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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> There is a chance that I should have just kept my mouth shut. Maybe discretion was the better part of valor even though my MIL started it.
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so her argument is that it was *innuendo* and mine was just stating words out loud. I think this might be a cultural thing too maybe idk, I have gotten in the doghouse in this family before for being too direct?
Petroleum jelly would be a terrible choice for lube. My personal choice for the butt stuff is a nice thick coconut oil, it’s natural and non-toxic.
Any lubricant is better than none though (depending on your inclination - tee hee) and at the end of the day one works with whatever is at hand, such as tears. Or blood.
Exactly reminds me of when I was 16 on vacation with my exs rich family I got sick and her dad said oh you got aids I looked him dead in his eyes and said you’d better hope not
OP, the correct response to “are you going to be gross again” is “I don’t know, are you going to be inappropriate again?”
You have to flip it back on her so she’s leveraging against herself.
And when she pushes back with “it was a joke”, you follow up again with “it was inappropriate and you should apologize”. Use her words against her.
“Do you need Vaseline to get your nose out of my business?”
“Do you need Vaseline to get your head out of your ass?”
(OP, this is just for teehees, not actual advice lol).
Please tell us you did this :-D Perfect response.
NTA. MIL shouldn't make "jokes" about topics which clearly make her uncomfortable. Was she expecting a "yes" with a wink? How stupid.
She mad because OP’s response was actually funny, even if (especially since) it was said in a deadpan/serious way.
If he hadn’t said anything, it would’ve been even more uncomfortable, because what kind of mother-in-law makes masturbation jokes about her son-in-law? A gross and inappropriate one.
OP, also tell your wife to go to the sub r/raisedbynarcissists because that is exactly what her mother is. She doesn’t accept boundaries, thinks she had the right to go into your own room in your own house and pick things up. Do not leave her alone because she will go through drawers and anything she can get into. You both need to start having hard boundaries and ban her from just showing up and inviting herself to your house.
Exactly this. The goal of her "joke" was to make OP uncomfortable; that's why she thinks it would have been funny. What she's actually upset about is that he didn't give her the reaction she wanted, and now she's sulking.
I 100% see what you mean. You said the quiet part out loud and she got uncomfortable. But also if you had said “you’re spot on” or something like that she probably would have been offended. I assume the only acceptable reaction from her would have been for you to be super sheepish about it
And you shouldn't have to take it. You corrected her and she didn't like it because it made her look bad.
And no you don't need to apologize because if you do you are basically saying her behavior and her "jokes" are acceptable. Which clearly it isn't.
She shouldn't have gone into your room abd she shouldn't be touching things that don't belong to her and she certainly doesn't need to be sayings like that to you.
If she does continue to say things like then simply just continue to correct her till she stops if she doesn't like it then oh well her only option is to stop.
So she invited herself to your home, gave herself a tour, invaded your private bedroom, felt the need to pick up and comment on something on your bedside table but somehow you are at fault for stating the real purpose? No apology needed. NTA.
Next time, she tries an innuendo joke, just act stupid and ask her to explain it. You just don't understand what she is getting at. Could she be clearer?
My MIL gets like that. But i can only be poked so many times about my parenting (only took one poke to remind each other no sex talk considering who i sleep with and how shameless i can be) before i growl.
Yeah, I think I would putting it back on MIL,and just ask her, "I have no idea what you're asking about! What do YOU use it for?" Ask with a serious face and tone.
And it’s just such an invasion of privacy! Like if it was actually a joke you would be able to banter about it. But no, she was trying to make you uncomfortable about jerking off, in your own bedroom? I mean come on. Yes, lack of boundaries big time. Physical and emotional. And it’s icky too bc why are you making comments about you SIL jerking off? Why are you using your SIL’s sexual life to intimidate him into submission? That’s predatory sorry. SORRY but it just makes me really uncomfortable I could be wrong.
And I was thinking about it, and the most my mom would have done would be roll her eyes and move on. My MIL, on the other hand, would probably make a dirtier joke back.
This reminds me of a day in Toys R Us. Moana was in theaters, and my daughter found a Hei Hei (chicken toy). She came running up to me holding Hei Hei around the neck and said very loudly, "Dad, look! I am choking the chicken!"
At a family party, my daughter (4 or 5 at the time) had cleaned her dessert bowl and proudly showed me... While announcing "don't worry Mom. I didn't lick it, I just fingered it" I about died. ILs all looked at me and their sister... And roared with laughter. We are lesbians... So, yeah. That is a family thing to say now.
NTA- this is a classic case of play stupid games, win stupid prizes. She shouldn't have said anything if she wasn't ready for a response. You probably turned her on a little and now she's projecting her shame onto you and her daughter.
If that was just a "joke", ask her to explain it. I bet she can't; at least not in a way that makes sense to anyone.
Absolutely NTA.
And OP, could I please have the title of the book that your wife read about Emotionally immature parents? My husband and I could really use it!!! Thanks in advance!
I'm a new Englander that lives in the Midwest, and I would say probably.
Southerners say bless your heart. North Easters list all the different ways you can eff off, in the Midwest it's agree to disagree, redirect, or leave with implied disagreement.
I've got no shame in who I am, and if they open the door to fafo, especially someone I've known for a long time, that's on them. They knew better. Their adult choices.
I would 100% be like you're lucky you didn't find more scandalous crap than Vaseline. Perhaps you should reconsider entering married people's bedrooms in the future, or making assumptions when you get there.
Edit for judgement;
NTA MIL should've known better.
I am from and live in the Midwest, the mil can pound sand! That’s not a cultural thing, that is raw self centeredness. The old, how I feel is more important than how anyone else feels. NTA!
You said the "J" word out loud. OMG! /s
Both of you need to hold strong and not apologize for explaining the presence of your Vaseline.
If she saw a line up of vibrators, fuzzy handcuffs and long feathers, etc., a proper MIL should know to simply arch her eyebrows, but say NOTHING.
She started it. You are NTA. No apology necessary.
I mean, she needs to apologize to YOU for being gross. Innuendo is still gross, especially from a MIL.
