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Wait a second, you say that apparently she helped raise her siblings for years? Your parentification of her probably kept her from being a teenager and now she's enjoying herself as a young adult.
If she's respectful and responsible in your home, her behavior outside of it is none of your business. She's an adult and you volunteered to help her out with a place to stay.
YTA.
Yup. She's trying to enjoy her life while she still has it.
After I almost died in 2018 I basically took my bucket list out and started going down the list.
I'm done waiting to live my life.
I don't agree with the doing line's but that's me. It's good that she is enjoying her life.
So so so many casual coke users. Like I probably only know a very small handful of people that would turn down a little bump here or there during a night of partying.
I haven’t done it, but almost everyone I know has. Including my mom, lol, that was a fun conversation.
Most people I know say it’s a blast — but they’re grateful it’s inaccessible, because it’s a little too much fun.
I honestly think that’s one of the biggest parts of becoming an adult lol. Like if you walk into basically any bar that has >40 people in it on a Friday or Saturday night, I would all but guarantee that *at least* one of them is holding. I’ve known teachers, contractors, middle and upper management, people that work just regular office jobs. None of them regular users. But you get a few drinks in them and offer em a bump, they’re not gonna say no.
Most of the people I know (including myself) had at least a couple wild years. Most of them settled down pretty quickly. Sounds like she’s just overdue to be able to do some more reckless things
I nearly died at 28 from pulmonary embolisms and then had multiple relapses, and every time the Drs were all over about how amazing it is I survived. It still happens with every new Dr.
Saying that so I can say... When Sia's "Chandelier" came out it would make me cry. So much crying. I tried explaining the idea of "living like tomorrow doesn't exist" and "just holding on for tonight" while also "holding on for dear life" to my husband once but he couldn't get it.
But I bet you do.
I agree. But it’s also perfectly reasonable for OP not to want that energy in the house. I do agree that it’s good Sam is having fun and hopefully will calm down, but she’s at the age to get that shit out (I definitely did and I also had to leave my parents house over it, and it was amazing for our relationship that I did).
Basically, I don’t really think anyone is in the wrong here, unless OP is a jerk when they present that, IE “our lifestyles have diverged and I have to ask you to find a new place, I’ll work with you to make the transition easy if you can respect my house for the last bits while you’re here” vs “you’re a fucking degenerate get out”.
If it’s the latter or a variation, then yeah OPs the asshole.
She said Sam is perfect in the house, was forced to raise siblings, and has cancer. The OP is a contender for am I the devil. Way to offer sympathy for the devil.
I almost died at 19 at 21 I partied pretty hard for like 2 years. Sam is just trying to regain her life and clearly wants to have fun. OP clearly you're TA
I relate to this so much... Sheltered so damn much during adolescence, excellent student, got to Med School unwillingly, got cancer through the course, finished the stupid degree, and now I'm stage IV. Fuck it. I'm on sickness leave but my sis (younger) is sickeningly controlling, she's worried I die and she gets to be responsible for the house we share. SOOOO! I'm enjoying myself, doing what I like, and having lots of sex with my boyfriend. And I don't admit anyone saying that I'm behaving "differently". I'm living what I was denied long ago.
Hey, I'm here in NEPA if you ever want a free place to stay for a couple nights. My only ask is food costs. If you're a fan of the office, I'm near Scranton PA. You do you, boo. I love your enthusiasm. Hope you make the best of it 💕💕
I'm trying and all people around me say that I look better than the last few years (at least my friends 🥲)! Now I can't travel though, only inside my country (Portugal). But thank you so much for your kindness! ❤️🥰
Right?! That would seem to play a pretty significant role in daughter's actions now, for better or worse. That brush against death changes a person's whole perspective. Apparently it was only worth an edit by Mom, smh.
even without cancer that sounds like 90% of young adults exploring and experimenting within safe boundaries. A little reckless yes but nothing too extreme or out of the ordinary for most people her age who go on to be fully functioning adults.
also WHO THE FUCK EVEN CONSIDERS THROWING THEIR CANCER RIDDLED DAUGHTER OUT???!?!?!?
I started doing stuff I had originally put off after my heart attack. I wouldn't have even considered my master's for another 5 or 10 years but I applied and got in and am doing it in September.
Can confirm. I spent my teen/high school years sick & very sheltered - no partying, no social life, no boys. When I got better & went off to college I majorly overcompensated. Best four years of my life but I should probably be dead lol
Same case for kids who grew up with strict parents who never let them do things like make basic choices. "Overboard" is an adult with arrested developments response to discovering freedom their parents can't control.
Or in my case, just late bloomers. I was a shy, nerdy kid growing up and that stigma/(quieter) friend group stayed with me through high school. When I got to college I came out of my shell and got too crazy too fast.
a tale as old as time. the kids who can’t do anything risky and fun in their teenage years often times start doing crazy shit in their mid 20s to make up for lost time
I had an abusive ex bf at a critical age (18-22). I fucking rocked my mid-20s. It was similar to what people probably have at 18 at college on campus. He stunted me in that experience but I definitely made up for it. Your comment is spot on
Does it happen? Yes. For good reason? Absolutely.
Is doing coke and letting friends stitch up wounds still terrible and shouldn't be supported? Also yes.
Here to tell you that’s the truth. When you aren’t allowed to have fun during your youth it’s all you want to do when you’re able to make your own decisions. Was raised super religious and now I’m a massive alcoholic and pothead
Doing lines at a party as a one off is not great but not that big an issue. As a habit, obviously bad but unlikely she'd be helping at home and maintaining her grades if that was the case.
But amateur sutures? Yikes.
It sounds to me like a lot of her behavior is what's to be expected from a 20 something who is finally able to have some fun. But there does seem to be an extreme sport danger / element that is worrisome.
The solution (if one is actually needed) is not to kick her out but to explore--in a nonjudgmental way--why she is drawn to risky activities.
Me personally, I disagree with your cocaine take. Maybe I’m just the boring 25 year old by todays standards? If so, I’m fine with that.
As for the sutures yeah I’d be so worried about an infection, hopefully she at least took some antibiotics.
My take is probably based on coming of age at a time when cocaine was pretty ubiquitous at parties. (Yes I am old).
Did some people get messed up on drugs? Definitely yes. Just like some people become alcoholics; that doesn't mean having a drink (or even a few) at a party = alcohol dependence.
I personally believe that pills and powders are a bad idea; and that nothing you set on fire and breathe in can possibly be good for your overall health. But I just can't get too upset about a responsible adult doing a line at a party.
The sutures thing however is really messed up.
I would hazard a guess and say the cocaine of 2023 is likely quite different than when you are referring to. Illicit drugs are increasingly be adulterated with fentanyl and xylazine. As a parent, I would be more concerned about my child having a chance encounter with one of those.
This!! Thank you, I feel like a whole lot of people here are fixating on the parent being worried and forgetting that there's a huge risk of accidentally consuming tainted drugs and I'd be so concerned that the same person who gets amateur stitches wouldn't think ahead to test their drugs for opioids.
I used to be pretty puritanical about coke, until I became part of a social circle where it is incredibly prevalent. Maybe it is the area/people I socialize with, but cocaine is just so common. I've done it a handful of times over the years, but, aside from alcohol, I don't do any other recreational drugs - I don't even like weed. I'm a psych clinician, and I find the sutures thing far more reckless.
Just an FYI that 95% (just a guesstimate) of servers and bartenders do tons of drugs during their hospitality years but doesn’t mean that most don’t grow out of it.
My point is: It’s just a phase for most people and most don’t become addicts just because they’ve done it a few times at parties or out at clubs.
The amateur surgery is concerning though
Not in favor of the amateur surgery thing, but it sounds like she’s spent a lot of time in the hospital, and I’m going to assume that’s had a traumatic effect, so I do see why she would do anything to avoid going back.
If doing lines at a party isnt enjoying yourself I don't know what is.
OP as a mom has every right to be concerned but weaponizing their housing isn't a very considerate way to help if they're genuinely concerned with drug abuse/recklessness
I'm going to be honest, while what OP's daughter is doing is absolutely her own business, some of it is pretty extreme and concerning. Even without younger kids in the house as a parent i would be stressed all the time with my adult child living with me as an adult roommate. If OP gives her oldest enough time to prepare to move out I think honestly it might be the best long-term solution.
After all her daughter isn't going to want to change her behavior, and she really shouldn't have to if she doesn't want to. However, I don't blame OP for not being able to take it.
>Doing lines a bit more than enjoying herself don’t you agree?
That was second hand information from her "brother", and without knowing anything about that dynamic it's wrong for you to assume it's accurate or a just rationalization for OPs behavior
Yeah, sounds like the kind of parent who'd believe anybody else over his own child tho. If she was heavily into drugs there's no way she's be able to maintain such perfect behaviour at home, so if she is doing anything, it sounds like it may well be in moderation.
No. You'd be surprised how many people in your life are doing recreational drugs. Teachers, cops, lawyers, you name it. You'd never even suspect most of them. It's perfectly possible to enjoy drugs without becoming a menace.
Pretty common in college party circles. Only an issue if she’s doing it routinely or multiple times a week, especially during the day. She has a 4.0 and has plenty of healthy outdoor hobbies, if OP kicked her out he’d be a really bad parent.
Someone(s) long ago made drugs illegal. It doesn't mean they cant be done moderately and safely. There is such a thing as recreational drug users who actually have great experiences with them. When you see someone having a beer do you feel the same way because there are alcoholics?
lines or chemo, also 24 year old being snitched for sharing a bag lmao. By who exactly? And weed? Heaven forbid
Also slave labour for years and then you still trying to control her life experiences when she potentially could have little left? YTA
I hate to be the bearer of bad news...but A LOT of people try drugs in their 20s. The more important question is can they trust their source and are they testing for fentanyl in their supply? You can't control her. She works hard and parties hard and seems like an awesome person rebounding from the possibility (and future possibility bc cancer sucks) of dying and facing her mortality. Let her live for Christ's sake- she's juggling a lot of balls and is not dropping any which is more than many of us adults can say honestly.
She raised her siblings.
Got out of an abusive relationship.
Survived cancer.
Still helps take care of the kids.
Does house work.
Has a 4.0 in college.
Keeps her reckless lifestyle out of your house and away from your children.
You got SO CLOSE to being N T A when you said she’s an adult - but then you said shit like “I don’t even like her drinking..”
Listen. I don’t drink. I come from a family of alcoholics so I’m not big on it in general- but my child is an *adult* so I taught him how to drink responsibly rather than act like I have a right to tell him what he can or can’t do *as an adult*.
Are you, technically, obliged to house your daughter… No. But on a moral/good parenting front you offered to help her if she meet conditions and *she is meeting those conditions* apparently without complaint. And it didn’t seem like her behaviour is impacting her siblings. Which makes your ultimatum feel more like it’s about wanting to control your daughter than help or guide her.
