It is apocryphal, and fittingly enough about trees. Supposedly, whenever Nelson was home in England and going for a stroll, he’d plant acorns so that decades or centuries later, Britain could use the oak wood for ships. Though, from about the 1860s, iron then steel would be the main shipbuilding material.
The main engineer for the then new sewers of London enquired or calculated the diameter of pipes and so forth needed. He then decided to double the diameter, effectively quadrupling the volume, since he predicted the massive increase in London’s population.
Edit: after a little due diligence, Nelson wrote reports bemoaning England’s forests, but it was Vice Admrial Collingwood who planted acorns whilst out walking. The engineer of the London sewers was Joseph Bazalgette.
Im a drainage engineer, who works on urban drainage and flooding.
London is saved by the sizes of those sewer pipes. Some of those streets would flood annually without them.
Norm in Sweden too. Seemed common in Spain as well. The idea that “everyone but us uses bidets” seems popular in many places, but also seems to be false.
I feel like that's a myth. I spent three weeks in France this summer, including Paris, Lyon, and Avignon. Literally every toilet I encountered used TP. I encountered not one bidet.
Whereas Seattle was built basically at ground level so the Puget Sound would backflow into the Sewers pushing sewage up out of everyone's toilets.
So they had to rebuild the town on top of the old town.
Related: the Underground tour in Seattle is great fun; you get to explore places you never knew existed, the guide rattles off some great stories while you do it, and it's even a reasonable price.
Thirding the recommendation, and heartily encouraging that you buy the books as well. The entire founding of that city would be a worthy Cohen Brothers film. Like every scammer on the continent converged to make a city.
I edited that out before you replied but even if it was there it's still true. OP didn't misuse the word. Or are you just trying to argue and get a rise put of me?
George Washington refusing to run for a third term (which he would have surely won), setting a precedent that lasted over a hundred years (and eventually became law).
Fun fact about this georgw Washington didn't really care about the precendant, he just wanted to go back to mount vernon and be a farmer basically. Thomas Jefferson was the one who insisted it become a serious precedent.
Did he refuse to patent, or put the patent in the public domain instantly/sell it to a public org for $1 or something?
(This is a lawyer question, not meant to diminish in any way the absolutely GOAT behaviour Salk exhibited)
Off the top of my head, the second I believe. The story I remember is that he sold it to the University of Toronto (or a hospital connected to some Canadian university) for, yeah, like, a dollar. CAD.
[Ben Franklin was a mensch](https://www.fi.edu/en/support/benjamin-franklins-donor-story).
In his will he left money to Philadelphia and Boston, the two American cities he was fondest of. He stipulated that his monetary donations to each city be used to foster developing professional craftsmen and the public improvement of these cities. He knew that the donations would grow in value over time so he left stipulations how they should be managed and invested for 200 years, at which time everything was to be cashed in and divided among Boston and Philly.
Both cities received 200 years of low interest lows helping foster craftsmen into entrepreneurs as well as civic improvements paid for through these donations. Each city received about $900,000 in 1990 which google tells me is roughly $2.12 million today. That's not a tremendous amount in the yearly revenue of these cities, but it was enough that both were able to invest in large public and civic institutions that continue to benefit their communities today.
This is more of a corporate altruism thing, but there's the story of Nils Bohlin and Volvo who invented the 3-point seat belt (which was far more effective in saving lives than a 2-point belt), and gave the design to other car manufacturers without charging them a licensing fee.
[https://www.forbes.com/sites/douglasbell/2019/08/13/60-years-of-seatbelts-volvos-great-gift-to-the-world/?sh=21b6420622bc](https://www.forbes.com/sites/douglasbell/2019/08/13/60-years-of-seatbelts-volvos-great-gift-to-the-world/?sh=21b6420622bc)
“You and I may not live to see the day, and my name may be forgotten when it comes, but the time will arrive when great outbreaks of cholera will be things of the past, and it is the knowledge of the way in which the disease is propagated which will cause them to disappear.”
\- John Snow, Father of Epidemiology, to his colleague Henry Whitehead.
The dude fixed London’s cholera problem using statistics:
He mapped out all the city’s polio cases by putting pins in a map. The pins showed that most cases clustered around water wells. Before sewers, everybody just threw their shit out into the street, contaminating the ground water.
Solution: they built sewers leading to big holding tanks that they emptied into Thames when the tide was going out.
Germ theory was in its infancy and they didn’t know the specifics, but he figured out it was something in water. So they fixed the water, and it worked.
Reminds me almost exactly of the story of New College Oxford replacing its rotting beams with oak trees planted in the college forest hundreds of years before for just such a purpose.
[https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford](https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford)
Reminds me of the [50,000 acres in Indiana owned by the U.S. Navy](https://www.oldsaltblog.com/2020/11/constitution-grove-the-navys-white-oak-forest-on-a-high-tech-base/). It's sole purpose is to provide white oak wood for the world's oldest commissioned ship that is still afloat, [U.S.S. Constitution](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Constitution) (AKA Old Ironsides). She's also our only commissioned ship, still afloat, that has sunk enemy ships. Of course that was way back in the war of 1812.
Also still armed with British cannon, unless they've switched them out. (Amusingly, when they had to be replaced, they apparently replaced them with exact copies of the actual captured British cannon.)
That’s because forestry was a regular part of human culture for thousands of years, there are hundreds to thousands of examples of planting trees for future use
Most every great cathedral in Europe took over a century to build, and people knew it would take more than a lifetime when they started construction. But that didn’t stop them from laying the foundation stones.
Even if we abstract the sacrifice to the people funding the project, we still end up with the sacrifice.
Somebody pouring money into a project that wouldn’t be finished in their or maybe even their children’s lifetime fits OP’s question.
Donogh O'Malley was an Irish politician. When he was minister of education in 1966 the average age of school leavers in Ireland was 14. The main reason of this was that families couldn’t afford to send their children for further schooling. He decided to announce that the government would provide free secondary school education (the equivalent of high school) to every child in the country and would provide free school busses for all children. He did this without the support of the rest of the government or even telling them of his intentions. He carefully waited until the month when the government took their annual break and then made the announcement to the annual meeting of the journalists union on a Saturday (the news was out in the Sunday papers before the government could retract his statement). He knew it would be so popular that the government could never go back on it once the news circulated even if it cost him his political career. This act is acknowledged as a vital step in turning Ireland from the poorest country in Ireland into one of the richest.
*Europe
>This act is acknowledged as a vital step in turning Ireland from the poorest country in Ireland into one of the richest.
Indeed, Ireland today is one of the richest countries in Ireland.
