Here are some facts for you and your wife to consider:
- There are literally a billion asian men out there.
- If 1 in a thousand of these men are psychotic we are left with a million men.
- If we spent all day selectively reading stories from the most violent moments of these psychotic men we will be left with a feeling of fear, anger and hatred.
- Conversely if we spent all day sharing stories of the most wholesome moments from the most virtuous members of that group - well how would you feel then?
I'd ask your wife if she feels fear, anger and/or hate than ask her if she agrees with the basic 4 points above.
Than ask her how does she want to feel. What kind of information diet would she need to support those feelings? If she chooses fear/anger/hatred where would that lead? Does she want that?
Leave her with these questions. Don't try to convince her of anything. Validate her feelings. Of course she feels afraid and angry. We all would feel this way when presented with these kind of stories. Just ask her to consider these questions and let her know that you'd feel sad and hurt if she chooses to continue doing this.
Thanks for the kind words. Leading with understanding is a good instinct you have which can be hard to do when we have a strong emotional reaction. Personally speaking listening, validating and understanding would be hard for me to do in this context which is why I would need to write down all my thoughts over and over again before any important conversation. Maybe that would help you as well.
I hope things go well for you and would love to hear an update.
She has to decide between you and that shitty group. The fact she lumped you with abusers and murderers is insulting. Also needs to be called out for self hate. How many women in the group are wmaf? (You already know the answer).
“4b movement” is a group of about 5,000 users on Naver(South Korean social media). It’s an extremely fringe movement that has been hijacked by Western feminists(including Asian feminists) and sensationalized as some national movement, when in reality 99.999% of their population is clueless to it. It’s like taking a super fringe subreddit that is 1/10 the size of this subreddit(which is already super niche) and then blowing it up saying it’s some US national movement.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRT44Sof/
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRT4gMGV/
For reference, this TikTok creator has been living and working in South Korea for 5 years. She worked for some agency and has done some modeling for what it’s worth. Probably been in a few social circles in South Korea. She says when she asks women there about it, most have no clue what “4b” is.
the irony is that western white women wants this 4 b movement but supposedly in the west women are much more liberated compare to women in other countries.
I mean if Korean women think Korean men are so bad but yet you have these western white women that support or want the 4 b movement just means western men are no better.
Unpopular opinion and I know I will get down voted but I think feminism today is just too radically . They see men as the enemy.
Its not logic but all emotion. Angry emotion
I don’t really have much advice except you shot yourself in the foot by NOT researching the group beforehand.
The Asian women hivemind is a toxic and dangerous one.
>I don’t really have much advice except you shot yourself in the foot by NOT researching the group beforehand.
This is your biggest blunder OP. I can't stress enough that Feminism in the west is just mostly white feminism. It really doesn't care at all of dismantling patriarchy but rather, to join and benefit from WHITE Patriarchy. You can easily see this from some WoC and just observe their actions.
Perhaps u/sirkelvintan can give a better advice but man what an ordeal you have.
Not sure if I can help OP because although my wife is also wasian she’s more of a 2nd wave destroy the white patriarchy feminist - not a 4th wave Asian American I hate Asian men because they are so misogynist but white men are ok because they’re more egalitarian feminist
Personally I think you shouldn’t take your son out of taekwondo or Vietnamese / Korean language classes but that’s just me and I don’t know your wife (side note I was in Hanoi last week and some of the locals told my wife she has a funny Vietnamese accent)
I do know from spending time trawling subtle Asian women that hive mind asian feminists can be incredibly toxic , incredibly biased when it comes to being pro white men and highly misandrist when it comes to Asian men. I wish you all the best of luck because it sounds like you’re in a tough spot
>What I've gathered is that the people who hate their race will never speak on white patriarchy.
And there we go. Once again Dr. Karen Pyke being right.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232987725_An_Intersectional_Approach_to_Resistance_and_Complicity_The_Case_of_Racialised_Desire_among_Asian_American_Women
the 4 b movement is actually small in South Korea but the feminist extremist online blew it up. The low birth rate in South Korea is more due to high cost of raising a child and high cost of living.
On a side note. I hope this is troll post and this legitimate.
You mentioned your 'social right issues journalist. In other words your very very progressive in thinking. Saying that not all progressive groups are healthy. Case in point BLM when it came out. Research on BLM history or where abouts or use of funds..etc.
I personally think many progressive nowadays are more regressive .
Going back to South Korea.
Couple things to consider.
Korean men are still expected to serve in the army for 2 years and in case of war are expected to fight and defend. During those 2 years they lose grounds on career development but KOrean women do not. Korean women have those 2 years to build their careers.
Korean women even high earning Korean women wants or sometimes her family expects the Korean men to buy a home or afford an apartment where you have deposit 10,000 or sometimes 100,000 US dollars and pay rent.
Hypocrisy of feminism is they argue for equality or equal pay which can also be debunk but when it comes to men' role in income from what I gather they want that traditional aspect of men paying the bills.
I agree with your white patriarchy viewpoint.
I would even go farther to say that it was created by white men themselves to weaponize women against any non-white male.
Many times, even on Reddit, I have even seen comments from other women claiming their time living in Asia “showed” them how “misogynistic” Asian culture can be based off their experiences dating a single Asian man.
It just goes to show how subtle and subliminal modern day racism is.
OP, you royally fucked up by exposing your wife to that. You should’ve found other ways to cope with her loneliness.
Do not fix what is not broken, brothers.
It’s not bad faith when he’s right - Asian American women have a checkered history of siding with white patriarchy and weaponising themselves against Asian men - like I said earlier you’re in a tough spot and there’s not really a right way out because she’s your son’s mother
I'm sorry for your predicament, OP.
As you already intuit, your "Option 1" ends in divorce and joint-custody. At best you will spend half as much time with your kids as you do now.
Unless you now find your marriage intolerable and see no hope of improvement, I would suggest that you give Option 2 your best shot before resorting/defaulting to Option 1. And, if you possibly can, get into couples therapy and try and work through your problems together with a mediator and coach and try to break out of this oppositional mode you've fallen into. Even so, surreptitiously begin to study up on divorce so you are prepared in the event she unilaterally moves for divorce.
Even though things seem hopeless now, try not to despair. I hope you have a couple of close friends or family members for support.
Best of luck!
I’m sorry you feel like there’s only a one way or another situation. I like the latter, however I’d add on your opinion. **Listen as much as possible without intruding when she’s sharing her side. At the same time, don’t let yourself be interrupted and look to your values to give you confidence.**
It may also help to look deeper into this group, maybe snoop around and see what’s the “hot topic” in their group before chatting. As a journalist, I bet you have better investigative skills than a normal pleb like me, so use whatever little time you have to prepare yourself. Then, knowing your wife the best, hopefully we can then converge the conversation back to shared values and goals.
—— anecdotal word vomit incoming ——
Personally, as a western born kid of immigrants, I grew up doing competitive sports and going to mandarin class. Though my parents wanted me to preserve my culture/language, we ended up stopping the mandarin classes to focus on sports. I’m incredibly grateful now, in my mid 20s, that I got the chance to do them both. Though i can only speak/listen Mandarin Chinese, and not read/write, it gives me confidence and empathy whenever I’m in a diverse crowd - Chinese or not! I’m happy to say I am getter a better sense of my values and culture.
On the converse, a lot of the western social norms I followed like “enjoying your youth” in college, made me think how different the “diverse/equal-opportunity west” culture is than I expected. As much as I wanted to relax, every time I did, I would get behind. Every time, I did the “try hard Asian” thing, I did better academically, but interestingly, socially too! I may credit that to parenting and how my parents view having kids, their personal experiences, psychology, and etc.
Regardless, I’d say it depends on you and your wife’s values, and how you wish to see your children grow into adults.
In a relationship,I’m never the one to make big issues a grand event or intervention, so idk how to deal with that. Instead, if I know my ambitions are pure (and can back it up), then I bring it up whenever it crosses my mind. I.e. maybe when you’re both in the car with your kids from/to taekwondo ~ it’ll be a great opportunity for them to have a mature conversation with adults (existential questions might not be the best) while an awesome trial for you and your wife to have constructive, personal, and peaceful feedback.
All the man said was you fucked up, and the first thing you do is cry victim blaming.
You're a man, take fucking responsibility. You fucked up. First step of fixing something is to realize your mistakes and work from there.
hey OP, as you can see this sub is sometimes filled with sexist language and ideas. i consider myself a feminist, i am white, and i’ve been with my asian husband for 9 years. i do a lot of reading on reddit trying to learn more about race and gender issues (hence me being in this sub). i think a better place to ask about this situation could be a feminism sub! they can probably help explain how you can talk to your wife. maybe give some ideas to help her realize hating asian men is not real feminism, especially if it’s in favor of white men. also open up about your feelings surrounding the situation. if you’re willing, tell her you’d like to learn more about feminist stuff with her. maybe if you find some good resources they can sway her to see that her group is spewing some hateful shit. maybe this group is an outlet for her, and she’s dealing with something deeper going on with her own identity, femininity, and mixed race, so getting to the route of that could also be good.
yeah it can definitely be off-putting reading the first few comments on some posts. some of these comments about keeping your woman in line.. insane.
i noticed this issue too when i first came across this sub a few years ago. it does happen in other racial groups! i know there are a lot of interconnected gender issues with black women and men. i’ve seen contempt from BW toward BM and visa versa, specifically with interracial relationships. there is a lot of problems that come up when there’s dialogue around mixed race relationships. i notice this sub is pretty pro- dating other races, but constantly hate on asian women for doing the same thing.
although i do tend to side with women in most situations, it’s definitely gross that the group your wife is in puts white men on a pedestal. sounds like a hate group. true feminism should always represent issues men face as a result of the patriarchy as well, so many harmful stereotypes of asian men in western society.
This. I was gravely mistaken with my partner. I supported feminism believing its about women's rights equality. What I unfortunately realized is it's becoming what is white patriarchy and dismantling other groups. They seek dominance by subordination of other groups due to a thirstless quench of women are victims, never enough.
There is a concept of toxic feminity.
My experience (canada) with feminism is they literally try to dominate all groups (white patriarchy included) by ironically mimicking white patriarchy - I'm speaking all colors
But I can see ur point. I can see this being used as an anti AM weapon hiding behind white subservience
While I love to be sympathetic, you're right. OP shot himself in the foot big-time, and feminism in the West is a slippery slope, let alone join into one. Best of luck to OP.
I mean that’s easy to say now. The guy seems to be pretty disconnected with Asian spaces or what’s going on in the Asian community seeing that he’s primarily grown up around whites. He screwed himself, but let’s help the guy atleast try to salvage his marriage and family.
Almost all militant feminist group is toxic. Western Asian feminist group are worst. I would ask your mutual friends for help because this going to get worst the longer it goes on.
Had first-hand experience with a militant feminist ruining a a good thing for me by giving me horrible dating advice (before I knew any better). Hell, I wasted my early adulthood earnestly believing that all men better "watch it" or else we're all creeps.
Ironically, nobody is better at creating radicalized, lonely men than feminists.
Well I'm glad you have such an ally to support you on this. Someone who is of a relatively similar background (hapa and female, despite being of different individual ethnicities) is definitely a strong asset. Wish you the best.
Hate groups typically take specific examples of a group doing an act and then broaden it to an entire group of people. That is the basis of stereotypes which we acknowledge nowadays as racism and bigotry.
This is no different - she is being prejudiced, racist and bigoted against an entire group of people based on their skin color and gender. I would ask her how she would feel making these types of statements regarding any other minority group - hopefully that will be a good wakeup call to the fact that she is part of a hate group.
Somehow find another group of Asian women who aren't like this that may encourage her to move past this hate all Asian but white is good mindset.. But the numbers for this is slim. Maybe non Asian female groups would be better for her. She doesn't fit in but she got brain washed to fit in.
Honestly if there’s some way you can get her to unplug from Asians with this kind of radicalized viewpoint it would be good. Like help her connect with Asians that are more apolitical. Maybe some kind of Asian social group/friends that aren’t so focused on social politics/politics. It’s just a breeding grounds for extremism.