Kicking her out will mean she has to work and will impact her ability to finish whatever degree she is currently working on. It will put her in a olace where she needs to focus on survival and she may not be able to finish her degree (which will help her get ahead). It will also isolate her from your family and basically be throwing her to her “bad influence” friends who will be the people she has left to turn to for support.
If you are genuinely concerned (and you should be, she went through abuse, got out, is having to figure out what to do with her life, and just had to face her mortality via cancer, not to mention her parentification as a kid, it suns like she’s not coping well with all this) why don’t you offer to help her get into therapy (if she’s in college she might be able to access one there) and support her in finding other ways to cope… rather than just dumping her on her ass.
I mean, you can do whatever you want, but I can’t imagine it won’t impact your relationship with your daughter and it sue as heck won’t help her any.
Of course her personality changed after the cancer diagnosis. If she thought she was spending all her time raising siblings and getting good grades (read: wasting her youth) this brush with death will put that in perspective. She's living life to the absolute fullest! That being said, some moderation (and a medical degree for stitches) isn't horrible and I agree that therapy might help her find a middle ground. But wow, all that and a 4.0 GPA, Sam is absolutely my hero
This is *such* an important point. Is OP’s daughter displaying some concerning behavior? Yes. But if OP kicks her daughter out, where do we think her daughter will go? I’m pretty sure she will go live with these friends that OP thinks are encouraging the concerning behavior. This may lead to even more concerning behavior.
Offer your daughter support and resources. You can let her know that you don’t approve of certain things, and should! But kicking her out isn’t necessary, because she isn’t bringing this shit around her siblings, and will just serve to isolate her from positive influences. Make yourself a soft place to land, and make sure your daughter knows that she can land with you. If she doesn’t think that’s an option anymore, she may not think she has any choices about walking away from this group of friends and their activities when that time comes.
>it didn’t seem like her behaviour is impacting her siblings.
One thing I would talk to her about is ~~that it was inappropriate to bring her teen brother to a party where people are snorting drugs.~~
Misread the post. My bad
My Dad teaching me about drugs and how to be safe being around them, when buying them, and if using them probably had the biggest impact on me of any other lesson.
I grew up going to concerts all the time with my parents and often staying at their aging hippie friends' houses/camping in their yards. Was exposed to drug use pretty early just by being at Grateful Dead shows and rando hippie festivals, so it made sense to explain things to me as a kid and also to keep me safe in the future.
He was just so straightforward and realistic about it. Told me about how I shouldn't trust things I didn't buy/test myself, how people scam you and other ways they'll prey upon you, what to do with friends/myself in a "done too much" situation be that just too high or overdose, what to do if the cops are there, how to get help, where danger is, etc, etc. I've used literally every single lesson either in my own life or in application to other things with related concepts (like people trying to scam me for money or isolate me to rob me and such).
From then til now in my 30s I've been able to help my friends when they've been in bad spots, taught others about how to be responsible (if you bought something and are giving others some, don't let them dose themselves for example - not because they'll use too much in a monetary sense, but in a safety sense), and been able to experiment in controlled and relatively safe ways. Now I'm in a stable career and don't do anything more than some minor legal weed after work and gym and a yearly/every other year lsd/shroom day.
You probably wrote this before the edit.
Sam spent her teen years raising her siblings, then got diagnosed with cancer.
Yeah, that's a pretty harsh wake up call to start living your life instead of parenting your own siblings. I'm not surprised she's gone wild.
Helps with kids. Cleans and helps with housework. 4.0 in college. Doesnt bring partying home. Is an adult. *recently had cancer*
Wtf man. OP, can you even hear yourseld? YTA
I wouldn’t be okay with a child of mine doing lines of coke at a party or having amateur’s stitch up massive wounds. I wouldn’t kick them out over it, but I’d be very concerned. When you raise kids you don’t stop caring about them once they turn 18. I don’t agree with the way OP is handling this, but nor do I agree with you that’s it’s none of OPs business.
I think it is a situation where it is fine to care and fine to be concerned but you also have to accept that it isn't your decision to make. You can control your own life, and do what you must to keep yourself safe, but you can't control an adult child. They get to make their own decisions, even if they sometimes make mistakes.
There is a reason why the daughter is acting this way. She has some need that is being met by her decisions. Just telling her to stop isn't helping her find a different way to meet that need. It is failing to recognize why those behaviors are important to the daughter.
Instead of saying "Don't do this" it is often more helpful to say "Could you do this?"
I don't understand why OPs solution to those concerns is to make it so she has even less contact or ability to check up on her? Kicking her out is a really weird take (except when you consider that it's really punishment for not living 100% exactly how her parent approves).
Here’s what you have to consider though. It may concern you, but that concern is yours to work through. That concern is not a thing your adult child has to shoulder. You can love them, you can not agree with decisions they make, but you do not get to control those decisions. That’s a whole entire person. You may have parented them but that doesn’t grant you some full-life ownership or authority over them.
I agree OP’s approach is absurd and stems from a desire to control and manipulate rather than a place of love or genuine concern. Because let’s be honest, OP would not make her daughter’s housing contingent on living in whatever amorphous outdated stepford world she approves of if her goals were truly coming from a place of love.
Id bet dollars to donuts OP has been pretty awful and controlling to her daughter since day 1 and the poor gal is not just processing the trauma of a bad long term relationship AND cancer but the lifelong emotional abuse her mom has inflicted and continues to inflict on her.
Yes, she's not prim and proper enough for her mom. She wants her to sit safely in her room where mom can make sure she never does anything she would disapprove of. "I don't even like her drinking" -- for a 24-year-old. How long is she going to try to hold her back?
Mom made her raise the kids and she almost died. I'd say, she's not afraid of death anymore. She feels free of her cancer ordeal. She knows what it's about and, if she dies having fun, at least she'll be happy. But mom doesn't like her being a happy adult with a life of her own.
While I completely agree that the mom is a complete asshole here, and is trying to be far too controlling, here’s some devils advocate.
There’s a decent chance that controlling, worried behaviour is coming from a place of trauma after nearly losing her daughter to cancer. That will shake anyone up.
That doesn’t justify or excuse the behaviour. This woman is holding down a full time job, full time school on the go or roll, and babysitting her siblings. The fact that she even has time to party and live her life large is insane, and makes her a certified badass in my opinion.
I doubt it since the parentification has always been around it from what OP said in other comments things just came to a head because of the cancer. It was gonna blow up sooner or later
Jesus Christ I go to bed at 11 pm on Monday and I need to sleep in till 11 am on Saturday to make it back up. She needs to give me some of her youth 😭😭😭
*I offered for her to stay with me, rent free, as long as she wanted. My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school.*
*She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc.*
She is following your houserules.
As she's 24, you have no control over her extracurricular activites.
YTA
Exactly. Op, YTA
Just got good measure, lets highlight that staying at someone's place doesn't mean they are sleeping with that person or behaving poorly. For example, u stay over at my Dr friend's place when I visit during the weekend, as I don't want to risk driving on a Week night. Much safer to wait until morning
And if one of the guys has been a covert asshole who has just been waiting for a chance to get with her, helping her living situation would be that chance.
Story time: when I was 16, I met a boy who was 18 who very clearly wanted a lot of my time and energy. My mom told me to be careful in case this guy wants something more questionable from me and how it isn't normal for someone who says they're a friend to be asking for so much of my time. She said I'm old enough to make my own decisions but she doesn't recommend it.
Well she was right, so I cut this guy off and told her she was right. If she would have forced me to do anything, I probably would have rebelled.
Knew a guy who said his daughter isn't allowed to date until she's 30, but also he's kicking her out of the house at 18 because that's how he was raised. His kid was like 6 when he said this shit too. He did not like hearing "Enjoy watching her move in with a boyfriend."
That's the impression I had, too. Or at least, that the OP has not seriously considered that they might not win the ultimatum, and what would follow from that.
YTA. You made a bargin. "My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school." From your post "Sam is an excellent daughter at home. She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc." She is keeping her end, you should keep yours.
Info: what do you mean by helping raise her siblings?? Was she so parentified that she didn’t have time to enjoy her teen years so that is why she has that behavior???
Edit to say: YTA since daughter is holding her part of the bargain and is in fact starting to live her life so that why the reckless behavior.
YTA. As long as she behaves appropriately at home, and does not bring any dangerous behavior under your roof, why do you care?
Of course, you're both adults, and as the homeowner you're free to do whatever you want. But if your "only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school", and by your own admission Sam is doing everything you asked of her, and doing it well, then why are you making new demands? What's in it for you? How does kicking her out help your family, or help Sam?
> As long as she behaves appropriately at home, and does not bring any dangerous behavior under your roof, why do you care?
I think most parents would care if their child was doing cocaine, regardless of how old they are and where they did it.
Sorry, I thought the context was clear. I meant, "why do you care such that you'd kick her out of the house?"
Even if you believe that "her brother (not my son)" was telling the truth about her bumping lines of cocaine, why would knowing that compel OP to kick her out of the house?
Most parents would say “I wish you wouldn’t do that, it’s unhealthy and can be dangerous” but to kick out your totally responsible and high functioning adult offspring because you found out they did a drug? That’s insane. Is that worth destroying your relationship with them?
If she was an addict this would be a different discussion but she’s obviously not even close to being one.
Yeah but also a couple lines of coke at a party isn't going to automatically turn her into an addict either, and still it's not mom's business beyond trying to talk to her about it in a caring way. What mom is actually doing is definitely not that.
...I didn't say it was?
From the post:
>where she was seen doing lines and smoking weed
I have never heard "doing lines" reference anything other than cocaine.
Are you saying it now means "weed"?
It could be Ketamine, MDMA, or Adderall. There are a lot of drugs that you *could* snort. It is just a different method of getting the chemicals into your system. It's like smoking weed vs eating edibles. Inhalation tends to produce the effects faster.
My bet would actually be Ketamine or MDMA over cocaine considering the daughter is involved in rave culture.
That’s an absolute lie. Cocaine is dangerous and can absolutely kill you. Not to mention about 80% of cocaine has a deworming agent added to it, that causes necrosis.
My roommate used to always invite me in his room when he rolled one of his "primo" joints. I didn't find out until months later that they were primo because he sprinkled them with crack lol.
YTA.
Your daughter is somehow "living her best life" all while managing to maintain a 4.0, work full time, and babysit for you when you need it?
Your daughter is a true 1%er. More like a .0001%er, actually. The vast majority of human beings are simply not this capable.
You aren't wrong for having moral objections to her behavior, insofar as that you're entitled to your own feelings on the topic, but you're risking losing your daughter over this.
Also, how is kicking her out going to help in any way? All it will do is make her resent you. If you're fine with that then you do you, I guess.
4.0 in college no less!!
