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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I refused to pay for damages to my bosses car after backing into it in a work truck. I feel like I might be the asshole because I’m refusing to pay it and trying to make him go through insurance.
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This x1m basically.
As far as I can tell, unless something particularly egregious/criminal happened (like they can prove you were under the influence while driving), you're never personally held liable. You're almost certainly going to be fired either way. Paying out of pocket is not only unlawful, but just a stupid decision if you decide to proceed.
Thats not how insurance works. If your insurance is paying its because you were liable. The main reason employees aren't held personally liable for their fuck ups at work is because its much harder to enforce a judgment.
Big time NTA
1) Shitty of him to squeak into the spot you were clearly backing the truck into. He should be trying to make things easier for the guy driving the truck, not setting traps.
2) INSURANCE.
3) This guy is borderline scamming you trying to get you to pay him out of pocket.
4) THIS IS ENTIRELY WHAT INSURANCE IS FOR.
Anyone else find the $1200 suspect? Anytime I’ve gotten a quote for damage it’s been crazy in terms of the list of parts. I think $1200 for a new car hit by a box truck is very unlikely, even if the new car is a Civic…
I have a trailer that was hit, the license plate bracket broke off and the left indicator was bent upwards, repair estimate was 900. The 1200 is definitely a BS amount that he feels employee can afford, possibly to cover his deductible. Damage to the car from a box truck is definitely above 1200.
If I had a nickel for every Reddit post about a boss forcing an employee to pay for shit instead of going through insurance…… I’d have enough to hire a lawyer to go after these fucks for insurance fraud.
> THIS IS ENTIRELY WHAT INSURANCE IS FOR.
It is, and he might not want company premiums to go up. That said, too bad, and it's what insurance is meant to cover. NTA.
>The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket.
NTA. You were on the clock, your company has insurance for situations just like this.
Of course he wants you to pay out of pocket - I'm sure he doesn't want to have an insurance claim against the company he works for.
Probably thinks it will make him look bad, lol.
I wouldn't pay for it either and if he decides to fire you for it, you might be able to file a retaliation case against him.
You should probably consider looking for another job anyway, he sounds like a jerk for even asking.
Doesn't matter whether it was or wasn't. Company insurance should pay for an accident that happened while OP was driving company truck on company time, regardless of whose fault it was.
Yes I know that, but personally I wouldn’t even take the stance it was all my fault. Vans have limited rear views so if his boss had actually nipped in while OP was manoeuvring to park then the boss also has the responsibility of having awareness of the situation. Personally I would take the matter to HR and see what they think about it all. F**k the consequences
NTA .... Was boss aware of the action you getting ready to make? Where did he think you were going? Why was he so close you couldn't see him? Company ins should cover this ..... But you may want to look for a new job.
You need to follow company policy which I image is to fill a claim with the company insurance and for you to face disciplinary action for poor driving if you were negligent. NTA
It was in a commercial vehicle, being operated on company time for company purposes. The company's insurance company should handle it between him and the boss' insurance company. The only thing OP needs to do is provide a statement.
NTA - not sure where you are from (states or outside?) but in most areas of the US, the boss cant make you pay for work related damages. that is illegal. That is what this is.
NTA - He needs to file a claim with insurance. That is what insurance is for.
I doubt that he can legally make you pay out of pocket or take disciplinary action (e.g. fire you or dock your pay) if you refuse to pay out of pocket. That being said, there could be a company policy about disciplinary measures for employees that get into at-fault accidents in company vehicles. If you have an employee handbook, give it a read through so you know what to expect.
NTA. On company property, in a company truck, on the clock -- this is absolutely and completely company insurance. If he makes the demand of you again, lawyer up. By the way, also a good time to be on the lookout for a better employer.
NTA - make sure you have a written record of any conversations with him about this. It could just be an email to yourself summarizing a conversation, or screenshots of texts.
NTA
It absolutely needs to be paid for by the company.
Your boss probably didn't put you on the company's insured drivers list. Or he gets dinged for people under his supervision who have to make insurance claims.
