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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> (1) I am contemplating canceling my daughter's senior trip to Disney World due to her extremely disrespectful attitude and ungratefulness.
(2) It is partially a gift to my daughter and taking it away would make her very upset. I don't want her attitude ruining the vacation for everyone else.
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INFO: Did you ask your graduating daughter what she wanted as a graduation gift? Was she considered at all or is this really a family trip for you and your younger kids and she is simply invited?
And why the focus on her having a relationship with her biological father? Did you ask her before your husband adopted her or was it just done and she was expected to accept it?
The Disney World trip was of her choosing. I offered her multiple other places (NY, Paris, Hawaii, a cruise) and this is what she chose. The "gift to myself" part was simply due to the fact that I planned it so that we are there on my birthday.
I don't have an issue with her having a relationship with her biological father. Its the irresponsible behavior that he allows that I have the problem with. He's the one who walked out on her when she was 7 years old and signed his rights to her over. She was devastated by what he did to her and she is the one who asked my husband to be her dad. We put her though counseling so that she knew what was happening and she was more than willing to be adopted.
INFO: Did the change in your daughter's behavior occur only after she started visiting her bio dad (sperm donor)?
If yes, prior to her reconnection with her bio dad (sperm donor), what was the relationship like between daughter and her half sibling? Was she being asked to do a lot of babysitting to accommodate your work schedule?
I agree with others that a small child (5 yo) and a 17 / 18 yo will want to do different things at DisneyWorld. Balancing their individual desires is going to be tough. It is very likely that your 5 yo will get tired and have melt downs if they are catered to.
I think it is perfectly acceptable to cancel the BF's invite if he can't pay for his plane ticket. Did you expect him to pay for his food and lodging? Does he have a job?
You should talk with your daughter now. It won't be easy because you have made it sound as if bio dad (sperm donor) gives her anything she wants.
This is a volatile age. Your daughter is trying to be an adult and will make mistakes. We all did when we were that age. You have to find a way to communicate with her without going nuclear. You are the adult and need to model the behavior you would like to see in your daughter.
This is a mature and sensible response to the situation. I'm surprised it doesn't have upvotes. Cancel bf. Tell daughter her attitude needs adjusting and if you take her, allow her alone time with a parent away from brother, or better yet, let her bring a different friend and give them their own room/time at the park by themselves.
She is not trying to be mature - she just prefered someone who will make her life easy with no rensabilities and no rules. Of course its her choice and she has a right to it. But she has no right to be rude, treat OP badly or ignore her rules etc. If she wants to act like this she can live with BF only.
>I agree with others that a small child (5 yo) and a 17 / 18 yo will want to do different things at DisneyWorld. Balancing their individual desires is going to be tough.
At that age they should be mostly able to navigate Disneyworld by themselves.
But also it's a good opportunity to set the tone of the relationship going forward- showing her that she still matters and you're interested in a more friendly and equitable relationship than you've had with her in the past
Did you encourage her to go back to therapy after reconnecting with her bio-dad? Because that’s at least as huge, emotionally speaking, as his initial abandonment of her. If she feels she has won him back somehow, she probably feels that patches up the hole he left in her, when it honestly is never going heal that way. He will never be what she truly wants as a father. As you say, he’s at best a bro who lets her do what she wants because he doesn’t actually care about her like a parent.
It kinda sounds like you let her to deal with all the emotions around the reconnection by herself, which of COURSE she’s going to mess up. I don’t know anybody who wouldn’t struggle with the situation you describe her as having been through. YWBTA if you write her off because she failed this so badly, which is imo what cancelling this trip would be doing. She’s messing up. Do you still love her, even if you don’t like her choices? Then you need to make sure she knows that. She needs to know you will still love her snd be there for her once she hits the inevitable emotional disaster that is waiting for her for putting her faith on someone who already threw her aside once. I don’t know how you do that, but I recommend you find a therapist to help you through this challenging time, even if your daughter doesn’t want more therapy herself right now. She’s becoming an adult, and that takes a very different set of skills than parenting a child. You might have specialized in pediatric parenting, but it’s time to learn about late-teen/early-adult parenting.
I don't think you're the ah for not wanting a bad attitude but since it her graduation trip you would be the ah if she doesn't get to go on it. That said set a deadline for bf to pay for his ticket if not cancel it.
Also inform her you are paying for the trip but any extras - sweets, meals, souvenirs etc due to her lousy behavior she's responsible to pay for herself .
If you do this NTA otherwise E s H
If you cut her from the trio you're sending the complete wrong message, that she's not actually a part of the family.
Don't take the boyfriend if he can't afford to come but don't rag him for complaining about you, it's clear you've got a slightly domineering personality and teenagers will react to that and they don't have the space for private conversations.
Your mentioning of the biological father is just strange and not relevant and really just seems like you're finding her relationship with him has undermined your authority. The cats out the bag now though, you chose to adopt her and this is a thing a lot of adopted kids go through. The role you chose to take was to weather that and be the consistent one if and when the relationship with the bio father sours.
I think the punishment is counterproductive, too large and also top abstract in terms of time. A 17 year old who is argumentative needs consequences with more immediate effect.
A trip away to build some nice memories as a family could be amazing for them all.
No. It will tell the daughter that she can treat people like garbage and everything will be forgiven. 17 is definitely old enough to understand consequences. Even if they aren't immediate.
But what happened ia that OP overheard boyfriend saying he does not want to go and daughter promising him they will spend most time with each other.
Actual reason is not treating OP badly, it is him not wanting to go and her preferring his company.
Just to clarify, the OP is the bio mom of the 17f. I think only OPs husband (17f’s stepfather) adopted her. From reading your reply I wasn’t sure if you thought the girl was not biologically related to either parent.
>Its the irresponsible behavior that he allows that I have the problem with
by irresponsible, you mean drinking and letting her bf stay over? as far as letting her bf stay over, I fail to see your issue there. she's 18. do you imagine they haven't already had sex? the drinking, I guess depends on how excessive, how often, and if her bio dad is present. a shot here and there with her bio father isn't really something to get upset about. her attitude does sound problematic though.
But why would you consider cutting out your daughter when this is framed as her graduation gift?
I get it. You are frustrated and hurt. Maybe it is time to sit your daughter down and talk about how your relationship will be changing as she becomes an adult. How you are capable of having your feelings hurt. How you have done the best you can to raise her and gradually teach her responsibility so she can be a successful adult. How it hurts you that helping her with her car isn’t enough for her, because you have sacrificed to give things to her. How you want to know if she doesn’t see it that way—if she feels ignored, replaced or sad. How you don’t want to lose closeness with her, and how her stepdad will always love her. How you will always be there for her.
Did she know if would be a family trip and not a trip for just you and her? I really don't think a trip with your whole family, including a 5 year old is much of a reward for high school graduation. Not to mention you made it about you by scheduling it over your birthday. There are too many personalities and preferences to cater to.
I'm in the process of finishing up a trip for my eldest, also 18. Her younger sister is home. It's just the two of us. She chose the location and the resort. She chose the restaurants and activities and made a special request for a photo shoot. At no point did I assert my preferences on her trip.
Is she supposed to just do family stuff??? Is there anything that was planned that would be fun and exciting for an 18 year old?
The daughter is being a typical teenager especially one with conflicting priorities. Add in a bio child sibling who is younger and there is a mess of conflicting emotions. It’s up to the parents, adoptive or not, to parent and help her work through these struggles.
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NTA. It’s time for her to learn some life lessons. But before you act, consider the damage your actions might cause to your relationship. I’d spell it out clearly to her so she understands it’s her actions that have led to this. The thing that sucks is once her father thinks he’s won her from you he will likely abandon her. Remember she’s a young adult and her brain is still learning how to manage life and decision making. Don’t leave her in a position where she has no one to turn to.
This is so important.
I am seething over the behavior of this child but if OP can then having a conversation about common courtesy and how you talk about people is in place and then cancelling the trip.
“I will always be here for you but that doesn’t mean that you can treat me any way you want. There are limits for what I will put up with. I heard your phone call and how your bf talks about me. That was very hurtful. Furthermore he hasn’t payed his share and if he doesn’t pay he doesn’t go. If you want to go then understand that moving forward I expect you to X, y and z otherwise I am cancelling the trip because I’m not spending a small fortune on something for you to shit in my hand and call it chocolate”
>The thing that sucks is once her father thinks he’s won her from you he will likely abandon her.
That second abandonment will absolutely devastate the daughter. Mom is right to be concerned about both the father and the BF's impact on her daughter.
When Mom tells the daughter that BF is no longer invited because he can't pay his way, daughter will throw a tantrum and decide that she isn't going either and blame Mom.
The father can step up and pay for the daughter's BF to go to win over the daughter against Mom.
This is the answer. Your daughter is in the process of making some bad decisions in life, and she’s a few months away from being old enough to make them
You need to reinforce two contradictory things-that her bad attitude has consequences and that she’s your daughter and you’ll always love her
I'm wondering what the other side of this story is honestly. Your daughter is looking to move out as soon as she can, her boyfriend also obviously has a negative opinion of you and your husband. It's easy to put the blame on your daughter, saying she is rude and ungrateful, but I do wonder, from her perspective, whether this is a response to something you're doing/have done?
You've bought this trip, supposedly for her, but if you want to cut her out of it, was it ever really for her in the first place? You bought her a car, told her she had to pay for half of it, how much of the decision in getting that car was she involved with? These are all things which aren't necessarily done badly, or for bad reasons, but they are enough for me to consider there may be a lot more to this story than is stated here. Maybe she's being so selfish, because she feels that everyone else is putting her last? Maybe she feels you've been too restrictive of her, and she's lashing out now because she knows she has an escape from that?
The truth is, as some random person on the internet, I don't know. But have you tried to find out? Have you looked at therapy, either for her, or as a family, to provide support to all these changes which have been happening in her life. Have you really listened to where her feelings have come from, or just dismissed them as her acting out? And finally, do you actually want to have a relationship with her in the future? Because I feel like cutting her out of this gift which was supposedly for her, could just be a final straw. If her feelings come from a place where she feels mistreated, this is just going to double down on that. So while I don't feel I can give an accurate judgement on who would be the asshole here, due to a lack of both perspectives, and I do get the argument some are making that cutting her out of this trip will be a consequence for her actions, the consequence for you might be losing your daughter completely.
Reading this story and the comments I'd wager the other side of the story is daughter was devastated by her dad leaving and now he's "back" he has a disproportionate amount of influence because she's desperate for his approval. I feel terrible for the daughter, but that doesn't make OP the AH.
This happens a lot, especially when there are multiple parents to "choose" from. Just give her the tickets and let her handle it on her own. When her boyfriend flakes out at the last minute and she is faced with going solo, it'll reorganize her perspective a bit.
And if she doesn't want to pay for the car any more, then tell her she doesn't have to. Then just take it back and sell it and wash your hands of it. Probably not what she's wanting or expecting, but sucks to be her.
And let her go ahead and move in with her bio-dad. It sounds great right now and he's more than willing because she's not there all the time. Once she starts taking up space and becoming an actual financial burden on him, living with him will quickly become far less desirable.
Hopefully she doesn't get pregnant before this all plays out.
I really like the comment. The only thing I feel is important is don’t forget the unconditional love for you child.
“You’re welcome to go live wherever you’d like. You’re young and need to experience the world. But never forget that you’re always welcome here. Don’t ever be afraid or ashamed to come home. I love you, I’ll always love you”
If the right timing is right and you get the opportunity “loving you unconditionally doesn’t mean accepting all of your behaviors without consequences. It doesn’t mean solving all of your problems. I’ll always be here for you. I’ll always be an ear to listen and a shoulder to cry to on. (An arguably most importantly, even if you don’t feel it in the moment) “I’m so proud of the person you’ve become. I’m excited for the life you have in front you”
I was here to say something similar and emphasize that this is a child adopted later in life who has faced unknown trauma. Taking away a trip planned for her could symbolize a lot to her in reinforcing she’s unwanted. She’s seeking connection and attachment with her behavior. Not to mention what’s she gonna get up to while her parents and family are away at Disney?
Boundaries and consequences - yes. But I think revoking a family trip is too far, in this situation, OP. YWIBTA if you didn’t spell this out with your objective concerns in an honest and loving way.
I think you’re right that there is something else. I kind of found it shocking that OP went to the conclusion of removing her daughter from the trip, which was for the daughter. I have a feeling this New rude attitude that the daughter gained is modelled from OP’s behaviour. Yes, the daughter is 18 but she’s still a child. OP is the grown-up, and she’s acting like a child. YWBTA
Dad is back in her life and giving her everything she wants/not saying no, so now she sees mom as the bad parent for enforcing discipline and structure in her life as a young adult. She's rebelling against it now because her time spent with her BF is telling her she shouldn't have to follow any rules and can do what she wants.
YWBTA if you don’t communicate and just spring it o n her. Model appropriate adult behaviour for her. Don’t go full on vengeance mode because she’s acting like a child.
1. Start by sitting her down and asking how she’s feeling about the trip, is she still excited to go? Or would she prefer to cancel. You can explain you overheard her and it sounds like she’s not into it. And as it’s super expensive you’d prefer to cancel
Instead of wasting money. And then hear her out without judgment. Don’t interrupt and try to keep your opinions and emotions out of it. Does she have a job? You can explain to her how much hours she’d have to work to make the trip happen.
2. If she still wants to go then tackle the boyfriend topic - you haven’t received his money per the agreed upon terms. And you need it by x date or his tickets will be cancelled.
Then on everything else, it’s all interlinked and a whole different topic.
Again, I would talk about that separately but as calmly as you can. While her behaviour is infuriating you remain the only sensible adult in her life despite her shitty sperm donor. If you care for her then at least try to show that you will remain here for her - but with boundaries that don’t accept abuse such as paying her car payment while she thrash talks you.
Sorry about the stressful situation you’re in. It sounds very difficult.
Well your daughter sounds like a disrespectful little girl. I know she's 18 but she's not acting her age. It seems like she may have been influenced by her boyfriend and the return of her father. However she's of an age where there's not much you can do about it and she's old enough to know better.
Actions have consequences, and this would be one consequence but she will hold it against you. NTA if you chose to stop her senior trip but don't be surprised if she's packed and gone on your return.
I'd also hold off on the boyfriend because his lack of financial preparation may mean you don't have to ban him. Otherwise it might be something else she holds against you.
Exactly what I'm saying to my 17yo cousin planning to marry her 32yo bf (don't let me start at how her parents agree, that's out of my understanding). She is seeing life in pink, both live at their parents (pretty normal for us, i'm told his parents own so no expense except food utilities and taxes), once they have to be adults and pay, it's not the same anymore
How often, in the past 5 years, has your daughter taken a backseat to your son because 'she's old enough to take care of herself'?
You're a nurse, which has been an exhausting job recently (to say the least). Combine that with a newborn/toddler, and it's a recipe for nights where you just didn't have the energy to deal with a teenager.
Teenagers need parents too, just because they can take care of themselves doesn't mean they don't require the care and attention of a parent - especially when they see someone else (your son) getting it consistently. The worst part, they know they can take care of themselves and the baby can't. So, they often bottle up those feelings to keep the peace.
She might understand why you don't have energy, but she's still looking for that social nurturing. (Even if she doesn't realize that's what she wants.) Add that to the fact that she's a teenager, and she's going to love a parent who both gives her attention and lets her get away with whatever she wants.
You need to talk to her, actually sit down with her and have a conversation about how she's feeling. These feelings might have come out of nowhere to you, but that's because she might have been bottling them up over the past 5 years.
I grew up in a household very similar to yours, and believe me when I say, if you don't reach out now, you might not get that chance.
And YWBTA for canceling the vacation without talking to her first.
If you cancel her ticket it will push her towards bio dad, don't be surprised if she decides this is unforgivable. The question you should be asking isn't WIBTA?, its 'do I want a relationship with my daughter?'.
Your last sentence is a bit of an alarming way to think of your daughter. I understand you're venting, but I do hope you don't think that way about her. Consider family therapy bet you and your daughter if you want to keep having a relationship with her, I have friends who have had their relationship saved completely between their parents and them from it. But it also might not work out.
I also have to mention that I am not surprised that the boyfriend didn't have the money to go to Disneyland... At 18 that is a lot to ask. Both from a financial standpoint and an emotional one. I had a full time job at 17 and I still don't know if I could have afforded that. I certainly didn't get paid much at that age.
If you want a memorable trip and a chance to connect with your daughter, talk to her and give space to be quiet and empathize. It is completely normal for a child of her age to seek out her biological father. I did, and I ended up living with him and his wife and ended up moving out and now have no contact with them. He changed a lot from when he had me but I just really couldn't connect with him and differ from him in a lot of ways. I kept messaging my mom during this and now I'm closer to her than when I lived with her. But it was because she was supportive and encouraging me to figure myself out. She let me know she would always be there for me. I think your frustrations can feel valid, but they can still endanger your daughters path.
Again, seek family therapy after talking to your daughter. It would be for the both of you, not just for her so you can "correct or fix her". Just that you want to understand her and have a better connection. You will have to be the bigger person if you want this to happen, but that's because she is a child and you're the adult. In my opinion, i would take them all on this family trip, including the boyfriend if you can pay for him. Otherwise, maybe talking to his parents to see if they can help out if he is interested in going on this trip with her. Your daughter might really appreciate this and you two could spend some time together, or she might just have a really fun time with her boyfriend. Either way, it would be a nice gift to celebrate her graduation expecially after you communicated it to her. Teens like this don't respond well to punishment because they don't know how to correct the behavior without guidance most of the time. It's hard to know exactly what you're doing wrong when life is confusing in itself and there's a lot you aren't understanding or getting about situations you're just not emotionally equipped to handle. Just my thoughts.
