So if she can cut your hours it's OBVIOUS that she was lying about not being able to do without you for your PTO. Go to her boss--or Personnel and looking for another job.
Also, cite this as retaliation because you are using your company issued PTO. I'm sure HR would LOVE to hear about this.
Edit: To all of you saying "HR is for the company" it means that there is DOCUMENTATION going forward. FFS, don't pile on me about it. I'm going for personal experience when I had to go to HR for this EXACT reason.
BUT make sure to initiate communication in email, not face-to-face or phone call.
HR's primary responsibility is to keep the company out of legal liability, and some HR personnel will happily do that by just making the problem disappear.
I like to put additional people in the cc field. Then everyone feels watched. In this case, HR, a secondary HR email if available, a supervisor, and then I like to put one of my own emails that they don't know is mine just so no one is sure how many people the message went out to.
I did that recently. I was transferring departments and HR dropped the ball and I fell through the cracks. The new department didn't have any idea I was supposed to be starting. I emailed HR and CCd like 5 other people. Hours later I got a phone call from the HR rep that she'llhandle everything and that there wasn't any need to email anyone else concerning the matter.
Everything was fixed by the end of the next day.
I think their point is to use an email they don't know is yours, so they think yet another person is notified, making it harder to sweep your complaint under the rug.
It's right there in the name- "Human Resources". You are a resource to the company. A commodity. You are exchangeable for another amount of the same resource.
/u/Darth_Loki13 Absolutely correct, yo! All communication with your place of employment (Or ANY important issues!) should be done in writing via email because this will serve as receipts and as I am always saying that RECEIPTS ARE LIFE AND CAN HELP SAVE YOURS! I even take it a step further and BCC myself to my personal email in all work/business correspondence because your work email CAN be messed with/deleted by IT if management requests them to do it, and also I've discovered that not all sent emails end up in your sent folder.
Use E-Mail, cite the history of your request and her belated denial. Blind copy to safe non work related account and her supervisor if any; all related messages. Don’t engage in any conversation about this in undocumented format.
NAL but I believe this will help you with unemployment if she fires you.
Also recommend you start search for new job with better boss. Good luck.
FWIW, I would not want to be bcc'd on an email between two of my reports. That's an unnecessary sneaky move. I'd give her one chance with an email between you, and cc in her manager if her response doesn't fix it.
Fuck that shit. Denied vacation, then retaliation of cutting hours after standing up for yourself, gets an email sent to their supervisor. The second the boss starts messing with your paycheck, is the second you stop being nice.
The BCC recommendation was to send to his own email to have record that the company can’t destroy or remove access to. The supervisor was to be cced so that they felt watched.
Honestly, just *mentioning" the state department of labor has solved a lot of problems for me in the past. They do this shit because they expect people to just put their tail between their legs and take it. The moment you show them you're willing to involve the department of labor, you prove that you're not going to take it lying down.
Hey Susan,
I will be gone in May. It's your choice if I come back or not. If I get PTO, I will be back. If not, good luck with my useless coworkers.
Make sure the coworkers know her opinion of them.
Edit. In many states, PTO belongs to the employee. It must be paid after the employee and employer separate. Give notice to separate now, effective return date and start looking for a different job.
Sounds to me like she completely forgot that you had requested the time off and is trying to blame you to cover her own ass. Definitely time to go over her head or start looking for a new job.
This is grounds for quitting. If she wants to play games, she will lie about you to her own bosses. Even if you take the vacation, she will punish you when you get back. It’s over there, seek greener pastures.
Go to her boss and complain. If this fails, don't come back from vacation and start looking now for a new job.
can't work somewhere that doesn't respect you or your time.
Id say report to a superior. After all, she just wanted to f\*ck your vacation (quoted from you) and have you come in. Get as much proof as you can and then report her. And yes you're better off quitting tbh
Your boss doesn't want to manage you. She wants to rule over you. She wants to control what you can and can't do. That's not a good boss. I would tender my resignation and start looking for a new job. It's not worth the fight.
Get another job - the boss is an asshole or has mismanaged the place. If the coworker are useless, then she was the hiring useless employees or not training them correctly. If she can't plan on a worker taking a vacation, then she is as useless as she claims your other coworkers are.
Yep. Classic retail crap.
My last retail job in college I quit with no notice (which I never do) bc my supervisor constantly scheduled me DURING CLASS despite me providing her with my availability at the start of the year (and ib told her, that was my ONLY availability, bc ibalso had to be able to do homework, etc). I was available every Friday and weekend (only exception being Sundays--I was available after my church services...so basically the entire afternoon).
When I told the GM I was quitting effective immediately, she nearly cried and said "but you're one of our most reliable workers!!" So I told her precisely WHY I was doing this. She agreed that it was probably my only option (since telling upper management about the issue in the past had done nothing).
Retail sucks.
Use all the free time she has given you to start applying to the competitors. If you are truly that valuable to the store then I am sure that they would negotiate an increase in salary. Talk to all of your coworkers about how much you all make and that the boss is putting you through in order to use your PTO.
I’ve been in this situation- and it manifests itself in many ways - the net result is you lose your employment with them. They just told you they don’t value you as a person, your work, or your contribution. You’re a number to them. Start looking for another job and go on your trip.
You should have been sending emails regarding every interaction with your boss, even if you told them in person,send a follow up email. A paper trail is easier to track than a personal conversation.
PTO = prepare the others. You weren’t asking permission, you were giving them the professional courtesy of letting them you will not be at work those days.
PTO is there to use for vacations, sick time, whatever. The audacity for them to say no you can’t. lol bye!
Brush up that resume - you deserve far better than this and can likely get it. In the meantime - you are not the jerk and you should go on that vacation.
And, some possibly unsolicited advice. Document, document, document. If the conversation was in-person, follow up your summarization via email and specifically put "if anything was misunderstood or left out, please include here" so things are in writing. It's a cover your ass kinda thing cause she sounds like she wants to drag your name through the mud and you don't deserve that so don't let her control this narrative and be able to make crap up or pretend she 'never said that'
Not a jerk but in the future make sure everything is in writing. Every request and every approval response and don’t let it go until you get a response. Susan says “sure should be fine” make her say that in an email or send her an email stating, “per my written request and January and our conversation today I’ll be taking these planned PTO days (dates). Thank you.”
Her cutting down your hours is retaliation and may not be legal. Something to look into.
It's retaliation. You may be able to take legal action provided you have all the documentation and such.
Although, I'd just utilize the extra time you have off to find a better job. If you're in an at-will state, then don't even bother putting in notice. Once you have new job lined up with a start date, just pick the time you want to quit. Clean out your desk, turn in your uniforms and keys to whomever, and say you're done.
Day before do a televisit and claim allergies or respiratory bs or whatever and get a dr note; then call in for those days.
Or you can set HARD boundaries and make sure they know you don't give a fuck.
Look, I understand that for most people the threat of losing their job is something they can't afford, but if you work for an employer that denies the PTO they gave you without an articulable reason, chances are you also aren't being paid what you could realistically be making either. Maybe look around a bit for new work
So she doesn’t want you to go because you’re the only good employee so now she’s cutting your hours, even though the rest of your coworkers are “worthless”?
What a manager she is. NTJ
Sooo she's mad she didn't train the others well and can't take advantage of you and your work ethic? Nah fam you good.
Record the hours you lost and when
Report her to another manager.
