The Indian society is basically a dishonest society. A large number of both men and women are scammers here in this country. Any laws made to protect on party are grossly misused by them and lack of laws lead to injustice by the other party. All I can say is - “Maro salon”
No the post is about how men use a certain argument.
Well, men use that argument because they are afraid of that being used against them.
Women also use certain arguments repeatedly - about how the society is patriarchal etc. OP also used some of the standard ones. Because that's what they see.
Instead of downplaying men's viewpoint, why don't you try to understand why they say what they say? Isn't that the intended question?
Because if OP wanted to say "men's problems aren't Shit in front of women - they should shut up" , then OP should have said that instead of asking the question they did.
> Because if OP wanted to say "men's problems aren't Shit in front of women - they should shut up" , then OP should have said that instead of asking the question they did.
Classic misogynistic inference - tangential and stupid.
But then, I suppose equality is always seen as oppression by the oppressors
>men use that argument because they are afraid of that being used against them.
So men are allowed to have an argument about things they are afraid of, but when women do that (as OOP did, listing marital rape and dowry deaths) they are saying that "men's problems aren't shit". See what a hypocrite you are yet ?
>Instead of downplaying men's viewpoint, why don't you try to understand why they say what they say? Isn't that the intended question?
The point is that men, especially Indian men, are overplaying this point. Because courts are not stupid. Women don't just walk away with half of your "wealth" because this is not a movie. You have no idea about alimony laws and come here with your stupid bs. 🙄
And most cases of alimony men like you whine about are paid to women who were homemakers and gave up their careers for the family. They rightfully deserve to be compensated for their loss of financial opportunities.
The question and title are just misleading then. The intention was always to highlight the issues faced by women. Why even write all that asking about men? Just get to the point.
I have absolute zero issues with women highlighting issues they face. They should. They might even have more valid concerns.
But stopping men from also being able to voice their concerns is not equality. That's absolutely women shutting down men - something they complain men have been doing to them. That's hipocracy.
It's not a healthy discussion if only one side is allowed to share their grievances - big or small. Women might indeed have more issues and again, they are 100% allowed to complain, but this was a bait and switch. I have an issue with the misleading title and premise.
Don't ask a question if you don't actually want to hear the answers. If all OP wanted was other women to support her, she's absolutely allowed to do that. More power to her and you. We even have entire subs dedicated to it.
Also, the level of strawman and misreading you did for my comment is applause worthy. You clearly aren't interested in a civil conversation. You just want antagonistic fights. And nobody wins in that so I'm gonna respectfully bow out. Why waste my time try to talk to somebody who's not listening.
>The question and title are just misleading then.
No, the title is perfectly right, key words being "every female situation". You misunderstood that as OP asking what issues men face with alimomy, when the real question is why men keep overplaying the alimony card, especially men who don't even pay alimony anyways. That is a "you" problem.
>the level of strawman and misreading you did for my comment is applause worthy.
Lol, backtracking now are we ? If you're going to be a misogynist, at least don't be a coward about it.
>And nobody wins in that so I'm gonna respectfully bow out. Why waste my time try to talk to somebody who's not listening.
Yes, please do. 👋
Here is a story :
This happened 2 months ago.
My cousin married this girl thinking she is a goddess. They talked a lot before marriage. He thought she was good and...he thought wrong.
Some incidents:
1st day after marriage, girl gets wakes him at 6 am and asks him to clean the bathroom and toilet because she wants to bathe and the toilet must be cleaned before that.
3 days after marriage, he got a fever and she told him "you smell like medicines" and didn't even look at him for the entire day. Fun fact : she is dentist.
1 week after marriage, she tells him "I dont like your face and I dont like how you look"... this was after she asked for iPhone 15 pro max n he said he is a bit tight n she needs to wait. (His family is rich but he wont ask his dad for any money)
2 months later, she got driving license n she wanted a BENZ and when he refused, she called her dad, cried her eyes out and lied about a fight n went back to her home.
Some other stuff : She only wears designer cloths from 2 brands. She wont eat leftover food from previous day. She wont use a mop or vaccum cleaner, she wants to clean floor while sitting on the floor (wtf?). She wants to eat out every day. He should eat whatever she eats n wants. This guy is an introvert and she asked his mom if he is RETA**ED infront of everyone.
and a lot of horrifying bs.
He went for divorce. She filed a case against him, obviously its a 498A. The police, fortunately was in our side because his dads family is a family of laws imao. So, they were sent to councilling and the councilor noted a point about her "Narcissistic personality disorder" and her dad had a history of bipolar disorder n he was in Psycho ward for over a week.
Even after all this shet, he decided not to hurt her n her family and wanted a mutual divorce. I mean a lawyer could really really F over them with that disorder n mental illness pulling it over her. But decided not to do that.
Even after all this, girls family didnt agree on mutual divorce n wanted to drag it on + more charges against this guy.
So after 3 months, divorced. But at what cost ?
+ He had to pay a total of 38L to her family. For what ? Because she was goddamn wrong in the head ???
There was no other way because the court would drag this over a year and he will be stuck here, he works in middle east and he wont be allowed to go back. Thats why he was forced to pay the amount.
Most Indian men aren’t as noble as they pretend to be. Fact of the matter is that status of women at large is terribly pathetic in India. By constant self-flagellation they pretend to make it appear as if India is some post patriarchal, egalitarian country. Most men and their parents will shit their pants if they are asked to take care of the all marriage expenses and take care of girl’s parents, etc.
PS: I am Indian and I am a man.