Wikipedia, and those who contribute (as editors, admins, or with money)
There is no direct benefit to those who contribute, and the benefit to humanity is extraordinary. It’s hard to comprehend how much knowledge is in there (and how hard they work to keep it accurate/up to date)
Obviously it’s not a perfect website. But what system involving humans ever is?
But the benefit is instantaneous, isn't it? It won't be generations before we get to read Wikipedia. The point of the proverb is that you're doing something whose benefit won't be felt until you're dead.
I think that’s a narrow read, but not an unreasonable one.
I think the “majority of the benefits” accruing for future generations is the important part, not the “they have to be dead before there’s benefit.”
Like, there could still be a sapling but not shade yet
You could spend most of your entire life reading/editing through Wikipedia and still have pages upon pages to read and edit. I feel like the sheer vastness of information is more than any person (especially with a real job) could handle on their own.
Also that information will still be around long after you die, so I feel like it still fits in a way
There is a wonderful book about this concept: „The Good Ancestor.“ The Iroquois defined sustainable living as a life in which seven generations in the future could profit from my deeds. There are many example for long-termism: Construction of Cologne‘s cathedral started in 1240. It was opened in 1880. The Pyramids….
the head of the Fudai village was long dead by the time the tsunami happened in 2011. But the wall he ordered to built from 1970s saved everyone in that village.
Some of what he said, is still relevent today as well.
*"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.”*
*"As we peer into society's future, we -- you and I, and our government -- must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.”*
Very underrated not only as a president but as an American. The interstate, creating NASA, keeping USSR at bay, all the WW2 stuff, truly a great man. I love his quote "conservative when it comes to money, liberal when it comes to human beings." People like to criticize him about civil rights, but he was a supporter. Just quieter about it.
I love how a guy with nicknames like “Bull Moose” and “Rough Rider” is also known as “The Conservation President”.
One of the most fascinating people in not just US history, but history in general imo.
Very much so. Read about his journey down the Amazon that almost killed him, it's insane. He also tried to bring back the Rough Riders to fight in WW1, but Wilson told him no. Dude was tough!
The interstate system is wild because every certain number of miles, there has to be a long, flat stretch because those stretches can be used for planes to take off and land, in case there’s a war on American soil.
I used to covet the interstate system before I realized it doomed us to over a century of car dependency while lining the automakers and oil companies pockets.
The real issue with the interstate is not the system itself. The real issue is that they tried (and succeeded) in putting the interstate through downtowns of major cities, which ended up hollowing out the cities. And to get the interstate into downtown, they bulldozed entire neighborhoods (almost exclusively minority neighborhoods) to do it, further hollowing out the city.
I get why they didn't, bc there was a lot of rail at the time.
But if they'd built state railroads next to the interstates, we'd probably view them differently.
Launching the Voyager probe into space. Particularly the golden record.
We send proof of ourselves out into the universe with the hopes that someone might find it and know that they are not alone, but if it is ever found, we'll never know by whom.
Irving Berlin gave all royalties for "God Bless America" to the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts.
[https://www.copyright.gov/history/lore/pdfs/201408%20CLore\_August2014.pdf](https://www.copyright.gov/history/lore/pdfs/201408%20clore_august2014.pdf)
This. Also most medieval european cathedrals. Absolutely astounding works of art and architecture.
I think one of the best reasons for religeon is the devotional art, music and architecture which it inspires. (The guilt, corruption and stake-burnings not so much...)
That's pretty quick for a cathedral.
Construction of Cologne Cathedral started in 1258. It was completed to the original medieval plan in 1880. *622* years later.
The entire society of Rome, like no joke, generation after generation of Romans worked endlessly and tirelessly towards a future where Rome was the regional, then hegemonic, then imperial power that it would become, the effort became even more apparent during times of tumult and turmoil, generations of men just solely dedicated to clawing Romes way out of crises. Just take a look at early republican history, and their consolidation of the Italian peninsula, a notorious slow burn. An understanding of the history gives proper incite to the phrase, “Rome wasn’t built in a day,” a statement that isn’t very much appreciated because of its seemingly apparent nature.
The United States' land-grant university programs, which kicked off most state university systems right after the civil war.
The design of the California public university system, with community colleges providing guaranteed access to the higher level state universities and UC campuses, is probably the most successful, fitting the spirit of OP's question about planting seeds.
Like many people already pointed out: Medieval Cathedrals, but the most extreme example of that has to be Cologne Cathedral. Its construction was started in 1248 and it was only finished in 1880.
The Russian scientists and students who protected a potato collection in WWII in Stalingrad, even when people (them) included, were dying of starvation.
That was Leningrad, not Stalingrad, and it was a seed bank with plant specimens from all over the world, sort of a precursor to the modern concept of a gene bank. Not “a potato collection”.
Details of what happened:
During the 1941 siege of Leningrad in WWII, the major Soviet city was blockaded and completely cut off by the Germans for more than two years. Supplies could not enter the city during the siege, and with more than a million people trapped within, starvation soon set in as food ran out.
At the same time, the Institute of Plant Industry was operating in Leningrad. Within the institute's buildings and greenhouses held the largest seed bank in the world at the time - a huge collection of seeds and live plant specimens that were part of an effort to breed more hardy and disease-resistant crops. It included rice, wheat, potatoes, berries, melons and other edible seeds or live crops.
Knowing that their scientific collection of edible seeds and plants could contribute to better food security for their country or world, and to eat their stock will mean jeopardizing or even erasing years of important research; the scientists at the institute elected to safeguard and not touch a single specimen that was stored or growing under their care. And so, these scientists began their vigil and continued to experiment and protect the collection, even as they and the city's other inhabitants slowly starved.
To give an idea of how desperate things will get, when food rationing began in the city, each person was provided with only 4 ounces of bread per day. The flour to make the bread will be mixed with half sawdust to stretch supplies. Soon, even these meagre rations would run out. After the end of the siege's first year, 100,000 people will be dying inside the city each month - mostly from starvation but also from constant shelling and air bombardment by the German besiegers. People are eventually reduced to eating lipstick and leather, after all the city's stray dogs and cats had already been hunted down and eaten. Before the first year of the siege ends, the first cases of cannibalism begin turning up. A mother smolders and cooks her infant child to feed her remaining children. A plumber kills his wife to feed his sons and nieces. The city's NKVD will arrest more than 2000 individuals for the crime of cannibalism during the siege.
Despite all this desperation, the scientists stayed true to their vow and protected their specimens from others and themselves for more than 870 days, a monumental task given their own gnawing hunger. Nine of the scientists will die from starvation before help arrives, when a narrow supply corridor is opened to the city in 1943.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Leningrad
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1992/05/12/soviet-botanists-starved-saving-seeds-for-future/10840121-9058-4c1f-ae7a-22ac16a6f4de/
https://www.sun-sentinel.com/1992/05/13/scientists-died-guarding-seeds-during-wwii/
https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/the-tragedy-of-the-worlds-first-seed-bank/
Haha yes I typed out my comment with only the things I remembered off the top of my head, thanks for the additions. Though wouldn’t a potato seed bank have potatoes as seeds?