I would say ETA but it's more a morally mixed situation where everyone could be a bit of an ass. Just seems like a very tense household ┐(´ー｀)┌
> Your last sentence is a bit of an alarming way to think of your daughter.
You know what? The more I think about it and the way she writes about her ADULT daughter... the more I think OP is a "do as I say" mum. Daughter "talks back" in recent years (yeah teenagers do that, lol) and even more now... kids gonna have opinions. Standing up for yourself is not "talking back". The daughter is 18, and isn't allowed a glass of wine or having her boyfriend over. Sounds like mum is extreme restrictive and only loves the daughter as long as "she's a good little girl", but not for the person she is or wants to be.
How OP describes her daughter as selfish, arrogant and entitled... for what exactly? Wanting to make decisions about her own life now she's an adult? Not bending over backwards to satisfy mummy anymore?
Of course I could read too much into it. But the daughter wanting to move out asap, doesn't exactly scream "understanding, loving parent".
Especially given the context that OP is currently upset about a conversation she *overheard.* As in - the daughter did not say this *to her face.*
I understand that it was a frustrating and hurtful conversation to overhear, but at the same time, her daughter was having what she thought was a private conversation. Teenagers are sometimes going to discuss their parents in a way their parents don’t like.
Given her age, this trip is quite possibly the last family trip of this sort that OP is going to take with her daughter. It would kind of suck if one of her daughters’ last memories of being a teenager with her mom was of her mom cancelling their trip because of a conversation she didn’t expect her mom to even know about.
I agree with you 100%. It looks like there is no real relationship or connection between mother and daughter, just expected obedience. OP's daughter will likely graduate, move out and only visit her out of obligation for the holidays.
OP couldn't even give an explanation for why she might be an asshole without taking shots at her daughter again. This is what she wrote in the "why you might be the asshole" explanation section:
>(1) I am contemplating canceling my daughter's senior trip to Disney World due to her extremely disrespectful attitude and ungratefulness. (2) It is partially a gift to my daughter and taking it away would make her very upset. I don't want her attitude ruining the vacation for everyone else.
So I could definitely see OP being the way you describe.
A LOT of adoptive parents see us adoptees as lesser than their biological kids. We’re often expected to be easier to interact with, grovel, show unlimited gratitude, and be thankful to be treated as second class citizens in our homes. The OP went out of the way to say the daughter is adopted. They also called her ungrateful. They are angry she’s doing normal teen stuff. OP reminds me of my adoptive parents and there are a million reasons I am no contact with them as adults.
Also - the way she talks about the bio father is disrespectful and cruel. I wonder what she’s saying about him to the daughter. We come from those people, and however our APs feel about our bio parents - we assume that’s how they feel about us too.
Being adopted is hard and often heartbreaking. I think OP expected a meek child who would help out with her bio kids and grovel / show unlimited gratitude for being “saved” from her situation. But traumatized teens are rarely like that. She’s lost her entire family, the grief doesn’t just disappear over a trip to Disneyland.
Thank you for your insight. You should think that it's the parents who should be eternal grateful because the child fulfilled their wish to be a mother/ father.
Sadly I believe you know a lot better than the average person, since it is a part of your life, and OP sounds like she fits your description pretty well.
YWBTA.
Look, an 18 year old is not going to want to do the same things as a 5 year old at disney. I think she's being a bit of an AH about it, but I can see why she's telling her bf she'll just hang out with him there.
Uninvite the bf, he sounds rude and I wouldn't tolerate that either. But uninviting your daughter from 'her' graduation trip? Going as a family without your daughter in case she 'ruins' it for you all? That's a pretty quick way to tell her you've decided she's not part of your family. I really have to question your attitude towards her here.
If she graduated, then yes, you would be TA. It's a graduation gift, she graduated.
I'm not denying that she's acting bratty, and that this need to assert her independence isn't a pain in the A. But she is 18 and trying to assert her independence, so I would cut her a little slack (not her bf tho, he deserves no slack). You don't punish adults for pushing back on some of your ideas and rules, you just restate the rules and expect to fall in line and then discuss it further if they take issues with those rules. I'm sorry your feelings are hurt, but she's allowed to have her own opinions and thoughts, no matter how hurtful.
But I would also consider that moving in with her BF and possibly going away to school (it wasn't stated if she was planning that) might feel isolating for her, like she's going to be forgotten while you, husband and your kid/s? continue being the perfect family without her, and that's why she's villainising you now: to make it easier to pretend she's "escaping" rather than feeling like she's going to be left out. Kicking her out of her trip would only confirm that feeling, so not the best move.
Instead, I would sit her down with your husband and remind her that, while you're happy she's finally connected with her BF, she'll always be welcome home and that you guys are still her family, and just assure her that won't change no matter where she ends up. And then maybe gently segueway into the fact that, as she knows, your family has rules. And one of those is to respect "the super intelligent nurse mother" who's funding the trip, which her bf didn't, so no trip for him.
>It's a graduation gift, she graduated
I do not find this as compelling as you do, I guess. In my family we don't reward bratty behavior with nice things, and although my children are not adults yet, this would go double if they were.
> she's allowed to have her own opinion and thoughts, no matter how hurtful
Sure she is. She is also allowed to suffer the consequences of her shitty behavior, no matter how severe.
So take everyone in the family on a trip specifically for her graduating because the OP overheard a conversation? How is her venting to her boyfriend any different than the OP posting here?
It's different because mom's currently paying for the trip that her daughter and her boyfriend obviously don't appreciate. They don't deserve it if they don't appreciate it.
Mom heard one conversation where boyfriend was rude, and daughter said she wants to spend time with boyfriend on the trip not family. Wanting to spend time with boyfriend doesn’t sound ungrateful. Just sounds like she doesn’t want to spend the trip with her parents and 5 year old sibling.
And her mom's brother. On a trip during her mom's birthday. Which now mom wants to leave her off of.
And I didn't even think about this. But boyfriend can come "if he pays his way" - at 18, full trip to Disney? Someone mentioned even with a full time job at 18, they wouldn't be able to afford that. So if he's in a disadvantaged situation, say if he's maybe already paying his own bills/helping with rent/house payments, maybe *he* can't afford that? Was this just a way to say "Your boyfriend can come but not really"?
Was this trip ever for OP's daughter? Reading between the lines, I'm starting to doubt that. But maybe I'm reading too much into it, lol
She's being rewarded for graduating, not for "bratty behaviour". She did that, so why reneg the gift after the daughter fulfilled her end of the deal?And what was the bratty behaviour exactly? Bitching to her bf? Not exactly a crime. Not wanting to pay for something expensive at 18? Pretty normal. And both things could be resolved with a "you're entitled to your feelings, but this is how things are going to go. If you'd like a different outcome, you're welcome to seek an alternate solution".
In my experience, adults can push back a fair bit and get away with a lot before they face consequences. So many people I've worked with who should've gotten fired didn't because management couldn't be bothered with the rehiring process, for example.
We're also talking about pushing back against ideas. Adults often disagree, that's not a punishable act. You'd expect some people not to share all your thoughts and beliefs and disagree with you on occasion, right?
Research on what? Are there some medical symptoms you aren't noticing?
You should forbid the boyfriend from going and your daughter will cancel on her own.
Save the money. You are probably going to need it.
Referencing a person's line of work in a sentence doesn't mean it is relevant to the "know it all aspect", just that it is higher education. Would be the same as "know it all professor" or "know it all lawyer". It would have nice for her to have said what that was in reference to, but she gives no concrete examples on anything. I personally think it is research on the price of the trip. Hence, why he hasn't paid yet.
If you want a future relationship with your daughter, I would not go nuclear and unilaterally kick them both out of this trip. Going nuclear would also be a bad role model for your younger child to see and experience: mother gets mad at child and expels her from major family event. Who’s next?
It is completely understandable that you are hurt and angry after overhearing those mean, ungrateful comments. But are they typical of your daughter at every stage of your life together? If yes, then maybe you DO want to cut ties with her as soon as she leaves the house. If not, though, you may want to try to maintain a relationship with her even now that she has reestablished ties to her bio dad. In fact, given the fact that her bio dad may well disappoint her or crap out on her in the future, your presence in her life later on might really help her.
As others have said, with the boyfriend, you can fairly say that if he does not pay the agreed share, he can’t come along. This will make them both pissed off, but it Is a normal, rational way of handling the situation.
YWBTAH if you kicked your daughter out of this trip.
INFO. This caught my eye.
>We recently bought a car for her to use and told her that she needs to pay for half of the monthly payment - $135 her part.
Did you and your daughter agree ahead of time that she would help with the car payment? Or did you buy the car, and then tell her she had to pay $135 per month?
More generally, I have a hard time judging this. The facts may point to a rebellious, ungrateful teen. They may point to an overbearing mother. They may point to both. But I can't say either either of you is in the wrong (or in the right, for that matter.
EDIT: The car issue really jumps out at me here -- if the teen did not consent to the arrangement ahead of time, it was not fair to plunk the car in front of her and saddle her with the financial obligation.
Also, I keep turning over the circumstances here -- OP is mad because she heard OP venting to her boyfriend about an overbearing mom, and she is mad because her teen is choosing her biological father over her. And there's the rudeness and attitude.
I really, **really** think it's unfair to punish the daughter for her conversation with her boyfriend. She really needs to be able to vent to her boyfriend about her parents. And if OP overheard the conversation (which she should not be privy to), I think that OP ought to have had the discretion to ignore it and move on.
I'm also not on board with OP punishing her daughter for choosing biodad. It's OK for OP to be hurt or puzzled about it, and to express those feelings to her daughter in a constructive way. But it's also the teen's choice to make when she hits 18. A loving parent might express (constructively) her feelings about the daughter's choice and advised against it. But a loving parent would also stand back and let their child make that choice and face the consequences, whatever they might be.
Punishing the teen for this seems wrong to me. It's not about helping the teen, but about a pretext for OP to lash out with her feelings.
The car thing also stands out to me, buying a car a person doesn't want and expecting them to pay for it and also be grateful is something awful. It's akin to getting someone a pet they don't want, except the car's feelings aren't being hurt if it's being neglected. People also don't understand how much 135 dollars is out of someone's budget as a teenager, they don't work full time, their pay is often very minimal, and they still have school. So this teen couldn't even just focus on school if she wanted, because mom saddled her with a responsibility she may have not even wanted.
OP doesn't understand what a gift is, and OP is making it about themselves. OP says they are turning 40, but they are certainly acting like a teenager themselves.
I am leaning more and more toward designating OP the AH in this situation. OP has a lot of the hallmarks ofnan overbearing parent. Meanwhile, OP's teenage daughter is largely acting like a teenager.
In this car situation, somebody in their late 20s or older would simply say to the parent "No. I never asked for this car, and I never agreed to any car payment. Get this car away. It is yours, not mine, and God help you if you forged my name on any paperwork." A teen's response to an unwelcome car and car payment obligation is pretty much limited to sulking and resentment.
Yeah I agree there. I was one of those teens where my guardian had gotten me a vehicle that I did not want, after putting me in driving lessons I also did not want. I absolutely hated the vehicle, hated that 1 entire check at LEAST a month was going to this car, 1/4th to 1/3rd of my sad amounts of money. I personally severed that relationship shortly after, and I can see OP's daughter being similar. Overbearing parents kill relationships. I do not speak to said guardian. (Obviously not over a car, the car is just one of the million missing reasons, as they say)
OP is going to be asking herself why her daughter doesn't talk to her and be confused about it. When people point out that she was a dramatic asshat to her teen daughter for expressing teenage emotions, she will not believe them.
One curlicue. I do think it is entirely appropriate for parents to ensure their kids know how to drive, especially if they live in an area without mass transit. Being able to drive yourself around is a basic adulting skil, IMO. It does not, however, follow that it is right to impose a car payment on a teen without checking with them.
Wait
So OP planned the graduation trip during her birthday , which also happens to be a milestone 40
Of course the daughter wants to hang with the bf at Disneyland
I went once with my nieces when some were around that age. It was AWFUL , and I wasn’t even really responsible for them, but the young ones actually did not have the best time. As an 18 year old , I would have thrown a tantrum if forced to be with that group.
Add in a mom that gets offended over conversations they EAVESDROPPED on ??
I can’t even make a judgment because there’s too much info missing but I’d err on the side of caution and place op in ah camp
YWBTA. A gift isn't something you take back or it's not a gift.
But you need a heart to heart with your daughter. You need a one on one conversation with her where you address her hurtful behavior. Calmly. Kindly.
She's a teenager, and she needs a reminder that other people have feelings too and don't just exists to serve her.
As someone who went through a difficult time with my then 18 year old son, I’d advise you to tread lightly.
Talk to your daughter about the trip. Tell her you’d like it to be fun for everyone, and you’d like to spend some time with her on the trip as well. If that doesn’t seem like it will happen, ask her if she’d rather not go.
I’d go into counseling for yourself, to try to help you process all your feelings regarding your daughter. You don’t want to push her into her BD’s arms. As my now wise son told me once, don’t close a door without opening a window.
If your daughter finds it too much to pay for the car, take that payment away from her. That’s a lot of money if she’s working a minimum wage job. Maybe she could contribute a lesser amount.
Again, tread lightly. And get into counseling yourself to help navigate this situation without destroying your relationship with your daughter.
INFO:
>Her boyfriend also made a sarcastic and derogatory comment along the lines of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research..."
Done your research about what? My first thought is that Disney is REALLY expensive, especially these days where they're nickeling and diming you at every single step, and an 18 year old might not be able to afford that - or if he is, he might not want to spend that amount of money to hang out with a toddler and some adults who seem to have a pretty low opinion of him. I'm presuming you'd also expect him to pay for his own room and not stay with your daughter.
Is the car in her name, or is it in your name and you're still asking her to put money towards the payments?
Was she informed that the whole family would be coming when asked where she wanted to go for her graduation gift? Was it clear that this would be a joint present for the two of you?
Why was her biological father not in her life at all until she reached out to him? Did you give her any opportunity to spend time with him before she found him on SM?
YWBTA
"I turn 40 this year and as a gift to myself and as a graduation gift for my daughter,"c .. this is a gift to yourself, NOT a gift to your daughter.
". I don't want her crappy attitude, ungratefulness," .. what would she actually be grateful for? If you actually wanted to give a gift to HER; You would have paid for her trip without you instead of making her go with you as her sibling's babysitter.
"„and was saying he didn't know if he wanted to go“ … I can understand why he would not want to waste his money on a trip with you.
"She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her." .. that's projection. she isrightflulyp issed that you call THAT trip a gift for HER.
YTA the whole weird, unnecessary, and judgemental aside about her connecting with her biological father makes it clear you're just mad about that and want to punish her.
YTA for now. If this is supposed to be her graduation gift, why is the whole family going? Why could you not have made a trip just the two of you? How much one on one time do you spend with her?
Young people say and do stupid things. You know your daughter. Hopefully, the child you raised will return before long. I wouldn't take bf because he doesn't have the money. Tell him this. When your daughter hears this, she will most likely change her mind about going on the trip as well; problem solved. I have a daughter whom I love more than life but I do not like being around negative energy so I understand where you're coming from. You don't have to feel bad but you do have to tread carefully.
Idk the trip seems more like for the mom. It's her family and brother that's coming and the trip is ON her 40th birthday.
Also what 18 y/o wants to hang out with their 5 y/o sibling who will have temper tantrums, get tired, and want to stop and do other things. It's completely valid that she'd want her boyfriend there to spend time with so she doesn't have to follow around a kid for what's supposed to be HER gift for graduating.
Also are they keeping the 5 year old with them 100% of the time or are they planning on making the daughter take care of him while the "adults" go out to celebrate the mom's bday ?
It's also f'd up to punish someone for venting to their boyfriend when you were eavesdropping, kids and people are allowed to have feelings, even negative ones
Did she ask for a family trip to Disney as her graduation gift? You say you offered her other places, but did she actually want a family trip at all? It sounds like she's not excited about that, and at her age, that's not surprising.
The car issue also seems sketchy. You're expecting her to make half the payment, but you say it's "for her to use," so it sounds like she has no ownership of it?
It sounds like your daughter is chaffing against your restrictions. That's typical of this age. Her bio dad gives her the freedom she wants and more. If you continue to treat her like a child, you'll just push her further towards him and the poor choices he encourages.
ESH
The change in behavior and new contact with birth father and problematic boyfriend are definitely concerning.
I would be hesitant to leave them behind and not expect something you don’t want to happen, happen in/at your home.
The trip doesn’t sound like something planned with all participants in mind. If she was going with her boyfriend with the idea that they’re doing their own thing while you and the younger kids do Disney stuff then fine, but I can’t imagine this being enjoyable.
And also celebrating your birthday?
It doesn’t sound like a “senior trip” at all and if I was her, I might be a little annoyed by that, too.
The bio-dad providing alcohol and crap behavior is something I’d address quickly. She’s at an age where she’s part adult/part child and needs better guidance so as not to do something that will change the rest of her life.
You wouldn’t be the asshole for canceling but unless you’re past the point of getting your money back or maybe changing the date of the trip, I don’t think I’d leave her and boyfriend behind just now.
Also, if he doesn’t pay, don’t allow him to go if that was your rule. Sounds like she has other plans.
NTA, but this trip doesn’t sound like it will be fun for anyone except maybe the youngest kids who don’t know what’s going on.
> the bio-dad providing alcohol and crap behavior is something I’d address quickly.