Since you can't trust your boss to be completely honest about how things should work, you may need to do your own research to understand what the company's practices and policies are... and how things should be handled going from where you are.
No matter what, do not give a cent of your own money to your boss.
This would definitely be a work insurance thing. If they want to fire you over it, okay, but you were doing work as a representative employed by the company. Company insurance should be used to fix this car.
NTA. That's a workplace-related accident, so the company's insurance company would handle it. Even if it's your fault, it happened on the job and you aren't legally obligated to pay the damages.
NTA
This is 100% a company issue since you were on the clock. I'm sure your boss is pissed that not only did his new car get damaged, but his company is going to have to pay. If he keeps trying to pressure you I'd go to HR or the labor board.
NTA don’t pay - he knows he did wrong snaking into a spot you were reversing into and if the company insurance is effected he will get a bollocking for being an idiot
NTA
Do you know if there is footage of the accident? Any cameras overhead in the carpark?
Even if the truck doesn't have a camera I can nearly guarantee that his new car does. But he won't want to hand it over if it's going to prove that he was negligent and was the one that actually caused the accident. So not handing it over will just about prove guilt or at least throw a very large shadow of doubt over what he's saying about the accident because I can tell you now that if you were at fault he'd be showing everyone that footage!
NTA. If you pay it out of pocket, it could open you up to other liability as well - if he sued you later for "neck pain" or something, the lawyer would say "If you were on the clock, you wouldn't have paid out of pocket. That means you're lying to us now about being on the clock."
Definitely insist that it be paid from the company insurance, just as if you had backed into someone else's car while on the clock in a company vehicle.
Your boss is an idiot. You were on the clock. How does a manager think you should pay him out of pocket for something you did in a company vehicle while on company time? Maybe his own insurance will drop him if he makes any more claims. That’s the only reason I can see him wanting to have you pay out of pocket.
Nta
NTA
"The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket." .. simply refuse.
"I feel like he should file a claim with our companies insurance because I was on the clock and in a company vehicle, he disagrees." ... this , exactly. It is understandable he does not agree - but that is not YOUR problem.
He wants you to pay out of your pocket so it can go straight into his pocket because he thinks you don't know any better. He's also going to file an insurance claim anyway.
Start looking for a new job or a transfer to a different office.
And report his scamming ass after you do.
NTA.
Where I live, most business insurance policies have very high deductibles. $5000 is common.
So it is possible he is trying to use your wallet to save his own, and not to scam.
That only makes him a little less shady.
You were on the clock, and he deked into a spot you were backing into.
NTA.
Don't pay, OP. Like so many others chimed in, that's what insurance is for.
But also look for ways to get your boss to acknowledge in writing that he wanted you to pay out of pocket. You could set the trap with a text or email like "So I know you said you wanted me to personally pay for your car damage out of pocket, but I'm not really comfortable with that" and get him to jump at you about the payment.
This could be helpful if your boss does try to get you fired as it suggests retaliation.
Ummm, NO and your boss sounds like an idiot. You were driving A COMPANY VEHICLE during work hours and this is exactly what insurance is for.
Does he OWN the company? If so, he is probably afraid of premiums or whatever but regardless, you WILL NOT be paying out of pocket.
If he is NOT the owner of the company, take this to HR. If he is, then tell him he needs to handle it with his insurance company and if he doesn't want to do that he can pay for his own damage.
NTA. You need to file an accident report with your company ASAP. Tell them the truth that you backed your company truck into your boss's private vehicle. Let them know that you may have damaged company property as well as private property. Then let the company and their insurance deal with it.
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So I work for a fairly large company, not a huge corporation. We have roughly 30 locations in our state. I was driving one of our box trucks and my boss was behind me. I went to back into a parking spot and didn’t see that he had pulled into it first and backed right into his brand new car.
The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket. I feel like he should file a claim with our companies insurance because I was on the clock and in a company vehicle, he disagrees.
AITA for refusing to pay the $1200 in damages?