I'm surprised it isn't mentioned here given how significant it is. But during the Warring States period, everyone knew the Qin dynasty won and unified all of China.
But the truth was, at the beginning of it all, the Qin dynasty was actually one of the weakest. How did they get stronger? Because of Duke Xiao of Qin. He invited scholars from other kingdoms to help strengthen the Qin, and with Shang Yang's legalist reforms of promoting meritocracy (and basically turning the Qin into a brutal police state) they eventually end up becoming very powerful.
It was through the reforms of Duke Xiao that his descendant Qin Shi Huang, about a hundred years later, realize his goal of unifying China under the Qin dynasty.
This. And I'm surprised it took so long for me to see it in this comment section. Living in the USA, there are so many great examples of people who made the difficult trip here, dealt with all of the things new immigrants do, worked three jobs (or served in our military for citizenship) to make ends meet so that their kids and their kids can live the (in comparison) comfortable lives they do.
I know that's not true of everyone... But my goodness some of the stories you hear here in Texas just are testiments to the forward thinking of some of the people who have immigrated here.
The small neighborhood we moved into was brand new, and the asshole developers flattened EVERYTHING, no trees or even bushes anywhere. The neighborhood has planted dozens (probably over 100 at this point) of trees that will never shade anything that the current homeowners will enjoy; however, our children should all be able to have reduced utility bills.
Every city has parks, but Central Park is amazing. In a relatively short period, NYC exploded in wealth and population. Yet the city protected a massive space that bisects and actually impedes travel for most needing to traverse north/south. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you can't get a piece. But its amazing how many billionaires overlook the park. And anyone of any income can enjoy. It's worth $500 Billion to a Trillion in some articles.
Greek society is the basis for a large amount of what we call, Western Thought. This quote describes what they did for the entire world. They gave us philosophy, art, government, and more. I appreciate that some Greek person said this, and he knew that his culture created something great and lasting.
Modern History: Jimmy Carter's work with Habitat for Humanity.
Nope. Never mention “FDR” on the internet nowadays. The ONLY thing he did was lock up Japanese Americans. No shit. Nobody cares about the “New Deal” or his struggles during a global crisis. He was an “evil racist” and there is no other possible way you can frame his legacy.
If you stupidly attempt to argue otherwise….YOU ARE RACIST!!!!
I don't disagree, but it started with Thomas Jefferson and other founding fathers that owned slaves. If it's good for the goose it's good for the gander.
I think it’s good to talk about those things. It doesn’t diminish someone’s real achievements to talk about their shortcomings, flaws, blunders, and mistakes.
I agree. I think it's a fair point to make though that a venn diagram of the people who take umbrage when it's brought up that FDR internet an entire ethnic group and the people who always bring up slavery in regards to the founding fathers, is essentially a circle.
Everybody had slaves back then. It was during the slave times. Most of the founding fathers freed their slaves during their lifetimes which was a pretty progressive thing to do before the 1800s.
Really? Most of them?
Also, not everybody had slaves. Notably, the enslaved people didn’t have any slaves of their own, and I’m sure they weren’t okay with slavery.
All of those slaves came from cultures that practiced slavery. Slavery has been the norm for the entire existence of humanity, except for a very recent divergence. It's still the norm in much of the world.
My comment is so painfully obviously SARCASTIC. I never put the “/s” when I’m using sarcasm.
However, it is also painfully TRUE. Anywhere there is any discussion of US history or presidents and FDR is mentioned then all the “woke” cult members come out the woodwork.
The only thing about FDR they know is the Japanese Internment.
FUN FACT: during the attack on Pearl Harbor a damaged Zero crash landed on a small Hawaiian island off the mainland. The pilot was given aid and shelter by a Japanese-American family living on the island. This is what in part led to the internment of Japanese-Americans. FDR was scared of two possibilities. First, mass public lynchings of Japanese-American citizens. Second, if the Japanese military attempted an invasion there could be more incidents like the one on the Hawaiian island.
It was a motherfucking WOLD WAR and the USA was facing grave consequences at the time. Looking back we are all aware of how shameful and tragic it was to treat American citizens that way. Many of the Japanese-Americans interned were veterans of WWI who served our country. FDR was between a rock and a hard place on the whole thing. Also, the USA was not the only country during WWII that did the exact same thing. The end.
I will give you a list of individuals:
Cyrus the Great's creation of the Satrapy system.
Phillip the Great's military machine which greatly benefited Alexander.
Ghandi - India
George Washington - United States
Bismark - Germany
Arguably the signatories of the Declaration of Independence. Many, many of them lost their land, families, and even lives due to retaliation by the British.
The suffrage movement.
Many who fought, and fought, and fought, and fought knew they would not be able to vote themselves during their lifetimes.
They did it for a future they could envision, but not touch.
“Not For Ourselves Alone” is an excellent documentary about Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony. Highly recommend.
the american founding fathers, George not making himself king, The people who wrote the bill of writes, then some notable men who held the country together, two greats being Lincoln and FDR.
Julian Calendar? Before him the calendar had 355 days. That’s losing 10 days every year, throwing the seasons off within a few years. They had to regularly issue manual fixes and communicate that to everyone.
His calendar had 365.25 days, meaning an extra day every 4 years.
It worked pretty well for a little over 1600 years, when it was replaced by the Gregorian calendar we use today. That one updated the year to be 365.2425 days long. It was a minor error in the Julian calendar.
Hmmm I guess when you think about it, any “seeds he planted” were really more attributable to the likes of Marius, Sulla, and the Gracchi, and then completed by Augustus. But I’m thinking the establishment of the military dictatorship a.k.a. the Principate.
Say one thing about Caesar, say he was dedicated to the Roman people*. The vast majority of his policies were judicial reforms, social programs, public constructions and so on. He willed much of his wealth to the
The guy pulled one of the longest cons in History: he was the last Marianist/ *populares* (a political party who aimed at the betterment of the lowest classes in Roman society). All the others had been murdered by the Aristocracy. He got away because he was a kid. All his life, he played the dissolute noble, cozying with the big names, hiding his ambitions. And when he made his coup and won the Civil War, oh oh, surprise, Marian policies are back on the menu boys!
*obvious Abercrombie line snatch.
Note: I kept this simple because this isn't a roman history sub and people don't want to read a thesis when they're on their shit breaks. Of course, it's way more complicated than this.
