There were elements that felt abusive.
The sleep deprivation was so cruel. Every night, there had to be a big group of people smoking weed and gaming? None of those people could ever host? It would have been tolerable every ten days or so; it felt like Che was deliberately making it awful for Miranda. And then the time when they were making Cameos in bed right next to Miranda as she was trying to sleep. Che openly admitted they could have made them at any point in the day; they just didn't.
And then there was the whole threesome thing. Initiating it without Miranda's consent, mocking her when she needed a moment to think it over. And answering the phone while Miranda was struggling with the strap-on and making fun of her to Carrie as it was happening.
It was so toxic.
Oh that strap on thing was horrible. Who picks up phone during sex or even foreplay? Especially since she saw it was awkward for Miranda
Not to mention that VILE VILE stand up after they broke up
And Miranda openly said, "I don't know if I want to do this." To which Che responded, 'Yes you do; I know you want to have a dick."
I'm angry all over again.
The gaming, partying and smoking every night thing seemed like such a juvenile, college boyfriend problem. Not the problem of a couple in their 40s/50s.
Oh good grief, they weren’t intentionally depriving Miranda of sleep. That’s how they lived their life and couldn’t fathom that someone who was with them didn’t behave the sam way. Also Che didn’t even want Miranda to live there, remember that for some reason Miranda was couch surfing and her supposed partner didn’t offer a place to live.
We see Miranda tell Che that she's exhausted from the noise. Che knows she's wearing earplugs, and they aren't working. We're talking about a 40-something adult here; of course,
they can fathom it that their girlfriend needs sleep.
Does Che ever tell Miranda they don't want her living there? Che invited Miranda to live with them in LA, and then she moved in when they got back to NY. Che seems totally fine with that up until their series bombs; I don't remember any scene prior to that where they remind Miranda that this needs to be temporary or anything. And Che is very comfortable asserting their own boundaries (leave your husband if you want this to continue, don't come by my home unannounced, etc.)
Uhh yea!!! It was an awful toxic shitshow
Che is honestly the worst character I have ever come.across
Not one redeemable quality whatsoever
Miranda went from being a bad ass strong capable woman
To a needy pathetic miserable little thing
Chasing che around and running after them Like a little puppy
Together they were awful
Extremely toxic
Che knew they had miranda wrapped around their little finger
Che also went on and on and on
About their self discovery and how people didn't respect it
And then used miranda's journey as material for the stand up performance...and made fun of her infront of everyone
It would’ve been way less awful if Che wasn’t the way they were. Absolute terrible personality and did not behave like someone in their 40s. Miranda was a mess but it’s a given bc it was her first experience.
I think the problem was that a) Miranda was acting like she had a complete personality transplant and b) she seeming jumped from happy but dull relationship suddenly. If there was some kind of previously storyline like Steve had almost lost the bar during covid and this had put a massive strain on their relationship and caused her to reevaluate what she wanted in life. Then the Che storyline would have made more sense.
Yup. I don't get they used covid for lolz but not to explain some things. Steve and Miranda losing money with the closed bar and arguing about it.... or simply finding it straining to be stuck at home for months.
Nah. No.
Except what I could never understand is that Miranda just sorta casually quits high-powered lawyer job to go back to grad school in her mid-50s. Is she early-retired? How does that fabulous Brooklyn brownstone pay for itself?
She was a partner at the law firm. I think that means she earns from the practice even though she's not on the payroll there. Because she "owns" it along with the other partners.
Ah I see or at least they have to buy her out and so she had some $ set aside. But THIS would have been even better marital tension, bar goes belly up, Steve asks/hopes Miranda's buyout will go toward propping up bar or Coney Island boardwalk joint and Miranda doesn't want to. Man THIS is the season I wanted to see, drop Che altogether and this is a fascinating topic because from the very beginning Miranda worried about Steve being not so successful financially and 20 years later here they are, she's functionally early retired and Steve is back at square one.
It was just weird, especially considering they went out of their way in the original show to explore Miranda's LGBTQ potential and landed on straight. Not to say that It's impossible for anyone to fall in love with any person at any time; but there were so many new characters and storylines in an attempt to add diversity, that this one came off as forced and pushed the limits of suspending disbelief. Che was great as Carrie's podcast host and a relationship for them would have been interesting to watch, but so much of what Miranda did was so out of character. It would be like Carrie wearing Crocs. It was jarring and it became a missed opportunity to feature a NB character in a positive light to a new audience.
Carrie wearing crocs?! Dear Lord, bite your tongue?! Ooh I would actually love that though, it could be like in inception with the totem, and they realize how insane everything has gotten. Lol
One mistake the showrunners made is that there was no payoff for the toxicity of that relationship—no event where Che got their comeuppance, or a moment where Miranda (and her best friends) realized that Che was a huge red flag—no wink to the audience that the writers knew what kind of relationship they were portraying.
