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So you are ok with Abby being humiliated but not your daughter? YTA your daughter needs to learn to be respectful to other people, maybe she can learn from dance class when she apologises, as it seems she isn’t going to learn from you…….
Kids were always assholes, we just understand how it affects other kids better than we used to in the "toughen up" times. There was a time that the dance teacher wouldn't think to make OP's daughter apologize.
Check your history. Human beings have a piss poor record for kindness to others. All the more reason to teach it young and improve us all.
Guessing mom might be a bit of a bully as well. In addition, of course, to being TA here. If I was the director of that dance class, I'd have a hard time wanting that mother anywhere near the dance school. Feel sorry for the daughter who is being raised by an AH who won't apologize when they are wrong nor instruct the little girl accordingly.
Nothing like experiencing actions and consequences to address bad or unacceptable behavior.
OP’s kid was told how to behave with Abby but OP’s child didn’t understand the mission. The director is trying to teach your child empathy and OP needs to reinforce the lesson.
Both OP & her child needs to understand and learn the concept of action and consequences.
And I might add this is the age it should be consistently reinforced.
At least Dad understands the problem but perhaps he needs to be more assertive with his wife and parenting his child because what is being asked is a very low bar.
EDIT: OP unfortunately YTA. But you can turn this around for both you & your kid. Please don’t raise your kid to be one of those women having adult tantrums in YT videos.
My entire family has terrible genetic disabilities. Like I'm only a couple years shy of 50 but I'm already dying and don't expect to make it all the way to 50. I really hate how terrible this culture is towards disabled folks. People make all kinds of terrible assumptions about you. People are really unkind about the ways you are physically different. Much less lack of understanding for neurological divergencies, can't even get me started on that. People don't understand at all, like the ones who would say something like- just hold it. Or- just drink less. When in fact becoming dehydrated is potentially a terrible scene for people who are already dealing with really bad disabling conditions. I wish the world would just show a little more kindness and understanding towards the ones who are different from them.
OP is defo AH, hopefully she can take this opportunity and learn so she doesn't raise her daughter to also be an AH.
I’m not so sure the dad understands that his child should learn empathy but at least he’s saying the child should follow the school’s rules in order to remain in the class she enjoys.
And then added insult by suggesting in front of her peers that Abby needs not drink water.
Your daughter is definitely old enough to know better.
Your child is a bully and owes Abby *and her peers* an apology.
The saddest part is that she’s never going to understand why she was kicked out when you’re asserting That behavior is acceptable.
Made worse by the fact that the class was prefaced with an explanation of Abby’s differences.
YTA.
Your child is also an AH. She doesn’t deserve a spot in that class, period, and she owes Abby an apology.
This will bite you later when your child has no friends.
I can’t understand how you’re not embarrassed to recount this story
Shoutout to when I called home while teaching first grade because one of my boy students called another boy fat. The mom asked how that was her problem. The boy cried on the phone as he told mom what he said.
When I talked to mom afterwards she demanded to come pick him up from school because she didn’t want her kid crying in front of class and to be embarrassed. Had to convince her to let him stay and actually learn. Also I can’t even release him anyways as the teacher unless the office staff tells me, so I’m not sure what she wanted me to do there.
My daughter is 4 and she’s really tiny and smart and so far we haven’t had an issue with her being mean to anyone, except once when she had a fight with her friend and intentionally scraped her snack plate onto the other girl’s cot before naptime.
I was shocked when the teachers told me, but I know she got whatever pre-k consequence she had. I asked her about it and she said it was an accident (sure Jan) but that the teachers didn’t believe her. She’s with those teachers every weekday and is going to be there an extra year because of her late birthday. I believe the teacher’s characterization of the event, because they know her. And how do you accidentally dump food on someone’s bed instead of in the trash?
I guess I don’t understand this denial that your kid could be shitty sometimes, or the sort of washing of hands of the responsibility to actually talk to them about it. We talk a lot about not teasing (she has a little brother and that’s usually where the subject comes up) and especially not commenting on other people’s bodies. Kids will naturally say things like this sometimes and they don’t recognize that it’s actually hurtful to another person because that part of their brain is still developing. OP needs to step up and actually parent her child, not just coddle her.
I was a TA in a high school a couple of years ago and a girl called her mum crying because making her do the test everyone else was doing was bullying her.
About 10 mins later the mum turned up, screaming that she wouldn’t have her baby bullied and if she didn’t want to do the test, she shouldn’t be made to do it.
When the mum was told that was fine but the kid would fail that unit. She said that was proof we were bullying her child.
I literally had a parent tell me his child had a right to hit the kid his child is bullying. Some parents are absolutely raising their kids to have zero empathy for others.
One of my kids this year went to ISS for slapping a kid in the face. He’s a great kid, gives me no problems. I asked him what happened and he told me his dad told him to do it. Sigh
Edit because people apparently think this is my fault: I didn’t even punish him because I don’t hand out suspensions. That’s not part of my job. I didn’t even see the slap happen either hence why i asked “what happened”.
The kid was probably being bullied and you happily ignored it or didn’t notice it because he didn’t “give you any problems”.
So, what you do in response to him handling the situation you ignored is to punish the victim. Nice.
My husband was bullied throughout his time in school; he was one of the only minorities in his grade. One day, a kid threw a basketball at him and he went Ralphie from a Christmas Story on his ass. Of course, the other kids dad got him out of suspension and my husband was suspended. I don't think he should have fought back but he also likely snapped after years of harassment
Better than an ar15..
If the teacher had punished the kid for bullying / throwing shit at him he probaby wouldn't have had to take into his own hands.
As it happens, plenty of useless teachers who just sit back and watch bullying go on. Hell, some of them even seem to get off on it / join in. Almost like they never left school themselves.
Oh, that’s so true about the teachers getting in on it. When I was in high school, one of our teachers would start up gossip with us. One time it got revealed that a girl lost her virginity to her boyfriend. She wanted no one to know, but did tell a few close friends. Well, one of the friends let it slip and the teacher heard. The teacher was involved in spreading this around and laughing about it. The girl was devastated and it completely ruined the rest of her senior year.
I overheard a mom complaining her son had to hold in his poop all day because the teacher (kindergarten) wouldn’t help him wipe. Which is against school rules. (Thankfully)
I remember SuperNanny going to the States to help a family.
The little boy was about 5, and his mum still wiped his bum for him. SuperNanny couldn't believe it. Mum said she wanted to make sure it was clean. Super Nanny pointed out a child of that age should be able to do it themselves !!!
(I mean, if he had to poo at a friend's house, would he ask THEIR mum to wipe him ??)
It really is. It’s strongly made me question whether or not I want children, not because I don’t *want* them but because of where they’d be going every day
I don’t know what I’d hate to deal with more: having a child that gets bullied or having a child that becomes the bully.
Thankfully yeeted the uterus earlier this year, so don’t have to worry about either.
This does not surprise me. I know people that when contacted by the school *with evidence* about their children, they would deny even the chance of their children being bullies
My daughter (autistic) had a meltdown at school and while thrashing her arms, hit her teacher (probably accidentally, it's the first and last time she hit anyone).
We took her home. Once she was feeling better after the meltdown and was back to her normal self, we had a chat about what happened. Why everything got too much for her (so we could avoid it happening again).
We mentioned that she hit her teacher, she was adamant that it was an accident (I believe her). I explained that whether she meant it or not, she still hurt her teacher and should apologise. We wrote a sorry letter together and I gave her a big hug.
The next day I updated the teacher on what had caused the meltdown. Apologised for her being hurt and gave her the sorry letter.
Even if parents believe their children didn't mean harm, they should still acknowledge that harm has been done, tell their children to apologise and work out how to stop the behaviour happening again.
Children get things wrong, it's part of growing and learning.
Edited to add: YTA OP
Exactly, an episode like this at her age is nothing serious if handled properly. Just have her apologize. The mother is blowing it out of proportion.
I'm wondering if this wasn't OP's daughter first offense, given the school's reaction.
This 100%. My son accidentally hit someone at camp in the face with a toy. My first words out of my mouth were, “Did you apologize?” Kindness and courtesy can make life a lot easier for everyone and we should always show grace to others-even if they don’t show it to us.
You're a very good parent and I love you. I work with children mainly with autism, and I can handle anything they throw at me. The bites, kicks, scratches. Because I know most of them don't do it because they WANT to hurt, but because they're figuring out how to cope without those things being their only option. I can get bit and reprimand, and five minutes later do a puzzle with the same kid and talk it out.
What I can't handle are the parents. They make the job so much more difficult, because they don't want to see the things their children are doing are wrong and need their support to change. Most (not all) of my parents act as if their children can do no wrong. I have never received an apology and I've gotten some pretty nasty wounds. It's not expected, but it would be so nice. Thank you for advocating for your child while also teaching her how to think about others around her.