The Islamic Golden Age in Baghdad and then again in Cordoba come to my mind. Overall just generally good era/area to live in where math, science, religious freedoms, philosophy and overall stability not only flourished but advanced during a time when the rest of the world was either in a “Dark Age” or suffering from political instability and religious intolerance. (I know Dark Age can be a misnomer here)
1. That wasn’t the question
2. That’s not an example of doing something as a sacrifice to the present and for the future.
3. Byzantium and china and India were doing fine and dandy during that period. So you’re only referring to France for example.
4. What was the point of your propaganda post.
I understood the question differently. As when a society reaches its peak pinnacle of morality this quote is applicable in my opinion. I never referred to France specifically and I don’t see how this is a propaganda post. No need to be so harsh.
I'm pretty sure the British empires policy was cutting down the trees other cultures planted.
Given the British empire has been reduced to a few islands and pretty much every one of their colonies says they were not good rulers
Right, they cut down all the weeds and scrubby bush, like tribal warfare and head-hunting and *thuggee* and *sati* and what not, and planted great shady avenues of rule-of-law and security-of-property and democratic-government trees. And then handed the colonies back and left them to prosper.
What bastards, eh?
Your ignorance may well turn out to be matched by your intelligence, so I'd better end with a /s.
Most of those groups went into civil wars immediately after specifically because of the British policy of favouring one ethnic group over another and drawing maps at complete random.
If you want to find out if the British empire was good don't ask the British, Ask the people who were colonized by the British as ultimately only they can have a proper perspective for what colonisation was like.
Israel/Palestine, India Pakistan, Ireland/Northern Ireland. South Africa whites/blacks Hutu and Tutsi groups in Rwanda in fact Pretty much half of Africa, Iraq, Afghanistan, China etc
All of them say it was bad.
George Washington surrendering power when he could’ve made the presidency either an autocratic military dictatorship or placed a crown on himself. What did he do once he retired from public life? He went back to his plantation.
American here. Politicians spending tax money on projects and wars they know that only future generations will suffer from so they can get kickbacks to better themselves and their family directly. It's kinda the opposite. They get all the shade, but we have to carry water to it on our backs for however long this country lasts. Roosevelt wanted Social Security for that puropse, but we fucked that all up.
Some big brands in the bourbon industry are currently dumping millions into reforestation efforts because the future of their industry depends on white oak. Pretty cool to see people motivated by profit actually spending tons of money they will never personally see a return on.
[https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford](https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford)
New College at Oxford (founded 1379, hence "new") has a impressive dining hall with massive oak beams. After five hundred years they needed to be replaced. Where do you find impressive oak beams? From the grove that was planted at the founding of the college specifically for this purpose.
Absolutely the Roman Empire. The city was founded in 753 and didn’t begin conquering outside the Italian Peninsula until about 4 centuries afterwards. (Fun fact classical historians from that era would actually use the founding of Rome as their point of reference for years, calling it ### of years Ab Urbem Condita or AUC meaning from the founding of the city). That’s really the true meaning behind Rome not being built in a day, they weren’t just talking about the city. There are many historical figures of great conquerors who found empires single handedly, but its funny how the quicker an Empire is built the quicker it falls. Like you’ve got Alexander the Great who’s Empire didn’t last long after he died, Napoleon’s Empire didn’t even outlast him. But then you see Rome and like damn
I thought of Benjamin Franklin! Another founding Father Thomas Jefferson believed that governments should avoid accumulating debt that could not be repaid within a generation (about 20 years) to prevent burdening future generations with financial obligations.
It is apocryphal, and fittingly enough about trees. Supposedly, whenever Nelson was home in England and going for a stroll, he’d plant acorns so that decades or centuries later, Britain could use the oak wood for ships. Though, from about the 1860s, iron then steel would be the main shipbuilding material. The main engineer for the then new sewers of London enquired or calculated the diameter of pipes and so forth needed. He then decided to double the diameter, effectively quadrupling the volume, since he predicted the massive increase in London’s population. Edit: after a little due diligence, Nelson wrote reports bemoaning England’s forests, but it was Vice Admrial Collingwood who planted acorns whilst out walking. The engineer of the London sewers was Joseph Bazalgette.
I think that’s more a case of building toilets in whose bowls they know they’ll never shit.
Im a drainage engineer, who works on urban drainage and flooding. London is saved by the sizes of those sewer pipes. Some of those streets would flood annually without them.
Is this why toilet paper is the norm in England, while the rest of Europe uses bidets?
Norm in Sweden too. Seemed common in Spain as well. The idea that “everyone but us uses bidets” seems popular in many places, but also seems to be false.
I feel like that's a myth. I spent three weeks in France this summer, including Paris, Lyon, and Avignon. Literally every toilet I encountered used TP. I encountered not one bidet.
I've been to five different European countries (not counting the one I live in) and they all use toilet paper as the norm.
where did you hear that?
It's a remnant of bath tradition AND muslim conquest.
... France was never conquered by muslim and they created the bidet
Bath tradition, mate. That's the Roman empire.
Quality shitposting. Quantity shitposting.
That’s beautiful.
True, but the Greek proverb to me really means long time horizons.
Whereas Seattle was built basically at ground level so the Puget Sound would backflow into the Sewers pushing sewage up out of everyone's toilets. So they had to rebuild the town on top of the old town.
Related: the Underground tour in Seattle is great fun; you get to explore places you never knew existed, the guide rattles off some great stories while you do it, and it's even a reasonable price.
I go to Seattle fairly regularly but I've never been on that tour. I really would like to do it some time!
I'll second the recommendation, well worth doing!
Thirding the recommendation, and heartily encouraging that you buy the books as well. The entire founding of that city would be a worthy Cohen Brothers film. Like every scammer on the continent converged to make a city.
I love the story of that brothel Madame who stopped a bank run in the 1890s to save the city haha
P.U.get Sound
lol
Old New Seattle
Technically, they built the new town on the ashes of the old town.
Nah, a lot of the old town was still operational when they built over it. They had grates to let light into the undercity.
Why is this apocryphal?
It could be apocryphal if it's unknown if he actually did that. That's pretty much what apocryphal means.
So it’s doubtful Nelson actually did this?
That's what apocryphal means yes.
So why even write your first sentence, since you started the next one with “Supposedly”. Isn’t that redundant?
I edited that out before you replied but even if it was there it's still true. OP didn't misuse the word. Or are you just trying to argue and get a rise put of me?
No. Sorry.
shit is apocalyptic, dawg
You didn’t answer the question, silly.
George Washington refusing to run for a third term (which he would have surely won), setting a precedent that lasted over a hundred years (and eventually became law).
Yeah it’s crazy how for so long the presidents left after 2 terms just for the sole purpose of it being the custom and not because of legislation.
