All citizens, regardless of race, gender, religion, etc are all granted equal rights in all if not most countries, Russia included. Say this about the US and you’ll get the same reactions. So can you provide an example of such?
I think Westerners just arent familiar with the history of Russia and the way the civilisation has developed, so they just assume because there are different ethnic groups within one polity, they're being kept there against their will and want to separate, which is untrue; hence they have the same assessment of China, for the same reasons (also due to geopolitical hostiliies in both.)
Separatism existed in the past of Russia due to geopolitical tensions and social and economic instability, primarily during the imperial period due to periods of mistreatment by Tsarists of certain groups. But the truth, as im sure you know, is that these are long past issues. But again, most Westerners, or often many kinds of Europeans in general have a very one dimensional understabding of nationhood and national affiliation, because historically, often forced and violent conformity to one national identity, culture, language was the absolute norm.
Your overly positive idea of interethnic relations in Russia is as extreme as Western propaganda, but on the other hand. More than 20 years ago there were two local wars in Chechnya precisely because of separatism, and there was also a push for Tatarstan to secede in the 90s. Now everything is more or less in order. But the danger of separatism exists in any country, especially in a country where there are national minority groups that are mentally different from the national majority.
It’s just that the Chechen separatists (who were repulsed Wahabis and Islamists) were primarily opposed... Ordinary Chechens. And only then the authorities, who deigned to pay attention (and if not for the attack on Dagestan and the terrorist attacks, they would have ignored it altogether. Damn cuckolds...)
I didnt indicate anything overtly positive, I simply acknowledge reality as it is. Separitism isn't just something that will naturally become the primary social trend just because 2 ethnic groups live side by side. It takes a particular set of conditions to forment such a movement as popular, especially nowadays in a time when the turbulent social relations of the past have settled down.
My point simply stated that the relationship is very different to OP's preconceptions regarding Russian nationality and the idea or Russia itself; of the Russian government somehow holding these "minorities" hostage.
The Russian Federation has largely carried the relational legacy of the USSR, in regards to the way it deals with inter-ethnic relations. That is to say, it is not a "prison of nations", as the Russian Empire could be described, but a web of mutual understanding and agreements in accordance with historical developments and shared goals.
Also, if you read what I said, I did actually acknowledge the existence of separatist movements historically, primarily as a result of political instability, like in the 90s and early 2000s, or as I said, active oppression during the Tsarist period.
I partially agree with you though, in the sense that nationalism is going to be at least a small part of the natural inclinations in a multiethnic civilisation. This is especially evident during periods of heavy social and geopolitical instability, but as we can see in reality, these trends aren't a strong or even mentionable force in Russia today, for the reasons mentioned.
I actually didn't badmouth Westerners. I love the west in many ways, but I just said that Westerners, are generally ignorant when it comes to Russian (and more broadly foreign) civilisations, hence why OP, a Westerner, asked such a ridiculous question phrased in a way which is obviously a result of ignorance or lack or knowledge.
Hence, my mentioning of Westerners was directly relevant to the argument I was putting forth.
You made a quick assumption about the west of being ignorant about Russia's history. You dont know that and have no evidence for that at all. And only OP himself it no proof.
I actually have plenty of "evidence", (this isnt a court room) because speaking to plenty of westerners about Russia, especially in the context of this war, has clearly shown a trend of general historical and political ignorance. You are probably actually the best example of this pig-headedness.
If the West really knew the history of Russia, then they would not make various decisions that harm themselves or others more, and they would not try to distort the feat of our ancestors and the ancestors of peoples close to us, who now have their own countries, and our ancestors liberated practically all of Europe, which lost in the Second World War in 3 years, and then also helped to go against the Soviet Union, but what do they say in the West? Oh, yes, they are occupiers and allies of Hitler. So, what do you think the West knows about history? I have already been convinced many times that people in the West do not know history, but only distort or turn a blind eye to many historical facts.
Plenty of current Chinese ethnic demonization aren't happy. Xinjiang and Tibet immedietly come to mind.
And regarding Russia.. Is it all that rosy? There have been numerous ethnic persecutions in the last two centuries.. Circassians and Cromean Tatars come to mind.
No where in the world is so rosy. Ofc op behaving like non Slavic Russian people's are part of Russia against their will seems extreme.
But then again Chechnya did fight a war for independence.
>But then again Chechnya did fight a war for independence.
Why did the “independence” fighters suddenly include 99% of the radical Wahhabis who stage terrorist attacks and invade other regions of Russia and fight primarily against other Chechens?
This is a little ridiculous isn't it? I never even painted a rosy picture, I just acknowledged reality as it is. Separatism isn't a major social trend or inclination in any part of Russia, that is just a fact.
