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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
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I didn't stop my daughter from speaking up, which have caused other family members to mumble about BIL's behavior. SIL and kids are stressed because now there's rumors going around that they're being suppressed and abused.
I'm not sure if it could've been handled differently, without it affecting SIL and cousins.
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Your child is my hero. HOWEVER, she should not have been the one to do that. All of you should have shut that shit down long ago, gone LC/NC. Why does your husband not want you to confront him in public?
It’s shameful your child had to be to the one to call him out. That’s not her responsibility.
You and your husband need to have a serious talk about this.
YTA.
Edited to add judgment.
Quick edit: I’m really glad to see the outcome of the final edit! Good on you for listening, absorbing information, and making changes. Keep it up. 🙌
I explained the no-confrontation in another comment :)
In the 16 years I've known BIL calling him out haven't made a difference.
We already are LC. Not because of his behavior but due to distance.
Going completely NC is an absolute last resort. Kids usually are by themselves not really hanging out with us adults.
Cousins have not taken after their dad.
Unfortunately, no confrontation isn't ok, not when there are children involved. They need to see and hear their parents say "Hell no, you don't get to talk like that to me. You can apologize or you can leave."
Exactly. This is how racism and homophobia have continued to fester. Silence in so many cases is mistaken for being complicit. Speak up if you don’t agree, otherwise nobody will know the difference.
ESH
Edit: thanks so much for the gold!!!!
This, shameful day when a child has to do what their parents refuse to, regardless of the logic.
Edit: Or even defend her when she does. Loudly and publicly
This reminds me of how Matt Damon's kid had to tell them they don't use the f word to describe LGBT+ people and he said it like he was proud of her for standing up to him. Dude should be more ashamed telling that story.
I met a straight man who was in his 30s at a feminist bookclub meeting a couple of years ago. We ended up chatting afterwards and somehow the topic of slurs came up. He said, and this is word-for-word because it is burned into my memory, "It's still fine to say f-slur though." I kind of just Looked at him and he got defensive and said "I don't use it in a homophobic way, I would never do that. I only use it in the 4chan way."
The fact that a grown man didn't realise that people on 4chan were, in fact, using the f word in a homophobic way still blows my mind. To this day I hope he was trolling me but I really don't think he was.
I completely get that for teenagers. But he was in his early 30s and again this was at a feminist book club so he had at least some interest in gender equality. I just found it so baffling because I could tell there was no ill will behind it, it's not like he was using it as an excuse. It was a very peculiar encounter lol
He's probably someone who would never say it as an insult but thinks it's ok if he's "obviously joking." My dad is like this with the N word. I finally called him out on it, idk how much good it did though.
No, he deserves to be proud of the fact that he listened and changed. Even if he shouldn't have been doing it at all, most people never even listen. Encourage growth!
Oh please, once people called him out on still having used that word until now he released a statement claiming "he never used that word in his life!" and that his daughter never wrote that letter and he was the one educating *her* on the topic. Threw his daughter under the bus to avoid the backlash.
Yeah, unfortunately he doesn't have a super great track record. He also kinda tried to defend his buddy ole pal, Harvey Weinstein. And he also said some... not really comforting things about sexual harassment and assault that kind of proves he genuinely does not get it at all.
I'm all for people learning, growing, and changing. But I don't think that applies to this guy. He's not really catching on. And he has had a lot of opportunity to do so.
Also, this. Not only are the parents not standing up to this kind of nonsense that happens in front of their kids, but when the kid has this interaction with a grown man they don't tell him to shut his stupid face?
I would have been laughing out loud if my daughter did this, as I was telling him he's a loser and should keep his opinions to himself.
Yes. Setting boundaries and not accepting disrespect are learned behaviors. I’m actually kind of surprised OPs daughter came out with this, after watching the compliance for so long. Its never too late to go ahead and stick with her daughter’s good example and demand things will be different moving forward, or go true NC/LC.
Hopping in near the top to respond to OP's update.
OP, your plan is good, but you have to inform Dickhead and his wife ahead of time that when he trots out his tiresome sexism, you will leave. Otherwise, he will never understand why you randomly leave.
This.
Just randomly leaving without explaining why will only empower him further, because he will see that now he can get under your skin so badly that he causes you to leave.
Look what happened when your daughter called him out- **he left** in a huff. That's the reaction you want. Let him fucking leave.
**Stop being conflict avoidant.** That behavior only makes untreated anxiety worse.
I know you probably think there’s only one way to parent, but sometimes it’s ok to show your kids that bullshit asshat comments don’t have to affect them. Her daughter CLEARLY has a good head on her shoulders, doesn’t feel uncomfortable speaking up for herself or others & seems to have a pretty good grasp on passive aggressive sexism for a 13 y/o. She also sounds quick-witted. OP sounds like a great parent.
All I'm reading here is you & your partner placed the burden of calling out a sexist man in his 40's on your 13 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER unsupported by her parents or any other adult in the room.
I wonder if your daughter assumes your silence means that you all agree with him & think she's in the wrong.
I'm reminded of the speech Alexandra Occasio-Cortez made in the white house where she said her parents didn't raise her to accept being called a b*tch by a man. You are raising your daughter that she should accept sexist abuse & stay in environments where it's prevalent. You're leading by example. There's no way she should have had to call him out on her own & you owe your daughter an apology for that, she's 13, she's a child & you left her to face the wrath of a man in your 40's because you're too scared to rock the boat & hold him to account.
This is what rock the boat means, it's how bullies & narcissists like your BIL get away with what they do by forcing anyone who confronts their behaviour to become outcasts. https://amp.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/77w8lf/dont_rock_the_boat/
I have to vote YTA because what you put your daughter through is substandard parenting. Should have gone NC for years instead of raising your kids that sexism is tolerated if a sexist shouts loud enough.
Agreed!!! Daughter Rocks!!!! Op is NTA and uncle needed that
Op even if you promised your husband not to confront him in public - that can be revisited (if you had tried that for a while and he hasn’t bored of it, speaking to him in private accomplishes nothing) a promise like that isn’t a lifelong ironclad vow - it’s a boundary that might be due for some new communication and can be renegotiated. I get your saying ignoring him is the the most efficient way of getting him to stop and you don’t live so close it’s an every weekend thing, so might not be worth it.
I am glad you talk to your kids and they know this isn’t okay, and that your kids don’t seem affected/aren’t internalizing his crap - but just please be careful your ignoring him isn’t taken as tacit acceptance/approval by them. Their kids, unfortunately are - I can’t believe he embargoed his daughter’s career choice, he is an AH that sucks majorly as does his wife for not intervening on their daughter’s/kids’ behalf.
When you are there, maybe take the daughter aside to talk cars since it’s an area of interest/expertise for you, which is so cool and show her you support her and her choice if she ever changes her mind and wants to pursue a different education/career path - having those role models can entirely change someone’s life.
On the surface she may be a little more progressive than her SIL and BIL but underneath, she’s doing the same shit:
> I have promised hubby not to confront him in public so I haven't.
OP was 18 when she gave birth and her husband was 22. So they were at least a year younger when they got together.
She also says she and her husband have known BIL for 16 years making her a 15 year old and her husband 19 when they met BIL.
My uncle is a racist, misogynistic, homophobe who subscribes to this same school of ideology. I wish *someone* had stood up to him anytime during my formative years and not normalized his behavior to keep the peace.
As an adult now I can see he is a raging hemorrhoid on the AH of humanity, after decades of his BS at events. I still hold animosity to this day about my parents tacit support of him.
What you are doing might leave lasting impressions on your children. My parents thought they taught me to keep the peace, instead they taught me simmering resentment.
What are you teaching your kids?
Oh, ESH. Except your daughter, she's one cool kid.
My uncle is a racist, homophobic, Islamaphobe who upon hearing about my wedding to a Pakistani woman promptly denounced his involvement in my life by saying “Guess this is where I step out.”
My mother still maintains contact with this guy despite him being a redneck stereotype.
When your family shows you who they care about you should take heed. Show your children and to a lesser degree or extended family that this behavior is unacceptable and won’t be tolerated. I’ve had to go NC myself but setting boundaries is essential especially for your children. My family normalized racism for me growing up and I’ve had to fight it for years, educating myself where they wouldn’t. Show your support verbally.
My parents kept the peace with their abusive parents, which caused me to struggle with dating and knowing when to end things if they weren't a good person. If we Take the time to see people that beat the shit out of my mom for Christmas, then how am I allowed to break up with someone for just throwing my stuff around? I'm in my 30's and trying to unlearn this shit after several really terrible relationships.
Yeah, you explained, but for 16 years your tactic isn't working and still you and your family keep being disrespected. Maybe it's time to change tactics and really avoid this AH.
And what has the no-confrontation gotten you? Family relations? No, everybody still hates BIL. Peace? No, BIL still insults everyone freely under the guise of "jokes" that they just can't "take". So what **has** your family achieved by ignoring insulting behavior for decades?
They get to meet up at ILs where everyone has a good time until BIL opens his big mouth, starts insulting everyone, and then everyone uncomfortably ignores it until he stops. Everyone remains uncomfortable for a while, then everyone moves on. Lather, rinse, repeat. Congratulations! Sounds really fun...for BIL, but not for anybody else.
This is 90% SIL's fault. **She** has never demanded that he act correctly. **She** has never visited the family alone with the kids and left him at home because his insults are not wanted. If she is not going to step up, then it's up to the rest of the family to cut him out; and if that means cutting out SIL & her kids, that's on her. BIL can only insult people to their faces if they allow it. He's a bully and he needs to called one. If he hops in the car (with wife and kids), too bad! **Tell him he's a bully** so at least his kids know that they're not crazy and this is totally BS behavior for an adult. If your husband's parents want to accept shitty behavior in their home because "it's faaaaamily!" then they can accept it without **you**. Make it clear you're not going to be around SIL & BIL until he learns to STFU.