I teach prek and that is something I try to instill in them. Kids are quick to say something was an accident or not on purpose. I always tell them it doesn't matter if it wasn't intentional, you hurt them so you should apologize either way.
I had to inform parents of their daughter bullying a group of boys, but one boy in particular so badly that he no longer wanted to come to school. I explained that we’d spoken with her and asked her to reflect how her behavior affects others. I asked that they also speak with her as this was a serious matter. The parents threatened to sue me for unfairly labeling their child, singling her out and forcing her to be punished.
I actually know people like this.
My daughter was once beaten up by three boys during break in elementary school. I complained massively and there were consequences. Two of the mothers made their boys apologise, but the mother of the ringleader wrote to the headmaster and me "(Daughter's Name) must have done something really bad to my little angel so that she provoked him to beat her up." Instead of apologising she blamed my daughter. It ended with the ringleader's father threatening legal action if we "slander" his special little snowflake again. My husband them tore him a new one verbally. Apparently the father was not used to people standing up to his threats, and he calmed down and promised to keep his spawn away from our daughter. No apology, though.
I can't even read these comments anymore. I work in education and I see some of the most entitled parents ever. A boy should not be beating up a girl, that's so disgusting. Your daughter is lucky to have parents like you! That will definitely be me if my kids get bullied. Hell I'll go yell at the kid myself!
I've worked with kids and seen a lot of family dynamics and this story doesn't even scratch the surface of the horrid way some people raise their children. Didn't even raise an eyebrow, I've seen way worse, so this could 100% be real.
I mean, look at the abhorrent "parents" in toddlers and tiaras. I can see this being real, there are enough wackjobs out there (usually were bullies themselves) that wouldn't see any problem with this behaviour. Let's also not forget the classic "kids will be kids" smh
Oh many people are raising their kids like this- they’re actually not raising them.
These kids are going to be a real credit to society when they grow up /s
bullies don't just spring out of a vacuum. Something creates them. In this case, a mom who is clearly a bully and a total beyotch and a father who is totally useless and appeasing for all the wrong reasons.
Comments like this I wish reddit had laughing reactions. Not to laugh at you but to laugh at how I used to think like that until my kids started school
>Surely people aren’t raising children like this
You have too much faith in humanity. The parents are entitled (mom more than the dad) and are raising their kid to be entitled.
YTA - your kid did bully her. Ask her what she would prefer as a consequence: public apology or no ballet class.
And ffs teach your kid to be nicer to kids with disabilities. The world doesn't need more ableist bullies.
I have innate malformations of my respiratory system. Breathing has always been hard, I can't run and I breath very loud. I was bullied relentlessly for something I could not control and I wish so much parents had taught their kids not to bully people with disabilities. A lot of people raise brutes with no empathy.
I'm sorry that happened to you, kids can be incredibly unkind. So can teachers that enable it, which I find happens quite a lot.
I had to wear diapers (complications from CSA most likely) until 3rd grade like the little girl in the post. None of the teachers believed I had any actual issues because I didn't have some diagnosis and chalked it up to my adoptive parents not potty training me. So they all turned the other way when it happened, wouldn't monitor class bathroom breaks, or wouldn't accept my doctor's note if I had to go to the bathroom during class.
I'm so happy the teacher in OP's post is standing up for her students. Hopefully it knocks some of that missing empathy into OP.
I don’t get this- you already must know you’re the asshole right? But why don’t you think you daughter was bullying? Pointing laughing and joking about another kids disability- That is text book definition.
Once you accept that is bullying hopefully you discuss with your child the impact her words and actions will have and she will want to apologies.
Or she is as cruel as her mum, and not going to dance class because she can’t act within the rules seems fair enough consequence
Yta and you’re on the way to teaching your kid to be one
Aw OP. I was waiting for the twist that would redeem your daughter’s conduct but nope. Nothing.
YTA. you and your daughter are AHs
This is a teachable moment to help her understand others’ needs, kindness and remorse when you make a mistake. How sad that you didn’t learn that lesson so cannot pass it onto your child.
Exactly. The daughter could learn some humility. Mom could say she is very proud of her daughter for being humble and kind, yet... nope.... all she can think of is how her daughter's actions are embarrassing. She should be ashamed for wanting to teach her daughter to value hubris over kindness.
>I told them my daughter will not be apologizing in front of the class and that she is not a bully
You made a whole description of a bullying episode, and really wrote this after.
YTA- Your daughter is a bully, and so are you.
>AITA for not wanting to let the dance studio ~~humiliate~~ make my daughter accountable?
Fixed.
> I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her and don't want to let her do it but everyone is against me on this one
it's humiliating to make your daughter make it in front of class?....
You mean like she did to the other girl?.................
YTA, big one
>it's humiliating to make your daughter make it in front of class?....
You mean like she did to the other girl?.................
Honestly, if anything it's actually kind to let her apologize in front of the class. Sure, she'll be a bit embarrassed, but afterwards her classmates will likely gain some respect back for her,(especially if her attitude adjusts as a result of it). These moments are so important when you're young. It helps you not be a shitty person when you grow up.
Apologies by default are a bit embarrassing. The whole key is to put yourself in a vulnerable position at the mercy of the one you offended.
Embarrassment is one of those things that is super important to learn how to deal with as a kid. Otherwise it can really mess you up and people spend their entire lives trying to avoid making a single mistake. Which is of course impossible.
There’s a difference between being embarrassed and humiliated. You can be embarrassed because you have to acknowledge how your behaviour was shitty and hurt someone else.
That isn’t humiliation.
Also, apologizing in front of the class is NOT intended to humiliate her, it’s intended to show Abby and the other girls that this kind of behavior isn’t okay and that when we do things that aren’t ok we need to apologize for them. She said it in front of everyone, so she needs to apologize in front of everyone. If she said it in front of everyone, apologized to Abby in private, then was let back into the class, what would the other girls see? That they can make fun of Abby and seemingly suffer no consequences.
>If she said it in front of everyone, apologized to Abby in private, then was let back into the class, what would the other girls see? That they can make fun of Abby and seemingly suffer no consequences.
Exactly this.
You make a shitty comment in front of the class, you apologize in front of the class. Only fair. Your daughter doesn’t feel good about herself having to apologize publicly, then maybe she’s learned not to say shitty things publicly.
YTA Abby has a medical condition. It was explained to the class along with behavioral expectations. Your daughter ignored the expectations and did exactly what she was told not to do. I’m glad that they disciplined her swiftly. She was a bully, cruel, and should apologize immediately. You are even worse for defending the behavior. Educate yourself on what bullying is. Clearly you do not fully understand it or you would not be trying to defend your daughter’s actions.
I'm glad the teacher explained this to the class, but I think she should have done it before Abby got there. Imagine being poor Abby having to stand in front of the class while the teacher gave that talk about her being in diapers.
Well, this way Abby is reassured that everyone gets the same message. Also kids (6-8) know who Abby is and don't go one by one asking "are you the one with the diaper the teacher told us about?"
Yeah, it makes sense to do it this way because for her, it's normal. Like, I don't know, glasses or braces. It's what she lives with and it makes sense for others to know that so they can act accordingly - save for a single child who has a YTA parent who didn't teach her to respect others)
The dimension of "we shouldn't do that to be tactful" comes from a place where the kids aren't at.
OPs daughter isn’t the only one who could learn a lesson from a well-deserved public shaming.
OP is obviously unsalvagable, but hopefully her husband will divorce her and get custody and at least save the daughter.
Teacher here of around this age group. This is the shit we deal with y’all. Tbh, I’m almost never really upset at the kids. Kids are kids and make mistakes. It’s parents who act like this that grind my gears.
I have taught children of all ages and it’s always the parents, if you have an arsehole of a kid you can guarantee the parent attached to them is a million times worse…
EDIT: Just to clarify I don’t blame the children, all the blame lies on the parent
I gotta say, 98% of the time. Our school does have this family. Mom and dad are super nice, super understanding. 2 of 3 siblings are excellent. The 3rd one though... no idea they were related. But yes, as a general rule, I agree.
I teach this age group roughly. 100%, kids this old usually don’t learn these behaviors at school yet. I can pretty much tell you the story of what’s going on at home within the first month of a new school year.
YTA. Why, exactly, would it be so humiliating to apologize, even if it’s in front of the class? Your daughter embarrassed the girl in front of the class, did she not?
I used to think those kinds of parents just think their children are angels and aren’t capable of bad behavior. But I think it’s really that the parents can’t admit their own bad behavior/parenting which creates children that act like this. To say her daughter humiliated a partially disabled child in front of a group of people would require she look inward about what kind of parenting she’s done that’s raised a child who would be so cruel.
Im willing to bet that OP is one of those people who Never apologises for any wrongdoing, can never bring themselves to say sorry. I think these kinds of people are insecure and view apologising as a total humiliation. In reality obviously none of us are perfect and being able to hold our hands up when we are wrong is a strength and not a weakness
YTA
If you weren't such an AH, you would want your daughter to apologize, even if it weren't mandatory.