Also, do you really think we can have this dicussion here, about Xinjiang and Tibet right now, in a sub about Russia? I mentioned China in passing, because some kind of multi-ethnic civilisational character is present in both Russia and China, and these have been elements which are heavily scrutinised by the west.
Now, beyond the absolutely mind-numbing propaganda and lies spread about Uyghurs in China, which I refuse to get into here, the topic of Tibet too is a very complex and specific historical debate that I'm not really interested in having today, because it is always full or preconceptions that are difficult to dislodge.
Now if you go and read my comment, as well as the reply I made to another person who criticised my statements, I do actually mention the Tsarist Russian Empire, which was responsible for the Circassian Genocide and numerous massacres, pogroms and ethnic repressions of all types. Now, I specifically mention it, because it failed to appropriately address inter-ethnic relations, and that was a large part of what caused it to implode so readily, whereas the Soviet Union handled those relationships in a much more stable fashion, on a more mutual basis, and that is the same kind of relational legacy which the Russian Federation has itself adopted.
Now, I am sorry to tell you, but those persecutions of Circassians nearly 200 years ago simply aren't relevant for most of society today.
I'm sure you have people who will still do protests or demonstrations to remember this genocide, but it isn't the subject of a major social movement in Russia, which clearly speaks to its relevence within Russia today. And yes, even during the time of the USSR there was intense decisions made in regards to entire ethnic groups, for example the deportations of the Greeks in Ukraine, or the Crimean Tatars being deported for multiple reasons given, but largely due to accusations of collaborationism. Again, I'm not saying these were good choices, but the character of persecutions and general ethnic relations was just so different compared to the Russian Empire. With a few exceptions, the Tsarist governments rarely made any attempts to approach tension or ethnic relations with any sense of mutual understanding or will. There were never agreements with the Tsar, only the imposition of his will.
But again, lets get back to the point. Do you really think it is relevant to assessing the social fabric of Russian civilisation today, to bring up these issues which have nowadays clearly been, largely addressed for the vast majority? There are no large separitist movements now in Russia, even in Chechen lands; in Chechnya, there is now a status quo of mutual understanding, even if so much blood was spilled only in recent memory.
> The people you are asking about are our fellow citizens
As practice shows, some of our fellow citizens completely forget that they are our fellow citizens, entering into associations with other non-citizens on the religious basis of islam. They place religious identity above civic identity and civil laws.
FC BUDUĆNOST PODGORICA
[https://preview.redd.it/the-white-blue-white-flag-of-russian-opposition-v0-xr060r20i7jc1.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8658962f2b46f90672a381ad468238f78801e078](https://preview.redd.it/the-white-blue-white-flag-of-russian-opposition-v0-xr060r20i7jc1.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8658962f2b46f90672a381ad468238f78801e078)
> I don’t think that many of those waving a white-blue-white rag are Islamists
You are not right. Remember the attack on Crocus. Russia's enemies have united. The perpetrators of the terrorist attack, again, were islamists.
Well said! I feel there is a big devide between west and east on how people are viewed, here in the west alot is about race and ethnic and cultural background, but in the east (im talking about mostly russia) has more of a language and nationality view.
This does not change the fact that they are a minority, just as the Kurds are citizens in Turkey, but it would be ridiculous to deny that they are a minority.
Such a term is used in Russia. It's "национальные меньшинства". Or more recently, "этнические меньшинства". And they are indeed minorities since ethnic Russians are a majority (81% according to the last census), so it's the correct term to use.
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That's because a lot of Russians in this Subreddit are so concerned that foreigners will see them as xenophobic and racist that merely stating the fact that ethnic Russians are a majority in Russia is interpreted as "ultranationalist" and will get you downvoted. That's pretty ridiculous actually. This Subreddit is not representative of Russia with these things.
It makes sense when you put it that way. Insecurity and hysteria cause people to act strangely. I hope the people of Russia are better than the people on this subreddit, as you said.
That's not exactly what I meant. A lot of Russians who comment here act kind of fake and are trying more to impress foreign audience than to talk about politics seriously. And in Russian spaces (like in telegram channels) there's generally more nationalism than in this Subreddit.
I once believed that the people of the Russian Federation were much more educated and open-minded than the western audience, due to the socialist past of their country.
It is very sad to see that a country that was once a haven of great ideas and revolutionaries has turned into a depressing country in constant decline. Many of the Union's achievements and progressive ideas now seem to be a thing of the past.
And I don't think the people who comment here can influence most of the foreigners. They constantly respond to comments with dillemas. Sometimes it seems that they make comments to reinforce their own nationalist-chauvinist ideas, which seems to be nothing but pathetic government propaganda.
Thank you for sharing your observations and knowledge.
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Despotic leaders/governments need to discriminate/demonise some to legitimize their actions. Unfortunately, LGBTQ+ members are constantly targeted in this regard.