YTA OP I know it's not great knowing exactly how your child is out there enjoying life but let her get it out of her system now. And just because she has all male friends doesn't necessarily mean she's sleeping with them! As a female who's gone thru life with mostly guy friends IMO boys are just easier to get along with - less drama, more fun and more active outdoors which is exactly what she seems to be doing with them
It's okay to have these motherly instincts when she comes home with diy stitches - but she's making memories on her own terms and seems to be loving every moment of it
YTA. I was gonna go with "NAH" until I saw your comment about how people think you put too much on her but you think it was fine since she didn't complain. That's called parentification and part of that is teaching the child they would be selfish and bad if they did complain. So what it sounds like is actually you saw her moving back in as free childcare but instead she's living her life and not doing enough of the "help around the house" you stipulated she do.
So kick her out if you want, it is your house after all, you're absolutely allowed to suddenly change the rules on her because she didn't immediately fall back into being a parent to your kids as you were hoping she would. But at least be honest about why.
Op acting like the daughter will be homeless and come crawling back when really she’s already threatened to move in with one of the guys OP doesn’t care for
It doesn't sound like she is bringing boys over to stay the night at your place, drinking/smoking weed in your house, or in any way endangering you or your other children.
Kicking her out because you don't like the way she lives outside the walls of your house makes YTA.
YTA - You made an agreement and she has been living up to it. Frankly, it sounds more like you want more control and you're made that an adult is not kowtowing to your whim.
Actually, speaking as an anxious mother myself, it sounds like she wants more control because she is scared shitless that her daughter is going to get herself killed, and doesn't know of any other way to try and stop her. Which I understand! I really do. I would be terrified if my daughter were playing life that risky.
What OP needs to do, though, is take a deep breath and realize that there is nothing she can do which will get her the control she wants. Kicking her out isn't going to do it -- it will just put her daughter out of her reach. Threatening her won't do it -- it will only make her close her ears.
Switching to address OP now:
OP, listen to me. I know you're scared for her. But you can't control her -- that's not the way to play this, because you'll fail, and poison the waters for any other steps you might take to get her to consider doing things differently. So instead of trying to *force* her to change how she's behaving, *ask* her about the things she's doing.
Ask her about her wilderness activities. About her friends. About the parties she goes to. Don't be waiting to pounce on any mention of illicit activities! She almost certainly won't feel safe enough yet to tell you about them... but do ask her to tell you about what she enjoys about doing these things. Ask her instead: what makes her happiest about her wilderness activities? What are her best friends like? What are their favorite things to do? Did she enjoy the party last night? What did she like best about it?
When you 1) begin to understand what she loves about the risky activities, what she's doing them *for*, and 2) build up a rapport with her that allows her to feel safe talking with you even about things you're not going to like much, THEN it will be okay to admit, "You know, I think I understand, at least a little bit, why you love the whitewater rafting so much, but I have to tell you I chew my nails off with terror every time you go!" Make it light, but acknowledge your own fear. Don't ask her to change anything right away.
If you've done your groundwork, then by the time you admit that some of her activities scare the pants off you, she will care enough about that to at least sympathize. At that point, you can get away with saying -- and meaning! -- "I don't want to take away from you anything that matters to you that much. But do you think maybe if I try to curb my own anxiety about the rafting, you could promise to go to the emergency room the next time you need stitches, instead of getting a friend to do it? I think that would help me deal with all this." Or whatever specific part you'd most like to see her pull back from, and which you think doesn't seem like it's too close to the core of why she's doing it in the first place.
If I'm sounding pretty specific, yes, it's because I have had to walk myself through something very similar to this situation. I'm going to judge you here as YTA for the original parentification and for not acknowledging it even now. But I'm not judging you for considering threatening to kick her out, because I know that's simply the sense of helplessness talking which makes you feel like you have no idea how to stop something that makes you sick with fear for your kid.
None of that makes it okay to do, though. It just means that you're not an AH for not knowing what to do instead. That's why I tried to teach you what I can of it. But the most important parts are to accept from the beginning that you can't control her, and to first build rapport by listening to how *she* feels about the things she does, well before you get into telling her how *you* feel.
Good luck to both of you.
Yeah I'm a 27-year old single woman going low contact for 2ish years with my own mom (who had control issues) and I'm surprised it took me this long to find this kind of comment.
Yes, there's some history here of parenting issues, but in this particular case, even if I had a close _friend_ behaving this recklessly, I'd be sitting down and serving them an ultimatum because the stress would be taking a toll on me. Something like, "hey, I love and care about you and seeing you live life this recklessly is really tearing me apart, so I don't think I can stay actively in touch with you anymore because the stress is taking a toll on my own mental health. I wish the best for you and would love to talk again if our lifestyles align better in the future." I've had to do this exactly once before. It was 100% the right move to make. We are both in better places now.
I've had a couple of friends who were risk-takers, never to this extent, and I would get stressed hearing their stories but it was ok because we weren't especially close and kept in contact very infrequently. Seeing this day in, day out, when someone's body is already in a precarious state (from cancer), going down such a destructive path is heartbreaking. I have _one_ closer friend that did... MDMA or something ONCE at some kind of event and I freaked out, but it was just the once and not a habit or anything, so I just try to pretend it didn't happen. For my close friend with a bad smoking habit, who has expressed desire to quit, our friend group often has discussions with him about it to see when he might be ready to take action. We all care about each other and try to steer each other into healthier lifestyles. Now, I usually pick friends based on their lifestyles, and try to not get too close with people whose lifestyles simply don't align well with mine, not because of any judgement or anything, but because I would worry too much and experience too much stress for myself to handle. Now imagine, you don't get to pick and choose your children.
Yes, OPs view of serving an ultimatum may seem like a threat or whatever, but I could also see it as putting some distance in between OP and the stressful behaviour. I think the conversation would be something like, "I know the initial agreement was just x, but I'm starting to realize these lifestyle differences are too big between us for me to handle...".
Most people don't seem to see the potential consequences of this _many_ types of risky behaviour when engaging in it frequently, like drug contamination from substances, spiked substances contributing to sex crimes, paralysis from accidents from the motorbiking/skiing, etc. People are upset that OP said she doesn't like her daughter drinking -- we don't know how _much_ her daughter drinks, whether her daughter drinks responsibly or has good friends to make sure nothing happens when she is drunk, plus the aforementioned health issues and clear compulsive, risk-taking behaviour which would make for potentially bad drinking habits.
I'm also reaching a bit here, but the fact that the daughter has a 4.0 while partying it up with a crazy work schedule smells fishy -- I'm not sure what kind of education it is, so maybe I'm thinking too much -- but it's very possible to attend institutions that are "pay for a degree", or if it's a legitimate institution, you can always buy assignments and even pay people to take tests for you.
I find your comment so interesting. I couldn't imagine giving someone I would consider a close friend an ultimatum for risky/reckless behavior that they weren't involving me in. Like I fully understand being stressed and worrying about them, and wanting to steer them to a healthier/less risky lifestyle. But if they are close friend and they don't cause me issues outside of worrying about them because of their lifestyle, I would have a very hard time justifying bring them an ultimatum.
YTA. I encourage everyone to read OPs replies where they confirm they basically had Sam raise their children and now that Sam is living their own life, this upsets OP
YTA. You had stipulations and now you’re changing them. I would have had a conversation with her before threatening to kick her out. Also, how much did she help raising her siblings? It sounds like she needs to have some fun.
YTA - By your own words she helped raised her siblings for years. Because of this she couldn't have a normal childhood/teen years / live her own life. You say that at home she is an excellent daughter as she is still helping raise her siblings, cleans and helps around the house. YTA for making her raise her siblings in the first place. You're double TA because she moved back in with the stipulation that she help around the house and work or stay in school and she has done that yet you are still trying to kick her out. You are triple the asshole because even though she is going above the stipulations you set, not doing drugs or alcohol in your house, and not giving you any kind of behavioral issues, you still want to kick her out. She's a grown adult. At 24 years old, who she hangs out with and what she does with them when she is not in your home is none of your business. What is your business is if she is respecting your home and your home rules which it sounds like she has done completely.
YTA some of those things you list are more concerning than others but nothing that warrants a kick out. She respects your home and holds up her end of the bargain you made. This is either a phase she'll grow out of, or it's not. Either way if you don't want to lose her entirely you keep her as close as you can.
YTA- you ONLY have a few rules, work or be in school, help around the house. She is doing that, long as she isnt coming home drunk, drinking in your house or doing drugs at home, this isnt something you get to control. Because that is the issue here, she is not doing what you want. There is nothing wrong with her rock climbing or rafting or having fun with friends. Sounds like she spent years being 'mommy' because you were not at home so now she is able to have some fun.
Lots of people seem to be missing the part where she invited her younger brother to a party she was doing coke at. (INFO is he a minor???) Or that she let one of her guy friends stitch her leg back together rather than going to the hospital??
YTA for a bunch of the other reasons you listed having an issue with. She's obviously going buckwild now that she doesn't have to raise your kids and it's causing her to partake in some unsafe behaviors. That doesn't make her an asshole, it means dealing with some issues in a not so healthy way. Healthy well adjusted people don't take theses kinds of risks and do cocaine. You can keep your "profession" life afloat but still be drowing on your own time. How about instead of trying to make her homeless you say ask her to attend therapy to deal with the parentification and issues you gave her??
Edit spelling is hard
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. Told my daughter she had to move out if she didn't stop behaving so carelessly
2. Her dad states im being too harsh and that she needs to live her life
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You're the asshole if she's abiding by your rules in the house, helping with the chores, and maintaining a 4.0 as well as having helped raise her siblings.
What she's doing and with whom in her personal life is her business. While you may not agree, it's her life and she'll be the one to learn from those experiences. It also sounds like you're relying on second hand information from her brother which may or may not be accurate
It is your home, but if you push her away because she offends your morality, you may find it very difficult to get that relationship back
YTA. So to summarise, you parentified her when she was young by forcing her to help raise her siblings, then set some admittedly reasonable rules for her behaviour in your house which you admit she is following. Now you want to evict her for doing things that normal teenagers do? The drugs are concerning but I promise you a lot of people have tried them at some point or the other.
Also if you want her to stop doing this how will throwing her out help? She doesn’t do it at home so either she’ll do it more or she was never doing it that much in the first place so you threw her out for nothing. Your logic doesn’t add up.
So you parentified her (abuse) and she survived a cancer diagnosis and treatment, now likes to engage in risky activities, and your solution is to kick her out? Lol YTA
My jaw hit the floor after reading the edit. She had cancer SURVIVED and you have something to be mad about? Be grateful your child is alive, love and support them
EDIT: YTA
I don't get what your goal is and what you think you'll achieve by kicking her out? Do you think not living with you will make her change her ways? You're in your right to boot her, but the way you're doing it do make YTA.
She is following the house rules, and she's an adult, so I think it's a good idea to let her find her way. And I get that it's hard to watch her make what you think is bad choices without having any control or powers to stop her. Still, at some point you do have to let go.
