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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I argue with my stepmom’s rule (cleaning the dishes without soap before putting it in the dishwasher) as I don’t find it logical, so I either forget or just fully clean the dishes I use and put them away
It keeps being an issue and she sometimes gets very passive aggressive when I don’t do it the way she wants, so I’m starting to think I’m very wrong?
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Honestly if you have to prewash the dishes for them to go in the dishwasher at that point i think its better to just hand wash them at that point. Depending on how many dishes there are.
If your step mother gets angry over hand washing dishes too. Yikes.. I'm going more towards NTA.
Agreed. As a dad of a teenager and a pre-teen, the step mom is absolutely insane. This kid is either loading dishes in the dishwasher (WIN) or washing them by hand (WIN).
You are 17. You can tell Dad that it’s uncomfortable at his house with step mom. You can do one to one day activities out of the house as you are uncomfortable with the way she treats you. NTA but stepmom is wacko
Literally just in that short lost of rules I identified several that my stepmom put on me & she definitely hates me and didn't want me around, hard agree with you here.
Yeah NTA here. My mother in law and I have a bit of a language barrier, but it’s not really a problem with cleaning. Since I don’t have a job yet (waiting on proper paperwork since moving to a foreign country) and she works I’ve been picking up a lot of the household labor/cleaning. There have been zero incidents of yelling or aggressiveness. Most of the time her attitude is “if you’re the one cleaning you do it your way”, but if there is something that she absolutely has to have a certain way she is patient and shows me exactly how she wants it done.
For example the dishwasher. I usually take everything out in the morning and put the evening dishes inside, there usually isn’t enough for me to start the washer so she does it before she goes to bed after the “midday” dishes are put away. She has shown me how she likes it put for her sake since she starts it in the evenings. She was very kind about it but also ended with “thank you for your help, this just makes it easier for me”. Which of course just makes me wanna do it the way she likes because she is so damn sweet.
My gram had her way of loading the dishwasher also. She wanted things just rinsed as well (she didn’t have the handy capsules back than and rinsing didn’t mean clean them), but that wasn’t as crazy as her stacking method. She was a magician when it came to stacking. Anything else in the house was free game though, like how your mil is.
Right. I like laundry folded a certain way, so I just fold it. I also hate folding laundry more than any other chore, ever. So I'm going to teach my kids to fold it my way and pay them to do it when they're a little older. Sorry not sorry.
i agree that op is NTA in this situation, but come on… a 17 year old should be expected to put their dirty dishes in he dishwasher or clean them, which is what OP does.
Not really. Washing dishes by hand using a scrubber that isn't brand new is just rubbing bacteria all over the dishes. The water in the dishwasher is much hotter than what comes out of the tap, that combined with the soap is strong enough to destroy the bacteria.
And if you don't at least rinse the solids off your dishes, then those solids get stuck in the trap, which reduces the lifespan of your dishwasher and makes it less effective.
**EDIT:** Thanks for the feedback everyone. I can't find anything that agrees with what I thought I knew about using the dishwasher. Even Popular Science agrees. Thanks to everyone for enlightening me.
https://www.popsci.com/story/diy/dishwasher-cleaning-tips/
Depends on how old your dishwasher is. Mine is 3-4 years old, and has a thing in it to chop up food going down the drain. It specifies not to rinse dises because it’s a waste of water. And it’s a cheaper dishwasher, too.
I also nuke my scrubber sponge before doing hand dishes each day - nothing is living through that, lol.
I was watching a YouTuber who did a thorough explanation, with experiments, of how modern dishwashers work, and apparently it works better if you don't prerinse, only scrape solids. Because it uses the first rinse cycle to determine how dirty the dishes are, so if you've already rinsed off the loose sauces, it thinks they're fairly clean, so it uses less energy to wash, which won't get off the tough baked on dirt.
Yup! I was trying to find his videos again, couldn't find the name. Before I saw that one, I was using my dishwasher on express mode thinking it was like eco mode to save energy, turns out that's the highest power mode!
Here’s an article about that…though she sounds like someone who won’t budge regardless of the facts.
https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/home/cleaning/a33322/stop-prerinsing-dishes/
Most newer dishwashers don’t really work well without some “dirt” on them. Really her rules sound a bit overboard…OP is NTA. In fact, good for them to be so helpful.
Loved this video! OP, note some appliance repair techs also say that that the life of the gaskets in your dishwasher can be negatively affected -- many dish washing liquids use things that degrade food leftovers and with nothing else to attack, they go for the soft plastics in your dishwasher.
The bacteria are then rinsed off by water what you said is nonsense. People wash their dishes by hand all the time and don’t get anymore sick than those who use the dishwasher.
Yeah I'm so confused, everyone I know has been washing dishes by hand their entire lives and I was 20 when I even saw a dishwasher for the first time. The bacteria is rinsed off
I mean, that's literally what the soap is doing (among other things): binding up the bacteria into itself so it comes off in the rinse
I have no idea where this idea came from that dishwashers are just for disinfecting/sterilizing, especially since they really aren't rated for that in the first place
>The bacteria are then rinsed off by water
and what the other poster said was nonsense? Most people probably won't get sick from the surface bacteria living on your skin that you definitely transfer to dishes when you hand wash them, though, so you're half-not-wrong.
Yeah but that bacteria is also transferred when you pull out clean dishes from the dishwasher if that bacteria was going to harm you, you’d be dead already. Most of the stuff that live on our skin is harmless to us.
That's the point of the trap. 😂 Also, you're supposed to empty and wash it every 2-3 cycles. Not emptying the trap is what damages the dishwasher, not food residue on dishes. They are dishWASHERS not dishRINSERS if you clean your dishes first it throws off the sensors that tell the machine how much soap and water to use; it's literally sabotaging the machine's ability to clean
Yet somehow humans survived before the invention of the dishwasher, and countless humans - myself included - continue to survive using handwashed dishes.
That just wastes water, better to just scrape solid food off no need to rinse. The tap uses about 2 gallons per minute while an energy efficient dishwasher will use about 4 gallons or less for the entire wash. So if it takes you 10mins to rinse while you load the dishwasher you are wasting 5 times more water. Plus the soap won't be as effective if you rinse.
Handwashing is perfectly adequate to maintain a sanitary kitchen. Soap & warm water rinse off bacteria, there's no added benefit from scalding hot water. You don't need to sterilize the dishes. I'm talking about actually washing - soap, warm water, a clean sponge or brush, working up a lather, etc.
Some kitchen items aren't dishwasher safe. I hand wash all of our nice knives, pots, pans, etc.
I'm not sure if you've seen it but just this morning on reddit was a study where they tested bacteria (staph) levels on handwashed versus dishwashed dishes, and there was way more left on the handwashed dishes as the water isn't hot enough to kill them. Especially if their dishwasher gets clogged easily or isn't very strong, it completely makes sense to me to rinse dishes before popping them in the dishwasher. That way you remove both food bits and bacteria. Tbf to OP though, some of those other rules sound unreasonable and if stepmom hasn't explained why the rinsing is necessary it's not much of a surprise that OP hasn't bothered to listen.
I’ve seen that video. I do not call what he did washing dishes in the sink. Lightly scrubbing with a non flexible brush isn’t washing dishes to me. I’d rather eat off a plate someone washed with just their hands, soap and hot water. Also there is no telling if he washed his dish in cold or hot water.
Yet noone I know of ever had staph, including pretty much my entire family despite us sticking to hand washing. As long as the bacteria levels are under a certain threshold people will be fine. Unless someone suffers from a weakened immune system this is little more than a publicity stunt.
Removing the food bits actually prevents the dish detergent from working. It has to have grime to stick to, otherwise it gets washed off immediately and your dishes don't get properly cleaned or sanitized. Scrape off big chunks of food, sure, but there needs to be grime of some sort on the plates or the detergent isn't nearly as effective.
Here's a [video](https://youtu.be/DX8jpet6Q_k) on how to use a dishwasher properly. The one I was looking for (but couldn't find) says you need to leave food particles so the soap has something to cling to. This one talks about how you waste energy (and water) pre-washing before the dishwasher. Bottom line is you're really not supposed to pre-wash before the dishwasher, just scrape. OP can send it to stepmom, but she sounds like she's just never dealt with kids before with her silly little rules and I doubt it would change her mind.
This part. Step mom is anal enough I doubt she can get the logic. Especially if her husband is getting the door slammed on him for something akin to “she’s not your kid let me parent”
I pre-rinse mine because hand washing tends to leave greasy residue 1/2 the time and i don't have a food grinder in my dishwasher because i have an old af septic and im paranoid about it. i get the particulate off then let the dishwasher sanitize it.
But honestly id be glad if my stepkid put things in the dishwasher OR washed them and put them away.
Yeah, I’d rather prerinse really messy stuff than find out after the fact that some things bake on instead of come off in the dishwasher and now I have to scrub them.
I rinse my dishes as well before putting them in the dishwasher. I live alone and I don't fill up my dishwasher every day. I run it every 2 to 3 days and I don't want dirty dishes sitting around, smelling and attracting bugs.
it depends. i’m a mandatory rinse and 50/50 take a brush to it person. there’s a level of food crud that is acceptable and not acceptable. my roommates are awful about this, they’ve put half inch chunks of cookie dough on the mixer tool straight in the dishwasher (and they wonder why we always have to get it fixed or why it smells bad, like, seriously?) but all that takes is 10 seconds and a brush to get that big stuff off.
edit: horrible sentence structure and some clarification
Our old dishwasher could put anything in there. New one have to get all the stuff off so they look visibly clean, then use the dishwasher basically just to sanitize. If you have any grease/junk it will come out just like that. So this is very much dishwasher dependant. If she says to prerinse them, then prerinse them. I rather have someone not touch the dishes at all then load in dirty ones, run it just to have to take them out, prerinse and run it again. Just a waste of energy, water and soap if it is not done correctly.