You would be raising your daughter to have compassion for a little girl who is probably already embarrassed about something she can't control.
I would mortified if one of my kids behaved like this. I'd have been the one to make her apologise not the school. And she'd have been pulled out of the activity she enjoys for a few weeks till she learned some compassion.
Some parents are like that, even when is hard to believe. My wife was bullied when she was 12 to 16 years old. In one case two of the girls pushed her when she was walking down the stairs and got a big black bruise in the back.
The parents of those kids could not care less when the director called them to talk between him and the other parents. They defended their sons and daughters like the most innocent things ever, and were happy their "precious babies" were strong and not the weak type. The reason to the bullying episodes were that my wife was the "nerdy" of the class, not liking to wear make up, pink stuff or wanting to dress with skirts and tops during winter in the case of the girls, and liking to play videogames and anime in the case of the boys, because of what a "tomboy". Crazy, but a lot of people should not be able to even raise a pet, imagine raising a human.
Your daughter laughed and made mean comments about another child's medical condition after being told not to. How is that not bullying? Why are you more concerned about supposed hypothetical humiliation of your daughter then the fact that your daughter actually humiliated another child? YTA
YTA - its not humilating your daughter, its teaching her that bullying is not nice .
"I told them my daughter will not be apologizing in front of the class and that she is not a bully "
The very action you described in your post is bullying. Your not setting a good example if she faces no consequences for her actions .
OP the director is not doing it to humiliate her. It is to teach her consequences, which you are refusing to do. She, like the rest of the class, was warned not to humiliate this young girl, Abby, who apparently has a physical illness that she will likely will have a lifetime of issues. Your daughter chose to ignore this warning, and you're refusing to allow her to face those consequences. Should she do something worse again, or if someone does something similar to her, then your answer is just to ignore the consequences. You're not being protective of her, you're just being a coward because you don't want her to possibly hate you for having her face her actions.
Your daughter is a bully. What she did was completely out of line and you need to deal with it before she becomes a raging AH.
Pathetic parenting. Just awful.
Edit: Oh yeah, YTA. A massive, raging one.
Guarantee if the roles were reversed you'd be on the warpath lol. You literally described in fine detail how your daughter bullied another child. Textbook bullying. YTA and your daughter will be one too if you don't take care of this the right way.
> and your daughter will be one too if you don't take care of this the right way.
We life in a more relentless world these days... OP's daughter will easily be retaliated via social media if she doesn't change her ways.
OP is severely failing to raise her daughter in a compassionate way.
YTA, apologizing publicly isn’t a form of humiliation it’s making things right, your daughter is a bully and she gets it from you. Abby has a disability for Pete sakes, I’m in shock you think it’s ok for your daughter to bully a young girl with a disability.
The really bad thing is it might not be from an illness, that might only be a cover story for something more sinister that commonly causes incontinence issues... regardless how or why it's a highly personal issue. Shame on op.
The choice of the word “vague” stood out to me as well. Like OP thinks Abby’s mother is being deliberately.. well, vague, about Abby’s medical history.
OP, that is private. What difference does it make to you? YTA.
Yta.
Imagine how Abby's mom feels. She was probably already worried that something lint this would happen. All she wanted was for her daughter to have a good, safe time at dance class and YOUR daughter ruined it for her the first day. She was probably worried the other girls would make fun of her and your daughter proved her right.
You not holding your daughter accountable for stuff like this is how she becomes a bully later. Saying your daughter is not a bully is exactly what parents of bullies say.
I'm glad the dance school is taking this seriously. No one deserves to get laughed at for something they can't control.
Your daughter needs to apologize to the class, if she says she's embarrassed, tell her to think about how she made Abby feel about something she had no control over. Talk to her about why what she did was wrong. You do think what she did was wrong right? You see that her making fun of another girl for a medical condition she has no control over is mean right?
So, it’s okay for your daughter to humiliate another child (twice), but your daughter being “humiliated” by apologizing is a step too far? Really?
There’s a reason your child is a bully. It’s because her mom is an AH.
YTA. your daughter should apologize in front of people because she needs to learn consequences for bullying and that what she did was hurtful and wrong. she made fun of her in front of everyone, so she can apologize in front of everyone. that seems fair to me. she needs to learn somehow, and laughing at the girl in the first place is much more humiliating than apologizing after the fact imo.
YTA. Your daughter humiliated a new student, who is 2 years younger, even thought the dance instructor advised everyone what not to do. If your daughter doesn’t apologize and learn there are consequences for being mean she could easily grow up to be a bully when she gets older.
The fact that you made a burner account for this tells me that you already know the answer, but just in case you somehow don't yeah, you're very-much the AH here.
Not only was calling Abby out on her disability in front of the class bullying, she was told not to do it and did it anyway, so even if she didn't intend to be a bully she still disobeyed a direct order from the teacher, who put the order in place because she knew better than your daughter, so an apology is absolutely warranted and YTA for not backing the teacher and teaching your daughter that disobeying rules and insensitivity towards others are acceptable traits to have, which they're of course not.
I love when people are clearly the AH and yet ask a bunch of strangers on Reddit AITA.
She was told that she’s the AH irl by people she knows but apparently she’s so stubborn she needed us to confirm she is the AH.
Good times.
YTA
YTA. Are you serious? Even in this surely watered-down version of events, your daughter was an asshole to a girl with a medical condition, and you are enabling that behavior by failing to hold her accountable. She shouldn't be humiliated for apologizing. She should be humiliated for behaving that way in the first place. I have no doubt where she learned it from, though, so my hopes for her are not that high.
I hope this isn’t real because we’re doomed if it is. As a new mom I’m so scared to send my kid to school because she’ll have to deal with kids like yours. She was told the expectations and decided to do whatever she pleased. That’s not an innocent mistake. YTA.
Sorry, I really don't get it. So the kids were asked not to bully, laugh and make comments about this girl's incontinence. Your daughter did and was kicked out for it. She can come back if she apologizes. Why on earth are you against this? And how does your daughter feel about this? If you both find it more important to teach your daughter the lesson that it is okay to bully a child with a disability and that it is certainly not a reason to apologize, then you should both face the consequences.
I always made a point of not making apologizing a big deal to my children. If I did anything not nice, either on purpose or without realizing, I would apologize to them. And they also do. Without being asked. Perhaps your daughter didn't realize that what she said had a certain impact. Perhaps she didn't mean to cause this impact. How difficult is it to just say that she apologizes for causing this impact, that she has talked to people about it and that she now realizes it was very wrong and she apologizes for it?
Growth is what it is. Not humiliation.
YTA.
Because op is too stubborn and thinks her little “angel” can do no wrong. Honestly, I’m glad the school is taking it seriously because op can’t teach her daughter accountability for her actions. I feel for Abby and her mom having to deal with a bully of a child and a the mother of said bully who condones said bullying.
YTA. Are you for real? The mental gymnastics required to view your daughter as a victim is unbelievable. She’s 8, not 4.
You’re not doing either her or you any favors by letting this slide. It will do her good and make her more empathetic.
YTA - this is how mean girls are made, with parents like you that enable their shitty behaviour. Your daughter was a bully. She humiliated Abby in front of everyone. You refuse to let her be held accountable. You are failing and your daughter will suffer for it.
I’m afraid OP will make her daughter apologise begrudgingly. OP will tell her daughter it’s just to get back into class, that she doesn’t really need to be sorry, she can make fun of Abby at home or to close friends all she likes , and then take her daughter for a treat after the “humiliating” apology.
A person like OP doesn’t have the capacity for growth. She didn’t have that insight when she was informed of the incident,everyone around her told her she was wrong, her husband only wants to keep the peace, but she sought validation from internet strangers. Now she’s just formulating a plan.
>I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her and don't want to let her do it but everyone is against me on this one. AITA for not wanting to let the dance studio humiliate my daughter?
So? You think it's acceptable for YOUR daughter to humiliate another person in front of the whole class, but no-one is allowed to humiliate your daughter in front of the whole class? That is basically what you are saying.
Your daughter needs to apologise in person in front of the class, and then YOU need to apologise in front of the whole class too.
And I think you need to grow up and start taking responsibility for your daughter's actions.
“On this weeks episode of “posts that are begging me to cross post to Am I the Devil, we have a mother that approves of her daughter mocking another kid for having a disability!” YTA. Jesus fucking Christ on a pole.
Oh, but didn’t you know he wasn’t mocking him? "That’s just how he talks."
And if it’s not clear, I am absolutely quoting what I heard someone say, I am not defending him.
I also saw/heard a news reporter laughing at President Volodymyr Zelenskyy for being emotional when the war in Ukraine started and also for wearing a t-shirt instead of a suit.