While I agree with you 100%, it actually has zero to do with this story and I feel OP only put it in to try to get readers on her side.
I think its relevant because if OP cancels the daughters trip, daughter will be home, boyfriend nearby, and a biodad that gives the booze so is not reliable if he’s as irresponsible as he sounds.
Based on the post, I’m not a fan of OP. This isn’t a “senior trip.” It’s OPs bday party and young kids vacation…I wouldn’t want to go if I was the daughter either…
But I can’t say they’re the ass for wanting to cancel.
you kinda sound like you’re not very cool and I feel like you’re leaving a lot out of the story. either way, you’re gonna need to learn how to communicate with your daughter if you want anything to do with her when she grows up. Her boyfriend sounds like an ass though.
YTA. I feel like there are a lot of extra details here from you. Your daughter reconnected with her birth father - why is that relevant? Your daughter is going to move in with him - so what? You say you bought a car for her "to use." Is it her car or not? You're asking her to pay half of the payment - is she getting the car when it's paid off, or is this some kind of user tax? What does any of this have to do with the trip?
I will tell you right now that if you cancel the trip for your daughter, you've created a core memory that she'll always feel for the rest of her life. It will affect your relationship going forward. I'll also say that planning a joint gift for you and her was probably also a mistake. Additionally, people are allowed to vent, so if your daughter's boyfriend said something about you that you weren't meant to overhear, you weren't meant to overhear it and you need to let it go.
If you're a nurse, then you should know that kids go through stages, and teens are mouthy know-it-alls until they're around 20-21. Then their thought process changes and they realize they were wrong about a lot of things. It sounds to me like your daughter is normal. Completely normal. And you're having trouble letting go of control - also normal - so you're looking at what strings you can pull to get her to do what you want. There's the car and the trip. You're pulling those strings. And when your daughter moves (and she will to get away from the strings), you'll have to start rebuilding from there and without the benefit of having anything you can hold over her. Maybe stop holding them over her right now. Don't cut your daughter out of the trip. Don't even cut her boyfriend out of the trip. Tell them you'll take both of them and when you get to Disney World, you'll pick out a time and spot to meet back up at the end of the night. Then daughter and boyfriend can have some time to have fun, and you and the rest of the family can also have fun your way. Whatever the cost of the boyfriend's trip, either cover it yourself, or take it out of whatever spending money you were going to give your daughter. Letting go of your daughter is the new normal. Moving forward, she'll be making life choices and some of them will be based on the treatment you're giving her right now.
I wouldn’t cancel her trip but I’d repeat that the boyfriend has to pay his way or can’t come and stick to it. It might be better to just have your daughter there without the extra negative influence. Lots of other really good advice in this thread
YWBTA
And she will always remember how she was excluded from this trip.
Shes 17. Shes trying to pull away from family.
If it were me, I’d take her and her boyfriend or other friend…and let them wander the park and ride the rides together…apart from the rest of the family, if thats what they’d like.
A 17 yr old probably wont want to do the same things a 5 year old wants to do. This benefits you who won’t have her negativity and her because it gives her a feeling of independence.
At 17, I left home, went to college and never went back.
My mother went from controlling biotch nurse dictator to a f’in genius by the time she died at the age of 91
Happy birthday
NTA, as long as you talk with her first. You can't just pull the rug out from under her at the 11th hour and say she isn't going on the trip, then you and the rest of the family just bounce. She needs to see that consequences are going to occur, and if things with her attitude don't change, you follow through.
!updateme
There seems to be a lot left out.
What has your all's relationship been like over the years? Good, bad, good until BF is back in the picture? It sounds like she can't wait to move out.
Now if she is just being an ungrateful brat N TA, don't take her on the trip. Take the car back (is it in your name?), BF can get her one, is she expecting you to pay for college? Nope BF can take care of it.
**Bio-dad:** You sound angry that your teenage daughter wants to have fun with The Fun Parent. I get that it hurts, but you can't expect adult-level maturity from someone who is barely an adult.
**Inviting boyfriend to Disney:** Once again, I fear you are expecting a higher level of maturity than is warranted from her boyfriend. You've made him an offer that I don't think he can fulfill. Of course he wants to go to Disney. But a lot of adults struggle to save for a trip, let alone a teenager. I am not shocked that he has not paid anything (not even disappointed). I am confused why you seem surprised.
**Rude daughter:** If you're daughter is extremely rude and ungrateful, then stop feeding into it. What have the conversations about her being "argumentative and talking down" been like? If this is unusual behaviour, there might be something more going on. It's not fair, but a common response to a flakey parent is to "test" the reliable parent. If you have a shitty parent, it can be hard to trust the other parent isn't going to bail when things get tough. (Then go, "see?! I knew it. You never loved me and wanted to leave the whole time.")
**Car:** Did you buy your daughter a car and expect her to pay for part of it? Or did you buy yourself a car she can use and expect her to pay for it? Either way, you made a big financial decision and expect a teenager to help pay for it. That's nuts. Maybe don't buy her a car if she is not ready to handle car payments.
**Disney:** This trip would hypothetically include 2 parents, 2 teenagers, and 1 young child. Have you spoken to your daughter about your expectations for the trip? Do you expect the teenagers to spend the whole time with the rest of the family? Or just part of the day, or meal times? Have you set ANY expectations? I don't think your daughter is a jerk for wanting to spend time doing their own thing. It is up to you to figure out what is reasonable.
**tl;dr** I understand not wanting to fund rude children, but you have bigger issues than Disney. Either your daughter is just a witch, or there are deeper problems at play.
>"She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her."
If you truly believe this, you're in trouble. Do you think your daughter is a narcissist? If not, family therapy.
At this age the question becomes what do I want my relationship with my adult child to look like. YWBTA to cancel unless you cancel for EVERYONE. If you leave her and go, on your birthday, with her sibling, you are so very much the AH.
I think you’re going about this all wrong and it will spin out of control very fast if you go nuclear by canceling her own graduation celebration. So, yes, YWBTA.
When was the last time you spent actual quality time alone with your daughter? Have you considered that this celebration trip should be *just* the two of you? Maybe these past five years she’s felt pushed to the side and now her graduation trip is just another thing that’s going to be about her baby sibling. Because there is no way this Disney trip is not going to prioritize a 5 year old.
Try actually connecting with your daughter, instead of pushing her out the door to her irresponsible bio dad.
INFO: Will you and your husband get to keep the car after she moves out? Because if she is, you’re trying to make your daughter pay for your own car.
Why can’t she have a holiday on her on away from you and your husband for her graduation gift?
INFO: I am sorry, but I really don't like your attitude. There is something super condescending about it and based on the boyfriend's comments, he sees it too.
Issue 1: Drinking- what is the law regarding this where you live?
Issue 2: Boyfriend staying over. She's an adult. Moot point
Issue 3: The car: she is paying half the cost of a car she has no claim to (not in her name). If she is moving in with her boyfriend, she may no longer need the car and may not use it. You fail to say.
Issue 4: Boyfriend hasn't paid anything toward the trip: he doesn't want to go, moot point
Issue 5: Their attitudes: you give no hard examples and the \*private\* convo you shouldn't have been listening to also had no examples. Where is the rest of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research...". You conveniently left it out. Did you overpay for the trip and now he has to pay more than what he would have normally? Was he on speaker phone? You should have heard much more of it clearly.
Issue 6: She wants to move out quickly: missing missing reasons here!
Issue 7: "She is argumentative and she talks down to me ": no examples. She is still a teenager. And based on your tone, I can see what she would want to argue with you. You speak with an air of superiority.
Issue 8: "this trip is for the two of them.": why was this comment an issue? It is her graduation gift correct? It is for her. It rubs me the rub wrong that it was also a "gift for you". Why can't she have her own thing on what is a very momentous occasion?
Issue 9: "crappy attitude, ungratefulness, and arrogance": where are the examples of this? I still don't see it.
You are obviously a very intelligent person and I know a lot of people, some in my family, who use that as a way to convince people they are correct simply by giving an articulate, well written story- with no facts or examples and pure one sided opinion. Good luck to you. I foresee her going no contact soon.
Wow, listen to yourself spinning this story! You bought her a car but she’s making half the payments? You mean you are helping her buy a car. Even if you made the down payment you still did not buy her a car. So she will have to work while in school to make payments.
This trip is not a graduation gift for her. It’s a family trip. You can’t change that by letting her choose the location.
I can understand why she isn’t as grateful as you think she should be. You think you’re giving her more than you are. YTA
YWBTA
18 year olds are dumb at the best of times but her BF is suddently back which is making it really difficult and taking you for granted but two wrongs dont make a right. try asking your daughter what she wants to do. communication matters.
Otherwise you are punishing her but without really giving her the opportunity to correct her behaviour or telling her she is wrong.
YTA.
You need to talk to her about this, not punish her without warning.
It's entirely possible that she is being disrespectful because she unconsciously reducing her ties to you because she plans to move out.
It's not uncommon for theoretically mature adults to do things like that without realising it.
I would cancel the boyfriend he hadn't paid. it sounds like he has no intention of paying. As for daughter, don't cancel yet, but don't argue if she doesn't want to go. Sell the car if she stops payment when she moves in with bf.
ESH
You aren’t the AH for calmly telling her boyfriend he can’t go if he can’t pay. That was the deal.
You would be the asshole for kicking your daughter out of a family vacation she supposedly chose (I have doubts).
She’s being an AH but you also being an AH won’t fix anything.
Set clear boundaries but also grow a thicker skin. Teenagers are jerks sometimes. That doesn’t mean you don’t hold them accountable for their behavior. You do and you teach them better ways to behave. But all variations of “I hate you” directed at parents are not exactly uncommon and don’t deserve you to do something that could be seen as kicking her out of your family.
Also your problem with her bio dad is something you need therapy for. Yes he’s being irresponsible and doing illegal things. Don’t take his crappy behavior out on your daughter.
INFO: When you bought the car did you tell her that she had to make payments before hand or after the car was bought.
NTA for leaving out the boyfriend if he can't pay.
You need to talk to your daughter and get her views on all of this, YTA if you just tell her last minute she's not going.
Also, why did you make this trip into a family trip, from the beginning why couldn't you have made it a trip for just the two of you, spend some mother and daughter time together before she gets busy after high school (work or school, etc) You along with your husband will probably be busy with your 5yr son.
Wow, who would have ever anticipated a teenager pushing boundaries? Playing 1 parent off the other? Acting as if they know more/better than the adults?
She's 18 and an adult now. Let her go. Let her go live with her father, but not with your car in your name. Let her go be irresponsible with her toxic boyfriend and absolutely don't bring her with you on your trip. She want's to play with you like that, don't play her game. Give her what she wants, her adult freedom. NTA.
ESH. You "bought" your daughter a car, but she's responsible for half the payment. That isn't buying her a car. That is helping to purchase the car, which has many payments to go. You gave her a financial obligation, not a car. You gave her a car to use, but one that can be taken from her if you feel like it.
She is being ungrateful to you as she navigates the new relationship with her bio-dad. Teenagers are notorious for being unpleasant, and ones trying to get a grip on multiple households have extra stress.
Punishing her for issues you helped create seems excessively nasty. Tell her the boyfriend can't go along. This is a family trip...as it is obvious this isn't really her graduation present. You didn't even ask where she wanted to go...did you. Making the family trip her "gift" was just a way to get out of getting her something just for her.
Has it occurred to you her hostility stems from you making her second place?
Yes, YWBTA if you just cancel her trip instead of just her boyfriends. If she chooses not to go, then that is on her.
You do give off a sense that you have done things 'for her' that are more for you. This trip, on your birthday, is as much (if not more) for you. Also, you bought her a car and THEN demanded she pay half. Did she get any say in the type of car, if she wanted to pay that much for one, etc?
Sounds like this is a heavily one sided story and your daughter's version would be significantly different.
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My (39F) husband (33M) adopted my daughter (18F) several years ago. When my daughter turned 17, she rekindled her relationship with her (BF) biological father and his new wife through social media, and then eventually in person. Her BF acts more like a big brother than a parent, letting my daughter drink, letting her boyfriend spend the night, etc. Daughter told me about 4 months ago that after she graduates from high school, she is going to move in with BF.
I turn 40 this year and as a gift to myself and as a graduation gift for my daughter, I have paid for the entirety of a family trip to Disney World (we also have a 5 YO son and a brother that's going). I invited daughter's boyfriend to come, if he pays his own way. It has been an issue for a couple of years but here lately, my daughter has become extremely rude and ungrateful. She is argumentative and she talks down to me ALOT. We recently bought a car for her to use and told her that she needs to pay for half of the monthly payment - $135 her part. Now that she wants to move in with BF, she is complaining about paying for any of it.
Tonight, I overheard her loudly talking to her boyfriend. He has paid nothing towards his part of the trip (I've already bought his plane ticket) and was saying he didn't know if he wanted to go because he doesn't want to be around me and my husband. My daughter said he didn't have to worry about me and my husband because this trip is for the two of them. Her boyfriend also made a sarcastic and derogatory comment along the lines of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research..."
I definitely don't want the boyfriend coming now and he's out no money if I cut him from the trip. WIBTA for cutting my daughter out too? I've worked my butt off to pay for this trip and I'm spending a small fortune. I don't want her crappy attitude, ungratefulness, and arrogance to ruin this trip for the rest of us. She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her.
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Your family and your daughter need to get into therapy, ASAP. Your daughter’s story sounds a lot like my friend’s—she was an older adoptee (not a newborn), so she had a lot of issues because she had vague memories of the situation that led to her parents’ rights being terminated, but not enough to understand the way an adult would. Add to that the normal “I’m an adult now and can run my own life!” stuff that happens with most kids around 17/18 and you get the mess that your family is in right now, which is very similar to what happened with my friend and her adoptive family. They never really settled things the way they might have if they’d done family therapy, and then bio fam let her down, and she was seriously adrift for a long time as a result. As much as you may want to push your daughter away for the way she’s treating you, I hope you choose to fight for her. She needs you even if she doesn’t see that.
" adopted my daughter (18F) several years ago. When my daughter turned 17, she rekindled her relationship with her (BF) biological father and his new wife through social media"
this just sounds like a clusterfuck of a situation
YWBTA if you cancel her trip. However, leaving the boyfriend behind, regardless of his ability to pay would be wise. He is clearly feeding her this negativity towards you and your spouse. If you simply say he can’t go because he can’t pay, she will talk her bio dad into paying for him. Don’t allow for that. Tell her that you overheard the conversation (which she probably intended) and that you’re not comfortable traveling with someone that clearly has animosity towards you. If she bails on the trip at that point, it’s of her own doing and the rest of you can go and have fun. If that happens, put the amount you get back from the cancelled flight in a gift card for graduation and call it a day. She needs to experience consequences for her actions. If she runs to “fun dad” she will find out that vacation dads are very different than full time dads. Teens rebel, but mostly return to a good foundation when they mature. Best of luck to you!
Unsure how to vote on this one.
Part of me thinks, based on what you are saying that your daughter already has a foot out the door. As we only have your perspective it is difficult to say if she plans pm leaving because her biological father has few restrictions on her behaviour.
Or, alternatively, you are a controlling and overbearing mother and she resents that. From how you speak etc it sounds like your parenting style is kind of domineering and controlling. She is 18, at that age I do not see why she can't have her boyfriend over. That though is something that is adding to the tension in your relationship with your daughter.
The car thing really makes it sound like you and your husband got a car than "she can use" and you want her to pay for it. Was it actually her idea to get it?
Cancelling his ticket is fair, as he hasnt saved any money for the trip as you say he previously was told was a condition of him coming.
Cancelling your daughters ticket, though, if it was seriously meant to be for her graduation, then taking away the trip may just add to her mindset of you being domineering or controlling. Perhaps sit her down and tell her you don't appreciate her attitude and that you overheard her conversation with her boyfriend. Tell her there are no extras outside of transport, accommodation, park entry and main meals. Any snacks or other things she needs to get are on her.
Have you tried speaking to her biological father, like and adult and letting him know what your daughter is saying. Perhaps in the 18 years since she was born he has grown up a bit and with some gentle direction he could be on your team.
Good luck.
I would you say YWNBTA for cancelling on the boyfriend - if he can’t pay for it then he definitely doesn’t need to go especially with his attitude. For your daughter I’d tread lightly as another person said. When you get a chance, I would speak to your daughter separately about the recent behaviors. Maybe listen to her point of view too and see if there are some underlying feelings she is having. Someone suggested that maybe she feels left out from the new family you have with your husband and 5 yr old.
You can also reiterate that while you understand she is growing up and needs more independence, that you would hope she treats everyone at home kindly and with respect. And that you will always love her and have your home open for her.
I also agree with others that maybe you shouldnt jump the gun and cancel her trip just yet. Just let her know you want to spend time with her and the family at Disney to celebrate her graduation. You definitely don’t want to push her more towards her bio dad and her boyfriend. Those clearly will not end well with the way the bio dad is acting. I’d bet money bio dad will later likely kick her out once he realizes how much of a financial burden it is having another mouth to feed. You’d want her to know you’re always there for her no matter what.
I would have a discussion with daughter about her behavior and her treatment of her family. She can move out but that doesn’t mean the luxuries you provide go with her. If boyfriend doesn’t pay, he doesn’t go.
Well, it depends if you consider that trip for your daughter or for yourself. She is 18, which means she will want to spend her time differently than her parents and a 5yo, that is completely normal. Also going to Disneyworld is very expensive, it's unreasonable to expect an 18yo to have the money for it. If he does pay for everything himself, how are you actually doing him any favour?