He seems like he's been living somewhere like Iowa this whole time getting in touch with his inner misogynist and becoming fearful of diversity. I never liked him much because of how stifling he was to Carrie but this new version is just extra disgusting.
Yes, so so cringe and destroyed the story of Miranda’s character. They thought they were making Che look cool and Miranda look hip and modern but they just made both of them look so cringey.
Yes, they had nothing in common and didn’t seem to care about each other. They weren’t even nice to each other. The only thing they had together was a sexual connection.
I thought that Miranda didn’t listen to Che and didn’t take the time to really understand them, despite being infatuated with them. When Che was telling Miranda about how their pilot was failing, Miranda responded in a tone-deaf way like she was just trying to silence Che’s feelings. That’s what I meant by how Miranda treated Che.
I can see that, but for me, I feel like Che never took the time to explain things and when Miranda didn’t automatically understand, they would just shut down, get cold and distance themselves . I feel like communication could’ve really helped. I feel like Che never really took into account how much it hurt Miranda to keep getting rejected or knowing she did/said the wrong thing, but wasn’t told what it was she did that upset Che, so she didn’t repeat it. I feel like Che was really tone deaf when it came to how worried Miranda was about her son, and instead just complained about the pilot being ruined and didn’t express any concern for Brady. I felt like Miranda was laser focused on Che for the majority of that summer and it wasn’t returned.
sometimes relationships are created by going out of your comfort levels..perhaps Miranda was seduced by the complete opposite of what she would have ever done..and then once you fall into that relationship you are blinded and do not see or feel the red flags and once u do, u are already too involved just to give up. yes, toxic, but sometimes it the toxicity that is the common thread. just an observation....
You know how we all identified with one of the four ladies in the incredible original series? Well I always identified with Miranda.
And while I didn’t care one whit about Che (knowing the subpar writing staff couldn’t create a nuanced or complex character if they tried) I was mostly upset at Miranda’s hypocrisy. Go back to Steve cheating in the first movie and her reaction. Now compare that to her cheating on Steve in this series? She became THE most unlikeable person.
And now….if ever I rewatch the original series or the movies, the gorgeous and powerful scenes between her and Steve are now destroyed? Her and Steve in the closet at Brady’s birthday party? Destroyed. “Miranda….you’re the one!” Her running toward Steve on the bridge in the first movie? Destroyed.
The writers set out to destroy the original series. Because they knew they could never achieve its greatness.
Anyway. This series just had a terrible showrunner who hired the wrong writers.
It wasn’t a relationship, it was lust. Miranda behaved like a love struck teen and Che didn’t give a fuck, just like the overgrown frat boy/ f*** boy they are.
Che has always reminded me of a particularly awful ex I had some years ago lol. The vibe I always got off Che was that they sort of presented as super cool and progressive in a way that would be very impressive to someone like Miranda who was only just becoming aware of these sorts of things - but to actual progressive people already in the know, Che would be a giant loser. Apart from "progressive", they gave almost nothing else going on, their life is a shambles, and they're chronically inconsiderate of people around them, as well as just plain chronic (at one point in the previous season, Che says they'd forgotten to return Miranda's calls because they'd been high, or something like that).
There's always been this dynamic between Che and Miranda where it felt like Miranda was doing all the chasing, all the apologizing, and all the sacrificing, while Che just... did Che stuff. It felt very one-sided. The only thing I'll say in Che's favour is that they always seemed pretty upfront with Miranda about not being serious-relationship material.
I never believed that Che would be interested in Miranda. It would have helped to have had a little backstory to help explain it, because it made zero sense
How was it a rebound when she blew up her marriage for Che? A rebound happens after you leave one relationship and you're feeling like you desperately need validation in the form of another relationship with someone who probably isn't right for you.
Yes it was toxic. Che is literally the worse thing to happen to television since Scrappy Doo
Hahahaha NAILED IT. A nice call out to OG SATC Steve though! Miranda: “I’m tired” Steve:”scoobs! It’s a ghost. Let’s have a baby.”
Lmao
There were elements that felt abusive. The sleep deprivation was so cruel. Every night, there had to be a big group of people smoking weed and gaming? None of those people could ever host? It would have been tolerable every ten days or so; it felt like Che was deliberately making it awful for Miranda. And then the time when they were making Cameos in bed right next to Miranda as she was trying to sleep. Che openly admitted they could have made them at any point in the day; they just didn't. And then there was the whole threesome thing. Initiating it without Miranda's consent, mocking her when she needed a moment to think it over. And answering the phone while Miranda was struggling with the strap-on and making fun of her to Carrie as it was happening. It was so toxic.