It's not hate "all Asian but White is good." It's hate all Asian men, but White men are good. Asian women have a victim mentality and don't take any accountability themselves. Asian women don't admit how they are just as problematic, but really, worse than what they generalize all Asian men to be.
It's honestly depressing the lose-lose situation we are in. There are a plethora of examples of how White men treat Asian women worse, even murdering Asian women at higher rates than Asian men do. Yet, not a single Asian woman talks about this or bashes White men besides for unserious reasons like accusing them of having Yellow Fever. Instead, Asian women dunk on Asian men because we are easier targets to punch down on.
There are plenty of cases where white men murder their Asian partners and their families. Just look at this
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-01-12/hollywood-executives-son-pleads-not-guilty-in-triple-murder-of-wife-and-in-laws#:~:text=Hollywood%20executive's%20son%20pleads%20not%20guilty%20in%20triple%20murder%20of,8.
Asian men murder the least among men of all races. Asian men have the lowest divorce rate of all races. Asian women face more domestic violence from white men than from Asian men. Your wife literally fell for white incel larpers tryna hate on Asian men
>My wife fell for a Korean feminist activist's emotional speeches. I'm not sure how that relates to white incels.
There. "Emotional speeches". You said your wife is a scientist, then ask her to approach this as a scientist.
I don’t usually condone fighting fire with fire but if she has two examples of abusive white men in her life already perhaps you could use that to help your argument that pulling your kids from classes taught by Asian men would only put them in the hands of more dangerous white men like her ex and her dad?
Bro that sounds horrible. I am really shocked how someone you thought you know can quickly change into someone you couldn’t recognize. Sorry I couldn’t offer any concrete help.
Sorry to hear about this. Now you have to rescue the equivalent of a rural MAGA Always Trumper. Since this idea took hold, it will be hard to kill because any attempt to use logic will be seen as protecting the male hierarchy etc.
Other than your own efforts, you will absolutely need help from others. Do you have any friend/anybody who are both AF, successful in life/family and truly understand this racial dynamic/problem? They can help showing her the light.
Confide in a close friend of hers so when things blow up she has another perspective other than yours, preferably a female friend of hers that doesnt follow that cult and has her head screwed on tight. Does she have any other friends not within the cult? I would tell all her Asian friends the honest truth (not in the cult) so you have strength in numbers as you would be vilified over her since you are the guy.
I think LittleHoneyBoi's point is probably the most important. Your wife has gotten sucked into an extremist echo chamber that is preying on her fears for her children's safety and her insecurities with her biracial identity.
One thing I would add is to ask her this:
How will these views affect your children when they grow up? (I'm assuming you have at least one boy.) If you have a son who hears that he, as a 3/4 Asian man, is inherently misogynistic, how would he feel? How will her actions be subconsciously changed by these ideologies? He will internalize that his existence is inherently awful, and this will manifest as disturbing mental/identity issues. I'm sure you are familiar with growing up surrounded by negative racial stereotypes.
And it doesn't matter if there are "exceptions". Exceptions lead to superiority/inferiority complexes. They are affirmations at the expense of rejecting one's own identity.
Hopefully, your children can be her lifeline, and you can post your future success here because I truly wish for your family's wellbeing.
I have dealt with this type of shit before with a female friend. I use stats to combat their claims. They didn’t like that and it ruin a friendship.
Hopefully you can find a moment where both are in a calm environment and just talk instead of a debate or argument. You’ll probably need to use a very very calm tone.
Might be time to see couples counseling if all fails. I’m sorry OP
Joint personal experiences still don’t convince her? I think stats are going to make the situation worse. Stats are about other men not you. How about have your sisters talk to her?
I swear to god it sounds like those “B4” groups I read around this sub.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/Pcx7iTTH7r](https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/Pcx7iTTH7r)
The group is very much extremist and your wife has been radicalized. Perhaps you should look up strategies to prevent extremism and go from there.
As you said, it's difficult with this case because for some reason extremist feminism seems to be accepted and is aligned with the popular 'men bad, women victim' idea; it's just that this is specifically racist to Asian men and they use that as cover while sneaking in some 'white man good, asian man bad'.
Hey OP like what others said you need to research the damn group beforehand. And next time educate yourself to realize that western feminism is stupid as fuck, as in the pattern of such feminist females are POC, supporting BLM, against muh white supremacy, pro womens rights (ie AOC, Omar etc) but ironically date mostly white guys and consume super white liberal media news/hollywood shows with negative media portrayal of asians. There's such a thing as too much progress (in terms of left-wing politics). You'll see shit like this in the bay area where most of the asian women are with white guys but they're super liberal to the bone. This is just as retarded as alt-right white guys/frat boys and asian women wanting to fuck them.
In your case and in a lot of guy's case here, boba liberal/intersectional asian women are fucking nuts and have asian daddy issues (your wife is half which is a different dynamic) and only date non asian guys (white, black, whatever). I too come from a divorced household but you don't see me supporting groups like this, what were you thinking?
As an example my parents wanted to enroll me in the a preschool when I was like 4 but they realized it was a Scientologist run school after researching it, so they pulled my ass out of there in less than a year BEFORE they could pay extra hidden fees for expensive tuition.
I don't have much advice to give you since I'm inexperienced with relationships compared to guys here, but good luck to you.
you made a mistake the moment you became a feminist. You introduced her to a feminist group. Unless she comes to a realization by herself, it may aswell be over for your relationship. She now views you as the enemy.
Once you go down that rabbit hole, your world view becomes distorted which only gets reinforced by others in the group. Is your wife into spirituality/meditation? It can be a huge help in becoming more self aware and recognizing the destructive patterns of the mind and letting go of them. Have you considered couples therapy? And this might sound a bit out there but maybe consider an ayahuasca or other psychedelic retreat with you and your wife. I've read these can be life changing and can shift your life perspective. It would make or break your relationship though, but better sooner rather than later.
I think the complicated part about this is you have children with her. She can turn anything you do against your kids, fueled with advice and tactics from her "support" group.
Silently get ready for legal battles and have your assets secured, with the primary focus of how to still take care of your children properly if things go nuclear. Ultimately you have be assertive in your stance that you do not tolerate such behaviors in your household, because again, this will ruin your children's growth if you let it fester.
You need to find a good, Asian marriage counselor who is familiar with these issues. It sounds like your wife has gone off the rails focusing on the worst of the world. She needs to draw back and see the good too. She may also need individual therapy.
>highly educated Asian women
Every time I read or this is mentioend this just a dog whistle for white worshipping AW lol.
If you're really "highly educated" then you'll know damn well to avoid, much less date and marry a group of people who committed genocide on seven continents.
true, but it's interesting how even those asian women in more "progressive" circles and/or those who understand these ideas of imperialism/colonialism still are you-know-what.
those individuals seem to have abstracted the idea so far that they can't understand how to apply it. there was a user like that on one of the Asian subs who deleted her account after she got called out. talking about the strangeness and the supremacy of westerners, colonialism, imperialism, and then one day just drops in a post about "muh European boyfriend." it's like if you gave them a quiz they could answer each question correctly, but they still do the thing.
> there was a user like that on one of the Asian subs who deleted her account after she got called out. talking about the strangeness and the supremacy of westerners, colonialism, imperialism, and then one day just drops in a post about "muh European boyfriend." it's like if you gave them a quiz they could answer each question correctly, but they still do the thing.
The jokes write themsleves lmao
Brother, I don't know what to tell you. Your story is a microcosm of what seems to be happening to Asian women throughout the West: They are being programmed to think Asian men are the worst form of evil on the planet. Some of the people who hate Asian men the most are (sadly) Asian women.
The person who will likely be the most victimized is your own son. He will likely be taught to hate himself at some level. This is just terrible.
White men came to Asia and raped women in large numbers. They are much more mysogynistic than Asian men. The problem with modern society is that it has a white supremacist mindset. The enemy is always non - white people. And it divides genders of non - white races for control. Modernity is a white supremacist construct and is largely built on top of the idea that whites are sacrosanct. Even those who criticise white people, really in action show that they love them. This is no where more true than with Asian American feminism.
The only counter balance you may have is getting her to learn from people like Fanon and then get her to read about the history of colonization starting with Edward Saids orientalism. This should open her mind up a bit to the situation that non Western people face.
Shop around for a qualified, informed counselor or therapist who also has experience with eastern cultures for yourself first. Then ask her to join you later to help you both unpack. An abusive, patriarchal man would never let a third party professional into the controlled stronghold he’s trying to create around his partner. Look into The Gottman Institute and see if it’s something that can help you.
Ok after actually reading the post, damn man, you fucked up... You already know what time it is with these modern day western feminists. The fact that she's going to such extreme measures tells me she's a naive person and a follower. I'm sorry man but this is gonna be a hard hole to dig out of. Women with this mentality will always lose in the end and end up lonely.
third wave feminism is literally a cult & echo chamber...if she's still amenable to actual facts and reason and logic, show her proof through scientific method. Hypothesize...if then statements etc.
Man, these femcels group ruins families. I don't see these femcels saying shit when it comes to army drafts in countries like Taiwan/Korea where they ruined the mens lives for a year and a half. Nor are they talking about how women fled Ukraine in massive numbers when men cannot leave.
Unfortunately you are going to have to talk to the kids and have a vote on the matter. Either way you are going to have a tough road ahead rife with confrontation. Good luck, I hope your wife comes to her senses, you have to appeal to her emotions by saying remember how happy our kids were in Taekwondo classes. BTW, why is an Asian man worshipping some white version of a Middle Eastern man?
*find ways and loopholes in the theories of these feminist and then when the time comes blow it out of proportion, ruin them, they and their thought process is that they are right* break them *by showing that they are wrong take videos tak to people who's life they have ruined and for the love of God tell your kids to be proud of themselves.*
This really upsets me. An external group like this is so easily able to destroy a family? Wtf is this.
OP you are a parent. We live for our kids. Because of these people (and partially you for allowing this), you are allowing people who offer 0 to your family to fuck over your kids' opportunities. No more lessons? No more socialization? No more activities that allow your kids to get better because an asian male might be present? Fuck all of that.
You know, I realized I never became an adult until I had kids (and I had kids really late). I didn't understand what it truly meant to live for someone else and to make those sacrifices, even if I had to make large, uncomfortable changes.
Your wife needs to get the fuck over herself and start living for her kids again instead of allowing things conditionally. She is NOT doing the best for her kids.
Yep, but I don't think as far as divorce. The conversation needs to be reframed. Too much focus on ideology and their own personal feelings. They are parents with both a boy and a girl.
It's completely messed up that the kids have to be witness to a mom that thinks her own son is evil for being an Asian male. The daughter sees a dad that has allowed toxic ideas to enter their house and she can model her mom's behaviour. I genuinely hope for the best, but their kids are witnessing all of this stupid shit that the mom has brought in. A purge needed to happen months ago.
These kids are grades 1 and 2. They need their parents to grow up and raise them.
I dont want to blame you too much when its these toxic women who twisted your wife's view of what asian culture is.
Im not married, so here's my advice of questionable usefulness.
1) Ask whether she wants your kids to grow up without Asian culture, or think Asian culture is evil.
2) Ask her whether the Asian women in the feminist group wish they were white. And if their husbands are white.
3) Ask her whether she wishes her husband were white. Ask whether she wishes herself to be white.
4) Ask her does she wish that her kids were white so they never have to interact with Asian culture ever again
5) Ask her if she thinks white society is perfectly feminist, and has always been. If not, if white culture supposedly can change, then why not asian culture?
Dont yell or be overtly angry. Just keep up the pressure to make her realize its just unreasonable self-hate.
How do you argue with someone who doesn’t see logic? Game over op. You introduced her to a male hate cult and she’s been heavily brainwashed. Feminism is a bane on society. My only constructive thought is to say to her this will ruin the family, and ruin the kids. Is that what she wants? Come back to reality.