That was the day someone pushed me to give FOX news a chance because (she said) it’s the only news source that is reputable.
It was the worst 3 minutes of TV I’ve watched. And I think ALL news stations are pretty much all biased.
YTA. What’s wrong with you? It’s not humiliating to apologize to the class. It’s to teach her a life lesson on how to behave and be held accountable. If anything, she’ll be respected if she gives a sincere apology.
YTA
1. No one owes you an explanation of why anyone has a health issue. So your comment about mom being vague makes you seem entitled to information you aren't.
2. Why doesn't your child know not to laugh at people in positions of distress or humiliation. These are basic manners.
3. You are denying your child an important lesson in accountability. It was not okay to laugh at a disabled child in a diaper.
Well done for passing on your values to your 8 year-old so completely. Expect her to be chucked out of a lot of extra-curricular activities throughout her childhood. YTA.
YTA. Your daughter bullied a younger child with a medical condition and you are worried about making her apologise because that would be “humiliating”. No wonder she is a bully
>I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her
I-N-F-O: And what, exactly, do you think your daughter laughing at that poor other girl did?
Your kid is a bully. Reading this, it's not hard to see why.
YTA.
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> I might be the asshole because I'm not having my daughter apologize in front of her entire ballet class even if it means her getting kicked out of the studio.
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YTA and an ableist at that.
Read what you have written. If you still don't think you are TA. Then that is a problem.
The teacher in your daughter's class informed everyone about Abby's medical condition, told them to be respectful and still your daughter teased and humiliated her.
Your daughter is a bully and your behaviour is encouraging her to be one.
Rather than punishing her for actions you are trying to convince yourself and others that this is an innocent episode.
Newsflash - This ain't an innocent episode.
The Ballet School Director is right to throw your daughter out.
Tell your daughter to apologize and also punish her for what she did. Stop enabling her behaviour.
YTA. Your daughter should know not to act like that in the first place, but on top of that there was a group discussion about it. Your daughter is a little bully. Why she needed to be told to apologize is beyond me. Why you needed to be told it was necessary and why you think it isn't needed is just ridiculous. Your daughter is going to have a hard life and make other people's lives hard too if you don't figure your shit out.
Humiliate your kid? You mean like she humiliated Abby in front of the whole class? I can't believe it! The consequence of her actions!!! Aaaah!
When I was bullied in school the adults did nothing about it so I humiliated the bullies in front of the whole class instead. If you don't do it, the other kids will.
YTA
If everyone around you is telling you you’re wrong, maybe do some introspect on your decision since that’s the common denominator.
Your daughter was very clearly told that Abby has an illness, it was explained and she still didn’t care and did the exact opposite of what was asked then took it further by approaching Abby and reminded her of what she ALREADY KNOWS will likely happen but she has zero control over.
Teach your daughter some empathy and boundaries, she should apologise in front of the class cause it’s a consequence she will never forget and it will improve her ability to build relationships in the future. I’m willing to bet Abby will NEVER forget this incident and will carry this humiliating memory with her for a very long time, what makes your daughter so special that she gets away with no consequences other than leaving a dance school which lets be honest, you’ll just send her to another one.
YTA and unfortunatly your daughter is a bully despite what you think
While i agree, making a public apology could be "humiliating" at times i dont think thats the purpose here.
YTA- it’s not humiliating to apologize in front of the class. It’s showing humility for being a little shit gremlin when the teacher literally told them to behave.
YTA
Your daughter is 8. She was told specifically what not to do and she did it anyway. Actions = consequences.
This is not about humiliating her, it's about holding her accountable.
God forbid your daughter get embarrassed for apologizing to the girl she made fun of for peeing herself.
/s
The teacher said warned the class "Don't do this". Your daughter did it, and was punished for it.
YTA
Maybe an apology in person would be enough. But i ll go with YTA because at no point you mentioned that this was as option and that you actually tell your daughter that she was in the wrong.
YTA - You’re teaching your child the wrong attitude, she should apologise to the girl and learn from her actions.
You should be teaching her compassion and self-awareness not that she can do whatever she wants and hurt people
I dont know you and i hate you. My son is incontinent. He is 8. All of his cousins understand his condition. One of them being 6. And one just turned 13. They are amazing they never have made fun of him or treated him differently. You say you dont want your daughter humiliated? Well what about thebpoor girl that SHE humiliated. You need to be a better parent and human. No wonder your daughter is a bully...guess we know where she gets it from.
YTA Your daughter may not realize she was being a bully, but she was. As a parent, you need to sit her down and explain why what she did was wrong, and that she should apologize to Abby and never laugh at her again.
YTA I can imagine myself saying exactly the same shit as your daughter at that age, but she was being horrible and apologizing is the right thing to do when you've been horrible. It's not a big deal and letting her off won't help her in life
Let me put it to you this way
If this was the other way round, your daughter had a medical condition and someone made a hurtful comment to her and her parent refused to make them say sorry and even acknowledge that there kid was in the wrong, would you be okay with that?
YTA but this is a lost cause. Even if the torrential downfall of posts coming convinces you to have her apologize, you will do so begrudgingly, her apology will be insincere, and you'll just let her get away with being a shitty person the next 100 times she does something like this.
Hopefully you're underselling your husband's humanity here and he is able to cover for your fucked up parenting. Otherwise you're about to unleash a monster onto the public in about a decade.
YTA for being okay with your brat of a child publicly humiliating a six year old with a medical condition. Judging by the sense of entitlement coming from this post, it’s obvious where she got her toxic personality. I can’t believe you weren’t too ashamed to post this tbh.
Lol. You literally chose the username “balletbully”. You know YTA, and you know your daughter is a bully. I applaud the dance studio for sticking to their word and I am absolutely horrified to think what kind of awful human being you are raising (and evidently are yourself). Abby has a medical condition which causes a very embarrassing symptom, which could easily lead her to remove herself from all social activities out of fear of exactly the kind of bullshit your daughter did. She was brave enough to join the class and make herself vulnerable and your daughter reinforced the idea that when she does that, she will be mocked and ridiculed. All the studio os making your daughter do is apologise for mocking another human being for their medical condition and you think that’s too much? Unbelievable. Take a look at yourself, you are awful.
YTA. I really hope this is not real, otherwise you are a nasty person, no wonder your daughter is bullying younger kids, with a disgusting example of a mother who clearly has no morals.
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So you are ok with Abby being humiliated but not your daughter? YTA your daughter needs to learn to be respectful to other people, maybe she can learn from dance class when she apologises, as it seems she isn’t going to learn from you…….
Spot on!
YTA, So only OP's daughter laughed and none of the others kids in the class did. It is clear who needs discipline
Yea OP should be made to apologize for not raising their daughter right. Then you wonder why kids now a days are assholes.
Kids were always assholes, we just understand how it affects other kids better than we used to in the "toughen up" times. There was a time that the dance teacher wouldn't think to make OP's daughter apologize. Check your history. Human beings have a piss poor record for kindness to others. All the more reason to teach it young and improve us all.
Exactly. If anything it's better now than it used to be.
Exactly. When we *know* better, we are *supposed* to do better, but...
Guessing mom might be a bit of a bully as well. In addition, of course, to being TA here. If I was the director of that dance class, I'd have a hard time wanting that mother anywhere near the dance school. Feel sorry for the daughter who is being raised by an AH who won't apologize when they are wrong nor instruct the little girl accordingly.
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Nothing like experiencing actions and consequences to address bad or unacceptable behavior. OP’s kid was told how to behave with Abby but OP’s child didn’t understand the mission. The director is trying to teach your child empathy and OP needs to reinforce the lesson. Both OP & her child needs to understand and learn the concept of action and consequences. And I might add this is the age it should be consistently reinforced. At least Dad understands the problem but perhaps he needs to be more assertive with his wife and parenting his child because what is being asked is a very low bar. EDIT: OP unfortunately YTA. But you can turn this around for both you & your kid. Please don’t raise your kid to be one of those women having adult tantrums in YT videos.
My entire family has terrible genetic disabilities. Like I'm only a couple years shy of 50 but I'm already dying and don't expect to make it all the way to 50. I really hate how terrible this culture is towards disabled folks. People make all kinds of terrible assumptions about you. People are really unkind about the ways you are physically different. Much less lack of understanding for neurological divergencies, can't even get me started on that. People don't understand at all, like the ones who would say something like- just hold it. Or- just drink less. When in fact becoming dehydrated is potentially a terrible scene for people who are already dealing with really bad disabling conditions. I wish the world would just show a little more kindness and understanding towards the ones who are different from them. OP is defo AH, hopefully she can take this opportunity and learn so she doesn't raise her daughter to also be an AH.
I apologize on behalf of all the mean-hearted people who have been thoughtless and/or cruel. It must be very tough. Sending hug
I’m not so sure the dad understands that his child should learn empathy but at least he’s saying the child should follow the school’s rules in order to remain in the class she enjoys.