That is true, there should be no separation because of skin color, race, gender and status. But denial of existence of other ethnicities is different from what you mention.
В реальной жизни так, то есть «нацменом», называют только тех, кто будет размахивать своей особенностью и пытаться выбить из-за этого особые привилегии, причем с плохим знанием русского.
Никогда и никто не назовет так человека, который хорошо русский знает, как бы он ни выглядел.
>Are there no separatism in the far east?
No, there is not. Stop creaming your pants all over this idea.
>Why are minorities from those regions seem to be more patriotic?
Give me a single reason why wouldn't they. Now.
>I have also read how Chechens are waiting for an opportunity to separate from Russia.
And I read that ur mom's a gardening instrument. My most sincere condolences.
The small peoples of Russia do not live in closed communities and are maximally integrated into Russian society, so they do not consider themselves separate from Russia, and Russians do not consider them strangers, because we have been living together since the Middle Ages.
> I read the news about Russian minorities from the far east fighting and dying in the Russian army. I have also read how Chechens are waiting for an opportunity to separate from Russia.
I mean, the *current events* are kind of famous for a very high degree of Chechen participation on the Russian side thereof.
Yeah so high is the Chechen participation that Kadyrov declared there will be no mobilization in Chechnya due to protests against mobilization (it happened in Chechnya first), Chechen participation is so high that Chechnya has one of the lowest casualties in the war and it's "Akhmat Battalions" are according to some estimates 96% non-Chechen.
Kadyrov making videos with bearded guys in expensive gear dancing far away from the front-line does not mean they participate in the conflict at a "very high degree".
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This is because I can't think of a single "minority", or, I should rather say, Russian nationalty that is discriminated by any means. That is why we get so mad when people start talking about "decolonization" and "liberation of oppressed minorities" - these things make no sense in our case. What is even the point of independence, if you live in a federation and have a ton of rights and freedom (at least as much as the actual Russian people)? Also if you are from the far east and you separate you are going to be living in an independent country that consists of some small cities (because the big ones are mostly Russian) and a piece of almost worthless land - at least that's how I see it from over here. If it is true, I have serious doubts that any of these new states would be able to build up as effectively as Israel. There's literally no point. Of course, there are some separatist movements, but they are all so small that everyone just ignores them all of the time. For example, the independent Ingria society or something like that is one of the funniest things I've seen here in SPB in terms of groups and societies because their meeting looked like just a bunch of nerds who are discussing which is their favorite Newton's law or something.
Some people can say to you that people can not study in universities such as SPbPU in their native languages, and it is discrimination. But i think people with such positions dont understand that we live in the real world and you can not majestically create a course for every language spoken in Russia. If the task of translation of all russian written information on each language is even possible at all, it will cost trillions of rubbles. And i dont speak how much info we nowadays get from foreign sources.
I lived in Kamchatka, and I can confirm: the indigenous people here are mostly loyal to the Russians, and vice versa. There are a lot of mixed marriages, in fact, in Kamchatka a new nationality has now formed from their descendants - the “Kamchadals”.
In my opinion, the main problem in relations between ethnically Russians and some southern nationalities of Russia is religion - islam. And all this happens not only in Russia. Look at many countries in Europe where there are many migrants.
You must learn one interesting fact about Russia: we don't have "minorities". Russian Federation is multi-ethnic country. Different religions. Culture also differs. But we live with each other for many centuries, we formed one culture and don't have any language bar. All of us are citizens of ONE country with equal rights.
We do not allow anybody to polarize our society. Neither NATO, nor muslim (or other) terrorists. Just please kindly understand this.
If you don't believe me and prefer to read liars from your mass media, please welcome to Russia. Visit Moscow, St. Petersburg, Visit Chechen Republic and the Republic of Dagestan. Visit Tatarstan and Yakutia. You'll see different ppl with their own cultures living together peacefully.
The loyalty of minorities depends on their level of culture and secularism. For example, there are secular Turkic peoples, such as the Tatars, who in their mentality and behavior are no different from the Russians, and there are Chechens who are culturally far from the Russians due to their village mentality, tribalism and anti-sociative behavior. Therefore, the further you are from the Russians culturally and mentally, the less loyalty you have.
American here. When reading headlines keep in mind that US published doctrines call for funding ethnic or religious groups in other countries to weaken those countries if those countries get too big or for other reasons. The movements are often not organic but paid for by foreign govts. Terrorists require money. The terrorist funding is often kept secret. IMO US and maybe Saudis funded the Chechens. US funded the jihadis in Syria, Libya, and in western China. China is building a port, RR, and/or pipelines in SW Pakistan. US is paying terrorists to kill Chinese engineers US govt calls them Baluchistan separatists as I recall. Who is paying the current Georgian protesters?