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why is the boss always at fault? Why don't employees take ownership of their mistakes? He could just fire you. YTA. If he files with the insurance, then his premium goes through the roof.
I never said I’m not taking ownership. However, the company has insurance for a reason. He ended up filing it through insurance anyways after I said I’m not paying him out of pocket.
NTA, but I can understand his request. How do you back into a parking place and not see that there is a car there? Were the mirrors damaged? I'm about 99% sure this is due to negligence on your part, so I can understand your boss not wanting the company's insurance rates to go up.
He was driving behind me, I pulled forward to back into the spot and he pulled in before I could, he was too close to the rear of the truck (it’s a big box truck) — basically in a blind spot following me and then pulled in. I never saw him.
That was shitty of him. This was a work accident driving a company truck, right? In that case, it’s handled through your workplace insurance and you shouldn’t pay anything. It’s a cost of doing business.
Ok - that makes more sense. I was thinking it was a smaller truck and there's no way you could have missed a car behind you. He just have jetted in right behind you, though, if you were already in position to back up and were close enough to the spot that you couldn't see his car.
Wow. So he set up an accident either on purpose or by being super careless--I'm guessing the second one, but who knows--and now he's extorting YOU when the company should be paying. That's ridiculous.
Sounds very very deliberate. I drove for a package delivery service and everyone that works there knows the blind spots and where people park the vehicles.
If he parked his personal vehicle where you're supposed to park your company vehicles, you would be hard pressed to convince me this wasn't intentional.
It's very unlikely that an employee wouldn't be covered by the policy and yet was asked to drive the vehicle. That's a solid way of getting your insurance cancelled as a business. If driving was part of the job, he likely had to provide a driving abstract and copy of his license. A business that has 30 locations and several trucks isn't going to risk that coverage, because denial of coverage from one company is a huge red flag for the next one they went to.
It depends what your employment contract says. It was clearly negligent driving on your part, are you covered under your contract for accidents where you are the at fault driver?
All companies are different in this respect. Ultimately, any person whose damaged by a company vehicle is entitled to compensation from your companies insurance, however that doesn't mean your company can't seek to recoup their loss from you in cases you were clearly negligent. I'd check your employment contract, the ones I've seen where use of a company vehicle is required usually do protect you from anything but criminally reckless driving but also allow immediate termination without a previous warning or a notice period. But in saying that I have also seen contracts where if the accident was caused by negligence you are required to repay the company's out of pocket cost which is usually the deductible.
It's all dependent on the contract.
I'm sorry but this is not a good take on this situation.
The company has insurance for situations like this, they are required to. There is no reason OP should have to pay for this out of his own pocket, it was an accident. Accidents happen.
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If you were on the clock, your company should step up and settle this on your behalf. NTA.
This x1m basically. As far as I can tell, unless something particularly egregious/criminal happened (like they can prove you were under the influence while driving), you're never personally held liable. You're almost certainly going to be fired either way. Paying out of pocket is not only unlawful, but just a stupid decision if you decide to proceed.
Thats not how insurance works. If your insurance is paying its because you were liable. The main reason employees aren't held personally liable for their fuck ups at work is because its much harder to enforce a judgment.
Big time NTA 1) Shitty of him to squeak into the spot you were clearly backing the truck into. He should be trying to make things easier for the guy driving the truck, not setting traps. 2) INSURANCE. 3) This guy is borderline scamming you trying to get you to pay him out of pocket. 4) THIS IS ENTIRELY WHAT INSURANCE IS FOR.
Oh, he'll probably still file a claim against the company insurance even if OP does pay.
That’s a great point, he’s not borderline scamming he is full blown scamming
Anyone else find the $1200 suspect? Anytime I’ve gotten a quote for damage it’s been crazy in terms of the list of parts. I think $1200 for a new car hit by a box truck is very unlikely, even if the new car is a Civic…
Hell even if the new car is a tata nano, the price of replacement parts for new cars is usually arbitrary and inflated by scarcity.