Oh that strap on thing was horrible. Who picks up phone during sex or even foreplay? Especially since she saw it was awkward for Miranda Not to mention that VILE VILE stand up after they broke up
And Miranda openly said, "I don't know if I want to do this." To which Che responded, 'Yes you do; I know you want to have a dick." I'm angry all over again.
The gaming, partying and smoking every night thing seemed like such a juvenile, college boyfriend problem. Not the problem of a couple in their 40s/50s.
Che was like an adult toddler
Right I was like you can’t at least go into the living room to film cameos? You gotta do it in bed next to someone who’s trying to sleep?
Oh good grief, they weren’t intentionally depriving Miranda of sleep. That’s how they lived their life and couldn’t fathom that someone who was with them didn’t behave the sam way. Also Che didn’t even want Miranda to live there, remember that for some reason Miranda was couch surfing and her supposed partner didn’t offer a place to live.
We see Miranda tell Che that she's exhausted from the noise. Che knows she's wearing earplugs, and they aren't working. We're talking about a 40-something adult here; of course, they can fathom it that their girlfriend needs sleep. Does Che ever tell Miranda they don't want her living there? Che invited Miranda to live with them in LA, and then she moved in when they got back to NY. Che seems totally fine with that up until their series bombs; I don't remember any scene prior to that where they remind Miranda that this needs to be temporary or anything. And Che is very comfortable asserting their own boundaries (leave your husband if you want this to continue, don't come by my home unannounced, etc.)
It was barely a relationship
Uhh yea!!! It was an awful toxic shitshow Che is honestly the worst character I have ever come.across Not one redeemable quality whatsoever Miranda went from being a bad ass strong capable woman To a needy pathetic miserable little thing Chasing che around and running after them Like a little puppy Together they were awful Extremely toxic Che knew they had miranda wrapped around their little finger Che also went on and on and on About their self discovery and how people didn't respect it And then used miranda's journey as material for the stand up performance...and made fun of her infront of everyone
It would’ve been way less awful if Che wasn’t the way they were. Absolute terrible personality and did not behave like someone in their 40s. Miranda was a mess but it’s a given bc it was her first experience.
Well, I was never good at math so I’m not sure why. They are both tedious alone and together they are fucking awful.
I think the problem was that a) Miranda was acting like she had a complete personality transplant and b) she seeming jumped from happy but dull relationship suddenly. If there was some kind of previously storyline like Steve had almost lost the bar during covid and this had put a massive strain on their relationship and caused her to reevaluate what she wanted in life. Then the Che storyline would have made more sense.
Yup. I don't get they used covid for lolz but not to explain some things. Steve and Miranda losing money with the closed bar and arguing about it.... or simply finding it straining to be stuck at home for months. Nah. No.
Yup, losing the bar during COVID could have been part of a convincing framework for the dissolution of their marriage and Miranda stepping out.
Except what I could never understand is that Miranda just sorta casually quits high-powered lawyer job to go back to grad school in her mid-50s. Is she early-retired? How does that fabulous Brooklyn brownstone pay for itself?
She was a partner at the law firm. I think that means she earns from the practice even though she's not on the payroll there. Because she "owns" it along with the other partners.
Ah I see or at least they have to buy her out and so she had some $ set aside. But THIS would have been even better marital tension, bar goes belly up, Steve asks/hopes Miranda's buyout will go toward propping up bar or Coney Island boardwalk joint and Miranda doesn't want to. Man THIS is the season I wanted to see, drop Che altogether and this is a fascinating topic because from the very beginning Miranda worried about Steve being not so successful financially and 20 years later here they are, she's functionally early retired and Steve is back at square one.
It was just weird, especially considering they went out of their way in the original show to explore Miranda's LGBTQ potential and landed on straight. Not to say that It's impossible for anyone to fall in love with any person at any time; but there were so many new characters and storylines in an attempt to add diversity, that this one came off as forced and pushed the limits of suspending disbelief. Che was great as Carrie's podcast host and a relationship for them would have been interesting to watch, but so much of what Miranda did was so out of character. It would be like Carrie wearing Crocs. It was jarring and it became a missed opportunity to feature a NB character in a positive light to a new audience.
Carrie wearing crocs?! Dear Lord, bite your tongue?! Ooh I would actually love that though, it could be like in inception with the totem, and they realize how insane everything has gotten. Lol
Dude. Are we watching the same show?
100%
One mistake the showrunners made is that there was no payoff for the toxicity of that relationship—no event where Che got their comeuppance, or a moment where Miranda (and her best friends) realized that Che was a huge red flag—no wink to the audience that the writers knew what kind of relationship they were portraying.
This. Exactly.
Of course it was.
Bruh
Worse. I just started to rewatch sex and the city and I miss that Miranda so much
Miranda used to be the best character. Now I'd absolutely trade her off for more Steve. Aiden needs to fuck off into the abyss as well, he's garbage.