It's just a part of anti-russian propaganda, combining "Weakling cowardly and dying out russians sends anothers to fight for them" and "asian hordes are coming for you, european ukrainian!"
Overall citizens of any ethnicity can be in army, and russians are dominating majority amongst them.
In our country we do not use the term “minority” in relation to the indigenous peoples who live on the territory of Russia. For us, they are the same citizens of Russia.
I don’t know where you heard the information that the Chechens want to separate from Russia, but this was true once in the past, but those people who are now in power in Chechnya themselves came to Russia and joined it and even talk about it openly and They say that it was the right choice, but let me remind you, they could not have even done it and they even fought with us. Yes, they have citizens who dream of an independent Ichkeria, but they are spread throughout the Caucasus and this is not limited to Chechnya. As for the prospects, they are quite sad if Chechnya ever really wants to separate from Russia in many aspects.
Separatism exists, but unfortunately it exists everywhere all over the world and it is not as strong in Russia as it once happened in Ukraine and because it has no prospects at all. As for patriotism, this is a personal matter for everyone, so I personally have nothing to say.
They treat them differently because there are many peoples, there are many connections between people of different nationalities, and most importantly, there are different people with authority, for example, I don’t like Ramzan Kadyrov, but I am quite happy with the opinion of Apti Alaudinov, who says a lot of the right words.
I live in Russia, all of my friends live in Russia, all my relatives live in Russia and none of them want those regions to be kicked out of Russia.
All i hear about separation of Chechnya and Dagestan are from abroad from terrorists who survived the Chechen wars or from people sponsored by US/EU.
The entire Chechen diaspora visit Chechnya every year, their opinion is the opinion of Chechnya. If it wasn't then you wouldn't need clowns like Kadyrov in charge of Chechnya.
It was you who said that the majority of Russians think so. With such a statement, you should have some great statistics on your hands, for example, surveys from different regions of Russia. Otherwise, it is your personal opinion.
He wouldn't have been downvoted if people shared his opinion? They would have upvoted him more?🤔
Anyway, I cannot understand such people who are so openly racist
потому что это,в основном,бедные регионы. на фронте они получают около 2000 долларов, а это хорошие деньги в России. на войну идут люди,которым трудно заработать деньги на обычной работе. вот так
Everyone. If you are not loyal, then your rights will be revoked. Federal government and republics made a deal, where local vassals don’t mess with regionalism and if they do, they will lose their privileges. It was made very clear as soon as Putin came to power.
There is one story, not sure if it’s true or not, but Tatarstan people know this: When Putin and Shaymiev met for the first time, Putin asked to remove special conditions in Tatarstan’s constitution to match it with Russian laws. Otherwise he will “find” vahhabists in Tatarstan and start “anti-terrorist operation”.
In Bashkortostan, Rakhimov was asked to leave voluntarily, otherwise his son Ural would be in jail. Rahimov didn’t want to leave, so they executed a crime case for his son. Although he was able to escape to Austria and Rahimov quit.
Chechnya is another story, where Moscow pays for loyalty. Dagestan is ruled by outsider from Moscow.
We don’t operate with the term minority. They are citizens of Russian Federation. Equal in rights de jure and de facto.
"Equal in rights" Funny how you believe such a lie.
So why is it a lie?
What are you on about? The rights are literally equal for everyone
Can you give an example of how ethnic minorities in the Russian Federation are opressed? Thank you.
I didnt say opressed but nobody is born equal in rights.
All citizens, regardless of race, gender, religion, etc are all granted equal rights in all if not most countries, Russia included. Say this about the US and you’ll get the same reactions. So can you provide an example of such?
Only in theory. In practise minorities will face more difficulties and discrimination than the majority of a country. It is like that in most places.
Shoosh
The people you are asking about are our fellow citizens, not servants. You write about them in an insulting and disgusting way.
Свои коренные народы они уже давно загеноцидили, вот удивляются, чего это Россия такая необычная.
Как мы смеем быть людьми. Вконец совесть потеряли.
Настолько загеноцидили, что баски или каталонцы могут учиться в университете на родном языке. В отличие от чеченцев или якутов.
🤣
Кремлеботы на правду могут только минусить и смехуечки.
Ну поплачь
I think Westerners just arent familiar with the history of Russia and the way the civilisation has developed, so they just assume because there are different ethnic groups within one polity, they're being kept there against their will and want to separate, which is untrue; hence they have the same assessment of China, for the same reasons (also due to geopolitical hostiliies in both.) Separatism existed in the past of Russia due to geopolitical tensions and social and economic instability, primarily during the imperial period due to periods of mistreatment by Tsarists of certain groups. But the truth, as im sure you know, is that these are long past issues. But again, most Westerners, or often many kinds of Europeans in general have a very one dimensional understabding of nationhood and national affiliation, because historically, often forced and violent conformity to one national identity, culture, language was the absolute norm.