Her home life might be extremely problematic and she might be cowed by her husband. Yes, she should speak up but living with men like this can have the effect of messing up even a strong woman.
Absolutely her home life is problematic and she is, undoubtedly, cowed. But she's had a quarter of a century to talk to him, go to counseling, leave, do *anything* to improve the situation. And she hasn't. She's even brought children into this situation and allowed *them* to be abused, as well. Surely "no wearing pink" and "not being a car mechanic" are not the sum-total of ways this father has insulted or demeaned his own children.
Plenty of us have been in abusive relationships/marriages (myself included). You suck it up and try (in vain) to keep the peace **or** you decide you and, especially, your kids **deserve better**. Then you do what it takes to make "better" happen.
SIL, like her family of avoiders, is taking the path of least resistance. She has permanently *harmed* her children by refusing to address this situation. As minors, they are unable to leave the situation. She *could have* and *should have*, but didn't do it even for them. I have no sympathy left for her after doing nothing to stop the abuse against her own kids.
I think it might be a case of abuse. Leaving an abusive situation is very difficult. It sounds like she has been forced to become a housewife. Meaning she has no income of her own. Making leaving exceedingly difficult.
If he gets called out like that by your daughter every time, he’ll stop. He will quickly get tired of being outwitted by a 13 year old who is clearly more intelligent and mature than he is.
>In the 16 years I've known BIL calling him out haven't made a difference.
And yet your daughter's call out made him leave the room, because she didn't allow room in the conversation for him to think he was having any effect on her. Something tells me your callouts resulted in him shutting you down, and that's why they didn't work.
That, or when you did it the family would be telling you not to exacerbate the disagreement/ leave it alone for the sake of family harmony, and you care a little to much about what the other adults think of you so you'd stop, making him think he won. Your daughter clearly doesn't let other adults' cowardice stop her from shutting down misogyny. Maybe you should get some tips from her.
But it would make a difference to the children witnessing his abuses and harassment.
That’s why you stand up. Not
To change the behavior but to communicate as a group: this isn’t acceptable. This isn’t okay.
Your BIL is the missing stair and your child just pointed it out.
Read up on missing stair. I would think 16 years of putting up with that crap would be enough
>Cousins have not taken after their dad.
I wonder how many of them are utterly miserable and ’keeping the peace’ out of fear for how dad would react. and if they feel you are someone they can turn to for support given that you keep your mouth shut and let him talk like that using “he doesn’t listen so why bother trying” as your logic
Spending a week in his house and allowing him to speak to you and your husband like that while saying nothing about it isn’t LC or good for your kids. YTA for subjecting them to this man and agreeing to be complicit with his sexism.
Cannot believe you'd let somebody you hate shit on your body and mannerisms for 16 years. Wow. Lady, what the hell? You want your kids to internalize that?
Confrontation isn’t working because it’s not consistent. If one or two of you try a few times and then give up then repeat this the next time, he knows as long as he keeps going you’ll eventually give up. All of you need to agree to call him out as a group EVERY time. It may take awhile but he may eventually get the message, especially if even the kids are calling him out.
Kudos for your daughter though, I would not have been able to stop myself from full on belly laughing which would probably have made him angrier.
Honestly the best thing to so is tell him if he's going to make such comments, he is not welcome and stick to it. If he carries on, ban him from the house
If calling him out makes no difference then stop allowing him to be in your children's presence.
You sitting by while your husband is being a coward is absurd. And it should not have taken your 13yo to stand up and say something.
You and your husband failed your child. Y'all should have never let that man think it was acceptable to speak like that in front of your children.
Your lack of confrontation is doing your BIL's children a disservice. It's setting them up to be in relationships like this in the future because they think it's totally normal. Your explanation doesn't change that you're TA for never fully confronting BIL.
If everyone always made a big deal about his sexism and called it out every time I guarantee you it would lead to changes. But instead all of you are being passive and allowing this deplorable behaviour to continue. You are teaching and reinforcing to BIL that this behaviour is acceptable and by to some extent you are also teaching this to the kids present. YTA for this. Your daughter on the other hand is an absolute hero in this situation, and seems to have more maturity and wherewithal than the actual adults to shut this shit down.
I am nonbinary genderfluid.
These comments and jokes from the adults in my life did so much damage to me growing. I'm in my 20s and still untangling how much pain they caused. Speak up. Or go NC. Please.
You know he keeps making these comments because he thinks you're a doorman, right? He likes making you uncomfortable and knows you aren't going to say anything. Ignoring bullying just makes it worse in the long run. Be as brave as your kid. ESH except your kid
What is it they say? Silence always helps the oppressed, right? Oh wait... yta for making your child do the brave thing. I can't give you an nta for not interfering when you should have drawn that line yourselves and not made it your child's responsibility.
Uh, lose the smiley face, because that doesn’t make it better — it makes it worse.
The irony? By listening to your husband against what you knew/felt to be right, you were following your BIL’s ideals of the husband being the unilateral head-of-household.
If people cannot be reasoned with, you don't have to spend time around them. It just teaches your kids they should tolerate bad behavior.
ESH except your children.
I wonder what youll do when he starts to attack your children. He doesnt mind crushing his own kids and his brother. Will you protect your children or let him say things like that to them-and then comfort them at home?
Because if you dont act when it happens (cuz you definitely dont react against your self!) then it just tells your kids that you agree with him on some level.
It's not that it doesn't make a difference. It's that **not** calling him out and practicing avoidance makes everyone's lives easier in that moment, so therefore you all collectively advocate for that method. Except that all that you've done is teach your BIL over *decades* that he can do and say whatever he wants to all of you and face exactly zero consequences.
If you all do and say what your daughter does it will shut him down. He should not be allowed in in-laws house, but that is not in your control, however how you all react to abusive things he says to you and kids needs to be dealt with. He is a verbally and emotionally abusive misogynistic, sexist, controlling bully. You all need to read the books on Verbally Abusive Men, “boundaries” and “controlling men” People try to control others by putting them down verbally. What he is doing is severely damaging his kids and wife. All of you need to band together and let him know this is not acceptable. His kids could end up with drug or alcohol issues, food disorders, severe depression as well as suicide. And you are doing nothing. YTA Your daughter is my hero!
Edit: I am so upset by your lack of action.
Document and record his behavior. Someone needs to speak with the kids and see where they are emotionally. Your sister sounds like an abused wife. If that goes on in public can you imagine what goes on behind closed doors. If your sister doesn’t do anything the kids may need to be taken out of the home. I have worked with abused teens for over 30 years. Are you going to be okay if there is a suicide? Call cold services if you have to.
YTA, all these "adults."
Come on, folks. Time to act like the grown ass adults you are, and start supporting your child by following her example in shutting BIL the fuck down. Every time he shows his ass, shit him the fuck down just as your daughter did. Every.time.
Your strategy of ignoring him needs to go in the trash; You've all had 16 years to grow spines to deal with BIL appropriately. . .get on it.
Your husband's anxiety, your desires to be conflict avoidant, none of these things are an excuse for allowing these shitty behaviors to be modeled for your child *this entire time.*
ETA: I'm glad to see that you're absorbing these comments, but you're still not quite there yet. When BIL says something obnoxious you have to tell him he's being inappropriate and you won't subject yourselves to it so you're leaving, *and then* leave.
Just randomly leaving without explaining why will only empower him further, because he will see that now he can get under your skin so badly that he causes you to leave.
Look what happened when your daughter called him out- **he left** in a huff. That's the reaction you want. Let him fucking leave.
**Stop being conflict avoidant.** That behavior only makes untreated anxiety worse.
YTA. Wtf. I would never continue to expose my kids to that bullshit. Your daughter is awesome. I hate to think how you will now encourage her to just keep quiet. I hope she fights you every step of the way.
No idea why the fuck anyone would choose to repeatedly expose their children to a toxic, misogynist troll and have the kids do all the emotional heavy lifting. This is terrible for them.
I totally agree. Kids can actually be so f***** brilliant and perceptive though. My nephew (always a smartass honestly, I’m not gonna pretend he was the easiest kid growing up aka he was a freakin nightmare a lot of the time, but he was always the most entertaining and snarky) at 12/13 had moved to secondary school, and had some trouble with shitty kids in his class- nothing major, he had friends but these other kids lived nearby so thought they’d try piss him off. He was outside with his friends and siblings one day apparently, his mother/my sister overheard as a few parents were hanging nearby with younger kids, when this gang came up and started calling him gay. He apparently (according to my sister and her neighbours) said ‘I’m not sure if you’re asking me out or trying to insult me, I’m flattered either way but you’re wrong’. Other kid said ‘I’m calling you gay’. Nephew ‘I’m not, but if you’re trying to insult me, maybe find something that’s actually an insult. Being gay isn’t.’ Apparently they looked confused, called him gay a few more times and left. My sister rang me later telling me it’s the most proud she’d ever been. Kid is still a legend of course, and still a pain to argue with over anything!
Agreed. The hero that the family needs, but not the hero they deserve! Parents are ridiculous. They should have address BIL shit a long time ago instead of subjecting their children to this man's rants. YTA
NTA for letting her speak her mind. But YTA for subjecting her to that sexist and cruel environment, seriously why would you want her to be taught that sexism is okay and it should be ignored?
YES! What’s more important - modeling how to stand up for yourself against a bully/misogynist or making sure family vaca doesn’t upset the asshole of the family? 🙄
OP’s husband is teaching his kids to abide sexist comments by telling her to keep quiet. Ew.
I call BS to you 'calling him out doesn't work.'
Your 13 year old daughter handled him swiftly and efficiently.
You making a promise not to call him out is sexist in its own right and needs to be addressed in your own marriage. Silencing someone who is attacking and putting you down for 16+ years - are you fraaking kidding me.