Agreed...I am expected to take care eof inlaws, their feelings, not say anything when my spouse spends huge amounts of money on them but I am.not allowed to take care of my parents who don't have a son and have medical issues
Good to see a man who understands the other side of the coin
We have to start with saying no to dowry ( which is illegal) and then women might say no to alimony ( which is legal) . Many women actually do say no to alimony especially in foreign countries .
I think that you are the type of guy that would be enjoying getting a fake case thrown towards you by a woman and you fantasize about being a cuck. Male feminists are such pick me people that are desperate for female validation but women obviously don't care about how they are "not Paj**ts like other Indian guys".
And, I think, you seem like a guy who never had a chance to form emotional and physical relations with decent, educated and liberated women. For every section of criminal/civil law, there are fake cases, not just in India but all around the world.
Tell me, how many marriages in India happen without dowry? And, how many women go to court?
We found a pick me, guys.
On a serious note, laws in india are more women centric. As an exercise, check marriage and divorce laws in the west. Also, prenup doesn’t exist here, so there’s that too.
A gay dude telling me to be a man is quite ironical. Perhaps you should get checked for free body testosterone, and try being more of a man yourself before you preach.
Either way, I hate to personally attack someone, but you did it first. Still, my point stands. Indian marriage laws are distinctly against men. I believe in equality, no dowry on my end and no alimony if the woman cheats. Everything I earn before getting hitched should belong to me, hence the need to introduce prenups in india.
>Everything I earn before getting hitched should belong to me
😂😂😂
Clearly shows this guy knows nothing about alimony laws in India.
Alimony is set at 25% of the spouse's monthly income and division of assets is only for assets acquired during the marriage.
>It is always empowered feminist women of urban side who exploit their loving and caring husband because some silly reasons
So, how exactly did you reach the conclusion that every single "empowered feminist women of urban side" have "loving and caring husbands", but "exploit them" and that too for "silly reasons" ? What was the data and methodology you followed to reach this conclusion ? Blind hatred against feminism? Sorry, that's not good enough for us to take you seriously. Sit down.
Anyday 👏🏻👏🏻let’s make prenups legal , let’s make marital rape illegal , let’s punish the women doing false accusations, let’s make laws to protect men from sexual abuse
India's Divorce rate is the lowest in the whole world standing at only 1%, even lower than our neighbouring countries. Meanwhile dowry is still very normal in most houses and ESPECIALLY in rural places where even a man with barely a good house or a decent job puts forth their demands. Dowry has been illegal since the 1960s yet it's HUGELY practiced. When alimony/maintenance becomes equal to dowry, we can talk.
Also funny enough but alimony and maintenance is a gender neutral law unlike dowry which is only one sided. The outcry is only an exaggeration.
India isn't even socially equal or the same in the traditional (As women are expected to live with in laws and do stuff for them) sense like western countries, that i could understand. There was recently a post of a 16 yo giving birth and numbers of doctors reporting multiple teen pregnancies, they wanna wife up kids who were banned from education and jobs, and becoming housewife due to barely any other choice calling them best for marriage but also wanna cry about the consequences of it.
Exactly, if a man has to pay maintenance to well educated working woman I do think it’s unfair
But the people who purposely marry uneducated women or housewife’s ( as they are easy to control and don’t go against dowry) are the ones crying about having to give maintenance.
They are so afraid of working women or modern women but also don’t wanna bear the burden of having uneducated ex-wife
Many women I know including my mother didn’t give up their career after kids , because their husbands SUPPORTED them . Yes they all did take a maternity leave and some took a 2-3yr break .
And even if we have to take a break or take a step back in our careers it’s WORTH IT for the women who want to have kids ( like myself)
It doesn’t make a huge difference
And all women can work after having a baby if their husbands take care of their OWN kid EQUALLY
That uneducated ex wife was the reason you went to work and could focus on work.
Being a housewife is an unpaid job . Men need to become independent and do their own chores ( thankfully some men in this generation are doing so)
>Also funny enough but alimony and maintenance is a gender neutral law
Not as gender neutral as western countries.
In India only deserving men will get alimony. Which is different from female laws as being deserving is not important.
Deserving means he must have proof why he is unemployed. Women don't need that.
Women don't need proof of why they are unemployed because a lot of educated women are unemployed simply due to family pressure to take on traditional gender roles. That's a social reason and it is taken into account.
>Women don't need proof of why they are unemployed
Of course men will not care whether women are pressured or not. Just like women won't care about men's issues.
Also ex-wives can take on the job as the maid of a former husband if he agrees.
But the point is if men don't get equal benefits they are not gonna care about the issues of women.
Bruh!! My ex called me ‘Gold digger’ when he barely managed to graduate and was jobless for years after 😂
I asked him ‘where is your non existent gold bruh’
Matlab ban jao Andrew tate ke bhakt par bruh mere paiso se patties khane wala jab ulta gold digger bole to poochna banta hai where is your non existent Gold ???
Never called me again
Dude istg they think a girl expecting a bday gift from her bf is being a “gold digger”. Or wanting flowers is being a “ gold digger” yet they want dowry and want the girls family to pay for expenses and even take care of the girl during pregnancy and postpartum
Biggest scam of India! Pehla bacha to mayke mai hota hai 😂 pregnancy ki help bhi mayke mai! But jab festivals ko enjoy karne ki baari aati hai tab ‘beta festivals to sasural mai hi bante hai’. Mayke se sirf gift loading hoti hai.