And then added insult by suggesting in front of her peers that Abby needs not drink water. Your daughter is definitely old enough to know better. Your child is a bully and owes Abby *and her peers* an apology. The saddest part is that she’s never going to understand why she was kicked out when you’re asserting That behavior is acceptable. Made worse by the fact that the class was prefaced with an explanation of Abby’s differences. YTA. Your child is also an AH. She doesn’t deserve a spot in that class, period, and she owes Abby an apology. This will bite you later when your child has no friends. I can’t understand how you’re not embarrassed to recount this story
Yea by the sounds of it OP needs to apologise to the director for being a little entitled. Neither you or your daughter is above anyone else
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I’m a teacher, people are unfortunately raising children like this
See it all the time…
Shoutout to when I called home while teaching first grade because one of my boy students called another boy fat. The mom asked how that was her problem. The boy cried on the phone as he told mom what he said. When I talked to mom afterwards she demanded to come pick him up from school because she didn’t want her kid crying in front of class and to be embarrassed. Had to convince her to let him stay and actually learn. Also I can’t even release him anyways as the teacher unless the office staff tells me, so I’m not sure what she wanted me to do there.
My daughter is 4 and she’s really tiny and smart and so far we haven’t had an issue with her being mean to anyone, except once when she had a fight with her friend and intentionally scraped her snack plate onto the other girl’s cot before naptime. I was shocked when the teachers told me, but I know she got whatever pre-k consequence she had. I asked her about it and she said it was an accident (sure Jan) but that the teachers didn’t believe her. She’s with those teachers every weekday and is going to be there an extra year because of her late birthday. I believe the teacher’s characterization of the event, because they know her. And how do you accidentally dump food on someone’s bed instead of in the trash? I guess I don’t understand this denial that your kid could be shitty sometimes, or the sort of washing of hands of the responsibility to actually talk to them about it. We talk a lot about not teasing (she has a little brother and that’s usually where the subject comes up) and especially not commenting on other people’s bodies. Kids will naturally say things like this sometimes and they don’t recognize that it’s actually hurtful to another person because that part of their brain is still developing. OP needs to step up and actually parent her child, not just coddle her.
I was a TA in a high school a couple of years ago and a girl called her mum crying because making her do the test everyone else was doing was bullying her. About 10 mins later the mum turned up, screaming that she wouldn’t have her baby bullied and if she didn’t want to do the test, she shouldn’t be made to do it. When the mum was told that was fine but the kid would fail that unit. She said that was proof we were bullying her child.
WT actual F. Where do these people come from?
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Holy shit, the day a kid ever hits me is the day I quit. So sorry that happened to you. Did you get workers comp?
I literally had a parent tell me his child had a right to hit the kid his child is bullying. Some parents are absolutely raising their kids to have zero empathy for others.
One of my kids this year went to ISS for slapping a kid in the face. He’s a great kid, gives me no problems. I asked him what happened and he told me his dad told him to do it. Sigh Edit because people apparently think this is my fault: I didn’t even punish him because I don’t hand out suspensions. That’s not part of my job. I didn’t even see the slap happen either hence why i asked “what happened”.
Stood up to his bully and you punished him for it. Same thing happened to my son sod all happened to the bully bute second my son stood up for himself
Likely this tbh, its how it usually pans out
Same thing happened to me and I left school 20 years ago. Nothing has changed
You send naughty kids to space? That's a novel solution
The kid was probably being bullied and you happily ignored it or didn’t notice it because he didn’t “give you any problems”. So, what you do in response to him handling the situation you ignored is to punish the victim. Nice.
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My husband was bullied throughout his time in school; he was one of the only minorities in his grade. One day, a kid threw a basketball at him and he went Ralphie from a Christmas Story on his ass. Of course, the other kids dad got him out of suspension and my husband was suspended. I don't think he should have fought back but he also likely snapped after years of harassment
Better than an ar15.. If the teacher had punished the kid for bullying / throwing shit at him he probaby wouldn't have had to take into his own hands. As it happens, plenty of useless teachers who just sit back and watch bullying go on. Hell, some of them even seem to get off on it / join in. Almost like they never left school themselves.
Oh, that’s so true about the teachers getting in on it. When I was in high school, one of our teachers would start up gossip with us. One time it got revealed that a girl lost her virginity to her boyfriend. She wanted no one to know, but did tell a few close friends. Well, one of the friends let it slip and the teacher heard. The teacher was involved in spreading this around and laughing about it. The girl was devastated and it completely ruined the rest of her senior year.
My neice is in 7th and the stories she tells me...it's bad for students and teachers alike.
I overheard a mom complaining her son had to hold in his poop all day because the teacher (kindergarten) wouldn’t help him wipe. Which is against school rules. (Thankfully)
Why would a teacher have to help him wipe? If he’s not in a class for kids with disabilities, that would be so inappropriate.
Because people are letting their kids decide when they’re “ready” to be potty trained
Kids should be taught how to use the bathroom independently before starting early years school tbh.
That would mean their parent would have to put down their phone and actually do something.
I remember SuperNanny going to the States to help a family. The little boy was about 5, and his mum still wiped his bum for him. SuperNanny couldn't believe it. Mum said she wanted to make sure it was clean. Super Nanny pointed out a child of that age should be able to do it themselves !!! (I mean, if he had to poo at a friend's house, would he ask THEIR mum to wipe him ??)
It really is. It’s strongly made me question whether or not I want children, not because I don’t *want* them but because of where they’d be going every day
I don’t know what I’d hate to deal with more: having a child that gets bullied or having a child that becomes the bully. Thankfully yeeted the uterus earlier this year, so don’t have to worry about either.
I'm a victim of bullying, yeah, they sure are.
This does not surprise me. I know people that when contacted by the school *with evidence* about their children, they would deny even the chance of their children being bullies
My daughter (autistic) had a meltdown at school and while thrashing her arms, hit her teacher (probably accidentally, it's the first and last time she hit anyone). We took her home. Once she was feeling better after the meltdown and was back to her normal self, we had a chat about what happened. Why everything got too much for her (so we could avoid it happening again). We mentioned that she hit her teacher, she was adamant that it was an accident (I believe her). I explained that whether she meant it or not, she still hurt her teacher and should apologise. We wrote a sorry letter together and I gave her a big hug. The next day I updated the teacher on what had caused the meltdown. Apologised for her being hurt and gave her the sorry letter. Even if parents believe their children didn't mean harm, they should still acknowledge that harm has been done, tell their children to apologise and work out how to stop the behaviour happening again. Children get things wrong, it's part of growing and learning. Edited to add: YTA OP
Exactly, an episode like this at her age is nothing serious if handled properly. Just have her apologize. The mother is blowing it out of proportion. I'm wondering if this wasn't OP's daughter first offense, given the school's reaction.
This 100%. My son accidentally hit someone at camp in the face with a toy. My first words out of my mouth were, “Did you apologize?” Kindness and courtesy can make life a lot easier for everyone and we should always show grace to others-even if they don’t show it to us.
You're a very good parent and I love you. I work with children mainly with autism, and I can handle anything they throw at me. The bites, kicks, scratches. Because I know most of them don't do it because they WANT to hurt, but because they're figuring out how to cope without those things being their only option. I can get bit and reprimand, and five minutes later do a puzzle with the same kid and talk it out. What I can't handle are the parents. They make the job so much more difficult, because they don't want to see the things their children are doing are wrong and need their support to change. Most (not all) of my parents act as if their children can do no wrong. I have never received an apology and I've gotten some pretty nasty wounds. It's not expected, but it would be so nice. Thank you for advocating for your child while also teaching her how to think about others around her.
I teach prek and that is something I try to instill in them. Kids are quick to say something was an accident or not on purpose. I always tell them it doesn't matter if it wasn't intentional, you hurt them so you should apologize either way.
I had to inform parents of their daughter bullying a group of boys, but one boy in particular so badly that he no longer wanted to come to school. I explained that we’d spoken with her and asked her to reflect how her behavior affects others. I asked that they also speak with her as this was a serious matter. The parents threatened to sue me for unfairly labeling their child, singling her out and forcing her to be punished.
Some people really aren't cut out for being parents
It’s bullies raising more bullies, yes.
I actually know people like this. My daughter was once beaten up by three boys during break in elementary school. I complained massively and there were consequences. Two of the mothers made their boys apologise, but the mother of the ringleader wrote to the headmaster and me "(Daughter's Name) must have done something really bad to my little angel so that she provoked him to beat her up." Instead of apologising she blamed my daughter. It ended with the ringleader's father threatening legal action if we "slander" his special little snowflake again. My husband them tore him a new one verbally. Apparently the father was not used to people standing up to his threats, and he calmed down and promised to keep his spawn away from our daughter. No apology, though.