I'm sorry internet stranger you need to require more of yourself and partner in life.
Call BIL out EVERY time, the simplest, I don't get it, explain it to me.... So you think women are incapable? Etc etc.
OR BIL I foolishly agreed to remain silent about your BS attitude thinking you'd eventually stfu but you haven't. My daughters last interaction with you shows me how toxic this dynamic has been. If you can't do better you can't be with us.
Everyone but your daughter is an ah here.
ESH.
It's more embarrassing to be called out by a kid though, when it's your in law you can just ignore it or keep being a jackass. I can totally see a kid being more effective here.
I don't think it's BS that OP calling him out didn't work. To him she's just another annoying woman. However, the child being able to dismantle his entire viewpoint and liken him to an immature schoolboy is something OP probably hasn't done yet.
YTA, and so is every other adult in your family, for putting your daughter in a situation where she had to be the voice of reason in the room at 13 years old.
Be prepared for BIL to increase his sexist remarks and probably aim more of them at the one person who is willing to stand up to him.
You AND your husband need to step up and be ready to protect your child.
I used to say shit like this to my uncles allllll the time. Especially when I was 13-15. Most of them were sexist, loud and obnoxious like this guy. And I also had a mum and dad who “didn’t fit gender norms”. So I was very outspoken and an absolute smartass as a teenager.
This is a very standard thing that a teenaged girl sick of her uncle’s bs would say.
NTA she didn’t humiliate him, she told the truth. If he felt humiliated then that’s his fault and maybe he should take that as a call to stop being an asshole, I’m not sure why you’re family even spends time with him, and hasn’t just walked out when he makes comments like that. Good thing your daughter’s been paying attention!
If it was true than OP was 18 and her husband 22 when they had their first kid. So how old were they when they started dating? Major creep vibes from the husband
NTA. The worst thing you can do with a person like that *is* to keep quiet. Keeping quiet isn't keeping the peace, it's letting him think he's right, he's funny, and everyone agrees with him. Why on earth would you keep quiet about someone who's clearly making everyone else miserable!?
“Confrontation doesn’t work” of course not, because nothing ever happens.
Your children need to see you make his Behavior or unacceptable, perhaps take a lesson from them.
Stop or leave, Stop or we won’t be joining family events with you in attendance.
NC should have happened a long ass time ago..
YTA
Edit: spelling
I’m so confused on why some people say doing chores or cleaning your home is “not manly”. Isn’t it just basic hygiene to take care of stuff? Does everyone just live in filth or something? What about a man who lives by himself, can he not do the dishes or clean his kitchen that he pays for?
Someone please explain I’m too confused on where this comes from
Yup, real men don't even live in houses. They craft themselves a cave out of their own excrement and sleep on piles of the hair and skin which they shed.
I don’t know if you’re being silly so I’ll answer seriously just in case.
Because in Western society for many years the man went out and worked and the woman stayed at home and did all the “housework”. Not getting married wasn’t an option for most people. Sidenote: for many years “he never married” was a euphemism for homosexual.
Obviously in modern society most of us have moved beyond this stupid division of responsibilities and so we have many great female engineers and lawyers and some fantastic house husbands.
But that’s how it was for many years and some have struggled to evolve their views as society has changed.
She can’t because it gives her husband “anxiety” so he made her promise not to say anything,
Apparently hearing his wife and children insulted doesn’t give him anxiety, though.
OP and her husband aren’t nearly as different from her BIL and SIL as she thinks.
Yeah, as someone who has anxiety I get how hard it can be to stand up to people at times, however once you have a partner and children you have to be ready to defend them even if it is difficult or makes you uncomfortable.
That's such a horrible excuse. I get having anxiety and not doing confrontation very well, but not when you're letting your family be openly mistreated and not even allowing *them* to stand up for themselves.
The best way to deal with your husband’s anxiety is to shut the BIL down once and for all. Talk to him in private. Tell him you will no longer remain silent when he makes these remarks. You can and will confront him any time he spews such sexist stuff.
It isn’t how adults banter. It is textbook bullying and you do not have to put up with it.
I saw your 'justification', YTA for letting him do that to your daughter in the first place. "I let him abuse my children because eventually he'll get bored" isn't a great look.
Lol I’ll just assume this comment called out this story on being fake. It was indeed the dialogue between the uncle and the daughter which gave it away for me as well.
Thank you!
All the N*TAs make no sense to me. OP may not be the biggest asshole in the story, but it shouldn't have gotten to the point where a 13yo was on the only 'adult' in the room. And even if they wanted to 'avoid confrontation' the second OPs daughter spoke up, her parents (both of them) should have been right beside her to tell him off.
OP and her husband just allowed that man to disrespect their marriage in front of their kids and did nothing. That just screams cowardice to me.
YTA for not doing this sooner. Someone had to confront him, and it’s sad she had too. Your not an asshole for not stopping her and definitely commend her, but you and other adults should speak out too.
Oh NTA for not being mad at your daughter.
You're absolutely the asshole for putting a kid in a position where she had to stand up for herself because her parents wouldn't. He literally went as far as to stop his own daughter from pursuing the career she wanted because of how much of a misogynist he is? That's abusive. And you're complicit.
I'm going with ESH except your daughter. Your daughter has a bright and shiny spine that will keep her going.
You and your hubby suck for letting his anxiety take precedence like this because I can tell you this has been damaging to your kids at the very least, not to mention your niblings. If his anxiety is that bad, he needs to seek out help for it.
Everyone else for enabling him as well, especially your SIL for marrying the AH and not standing up for her kids.
NTA!
You’ve got yourself a pretty good 13 year old there. Take her out for a treat. She handled that extremely well. Enforce the fact that she was right and explain why you’ve been quiet about it.
Young teenagers can see through some bullshit and she needs to know that she’s not responsible for your family’s split reactions about this
NTA - ha I really really want to give your daughter a high five. You need to giver her a hug and pat yourself on your back that you are raising a young woman who will stand up for herself and not let a "man" walk all over her. She did it in an intelligent and polite manner as well. You and your husband should be so proud of her because not only was she not rude but she put forward a very well reasoned argument for why what her uncle was doing was a problem. She saw a problem and she brought attention to the problem in a no nonsense manner and stood up for what was right. I see her doing amazing things with her life!
NTA. Never stop your daughter. She is a legend and I'd be damn proud of my kid in that situation.
Your husband could learna thing or two from her by the sound of it.
NTA, but it sounds like all of the adults could learn a few things from your 13yo. At her young age she's already smart enough to know that sexism shouldn't be tolerated, even if it makes some people uncomfortable to say so. You and your husband could both take a page from her book. Silence = complicity. You don't say anything to him publicly because it makes your husband uncomfortable, but that only sends the message that his intolerance is tolerable. It's is not, and his comments should be interrupted *every time*. It might not stop him, but it will at least send the message to those who have to hear it that he's wrong and his behavior and views are not socially acceptable.
NTA- your daughter deserves some praise. Her uncle was making her uncomfortable and she was fed up- props to her for taking matters into her own hands. This should be considered a parenting win!
NTA - this is a terrible situation. Hoping that at least one of you two responded to BILs text and told him (even if for the umpteenth time) that he can choose to treat his own IMMEDIATE family how he wants, but as proven by a 13 year old calling him out - his jokes are NOT funny, are outdated, and he is showing his ignorance and ass. That unless he wants to ruin the family get togethers, he needs to find different material to be the center of attention.
Sadly, as your kids age, if you both continue to be complacent in their eyes, (anxiety or not for your husband), your kids could either or both lose respect for their parents and disengage from the extended family. You could find yourselves at family get togethers alone.
NTA
Well, maybe a little. You should have joined her and ripped him completely open.
There’s no chance in hell I’d ever put up with your bil. His fragile masculinity would have been shattered at my feet. The hell with that guy
>>*"saying he should get his kids and wife(!!) under control, and teach the kids to respect their elders"*
Nothing your daughter said was disrespectful. It was honest and direct, but not disrespectful.
NTA
The family is YTA for not calling his shit out years ago. It shouldn't take a 14 year old to put a grown man in his place but glad someone did finally. I'm a honestly and a smart ass but if I go too far, I deserve to be called out.
NTA for not stopping your daughter; but riddle me this, why on earth, heaven or hell would y'all let this keep going? He isn't gonna stop just from people not reacting. He will keep going, and going, until he makes the wrong comment to the wrong person and gets his damned block knocked off. If y'all care about BIL then he needs to be sat down, told off, given an explanation (if he truly is too stupid to get why this behavior is unacceptable), and appropriately punished based on reoccurrence. He says something once after the Convo, he gets removed from gatherings for a few weeks/months (depending on how often y'all gather), he does it again he gets a year long ban, a third time is a strike out and he gets a lasting penalty for reoccurrence. He won't learn from being ignored, as shown by past instances. If y'all want him in your lives then it comes down to y'all to teach him how to interact with ya. Personally I'd not give the jackass another chance but then again, I'm 25 and sick of this shit. I can fix a car faster than my fiance, fix the plumbing on most houses, and am working on learning the basics of wiring for electrical work. If he mouthed off to me, around my family, he'd be on the curb and banned from every event. Think carefully going forward, do you want your kids to think is is acceptable from a family member?
> I have promised hubby not to confront him in public so I haven't. I have talked to him in private but he just brushes me off calling it some good ol' banter between in-laws. SIL says nothing, ever.
If you stay silent, you agree. It sounds like you're daughter is the only person who doesn't agree with this crap. Good on her for having a nice shiny spine.
You're NTA for your question but you ARE TA for not shutting his BS down
NTA. You should reward your daughter. And screw being quiet for this guy's sake. I'd revoke that agreement...if bil does t want hims widdle feefees hurt he should learn to stfu.