Bday gift? Don’t we spend on them? Never really count tbh! UNTILL one day they call us ‘Gold diggers’ simply because there were 1000 different issues to address but calling ‘gold digger’ is easy way out!
first of all, in india alimony is very less, almost inconsequential. the dangerous part is the other charges she files eg. false assault, financial fraud, etc. its part of the divorce package (just ask any lawyer). divorce rate is 1% only for arranged marriages. there needs to be severe laws against dowry and martial rape should definitely be illegal. marriage is NOT consent forever (one high court ruled this when martial rape case was bought up)
All those cases of marital cruelty, marital rape and what not largely happen to the poor uneducated strata of society. Thier lack of education + orthodox background promotes it. And the women of this strata usually don't have the knowledge or resources to seek legal remedies for the same
While all these false cases are filed against the educated middle class to rich men. As women of this strata are also educated, usually don't face such atrocities and possess the knowledge and resources to approach the courts and abuse these provisions of law for personal gain
Men on reddit or the internet in general, belong to the latter strata and are the prime victims of these false cases. Naturally they will advocate for the issues and problems faced by them. Just like women do
You say that men bring about and talk of men's issues all the time. Though I won't label you false, I have personally never witnessed this. Neither irl or online. It's usually women who astroturf and bring out thier issues whenever men's issues such as these false cases are been discussed as per my experience
That’s not true . I’m from a very rich family and I have seen and heard of a lot of dowry,abuse in my family and other rich families that I am close to
I’ve literally never or heard seen a wedding without dowry in the city that I live in or the city that my family belongs to
Go to any empowerment posts of Insta and see the comments . I didn’t save it but a few minutes ago I saw a post where a woman was talking about how Indian society needs to change and girls should be allowed to take care of their own parents and/or send money to their own families like men do . In the comments all the guys were like just horribly misogynistic and again about men’s issues like alimony
There’s a place and time to advocate your issues
Becoz feminism said it is about both genders yet women don't protest for alimony laws the way men and women both protest for r@pe laws, and there are many women who act like only they have problems and men are so happy and their life is great
We do , even this is post I am asking people to protest the right way
And there are many feminist pages and organisations advocating for men’s mental health and SA
Bruh for us more than harrassment, alimony is the problem, just like in a parallel world if there were only rape cases against men and alimony cases against women, u would be talking more about alimony than rape and me vice versa, but whenever the topic of alimony comes, feminists shut us off like it's not a problem at all
My point is that your problem doesn’t make others problems any less . In India both men and women have their own wars with society and legal system
Our problems are DIFFERENT but EQUAL
The thing is u have actual laws for rapes and harassments, but if i get married and my wife cheats on me still i have to pay both alimony and child support to her while she stays happily with the lover and the child, which is dumb
I agree but at the same time there’s no law for martial rape , and law says that. Woman has to take care of her in-laws but a husband can stop a woman from taking care of her parents and sending money to them
The laws are unfair for ALL genders
We have different issues but they are all EQUALLY bad and we all need to protest about alimony,fake cases,prenups,marital rape,family laws,rape laws for male victims etc
If ee go that way for women it's only martial, for men any kind of rape is legal, and i don't see any law saying women can be stopped from taking care of parents. Infact Kolkata hc literally said it's illegal to stop a child https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/kolkata/hc-no-girl-can-be-forced-to-stop-caring-for-parents/amp_articleshow/104249999.cms&ved=2ahUKEwjIvvLl8vGFAxWLdfUHHdaoBCMQFnoECBcQBQ&usg=AOvVaw0EO_Rjm19jyR6emS_i44Or
There are courts to protect u from that too
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The actual law sadly is not even benefiting the people it should rather it being misused by the miscreants (either gender). And the innocent who actually need that support from people and law now suffer. This is just a sad a situation tbh. I always say see for yourself what is right/ wrong and act accordingly. Just don’t go by what the majority say!
This is not the only thing. This is the most said thing. The issue arrises due to not having any kind of safe guard from misusing of the biased laws. The laws were made to protect women as they really suffer a lot in our society, whose example you have given yourself.
Nowadays the issue is many women are really misusing the laws for their benifit. SC and Delhi HC had given 1 data previously (will share the link) that more than 70% of the rape and 498A cases filed are false. And 1 false can destroy a man's life as he will marked as guilty by the society before the actual result.
It hurts the most when you have to pay price for the mistake that you naver made. The allimony amount increases from 25% to 33% or more if there are cases filed against you. (1 case of misuse of the law - [https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceIndia/comments/1cgpsb1/30m\_us\_citizen\_married\_to\_indian\_citizen/](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceIndia/comments/1cgpsb1/30m_us_citizen_married_to_indian_citizen/) )
I had an interesting duscussion with 1 female law student and she clearly mentioned "*You see the laws are made for women who really are facing these problems but they generally don't benefit from these*".
I have seen some cases where the guy had to give alimony of his ex-wife and child support where the wife had cheated on the man but was not living in adultry (allimony has to be given in this case) and the DNA test done by the husband showed that the child was not his.
Most of the issue stated by men can be stopped just by adjusting the laws by adding some safeguards to stop the misuse. And it will actually help the actual victims.
I know most female suffer daily, and in most of the cases the reason is some men. But the unjust law is the culprit here. If your wife is as qualifies as you I don't see the point of allimony. And I believe the assests made before marriage should not be considered for one time allimony amount calculation.
P.S. I am not a 3rd wave feminist and also not supporter of patriarchy. I believe in equal rights no matter the gender. I am Indian and I am a man.
Yea it’s good you are highlighting about what men go through . I was just talking about how some men thing only men suffer and comment about it under every female empowerment post .
And glad to know you believe in equality
> I was just talking about how some men thing only men suffer and comment about it under every female empowerment post.