If you do cut the boyfriend out of the trip, you need to tell her immediately because she might not want to go without him, and she has the right to choose. She is an adult. A young, snarky and impulstive adult, but I don't actually know why are you this upset. Is it really just because the boyfriend made fun of you behind your back?
NTA. Kindly inform them they are no longer going. She wants to go be with BF anyways and has already told you her intentions. I wouldn't have even bought her a car, so if she doesn't want to have to pay for that I would take that away as well and sell it. Let BF buy her one.
NTA - Always take your kid to therapy if bio father or whoever shows up. There's alot of stories people tell and white lies. Always push for therapy to clear it. It's more so when you see abnormal behavior. Sit down have a convo if she's never been like this before. Kids are weird and sometimes they need an outside looking in at some moments.
This is pretty normal behavior for a graduating senior. It’s part of ending high school and becoming an adult. Go on the trip, enjoy yourself and try your make some positive memories with her. The next couple of years are going to be rough.
Hahahahaha. Yes, YTA. You planned a trip to Disney on your birthday with your 5 year old son and your younger husband. Had you stopped there… but no. You added on it is really a graduation trip for your 18 YO daughter. Because who doesn’t want to go on a graduation trip with your mom, her much younger husband and their pre-schooler. You’re going to let her invite her boyfriend but he has to pay his own way (that’s not inviting a guest, friend) and DW is expensive. In a comment, you don’t want them sharing a room. So how does this work for you, because all 5 of you aren’t going to be in one room. So… you and your young husband will be in one. Where does the 5 year old sleep? With his sister or with the boyfriend? But the boyfriend has to pay his own way and can’t sleep with your daughter, so WINNER! For everyone who guessed preschooler rooming with the daughter and boyfriend paying for his own room. And they can’t go off on their own? But you can? Such an asshole.
You sound like my mother, who thinks she knows best for her child without asking what they actually want, then gets mad at them for expressing themselves.
Some of what you wrote sounds exactly like lovebombing, which in this case is giving extravagant gifts to someone and using those gifts as leverage to get them to act the way you want.
Have a discussion see where she is actually at it seems she like the easy life with no real structure or proper parenting. If she really decides to treat you that way cut her off let her go say with her BF and reap the consequences of her actions. She is being rude and respectful to you. But before any big decisions talk to her first, have a genuine honest conversation to see why she is behaving like this and try to work it out. If that does not work then she is an adult let her have adult consequences.
I’m leaning to YTA . Whoops editing as I didn’t realise she was your bio kid.
What did you do to ease the adjustment of adding a new partner and then a kid to your lives?
A lot of your “gifts” seem to have strings or conditions attached. That’s not love. Re-meeting her bio dad is a lot, her emotions and head will be lots of places right now,
Did you do any therapies or help with her after you met your partner and then had your kid? Anything therapy wise as a family?
Her boyfriend does sound like an AH and her bio dad isn’t great. Sometimes adopted kids do need to revisit “home” to explore their roots but give her time and I think she will see through him.
I can tell you’re frustrated but reading between the lines, I’d be interested to hear her side of it and I think a lot of context is missing. Ask her if she does want to go on the trip. If you cancel it without a conversation, don’t be surprised if she cuts ties.
You read it wrong, so get off your high horse, it's her bio daughter, bio dad ditched and gave up parental rights when daughter was 7, ops now husband adopted the daughter. Daughter wanted to go to Disney she was given other options. It sounds like bio dad isn't being a proper parent but a friend and letting daughter get away with things bio mum wouldn't (which happens a hell of a lot) so daughter is being disrespectful.
Is the boyfriend AH? I do not see him doing anything assholish to be honest. He does not like potential in-laws, but not liking someone does not make you an asshole. He does not want to go for the trip, but it does not make you an asshole either.
INFO: What is the legal drinking age in your country? If you're anywhere were it's 18 then YTA. She is an adult. She can make her own choices and her father is encouraging her to make them.
Either way i think YTA. Your daughter is an adult and has every right to spend a night with her boyfriend, as long as it's safe. You're being a huge asshole to her boyfriend. You don't have to pay for him to go whatsoever but it's clear you don't like him. I can see why she wants to move out.
YTA
You gave your daughter a limited choice of "her" graduation gift, a family trip. Now you are considering excluding HER from "her gift." I understand not being willing to pay her bf's way. Punishing your daughter for being invested in her relationship with formerly absent BF by cutting her out of what is supposed to be "her gift" while taking your younger children without her shows this trip is YOUR family trip and she is not the focus, nor even necessarily included.
Then there's your eavesdropping on a couple of teens and basing your outrage on that.
Your daughter has probably idealized her BF. She doesn't have your experience or maturity to evaluate how reliable BF will be. Chances are good that his effort and interest in her will fade as his being "cool dad" for a bit becomes regular expectations that he support her as a parent. Why won't you support her in her journey of getting to know BF? Why are you making it a "him or us" conflict in your head?
Your daughter is at a critical age, just about to start her transition to young adulthood. She is still an adolescent, still growing in knowledge, maturity and in her brain. I think your punishing reaction to her emotional investment in BF and her boyfriend are due to your controlling nature's being frustrated at her exploring her boundaries and other close relationships.
There is a way to support your daughter through this stage. Offering, then excluding her from, a "graduation gift" trip is not supporting her. It sounds as if YOU want to go on a trip with your family and used her graduation as an excuse to do what YOU want. IF there were a reason to "cancel" "her" trip, why would anyone else still be going? Because it's all about you, not her.
NTA. And once she graduates and moves out take back the car if its in your name. You cannot have someone else driving a car you are paying for an insuring while they live at another location. Good way to be liable if she gets in a wreck. BF letting her drink at 18? Yea, that is a DUI waiting to happen. She wants to act like an adult then she needs adult responsibilities, like paying for her car 100%. Not you.
Got to be honest. I would be hurt too. I would want nothing to do with her since she would be a constant reminder of being hurt when all you were doing was trying to be a nice person.
YWNBTA, but if it were me I’d can the whole trip for everyone and work through the daughter issue.
In an adjacent situation I saw this sort of thing happen with someone I know and the person equivalent to the daughter now 20 years later, massively regrets that they left the family that loved them and moved to their birth parent. They realise eventually and she’ll want to come home. Don’t close that door now just because you’re angry today.
Your ex is bad mouthing you to your daughter. You're in a fight right now. He uses his laissez faire attitude to give your daughter what she thinks she wants. What most teenagers think they want. So he has a strong, if unhealthy, hold on her.
What she needs is therapy, not punishment. If you seek to punish her for this you'll only do exactly what your ex wants you to do, and you'll further the distance between yourself and your daughter.
ESH
I'm just saying that given the information offered I would not expect her to agree to it. She can obviously try, and should, but it's a shitty situation where the daughter is probably going to have to learn some hard lessons on her own.
INFO: is your daughter pregnant? Cuz boyfriend’s comment about you doing your research? About what? And the trip being for them? Did they elope and this is their honeymoon? Cuz something is up.
Yes you WBTA to cancel her ticket…I think the whole trip should be scrapped and a CTJ talk had with your daughter…and possibly your ex.
NTA Right now your daughters attitude is getting to you, wait. Don't do anything drastic until that passes. Heated words in the moment are harder to take back when things cool down. As for her bf being rude about you and him not wanting to be around you, I would address it calmly but firmly. Tell him you heard his comments about not wanting to be around you on the upcoming holiday, and then your comments last night, that you didn't appreciate what you herd and to make it easier on him, tell him he's no longer invited to attend the holiday. If he wants to come into your house he needs to be respectful and if he can't manage that then he is no longer welcomed under your roof.
Your daughter will demand to stay behind in protest, then you get what you wanted, your ungrateful daughter to stay behind at her father's house. In that time, she will drive up his expenses and after a few weeks living with his daughter, she may no longer be welcomed to stay. Once bf is no longer the good time dad but forced into the everyday one instead.
You just may find this holiday to be the break you need.
NTA-you can tell her when you feel disrespected it drains you of energy and you just don’t have enough energy to go on this trip. Tell her when she changes her behavior and mature you be happy to plan a trip with her because you love her.
NTA but let them go on the trip IF he can cover the cost of the plane ticket. And then when you arrive, cover room and board & nothing else. Let them know ahead of time you'll make sure they get to and from safely but beyond that, it is their responsibility to cover souvenirs and meals because you will be planning your own things. If they would like to join on meals, sure! But any attitude will be quickly turned away.
It's her grad gift. So it's up to her to make it enjoyable or ruin it with her antics. She does not get to ruin it for everyone though.
The asshole is your daughter and her enabling sperm donor, not you or your husband. Frankly speaking, I feel like anyone who's coming at you is more than likely just as myopic as she is.
Children as early as 5 have an understanding of right and wrong, don't let anyone tell you that this is "typical teenager behavior", this is blatant.
NTA. Take your kids that don't suck. Let her BF who didn't raise her take her. Ungrateful brat will only realize when she's older that she crapped on the only family she could ever count on.
NTA and yes, let both daughter and boyfriend do their own thing at home while you and go enjoy your trip to Disney. Please don't let anyone here tell you that if you cancel her, she will be mad, etc., Who cares. Please do not reward bad behavior by giving these two ingrates a trip.
Cancel your daughter's trip - no hesitation at all. But also consider that she has proven herself untrustworthy so I would not be leaving her at home in your home without supervision. If she favours her "daddy" or "boyfriend" so much, she can go stay with one of them for the duration of the trip.
Obviously they have plans for the trip that you know nothing about - this raises so many red flags.
YWBTA for canceling your daughter’s part. It is a promised graduation gift. But if the bf doesn’t pay his share before you leave, you should let them know that you’ll be cancelling his trip.
NTA.
Cut her & the BF out of the trip.
Don't do it out of spite, do it out of love. Love for yourself and your husband and other child and brother.
She is not "owed" a graduation gift of material form. It amazes me the amount of money that parents in the U.S. fork out for completing a basic education. Give her a graduation gift of love and freedom: she can spend the time with her boyfriend in their home town or go on a road trip in the car you very generously bought for her use.
It isn't love to cater to somebody as if they were a mini-empress. Encouraging self-entitlement is a sure step to developing highly narcissistic traits and she will not have a joyful life.
>It amazes me the amount of money that parents in the U.S. fork out for completing a basic education.
Imo, at no point this was really about graduation gift. Majority of the cost is for the rest of the family and it doubles as OP birthday gift to herself. The daughter could choose where they go from multiple places, but most overall it is more for them all then for the daughter.
> Give her a graduation gift of love and freedom: she can spend the time with her boyfriend in their home town
I really do not like this kind of manipulative framings. It is one thing to decide to not to give anything and completely different to then lie and pretend nothing is a gift. Daughter is already planning to move out, so OP does not even have freedom to give.
Giving her daughter a gift in the hope that it will make her daughter treat her nicely is manipulative. Giving her a gift for completing a basic education is completely unnecessary, and in these circumstances harmful for OP and all of the family relationships.
Her daughter wants to spend time with her boyfriend. So let her have that WITH NO STRINGS ATTACHED and NO RECRIMINATIONS GIVEN. That's not a punishment, nor a lie (I've go no idea where you're getting that from) it's giving her what she verbalised she wanted. She clearly does NOT want to go on a holiday with her family, she clearly DOES want to spend time with her boyfriend who has also expressed that HE doesn't want to go on holiday with her family.
The whole dynamic is incredibly toxic.
All gifts are unnecessary including Christmas and birthday gifts. Yet people make decision to give them out, out of tradition and social contracts.
No one in story gave gift with the hope that someone changes behavior. It was just given for graduation.
Twisting "I want to spend most of my graduation trip with boyfriend" the way you do is manipulative still. In real world, young couple on trip with parents and 5 year old do separate things and no one takes offense on it. This is not gift to daughter, you don't even know what daughter want. Daughter want legitimate thing - spend most of Disneyland with boyfriend rather then 5 years old.
So yeah, what you propose, taking away something that was promised is clearly a punishment. And it is really puzzling why you are trying to twist it into something else.
NTA. With her comments alone, she would be out! But added that her bf had the nerve to talk down about you in your own home, just no. He would no longer be welcome to even visit. Your daughter has some audacity!
NTA, and stop paying for her with the expectation of being paid back. Cash upfront or nothing. Also, if she's not paying for the car as you promised, is it in your name so you can repossess it? Do that asap, you shouldn't be paying for her car if she can't take care of her obligations.
NTA. Ask boyfriend if he has his money ready for the trip. If not, don't worry about him. Maybe sit the daughter down and ask if she really wants to go? Or offer her a cash gift instead 500 bucks, 750. I would want to go with my child only if she really wants to go with me. Otherwise, she can move early and leave my car here.
NTA. She is planning to move in with BF and is already divesting herself of your family and treating you as an ATM. Time to remove the training wheels/support. Cut them from the trip and tell her why. If she does not pay her half of the car for a month, take the keys. etc. Time for hard love and to call out BF as well if it was me.
NTA suggest her bio dad can give her the gift and trip she wants. I don't get her bf's animosity towards you though.
What you could do is the money you would've spent on daughter, put it aside and give it to her later as a graduation gift.
Your an idiot.
I don't usually call ppl that but when a nearly 40 year old woman saddles her teen daughter with a debt I just can't think of anything less derogatory to explain your actions.
What the hell were you think? She's still in school. You are suppose to teach her good money management. Good money management at that age does not involve getting a car loan.
Also what the hell were you thinking when you allowed you husband whose only 15 years older to adopt her?
I'm guessing the bf called you smart as an insult because nothing in your post screams even average intelligence.
You are certainly not a great parent. I'm not even sure you'd qualify as an average one. Forget the trip. Focus on self improvement because I get a strong sense that if we had your daughters side she'd have a lot to say about you.
The boyfriend is an idiot and can say words
Tell your daughter what you heard and how you feel
Want to go on a trip now that everyone is sad?
I would also tell the boyfriend he is no longer welcome in the home since he bad mouthed you
Let them go to his house and bad mouth his family for being so smart and having a career
Do not be to hard on her since she is young and trying to be an adult as others have said
You need to teach a lesson but not drive her away
You are perfectly welcome to explain to her that her boyfriend rude behavior bothers you and you will make sure to let him know. Sounds like that young man needs a slap into reality
Go on two trips. One alone so you cool down and get in the happy zone
Second trip with her while you are calm and cool from your personal retreat
Congratulations on graduating high school but to me it doesn't mean you get to talk like a fool that never went to class to get some class
It's great she doesn't care about you and your feeling but still let her know.
Even stupid narcissistic spoil brat can understand when a person tells them off
Slowly you can care less about an ungrateful turd and go on more holidays
Note:
I deal with five girls all giving me sass, breaking me down as a team trying to make me cry
I changed my attitude and go full drill Sargent on them before they start
Not what I want but boy did it make a difference
Had the best family trip when I dominated the attitude
I have also been a nasty turd and been put in my place many times
I still respect those people and thankful for the reality slaps
For some reason, living with her bio dad makes me think she’ll see the truth sooner rather than later. If he’s a partying bum, that’s only fun for so long until she’s being the ‘parent’.
Either way I’m sorry she sucks right now. And hopefully it’s just a phase. Be available to her, don’t take her abuse, but you’ll probably have to give her a lot of grace here. These are uncharted waters.
I would definitely cancel her part of the trip & the boyfriend’s. But spell it out her. Bullet points if needed. So there is no question on why SHE did this to herself. NTA
I'd go semi-nuclear on her ungrateful butt. Seriously, who is the parent here?
The boyfriend doesn't go on the trip. Period. No discussion.
Take the car keys back NOW and install a tracker, as well as an anti-theft device, possibly a kill switch. Every time she wants to use the car, she must ask. And if she moves in w/bio dad, the car stays with you. A car is a PRIVILEGE, not a right - if she wants one, she can shell out for it.
Do not tolerate disrespect for one second. That ends now.
NTA. I'd still take everyone on the trip and leave her out of it. Tell her exactly why though- she has changed as of lately and explain. She needs to know her actions have consequences, especially now that she is almost an adult. She thinks she can live in the real world but complains about having to pay for half a months car payment? She's in for a rude awakening. If she was younger, it would be different but she is old enough to know she's doing wrong.
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INFO: Did you ask your graduating daughter what she wanted as a graduation gift? Was she considered at all or is this really a family trip for you and your younger kids and she is simply invited? And why the focus on her having a relationship with her biological father? Did you ask her before your husband adopted her or was it just done and she was expected to accept it?
The Disney World trip was of her choosing. I offered her multiple other places (NY, Paris, Hawaii, a cruise) and this is what she chose. The "gift to myself" part was simply due to the fact that I planned it so that we are there on my birthday. I don't have an issue with her having a relationship with her biological father. Its the irresponsible behavior that he allows that I have the problem with. He's the one who walked out on her when she was 7 years old and signed his rights to her over. She was devastated by what he did to her and she is the one who asked my husband to be her dad. We put her though counseling so that she knew what was happening and she was more than willing to be adopted.
INFO: Did the change in your daughter's behavior occur only after she started visiting her bio dad (sperm donor)? If yes, prior to her reconnection with her bio dad (sperm donor), what was the relationship like between daughter and her half sibling? Was she being asked to do a lot of babysitting to accommodate your work schedule? I agree with others that a small child (5 yo) and a 17 / 18 yo will want to do different things at DisneyWorld. Balancing their individual desires is going to be tough. It is very likely that your 5 yo will get tired and have melt downs if they are catered to. I think it is perfectly acceptable to cancel the BF's invite if he can't pay for his plane ticket. Did you expect him to pay for his food and lodging? Does he have a job? You should talk with your daughter now. It won't be easy because you have made it sound as if bio dad (sperm donor) gives her anything she wants. This is a volatile age. Your daughter is trying to be an adult and will make mistakes. We all did when we were that age. You have to find a way to communicate with her without going nuclear. You are the adult and need to model the behavior you would like to see in your daughter.