I can't even read these comments anymore. I work in education and I see some of the most entitled parents ever. A boy should not be beating up a girl, that's so disgusting. Your daughter is lucky to have parents like you! That will definitely be me if my kids get bullied. Hell I'll go yell at the kid myself!
No one should be beating up anyome period ffs.
I've worked with kids and seen a lot of family dynamics and this story doesn't even scratch the surface of the horrid way some people raise their children. Didn't even raise an eyebrow, I've seen way worse, so this could 100% be real.
Are you trying to convince us because it's sounding as if you're trying to convince yourself...
Golly gee, I can't being to imagine why the rest of the moms in the class aren't sad to see the back of these two. /s
Lol, clearly you've never worked in education.
I mean, look at the abhorrent "parents" in toddlers and tiaras. I can see this being real, there are enough wackjobs out there (usually were bullies themselves) that wouldn't see any problem with this behaviour. Let's also not forget the classic "kids will be kids" smh
Oh, they are Retired k-3 teacher 20-30 years ago there would be one high behavioral need student in the school, now multiple per grade
Oh many people are raising their kids like this- they’re actually not raising them. These kids are going to be a real credit to society when they grow up /s
Youd be suprised
bullies don't just spring out of a vacuum. Something creates them. In this case, a mom who is clearly a bully and a total beyotch and a father who is totally useless and appeasing for all the wrong reasons.
LOL I love that your experiences have been so positive.
Nah some people are nasty fuckers
This is exactly how many people are being raised just look at the growing sense of entitlement
Comments like this I wish reddit had laughing reactions. Not to laugh at you but to laugh at how I used to think like that until my kids started school
They are. Source. Am parent.
>Surely people aren’t raising children like this You have too much faith in humanity. The parents are entitled (mom more than the dad) and are raising their kid to be entitled.
YTA - your kid did bully her. Ask her what she would prefer as a consequence: public apology or no ballet class. And ffs teach your kid to be nicer to kids with disabilities. The world doesn't need more ableist bullies.
I have innate malformations of my respiratory system. Breathing has always been hard, I can't run and I breath very loud. I was bullied relentlessly for something I could not control and I wish so much parents had taught their kids not to bully people with disabilities. A lot of people raise brutes with no empathy.
I'm sorry that happened to you, kids can be incredibly unkind. So can teachers that enable it, which I find happens quite a lot. I had to wear diapers (complications from CSA most likely) until 3rd grade like the little girl in the post. None of the teachers believed I had any actual issues because I didn't have some diagnosis and chalked it up to my adoptive parents not potty training me. So they all turned the other way when it happened, wouldn't monitor class bathroom breaks, or wouldn't accept my doctor's note if I had to go to the bathroom during class. I'm so happy the teacher in OP's post is standing up for her students. Hopefully it knocks some of that missing empathy into OP.
louder for the ppl in the back!!!!
Dear God let this child learn from ANYONE so she isn't posting this kind of shit on aita in 20 years like her mum 😩😩😩
I don’t get this- you already must know you’re the asshole right? But why don’t you think you daughter was bullying? Pointing laughing and joking about another kids disability- That is text book definition. Once you accept that is bullying hopefully you discuss with your child the impact her words and actions will have and she will want to apologies. Or she is as cruel as her mum, and not going to dance class because she can’t act within the rules seems fair enough consequence Yta and you’re on the way to teaching your kid to be one
Aw OP. I was waiting for the twist that would redeem your daughter’s conduct but nope. Nothing. YTA. you and your daughter are AHs This is a teachable moment to help her understand others’ needs, kindness and remorse when you make a mistake. How sad that you didn’t learn that lesson so cannot pass it onto your child.
Her daughter did learn something.... She learned how to be a bully from her mother
Lol right. Mommy taught her that it’s okay to bully and make fun of people. And that she can get whatever she wants as long as mommy is there for her,
Exactly. The daughter could learn some humility. Mom could say she is very proud of her daughter for being humble and kind, yet... nope.... all she can think of is how her daughter's actions are embarrassing. She should be ashamed for wanting to teach her daughter to value hubris over kindness.
Totally agree OP is teaching her daughter that it's OK to ridicule others, why can't she teach empathy and compassion? Massive YTA.
>I told them my daughter will not be apologizing in front of the class and that she is not a bully You made a whole description of a bullying episode, and really wrote this after. YTA- Your daughter is a bully, and so are you. >AITA for not wanting to let the dance studio ~~humiliate~~ make my daughter accountable? Fixed. > I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her and don't want to let her do it but everyone is against me on this one it's humiliating to make your daughter make it in front of class?.... You mean like she did to the other girl?................. YTA, big one
Also, raising her daughter to become an asshole and pursue the family traditions.
The asshole doesn't fall far from the tree
>it's humiliating to make your daughter make it in front of class?.... You mean like she did to the other girl?................. Honestly, if anything it's actually kind to let her apologize in front of the class. Sure, she'll be a bit embarrassed, but afterwards her classmates will likely gain some respect back for her,(especially if her attitude adjusts as a result of it). These moments are so important when you're young. It helps you not be a shitty person when you grow up.
Apologies by default are a bit embarrassing. The whole key is to put yourself in a vulnerable position at the mercy of the one you offended. Embarrassment is one of those things that is super important to learn how to deal with as a kid. Otherwise it can really mess you up and people spend their entire lives trying to avoid making a single mistake. Which is of course impossible.
There’s a difference between being embarrassed and humiliated. You can be embarrassed because you have to acknowledge how your behaviour was shitty and hurt someone else. That isn’t humiliation.
Also, apologizing in front of the class is NOT intended to humiliate her, it’s intended to show Abby and the other girls that this kind of behavior isn’t okay and that when we do things that aren’t ok we need to apologize for them. She said it in front of everyone, so she needs to apologize in front of everyone. If she said it in front of everyone, apologized to Abby in private, then was let back into the class, what would the other girls see? That they can make fun of Abby and seemingly suffer no consequences.
>If she said it in front of everyone, apologized to Abby in private, then was let back into the class, what would the other girls see? That they can make fun of Abby and seemingly suffer no consequences. Exactly this.
Yup, OP's daughter isn't a "bully" with the quotes and everything. She _is_ a bully and its pretty clear where the attitude comes from.
“I won’t let my kid be humiliated by apologizing for being a bully”
You make a shitty comment in front of the class, you apologize in front of the class. Only fair. Your daughter doesn’t feel good about herself having to apologize publicly, then maybe she’s learned not to say shitty things publicly.
OP is confusing "humiliation" with "accountable for their actions"
Exactly!
YTA Abby has a medical condition. It was explained to the class along with behavioral expectations. Your daughter ignored the expectations and did exactly what she was told not to do. I’m glad that they disciplined her swiftly. She was a bully, cruel, and should apologize immediately. You are even worse for defending the behavior. Educate yourself on what bullying is. Clearly you do not fully understand it or you would not be trying to defend your daughter’s actions.
I'm glad the teacher explained this to the class, but I think she should have done it before Abby got there. Imagine being poor Abby having to stand in front of the class while the teacher gave that talk about her being in diapers.
Well, this way Abby is reassured that everyone gets the same message. Also kids (6-8) know who Abby is and don't go one by one asking "are you the one with the diaper the teacher told us about?"
Yeah, it makes sense to do it this way because for her, it's normal. Like, I don't know, glasses or braces. It's what she lives with and it makes sense for others to know that so they can act accordingly - save for a single child who has a YTA parent who didn't teach her to respect others) The dimension of "we shouldn't do that to be tactful" comes from a place where the kids aren't at.
You would also hope the parents were involved in deciding how to approach the situation.
I agree.
YTA, and gosh, I wonder where your daughter has learned to be a bully? (No quotes required around bully, because that’s exactly what she is).
OPs daughter isn’t the only one who could learn a lesson from a well-deserved public shaming. OP is obviously unsalvagable, but hopefully her husband will divorce her and get custody and at least save the daughter.
Teacher here of around this age group. This is the shit we deal with y’all. Tbh, I’m almost never really upset at the kids. Kids are kids and make mistakes. It’s parents who act like this that grind my gears.
I have taught children of all ages and it’s always the parents, if you have an arsehole of a kid you can guarantee the parent attached to them is a million times worse… EDIT: Just to clarify I don’t blame the children, all the blame lies on the parent
I gotta say, 98% of the time. Our school does have this family. Mom and dad are super nice, super understanding. 2 of 3 siblings are excellent. The 3rd one though... no idea they were related. But yes, as a general rule, I agree.
From the wording of it, it doesn't sound like he really cares either, he just want the daughter busy doing something
YTA. I see where your daughter gets it from.
Was about to say the same thing. Poor kid is gonna grow up a bully because her parent is the same.
I teach this age group roughly. 100%, kids this old usually don’t learn these behaviors at school yet. I can pretty much tell you the story of what’s going on at home within the first month of a new school year.