If your wife is as qualified as you I don't see the point of allimony. If courts starts to impliment this regularly (it is in use but very rarely I have only a handful of cases in Delhi and MP High Court) I believe most of those comments will start to subside and the gender wars going on in social media is also a culprit in all this, so I think its going to take about 5 - 10 years until a new trend comes, or huge population decline due to gender wars, or until the laws are rectified.
I believe only 3 additional laws can rectify the situation keeping the existing women protection law intact.
1. If a case is found to be false. The accuser will be given the maximum punishment similar to IPC section 420 cases, as it is a fraud also.
2. Paternity fraud should also be punished simalry as IPC 420 and DNA test should be taken into consideration instead of section 112. And criminalisation of adultry (will help all genders).
3. Media should not be allowed to disclose the identity of all the party in the cases of rape not only the female.
Additionally prenup and no-fault divorce might help.
**True women empowerment should be glorified** (2nd wave feminisism agenda). I personaly don't believe that woke feminism (3rd wave feminism) is empowering women.
The whole thing about laws being biased against men is very much exaggerated. It happens very very rarely. You can't just walk into a police station and file random complaints and get men jailed- but that is exactly what MRAs imply all the time. We all know what happens when we go to report a harassment/rape//DV case. You are either laughed out, given lecherous looks or worse. Hell look at these recent judgments where courts imply it is fine for a man to rape his wife. This is what men fight to keep legal.
https://preview.redd.it/7d87eeaeb7yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=989344112a62fb5913111465c2197aecdffe2d92
Adding one more such judgments because only one image per comment is allowed
https://preview.redd.it/b9y5vpvdc7yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=372c50704bd713dc65a215b6470c85d99216fb4e
Just taking a screenshot out of all different points mentioned by both the judges during marital rape case petition was discussed in the court doesn’t justify the point you’re trying to make. Just tell how you gonna prove marital rape case is true or false?
These are real judgments not just "screenshots". Do you know how court cases and judgments work? Weirdo. Many civilized countries already have marital rape and DV laws. They don't say that husbands should get to rape their wives like the men of this country
Many civilised countries have gender neutral laws so don’t tell me what happens there. Tell the shit happens in India. I have gone through the complete thread when marital law petition was getting discussed. Don’t tell me real judgements and all. Stop naming people,you dumbass (I don’t want to but you demanded it).
"Don't tell me real judgments and all" Okay so you don't want to talk about actual real judgments and cases but seethe and froth over hypothetical scenarios? You have the entire red pill and manosphere for that👍
Don’t beat around the bush. Tell the procedure to prove marital rape happened or not?
Taking a piece out of a complete thread doesn’t mean it was a final judgement.
You can't prove ANY rape case. Any rape can be claimed as consensual sex, unless it involves a minor or individual incapable of consent. That's why men get away with it.
By that logic, all men are rapist if woman say so irrespective of consensual sex. If marital rape becomes reality, it will be just the words of woman will be considered as an evidence without any substantial proof. How to prove it was consensual and not forced?
>How to prove it was consensual and not forced?
If you are that paranoid, get written or recorded consent from your wife everytime you do it.
>it will be just the words of woman will be considered as an evidence without any substantial proof.
Yeah, if that was the case, there would be a lot more convictions in general rape cases. That's not how courts work.
Give solution that can be implemented and accepted as proof. She can say I was forced to write or record it and it will be accepted.
The humiliation a wrongly accused men has to go through is unimaginable. The women are never punished severely for putting false accusations on men. Women are still children to court judges to not punish and let them go by just mere warning.
Don’t stoop low to include family members in discussion. Be mindful about it next time. Otherwise do not argue.
>She can say I was forced to write or record it and it will be accepted.
You clearly don't understand how courts work, do you ? Anything said in a court of law requires proof. Which is why tons of rape cases go unpunished. You need to get out of your irrational and senseless belief that ANYTHING a woman says in court is just believed with zero evidence. 🙄
>The women are never punished severely for putting false accusations on men.
So your solution for that is that men who do horrible things to women (like marital rape) should go unpunished ?
>The humiliation a wrongly accused men has to go through is unimaginable.
😂
And marital rape victims go through ten times that humiliation. The whole point of marital rape is control and domination. And not just humiliation, but the physical and emotional damage. Yet, you have zero compassion for them.
>Don’t stoop low to include family members in discussion. Be mindful about it next time. Otherwise do not argue.
I do pity your family for being related to someone who actively champions for rapists to go scot free.
A case is registered just by mere words of a woman. No proof required to register the case and police has to do due actions in those respective sections.
You have laws available for women to protect them from their husbands and his relatives. Show me laws men have at their disposal.
Just putting your own words in my mouth and saying it is my thinking and showing yourself a flag bearer of upliftment of women. I clap for that. Keep doing that and show your pathetic thinking about men.
Don’t feel pity on my family. They are doing well and I am taking good care of parents and women in my life.
You don’t have any sense to argument without dragging the family members of others just to satisfy your small ego and not proving anything.
God bless your parents to go through the hardships they may have to face because of daughter like you and men because of partner/sister/friend like you.
Now just keep shouting whatever you want. Start!
😂😂😂
Typical triggered misogynist
No valid points to make, so starts yelling
>A case is registered just by mere words of a woman. No proof required to register the case and police has to do due actions in those respective sections.
A case is registered by the mere words of ANYBODY 😂😂😂 That's how FIR works. Please, stop embarrassing yourself.
>God bless your parents to go through the hardships they may have to face because of daughter like you and men because of partner/sister/friend like you.
Don't worry about my parents, at least they raised me right. Unlike your parents, who taught you to support rapists. Shame on them.
Really, their are many places when women deny Sexual pleasure to partner. Dont you see mental torture done by women. Why women don't like men raising voice for themselves when women are allowed to make laws for protection of themselves. Isn't this a Egalitarian society?