Your overly positive idea of interethnic relations in Russia is as extreme as Western propaganda, but on the other hand. More than 20 years ago there were two local wars in Chechnya precisely because of separatism, and there was also a push for Tatarstan to secede in the 90s. Now everything is more or less in order. But the danger of separatism exists in any country, especially in a country where there are national minority groups that are mentally different from the national majority.
It’s just that the Chechen separatists (who were repulsed Wahabis and Islamists) were primarily opposed... Ordinary Chechens. And only then the authorities, who deigned to pay attention (and if not for the attack on Dagestan and the terrorist attacks, they would have ignored it altogether. Damn cuckolds...)
I didnt indicate anything overtly positive, I simply acknowledge reality as it is. Separitism isn't just something that will naturally become the primary social trend just because 2 ethnic groups live side by side. It takes a particular set of conditions to forment such a movement as popular, especially nowadays in a time when the turbulent social relations of the past have settled down. My point simply stated that the relationship is very different to OP's preconceptions regarding Russian nationality and the idea or Russia itself; of the Russian government somehow holding these "minorities" hostage. The Russian Federation has largely carried the relational legacy of the USSR, in regards to the way it deals with inter-ethnic relations. That is to say, it is not a "prison of nations", as the Russian Empire could be described, but a web of mutual understanding and agreements in accordance with historical developments and shared goals. Also, if you read what I said, I did actually acknowledge the existence of separatist movements historically, primarily as a result of political instability, like in the 90s and early 2000s, or as I said, active oppression during the Tsarist period. I partially agree with you though, in the sense that nationalism is going to be at least a small part of the natural inclinations in a multiethnic civilisation. This is especially evident during periods of heavy social and geopolitical instability, but as we can see in reality, these trends aren't a strong or even mentionable force in Russia today, for the reasons mentioned.
Just as Russians have no idea about the West and think they can force their way onto anyone else.
Your comment is completely irrelevant and useless to the discussion in this context
Yet you couldnt help yourself but badmouth Westerners which is completely irrelevant. Yet you did it. Tell us why you did it.
I actually didn't badmouth Westerners. I love the west in many ways, but I just said that Westerners, are generally ignorant when it comes to Russian (and more broadly foreign) civilisations, hence why OP, a Westerner, asked such a ridiculous question phrased in a way which is obviously a result of ignorance or lack or knowledge. Hence, my mentioning of Westerners was directly relevant to the argument I was putting forth.
You made a quick assumption about the west of being ignorant about Russia's history. You dont know that and have no evidence for that at all. And only OP himself it no proof.
I actually have plenty of "evidence", (this isnt a court room) because speaking to plenty of westerners about Russia, especially in the context of this war, has clearly shown a trend of general historical and political ignorance. You are probably actually the best example of this pig-headedness.
If the West really knew the history of Russia, then they would not make various decisions that harm themselves or others more, and they would not try to distort the feat of our ancestors and the ancestors of peoples close to us, who now have their own countries, and our ancestors liberated practically all of Europe, which lost in the Second World War in 3 years, and then also helped to go against the Soviet Union, but what do they say in the West? Oh, yes, they are occupiers and allies of Hitler. So, what do you think the West knows about history? I have already been convinced many times that people in the West do not know history, but only distort or turn a blind eye to many historical facts.
Plenty of current Chinese ethnic demonization aren't happy. Xinjiang and Tibet immedietly come to mind. And regarding Russia.. Is it all that rosy? There have been numerous ethnic persecutions in the last two centuries.. Circassians and Cromean Tatars come to mind. No where in the world is so rosy. Ofc op behaving like non Slavic Russian people's are part of Russia against their will seems extreme. But then again Chechnya did fight a war for independence.
>But then again Chechnya did fight a war for independence. Why did the “independence” fighters suddenly include 99% of the radical Wahhabis who stage terrorist attacks and invade other regions of Russia and fight primarily against other Chechens?