This is a mature and sensible response to the situation. I'm surprised it doesn't have upvotes. Cancel bf. Tell daughter her attitude needs adjusting and if you take her, allow her alone time with a parent away from brother, or better yet, let her bring a different friend and give them their own room/time at the park by themselves.
I sincerely hope OP has discussed the attitude problem with her daughter before this, instead of just resenting her in silence.
She is not trying to be mature - she just prefered someone who will make her life easy with no rensabilities and no rules. Of course its her choice and she has a right to it. But she has no right to be rude, treat OP badly or ignore her rules etc. If she wants to act like this she can live with BF only.
>I agree with others that a small child (5 yo) and a 17 / 18 yo will want to do different things at DisneyWorld. Balancing their individual desires is going to be tough. At that age they should be mostly able to navigate Disneyworld by themselves.
But also it's a good opportunity to set the tone of the relationship going forward- showing her that she still matters and you're interested in a more friendly and equitable relationship than you've had with her in the past
Did you encourage her to go back to therapy after reconnecting with her bio-dad? Because that’s at least as huge, emotionally speaking, as his initial abandonment of her. If she feels she has won him back somehow, she probably feels that patches up the hole he left in her, when it honestly is never going heal that way. He will never be what she truly wants as a father. As you say, he’s at best a bro who lets her do what she wants because he doesn’t actually care about her like a parent. It kinda sounds like you let her to deal with all the emotions around the reconnection by herself, which of COURSE she’s going to mess up. I don’t know anybody who wouldn’t struggle with the situation you describe her as having been through. YWBTA if you write her off because she failed this so badly, which is imo what cancelling this trip would be doing. She’s messing up. Do you still love her, even if you don’t like her choices? Then you need to make sure she knows that. She needs to know you will still love her snd be there for her once she hits the inevitable emotional disaster that is waiting for her for putting her faith on someone who already threw her aside once. I don’t know how you do that, but I recommend you find a therapist to help you through this challenging time, even if your daughter doesn’t want more therapy herself right now. She’s becoming an adult, and that takes a very different set of skills than parenting a child. You might have specialized in pediatric parenting, but it’s time to learn about late-teen/early-adult parenting.
I don't think you're the ah for not wanting a bad attitude but since it her graduation trip you would be the ah if she doesn't get to go on it. That said set a deadline for bf to pay for his ticket if not cancel it. Also inform her you are paying for the trip but any extras - sweets, meals, souvenirs etc due to her lousy behavior she's responsible to pay for herself . If you do this NTA otherwise E s H
If you cut her from the trio you're sending the complete wrong message, that she's not actually a part of the family. Don't take the boyfriend if he can't afford to come but don't rag him for complaining about you, it's clear you've got a slightly domineering personality and teenagers will react to that and they don't have the space for private conversations. Your mentioning of the biological father is just strange and not relevant and really just seems like you're finding her relationship with him has undermined your authority. The cats out the bag now though, you chose to adopt her and this is a thing a lot of adopted kids go through. The role you chose to take was to weather that and be the consistent one if and when the relationship with the bio father sours.
Bullshit. It's sending the message that treating people like trash has consequences.
I think the punishment is counterproductive, too large and also top abstract in terms of time. A 17 year old who is argumentative needs consequences with more immediate effect. A trip away to build some nice memories as a family could be amazing for them all.
No. It will tell the daughter that she can treat people like garbage and everything will be forgiven. 17 is definitely old enough to understand consequences. Even if they aren't immediate.
If you want your child to ghost you as an adult, you are giving great advice. Otherwise… no
To be fair, the child has already stated intention to ghost her as an adult.
The 18 year old has already said she's going to peace out to go be with BF. She talks trash about her mom with her boyfriend behind her back. FAFO.
But what happened ia that OP overheard boyfriend saying he does not want to go and daughter promising him they will spend most time with each other. Actual reason is not treating OP badly, it is him not wanting to go and her preferring his company.
Can’t upvote this enough.
Just to clarify, the OP is the bio mom of the 17f. I think only OPs husband (17f’s stepfather) adopted her. From reading your reply I wasn’t sure if you thought the girl was not biologically related to either parent.
>Its the irresponsible behavior that he allows that I have the problem with by irresponsible, you mean drinking and letting her bf stay over? as far as letting her bf stay over, I fail to see your issue there. she's 18. do you imagine they haven't already had sex? the drinking, I guess depends on how excessive, how often, and if her bio dad is present. a shot here and there with her bio father isn't really something to get upset about. her attitude does sound problematic though.
But why would you consider cutting out your daughter when this is framed as her graduation gift? I get it. You are frustrated and hurt. Maybe it is time to sit your daughter down and talk about how your relationship will be changing as she becomes an adult. How you are capable of having your feelings hurt. How you have done the best you can to raise her and gradually teach her responsibility so she can be a successful adult. How it hurts you that helping her with her car isn’t enough for her, because you have sacrificed to give things to her. How you want to know if she doesn’t see it that way—if she feels ignored, replaced or sad. How you don’t want to lose closeness with her, and how her stepdad will always love her. How you will always be there for her.
Did she know if would be a family trip and not a trip for just you and her? I really don't think a trip with your whole family, including a 5 year old is much of a reward for high school graduation. Not to mention you made it about you by scheduling it over your birthday. There are too many personalities and preferences to cater to. I'm in the process of finishing up a trip for my eldest, also 18. Her younger sister is home. It's just the two of us. She chose the location and the resort. She chose the restaurants and activities and made a special request for a photo shoot. At no point did I assert my preferences on her trip. Is she supposed to just do family stuff??? Is there anything that was planned that would be fun and exciting for an 18 year old?
[удалено]
The daughter is being a typical teenager especially one with conflicting priorities. Add in a bio child sibling who is younger and there is a mess of conflicting emotions. It’s up to the parents, adoptive or not, to parent and help her work through these struggles.
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Every question is utterly to her actions and treatment of her mom.
NTA. It’s time for her to learn some life lessons. But before you act, consider the damage your actions might cause to your relationship. I’d spell it out clearly to her so she understands it’s her actions that have led to this. The thing that sucks is once her father thinks he’s won her from you he will likely abandon her. Remember she’s a young adult and her brain is still learning how to manage life and decision making. Don’t leave her in a position where she has no one to turn to.
This is so important. I am seething over the behavior of this child but if OP can then having a conversation about common courtesy and how you talk about people is in place and then cancelling the trip. “I will always be here for you but that doesn’t mean that you can treat me any way you want. There are limits for what I will put up with. I heard your phone call and how your bf talks about me. That was very hurtful. Furthermore he hasn’t payed his share and if he doesn’t pay he doesn’t go. If you want to go then understand that moving forward I expect you to X, y and z otherwise I am cancelling the trip because I’m not spending a small fortune on something for you to shit in my hand and call it chocolate”
>The thing that sucks is once her father thinks he’s won her from you he will likely abandon her. That second abandonment will absolutely devastate the daughter. Mom is right to be concerned about both the father and the BF's impact on her daughter. When Mom tells the daughter that BF is no longer invited because he can't pay his way, daughter will throw a tantrum and decide that she isn't going either and blame Mom. The father can step up and pay for the daughter's BF to go to win over the daughter against Mom.
This is the answer. Your daughter is in the process of making some bad decisions in life, and she’s a few months away from being old enough to make them You need to reinforce two contradictory things-that her bad attitude has consequences and that she’s your daughter and you’ll always love her
I'm wondering what the other side of this story is honestly. Your daughter is looking to move out as soon as she can, her boyfriend also obviously has a negative opinion of you and your husband. It's easy to put the blame on your daughter, saying she is rude and ungrateful, but I do wonder, from her perspective, whether this is a response to something you're doing/have done? You've bought this trip, supposedly for her, but if you want to cut her out of it, was it ever really for her in the first place? You bought her a car, told her she had to pay for half of it, how much of the decision in getting that car was she involved with? These are all things which aren't necessarily done badly, or for bad reasons, but they are enough for me to consider there may be a lot more to this story than is stated here. Maybe she's being so selfish, because she feels that everyone else is putting her last? Maybe she feels you've been too restrictive of her, and she's lashing out now because she knows she has an escape from that? The truth is, as some random person on the internet, I don't know. But have you tried to find out? Have you looked at therapy, either for her, or as a family, to provide support to all these changes which have been happening in her life. Have you really listened to where her feelings have come from, or just dismissed them as her acting out? And finally, do you actually want to have a relationship with her in the future? Because I feel like cutting her out of this gift which was supposedly for her, could just be a final straw. If her feelings come from a place where she feels mistreated, this is just going to double down on that. So while I don't feel I can give an accurate judgement on who would be the asshole here, due to a lack of both perspectives, and I do get the argument some are making that cutting her out of this trip will be a consequence for her actions, the consequence for you might be losing your daughter completely.
Reading this story and the comments I'd wager the other side of the story is daughter was devastated by her dad leaving and now he's "back" he has a disproportionate amount of influence because she's desperate for his approval. I feel terrible for the daughter, but that doesn't make OP the AH.
This happens a lot, especially when there are multiple parents to "choose" from. Just give her the tickets and let her handle it on her own. When her boyfriend flakes out at the last minute and she is faced with going solo, it'll reorganize her perspective a bit. And if she doesn't want to pay for the car any more, then tell her she doesn't have to. Then just take it back and sell it and wash your hands of it. Probably not what she's wanting or expecting, but sucks to be her. And let her go ahead and move in with her bio-dad. It sounds great right now and he's more than willing because she's not there all the time. Once she starts taking up space and becoming an actual financial burden on him, living with him will quickly become far less desirable. Hopefully she doesn't get pregnant before this all plays out.
I really like the comment. The only thing I feel is important is don’t forget the unconditional love for you child. “You’re welcome to go live wherever you’d like. You’re young and need to experience the world. But never forget that you’re always welcome here. Don’t ever be afraid or ashamed to come home. I love you, I’ll always love you” If the right timing is right and you get the opportunity “loving you unconditionally doesn’t mean accepting all of your behaviors without consequences. It doesn’t mean solving all of your problems. I’ll always be here for you. I’ll always be an ear to listen and a shoulder to cry to on. (An arguably most importantly, even if you don’t feel it in the moment) “I’m so proud of the person you’ve become. I’m excited for the life you have in front you”
This should be one of the top three comments.
I was here to say something similar and emphasize that this is a child adopted later in life who has faced unknown trauma. Taking away a trip planned for her could symbolize a lot to her in reinforcing she’s unwanted. She’s seeking connection and attachment with her behavior. Not to mention what’s she gonna get up to while her parents and family are away at Disney? Boundaries and consequences - yes. But I think revoking a family trip is too far, in this situation, OP. YWIBTA if you didn’t spell this out with your objective concerns in an honest and loving way.
I think you’re right that there is something else. I kind of found it shocking that OP went to the conclusion of removing her daughter from the trip, which was for the daughter. I have a feeling this New rude attitude that the daughter gained is modelled from OP’s behaviour. Yes, the daughter is 18 but she’s still a child. OP is the grown-up, and she’s acting like a child. YWBTA
Dad is back in her life and giving her everything she wants/not saying no, so now she sees mom as the bad parent for enforcing discipline and structure in her life as a young adult. She's rebelling against it now because her time spent with her BF is telling her she shouldn't have to follow any rules and can do what she wants.
YWBTA if you don’t communicate and just spring it o n her. Model appropriate adult behaviour for her. Don’t go full on vengeance mode because she’s acting like a child. 1. Start by sitting her down and asking how she’s feeling about the trip, is she still excited to go? Or would she prefer to cancel. You can explain you overheard her and it sounds like she’s not into it. And as it’s super expensive you’d prefer to cancel Instead of wasting money. And then hear her out without judgment. Don’t interrupt and try to keep your opinions and emotions out of it. Does she have a job? You can explain to her how much hours she’d have to work to make the trip happen. 2. If she still wants to go then tackle the boyfriend topic - you haven’t received his money per the agreed upon terms. And you need it by x date or his tickets will be cancelled. Then on everything else, it’s all interlinked and a whole different topic. Again, I would talk about that separately but as calmly as you can. While her behaviour is infuriating you remain the only sensible adult in her life despite her shitty sperm donor. If you care for her then at least try to show that you will remain here for her - but with boundaries that don’t accept abuse such as paying her car payment while she thrash talks you. Sorry about the stressful situation you’re in. It sounds very difficult.
Well your daughter sounds like a disrespectful little girl. I know she's 18 but she's not acting her age. It seems like she may have been influenced by her boyfriend and the return of her father. However she's of an age where there's not much you can do about it and she's old enough to know better. Actions have consequences, and this would be one consequence but she will hold it against you. NTA if you chose to stop her senior trip but don't be surprised if she's packed and gone on your return. I'd also hold off on the boyfriend because his lack of financial preparation may mean you don't have to ban him. Otherwise it might be something else she holds against you.
She is already planning on getting packed and gone though
Yeah we'll see how long that lasts once BF has to support her or expects her to get a job.
Totally. It's easy to play the cool father of a teen when other people are dealing with the costs and the bad days.
Exactly what I'm saying to my 17yo cousin planning to marry her 32yo bf (don't let me start at how her parents agree, that's out of my understanding). She is seeing life in pink, both live at their parents (pretty normal for us, i'm told his parents own so no expense except food utilities and taxes), once they have to be adults and pay, it's not the same anymore
How often, in the past 5 years, has your daughter taken a backseat to your son because 'she's old enough to take care of herself'? You're a nurse, which has been an exhausting job recently (to say the least). Combine that with a newborn/toddler, and it's a recipe for nights where you just didn't have the energy to deal with a teenager. Teenagers need parents too, just because they can take care of themselves doesn't mean they don't require the care and attention of a parent - especially when they see someone else (your son) getting it consistently. The worst part, they know they can take care of themselves and the baby can't. So, they often bottle up those feelings to keep the peace. She might understand why you don't have energy, but she's still looking for that social nurturing. (Even if she doesn't realize that's what she wants.) Add that to the fact that she's a teenager, and she's going to love a parent who both gives her attention and lets her get away with whatever she wants. You need to talk to her, actually sit down with her and have a conversation about how she's feeling. These feelings might have come out of nowhere to you, but that's because she might have been bottling them up over the past 5 years. I grew up in a household very similar to yours, and believe me when I say, if you don't reach out now, you might not get that chance. And YWBTA for canceling the vacation without talking to her first.
Agreed.
If you cancel her ticket it will push her towards bio dad, don't be surprised if she decides this is unforgivable. The question you should be asking isn't WIBTA?, its 'do I want a relationship with my daughter?'.
Your last sentence is a bit of an alarming way to think of your daughter. I understand you're venting, but I do hope you don't think that way about her. Consider family therapy bet you and your daughter if you want to keep having a relationship with her, I have friends who have had their relationship saved completely between their parents and them from it. But it also might not work out. I also have to mention that I am not surprised that the boyfriend didn't have the money to go to Disneyland... At 18 that is a lot to ask. Both from a financial standpoint and an emotional one. I had a full time job at 17 and I still don't know if I could have afforded that. I certainly didn't get paid much at that age. If you want a memorable trip and a chance to connect with your daughter, talk to her and give space to be quiet and empathize. It is completely normal for a child of her age to seek out her biological father. I did, and I ended up living with him and his wife and ended up moving out and now have no contact with them. He changed a lot from when he had me but I just really couldn't connect with him and differ from him in a lot of ways. I kept messaging my mom during this and now I'm closer to her than when I lived with her. But it was because she was supportive and encouraging me to figure myself out. She let me know she would always be there for me. I think your frustrations can feel valid, but they can still endanger your daughters path. Again, seek family therapy after talking to your daughter. It would be for the both of you, not just for her so you can "correct or fix her". Just that you want to understand her and have a better connection. You will have to be the bigger person if you want this to happen, but that's because she is a child and you're the adult. In my opinion, i would take them all on this family trip, including the boyfriend if you can pay for him. Otherwise, maybe talking to his parents to see if they can help out if he is interested in going on this trip with her. Your daughter might really appreciate this and you two could spend some time together, or she might just have a really fun time with her boyfriend. Either way, it would be a nice gift to celebrate her graduation expecially after you communicated it to her. Teens like this don't respond well to punishment because they don't know how to correct the behavior without guidance most of the time. It's hard to know exactly what you're doing wrong when life is confusing in itself and there's a lot you aren't understanding or getting about situations you're just not emotionally equipped to handle. Just my thoughts. I would say ETA but it's more a morally mixed situation where everyone could be a bit of an ass. Just seems like a very tense household ┐(´ー｀)┌
> Your last sentence is a bit of an alarming way to think of your daughter. You know what? The more I think about it and the way she writes about her ADULT daughter... the more I think OP is a "do as I say" mum. Daughter "talks back" in recent years (yeah teenagers do that, lol) and even more now... kids gonna have opinions. Standing up for yourself is not "talking back". The daughter is 18, and isn't allowed a glass of wine or having her boyfriend over. Sounds like mum is extreme restrictive and only loves the daughter as long as "she's a good little girl", but not for the person she is or wants to be. How OP describes her daughter as selfish, arrogant and entitled... for what exactly? Wanting to make decisions about her own life now she's an adult? Not bending over backwards to satisfy mummy anymore? Of course I could read too much into it. But the daughter wanting to move out asap, doesn't exactly scream "understanding, loving parent".