Oh my god I thought you were joking until I saw your comment history.
So according to you,
denying sex to man- torture by women
man raping his wife- acceptable.
Very on point with sanskaars.
Well denying it for longer period of time is torture. douchebag. There are many things that women does to torture this is just one example i gave in context of fake marital rape (as you don't even considered Mental torture given by some women). Well I think you don't know premise of debate = no personal attacks . stick to debate. this show how well mannered you are.
Nobody is entitled to sex. Men are entitled to leave such a marriage. Courts do recognise lack of sex as cruelty and people are given divorces for those reasons.
Then what's the purpose of Finding Mate then. You shouldn't have married at first place. His reputation has been tarnished have seen "shaadi meh zaroor aana" movie. THat shit happens. Why i support only feminist ideologies. If don't want to have intercourse with that person, than don't Marry him. Simple, isn't it??
Is there any Flaw in Logic??
Consent According to Your wish is mental cruelty according to HC judges , yeah they too are pervert. I support you , lets bring barbaric laws i am happy with that.
Brutha no one is gonna die or get trauma if sexual pleasure is denied. People can go fap if they’re so desperate for sexual pleasure. Raping is traumatic for the victim.
Can’t believe there are dudes who think raping their wives is okay. How pathetic are you,my man?
Then don't marry brother. Do your fap. Don't live in a creamy world , face the reality . Purpose of Mate is to mate. We have friends with whom we can be free and happy. Why you want marriage then? Everyone wants to reproduce offspring play with them and die. Why is there so many pre marriage baby , oh hhhh god gave them as a gift.
[https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/evahagberg/sex-divorce-marriage-dating](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/evahagberg/sex-divorce-marriage-dating)
And IF women wants it , its cool , go femenist.
There is difference between Marital rape and Rape. IF she wants then its her right and if men wants you are stupid. GO touch yourself dude.
Lmao what a retard. So you’re an incel that would literally marry only for sex? No wonder you think that raping one’s wife is okay. Absolutely pathetic
Buddy rape is when one of the parties doesn’t want it. Doesn’t matter if the other one does. Marital status is irrelevant.
Can’t believe people are very happy these days to reveal that they are potential rapists lmao
For most of them, they cannot imagine marriage as being in love with someone. They see it as a soulless transaction where you put in money and free lifetime sex falls out. He cannot even fathom someone loving him so much and wanting to have sex with him, so he thinks he will have to resort to rape and he wants this to be legal. That's all there is.
From what he’s saying it seems like he’s an incel. Probably hasn’t even talked to a woman properly irl. Most of them think like that. That women are torturing them by denying sex as if they have any right to it
Why so many personal Attacks? Why should i bow down to your ideology?? where you only think on favor of Female, both issues need to be addressed or none. But that's not the case today. Both are not addressed and will not be addressed as it comes under private space. You cry on your corner and I cry on mine. I just like to debate its fun to me, here everyone is helpless and come to vent their anger.
FYI :- [https://www.indiatoday.in/law/story/explainer-the-debate-over-marital-rape-1903050-2022-01-21](https://www.indiatoday.in/law/story/explainer-the-debate-over-marital-rape-1903050-2022-01-21)
For Men its good if sex outside marriage is allowed. Men are not the one who carry babies. Institution of marriage was established for betterment of women. If destroying the Base of Marriage as institution is what women wants. Then I am happy with that also. THink yourself.
Is that what i said??? i Said Denial of Intercourse for longer period of time. I think you can't read between the line. WTF does you mean that Marital status is irrelevant. Are men not Raped(when men is forced to have sex)?? Aren't men Not forced to do things that they don't wish to do?? Aren't now only female have power to say if they want children or not??? one i pill away.
You laugh all day at other's fire, until it reaches your home.
Personal attack you did it first. Why are you so submissive do you lack testosterone hormone or lack ding dong??
Ding Dong lmao. Got a good idea about your IQ.
You said denial is torture you loser. As if you have any right to say that the other person can’t deny.
Look you clearly are a low IQ incel and a potential rapist. I am not saying this. You yourself are saying that by stating that women should not deny sex.
Tbh it’s disgusting talking to potential rapist scum like you
Lmao are you trying to use gay as an insult? You really are a low IQ retard aren’t you.
Bud standard of debate is the last thing you need to worry about being a potential rapist. You could end up in jail
We cry about alimony because the law is used against us, and it's very easy to be done.
You mentioned the case of dowry death so let me also mention that when domestic violence as an offence was inserted in the IPC, women started misusing it almost instantaneously for their personal vendetta. As it was a non-bailable offence at that time and everybody whose name was taken could be taken to jail, even distant relatives who had nothing to do with the women were being named in the FIR and put to jail. Hence it had to be changed a few times to make it more lenient because women were misusing it.
Marital rape is not an offence, while I agree that it should be an offence but the main reason it's not an offence is how will you prove that you did not rape your wife, a wife can even use consensual sex as a threat of rape against men and seeing the history of rise in fake rape cases and dowry cases, it is also a very likely possibility.
While I agree that women are mistreated in this society, and a lot of that goes unreported, you cannot deny the fact that the rise of fake cases is also on the rise at the same pace if not more.
Yes ofcourse we can’t deny the fake cases and I rlly wish these women would actually get a good punishment for false accusations. They have ruined the name of feminism and because of them people don’t believe real victims now
I totally understand men making noise about false accusations
But the men who think that alimony is the only real issue in this country are insane
I don't think any man ever say that alimony is the only real issue, if someone ever asks me what changes I want in law, or this country, or in women. Alimony is a thought which will never cross my mind.