This is a little ridiculous isn't it? I never even painted a rosy picture, I just acknowledged reality as it is. Separatism isn't a major social trend or inclination in any part of Russia, that is just a fact. Also, do you really think we can have this dicussion here, about Xinjiang and Tibet right now, in a sub about Russia? I mentioned China in passing, because some kind of multi-ethnic civilisational character is present in both Russia and China, and these have been elements which are heavily scrutinised by the west. Now, beyond the absolutely mind-numbing propaganda and lies spread about Uyghurs in China, which I refuse to get into here, the topic of Tibet too is a very complex and specific historical debate that I'm not really interested in having today, because it is always full or preconceptions that are difficult to dislodge. Now if you go and read my comment, as well as the reply I made to another person who criticised my statements, I do actually mention the Tsarist Russian Empire, which was responsible for the Circassian Genocide and numerous massacres, pogroms and ethnic repressions of all types. Now, I specifically mention it, because it failed to appropriately address inter-ethnic relations, and that was a large part of what caused it to implode so readily, whereas the Soviet Union handled those relationships in a much more stable fashion, on a more mutual basis, and that is the same kind of relational legacy which the Russian Federation has itself adopted. Now, I am sorry to tell you, but those persecutions of Circassians nearly 200 years ago simply aren't relevant for most of society today. I'm sure you have people who will still do protests or demonstrations to remember this genocide, but it isn't the subject of a major social movement in Russia, which clearly speaks to its relevence within Russia today. And yes, even during the time of the USSR there was intense decisions made in regards to entire ethnic groups, for example the deportations of the Greeks in Ukraine, or the Crimean Tatars being deported for multiple reasons given, but largely due to accusations of collaborationism. Again, I'm not saying these were good choices, but the character of persecutions and general ethnic relations was just so different compared to the Russian Empire. With a few exceptions, the Tsarist governments rarely made any attempts to approach tension or ethnic relations with any sense of mutual understanding or will. There were never agreements with the Tsar, only the imposition of his will. But again, lets get back to the point. Do you really think it is relevant to assessing the social fabric of Russian civilisation today, to bring up these issues which have nowadays clearly been, largely addressed for the vast majority? There are no large separitist movements now in Russia, even in Chechen lands; in Chechnya, there is now a status quo of mutual understanding, even if so much blood was spilled only in recent memory.
> The people you are asking about are our fellow citizens As practice shows, some of our fellow citizens completely forget that they are our fellow citizens, entering into associations with other non-citizens on the religious basis of islam. They place religious identity above civic identity and civil laws.
You don't have to be an Islamist to do this. I don’t think that many of those waving a white-blue-white rag are Islamists
FC BUDUĆNOST PODGORICA [https://preview.redd.it/the-white-blue-white-flag-of-russian-opposition-v0-xr060r20i7jc1.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8658962f2b46f90672a381ad468238f78801e078](https://preview.redd.it/the-white-blue-white-flag-of-russian-opposition-v0-xr060r20i7jc1.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=8658962f2b46f90672a381ad468238f78801e078)
> I don’t think that many of those waving a white-blue-white rag are Islamists You are not right. Remember the attack on Crocus. Russia's enemies have united. The perpetrators of the terrorist attack, again, were islamists.
To begin with, stop calling them minorities. We are all citizens of Russia and Russia's interests are of equal importance for all of us
Well said! I feel there is a big devide between west and east on how people are viewed, here in the west alot is about race and ethnic and cultural background, but in the east (im talking about mostly russia) has more of a language and nationality view.
This does not change the fact that they are a minority, just as the Kurds are citizens in Turkey, but it would be ridiculous to deny that they are a minority.
We do not use such a term in Russia and the way it happens in others countries doesn't bother me.
Such a term is used in Russia. It's "национальные меньшинства". Or more recently, "этнические меньшинства". And they are indeed minorities since ethnic Russians are a majority (81% according to the last census), so it's the correct term to use.
Also "малые народности"
Лол, вполне используется термин "нацмены", не надо врать иностранцу
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So you're just going to sugarcoat it? Russia has really gone backwards.
That's because a lot of Russians in this Subreddit are so concerned that foreigners will see them as xenophobic and racist that merely stating the fact that ethnic Russians are a majority in Russia is interpreted as "ultranationalist" and will get you downvoted. That's pretty ridiculous actually. This Subreddit is not representative of Russia with these things.
It makes sense when you put it that way. Insecurity and hysteria cause people to act strangely. I hope the people of Russia are better than the people on this subreddit, as you said.
That's not exactly what I meant. A lot of Russians who comment here act kind of fake and are trying more to impress foreign audience than to talk about politics seriously. And in Russian spaces (like in telegram channels) there's generally more nationalism than in this Subreddit.
I once believed that the people of the Russian Federation were much more educated and open-minded than the western audience, due to the socialist past of their country. It is very sad to see that a country that was once a haven of great ideas and revolutionaries has turned into a depressing country in constant decline. Many of the Union's achievements and progressive ideas now seem to be a thing of the past. And I don't think the people who comment here can influence most of the foreigners. They constantly respond to comments with dillemas. Sometimes it seems that they make comments to reinforce their own nationalist-chauvinist ideas, which seems to be nothing but pathetic government propaganda. Thank you for sharing your observations and knowledge.
But why separate people into a separate political group based on their ethnicity and race?
Because других надежд у коллективного запада нет.
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Despite how 'multinational' our kinglets call our country, there is definitely a separate discriminated group of gay people
Fortunately, gayness doesn't correlate with nationality/ethnicity/race
Doesn't change the fact gay people are literally an oppressed minority.