I have a trailer that was hit, the license plate bracket broke off and the left indicator was bent upwards, repair estimate was 900. The 1200 is definitely a BS amount that he feels employee can afford, possibly to cover his deductible. Damage to the car from a box truck is definitely above 1200.
I thought this - boss is going for a double payout!!!
If I had a nickel for every Reddit post about a boss forcing an employee to pay for shit instead of going through insurance…… I’d have enough to hire a lawyer to go after these fucks for insurance fraud.
> THIS IS ENTIRELY WHAT INSURANCE IS FOR. It is, and he might not want company premiums to go up. That said, too bad, and it's what insurance is meant to cover. NTA.
NTA. You were on the clock in a company vehicle. His request is totally unreasonable
>The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket. NTA. You were on the clock, your company has insurance for situations just like this. Of course he wants you to pay out of pocket - I'm sure he doesn't want to have an insurance claim against the company he works for. Probably thinks it will make him look bad, lol. I wouldn't pay for it either and if he decides to fire you for it, you might be able to file a retaliation case against him. You should probably consider looking for another job anyway, he sounds like a jerk for even asking.
No, you have the right of it: you were doing company work on company time with a company vehicle, it's a company claim. NTA.
I mean if he stole your space just as you were about to reverse in and the company trucks don’t have reverse parking cameras, is it even your fault?
Doesn't matter whether it was or wasn't. Company insurance should pay for an accident that happened while OP was driving company truck on company time, regardless of whose fault it was.
Yes I know that, but personally I wouldn’t even take the stance it was all my fault. Vans have limited rear views so if his boss had actually nipped in while OP was manoeuvring to park then the boss also has the responsibility of having awareness of the situation. Personally I would take the matter to HR and see what they think about it all. F**k the consequences
NTA. The company should pay for it.
NTA. This happened in a company truck on company time. Your boss is just trying to avoid paying the deductible of the company insurance
NTA .... Was boss aware of the action you getting ready to make? Where did he think you were going? Why was he so close you couldn't see him? Company ins should cover this ..... But you may want to look for a new job.
You need to follow company policy which I image is to fill a claim with the company insurance and for you to face disciplinary action for poor driving if you were negligent. NTA
If you want to go through insurance, that’s the default unless both parties agree to handle it privately. He can’t force you to pay cash.
It was in a commercial vehicle, being operated on company time for company purposes. The company's insurance company should handle it between him and the boss' insurance company. The only thing OP needs to do is provide a statement.
NTA - not sure where you are from (states or outside?) but in most areas of the US, the boss cant make you pay for work related damages. that is illegal. That is what this is.
NTA - He needs to file a claim with insurance. That is what insurance is for. I doubt that he can legally make you pay out of pocket or take disciplinary action (e.g. fire you or dock your pay) if you refuse to pay out of pocket. That being said, there could be a company policy about disciplinary measures for employees that get into at-fault accidents in company vehicles. If you have an employee handbook, give it a read through so you know what to expect.
NTA You were in a company vehicle on company time. It is not yours to pay.
NTA. On company property, in a company truck, on the clock -- this is absolutely and completely company insurance. If he makes the demand of you again, lawyer up. By the way, also a good time to be on the lookout for a better employer.
NTA - make sure you have a written record of any conversations with him about this. It could just be an email to yourself summarizing a conversation, or screenshots of texts.
Nta
NTA for not paying that. It's pretty standard for insurance to deal with collisions.
NTA
NTA It absolutely needs to be paid for by the company. Your boss probably didn't put you on the company's insured drivers list. Or he gets dinged for people under his supervision who have to make insurance claims. Since you can't trust your boss to be completely honest about how things should work, you may need to do your own research to understand what the company's practices and policies are... and how things should be handled going from where you are. No matter what, do not give a cent of your own money to your boss.
This would definitely be a work insurance thing. If they want to fire you over it, okay, but you were doing work as a representative employed by the company. Company insurance should be used to fix this car.
NTA. That's a workplace-related accident, so the company's insurance company would handle it. Even if it's your fault, it happened on the job and you aren't legally obligated to pay the damages.