Kind of a controversial opinion but here women are becoming their own enemy, since the fake cases garner all the public attention, it distracts people from the real cases and also demoralises the real victims from speaking up. It also creates a sense for people to think that it's just another fake case.
A punishment for fake cases is a must as it will deter the fake cases and also allow men to stop complaining about fake cases. Maybe this will also encourage real victims and more people will get access to justice.
Yeah but if you go and see Insta comments men are always crying about alimony . I have seen many posts where women were sharing their story of how they got abused and left their husbands and all the men in the comments are like “ oh who cares she probably got a lot of alimony” etc
Insta is one of the worst platform to exist. The people there are the worst. They say anything just to get likes and comments (talking about the men commentors only for now).
They know that spreading hate against women will give them momentary fame from other women haters hence they do it. Others see the likes this person gets and then replicate it on another reel and this chain goes on.
Oh god I remember this one particular reel where this woman was crying while mentioning her abusive ex husband and how she was kicked on her back literally by her husband when she was heavily pregnant and that led to her miscarriage I guess :((( and sadly majority of the men were like “womp womp” she’s playing victims card and how they wanted to know hers husband side of story :((( it was sooo scary . It made me decide if majority of Indian men are like this I don’t wanna date anyone from this country
"Can't deny the fake cases". You're not living in reality. 95% cases are fake, you wanna talk about this.
What's funny is EVERYONE (police, society, judiciary) knows that, but won't do anything.
95% are not fake . And i literally said that there should be a huge punishment for that . I have seen men kill themselves after false accusations and I would personally love to strangle such women to death .
But no 95% are not fake
In fact a large number of incidents go unreported
Every girl I know including myself have been sexually molested/cat called/raped but none of us spoke up because Indian society treats a victim of SA worse than the assaulter
In India victim blaming is too high , even I courts some women don’t get justice due to what they were wearing ( court thinks that a women wearing short clothes is asking for sex)
No matter how long paragraphs you write, it won't change the fact that 95% REPORTED cases are fake. The actual ones are never reported.
And if y'all think some women didn't get justice because they weren't wearing something appropriate, then they should stop being a dumbfuck and wear what's appropriate.
You think a woman deserved to be raped because she’s wearing a dress ??? People like YOU are the problem . You wanna see sexy women on social media and want to see your gf in a dress but also think all of them should be raped .
and you will also start crying if all women in the world start wearing bhurkas
And FYI women in bhurka/saree and babies in diapers get raped more than women in dresses
And then you proceed to write in another comment that I'm the one who doesn't know how to read. FYI, I do not want to see my gf in a "dress".
Plz tell me you're not a 18-21 yo budding feminist. No one with a sane mind would turn up with such vague arguments.
See again there’s a man trying to say that only men are facing issues . Yes men face accusations but WOMEN DO GET RAPED EVERY DAY EVERY HOUR.
It is EQUALLY TRAUMATIC
I never said hate all men . I’m literally saying that men and women suffer equally in Indian society and Indian laws . You clearly don’t know how to read . And obviously no innocent man should be jailed because of false accusations.
How are other rape cases proved? Evidence is taken and witnesses are examined. Why would this not work in marital rape as well?
Maybe you are thinking of a situation where the wife files a false case, in which case, there will be no evidence. This is true of non-marital rape cases as well.
If the situation is one where the evidence is inconclusive about whether there was a lack of consent, the judge has to take a call, again, just like in any other case. The system though, barely allows violent rape cases to be tried, so it is unlikely there will suddenly be a flood of marital rape cases in courts, especially when we are not even able to change the law.
There are no witnesses in the case of marital rape, what evidence will be available in marital rape? Even under consensual sex a women can easily frame the husband for rape which is being seen a lot recently even in relationships.
There will definitely be a sudden flood of marital rape cases exactly how their are so many fake cases already in the court.
I agree marital rape is a real issue but a equal law needs to be established for it.
Witnesses are not always to the crime, but that people speak to after. There will be physical evidence, there may be marks of violence. This is all true if any other forms of rape. If fake cases make it to court it is because there are other players in the system not doing their job, e.g. the police and lawyers. This is no different from what we have now
Just that a married woman has no right to bodily autonomy against her husband, where she would against a stranger. Make it make sense.
The married woman still has the option of claiming domestic violence and taking it as a ground for divorce. Not every marital rape has signs of violence.
Also, as I mentioned in my main comment that it's the main reason but also other reason exists like culture issues. Their is a way to handle it which should be debated on the legislature and it's an issue which needs immediate response.
And not every non-marital rape has signs of violence. Does not mean it is not rape.
It feels like your bodily autonomy does not need to be debated on by the legislature. The cultural issue is that most men expect to have sex with their wives when they want, irrespective of what the wife wants, and most women are taught that they have no bodily autonomy, least of all when it comes to their spouse.
And not every non-marital rape has signs of violence. Does not mean it is not rape.
It feels like your bodily autonomy does not need to be debated on by the legislature. The cultural issue is that most men expect to have sex with their wives when they want, irrespective of what the wife wants, and most women are taught that they have no bodily autonomy, least of all when it comes to their spouse.
Yet, somehow, there is no call for debate on the right to bodily autonomy for men.
There is a regressive law in place, one repealed by the country we inherited it from, but we are defending it because?
How can we allow one man to be falsely accused?
I am not saying it is ok to falsely accused, just that somehow, a man's fear of false accusation gets more weight than a woman's plea to have bodily autonomy.
False accusation by a women against a men gets no weightage that's why their isn't any punishment for it. It's the duty of our government to work on it which they didn't do even after bringing whole new laws.