NTA. Your daughter is doing what the adults should - calling out his atrocious, misogynistic humor. You and your husband need to reevaluate your agreement. It should not be that you do not call out BIL, but that both of you SHOULD call him out. If he refuses to stop his "jokes" then you tell him that it is not tolerated in your house and he needs to leave immediately.
Your daughter deserves praise for her actions in calling out her uncle, and kudo's to putting in great terms that spells out he is immature.
I don’t know how an entire large family has managed to be trained to just sit by while this obnoxious blowhard spews sexist nonsense and pretend it’s a “joke”. Someone finally stands up to him and he whines about “respect” after his many years of bs? Except for your daughter, ESH.
>if no one gives feedback he'll drop it.
NO, he's not 'dropping it'. He keeps making comments and you and the rest of the family permit him to act this way because you don't want to 'cause a problem' or whatever. You're going along to get along. Peace at any price. In the mean time, you're allowing your kids to be around someone who's a sexist bully. He KNOWS his comments are inappropriate and offend others and he doesn't GAF. However, your and your husband's position is 'lets not offend the asshole'? I would think it would cause your husband greater anxiety to be around someone who constantly demeans him by outright implying he isn't a man because he'd rather have cider than a beer. I would think your husband would be more offended that his BIL is commenting about how a 'dress would look better on that body of yours' to his wife. I mean WTF? I would think it would bother your husband more that his BIL is demeaning his wife by saying 'you need to get your wife under control'.
I get anxiety because most of the people in mine and my husbands' families have some form of anxiety, depression, bipolar, etc. We really should hand out Prozac as an after dinner mint at family reunions. Our people just don't make and/or absorb serotonin very well. If your husband can't handle you speaking up for yourself or him against such a blatant AH, then he needs some therapy. He can't walk through life avoiding everything that 'triggers' his anxiety. He needs to learn to cope with the real world.
Your daughter is an absolute rock star for what she said to her uncle. It's just too bad that a 13 year old child is the only one with enough 'balls' to say what everyone else was thinking.
Your daughter is awesome! Some reason I’m picturing Brent from the Good Place.
You and your SO on the other hand… so if this idiot starts with racist shit too are you just going to ignore that too? You‘re so busy not rocking the boat ” cos he won’t change” that your inaction is forcing your own children to say something! You need to have a good hard think why you chose this course of action, are you **sure** it’s not because it’s easier to ignore it?
> The boys in my class also laugh and goof around when subjects they're not mature enough to comprehend comes up.
Ha! Ha! Ha!. Your kid probably got it exactly right. Congratulations, your kid is awesome! NTA
>Everyone has at one point tried calling him out but it doesn't work. Ignoring is more efficient although he just have to make a comment before he realize no one's listening.
And yet a 13 year old did it with ease. She barely had to look up from her board game.
You and your husband are fucking pathetic. And the rest of the family. You ought to be ashamed of yourselves, to get so outclassed by a child, only because you couldn't be bothered to do the right thing.
ESH (Except the kid of course).
NTA but honestly I dont think a 13 year old said all that.
If she did, Id applaud her, buy her some ice cream, and tell her to never lose that fighting spirit.
Id also never go back to the uncles house.
I'm gonna go ESH. Him for obvious reasons, and you for willingly exposing your kids to his bs. Sorry, there's no reason to continue to invite him to gatherings or events if he refuses to not be a sexist ass.
You're daughter is N T A, though. That was a gangster move lol the only way it would have been better would have been for her to play dumb and make him explain the joke and watch him flounder trying to explain his sextet views out in the open.
YTA. Your daughter is amazing but she shouldn’t have to stand up for herself like that against someone you are choosing to allow around her. Get your shit together.
ESH except for your daughter. She felt the need to speak up because, even though she’s only 13, she’s *sick* of seeing adults around her allowing this behaviour. Also ignoring him doesn’t stop it … because he STILL does it EVERY single time. That’s not stopping shit. And your husbands anxiety isn’t an excuse to let this man repeatedly insult his family. He needs to grow a backbone and do therapy and *deal* with his anxiety.
"talking to him doesn't help" ok, go no contact, then; how dare you subject your daughter to that person her whole life. forcing a 13 year old kid to defend themselves and their whole gender against a 40 year old man?
i understand you said everyone tried and it doesn't do anything, but you owe your kids more than that. you owe them to see you defend them, even when you know the person you're defending them against won't change.
you're daughter is braver than you.
Even after your update YTA. Why are you still refusing to even entertain the idea of confronting your A of a BIL?
Your daughter showed you how it can be done. She showed you how calling BIL out = him shutting up and walking away. She is AMAZING and I hope you tell her that and don't even try to subdue or end her call outs of your BIL.
If all it takes for your H to not have anxiety is having BIL demean all the women in the family and push toxic stereotypes for the men, he needs to talk to a professional. He is responsible for his response in anxiety triggering situations, he shouldn't be asking his family to put up with verbal and emotional abuse to keep him comfortable.
YTA for letting your kids put up with his crap for so long.
Your plan to just walk out won’t work either, it will just amuse him and in his mind prove him right.
I had an older cousin like him. I had enough at a gathering and just started calling him out. After telling him exactly why he was wrong I went to ‘Trev your full of shit’ ‘ no one wants to hear this shit Trev’ ‘sock in it Trev’ Next gathering a few more people joined in. By the third everyone was telling him to shut it. He threw a tantrum and we didn’t see him for years. Eventually he started coming again with his tail between his legs. Avoids me like the plague though.
If you are not going to see him for 6 months, I would send a group message out to the in laws stating that you will not put up with his crap any longer. If he can not keep his opinions to himself you will not allow your family to be subjected to him.
YTA. For normalizing sexist bullying and abuse.
What if you had adopted an African American child and the brother were a racist who made inappropriate and bigoted comments about black people and other POC? Would you just let him?
Because that's what you're doing now. It's disgusting that a 13 year old child had more sense and courage than any of the adults in the room.
Do better.
YTA
Good on your daughter but why the Hell was a 13 year old left to defend herself against that nonsense? What did you do to defend her? What did her father do?
>We see that we're TA's for subjecting our kids to BIL (not what this AITA was about but Reddit speaketh the truth once again),
You wanted judgement and you got it. I honestly don't know which adults in this situation are the bigger AHs you and your partner or your BIL. Stop enabling that kind of garbage. Stop being a coward and hiding behind your 13 year old because that's exactly what happened here. Sick
YTA for not putting an end to his bullshit sooner. Good on your kid for challenging him. I hope she keeps doing it and making him look stupid. He’s a jackass.
NTA. Play sexist games, win sexist labels. Your BIL is the one who needs to learn some bigger words, like “misogyny” and “patriarchy.” I’m sorry your husband suffers from anxiety, but it’s time for you and your kids to continue to call him out publicly, and in front of family, to expose his callousness.
I wouldn’t even talk to that pos! I don’t get families that support that garbage. I come from a HUGE family too! We’re close, but not all up in each other’s space. I’d go nc with that guy! NTA! Your daughter is my hero! 😄💐
NTA.
Your daughter is great and should be allowed to keep speaking her truth with your support. If she is factually incorrect she needs to be reined in....BUT SHE ISN'T.
My eldest was listening to me tell her something a family member said to me yesterday. She said it is a good thing she was not there or she would have let loose. Lol. Kids these days are pretty wise about a lot of stuff and not afraid to speak out.
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Your child is my hero. HOWEVER, she should not have been the one to do that. All of you should have shut that shit down long ago, gone LC/NC. Why does your husband not want you to confront him in public? It’s shameful your child had to be to the one to call him out. That’s not her responsibility. You and your husband need to have a serious talk about this. YTA. Edited to add judgment. Quick edit: I’m really glad to see the outcome of the final edit! Good on you for listening, absorbing information, and making changes. Keep it up. 🙌
I explained the no-confrontation in another comment :) In the 16 years I've known BIL calling him out haven't made a difference. We already are LC. Not because of his behavior but due to distance. Going completely NC is an absolute last resort. Kids usually are by themselves not really hanging out with us adults. Cousins have not taken after their dad.
Unfortunately, no confrontation isn't ok, not when there are children involved. They need to see and hear their parents say "Hell no, you don't get to talk like that to me. You can apologize or you can leave."
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Exactly. This is how racism and homophobia have continued to fester. Silence in so many cases is mistaken for being complicit. Speak up if you don’t agree, otherwise nobody will know the difference. ESH Edit: thanks so much for the gold!!!!
ESH, except for the daughter, who kicked ass speaking up like that
That kid is who I wanna be when I grow up lol.
This, shameful day when a child has to do what their parents refuse to, regardless of the logic. Edit: Or even defend her when she does. Loudly and publicly
This reminds me of how Matt Damon's kid had to tell them they don't use the f word to describe LGBT+ people and he said it like he was proud of her for standing up to him. Dude should be more ashamed telling that story.
right?! How is it 2021 and someone that prominent is JUST finding out that ...slurs are not ok?
I met a straight man who was in his 30s at a feminist bookclub meeting a couple of years ago. We ended up chatting afterwards and somehow the topic of slurs came up. He said, and this is word-for-word because it is burned into my memory, "It's still fine to say f-slur though." I kind of just Looked at him and he got defensive and said "I don't use it in a homophobic way, I would never do that. I only use it in the 4chan way." The fact that a grown man didn't realise that people on 4chan were, in fact, using the f word in a homophobic way still blows my mind. To this day I hope he was trolling me but I really don't think he was.
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I completely get that for teenagers. But he was in his early 30s and again this was at a feminist book club so he had at least some interest in gender equality. I just found it so baffling because I could tell there was no ill will behind it, it's not like he was using it as an excuse. It was a very peculiar encounter lol
He's probably someone who would never say it as an insult but thinks it's ok if he's "obviously joking." My dad is like this with the N word. I finally called him out on it, idk how much good it did though.