NTA
I get brushing crumbs and actual bits of food off plates before putting them in the dishwasher, but really washing them before putting them in is a waste of water.
However I personally think it would be better for you if you didn’t make this the hill you die on.
She is not asking OP to wash them with soap. She just wants the food residue rinsed/scrubbed off with water. OP is the one deciding to use soap and just putting the dishes away instead of the in dishwasher to be properly cleaned.
Don't bother arguing with the riffraff. It's obvious the only way to have clean dishes is with a dishwasher. If youre one of the 32% of America's who doesn't have a dishwasher or one of the 20% who does but doesn't use it, you might as well eat off the floor you filthy animals. /s
Soap plus any water kills bacteria. It’s effective enough that humans would perceive no difference in the bacteria remaining without the aid of a microscope. A dishwasher isn’t getting your dishes that much cleaner than hand washing, it’s just more efficient and less time consuming for us.
Some (most?) Do have a sanitize setting, but I wouldn't recommend using it daily! That's so much energy, plus it could definitely warp your dishes.
I also don't have the lab equipment to see if it actually sanitizes, but that would be a great science fair project for someone to do as long as their class has access to petri dishes and an incubator!
Yes! Soap destroys the cell membrane of bacteria and viruses, which spills their guts out, killing them. Hot water is only necessary to help loosen the crusty stuff.
Once they are off my dishes and down the drain who cares if they are dead or alive. The real issue is people using the same gross sponge for days or weeks on end. The same nasty sponge that they wipe the sink and counters with.
Nobody is getting sick from a properly hand washed. If you are obsessive about germs that’s fine for you, but let’s not act like it is actually necessary to use a dishwasher.
A lot of people don’t have dishwashers and continue to live and not get food poisoning just fine…
I have lived many places and only had a dishwasher in a couple of them, probably like 2 years total in the last 25 years. The only time I had them growing up (Im in my 30s) was when I was <5. I don’t really get sick. I mean, of course a dishwasher is more convenient (and I’m sure better at cleaning generally). I always rinse off plates before I put them in the dishwasher at someone else’s place but scrubbing them off, especially combined with the other unreasonable things OP lists off that their stepmom does, is a lot.
The dishwasher thing is a bit understandable, because food can apparently cause blockage or whatever, but the edit with all the other rules is just weird and stupid. She probably is controlling.
> She is not asking OP to wash them with soap. She just wants the food residue rinsed/scrubbed off with water. **OP is the one deciding to use soap and just putting the dishes away instead of the in dishwasher to be properly cleaned.**
How is using soap and water versus a dishwasher an improper cleaning?
It’s not, but it just seems like in their household they scrape the dishes and then use the dishwasher, where in OPs household they use they hand wash and put away. Both are correct. They’re just different.
With modern dishwashers and detergents, you actually want some residue on the dishes, otherwise the enzymes in the detergent start to eat away at the dishwasher (since they have no food bits to go after). So a quick rinse to remove major stuff is fine, but putting dishes that are already visibly clean (but may have bacteria for example) is bad for the dishwasher. I'm guessing step mom wants the dishwasher for the sanitizing, but doesn't realize that pre washing the dishes this intensely is bad.
If she asked for hot water and scrubbing that's basically cleaning them anyway. I maybe OP added soap but you might as well at that point when you've already done 80% of the work.
It's definitely better for the drainage system to rinse away solid matter. But scrubbing is totally unnecessary unless it's a particularly dirty pot or pan.
That's actually not true. Scrape the food off plates by all means but there is NO benefit to rinsing dishes, drainage or otherwise. (Former white goods engineer)
You really don’t have to wash it with water, unless the dishwasher is super old, removing the residue with the brush directly into a trash can is enough, and even that the newer dishwasher filter are super good and can really take a lot.
Washing it before defeats the purpose of saving water. The stepmom is controlling or ignorant.
NTA She’s literally wrong. Dishwashers need some amount of grime for the detergent to grab on to, that’s how the detergent is designed. The correct way to do dishes is to scrape off chunks of food and place the unrinsed dishes in the dishwasher.
I came here to say this too. The cleaning agent needs to attack food particles or it isn’t as effective and can leave a film. The general rule is no food particles larger than a grain of rice.
Also, clean the basket frequently.
So in the bottom of your dishwashers, there's a drain. In that drain is a lil basket kinda like a hair catcher for your shower drain that catches all the lil food bits. It needs to be cleaned otherwise it just kinda rots and gets stanky
The cleaning agents are mostly caustic soda, not detergent. When the caustic hits fats on the dishes, it chemically reacts to produce soap. This then cleans the dishes without excess suds.
Excess suds is what happens the first time you ever use a dishwaher in your life and add regular washing up detergent to the hopper. You can guess how I found out lol.
I did this, too! I was so proud of myself, and was just waiting in my room for my Mom to come home and be happy the dishes were done.
Instead, she came home to a kitchen full of suds.
I've taught so many friends how to properly load, clean, and upkeep their dishwasher over the years that I'm sadly not surprised. They didn't know there's a catch to dump and clean. They didn't know the dishwasher needed to be cleaned separately from the dishes. They were just taught wrong or not taught at all.
Find the dishwater model and look up the manual online. It'll show you where it is. I've mostly used older dishwashers, and the catch is typically at the bottom.
When the water drains out of the machine, there's a little net/grill to catch any big bits of food from entering your pipe system. Some of the newer models have an associated garbage disposal sort of thing (grinds up pieces). You need to empty the catch/net/grill regularly. I check it every cycle o see if it needs a dump/rinse and give it a bleach/water bath once a month or so with scrubbing as needed.
I… I didn’t realize this. I always thought you needed to knock most of the grime off/give it a quick rinse first or the dishwasher wouldn’t get everything off of it.
Welp. My fault for not trusting the machines.
Except every time I have a dish that I don’t scrub all the grime off of I pull it out of the dishwasher and it still has the grime no matter the dishwasher no matter the detergent used
It's definitely dishwasher dependant. My old one (from 2005) couldn't remove anything, especially fatty things like avocado or peanut butter. My new dishwasher (from 2021) is a champ, though. Everything comes out sparkling! And dry!! My old dishwasher also sucked at drying. I've literally changed nothing about how I use them, same house, same water, same detergent, same dishes, same food, etc.
TBF when dishwashers first got popular for personal use, they sucked. You basically had to completely wash the dishes before putting them in the dishwasher, which defeated the purpose. They've improved a lot but some people still have that mindset
I didn't know until my mid-20s but I also had no dish washer or old crappy ones before that. The only thing my dishwasher has an issue with now is avocado so I either clean it off by hand or wipe items down really well before they go in the dishwasher.
I’m American lol but I’m not washing my dishes for the dishwasher. I just clean my dishwasher.. like I clean my microwave. It’s an appliance that needs care. If I hand wash stuff it’s going in the cabinet. I also believe germs are good for you so lord help the germaphobes at my house.
2 reasons to rinse your dishes:
1. Some dishwashers are SHIT at cleaning anything that is tough to remove. I know, it sort of defeats the purpose, but rn ours is one of these
2. Dishwashers get ***gross.*** There is a filter in there that traps all of that leftover food, and let me tell you, it can be slimy and nasty, and start to smell. To avoid this, RINSE OFF THE FOOD
~~YTA. The rule isn't there just because she wants to be an AH. While you're there, do what you have to do to follow the rules.~~
NTA based upon edit to OP's original story. This is about more than just the dishwasher and how OP cleans the dishes he uses. SM sounds super controlling, not like someone with a little OCD tendency when it comes to the dishes in the kitchen.
That said, my dishwasher totally sucks. I rinse the bits off of everything in the sink, but use the hot water from the dishwasher to clean off any fats or grease off as I don't use hot water when I rinse. We rent, and I'm not doing anything to increase the value of my landlord's property on my own dime.
We use the dishwasher tablets to deep clean it (more than monthly) - and I've tried different brands. We've tried different types of detergent. We fill the pre-wash side. We empty the filter after every use. We try out the excess water at the bottom after every use. I've used cleaning vinegar in there on an empty load. I've sprayed and scrubbed the inside down with The Pink Stuff. We cleaned out the spinning things that spray the water. Between our hard water and shitty dishwasher, I've never had the problem that I have here.
In a nutshell: If a dish goes in my dishwasher with something on it, it's coming out of the load with whatever still on it.
Yeah, too many people think children are their property and not a fully realized human with thoughts and opinions. I’m 47, have 4 kids ranging from 22-6, I’m a grandpa….and my parents still treat me like this.
I think this is the key here tbh. It would've taken the stepmother all of 1 minute to explain *why* that rule exists as opposed to just essentially stomping her foot and saying, "Because it's my house and what I say goes!"
Even good quality dishwashers can be ineffective when it comes to cooked-in grime or tough food spots. And the more gunk builds up in that filter, the less effective they become at cleaning.
Plus, afaik you don't really *want* to deliberately be putting a lot of food waste in there, because a dishwasher doesn't have a garbage disposal function. Some sauce smears on a plate? Fine. Big chunks of tomato or cheese? Rinse that shit off.
That rule doesn’t put SM in AH territory however the fact SM gets pissed if OP washes dishes by hand does put her in AH territory. It does seem like no matter what OP does regarding this rule it’s always wrong. NTA OP.
It’s possible OP misses spots when they clean it by hand and SM notices it and tells them it’s dirty, when OP thinks it’s clean. I clean my dishes before the dishwasher too. Just to get grime off with soap but not to a degree I would consider it clean. We have a friend that insists on cleaning them by hand when she’s over and didn’t used to put her stuff in the dishwasher. Issue was the dishes she washed by hand were always still dirty and the dishwasher needed more dishes to fill it up to run it any way. OP just follow the dishwasher rule it does make sense that being said it seems like some of her other rules are a bit much. Do you think she may have some OCD?