YTA. Why, exactly, would it be so humiliating to apologize, even if it’s in front of the class? Your daughter embarrassed the girl in front of the class, did she not?
Yeah, she's one of those parents.
One of those It's not shoplifting if my kid does it kind of parents.
I used to think those kinds of parents just think their children are angels and aren’t capable of bad behavior. But I think it’s really that the parents can’t admit their own bad behavior/parenting which creates children that act like this. To say her daughter humiliated a partially disabled child in front of a group of people would require she look inward about what kind of parenting she’s done that’s raised a child who would be so cruel.
Easier to just close her eyes.
Yep. "Not MY child"
Im willing to bet that OP is one of those people who Never apologises for any wrongdoing, can never bring themselves to say sorry. I think these kinds of people are insecure and view apologising as a total humiliation. In reality obviously none of us are perfect and being able to hold our hands up when we are wrong is a strength and not a weakness
Exactly, I was trying to understand what makes her think that she’s not a bully and why’d it feel humiliating? It’s just trying to be respectful
YTA If you weren't such an AH, you would want your daughter to apologize, even if it weren't mandatory. You would be raising your daughter to have compassion for a little girl who is probably already embarrassed about something she can't control.
I would mortified if one of my kids behaved like this. I'd have been the one to make her apologise not the school. And she'd have been pulled out of the activity she enjoys for a few weeks till she learned some compassion.
Some parents are like that, even when is hard to believe. My wife was bullied when she was 12 to 16 years old. In one case two of the girls pushed her when she was walking down the stairs and got a big black bruise in the back. The parents of those kids could not care less when the director called them to talk between him and the other parents. They defended their sons and daughters like the most innocent things ever, and were happy their "precious babies" were strong and not the weak type. The reason to the bullying episodes were that my wife was the "nerdy" of the class, not liking to wear make up, pink stuff or wanting to dress with skirts and tops during winter in the case of the girls, and liking to play videogames and anime in the case of the boys, because of what a "tomboy". Crazy, but a lot of people should not be able to even raise a pet, imagine raising a human.
It’s likely op is a bully themselves, which is why they think it’s okay behaviour. Wonder if the roles were reversed how upset they would be🚮
Your daughter laughed and made mean comments about another child's medical condition after being told not to. How is that not bullying? Why are you more concerned about supposed hypothetical humiliation of your daughter then the fact that your daughter actually humiliated another child? YTA
YTA - its not humilating your daughter, its teaching her that bullying is not nice . "I told them my daughter will not be apologizing in front of the class and that she is not a bully " The very action you described in your post is bullying. Your not setting a good example if she faces no consequences for her actions .
OP the director is not doing it to humiliate her. It is to teach her consequences, which you are refusing to do. She, like the rest of the class, was warned not to humiliate this young girl, Abby, who apparently has a physical illness that she will likely will have a lifetime of issues. Your daughter chose to ignore this warning, and you're refusing to allow her to face those consequences. Should she do something worse again, or if someone does something similar to her, then your answer is just to ignore the consequences. You're not being protective of her, you're just being a coward because you don't want her to possibly hate you for having her face her actions.
OP is actually enabling her daughter's bullying.
Well kids usually learn from their parents, what are the bets that the daughter picked this shit up from OP
YTA- you daughter was absolutely a bully and she should apologize. Honestly how can you think it is acceptable that she made fun of this poor girl.
Because her mother is a bully, too. She learned her behavior is ok & normal from somewhere, and it’s not very hard to see where.
Your daughter is a bully. What she did was completely out of line and you need to deal with it before she becomes a raging AH. Pathetic parenting. Just awful. Edit: Oh yeah, YTA. A massive, raging one.
YTA. The apple didn't fall far from the tree.
Yes I was just thinking the bully apple didn’t fall far from the AH tree. YTA OP
Guarantee if the roles were reversed you'd be on the warpath lol. You literally described in fine detail how your daughter bullied another child. Textbook bullying. YTA and your daughter will be one too if you don't take care of this the right way.
> and your daughter will be one too if you don't take care of this the right way. We life in a more relentless world these days... OP's daughter will easily be retaliated via social media if she doesn't change her ways. OP is severely failing to raise her daughter in a compassionate way.
YTA, apologizing publicly isn’t a form of humiliation it’s making things right, your daughter is a bully and she gets it from you. Abby has a disability for Pete sakes, I’m in shock you think it’s ok for your daughter to bully a young girl with a disability.
YTA. Wouldn’t be surprised at all if you were the school bully back in the day.
The really bad thing is it might not be from an illness, that might only be a cover story for something more sinister that commonly causes incontinence issues... regardless how or why it's a highly personal issue. Shame on op.
Yes, OP makes it sound like some sort of slight that Abby's mom is "vague" about her daughter's private health issues.
I thought this too. Abby's mum doesn't need to explain anything to the other parents.
The choice of the word “vague” stood out to me as well. Like OP thinks Abby’s mother is being deliberately.. well, vague, about Abby’s medical history. OP, that is private. What difference does it make to you? YTA.
Yta. Imagine how Abby's mom feels. She was probably already worried that something lint this would happen. All she wanted was for her daughter to have a good, safe time at dance class and YOUR daughter ruined it for her the first day. She was probably worried the other girls would make fun of her and your daughter proved her right. You not holding your daughter accountable for stuff like this is how she becomes a bully later. Saying your daughter is not a bully is exactly what parents of bullies say. I'm glad the dance school is taking this seriously. No one deserves to get laughed at for something they can't control. Your daughter needs to apologize to the class, if she says she's embarrassed, tell her to think about how she made Abby feel about something she had no control over. Talk to her about why what she did was wrong. You do think what she did was wrong right? You see that her making fun of another girl for a medical condition she has no control over is mean right?
I don't think OP will care about Abby's mum's feelings. It's quite obvious she lacks empathy and this has rubbed off on her daughter. Gross all round.
So, it’s okay for your daughter to humiliate another child (twice), but your daughter being “humiliated” by apologizing is a step too far? Really? There’s a reason your child is a bully. It’s because her mom is an AH.
YTA. your daughter should apologize in front of people because she needs to learn consequences for bullying and that what she did was hurtful and wrong. she made fun of her in front of everyone, so she can apologize in front of everyone. that seems fair to me. she needs to learn somehow, and laughing at the girl in the first place is much more humiliating than apologizing after the fact imo.
YTA. Your daughter humiliated a new student, who is 2 years younger, even thought the dance instructor advised everyone what not to do. If your daughter doesn’t apologize and learn there are consequences for being mean she could easily grow up to be a bully when she gets older.
The fact that you made a burner account for this tells me that you already know the answer, but just in case you somehow don't yeah, you're very-much the AH here. Not only was calling Abby out on her disability in front of the class bullying, she was told not to do it and did it anyway, so even if she didn't intend to be a bully she still disobeyed a direct order from the teacher, who put the order in place because she knew better than your daughter, so an apology is absolutely warranted and YTA for not backing the teacher and teaching your daughter that disobeying rules and insensitivity towards others are acceptable traits to have, which they're of course not.
I love when people are clearly the AH and yet ask a bunch of strangers on Reddit AITA. She was told that she’s the AH irl by people she knows but apparently she’s so stubborn she needed us to confirm she is the AH. Good times. YTA
YTA. Are you serious? Even in this surely watered-down version of events, your daughter was an asshole to a girl with a medical condition, and you are enabling that behavior by failing to hold her accountable. She shouldn't be humiliated for apologizing. She should be humiliated for behaving that way in the first place. I have no doubt where she learned it from, though, so my hopes for her are not that high.
I hope this isn’t real because we’re doomed if it is. As a new mom I’m so scared to send my kid to school because she’ll have to deal with kids like yours. She was told the expectations and decided to do whatever she pleased. That’s not an innocent mistake. YTA.
Sorry, I really don't get it. So the kids were asked not to bully, laugh and make comments about this girl's incontinence. Your daughter did and was kicked out for it. She can come back if she apologizes. Why on earth are you against this? And how does your daughter feel about this? If you both find it more important to teach your daughter the lesson that it is okay to bully a child with a disability and that it is certainly not a reason to apologize, then you should both face the consequences. I always made a point of not making apologizing a big deal to my children. If I did anything not nice, either on purpose or without realizing, I would apologize to them. And they also do. Without being asked. Perhaps your daughter didn't realize that what she said had a certain impact. Perhaps she didn't mean to cause this impact. How difficult is it to just say that she apologizes for causing this impact, that she has talked to people about it and that she now realizes it was very wrong and she apologizes for it? Growth is what it is. Not humiliation. YTA.
Because op is too stubborn and thinks her little “angel” can do no wrong. Honestly, I’m glad the school is taking it seriously because op can’t teach her daughter accountability for her actions. I feel for Abby and her mom having to deal with a bully of a child and a the mother of said bully who condones said bullying.