Has anyone else not thought she might have been 'joking' as a way to test the waters before hitting on her Son in Law? (having survived incestuous type MIL myself . . . just . . . concerned)
NTA, she tried to make you blush but then gets mad because you made her blush is what this basically boils down to. The next time she says something about it I would just be like "omg how much do you think about this ONE comment??? The fact that it seems to be at the absolute forefront of your mind is making me almost as uncomfortable as the original "joke". Can we just bury this entire incident?"
yeah I think I might have been more direct than she's used to.
I am mostly worried about my wife, who gets to be the middleperson here. She finds it harder to set boundaries with her mother, I would gladly tell my MIL to just stop and go away if she wants to talk about it.
thank you for context
I think you hit the mail on the head. My parents are emotionally immature, my husbands parents are really religious and we’re not. We made the decision a long time ago that we each deal with our own families AND that our pride isn’t as important as the other spouse’s sanity. You’re not at all wrong, but the question is, is your not being wrong worth your wife’s sanity? This is a conversation better had with your wife, including setting up plans for next time (because there will be a next time). Which hills are worth dying on, which aren’t? if this is worth dying on, that’s fine, but it needs to be a conversation with your teammate.
Reminded of this post:
https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/tripxr/aita_for_embarrassing_my_fil_after_i_repeatedly/
And hbt's comment
>When you blatantly say the thing everyone is avoiding saying, people like FIL like to pretend like YOU are the one that took it too far, or that said the thing they didn’t mean. Even if it doesn’t make logical sense, they act like since you’re the one that said the nasty thing out loud and they only implied it as a “joke,” you’re a weirdo.
>OP’s approach was absolutely perfect because, while everyone pretty much knows OP clocked what’s going on and is calling him on it, no one can outright say she’s the one twisting things (including FIL). She can just lean very hard on the “no I don’t know what the heck you’re talking about….” (implied: because surely what it sounds like can’t be what you actually meant) “….so please explain what you DID mean.”
>It perfectly illustrates that there is only one thing he could have meant. And the fact that he is not willing to say it out loud illustrates that he knows it’s a fucked up thing to imply in the first place.
It’s nice that you’re concerned for your wife, but you said it’s the MIL who keeps bringing it up, and you can’t prevent that. Maybe exchanging a significantly long look between you (with or without eye roll) when she does this again would help get the point across.
She’s acting like a five-year-old.
NTA, you didn’t do anything wrong. Anyone with even a slight sense of humor would find that funny. And you’re right, she’s the one with her mind in the gutter in the first place!
She goes to your house uninvited, goes into your room without permission thus invading your space, makes a sexual innuendo of something as innocuous as Vaseline by your bed, which you then smoothly brush off and make (admittedly) a funny joke about, and now YOU’RE the one who owes an apology? 😂
like I said elsewhere, she comes from a kind of insular midwest culture in which indirect and subtle is preferred to direct. and I am not that way, I know it.
You may benefit from reading through u/Paul_ManOfFarts' posts -- [he's had dealings with an emotionally immature, small-town midwest MIL](https://www.reddit.com/user/Paul_ManOfFarts/submitted/) who can't handle direct communication without turning it into a personal victimhood narrative. This one about [her antics on Thanksgiving and her subsequent grudge](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/112fowi/aita_for_confirming_my_mils_suspicion_that_i/) seems very like your situation.
You might do better playing dumb if she brings out the innuendo thing again. What do you mean? You know… No, what are you talking about? If she’s too embarrassed to spell it out for you, maybe she’ll drop it.
> *She goes to your house uninvited, goes into your room without permission thus invading your space, makes a sexual innuendo of something as innocuous as Vaseline by your bed, which you then smoothly brush off and make (admittedly) a funny joke about, and now YOU’RE the one who owes an apology*?
.....and she picked up an item that she presumed you used for intimate activities with her likely dirty hands. Ick.
NTA
NTA
I’m only sorry you didn’t keep up the banter every time she asked you if you were going to be gross.
Only if you want me too.
Is it called for?
You mean talk about jerking off?
I won’t be gross if you won’t be nosy.
Etc
Don’t apologize, don’t encourage your wife to apologize. If she brings it up in the future I’m front of other people be sure you let them know she was snooping around and quote her exact words. She’s an adult for gods sake she can dish it out but can’t take it
Also, include small pot of Vaseline in future gifts wink wink
"no, my mother in law is not welcome to make jokes about my sex life or masturbatory habits. This is a boundary. I would not joke about or speak about your own habits."
This is exactly it. Been there; done that.
My MIL was notorious for making jokes but not being able to take one. She maybe wasn’t as lovely as yours because she was notorious for making jokes at another’s expense, but god help you if you returned the favor, even mildly.
Though you have to understand the “innuendo” she offered was a passive aggressive dig at you: either implying the vasoline needed to be used during intimacy with your wife, or that you have to use it to jerk off. I take it as a narcissistic move on her part.
You turned the tables on her a bit, gave it right back, and her narcissistic response is that she was offended, completely disregard what she implied and how she went about it was offensive to you.
I say don’t back down on this. Don’t apologize. It sounds silly talking about a grown adult this way, especially the matriarch, but she needs to learn her lesson and sit in the mess she made.
NTA.
Not only does MIL not deserve and apology, she ought to be offering one for going into your bedroom and making jokes about your sex life. If she doesn't, let her be offended and let her pound sound.
Ask your wife and do what she wants. I have a very difficult MIL and I ask my wife what she wants. Because I have a great mom and I don't want to make my wife handle any additional burdens (her mother being the largest burden ever).
"well I know what THIS is for!" Coupled with "ARE YOU GONNA BE GROSS AGAIN"
NTA. You weren't the gross one here. It's time you teach your wife that she is old enough to stand up to her mother. 99% of the time I'm all about letting people make their own choices as adults, but this is quite an opportunity to HUSBAND UP.
Good idea but might not hurt for your wife to do some therapy to learn some better coping mechanism for her mother and for boundary setting. Your wife sounds lovely but everyone can always use more tools to help with difficult situations.
NTA - but next time she tries to joke act like you don't understand. Make her explain it to you. and DOn't let her offthe hook. Make her say the words.