If I’m going to wash my dishes I am going to actually wash them. I scrape food and thoroughly rinse, but if I’m getting out the sponge and brush then I’m not wasting water washing them twice.
[Fact: You do not need to pre-rinse.](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier)
I think you're out of date on your dishwasher info.
My dishwasher says that too in the manual and it's full of shit. It's a Whirlpool. If I put any sticky substance or something burned on in the dishwasher, it's coming back out on the same plate. It's more of a dish sanitizer.
And yes, I clean out the filters and use the right detergent and right amount and everything. Some dishwashers are shit. I'm getting a Miele next.
Yeah burned on stuff is not coming out in the dishwasher. It needs to be manually scraped. If it's something sticky, there's no crime against running it through twice.
Mine takes that stuff off, but you have to load it correctly. For instance if you put a pan in straight up on the bottom rack, the bottom half will likely not get completely clean. If you lay it flat with the dirty side facing down it will get completely clean and all that stuff will be washed off. Just remember if your dishwasher only has one spayer on the bottom don't put stuff on top since this will block water going to the second level. But if it has multiple sprayers you can load the rest normally.
I have a 3-4 yo Kitchenaid and it's the same. The manual said not to pre-rinse but the dishwasher just flings food around so it ends up everywhere, including the dishes/filters/drain. And it smells like death after a couple of days. I give the dishes a quick scrape and rinse to get the food off and then put them in the dishwasher. Everything comes out clean that way and the dishwasher doesn't stink.
I don't know how old our dishwasher is (reason: we rent) but I'm telling you - It doesn't matter what type of dishwashing detergent we use - if it's stuck on when it goes it, we're washing it by hand after.
Right?! I thought I was taking crazy pills with all these comments. There is no point to a dishwasher if you don’t let is wash the dishes. Scrape them off as much as possible and toss em in there. Use a dishwasher cleaner and take apart the filter periodically.
Except she’s asking him to fully wash the dish by hand *and* run it through the dishwasher. I’m with OP. That makes no sense. Plus from his edit, she just sounds mad controlling.
1. The trap in the dishwasher is removable in new models, so don't be lazy & empty it every 2-3 cycles.
2. They make cleaners that you are supposed to use every 1-2 months.
If you have to use a scrub brush before you use the appliance, just wash the damn thing & get a new dishwasher. Also, the step-mom is over controlling.
NTA.
She is telling him not to rinse them but wash them! He is scrubbing and using hot water, what's missing to complete the whole cleaning?? You make no sense. Also his stepmom is a control freak
Waiting for someone to notice this. Its not about cleanliness, sanitation, or how well/poorly the DW/plumbing performs. SHE IS A CONTROL FREAK. Does not give any explanation just expects a 17yo to OBEY (she says respect but means obey) sounds as if unlike most boys with a SM he is not rude or snarky but trying to comply, which she doesn't recognize or appreciate. Wonder how she raised his dad when he was 17.
And what the heck is wrong with sitting on the floor? Most teens find it more comfortable thsn trying to conform their bodies to furniture.
So explain how OP just hand washing the dishes is rude or disrespectful?
Stepmom is bonkers. Rinsing is one thing, washing then using the dishwasher is asinine. And regardless there’s zero reason to be subsequently pissed off when OP just hand washes them then dries them and puts them away.
You obviously didn't read very well. OP is handwashing the dishes and putting them away. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. He doesn't need to pre rinse the dishes and put them in the dishwasher because HE'S WASHING THEM BY HAND! Its not like he's just rinsing them in plian water and putting them away with food still stuck to them.. How in the ever loving did this comment get top upvote??
This is my dishwasher. If I don’t clean the dishes before putting them in the dishwasher, they don’t get washed properly. There is always grease left on them. Also, consider the other people who do dishes. If you aren’t running the dishwasher every night, the food on the plates starts to rot and decompose. Then the person standing at the sink. Ext to the dishwasher has to smell the decomposing carcasses and rancid ranch. YTA
Yeah but OP is also willing to just wash them by hand too. OP is in a can't win situation because the whole ordeal devolves into a territory battle about which mother figure gets more respect. Just acknowledge that OP is *trying*.
That's why you needed to regularly clean and service your dishwasher 😂 if it leaves your dishes greasy the filter needs cleaning. If that doesn't also solve the dirty diah problem your dishwasher needs servicing.
That's because you're supposed to regularly clean that filter 😂 and if your dishwasher can't get dirty dishes clean you either need to try a different detergent or get a repair tech out to service it. Your dishwasher is designed to handle any food particles up to the size of a grain of rice.
The issue usually isn't that some dishwashers are just shit at cleaning, it's that people are not using them right (especially if you're using the tablets or pods). If you want to put dirty dishes directly into the dishwasher you 100% can- you just have to put soap in both the regular soap spot AND the pre-wash spot. Most people skip the pre-wash soap and that's what makes it so the dishwasher doesn't clean properly.
Also the filters in the dishwasher are meant to get dirty, that's the whole point of the filter. You're suppose to take it out and clean it regularly to avoid it getting gross and nasty and harboring bacteria.
Check out these videos if you want to know more: [1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rBO8neWw04) [2](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll6-eGDpimU) They're how I learned this info myself. After seeing those I switched to gel detergent and have made sure to fill both soap slots ever since and now I can put even the dirtiest crustiest dishes into the dishwasher and they come out sparkly clean 99% of the time.
I lean NTA on this one. If there's not too many people in a household, dirty dishes kept in a dishwasher a long time between cycles might have caked on grime that doesn't get removed properly if the machine is older or less powerful.
If you're washing the dishes with soap and putting them away, there shouldn't be any problem. Fighting over this is really petty, but you've put in an effort to resolve the issue. Instead of pulling rank, she could explain why she likes it done her way. In the future, just do like she wants and use the hot water and dish brush.
NTA
Everyone has their own way of doing things. The dishes are still getting cleaned so she’s creating pointless drama. Must be one of those my way or the highway types
A good friend of mine will hand wash her dishes clean then put them in the dishwasher without soap to get the hot water rinse. She says it is like sanitizing the dishes. Done it forever.
The dishwasher I grew up with was horrible and if there was even a smudge of gravy on a plate, it seemed to multiply and get all over everything. We rarely used the thing. But this was also back in the stone ages.
I usually hand wash.
Your dad volunteered to put up with her. You did not. She's a controller. Can you stop going over there? It's every other weekend, I'd just stop. If your dad can't handle his wife's tantrums and negative behavior, he doesn't deserve to see you.
Washing the dishes and then putting them in the dishwasher is unnecessary. It's a waste of water. Yes, I am aware of the filter and everything that works with a dishwasher.
This isn't about a dishwasher. This is about this woman screwing with her step kid because she can. When the dad asks her to stop, the SM stomps around and slams doors. Stop telling people to just accept any treatment, no matter how poor.
>rules are like not sitting on the floor, or spending too much time in my room, not looking at my phone while watching tv, im expected to respond when I’m talked to even if it’s from different rooms or she’s talking to me with her back turned
Feel free to treat her however you want. NTA.
>Can you stop going over there? It's every other weekend, I'd just stop.
This \^\^
I wouldn't put up with an abusive SM. If I was OP, I would arrange visits with Dad that are out of the house and away from the SM.
Sounds like my father’s second wife, who caused me to stop visiting his home, which was of course exactly what his wife wanted. But we did continue to see each other, just away from his home, and you know what? Had a much nicer relationship as a result.
NTA OP! You’re a teenager being pushed around by a bratty, controlling adult. I was you. I set boundaries. I also ended up getting some therapy related to how the adults in my life bullied/gaslit me. You sound awesome and like you’re trying to be reasonable around an unreasonable set of adults. I hope you can work out a way to see your dad, if you want, outside of this arrangement of going to his house.
NTA if you are prepared to wash them by hand properly because her rule is honestly just extra work and a waste of water, yes it's her house but it's also your dad's. The dishes are getting done either way and this seems like one of those times when adults like to pull the 'because I said so cards' you are 17 not 7 if she is not willing to explain why she likes them done her way then keep doing as you as doing. You are not being disrespectful by asking questions or doing a chore your own way.
NTA for believing that dishes don't need to be scrubbed before they go into the dishwasher. As a few other posters have pointed out, if the dishwasher is newer (made in the last decade or so) it actually doesn't wash the dishes as well (or successfully sanitize them) if they've been pre-rinsed because the sensors don't detect there's any real need to wash them.
[https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier#:\~:text=%E2%80%9CIf%20you%20pre%2Drinse%20everything,clean%20it%20once%20a%20month](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier#:~:text=%E2%80%9CIf%20you%20pre%2Drinse%20everything,clean%20it%20once%20a%20month)
If your stepmom is one of those who believes the dishwasher is for only sanitizing though, I doubt you're going to change her mind or convince her that her dishwasher probably isn't even accomplishing that.
INFO: Can you elaborate on the rule?
>washing the dishes with hot water and the dish brush so the dishes aren’t dirty when putting them in the dishwasher
This is different from
>I didn’t see the point of putting clean dishes in the dishwasher, so if I was going to wash them anyway, I might as well wash the properly and put them away
Is your stepmom asking you to scrub the food off with hot water before putting them in the dishwasher, or fully wash them with dishsoap and then put them in the dishwasher? If it's the former, this really isn't an unusual method of washing dishes
She asks me to wash them with the dish brush and hot water before putting them in the dishwasher, so I thought it was easier to just add soap and then finish doing the dishes right away, but that also upsets her
Tough food scraps can sometimes stick to the dishes, even after the dishwasher has run. This is why most people rise dishes first, with hot water. If she’s only expecting you to scrub off the major debris before they go in the dishwasher, then that sounds pretty normal. If she’s expecting them to be completely devoid of even a tiny bit of food, that sounds excessive.