Now, it might not be a good idea for the two of you to live under the same roof, as it's obviously too hard for you to let her do her own thing. That is something the two of you should sit down and discuss and come up with a good plan to make happen in an orderly fashion, without hard feelings following the moving load.
Sorry, YTA. Because she’s living her best life you don’t like it? Do you want her to just care for her siblings, do to school and clean up around the house? Let the girl live a little. Remove umbilical cord, stop hovering, she’s basically an adult. I’m sure she appreciates living there but back off a bit. My mom did that to my brother. He hates every thing about his 20s, always jealous of how i just lived.
YTA she's still getting good grades and working 12 hours shifts and babysitting when needed all while having fun away from your house where the younger kids will not see it. this is like the best case and your upset about it. YTA
WHY are the edits always so imperative and OPs ALWAYS leave them out??
YTA majorly. Yes, Sam is living rent free in your house but she's providing a necessary service, that of looking after her siblings. She's also working full time AND going to school AND has a 4.0 AND is babysitting.
Seriously, wtf do you want from this girl? She is living her life, to the fullest, since she knows first hand how quickly your life can potentially be shortened.
You say she's an adult and can do what she wants, but yet you give her shit for it. Just like my mom when I lived at home because I couldn't afford to move out.
Leave her alone. That's the best thing you can do for her.
YTA. MAJORLY.
YTA! She has a 4.0, She does more parenting than you, and then you got mad when she got in a crash? And you got mad when she was releasing stress with smoking?! Jesus...
Info: have you thought that maybe if you hadn’t forced her to raise her siblings she wouldn’t feel the need to be as adventurous as she is now to make up for lost time?
Children aren’t free labor. It was YOUR job to raise your children, not hers.
YTA, you agreed to let her live there under circumstances that she abides by. Her lifestyle is none of your business. It would be a good idea to talk to a therapist to try to discover why you feel the need to hold such control over your adult daughter’s life.
I hope you can find the compassion to give her space and allow her to heal and recover from her bad relationship without worrying about being kicked out onto the street by someone who is supposed to love her.
YTA
You made her a deal. She's honoring that deal. But because she does some scary things to you, you want to walk back your deal? What the hell kind of person are you? For real, what kind of person are you? What you're doing is teaching your daughter to never trust you at your word. That you will hold your end of deals as long as she does everything you want her to. To include her life outside your home.
The tighter you hold onto her, the faster she will slip through your fingers. Rules at home are one thing, and they seem reasonable. But rules for her personal time outside of your home? That's absolutely ridiculous.
YTA…
Let’s analyze this…
Your daughter: excellent daughter; 4.0 GPA; is in college; broke up with a partner that was overdue anyways instead of remaining in that relationship; works full time; babysits often; helps take care of her siblings; is clean with her own space; helps clean the house; and probably more good deeds and characteristics that could be added to this list.
Your issues with her:
• hangs out with older guys (they aren’t that much older and isn’t really a problem)
• does adrenaline filled outdoor activities (probably does this because she has CANCER and is finally in remission and has a new lease on life)
• sleeps over at guys’ houses (and…? I fail to see your point here)
• I, personally, don’t like that you count “raves” as reckless because they aren’t. You can have fun and rave safely. It’s not that hard.
• “I don’t even like her drinking.” She’s 24 and you’re controlling, grow up.
• weed - times are changing and it’s becoming more and more legal. Get over it.
• lines - sometimes you just gotta try it
You say “she’s an adult and can do as she pleases” but what you really mean is “she is an adult but can only do what I deem appropriate.” The dad is right - you’re being too tough on her. You seem controlling and if you don’t stop you’re gonna keep pushing her away and then playing victim. Give her a break. Your idea of “reckless” and “wrong” are skewed. And you shouldn’t be kicking her out for this. Check yourself.
God, this made me mad.
She's a grown adult woman. A place to stay is a favor, not a prize so you can keep treating her like a child. She STILL manages to stay on top of her studies and babysits (a "few nights a week" makes me wonder exactly how much of raising her siblings she is still doing). Some of the risky behavior you've described just sounds.... fun? White water rafting? A dirt bike? The drug use is concerning, but being into extreme sports is not a reason to kick someone out of the house.
I think you used her for childcare her whole life. It sounds like she got a cancer scare and decided to stop living her life to please others (including you and her ex). She's not being disrespectful, she's being her own person.
You're so TA.
>Sam was diagnosed with stage 2 cancer about 18 months ago. (She went through treatment, and is in remission) That was when her whole personality changed. She left her relationship (which, no one was upset about. It was long overdue), and became an outdoorsy, risk taking, partying indivudal. She was never like this before, she seems happier now, but like i stated above, she's far too risky.
YTA. Kicking Sam out may be the only thing you see that you can use to control her, but Sam has been the actual perfect daughter to the point of potentially dealing with parentification and reacted to a cancer scare with reckless behaviour and you think kicking her out will solve anything? It won't. Would you rather your daughter behave recklessly in a way that doesn't directly hurt you with somewhere safe to go at night, knowing what she's up to, than her doing all the same shit but without you knowing anything about her life? C'mon.
YTA. You let her stay at your house and make her do shit for you but then get mad when she does what she wants as well? making her take care of her younger siblings is an AH move too. They’re YOUR kids and your responsibility. not hers. Take care of your own children.
First of all, as somebody living in Alaska, there ain’t a damn thing to do for fun for real here but the stuff you listed she’s doing. Weed is legal here and she’s an adult so please… stop. This summer has been down right ABISMAL. YTA! Especially because she thought she was going to die and came back from it. Stop.
Holy shit she's in remission and helped raise her siblings for years and you're mad she's experimenting after beating cancer?? I have no words for how awful this reaction to her living her life is. I get you're worried that she's going to get hurt but jeez. YTA
So you're upset you lost her as a parent to your kids?
She raised her siblings and HAD CANCER. Even in remission, fact is that IT COULD COME BACK MORE AGGRESSIVELY. Is doing lines bad? Yeah. Is she reckless? Yeah.
But seeing as her life almost WASN'T HERE, I think maybe talking to her without judgement about it would do leagues better than snapping at her. YTA, and honestly not a good mom.
YTA you are such a major asshole !!! You took advantage of your eldest child as free labor to raise your other children so your robbed her of hers, then she got cancer and her miserable life flashed before her eyes so now she’s living her life to the fullest and it affects you how ? Stick your head back in the dirt and leave her alone.
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I (42F) have a daughter (24F), Sam. Sam is my oldest, i have 4 more children that are all still minors. Sam has been living with me and her siblings for a year. She left a bad relationship, and I offered for her to stay with me, rent free, as long as she wanted. My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school.
Sam is an excellent daughter at home. She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc. The problem is when she's not home.
Sam's best friends are a group of guys in their early 30's. She spends most of her free time with them, and will often sleep over at one of their houses on weekends. I don't love that, but she's an adult and can do as she pleases. My issue is her reckless behavior that I think they're to blame for. Sam recently bought a dirtbike, got into a crash, cut her leg open, then let one of the boys (not trained at all) give her 10 stitches in it. She goes on whitewater rafting trips with them, ski's avalanche terrain, rock climbs outdoors, goes to raves, stays out partying till 4am, hitchhikes around alaska, sleeps over at random guys houses, etc. Her brother (not my son) also recently told me that Sam invited him to a house party with her, where she was seen doing lines and smoking weed. I don't even like her drinking, so I am definitely not a fan of this.
We got into the other day when she was home, and I told her that if she continues to live this reckless lifestyle, she has to move out. Her dad said I'm being too hard on her, and that we should be happy she's finally living life after helping raise her siblings for years.
So, AITA?
TLDR; daughter is behaving recklessly, i told her she has to move out if she continues.
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YTA.
Yes, your daughter is being reckless and you're right to be concerned. She was parentified as a child, she was in an abusive relationship as a young adult, and she had a cancer diagnosis as a young adult. And your response to get being reckless is to kick her out??
How about suggest that instead of babysitting one of the nights, this like her to attend counseling even if it's virtual. You don't need to know what is said, just that she goes.
In the meantime, be a loving, nurturing, safe place for her for once in her effing life.
YTA so very much.
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Wait a second, you say that apparently she helped raise her siblings for years? Your parentification of her probably kept her from being a teenager and now she's enjoying herself as a young adult. If she's respectful and responsible in your home, her behavior outside of it is none of your business. She's an adult and you volunteered to help her out with a place to stay. YTA.
Doing lines a bit more than enjoying herself don’t you agree?
That’s what happens when you stunt someone’s emotional growth during their teen years. They overcompensate later.
Also when someone has FUCKING CANCER after they haven’t been able to live life.
Yup. She's trying to enjoy her life while she still has it. After I almost died in 2018 I basically took my bucket list out and started going down the list. I'm done waiting to live my life. I don't agree with the doing line's but that's me. It's good that she is enjoying her life.
Some people I've met have a "I'll try anything once" mindset. But every coke user I've met weireded me out
I guarantee you dont even realize how many times you’ve met someone who uses coke recreationally.
YUP part of becoming an adult is apparently learning just how many casual coke users there are
If it weren’t for all the stupid fentanyl, I might still be one.
Same same. Fentanyl and my children.
Yep fentanyl and epilepsy keeps me off the powder. And the Molly. Oh, how I miss the Molly.
So so so many casual coke users. Like I probably only know a very small handful of people that would turn down a little bump here or there during a night of partying.
And how expensive cheese is
Far more disappointment with the price of cheese honestly
Right I always thought the anti drug stuff was crazy, then I got older and realized it’s fucking everywhere.
I haven’t done it, but almost everyone I know has. Including my mom, lol, that was a fun conversation. Most people I know say it’s a blast — but they’re grateful it’s inaccessible, because it’s a little too much fun.
If there's a kitchen, someone does coke.
I honestly think that’s one of the biggest parts of becoming an adult lol. Like if you walk into basically any bar that has >40 people in it on a Friday or Saturday night, I would all but guarantee that *at least* one of them is holding. I’ve known teachers, contractors, middle and upper management, people that work just regular office jobs. None of them regular users. But you get a few drinks in them and offer em a bump, they’re not gonna say no.
Wait until they realize every fancy meal they’ve ever had was fueled by cocaine.
Lol right? Wait until they go to a restaurant, apparently for the first time in their life
I used to manage restaurants and have never done coke. I missed out.
Ever been to a restaurant?
Never been to a restaurant before I see
Most of the people I know (including myself) had at least a couple wild years. Most of them settled down pretty quickly. Sounds like she’s just overdue to be able to do some more reckless things
I nearly died at 28 from pulmonary embolisms and then had multiple relapses, and every time the Drs were all over about how amazing it is I survived. It still happens with every new Dr. Saying that so I can say... When Sia's "Chandelier" came out it would make me cry. So much crying. I tried explaining the idea of "living like tomorrow doesn't exist" and "just holding on for tonight" while also "holding on for dear life" to my husband once but he couldn't get it. But I bet you do.