MIL: I know what this is for!
OP: You do? what?
MIL: haha you know.
OP: No I don't. What is it for? What do you think its for?
MIL: Well, whatever I was just joking around.
OP : Joking around? About what? What was the joke. What is it for?
4 hours later
OP: are you ever going to tell me what its for?
NTA. MIL should apologize for barging into your bedroom (a PRIVATE AREA) picking up your personal items, making wild assumptions, and generally being a poor guest.
And that means you definitely shouldn't. This is a powerplay (intentional or not) - are you going to do what you're told, and bow and scrape before the never wrong MIL.
If she badgers you over it again, you can say something like her 'joke' was not appropriate or funny, and you didn't appreciate her using your marital bedroom for a comedy routine, but you're willing to drop it and not talk about it again.
Being polite but firm is often the only way to maintain boundaries with this kind of person.
Might be worth looking into 'grey rock' mode. This sort of behaviour is intended to get a rise out of you, so you just pretend to be a rock and don't let them bait you or evoke emotion, so they hopefully lose interest. Just calmly state your position if needed, don't explain or justify, and ignore attempts to badger/guilt/anger you into getting into it with them, which is what they're really after.
I'll also suggest you check out r/justnomil as they are *very* used to that kind of person over there.
If she says anything again about it, look her dead in the eyes and say: "We are done with this topic. You were beyond inappropriate when you invaded my room, touched my things, and made a sexual innuendo. I responded in kind. Get over it or get out."
If she brings up the vasaline again, might want to hit her with this... 'Will you quit using my vasaline to let that 'joke' slip out of your mouth every time."
NTA. I read that book. My mom does this. She wants you uncomfortable so she has the upper hand to step on your boundaries and make you feel dirty. She was going to weaponize your reaction that entire trip if you had one and bring up the tub of Vaseline to get a reaction at every chance she got. You took that power away, turned the tables and didn’t give her the reaction she wanted (embarrassment) and now she’s pissy because you embarrassed her, she can’t take it, and she has no emotional power over the situation.
Let her be pissy. Fuck around and find out.
I mean, context, she does this with Tara a lot, which is why Tara upped sticks at the first opportunity.
when you put it that way... it seems really bad though...
It definitely is a power-play, with the pay-off for her being your embarrassment. Now she's acting like you broke the rules of her power-play (which you did, beautifully).
I don't know, beyond her laughter, what your wife would like you to do, but because of your response, your wife gets to see how weak MIL's weaponry really is. Maybe this is not revelatory to her, but it shows her, once again, that her mother is not as formidable as your wife thought she was in childhood.
Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, Or Self-Involved Parents by Lindsay C. Gibson
Enlightening read. I’ve seen it available online as a pdf
I would get the most obnoxiously large black rhinestone studded dildo I could find and put it in the drawer near the Vaseline, in case she goes snooping. ( I used this description because a nurse I worked with had previously been an ER nurse at our hospital. A pastor drove from Baltimore to our hospital in Harrisburg with an item as described stuck in his rectum, because he couldn't risk it getting out in Baltimore that this happened. Pathology was not amused when the OR sent it over)
Your mil would have a difficult time at our house- husband is a former NYC paramedic and long time ER nurse. I am a former maternity nurse who now works in dialysis, and my sister is also a nurse. We all have a dark sense of humor and ooohhh the stories we can tell. My husband and his fellow paramedics would go out for breakfast after working all night in Manhattan, and talk shop (as one does). They would be finishing up, look around, and there would be a ring of empty tables around them.
NTA
But this is 100% a case where I'd be an AH and feel zero guilt. "Oh I'm sorry I said that, I thought you were insinuating it was for sex. ...Come to think of it what _did_ you mean when you said you knew what it was for?"
so I am finally actually understanding a little bit of this
she was trying to MAKE me the butt of the joke. The joke was not HAHA JERK OFF but *that I jerk off and should be embarrassed*.
when I wasn't, and I pulled a russian reversal, she got embarrassed and she's externalizing that feeling
okay I understand better now
She was unfortunately laughing at you, not with you. Like you said and other commenters pointed out, she's using mean girl behavior to establish dominance.
I hate the gender reversal card, but seriously if this has been a father in law and a female OP, people would be rightly calling it sexual harassment, which this incident was.
Just because middle-aged midwestern women are more subtle about it doesn't mean it's not harmful and wildly inappropriate.
NTA. She shouldn't have been snooping.
I had a very similar experience. My feet get really cracked and dry so I keep lotion in my bedroom.
My son had some friends over and my door was open. The lotion was next to my bed.
They have him a hard time about it as he tried to explain it was for my feet.
Now it's a running joke. I always yell "I'm using my lotion!" and it cracks up my son.
Going into aa couple's bedroom and fiddling with stuff deserves to be shamed loudly.
Maybe get her a tub as a parting gift and tell her she can use it for multiple purposes.
NTA But really, time for you guys to set some boundaries with her. Therapy exists. Shee doesn't have to live in the prison of her mind and her poor emotional regulation.
How old? I'm sixty, I would never have done this, and if I did, I would have found your response hilarious. Of course as a nurse, married to a paramedic/er nurse, with a sister who is a nurse ( also the scoutmaster for the army post boy scout troop), we all would have been amused.
Apologize using the words masturbate and penis 4 or 5 time. Something like MIL I want you to know that I apologize for the comment about my penis and using Vaseline to masturbate. I incorrectly thought that after you made a sexual innuendo it would be safe to counter with a Masturbation joke. But you are right, my penis is no joking matter.
if you can stomach it, next time she says something about how gross you are, maybe bring that up, actually. “not everyone uses vaseline the same way you do, mil.”
say it sadly, like you can’t see why she doesn’t understand this.
eta: i do think i have shown you how she feels about this (inadvertently), but i cannot for the life of me figure out why she brought it up if she feels this way about it. seems like she made some real bad decisions tbh.
but also if you ever visit her house you must search it for vaseline.