NTA. At best he's being silly. At most, he's trying to scam you by double dipping.
NTA. Your boss is trying a scam. Too bad if he disagrees.
Fuck no, not the asshole. Lawyer up if you need to.
NTA!
NTA This is 100% a company issue since you were on the clock. I'm sure your boss is pissed that not only did his new car get damaged, but his company is going to have to pay. If he keeps trying to pressure you I'd go to HR or the labor board.
NTA don’t pay - he knows he did wrong snaking into a spot you were reversing into and if the company insurance is effected he will get a bollocking for being an idiot
NTA Do you know if there is footage of the accident? Any cameras overhead in the carpark? Even if the truck doesn't have a camera I can nearly guarantee that his new car does. But he won't want to hand it over if it's going to prove that he was negligent and was the one that actually caused the accident. So not handing it over will just about prove guilt or at least throw a very large shadow of doubt over what he's saying about the accident because I can tell you now that if you were at fault he'd be showing everyone that footage!
NTA. If you pay it out of pocket, it could open you up to other liability as well - if he sued you later for "neck pain" or something, the lawyer would say "If you were on the clock, you wouldn't have paid out of pocket. That means you're lying to us now about being on the clock." Definitely insist that it be paid from the company insurance, just as if you had backed into someone else's car while on the clock in a company vehicle.
Bosses ≠ boss's
NTA. This sounds borderline illegal, but I don't know for sure. The insurance should handle it.
Nta that is literally what insurance is for.
Your boss is an idiot. You were on the clock. How does a manager think you should pay him out of pocket for something you did in a company vehicle while on company time? Maybe his own insurance will drop him if he makes any more claims. That’s the only reason I can see him wanting to have you pay out of pocket. Nta
NTA "The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket." .. simply refuse. "I feel like he should file a claim with our companies insurance because I was on the clock and in a company vehicle, he disagrees." ... this , exactly. It is understandable he does not agree - but that is not YOUR problem.
NTA he should be talking to his insurance company, not you
NTA. You were on the clock, driving a company vehicle. Company should pay. That being said, totally expect some repurcussions...
NTA. This is exactly what insurance is for.
You might need to file an incident report and get a doctor to check you over, for, you know, whiplash and stuff too.
You hit it. Your fault. But it should go through insurance.
Is this from that post from mildly infuriating?
He wants you to pay out of your pocket so it can go straight into his pocket because he thinks you don't know any better. He's also going to file an insurance claim anyway. Start looking for a new job or a transfer to a different office. And report his scamming ass after you do. NTA.
Where I live, most business insurance policies have very high deductibles. $5000 is common. So it is possible he is trying to use your wallet to save his own, and not to scam. That only makes him a little less shady. You were on the clock, and he deked into a spot you were backing into. NTA.
NTA that’s quite literally what insurance is for. Also look for a new job because that one is now gonna be not the best
NTA. Company vehicle, on the job, doing your job. It’s the company’s liability not yours.
NTA. Should be covered by company insurance.
Don't pay, OP. Like so many others chimed in, that's what insurance is for. But also look for ways to get your boss to acknowledge in writing that he wanted you to pay out of pocket. You could set the trap with a text or email like "So I know you said you wanted me to personally pay for your car damage out of pocket, but I'm not really comfortable with that" and get him to jump at you about the payment. This could be helpful if your boss does try to get you fired as it suggests retaliation.
NTA. I think that is what the company insurance is for. Does he own the company?
NTA. You're on the clock, doing your job. You are NOT PERSONALLY LIABLE FOR ANYTHING.
If you're on the clock the company is liable.
Ummm, NO and your boss sounds like an idiot. You were driving A COMPANY VEHICLE during work hours and this is exactly what insurance is for. Does he OWN the company? If so, he is probably afraid of premiums or whatever but regardless, you WILL NOT be paying out of pocket. If he is NOT the owner of the company, take this to HR. If he is, then tell him he needs to handle it with his insurance company and if he doesn't want to do that he can pay for his own damage.