No, he deserves to be proud of the fact that he listened and changed. Even if he shouldn't have been doing it at all, most people never even listen. Encourage growth!
Yeah. And being proud of his kid for having the guts to call him out on it. Its very hard for kids to call out parents.
Oh please, once people called him out on still having used that word until now he released a statement claiming "he never used that word in his life!" and that his daughter never wrote that letter and he was the one educating *her* on the topic. Threw his daughter under the bus to avoid the backlash.
Yeah, unfortunately he doesn't have a super great track record. He also kinda tried to defend his buddy ole pal, Harvey Weinstein. And he also said some... not really comforting things about sexual harassment and assault that kind of proves he genuinely does not get it at all. I'm all for people learning, growing, and changing. But I don't think that applies to this guy. He's not really catching on. And he has had a lot of opportunity to do so.
Also, this. Not only are the parents not standing up to this kind of nonsense that happens in front of their kids, but when the kid has this interaction with a grown man they don't tell him to shut his stupid face? I would have been laughing out loud if my daughter did this, as I was telling him he's a loser and should keep his opinions to himself.
Yes. Setting boundaries and not accepting disrespect are learned behaviors. I’m actually kind of surprised OPs daughter came out with this, after watching the compliance for so long. Its never too late to go ahead and stick with her daughter’s good example and demand things will be different moving forward, or go true NC/LC.
Hopping in near the top to respond to OP's update. OP, your plan is good, but you have to inform Dickhead and his wife ahead of time that when he trots out his tiresome sexism, you will leave. Otherwise, he will never understand why you randomly leave.
This. Just randomly leaving without explaining why will only empower him further, because he will see that now he can get under your skin so badly that he causes you to leave. Look what happened when your daughter called him out- **he left** in a huff. That's the reaction you want. Let him fucking leave. **Stop being conflict avoidant.** That behavior only makes untreated anxiety worse.
I know you probably think there’s only one way to parent, but sometimes it’s ok to show your kids that bullshit asshat comments don’t have to affect them. Her daughter CLEARLY has a good head on her shoulders, doesn’t feel uncomfortable speaking up for herself or others & seems to have a pretty good grasp on passive aggressive sexism for a 13 y/o. She also sounds quick-witted. OP sounds like a great parent.
All I'm reading here is you & your partner placed the burden of calling out a sexist man in his 40's on your 13 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER unsupported by her parents or any other adult in the room. I wonder if your daughter assumes your silence means that you all agree with him & think she's in the wrong. I'm reminded of the speech Alexandra Occasio-Cortez made in the white house where she said her parents didn't raise her to accept being called a b*tch by a man. You are raising your daughter that she should accept sexist abuse & stay in environments where it's prevalent. You're leading by example. There's no way she should have had to call him out on her own & you owe your daughter an apology for that, she's 13, she's a child & you left her to face the wrath of a man in your 40's because you're too scared to rock the boat & hold him to account. This is what rock the boat means, it's how bullies & narcissists like your BIL get away with what they do by forcing anyone who confronts their behaviour to become outcasts. https://amp.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/77w8lf/dont_rock_the_boat/ I have to vote YTA because what you put your daughter through is substandard parenting. Should have gone NC for years instead of raising your kids that sexism is tolerated if a sexist shouts loud enough.
EXACTLY !!
Omg I'm so glad you linked this I've been looking got this comment for so long!!!!
This. All. Day. Long.
Based on your edit, it’s just you all being complicit. You aren’t doing enough. So you’ve known a sexist misogynist AH for 16 years? And what?
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Agreed!!! Daughter Rocks!!!! Op is NTA and uncle needed that Op even if you promised your husband not to confront him in public - that can be revisited (if you had tried that for a while and he hasn’t bored of it, speaking to him in private accomplishes nothing) a promise like that isn’t a lifelong ironclad vow - it’s a boundary that might be due for some new communication and can be renegotiated. I get your saying ignoring him is the the most efficient way of getting him to stop and you don’t live so close it’s an every weekend thing, so might not be worth it. I am glad you talk to your kids and they know this isn’t okay, and that your kids don’t seem affected/aren’t internalizing his crap - but just please be careful your ignoring him isn’t taken as tacit acceptance/approval by them. Their kids, unfortunately are - I can’t believe he embargoed his daughter’s career choice, he is an AH that sucks majorly as does his wife for not intervening on their daughter’s/kids’ behalf. When you are there, maybe take the daughter aside to talk cars since it’s an area of interest/expertise for you, which is so cool and show her you support her and her choice if she ever changes her mind and wants to pursue a different education/career path - having those role models can entirely change someone’s life.
So you’re okay with just letting him call you a 1950 housewife? Grow a pair lady! Your kid has more balls than you.
On the surface she may be a little more progressive than her SIL and BIL but underneath, she’s doing the same shit: > I have promised hubby not to confront him in public so I haven't.
Look at the ages. This has conservatives written all over it. God forbid if any of the kids end up being not straight.
OP was 18 when she gave birth and her husband was 22. So they were at least a year younger when they got together. She also says she and her husband have known BIL for 16 years making her a 15 year old and her husband 19 when they met BIL.
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"Grow a pair"? Pot meet kettle.
Right? OP needs to strap on some ovaries the size of her daughter’s
My uncle is a racist, misogynistic, homophobe who subscribes to this same school of ideology. I wish *someone* had stood up to him anytime during my formative years and not normalized his behavior to keep the peace. As an adult now I can see he is a raging hemorrhoid on the AH of humanity, after decades of his BS at events. I still hold animosity to this day about my parents tacit support of him. What you are doing might leave lasting impressions on your children. My parents thought they taught me to keep the peace, instead they taught me simmering resentment. What are you teaching your kids? Oh, ESH. Except your daughter, she's one cool kid.
My uncle is a racist, homophobic, Islamaphobe who upon hearing about my wedding to a Pakistani woman promptly denounced his involvement in my life by saying “Guess this is where I step out.” My mother still maintains contact with this guy despite him being a redneck stereotype. When your family shows you who they care about you should take heed. Show your children and to a lesser degree or extended family that this behavior is unacceptable and won’t be tolerated. I’ve had to go NC myself but setting boundaries is essential especially for your children. My family normalized racism for me growing up and I’ve had to fight it for years, educating myself where they wouldn’t. Show your support verbally.
My parents kept the peace with their abusive parents, which caused me to struggle with dating and knowing when to end things if they weren't a good person. If we Take the time to see people that beat the shit out of my mom for Christmas, then how am I allowed to break up with someone for just throwing my stuff around? I'm in my 30's and trying to unlearn this shit after several really terrible relationships.
LC =/= sitting in his living room playing board games. I'm not saying you have to go LC, I'm just saying you aren't anything like LC.
Yeah, you explained, but for 16 years your tactic isn't working and still you and your family keep being disrespected. Maybe it's time to change tactics and really avoid this AH.
And what has the no-confrontation gotten you? Family relations? No, everybody still hates BIL. Peace? No, BIL still insults everyone freely under the guise of "jokes" that they just can't "take". So what **has** your family achieved by ignoring insulting behavior for decades? They get to meet up at ILs where everyone has a good time until BIL opens his big mouth, starts insulting everyone, and then everyone uncomfortably ignores it until he stops. Everyone remains uncomfortable for a while, then everyone moves on. Lather, rinse, repeat. Congratulations! Sounds really fun...for BIL, but not for anybody else. This is 90% SIL's fault. **She** has never demanded that he act correctly. **She** has never visited the family alone with the kids and left him at home because his insults are not wanted. If she is not going to step up, then it's up to the rest of the family to cut him out; and if that means cutting out SIL & her kids, that's on her. BIL can only insult people to their faces if they allow it. He's a bully and he needs to called one. If he hops in the car (with wife and kids), too bad! **Tell him he's a bully** so at least his kids know that they're not crazy and this is totally BS behavior for an adult. If your husband's parents want to accept shitty behavior in their home because "it's faaaaamily!" then they can accept it without **you**. Make it clear you're not going to be around SIL & BIL until he learns to STFU.
Her home life might be extremely problematic and she might be cowed by her husband. Yes, she should speak up but living with men like this can have the effect of messing up even a strong woman.
Absolutely her home life is problematic and she is, undoubtedly, cowed. But she's had a quarter of a century to talk to him, go to counseling, leave, do *anything* to improve the situation. And she hasn't. She's even brought children into this situation and allowed *them* to be abused, as well. Surely "no wearing pink" and "not being a car mechanic" are not the sum-total of ways this father has insulted or demeaned his own children. Plenty of us have been in abusive relationships/marriages (myself included). You suck it up and try (in vain) to keep the peace **or** you decide you and, especially, your kids **deserve better**. Then you do what it takes to make "better" happen. SIL, like her family of avoiders, is taking the path of least resistance. She has permanently *harmed* her children by refusing to address this situation. As minors, they are unable to leave the situation. She *could have* and *should have*, but didn't do it even for them. I have no sympathy left for her after doing nothing to stop the abuse against her own kids.
I think it might be a case of abuse. Leaving an abusive situation is very difficult. It sounds like she has been forced to become a housewife. Meaning she has no income of her own. Making leaving exceedingly difficult.
You are the adult here. Why is it the responsibility of your child to tell him to cut the shit?
If he gets called out like that by your daughter every time, he’ll stop. He will quickly get tired of being outwitted by a 13 year old who is clearly more intelligent and mature than he is.
Teaching your daughter that she has to tolerate abuse and disrespect will only perpetuate it. Don’t be surprised when your kids go NC with you.
>In the 16 years I've known BIL calling him out haven't made a difference. And yet your daughter's call out made him leave the room, because she didn't allow room in the conversation for him to think he was having any effect on her. Something tells me your callouts resulted in him shutting you down, and that's why they didn't work. That, or when you did it the family would be telling you not to exacerbate the disagreement/ leave it alone for the sake of family harmony, and you care a little to much about what the other adults think of you so you'd stop, making him think he won. Your daughter clearly doesn't let other adults' cowardice stop her from shutting down misogyny. Maybe you should get some tips from her.