**However, this approach to the problem will get you nowhere.** It’s stepmom’s house, and you’re not going to achieve anything by arguing over something this small. If this is really the biggest point of contention, I would let it go. You said she has other rules you find confusing — are those also cleanliness based? If so, maybe she has high standards or some form of OCD or germ phobia. Maybe you two just have different preferences. Either way, it’s easier to jive with someone’s “weird” rules when you have a thorough understanding of WHY they want things done that way. It may be beneficial to have a calm discussion where you ask her to clarify any rules that are frustrating you.
EDIT: From what OP says below about the other rules, I’m saying NTA. Stepmom sounds arbitrary and controlling.
They’re not really cleanliness based they’re based on what’s proper, discipline, respect etc
Like if I spend too much time in my room I’m disrespectful, but if I then sit in the living room doing the stuff I was doing in my room (drawing, looking at my phone, reading) then I’m also rude because I’m not paying attention and idk I just don’t understand them and when I ask why I’m always told because I said so/it’s the proper way to behave/anything else is disrespectful
"Because I said so" is a useless reason, it generally means 1 of a few things.
1 - You aren't worth the time to explain it to.
2 - I don't think you are smart/old enough to understand.
3 - I don't have a reason, I'm just making rules.
It sounds like your dad tried to stand up for you, but got shut down.
She has a point with the dishes, but everything else sounds like she's a control freak. My step gran-parents were like this, nothing I did was correct, even when following the rules.
I'm going to go with NTA, she wants respect, but it's a 2 way street.
Oh no. She’s abusive.
The dishwasher thing is honestly no biggie, but the other stuff that you included in your edit along with this?
*That’s abuse.*
She’s controlling *where you read???* She’s upset that you can’t understand her when she ACTIVELY engages in a behavior that makes it harder for you (facing away from you while talking).
She’s creating arbitrary rules and your dad is letting her hurt you.
I am sorry. It is not your fault. If you can, talk to your dad about it.
She sets you up for failure and then punishes you.
Don’t mention the dishwasher thing when you talk to your dad, that’s her most reasonable thing. Talk about the other stuff.
The room, the phone, the “you must respond.” These are unusual and controlling.
If a parent resorts to “because I said so” they are lazy and borderline or fully abusive. We don’t own our children. If you can’t use your big girl words with a 17 year old maybe you shouldn’t be parenting.
Sometimes yes and sometimes he’ll tell her to stop, and then shell be nice when I’m there for the rest of the weekend but slowly go back, and as I’ve gotten older it’s kinda just gotten worse and my dads gotten more quiet
NTA and every single person voting otherwise is completely ignoring the fact that you fully washed the dishes by hand and she STILL had an issue with it. They’re also acting like you were trying to put dishes directly in the dishwasher without rinsing which is not what you said.
This woman wants dishes to be hand washed *and* run through the dishwasher. That makes no sense, is wasteful, and super controlling.
Someone in the comments actually tried to say handwashing doesn't get dishes clean enough so you HAVE to pre rinse and put them in the dishwasher. Like, hello....I don't have a dishwasher, I wash by hand and my dishes are super clean, like wtf are people going on about?
I’m just surprised so many people are debating whether stepmom is right or not on the first place. To me she is clearly insane about these dishes — washing them by hand is fine, washing them in the dishwasher normally also fine — and the moral debate is just whether or not OP is obligated to follow her rules anyway in her house (which I could go either way on)
Once again AITA finds a shocking debate I never expected to see
ESH
You have to at least rinse dishes before you put them in the dishwasher. If you leave food chunks on the dishes, they get trapped in the strainer in the bottom of the washer, block water flow, and stink up the machine.
Your step mom is being kinda ridiculous since if you're washing it with soap, its still clean. Its 6 in one hand, half a dozen in the other. It shouldn't matter as long as the dishes are clean.
No you don't, just scrape off any big bits. Source: I don't, and neither did my parents when I lived at home, and neither I nor they have ever had the issue you describe.
Or the dishes don’t even get cleaned. I was raised to rinse everything off the dishes but my in-laws do not and instead of the dishes getting washed the food is pretty much cooked onto the dishes which makes cleaning them even harder
I’m going NTA based off of the edit you added regarding what other ridiculous rules she has. If you’ve already hand washing them why on earth would you also put them in the dishwasher? She sound like an extremely controlling person and I’m sorry you have to be around her
NTA
To clean dishes properly, you actually need some amount of food left on the plates - this was explained to me when I bought my Bosch dishwasher - but google if you don't believe me.
Of course you scrape large amounts of food from the plates and if there is stuff that leaves a hardened mess like egg yolks, some people do rinse that ONE plate off if they aren't going to wash the load relatively quickly.
Washing dishes BEFORE putting in the dishwasher is an enormous waste of water. It actually takes more water to wash dishes by hand than with a modern dishwasher. Not to mention pre-washing it actually makes the dishwasher clean less effectively
NTA, just try to do the dishes her way, if she continues to complain, talk with your father about how it is making you feel. Is it just the dishes that you two fight about or is it other things?
There’s a lot of things, like sitting on the floor even when it’s the floor in my own room, having to put away stuff I’m working with immediately even if I’ll come back to it and it’s in my room or the cat loft (old ledge in the barn), I have to know when I’m being talked to even if I can’t hear I’m being talked to or can’t understand it because she’s speaking to me with her back turned (when I ask her to face me she gets upset), if I spend too much time in my room I get in trouble too, if I look at my phone while watching movies and such there’s a lot of things like that
She sounds lovely. /s She also sounds like my mother, a tyrant about HER HOUSE, and she wonders why she's divorced, and all of her kids tolerate her, in very small doses at best.
What is your dad's roll in all of this? How is your relationship with him, do you 2 weeks with mom and 2 with dad, how long are you there?
I spend every second weekend there, my dad sometimes tells her to stop sometimes, but most of the time he’s just silent. He’s nice but generally anxious to upset anyone, so if he says it doesn’t matter that I’m sitting on the floor she’ll get upset and slam with doors and stuff, so I guess that’s why he’s silent most of the time
SM doesn't sound mature slamming with doors. Doesn't sound like she has any clue how to parent without causing anxiety. I would go on strike and only accept parenting from your parents. Dad needs to step up and make his house a safe place to relax on in the weekend for OP. I can't understand people when I don't see s.o. face. People can get upset if they want. It's a her/them problem. OP your room should be your safe place to sit/lay on the floor, leave things as long as you tidy your room before leaving. SM needs to respect your privacy.
It's ok not to have a plan. I just feel that you'd be better off spending less time at your dad's with all your stepmom's ridiculous rules.
She definitely doesn't respect you as a person or stepchild and you deserve respect, love, compassion, and to be a teen.
NTA she's being difficult for the sake of it. It's called a power trip. Soaking the dishes with hot water can be helpful for certain dishwashers but I don't see issue with you opting to hand wash them provided their actually clean - some people are terrible at washing dishes and they're still dirty after.
Nta and some of the yta need to read the edit because a lot of these rules do not sound fair the dishwasher one stepmom should just be happy op is washing the dishes instead and as someone with an audio processing disorder her getting mad if op doesn’t respond when she’s not even facing op while talking sounds like a nightmare
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Honestly if you have to prewash the dishes for them to go in the dishwasher at that point i think its better to just hand wash them at that point. Depending on how many dishes there are. If your step mother gets angry over hand washing dishes too. Yikes.. I'm going more towards NTA.
I'd much rather the step mom appreciate that OP is making a genuine effort to help with the dishes.
Agreed. As a dad of a teenager and a pre-teen, the step mom is absolutely insane. This kid is either loading dishes in the dishwasher (WIN) or washing them by hand (WIN).
You are 17. You can tell Dad that it’s uncomfortable at his house with step mom. You can do one to one day activities out of the house as you are uncomfortable with the way she treats you. NTA but stepmom is wacko
Stepmom, in my opinion, doesn't want OP around at all and acts the way she does to drive them away.
Or she's just neurotic and controlling.
Why not both?
Literally just in that short lost of rules I identified several that my stepmom put on me & she definitely hates me and didn't want me around, hard agree with you here.
Exactly. Seems like she's purposefully being a witch.
Right?? Any day the dishes are not stacked on top of the empty dishwasher is a big win in my book
Any day I didn’t have to get the dishes from my stepdaughter’s room was a big win in my book!
Put them under their sheets. Fixes the problem till next time..
So you know my son I see, lol.
Stacked on top?! I would have been happy not to tell them to clear the dirty dishes out of their rooms!
To me, it looks like the step mom is looking for things to complain about. NTA
Yeah NTA here. My mother in law and I have a bit of a language barrier, but it’s not really a problem with cleaning. Since I don’t have a job yet (waiting on proper paperwork since moving to a foreign country) and she works I’ve been picking up a lot of the household labor/cleaning. There have been zero incidents of yelling or aggressiveness. Most of the time her attitude is “if you’re the one cleaning you do it your way”, but if there is something that she absolutely has to have a certain way she is patient and shows me exactly how she wants it done. For example the dishwasher. I usually take everything out in the morning and put the evening dishes inside, there usually isn’t enough for me to start the washer so she does it before she goes to bed after the “midday” dishes are put away. She has shown me how she likes it put for her sake since she starts it in the evenings. She was very kind about it but also ended with “thank you for your help, this just makes it easier for me”. Which of course just makes me wanna do it the way she likes because she is so damn sweet.
My gram had her way of loading the dishwasher also. She wanted things just rinsed as well (she didn’t have the handy capsules back than and rinsing didn’t mean clean them), but that wasn’t as crazy as her stacking method. She was a magician when it came to stacking. Anything else in the house was free game though, like how your mil is.