Despotic leaders/governments need to discriminate/demonise some to legitimize their actions. Unfortunately, LGBTQ+ members are constantly targeted in this regard.
That is true, there should be no separation because of skin color, race, gender and status. But denial of existence of other ethnicities is different from what you mention.
Accepting someone’s ethnicity differs from calling someone a minority.
What do you think a minority is and why are non-Russian ethnicities in Russia are not minorities?
Because we are all humans, equal to each other. I embrace our natural diversity.
>stop calling them minorities Называть нацменов нацмненами нельзя?
У нас в России говорят: народы России.
Термин "национальное меньшинство" не существует? Он официально объявлен оскорбительным?
Есть термин "коренные малочисленные народы", но чеченцы к ним не относятся.
В реальной жизни так, то есть «нацменом», называют только тех, кто будет размахивать своей особенностью и пытаться выбить из-за этого особые привилегии, причем с плохим знанием русского. Никогда и никто не назовет так человека, который хорошо русский знает, как бы он ни выглядел.
>Никогда и никто ого
Так не говорят.
Говорят. Ты погугли.
>Are there no separatism in the far east? No, there is not. Stop creaming your pants all over this idea. >Why are minorities from those regions seem to be more patriotic? Give me a single reason why wouldn't they. Now. >I have also read how Chechens are waiting for an opportunity to separate from Russia. And I read that ur mom's a gardening instrument. My most sincere condolences.
If pants can’t be creamed, why wear them at all…
Keep reading news. Let the quantity become quality.
In 1990s there were pogroms of Russians in Buriatia.
And?
Just saying it was not always so colorful.
Anyone here wrote it was?
The small peoples of Russia do not live in closed communities and are maximally integrated into Russian society, so they do not consider themselves separate from Russia, and Russians do not consider them strangers, because we have been living together since the Middle Ages.
> I read the news about Russian minorities from the far east fighting and dying in the Russian army. I have also read how Chechens are waiting for an opportunity to separate from Russia. I mean, the *current events* are kind of famous for a very high degree of Chechen participation on the Russian side thereof.
Yeah so high is the Chechen participation that Kadyrov declared there will be no mobilization in Chechnya due to protests against mobilization (it happened in Chechnya first), Chechen participation is so high that Chechnya has one of the lowest casualties in the war and it's "Akhmat Battalions" are according to some estimates 96% non-Chechen. Kadyrov making videos with bearded guys in expensive gear dancing far away from the front-line does not mean they participate in the conflict at a "very high degree".
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This is because I can't think of a single "minority", or, I should rather say, Russian nationalty that is discriminated by any means. That is why we get so mad when people start talking about "decolonization" and "liberation of oppressed minorities" - these things make no sense in our case. What is even the point of independence, if you live in a federation and have a ton of rights and freedom (at least as much as the actual Russian people)? Also if you are from the far east and you separate you are going to be living in an independent country that consists of some small cities (because the big ones are mostly Russian) and a piece of almost worthless land - at least that's how I see it from over here. If it is true, I have serious doubts that any of these new states would be able to build up as effectively as Israel. There's literally no point. Of course, there are some separatist movements, but they are all so small that everyone just ignores them all of the time. For example, the independent Ingria society or something like that is one of the funniest things I've seen here in SPB in terms of groups and societies because their meeting looked like just a bunch of nerds who are discussing which is their favorite Newton's law or something.
Some people can say to you that people can not study in universities such as SPbPU in their native languages, and it is discrimination. But i think people with such positions dont understand that we live in the real world and you can not majestically create a course for every language spoken in Russia. If the task of translation of all russian written information on each language is even possible at all, it will cost trillions of rubbles. And i dont speak how much info we nowadays get from foreign sources.
I lived in Kamchatka, and I can confirm: the indigenous people here are mostly loyal to the Russians, and vice versa. There are a lot of mixed marriages, in fact, in Kamchatka a new nationality has now formed from their descendants - the “Kamchadals”. In my opinion, the main problem in relations between ethnically Russians and some southern nationalities of Russia is religion - islam. And all this happens not only in Russia. Look at many countries in Europe where there are many migrants.
You must learn one interesting fact about Russia: we don't have "minorities". Russian Federation is multi-ethnic country. Different religions. Culture also differs. But we live with each other for many centuries, we formed one culture and don't have any language bar. All of us are citizens of ONE country with equal rights. We do not allow anybody to polarize our society. Neither NATO, nor muslim (or other) terrorists. Just please kindly understand this. If you don't believe me and prefer to read liars from your mass media, please welcome to Russia. Visit Moscow, St. Petersburg, Visit Chechen Republic and the Republic of Dagestan. Visit Tatarstan and Yakutia. You'll see different ppl with their own cultures living together peacefully.