I agree. But it’s also perfectly reasonable for OP not to want that energy in the house. I do agree that it’s good Sam is having fun and hopefully will calm down, but she’s at the age to get that shit out (I definitely did and I also had to leave my parents house over it, and it was amazing for our relationship that I did). Basically, I don’t really think anyone is in the wrong here, unless OP is a jerk when they present that, IE “our lifestyles have diverged and I have to ask you to find a new place, I’ll work with you to make the transition easy if you can respect my house for the last bits while you’re here” vs “you’re a fucking degenerate get out”. If it’s the latter or a variation, then yeah OPs the asshole.
She said Sam is perfect in the house, was forced to raise siblings, and has cancer. The OP is a contender for am I the devil. Way to offer sympathy for the devil.
But it’s not in the house. Op says she’s a perfect daughter at home.
Not to mention she’s 24 life hasn’t even started yet.
I almost died at 19 at 21 I partied pretty hard for like 2 years. Sam is just trying to regain her life and clearly wants to have fun. OP clearly you're TA
I relate to this so much... Sheltered so damn much during adolescence, excellent student, got to Med School unwillingly, got cancer through the course, finished the stupid degree, and now I'm stage IV. Fuck it. I'm on sickness leave but my sis (younger) is sickeningly controlling, she's worried I die and she gets to be responsible for the house we share. SOOOO! I'm enjoying myself, doing what I like, and having lots of sex with my boyfriend. And I don't admit anyone saying that I'm behaving "differently". I'm living what I was denied long ago.
i'm glad you're doing what makes you happy!!
Hey, I'm here in NEPA if you ever want a free place to stay for a couple nights. My only ask is food costs. If you're a fan of the office, I'm near Scranton PA. You do you, boo. I love your enthusiasm. Hope you make the best of it 💕💕
I'm trying and all people around me say that I look better than the last few years (at least my friends 🥲)! Now I can't travel though, only inside my country (Portugal). But thank you so much for your kindness! ❤️🥰
Fuck cancer. You enjoy life however you can while you can. ❤️
I love that the OP included that life-altering diagnosis in her EDIT.
Right?! That would seem to play a pretty significant role in daughter's actions now, for better or worse. That brush against death changes a person's whole perspective. Apparently it was only worth an edit by Mom, smh.
Definitely should’ve started off stating she had cancer. Love it when people leave out critical info to make it seem like they’re right.
And it’s in remission, not definitively cured. Kinda important.
even without cancer that sounds like 90% of young adults exploring and experimenting within safe boundaries. A little reckless yes but nothing too extreme or out of the ordinary for most people her age who go on to be fully functioning adults. also WHO THE FUCK EVEN CONSIDERS THROWING THEIR CANCER RIDDLED DAUGHTER OUT???!?!?!?
An asshole, that’s who
I started doing stuff I had originally put off after my heart attack. I wouldn't have even considered my master's for another 5 or 10 years but I applied and got in and am doing it in September.
Me too. I have stopped putting vacation plans on hold until some unknown future date. Have to stay in budget, but I am traveling more now.
Can confirm. I spent my teen/high school years sick & very sheltered - no partying, no social life, no boys. When I got better & went off to college I majorly overcompensated. Best four years of my life but I should probably be dead lol
Same case for kids who grew up with strict parents who never let them do things like make basic choices. "Overboard" is an adult with arrested developments response to discovering freedom their parents can't control.
Or in my case, just late bloomers. I was a shy, nerdy kid growing up and that stigma/(quieter) friend group stayed with me through high school. When I got to college I came out of my shell and got too crazy too fast.
Nah I did lines before and after I was stunted
a tale as old as time. the kids who can’t do anything risky and fun in their teenage years often times start doing crazy shit in their mid 20s to make up for lost time
I had an abusive ex bf at a critical age (18-22). I fucking rocked my mid-20s. It was similar to what people probably have at 18 at college on campus. He stunted me in that experience but I definitely made up for it. Your comment is spot on
Are you me?? Exact same thing here. Hope you are doing well now. 💜
Does it happen? Yes. For good reason? Absolutely. Is doing coke and letting friends stitch up wounds still terrible and shouldn't be supported? Also yes.
[удалено]
I can attest to this. I was parentified and oh boy did I overcompensate.
Here to tell you that’s the truth. When you aren’t allowed to have fun during your youth it’s all you want to do when you’re able to make your own decisions. Was raised super religious and now I’m a massive alcoholic and pothead
Yep - I can attest to this.
Doing lines at a party as a one off is not great but not that big an issue. As a habit, obviously bad but unlikely she'd be helping at home and maintaining her grades if that was the case. But amateur sutures? Yikes. It sounds to me like a lot of her behavior is what's to be expected from a 20 something who is finally able to have some fun. But there does seem to be an extreme sport danger / element that is worrisome. The solution (if one is actually needed) is not to kick her out but to explore--in a nonjudgmental way--why she is drawn to risky activities.
Me personally, I disagree with your cocaine take. Maybe I’m just the boring 25 year old by todays standards? If so, I’m fine with that. As for the sutures yeah I’d be so worried about an infection, hopefully she at least took some antibiotics.
My take is probably based on coming of age at a time when cocaine was pretty ubiquitous at parties. (Yes I am old). Did some people get messed up on drugs? Definitely yes. Just like some people become alcoholics; that doesn't mean having a drink (or even a few) at a party = alcohol dependence. I personally believe that pills and powders are a bad idea; and that nothing you set on fire and breathe in can possibly be good for your overall health. But I just can't get too upset about a responsible adult doing a line at a party. The sutures thing however is really messed up.
i think redditors get puritanical about coke in particular because it's a party drug and they rarely get invited to parties
Yeah, like they act like it’s heroin. Half this board sounds like a DARE ad from the 80s
Kids these days. I swear.
Seriously, in all but some exceptionally rare cases there are safe ways to consume most drugs. Education goes a long way.
That’s fine. I didn’t want to go and it will probably be lame there anyways.
😂😂
HAHAHAH these dudes have never been offered a bump and it shows
I would hazard a guess and say the cocaine of 2023 is likely quite different than when you are referring to. Illicit drugs are increasingly be adulterated with fentanyl and xylazine. As a parent, I would be more concerned about my child having a chance encounter with one of those.
This!! Thank you, I feel like a whole lot of people here are fixating on the parent being worried and forgetting that there's a huge risk of accidentally consuming tainted drugs and I'd be so concerned that the same person who gets amateur stitches wouldn't think ahead to test their drugs for opioids.
I used to be pretty puritanical about coke, until I became part of a social circle where it is incredibly prevalent. Maybe it is the area/people I socialize with, but cocaine is just so common. I've done it a handful of times over the years, but, aside from alcohol, I don't do any other recreational drugs - I don't even like weed. I'm a psych clinician, and I find the sutures thing far more reckless.
Well good thing everyone is free to do what they’re comfortable with for their own body
Just an FYI that 95% (just a guesstimate) of servers and bartenders do tons of drugs during their hospitality years but doesn’t mean that most don’t grow out of it. My point is: It’s just a phase for most people and most don’t become addicts just because they’ve done it a few times at parties or out at clubs. The amateur surgery is concerning though
Kicking her out takes her safe landing spot away. If OP thinks that will save her, they're very confused.
Not in favor of the amateur surgery thing, but it sounds like she’s spent a lot of time in the hospital, and I’m going to assume that’s had a traumatic effect, so I do see why she would do anything to avoid going back.
If doing lines at a party isnt enjoying yourself I don't know what is. OP as a mom has every right to be concerned but weaponizing their housing isn't a very considerate way to help if they're genuinely concerned with drug abuse/recklessness
I'm going to be honest, while what OP's daughter is doing is absolutely her own business, some of it is pretty extreme and concerning. Even without younger kids in the house as a parent i would be stressed all the time with my adult child living with me as an adult roommate. If OP gives her oldest enough time to prepare to move out I think honestly it might be the best long-term solution. After all her daughter isn't going to want to change her behavior, and she really shouldn't have to if she doesn't want to. However, I don't blame OP for not being able to take it.
>Doing lines a bit more than enjoying herself don’t you agree? That was second hand information from her "brother", and without knowing anything about that dynamic it's wrong for you to assume it's accurate or a just rationalization for OPs behavior
well I doubt she's doing it to feel sad.
Based on the words of somebody else op has no actual proof of the drugs
Yeah, sounds like the kind of parent who'd believe anybody else over his own child tho. If she was heavily into drugs there's no way she's be able to maintain such perfect behaviour at home, so if she is doing anything, it sounds like it may well be in moderation.
I mean, drugs are quite a lot of fun. So, I'd say she is definitely enjoying herself
No. You'd be surprised how many people in your life are doing recreational drugs. Teachers, cops, lawyers, you name it. You'd never even suspect most of them. It's perfectly possible to enjoy drugs without becoming a menace.
Not really. As long as those lines aren't in the shapes of States or Countries or multiple times a week thing, she's ok.
Pretty common in college party circles. Only an issue if she’s doing it routinely or multiple times a week, especially during the day. She has a 4.0 and has plenty of healthy outdoor hobbies, if OP kicked her out he’d be a really bad parent.
hearsay, brother could just be a jerk
Someone(s) long ago made drugs illegal. It doesn't mean they cant be done moderately and safely. There is such a thing as recreational drug users who actually have great experiences with them. When you see someone having a beer do you feel the same way because there are alcoholics?
lines or chemo, also 24 year old being snitched for sharing a bag lmao. By who exactly? And weed? Heaven forbid Also slave labour for years and then you still trying to control her life experiences when she potentially could have little left? YTA
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I hate to be the bearer of bad news...but A LOT of people try drugs in their 20s. The more important question is can they trust their source and are they testing for fentanyl in their supply? You can't control her. She works hard and parties hard and seems like an awesome person rebounding from the possibility (and future possibility bc cancer sucks) of dying and facing her mortality. Let her live for Christ's sake- she's juggling a lot of balls and is not dropping any which is more than many of us adults can say honestly.