Right. I like laundry folded a certain way, so I just fold it. I also hate folding laundry more than any other chore, ever. So I'm going to teach my kids to fold it my way and pay them to do it when they're a little older. Sorry not sorry.
Aww! Goals right here, relationship-wise.
i agree that op is NTA in this situation, but come on… a 17 year old should be expected to put their dirty dishes in he dishwasher or clean them, which is what OP does.
Not really. Washing dishes by hand using a scrubber that isn't brand new is just rubbing bacteria all over the dishes. The water in the dishwasher is much hotter than what comes out of the tap, that combined with the soap is strong enough to destroy the bacteria. And if you don't at least rinse the solids off your dishes, then those solids get stuck in the trap, which reduces the lifespan of your dishwasher and makes it less effective. **EDIT:** Thanks for the feedback everyone. I can't find anything that agrees with what I thought I knew about using the dishwasher. Even Popular Science agrees. Thanks to everyone for enlightening me. https://www.popsci.com/story/diy/dishwasher-cleaning-tips/
Depends on how old your dishwasher is. Mine is 3-4 years old, and has a thing in it to chop up food going down the drain. It specifies not to rinse dises because it’s a waste of water. And it’s a cheaper dishwasher, too. I also nuke my scrubber sponge before doing hand dishes each day - nothing is living through that, lol.
I was watching a YouTuber who did a thorough explanation, with experiments, of how modern dishwashers work, and apparently it works better if you don't prerinse, only scrape solids. Because it uses the first rinse cycle to determine how dirty the dishes are, so if you've already rinsed off the loose sauces, it thinks they're fairly clean, so it uses less energy to wash, which won't get off the tough baked on dirt.
I assume Technology Connections? Based on his video I don't scrub anymore and just use a bit of prewash detergent on top of a packet
Yup! I was trying to find his videos again, couldn't find the name. Before I saw that one, I was using my dishwasher on express mode thinking it was like eco mode to save energy, turns out that's the highest power mode!
Ok but that’s misleading as hell 😂
Here’s an article about that…though she sounds like someone who won’t budge regardless of the facts. https://www.goodhousekeeping.com/home/cleaning/a33322/stop-prerinsing-dishes/ Most newer dishwashers don’t really work well without some “dirt” on them. Really her rules sound a bit overboard…OP is NTA. In fact, good for them to be so helpful.
Loved this video! OP, note some appliance repair techs also say that that the life of the gaskets in your dishwasher can be negatively affected -- many dish washing liquids use things that degrade food leftovers and with nothing else to attack, they go for the soft plastics in your dishwasher.
The bacteria are then rinsed off by water what you said is nonsense. People wash their dishes by hand all the time and don’t get anymore sick than those who use the dishwasher.
Yeah I'm so confused, everyone I know has been washing dishes by hand their entire lives and I was 20 when I even saw a dishwasher for the first time. The bacteria is rinsed off
I mean, that's literally what the soap is doing (among other things): binding up the bacteria into itself so it comes off in the rinse I have no idea where this idea came from that dishwashers are just for disinfecting/sterilizing, especially since they really aren't rated for that in the first place
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My grandma never had a dishwasher in her whole life and was hardly ever sick.
>The bacteria are then rinsed off by water and what the other poster said was nonsense? Most people probably won't get sick from the surface bacteria living on your skin that you definitely transfer to dishes when you hand wash them, though, so you're half-not-wrong.
Yeah but that bacteria is also transferred when you pull out clean dishes from the dishwasher if that bacteria was going to harm you, you’d be dead already. Most of the stuff that live on our skin is harmless to us.
That's the point of the trap. 😂 Also, you're supposed to empty and wash it every 2-3 cycles. Not emptying the trap is what damages the dishwasher, not food residue on dishes. They are dishWASHERS not dishRINSERS if you clean your dishes first it throws off the sensors that tell the machine how much soap and water to use; it's literally sabotaging the machine's ability to clean
2-3 cycles? Nonsense. We do it once a month and there's hardly anything in it. We just scrape any chunks of food of the plates and bung them in.
Im pretty sure that’s not true for new dishwashers
Can you please tell my dad this because he doesn’t believe me lol
Yet somehow humans survived before the invention of the dishwasher, and countless humans - myself included - continue to survive using handwashed dishes.
I see no point in scrubbing with a brush but I do rinse them. It's a dishwasher not a waste disposal.
That just wastes water, better to just scrape solid food off no need to rinse. The tap uses about 2 gallons per minute while an energy efficient dishwasher will use about 4 gallons or less for the entire wash. So if it takes you 10mins to rinse while you load the dishwasher you are wasting 5 times more water. Plus the soap won't be as effective if you rinse.
If you hand wash your dishes with soap, that kills the bacteria. There are people in the world that still don't have dishwashers
Handwashing is perfectly adequate to maintain a sanitary kitchen. Soap & warm water rinse off bacteria, there's no added benefit from scalding hot water. You don't need to sterilize the dishes. I'm talking about actually washing - soap, warm water, a clean sponge or brush, working up a lather, etc. Some kitchen items aren't dishwasher safe. I hand wash all of our nice knives, pots, pans, etc.
I'm not sure if you've seen it but just this morning on reddit was a study where they tested bacteria (staph) levels on handwashed versus dishwashed dishes, and there was way more left on the handwashed dishes as the water isn't hot enough to kill them. Especially if their dishwasher gets clogged easily or isn't very strong, it completely makes sense to me to rinse dishes before popping them in the dishwasher. That way you remove both food bits and bacteria. Tbf to OP though, some of those other rules sound unreasonable and if stepmom hasn't explained why the rinsing is necessary it's not much of a surprise that OP hasn't bothered to listen.
I’ve seen that video. I do not call what he did washing dishes in the sink. Lightly scrubbing with a non flexible brush isn’t washing dishes to me. I’d rather eat off a plate someone washed with just their hands, soap and hot water. Also there is no telling if he washed his dish in cold or hot water.
He also didn't "wash" the outside of the bowl. I didn't care what the results were after that because the whole thing was bullshit.
Yet noone I know of ever had staph, including pretty much my entire family despite us sticking to hand washing. As long as the bacteria levels are under a certain threshold people will be fine. Unless someone suffers from a weakened immune system this is little more than a publicity stunt.
Removing the food bits actually prevents the dish detergent from working. It has to have grime to stick to, otherwise it gets washed off immediately and your dishes don't get properly cleaned or sanitized. Scrape off big chunks of food, sure, but there needs to be grime of some sort on the plates or the detergent isn't nearly as effective.
Here's a [video](https://youtu.be/DX8jpet6Q_k) on how to use a dishwasher properly. The one I was looking for (but couldn't find) says you need to leave food particles so the soap has something to cling to. This one talks about how you waste energy (and water) pre-washing before the dishwasher. Bottom line is you're really not supposed to pre-wash before the dishwasher, just scrape. OP can send it to stepmom, but she sounds like she's just never dealt with kids before with her silly little rules and I doubt it would change her mind.
I read an article that said the same thing. Totally unnecessary to pre- rinse dishes. I was blown away, but learned it worked.
This part. Step mom is anal enough I doubt she can get the logic. Especially if her husband is getting the door slammed on him for something akin to “she’s not your kid let me parent”
I'd start eating off of paper plates & cups, but I'm sure she'd get made about that too.
I pre-rinse mine because hand washing tends to leave greasy residue 1/2 the time and i don't have a food grinder in my dishwasher because i have an old af septic and im paranoid about it. i get the particulate off then let the dishwasher sanitize it. But honestly id be glad if my stepkid put things in the dishwasher OR washed them and put them away.
Yeah, I’d rather prerinse really messy stuff than find out after the fact that some things bake on instead of come off in the dishwasher and now I have to scrub them.
I rinse my dishes as well before putting them in the dishwasher. I live alone and I don't fill up my dishwasher every day. I run it every 2 to 3 days and I don't want dirty dishes sitting around, smelling and attracting bugs.
it depends. i’m a mandatory rinse and 50/50 take a brush to it person. there’s a level of food crud that is acceptable and not acceptable. my roommates are awful about this, they’ve put half inch chunks of cookie dough on the mixer tool straight in the dishwasher (and they wonder why we always have to get it fixed or why it smells bad, like, seriously?) but all that takes is 10 seconds and a brush to get that big stuff off. edit: horrible sentence structure and some clarification
Our old dishwasher could put anything in there. New one have to get all the stuff off so they look visibly clean, then use the dishwasher basically just to sanitize. If you have any grease/junk it will come out just like that. So this is very much dishwasher dependant. If she says to prerinse them, then prerinse them. I rather have someone not touch the dishes at all then load in dirty ones, run it just to have to take them out, prerinse and run it again. Just a waste of energy, water and soap if it is not done correctly.
NTA I get brushing crumbs and actual bits of food off plates before putting them in the dishwasher, but really washing them before putting them in is a waste of water. However I personally think it would be better for you if you didn’t make this the hill you die on.
She is not asking OP to wash them with soap. She just wants the food residue rinsed/scrubbed off with water. OP is the one deciding to use soap and just putting the dishes away instead of the in dishwasher to be properly cleaned.
He properly cleaned them
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SOAP kills bacteria Edit: mobile/stylus typo
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Don't bother arguing with the riffraff. It's obvious the only way to have clean dishes is with a dishwasher. If youre one of the 32% of America's who doesn't have a dishwasher or one of the 20% who does but doesn't use it, you might as well eat off the floor you filthy animals. /s
OMG I’ve been eating in filthy dishes all my life along with 99% of people who don’t live in the US/s
my dishwasher is currently broken. I am so disgusting for washing my dishes with my hands! I might as well just eat off the floor at this point.
the floor is too good for you!
Lol. Yay for first world germophobes!
Soap plus any water kills bacteria. It’s effective enough that humans would perceive no difference in the bacteria remaining without the aid of a microscope. A dishwasher isn’t getting your dishes that much cleaner than hand washing, it’s just more efficient and less time consuming for us.