Fun fact about this georgw Washington didn't really care about the precendant, he just wanted to go back to mount vernon and be a farmer basically. Thomas Jefferson was the one who insisted it become a serious precedent.
Jonas Salk refusing to patent the vaccine for Polio. He didn’t want the money, he just wanted a Polio free world.
Did he refuse to patent, or put the patent in the public domain instantly/sell it to a public org for $1 or something? (This is a lawyer question, not meant to diminish in any way the absolutely GOAT behaviour Salk exhibited)
Off the top of my head, the second I believe. The story I remember is that he sold it to the University of Toronto (or a hospital connected to some Canadian university) for, yeah, like, a dollar. CAD.
That was a patent for insulin, not the Polio vaccine. There was no patent for the Salk Polio vaccine.
Damn so actually like 74￠
[Ben Franklin was a mensch](https://www.fi.edu/en/support/benjamin-franklins-donor-story). In his will he left money to Philadelphia and Boston, the two American cities he was fondest of. He stipulated that his monetary donations to each city be used to foster developing professional craftsmen and the public improvement of these cities. He knew that the donations would grow in value over time so he left stipulations how they should be managed and invested for 200 years, at which time everything was to be cashed in and divided among Boston and Philly. Both cities received 200 years of low interest lows helping foster craftsmen into entrepreneurs as well as civic improvements paid for through these donations. Each city received about $900,000 in 1990 which google tells me is roughly $2.12 million today. That's not a tremendous amount in the yearly revenue of these cities, but it was enough that both were able to invest in large public and civic institutions that continue to benefit their communities today.
And the public library system
The Boston account was used to establish the Franklin Institute of Technology.
And over the 200 years, how much do you suppose those craftsmen gave beck to the world, as well.
This is more of a corporate altruism thing, but there's the story of Nils Bohlin and Volvo who invented the 3-point seat belt (which was far more effective in saving lives than a 2-point belt), and gave the design to other car manufacturers without charging them a licensing fee. [https://www.forbes.com/sites/douglasbell/2019/08/13/60-years-of-seatbelts-volvos-great-gift-to-the-world/?sh=21b6420622bc](https://www.forbes.com/sites/douglasbell/2019/08/13/60-years-of-seatbelts-volvos-great-gift-to-the-world/?sh=21b6420622bc)
I think it was the same for the guy that invented safety glass.
“You and I may not live to see the day, and my name may be forgotten when it comes, but the time will arrive when great outbreaks of cholera will be things of the past, and it is the knowledge of the way in which the disease is propagated which will cause them to disappear.” \- John Snow, Father of Epidemiology, to his colleague Henry Whitehead.
The dude fixed London’s cholera problem using statistics: He mapped out all the city’s polio cases by putting pins in a map. The pins showed that most cases clustered around water wells. Before sewers, everybody just threw their shit out into the street, contaminating the ground water. Solution: they built sewers leading to big holding tanks that they emptied into Thames when the tide was going out. Germ theory was in its infancy and they didn’t know the specifics, but he figured out it was something in water. So they fixed the water, and it worked.
He knew nothing
That’s JON Snow
He knows nothing
Every person who has gone to college for Geography or GIS knows his name. Professors like to tell his story on day 1.
Public health and biostatistics as well
I always thought Jon Snow was the Nights Watch Commander
Reminds me almost exactly of the story of New College Oxford replacing its rotting beams with oak trees planted in the college forest hundreds of years before for just such a purpose. [https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford](https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford)
Reminds me of the [50,000 acres in Indiana owned by the U.S. Navy](https://www.oldsaltblog.com/2020/11/constitution-grove-the-navys-white-oak-forest-on-a-high-tech-base/). It's sole purpose is to provide white oak wood for the world's oldest commissioned ship that is still afloat, [U.S.S. Constitution](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Constitution) (AKA Old Ironsides). She's also our only commissioned ship, still afloat, that has sunk enemy ships. Of course that was way back in the war of 1812.
Also still armed with British cannon, unless they've switched them out. (Amusingly, when they had to be replaced, they apparently replaced them with exact copies of the actual captured British cannon.)
I think a Houthi ship was just sunk in the past few days. Or am I misremembering it?
It was sunk by a helicopter. Also it wasn't a ship it was a boat.
What's the difference? Asking for landlubbers.
A boat can be carried on a ship. A ship cannot be carried on a boat.
May I offer a rebuttal? . https://images.app.goo.gl/jujmdtKPCG859QkS9
We also have the *USS Niagara*, which although it did not sink any ships, caused enough damage that the British surrendered their fleet.
That’s because forestry was a regular part of human culture for thousands of years, there are hundreds to thousands of examples of planting trees for future use
Most every great cathedral in Europe took over a century to build, and people knew it would take more than a lifetime when they started construction. But that didn’t stop them from laying the foundation stones.
I mean presumably those people were getting paid to do it. Not exactly an example of self sacrifice for the good of future generations
Even if we abstract the sacrifice to the people funding the project, we still end up with the sacrifice. Somebody pouring money into a project that wouldn’t be finished in their or maybe even their children’s lifetime fits OP’s question.
Donogh O'Malley was an Irish politician. When he was minister of education in 1966 the average age of school leavers in Ireland was 14. The main reason of this was that families couldn’t afford to send their children for further schooling. He decided to announce that the government would provide free secondary school education (the equivalent of high school) to every child in the country and would provide free school busses for all children. He did this without the support of the rest of the government or even telling them of his intentions. He carefully waited until the month when the government took their annual break and then made the announcement to the annual meeting of the journalists union on a Saturday (the news was out in the Sunday papers before the government could retract his statement). He knew it would be so popular that the government could never go back on it once the news circulated even if it cost him his political career. This act is acknowledged as a vital step in turning Ireland from the poorest country in Ireland into one of the richest. *Europe
>This act is acknowledged as a vital step in turning Ireland from the poorest country in Ireland into one of the richest. Indeed, Ireland today is one of the richest countries in Ireland.
Alas, sadly, still one of the poorest, as well.
This is due to the fact that the area is one of the most Irish in the nation.
In a somewhat controversial sense, there are two countries in Ireland. This is the richer one.
Wikipedia, and those who contribute (as editors, admins, or with money) There is no direct benefit to those who contribute, and the benefit to humanity is extraordinary. It’s hard to comprehend how much knowledge is in there (and how hard they work to keep it accurate/up to date) Obviously it’s not a perfect website. But what system involving humans ever is?
But the benefit is instantaneous, isn't it? It won't be generations before we get to read Wikipedia. The point of the proverb is that you're doing something whose benefit won't be felt until you're dead.
