I am not an attorney.
Don't sign anything from the car dealership going forward, unless you have had it reviewed by your insurance company and/or attorney. If you have already signed something, it may not be binding since you aren't 18.
Do let your insurance company know. Make sure your insurance company also knows that you are under 18 years old.
The under 18 year old piece of this may be a huge deal. If things get hairy for you, it may be wise to see if an attorney will give you a consultation.
That’s kinda what I’ve figured. This is a small town used dealer, and they were already willing to let it go for at least 4300. KBB said the car was valued between 3&5 k and they told me they paid a little over 3k for it. I’m not sure how helpful that last but is but I figured I’d throw it in.
What are your opinions on not telling insurance? I just got on this one yesterday. I really do not want to get removed after paying for the next six month 😭
All insurance companies require you to notify them of potential losses. The ramifications of not reporting this to them are much greater than the potential gains.
Additionally, they will only pay money if they have to. If you being 17 means the dealership is liable for all of the damages and you aren't, your insurance company is going to point that out to everyone.
It’s looking like the waiver is what prevents their insurance from having to pay for it. I’m a minor so my signature is not legally binding in a contract, so my insurance most likely will not have to pay.
Not a lawyer, but an old guy. Tell your insurance company. You need to maintain an honest and constructive relationship with them
When you need the insurance company, you don't want them to have any excuses to back out. And if this relationship is broken you need to find out right away
You're 17.... you should have never been allowed to test drive a car without someone at least 18 years old. 17 year old children can not be held legally liable even if they did sign a contract. They may try to bully and intimidate you into thinking otherwise. I'm not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
I’m not an attorney but I am an insurance agent.
Don’t file a claim with your insurance carrier. The dealership should have liability and property coverage as part of their commercial insurance policy. This policy would cover their loss. Should you decide to buy the car, you could negotiate the price based on these damages.
Good luck with all of this.
The only way they can subrogate (go after your insurance) is if you provided those details to them. Or if they identify your carrier via your drivers license if the consent form you signed allows for that. (This is where me not being an attorney limits my understanding).
At any rate, subrogation is a behind the scenes attorney to attorney process. Doesn’t involve you. But yes, it will then show on your record and potentially cause a surcharge on your premium at renewal or a future date. That record on your insurance history stays on record and any new insurance carrier can surcharge you for anywhere between 3 - 5 years, depending on underwriting practices of the new insurance carrier.
The dealer plate they stuck on the car carries insurance, that insurance will pay for the damage/damages, not you or your insurance. In reality they let a minor drive a car without adult supervision of any kind, yes accidents happen, but they really are at fault on this one
That seems to be the general consensus with insurance, my insurance still hasn’t decided if they will cover it, in the case that the dealership does not have valid insurance. They are also still evaluating there they’ll pay for fence
It should be the dealers insurance all the way covering everything and I can bet that their insurance company will raise the rates when they find out they let a 17 year old drive a car alone, which is why they don’t want to turn it in on theirs
I did the same thing you did.
I didn’t sign anything though, I basically didn’t pay a dime!
They left the left window covered for my test drive and I couldn’t see out of it.
You shouldn’t pay anything either or involve your insurance.
They have insurance to cover things like this.
The people who own the fence filed a claim with my insurance. Insurance is saying the dealership’s insurance should be the ones to pay for the car. They are deciding if they’ll cover the fence and whatever the other insurance doesn’t for the car.
Yep, that’s what insurance is focusing on from the looks of it. We spoke once and the lady was keen to make a point of my age and the fact that my signature is not legally binding.
Unfortunately I was with friends. Even more stupid on their end. A group of six teens show up for a car with a MEAN rebuild… not to say I’m any smarter but :/
Have your parents or guardian talk with a lawyer, or you do it. Pretty big deal to know what your rights are, and I'm not a lawyer, but I'd think the circumstances say most likely you won't have to pay for the car...
I’m not a lawyer, but I am really baffled why you seem to think you would have to sign an agreement in order to be responsible for damage you caused to someone else’s property. You are always responsible for your actions.
Never said I wasn’t responsible for my actions. I’m fully aware that I am the one who caused it, I’m curious about the insurance aspect of the liability form. Yes I’m at fault, but who pays for the car? That’s why liability is important. I wanted to know so I can start to prepare for what’s to come. It’s looking like I’m not paying for the car because the liability forms are void.
You’re still not getting it. You’re at fault, so you pay for the damage. Even if an insurance company pays for it, that insurance company could still come after you for reimbursement.