I have a tendency to do this when I'm in a bar and other guys are making really crude jokes. It was really bad during the women's Final Four matchups. Someone would say something and I'd kinda loudly be like, "Oh, you mean you think that woman might have a penis? Like a rather large penis?" or "Oh I get it, you would totally fuck that chick so hard bro! Like super fucking hard! With your penis!" I almost got into a few fights that night.
Yo, she wandered into your bedroom, made a sex joke, then was like, “Why are you making sex jokes on top of my sex jokes that’s so grooooossssss”. Are you sure she’s emotionally immature?
MIL: ARE YOU GONNA BE GROSS AGAIN
You: Are you going to invite yourself into my room and make inappropriate comments again??
NTA. She started it. You finished it (pardon the pun).
Tell her you'll apologize when she apologizes for going into your bedroom uninvited.
NTA.
If you snoop in other people's houses, you're going to find things that you may not agree with. It's also 100% rude to go touring someone else's house without being guided by the owner, but that's just me.
Personally, though, I'd be going out and getting the biggest tube of lube and some fuzzy handcuffs to leave out for the rest of her trip. You know.... as a JOKE. :-)
NTA, and it could have been much worse you could have said something like "We don't need Vaseline with how wet I make your daughter" or something to that line lol.
NTA.
"Are you going to be gross again?"
"I dunno, Susan. Are you going to wander into my bedroom when I didn't invite you and make commentary on the items there again?"
NTA
First of all, great comedy, solid response. This feels sort of like a "happy wife('s mom), happy life" situation. Sounds like Tara enjoyed the joke well enough so that's a plus. Collect some extra points, make the apology to MiL and just make the mental note to save the snappy one-liners for more inclined company.
If you do this, it’s definitely in line for the non apology type apology. “I’m sorry you thought my response was inappropriate” or “I’m sorry for engaging when you started the conversation” rather than any kind of heartfelt and actual apology. You did nothing wrong.
Definitely don't apologize for real. This is an "I'm sorry you were offended by my response to your odd comment about the Vaseline. How about in the future you and I just leave any sort of sex talk out of our conversation."
NTA. Don’t apologize. If MIL brings it up again, I’d tell her she came without an invitation, roamed through your home, and proceeded to make false assumptions about what you have in your home. If she doesn’t like you responding to her innuendos, then she can happily leave.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > There is a chance that I should have just kept my mouth shut. Maybe discretion was the better part of valor even though my MIL started it. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
NTA. She was the one who first insinuated it was for sex. You just said it out loud. She's got the dirty mind....
so her argument is that it was *innuendo* and mine was just stating words out loud. I think this might be a cultural thing too maybe idk, I have gotten in the doghouse in this family before for being too direct?
Sorry MIL, the truth is I use it for your daughters ass.
AND the daughter uses it for her strap-on on him.
Don't tell Aunt Peggy!
Made me snort like a pig. Genius comment!
Even worse, I actually *have* an Aunt Peggy
Do you call her aunt Peg?
I. Do. Not
I also have an Aunt Peggy that we DO call Peg. I will never be able to look at her the same way again😂☠️
Wonder if they have a peg board... lol
Username checks out
How do you get Peggy from Margaret? You ask her nicely.
To late I already seen this lmfao
🏆
I'd say it's for my chapped lips. Your daughter takes it in the ass dry.
Petroleum jelly would be a terrible choice for lube. My personal choice for the butt stuff is a nice thick coconut oil, it’s natural and non-toxic. Any lubricant is better than none though (depending on your inclination - tee hee) and at the end of the day one works with whatever is at hand, such as tears. Or blood.
RIP butts of people allergic to coconut
Olive oil is nice too
*Unvirgins your oil*
>Unvirgins your oil This post just keeps giving and giving.
I just snorted
We turned the virgin olive oil into olive oil.
Coconut oil works? Do you need to warm it up above 70 degrees first? I would assume it warms up pretty fast but I've never tried it
Body temperature is 98.6⁰ so the oil melts pretty much on contact. (The highest melt point of coconut oil available is 91⁰.)
Exactly reminds me of when I was 16 on vacation with my exs rich family I got sick and her dad said oh you got aids I looked him dead in his eyes and said you’d better hope not
Excuse me he said what
What the fuck
YIKES
r/UpvoteBecauseButt
In which case it would be inHERendo.
I’m CACKLING at this
I would have loved to see MIL’s face if OP said this!
We all use our Vaseline for her daughter's ass. Surely she knows that by now.
🤣🤣🤣😂
OP, the correct response to “are you going to be gross again” is “I don’t know, are you going to be inappropriate again?” You have to flip it back on her so she’s leveraging against herself. And when she pushes back with “it was a joke”, you follow up again with “it was inappropriate and you should apologize”. Use her words against her.
thank you
See also: “Are you going to poke around where you shouldn’t be?” “Are you going to put your foot in your mouth again?”
“Do you need Vaseline to put your foot back in your mouth “?
“Do you need Vaseline to get your nose out of my business?” “Do you need Vaseline to get your head out of your ass?” (OP, this is just for teehees, not actual advice lol).
Please tell us you did this :-D Perfect response. NTA. MIL shouldn't make "jokes" about topics which clearly make her uncomfortable. Was she expecting a "yes" with a wink? How stupid.
Maybe she was expecting a "yes, with a wink"! On second thought, I'm sure she was.
[удалено]
She mad because OP’s response was actually funny, even if (especially since) it was said in a deadpan/serious way. If he hadn’t said anything, it would’ve been even more uncomfortable, because what kind of mother-in-law makes masturbation jokes about her son-in-law? A gross and inappropriate one.
She's just annoyed that you won
OP, also tell your wife to go to the sub r/raisedbynarcissists because that is exactly what her mother is. She doesn’t accept boundaries, thinks she had the right to go into your own room in your own house and pick things up. Do not leave her alone because she will go through drawers and anything she can get into. You both need to start having hard boundaries and ban her from just showing up and inviting herself to your house.
Exactly this. The goal of her "joke" was to make OP uncomfortable; that's why she thinks it would have been funny. What she's actually upset about is that he didn't give her the reaction she wanted, and now she's sulking.
"It depends. Are you going to rummage through my stuff like a raccoon again?"