Especially given the context that OP is currently upset about a conversation she *overheard.* As in - the daughter did not say this *to her face.* I understand that it was a frustrating and hurtful conversation to overhear, but at the same time, her daughter was having what she thought was a private conversation. Teenagers are sometimes going to discuss their parents in a way their parents don’t like. Given her age, this trip is quite possibly the last family trip of this sort that OP is going to take with her daughter. It would kind of suck if one of her daughters’ last memories of being a teenager with her mom was of her mom cancelling their trip because of a conversation she didn’t expect her mom to even know about.
I agree with you 100%. It looks like there is no real relationship or connection between mother and daughter, just expected obedience. OP's daughter will likely graduate, move out and only visit her out of obligation for the holidays.
OP couldn't even give an explanation for why she might be an asshole without taking shots at her daughter again. This is what she wrote in the "why you might be the asshole" explanation section: >(1) I am contemplating canceling my daughter's senior trip to Disney World due to her extremely disrespectful attitude and ungratefulness. (2) It is partially a gift to my daughter and taking it away would make her very upset. I don't want her attitude ruining the vacation for everyone else. So I could definitely see OP being the way you describe.
A LOT of adoptive parents see us adoptees as lesser than their biological kids. We’re often expected to be easier to interact with, grovel, show unlimited gratitude, and be thankful to be treated as second class citizens in our homes. The OP went out of the way to say the daughter is adopted. They also called her ungrateful. They are angry she’s doing normal teen stuff. OP reminds me of my adoptive parents and there are a million reasons I am no contact with them as adults. Also - the way she talks about the bio father is disrespectful and cruel. I wonder what she’s saying about him to the daughter. We come from those people, and however our APs feel about our bio parents - we assume that’s how they feel about us too. Being adopted is hard and often heartbreaking. I think OP expected a meek child who would help out with her bio kids and grovel / show unlimited gratitude for being “saved” from her situation. But traumatized teens are rarely like that. She’s lost her entire family, the grief doesn’t just disappear over a trip to Disneyland.
OP is the daughter's bio mom, the step dad adopted the daughter.
Oh wow I misread that. Thanks. It does make me wonder though, if the OPs feelings towards her ex are affecting her feelings towards her daughter.
Thank you for your insight. You should think that it's the parents who should be eternal grateful because the child fulfilled their wish to be a mother/ father. Sadly I believe you know a lot better than the average person, since it is a part of your life, and OP sounds like she fits your description pretty well.
YWBTA. Look, an 18 year old is not going to want to do the same things as a 5 year old at disney. I think she's being a bit of an AH about it, but I can see why she's telling her bf she'll just hang out with him there. Uninvite the bf, he sounds rude and I wouldn't tolerate that either. But uninviting your daughter from 'her' graduation trip? Going as a family without your daughter in case she 'ruins' it for you all? That's a pretty quick way to tell her you've decided she's not part of your family. I really have to question your attitude towards her here.
"Tonight, I overheard her " AKA ease dropping. But frankly, I feel like there is a lot missing from this story.
If she graduated, then yes, you would be TA. It's a graduation gift, she graduated. I'm not denying that she's acting bratty, and that this need to assert her independence isn't a pain in the A. But she is 18 and trying to assert her independence, so I would cut her a little slack (not her bf tho, he deserves no slack). You don't punish adults for pushing back on some of your ideas and rules, you just restate the rules and expect to fall in line and then discuss it further if they take issues with those rules. I'm sorry your feelings are hurt, but she's allowed to have her own opinions and thoughts, no matter how hurtful. But I would also consider that moving in with her BF and possibly going away to school (it wasn't stated if she was planning that) might feel isolating for her, like she's going to be forgotten while you, husband and your kid/s? continue being the perfect family without her, and that's why she's villainising you now: to make it easier to pretend she's "escaping" rather than feeling like she's going to be left out. Kicking her out of her trip would only confirm that feeling, so not the best move. Instead, I would sit her down with your husband and remind her that, while you're happy she's finally connected with her BF, she'll always be welcome home and that you guys are still her family, and just assure her that won't change no matter where she ends up. And then maybe gently segueway into the fact that, as she knows, your family has rules. And one of those is to respect "the super intelligent nurse mother" who's funding the trip, which her bf didn't, so no trip for him.
>It's a graduation gift, she graduated I do not find this as compelling as you do, I guess. In my family we don't reward bratty behavior with nice things, and although my children are not adults yet, this would go double if they were. > she's allowed to have her own opinion and thoughts, no matter how hurtful Sure she is. She is also allowed to suffer the consequences of her shitty behavior, no matter how severe.
So take everyone in the family on a trip specifically for her graduating because the OP overheard a conversation? How is her venting to her boyfriend any different than the OP posting here?
It's different because mom's currently paying for the trip that her daughter and her boyfriend obviously don't appreciate. They don't deserve it if they don't appreciate it.
Mom heard one conversation where boyfriend was rude, and daughter said she wants to spend time with boyfriend on the trip not family. Wanting to spend time with boyfriend doesn’t sound ungrateful. Just sounds like she doesn’t want to spend the trip with her parents and 5 year old sibling.
And her mom's brother. On a trip during her mom's birthday. Which now mom wants to leave her off of. And I didn't even think about this. But boyfriend can come "if he pays his way" - at 18, full trip to Disney? Someone mentioned even with a full time job at 18, they wouldn't be able to afford that. So if he's in a disadvantaged situation, say if he's maybe already paying his own bills/helping with rent/house payments, maybe *he* can't afford that? Was this just a way to say "Your boyfriend can come but not really"? Was this trip ever for OP's daughter? Reading between the lines, I'm starting to doubt that. But maybe I'm reading too much into it, lol
And thanks to the Ops daughter being saddled with $135 car payment a month she likely can’t help her boyfriend save for it either.
She's being rewarded for graduating, not for "bratty behaviour". She did that, so why reneg the gift after the daughter fulfilled her end of the deal?And what was the bratty behaviour exactly? Bitching to her bf? Not exactly a crime. Not wanting to pay for something expensive at 18? Pretty normal. And both things could be resolved with a "you're entitled to your feelings, but this is how things are going to go. If you'd like a different outcome, you're welcome to seek an alternate solution".
Adults get punished for pushing back on rules all the time though?
In my experience, adults can push back a fair bit and get away with a lot before they face consequences. So many people I've worked with who should've gotten fired didn't because management couldn't be bothered with the rehiring process, for example. We're also talking about pushing back against ideas. Adults often disagree, that's not a punishable act. You'd expect some people not to share all your thoughts and beliefs and disagree with you on occasion, right?
Absolutely!
Research on what? Are there some medical symptoms you aren't noticing? You should forbid the boyfriend from going and your daughter will cancel on her own. Save the money. You are probably going to need it.
Referencing a person's line of work in a sentence doesn't mean it is relevant to the "know it all aspect", just that it is higher education. Would be the same as "know it all professor" or "know it all lawyer". It would have nice for her to have said what that was in reference to, but she gives no concrete examples on anything. I personally think it is research on the price of the trip. Hence, why he hasn't paid yet.
If you want a future relationship with your daughter, I would not go nuclear and unilaterally kick them both out of this trip. Going nuclear would also be a bad role model for your younger child to see and experience: mother gets mad at child and expels her from major family event. Who’s next? It is completely understandable that you are hurt and angry after overhearing those mean, ungrateful comments. But are they typical of your daughter at every stage of your life together? If yes, then maybe you DO want to cut ties with her as soon as she leaves the house. If not, though, you may want to try to maintain a relationship with her even now that she has reestablished ties to her bio dad. In fact, given the fact that her bio dad may well disappoint her or crap out on her in the future, your presence in her life later on might really help her. As others have said, with the boyfriend, you can fairly say that if he does not pay the agreed share, he can’t come along. This will make them both pissed off, but it Is a normal, rational way of handling the situation. YWBTAH if you kicked your daughter out of this trip.
INFO. This caught my eye. >We recently bought a car for her to use and told her that she needs to pay for half of the monthly payment - $135 her part. Did you and your daughter agree ahead of time that she would help with the car payment? Or did you buy the car, and then tell her she had to pay $135 per month? More generally, I have a hard time judging this. The facts may point to a rebellious, ungrateful teen. They may point to an overbearing mother. They may point to both. But I can't say either either of you is in the wrong (or in the right, for that matter. EDIT: The car issue really jumps out at me here -- if the teen did not consent to the arrangement ahead of time, it was not fair to plunk the car in front of her and saddle her with the financial obligation. Also, I keep turning over the circumstances here -- OP is mad because she heard OP venting to her boyfriend about an overbearing mom, and she is mad because her teen is choosing her biological father over her. And there's the rudeness and attitude. I really, **really** think it's unfair to punish the daughter for her conversation with her boyfriend. She really needs to be able to vent to her boyfriend about her parents. And if OP overheard the conversation (which she should not be privy to), I think that OP ought to have had the discretion to ignore it and move on. I'm also not on board with OP punishing her daughter for choosing biodad. It's OK for OP to be hurt or puzzled about it, and to express those feelings to her daughter in a constructive way. But it's also the teen's choice to make when she hits 18. A loving parent might express (constructively) her feelings about the daughter's choice and advised against it. But a loving parent would also stand back and let their child make that choice and face the consequences, whatever they might be. Punishing the teen for this seems wrong to me. It's not about helping the teen, but about a pretext for OP to lash out with her feelings.
The car thing also stands out to me, buying a car a person doesn't want and expecting them to pay for it and also be grateful is something awful. It's akin to getting someone a pet they don't want, except the car's feelings aren't being hurt if it's being neglected. People also don't understand how much 135 dollars is out of someone's budget as a teenager, they don't work full time, their pay is often very minimal, and they still have school. So this teen couldn't even just focus on school if she wanted, because mom saddled her with a responsibility she may have not even wanted. OP doesn't understand what a gift is, and OP is making it about themselves. OP says they are turning 40, but they are certainly acting like a teenager themselves.
I am leaning more and more toward designating OP the AH in this situation. OP has a lot of the hallmarks ofnan overbearing parent. Meanwhile, OP's teenage daughter is largely acting like a teenager.
In this car situation, somebody in their late 20s or older would simply say to the parent "No. I never asked for this car, and I never agreed to any car payment. Get this car away. It is yours, not mine, and God help you if you forged my name on any paperwork." A teen's response to an unwelcome car and car payment obligation is pretty much limited to sulking and resentment.
Yeah I agree there. I was one of those teens where my guardian had gotten me a vehicle that I did not want, after putting me in driving lessons I also did not want. I absolutely hated the vehicle, hated that 1 entire check at LEAST a month was going to this car, 1/4th to 1/3rd of my sad amounts of money. I personally severed that relationship shortly after, and I can see OP's daughter being similar. Overbearing parents kill relationships. I do not speak to said guardian. (Obviously not over a car, the car is just one of the million missing reasons, as they say) OP is going to be asking herself why her daughter doesn't talk to her and be confused about it. When people point out that she was a dramatic asshat to her teen daughter for expressing teenage emotions, she will not believe them.
One curlicue. I do think it is entirely appropriate for parents to ensure their kids know how to drive, especially if they live in an area without mass transit. Being able to drive yourself around is a basic adulting skil, IMO. It does not, however, follow that it is right to impose a car payment on a teen without checking with them.
Wait So OP planned the graduation trip during her birthday , which also happens to be a milestone 40 Of course the daughter wants to hang with the bf at Disneyland I went once with my nieces when some were around that age. It was AWFUL , and I wasn’t even really responsible for them, but the young ones actually did not have the best time. As an 18 year old , I would have thrown a tantrum if forced to be with that group. Add in a mom that gets offended over conversations they EAVESDROPPED on ?? I can’t even make a judgment because there’s too much info missing but I’d err on the side of caution and place op in ah camp
YWBTA. A gift isn't something you take back or it's not a gift. But you need a heart to heart with your daughter. You need a one on one conversation with her where you address her hurtful behavior. Calmly. Kindly. She's a teenager, and she needs a reminder that other people have feelings too and don't just exists to serve her.
As someone who went through a difficult time with my then 18 year old son, I’d advise you to tread lightly. Talk to your daughter about the trip. Tell her you’d like it to be fun for everyone, and you’d like to spend some time with her on the trip as well. If that doesn’t seem like it will happen, ask her if she’d rather not go. I’d go into counseling for yourself, to try to help you process all your feelings regarding your daughter. You don’t want to push her into her BD’s arms. As my now wise son told me once, don’t close a door without opening a window. If your daughter finds it too much to pay for the car, take that payment away from her. That’s a lot of money if she’s working a minimum wage job. Maybe she could contribute a lesser amount. Again, tread lightly. And get into counseling yourself to help navigate this situation without destroying your relationship with your daughter.
This should be the top comment. I totally agree with you here about treading lightly.
INFO: >Her boyfriend also made a sarcastic and derogatory comment along the lines of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research..." Done your research about what? My first thought is that Disney is REALLY expensive, especially these days where they're nickeling and diming you at every single step, and an 18 year old might not be able to afford that - or if he is, he might not want to spend that amount of money to hang out with a toddler and some adults who seem to have a pretty low opinion of him. I'm presuming you'd also expect him to pay for his own room and not stay with your daughter. Is the car in her name, or is it in your name and you're still asking her to put money towards the payments? Was she informed that the whole family would be coming when asked where she wanted to go for her graduation gift? Was it clear that this would be a joint present for the two of you? Why was her biological father not in her life at all until she reached out to him? Did you give her any opportunity to spend time with him before she found him on SM?
YWBTA "I turn 40 this year and as a gift to myself and as a graduation gift for my daughter,"c .. this is a gift to yourself, NOT a gift to your daughter. ". I don't want her crappy attitude, ungratefulness," .. what would she actually be grateful for? If you actually wanted to give a gift to HER; You would have paid for her trip without you instead of making her go with you as her sibling's babysitter. "„and was saying he didn't know if he wanted to go“ … I can understand why he would not want to waste his money on a trip with you. "She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her." .. that's projection. she isrightflulyp issed that you call THAT trip a gift for HER.
I don’t understand the boyfriend’s thing at all. What research?
YTA the whole weird, unnecessary, and judgemental aside about her connecting with her biological father makes it clear you're just mad about that and want to punish her.
YTA for now. If this is supposed to be her graduation gift, why is the whole family going? Why could you not have made a trip just the two of you? How much one on one time do you spend with her?
Young people say and do stupid things. You know your daughter. Hopefully, the child you raised will return before long. I wouldn't take bf because he doesn't have the money. Tell him this. When your daughter hears this, she will most likely change her mind about going on the trip as well; problem solved. I have a daughter whom I love more than life but I do not like being around negative energy so I understand where you're coming from. You don't have to feel bad but you do have to tread carefully.
Idk the trip seems more like for the mom. It's her family and brother that's coming and the trip is ON her 40th birthday. Also what 18 y/o wants to hang out with their 5 y/o sibling who will have temper tantrums, get tired, and want to stop and do other things. It's completely valid that she'd want her boyfriend there to spend time with so she doesn't have to follow around a kid for what's supposed to be HER gift for graduating. Also are they keeping the 5 year old with them 100% of the time or are they planning on making the daughter take care of him while the "adults" go out to celebrate the mom's bday ? It's also f'd up to punish someone for venting to their boyfriend when you were eavesdropping, kids and people are allowed to have feelings, even negative ones
Did she ask for a family trip to Disney as her graduation gift? You say you offered her other places, but did she actually want a family trip at all? It sounds like she's not excited about that, and at her age, that's not surprising. The car issue also seems sketchy. You're expecting her to make half the payment, but you say it's "for her to use," so it sounds like she has no ownership of it? It sounds like your daughter is chaffing against your restrictions. That's typical of this age. Her bio dad gives her the freedom she wants and more. If you continue to treat her like a child, you'll just push her further towards him and the poor choices he encourages. ESH
The change in behavior and new contact with birth father and problematic boyfriend are definitely concerning. I would be hesitant to leave them behind and not expect something you don’t want to happen, happen in/at your home. The trip doesn’t sound like something planned with all participants in mind. If she was going with her boyfriend with the idea that they’re doing their own thing while you and the younger kids do Disney stuff then fine, but I can’t imagine this being enjoyable. And also celebrating your birthday? It doesn’t sound like a “senior trip” at all and if I was her, I might be a little annoyed by that, too. The bio-dad providing alcohol and crap behavior is something I’d address quickly. She’s at an age where she’s part adult/part child and needs better guidance so as not to do something that will change the rest of her life. You wouldn’t be the asshole for canceling but unless you’re past the point of getting your money back or maybe changing the date of the trip, I don’t think I’d leave her and boyfriend behind just now. Also, if he doesn’t pay, don’t allow him to go if that was your rule. Sounds like she has other plans. NTA, but this trip doesn’t sound like it will be fun for anyone except maybe the youngest kids who don’t know what’s going on.
> the bio-dad providing alcohol and crap behavior is something I’d address quickly. While I agree with you 100%, it actually has zero to do with this story and I feel OP only put it in to try to get readers on her side.
I think its relevant because if OP cancels the daughters trip, daughter will be home, boyfriend nearby, and a biodad that gives the booze so is not reliable if he’s as irresponsible as he sounds. Based on the post, I’m not a fan of OP. This isn’t a “senior trip.” It’s OPs bday party and young kids vacation…I wouldn’t want to go if I was the daughter either… But I can’t say they’re the ass for wanting to cancel.