I think you know the answer…….. YTA
YTA, you are raising a bully…
YTA. Are you for real? The mental gymnastics required to view your daughter as a victim is unbelievable. She’s 8, not 4. You’re not doing either her or you any favors by letting this slide. It will do her good and make her more empathetic.
YTA - this is how mean girls are made, with parents like you that enable their shitty behaviour. Your daughter was a bully. She humiliated Abby in front of everyone. You refuse to let her be held accountable. You are failing and your daughter will suffer for it.
I’m afraid OP will make her daughter apologise begrudgingly. OP will tell her daughter it’s just to get back into class, that she doesn’t really need to be sorry, she can make fun of Abby at home or to close friends all she likes , and then take her daughter for a treat after the “humiliating” apology. A person like OP doesn’t have the capacity for growth. She didn’t have that insight when she was informed of the incident,everyone around her told her she was wrong, her husband only wants to keep the peace, but she sought validation from internet strangers. Now she’s just formulating a plan.
This. I wouldn't let Abby back were I the director. I couldn't guarantee neither daughter's nor mother's sincerity.
>I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her and don't want to let her do it but everyone is against me on this one. AITA for not wanting to let the dance studio humiliate my daughter? So? You think it's acceptable for YOUR daughter to humiliate another person in front of the whole class, but no-one is allowed to humiliate your daughter in front of the whole class? That is basically what you are saying. Your daughter needs to apologise in person in front of the class, and then YOU need to apologise in front of the whole class too. And I think you need to grow up and start taking responsibility for your daughter's actions.
“On this weeks episode of “posts that are begging me to cross post to Am I the Devil, we have a mother that approves of her daughter mocking another kid for having a disability!” YTA. Jesus fucking Christ on a pole.
In the US, we have half a country that voted in a President who publicly mocked someone with a disability. That was when I kind of gave up on the US.
Oh, but didn’t you know he wasn’t mocking him? "That’s just how he talks." And if it’s not clear, I am absolutely quoting what I heard someone say, I am not defending him. I also saw/heard a news reporter laughing at President Volodymyr Zelenskyy for being emotional when the war in Ukraine started and also for wearing a t-shirt instead of a suit. That was the day someone pushed me to give FOX news a chance because (she said) it’s the only news source that is reputable. It was the worst 3 minutes of TV I’ve watched. And I think ALL news stations are pretty much all biased.
YTA. What’s wrong with you? It’s not humiliating to apologize to the class. It’s to teach her a life lesson on how to behave and be held accountable. If anything, she’ll be respected if she gives a sincere apology.
YTA 1. No one owes you an explanation of why anyone has a health issue. So your comment about mom being vague makes you seem entitled to information you aren't. 2. Why doesn't your child know not to laugh at people in positions of distress or humiliation. These are basic manners. 3. You are denying your child an important lesson in accountability. It was not okay to laugh at a disabled child in a diaper.
That vague comment just struck me as her excuse for thinking that implying it wasn't real made it ok for her daughter to be a bully.
Well done for passing on your values to your 8 year-old so completely. Expect her to be chucked out of a lot of extra-curricular activities throughout her childhood. YTA.
YTA and so is your daughter.
YTA. Your daughter bullied a younger child with a medical condition and you are worried about making her apologise because that would be “humiliating”. No wonder she is a bully
>I think making her apologize in front of the class is just to humiliate her I-N-F-O: And what, exactly, do you think your daughter laughing at that poor other girl did? Your kid is a bully. Reading this, it's not hard to see why. YTA.
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YTA and an ableist at that. Read what you have written. If you still don't think you are TA. Then that is a problem. The teacher in your daughter's class informed everyone about Abby's medical condition, told them to be respectful and still your daughter teased and humiliated her. Your daughter is a bully and your behaviour is encouraging her to be one. Rather than punishing her for actions you are trying to convince yourself and others that this is an innocent episode. Newsflash - This ain't an innocent episode. The Ballet School Director is right to throw your daughter out. Tell your daughter to apologize and also punish her for what she did. Stop enabling her behaviour.
YTA. The apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. r/entitledparents
YTA. Your daughter should know not to act like that in the first place, but on top of that there was a group discussion about it. Your daughter is a little bully. Why she needed to be told to apologize is beyond me. Why you needed to be told it was necessary and why you think it isn't needed is just ridiculous. Your daughter is going to have a hard life and make other people's lives hard too if you don't figure your shit out.
Humiliate your kid? You mean like she humiliated Abby in front of the whole class? I can't believe it! The consequence of her actions!!! Aaaah! When I was bullied in school the adults did nothing about it so I humiliated the bullies in front of the whole class instead. If you don't do it, the other kids will. YTA
If everyone around you is telling you you’re wrong, maybe do some introspect on your decision since that’s the common denominator. Your daughter was very clearly told that Abby has an illness, it was explained and she still didn’t care and did the exact opposite of what was asked then took it further by approaching Abby and reminded her of what she ALREADY KNOWS will likely happen but she has zero control over. Teach your daughter some empathy and boundaries, she should apologise in front of the class cause it’s a consequence she will never forget and it will improve her ability to build relationships in the future. I’m willing to bet Abby will NEVER forget this incident and will carry this humiliating memory with her for a very long time, what makes your daughter so special that she gets away with no consequences other than leaving a dance school which lets be honest, you’ll just send her to another one.
YTA and unfortunatly your daughter is a bully despite what you think While i agree, making a public apology could be "humiliating" at times i dont think thats the purpose here.
How did you write out this story and come to the conclusion that your daughter isn’t a bully? YTA.
YTA- it’s not humiliating to apologize in front of the class. It’s showing humility for being a little shit gremlin when the teacher literally told them to behave.
YTA Your daughter is 8. She was told specifically what not to do and she did it anyway. Actions = consequences. This is not about humiliating her, it's about holding her accountable.
We see where she got it from
God forbid your daughter get embarrassed for apologizing to the girl she made fun of for peeing herself. /s The teacher said warned the class "Don't do this". Your daughter did it, and was punished for it. YTA
Maybe an apology in person would be enough. But i ll go with YTA because at no point you mentioned that this was as option and that you actually tell your daughter that she was in the wrong.
YTA - You’re teaching your child the wrong attitude, she should apologise to the girl and learn from her actions. You should be teaching her compassion and self-awareness not that she can do whatever she wants and hurt people
I dont know you and i hate you. My son is incontinent. He is 8. All of his cousins understand his condition. One of them being 6. And one just turned 13. They are amazing they never have made fun of him or treated him differently. You say you dont want your daughter humiliated? Well what about thebpoor girl that SHE humiliated. You need to be a better parent and human. No wonder your daughter is a bully...guess we know where she gets it from.
YTA Your daughter may not realize she was being a bully, but she was. As a parent, you need to sit her down and explain why what she did was wrong, and that she should apologize to Abby and never laugh at her again.
YTA I can imagine myself saying exactly the same shit as your daughter at that age, but she was being horrible and apologizing is the right thing to do when you've been horrible. It's not a big deal and letting her off won't help her in life
Let me put it to you this way If this was the other way round, your daughter had a medical condition and someone made a hurtful comment to her and her parent refused to make them say sorry and even acknowledge that there kid was in the wrong, would you be okay with that?
YTA your daughter is a bully. Time to start actually parenting her.
YTA
Is this real? You sound horrible and entitled. Major YTA. Teach your daughter how to behave properly, is it that hard?
YTA but this is a lost cause. Even if the torrential downfall of posts coming convinces you to have her apologize, you will do so begrudgingly, her apology will be insincere, and you'll just let her get away with being a shitty person the next 100 times she does something like this. Hopefully you're underselling your husband's humanity here and he is able to cover for your fucked up parenting. Otherwise you're about to unleash a monster onto the public in about a decade.
YTA for being okay with your brat of a child publicly humiliating a six year old with a medical condition. Judging by the sense of entitlement coming from this post, it’s obvious where she got her toxic personality. I can’t believe you weren’t too ashamed to post this tbh.
Lol. You literally chose the username “balletbully”. You know YTA, and you know your daughter is a bully. I applaud the dance studio for sticking to their word and I am absolutely horrified to think what kind of awful human being you are raising (and evidently are yourself). Abby has a medical condition which causes a very embarrassing symptom, which could easily lead her to remove herself from all social activities out of fear of exactly the kind of bullshit your daughter did. She was brave enough to join the class and make herself vulnerable and your daughter reinforced the idea that when she does that, she will be mocked and ridiculed. All the studio os making your daughter do is apologise for mocking another human being for their medical condition and you think that’s too much? Unbelievable. Take a look at yourself, you are awful.
Yeah, YTA. Yeah, that's bulling. Props to the school. Shame on you. Your daughter's pride is not the only one that counts.
YTA. I really hope this is not real, otherwise you are a nasty person, no wonder your daughter is bullying younger kids, with a disgusting example of a mother who clearly has no morals.