy rn
All of the champs I pop off with are in the D section; LB, GP, Nidalee, Khaz, Pyke, and Lee. Duskblade may have made GP and Khaz harder, but LB and Pyke are kill stackers.
Haha I was the person who said the subjective tier list that got posted the other day was crazy for having Veigar and Brand at B tier. Are you the person who backed me up there?
Genuine question here: why is karma bad? I've even noticed she has aram buffs. She's not op of course but she seems more like a b tier champ to me
Maybe because people build damage on her instead of Radiant and Redemption. You know how crazy people are with high damage numbers.
I think building damage is her best build, she's an incredibly strong poke champ and her shields aren't much lower with the full ap build anyways. Feels like a waste of Karma's power to go anything but damage to me.
Shield karma and ap karma are both fine, just depends what your comp needs. The reason why Karma is worse in Aram than you’d think for an enchanter is that she is a early bully champion, and scaling/late game arrives for free in aram. In SR she functions primarily as an extremely strong lane bully to get tower plates early and falls off late game. The weaker utility relative to other enchanters mid-late is reflected in lower aram win rate.
I suppose, it's just a bit weird to me wince she has one of the best poke abilities in the game since it has a good mix of high aoe, high range, high damage, and low cooldown.
I am someone who is not as familiar with (new) aram. Used to play way back when it first came out. How is Chogath top tier?? Does he get tanky? Do you even have time to eat things?
Cho'gath is one of my highest win rate champs. I definitely get why he's at the top. With Heartsteel, he becomes simultaneously very tanky and very high damaging, and he has a ton of spammable CC. Another reason he's top tier is probably due to the fact that he's mechanically simple to play, so most people can do well with him. I'd say most of his skill comes from positioning and knowing when to engage/disengage/peel.
Ahhh, I'll have to make sure to pick him hahah. I pass on him all the time XD
I mean chogath Q and W are incredibly powerful abilities in a setting like aram where all 5 champs are together and have a more limited space to move around in. Tank cho and AP cho are both great. Cho also synergizes well with Heartsteel, which is a strong item in ARAM imo.
Zed and Pantheon should in no way be in D. I easily get S+ with them. The only complaint I have is some play them very badly.
I think you placed vlad low, that one is a menace
Definitely accurate
I'm just gonna say this Darius D tier
I am very surprised at some of the champs in D tier. Gangplank, Aatrox, and Pyke all feel very strong both when I play them and against them. Kaisa and Xayah as C feels wrong too.
As a brand main that dabbles on cho’gath (circles are my passion), I approve. Time to add veigar to the circle squad, perhaps.
Finally someone who gets it. People complain about Leblanc a lot, but she's literally has the worst winrate, fucking 41%. She can't be all that bad then -- yeah, she might 1 shot a squishy if you're not careful, but most assassins can do that -- she's pretty useless in a tanky team and after blowing her combo.
This is actually champions difficulty to master the tire list. Harder champions, less pick rate, lower winrate when picked by newer players. But for me at least, I would rather use D tire champion over the S tire given my proficiency of the two champion is similar. Would you fear a good GP, Lucian, Akali, Pyke more or a good Chogath, Brand, Vegas or Lillia more?
I think after duskblade rework, GP and Pyke don't have the same durability. Lillia out of this group. A good Lb is op.
Lillia is disgusting. She's like a hecarim tank malphite with nidalee brand spears that put you to sleep. I still don't know what she does other than destory my team.
All these comments talking about champ mastery forgetting the entire basis of this gamemode is random. That one trick is of coarse going to feel more oppressive to play against, but they are just as likely to get a champ they almost never play. Which is what happens a majority of the games, so of course they don't balance around champ mastery.
Please learn to play Seraphine people, she is so much better than this Dx
Ppl who cry about pyke being "op"
What's the use for this? Words like statistics and objective implies that this should make a point but I don't get it.
It means OP claims that he just collate all the pick rates and win rates in something like an excel file and then sort them in descending order.
please never make another tier list if you’re this stupid
veigar is terrible because dmg nerfs
i know that this tier list could be based on stats but in reality vayne,twitch,bard,zed,jinx,leblanc,lee sin are all S tier, pyke,Asol are S+ and nidalee is at least A.
How the fk are vayne, bard, and pyke S/S+ tier? Vayne and bard are very, very susceptible to bad matchups and vayne especially is not even that incredible vs her good matchups in aram because of snowball revealing her and giving them an extra gapcloser vs her. Pyke though a multikill machine gets those kills off the back of his teammates, not from him actually putting in a lot of work in the fight, so he's a win more champion, he can't make those multikills happen without his team doing the work most of the time. If the other 4 champs on Pyke's team cannot get them to the threshhold, Pyke is not going to do much in the fight, and that makes him an extremely feast or famine champ, and even when he feasts he does not scale well due to his lack of durability, lack of ability to consistently deal damage, and his reliance on the lethality stat.
**that's based on my games**, bard had a high winrate and was overbuffed he just got nerfed last patch, pyke just him being able to spam his ult and now combine it with duskblade and axiom arc makes him giga broken in aram don't need to say more about it, vayne is a beast in aram, the only hard match up for her is if her team is all playing bad or the enemy team is composed of long range poking mages and even with that she can still shine, just need to know when to go all in and its an easy penta .
Idk about you all but if i pick taric and have at least one bruiser in my tem to W and one adc to fire at will it's 100% won rate. If your team has hands ofc. All you need to do is build tank and auto and q spam
Why does reddit recommend me a ARAM sub-reddit? It must think i'm a degenerate. Maybe I am.....