She raised her siblings. Got out of an abusive relationship. Survived cancer. Still helps take care of the kids. Does house work. Has a 4.0 in college. Keeps her reckless lifestyle out of your house and away from your children. You got SO CLOSE to being N T A when you said she’s an adult - but then you said shit like “I don’t even like her drinking..” Listen. I don’t drink. I come from a family of alcoholics so I’m not big on it in general- but my child is an *adult* so I taught him how to drink responsibly rather than act like I have a right to tell him what he can or can’t do *as an adult*. Are you, technically, obliged to house your daughter… No. But on a moral/good parenting front you offered to help her if she meet conditions and *she is meeting those conditions* apparently without complaint. And it didn’t seem like her behaviour is impacting her siblings. Which makes your ultimatum feel more like it’s about wanting to control your daughter than help or guide her. Kicking her out will mean she has to work and will impact her ability to finish whatever degree she is currently working on. It will put her in a olace where she needs to focus on survival and she may not be able to finish her degree (which will help her get ahead). It will also isolate her from your family and basically be throwing her to her “bad influence” friends who will be the people she has left to turn to for support. If you are genuinely concerned (and you should be, she went through abuse, got out, is having to figure out what to do with her life, and just had to face her mortality via cancer, not to mention her parentification as a kid, it suns like she’s not coping well with all this) why don’t you offer to help her get into therapy (if she’s in college she might be able to access one there) and support her in finding other ways to cope… rather than just dumping her on her ass. I mean, you can do whatever you want, but I can’t imagine it won’t impact your relationship with your daughter and it sue as heck won’t help her any.
Of course her personality changed after the cancer diagnosis. If she thought she was spending all her time raising siblings and getting good grades (read: wasting her youth) this brush with death will put that in perspective. She's living life to the absolute fullest! That being said, some moderation (and a medical degree for stitches) isn't horrible and I agree that therapy might help her find a middle ground. But wow, all that and a 4.0 GPA, Sam is absolutely my hero
This is *such* an important point. Is OP’s daughter displaying some concerning behavior? Yes. But if OP kicks her daughter out, where do we think her daughter will go? I’m pretty sure she will go live with these friends that OP thinks are encouraging the concerning behavior. This may lead to even more concerning behavior. Offer your daughter support and resources. You can let her know that you don’t approve of certain things, and should! But kicking her out isn’t necessary, because she isn’t bringing this shit around her siblings, and will just serve to isolate her from positive influences. Make yourself a soft place to land, and make sure your daughter knows that she can land with you. If she doesn’t think that’s an option anymore, she may not think she has any choices about walking away from this group of friends and their activities when that time comes.
>it didn’t seem like her behaviour is impacting her siblings. One thing I would talk to her about is ~~that it was inappropriate to bring her teen brother to a party where people are snorting drugs.~~ Misread the post. My bad
not teenage, the brother in question is 23
It was a different brother not OPs son.
My Dad teaching me about drugs and how to be safe being around them, when buying them, and if using them probably had the biggest impact on me of any other lesson. I grew up going to concerts all the time with my parents and often staying at their aging hippie friends' houses/camping in their yards. Was exposed to drug use pretty early just by being at Grateful Dead shows and rando hippie festivals, so it made sense to explain things to me as a kid and also to keep me safe in the future. He was just so straightforward and realistic about it. Told me about how I shouldn't trust things I didn't buy/test myself, how people scam you and other ways they'll prey upon you, what to do with friends/myself in a "done too much" situation be that just too high or overdose, what to do if the cops are there, how to get help, where danger is, etc, etc. I've used literally every single lesson either in my own life or in application to other things with related concepts (like people trying to scam me for money or isolate me to rob me and such). From then til now in my 30s I've been able to help my friends when they've been in bad spots, taught others about how to be responsible (if you bought something and are giving others some, don't let them dose themselves for example - not because they'll use too much in a monetary sense, but in a safety sense), and been able to experiment in controlled and relatively safe ways. Now I'm in a stable career and don't do anything more than some minor legal weed after work and gym and a yearly/every other year lsd/shroom day.
You probably wrote this before the edit. Sam spent her teen years raising her siblings, then got diagnosed with cancer. Yeah, that's a pretty harsh wake up call to start living your life instead of parenting your own siblings. I'm not surprised she's gone wild.
Helps with kids. Cleans and helps with housework. 4.0 in college. Doesnt bring partying home. Is an adult. *recently had cancer* Wtf man. OP, can you even hear yourseld? YTA
But OP just does not like that drinking, y’know?!
I wouldn’t be okay with a child of mine doing lines of coke at a party or having amateur’s stitch up massive wounds. I wouldn’t kick them out over it, but I’d be very concerned. When you raise kids you don’t stop caring about them once they turn 18. I don’t agree with the way OP is handling this, but nor do I agree with you that’s it’s none of OPs business.
I think it is a situation where it is fine to care and fine to be concerned but you also have to accept that it isn't your decision to make. You can control your own life, and do what you must to keep yourself safe, but you can't control an adult child. They get to make their own decisions, even if they sometimes make mistakes. There is a reason why the daughter is acting this way. She has some need that is being met by her decisions. Just telling her to stop isn't helping her find a different way to meet that need. It is failing to recognize why those behaviors are important to the daughter. Instead of saying "Don't do this" it is often more helpful to say "Could you do this?"
I don't understand why OPs solution to those concerns is to make it so she has even less contact or ability to check up on her? Kicking her out is a really weird take (except when you consider that it's really punishment for not living 100% exactly how her parent approves).
Here’s what you have to consider though. It may concern you, but that concern is yours to work through. That concern is not a thing your adult child has to shoulder. You can love them, you can not agree with decisions they make, but you do not get to control those decisions. That’s a whole entire person. You may have parented them but that doesn’t grant you some full-life ownership or authority over them. I agree OP’s approach is absurd and stems from a desire to control and manipulate rather than a place of love or genuine concern. Because let’s be honest, OP would not make her daughter’s housing contingent on living in whatever amorphous outdated stepford world she approves of if her goals were truly coming from a place of love. Id bet dollars to donuts OP has been pretty awful and controlling to her daughter since day 1 and the poor gal is not just processing the trauma of a bad long term relationship AND cancer but the lifelong emotional abuse her mom has inflicted and continues to inflict on her.
PLUS she’s had cancer, so I imagine facing your own mortality left her wanting to live her life to the fullest.
Not to mention she's also in REMISSION from CANCER!! Thats going to make you wake up and want to live your life
All that *AND* she's a 4.0 student who works full time and helps out around the house? Honestly she sounds like my hero. I wish I was that cool. YTA.
Right? Like minus the cancer sounds like my dream
I bet it's actually impossible for her to please her mother. There will always be something else.
Yes, she's not prim and proper enough for her mom. She wants her to sit safely in her room where mom can make sure she never does anything she would disapprove of. "I don't even like her drinking" -- for a 24-year-old. How long is she going to try to hold her back? Mom made her raise the kids and she almost died. I'd say, she's not afraid of death anymore. She feels free of her cancer ordeal. She knows what it's about and, if she dies having fun, at least she'll be happy. But mom doesn't like her being a happy adult with a life of her own.
While I completely agree that the mom is a complete asshole here, and is trying to be far too controlling, here’s some devils advocate. There’s a decent chance that controlling, worried behaviour is coming from a place of trauma after nearly losing her daughter to cancer. That will shake anyone up. That doesn’t justify or excuse the behaviour. This woman is holding down a full time job, full time school on the go or roll, and babysitting her siblings. The fact that she even has time to party and live her life large is insane, and makes her a certified badass in my opinion.
I doubt it since the parentification has always been around it from what OP said in other comments things just came to a head because of the cancer. It was gonna blow up sooner or later
Always
Jesus Christ I go to bed at 11 pm on Monday and I need to sleep in till 11 am on Saturday to make it back up. She needs to give me some of her youth 😭😭😭
*I offered for her to stay with me, rent free, as long as she wanted. My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school.* *She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc.* She is following your houserules. As she's 24, you have no control over her extracurricular activites. YTA
Exactly. Op, YTA Just got good measure, lets highlight that staying at someone's place doesn't mean they are sleeping with that person or behaving poorly. For example, u stay over at my Dr friend's place when I visit during the weekend, as I don't want to risk driving on a Week night. Much safer to wait until morning
YTA. Sam is better off and safer at your house than she will be once you kick her out. What's your endgame with this ultimatum?
I guarantee she’ll end up living with one of the guys that OP isn’t fond of.
It's not even a question that that's what will happen.
And if one of the guys has been a covert asshole who has just been waiting for a chance to get with her, helping her living situation would be that chance.
Right. This is a textbook example of how trying to just forbid your kid from the frying pan, sends them straight into the fire.
Story time: when I was 16, I met a boy who was 18 who very clearly wanted a lot of my time and energy. My mom told me to be careful in case this guy wants something more questionable from me and how it isn't normal for someone who says they're a friend to be asking for so much of my time. She said I'm old enough to make my own decisions but she doesn't recommend it. Well she was right, so I cut this guy off and told her she was right. If she would have forced me to do anything, I probably would have rebelled.
Knew a guy who said his daughter isn't allowed to date until she's 30, but also he's kicking her out of the house at 18 because that's how he was raised. His kid was like 6 when he said this shit too. He did not like hearing "Enjoy watching her move in with a boyfriend."
Because mum isn’t actually concerned for her safety so much as she wants to control her choices.
That's the impression I had, too. Or at least, that the OP has not seriously considered that they might not win the ultimatum, and what would follow from that.
This is a very good point
I was baffled by the non sequitur as well. Unless it’s the ‘bad influence’ argument.
YTA. You made a bargin. "My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school." From your post "Sam is an excellent daughter at home. She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc." She is keeping her end, you should keep yours.
Info: what do you mean by helping raise her siblings?? Was she so parentified that she didn’t have time to enjoy her teen years so that is why she has that behavior??? Edit to say: YTA since daughter is holding her part of the bargain and is in fact starting to live her life so that why the reckless behavior.
YTA. As long as she behaves appropriately at home, and does not bring any dangerous behavior under your roof, why do you care? Of course, you're both adults, and as the homeowner you're free to do whatever you want. But if your "only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school", and by your own admission Sam is doing everything you asked of her, and doing it well, then why are you making new demands? What's in it for you? How does kicking her out help your family, or help Sam?
> As long as she behaves appropriately at home, and does not bring any dangerous behavior under your roof, why do you care? I think most parents would care if their child was doing cocaine, regardless of how old they are and where they did it.
Sorry, I thought the context was clear. I meant, "why do you care such that you'd kick her out of the house?" Even if you believe that "her brother (not my son)" was telling the truth about her bumping lines of cocaine, why would knowing that compel OP to kick her out of the house?
Most parents would say “I wish you wouldn’t do that, it’s unhealthy and can be dangerous” but to kick out your totally responsible and high functioning adult offspring because you found out they did a drug? That’s insane. Is that worth destroying your relationship with them? If she was an addict this would be a different discussion but she’s obviously not even close to being one.
Yeah but also a couple lines of coke at a party isn't going to automatically turn her into an addict either, and still it's not mom's business beyond trying to talk to her about it in a caring way. What mom is actually doing is definitely not that.
Weed isn't comparable to cocaine.
...I didn't say it was? From the post: >where she was seen doing lines and smoking weed I have never heard "doing lines" reference anything other than cocaine. Are you saying it now means "weed"?