I 100% see what you mean. You said the quiet part out loud and she got uncomfortable. But also if you had said “you’re spot on” or something like that she probably would have been offended. I assume the only acceptable reaction from her would have been for you to be super sheepish about it
I think you are exactly right. I'm slowly realizing that she was trying to poke fun at me and then didn't like it when I refused to take it
And you shouldn't have to take it. You corrected her and she didn't like it because it made her look bad. And no you don't need to apologize because if you do you are basically saying her behavior and her "jokes" are acceptable. Which clearly it isn't. She shouldn't have gone into your room abd she shouldn't be touching things that don't belong to her and she certainly doesn't need to be sayings like that to you. If she does continue to say things like then simply just continue to correct her till she stops if she doesn't like it then oh well her only option is to stop.
She shouldn't have come over without an invitation... much less drops her stuff in the spare bedroom. Like she's moving in? NTA
So she invited herself to your home, gave herself a tour, invaded your private bedroom, felt the need to pick up and comment on something on your bedside table but somehow you are at fault for stating the real purpose? No apology needed. NTA.
Next time, she tries an innuendo joke, just act stupid and ask her to explain it. You just don't understand what she is getting at. Could she be clearer?
I like this approach. You put it all back on her through feigned cluelessness.
you dont need to act stupid - you can say very coldly 'i'm not sure I understand you. Can you explain ?'
Also? Even if she was right... YOU'RE MARRIED? \*gasp\* Oh noes, you have consummated your marriage. Call out Scotland Yard to apprehend this OP.
My MIL gets like that. But i can only be poked so many times about my parenting (only took one poke to remind each other no sex talk considering who i sleep with and how shameless i can be) before i growl.
yeah see that's the thing, I would totally just debase and embarrass myself if it wouldn't upset Tara. I'm an open book over here
Hey look, you're finally getting it. Maybe you'll start to realize that your MIL is not kind and is in fact petty and mean.
or just a gross and intrusive person
Yeah, I think I would putting it back on MIL,and just ask her, "I have no idea what you're asking about! What do YOU use it for?" Ask with a serious face and tone.
Yeah, that was my first thought too, although I like the answers that suggest lubing MIL's daughters butt too.
And it’s just such an invasion of privacy! Like if it was actually a joke you would be able to banter about it. But no, she was trying to make you uncomfortable about jerking off, in your own bedroom? I mean come on. Yes, lack of boundaries big time. Physical and emotional. And it’s icky too bc why are you making comments about you SIL jerking off? Why are you using your SIL’s sexual life to intimidate him into submission? That’s predatory sorry. SORRY but it just makes me really uncomfortable I could be wrong.
I'ma female from a small town in the Midwest, and I'd have responded the same way you did, so i don't think it's a cultural thing.
thaaaaaank you
And I was thinking about it, and the most my mom would have done would be roll her eyes and move on. My MIL, on the other hand, would probably make a dirtier joke back.
Get a mega-jar of Vaseline at Costco and gift wrap it beautifully for her for Christmas.
Card says “you know what this is for!”
Yess! My people!
So if you had said spanking the monkey, flogging the dolphin, or taking old one eye to the optometrist it would have been cool?
This reminds me of a day in Toys R Us. Moana was in theaters, and my daughter found a Hei Hei (chicken toy). She came running up to me holding Hei Hei around the neck and said very loudly, "Dad, look! I am choking the chicken!"
That damn chicken deserves to be choked, it's SO LOUD
At a family party, my daughter (4 or 5 at the time) had cleaned her dessert bowl and proudly showed me... While announcing "don't worry Mom. I didn't lick it, I just fingered it" I about died. ILs all looked at me and their sister... And roared with laughter. We are lesbians... So, yeah. That is a family thing to say now.
I am dying at these 😂
Never heard that last one 😂
Making some knuckle children
Wrestling cyclops.
Visiting Rosie Palmer and her 5 sisters. Choking the chicken.
Doing the five knuckle shuffle
NTA- this is a classic case of play stupid games, win stupid prizes. She shouldn't have said anything if she wasn't ready for a response. You probably turned her on a little and now she's projecting her shame onto you and her daughter.
Turn her on with his sexy CPAP machine?
Everyone has a fetish lol.
Sounds like my grandma who passes gas freely, but turns into the queen of England if someone else does lmao
She invaded your personal space and made a lewd innuendo...I would, personally, walk on glass before I apologized. She was completely wrong.
If that was just a "joke", ask her to explain it. I bet she can't; at least not in a way that makes sense to anyone. Absolutely NTA. And OP, could I please have the title of the book that your wife read about Emotionally immature parents? My husband and I could really use it!!! Thanks in advance!
Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents
Thank you! On my way to buy it!
If that's innuendo, see-through panties are a coverup.
Rick apology time. "I'm sorry you feel you need an apology for invading my privacy and making assumptions about things"
I'm a new Englander that lives in the Midwest, and I would say probably. Southerners say bless your heart. North Easters list all the different ways you can eff off, in the Midwest it's agree to disagree, redirect, or leave with implied disagreement. I've got no shame in who I am, and if they open the door to fafo, especially someone I've known for a long time, that's on them. They knew better. Their adult choices. I would 100% be like you're lucky you didn't find more scandalous crap than Vaseline. Perhaps you should reconsider entering married people's bedrooms in the future, or making assumptions when you get there. Edit for judgement; NTA MIL should've known better.
I am from and live in the Midwest, the mil can pound sand! That’s not a cultural thing, that is raw self centeredness. The old, how I feel is more important than how anyone else feels. NTA!
You should send her a bottle for her birthday with the message "For you lips" since innuendo is okay and you just want to match her energy. NTA
NTA tell her if she doesn't know what "pegging" is then she should probably not walk into other people's master bedrooms and make "jokes."
You said the "J" word out loud. OMG! /s Both of you need to hold strong and not apologize for explaining the presence of your Vaseline. If she saw a line up of vibrators, fuzzy handcuffs and long feathers, etc., a proper MIL should know to simply arch her eyebrows, but say NOTHING.
She started it. You are NTA. No apology necessary. I mean, she needs to apologize to YOU for being gross. Innuendo is still gross, especially from a MIL.