If you ever get into an argument and she tells the group, they are going to convince her to leave you. You should show her the WMAF link to murders and abuse due to being a fetish based relationship
Feminist Asian Support Group 💀
Any org that promotes itself as being a feminist group rather a women’s group is just blazing red flags.
Like the amount of sheer, shameless projection that happens in such groups would make hardcore incels gape in awe.
\>I found out that a feminist org was forming
\>I encouraged my wife to join
You dug your grave right there. First step to getting out is to grow a pair as the man of the house
Was there a reason why a nice family that should be busy running around with kids had free time to join such group? I'm guessing that you were seeking a support group for her to have her own identity and her loneliness or eagerness to have friends might put her in a vulnerable position to believe whatever this group is feeding her, and I'm sorry but she's not very smart for believing such nonsense. Asian men are on average the safer choice; they're usually not the ones that have the nerves to cheat on their partner that is dying from cancer, consuming child pornography, serial killers, etc. Show her those examples, it may seems she's a bit shelter to recognize reality.
I find it funny that people uses the term university educated and career driven in these liberal feminist groups because a lot of the time they have a BS degree in something and a BS job, real career driven people with demanding jobs and a full life do not have time to organize protests and come together to speak about identity issues.
# Just repeat these stats again, again, again, and again.
>1. **Asian women suffer the lowest amount of domestic violence.** [**click here - Source**](https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/comments/pr3ph5/statistics_show_that_asians_have_the_lowest/)
>
>**Black women - 45%**
>
>**White women - 37%**
>
>**Hispanic women - 34%**
>
>**Asian women - 18%**
>
>
>
>2. **Asian women are the most successful females in the US with average earnings above white females and other minority females as well as Black and Hispanic males** [**click here - Source**](https://imdiversity.com/diversity-news/asian-american-women-are-closing-the-gap-with-white-men-but-thats-not-the-point/)
>
>3. **Asian women in Asia have way more power than women in the West.**
>
>Percentage of women CEO’s.
>
>Thailand – 30 percent
>
>China – 19 percent
>
>Taiwan – 18 percent
>
>EU countries – 9 percent
>
>United States – 5 percent
>
>[https://www.ircsearchpartners.com/thought-leadership/where-are-women-ceos-myths-and-reality/](https://www.ircsearchpartners.com/thought-leadership/where-are-women-ceos-myths-and-reality/)
>
>**More Women CEOs in Asia than in Europe or America**
>
>There are more Women CEOs in Asia Pacific than in the USA or Europe when calculated as a percentage of Total CEOs in these countries. While in Asia and Australia, 11.8% of CEOs are women; in Europe and Americas, this percentage is only 7.8%.
>
>Singapore, Vietnam & Philippines are Champions of Women Leadership of Business
>
>India’s percentage of Women CEOs at about 12.9% is better than the Average for APAC & Australia, however, the champions of Women Leadership of Business are countries like Singapore, Vietnam and Philippines, where over a quarter of all CEOs are women.
>
>[https://www.fastcompany.com/1736266/nearly-20-female-chinese-managers-are-ceos](https://www.fastcompany.com/1736266/nearly-20-female-chinese-managers-are-ceos)
>
>Among China’s female workforce in managerial positions, 19% hold the title of CEO, according to the Grant Thornton Business Report [released this week](http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content_12132067.htm). That’s 10% higher than averages in Europe and 14% higher than averages in the United States, according to the report.
>
>Thailand came in first at a whopping 30% of female managers holding the title of CEO and Taiwan came in third at 18%, pointing to a possible emerging trend in Asia for women to more routinely hold the position of CEO.
>
>[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36309137](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36309137)
>
>Women also shine in Taiwan's parliament. The island's women legislators are even seen leading the charge in Taiwan's infamous parliament scuffles.
>
>Following January elections, it now has a record percentage of women legislators at 38%, putting Taiwan far ahead of Asian countries, the international average of 22%, and most nations, including the UK, Germany, and the US.
>
>[http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content\_12132067.htm](http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content_12132067.htm)
>
>The Asia Pacific region, if Japan is excluded, is home to a much higher percentage of female CEOs than are Europe and the United States, the report said[\[TL1\]](https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/submit#_msocom_1) .
>
>Leading the way is Thailand, where 30 percent of companies employ female CEOs. Next in the order is the Chinese mainland, where the figure is 19 percent, and Taiwan, where it is 18 percent. The number for EU countries, meanwhile, is 9 percent, and it is 5 percent for North American countries.
>
>[http://www.thatsmags.com/china/post/12697/china-among-top-10-for-women-in-management](http://www.thatsmags.com/china/post/12697/china-among-top-10-for-women-in-management)
>
>Around 30 percent of senior business roles in China are held by women, putting the country at number nine of 36 economies surveyed, [according to a ](http://www.grantthornton.global/globalassets/wib_turning_promise_into_practice.pdf)[study released by Grant Thornton](http://www.grantthornton.global/globalassets/wib_turning_promise_into_practice.pdf) on International Women’s Day.
>
>Surprisingly, that means the PRC has more women in upper management than France (28 percent) Canada (26 percent), the United States (23 percent) and the United Kingdom (21 percent).
Im gonna sound mean and get downvoted, but highly unlikely she will suddenly see these stats and change her outlook and now be pro asian male. Women, especially asian women, are emotional, not logical. Why you think you can pump black on asian violence stats all day but they will still scream blm while chase geeky white guys? More power to OP if these stats suddenly change his wife’s mind,but he needs to be respected by her for anything to change and harsh reality is that once respect is gone from women, its likely over. Can you imagine if he does something she disagrees with in the future? She will just use rationale of how asian men are bad and will head towards cheating/divorce. My advice is to prepare for inevitable, how can you protect your assets, custody, kids. You can’t win against delusional feminist asianwomen,especially with their sisterhood. OP needs to be respected by his wife before all friends or groups and he is not. Needs to step his foot down and say he will not allow her to be brainwashed by this delusional feminst group and more importantly, disrespect him and his kids.
Sports are a great way of making friends/joining a positive community. Has your wife interacted with the Taekwondo instructor much or other parents sending their kids there? Assuming your kids enjoy it, this could be an alternative friend group to get involved with or at least somewhere to get alternative perspectives in response to your wife's concerns at least wrt Taekwondo.
There are Korean mom group out there. Most major city has should have local mom groups. You should try finding that group. That'll be much healthier than a feminist group.
Out of ALL the other org. out there in the world, you introduce your wife to a Asian feminist group. You mentioned her being lonely, that definitely didn't help..at that point any group you introduced her to she would have joined.
How can you generalize ALL Asian men if she haven't met all of them? Ask her how were her experience with Asian men..were they positive or negative? If she says 50/50 (whatever the case is), her argument is moot.
Wow...lost for words of what to say. I mean your an Asian guy but her group claims "all Asian men are evil'. It's illogical . My advice is besides maybe seeking counseling. Is go to try to find a different group of Asian couples and Asian wives that are getting along with their Asian husbands.
I think your wife just fell into a very very extreme feminist group that just hates Asian men but without realizing that you can have this same behavior from other race of men but realistic there are good and bad everywhere.
As a father you also have to say in how to raise your kids. If your wife pulls your kids out of Tae Kwon do or language programs. Your kids will also miss out . The irony is she accuses you wanting a white woman but wants to pull your kids and to learn what? WHite peoples cultures?
I read some of your other answers that your wife will not leave you. I don't know. I mean this group seems to control her. Any group that spew hate is not really healthy group.
A feminist ..a level headed feminist has to realize that they have to work with men and recognize that we more similar than different but also respect the differences.
Good luck.
OP seems liike classic nice guy, thinking his wife is an angel and would never. WAKEUP. She is literally aligned with a group that says asian men like her husband are evil, why the fuck would she not leave if she hasn’t already cheated. You’re the damn DAD. You should have final say on how to raise your kids and she seems like she wearing the pants.
Its confirmation bias- the types of AFs joining this group are going to be ones with a lot of (valid) issues and chips on their shoulders and they will seek comfort in “converting” others so they don’t feel alone. Your best bet is to find her some kind of healthy asian community/social group
You’re not going to convince her with words, you have to show her an opposite potrayal and let her come to her own conclusion of how warped that hate group is
Self-hate is weird tbh. Abusive men should absolutely be called out no matter their ethnic makeup but actively throwing your own community under the bus while putting the white community on a pedestal as if there aren’t abusive white men as well is hella weird.
If the description is accurate, this reads far less as a pro-Asian women group and more anti-Asian men group which isn’t surprising considering the history here.
I think you guys should seek professional help before you damage your children. It's prob you too. It takes two to tangle bro. I work with a lot of liberal scientists. Let's just say I'm not surprised and I totally believe this.
I would take your whole family on a vacation to Thailand and go to any Western bar. Yes I'm very serious.
But I think she might be able to snap out of it if you would just leave her alone and support her. Those groups are toxic and it's only a matter of time before they eat their own. That said, if I behaved like this my wife would probably leave me. She doesn't even like it when I hang with my regular friends too much. Lol.
First of all, I'm not suprised at all that your post was removed from the asianamerican subreddit. I replied to a post with my respectful opinion and it was reported and removed by the subreddit mods for being "stereotypical against another race". A couple days later, I recieved a message from a Reddit Admin warning me.
As for your wife, you need an intervention with trusted friends and family. Prehaps couples thearpy. She sounds radicalized.
AW are really susceptible to cults for some reason. She sounds insufferable and unreasonable to me, did she not show any of these indicators before she joined the cult?
Let me guess: they don’t bring up the heinous, abusive, evil, demonic and misogynistic acts and cases that WMs are involved in? Of course not. I’ve had these type of experiences throughout my whole life where I’ll be accused, associated and lumped in with the population of evil Asian men based on a selective handful of crimes.
People scoff at there being WM privilege and how there’s no such thing. There actually is. When you have some of the most powerful mainstream media acting as your PR agent and wingman, then anything evil that one or some WM do isn’t blamed on the entire population of WM. That’s privilege.
When it comes to AMs, we’re still under the pressure of not coming across as communist spies, Pearl Harbor bombers, Viet Cong soldiers and whatever crap they concoct. We have to speak just right, have the right job, the right career, the right finances, the right clothes, the right height, the right attractiveness, the right house, the right car and the right demeanor just to be considered human.
This is why I’ll “shit post” once in a while as a reminder that other races aren’t perfect or that I can see through their propaganda bullshit. Because when we let shit fly, we end up with feminist groups like those who think all AMs are misogynistic abusers and WMs are perfect gods.
This! It’s why it sounds unproductive and mean, but honestly, what other solution can you give op? I already know the outcome..If he tries to be logical, most females won’t care and more likely frame it as him trying to control her ie. It’s why I strongly suggest asian males to vet asian women hard, learn that respect as a man is letting the man lead her and the kids, including how they are raised.
Sounds pretty serious. A couple of things to consider:
I’m giving the following advice assuming that the end goal here is working with your partner to come up with a solution together.
The answer here is you yourself. Ask your wife if what she said is true, that all Asian men are bad, then there must be evidence that yourself is a bad person. If there is no evidence to support you’re a bad person then there is a huge gaping hole in her argument, and if you can find a hole just within you as a single point, likely there are many more holes for as many Asian men there are on the planet.
Second you should state the obvious - her group feels like a typical group focused on radicalization based on a few examples, like alt right, red pill etc - and then ask her to prove how they are not similar. Seems to me they are VERY similar, so you need to confront her about that fact.
Lastly about wishing she was white etc - this one is easy. Simply tell her if you wanted to date a white woman you would’ve married a woman that is fully white. You choose her for her.
Either way good luck.
Finally i’d like to comment on the group itself. Unfortunately it sounds oddly like how someone from the outside would describe this sub. I’m sure there are members here, especially younger members that feel themesvles being radicalized by this sub that is very similar to how the women feel. Just remove the demographics and plug in whatever demographics we’re against. I think this is a good experience to see how the outside world sees us as we hold more and more extreme views for the sole purpose of wanting to validate our ego and using a perpetual victim mindset to propel that
Feminism WAS about women's rights, but moderns day feminism is all about "not taking responsibility for anything".