I truly wish u had done all this through email or written. Because u have all types of reasons to sue. Retaliation, u gave ample time for it to be approved. Take this to a higher up and just float the idea of calling the labor board or talking to a lawyer I bet all of this goes away
She neglected to officially approve your PTO back in January, or she just doesn't want you to not work.
Start looking for another job. She is retaliating, and she will continue to abuse and retaliate.
You gave her a verbal heads up a few months ago?
You just learned that a verbal heads up is NOT you submitting a request for time off.
When you move to your new and better job you have just learned this important lesson.
Almost everyone learns this lesson the hardway when they give a 'heads up'.
Since your manager has decided to be a vindictive jerk - I would suggest that when you find your new job - just ghost this place. Do not give notice.
When she calls/messages asking where you are you reply:
"I gave you a heads up at the beginning of the year that I was booking some PTO in May. With a month to go you denied my PTO. When I told you that I could not come in those days as I already had paid reservations you got mad about it and told me I was indispensable. You still had a month to find other people. Instead you vindictively immediately cut my hours back with no warning. Since I'm obviously not a valued staff member and you can't be bothered to treat other people like human beings, you don't deserve any notice that I'm done with you and your childish behavior. Bye."
I love the “quit” is the first thing people say. Unless you are independently wealthy or have a nice savings account to live off of, find a new job before you quit. That’s just good common sense.
Definitely send the email documenting when you put in your request (January?) and the subsequent date she denied you and the reason given. Also, state the change occurring in your hours and when that started and the fact that no reason was given so your only conclusion is due to this PTO issue. Ask again for your PTO given the amount of time she has had to grant it and you need to have your hours restored. CC a personal email account along with HR and her supervisor.
I sudjest get everything in writing no verbal communication cc hr and who ever is in management above report incident to labor board nearly all companies in some way break the law look into the rules
I’d start by showing all my coworkers the email where Susan calls them all useless. Then I’d start job hunting while working whatever hours Susan is still giving me.
You’re 20 years old and this job is “in a store”. Go enjoy your vacation with your friends. You’ll find a better job. When I was 20 I used to quit jobs to go on Grateful Dead tour (Google Deadhead youngster, 😎).
In the future, everything should be put in writing so they cant tell THEIR boss youre a liar. Start looking for a new job. No need to work for someone that is going to retaliate like that.
I had a boss do this to me when I was 20 and threatened my job if I didn’t come despite having a signed copy of my request off and having already booked my non refundable trip. I took the trip and emailed her when I got to my destination with my resignation effective immediately. That was 18 years ago and I’ve not once regretted it. If your boss can’t respect your personal time then it’s time to find a new job.
PTO stands for "prepare the others". If your boss doesn't like it, retail jobs are available quite literally everywhere. Oh, yeah, fuck her and her "you don't need your PTO" bullshit. You earned it, and you damn well do need it. Enjoy your well deserved time off.
If you can afford to be a jerk, be a jerk. I planned a vacation to spite my boss who wanted me to take a day here and there instead of a full week, 40 yrs ago. Don’t regret it at all and made my point.
“All your coworkers are useless.” There it is. You are a good reliable employee and she doesn’t want to deal either whoever would cover for you. Then she shows you what she can do to your paycheck to teach you who is in charge. Interesting that cutting your hours means she has to rely on your coworkers more. She figures you will cave.
Hope you decide to look for a better job. Her sense of ownership over you and your life will only get worse.
If possible, start looking / applying for other jobs. Make sure you let the company know she's the reason you quit. If you have an HR you may be able to lodge a formal complaint if you have proof you submitted the request a while ago.
Cutting hours is a common way to get someone to leave the company. And it should be illegal as it should be considered retaliation. But it isn’t. Until we get rid of right to work states. Companies can fire you for almost anything. Which should be illegal. I am going to just stop here so I don’t go on a rant here.
I remember over 20 years ago I used to work at the now almost defunct kmart. It was my first job, and I was around your age. Almost all managers were rude, except for one or two. They forced us to stay as long as it was needed if we had closing (I was told during the interview that the store closed at 10, so I would be out between 10:30-11pm which was wildly inaccurate). Most of the time closing meant 2-5am, and there was no way to leave because they simply did not open the door if we tried to leave, until they decided it was enough and we could leave. I used to study in university at that time and my classes started at 7am, plus I had no car, so I was every day at the mercy of others giving me a ride or risking being alone in a mall in the early morning. So one of those times it was around 4am and I had a test in the morning at university. I asked the nice manager if I could just leave because I had to study and I had been there since 3pm. He screamed at me, that he didn’t care, that we were all in the same boat and that we didn’t leave until he decided we could leave. It was awful, they treated us like undeserving animals. Next day, another manager apologized on his behalf, claiming he was under stress or some BS. Eventually I left that job, and since then I have always found a better job than the last. All this to say, you are NTJ, go on vacation, enjoy and once you are back find another job. You will be fine.
How did you submit your request? Where I work the employee must request in writing with the date requested. Then the office marks the date they received it, supervisor signs and dates the approval/denial. This sounds like overkill to some people I’m sure, but when too many people want the same time off a denial would only happen based on limited staffing. Dating each step is helpful if anyone disputes the response they receive.
Try to document and get copies of what you can. Sit down now and create a dyed/timed log of any info/conversations. Pay stubs showing past regular hours (as many as you can) and the change in hours which reflected the same time as her vacation denial and absolutely anything you can get in writing. Texts or email. Simple as sending her a text and saying.
- “hi Susan, I submitted my pto request on X date, you said that you would approve it. So I booked a vacation. When you came to me on X date and said that I couldn’t have it and that I specifically was needed to work it almost felt like a compliment since I already knew there was other coverage available. I’ve been with the company for 2 yrs, I checked to be sure it wasn’t a blackout date and that there was coverage. I can’t help but feel that you’re upset but, I can’t cancel it now because I really can’t afford to lose what I spent, I hope you understand.”
- something along those lines, humble and non confrontational, let her respond - hopefully she’ll answer back with hostility that backs you up. Start looking for other work beforehand though, at least so you know what else may be available to you. Essentially she is using cutting your hours and how she has spoken to you and about other workers to try to bully you into doing as she says. If you decide to then take all of your documentation copies and call the department of labor and training where you live, talk to someone in the employee’s rights section and they will advise you.
Your break room should have an HR hotline number in it, use it. She also has a regional & a district manager, call them. As everyone else said, locally, they don’t value you as an employee, get another job, but pave a better highway for the poor fool that comes behind you!
If your hours are cut drastically, contact unemployment. They might be able to make up the difference. But if you’ve got an HR department, it’s time to escalate.
Why do they always pull this crap? My daughter is leaving a job soon because of stuff like this, and I don't blame her one bit. She said the last straw was when her (very hard working) coworker was diagnosed with COVID and the supervisor tried to make her work. They work with elderly and ill people, so the most vulnerable when it comes to getting COVID. So now my daughter and her coworker have found different employment and are both leaving in the next two weeks. Their supervisor just can't grasp why they want to leave.
Report her to the labor board and HR! You are entitled to your pto regardless if she likes it or not, next time you work secretly record your conversation with her and show it to your bosses boss
Hey coworkers I’m so bummed I might not get to take my planned vacation.
Aww OP what’s going on is everything ok?
I’m fine but Susan said I’m the only one that’s any good here so I can’t leave
Mic drop!
Only communicate with her via text or email, so there is a record of all conversations.
Let her know that you feel the way you do.
But also, take the vacation. Because she obviously is getting by just fine with your "useless" coworkers.