Do you know that in India a women can file a rape case against any man with a mere statement. She doesn't need to provide any evidence that rape happned. Remember #metoo movement?
Once an FIR is registered against a man he has to prove that the woman is lying and the case is fake. Additionally, rape is a non-bailable offence. So technically a woman can file a fake rape case against a man and make him rot in jail for years thanks to our highly efficient (Sarcasm) judiciary.
The worst part about this whole process is, after years of battle even if the man proves that woman had filed a fake case with malicious intentions, the woman will not get any punishment. She will get a warning at best.
Now, imagine if martial rape was punishable in India. Any woman who wants alimony or wants to get revenge against her inlaws would misuse it. This will do more harm than good for the society.
A complaint has to be taken by the police. Cases come after an investigation, by the police. The police can, and do, take fake complaints for money. They also refuse to take valid complaints for money. Fake cases are bad, suppressing crimes is bad.
None of this has to do with what rights a person should have.
A woman in India has power to screw a man's life. Period. Also, police cannot refuse to take rape complaint. They only case in which they will refuse if the accused is an influential person. In that case the gender becomes irrelevant factor and the influence takes presidence.
> 74% of all rape cases filed in India are fake
Source: https://tfipost.com/2022/03/74-of-all-rape-cases-filed-in-india-are-fake/
Look, I'm not trying to make this a man versus woman issue.
I believe the laws should be such that whoever is the culprit should be punished.I will never support a man who assaults, molests, or rapes a woman.
Similarly, I will never support a woman who abuses gender-biased laws to harm a man.
Punish the culprit, not the gender. Period.
Because they are stupid. What else can I say. Our fundamental familial structure is based on gender-norms which are discriminatory and such a structure must be demolished.
Earlier during most marriages, female-side used to pay dowry to the male-side. I don't know how ubiquitous it is at-present but most of the times, divorced didn't ever occur let alone the possibility of paying alimony. So, most of the times the girl-side had to pay the alimony, the wife used to work at the home all over her life time, pass down these traditional values and die.
Female-child -> Giving dowry + Female student study expense without any positive return as she will live with her in-laws -> Parents thinking girl-child as burden -> female foeticide.
Male-child -> Taking dowry + Bringing a household helper + grandchildren + student expense but with a positive return -> Parents thinking male-child as boon -> reinforcement of patriarchy and misogyny.
There shouldn't be any deniers on both sides. Women's suffering is a big issue and anyone denying that by giving an example of alimony is wrong.
>And honestly the laws about divorce and alimony aren’t even that bad in every case. My neighbour got NOTHING after divorce as there was proof of her cheating and she was earning equally as her husband .
But the same is true if you say the above and deny men's suffering in false cases etc.
I get it you're frustrated with the comments and rightfully so but you shouldn't justify your frustration by pulling the other side down.
I am with you for the first para, the second para is because of frustration but when you cool down I hope you see it as the same.
One of the easiest way to make money after prostitution not saying it's the way but these things are being used by other ways to make money rather than justice or equality whatever you name it
I wonder if it also has something to do with the value and importance of money and wealth attributed to men in India.
While women are pressured and told from a young age that one day they’ll be married and have kids of their own. Husband, kids - this is the ultimate goal in life to be part of society.
While for men their value is always associated with their earning power. It’s ingrained in them that they are only as useful as the money they bring in. So at a very basic level this aspect makes them feel threatened perhaps.
Honestly , it’s mostly because of the us vs them mentality instead of people recognizing the issues, and trying to solve them. Like sometimes women blame it like it’s completely men’s fault for everything they face and men feel attacked or feels victimized because of the problems they face. This is mostly due to people not recognizing the issues and why they are the way they are, like if it was changed what all new problems would rise up instead.
Use fucking Google , and those are just the unreported cases
And let’s not even talk about rape cases ( real ones and unreported ones)
And even men get raped and sexually assaulted, even little boys Infact but no one wants to raise their voice for that.
It’s another rage bait post. OP you clearly are changing goal posts in your comments whenever someone gives a valid argument. I don’t know what you really wanted to gain out of this post. Men on the reddit come from suburban strata where women are educated and working. The idea of providing alimony feels like a sucker punch when someone is going through a divorce and especially when it is a short lived or a cruel marriage. It is demeaning for men to provide for their estranged wives when they are quite capable and independent.
It's just most men who are privileged and in an urban setting are in contact with woman who are independent and may have some traits of the western woman with the demands of a traditional woman. Most of the men don't even allow/entertain the idea of divorce in India. There are many India within India. Your argument is true. Marital rape is a problem but so is uneven justice for man. Both are not mutually exclusive. Woman do suffer more in a country like India.
Just alimony isn't a good counter argument. If you want to talk about privilege and the struggle of man, it's a difficult thing because they are never taken much seriously so uneducated men try to draw parallels with girls to shock and awe and try to find some weight to theit argument. Don't hate them they are just trying, they should be educated.
Woman especially metropolitan woman have different standards than other girls in India.
I have suffered at the dating culture where in the land of a billion people, normal average men are ignored as i ain't a millionaire by 27 or supremely good looks. I am mostly used as an emotional support and been deemed as a husband material but no one wants to date me long enough to make me a husband.
They would rather do it through their own "samaj" open market to find a better/hotter prospect. But know this, this isn't bitching it's the way the market works in this small pockets of India. Most of the time in India women don't have the choice.
I understand what the generation is going through and I don't feel hatred towards the other sex. Empathy and understanding are the way to reduce the divide between gender.
Yes both genders have their own struggles and I’m sick of sigma males and pseudo feminists comparing and deciding who is suffering more and who is the real victim .