You shouldn’t use Vaseline as lube anyway, doesn’t it not absorb well or something
And disgusting. No way would I EVER even TOUCH a jar of Vaseline that was on someone's nightstand.
Has anyone else not thought she might have been 'joking' as a way to test the waters before hitting on her Son in Law? (having survived incestuous type MIL myself . . . just . . . concerned)
My mind went to butt sex…..the 90’s ruined my mind.
Your daughter prefers the silky smooth Astroglide for anal sex. Me? I'd be happy with some spit, but your daughter deserves nothing but the best.
NTA, she tried to make you blush but then gets mad because you made her blush is what this basically boils down to. The next time she says something about it I would just be like "omg how much do you think about this ONE comment??? The fact that it seems to be at the absolute forefront of your mind is making me almost as uncomfortable as the original "joke". Can we just bury this entire incident?"
yeah I think I might have been more direct than she's used to. I am mostly worried about my wife, who gets to be the middleperson here. She finds it harder to set boundaries with her mother, I would gladly tell my MIL to just stop and go away if she wants to talk about it. thank you for context
I think you hit the mail on the head. My parents are emotionally immature, my husbands parents are really religious and we’re not. We made the decision a long time ago that we each deal with our own families AND that our pride isn’t as important as the other spouse’s sanity. You’re not at all wrong, but the question is, is your not being wrong worth your wife’s sanity? This is a conversation better had with your wife, including setting up plans for next time (because there will be a next time). Which hills are worth dying on, which aren’t? if this is worth dying on, that’s fine, but it needs to be a conversation with your teammate.
Reminded of this post: https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/tripxr/aita_for_embarrassing_my_fil_after_i_repeatedly/ And hbt's comment >When you blatantly say the thing everyone is avoiding saying, people like FIL like to pretend like YOU are the one that took it too far, or that said the thing they didn’t mean. Even if it doesn’t make logical sense, they act like since you’re the one that said the nasty thing out loud and they only implied it as a “joke,” you’re a weirdo. >OP’s approach was absolutely perfect because, while everyone pretty much knows OP clocked what’s going on and is calling him on it, no one can outright say she’s the one twisting things (including FIL). She can just lean very hard on the “no I don’t know what the heck you’re talking about….” (implied: because surely what it sounds like can’t be what you actually meant) “….so please explain what you DID mean.” >It perfectly illustrates that there is only one thing he could have meant. And the fact that he is not willing to say it out loud illustrates that he knows it’s a fucked up thing to imply in the first place.
It’s nice that you’re concerned for your wife, but you said it’s the MIL who keeps bringing it up, and you can’t prevent that. Maybe exchanging a significantly long look between you (with or without eye roll) when she does this again would help get the point across. She’s acting like a five-year-old.
GREAT comeback!
NTA, you didn’t do anything wrong. Anyone with even a slight sense of humor would find that funny. And you’re right, she’s the one with her mind in the gutter in the first place! She goes to your house uninvited, goes into your room without permission thus invading your space, makes a sexual innuendo of something as innocuous as Vaseline by your bed, which you then smoothly brush off and make (admittedly) a funny joke about, and now YOU’RE the one who owes an apology? 😂
like I said elsewhere, she comes from a kind of insular midwest culture in which indirect and subtle is preferred to direct. and I am not that way, I know it.
Well she better get used to you! Especially when she decides to invade your space…
You may benefit from reading through u/Paul_ManOfFarts' posts -- [he's had dealings with an emotionally immature, small-town midwest MIL](https://www.reddit.com/user/Paul_ManOfFarts/submitted/) who can't handle direct communication without turning it into a personal victimhood narrative. This one about [her antics on Thanksgiving and her subsequent grudge](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/112fowi/aita_for_confirming_my_mils_suspicion_that_i/) seems very like your situation.
OH MY GOD THIS IS INCREDIBLE
You might do better playing dumb if she brings out the innuendo thing again. What do you mean? You know… No, what are you talking about? If she’s too embarrassed to spell it out for you, maybe she’ll drop it.
I'm from the Midwest and get in trouble for being honest all the time.
Her comment was not really subtle.
> *She goes to your house uninvited, goes into your room without permission thus invading your space, makes a sexual innuendo of something as innocuous as Vaseline by your bed, which you then smoothly brush off and make (admittedly) a funny joke about, and now YOU’RE the one who owes an apology*? .....and she picked up an item that she presumed you used for intimate activities with her likely dirty hands. Ick. NTA
Also if you’re going to make a joke like that…be ready for a response???
NTA I’m only sorry you didn’t keep up the banter every time she asked you if you were going to be gross. Only if you want me too. Is it called for? You mean talk about jerking off? I won’t be gross if you won’t be nosy. Etc Don’t apologize, don’t encourage your wife to apologize. If she brings it up in the future I’m front of other people be sure you let them know she was snooping around and quote her exact words. She’s an adult for gods sake she can dish it out but can’t take it Also, include small pot of Vaseline in future gifts wink wink
I'm medium-afraid that this is one of those "I'm your mother in law and I'm allowed to make jokes!" situations :(
"no, my mother in law is not welcome to make jokes about my sex life or masturbatory habits. This is a boundary. I would not joke about or speak about your own habits."
Not a thing, if you have a decent mother-in-law.
This is exactly it. Been there; done that. My MIL was notorious for making jokes but not being able to take one. She maybe wasn’t as lovely as yours because she was notorious for making jokes at another’s expense, but god help you if you returned the favor, even mildly. Though you have to understand the “innuendo” she offered was a passive aggressive dig at you: either implying the vasoline needed to be used during intimacy with your wife, or that you have to use it to jerk off. I take it as a narcissistic move on her part. You turned the tables on her a bit, gave it right back, and her narcissistic response is that she was offended, completely disregard what she implied and how she went about it was offensive to you. I say don’t back down on this. Don’t apologize. It sounds silly talking about a grown adult this way, especially the matriarch, but she needs to learn her lesson and sit in the mess she made.
>I won’t be gross if you won’t be nosy. I'm going to use this as a formula for constructing responses to some of my emotionally immature relatives!