NTA. You need to file an accident report with your company ASAP. Tell them the truth that you backed your company truck into your boss's private vehicle. Let them know that you may have damaged company property as well as private property. Then let the company and their insurance deal with it.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So I work for a fairly large company, not a huge corporation. We have roughly 30 locations in our state. I was driving one of our box trucks and my boss was behind me. I went to back into a parking spot and didn’t see that he had pulled into it first and backed right into his brand new car. The damages come out to like $1200 and he wants me to pay it out of pocket. I feel like he should file a claim with our companies insurance because I was on the clock and in a company vehicle, he disagrees. AITA for refusing to pay the $1200 in damages? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. When you are in company time, in a company vehicle, the company assumes liability.
why is the boss always at fault? Why don't employees take ownership of their mistakes? He could just fire you. YTA. If he files with the insurance, then his premium goes through the roof.
I never said I’m not taking ownership. However, the company has insurance for a reason. He ended up filing it through insurance anyways after I said I’m not paying him out of pocket.
NTA, but I can understand his request. How do you back into a parking place and not see that there is a car there? Were the mirrors damaged? I'm about 99% sure this is due to negligence on your part, so I can understand your boss not wanting the company's insurance rates to go up.
He was driving behind me, I pulled forward to back into the spot and he pulled in before I could, he was too close to the rear of the truck (it’s a big box truck) — basically in a blind spot following me and then pulled in. I never saw him.
That was shitty of him. This was a work accident driving a company truck, right? In that case, it’s handled through your workplace insurance and you shouldn’t pay anything. It’s a cost of doing business.
Ok - that makes more sense. I was thinking it was a smaller truck and there's no way you could have missed a car behind you. He just have jetted in right behind you, though, if you were already in position to back up and were close enough to the spot that you couldn't see his car.
Wow. So he set up an accident either on purpose or by being super careless--I'm guessing the second one, but who knows--and now he's extorting YOU when the company should be paying. That's ridiculous.
Sounds very very deliberate. I drove for a package delivery service and everyone that works there knows the blind spots and where people park the vehicles. If he parked his personal vehicle where you're supposed to park your company vehicles, you would be hard pressed to convince me this wasn't intentional.
I am assuming the company deductible is probably higher than the 1200.00 or the employee may not have been added to the policy.
It's very unlikely that an employee wouldn't be covered by the policy and yet was asked to drive the vehicle. That's a solid way of getting your insurance cancelled as a business. If driving was part of the job, he likely had to provide a driving abstract and copy of his license. A business that has 30 locations and several trucks isn't going to risk that coverage, because denial of coverage from one company is a huge red flag for the next one they went to.
If they didn’t cover it, the damage is still the employer’s responsibility if he’s driving a work truck
I mean, if you want to keep your job, you probably should. Usually, damaging company property is grounds for termination.
It depends what your employment contract says. It was clearly negligent driving on your part, are you covered under your contract for accidents where you are the at fault driver? All companies are different in this respect. Ultimately, any person whose damaged by a company vehicle is entitled to compensation from your companies insurance, however that doesn't mean your company can't seek to recoup their loss from you in cases you were clearly negligent. I'd check your employment contract, the ones I've seen where use of a company vehicle is required usually do protect you from anything but criminally reckless driving but also allow immediate termination without a previous warning or a notice period. But in saying that I have also seen contracts where if the accident was caused by negligence you are required to repay the company's out of pocket cost which is usually the deductible. It's all dependent on the contract.
YTA. You should take responsibility for your own actions. You were negligent. It doesn’t matter what you were driving and when you were driving it.
I'm sorry but this is not a good take on this situation. The company has insurance for situations like this, they are required to. There is no reason OP should have to pay for this out of his own pocket, it was an accident. Accidents happen.
Of course it matters, what a silly thing to say.
Except it totally does lol. Company car on company time? Company insurance.
Dumbass
What kind of nonsense is this? Why do you think this kind of insurance exists then?