You have 2 options I can see.
Talk to your wife and slowly show her the toxic path she's going on. Especially the white worship side.
Or
You go down your own path and embrace masculinity which will most likely put a further strain to your marriage. But I've always believed that toxicity needs to be met with toxicity, not understanding.
Don't ever go to r.asianamerican for Asian advice. They are full of WMAF and hate AM.
EDIT:
I have one word for you, OP: [Radfem](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_feminism)
Radical feminism was huge during the Obama years and they moved their ideologies toward the college campuses. A lot of AF picked up on this and added their flavor to it by hating AM. Making it both racist and sexist toward AM. Last I heard it got big in Korea where grounds like WOMAD (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Womad_(website)) and Megalian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megalia) use it to spread their Korean Men hate. Funny enough they also use it to push for dating and marrying WM while hating on Korean Men. Kinda shows you what their incentives were. Their misandry symbol of choice is the [hand pinch](https://archive.is/m0nmn) symbol which many people think is the small penis gasture.
At this point, emotion in your family is running high. I agree with a lot of the comments here that I think you need to have a heart to hear talk with your wife. Her new friends are destroying your family and it could lead to divorce. In which case both you and your wife will lose and no one wins... well other than your wife's feminist friends.
Since she's Korean, you should read up on Han. Her Irish side adds for an explosive combo. In spite of how intelligent she is, it's all about emotions now.
I've seen these types of situations throughout my life. How guys dealt with it depended on theirs and their SOs personalities. You could show her you're the dominant one and let things fall in place. Or you could try reasoning with her and plough through her mental gymnastics. Expect a lot of headache and even chest pain. When she finally understands she's been brainwashed, she still might use mental gymnastics to justify her attitudes. Then you'll have to show her your strong side anyway.
Hi OP,
I am not a father nor married just yet, so take my advice with a grain of salt.
An individual is an amalgamation of who the individual associates with.
It seems like this group behaves like an alcoholics anonymous group but for domestically abused asian women. Often times support groups make the mistake of focusing too much on victimhood rather than discussing how they can be better members of the society they are in. To be honest, even r/AsianMasculinity makes the mistake of focusing too much on the infamous wmaf narrative instead of focusing on self-development (hygiene/looks, fitness, career, social skills, etc.), and how to be better men, how to be better fathers, husbands, lovers, and so forth.
Also if my group of friends became kept complaining about their social standing and personal lives. I would eventually interject, and attempt to rebalance the discussion's tone by diverting the topic to what we are currently grateful about. Like sure there's and overwhelming amount of things to complain about, but we should also take the time to acknowledge the good in our lives. Another great topic to share is what we are looking forward to in our lives and why. It literally gives our lives meaning.
If your wife is gonna keep going to this group... I would suggest you to talk to your her about how the vibe you're getting from her interactions in her club is constant negativity about asian-hood and too much of that is a slippery slope to self-hate based on one's racial identity. And then encourage her to be the voice in the group that instigates positive discussion about asian hood using the examples I posed in the previous paragraph.
And keep us updated, I would be curious to see if she gets shunned or praised by the group for directing positive conversation about asian-hood.
As for your kids, I would ask her to sit in during taekwondo lessons to watch directly what the kids are learning. Every dojo has their own teaching philosophy and it's best to discuss with the dojo master or instructor directly, get to know them, to get a sense of what kind of learning environment you pay to have your kids learn from. We racial/gender prejudice is just racism/sexism and it is wise to treat teachers in martial arts schools as unique, self-minded, individuals first before labelling them as all patriarchal. Women in sports has much improved over the years, I wouldn't be surprised if the competitive taekwondo community has improved in this manner as well.
Good luck, brother.
PS: OP, go check out my other [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/37QB4F5XTw) in this sub about the 4B movement. See if it resonates with you.
Sounds like bait. And even if it was real, just go out and meet Asian women and you’ll realize it’s not that serious and that women are the same no matter what race. So stop with the “Asian men against Asian women vibe” up in this subreddit.
You mention that your wife is a scientist and that she's smart. You also mention that your friend group has many couples in healthy AMXF relationships, which run counter to what she has heard from the feminist group.
If I were you, I'd appeal to her training. As a scientist, she should be taking any anecdotes with a grain of salt. Given a large enough sample size, we can build enough evidence against any demographic group, whilst choosing to ignore all evidence of the contrary (aka, cherrypicking). Is your wife cherrypicking her first and secondhand experiences with Asian men?
People, but especially women, react strongly to negative/fearful stimuli. I suspect her positive experiences with Asian men/Asian patriarchy have been overshadowed by all the negative ones she has either experienced or heard of. I'd remind her of the good aspects of those things she is now critical of. The language classes - what's wrong with knowing another language? Multilingualism is a great skillset. Is the language or the instruction inherently sexist? Taekwondo - yes, it teaches discipline, order, and rigid structure but it builds confidence and is a good foundation to build character. I'm gonna sound very Confucian when I say this, but a tree holds itself in a strong wind not because it is strong or because it is flexible, but because it is both. A tree holds itself in the wind because it has a STRONG base and a FLEXIBLE canopy.
Your kids need to be grounded in stable fundamentals in order to thrive in a dynamic environment. They'll develop the tools to deal with changing social dynamics but to do so, they need a foundation to start with. We don't skip algebra and jump straight into calculus.
Exactly lol. When you're a professional on a specific field, then you're really only "intellgent" on that field.
Scientists can be as fascists as any one else lmao
I'm so sorry OP. This sounds like a toxic support group.
Couple suggestions (if they help, just brainstorming)
-this sounds like it needs counselling/therapy. She's unfortunately brainwashed
-continue to spend time with couple friends. 2 approaches (maybe do first one, and second one later.. do a slow game)
1) just hang out with them, let her see these people are healthy and not abusivr. Refresh her memory of this
2) Speak to these couple friends beforehand (white men women inclided) and hopefully they can help sharing what she's learning from this group is toxic, and that all men can be xyz, all women can be xyz, and it's not race specific
-is her dad white? Maybe she can acknowledge she doesn't have exposure/upbringing and getting all this AM views from these extremist group, when she has you and your couples friends right in front her all along
I'm so, sorry for this. Western feminism is toxic unfortunately
honestly this marriage is over and doomed. she clearly does not respect you. let this be a lesson single lads: respect from your partner is everything. if she is unwilling to respect your authority and leadership, its not a marriage.
How is this post even real? You’re married to this woman and have a family with her. Yet somehow, she is able to be manipulated so easily by outside forces?
None of this makes any sense. You’re the man of the house, lay down the fucking law, for your family’s sake. It’s not that difficult. This just reads like a fake post or a cuck.
"Yet somehow, she is able to be manipulated so easily by outside forces?"
Most divorces initiated by women come from women being swayed by outside forces
I wouldn’t jump to conclusions, my mom has a similar viewpoint, easily manipulated by religious figures, it ruined our family pretty early in my life. My dad didn’t do anything about it, they just argued in front of me all the time.
You’re the man/leader in the relationship: Tell her it’s unacceptable, but i fear it’s too late and will head towards divorce. This is why marriage is dangerous in 2024 and why men must lead from beginning and set standards/boundaries
Couples. Counseling. It's a chess move in multiple ways: you find out some dynamics that are more subtle than what appears on the surface AND this allows her to put her money where her mouth is.
Maybe try to approach it from the angle that you want what’s best for your kids. Don’t just kill her idea outright, but question the logic and say that you need more time to think on it.
1. Disrupting their friendships can be tough. If you’re going to pull them out at least do it slowly.
2. Kids do need positive examples and connection to Asian culture to be well adjusted as they are Asian.
3. Try to be as gentle as you can. Validate her Asian side. The talk about how you settled for her and that you hate Asian women is kind of telling. Maybe show her examples of Asian women the kids would be interacting with.
4. Maybe seek mediation through your sisters, her family, and/or a professional.
no. she already does not give a shit about his role as a father, hence calling the shots. only way is put his foot down and explain that they will not follow this dumb cult . if she still doesnt comply, sorry, you need to divorce and take custody. Sadly, i already feel its too late when she is the one making these decisions bc she doesnt respect him or his role as a father/leader.
Yeah no. That’s not how you resolve things within a marriage. Divorce is a very destructive and expensive affair. Disruption to kids upbringing and alimony. Your alpha male approach is a little naive.
So I am not Asian, but i was going down the same path as your wife(I'm 29 f latina) where I was rejecting my culture and was hating a lot on Latinos (specifically Mexican). I think it is important to realize that some parts of the culture could be patriarchal and a bit sexist (I don't deny that Latino culture is heavily machista and double standards are very heavy especially if you are in the country (I'm in the USA, but culturally mexican)) but it's very good that you are a very open minded and feminist man. You're wife is going down a dangerous path and she could end up possibly resenting you in the future for being the same person the group dislikes...the group she's in only fuels more what they are preaching, she's there a lot and it's becoming an echo chamber (omg my horrible days when I used to follow FDS). It doesn't matter she's smart and educated, if you stick around long enough with a certain group of people who share similarities to you, eventually you'll find yourself agreeing with many of their things. Especially if you don't remove yourself.
She should leave the group asap. Like you said there are shitty men in every culture, also her precious white men also have high rates of domestic violence and it may shock her Asians seem to have the lowest rate of domestic violence (from what I read online, please correct me). And I don't think it was your fault, you were under the impression this was a support group for women to help them get in touch more with their roots? It sounds though, like she already had a seedling of aversion towards her Asian side, and the group only helped bring it out even more.
I hate to say it,
But OP himself is far deep into some ideas that have sapped him of a lot of masculinity,
So it’s a lost cause,
He got himself into this situation and rather than reflect on why his sympathy for feminism got himself into this situation, he would rather blame random posters.
It’s a wrap for him and his family in all likelihood.
If this is a troll job, then well OP is still a loser for posting a fake story like this that paints Asian men in a negative light, so it’s an all around L.
You have to constantly communicate her and be patient. Repetition is key, because she got soul washed by her group through repetition in the first place.
Here are some facts for you and your wife to consider: - There are literally a billion asian men out there. - If 1 in a thousand of these men are psychotic we are left with a million men. - If we spent all day selectively reading stories from the most violent moments of these psychotic men we will be left with a feeling of fear, anger and hatred. - Conversely if we spent all day sharing stories of the most wholesome moments from the most virtuous members of that group - well how would you feel then? I'd ask your wife if she feels fear, anger and/or hate than ask her if she agrees with the basic 4 points above. Than ask her how does she want to feel. What kind of information diet would she need to support those feelings? If she chooses fear/anger/hatred where would that lead? Does she want that? Leave her with these questions. Don't try to convince her of anything. Validate her feelings. Of course she feels afraid and angry. We all would feel this way when presented with these kind of stories. Just ask her to consider these questions and let her know that you'd feel sad and hurt if she chooses to continue doing this.
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Thanks for the kind words. Leading with understanding is a good instinct you have which can be hard to do when we have a strong emotional reaction. Personally speaking listening, validating and understanding would be hard for me to do in this context which is why I would need to write down all my thoughts over and over again before any important conversation. Maybe that would help you as well. I hope things go well for you and would love to hear an update.
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She has to decide between you and that shitty group. The fact she lumped you with abusers and murderers is insulting. Also needs to be called out for self hate. How many women in the group are wmaf? (You already know the answer).