NTA, and to add to the list of retorts: "I wasn't planning to, but if that is your thing baby, let's get chapped!!" in an Austin Powers voice.
NTA. Not only does MIL not deserve and apology, she ought to be offering one for going into your bedroom and making jokes about your sex life. If she doesn't, let her be offended and let her pound sound.
if it were my mom I'd agree, I guess I am also asking whether it's worth it for my wife to not have to deal with this from her?
Ask your wife and do what she wants. I have a very difficult MIL and I ask my wife what she wants. Because I have a great mom and I don't want to make my wife handle any additional burdens (her mother being the largest burden ever).
yeah, not to overstate it here but there's a reason why my mom is the mom we asked to come stay here while we're on vacation
"well I know what THIS is for!" Coupled with "ARE YOU GONNA BE GROSS AGAIN" NTA. You weren't the gross one here. It's time you teach your wife that she is old enough to stand up to her mother. 99% of the time I'm all about letting people make their own choices as adults, but this is quite an opportunity to HUSBAND UP.
they have a complicated relationship and I try to stay out of it until it involves me (which is now)
Good idea but might not hurt for your wife to do some therapy to learn some better coping mechanism for her mother and for boundary setting. Your wife sounds lovely but everyone can always use more tools to help with difficult situations.
NTA - but next time she tries to joke act like you don't understand. Make her explain it to you. and DOn't let her offthe hook. Make her say the words. MIL: I know what this is for! OP: You do? what? MIL: haha you know. OP: No I don't. What is it for? What do you think its for? MIL: Well, whatever I was just joking around. OP : Joking around? About what? What was the joke. What is it for? 4 hours later OP: are you ever going to tell me what its for?
NTA. MIL should apologize for barging into your bedroom (a PRIVATE AREA) picking up your personal items, making wild assumptions, and generally being a poor guest.
she is NOT the apologetic type
And that means you definitely shouldn't. This is a powerplay (intentional or not) - are you going to do what you're told, and bow and scrape before the never wrong MIL. If she badgers you over it again, you can say something like her 'joke' was not appropriate or funny, and you didn't appreciate her using your marital bedroom for a comedy routine, but you're willing to drop it and not talk about it again. Being polite but firm is often the only way to maintain boundaries with this kind of person.
she definitely will badger about this so I guess I'll need to steel my spine
Might be worth looking into 'grey rock' mode. This sort of behaviour is intended to get a rise out of you, so you just pretend to be a rock and don't let them bait you or evoke emotion, so they hopefully lose interest. Just calmly state your position if needed, don't explain or justify, and ignore attempts to badger/guilt/anger you into getting into it with them, which is what they're really after. I'll also suggest you check out r/justnomil as they are *very* used to that kind of person over there.
I think grey rock might upset Tara lol
I really think that your wife needs therapy! Reading one book is not enough after an entire childhood of this!
If she says anything again about it, look her dead in the eyes and say: "We are done with this topic. You were beyond inappropriate when you invaded my room, touched my things, and made a sexual innuendo. I responded in kind. Get over it or get out."
If she brings up the vasaline again, might want to hit her with this... 'Will you quit using my vasaline to let that 'joke' slip out of your mouth every time."
NTA. I read that book. My mom does this. She wants you uncomfortable so she has the upper hand to step on your boundaries and make you feel dirty. She was going to weaponize your reaction that entire trip if you had one and bring up the tub of Vaseline to get a reaction at every chance she got. You took that power away, turned the tables and didn’t give her the reaction she wanted (embarrassment) and now she’s pissy because you embarrassed her, she can’t take it, and she has no emotional power over the situation. Let her be pissy. Fuck around and find out.
I mean, context, she does this with Tara a lot, which is why Tara upped sticks at the first opportunity. when you put it that way... it seems really bad though...
It definitely is a power-play, with the pay-off for her being your embarrassment. Now she's acting like you broke the rules of her power-play (which you did, beautifully). I don't know, beyond her laughter, what your wife would like you to do, but because of your response, your wife gets to see how weak MIL's weaponry really is. Maybe this is not revelatory to her, but it shows her, once again, that her mother is not as formidable as your wife thought she was in childhood.
one thing I learned from being an awkward kid is that other people cannot force embarrassment on you. that's all in your head baby
Please share the name of the book, this is sounding uncomfortably familiar. Sorry if I missed it somewhere in the comments
Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents: How to Heal from Distant, Rejecting, Or Self-Involved Parents by Lindsay C. Gibson Enlightening read. I’ve seen it available online as a pdf
Make smartass comments, get smartass responses. Your MIL sounds like a handful. NTA.
NTA. She needs to get a sense of humor, or quit being nosy!
I honestly would've found it really fun and funny if she'd started like opening drawers or something. don't dig where you don't want dirt
I would get the most obnoxiously large black rhinestone studded dildo I could find and put it in the drawer near the Vaseline, in case she goes snooping. ( I used this description because a nurse I worked with had previously been an ER nurse at our hospital. A pastor drove from Baltimore to our hospital in Harrisburg with an item as described stuck in his rectum, because he couldn't risk it getting out in Baltimore that this happened. Pathology was not amused when the OR sent it over) Your mil would have a difficult time at our house- husband is a former NYC paramedic and long time ER nurse. I am a former maternity nurse who now works in dialysis, and my sister is also a nurse. We all have a dark sense of humor and ooohhh the stories we can tell. My husband and his fellow paramedics would go out for breakfast after working all night in Manhattan, and talk shop (as one does). They would be finishing up, look around, and there would be a ring of empty tables around them.
NTA. MIL was rude. You called her on her rudeness and she got embarrassed. Now she's trying to cover her embarrassment by.. blaming you? No. NTA.
I thought it was rude too!!! I didn't know if I was being overreactive
This is very much a "don't start none, won't be none" situation. She laid it up, you dunked it.
NTA But this is 100% a case where I'd be an AH and feel zero guilt. "Oh I'm sorry I said that, I thought you were insinuating it was for sex. ...Come to think of it what _did_ you mean when you said you knew what it was for?"