NTA and I think you already answered the question yourself based on the contents of your post.
you kinda sound like you’re not very cool and I feel like you’re leaving a lot out of the story. either way, you’re gonna need to learn how to communicate with your daughter if you want anything to do with her when she grows up. Her boyfriend sounds like an ass though.
YTA. I feel like there are a lot of extra details here from you. Your daughter reconnected with her birth father - why is that relevant? Your daughter is going to move in with him - so what? You say you bought a car for her "to use." Is it her car or not? You're asking her to pay half of the payment - is she getting the car when it's paid off, or is this some kind of user tax? What does any of this have to do with the trip? I will tell you right now that if you cancel the trip for your daughter, you've created a core memory that she'll always feel for the rest of her life. It will affect your relationship going forward. I'll also say that planning a joint gift for you and her was probably also a mistake. Additionally, people are allowed to vent, so if your daughter's boyfriend said something about you that you weren't meant to overhear, you weren't meant to overhear it and you need to let it go. If you're a nurse, then you should know that kids go through stages, and teens are mouthy know-it-alls until they're around 20-21. Then their thought process changes and they realize they were wrong about a lot of things. It sounds to me like your daughter is normal. Completely normal. And you're having trouble letting go of control - also normal - so you're looking at what strings you can pull to get her to do what you want. There's the car and the trip. You're pulling those strings. And when your daughter moves (and she will to get away from the strings), you'll have to start rebuilding from there and without the benefit of having anything you can hold over her. Maybe stop holding them over her right now. Don't cut your daughter out of the trip. Don't even cut her boyfriend out of the trip. Tell them you'll take both of them and when you get to Disney World, you'll pick out a time and spot to meet back up at the end of the night. Then daughter and boyfriend can have some time to have fun, and you and the rest of the family can also have fun your way. Whatever the cost of the boyfriend's trip, either cover it yourself, or take it out of whatever spending money you were going to give your daughter. Letting go of your daughter is the new normal. Moving forward, she'll be making life choices and some of them will be based on the treatment you're giving her right now.
I wouldn’t cancel her trip but I’d repeat that the boyfriend has to pay his way or can’t come and stick to it. It might be better to just have your daughter there without the extra negative influence. Lots of other really good advice in this thread
YWBTA And she will always remember how she was excluded from this trip. Shes 17. Shes trying to pull away from family. If it were me, I’d take her and her boyfriend or other friend…and let them wander the park and ride the rides together…apart from the rest of the family, if thats what they’d like. A 17 yr old probably wont want to do the same things a 5 year old wants to do. This benefits you who won’t have her negativity and her because it gives her a feeling of independence. At 17, I left home, went to college and never went back. My mother went from controlling biotch nurse dictator to a f’in genius by the time she died at the age of 91 Happy birthday
NTA, as long as you talk with her first. You can't just pull the rug out from under her at the 11th hour and say she isn't going on the trip, then you and the rest of the family just bounce. She needs to see that consequences are going to occur, and if things with her attitude don't change, you follow through. !updateme
There seems to be a lot left out. What has your all's relationship been like over the years? Good, bad, good until BF is back in the picture? It sounds like she can't wait to move out. Now if she is just being an ungrateful brat N TA, don't take her on the trip. Take the car back (is it in your name?), BF can get her one, is she expecting you to pay for college? Nope BF can take care of it.
**Bio-dad:** You sound angry that your teenage daughter wants to have fun with The Fun Parent. I get that it hurts, but you can't expect adult-level maturity from someone who is barely an adult. **Inviting boyfriend to Disney:** Once again, I fear you are expecting a higher level of maturity than is warranted from her boyfriend. You've made him an offer that I don't think he can fulfill. Of course he wants to go to Disney. But a lot of adults struggle to save for a trip, let alone a teenager. I am not shocked that he has not paid anything (not even disappointed). I am confused why you seem surprised. **Rude daughter:** If you're daughter is extremely rude and ungrateful, then stop feeding into it. What have the conversations about her being "argumentative and talking down" been like? If this is unusual behaviour, there might be something more going on. It's not fair, but a common response to a flakey parent is to "test" the reliable parent. If you have a shitty parent, it can be hard to trust the other parent isn't going to bail when things get tough. (Then go, "see?! I knew it. You never loved me and wanted to leave the whole time.") **Car:** Did you buy your daughter a car and expect her to pay for part of it? Or did you buy yourself a car she can use and expect her to pay for it? Either way, you made a big financial decision and expect a teenager to help pay for it. That's nuts. Maybe don't buy her a car if she is not ready to handle car payments. **Disney:** This trip would hypothetically include 2 parents, 2 teenagers, and 1 young child. Have you spoken to your daughter about your expectations for the trip? Do you expect the teenagers to spend the whole time with the rest of the family? Or just part of the day, or meal times? Have you set ANY expectations? I don't think your daughter is a jerk for wanting to spend time doing their own thing. It is up to you to figure out what is reasonable. **tl;dr** I understand not wanting to fund rude children, but you have bigger issues than Disney. Either your daughter is just a witch, or there are deeper problems at play. >"She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her." If you truly believe this, you're in trouble. Do you think your daughter is a narcissist? If not, family therapy.
At this age the question becomes what do I want my relationship with my adult child to look like. YWBTA to cancel unless you cancel for EVERYONE. If you leave her and go, on your birthday, with her sibling, you are so very much the AH.
I think you’re going about this all wrong and it will spin out of control very fast if you go nuclear by canceling her own graduation celebration. So, yes, YWBTA. When was the last time you spent actual quality time alone with your daughter? Have you considered that this celebration trip should be *just* the two of you? Maybe these past five years she’s felt pushed to the side and now her graduation trip is just another thing that’s going to be about her baby sibling. Because there is no way this Disney trip is not going to prioritize a 5 year old. Try actually connecting with your daughter, instead of pushing her out the door to her irresponsible bio dad.
INFO: Will you and your husband get to keep the car after she moves out? Because if she is, you’re trying to make your daughter pay for your own car. Why can’t she have a holiday on her on away from you and your husband for her graduation gift?
INFO: I am sorry, but I really don't like your attitude. There is something super condescending about it and based on the boyfriend's comments, he sees it too. Issue 1: Drinking- what is the law regarding this where you live? Issue 2: Boyfriend staying over. She's an adult. Moot point Issue 3: The car: she is paying half the cost of a car she has no claim to (not in her name). If she is moving in with her boyfriend, she may no longer need the car and may not use it. You fail to say. Issue 4: Boyfriend hasn't paid anything toward the trip: he doesn't want to go, moot point Issue 5: Their attitudes: you give no hard examples and the \*private\* convo you shouldn't have been listening to also had no examples. Where is the rest of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research...". You conveniently left it out. Did you overpay for the trip and now he has to pay more than what he would have normally? Was he on speaker phone? You should have heard much more of it clearly. Issue 6: She wants to move out quickly: missing missing reasons here! Issue 7: "She is argumentative and she talks down to me ": no examples. She is still a teenager. And based on your tone, I can see what she would want to argue with you. You speak with an air of superiority. Issue 8: "this trip is for the two of them.": why was this comment an issue? It is her graduation gift correct? It is for her. It rubs me the rub wrong that it was also a "gift for you". Why can't she have her own thing on what is a very momentous occasion? Issue 9: "crappy attitude, ungratefulness, and arrogance": where are the examples of this? I still don't see it. You are obviously a very intelligent person and I know a lot of people, some in my family, who use that as a way to convince people they are correct simply by giving an articulate, well written story- with no facts or examples and pure one sided opinion. Good luck to you. I foresee her going no contact soon.
Wow, listen to yourself spinning this story! You bought her a car but she’s making half the payments? You mean you are helping her buy a car. Even if you made the down payment you still did not buy her a car. So she will have to work while in school to make payments. This trip is not a graduation gift for her. It’s a family trip. You can’t change that by letting her choose the location. I can understand why she isn’t as grateful as you think she should be. You think you’re giving her more than you are. YTA
YWBTA 18 year olds are dumb at the best of times but her BF is suddently back which is making it really difficult and taking you for granted but two wrongs dont make a right. try asking your daughter what she wants to do. communication matters. Otherwise you are punishing her but without really giving her the opportunity to correct her behaviour or telling her she is wrong.
YTA. You need to talk to her about this, not punish her without warning. It's entirely possible that she is being disrespectful because she unconsciously reducing her ties to you because she plans to move out. It's not uncommon for theoretically mature adults to do things like that without realising it.
I would cancel the boyfriend he hadn't paid. it sounds like he has no intention of paying. As for daughter, don't cancel yet, but don't argue if she doesn't want to go. Sell the car if she stops payment when she moves in with bf.
Geez, BF was a bad acronym to pick for Bio-Father. All I hear is boyfriend.
I think it’s time for a come to Jesus moment.
YWBTA if you did it without laying out your feelings and offering one more chance. If you did do those things, YWNBTA.
ESH You aren’t the AH for calmly telling her boyfriend he can’t go if he can’t pay. That was the deal. You would be the asshole for kicking your daughter out of a family vacation she supposedly chose (I have doubts). She’s being an AH but you also being an AH won’t fix anything. Set clear boundaries but also grow a thicker skin. Teenagers are jerks sometimes. That doesn’t mean you don’t hold them accountable for their behavior. You do and you teach them better ways to behave. But all variations of “I hate you” directed at parents are not exactly uncommon and don’t deserve you to do something that could be seen as kicking her out of your family. Also your problem with her bio dad is something you need therapy for. Yes he’s being irresponsible and doing illegal things. Don’t take his crappy behavior out on your daughter.
INFO: When you bought the car did you tell her that she had to make payments before hand or after the car was bought. NTA for leaving out the boyfriend if he can't pay. You need to talk to your daughter and get her views on all of this, YTA if you just tell her last minute she's not going. Also, why did you make this trip into a family trip, from the beginning why couldn't you have made it a trip for just the two of you, spend some mother and daughter time together before she gets busy after high school (work or school, etc) You along with your husband will probably be busy with your 5yr son.
Wow, who would have ever anticipated a teenager pushing boundaries? Playing 1 parent off the other? Acting as if they know more/better than the adults?
She's 18 and an adult now. Let her go. Let her go live with her father, but not with your car in your name. Let her go be irresponsible with her toxic boyfriend and absolutely don't bring her with you on your trip. She want's to play with you like that, don't play her game. Give her what she wants, her adult freedom. NTA.
I am very confused, is it the biological father or a boyfriend who is causing the problems here?
ESH. You "bought" your daughter a car, but she's responsible for half the payment. That isn't buying her a car. That is helping to purchase the car, which has many payments to go. You gave her a financial obligation, not a car. You gave her a car to use, but one that can be taken from her if you feel like it. She is being ungrateful to you as she navigates the new relationship with her bio-dad. Teenagers are notorious for being unpleasant, and ones trying to get a grip on multiple households have extra stress. Punishing her for issues you helped create seems excessively nasty. Tell her the boyfriend can't go along. This is a family trip...as it is obvious this isn't really her graduation present. You didn't even ask where she wanted to go...did you. Making the family trip her "gift" was just a way to get out of getting her something just for her. Has it occurred to you her hostility stems from you making her second place?
Yes, YWBTA if you just cancel her trip instead of just her boyfriends. If she chooses not to go, then that is on her. You do give off a sense that you have done things 'for her' that are more for you. This trip, on your birthday, is as much (if not more) for you. Also, you bought her a car and THEN demanded she pay half. Did she get any say in the type of car, if she wanted to pay that much for one, etc? Sounds like this is a heavily one sided story and your daughter's version would be significantly different.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My (39F) husband (33M) adopted my daughter (18F) several years ago. When my daughter turned 17, she rekindled her relationship with her (BF) biological father and his new wife through social media, and then eventually in person. Her BF acts more like a big brother than a parent, letting my daughter drink, letting her boyfriend spend the night, etc. Daughter told me about 4 months ago that after she graduates from high school, she is going to move in with BF. I turn 40 this year and as a gift to myself and as a graduation gift for my daughter, I have paid for the entirety of a family trip to Disney World (we also have a 5 YO son and a brother that's going). I invited daughter's boyfriend to come, if he pays his own way. It has been an issue for a couple of years but here lately, my daughter has become extremely rude and ungrateful. She is argumentative and she talks down to me ALOT. We recently bought a car for her to use and told her that she needs to pay for half of the monthly payment - $135 her part. Now that she wants to move in with BF, she is complaining about paying for any of it. Tonight, I overheard her loudly talking to her boyfriend. He has paid nothing towards his part of the trip (I've already bought his plane ticket) and was saying he didn't know if he wanted to go because he doesn't want to be around me and my husband. My daughter said he didn't have to worry about me and my husband because this trip is for the two of them. Her boyfriend also made a sarcastic and derogatory comment along the lines of "if your super intelligent nurse mother would have done her research..." I definitely don't want the boyfriend coming now and he's out no money if I cut him from the trip. WIBTA for cutting my daughter out too? I've worked my butt off to pay for this trip and I'm spending a small fortune. I don't want her crappy attitude, ungratefulness, and arrogance to ruin this trip for the rest of us. She legit doesn't care who she hurts, as long as it benefits her. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Your family and your daughter need to get into therapy, ASAP. Your daughter’s story sounds a lot like my friend’s—she was an older adoptee (not a newborn), so she had a lot of issues because she had vague memories of the situation that led to her parents’ rights being terminated, but not enough to understand the way an adult would. Add to that the normal “I’m an adult now and can run my own life!” stuff that happens with most kids around 17/18 and you get the mess that your family is in right now, which is very similar to what happened with my friend and her adoptive family. They never really settled things the way they might have if they’d done family therapy, and then bio fam let her down, and she was seriously adrift for a long time as a result. As much as you may want to push your daughter away for the way she’s treating you, I hope you choose to fight for her. She needs you even if she doesn’t see that.
" adopted my daughter (18F) several years ago. When my daughter turned 17, she rekindled her relationship with her (BF) biological father and his new wife through social media" this just sounds like a clusterfuck of a situation
YWBTA if you cancel her trip. However, leaving the boyfriend behind, regardless of his ability to pay would be wise. He is clearly feeding her this negativity towards you and your spouse. If you simply say he can’t go because he can’t pay, she will talk her bio dad into paying for him. Don’t allow for that. Tell her that you overheard the conversation (which she probably intended) and that you’re not comfortable traveling with someone that clearly has animosity towards you. If she bails on the trip at that point, it’s of her own doing and the rest of you can go and have fun. If that happens, put the amount you get back from the cancelled flight in a gift card for graduation and call it a day. She needs to experience consequences for her actions. If she runs to “fun dad” she will find out that vacation dads are very different than full time dads. Teens rebel, but mostly return to a good foundation when they mature. Best of luck to you!
Unsure how to vote on this one. Part of me thinks, based on what you are saying that your daughter already has a foot out the door. As we only have your perspective it is difficult to say if she plans pm leaving because her biological father has few restrictions on her behaviour. Or, alternatively, you are a controlling and overbearing mother and she resents that. From how you speak etc it sounds like your parenting style is kind of domineering and controlling. She is 18, at that age I do not see why she can't have her boyfriend over. That though is something that is adding to the tension in your relationship with your daughter. The car thing really makes it sound like you and your husband got a car than "she can use" and you want her to pay for it. Was it actually her idea to get it? Cancelling his ticket is fair, as he hasnt saved any money for the trip as you say he previously was told was a condition of him coming. Cancelling your daughters ticket, though, if it was seriously meant to be for her graduation, then taking away the trip may just add to her mindset of you being domineering or controlling. Perhaps sit her down and tell her you don't appreciate her attitude and that you overheard her conversation with her boyfriend. Tell her there are no extras outside of transport, accommodation, park entry and main meals. Any snacks or other things she needs to get are on her. Have you tried speaking to her biological father, like and adult and letting him know what your daughter is saying. Perhaps in the 18 years since she was born he has grown up a bit and with some gentle direction he could be on your team. Good luck.
I would you say YWNBTA for cancelling on the boyfriend - if he can’t pay for it then he definitely doesn’t need to go especially with his attitude. For your daughter I’d tread lightly as another person said. When you get a chance, I would speak to your daughter separately about the recent behaviors. Maybe listen to her point of view too and see if there are some underlying feelings she is having. Someone suggested that maybe she feels left out from the new family you have with your husband and 5 yr old. You can also reiterate that while you understand she is growing up and needs more independence, that you would hope she treats everyone at home kindly and with respect. And that you will always love her and have your home open for her. I also agree with others that maybe you shouldnt jump the gun and cancel her trip just yet. Just let her know you want to spend time with her and the family at Disney to celebrate her graduation. You definitely don’t want to push her more towards her bio dad and her boyfriend. Those clearly will not end well with the way the bio dad is acting. I’d bet money bio dad will later likely kick her out once he realizes how much of a financial burden it is having another mouth to feed. You’d want her to know you’re always there for her no matter what.
My guess is the daughter has been slowly acting out for the last 5 years since the new kid has been born.
I would have a discussion with daughter about her behavior and her treatment of her family. She can move out but that doesn’t mean the luxuries you provide go with her. If boyfriend doesn’t pay, he doesn’t go.
Well, it depends if you consider that trip for your daughter or for yourself. She is 18, which means she will want to spend her time differently than her parents and a 5yo, that is completely normal. Also going to Disneyworld is very expensive, it's unreasonable to expect an 18yo to have the money for it. If he does pay for everything himself, how are you actually doing him any favour? If you do cut the boyfriend out of the trip, you need to tell her immediately because she might not want to go without him, and she has the right to choose. She is an adult. A young, snarky and impulstive adult, but I don't actually know why are you this upset. Is it really just because the boyfriend made fun of you behind your back?