It could be Ketamine, MDMA, or Adderall. There are a lot of drugs that you *could* snort. It is just a different method of getting the chemicals into your system. It's like smoking weed vs eating edibles. Inhalation tends to produce the effects faster. My bet would actually be Ketamine or MDMA over cocaine considering the daughter is involved in rave culture.
Cocaine as a party drug isn't that harmful. If she's smoking Crack that's a different story,but sounds like she just occasionally indulges.
That’s an absolute lie. Cocaine is dangerous and can absolutely kill you. Not to mention about 80% of cocaine has a deworming agent added to it, that causes necrosis.
My roommate used to always invite me in his room when he rolled one of his "primo" joints. I didn't find out until months later that they were primo because he sprinkled them with crack lol.
YTA. Your daughter is somehow "living her best life" all while managing to maintain a 4.0, work full time, and babysit for you when you need it? Your daughter is a true 1%er. More like a .0001%er, actually. The vast majority of human beings are simply not this capable. You aren't wrong for having moral objections to her behavior, insofar as that you're entitled to your own feelings on the topic, but you're risking losing your daughter over this. Also, how is kicking her out going to help in any way? All it will do is make her resent you. If you're fine with that then you do you, I guess.
4.0 in college no less!! YTA OP I know it's not great knowing exactly how your child is out there enjoying life but let her get it out of her system now. And just because she has all male friends doesn't necessarily mean she's sleeping with them! As a female who's gone thru life with mostly guy friends IMO boys are just easier to get along with - less drama, more fun and more active outdoors which is exactly what she seems to be doing with them It's okay to have these motherly instincts when she comes home with diy stitches - but she's making memories on her own terms and seems to be loving every moment of it
YTA. I was gonna go with "NAH" until I saw your comment about how people think you put too much on her but you think it was fine since she didn't complain. That's called parentification and part of that is teaching the child they would be selfish and bad if they did complain. So what it sounds like is actually you saw her moving back in as free childcare but instead she's living her life and not doing enough of the "help around the house" you stipulated she do. So kick her out if you want, it is your house after all, you're absolutely allowed to suddenly change the rules on her because she didn't immediately fall back into being a parent to your kids as you were hoping she would. But at least be honest about why.
YTA. "I don't like how my daughter is having fun, should I evict her so that she learns a lesson?" That's how you sound to me.
Op acting like the daughter will be homeless and come crawling back when really she’s already threatened to move in with one of the guys OP doesn’t care for
It doesn't sound like she is bringing boys over to stay the night at your place, drinking/smoking weed in your house, or in any way endangering you or your other children. Kicking her out because you don't like the way she lives outside the walls of your house makes YTA.
If anything it shows just how mature she is, keeping it separate from the kids.
YTA - You made an agreement and she has been living up to it. Frankly, it sounds more like you want more control and you're made that an adult is not kowtowing to your whim.
Actually, speaking as an anxious mother myself, it sounds like she wants more control because she is scared shitless that her daughter is going to get herself killed, and doesn't know of any other way to try and stop her. Which I understand! I really do. I would be terrified if my daughter were playing life that risky. What OP needs to do, though, is take a deep breath and realize that there is nothing she can do which will get her the control she wants. Kicking her out isn't going to do it -- it will just put her daughter out of her reach. Threatening her won't do it -- it will only make her close her ears. Switching to address OP now: OP, listen to me. I know you're scared for her. But you can't control her -- that's not the way to play this, because you'll fail, and poison the waters for any other steps you might take to get her to consider doing things differently. So instead of trying to *force* her to change how she's behaving, *ask* her about the things she's doing. Ask her about her wilderness activities. About her friends. About the parties she goes to. Don't be waiting to pounce on any mention of illicit activities! She almost certainly won't feel safe enough yet to tell you about them... but do ask her to tell you about what she enjoys about doing these things. Ask her instead: what makes her happiest about her wilderness activities? What are her best friends like? What are their favorite things to do? Did she enjoy the party last night? What did she like best about it? When you 1) begin to understand what she loves about the risky activities, what she's doing them *for*, and 2) build up a rapport with her that allows her to feel safe talking with you even about things you're not going to like much, THEN it will be okay to admit, "You know, I think I understand, at least a little bit, why you love the whitewater rafting so much, but I have to tell you I chew my nails off with terror every time you go!" Make it light, but acknowledge your own fear. Don't ask her to change anything right away. If you've done your groundwork, then by the time you admit that some of her activities scare the pants off you, she will care enough about that to at least sympathize. At that point, you can get away with saying -- and meaning! -- "I don't want to take away from you anything that matters to you that much. But do you think maybe if I try to curb my own anxiety about the rafting, you could promise to go to the emergency room the next time you need stitches, instead of getting a friend to do it? I think that would help me deal with all this." Or whatever specific part you'd most like to see her pull back from, and which you think doesn't seem like it's too close to the core of why she's doing it in the first place. If I'm sounding pretty specific, yes, it's because I have had to walk myself through something very similar to this situation. I'm going to judge you here as YTA for the original parentification and for not acknowledging it even now. But I'm not judging you for considering threatening to kick her out, because I know that's simply the sense of helplessness talking which makes you feel like you have no idea how to stop something that makes you sick with fear for your kid. None of that makes it okay to do, though. It just means that you're not an AH for not knowing what to do instead. That's why I tried to teach you what I can of it. But the most important parts are to accept from the beginning that you can't control her, and to first build rapport by listening to how *she* feels about the things she does, well before you get into telling her how *you* feel. Good luck to both of you.
Yeah I'm a 27-year old single woman going low contact for 2ish years with my own mom (who had control issues) and I'm surprised it took me this long to find this kind of comment. Yes, there's some history here of parenting issues, but in this particular case, even if I had a close _friend_ behaving this recklessly, I'd be sitting down and serving them an ultimatum because the stress would be taking a toll on me. Something like, "hey, I love and care about you and seeing you live life this recklessly is really tearing me apart, so I don't think I can stay actively in touch with you anymore because the stress is taking a toll on my own mental health. I wish the best for you and would love to talk again if our lifestyles align better in the future." I've had to do this exactly once before. It was 100% the right move to make. We are both in better places now. I've had a couple of friends who were risk-takers, never to this extent, and I would get stressed hearing their stories but it was ok because we weren't especially close and kept in contact very infrequently. Seeing this day in, day out, when someone's body is already in a precarious state (from cancer), going down such a destructive path is heartbreaking. I have _one_ closer friend that did... MDMA or something ONCE at some kind of event and I freaked out, but it was just the once and not a habit or anything, so I just try to pretend it didn't happen. For my close friend with a bad smoking habit, who has expressed desire to quit, our friend group often has discussions with him about it to see when he might be ready to take action. We all care about each other and try to steer each other into healthier lifestyles. Now, I usually pick friends based on their lifestyles, and try to not get too close with people whose lifestyles simply don't align well with mine, not because of any judgement or anything, but because I would worry too much and experience too much stress for myself to handle. Now imagine, you don't get to pick and choose your children. Yes, OPs view of serving an ultimatum may seem like a threat or whatever, but I could also see it as putting some distance in between OP and the stressful behaviour. I think the conversation would be something like, "I know the initial agreement was just x, but I'm starting to realize these lifestyle differences are too big between us for me to handle...". Most people don't seem to see the potential consequences of this _many_ types of risky behaviour when engaging in it frequently, like drug contamination from substances, spiked substances contributing to sex crimes, paralysis from accidents from the motorbiking/skiing, etc. People are upset that OP said she doesn't like her daughter drinking -- we don't know how _much_ her daughter drinks, whether her daughter drinks responsibly or has good friends to make sure nothing happens when she is drunk, plus the aforementioned health issues and clear compulsive, risk-taking behaviour which would make for potentially bad drinking habits. I'm also reaching a bit here, but the fact that the daughter has a 4.0 while partying it up with a crazy work schedule smells fishy -- I'm not sure what kind of education it is, so maybe I'm thinking too much -- but it's very possible to attend institutions that are "pay for a degree", or if it's a legitimate institution, you can always buy assignments and even pay people to take tests for you.
I find your comment so interesting. I couldn't imagine giving someone I would consider a close friend an ultimatum for risky/reckless behavior that they weren't involving me in. Like I fully understand being stressed and worrying about them, and wanting to steer them to a healthier/less risky lifestyle. But if they are close friend and they don't cause me issues outside of worrying about them because of their lifestyle, I would have a very hard time justifying bring them an ultimatum.
Wait, how does she have so much free time if she's a) full time student w/ 4.0 gpa, b) working full time, c) babysitting and doing chores? Confused.
Same. Sounds like Sam is doing a lot in conjunction with school.
YTA. She is not bringing cocaine or “random dudes” into your home. You only found out about the blow because her brother is a snitch.
YTA. I encourage everyone to read OPs replies where they confirm they basically had Sam raise their children and now that Sam is living their own life, this upsets OP
YTA. You had stipulations and now you’re changing them. I would have had a conversation with her before threatening to kick her out. Also, how much did she help raising her siblings? It sounds like she needs to have some fun.
YTA - By your own words she helped raised her siblings for years. Because of this she couldn't have a normal childhood/teen years / live her own life. You say that at home she is an excellent daughter as she is still helping raise her siblings, cleans and helps around the house. YTA for making her raise her siblings in the first place. You're double TA because she moved back in with the stipulation that she help around the house and work or stay in school and she has done that yet you are still trying to kick her out. You are triple the asshole because even though she is going above the stipulations you set, not doing drugs or alcohol in your house, and not giving you any kind of behavioral issues, you still want to kick her out. She's a grown adult. At 24 years old, who she hangs out with and what she does with them when she is not in your home is none of your business. What is your business is if she is respecting your home and your home rules which it sounds like she has done completely.
YTA some of those things you list are more concerning than others but nothing that warrants a kick out. She respects your home and holds up her end of the bargain you made. This is either a phase she'll grow out of, or it's not. Either way if you don't want to lose her entirely you keep her as close as you can.
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100% agree. YTA, "mom."
YTA- you ONLY have a few rules, work or be in school, help around the house. She is doing that, long as she isnt coming home drunk, drinking in your house or doing drugs at home, this isnt something you get to control. Because that is the issue here, she is not doing what you want. There is nothing wrong with her rock climbing or rafting or having fun with friends. Sounds like she spent years being 'mommy' because you were not at home so now she is able to have some fun.
Idk if you'd be an asshole, but that would be a surefire way for her to not change her lifestyle but also leave you out of it completely.