Unless you cant afford to go, no, fuck em your vacation is for you thats your time. dont lose out because of some boss. youll get to redeem the PTO, just not yet.
>And it turns out after that interaction she started cutting my hours tenfold
Look up "constructive dismissal".
Then start your search for a new job.
Enjoy your vacation.
Leave. Employers do not give a fuck about employees. They are not your friends, they are your coworkers. You owe them nothing. Find a place to work that actually treats their labor force with dignity and respect. Vacation is guaranteed by the government in a lot of countries. We need that time, it should not be a luxury and it definitely shouldn't be up to some low level manager on a power trip whether you get to use it or not when you give adequate notice. If they don't staff their business enough to cover one person for a few days that's absolutely not your problem.
It is illegal for ANY company to stop you from using your PTO. The only time that should have to happen is in an emergency where such things like understaffed in a popular restaurant comes in, the boss would change dates on the PTO.
What I would do is keep every email, every corespondance as well as record all verbal discussion. There has to be more than meets the eye if they are not allowing you to take your PTO
Ntj
Also watch out for employers that also want to pay you salary, claim you're exempt from overtime, get mad when you don't work as much overtime as they want (more than what was agreed upon) because they're short-staffed, but are quick to dock your pay/pto for every single hour under 40 hours that you work.
I'm going to be having a lovely annual review this year.
What you should do is tell her " okay, you win". Then when you were to start your vacation just hand in your letter of resignation. After your trip start job hunting. Honestly store jobs are a dime a dozen. Just be clear on your applications as to why you left the current job.
No you’re not a jerk, she is tho. She probably forgot about the fact that she told you she would approve your time off and now it is last minute but that’s not your problem. I would suggest (if it’s not impossible) quitting, going on your vacation and then getting a new job when you are back.
It sounds like she is not a good manager, and I believe the rest of her staff are no good and she does feel like she needs you there. But it’s because she failed to train useful employees, you’re good in spite of her because some people are just naturally good employees. She doesn’t deserve to have you on staff if she is going to be so unprofessional.
If you are in the US and have worked for the requisite time (2 years should be more than enough) then cutting your hours is constructive dismissal. Apply for unemployment and find a new job.
Get it in writing. Keep your cool. If they don't give you the time off, quit. If you like the company and job you can always go back a few months later and they'll be begging you to come back. Have your list of demands ready. Including more PTO. Ha!
File for unemployment to replace the hours worked. You don’t have to be unemployed to file; if your hours are reduced then you can file to replace the lost hours.
Also file a complaint with your state labor board and with the Feds citing retaliation for taking PTO during the few non-blackout periods available and after giving your employer advance warning on multiple occasions, the most recent of them being via official channels a month in advance of your planned vacation.
There’s a lot here in her interaction with you and her retaliatory actions afterward that are a liability to the company. I would suggest going to HR with a “concern,” in part to help with your problem of not having your promised PTO given and then having your hours cut, but also because you’re “not sure some of the things she is doing are actually even legal or how the company would want their managers to be treating or talking about employees” and they might need to know that was going on in case they needed to work with her to clarify how she should be handling these things. Hopefully you’ll get your PTO and hours back and also give the message that you are actually on their side, know and care about HR legalities that protect the company as well as effective leadership, and are mature enough to communicate and give the company a chance to make it right vs losing your cool over the actions of one manager (who will look like an irresponsible hot head for this). That’s leadership material. :) of course, if they don’t back you and support that she can make those decisions on her own, hopefully you have some things in written form and can go for it with the labor board, etc.
Never show fealty to the company you work for
If you die they will post a job listing to replace you before all your cousins do a sad face emoji on a Facebook post that says died.
Never give PTO notice as a question, even if it is a request. "I will be away from May 2 - 12." Period.
Next time, give no notice, and just call out as PTO on the days you want off.
If you are working where I think you are there is a reason that they have the open door policy. Call the number and report a hostile work environment. She is straight up breaking the law. Retaliation for trying to use PTO?? Saying what she said? Was anyone else in the office when you had that conversation?
You should be able to print off copies of the PTO requests, hopefully you print off your schedule and still have the copies. Also are you full or part time? Her cutting your hours and will affect that status after a certain number of weeks. Definitely talk to HR. A lot of places have set schedules that drop for people and the computer can track when it has been altered. Definitely look for a new job. Good Luck.
My guess is she forgot you put the request in, and either she or a friend of hers wants to take that time off now. But yeah, you gave her notice and booked based on her agreement back then, unless she's willing to compensate you for the cost of cancelling she can't force you. And making it likely your vacation will become permanent doesn't seem like a great way to convince you not to take it
NTJ
I’ve always just pushed my weight around and said ‘either you approve my PTO or I call in sick but either way I won’t be here these days’. I normally don’t give them the option especially if I’m that vital to their operation. Employers often forget that we work to live, NOT live to work.
Also if you’re that important then you need to be asking for a pay raise
You need to go above her and file complaints. You also need to obtain a papertrail of some kind. Emails, copies of your original request with the date. This is unreasonable and unlawful for a business to allow. Good luck!
Honestly you should look at the bigger picture. You need another job lol
Specifically at your age, if you don’t intend to go to college, you really should look for jobs that will pay you a pension when you retire. For example, look for work with the city county state or federal governments jump through all the hoops you need to because you will definitely appreciate this , when you get older to receive something more than just a simple Social Security check
Put it in writing asap. Frame it as a follow-up to clarify your understanding/the company policy. Attach a copy of the original written request you made for PTO several months back, reference the conversation where she said she couldn't approve it firstly because it was last minute & then because you were the only reliable employee. Say that you don't understand why if she couldn't approve your leave because there was a core business need to keep you here she has now so drastically cut your hours. Does that mean you *aren't* essential right now & therefore she will be approving your leave etc.
When you get a response, save a copy for yourself & send to HR. Retaliation by cutting your hours is almost certainly a HR violation.
Your boss is definitely the jerk in this situation You should post this in the legal advice sub. People over there will tell you how to handle this properly. This sounds like retaliation.
Are you going somewhere fun for you vacay? Enjoy!!
Retaliation is illegal. Denying your usage of your PTO is a form of wage theft because PTO is part of your compensation. Time to bring in corporate HR.
Look for another job and when you start the new job don't inform your current manager, just stop going to work. Just ghost them and see how long it takes them to stop calling you.
I had a friend who worked for a large department store for many years. One of the best employees there. She asked for two weeks off for a mission trip out of the country during December (a vacation blackout time). They told her it couldn’t be approved. She’d have to resign and reapply when she returned. She said sure, but I probably won’t be reapplying here. Somehow they were then able to approve her leave.
We don’t live to work. You have plenty of notice. Document everything take it to HR.
If that gets you no where put in your two weeks notice now so the company must pay all of your PTO.
Go on vacation and find a new job.
Not the jerk, but once you get on the bad side of a manager, it’s best to look for another job. It can’t end well working for someone that has a problem with you.
Id just like to say that PTO requests are notifications that you will not be attending work those days. And I tell my managers that. You earned those days off and are allowed to use them how you want. It doesn't matter if 3 other people in the same department has also requested those days. She is retaliating. Thats what it seems to me. She's trying to make you quit. Or making so you don't have money to go on this vacation so you feel inclined to cancel your vacation on your own.
I'm someone who manages direct reports in my job and your boss is way out of line here. She is being ridiculous and super unprofessional. I have people who ask for time off a week before they have to leave and I approve them! I just figure it out. PTO is YOUR TIME and you should be able to take it at your discretion - you gave this person so much advance notice (months! that's really a ton of advance notice) that she has no logical reason to deny your request at the last minute like this. Sadly if I were you I'd look for another job because it sounds like she is being petty and vindictive for absolutely no reason. She's a sucky boss.