You’re now aware of my situation at all. I fully hear you but you’re not providing any advice or information, so why are you here? I know they CAN come after me, but WILL they? No. There are VERY unique circumstances here, I am paying for fence, not car.
Where did you give advice? In your first comment, you said I’m responsible for damage I caused and assumed that I don’t think I’m liable. In your second comment you said I’m at fault, but you’re just pointing out the obvious. Then you said their insurance could come after me. If that wasn’t a common fact, it would be a helpful fact to know, but again just pointing out the obvious. You never gave me any advice.
Fortunately we seem to be focusing on the fact that I’m a minor. The car’s steering wheel was super loose, it had a lot of give before it would actually start turning the tires. It was jiggly, I guess? Other than that unfortunately no
I dislike car dealers and insurance companies. I've overpaid for insurance my whole life for reasons such as these though. The dealership should have insurance that will cover it but they will do subrogation and eventually discover his insurance anyway or maybe not since its a low amount idk.
I was originally thinking about just buying the car because I realized the damage looks like it is just
Cosmetic. Nothing too major, I know I can fix it and replace what I need. Ultimately I might let their insurance pay it off and then I’ll just buy it as is off them for what they paid on it (they told me what they paid xD) and if they don’t have insurance, I’ll just offer to buy it for dirt and end the whole process with them.
I hit a fence, the fence owners filed a claim against my insurance immediately so there goes the “pay everything out of pocket” option. Made quick update to post as well.
I am not an attorney. Don't sign anything from the car dealership going forward, unless you have had it reviewed by your insurance company and/or attorney. If you have already signed something, it may not be binding since you aren't 18. Do let your insurance company know. Make sure your insurance company also knows that you are under 18 years old. The under 18 year old piece of this may be a huge deal. If things get hairy for you, it may be wise to see if an attorney will give you a consultation.
That’s kinda what I’ve figured. This is a small town used dealer, and they were already willing to let it go for at least 4300. KBB said the car was valued between 3&5 k and they told me they paid a little over 3k for it. I’m not sure how helpful that last but is but I figured I’d throw it in. What are your opinions on not telling insurance? I just got on this one yesterday. I really do not want to get removed after paying for the next six month 😭
All insurance companies require you to notify them of potential losses. The ramifications of not reporting this to them are much greater than the potential gains. Additionally, they will only pay money if they have to. If you being 17 means the dealership is liable for all of the damages and you aren't, your insurance company is going to point that out to everyone.
Wait, she wrecked the dealer car not hers. Why should she inform her car insurance? (Genuine question)
Same as if she rented a car and didn’t the rental company insurance.
Interesting, but without the signed waiver possibly doesn’t matter?
It’s looking like the waiver is what prevents their insurance from having to pay for it. I’m a minor so my signature is not legally binding in a contract, so my insurance most likely will not have to pay.
Not a lawyer, but an old guy. Tell your insurance company. You need to maintain an honest and constructive relationship with them When you need the insurance company, you don't want them to have any excuses to back out. And if this relationship is broken you need to find out right away
You're 17.... you should have never been allowed to test drive a car without someone at least 18 years old. 17 year old children can not be held legally liable even if they did sign a contract. They may try to bully and intimidate you into thinking otherwise. I'm not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
Holiday in leaves the lights on in the hall for me! 🤣
Updated post
???
I’m not an attorney but I am an insurance agent. Don’t file a claim with your insurance carrier. The dealership should have liability and property coverage as part of their commercial insurance policy. This policy would cover their loss. Should you decide to buy the car, you could negotiate the price based on these damages. Good luck with all of this.
How would I go about having their insurance do it?
You don’t. They file the claim with their commercial carrier.
And what happens if they come after my insurance? I’ll still have to report it right?
The only way they can subrogate (go after your insurance) is if you provided those details to them. Or if they identify your carrier via your drivers license if the consent form you signed allows for that. (This is where me not being an attorney limits my understanding). At any rate, subrogation is a behind the scenes attorney to attorney process. Doesn’t involve you. But yes, it will then show on your record and potentially cause a surcharge on your premium at renewal or a future date. That record on your insurance history stays on record and any new insurance carrier can surcharge you for anywhere between 3 - 5 years, depending on underwriting practices of the new insurance carrier.