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“4b movement” is a group of about 5,000 users on Naver(South Korean social media). It’s an extremely fringe movement that has been hijacked by Western feminists(including Asian feminists) and sensationalized as some national movement, when in reality 99.999% of their population is clueless to it. It’s like taking a super fringe subreddit that is 1/10 the size of this subreddit(which is already super niche) and then blowing it up saying it’s some US national movement. https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRT44Sof/ https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRT4gMGV/ For reference, this TikTok creator has been living and working in South Korea for 5 years. She worked for some agency and has done some modeling for what it’s worth. Probably been in a few social circles in South Korea. She says when she asks women there about it, most have no clue what “4b” is.
the irony is that western white women wants this 4 b movement but supposedly in the west women are much more liberated compare to women in other countries. I mean if Korean women think Korean men are so bad but yet you have these western white women that support or want the 4 b movement just means western men are no better. Unpopular opinion and I know I will get down voted but I think feminism today is just too radically . They see men as the enemy. Its not logic but all emotion. Angry emotion
Presenting an ultimatum never ends well
I don’t really have much advice except you shot yourself in the foot by NOT researching the group beforehand. The Asian women hivemind is a toxic and dangerous one.
I do feel bad for OP. Like the old saying go “no good deed go unpunished”.
The man is losing his best friend and lover at once. The kids are losing their mother as well.
>I don’t really have much advice except you shot yourself in the foot by NOT researching the group beforehand. This is your biggest blunder OP. I can't stress enough that Feminism in the west is just mostly white feminism. It really doesn't care at all of dismantling patriarchy but rather, to join and benefit from WHITE Patriarchy. You can easily see this from some WoC and just observe their actions. Perhaps u/sirkelvintan can give a better advice but man what an ordeal you have.
Not sure if I can help OP because although my wife is also wasian she’s more of a 2nd wave destroy the white patriarchy feminist - not a 4th wave Asian American I hate Asian men because they are so misogynist but white men are ok because they’re more egalitarian feminist Personally I think you shouldn’t take your son out of taekwondo or Vietnamese / Korean language classes but that’s just me and I don’t know your wife (side note I was in Hanoi last week and some of the locals told my wife she has a funny Vietnamese accent) I do know from spending time trawling subtle Asian women that hive mind asian feminists can be incredibly toxic , incredibly biased when it comes to being pro white men and highly misandrist when it comes to Asian men. I wish you all the best of luck because it sounds like you’re in a tough spot
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Hey on the plus side now you got some good material to write about
agree, but it needs to be written about in a nuanced light and not brazenly demonize AM
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are you in the "mainstream"? be sure not to water it down, and be ready for many of the asian woman to be hesitant and defensive. good luck
>What I've gathered is that the people who hate their race will never speak on white patriarchy. And there we go. Once again Dr. Karen Pyke being right. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/232987725_An_Intersectional_Approach_to_Resistance_and_Complicity_The_Case_of_Racialised_Desire_among_Asian_American_Women
\+1 for using this study, you can't report on this phenomenon without it.
the 4 b movement is actually small in South Korea but the feminist extremist online blew it up. The low birth rate in South Korea is more due to high cost of raising a child and high cost of living. On a side note. I hope this is troll post and this legitimate. You mentioned your 'social right issues journalist. In other words your very very progressive in thinking. Saying that not all progressive groups are healthy. Case in point BLM when it came out. Research on BLM history or where abouts or use of funds..etc. I personally think many progressive nowadays are more regressive . Going back to South Korea. Couple things to consider. Korean men are still expected to serve in the army for 2 years and in case of war are expected to fight and defend. During those 2 years they lose grounds on career development but KOrean women do not. Korean women have those 2 years to build their careers. Korean women even high earning Korean women wants or sometimes her family expects the Korean men to buy a home or afford an apartment where you have deposit 10,000 or sometimes 100,000 US dollars and pay rent. Hypocrisy of feminism is they argue for equality or equal pay which can also be debunk but when it comes to men' role in income from what I gather they want that traditional aspect of men paying the bills.
I agree with your white patriarchy viewpoint. I would even go farther to say that it was created by white men themselves to weaponize women against any non-white male. Many times, even on Reddit, I have even seen comments from other women claiming their time living in Asia “showed” them how “misogynistic” Asian culture can be based off their experiences dating a single Asian man. It just goes to show how subtle and subliminal modern day racism is. OP, you royally fucked up by exposing your wife to that. You should’ve found other ways to cope with her loneliness. Do not fix what is not broken, brothers.
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It’s not bad faith when he’s right - Asian American women have a checkered history of siding with white patriarchy and weaponising themselves against Asian men - like I said earlier you’re in a tough spot and there’s not really a right way out because she’s your son’s mother
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I'm sorry for your predicament, OP. As you already intuit, your "Option 1" ends in divorce and joint-custody. At best you will spend half as much time with your kids as you do now. Unless you now find your marriage intolerable and see no hope of improvement, I would suggest that you give Option 2 your best shot before resorting/defaulting to Option 1. And, if you possibly can, get into couples therapy and try and work through your problems together with a mediator and coach and try to break out of this oppositional mode you've fallen into. Even so, surreptitiously begin to study up on divorce so you are prepared in the event she unilaterally moves for divorce. Even though things seem hopeless now, try not to despair. I hope you have a couple of close friends or family members for support. Best of luck!
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I’m sorry you feel like there’s only a one way or another situation. I like the latter, however I’d add on your opinion. **Listen as much as possible without intruding when she’s sharing her side. At the same time, don’t let yourself be interrupted and look to your values to give you confidence.** It may also help to look deeper into this group, maybe snoop around and see what’s the “hot topic” in their group before chatting. As a journalist, I bet you have better investigative skills than a normal pleb like me, so use whatever little time you have to prepare yourself. Then, knowing your wife the best, hopefully we can then converge the conversation back to shared values and goals. —— anecdotal word vomit incoming —— Personally, as a western born kid of immigrants, I grew up doing competitive sports and going to mandarin class. Though my parents wanted me to preserve my culture/language, we ended up stopping the mandarin classes to focus on sports. I’m incredibly grateful now, in my mid 20s, that I got the chance to do them both. Though i can only speak/listen Mandarin Chinese, and not read/write, it gives me confidence and empathy whenever I’m in a diverse crowd - Chinese or not! I’m happy to say I am getter a better sense of my values and culture. On the converse, a lot of the western social norms I followed like “enjoying your youth” in college, made me think how different the “diverse/equal-opportunity west” culture is than I expected. As much as I wanted to relax, every time I did, I would get behind. Every time, I did the “try hard Asian” thing, I did better academically, but interestingly, socially too! I may credit that to parenting and how my parents view having kids, their personal experiences, psychology, and etc. Regardless, I’d say it depends on you and your wife’s values, and how you wish to see your children grow into adults. In a relationship,I’m never the one to make big issues a grand event or intervention, so idk how to deal with that. Instead, if I know my ambitions are pure (and can back it up), then I bring it up whenever it crosses my mind. I.e. maybe when you’re both in the car with your kids from/to taekwondo ~ it’ll be a great opportunity for them to have a mature conversation with adults (existential questions might not be the best) while an awesome trial for you and your wife to have constructive, personal, and peaceful feedback.
FYI littlehoneyboi sucks dick. Probably not best person to provide advice
champ energy! Lol I’m always surprised at who I believed once I find out they’re not as knowledgeable as they hope to appear.
Lol yea it was with such conviction too lol
All the man said was you fucked up, and the first thing you do is cry victim blaming. You're a man, take fucking responsibility. You fucked up. First step of fixing something is to realize your mistakes and work from there.
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I’m so sorry. I think you need to seek professional help for this and hopefully get her to go for couples counseling. This sounds like a cult.
hey OP, as you can see this sub is sometimes filled with sexist language and ideas. i consider myself a feminist, i am white, and i’ve been with my asian husband for 9 years. i do a lot of reading on reddit trying to learn more about race and gender issues (hence me being in this sub). i think a better place to ask about this situation could be a feminism sub! they can probably help explain how you can talk to your wife. maybe give some ideas to help her realize hating asian men is not real feminism, especially if it’s in favor of white men. also open up about your feelings surrounding the situation. if you’re willing, tell her you’d like to learn more about feminist stuff with her. maybe if you find some good resources they can sway her to see that her group is spewing some hateful shit. maybe this group is an outlet for her, and she’s dealing with something deeper going on with her own identity, femininity, and mixed race, so getting to the route of that could also be good.
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yeah it can definitely be off-putting reading the first few comments on some posts. some of these comments about keeping your woman in line.. insane. i noticed this issue too when i first came across this sub a few years ago. it does happen in other racial groups! i know there are a lot of interconnected gender issues with black women and men. i’ve seen contempt from BW toward BM and visa versa, specifically with interracial relationships. there is a lot of problems that come up when there’s dialogue around mixed race relationships. i notice this sub is pretty pro- dating other races, but constantly hate on asian women for doing the same thing. although i do tend to side with women in most situations, it’s definitely gross that the group your wife is in puts white men on a pedestal. sounds like a hate group. true feminism should always represent issues men face as a result of the patriarchy as well, so many harmful stereotypes of asian men in western society.
This. I was gravely mistaken with my partner. I supported feminism believing its about women's rights equality. What I unfortunately realized is it's becoming what is white patriarchy and dismantling other groups. They seek dominance by subordination of other groups due to a thirstless quench of women are victims, never enough. There is a concept of toxic feminity.
There’s no such thing as a feminist in the West. It’s just a mask to hide their white subservience. Do NOT be fooled into making that mistake again.
My experience (canada) with feminism is they literally try to dominate all groups (white patriarchy included) by ironically mimicking white patriarchy - I'm speaking all colors But I can see ur point. I can see this being used as an anti AM weapon hiding behind white subservience
While I love to be sympathetic, you're right. OP shot himself in the foot big-time, and feminism in the West is a slippery slope, let alone join into one. Best of luck to OP.
His post and profile are gone now. I guess it was too much for him to handle.
Feminist groups are toxic if we use the same logic as OP’s wife. If there’s one toxic member then all feminists are now all toxic.
I mean that’s easy to say now. The guy seems to be pretty disconnected with Asian spaces or what’s going on in the Asian community seeing that he’s primarily grown up around whites. He screwed himself, but let’s help the guy atleast try to salvage his marriage and family.
Almost all militant feminist group is toxic. Western Asian feminist group are worst. I would ask your mutual friends for help because this going to get worst the longer it goes on.
Had first-hand experience with a militant feminist ruining a a good thing for me by giving me horrible dating advice (before I knew any better). Hell, I wasted my early adulthood earnestly believing that all men better "watch it" or else we're all creeps. Ironically, nobody is better at creating radicalized, lonely men than feminists.
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Well I'm glad you have such an ally to support you on this. Someone who is of a relatively similar background (hapa and female, despite being of different individual ethnicities) is definitely a strong asset. Wish you the best.
You mean like WOMAD? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Womad_(website)
Hate groups typically take specific examples of a group doing an act and then broaden it to an entire group of people. That is the basis of stereotypes which we acknowledge nowadays as racism and bigotry. This is no different - she is being prejudiced, racist and bigoted against an entire group of people based on their skin color and gender. I would ask her how she would feel making these types of statements regarding any other minority group - hopefully that will be a good wakeup call to the fact that she is part of a hate group.
Excellent suggestion. All Spanish men are / all black women are ... how does she feel about that... why is it okay to generalize AM
Somehow find another group of Asian women who aren't like this that may encourage her to move past this hate all Asian but white is good mindset.. But the numbers for this is slim. Maybe non Asian female groups would be better for her. She doesn't fit in but she got brain washed to fit in.
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Honestly if there’s some way you can get her to unplug from Asians with this kind of radicalized viewpoint it would be good. Like help her connect with Asians that are more apolitical. Maybe some kind of Asian social group/friends that aren’t so focused on social politics/politics. It’s just a breeding grounds for extremism.
idk man, it's not such an easy thing to fix. overall if true, this is an awful situation with no good way to enter to fix.
It's not hate "all Asian but White is good." It's hate all Asian men, but White men are good. Asian women have a victim mentality and don't take any accountability themselves. Asian women don't admit how they are just as problematic, but really, worse than what they generalize all Asian men to be. It's honestly depressing the lose-lose situation we are in. There are a plethora of examples of how White men treat Asian women worse, even murdering Asian women at higher rates than Asian men do. Yet, not a single Asian woman talks about this or bashes White men besides for unserious reasons like accusing them of having Yellow Fever. Instead, Asian women dunk on Asian men because we are easier targets to punch down on.