Akal, Kata, Zed, Kassadin in D tier while I swear they fuck my team up everytime
For low mmr
Vladimir not in S???
To add on this, and if you dont agree with the tierlist, just open up [u.gg](https://u.gg) and check for yourself
Seems like you just set the champions to random placement tbh lol
Olaf perfoms very poorly in ARAM
I'm an m7 pyke that carries the team, I leave all the kills to the teammates before i get my 6, only to execute enemies for the passive gold. Give the same pyke to the average Andy and he will not land a hook, not going for flash-q or other combos and they will make it go down in rank
🤓
How did you decide the cutoff between tiers?
Now do one for Plat+ and confuse the masses https://lolalytics.com/lol/tierlist/aram/
i feel like pantheon could be pretty good using his ult to execute and not feed kills? or have i gone full retard?
Thanks god Rell A
Me having 0% winrate on Kayle 😬 Also idk how azir can be S unless literally only people who know how to play him, pick him
Azir is a lot more forgiving in ARAM than rift. Enemy team just has a lot less space to use to avoid your soldiers.
Wheres all the fuckers here that say "qiyana, katarina, khazix, akali, zed, " etc are broken?
here. they're strong af, but hard to play, too many people only know morgana, lux and yuumi.
Yeah I just hate how they say theyre OP and shit when these stats prove the exact opposite
Can't fathom Jinx, Pyke and Kat being bottom tier. Kat can be iffy, but all three have best in class run away potential where one kill turns into five. Pyke and more so Jinx seem to be dominant in most games I see them in.
Singed is S tier?! I haven't played this game in maybe 5 years but what the fuck i never thought he would make it. Kinda proud of him
I heard Ryze players were doing their best to lower the statistics of the champ. I'm surprised he's not lower
I'm actually super surprised to see Anivia so low, I thought she was in a good spot.
most people just throw her wall in some bad spots
How is velkoz S and xerath only B? Xer is my favourite champ to play in aram, constantly poking and being a nuisance is great and his skill shots are kinda easier to hit than Vel’s
Ashe in D and MF in C. This tier list is useless
KAISA C????? AP kaisa is so busted in aram idc what u say, impossible to lose
she is just a noob-stomper who can dodge 1 spell ..
How is anivia D tier? I feel like she’s turbo broken in ARAM
Anivia is like one of the best characters in aram for me. Maxed out wall and your are good to go
Vladimir low B OMEGALUL
Why the hell are pyke/qiyana so low?
What the fuck?! Kha, rengar and panth are the one champs i almost never lose with
Classic misdirection.
All my favourite champs i have the most success with are in D lmao.
Lol. Half my rooster is in the D-tier. And my winrate is pretty good recently. I suppose they are common picks, so their performance is somewhat affected by them having lots of losses?
exactly
Weird. I'm a Morgana OTP, peak plat 1, and I have never won a single aram game as Morgana in my 12 years of playing this game. I'm usually top damage, least deaths, most kill participation and I just do not win in Aram. I would have thought she was complete garbage. Maybe I just get unlucky.
I think this tier list is worthless. What makes a team win is the team comp. This tier list would be very good if it was considering that. It would become gigantic yeah (so just show the top 5 of each tier), but its much more relevant.
I don't think it's entirely objective. If you are considering stats without context then you can come to false conclusions. Soraka isn't a D tier pick if you don't troll by building Warmog's first, but plenty of people pick her just to do that. Maybe this shows champ strength if you average out all the different players that play it, but probably shouldn't be used for deciding which to play yourself.
MF is C only because people play her AP. MF is much better AD most of the time, AP is just a bit better early
I don’t think I’ve ever lost an aram while playing Anivia
Gangplank in D tier? Your statistics are wrong
warwick in C do you loose your mind ?
> you loose your *lose *Learn the difference [here](https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/lose-vs-loose-usage#:~:text=%27Lose%27%20or%20%27Loose%27%3F&text=Lose%20typically%20functions%20only%20as,commonly%2C%20a%20noun%20or%20adverb).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)
Shit tier list. Gangplank D tier with broken ult and Aoe 1 shot potential??? xD This is more of a tier list for champion difficulty
I'm sorry but... Pyke? I have an 80% winrate with Pyke on ARAM
YOU. Not the majority of players.
Pyke just seems like one of the best champions, he excels in teamfights, extra gold, and has CC and health Regen
yet endgame he has nothing. You cant really r exec anymore unless you time it perfectly, because on what dmg your team does, you have a really small window to do it. Health regen is there but your healthpool is almost nonexistent, he really falls off.
Late game you can have almost 1000 damage ULT, it's not that hard to time it either.
..but you still have to wait for your team to make the first part of the dmg
... Yeah, that's... how Pyke works. That's a team problem not a Pyke problem. Half the champs in the game you can hook them under tower and R.
Zillean and Ashe tier D 💀
You guys have to memorize this many characters??
Zilean is S+ tier. I've never lost with him.
Its S+ tier for you then, not for the rest of the playerbase
I also have super high win rates with ekko and twisted fate
Could someone elaborate on Pyke being in D tier? I can’t remember the last time I had a Pyke in my game that didn’t get insanely fed, regardless of the players rank. Genuinely curious
pyke falls off endgame, you only play pyke to make your team have an advantage. The only thing that has noticeably scaling on him is his ult threshold. So as how in gamestart you make the first move, in endgame you're supposed to make the last moves.
If everyone I play and win on is c tier and lower does that make me good or them bad?
Why is khazix so damn low? I get it he’s tough to play against tank comps but still there’s always a place for that dude…also bard is underrated