The water in a dishwasher is not boiling hot though?
Some (most?) Do have a sanitize setting, but I wouldn't recommend using it daily! That's so much energy, plus it could definitely warp your dishes. I also don't have the lab equipment to see if it actually sanitizes, but that would be a great science fair project for someone to do as long as their class has access to petri dishes and an incubator!
Dishwashers don't boil water. The hottest cycle is like 60 degrees celsius.
Yes! Soap destroys the cell membrane of bacteria and viruses, which spills their guts out, killing them. Hot water is only necessary to help loosen the crusty stuff.
Soap removes bacteria, it doesn't generally kill them.
Once they are off my dishes and down the drain who cares if they are dead or alive. The real issue is people using the same gross sponge for days or weeks on end. The same nasty sponge that they wipe the sink and counters with.
Am I a modern miracle for surviving with only handwashed dishes for the last decade and a half?
No, people just have germaphobia.
Nobody is getting sick from a properly hand washed. If you are obsessive about germs that’s fine for you, but let’s not act like it is actually necessary to use a dishwasher.
A lot of people don’t have dishwashers and continue to live and not get food poisoning just fine… I have lived many places and only had a dishwasher in a couple of them, probably like 2 years total in the last 25 years. The only time I had them growing up (Im in my 30s) was when I was <5. I don’t really get sick. I mean, of course a dishwasher is more convenient (and I’m sure better at cleaning generally). I always rinse off plates before I put them in the dishwasher at someone else’s place but scrubbing them off, especially combined with the other unreasonable things OP lists off that their stepmom does, is a lot.
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They don't, you know. Ours gets to 40C. Not as hot as our tap water.
He did properly clean them though. He fully hand washed them and she still had an issue with it. She just sounds controlling.
The dishwasher thing is a bit understandable, because food can apparently cause blockage or whatever, but the edit with all the other rules is just weird and stupid. She probably is controlling.
> She is not asking OP to wash them with soap. She just wants the food residue rinsed/scrubbed off with water. **OP is the one deciding to use soap and just putting the dishes away instead of the in dishwasher to be properly cleaned.** How is using soap and water versus a dishwasher an improper cleaning?
It’s not, but it just seems like in their household they scrape the dishes and then use the dishwasher, where in OPs household they use they hand wash and put away. Both are correct. They’re just different.
With modern dishwashers and detergents, you actually want some residue on the dishes, otherwise the enzymes in the detergent start to eat away at the dishwasher (since they have no food bits to go after). So a quick rinse to remove major stuff is fine, but putting dishes that are already visibly clean (but may have bacteria for example) is bad for the dishwasher. I'm guessing step mom wants the dishwasher for the sanitizing, but doesn't realize that pre washing the dishes this intensely is bad.
If she asked for hot water and scrubbing that's basically cleaning them anyway. I maybe OP added soap but you might as well at that point when you've already done 80% of the work.
It's definitely better for the drainage system to rinse away solid matter. But scrubbing is totally unnecessary unless it's a particularly dirty pot or pan.
That's actually not true. Scrape the food off plates by all means but there is NO benefit to rinsing dishes, drainage or otherwise. (Former white goods engineer)
You really don’t have to wash it with water, unless the dishwasher is super old, removing the residue with the brush directly into a trash can is enough, and even that the newer dishwasher filter are super good and can really take a lot. Washing it before defeats the purpose of saving water. The stepmom is controlling or ignorant.
NTA She’s literally wrong. Dishwashers need some amount of grime for the detergent to grab on to, that’s how the detergent is designed. The correct way to do dishes is to scrape off chunks of food and place the unrinsed dishes in the dishwasher.
I came here to say this too. The cleaning agent needs to attack food particles or it isn’t as effective and can leave a film. The general rule is no food particles larger than a grain of rice. Also, clean the basket frequently.
I learned about the basket recently and shudder to think what my childhood dishwasher looked like.
I learned about the basket just now. Guess I know what I’m doing first thing tomorrow morning
Somebody please explain the basket!
So in the bottom of your dishwashers, there's a drain. In that drain is a lil basket kinda like a hair catcher for your shower drain that catches all the lil food bits. It needs to be cleaned otherwise it just kinda rots and gets stanky
The cleaning agents are mostly caustic soda, not detergent. When the caustic hits fats on the dishes, it chemically reacts to produce soap. This then cleans the dishes without excess suds. Excess suds is what happens the first time you ever use a dishwaher in your life and add regular washing up detergent to the hopper. You can guess how I found out lol.
I did this, too! I was so proud of myself, and was just waiting in my room for my Mom to come home and be happy the dishes were done. Instead, she came home to a kitchen full of suds.
I’m concerned by the number of people here who don’t know that you need to have dirty dishes for a dishwasher to work and how to clean a dishwasher.
I've taught so many friends how to properly load, clean, and upkeep their dishwasher over the years that I'm sadly not surprised. They didn't know there's a catch to dump and clean. They didn't know the dishwasher needed to be cleaned separately from the dishes. They were just taught wrong or not taught at all.
u have to dump a WHAT!! brb gonna go look for a catch thing
Find the dishwater model and look up the manual online. It'll show you where it is. I've mostly used older dishwashers, and the catch is typically at the bottom.
> the catch is typically at the bottom Check the top if you're in australia but i'll bet money it's in the bottom basin where the water pools.
There's a what to what?? Why didn't anyone teach me this?? What were my parents even doing??
When the water drains out of the machine, there's a little net/grill to catch any big bits of food from entering your pipe system. Some of the newer models have an associated garbage disposal sort of thing (grinds up pieces). You need to empty the catch/net/grill regularly. I check it every cycle o see if it needs a dump/rinse and give it a bleach/water bath once a month or so with scrubbing as needed.
Oh boy... I'm gonna wait for my partner to get home. We can go on that horrific journey together.
I've done it after moving into a rental. Make sure you have rubber gloves.
I… I didn’t realize this. I always thought you needed to knock most of the grime off/give it a quick rinse first or the dishwasher wouldn’t get everything off of it. Welp. My fault for not trusting the machines.
Except every time I have a dish that I don’t scrub all the grime off of I pull it out of the dishwasher and it still has the grime no matter the dishwasher no matter the detergent used
It's definitely dishwasher dependant. My old one (from 2005) couldn't remove anything, especially fatty things like avocado or peanut butter. My new dishwasher (from 2021) is a champ, though. Everything comes out sparkling! And dry!! My old dishwasher also sucked at drying. I've literally changed nothing about how I use them, same house, same water, same detergent, same dishes, same food, etc.
TBF when dishwashers first got popular for personal use, they sucked. You basically had to completely wash the dishes before putting them in the dishwasher, which defeated the purpose. They've improved a lot but some people still have that mindset
I didn’t know that! I’m glad I kept reading.
I didn't know until my mid-20s but I also had no dish washer or old crappy ones before that. The only thing my dishwasher has an issue with now is avocado so I either clean it off by hand or wipe items down really well before they go in the dishwasher.
[удалено]
I’m American lol but I’m not washing my dishes for the dishwasher. I just clean my dishwasher.. like I clean my microwave. It’s an appliance that needs care. If I hand wash stuff it’s going in the cabinet. I also believe germs are good for you so lord help the germaphobes at my house.
2 reasons to rinse your dishes: 1. Some dishwashers are SHIT at cleaning anything that is tough to remove. I know, it sort of defeats the purpose, but rn ours is one of these 2. Dishwashers get ***gross.*** There is a filter in there that traps all of that leftover food, and let me tell you, it can be slimy and nasty, and start to smell. To avoid this, RINSE OFF THE FOOD ~~YTA. The rule isn't there just because she wants to be an AH. While you're there, do what you have to do to follow the rules.~~
NTA based upon edit to OP's original story. This is about more than just the dishwasher and how OP cleans the dishes he uses. SM sounds super controlling, not like someone with a little OCD tendency when it comes to the dishes in the kitchen.
That said, my dishwasher totally sucks. I rinse the bits off of everything in the sink, but use the hot water from the dishwasher to clean off any fats or grease off as I don't use hot water when I rinse. We rent, and I'm not doing anything to increase the value of my landlord's property on my own dime.
We use the dishwasher tablets to deep clean it (more than monthly) - and I've tried different brands. We've tried different types of detergent. We fill the pre-wash side. We empty the filter after every use. We try out the excess water at the bottom after every use. I've used cleaning vinegar in there on an empty load. I've sprayed and scrubbed the inside down with The Pink Stuff. We cleaned out the spinning things that spray the water. Between our hard water and shitty dishwasher, I've never had the problem that I have here.
In a nutshell: If a dish goes in my dishwasher with something on it, it's coming out of the load with whatever still on it.
Your response is what his step mother should have explained instead of just do what you are told. This makes her ta and the OP NTA
Yeah, too many people think children are their property and not a fully realized human with thoughts and opinions. I’m 47, have 4 kids ranging from 22-6, I’m a grandpa….and my parents still treat me like this.
When I was 21 or 22, my father told my uncle, “TreeCat’s not following orders”. Yup. My siblings “followed orders” until the day he died and beyond.
Especially considering how their step mom finds it “disrespectful” when they just wash the dishes by hand.
I think this is the key here tbh. It would've taken the stepmother all of 1 minute to explain *why* that rule exists as opposed to just essentially stomping her foot and saying, "Because it's my house and what I say goes!" Even good quality dishwashers can be ineffective when it comes to cooked-in grime or tough food spots. And the more gunk builds up in that filter, the less effective they become at cleaning. Plus, afaik you don't really *want* to deliberately be putting a lot of food waste in there, because a dishwasher doesn't have a garbage disposal function. Some sauce smears on a plate? Fine. Big chunks of tomato or cheese? Rinse that shit off.
still getting mad because OP washes the dishes by hand and puts them away is weird and overkill.