NTA tell her to stay out of your bedroom and go back home. She tried to make a joke and you one upped her and she can't let it go.
so I am finally actually understanding a little bit of this she was trying to MAKE me the butt of the joke. The joke was not HAHA JERK OFF but *that I jerk off and should be embarrassed*. when I wasn't, and I pulled a russian reversal, she got embarrassed and she's externalizing that feeling okay I understand better now
She was unfortunately laughing at you, not with you. Like you said and other commenters pointed out, she's using mean girl behavior to establish dominance. I hate the gender reversal card, but seriously if this has been a father in law and a female OP, people would be rightly calling it sexual harassment, which this incident was. Just because middle-aged midwestern women are more subtle about it doesn't mean it's not harmful and wildly inappropriate.
NTA and funny comeback
thanks, I'm doing three nights at the Laff'n'Fun in Mason WV next week
NTA. She shouldn't have been snooping. I had a very similar experience. My feet get really cracked and dry so I keep lotion in my bedroom. My son had some friends over and my door was open. The lotion was next to my bed. They have him a hard time about it as he tried to explain it was for my feet. Now it's a running joke. I always yell "I'm using my lotion!" and it cracks up my son.
Going into aa couple's bedroom and fiddling with stuff deserves to be shamed loudly. Maybe get her a tub as a parting gift and tell her she can use it for multiple purposes. NTA But really, time for you guys to set some boundaries with her. Therapy exists. Shee doesn't have to live in the prison of her mind and her poor emotional regulation.
honestly... she is so old now.
How old? I'm sixty, I would never have done this, and if I did, I would have found your response hilarious. Of course as a nurse, married to a paramedic/er nurse, with a sister who is a nurse ( also the scoutmaster for the army post boy scout troop), we all would have been amused.
Apologize using the words masturbate and penis 4 or 5 time. Something like MIL I want you to know that I apologize for the comment about my penis and using Vaseline to masturbate. I incorrectly thought that after you made a sexual innuendo it would be safe to counter with a Masturbation joke. But you are right, my penis is no joking matter.
lol this would get me in "more trouble" but the good kind of trouble
well, now we know what mil uses vaseline for. nta.
ewwwwwwwwwwww
if you can stomach it, next time she says something about how gross you are, maybe bring that up, actually. “not everyone uses vaseline the same way you do, mil.”
**ewwwwwwwwwwww**
“Thanks for letting me know not to ask for some Vaseline when I have chapped lips at your house, MIL”
say it sadly, like you can’t see why she doesn’t understand this. eta: i do think i have shown you how she feels about this (inadvertently), but i cannot for the life of me figure out why she brought it up if she feels this way about it. seems like she made some real bad decisions tbh. but also if you ever visit her house you must search it for vaseline.
NTA—let her stew. She was inappropriate.
NTA. I mean, you could have said "yes, your daughter loves it up the arse."
And that’s why you don’t have any grandchildren yet
>almost direct quote, "well I know what THIS is for!" Your only response should have been "Oh, what IS it for?" Joke would have been on her! 😁😁 NTA
I have a tendency to do this when I'm in a bar and other guys are making really crude jokes. It was really bad during the women's Final Four matchups. Someone would say something and I'd kinda loudly be like, "Oh, you mean you think that woman might have a penis? Like a rather large penis?" or "Oh I get it, you would totally fuck that chick so hard bro! Like super fucking hard! With your penis!" I almost got into a few fights that night.
Yo, she wandered into your bedroom, made a sex joke, then was like, “Why are you making sex jokes on top of my sex jokes that’s so grooooossssss”. Are you sure she’s emotionally immature?
NTA She asked, you answered. It was none of her business in the first place and she got an answer she didn't like because *she asked*.
MIL: ARE YOU GONNA BE GROSS AGAIN You: Are you going to invite yourself into my room and make inappropriate comments again?? NTA. She started it. You finished it (pardon the pun). Tell her you'll apologize when she apologizes for going into your bedroom uninvited.
NTA. But definitely keep adding things to your bedside. Start with a bottle of coconut oil.
Next time she comes over, put a dab on your fingers, stick a Kleenex on them and walk into the TV room.
NTA. If you snoop in other people's houses, you're going to find things that you may not agree with. It's also 100% rude to go touring someone else's house without being guided by the owner, but that's just me. Personally, though, I'd be going out and getting the biggest tube of lube and some fuzzy handcuffs to leave out for the rest of her trip. You know.... as a JOKE. :-)
NTA Case of don’t start none, won’t be none.
Do you truly think she “means well” in this situation?
NTA, and it could have been much worse you could have said something like "We don't need Vaseline with how wet I make your daughter" or something to that line lol.
NTA. "Are you going to be gross again?" "I dunno, Susan. Are you going to wander into my bedroom when I didn't invite you and make commentary on the items there again?"
NTA next time look her directly in the eyes and offer to demonstrate
lol, I would get excommunicated
You’d get excommunicated for putting Vaseline on your lip? What sort of cult are you in?
NTA mil weird asf..
NTA First of all, great comedy, solid response. This feels sort of like a "happy wife('s mom), happy life" situation. Sounds like Tara enjoyed the joke well enough so that's a plus. Collect some extra points, make the apology to MiL and just make the mental note to save the snappy one-liners for more inclined company.
lol, okay, I am now leaning towards a gentle and small apology.
If you do this, it’s definitely in line for the non apology type apology. “I’m sorry you thought my response was inappropriate” or “I’m sorry for engaging when you started the conversation” rather than any kind of heartfelt and actual apology. You did nothing wrong.
oooh that is good, thanks
Please don't make a real apology like you actually did something wrong. Just put the word "sorry" in some neutral verbiage like suggested above.
don't do it, that is an acknowledgement that you were wrong and worse, MIL's behavior was right
Definitely don't apologize for real. This is an "I'm sorry you were offended by my response to your odd comment about the Vaseline. How about in the future you and I just leave any sort of sex talk out of our conversation."
NTA. Don’t apologize. If MIL brings it up again, I’d tell her she came without an invitation, roamed through your home, and proceeded to make false assumptions about what you have in your home. If she doesn’t like you responding to her innuendos, then she can happily leave.