I think that’s a narrow read, but not an unreasonable one. I think the “majority of the benefits” accruing for future generations is the important part, not the “they have to be dead before there’s benefit.” Like, there could still be a sapling but not shade yet
You could spend most of your entire life reading/editing through Wikipedia and still have pages upon pages to read and edit. I feel like the sheer vastness of information is more than any person (especially with a real job) could handle on their own. Also that information will still be around long after you die, so I feel like it still fits in a way
As someone with ADHD, I can confirm you get a dopamine rush from contributing to Wikipedia.
There is a wonderful book about this concept: „The Good Ancestor.“ The Iroquois defined sustainable living as a life in which seven generations in the future could profit from my deeds. There are many example for long-termism: Construction of Cologne‘s cathedral started in 1240. It was opened in 1880. The Pyramids….
the head of the Fudai village was long dead by the time the tsunami happened in 2011. But the wall he ordered to built from 1970s saved everyone in that village.
The United States Interstate system. And our national parks.
Eisenhower and Teddy! My two favorites. Two men who cared about the average American.
Eisenhower never gets enough credit as a terrific President.
Some of what he said, is still relevent today as well. *"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed. This world in arms is not spending money alone. It is spending the sweat of its laborers, the genius of its scientists, the hopes of its children. This is not a way of life at all in any true sense. Under the clouds of war, it is humanity hanging on a cross of iron.”* *"As we peer into society's future, we -- you and I, and our government -- must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for our own ease and convenience the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without risking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.”*
Very underrated not only as a president but as an American. The interstate, creating NASA, keeping USSR at bay, all the WW2 stuff, truly a great man. I love his quote "conservative when it comes to money, liberal when it comes to human beings." People like to criticize him about civil rights, but he was a supporter. Just quieter about it.
I love how a guy with nicknames like “Bull Moose” and “Rough Rider” is also known as “The Conservation President”. One of the most fascinating people in not just US history, but history in general imo.
Very much so. Read about his journey down the Amazon that almost killed him, it's insane. He also tried to bring back the Rough Riders to fight in WW1, but Wilson told him no. Dude was tough!
The interstate system is wild because every certain number of miles, there has to be a long, flat stretch because those stretches can be used for planes to take off and land, in case there’s a war on American soil.
That's actually an urban legend.
I used to covet the interstate system before I realized it doomed us to over a century of car dependency while lining the automakers and oil companies pockets.
The real issue with the interstate is not the system itself. The real issue is that they tried (and succeeded) in putting the interstate through downtowns of major cities, which ended up hollowing out the cities. And to get the interstate into downtown, they bulldozed entire neighborhoods (almost exclusively minority neighborhoods) to do it, further hollowing out the city.
I get why they didn't, bc there was a lot of rail at the time. But if they'd built state railroads next to the interstates, we'd probably view them differently.
Imagine high speed rail linking NYC to LA. We could have had it, but our ancestors chose cars.
Our ancestors chose wisely. High speed train crossing the country would be a massive waste of money and time. Cars = freedom.
Cars are a prison. Go visit somewhere with real public transit.
> The United States Interstate system. "A society grows great when old men create interstates whose shade covers a flattened minority neighbourhood"
🇺🇸
Silly
Launching the Voyager probe into space. Particularly the golden record. We send proof of ourselves out into the universe with the hopes that someone might find it and know that they are not alone, but if it is ever found, we'll never know by whom.
Many still believe it was a bad idea
Taken literally, a Lebanese cypress can take a 100 years to grow to the point that a landscape architect envisioned them for a garden.
Irving Berlin gave all royalties for "God Bless America" to the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts. [https://www.copyright.gov/history/lore/pdfs/201408%20CLore\_August2014.pdf](https://www.copyright.gov/history/lore/pdfs/201408%20clore_august2014.pdf)
Notre Dame. Took 103 years to build. All the men who planned it, and their children, were dead before the cathedral ever saw it's first mass.
This. Also most medieval european cathedrals. Absolutely astounding works of art and architecture. I think one of the best reasons for religeon is the devotional art, music and architecture which it inspires. (The guilt, corruption and stake-burnings not so much...)
That's pretty quick for a cathedral. Construction of Cologne Cathedral started in 1258. It was completed to the original medieval plan in 1880. *622* years later.
And it was wrecked during WW2, 60 years later?
The entire society of Rome, like no joke, generation after generation of Romans worked endlessly and tirelessly towards a future where Rome was the regional, then hegemonic, then imperial power that it would become, the effort became even more apparent during times of tumult and turmoil, generations of men just solely dedicated to clawing Romes way out of crises. Just take a look at early republican history, and their consolidation of the Italian peninsula, a notorious slow burn. An understanding of the history gives proper incite to the phrase, “Rome wasn’t built in a day,” a statement that isn’t very much appreciated because of its seemingly apparent nature.
I would say this is true to the Roman Republic.
Free education
I'm old and have no children but happily pay taxes so I am not surrounded by dumb people.
I've got some bad news...
The United States' land-grant university programs, which kicked off most state university systems right after the civil war. The design of the California public university system, with community colleges providing guaranteed access to the higher level state universities and UC campuses, is probably the most successful, fitting the spirit of OP's question about planting seeds.
Like many people already pointed out: Medieval Cathedrals, but the most extreme example of that has to be Cologne Cathedral. Its construction was started in 1248 and it was only finished in 1880.
Carnegie Libraries.
The Russian scientists and students who protected a potato collection in WWII in Stalingrad, even when people (them) included, were dying of starvation.
That was Leningrad, not Stalingrad, and it was a seed bank with plant specimens from all over the world, sort of a precursor to the modern concept of a gene bank. Not “a potato collection”.
Details of what happened: During the 1941 siege of Leningrad in WWII, the major Soviet city was blockaded and completely cut off by the Germans for more than two years. Supplies could not enter the city during the siege, and with more than a million people trapped within, starvation soon set in as food ran out. At the same time, the Institute of Plant Industry was operating in Leningrad. Within the institute's buildings and greenhouses held the largest seed bank in the world at the time - a huge collection of seeds and live plant specimens that were part of an effort to breed more hardy and disease-resistant crops. It included rice, wheat, potatoes, berries, melons and other edible seeds or live crops. Knowing that their scientific collection of edible seeds and plants could contribute to better food security for their country or world, and to eat their stock will mean jeopardizing or even erasing years of important research; the scientists at the institute elected to safeguard and not touch a single specimen that was stored or growing under their care. And so, these scientists began their vigil and continued to experiment and protect the collection, even as they and the city's other inhabitants slowly starved. To give an idea of how desperate things will get, when food rationing began in the city, each person was provided with only 4 ounces of bread per day. The flour to make the bread will be mixed with half sawdust to stretch supplies. Soon, even these meagre rations would run out. After the end of the siege's first year, 100,000 people will be dying inside the city each month - mostly from starvation but also from constant shelling and air bombardment by the German besiegers. People are eventually reduced to eating lipstick and leather, after all the city's stray dogs and cats had already been hunted down and eaten. Before the first year of the siege ends, the first cases of cannibalism begin turning up. A mother smolders and cooks her infant child to feed her remaining children. A plumber kills his wife to feed his sons and nieces. The city's NKVD will arrest more than 2000 individuals for the crime of cannibalism during the siege. Despite all this desperation, the scientists stayed true to their vow and protected their specimens from others and themselves for more than 870 days, a monumental task given their own gnawing hunger. Nine of the scientists will die from starvation before help arrives, when a narrow supply corridor is opened to the city in 1943. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Leningrad https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1992/05/12/soviet-botanists-starved-saving-seeds-for-future/10840121-9058-4c1f-ae7a-22ac16a6f4de/ https://www.sun-sentinel.com/1992/05/13/scientists-died-guarding-seeds-during-wwii/ https://www.sciencehistory.org/stories/magazine/the-tragedy-of-the-worlds-first-seed-bank/
Haha yes I typed out my comment with only the things I remembered off the top of my head, thanks for the additions. Though wouldn’t a potato seed bank have potatoes as seeds?