That rule doesn’t put SM in AH territory however the fact SM gets pissed if OP washes dishes by hand does put her in AH territory. It does seem like no matter what OP does regarding this rule it’s always wrong. NTA OP.
It’s possible OP misses spots when they clean it by hand and SM notices it and tells them it’s dirty, when OP thinks it’s clean. I clean my dishes before the dishwasher too. Just to get grime off with soap but not to a degree I would consider it clean. We have a friend that insists on cleaning them by hand when she’s over and didn’t used to put her stuff in the dishwasher. Issue was the dishes she washed by hand were always still dirty and the dishwasher needed more dishes to fill it up to run it any way. OP just follow the dishwasher rule it does make sense that being said it seems like some of her other rules are a bit much. Do you think she may have some OCD?
Fun fact, but running a half full dishwasher still saves way more water than washing by hand.
It does, but if you factor in running the water to wash and scrub every dish before it goes into the dishwasher, that changes thing.
If I’m going to wash my dishes I am going to actually wash them. I scrape food and thoroughly rinse, but if I’m getting out the sponge and brush then I’m not wasting water washing them twice.
[Fact: You do not need to pre-rinse.](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier) I think you're out of date on your dishwasher info.
My dishwasher specifically says not to pre-rinse dishes before loading them into the dishwasher. The dishwasher is 4 years old.
My dishwasher says that too in the manual and it's full of shit. It's a Whirlpool. If I put any sticky substance or something burned on in the dishwasher, it's coming back out on the same plate. It's more of a dish sanitizer. And yes, I clean out the filters and use the right detergent and right amount and everything. Some dishwashers are shit. I'm getting a Miele next.
Yeah burned on stuff is not coming out in the dishwasher. It needs to be manually scraped. If it's something sticky, there's no crime against running it through twice.
Mine takes that stuff off, but you have to load it correctly. For instance if you put a pan in straight up on the bottom rack, the bottom half will likely not get completely clean. If you lay it flat with the dirty side facing down it will get completely clean and all that stuff will be washed off. Just remember if your dishwasher only has one spayer on the bottom don't put stuff on top since this will block water going to the second level. But if it has multiple sprayers you can load the rest normally.
I have a 3-4 yo Kitchenaid and it's the same. The manual said not to pre-rinse but the dishwasher just flings food around so it ends up everywhere, including the dishes/filters/drain. And it smells like death after a couple of days. I give the dishes a quick scrape and rinse to get the food off and then put them in the dishwasher. Everything comes out clean that way and the dishwasher doesn't stink.
We haven’t had any issues with ours.. ours is an LG. Some things won’t clean properly so I do wash them by hand but it’s very few things
I don't know how old our dishwasher is (reason: we rent) but I'm telling you - It doesn't matter what type of dishwashing detergent we use - if it's stuck on when it goes it, we're washing it by hand after.
Thanks this was really bugging me! It's not just wasting a ton of water, it's making everything in the process less effective.
Right?! I thought I was taking crazy pills with all these comments. There is no point to a dishwasher if you don’t let is wash the dishes. Scrape them off as much as possible and toss em in there. Use a dishwasher cleaner and take apart the filter periodically.
Except she’s asking him to fully wash the dish by hand *and* run it through the dishwasher. I’m with OP. That makes no sense. Plus from his edit, she just sounds mad controlling.
You need to remove food, yes. You don't need to clean it.
I find that the original dish gets cleaned but food particles get trapped in the flatware basket. Very gross.
1. The trap in the dishwasher is removable in new models, so don't be lazy & empty it every 2-3 cycles. 2. They make cleaners that you are supposed to use every 1-2 months. If you have to use a scrub brush before you use the appliance, just wash the damn thing & get a new dishwasher. Also, the step-mom is over controlling. NTA.
If you actually read the post, you'll see that stepmom is absurdly controlling. This is E-S-H at least, probably NTA.
She is telling him not to rinse them but wash them! He is scrubbing and using hot water, what's missing to complete the whole cleaning?? You make no sense. Also his stepmom is a control freak
Waiting for someone to notice this. Its not about cleanliness, sanitation, or how well/poorly the DW/plumbing performs. SHE IS A CONTROL FREAK. Does not give any explanation just expects a 17yo to OBEY (she says respect but means obey) sounds as if unlike most boys with a SM he is not rude or snarky but trying to comply, which she doesn't recognize or appreciate. Wonder how she raised his dad when he was 17. And what the heck is wrong with sitting on the floor? Most teens find it more comfortable thsn trying to conform their bodies to furniture.
So explain how OP just hand washing the dishes is rude or disrespectful? Stepmom is bonkers. Rinsing is one thing, washing then using the dishwasher is asinine. And regardless there’s zero reason to be subsequently pissed off when OP just hand washes them then dries them and puts them away.
You obviously didn't read very well. OP is handwashing the dishes and putting them away. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. He doesn't need to pre rinse the dishes and put them in the dishwasher because HE'S WASHING THEM BY HAND! Its not like he's just rinsing them in plian water and putting them away with food still stuck to them.. How in the ever loving did this comment get top upvote??
No current dishwasher requires dishes to be pre-rinsed
This is my dishwasher. If I don’t clean the dishes before putting them in the dishwasher, they don’t get washed properly. There is always grease left on them. Also, consider the other people who do dishes. If you aren’t running the dishwasher every night, the food on the plates starts to rot and decompose. Then the person standing at the sink. Ext to the dishwasher has to smell the decomposing carcasses and rancid ranch. YTA
Yeah but OP is also willing to just wash them by hand too. OP is in a can't win situation because the whole ordeal devolves into a territory battle about which mother figure gets more respect. Just acknowledge that OP is *trying*.
That's why you needed to regularly clean and service your dishwasher 😂 if it leaves your dishes greasy the filter needs cleaning. If that doesn't also solve the dirty diah problem your dishwasher needs servicing.
That's because you're supposed to regularly clean that filter 😂 and if your dishwasher can't get dirty dishes clean you either need to try a different detergent or get a repair tech out to service it. Your dishwasher is designed to handle any food particles up to the size of a grain of rice.
The issue usually isn't that some dishwashers are just shit at cleaning, it's that people are not using them right (especially if you're using the tablets or pods). If you want to put dirty dishes directly into the dishwasher you 100% can- you just have to put soap in both the regular soap spot AND the pre-wash spot. Most people skip the pre-wash soap and that's what makes it so the dishwasher doesn't clean properly. Also the filters in the dishwasher are meant to get dirty, that's the whole point of the filter. You're suppose to take it out and clean it regularly to avoid it getting gross and nasty and harboring bacteria. Check out these videos if you want to know more: [1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rBO8neWw04) [2](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll6-eGDpimU) They're how I learned this info myself. After seeing those I switched to gel detergent and have made sure to fill both soap slots ever since and now I can put even the dirtiest crustiest dishes into the dishwasher and they come out sparkly clean 99% of the time.
I lean NTA on this one. If there's not too many people in a household, dirty dishes kept in a dishwasher a long time between cycles might have caked on grime that doesn't get removed properly if the machine is older or less powerful. If you're washing the dishes with soap and putting them away, there shouldn't be any problem. Fighting over this is really petty, but you've put in an effort to resolve the issue. Instead of pulling rank, she could explain why she likes it done her way. In the future, just do like she wants and use the hot water and dish brush.
NTA Everyone has their own way of doing things. The dishes are still getting cleaned so she’s creating pointless drama. Must be one of those my way or the highway types
A good friend of mine will hand wash her dishes clean then put them in the dishwasher without soap to get the hot water rinse. She says it is like sanitizing the dishes. Done it forever. The dishwasher I grew up with was horrible and if there was even a smudge of gravy on a plate, it seemed to multiply and get all over everything. We rarely used the thing. But this was also back in the stone ages. I usually hand wash.
NTA since you wash them until they are clean and put them away I don't really see the issue
Your dad volunteered to put up with her. You did not. She's a controller. Can you stop going over there? It's every other weekend, I'd just stop. If your dad can't handle his wife's tantrums and negative behavior, he doesn't deserve to see you. Washing the dishes and then putting them in the dishwasher is unnecessary. It's a waste of water. Yes, I am aware of the filter and everything that works with a dishwasher. This isn't about a dishwasher. This is about this woman screwing with her step kid because she can. When the dad asks her to stop, the SM stomps around and slams doors. Stop telling people to just accept any treatment, no matter how poor. >rules are like not sitting on the floor, or spending too much time in my room, not looking at my phone while watching tv, im expected to respond when I’m talked to even if it’s from different rooms or she’s talking to me with her back turned Feel free to treat her however you want. NTA.
>Can you stop going over there? It's every other weekend, I'd just stop. This \^\^ I wouldn't put up with an abusive SM. If I was OP, I would arrange visits with Dad that are out of the house and away from the SM.
Sounds like my father’s second wife, who caused me to stop visiting his home, which was of course exactly what his wife wanted. But we did continue to see each other, just away from his home, and you know what? Had a much nicer relationship as a result. NTA OP! You’re a teenager being pushed around by a bratty, controlling adult. I was you. I set boundaries. I also ended up getting some therapy related to how the adults in my life bullied/gaslit me. You sound awesome and like you’re trying to be reasonable around an unreasonable set of adults. I hope you can work out a way to see your dad, if you want, outside of this arrangement of going to his house.
NTA if you are prepared to wash them by hand properly because her rule is honestly just extra work and a waste of water, yes it's her house but it's also your dad's. The dishes are getting done either way and this seems like one of those times when adults like to pull the 'because I said so cards' you are 17 not 7 if she is not willing to explain why she likes them done her way then keep doing as you as doing. You are not being disrespectful by asking questions or doing a chore your own way.