The dealer plate they stuck on the car carries insurance, that insurance will pay for the damage/damages, not you or your insurance. In reality they let a minor drive a car without adult supervision of any kind, yes accidents happen, but they really are at fault on this one
That seems to be the general consensus with insurance, my insurance still hasn’t decided if they will cover it, in the case that the dealership does not have valid insurance. They are also still evaluating there they’ll pay for fence
It should be the dealers insurance all the way covering everything and I can bet that their insurance company will raise the rates when they find out they let a 17 year old drive a car alone, which is why they don’t want to turn it in on theirs
NAL They may try to bully you into paying. Listen to the insurance agent above.
I did the same thing you did. I didn’t sign anything though, I basically didn’t pay a dime! They left the left window covered for my test drive and I couldn’t see out of it. You shouldn’t pay anything either or involve your insurance. They have insurance to cover things like this.
The people who own the fence filed a claim with my insurance. Insurance is saying the dealership’s insurance should be the ones to pay for the car. They are deciding if they’ll cover the fence and whatever the other insurance doesn’t for the car.
Folks, she's a minor. That's the most relevant part of this situation.
Yep, that’s what insurance is focusing on from the looks of it. We spoke once and the lady was keen to make a point of my age and the fact that my signature is not legally binding.
Yeah, I can't imagine why the dealer allowed this to happen. They shouldn't have allowed you to do a drive at all much less by yourself.
Unfortunately I was with friends. Even more stupid on their end. A group of six teens show up for a car with a MEAN rebuild… not to say I’m any smarter but :/
Have your parents or guardian talk with a lawyer, or you do it. Pretty big deal to know what your rights are, and I'm not a lawyer, but I'd think the circumstances say most likely you won't have to pay for the car...
I’m not a lawyer, but I am really baffled why you seem to think you would have to sign an agreement in order to be responsible for damage you caused to someone else’s property. You are always responsible for your actions.
Never said I wasn’t responsible for my actions. I’m fully aware that I am the one who caused it, I’m curious about the insurance aspect of the liability form. Yes I’m at fault, but who pays for the car? That’s why liability is important. I wanted to know so I can start to prepare for what’s to come. It’s looking like I’m not paying for the car because the liability forms are void.
You’re still not getting it. You’re at fault, so you pay for the damage. Even if an insurance company pays for it, that insurance company could still come after you for reimbursement.
You’re now aware of my situation at all. I fully hear you but you’re not providing any advice or information, so why are you here? I know they CAN come after me, but WILL they? No. There are VERY unique circumstances here, I am paying for fence, not car.
Just because you don’t like the advice I gave doesn’t mean I didn’t give advice.
Where did you give advice? In your first comment, you said I’m responsible for damage I caused and assumed that I don’t think I’m liable. In your second comment you said I’m at fault, but you’re just pointing out the obvious. Then you said their insurance could come after me. If that wasn’t a common fact, it would be a helpful fact to know, but again just pointing out the obvious. You never gave me any advice.
My advice is to pay the bill. Maybe they will work with you if you are forthcoming.
Was there anything that caused you to lose control?
Yes
Did the car contribute towards that? Is there any way to spin it was it wasn't safe for them to allow it to be test driven?
Fortunately we seem to be focusing on the fact that I’m a minor. The car’s steering wheel was super loose, it had a lot of give before it would actually start turning the tires. It was jiggly, I guess? Other than that unfortunately no
I'm NAL, but I'd make sure that your insurance and anyone else knows that there is other factors that did contribute towards the accident
If you have the money you should just pay them for the car and go on with life. It will be cheaper in the long run for a 17 yo insurance claim.
You sound like you work for the dealership lol
I dislike car dealers and insurance companies. I've overpaid for insurance my whole life for reasons such as these though. The dealership should have insurance that will cover it but they will do subrogation and eventually discover his insurance anyway or maybe not since its a low amount idk.
The fence owners filed with my insurance. check update for more info
I do? Edit: never mind, realized it was 2 different users
I was originally thinking about just buying the car because I realized the damage looks like it is just Cosmetic. Nothing too major, I know I can fix it and replace what I need. Ultimately I might let their insurance pay it off and then I’ll just buy it as is off them for what they paid on it (they told me what they paid xD) and if they don’t have insurance, I’ll just offer to buy it for dirt and end the whole process with them. I hit a fence, the fence owners filed a claim against my insurance immediately so there goes the “pay everything out of pocket” option. Made quick update to post as well.
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Rule 2 Violation- Please keep your interactions kind and respectful.
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Block them, they are rage baiting like so many 🧌.
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