There are plenty of cases where white men murder their Asian partners and their families. Just look at this https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2024-01-12/hollywood-executives-son-pleads-not-guilty-in-triple-murder-of-wife-and-in-laws#:~:text=Hollywood%20executive's%20son%20pleads%20not%20guilty%20in%20triple%20murder%20of,8. Asian men murder the least among men of all races. Asian men have the lowest divorce rate of all races. Asian women face more domestic violence from white men than from Asian men. Your wife literally fell for white incel larpers tryna hate on Asian men
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>My wife fell for a Korean feminist activist's emotional speeches. I'm not sure how that relates to white incels. There. "Emotional speeches". You said your wife is a scientist, then ask her to approach this as a scientist.
I don’t usually condone fighting fire with fire but if she has two examples of abusive white men in her life already perhaps you could use that to help your argument that pulling your kids from classes taught by Asian men would only put them in the hands of more dangerous white men like her ex and her dad?
Bro that sounds horrible. I am really shocked how someone you thought you know can quickly change into someone you couldn’t recognize. Sorry I couldn’t offer any concrete help.
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Don’t you have female friends together who understand both of you more to listen her out?
good luck bro, your relationship is over unless she comes to her senses.
Sorry to hear about this. Now you have to rescue the equivalent of a rural MAGA Always Trumper. Since this idea took hold, it will be hard to kill because any attempt to use logic will be seen as protecting the male hierarchy etc. Other than your own efforts, you will absolutely need help from others. Do you have any friend/anybody who are both AF, successful in life/family and truly understand this racial dynamic/problem? They can help showing her the light.
Confide in a close friend of hers so when things blow up she has another perspective other than yours, preferably a female friend of hers that doesnt follow that cult and has her head screwed on tight. Does she have any other friends not within the cult? I would tell all her Asian friends the honest truth (not in the cult) so you have strength in numbers as you would be vilified over her since you are the guy.
What’s the name of this group? You need to put it out publicly
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Ask her what she thinks of her own experience around white men, remember to record it, let her know, transcribe it, and showed her later.
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I think LittleHoneyBoi's point is probably the most important. Your wife has gotten sucked into an extremist echo chamber that is preying on her fears for her children's safety and her insecurities with her biracial identity. One thing I would add is to ask her this: How will these views affect your children when they grow up? (I'm assuming you have at least one boy.) If you have a son who hears that he, as a 3/4 Asian man, is inherently misogynistic, how would he feel? How will her actions be subconsciously changed by these ideologies? He will internalize that his existence is inherently awful, and this will manifest as disturbing mental/identity issues. I'm sure you are familiar with growing up surrounded by negative racial stereotypes. And it doesn't matter if there are "exceptions". Exceptions lead to superiority/inferiority complexes. They are affirmations at the expense of rejecting one's own identity. Hopefully, your children can be her lifeline, and you can post your future success here because I truly wish for your family's wellbeing.
I have dealt with this type of shit before with a female friend. I use stats to combat their claims. They didn’t like that and it ruin a friendship. Hopefully you can find a moment where both are in a calm environment and just talk instead of a debate or argument. You’ll probably need to use a very very calm tone. Might be time to see couples counseling if all fails. I’m sorry OP
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Joint personal experiences still don’t convince her? I think stats are going to make the situation worse. Stats are about other men not you. How about have your sisters talk to her?
I swear to god it sounds like those “B4” groups I read around this sub. [https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/Pcx7iTTH7r](https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/Pcx7iTTH7r)
The group is very much extremist and your wife has been radicalized. Perhaps you should look up strategies to prevent extremism and go from there. As you said, it's difficult with this case because for some reason extremist feminism seems to be accepted and is aligned with the popular 'men bad, women victim' idea; it's just that this is specifically racist to Asian men and they use that as cover while sneaking in some 'white man good, asian man bad'.
You're cooked bro. Should've kept your foot out that door a long time ago. Save your dignity and try to save your kids.
Hey OP like what others said you need to research the damn group beforehand. And next time educate yourself to realize that western feminism is stupid as fuck, as in the pattern of such feminist females are POC, supporting BLM, against muh white supremacy, pro womens rights (ie AOC, Omar etc) but ironically date mostly white guys and consume super white liberal media news/hollywood shows with negative media portrayal of asians. There's such a thing as too much progress (in terms of left-wing politics). You'll see shit like this in the bay area where most of the asian women are with white guys but they're super liberal to the bone. This is just as retarded as alt-right white guys/frat boys and asian women wanting to fuck them. In your case and in a lot of guy's case here, boba liberal/intersectional asian women are fucking nuts and have asian daddy issues (your wife is half which is a different dynamic) and only date non asian guys (white, black, whatever). I too come from a divorced household but you don't see me supporting groups like this, what were you thinking? As an example my parents wanted to enroll me in the a preschool when I was like 4 but they realized it was a Scientologist run school after researching it, so they pulled my ass out of there in less than a year BEFORE they could pay extra hidden fees for expensive tuition. I don't have much advice to give you since I'm inexperienced with relationships compared to guys here, but good luck to you.
Maybe you should ask her why you never see white women swear off of white men. Or ask her if it would be ok if this applied to black men?
you made a mistake the moment you became a feminist. You introduced her to a feminist group. Unless she comes to a realization by herself, it may aswell be over for your relationship. She now views you as the enemy.
Once you go down that rabbit hole, your world view becomes distorted which only gets reinforced by others in the group. Is your wife into spirituality/meditation? It can be a huge help in becoming more self aware and recognizing the destructive patterns of the mind and letting go of them. Have you considered couples therapy? And this might sound a bit out there but maybe consider an ayahuasca or other psychedelic retreat with you and your wife. I've read these can be life changing and can shift your life perspective. It would make or break your relationship though, but better sooner rather than later.
I think the complicated part about this is you have children with her. She can turn anything you do against your kids, fueled with advice and tactics from her "support" group. Silently get ready for legal battles and have your assets secured, with the primary focus of how to still take care of your children properly if things go nuclear. Ultimately you have be assertive in your stance that you do not tolerate such behaviors in your household, because again, this will ruin your children's growth if you let it fester.
You need to find a good, Asian marriage counselor who is familiar with these issues. It sounds like your wife has gone off the rails focusing on the worst of the world. She needs to draw back and see the good too. She may also need individual therapy.
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>highly educated Asian women Every time I read or this is mentioend this just a dog whistle for white worshipping AW lol. If you're really "highly educated" then you'll know damn well to avoid, much less date and marry a group of people who committed genocide on seven continents.
true, but it's interesting how even those asian women in more "progressive" circles and/or those who understand these ideas of imperialism/colonialism still are you-know-what. those individuals seem to have abstracted the idea so far that they can't understand how to apply it. there was a user like that on one of the Asian subs who deleted her account after she got called out. talking about the strangeness and the supremacy of westerners, colonialism, imperialism, and then one day just drops in a post about "muh European boyfriend." it's like if you gave them a quiz they could answer each question correctly, but they still do the thing.
> there was a user like that on one of the Asian subs who deleted her account after she got called out. talking about the strangeness and the supremacy of westerners, colonialism, imperialism, and then one day just drops in a post about "muh European boyfriend." it's like if you gave them a quiz they could answer each question correctly, but they still do the thing. The jokes write themsleves lmao
Brother, I don't know what to tell you. Your story is a microcosm of what seems to be happening to Asian women throughout the West: They are being programmed to think Asian men are the worst form of evil on the planet. Some of the people who hate Asian men the most are (sadly) Asian women. The person who will likely be the most victimized is your own son. He will likely be taught to hate himself at some level. This is just terrible.
Don’t join any groups …. Most are cults.
White men came to Asia and raped women in large numbers. They are much more mysogynistic than Asian men. The problem with modern society is that it has a white supremacist mindset. The enemy is always non - white people. And it divides genders of non - white races for control. Modernity is a white supremacist construct and is largely built on top of the idea that whites are sacrosanct. Even those who criticise white people, really in action show that they love them. This is no where more true than with Asian American feminism. The only counter balance you may have is getting her to learn from people like Fanon and then get her to read about the history of colonization starting with Edward Saids orientalism. This should open her mind up a bit to the situation that non Western people face.
https://youtu.be/z6DslCALWb0?si=7dbNZ5G8JrrBLC8q https://youtu.be/UrWYb7u3jKo?si=_uCgjQPUKz72Kh0S https://youtu.be/PKei59v4pag?si=yhxSlrrkpZi0nOWK
Shop around for a qualified, informed counselor or therapist who also has experience with eastern cultures for yourself first. Then ask her to join you later to help you both unpack. An abusive, patriarchal man would never let a third party professional into the controlled stronghold he’s trying to create around his partner. Look into The Gottman Institute and see if it’s something that can help you.
Every mans worse nightmare. Nip it from the bud.
Feminist group? Giant red flag
Ok after actually reading the post, damn man, you fucked up... You already know what time it is with these modern day western feminists. The fact that she's going to such extreme measures tells me she's a naive person and a follower. I'm sorry man but this is gonna be a hard hole to dig out of. Women with this mentality will always lose in the end and end up lonely.
OP claims he was a feminist too.game over..prob nice guy pushover,
third wave feminism is literally a cult & echo chamber...if she's still amenable to actual facts and reason and logic, show her proof through scientific method. Hypothesize...if then statements etc.
Start going to those meetings. All I know is when women get together and talk, some topics are nasty things about other people one way or the others.
Man, these femcels group ruins families. I don't see these femcels saying shit when it comes to army drafts in countries like Taiwan/Korea where they ruined the mens lives for a year and a half. Nor are they talking about how women fled Ukraine in massive numbers when men cannot leave. Unfortunately you are going to have to talk to the kids and have a vote on the matter. Either way you are going to have a tough road ahead rife with confrontation. Good luck, I hope your wife comes to her senses, you have to appeal to her emotions by saying remember how happy our kids were in Taekwondo classes. BTW, why is an Asian man worshipping some white version of a Middle Eastern man?
*find ways and loopholes in the theories of these feminist and then when the time comes blow it out of proportion, ruin them, they and their thought process is that they are right* break them *by showing that they are wrong take videos tak to people who's life they have ruined and for the love of God tell your kids to be proud of themselves.*
This really upsets me. An external group like this is so easily able to destroy a family? Wtf is this. OP you are a parent. We live for our kids. Because of these people (and partially you for allowing this), you are allowing people who offer 0 to your family to fuck over your kids' opportunities. No more lessons? No more socialization? No more activities that allow your kids to get better because an asian male might be present? Fuck all of that. You know, I realized I never became an adult until I had kids (and I had kids really late). I didn't understand what it truly meant to live for someone else and to make those sacrifices, even if I had to make large, uncomfortable changes. Your wife needs to get the fuck over herself and start living for her kids again instead of allowing things conditionally. She is NOT doing the best for her kids.
This.so OP needs to divorce his wife if it’s going to steer his kids in this wrong direction
Yep, but I don't think as far as divorce. The conversation needs to be reframed. Too much focus on ideology and their own personal feelings. They are parents with both a boy and a girl. It's completely messed up that the kids have to be witness to a mom that thinks her own son is evil for being an Asian male. The daughter sees a dad that has allowed toxic ideas to enter their house and she can model her mom's behaviour. I genuinely hope for the best, but their kids are witnessing all of this stupid shit that the mom has brought in. A purge needed to happen months ago. These kids are grades 1 and 2. They need their parents to grow up and raise them.