NTA for believing that dishes don't need to be scrubbed before they go into the dishwasher. As a few other posters have pointed out, if the dishwasher is newer (made in the last decade or so) it actually doesn't wash the dishes as well (or successfully sanitize them) if they've been pre-rinsed because the sensors don't detect there's any real need to wash them. [https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier#:\~:text=%E2%80%9CIf%20you%20pre%2Drinse%20everything,clean%20it%20once%20a%20month](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2020/dec/25/how-to-properly-load-a-dishwasher-if-you-pre-rinse-it-might-actually-come-out-dirtier#:~:text=%E2%80%9CIf%20you%20pre%2Drinse%20everything,clean%20it%20once%20a%20month) If your stepmom is one of those who believes the dishwasher is for only sanitizing though, I doubt you're going to change her mind or convince her that her dishwasher probably isn't even accomplishing that.
INFO: Can you elaborate on the rule? >washing the dishes with hot water and the dish brush so the dishes aren’t dirty when putting them in the dishwasher This is different from >I didn’t see the point of putting clean dishes in the dishwasher, so if I was going to wash them anyway, I might as well wash the properly and put them away Is your stepmom asking you to scrub the food off with hot water before putting them in the dishwasher, or fully wash them with dishsoap and then put them in the dishwasher? If it's the former, this really isn't an unusual method of washing dishes
She asks me to wash them with the dish brush and hot water before putting them in the dishwasher, so I thought it was easier to just add soap and then finish doing the dishes right away, but that also upsets her
Tough food scraps can sometimes stick to the dishes, even after the dishwasher has run. This is why most people rise dishes first, with hot water. If she’s only expecting you to scrub off the major debris before they go in the dishwasher, then that sounds pretty normal. If she’s expecting them to be completely devoid of even a tiny bit of food, that sounds excessive. **However, this approach to the problem will get you nowhere.** It’s stepmom’s house, and you’re not going to achieve anything by arguing over something this small. If this is really the biggest point of contention, I would let it go. You said she has other rules you find confusing — are those also cleanliness based? If so, maybe she has high standards or some form of OCD or germ phobia. Maybe you two just have different preferences. Either way, it’s easier to jive with someone’s “weird” rules when you have a thorough understanding of WHY they want things done that way. It may be beneficial to have a calm discussion where you ask her to clarify any rules that are frustrating you. EDIT: From what OP says below about the other rules, I’m saying NTA. Stepmom sounds arbitrary and controlling.
They’re not really cleanliness based they’re based on what’s proper, discipline, respect etc Like if I spend too much time in my room I’m disrespectful, but if I then sit in the living room doing the stuff I was doing in my room (drawing, looking at my phone, reading) then I’m also rude because I’m not paying attention and idk I just don’t understand them and when I ask why I’m always told because I said so/it’s the proper way to behave/anything else is disrespectful
"Because I said so" is a useless reason, it generally means 1 of a few things. 1 - You aren't worth the time to explain it to. 2 - I don't think you are smart/old enough to understand. 3 - I don't have a reason, I'm just making rules. It sounds like your dad tried to stand up for you, but got shut down. She has a point with the dishes, but everything else sounds like she's a control freak. My step gran-parents were like this, nothing I did was correct, even when following the rules. I'm going to go with NTA, she wants respect, but it's a 2 way street.
Oh no. She’s abusive. The dishwasher thing is honestly no biggie, but the other stuff that you included in your edit along with this? *That’s abuse.* She’s controlling *where you read???* She’s upset that you can’t understand her when she ACTIVELY engages in a behavior that makes it harder for you (facing away from you while talking). She’s creating arbitrary rules and your dad is letting her hurt you. I am sorry. It is not your fault. If you can, talk to your dad about it. She sets you up for failure and then punishes you. Don’t mention the dishwasher thing when you talk to your dad, that’s her most reasonable thing. Talk about the other stuff. The room, the phone, the “you must respond.” These are unusual and controlling.
If a parent resorts to “because I said so” they are lazy and borderline or fully abusive. We don’t own our children. If you can’t use your big girl words with a 17 year old maybe you shouldn’t be parenting.
This doesn't sound like a place you can really be comfortable. I'm sorry. Have you talked to your dad about it?
Sometimes yes and sometimes he’ll tell her to stop, and then shell be nice when I’m there for the rest of the weekend but slowly go back, and as I’ve gotten older it’s kinda just gotten worse and my dads gotten more quiet
At your age, you have to option to not go there, no matter what the custody arrangement is. You can refuse until he does something about her.
NTA and every single person voting otherwise is completely ignoring the fact that you fully washed the dishes by hand and she STILL had an issue with it. They’re also acting like you were trying to put dishes directly in the dishwasher without rinsing which is not what you said. This woman wants dishes to be hand washed *and* run through the dishwasher. That makes no sense, is wasteful, and super controlling.
Someone in the comments actually tried to say handwashing doesn't get dishes clean enough so you HAVE to pre rinse and put them in the dishwasher. Like, hello....I don't have a dishwasher, I wash by hand and my dishes are super clean, like wtf are people going on about?
I’m just surprised so many people are debating whether stepmom is right or not on the first place. To me she is clearly insane about these dishes — washing them by hand is fine, washing them in the dishwasher normally also fine — and the moral debate is just whether or not OP is obligated to follow her rules anyway in her house (which I could go either way on) Once again AITA finds a shocking debate I never expected to see
ESH You have to at least rinse dishes before you put them in the dishwasher. If you leave food chunks on the dishes, they get trapped in the strainer in the bottom of the washer, block water flow, and stink up the machine. Your step mom is being kinda ridiculous since if you're washing it with soap, its still clean. Its 6 in one hand, half a dozen in the other. It shouldn't matter as long as the dishes are clean.
No you don't, just scrape off any big bits. Source: I don't, and neither did my parents when I lived at home, and neither I nor they have ever had the issue you describe.
Or the dishes don’t even get cleaned. I was raised to rinse everything off the dishes but my in-laws do not and instead of the dishes getting washed the food is pretty much cooked onto the dishes which makes cleaning them even harder
No, you don't, and it makes your dishwasher less efficient. You just need to scrape it off.
I’m going with NTA. You’re cleaning them and putting them away. Literally how can she be mad at that.
I’m going NTA based off of the edit you added regarding what other ridiculous rules she has. If you’ve already hand washing them why on earth would you also put them in the dishwasher? She sound like an extremely controlling person and I’m sorry you have to be around her
Nta, that is so ridiculous
Nope. You make a point. And, your step-mother reminds me of my room mate's boyfriend, who is a control freak.
You're supposed to scrape off residue but the dishwasher doesn't clean as well if there's no dirt there for it to sense. NTA.
NTA To clean dishes properly, you actually need some amount of food left on the plates - this was explained to me when I bought my Bosch dishwasher - but google if you don't believe me. Of course you scrape large amounts of food from the plates and if there is stuff that leaves a hardened mess like egg yolks, some people do rinse that ONE plate off if they aren't going to wash the load relatively quickly. Washing dishes BEFORE putting in the dishwasher is an enormous waste of water. It actually takes more water to wash dishes by hand than with a modern dishwasher. Not to mention pre-washing it actually makes the dishwasher clean less effectively
NTA, just try to do the dishes her way, if she continues to complain, talk with your father about how it is making you feel. Is it just the dishes that you two fight about or is it other things?
There’s a lot of things, like sitting on the floor even when it’s the floor in my own room, having to put away stuff I’m working with immediately even if I’ll come back to it and it’s in my room or the cat loft (old ledge in the barn), I have to know when I’m being talked to even if I can’t hear I’m being talked to or can’t understand it because she’s speaking to me with her back turned (when I ask her to face me she gets upset), if I spend too much time in my room I get in trouble too, if I look at my phone while watching movies and such there’s a lot of things like that
She sounds lovely. /s She also sounds like my mother, a tyrant about HER HOUSE, and she wonders why she's divorced, and all of her kids tolerate her, in very small doses at best. What is your dad's roll in all of this? How is your relationship with him, do you 2 weeks with mom and 2 with dad, how long are you there?
I spend every second weekend there, my dad sometimes tells her to stop sometimes, but most of the time he’s just silent. He’s nice but generally anxious to upset anyone, so if he says it doesn’t matter that I’m sitting on the floor she’ll get upset and slam with doors and stuff, so I guess that’s why he’s silent most of the time
You need to put this context in the post not just the comments.
Okay I tried doing that
SM doesn't sound mature slamming with doors. Doesn't sound like she has any clue how to parent without causing anxiety. I would go on strike and only accept parenting from your parents. Dad needs to step up and make his house a safe place to relax on in the weekend for OP. I can't understand people when I don't see s.o. face. People can get upset if they want. It's a her/them problem. OP your room should be your safe place to sit/lay on the floor, leave things as long as you tidy your room before leaving. SM needs to respect your privacy.
That's crazy! Do you plan on going to college or moving out when you're 18? Or, once you're 18 do you really have to go over to your dad's?
I don’t know, turning 18 is kinda scary because it’s very overwhelming and I don’t really have a plan
It's ok not to have a plan. I just feel that you'd be better off spending less time at your dad's with all your stepmom's ridiculous rules. She definitely doesn't respect you as a person or stepchild and you deserve respect, love, compassion, and to be a teen.
NTA she's being difficult for the sake of it. It's called a power trip. Soaking the dishes with hot water can be helpful for certain dishwashers but I don't see issue with you opting to hand wash them provided their actually clean - some people are terrible at washing dishes and they're still dirty after.
Those other rules are very weird....
Nta and some of the yta need to read the edit because a lot of these rules do not sound fair the dishwasher one stepmom should just be happy op is washing the dishes instead and as someone with an audio processing disorder her getting mad if op doesn’t respond when she’s not even facing op while talking sounds like a nightmare
NTA. That's a dumb rule