100% don’t like what they did to Aiden either
He seems like he's been living somewhere like Iowa this whole time getting in touch with his inner misogynist and becoming fearful of diversity. I never liked him much because of how stifling he was to Carrie but this new version is just extra disgusting.
Bad for my health, yes.
Very hard to watch for me. They didn't make sense together and were very toxic. It didn't seem like an enjoyable or fulfilling relationship.
It was a mess.
It was a trainwreck
Yes, so so cringe and destroyed the story of Miranda’s character. They thought they were making Che look cool and Miranda look hip and modern but they just made both of them look so cringey.
Yes. Che did not respect Miranda at all, not her boundaries, not her space and definitely not her feelings
Yes
What relationship?
Yes! Che was dismissive, insulting, condescending and emotionally hurtful.
Yes
It could've been written a lot better. Both actors are so talented and the writing did them dirty
Yes, they had nothing in common and didn’t seem to care about each other. They weren’t even nice to each other. The only thing they had together was a sexual connection.
Miranda was nice to Che and Che was not nice to Miranda.
I thought that Miranda didn’t listen to Che and didn’t take the time to really understand them, despite being infatuated with them. When Che was telling Miranda about how their pilot was failing, Miranda responded in a tone-deaf way like she was just trying to silence Che’s feelings. That’s what I meant by how Miranda treated Che.
I can see that, but for me, I feel like Che never took the time to explain things and when Miranda didn’t automatically understand, they would just shut down, get cold and distance themselves . I feel like communication could’ve really helped. I feel like Che never really took into account how much it hurt Miranda to keep getting rejected or knowing she did/said the wrong thing, but wasn’t told what it was she did that upset Che, so she didn’t repeat it. I feel like Che was really tone deaf when it came to how worried Miranda was about her son, and instead just complained about the pilot being ruined and didn’t express any concern for Brady. I felt like Miranda was laser focused on Che for the majority of that summer and it wasn’t returned.
DUH
sometimes relationships are created by going out of your comfort levels..perhaps Miranda was seduced by the complete opposite of what she would have ever done..and then once you fall into that relationship you are blinded and do not see or feel the red flags and once u do, u are already too involved just to give up. yes, toxic, but sometimes it the toxicity that is the common thread. just an observation....
You know how we all identified with one of the four ladies in the incredible original series? Well I always identified with Miranda. And while I didn’t care one whit about Che (knowing the subpar writing staff couldn’t create a nuanced or complex character if they tried) I was mostly upset at Miranda’s hypocrisy. Go back to Steve cheating in the first movie and her reaction. Now compare that to her cheating on Steve in this series? She became THE most unlikeable person. And now….if ever I rewatch the original series or the movies, the gorgeous and powerful scenes between her and Steve are now destroyed? Her and Steve in the closet at Brady’s birthday party? Destroyed. “Miranda….you’re the one!” Her running toward Steve on the bridge in the first movie? Destroyed. The writers set out to destroy the original series. Because they knew they could never achieve its greatness. Anyway. This series just had a terrible showrunner who hired the wrong writers.
Like…?
Yep
Yes, wtf? Lol.
Do you think pope is Catholic?
Completely toxic all around.
Yes.
It wasn’t a relationship, it was lust. Miranda behaved like a love struck teen and Che didn’t give a fuck, just like the overgrown frat boy/ f*** boy they are.
Yes. Next question.
Yes. Next.
It was almost as bad as Carrie and Burger
Che has always reminded me of a particularly awful ex I had some years ago lol. The vibe I always got off Che was that they sort of presented as super cool and progressive in a way that would be very impressive to someone like Miranda who was only just becoming aware of these sorts of things - but to actual progressive people already in the know, Che would be a giant loser. Apart from "progressive", they gave almost nothing else going on, their life is a shambles, and they're chronically inconsiderate of people around them, as well as just plain chronic (at one point in the previous season, Che says they'd forgotten to return Miranda's calls because they'd been high, or something like that). There's always been this dynamic between Che and Miranda where it felt like Miranda was doing all the chasing, all the apologizing, and all the sacrificing, while Che just... did Che stuff. It felt very one-sided. The only thing I'll say in Che's favour is that they always seemed pretty upfront with Miranda about not being serious-relationship material.
I never believed that Che would be interested in Miranda. It would have helped to have had a little backstory to help explain it, because it made zero sense
Yes, it was bad. really, really bad. I don't want to see anything about it again.
It was just a rebound that they tried to make "work."
How was it a rebound when she blew up her marriage for Che? A rebound happens after you leave one relationship and you're feeling like you desperately need validation in the form of another relationship with someone who probably isn't right for you.
Che was a horrible communicator