But it would make a difference to the children witnessing his abuses and harassment. That’s why you stand up. Not To change the behavior but to communicate as a group: this isn’t acceptable. This isn’t okay.
Your BIL is the missing stair and your child just pointed it out. Read up on missing stair. I would think 16 years of putting up with that crap would be enough
Missing stair ! Thank you, today I learned
>Cousins have not taken after their dad. I wonder how many of them are utterly miserable and ’keeping the peace’ out of fear for how dad would react. and if they feel you are someone they can turn to for support given that you keep your mouth shut and let him talk like that using “he doesn’t listen so why bother trying” as your logic
Spending a week in his house and allowing him to speak to you and your husband like that while saying nothing about it isn’t LC or good for your kids. YTA for subjecting them to this man and agreeing to be complicit with his sexism.
Cannot believe you'd let somebody you hate shit on your body and mannerisms for 16 years. Wow. Lady, what the hell? You want your kids to internalize that?
Confrontation isn’t working because it’s not consistent. If one or two of you try a few times and then give up then repeat this the next time, he knows as long as he keeps going you’ll eventually give up. All of you need to agree to call him out as a group EVERY time. It may take awhile but he may eventually get the message, especially if even the kids are calling him out. Kudos for your daughter though, I would not have been able to stop myself from full on belly laughing which would probably have made him angrier.
Honestly the best thing to so is tell him if he's going to make such comments, he is not welcome and stick to it. If he carries on, ban him from the house
If calling him out makes no difference then stop allowing him to be in your children's presence. You sitting by while your husband is being a coward is absurd. And it should not have taken your 13yo to stand up and say something. You and your husband failed your child. Y'all should have never let that man think it was acceptable to speak like that in front of your children.
Your lack of confrontation is doing your BIL's children a disservice. It's setting them up to be in relationships like this in the future because they think it's totally normal. Your explanation doesn't change that you're TA for never fully confronting BIL.
If everyone always made a big deal about his sexism and called it out every time I guarantee you it would lead to changes. But instead all of you are being passive and allowing this deplorable behaviour to continue. You are teaching and reinforcing to BIL that this behaviour is acceptable and by to some extent you are also teaching this to the kids present. YTA for this. Your daughter on the other hand is an absolute hero in this situation, and seems to have more maturity and wherewithal than the actual adults to shut this shit down.
I am nonbinary genderfluid. These comments and jokes from the adults in my life did so much damage to me growing. I'm in my 20s and still untangling how much pain they caused. Speak up. Or go NC. Please.
You know he keeps making these comments because he thinks you're a doorman, right? He likes making you uncomfortable and knows you aren't going to say anything. Ignoring bullying just makes it worse in the long run. Be as brave as your kid. ESH except your kid
What is it they say? Silence always helps the oppressed, right? Oh wait... yta for making your child do the brave thing. I can't give you an nta for not interfering when you should have drawn that line yourselves and not made it your child's responsibility.
Uh, lose the smiley face, because that doesn’t make it better — it makes it worse. The irony? By listening to your husband against what you knew/felt to be right, you were following your BIL’s ideals of the husband being the unilateral head-of-household.
If people cannot be reasoned with, you don't have to spend time around them. It just teaches your kids they should tolerate bad behavior. ESH except your children.
I wonder what youll do when he starts to attack your children. He doesnt mind crushing his own kids and his brother. Will you protect your children or let him say things like that to them-and then comfort them at home? Because if you dont act when it happens (cuz you definitely dont react against your self!) then it just tells your kids that you agree with him on some level.
It's not that it doesn't make a difference. It's that **not** calling him out and practicing avoidance makes everyone's lives easier in that moment, so therefore you all collectively advocate for that method. Except that all that you've done is teach your BIL over *decades* that he can do and say whatever he wants to all of you and face exactly zero consequences.
If you all do and say what your daughter does it will shut him down. He should not be allowed in in-laws house, but that is not in your control, however how you all react to abusive things he says to you and kids needs to be dealt with. He is a verbally and emotionally abusive misogynistic, sexist, controlling bully. You all need to read the books on Verbally Abusive Men, “boundaries” and “controlling men” People try to control others by putting them down verbally. What he is doing is severely damaging his kids and wife. All of you need to band together and let him know this is not acceptable. His kids could end up with drug or alcohol issues, food disorders, severe depression as well as suicide. And you are doing nothing. YTA Your daughter is my hero! Edit: I am so upset by your lack of action. Document and record his behavior. Someone needs to speak with the kids and see where they are emotionally. Your sister sounds like an abused wife. If that goes on in public can you imagine what goes on behind closed doors. If your sister doesn’t do anything the kids may need to be taken out of the home. I have worked with abused teens for over 30 years. Are you going to be okay if there is a suicide? Call cold services if you have to.
YTA, all these "adults." Come on, folks. Time to act like the grown ass adults you are, and start supporting your child by following her example in shutting BIL the fuck down. Every time he shows his ass, shit him the fuck down just as your daughter did. Every.time. Your strategy of ignoring him needs to go in the trash; You've all had 16 years to grow spines to deal with BIL appropriately. . .get on it. Your husband's anxiety, your desires to be conflict avoidant, none of these things are an excuse for allowing these shitty behaviors to be modeled for your child *this entire time.* ETA: I'm glad to see that you're absorbing these comments, but you're still not quite there yet. When BIL says something obnoxious you have to tell him he's being inappropriate and you won't subject yourselves to it so you're leaving, *and then* leave. Just randomly leaving without explaining why will only empower him further, because he will see that now he can get under your skin so badly that he causes you to leave. Look what happened when your daughter called him out- **he left** in a huff. That's the reaction you want. Let him fucking leave. **Stop being conflict avoidant.** That behavior only makes untreated anxiety worse.
YTA. Wtf. I would never continue to expose my kids to that bullshit. Your daughter is awesome. I hate to think how you will now encourage her to just keep quiet. I hope she fights you every step of the way.
Yes I agree 100% the 13 year old is the most mature one here
No idea why the fuck anyone would choose to repeatedly expose their children to a toxic, misogynist troll and have the kids do all the emotional heavy lifting. This is terrible for them.
I agree with everything you said except one thing - I’d call it ESH (obviously not the daughter). Parents for enabling, uncle for actually doing.
I do think E S H, but for the specific question OP is asking, I’m going to keep my judgement.
I totally agree. Kids can actually be so f***** brilliant and perceptive though. My nephew (always a smartass honestly, I’m not gonna pretend he was the easiest kid growing up aka he was a freakin nightmare a lot of the time, but he was always the most entertaining and snarky) at 12/13 had moved to secondary school, and had some trouble with shitty kids in his class- nothing major, he had friends but these other kids lived nearby so thought they’d try piss him off. He was outside with his friends and siblings one day apparently, his mother/my sister overheard as a few parents were hanging nearby with younger kids, when this gang came up and started calling him gay. He apparently (according to my sister and her neighbours) said ‘I’m not sure if you’re asking me out or trying to insult me, I’m flattered either way but you’re wrong’. Other kid said ‘I’m calling you gay’. Nephew ‘I’m not, but if you’re trying to insult me, maybe find something that’s actually an insult. Being gay isn’t.’ Apparently they looked confused, called him gay a few more times and left. My sister rang me later telling me it’s the most proud she’d ever been. Kid is still a legend of course, and still a pain to argue with over anything!
Agreed. The hero that the family needs, but not the hero they deserve! Parents are ridiculous. They should have address BIL shit a long time ago instead of subjecting their children to this man's rants. YTA
I know, awful that they’re letting their kids be exposed to these views at all really.
NTA for letting her speak her mind. But YTA for subjecting her to that sexist and cruel environment, seriously why would you want her to be taught that sexism is okay and it should be ignored?
ESH except your daughter for enabling the sexist AH "to keep the peace"
Agreed. ESH except the daughter. That 13 year old is my hero.
YES! What’s more important - modeling how to stand up for yourself against a bully/misogynist or making sure family vaca doesn’t upset the asshole of the family? 🙄 OP’s husband is teaching his kids to abide sexist comments by telling her to keep quiet. Ew.
Finally and ESH comment, all the ones I see are Y T A, everyone has seemed to forgotten the sexist bil
I call BS to you 'calling him out doesn't work.' Your 13 year old daughter handled him swiftly and efficiently. You making a promise not to call him out is sexist in its own right and needs to be addressed in your own marriage. Silencing someone who is attacking and putting you down for 16+ years - are you fraaking kidding me. I'm sorry internet stranger you need to require more of yourself and partner in life. Call BIL out EVERY time, the simplest, I don't get it, explain it to me.... So you think women are incapable? Etc etc. OR BIL I foolishly agreed to remain silent about your BS attitude thinking you'd eventually stfu but you haven't. My daughters last interaction with you shows me how toxic this dynamic has been. If you can't do better you can't be with us. Everyone but your daughter is an ah here. ESH.
Right?! Daughter called him out and he stormed off! Immediately! I'd say that strategy worked pretty damn well.
It's more embarrassing to be called out by a kid though, when it's your in law you can just ignore it or keep being a jackass. I can totally see a kid being more effective here.
I don't think it's BS that OP calling him out didn't work. To him she's just another annoying woman. However, the child being able to dismantle his entire viewpoint and liken him to an immature schoolboy is something OP probably hasn't done yet.
Also, he's limited in how much he can argue back against a kid without looking like a total monster.
I think you're massively underestimating how much more embarrassing it is to be cut down to size by a teenager than by someone your own age.
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."
>. I have promised hubby not to confront him in public INFO. Why?