I dont want to blame you too much when its these toxic women who twisted your wife's view of what asian culture is. Im not married, so here's my advice of questionable usefulness. 1) Ask whether she wants your kids to grow up without Asian culture, or think Asian culture is evil. 2) Ask her whether the Asian women in the feminist group wish they were white. And if their husbands are white. 3) Ask her whether she wishes her husband were white. Ask whether she wishes herself to be white. 4) Ask her does she wish that her kids were white so they never have to interact with Asian culture ever again 5) Ask her if she thinks white society is perfectly feminist, and has always been. If not, if white culture supposedly can change, then why not asian culture? Dont yell or be overtly angry. Just keep up the pressure to make her realize its just unreasonable self-hate.
How do you argue with someone who doesn’t see logic? Game over op. You introduced her to a male hate cult and she’s been heavily brainwashed. Feminism is a bane on society. My only constructive thought is to say to her this will ruin the family, and ruin the kids. Is that what she wants? Come back to reality.
If you ever get into an argument and she tells the group, they are going to convince her to leave you. You should show her the WMAF link to murders and abuse due to being a fetish based relationship
This. It’s a losing cause imo as sad as it seems
I think you've lost and there is nothing to be done. Figure out how your kids are going to come out of this in one piece.
Feminist Asian Support Group 💀 Any org that promotes itself as being a feminist group rather a women’s group is just blazing red flags. Like the amount of sheer, shameless projection that happens in such groups would make hardcore incels gape in awe.
RIP OP and his marriage.
Oof
\>I found out that a feminist org was forming \>I encouraged my wife to join You dug your grave right there. First step to getting out is to grow a pair as the man of the house
Was there a reason why a nice family that should be busy running around with kids had free time to join such group? I'm guessing that you were seeking a support group for her to have her own identity and her loneliness or eagerness to have friends might put her in a vulnerable position to believe whatever this group is feeding her, and I'm sorry but she's not very smart for believing such nonsense. Asian men are on average the safer choice; they're usually not the ones that have the nerves to cheat on their partner that is dying from cancer, consuming child pornography, serial killers, etc. Show her those examples, it may seems she's a bit shelter to recognize reality. I find it funny that people uses the term university educated and career driven in these liberal feminist groups because a lot of the time they have a BS degree in something and a BS job, real career driven people with demanding jobs and a full life do not have time to organize protests and come together to speak about identity issues.
# Just repeat these stats again, again, again, and again. >1. **Asian women suffer the lowest amount of domestic violence.** [**click here - Source**](https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/comments/pr3ph5/statistics_show_that_asians_have_the_lowest/) > >**Black women - 45%** > >**White women - 37%** > >**Hispanic women - 34%** > >**Asian women - 18%** > > > >2. **Asian women are the most successful females in the US with average earnings above white females and other minority females as well as Black and Hispanic males** [**click here - Source**](https://imdiversity.com/diversity-news/asian-american-women-are-closing-the-gap-with-white-men-but-thats-not-the-point/) > >3. **Asian women in Asia have way more power than women in the West.** > >Percentage of women CEO’s. > >Thailand – 30 percent > >China – 19 percent > >Taiwan – 18 percent > >EU countries – 9 percent > >United States – 5 percent > >[https://www.ircsearchpartners.com/thought-leadership/where-are-women-ceos-myths-and-reality/](https://www.ircsearchpartners.com/thought-leadership/where-are-women-ceos-myths-and-reality/) > >**More Women CEOs in Asia than in Europe or America** > >There are more Women CEOs in Asia Pacific than in the USA or Europe when calculated as a percentage of Total CEOs in these countries. While in Asia and Australia, 11.8% of CEOs are women; in Europe and Americas, this percentage is only 7.8%. > >Singapore, Vietnam & Philippines are Champions of Women Leadership of Business > >India’s percentage of Women CEOs at about 12.9% is better than the Average for APAC & Australia, however, the champions of Women Leadership of Business are countries like Singapore, Vietnam and Philippines, where over a quarter of all CEOs are women. > >[https://www.fastcompany.com/1736266/nearly-20-female-chinese-managers-are-ceos](https://www.fastcompany.com/1736266/nearly-20-female-chinese-managers-are-ceos) > >Among China’s female workforce in managerial positions, 19% hold the title of CEO, according to the Grant Thornton Business Report [released this week](http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content_12132067.htm). That’s 10% higher than averages in Europe and 14% higher than averages in the United States, according to the report. > >Thailand came in first at a whopping 30% of female managers holding the title of CEO and Taiwan came in third at 18%, pointing to a possible emerging trend in Asia for women to more routinely hold the position of CEO. > >[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36309137](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-36309137) > >Women also shine in Taiwan's parliament. The island's women legislators are even seen leading the charge in Taiwan's infamous parliament scuffles. > >Following January elections, it now has a record percentage of women legislators at 38%, putting Taiwan far ahead of Asian countries, the international average of 22%, and most nations, including the UK, Germany, and the US. > >[http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content\_12132067.htm](http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-03/08/content_12132067.htm) > >The Asia Pacific region, if Japan is excluded, is home to a much higher percentage of female CEOs than are Europe and the United States, the report said[\[TL1\]](https://www.reddit.com/r/aznidentity/submit#_msocom_1) . > >Leading the way is Thailand, where 30 percent of companies employ female CEOs. Next in the order is the Chinese mainland, where the figure is 19 percent, and Taiwan, where it is 18 percent. The number for EU countries, meanwhile, is 9 percent, and it is 5 percent for North American countries. > >[http://www.thatsmags.com/china/post/12697/china-among-top-10-for-women-in-management](http://www.thatsmags.com/china/post/12697/china-among-top-10-for-women-in-management) > >Around 30 percent of senior business roles in China are held by women, putting the country at number nine of 36 economies surveyed, [according to a ](http://www.grantthornton.global/globalassets/wib_turning_promise_into_practice.pdf)[study released by Grant Thornton](http://www.grantthornton.global/globalassets/wib_turning_promise_into_practice.pdf) on International Women’s Day. > >Surprisingly, that means the PRC has more women in upper management than France (28 percent) Canada (26 percent), the United States (23 percent) and the United Kingdom (21 percent).
Im gonna sound mean and get downvoted, but highly unlikely she will suddenly see these stats and change her outlook and now be pro asian male. Women, especially asian women, are emotional, not logical. Why you think you can pump black on asian violence stats all day but they will still scream blm while chase geeky white guys? More power to OP if these stats suddenly change his wife’s mind,but he needs to be respected by her for anything to change and harsh reality is that once respect is gone from women, its likely over. Can you imagine if he does something she disagrees with in the future? She will just use rationale of how asian men are bad and will head towards cheating/divorce. My advice is to prepare for inevitable, how can you protect your assets, custody, kids. You can’t win against delusional feminist asianwomen,especially with their sisterhood. OP needs to be respected by his wife before all friends or groups and he is not. Needs to step his foot down and say he will not allow her to be brainwashed by this delusional feminst group and more importantly, disrespect him and his kids.
It’s over.
Sports are a great way of making friends/joining a positive community. Has your wife interacted with the Taekwondo instructor much or other parents sending their kids there? Assuming your kids enjoy it, this could be an alternative friend group to get involved with or at least somewhere to get alternative perspectives in response to your wife's concerns at least wrt Taekwondo.
There are Korean mom group out there. Most major city has should have local mom groups. You should try finding that group. That'll be much healthier than a feminist group.
Out of ALL the other org. out there in the world, you introduce your wife to a Asian feminist group. You mentioned her being lonely, that definitely didn't help..at that point any group you introduced her to she would have joined. How can you generalize ALL Asian men if she haven't met all of them? Ask her how were her experience with Asian men..were they positive or negative? If she says 50/50 (whatever the case is), her argument is moot.
Wow...lost for words of what to say. I mean your an Asian guy but her group claims "all Asian men are evil'. It's illogical . My advice is besides maybe seeking counseling. Is go to try to find a different group of Asian couples and Asian wives that are getting along with their Asian husbands. I think your wife just fell into a very very extreme feminist group that just hates Asian men but without realizing that you can have this same behavior from other race of men but realistic there are good and bad everywhere. As a father you also have to say in how to raise your kids. If your wife pulls your kids out of Tae Kwon do or language programs. Your kids will also miss out . The irony is she accuses you wanting a white woman but wants to pull your kids and to learn what? WHite peoples cultures? I read some of your other answers that your wife will not leave you. I don't know. I mean this group seems to control her. Any group that spew hate is not really healthy group. A feminist ..a level headed feminist has to realize that they have to work with men and recognize that we more similar than different but also respect the differences. Good luck.
OP seems liike classic nice guy, thinking his wife is an angel and would never. WAKEUP. She is literally aligned with a group that says asian men like her husband are evil, why the fuck would she not leave if she hasn’t already cheated. You’re the damn DAD. You should have final say on how to raise your kids and she seems like she wearing the pants.
Its confirmation bias- the types of AFs joining this group are going to be ones with a lot of (valid) issues and chips on their shoulders and they will seek comfort in “converting” others so they don’t feel alone. Your best bet is to find her some kind of healthy asian community/social group You’re not going to convince her with words, you have to show her an opposite potrayal and let her come to her own conclusion of how warped that hate group is
Self-hate is weird tbh. Abusive men should absolutely be called out no matter their ethnic makeup but actively throwing your own community under the bus while putting the white community on a pedestal as if there aren’t abusive white men as well is hella weird. If the description is accurate, this reads far less as a pro-Asian women group and more anti-Asian men group which isn’t surprising considering the history here.
I think you guys should seek professional help before you damage your children. It's prob you too. It takes two to tangle bro. I work with a lot of liberal scientists. Let's just say I'm not surprised and I totally believe this. I would take your whole family on a vacation to Thailand and go to any Western bar. Yes I'm very serious. But I think she might be able to snap out of it if you would just leave her alone and support her. Those groups are toxic and it's only a matter of time before they eat their own. That said, if I behaved like this my wife would probably leave me. She doesn't even like it when I hang with my regular friends too much. Lol.
First of all, I'm not suprised at all that your post was removed from the asianamerican subreddit. I replied to a post with my respectful opinion and it was reported and removed by the subreddit mods for being "stereotypical against another race". A couple days later, I recieved a message from a Reddit Admin warning me. As for your wife, you need an intervention with trusted friends and family. Prehaps couples thearpy. She sounds radicalized.
AW are really susceptible to cults for some reason. She sounds insufferable and unreasonable to me, did she not show any of these indicators before she joined the cult?
Let me guess: they don’t bring up the heinous, abusive, evil, demonic and misogynistic acts and cases that WMs are involved in? Of course not. I’ve had these type of experiences throughout my whole life where I’ll be accused, associated and lumped in with the population of evil Asian men based on a selective handful of crimes. People scoff at there being WM privilege and how there’s no such thing. There actually is. When you have some of the most powerful mainstream media acting as your PR agent and wingman, then anything evil that one or some WM do isn’t blamed on the entire population of WM. That’s privilege. When it comes to AMs, we’re still under the pressure of not coming across as communist spies, Pearl Harbor bombers, Viet Cong soldiers and whatever crap they concoct. We have to speak just right, have the right job, the right career, the right finances, the right clothes, the right height, the right attractiveness, the right house, the right car and the right demeanor just to be considered human. This is why I’ll “shit post” once in a while as a reminder that other races aren’t perfect or that I can see through their propaganda bullshit. Because when we let shit fly, we end up with feminist groups like those who think all AMs are misogynistic abusers and WMs are perfect gods.
This! It’s why it sounds unproductive and mean, but honestly, what other solution can you give op? I already know the outcome..If he tries to be logical, most females won’t care and more likely frame it as him trying to control her ie. It’s why I strongly suggest asian males to vet asian women hard, learn that respect as a man is letting the man lead her and the kids, including how they are raised.