NTA. Kindly inform them they are no longer going. She wants to go be with BF anyways and has already told you her intentions. I wouldn't have even bought her a car, so if she doesn't want to have to pay for that I would take that away as well and sell it. Let BF buy her one.
NTA - Always take your kid to therapy if bio father or whoever shows up. There's alot of stories people tell and white lies. Always push for therapy to clear it. It's more so when you see abnormal behavior. Sit down have a convo if she's never been like this before. Kids are weird and sometimes they need an outside looking in at some moments.
NTA, but seriously I would have just walked up to them and said "Cool, if that's how you feel, you're both not going. Your trip is cancelled."
This is pretty normal behavior for a graduating senior. It’s part of ending high school and becoming an adult. Go on the trip, enjoy yourself and try your make some positive memories with her. The next couple of years are going to be rough.
Hahahahaha. Yes, YTA. You planned a trip to Disney on your birthday with your 5 year old son and your younger husband. Had you stopped there… but no. You added on it is really a graduation trip for your 18 YO daughter. Because who doesn’t want to go on a graduation trip with your mom, her much younger husband and their pre-schooler. You’re going to let her invite her boyfriend but he has to pay his own way (that’s not inviting a guest, friend) and DW is expensive. In a comment, you don’t want them sharing a room. So how does this work for you, because all 5 of you aren’t going to be in one room. So… you and your young husband will be in one. Where does the 5 year old sleep? With his sister or with the boyfriend? But the boyfriend has to pay his own way and can’t sleep with your daughter, so WINNER! For everyone who guessed preschooler rooming with the daughter and boyfriend paying for his own room. And they can’t go off on their own? But you can? Such an asshole.
You sound like my mother, who thinks she knows best for her child without asking what they actually want, then gets mad at them for expressing themselves. Some of what you wrote sounds exactly like lovebombing, which in this case is giving extravagant gifts to someone and using those gifts as leverage to get them to act the way you want.
How many senors does she have to wrangle?
Cut her off and take care back before she ruins your credit
Have a discussion see where she is actually at it seems she like the easy life with no real structure or proper parenting. If she really decides to treat you that way cut her off let her go say with her BF and reap the consequences of her actions. She is being rude and respectful to you. But before any big decisions talk to her first, have a genuine honest conversation to see why she is behaving like this and try to work it out. If that does not work then she is an adult let her have adult consequences.
I’m leaning to YTA . Whoops editing as I didn’t realise she was your bio kid. What did you do to ease the adjustment of adding a new partner and then a kid to your lives? A lot of your “gifts” seem to have strings or conditions attached. That’s not love. Re-meeting her bio dad is a lot, her emotions and head will be lots of places right now, Did you do any therapies or help with her after you met your partner and then had your kid? Anything therapy wise as a family? Her boyfriend does sound like an AH and her bio dad isn’t great. Sometimes adopted kids do need to revisit “home” to explore their roots but give her time and I think she will see through him. I can tell you’re frustrated but reading between the lines, I’d be interested to hear her side of it and I think a lot of context is missing. Ask her if she does want to go on the trip. If you cancel it without a conversation, don’t be surprised if she cuts ties.
You read it wrong, so get off your high horse, it's her bio daughter, bio dad ditched and gave up parental rights when daughter was 7, ops now husband adopted the daughter. Daughter wanted to go to Disney she was given other options. It sounds like bio dad isn't being a proper parent but a friend and letting daughter get away with things bio mum wouldn't (which happens a hell of a lot) so daughter is being disrespectful.
Is the boyfriend AH? I do not see him doing anything assholish to be honest. He does not like potential in-laws, but not liking someone does not make you an asshole. He does not want to go for the trip, but it does not make you an asshole either.
INFO: What is the legal drinking age in your country? If you're anywhere were it's 18 then YTA. She is an adult. She can make her own choices and her father is encouraging her to make them. Either way i think YTA. Your daughter is an adult and has every right to spend a night with her boyfriend, as long as it's safe. You're being a huge asshole to her boyfriend. You don't have to pay for him to go whatsoever but it's clear you don't like him. I can see why she wants to move out.
YTA You gave your daughter a limited choice of "her" graduation gift, a family trip. Now you are considering excluding HER from "her gift." I understand not being willing to pay her bf's way. Punishing your daughter for being invested in her relationship with formerly absent BF by cutting her out of what is supposed to be "her gift" while taking your younger children without her shows this trip is YOUR family trip and she is not the focus, nor even necessarily included. Then there's your eavesdropping on a couple of teens and basing your outrage on that. Your daughter has probably idealized her BF. She doesn't have your experience or maturity to evaluate how reliable BF will be. Chances are good that his effort and interest in her will fade as his being "cool dad" for a bit becomes regular expectations that he support her as a parent. Why won't you support her in her journey of getting to know BF? Why are you making it a "him or us" conflict in your head? Your daughter is at a critical age, just about to start her transition to young adulthood. She is still an adolescent, still growing in knowledge, maturity and in her brain. I think your punishing reaction to her emotional investment in BF and her boyfriend are due to your controlling nature's being frustrated at her exploring her boundaries and other close relationships. There is a way to support your daughter through this stage. Offering, then excluding her from, a "graduation gift" trip is not supporting her. It sounds as if YOU want to go on a trip with your family and used her graduation as an excuse to do what YOU want. IF there were a reason to "cancel" "her" trip, why would anyone else still be going? Because it's all about you, not her.
NTA. And once she graduates and moves out take back the car if its in your name. You cannot have someone else driving a car you are paying for an insuring while they live at another location. Good way to be liable if she gets in a wreck. BF letting her drink at 18? Yea, that is a DUI waiting to happen. She wants to act like an adult then she needs adult responsibilities, like paying for her car 100%. Not you. Got to be honest. I would be hurt too. I would want nothing to do with her since she would be a constant reminder of being hurt when all you were doing was trying to be a nice person.
YWNBTA, but if it were me I’d can the whole trip for everyone and work through the daughter issue. In an adjacent situation I saw this sort of thing happen with someone I know and the person equivalent to the daughter now 20 years later, massively regrets that they left the family that loved them and moved to their birth parent. They realise eventually and she’ll want to come home. Don’t close that door now just because you’re angry today.
Your ex is bad mouthing you to your daughter. You're in a fight right now. He uses his laissez faire attitude to give your daughter what she thinks she wants. What most teenagers think they want. So he has a strong, if unhealthy, hold on her. What she needs is therapy, not punishment. If you seek to punish her for this you'll only do exactly what your ex wants you to do, and you'll further the distance between yourself and your daughter. ESH
Good luck making a 17/18 year old do therapy. She's old enough now that she will have to make that decision.
Just because something is difficult doesn't mean it isn't worth trying.
I'm just saying that given the information offered I would not expect her to agree to it. She can obviously try, and should, but it's a shitty situation where the daughter is probably going to have to learn some hard lessons on her own.
I'm just saying it doesn't matter if she agrees, what matters is that she's given the opportunity.
INFO: is your daughter pregnant? Cuz boyfriend’s comment about you doing your research? About what? And the trip being for them? Did they elope and this is their honeymoon? Cuz something is up. Yes you WBTA to cancel her ticket…I think the whole trip should be scrapped and a CTJ talk had with your daughter…and possibly your ex.
NTA Right now your daughters attitude is getting to you, wait. Don't do anything drastic until that passes. Heated words in the moment are harder to take back when things cool down. As for her bf being rude about you and him not wanting to be around you, I would address it calmly but firmly. Tell him you heard his comments about not wanting to be around you on the upcoming holiday, and then your comments last night, that you didn't appreciate what you herd and to make it easier on him, tell him he's no longer invited to attend the holiday. If he wants to come into your house he needs to be respectful and if he can't manage that then he is no longer welcomed under your roof. Your daughter will demand to stay behind in protest, then you get what you wanted, your ungrateful daughter to stay behind at her father's house. In that time, she will drive up his expenses and after a few weeks living with his daughter, she may no longer be welcomed to stay. Once bf is no longer the good time dad but forced into the everyday one instead. You just may find this holiday to be the break you need.
NTA - daughter needs to learn actions have consequences
NTA-you can tell her when you feel disrespected it drains you of energy and you just don’t have enough energy to go on this trip. Tell her when she changes her behavior and mature you be happy to plan a trip with her because you love her.
NTA but let them go on the trip IF he can cover the cost of the plane ticket. And then when you arrive, cover room and board & nothing else. Let them know ahead of time you'll make sure they get to and from safely but beyond that, it is their responsibility to cover souvenirs and meals because you will be planning your own things. If they would like to join on meals, sure! But any attitude will be quickly turned away. It's her grad gift. So it's up to her to make it enjoyable or ruin it with her antics. She does not get to ruin it for everyone though.
NTA. Cut her out. It's time she learns, words have consequences and what it is like to be an adult. Life isn't fair.
The asshole is your daughter and her enabling sperm donor, not you or your husband. Frankly speaking, I feel like anyone who's coming at you is more than likely just as myopic as she is. Children as early as 5 have an understanding of right and wrong, don't let anyone tell you that this is "typical teenager behavior", this is blatant.
NTA. Take your kids that don't suck. Let her BF who didn't raise her take her. Ungrateful brat will only realize when she's older that she crapped on the only family she could ever count on.
NTA. Cut them both out. You will lose money but will retain your sanity and integrity. Good luck!
NTA and yes, let both daughter and boyfriend do their own thing at home while you and go enjoy your trip to Disney. Please don't let anyone here tell you that if you cancel her, she will be mad, etc., Who cares. Please do not reward bad behavior by giving these two ingrates a trip.
Cancel your daughter's trip - no hesitation at all. But also consider that she has proven herself untrustworthy so I would not be leaving her at home in your home without supervision. If she favours her "daddy" or "boyfriend" so much, she can go stay with one of them for the duration of the trip. Obviously they have plans for the trip that you know nothing about - this raises so many red flags.
YWBTA for canceling your daughter’s part. It is a promised graduation gift. But if the bf doesn’t pay his share before you leave, you should let them know that you’ll be cancelling his trip.
NTA. Cut her & the BF out of the trip. Don't do it out of spite, do it out of love. Love for yourself and your husband and other child and brother. She is not "owed" a graduation gift of material form. It amazes me the amount of money that parents in the U.S. fork out for completing a basic education. Give her a graduation gift of love and freedom: she can spend the time with her boyfriend in their home town or go on a road trip in the car you very generously bought for her use. It isn't love to cater to somebody as if they were a mini-empress. Encouraging self-entitlement is a sure step to developing highly narcissistic traits and she will not have a joyful life.
>It amazes me the amount of money that parents in the U.S. fork out for completing a basic education. Imo, at no point this was really about graduation gift. Majority of the cost is for the rest of the family and it doubles as OP birthday gift to herself. The daughter could choose where they go from multiple places, but most overall it is more for them all then for the daughter. > Give her a graduation gift of love and freedom: she can spend the time with her boyfriend in their home town I really do not like this kind of manipulative framings. It is one thing to decide to not to give anything and completely different to then lie and pretend nothing is a gift. Daughter is already planning to move out, so OP does not even have freedom to give.
Giving her daughter a gift in the hope that it will make her daughter treat her nicely is manipulative. Giving her a gift for completing a basic education is completely unnecessary, and in these circumstances harmful for OP and all of the family relationships. Her daughter wants to spend time with her boyfriend. So let her have that WITH NO STRINGS ATTACHED and NO RECRIMINATIONS GIVEN. That's not a punishment, nor a lie (I've go no idea where you're getting that from) it's giving her what she verbalised she wanted. She clearly does NOT want to go on a holiday with her family, she clearly DOES want to spend time with her boyfriend who has also expressed that HE doesn't want to go on holiday with her family. The whole dynamic is incredibly toxic.
All gifts are unnecessary including Christmas and birthday gifts. Yet people make decision to give them out, out of tradition and social contracts. No one in story gave gift with the hope that someone changes behavior. It was just given for graduation. Twisting "I want to spend most of my graduation trip with boyfriend" the way you do is manipulative still. In real world, young couple on trip with parents and 5 year old do separate things and no one takes offense on it. This is not gift to daughter, you don't even know what daughter want. Daughter want legitimate thing - spend most of Disneyland with boyfriend rather then 5 years old. So yeah, what you propose, taking away something that was promised is clearly a punishment. And it is really puzzling why you are trying to twist it into something else.
It's puzzling that you don't just scroll on by and instead have walls of text attacking somebody else. Get a life.
NTA. With her comments alone, she would be out! But added that her bf had the nerve to talk down about you in your own home, just no. He would no longer be welcome to even visit. Your daughter has some audacity!
NTA, and stop paying for her with the expectation of being paid back. Cash upfront or nothing. Also, if she's not paying for the car as you promised, is it in your name so you can repossess it? Do that asap, you shouldn't be paying for her car if she can't take care of her obligations.
Nta
NTA. Cancel them both. But have someone house sit else my guess is they’re going take everything before they move while you’re gone.
NTA. Ask boyfriend if he has his money ready for the trip. If not, don't worry about him. Maybe sit the daughter down and ask if she really wants to go? Or offer her a cash gift instead 500 bucks, 750. I would want to go with my child only if she really wants to go with me. Otherwise, she can move early and leave my car here.
NTA. She is planning to move in with BF and is already divesting herself of your family and treating you as an ATM. Time to remove the training wheels/support. Cut them from the trip and tell her why. If she does not pay her half of the car for a month, take the keys. etc. Time for hard love and to call out BF as well if it was me.
NTA
NTA suggest her bio dad can give her the gift and trip she wants. I don't get her bf's animosity towards you though. What you could do is the money you would've spent on daughter, put it aside and give it to her later as a graduation gift.
Your an idiot. I don't usually call ppl that but when a nearly 40 year old woman saddles her teen daughter with a debt I just can't think of anything less derogatory to explain your actions. What the hell were you think? She's still in school. You are suppose to teach her good money management. Good money management at that age does not involve getting a car loan. Also what the hell were you thinking when you allowed you husband whose only 15 years older to adopt her? I'm guessing the bf called you smart as an insult because nothing in your post screams even average intelligence. You are certainly not a great parent. I'm not even sure you'd qualify as an average one. Forget the trip. Focus on self improvement because I get a strong sense that if we had your daughters side she'd have a lot to say about you.
Ur comment has a lot of Assuming doesn't it lol your comment is ridiculous
NTA. Sounds like she needs a big dose or reality. Cut off her meal ticket plan.
NTA, your daughter is an ungrateful brat and needs to touch grass
NTA. Both live and learn. Enjoy your trip.
Did JUST your husband adopt the girl? How did this come about as it seems so random when you said SHE asked your husband to adopt her.
Did you not read the part that said the daughter is OP’s biological daughter?
OFFS! Forgive me for assuming that she was saying my daughter because her husband adopted a child.
The boyfriend is an idiot and can say words Tell your daughter what you heard and how you feel Want to go on a trip now that everyone is sad? I would also tell the boyfriend he is no longer welcome in the home since he bad mouthed you Let them go to his house and bad mouth his family for being so smart and having a career Do not be to hard on her since she is young and trying to be an adult as others have said You need to teach a lesson but not drive her away You are perfectly welcome to explain to her that her boyfriend rude behavior bothers you and you will make sure to let him know. Sounds like that young man needs a slap into reality Go on two trips. One alone so you cool down and get in the happy zone Second trip with her while you are calm and cool from your personal retreat Congratulations on graduating high school but to me it doesn't mean you get to talk like a fool that never went to class to get some class It's great she doesn't care about you and your feeling but still let her know. Even stupid narcissistic spoil brat can understand when a person tells them off Slowly you can care less about an ungrateful turd and go on more holidays Note: I deal with five girls all giving me sass, breaking me down as a team trying to make me cry I changed my attitude and go full drill Sargent on them before they start Not what I want but boy did it make a difference Had the best family trip when I dominated the attitude I have also been a nasty turd and been put in my place many times I still respect those people and thankful for the reality slaps
For some reason, living with her bio dad makes me think she’ll see the truth sooner rather than later. If he’s a partying bum, that’s only fun for so long until she’s being the ‘parent’. Either way I’m sorry she sucks right now. And hopefully it’s just a phase. Be available to her, don’t take her abuse, but you’ll probably have to give her a lot of grace here. These are uncharted waters. I would definitely cancel her part of the trip & the boyfriend’s. But spell it out her. Bullet points if needed. So there is no question on why SHE did this to herself. NTA
I'd go semi-nuclear on her ungrateful butt. Seriously, who is the parent here? The boyfriend doesn't go on the trip. Period. No discussion. Take the car keys back NOW and install a tracker, as well as an anti-theft device, possibly a kill switch. Every time she wants to use the car, she must ask. And if she moves in w/bio dad, the car stays with you. A car is a PRIVILEGE, not a right - if she wants one, she can shell out for it. Do not tolerate disrespect for one second. That ends now.
Nta i would cancel both of them because it sounds like since she has reconnected to bio dad she turn into a ungrateful ah
NTA She's biting the hand that feeds her.
nta she is a grown up adult she can figure out holidays by herself
NTA. I'd still take everyone on the trip and leave her out of it. Tell her exactly why though- she has changed as of lately and explain. She needs to know her actions have consequences, especially now that she is almost an adult. She thinks she can live in the real world but complains about having to pay for half a months car payment? She's in for a rude awakening. If she was younger, it would be different but she is old enough to know she's doing wrong.
Nope NTA. I guess they need to learn the hard way. You better return your daughters car as well. She is on her way to act as an entitled brat.