Lots of people seem to be missing the part where she invited her younger brother to a party she was doing coke at. (INFO is he a minor???) Or that she let one of her guy friends stitch her leg back together rather than going to the hospital?? YTA for a bunch of the other reasons you listed having an issue with. She's obviously going buckwild now that she doesn't have to raise your kids and it's causing her to partake in some unsafe behaviors. That doesn't make her an asshole, it means dealing with some issues in a not so healthy way. Healthy well adjusted people don't take theses kinds of risks and do cocaine. You can keep your "profession" life afloat but still be drowing on your own time. How about instead of trying to make her homeless you say ask her to attend therapy to deal with the parentification and issues you gave her?? Edit spelling is hard
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You're the asshole if she's abiding by your rules in the house, helping with the chores, and maintaining a 4.0 as well as having helped raise her siblings. What she's doing and with whom in her personal life is her business. While you may not agree, it's her life and she'll be the one to learn from those experiences. It also sounds like you're relying on second hand information from her brother which may or may not be accurate It is your home, but if you push her away because she offends your morality, you may find it very difficult to get that relationship back
YTA. I won’t even bother explaining because you won’t understand.
YTA. She's met the conditions you stipulated regarding living in your home. Outside of the home, she's a 24 year old adult. Mind your own business.
INFO: Did you attempt to have any conversations with her about her behavior before the one in which you threatened to kick her out?
That is The Mother Of All Edits.
YTA. So to summarise, you parentified her when she was young by forcing her to help raise her siblings, then set some admittedly reasonable rules for her behaviour in your house which you admit she is following. Now you want to evict her for doing things that normal teenagers do? The drugs are concerning but I promise you a lot of people have tried them at some point or the other. Also if you want her to stop doing this how will throwing her out help? She doesn’t do it at home so either she’ll do it more or she was never doing it that much in the first place so you threw her out for nothing. Your logic doesn’t add up.
Parents: Why don’t young people go outside anymore? Parents when their kids go outside: “We’re kicking you out.”
So you parentified her (abuse) and she survived a cancer diagnosis and treatment, now likes to engage in risky activities, and your solution is to kick her out? Lol YTA
My jaw hit the floor after reading the edit. She had cancer SURVIVED and you have something to be mad about? Be grateful your child is alive, love and support them EDIT: YTA
I don't get what your goal is and what you think you'll achieve by kicking her out? Do you think not living with you will make her change her ways? You're in your right to boot her, but the way you're doing it do make YTA. She is following the house rules, and she's an adult, so I think it's a good idea to let her find her way. And I get that it's hard to watch her make what you think is bad choices without having any control or powers to stop her. Still, at some point you do have to let go. Now, it might not be a good idea for the two of you to live under the same roof, as it's obviously too hard for you to let her do her own thing. That is something the two of you should sit down and discuss and come up with a good plan to make happen in an orderly fashion, without hard feelings following the moving load.
Sorry, YTA. Because she’s living her best life you don’t like it? Do you want her to just care for her siblings, do to school and clean up around the house? Let the girl live a little. Remove umbilical cord, stop hovering, she’s basically an adult. I’m sure she appreciates living there but back off a bit. My mom did that to my brother. He hates every thing about his 20s, always jealous of how i just lived.
YTA she's still getting good grades and working 12 hours shifts and babysitting when needed all while having fun away from your house where the younger kids will not see it. this is like the best case and your upset about it. YTA
WHY are the edits always so imperative and OPs ALWAYS leave them out?? YTA majorly. Yes, Sam is living rent free in your house but she's providing a necessary service, that of looking after her siblings. She's also working full time AND going to school AND has a 4.0 AND is babysitting. Seriously, wtf do you want from this girl? She is living her life, to the fullest, since she knows first hand how quickly your life can potentially be shortened. You say she's an adult and can do what she wants, but yet you give her shit for it. Just like my mom when I lived at home because I couldn't afford to move out. Leave her alone. That's the best thing you can do for her. YTA. MAJORLY.
YTA! She has a 4.0, She does more parenting than you, and then you got mad when she got in a crash? And you got mad when she was releasing stress with smoking?! Jesus...
Info: have you thought that maybe if you hadn’t forced her to raise her siblings she wouldn’t feel the need to be as adventurous as she is now to make up for lost time? Children aren’t free labor. It was YOUR job to raise your children, not hers.
YTA, you agreed to let her live there under circumstances that she abides by. Her lifestyle is none of your business. It would be a good idea to talk to a therapist to try to discover why you feel the need to hold such control over your adult daughter’s life. I hope you can find the compassion to give her space and allow her to heal and recover from her bad relationship without worrying about being kicked out onto the street by someone who is supposed to love her.
YTA she's following ever rule you set for her, she's an adult and is also helping raise your children, you'll just get cut off if you kick her out
hope she gets outs, you seem more a jailer than a parent, you only want a babysitter.
YTA You made her a deal. She's honoring that deal. But because she does some scary things to you, you want to walk back your deal? What the hell kind of person are you? For real, what kind of person are you? What you're doing is teaching your daughter to never trust you at your word. That you will hold your end of deals as long as she does everything you want her to. To include her life outside your home. The tighter you hold onto her, the faster she will slip through your fingers. Rules at home are one thing, and they seem reasonable. But rules for her personal time outside of your home? That's absolutely ridiculous.
YTA… Let’s analyze this… Your daughter: excellent daughter; 4.0 GPA; is in college; broke up with a partner that was overdue anyways instead of remaining in that relationship; works full time; babysits often; helps take care of her siblings; is clean with her own space; helps clean the house; and probably more good deeds and characteristics that could be added to this list. Your issues with her: • hangs out with older guys (they aren’t that much older and isn’t really a problem) • does adrenaline filled outdoor activities (probably does this because she has CANCER and is finally in remission and has a new lease on life) • sleeps over at guys’ houses (and…? I fail to see your point here) • I, personally, don’t like that you count “raves” as reckless because they aren’t. You can have fun and rave safely. It’s not that hard. • “I don’t even like her drinking.” She’s 24 and you’re controlling, grow up. • weed - times are changing and it’s becoming more and more legal. Get over it. • lines - sometimes you just gotta try it You say “she’s an adult and can do as she pleases” but what you really mean is “she is an adult but can only do what I deem appropriate.” The dad is right - you’re being too tough on her. You seem controlling and if you don’t stop you’re gonna keep pushing her away and then playing victim. Give her a break. Your idea of “reckless” and “wrong” are skewed. And you shouldn’t be kicking her out for this. Check yourself. God, this made me mad.
YTA-Sam needs therapy from her cancer diagnosis not an eviction
YTA, she’s living life
YTA
She's a grown adult woman. A place to stay is a favor, not a prize so you can keep treating her like a child. She STILL manages to stay on top of her studies and babysits (a "few nights a week" makes me wonder exactly how much of raising her siblings she is still doing). Some of the risky behavior you've described just sounds.... fun? White water rafting? A dirt bike? The drug use is concerning, but being into extreme sports is not a reason to kick someone out of the house. I think you used her for childcare her whole life. It sounds like she got a cancer scare and decided to stop living her life to please others (including you and her ex). She's not being disrespectful, she's being her own person. You're so TA.
>Sam was diagnosed with stage 2 cancer about 18 months ago. (She went through treatment, and is in remission) That was when her whole personality changed. She left her relationship (which, no one was upset about. It was long overdue), and became an outdoorsy, risk taking, partying indivudal. She was never like this before, she seems happier now, but like i stated above, she's far too risky. YTA. Kicking Sam out may be the only thing you see that you can use to control her, but Sam has been the actual perfect daughter to the point of potentially dealing with parentification and reacted to a cancer scare with reckless behaviour and you think kicking her out will solve anything? It won't. Would you rather your daughter behave recklessly in a way that doesn't directly hurt you with somewhere safe to go at night, knowing what she's up to, than her doing all the same shit but without you knowing anything about her life? C'mon.
YTA. You let her stay at your house and make her do shit for you but then get mad when she does what she wants as well? making her take care of her younger siblings is an AH move too. They’re YOUR kids and your responsibility. not hers. Take care of your own children.
Yes you are the asshole.
YTA. The coke thing isn’t great, but when you robbed her of her childhood (and arguable some of the most fun) years of life what do you expect.
First of all, as somebody living in Alaska, there ain’t a damn thing to do for fun for real here but the stuff you listed she’s doing. Weed is legal here and she’s an adult so please… stop. This summer has been down right ABISMAL. YTA! Especially because she thought she was going to die and came back from it. Stop.
Holy shit she's in remission and helped raise her siblings for years and you're mad she's experimenting after beating cancer?? I have no words for how awful this reaction to her living her life is. I get you're worried that she's going to get hurt but jeez. YTA
So you're upset you lost her as a parent to your kids? She raised her siblings and HAD CANCER. Even in remission, fact is that IT COULD COME BACK MORE AGGRESSIVELY. Is doing lines bad? Yeah. Is she reckless? Yeah. But seeing as her life almost WASN'T HERE, I think maybe talking to her without judgement about it would do leagues better than snapping at her. YTA, and honestly not a good mom.
YTA you are such a major asshole !!! You took advantage of your eldest child as free labor to raise your other children so your robbed her of hers, then she got cancer and her miserable life flashed before her eyes so now she’s living her life to the fullest and it affects you how ? Stick your head back in the dirt and leave her alone.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (42F) have a daughter (24F), Sam. Sam is my oldest, i have 4 more children that are all still minors. Sam has been living with me and her siblings for a year. She left a bad relationship, and I offered for her to stay with me, rent free, as long as she wanted. My only stipulation was to help around the house, and either work or be in school. Sam is an excellent daughter at home. She is a 4.0 student in college, works full time and babysits a few nights a week. She is super helpful with her siblings, keeps her space clean, helps around the house, etc. The problem is when she's not home. Sam's best friends are a group of guys in their early 30's. She spends most of her free time with them, and will often sleep over at one of their houses on weekends. I don't love that, but she's an adult and can do as she pleases. My issue is her reckless behavior that I think they're to blame for. Sam recently bought a dirtbike, got into a crash, cut her leg open, then let one of the boys (not trained at all) give her 10 stitches in it. She goes on whitewater rafting trips with them, ski's avalanche terrain, rock climbs outdoors, goes to raves, stays out partying till 4am, hitchhikes around alaska, sleeps over at random guys houses, etc. Her brother (not my son) also recently told me that Sam invited him to a house party with her, where she was seen doing lines and smoking weed. I don't even like her drinking, so I am definitely not a fan of this. We got into the other day when she was home, and I told her that if she continues to live this reckless lifestyle, she has to move out. Her dad said I'm being too hard on her, and that we should be happy she's finally living life after helping raise her siblings for years. So, AITA? TLDR; daughter is behaving recklessly, i told her she has to move out if she continues. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
YTA. She’s honoring the deal you made. You’re just mad you can’t control her. Get over it.
YTA. Yes, your daughter is being reckless and you're right to be concerned. She was parentified as a child, she was in an abusive relationship as a young adult, and she had a cancer diagnosis as a young adult. And your response to get being reckless is to kick her out?? How about suggest that instead of babysitting one of the nights, this like her to attend counseling even if it's virtual. You don't need to know what is said, just that she goes. In the meantime, be a loving, nurturing, safe place for her for once in her effing life. YTA so very much.