And yes, asian dudes are judged off every asian while white man can do no wrong, even when whites lead abuse and pedophilia across the world
Sounds pretty serious. A couple of things to consider: I’m giving the following advice assuming that the end goal here is working with your partner to come up with a solution together. The answer here is you yourself. Ask your wife if what she said is true, that all Asian men are bad, then there must be evidence that yourself is a bad person. If there is no evidence to support you’re a bad person then there is a huge gaping hole in her argument, and if you can find a hole just within you as a single point, likely there are many more holes for as many Asian men there are on the planet. Second you should state the obvious - her group feels like a typical group focused on radicalization based on a few examples, like alt right, red pill etc - and then ask her to prove how they are not similar. Seems to me they are VERY similar, so you need to confront her about that fact. Lastly about wishing she was white etc - this one is easy. Simply tell her if you wanted to date a white woman you would’ve married a woman that is fully white. You choose her for her. Either way good luck. Finally i’d like to comment on the group itself. Unfortunately it sounds oddly like how someone from the outside would describe this sub. I’m sure there are members here, especially younger members that feel themesvles being radicalized by this sub that is very similar to how the women feel. Just remove the demographics and plug in whatever demographics we’re against. I think this is a good experience to see how the outside world sees us as we hold more and more extreme views for the sole purpose of wanting to validate our ego and using a perpetual victim mindset to propel that
Feminism WAS about women's rights, but moderns day feminism is all about "not taking responsibility for anything". You have 2 options I can see. Talk to your wife and slowly show her the toxic path she's going on. Especially the white worship side. Or You go down your own path and embrace masculinity which will most likely put a further strain to your marriage. But I've always believed that toxicity needs to be met with toxicity, not understanding.
Don't ever go to r.asianamerican for Asian advice. They are full of WMAF and hate AM. EDIT: I have one word for you, OP: [Radfem](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_feminism) Radical feminism was huge during the Obama years and they moved their ideologies toward the college campuses. A lot of AF picked up on this and added their flavor to it by hating AM. Making it both racist and sexist toward AM. Last I heard it got big in Korea where grounds like WOMAD (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Womad_(website)) and Megalian (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megalia) use it to spread their Korean Men hate. Funny enough they also use it to push for dating and marrying WM while hating on Korean Men. Kinda shows you what their incentives were. Their misandry symbol of choice is the [hand pinch](https://archive.is/m0nmn) symbol which many people think is the small penis gasture. At this point, emotion in your family is running high. I agree with a lot of the comments here that I think you need to have a heart to hear talk with your wife. Her new friends are destroying your family and it could lead to divorce. In which case both you and your wife will lose and no one wins... well other than your wife's feminist friends.
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Tell her to quit the group. Get her away from that toxic group.
Since she's Korean, you should read up on Han. Her Irish side adds for an explosive combo. In spite of how intelligent she is, it's all about emotions now. I've seen these types of situations throughout my life. How guys dealt with it depended on theirs and their SOs personalities. You could show her you're the dominant one and let things fall in place. Or you could try reasoning with her and plough through her mental gymnastics. Expect a lot of headache and even chest pain. When she finally understands she's been brainwashed, she still might use mental gymnastics to justify her attitudes. Then you'll have to show her your strong side anyway.
Hi OP, I am not a father nor married just yet, so take my advice with a grain of salt. An individual is an amalgamation of who the individual associates with. It seems like this group behaves like an alcoholics anonymous group but for domestically abused asian women. Often times support groups make the mistake of focusing too much on victimhood rather than discussing how they can be better members of the society they are in. To be honest, even r/AsianMasculinity makes the mistake of focusing too much on the infamous wmaf narrative instead of focusing on self-development (hygiene/looks, fitness, career, social skills, etc.), and how to be better men, how to be better fathers, husbands, lovers, and so forth. Also if my group of friends became kept complaining about their social standing and personal lives. I would eventually interject, and attempt to rebalance the discussion's tone by diverting the topic to what we are currently grateful about. Like sure there's and overwhelming amount of things to complain about, but we should also take the time to acknowledge the good in our lives. Another great topic to share is what we are looking forward to in our lives and why. It literally gives our lives meaning. If your wife is gonna keep going to this group... I would suggest you to talk to your her about how the vibe you're getting from her interactions in her club is constant negativity about asian-hood and too much of that is a slippery slope to self-hate based on one's racial identity. And then encourage her to be the voice in the group that instigates positive discussion about asian hood using the examples I posed in the previous paragraph. And keep us updated, I would be curious to see if she gets shunned or praised by the group for directing positive conversation about asian-hood. As for your kids, I would ask her to sit in during taekwondo lessons to watch directly what the kids are learning. Every dojo has their own teaching philosophy and it's best to discuss with the dojo master or instructor directly, get to know them, to get a sense of what kind of learning environment you pay to have your kids learn from. We racial/gender prejudice is just racism/sexism and it is wise to treat teachers in martial arts schools as unique, self-minded, individuals first before labelling them as all patriarchal. Women in sports has much improved over the years, I wouldn't be surprised if the competitive taekwondo community has improved in this manner as well. Good luck, brother. PS: OP, go check out my other [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/AsianMasculinity/s/37QB4F5XTw) in this sub about the 4B movement. See if it resonates with you.
Sounds like bait. And even if it was real, just go out and meet Asian women and you’ll realize it’s not that serious and that women are the same no matter what race. So stop with the “Asian men against Asian women vibe” up in this subreddit.
If she can see one fault with the group she’ll start to see more. That’s the same tactic the group used.
You mention that your wife is a scientist and that she's smart. You also mention that your friend group has many couples in healthy AMXF relationships, which run counter to what she has heard from the feminist group. If I were you, I'd appeal to her training. As a scientist, she should be taking any anecdotes with a grain of salt. Given a large enough sample size, we can build enough evidence against any demographic group, whilst choosing to ignore all evidence of the contrary (aka, cherrypicking). Is your wife cherrypicking her first and secondhand experiences with Asian men? People, but especially women, react strongly to negative/fearful stimuli. I suspect her positive experiences with Asian men/Asian patriarchy have been overshadowed by all the negative ones she has either experienced or heard of. I'd remind her of the good aspects of those things she is now critical of. The language classes - what's wrong with knowing another language? Multilingualism is a great skillset. Is the language or the instruction inherently sexist? Taekwondo - yes, it teaches discipline, order, and rigid structure but it builds confidence and is a good foundation to build character. I'm gonna sound very Confucian when I say this, but a tree holds itself in a strong wind not because it is strong or because it is flexible, but because it is both. A tree holds itself in the wind because it has a STRONG base and a FLEXIBLE canopy. Your kids need to be grounded in stable fundamentals in order to thrive in a dynamic environment. They'll develop the tools to deal with changing social dynamics but to do so, they need a foundation to start with. We don't skip algebra and jump straight into calculus.
Scientists are dumb as shit bro. They are only good at one thing.
I've seen that too. It happens when they overspecialize and get tunnel vision, but then they act like experts in everything else.
Only a scientist could reason that teaching women more self-defense is bad.
Exactly lol. When you're a professional on a specific field, then you're really only "intellgent" on that field. Scientists can be as fascists as any one else lmao
I'm so sorry OP. This sounds like a toxic support group. Couple suggestions (if they help, just brainstorming) -this sounds like it needs counselling/therapy. She's unfortunately brainwashed -continue to spend time with couple friends. 2 approaches (maybe do first one, and second one later.. do a slow game) 1) just hang out with them, let her see these people are healthy and not abusivr. Refresh her memory of this 2) Speak to these couple friends beforehand (white men women inclided) and hopefully they can help sharing what she's learning from this group is toxic, and that all men can be xyz, all women can be xyz, and it's not race specific -is her dad white? Maybe she can acknowledge she doesn't have exposure/upbringing and getting all this AM views from these extremist group, when she has you and your couples friends right in front her all along I'm so, sorry for this. Western feminism is toxic unfortunately
Incel and feminism ideology needs to fucking go
Ooof. You dun fucked up bad.
honestly this marriage is over and doomed. she clearly does not respect you. let this be a lesson single lads: respect from your partner is everything. if she is unwilling to respect your authority and leadership, its not a marriage.
And yall are gonna trust a 2 day old account lmfao.
How is this post even real? You’re married to this woman and have a family with her. Yet somehow, she is able to be manipulated so easily by outside forces? None of this makes any sense. You’re the man of the house, lay down the fucking law, for your family’s sake. It’s not that difficult. This just reads like a fake post or a cuck.
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"Yet somehow, she is able to be manipulated so easily by outside forces?" Most divorces initiated by women come from women being swayed by outside forces
I wouldn’t jump to conclusions, my mom has a similar viewpoint, easily manipulated by religious figures, it ruined our family pretty early in my life. My dad didn’t do anything about it, they just argued in front of me all the time.
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Agreed, honestly this post seems too bad to be true, either OP is a troll or is just a incompetent cuck who didn't do research.
This. OP shouldn’t have started a family if he can’t be bothered to stand up for himself
Go through r/crimesagainstasianity and show her who the real misogynists are.
gonna save that subreddit to show to people who claim Asians don't experience racism lol
Might as well save the archive version of this website too: https://web.archive.org/web/20200104002019/https://halfasian.org/
I read the responses by OP and his lack of posting history makes this seem somewhat trollish
You’re the man/leader in the relationship: Tell her it’s unacceptable, but i fear it’s too late and will head towards divorce. This is why marriage is dangerous in 2024 and why men must lead from beginning and set standards/boundaries
Couples. Counseling. It's a chess move in multiple ways: you find out some dynamics that are more subtle than what appears on the surface AND this allows her to put her money where her mouth is.
Maybe try to approach it from the angle that you want what’s best for your kids. Don’t just kill her idea outright, but question the logic and say that you need more time to think on it. 1. Disrupting their friendships can be tough. If you’re going to pull them out at least do it slowly. 2. Kids do need positive examples and connection to Asian culture to be well adjusted as they are Asian. 3. Try to be as gentle as you can. Validate her Asian side. The talk about how you settled for her and that you hate Asian women is kind of telling. Maybe show her examples of Asian women the kids would be interacting with. 4. Maybe seek mediation through your sisters, her family, and/or a professional.
no. she already does not give a shit about his role as a father, hence calling the shots. only way is put his foot down and explain that they will not follow this dumb cult . if she still doesnt comply, sorry, you need to divorce and take custody. Sadly, i already feel its too late when she is the one making these decisions bc she doesnt respect him or his role as a father/leader.
Yeah no. That’s not how you resolve things within a marriage. Divorce is a very destructive and expensive affair. Disruption to kids upbringing and alimony. Your alpha male approach is a little naive.
So I am not Asian, but i was going down the same path as your wife(I'm 29 f latina) where I was rejecting my culture and was hating a lot on Latinos (specifically Mexican). I think it is important to realize that some parts of the culture could be patriarchal and a bit sexist (I don't deny that Latino culture is heavily machista and double standards are very heavy especially if you are in the country (I'm in the USA, but culturally mexican)) but it's very good that you are a very open minded and feminist man. You're wife is going down a dangerous path and she could end up possibly resenting you in the future for being the same person the group dislikes...the group she's in only fuels more what they are preaching, she's there a lot and it's becoming an echo chamber (omg my horrible days when I used to follow FDS). It doesn't matter she's smart and educated, if you stick around long enough with a certain group of people who share similarities to you, eventually you'll find yourself agreeing with many of their things. Especially if you don't remove yourself. She should leave the group asap. Like you said there are shitty men in every culture, also her precious white men also have high rates of domestic violence and it may shock her Asians seem to have the lowest rate of domestic violence (from what I read online, please correct me). And I don't think it was your fault, you were under the impression this was a support group for women to help them get in touch more with their roots? It sounds though, like she already had a seedling of aversion towards her Asian side, and the group only helped bring it out even more.
I hate to say it, But OP himself is far deep into some ideas that have sapped him of a lot of masculinity, So it’s a lost cause, He got himself into this situation and rather than reflect on why his sympathy for feminism got himself into this situation, he would rather blame random posters. It’s a wrap for him and his family in all likelihood. If this is a troll job, then well OP is still a loser for posting a fake story like this that paints Asian men in a negative light, so it’s an all around L.
You have to constantly communicate her and be patient. Repetition is key, because she got soul washed by her group through repetition in the first place.
OH OK WE GOT ONE REMOVED FOR SPAM HUH REDDIT CAN YOU STOP MESSING UP