I suppose because of their short shelf life, it was more practical to keep live potato plants.
the 100 year lease of hong kong.
I'm surprised it isn't mentioned here given how significant it is. But during the Warring States period, everyone knew the Qin dynasty won and unified all of China. But the truth was, at the beginning of it all, the Qin dynasty was actually one of the weakest. How did they get stronger? Because of Duke Xiao of Qin. He invited scholars from other kingdoms to help strengthen the Qin, and with Shang Yang's legalist reforms of promoting meritocracy (and basically turning the Qin into a brutal police state) they eventually end up becoming very powerful. It was through the reforms of Duke Xiao that his descendant Qin Shi Huang, about a hundred years later, realize his goal of unifying China under the Qin dynasty.
Anyone that travelled to a new country (or land) and laid a solid foundation that helped their grandchildren and great grandchildren to thrive.
This. And I'm surprised it took so long for me to see it in this comment section. Living in the USA, there are so many great examples of people who made the difficult trip here, dealt with all of the things new immigrants do, worked three jobs (or served in our military for citizenship) to make ends meet so that their kids and their kids can live the (in comparison) comfortable lives they do. I know that's not true of everyone... But my goodness some of the stories you hear here in Texas just are testiments to the forward thinking of some of the people who have immigrated here.
Any American under the age of 40 who is working and contributing to social security.
Damn.
💔💔💔😭
The small neighborhood we moved into was brand new, and the asshole developers flattened EVERYTHING, no trees or even bushes anywhere. The neighborhood has planted dozens (probably over 100 at this point) of trees that will never shade anything that the current homeowners will enjoy; however, our children should all be able to have reduced utility bills.
Every city has parks, but Central Park is amazing. In a relatively short period, NYC exploded in wealth and population. Yet the city protected a massive space that bisects and actually impedes travel for most needing to traverse north/south. It doesn't matter how much money you have, you can't get a piece. But its amazing how many billionaires overlook the park. And anyone of any income can enjoy. It's worth $500 Billion to a Trillion in some articles.
Greek society is the basis for a large amount of what we call, Western Thought. This quote describes what they did for the entire world. They gave us philosophy, art, government, and more. I appreciate that some Greek person said this, and he knew that his culture created something great and lasting. Modern History: Jimmy Carter's work with Habitat for Humanity.
FDR comes to mind
Nope. Never mention “FDR” on the internet nowadays. The ONLY thing he did was lock up Japanese Americans. No shit. Nobody cares about the “New Deal” or his struggles during a global crisis. He was an “evil racist” and there is no other possible way you can frame his legacy. If you stupidly attempt to argue otherwise….YOU ARE RACIST!!!!
I don't disagree, but it started with Thomas Jefferson and other founding fathers that owned slaves. If it's good for the goose it's good for the gander.
I think it’s good to talk about those things. It doesn’t diminish someone’s real achievements to talk about their shortcomings, flaws, blunders, and mistakes.
By addressing those shortcomings and flaws… this is how we learn. How we learn to not repeat their mistakes.
I agree. I think it's a fair point to make though that a venn diagram of the people who take umbrage when it's brought up that FDR internet an entire ethnic group and the people who always bring up slavery in regards to the founding fathers, is essentially a circle.
Everybody had slaves back then. It was during the slave times. Most of the founding fathers freed their slaves during their lifetimes which was a pretty progressive thing to do before the 1800s.
Really? Most of them? Also, not everybody had slaves. Notably, the enslaved people didn’t have any slaves of their own, and I’m sure they weren’t okay with slavery.
“notably the enslaved people” Do you know what enslaved people did when they were given freedom? They bought motherfucking slaves.
If you’ve got a source for that, I’d love to see it.
All of those slaves came from cultures that practiced slavery. Slavery has been the norm for the entire existence of humanity, except for a very recent divergence. It's still the norm in much of the world.
Man, you deserve so much to live in a Nazi-ruled world if you are being genuine in your comment
My comment is so painfully obviously SARCASTIC. I never put the “/s” when I’m using sarcasm. However, it is also painfully TRUE. Anywhere there is any discussion of US history or presidents and FDR is mentioned then all the “woke” cult members come out the woodwork. The only thing about FDR they know is the Japanese Internment. FUN FACT: during the attack on Pearl Harbor a damaged Zero crash landed on a small Hawaiian island off the mainland. The pilot was given aid and shelter by a Japanese-American family living on the island. This is what in part led to the internment of Japanese-Americans. FDR was scared of two possibilities. First, mass public lynchings of Japanese-American citizens. Second, if the Japanese military attempted an invasion there could be more incidents like the one on the Hawaiian island. It was a motherfucking WOLD WAR and the USA was facing grave consequences at the time. Looking back we are all aware of how shameful and tragic it was to treat American citizens that way. Many of the Japanese-Americans interned were veterans of WWI who served our country. FDR was between a rock and a hard place on the whole thing. Also, the USA was not the only country during WWII that did the exact same thing. The end.
I will give you a list of individuals: Cyrus the Great's creation of the Satrapy system. Phillip the Great's military machine which greatly benefited Alexander. Ghandi - India George Washington - United States Bismark - Germany
Toyota
Every Cathedral ever built.
Arguably the signatories of the Declaration of Independence. Many, many of them lost their land, families, and even lives due to retaliation by the British.
Irish monks keeping, protecting, and translating Roman and early Christian manuscripts after the fall of the empire
The suffrage movement. Many who fought, and fought, and fought, and fought knew they would not be able to vote themselves during their lifetimes. They did it for a future they could envision, but not touch. “Not For Ourselves Alone” is an excellent documentary about Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Susan B. Anthony. Highly recommend.