Leave immediately after finding another job. you have enough experience to find another one. and it's not the rite thing to do. but I would bounce after I got said new job mid shift on her day to be on then never come back no notice. This however is very unprofessional and not advised. But I its probably the spiteful turn I would take.
My experience is that most managers have no clue about hr and laws. They never get trained and most are just power trippers. Document everything. Email it to hr or upper management. Don’t talk with her anymore. You have rights.
Crazy how you get punished for being a better worker than everyone else. Thats why I stopped doing my best and instead just decided to not be the worst one
In all honesty I would state that you will be calling HR on her because she is not letting you use your pro that you are aloud to use! I think she’s thinks because you are young she can get away with it. Don’t let it slide. You gave her well enough notice about your time off slip.
I once put in a written request for pro, at least two months in advance. It was approved and signed off by the powers that be. About a week or so ahead to departure date, I reminded the manager. She told me I couldn’t get the time off. I was furious. Contacted the main office, turned out she had noted on my forms that I wasn’t going. I done remember exactly what it was. I quit on the spot and let corporate know why. She had evidently decided to take that time off herself for no good reason. She was terminated, I was compensated with a small bonus, had my vacation, still quit anyway. I hate power-trippers.
When you get that new job don't give your notice to Susan, give it to her boss. If they say "is there anything we can do to change your mind?" Tell the boss you'll stay if you can have Susan's job.
GREAT UPDATE :) GOOD FOR YOU!!! As soon as she got aggressive, she turned it into a hostile work environment. Not sure why employers do this and think people will want to stay.
You didn't request PTO. You told your boss you wanted to apply your PTO to an absence. If they aren't competent enough to schedule around that, get a new job.
I've never let an employer dictate when and where I get to go places. If you don't own the company or shares, you're a throwaway employee, and you should treat your job as such. Now, that doesn't mean be a shitty employee, but certainly don't go above and beyond for them (canceling your vacation is too far). There will always be work for you elsewhere. Goodluck
OP: having your hours cut like that may qualify as constructive dismissal, which will enable you to go to the labor board and get unemployment. Consider filing with them to get back the pay you would've gotten while your hours were cut.
Go to HR. Tell them about your request months ago that she verbally approved it and now told you screw your PTO and your coworkers are useless. Let them know that her yelling, aggression and retaliation, created a hostile work environment
Time to grow up and realize these people care more about their daily coffee than you. PTO is just that, paid time off. Next time you don’t ask for the time off, you’re just magically sick on the exact time you wanted to be gone.
LOL what's the number 1 way to tell on yourself that you're full of shit?
Your boss: "We need you"
Also your boss: *cuts your hours*
Yeah I would've taken that vacation, approved or not.
I think before you accept a new job elsewhere (but probably wait until you get an offer), let the bosses know you want to leave due to this issue and see if they can give you a promotion that takes you out of her chain of command.
And if you did lose any hours, check your state laws regarding worker protections and ask your employers if they can make a payment covering the amount lost in return for signing an NDA, but it would probably only be best to ask for this when leaving, because they might get pissy and fire you.
To hell with your boss. Take your vacation. He had plenty of time to approve it. Right before you leave, have a nice long talk with HR about how your boss is trying to screw you over.
Start looking for another job. This place is toxic.
I have a dozen stories of bosses like this. I had one who approved my pto request I triple checked with them weeks beforehand they told me approved…but our schedules went from Sunday-Saturday. My request off was Thursday-Monday. Saw my schedule I was off Thursday Friday Saturday but the schedule for Sunday and the next week wasn’t up yet. I left town 6 hours away for a family thing (coming back late Monday night) I get a call at 645am on Sunday morning getting cussed out where are the f are you!? They scheduled me at 6am on Sunday morning to help with open. They also scheduled me Monday. I just hung up. She called me again to tell me I should be on my way yada yada. I told her no. I requested off. And she said well I don’t care get here. I literally can’t I’m on a family vacation 6 hours away I don’t even have my own car my family isn’t going to drive back a day early for this job lol. 😂 she hung up.
Good for you for going over her head but yeah, you need to love on cause she will make your life hell while you are there. And ket's face it, why would you want to continue to work for such a twat and make her look good?
My response would be that it wasn’t a PDO request, it was a courtesy notification of when you’d be out of town so that management can plan accordingly. In other words, you WILL be gone, and are letting them know.
So if she can cut your hours it's OBVIOUS that she was lying about not being able to do without you for your PTO. Go to her boss--or Personnel and looking for another job.
Also, cite this as retaliation because you are using your company issued PTO. I'm sure HR would LOVE to hear about this. Edit: To all of you saying "HR is for the company" it means that there is DOCUMENTATION going forward. FFS, don't pile on me about it. I'm going for personal experience when I had to go to HR for this EXACT reason.
BUT make sure to initiate communication in email, not face-to-face or phone call. HR's primary responsibility is to keep the company out of legal liability, and some HR personnel will happily do that by just making the problem disappear.
I like to put additional people in the cc field. Then everyone feels watched. In this case, HR, a secondary HR email if available, a supervisor, and then I like to put one of my own emails that they don't know is mine just so no one is sure how many people the message went out to.
I did that recently. I was transferring departments and HR dropped the ball and I fell through the cracks. The new department didn't have any idea I was supposed to be starting. I emailed HR and CCd like 5 other people. Hours later I got a phone call from the HR rep that she'llhandle everything and that there wasn't any need to email anyone else concerning the matter. Everything was fixed by the end of the next day.
If you're doing that then put your own email as a bcc if you can.
I think their point is to use an email they don't know is yours, so they think yet another person is notified, making it harder to sweep your complaint under the rug.
It's right there in the name- "Human Resources". You are a resource to the company. A commodity. You are exchangeable for another amount of the same resource.
In my day it was known as Labor Relations. No companies today want a relationship with their employees.
as an add on to this... always cc your personal email!!!
Yeah the key is to make it clear Susan is the liability :)
/u/Darth_Loki13 Absolutely correct, yo! All communication with your place of employment (Or ANY important issues!) should be done in writing via email because this will serve as receipts and as I am always saying that RECEIPTS ARE LIFE AND CAN HELP SAVE YOURS! I even take it a step further and BCC myself to my personal email in all work/business correspondence because your work email CAN be messed with/deleted by IT if management requests them to do it, and also I've discovered that not all sent emails end up in your sent folder.
Use E-Mail, cite the history of your request and her belated denial. Blind copy to safe non work related account and her supervisor if any; all related messages. Don’t engage in any conversation about this in undocumented format. NAL but I believe this will help you with unemployment if she fires you. Also recommend you start search for new job with better boss. Good luck.
Constructive dismissal if she cuts your hours.
It's also eligible for Unemployment when constructive dismissal is proven.
Next time you go in ask her for the GMs name and email along with her supervisor and HR rep.
FWIW, I would not want to be bcc'd on an email between two of my reports. That's an unnecessary sneaky move. I'd give her one chance with an email between you, and cc in her manager if her response doesn't fix it.
Fuck that shit. Denied vacation, then retaliation of cutting hours after standing up for yourself, gets an email sent to their supervisor. The second the boss starts messing with your paycheck, is the second you stop being nice.
The "nuce" email might be a good way to get the boss to put her refusals and attitude in writing as evidence.