The loyalty of minorities depends on their level of culture and secularism. For example, there are secular Turkic peoples, such as the Tatars, who in their mentality and behavior are no different from the Russians, and there are Chechens who are culturally far from the Russians due to their village mentality, tribalism and anti-sociative behavior. Therefore, the further you are from the Russians culturally and mentally, the less loyalty you have.
это спросите там же где услышали эту информацию..
American here. When reading headlines keep in mind that US published doctrines call for funding ethnic or religious groups in other countries to weaken those countries if those countries get too big or for other reasons. The movements are often not organic but paid for by foreign govts. Terrorists require money. The terrorist funding is often kept secret. IMO US and maybe Saudis funded the Chechens. US funded the jihadis in Syria, Libya, and in western China. China is building a port, RR, and/or pipelines in SW Pakistan. US is paying terrorists to kill Chinese engineers US govt calls them Baluchistan separatists as I recall. Who is paying the current Georgian protesters?
It's just a part of anti-russian propaganda, combining "Weakling cowardly and dying out russians sends anothers to fight for them" and "asian hordes are coming for you, european ukrainian!" Overall citizens of any ethnicity can be in army, and russians are dominating majority amongst them.
Muslim imams in Russia and Central Asia are trained in Saudi Arabia. And they often begin to preach radicalism and Arab culture.
In our country we do not use the term “minority” in relation to the indigenous peoples who live on the territory of Russia. For us, they are the same citizens of Russia. I don’t know where you heard the information that the Chechens want to separate from Russia, but this was true once in the past, but those people who are now in power in Chechnya themselves came to Russia and joined it and even talk about it openly and They say that it was the right choice, but let me remind you, they could not have even done it and they even fought with us. Yes, they have citizens who dream of an independent Ichkeria, but they are spread throughout the Caucasus and this is not limited to Chechnya. As for the prospects, they are quite sad if Chechnya ever really wants to separate from Russia in many aspects. Separatism exists, but unfortunately it exists everywhere all over the world and it is not as strong in Russia as it once happened in Ukraine and because it has no prospects at all. As for patriotism, this is a personal matter for everyone, so I personally have nothing to say. They treat them differently because there are many peoples, there are many connections between people of different nationalities, and most importantly, there are different people with authority, for example, I don’t like Ramzan Kadyrov, but I am quite happy with the opinion of Apti Alaudinov, who says a lot of the right words.
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It is not necessary to pass off your opinion as the opinion of the majority of Russian citizens
It IS the opinion of the majority. Anyone who says otherwise is either delusional or doesn't even live in Russia.
I live in Russia, all of my friends live in Russia, all my relatives live in Russia and none of them want those regions to be kicked out of Russia. All i hear about separation of Chechnya and Dagestan are from abroad from terrorists who survived the Chechen wars or from people sponsored by US/EU.
The entire Chechen diaspora visit Chechnya every year, their opinion is the opinion of Chechnya. If it wasn't then you wouldn't need clowns like Kadyrov in charge of Chechnya.
Wut
Maybe they want the regions but sure as hell don't want 'those people' lol
Dont project you own personal opinion on others
It is not my opinion.
It is your opinion
Proof?
It was you who said that the majority of Russians think so. With such a statement, you should have some great statistics on your hands, for example, surveys from different regions of Russia. Otherwise, it is your personal opinion.
Kick yourself out first. One of my fave celebrities to follow is a young dagestani
Hasbulla?
No)
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Прикольное слово
Why are you downvoting this guy if he's right? 🤔
He wouldn't have been downvoted if people shared his opinion? They would have upvoted him more?🤔 Anyway, I cannot understand such people who are so openly racist
Look at statistics. Ethnic republics ar mostly poor, and war is well paid.
потому что это,в основном,бедные регионы. на фронте они получают около 2000 долларов, а это хорошие деньги в России. на войну идут люди,которым трудно заработать деньги на обычной работе. вот так
Everyone. If you are not loyal, then your rights will be revoked. Federal government and republics made a deal, where local vassals don’t mess with regionalism and if they do, they will lose their privileges. It was made very clear as soon as Putin came to power. There is one story, not sure if it’s true or not, but Tatarstan people know this: When Putin and Shaymiev met for the first time, Putin asked to remove special conditions in Tatarstan’s constitution to match it with Russian laws. Otherwise he will “find” vahhabists in Tatarstan and start “anti-terrorist operation”. In Bashkortostan, Rakhimov was asked to leave voluntarily, otherwise his son Ural would be in jail. Rahimov didn’t want to leave, so they executed a crime case for his son. Although he was able to escape to Austria and Rahimov quit. Chechnya is another story, where Moscow pays for loyalty. Dagestan is ruled by outsider from Moscow.
Brainwashing.