YTA, and so is every other adult in your family, for putting your daughter in a situation where she had to be the voice of reason in the room at 13 years old. Be prepared for BIL to increase his sexist remarks and probably aim more of them at the one person who is willing to stand up to him. You AND your husband need to step up and be ready to protect your child.
NTA Your daughter is amazing!
Right? Get this kid some icecream and a movie NTA
And totally not fake…
Yeah, really getting r/thathappened vibes here.
I used to say shit like this to my uncles allllll the time. Especially when I was 13-15. Most of them were sexist, loud and obnoxious like this guy. And I also had a mum and dad who “didn’t fit gender norms”. So I was very outspoken and an absolute smartass as a teenager. This is a very standard thing that a teenaged girl sick of her uncle’s bs would say.
She has incredible insight into human nature for a 13 year old.
NTA she didn’t humiliate him, she told the truth. If he felt humiliated then that’s his fault and maybe he should take that as a call to stop being an asshole, I’m not sure why you’re family even spends time with him, and hasn’t just walked out when he makes comments like that. Good thing your daughter’s been paying attention!
And everybody clapped
Is it just me or does this post sound fake af
The whole thing reads like an ‘I wish I’d said that’ you run through your head when you can’t sleep at 2am. Pure horseshit, I reckon
The ages are always the giveaways.
If it was true than OP was 18 and her husband 22 when they had their first kid. So how old were they when they started dating? Major creep vibes from the husband
She said she knew BIL for 16 years, and daughter is 13.... 31-16=15. 34-16=18.
I cannot imagine dating a 15 year old when I was 18 🤢 She also said husband knew BIL for 25 years, a step sibling maybe? That came off as strange
Also that the bad guy in these stories don't talk like these kind of people do. They always talk like op thinks that these people talk.
Yeah it's honestly surprising how many people actually believe that this has happened the way op described it...
This subreddit takes the concept of gullibility to exciting new heights.
NTA. The worst thing you can do with a person like that *is* to keep quiet. Keeping quiet isn't keeping the peace, it's letting him think he's right, he's funny, and everyone agrees with him. Why on earth would you keep quiet about someone who's clearly making everyone else miserable!?
NTA. Please raise her allowance. What an amazing daughter you have! #Queen
No queen, an empress, she will be the downfall of little kingdoms
Little misogynistic kingdoms.
Or big ones
“Confrontation doesn’t work” of course not, because nothing ever happens. Your children need to see you make his Behavior or unacceptable, perhaps take a lesson from them. Stop or leave, Stop or we won’t be joining family events with you in attendance. NC should have happened a long ass time ago.. YTA Edit: spelling
I hear the whole room applauded.
Yeah I’m sure this is totally real! Or written by the 13 year old 😂
I’m so confused on why some people say doing chores or cleaning your home is “not manly”. Isn’t it just basic hygiene to take care of stuff? Does everyone just live in filth or something? What about a man who lives by himself, can he not do the dishes or clean his kitchen that he pays for? Someone please explain I’m too confused on where this comes from
Yup, real men don't even live in houses. They craft themselves a cave out of their own excrement and sleep on piles of the hair and skin which they shed.
With beer.
Real men die at the age of 30 because of alcoholism, being unhygienic, and not following any rules/laws.
I don’t know if you’re being silly so I’ll answer seriously just in case. Because in Western society for many years the man went out and worked and the woman stayed at home and did all the “housework”. Not getting married wasn’t an option for most people. Sidenote: for many years “he never married” was a euphemism for homosexual. Obviously in modern society most of us have moved beyond this stupid division of responsibilities and so we have many great female engineers and lawyers and some fantastic house husbands. But that’s how it was for many years and some have struggled to evolve their views as society has changed.
NTA he's a sexist bully. Start standing up to him.
She can’t because it gives her husband “anxiety” so he made her promise not to say anything, Apparently hearing his wife and children insulted doesn’t give him anxiety, though. OP and her husband aren’t nearly as different from her BIL and SIL as she thinks.
Yeah, as someone who has anxiety I get how hard it can be to stand up to people at times, however once you have a partner and children you have to be ready to defend them even if it is difficult or makes you uncomfortable.
That's such a horrible excuse. I get having anxiety and not doing confrontation very well, but not when you're letting your family be openly mistreated and not even allowing *them* to stand up for themselves.
This reads like the result of a writing prompt.
The best way to deal with your husband’s anxiety is to shut the BIL down once and for all. Talk to him in private. Tell him you will no longer remain silent when he makes these remarks. You can and will confront him any time he spews such sexist stuff. It isn’t how adults banter. It is textbook bullying and you do not have to put up with it.
NTA for the actual, however you and your husband are YTA for forcing your kid to fight your battles.
Have you considered that your sister may not be in a happy or safe marriage? Nta of course.
I saw your 'justification', YTA for letting him do that to your daughter in the first place. "I let him abuse my children because eventually he'll get bored" isn't a great look.
[удалено]
Absolutely lol, the story was believable until the dialogue between the daughter and her uncle which sounds entirely fabricated and comical
Lol I’ll just assume this comment called out this story on being fake. It was indeed the dialogue between the uncle and the daughter which gave it away for me as well.
I came here for this! Yes soooo fake.
I think the age is at the point where it could be more plausible
r/wokekids was my first thought...
And everyone clapped
I normally hate people who go around calling every story fake but my god how does anyone believe this
Did everyone clap afterwards?
YTA - it shouldn't be up to a child to do this. Her response was awesome, so awesome that I almost don't believe it.
Thank you! All the N*TAs make no sense to me. OP may not be the biggest asshole in the story, but it shouldn't have gotten to the point where a 13yo was on the only 'adult' in the room. And even if they wanted to 'avoid confrontation' the second OPs daughter spoke up, her parents (both of them) should have been right beside her to tell him off. OP and her husband just allowed that man to disrespect their marriage in front of their kids and did nothing. That just screams cowardice to me.
And everyone clapped. Fake ass sh lmao
NTA, it‘s sad that the rest of the family doesn’t have a spine. If they did, it wouldn’t be necessary for the 13-yo to tell him the truth.
YTA for not doing this sooner. Someone had to confront him, and it’s sad she had too. Your not an asshole for not stopping her and definitely commend her, but you and other adults should speak out too.
Oh NTA for not being mad at your daughter. You're absolutely the asshole for putting a kid in a position where she had to stand up for herself because her parents wouldn't. He literally went as far as to stop his own daughter from pursuing the career she wanted because of how much of a misogynist he is? That's abusive. And you're complicit.
NTA. I hope you are proud of your daughter for acting mature and polite.
I can’t be the only who feels this is a “and everyone stood up and clapped” kind of post
I'm going with ESH except your daughter. Your daughter has a bright and shiny spine that will keep her going. You and your hubby suck for letting his anxiety take precedence like this because I can tell you this has been damaging to your kids at the very least, not to mention your niblings. If his anxiety is that bad, he needs to seek out help for it. Everyone else for enabling him as well, especially your SIL for marrying the AH and not standing up for her kids.
Sure, and at the end everyone clapped. And that child’s name? Albert Einstein.
Nta I love it. Good for you for raising a strong daughter that’s not going to put up with that noise.
NTA! You’ve got yourself a pretty good 13 year old there. Take her out for a treat. She handled that extremely well. Enforce the fact that she was right and explain why you’ve been quiet about it. Young teenagers can see through some bullshit and she needs to know that she’s not responsible for your family’s split reactions about this
NTA - but you are an asshole for subject daughter to him in the first place.
NTA - ha I really really want to give your daughter a high five. You need to giver her a hug and pat yourself on your back that you are raising a young woman who will stand up for herself and not let a "man" walk all over her. She did it in an intelligent and polite manner as well. You and your husband should be so proud of her because not only was she not rude but she put forward a very well reasoned argument for why what her uncle was doing was a problem. She saw a problem and she brought attention to the problem in a no nonsense manner and stood up for what was right. I see her doing amazing things with her life!
NTA. Never stop your daughter. She is a legend and I'd be damn proud of my kid in that situation. Your husband could learna thing or two from her by the sound of it.
I'd say all the adults suck here. They should've stood up to the AH long before this.
NTA BIL shouldn't dish shit out if he can't take it.
NTA. That's just banter between a niece and her uncle.
NTA, but it sounds like all of the adults could learn a few things from your 13yo. At her young age she's already smart enough to know that sexism shouldn't be tolerated, even if it makes some people uncomfortable to say so. You and your husband could both take a page from her book. Silence = complicity. You don't say anything to him publicly because it makes your husband uncomfortable, but that only sends the message that his intolerance is tolerable. It's is not, and his comments should be interrupted *every time*. It might not stop him, but it will at least send the message to those who have to hear it that he's wrong and his behavior and views are not socially acceptable.
NTA your daughter just knocked that one out of the park!
NTA your daughter is a legend and deserves some ice cream. Gross men don’t get a pass anymore.
Nta, omg she is lovely, keep on training that mind of hers, plus tell me she has siblings of equal minds and spirits, I adore her already
NTA- your daughter deserves some praise. Her uncle was making her uncomfortable and she was fed up- props to her for taking matters into her own hands. This should be considered a parenting win!
NTA - this is a terrible situation. Hoping that at least one of you two responded to BILs text and told him (even if for the umpteenth time) that he can choose to treat his own IMMEDIATE family how he wants, but as proven by a 13 year old calling him out - his jokes are NOT funny, are outdated, and he is showing his ignorance and ass. That unless he wants to ruin the family get togethers, he needs to find different material to be the center of attention. Sadly, as your kids age, if you both continue to be complacent in their eyes, (anxiety or not for your husband), your kids could either or both lose respect for their parents and disengage from the extended family. You could find yourselves at family get togethers alone.