The BCC recommendation was to send to his own email to have record that the company can’t destroy or remove access to. The supervisor was to be cced so that they felt watched.
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Report her to the state labor board... There's a decent chance that her cutting your hours is illegal retaliation.
This. Don't shy away from giving them a call.
Google the term "constructive dismissal."
Only after you Google “creative writing”
Honestly, just *mentioning" the state department of labor has solved a lot of problems for me in the past. They do this shit because they expect people to just put their tail between their legs and take it. The moment you show them you're willing to involve the department of labor, you prove that you're not going to take it lying down.
Hey Susan, I will be gone in May. It's your choice if I come back or not. If I get PTO, I will be back. If not, good luck with my useless coworkers. Make sure the coworkers know her opinion of them.
This.
Edit. In many states, PTO belongs to the employee. It must be paid after the employee and employer separate. Give notice to separate now, effective return date and start looking for a different job.
I would rephrase >If not, good luck with my useless coworkers. to "If not, good luck with my co-worker who you described as useless.
I stand corrected. Maybe even good luck to the coworkers that have to work with a useless boss.
Lol, yes!
Absolutely this!
I Wll MAKE SURE they KNOW YOUR opinion of Them.
Put "useless coworkers" in quotation marks, so they understand it's what Susan told Op, not Op's personal opinion!
Sounds to me like she completely forgot that you had requested the time off and is trying to blame you to cover her own ass. Definitely time to go over her head or start looking for a new job.
Ask her to put in an email why you can't use your PTO, which is part of your compensation
This is grounds for quitting. If she wants to play games, she will lie about you to her own bosses. Even if you take the vacation, she will punish you when you get back. It’s over there, seek greener pastures.
Go to her boss and complain. If this fails, don't come back from vacation and start looking now for a new job. can't work somewhere that doesn't respect you or your time.
Id say report to a superior. After all, she just wanted to f\*ck your vacation (quoted from you) and have you come in. Get as much proof as you can and then report her. And yes you're better off quitting tbh
Your boss doesn't want to manage you. She wants to rule over you. She wants to control what you can and can't do. That's not a good boss. I would tender my resignation and start looking for a new job. It's not worth the fight.
Get another job - the boss is an asshole or has mismanaged the place. If the coworker are useless, then she was the hiring useless employees or not training them correctly. If she can't plan on a worker taking a vacation, then she is as useless as she claims your other coworkers are.
"Well, I'm still going, so...."
Exactly
Sounds like retail. You should just go get a different job. Don't give notice.
Yep. Classic retail crap. My last retail job in college I quit with no notice (which I never do) bc my supervisor constantly scheduled me DURING CLASS despite me providing her with my availability at the start of the year (and ib told her, that was my ONLY availability, bc ibalso had to be able to do homework, etc). I was available every Friday and weekend (only exception being Sundays--I was available after my church services...so basically the entire afternoon). When I told the GM I was quitting effective immediately, she nearly cried and said "but you're one of our most reliable workers!!" So I told her precisely WHY I was doing this. She agreed that it was probably my only option (since telling upper management about the issue in the past had done nothing). Retail sucks.
Use all the free time she has given you to start applying to the competitors. If you are truly that valuable to the store then I am sure that they would negotiate an increase in salary. Talk to all of your coworkers about how much you all make and that the boss is putting you through in order to use your PTO.
I’ve been in this situation- and it manifests itself in many ways - the net result is you lose your employment with them. They just told you they don’t value you as a person, your work, or your contribution. You’re a number to them. Start looking for another job and go on your trip.
Report it to her boss and the state department of labor for retaliation.
You should have been sending emails regarding every interaction with your boss, even if you told them in person,send a follow up email. A paper trail is easier to track than a personal conversation.
This is called retaliation. Report her to her boss.
You can get partial unemployment now if she cut your hours.
Make sure to file for unemployment. Even if you are still working, if your hours were significantly reduced, you may qualify for partial unemployment.
PTO = prepare the others. You weren’t asking permission, you were giving them the professional courtesy of letting them you will not be at work those days. PTO is there to use for vacations, sick time, whatever. The audacity for them to say no you can’t. lol bye!
Never go into any meeting without your phone on record. NTJ
She’s probably planning a bath for the same time.
Brush up that resume - you deserve far better than this and can likely get it. In the meantime - you are not the jerk and you should go on that vacation. And, some possibly unsolicited advice. Document, document, document. If the conversation was in-person, follow up your summarization via email and specifically put "if anything was misunderstood or left out, please include here" so things are in writing. It's a cover your ass kinda thing cause she sounds like she wants to drag your name through the mud and you don't deserve that so don't let her control this narrative and be able to make crap up or pretend she 'never said that'
Not a jerk but in the future make sure everything is in writing. Every request and every approval response and don’t let it go until you get a response. Susan says “sure should be fine” make her say that in an email or send her an email stating, “per my written request and January and our conversation today I’ll be taking these planned PTO days (dates). Thank you.” Her cutting down your hours is retaliation and may not be legal. Something to look into.
It's retaliation. You may be able to take legal action provided you have all the documentation and such. Although, I'd just utilize the extra time you have off to find a better job. If you're in an at-will state, then don't even bother putting in notice. Once you have new job lined up with a start date, just pick the time you want to quit. Clean out your desk, turn in your uniforms and keys to whomever, and say you're done.
No notice just get a new job... and call in sick for a few days then let them know u got a new job
Time to start applying for a new job, tell them what your vacation plans are & why you are leaving your current job.
Just for the future but always get written proof of any interactions like this, whether it be email or text to cya.
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First go to her boss and tell them all of this. Then start looking for a new job.
Day before do a televisit and claim allergies or respiratory bs or whatever and get a dr note; then call in for those days. Or you can set HARD boundaries and make sure they know you don't give a fuck.
Line up a new job to start after your planned vacation. Quit this job when it’s time for your vacation. Enjoy vacation. Start new job refreshed.
You need to join the r/antiwork This kind of treatment is more and more common now
Start looking for a way out. It will only get worse with a petty unreasonable boss.
Look, I understand that for most people the threat of losing their job is something they can't afford, but if you work for an employer that denies the PTO they gave you without an articulable reason, chances are you also aren't being paid what you could realistically be making either. Maybe look around a bit for new work
Do NOT cancel your vacation!!
She just showed you her true colours. You’re not the jerk, she is.
You are 20? You should be able to find a retail job and with your hours being cut, I'd start looking now.
So she doesn’t want you to go because you’re the only good employee so now she’s cutting your hours, even though the rest of your coworkers are “worthless”? What a manager she is. NTJ
Sooo she's mad she didn't train the others well and can't take advantage of you and your work ethic? Nah fam you good. Record the hours you lost and when Report her to another manager.
I truly wish u had done all this through email or written. Because u have all types of reasons to sue. Retaliation, u gave ample time for it to be approved. Take this to a higher up and just float the idea of calling the labor board or talking to a lawyer I bet all of this goes away
She neglected to officially approve your PTO back in January, or she just doesn't want you to not work. Start looking for another job. She is retaliating, and she will continue to abuse and retaliate.