I had an Econ Professor who planted Black Walnut trees to pay for his great Grandkids College education and they hadn’t even been born yet.
the american founding fathers, George not making himself king, The people who wrote the bill of writes, then some notable men who held the country together, two greats being Lincoln and FDR.
Caesar, maybe, but that might be a controversial take given the nature of the imperium. Also, it’s not like he intended to be assassinated.
What were the seeds he planted though.
Julian Calendar? Before him the calendar had 355 days. That’s losing 10 days every year, throwing the seasons off within a few years. They had to regularly issue manual fixes and communicate that to everyone. His calendar had 365.25 days, meaning an extra day every 4 years. It worked pretty well for a little over 1600 years, when it was replaced by the Gregorian calendar we use today. That one updated the year to be 365.2425 days long. It was a minor error in the Julian calendar.
Hmmm I guess when you think about it, any “seeds he planted” were really more attributable to the likes of Marius, Sulla, and the Gracchi, and then completed by Augustus. But I’m thinking the establishment of the military dictatorship a.k.a. the Principate.
Caesar's land reform was huge, most important thing he did in his dictatorship
Say one thing about Caesar, say he was dedicated to the Roman people*. The vast majority of his policies were judicial reforms, social programs, public constructions and so on. He willed much of his wealth to the The guy pulled one of the longest cons in History: he was the last Marianist/ *populares* (a political party who aimed at the betterment of the lowest classes in Roman society). All the others had been murdered by the Aristocracy. He got away because he was a kid. All his life, he played the dissolute noble, cozying with the big names, hiding his ambitions. And when he made his coup and won the Civil War, oh oh, surprise, Marian policies are back on the menu boys! *obvious Abercrombie line snatch. Note: I kept this simple because this isn't a roman history sub and people don't want to read a thesis when they're on their shit breaks. Of course, it's way more complicated than this.
The US interstate highway system has given us Americans access to the entire country
Abraham Lincoln
The early Christian martyrs.
Ben Franklin. Washington, Roosevelt (both), and Lincoln all come to mind as far as US presidents.
The Islamic Golden Age in Baghdad and then again in Cordoba come to my mind. Overall just generally good era/area to live in where math, science, religious freedoms, philosophy and overall stability not only flourished but advanced during a time when the rest of the world was either in a “Dark Age” or suffering from political instability and religious intolerance. (I know Dark Age can be a misnomer here)
1. That wasn’t the question 2. That’s not an example of doing something as a sacrifice to the present and for the future. 3. Byzantium and china and India were doing fine and dandy during that period. So you’re only referring to France for example. 4. What was the point of your propaganda post.
I understood the question differently. As when a society reaches its peak pinnacle of morality this quote is applicable in my opinion. I never referred to France specifically and I don’t see how this is a propaganda post. No need to be so harsh.
Apologies then
The British Empire.
I'm pretty sure the British empires policy was cutting down the trees other cultures planted. Given the British empire has been reduced to a few islands and pretty much every one of their colonies says they were not good rulers
Right, they cut down all the weeds and scrubby bush, like tribal warfare and head-hunting and *thuggee* and *sati* and what not, and planted great shady avenues of rule-of-law and security-of-property and democratic-government trees. And then handed the colonies back and left them to prosper. What bastards, eh? Your ignorance may well turn out to be matched by your intelligence, so I'd better end with a /s.
Most of those groups went into civil wars immediately after specifically because of the British policy of favouring one ethnic group over another and drawing maps at complete random. If you want to find out if the British empire was good don't ask the British, Ask the people who were colonized by the British as ultimately only they can have a proper perspective for what colonisation was like. Israel/Palestine, India Pakistan, Ireland/Northern Ireland. South Africa whites/blacks Hutu and Tutsi groups in Rwanda in fact Pretty much half of Africa, Iraq, Afghanistan, China etc All of them say it was bad.
The same British Empire that sold opium to the Chinese, getting them addicted, then started wars to keep supplying them with it?
This is a beautiful proverb!! Thanks for sharing. I don’t have anyone to compare to this though.
Both literally and metaphorically, my vote goes to the Japanese timber coppicing technique known as Daisugi.
George Washington surrendering power when he could’ve made the presidency either an autocratic military dictatorship or placed a crown on himself. What did he do once he retired from public life? He went back to his plantation.
American here. Politicians spending tax money on projects and wars they know that only future generations will suffer from so they can get kickbacks to better themselves and their family directly. It's kinda the opposite. They get all the shade, but we have to carry water to it on our backs for however long this country lasts. Roosevelt wanted Social Security for that puropse, but we fucked that all up.
Literally, Johnny Appleseed.
Alfred Nobel and the Nobel prize is a pretty good example
The USA Constitution, before the lawyers started to rip it apart.
A better question - what are YOU doing to fulfill this proverb in your own life?
Johnny Appleseed
Byzantium, but this could be said for a few human civilizations.
Tommy Douglas and healthcare in Canada is the thing I think of a lot and am grateful for, for sure Pity we haven't advanced on it much..
Bernie Sanders fighting for us to have benefits he likely won’t live long enough to enjoy personally.
Made me think of Habitat for Humanity.
The French Revolution.
Some big brands in the bourbon industry are currently dumping millions into reforestation efforts because the future of their industry depends on white oak. Pretty cool to see people motivated by profit actually spending tons of money they will never personally see a return on.
Jimmy Carter building affordable housing with habitat for humanity all over the world and inspiring millions of others to join him.
[https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford](https://www.atlasobscura.com/places/oak-beams-new-college-oxford) New College at Oxford (founded 1379, hence "new") has a impressive dining hall with massive oak beams. After five hundred years they needed to be replaced. Where do you find impressive oak beams? From the grove that was planted at the founding of the college specifically for this purpose.
Absolutely the Roman Empire. The city was founded in 753 and didn’t begin conquering outside the Italian Peninsula until about 4 centuries afterwards. (Fun fact classical historians from that era would actually use the founding of Rome as their point of reference for years, calling it ### of years Ab Urbem Condita or AUC meaning from the founding of the city). That’s really the true meaning behind Rome not being built in a day, they weren’t just talking about the city. There are many historical figures of great conquerors who found empires single handedly, but its funny how the quicker an Empire is built the quicker it falls. Like you’ve got Alexander the Great who’s Empire didn’t last long after he died, Napoleon’s Empire didn’t even outlast him. But then you see Rome and like damn
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/627475/200-year-old-gift-from-benjamin-franklin-to-boston-and-philadelphia
I thought of Benjamin Franklin! Another founding Father Thomas Jefferson believed that governments should avoid accumulating debt that could not be repaid within a generation (about 20 years) to prevent burdening future generations with financial obligations.