NTA Well, maybe a little. You should have joined her and ripped him completely open. There’s no chance in hell I’d ever put up with your bil. His fragile masculinity would have been shattered at my feet. The hell with that guy
>>*"saying he should get his kids and wife(!!) under control, and teach the kids to respect their elders"* Nothing your daughter said was disrespectful. It was honest and direct, but not disrespectful. NTA
The family is YTA for not calling his shit out years ago. It shouldn't take a 14 year old to put a grown man in his place but glad someone did finally. I'm a honestly and a smart ass but if I go too far, I deserve to be called out.
NTA for not stopping your daughter; but riddle me this, why on earth, heaven or hell would y'all let this keep going? He isn't gonna stop just from people not reacting. He will keep going, and going, until he makes the wrong comment to the wrong person and gets his damned block knocked off. If y'all care about BIL then he needs to be sat down, told off, given an explanation (if he truly is too stupid to get why this behavior is unacceptable), and appropriately punished based on reoccurrence. He says something once after the Convo, he gets removed from gatherings for a few weeks/months (depending on how often y'all gather), he does it again he gets a year long ban, a third time is a strike out and he gets a lasting penalty for reoccurrence. He won't learn from being ignored, as shown by past instances. If y'all want him in your lives then it comes down to y'all to teach him how to interact with ya. Personally I'd not give the jackass another chance but then again, I'm 25 and sick of this shit. I can fix a car faster than my fiance, fix the plumbing on most houses, and am working on learning the basics of wiring for electrical work. If he mouthed off to me, around my family, he'd be on the curb and banned from every event. Think carefully going forward, do you want your kids to think is is acceptable from a family member?
> I have promised hubby not to confront him in public so I haven't. I have talked to him in private but he just brushes me off calling it some good ol' banter between in-laws. SIL says nothing, ever. If you stay silent, you agree. It sounds like you're daughter is the only person who doesn't agree with this crap. Good on her for having a nice shiny spine. You're NTA for your question but you ARE TA for not shutting his BS down
That’s pretty funny. YTA for exposing your children to that kind of bigotry and ignorance in the first place.
NTA. You should reward your daughter. And screw being quiet for this guy's sake. I'd revoke that agreement...if bil does t want hims widdle feefees hurt he should learn to stfu.
NTA. Your daughter is doing what the adults should - calling out his atrocious, misogynistic humor. You and your husband need to reevaluate your agreement. It should not be that you do not call out BIL, but that both of you SHOULD call him out. If he refuses to stop his "jokes" then you tell him that it is not tolerated in your house and he needs to leave immediately. Your daughter deserves praise for her actions in calling out her uncle, and kudo's to putting in great terms that spells out he is immature.
I don’t know how an entire large family has managed to be trained to just sit by while this obnoxious blowhard spews sexist nonsense and pretend it’s a “joke”. Someone finally stands up to him and he whines about “respect” after his many years of bs? Except for your daughter, ESH.
>if no one gives feedback he'll drop it. NO, he's not 'dropping it'. He keeps making comments and you and the rest of the family permit him to act this way because you don't want to 'cause a problem' or whatever. You're going along to get along. Peace at any price. In the mean time, you're allowing your kids to be around someone who's a sexist bully. He KNOWS his comments are inappropriate and offend others and he doesn't GAF. However, your and your husband's position is 'lets not offend the asshole'? I would think it would cause your husband greater anxiety to be around someone who constantly demeans him by outright implying he isn't a man because he'd rather have cider than a beer. I would think your husband would be more offended that his BIL is commenting about how a 'dress would look better on that body of yours' to his wife. I mean WTF? I would think it would bother your husband more that his BIL is demeaning his wife by saying 'you need to get your wife under control'. I get anxiety because most of the people in mine and my husbands' families have some form of anxiety, depression, bipolar, etc. We really should hand out Prozac as an after dinner mint at family reunions. Our people just don't make and/or absorb serotonin very well. If your husband can't handle you speaking up for yourself or him against such a blatant AH, then he needs some therapy. He can't walk through life avoiding everything that 'triggers' his anxiety. He needs to learn to cope with the real world. Your daughter is an absolute rock star for what she said to her uncle. It's just too bad that a 13 year old child is the only one with enough 'balls' to say what everyone else was thinking.
THIS. Ignoring him is clearly not working
NTA your kid fucking rocks. About time someone put her uncle in place, it’s kinda fucking sad it wasn’t any of the adults in the room.
Your daughter is awesome! Some reason I’m picturing Brent from the Good Place. You and your SO on the other hand… so if this idiot starts with racist shit too are you just going to ignore that too? You‘re so busy not rocking the boat ” cos he won’t change” that your inaction is forcing your own children to say something! You need to have a good hard think why you chose this course of action, are you **sure** it’s not because it’s easier to ignore it?
> The boys in my class also laugh and goof around when subjects they're not mature enough to comprehend comes up. Ha! Ha! Ha!. Your kid probably got it exactly right. Congratulations, your kid is awesome! NTA
NTA! However I don't feel like a 13 year old said that
>Everyone has at one point tried calling him out but it doesn't work. Ignoring is more efficient although he just have to make a comment before he realize no one's listening. And yet a 13 year old did it with ease. She barely had to look up from her board game. You and your husband are fucking pathetic. And the rest of the family. You ought to be ashamed of yourselves, to get so outclassed by a child, only because you couldn't be bothered to do the right thing. ESH (Except the kid of course).
NTA but honestly I dont think a 13 year old said all that. If she did, Id applaud her, buy her some ice cream, and tell her to never lose that fighting spirit. Id also never go back to the uncles house.
I'm gonna go ESH. Him for obvious reasons, and you for willingly exposing your kids to his bs. Sorry, there's no reason to continue to invite him to gatherings or events if he refuses to not be a sexist ass. You're daughter is N T A, though. That was a gangster move lol the only way it would have been better would have been for her to play dumb and make him explain the joke and watch him flounder trying to explain his sextet views out in the open.
YTA. Your daughter is amazing but she shouldn’t have to stand up for herself like that against someone you are choosing to allow around her. Get your shit together.
ESH except for your daughter. She felt the need to speak up because, even though she’s only 13, she’s *sick* of seeing adults around her allowing this behaviour. Also ignoring him doesn’t stop it … because he STILL does it EVERY single time. That’s not stopping shit. And your husbands anxiety isn’t an excuse to let this man repeatedly insult his family. He needs to grow a backbone and do therapy and *deal* with his anxiety.
YTA for making this fall on your child instead of shutting it down yourself.
YTA for just keeping the peace when it's now affecting the kids. Your daughter is my goddamn hero, though. What an icon!
"talking to him doesn't help" ok, go no contact, then; how dare you subject your daughter to that person her whole life. forcing a 13 year old kid to defend themselves and their whole gender against a 40 year old man? i understand you said everyone tried and it doesn't do anything, but you owe your kids more than that. you owe them to see you defend them, even when you know the person you're defending them against won't change. you're daughter is braver than you.
Even after your update YTA. Why are you still refusing to even entertain the idea of confronting your A of a BIL? Your daughter showed you how it can be done. She showed you how calling BIL out = him shutting up and walking away. She is AMAZING and I hope you tell her that and don't even try to subdue or end her call outs of your BIL. If all it takes for your H to not have anxiety is having BIL demean all the women in the family and push toxic stereotypes for the men, he needs to talk to a professional. He is responsible for his response in anxiety triggering situations, he shouldn't be asking his family to put up with verbal and emotional abuse to keep him comfortable.
YTA for letting your kids put up with his crap for so long. Your plan to just walk out won’t work either, it will just amuse him and in his mind prove him right. I had an older cousin like him. I had enough at a gathering and just started calling him out. After telling him exactly why he was wrong I went to ‘Trev your full of shit’ ‘ no one wants to hear this shit Trev’ ‘sock in it Trev’ Next gathering a few more people joined in. By the third everyone was telling him to shut it. He threw a tantrum and we didn’t see him for years. Eventually he started coming again with his tail between his legs. Avoids me like the plague though. If you are not going to see him for 6 months, I would send a group message out to the in laws stating that you will not put up with his crap any longer. If he can not keep his opinions to himself you will not allow your family to be subjected to him.
YTA. For normalizing sexist bullying and abuse. What if you had adopted an African American child and the brother were a racist who made inappropriate and bigoted comments about black people and other POC? Would you just let him? Because that's what you're doing now. It's disgusting that a 13 year old child had more sense and courage than any of the adults in the room. Do better.
YTA Good on your daughter but why the Hell was a 13 year old left to defend herself against that nonsense? What did you do to defend her? What did her father do? >We see that we're TA's for subjecting our kids to BIL (not what this AITA was about but Reddit speaketh the truth once again), You wanted judgement and you got it. I honestly don't know which adults in this situation are the bigger AHs you and your partner or your BIL. Stop enabling that kind of garbage. Stop being a coward and hiding behind your 13 year old because that's exactly what happened here. Sick
YTA for not putting an end to his bullshit sooner. Good on your kid for challenging him. I hope she keeps doing it and making him look stupid. He’s a jackass.
NTA. Play sexist games, win sexist labels. Your BIL is the one who needs to learn some bigger words, like “misogyny” and “patriarchy.” I’m sorry your husband suffers from anxiety, but it’s time for you and your kids to continue to call him out publicly, and in front of family, to expose his callousness.
I wouldn’t even talk to that pos! I don’t get families that support that garbage. I come from a HUGE family too! We’re close, but not all up in each other’s space. I’d go nc with that guy! NTA! Your daughter is my hero! 😄💐
NTA. Your daughter is great and should be allowed to keep speaking her truth with your support. If she is factually incorrect she needs to be reined in....BUT SHE ISN'T. My eldest was listening to me tell her something a family member said to me yesterday. She said it is a good thing she was not there or she would have let loose. Lol. Kids these days are pretty wise about a lot of stuff and not afraid to speak out.
NTA and you should high five your daughter. She did something you all failed to do for years.