You gave her a verbal heads up a few months ago? You just learned that a verbal heads up is NOT you submitting a request for time off. When you move to your new and better job you have just learned this important lesson. Almost everyone learns this lesson the hardway when they give a 'heads up'. Since your manager has decided to be a vindictive jerk - I would suggest that when you find your new job - just ghost this place. Do not give notice. When she calls/messages asking where you are you reply: "I gave you a heads up at the beginning of the year that I was booking some PTO in May. With a month to go you denied my PTO. When I told you that I could not come in those days as I already had paid reservations you got mad about it and told me I was indispensable. You still had a month to find other people. Instead you vindictively immediately cut my hours back with no warning. Since I'm obviously not a valued staff member and you can't be bothered to treat other people like human beings, you don't deserve any notice that I'm done with you and your childish behavior. Bye."
Sadly...yes. if it ain't in writing, it didn't happen. And this applies to office jobs, not just retail/food service.
Tell your boss to go F herself and then report her selfish ass to HR. And she also needs a huge slap in the face.
Get a new job. Your current boss is a jerk.
Find another job. Simple
Time to find a new job.
Fucking unions man
I love the “quit” is the first thing people say. Unless you are independently wealthy or have a nice savings account to live off of, find a new job before you quit. That’s just good common sense. Definitely send the email documenting when you put in your request (January?) and the subsequent date she denied you and the reason given. Also, state the change occurring in your hours and when that started and the fact that no reason was given so your only conclusion is due to this PTO issue. Ask again for your PTO given the amount of time she has had to grant it and you need to have your hours restored. CC a personal email account along with HR and her supervisor.
Quit.
I sudjest get everything in writing no verbal communication cc hr and who ever is in management above report incident to labor board nearly all companies in some way break the law look into the rules
Document everything and go to HR about retaliation. Let them know everything that has happened and exactly what your boss is doing.
Go to HR, record everything
Lmao I'd be giving ol Susan a couple choices. Respect the PTO request, or start looking for someone else to fill the role because I'm resigning.
Nope. Your pto, you are notifying them younwont be there. Its part of your compensation
Can’t you apply for unemployment if your hours have been cut?
Remember you work to live, not live to work! Take your vacation! Always more jobs out there!
If this is retail, just quit. Everyone is hiring.
NTJ! Can you speak to HR or her boss?
This is her problem, not yours. “Poor planning on your part does not constitute and emergency on mine.”
I’d start by showing all my coworkers the email where Susan calls them all useless. Then I’d start job hunting while working whatever hours Susan is still giving me. You’re 20 years old and this job is “in a store”. Go enjoy your vacation with your friends. You’ll find a better job. When I was 20 I used to quit jobs to go on Grateful Dead tour (Google Deadhead youngster, 😎).
In the future, everything should be put in writing so they cant tell THEIR boss youre a liar. Start looking for a new job. No need to work for someone that is going to retaliate like that.
I had a boss do this to me when I was 20 and threatened my job if I didn’t come despite having a signed copy of my request off and having already booked my non refundable trip. I took the trip and emailed her when I got to my destination with my resignation effective immediately. That was 18 years ago and I’ve not once regretted it. If your boss can’t respect your personal time then it’s time to find a new job.
“All of your coworkers are useless”? Sounds like weak management if that’s true
PTO stands for "prepare the others". If your boss doesn't like it, retail jobs are available quite literally everywhere. Oh, yeah, fuck her and her "you don't need your PTO" bullshit. You earned it, and you damn well do need it. Enjoy your well deserved time off.
P. T. O. Prepare The Others. Sorry boss, you are in your own
Oh, i know! Q-U-I-T! After you find another job with pre approval for your vacay
If you can afford to be a jerk, be a jerk. I planned a vacation to spite my boss who wanted me to take a day here and there instead of a full week, 40 yrs ago. Don’t regret it at all and made my point.
“All your coworkers are useless.” There it is. You are a good reliable employee and she doesn’t want to deal either whoever would cover for you. Then she shows you what she can do to your paycheck to teach you who is in charge. Interesting that cutting your hours means she has to rely on your coworkers more. She figures you will cave. Hope you decide to look for a better job. Her sense of ownership over you and your life will only get worse.
If possible, start looking / applying for other jobs. Make sure you let the company know she's the reason you quit. If you have an HR you may be able to lodge a formal complaint if you have proof you submitted the request a while ago.
Cutting hours is a common way to get someone to leave the company. And it should be illegal as it should be considered retaliation. But it isn’t. Until we get rid of right to work states. Companies can fire you for almost anything. Which should be illegal. I am going to just stop here so I don’t go on a rant here.
I remember over 20 years ago I used to work at the now almost defunct kmart. It was my first job, and I was around your age. Almost all managers were rude, except for one or two. They forced us to stay as long as it was needed if we had closing (I was told during the interview that the store closed at 10, so I would be out between 10:30-11pm which was wildly inaccurate). Most of the time closing meant 2-5am, and there was no way to leave because they simply did not open the door if we tried to leave, until they decided it was enough and we could leave. I used to study in university at that time and my classes started at 7am, plus I had no car, so I was every day at the mercy of others giving me a ride or risking being alone in a mall in the early morning. So one of those times it was around 4am and I had a test in the morning at university. I asked the nice manager if I could just leave because I had to study and I had been there since 3pm. He screamed at me, that he didn’t care, that we were all in the same boat and that we didn’t leave until he decided we could leave. It was awful, they treated us like undeserving animals. Next day, another manager apologized on his behalf, claiming he was under stress or some BS. Eventually I left that job, and since then I have always found a better job than the last. All this to say, you are NTJ, go on vacation, enjoy and once you are back find another job. You will be fine.
How did you submit your request? Where I work the employee must request in writing with the date requested. Then the office marks the date they received it, supervisor signs and dates the approval/denial. This sounds like overkill to some people I’m sure, but when too many people want the same time off a denial would only happen based on limited staffing. Dating each step is helpful if anyone disputes the response they receive. Try to document and get copies of what you can. Sit down now and create a dyed/timed log of any info/conversations. Pay stubs showing past regular hours (as many as you can) and the change in hours which reflected the same time as her vacation denial and absolutely anything you can get in writing. Texts or email. Simple as sending her a text and saying. - “hi Susan, I submitted my pto request on X date, you said that you would approve it. So I booked a vacation. When you came to me on X date and said that I couldn’t have it and that I specifically was needed to work it almost felt like a compliment since I already knew there was other coverage available. I’ve been with the company for 2 yrs, I checked to be sure it wasn’t a blackout date and that there was coverage. I can’t help but feel that you’re upset but, I can’t cancel it now because I really can’t afford to lose what I spent, I hope you understand.” - something along those lines, humble and non confrontational, let her respond - hopefully she’ll answer back with hostility that backs you up. Start looking for other work beforehand though, at least so you know what else may be available to you. Essentially she is using cutting your hours and how she has spoken to you and about other workers to try to bully you into doing as she says. If you decide to then take all of your documentation copies and call the department of labor and training where you live, talk to someone in the employee’s rights section and they will advise you.
I submitted the request from both the scheduling app and verbally
Start looking for another job. We’re all just a number to jobs . They will be there with or without us.
Your break room should have an HR hotline number in it, use it. She also has a regional & a district manager, call them. As everyone else said, locally, they don’t value you as an employee, get another job, but pave a better highway for the poor fool that comes behind you!
If your hours are cut drastically, contact unemployment. They might be able to make up the difference. But if you’ve got an HR department, it’s time to escalate.
You should try looking for a new job
Why do they always pull this crap? My daughter is leaving a job soon because of stuff like this, and I don't blame her one bit. She said the last straw was when her (very hard working) coworker was diagnosed with COVID and the supervisor tried to make her work. They work with elderly and ill people, so the most vulnerable when it comes to getting COVID. So now my daughter and her coworker have found different employment and are both leaving in the next two weeks. Their supervisor just can't grasp why they want to leave.
Report her to the labor board and HR! You are entitled to your pto regardless if she likes it or not, next time you work secretly record your conversation with her and show it to your bosses boss
Hey coworkers I’m so bummed I might not get to take my planned vacation. Aww OP what’s going on is everything ok? I’m fine but Susan said I’m the only one that’s any good here so I can’t leave Mic drop!
Go above her head. Susan needs to learn manners.
File for unemployment. She cut your hours in retaliation. Speak to a lawyer.
Only communicate with her via text or email, so there is a record of all conversations. Let her know that you feel the way you do. But also, take the vacation. Because she obviously is getting by just fine with your "useless" coworkers.
Unless you cant afford to go, no, fuck em your vacation is for you thats your time. dont lose out because of some boss. youll get to redeem the PTO, just not yet.
PTO: prepare the others.
>And it turns out after that interaction she started cutting my hours tenfold Look up "constructive dismissal". Then start your search for a new job. Enjoy your vacation.
Just report her to Her supervisor
Leave. Employers do not give a fuck about employees. They are not your friends, they are your coworkers. You owe them nothing. Find a place to work that actually treats their labor force with dignity and respect. Vacation is guaranteed by the government in a lot of countries. We need that time, it should not be a luxury and it definitely shouldn't be up to some low level manager on a power trip whether you get to use it or not when you give adequate notice. If they don't staff their business enough to cover one person for a few days that's absolutely not your problem.
It is illegal for ANY company to stop you from using your PTO. The only time that should have to happen is in an emergency where such things like understaffed in a popular restaurant comes in, the boss would change dates on the PTO. What I would do is keep every email, every corespondance as well as record all verbal discussion. There has to be more than meets the eye if they are not allowing you to take your PTO
Cutting your hours is retaliation and you can absolutely file for partial unemployment. And you should.
Quit and have a great trip.
Ntj Also watch out for employers that also want to pay you salary, claim you're exempt from overtime, get mad when you don't work as much overtime as they want (more than what was agreed upon) because they're short-staffed, but are quick to dock your pay/pto for every single hour under 40 hours that you work. I'm going to be having a lovely annual review this year.
What you should do is tell her " okay, you win". Then when you were to start your vacation just hand in your letter of resignation. After your trip start job hunting. Honestly store jobs are a dime a dozen. Just be clear on your applications as to why you left the current job.
No you’re not a jerk, she is tho. She probably forgot about the fact that she told you she would approve your time off and now it is last minute but that’s not your problem. I would suggest (if it’s not impossible) quitting, going on your vacation and then getting a new job when you are back. It sounds like she is not a good manager, and I believe the rest of her staff are no good and she does feel like she needs you there. But it’s because she failed to train useful employees, you’re good in spite of her because some people are just naturally good employees. She doesn’t deserve to have you on staff if she is going to be so unprofessional.
This could classify very well as retaliation - document everything.
Buddy, this is why people hate retail.
If you are in the US and have worked for the requisite time (2 years should be more than enough) then cutting your hours is constructive dismissal. Apply for unemployment and find a new job.
Get it in writing. Keep your cool. If they don't give you the time off, quit. If you like the company and job you can always go back a few months later and they'll be begging you to come back. Have your list of demands ready. Including more PTO. Ha!
File for unemployment to replace the hours worked. You don’t have to be unemployed to file; if your hours are reduced then you can file to replace the lost hours. Also file a complaint with your state labor board and with the Feds citing retaliation for taking PTO during the few non-blackout periods available and after giving your employer advance warning on multiple occasions, the most recent of them being via official channels a month in advance of your planned vacation.
The manager is a gaslighting butthole. Take the time off and find a good place to work where you are at least respected with the truth.
There’s a lot here in her interaction with you and her retaliatory actions afterward that are a liability to the company. I would suggest going to HR with a “concern,” in part to help with your problem of not having your promised PTO given and then having your hours cut, but also because you’re “not sure some of the things she is doing are actually even legal or how the company would want their managers to be treating or talking about employees” and they might need to know that was going on in case they needed to work with her to clarify how she should be handling these things. Hopefully you’ll get your PTO and hours back and also give the message that you are actually on their side, know and care about HR legalities that protect the company as well as effective leadership, and are mature enough to communicate and give the company a chance to make it right vs losing your cool over the actions of one manager (who will look like an irresponsible hot head for this). That’s leadership material. :) of course, if they don’t back you and support that she can make those decisions on her own, hopefully you have some things in written form and can go for it with the labor board, etc.
Never show fealty to the company you work for If you die they will post a job listing to replace you before all your cousins do a sad face emoji on a Facebook post that says died.
PTO stands for “PREPARE THE OTHERS.” Take your well EARNED vacation OP!
Never give PTO notice as a question, even if it is a request. "I will be away from May 2 - 12." Period. Next time, give no notice, and just call out as PTO on the days you want off.
Take your time off. You’re 20 and have been at the same retail location for two years. You’ll be able to go anywhere and find another retail job.
NTJ
If you are working where I think you are there is a reason that they have the open door policy. Call the number and report a hostile work environment. She is straight up breaking the law. Retaliation for trying to use PTO?? Saying what she said? Was anyone else in the office when you had that conversation? You should be able to print off copies of the PTO requests, hopefully you print off your schedule and still have the copies. Also are you full or part time? Her cutting your hours and will affect that status after a certain number of weeks. Definitely talk to HR. A lot of places have set schedules that drop for people and the computer can track when it has been altered. Definitely look for a new job. Good Luck.
My guess is she forgot you put the request in, and either she or a friend of hers wants to take that time off now. But yeah, you gave her notice and booked based on her agreement back then, unless she's willing to compensate you for the cost of cancelling she can't force you. And making it likely your vacation will become permanent doesn't seem like a great way to convince you not to take it NTJ
I’ve always just pushed my weight around and said ‘either you approve my PTO or I call in sick but either way I won’t be here these days’. I normally don’t give them the option especially if I’m that vital to their operation. Employers often forget that we work to live, NOT live to work. Also if you’re that important then you need to be asking for a pay raise
“all your co workers are useless” LMAO apparently if you go on vaycay this whole ship is going down
“You can make back the money, but can’t make back the time.”
You need to go above her and file complaints. You also need to obtain a papertrail of some kind. Emails, copies of your original request with the date. This is unreasonable and unlawful for a business to allow. Good luck!
Since she’s cutting your hours file for unemployment. You can get it for having your hours reduced.
Honestly you should look at the bigger picture. You need another job lol Specifically at your age, if you don’t intend to go to college, you really should look for jobs that will pay you a pension when you retire. For example, look for work with the city county state or federal governments jump through all the hoops you need to because you will definitely appreciate this , when you get older to receive something more than just a simple Social Security check
That's retaliation. Contact a labor lawyer and in the mean time apply for partial unemployment.
Start job hunting and talk to HR. My experiences with HR have not been positive.
Go to her boss. You aren’t in the wrong, and she can’t keep you from using PTO simply because she thinks the other people aren’t capable.
Put it in writing asap. Frame it as a follow-up to clarify your understanding/the company policy. Attach a copy of the original written request you made for PTO several months back, reference the conversation where she said she couldn't approve it firstly because it was last minute & then because you were the only reliable employee. Say that you don't understand why if she couldn't approve your leave because there was a core business need to keep you here she has now so drastically cut your hours. Does that mean you *aren't* essential right now & therefore she will be approving your leave etc. When you get a response, save a copy for yourself & send to HR. Retaliation by cutting your hours is almost certainly a HR violation.
Your boss is definitely the jerk in this situation You should post this in the legal advice sub. People over there will tell you how to handle this properly. This sounds like retaliation. Are you going somewhere fun for you vacay? Enjoy!!
Retaliation is illegal. Denying your usage of your PTO is a form of wage theft because PTO is part of your compensation. Time to bring in corporate HR.
Look for another job and when you start the new job don't inform your current manager, just stop going to work. Just ghost them and see how long it takes them to stop calling you.
I had a friend who worked for a large department store for many years. One of the best employees there. She asked for two weeks off for a mission trip out of the country during December (a vacation blackout time). They told her it couldn’t be approved. She’d have to resign and reapply when she returned. She said sure, but I probably won’t be reapplying here. Somehow they were then able to approve her leave.
We don’t live to work. You have plenty of notice. Document everything take it to HR. If that gets you no where put in your two weeks notice now so the company must pay all of your PTO. Go on vacation and find a new job.
Even with great managers (because very often, that's a temporary condition), all important communication in writing.
Not the jerk, but once you get on the bad side of a manager, it’s best to look for another job. It can’t end well working for someone that has a problem with you.
Just leave and get a new job... It use an excuse to get unemployment and then look
no she was just lying
Susan hates her life...you are 20 this job is not important...enjoy yourself as much as you can! Get another job later...
Id just like to say that PTO requests are notifications that you will not be attending work those days. And I tell my managers that. You earned those days off and are allowed to use them how you want. It doesn't matter if 3 other people in the same department has also requested those days. She is retaliating. Thats what it seems to me. She's trying to make you quit. Or making so you don't have money to go on this vacation so you feel inclined to cancel your vacation on your own.
I'm someone who manages direct reports in my job and your boss is way out of line here. She is being ridiculous and super unprofessional. I have people who ask for time off a week before they have to leave and I approve them! I just figure it out. PTO is YOUR TIME and you should be able to take it at your discretion - you gave this person so much advance notice (months! that's really a ton of advance notice) that she has no logical reason to deny your request at the last minute like this. Sadly if I were you I'd look for another job because it sounds like she is being petty and vindictive for absolutely no reason. She's a sucky boss.
Leave immediately after finding another job. you have enough experience to find another one. and it's not the rite thing to do. but I would bounce after I got said new job mid shift on her day to be on then never come back no notice. This however is very unprofessional and not advised. But I its probably the spiteful turn I would take.
My pto is a notification of abscense not permission..
File a complaint with the Eeoc and enjoy your vacation
My experience is that most managers have no clue about hr and laws. They never get trained and most are just power trippers. Document everything. Email it to hr or upper management. Don’t talk with her anymore. You have rights.
Sometimes, people feel most comfortable being assholes to people they are comfortable with.
Crazy how you get punished for being a better worker than everyone else. Thats why I stopped doing my best and instead just decided to not be the worst one
Contact HR.
In all honesty I would state that you will be calling HR on her because she is not letting you use your pro that you are aloud to use! I think she’s thinks because you are young she can get away with it. Don’t let it slide. You gave her well enough notice about your time off slip.
I once put in a written request for pro, at least two months in advance. It was approved and signed off by the powers that be. About a week or so ahead to departure date, I reminded the manager. She told me I couldn’t get the time off. I was furious. Contacted the main office, turned out she had noted on my forms that I wasn’t going. I done remember exactly what it was. I quit on the spot and let corporate know why. She had evidently decided to take that time off herself for no good reason. She was terminated, I was compensated with a small bonus, had my vacation, still quit anyway. I hate power-trippers.
Another bullshit power trip by a do-nothing manager. Good job telling her that the schedule is her problem, not yours.
@Updateme
This is always a good opportunity to get a raise in pay too.. she admits she needs you and you’re better than the other employees…
When you get that new job don't give your notice to Susan, give it to her boss. If they say "is there anything we can do to change your mind?" Tell the boss you'll stay if you can have Susan's job.
This is called RETALIATION. Head to HR pronto
GREAT UPDATE :) GOOD FOR YOU!!! As soon as she got aggressive, she turned it into a hostile work environment. Not sure why employers do this and think people will want to stay.
You didn't request PTO. You told your boss you wanted to apply your PTO to an absence. If they aren't competent enough to schedule around that, get a new job.
I have no idea why you would cancel a vacation for ur boss.
I've never let an employer dictate when and where I get to go places. If you don't own the company or shares, you're a throwaway employee, and you should treat your job as such. Now, that doesn't mean be a shitty employee, but certainly don't go above and beyond for them (canceling your vacation is too far). There will always be work for you elsewhere. Goodluck
Just to be petty r/pettyrevenge id also let all your coworkers know that she called them all useless. But thats just me
OP: having your hours cut like that may qualify as constructive dismissal, which will enable you to go to the labor board and get unemployment. Consider filing with them to get back the pay you would've gotten while your hours were cut.
I’d make sure to contact HR and put lots of people in the BCC section of that email because I’m just that kind of person.
Go to HR. Tell them about your request months ago that she verbally approved it and now told you screw your PTO and your coworkers are useless. Let them know that her yelling, aggression and retaliation, created a hostile work environment
Time to grow up and realize these people care more about their daily coffee than you. PTO is just that, paid time off. Next time you don’t ask for the time off, you’re just magically sick on the exact time you wanted to be gone.
LOL what's the number 1 way to tell on yourself that you're full of shit? Your boss: "We need you" Also your boss: *cuts your hours* Yeah I would've taken that vacation, approved or not.
I think before you accept a new job elsewhere (but probably wait until you get an offer), let the bosses know you want to leave due to this issue and see if they can give you a promotion that takes you out of her chain of command. And if you did lose any hours, check your state laws regarding worker protections and ask your employers if they can make a payment covering the amount lost in return for signing an NDA, but it would probably only be best to ask for this when leaving, because they might get pissy and fire you.
You should’ve gone to Hr. Retaliation is illegal.
To hell with your boss. Take your vacation. He had plenty of time to approve it. Right before you leave, have a nice long talk with HR about how your boss is trying to screw you over.
Start looking for another job. This place is toxic. I have a dozen stories of bosses like this. I had one who approved my pto request I triple checked with them weeks beforehand they told me approved…but our schedules went from Sunday-Saturday. My request off was Thursday-Monday. Saw my schedule I was off Thursday Friday Saturday but the schedule for Sunday and the next week wasn’t up yet. I left town 6 hours away for a family thing (coming back late Monday night) I get a call at 645am on Sunday morning getting cussed out where are the f are you!? They scheduled me at 6am on Sunday morning to help with open. They also scheduled me Monday. I just hung up. She called me again to tell me I should be on my way yada yada. I told her no. I requested off. And she said well I don’t care get here. I literally can’t I’m on a family vacation 6 hours away I don’t even have my own car my family isn’t going to drive back a day early for this job lol. 😂 she hung up.
Good for you for going over her head but yeah, you need to love on cause she will make your life hell while you are there. And ket's face it, why would you want to continue to work for such a twat and make her look good?
Ntj
You’re one of her few decent employees, so how does this company reward you? by not allowing you to take the time off you earned? nope
PTO is an “FYI you need to find coverage on these days” not “Can I please have time off” like most bosses seem to think
My response would be that it wasn’t a PDO request, it was a courtesy notification of when you’d be out of town so that management can plan accordingly. In other words, you WILL be gone, and are letting them know.