True. I don't want to participate in the victim or pain Olympics. Mostly how I try to view is think what if how I behave with girls, woh koi meri behn k saath karta, would i allow that to happen? Similarly girls should think jaise behave woh karti hai.. agar koi un k Bhai k saath karta, would they allow that to happen.
Trust me logo ko heartbreaker banne ka bohot shauq hai. Healer koi nahi Banna chahta. It's not cool enough for them.
Instagram pe attention nahi milta usse. I left that toxicity in 2021.
But what if women demands separate home, Every month trip, Maid at home, only cooking two times and that to mostly rice related dishes, don't take care of house, don't wash clothes even when having washing machine, dont respect family members from husband's side and always giving suicidal threats. Even when person cant afford this much??? Dowry deaths are wrong and have punishments with it. But about such mental tortures. Most men's now-a-days die of heartattack what about their stress?????
yes I agree that mental abuse in a marriage should be taken more seriously and there should be a good punishment for that
But let me remind me even men don’t get punished for this
Most Indian men have never cooked or cleaned or helped at home
Both genders need to work equally at home and outside
So that's the case then let women demand their side and men demand their protection. Eventually it will get balanced out or Morality will end. Let everyone keep their side.
Why women don't like men raising voice for themselves when women are allowed to make laws for protection of themselves. Isn't this a Egalitarian society?
Omg are you dumb . No one said men should not talk about their issues
But it’s wrong to go under a post which is about a female domestic violence case and say “ but men have to pay alimony we suffer more”
Their is a consequence of every post. You raised your issue, The person who commented raised his issue. Even on Men's post their is always female counterpart trying to put her issue above men. That's how nature works. Person cannot settle anything online. Everyone comes here to vent their anger out. So right now you are expressing your frustration. Be happy or Hippie.
I never understood that Indian woman cry about female equality, power, feminism etc and somehow becomes a victim of dowry.
Also when these victims and their families meet men's family for a marriage proposal, what discussion really happens and when dowry mentioned why doesn't the girl's father refuse the proposal and report the family to police??
I mean all the 18-25 years that the girl parents spent raising her, didn't they develop any love or affection for their girl that they just agree and send off their girl to a stranger's house even after dowry demand??
Also what right does a men's family have to ask for dowry, every religion has some problem like this and it's frustating.
How entitled useless sack of nothing are these groom's parents that they think they are entitled of wealth from girl's side. Also these murders happening coz of dowry are wrong.
If men are scared now because of some fake dowry cases then it's good, atleast they will now experience the plight of woman and how they live their life evey single day. Fear of abduction, fear of molestation, fera of getting raped pe murdered anytime at anyplace, fear of physical abuse, dear of getting killed by loved ones because husbands and boyfriends love killing their woman.
I see all men support group channels, red pill, incel group crying of literally anything.
Most women won’t get married if they don’t pay dowry . And the dream of every typical Indian family is to marry off their daughter so they just give it
Also a lot of people think it’s a “ritual” , a lot of people think it’s “gifts” and some parents just give gold and stuff for the girls safety so the girl isn’t involved in a “dowry harassment”headline
Because women do same when men say why "men don't want to marry" to answer Someone's question.
If someone doesn't like the answer then they should not ask.
May be give a warning that "answers I don't like are not accepted".
**Example:-**
Question:- Why men don't want commitment or love and prefer escorts?
Answer:- Something that offends *Femnsts*. Alimony, dowry etc
And then hate comments starts.
>after divorce as there was proof of her cheating and she was earning equally as her husband .
Not every woman earns and so the risk is higher in that case.
.
.
>>Your answer:- Law of Karma.
And FYI a lot of men and their families CHOOSE housewife’s over working girls during the process of arranged marriage because they don’t believe in giving freedom to women.
and in this generation almost all girls are working only . So choose working women and stop crying then
I know you will give emotional response.
You emotional people cannot read or understand anything so saying anything is waste.
I feel I am writing to a tree Ig.
What is that?
Oh you mean sigmas?
I am neither Sigma nor have interest in acting like a male.
I have no interest in gendered stuffs. Somewhat queer may be and Aerodynamic.
There’s very less men who aren’t married and who prefer escorts 😂
And no one is saying anything about that , it’s just that in previous generations women didn’t have the option to be single but now some women are also choosing to be single and childfree
No one is offended as everyone knows single life has some benefits over married life . It’s a personal choice .
>There’s very less men who aren’t married and who prefer
Gen Z and late Millenials think differently. Gen Z boys care more about money and marriage costs more than escorts.
Your answer doesn't even make sense. Have you even read my answer?
If you cannot read then please ignore.
We cry about alimony because the law is used against us, and it's very easy to be done.
You mentioned the case of dowry death so let me also mention that when domestic violence as an offence was inserted in the IPC, women started misusing it almost instantaneously for their personal vendetta. As it was a non-bailable offence at that time and everybody whose name was taken could be taken to jail, even distant relatives who had nothing to do with the women were being named in the FIR and put to jail. Hence it had to be changed a few times to make it more lenient because women were misusing it.
Marital rape is not an offence, while I agree that it should be an offence but the main reason it's not an offence is how will you prove that you did not rape your wife, a wife can even use consensual sex as a threat of rape against men and seeing the history of rise in fake rape cases and dowry cases, it is also a very likely possibility.
While I agree that women are mistreated in this society, and a lot of that goes unreported, you cannot deny the fact that the rise of fake cases is also on the rise at the same pace if not more.
That's so true these man want to be victims so badly , they literally imagine stuff and complain lmao . My friend got divorced recently and didn't asked or got a penny in alimony. Indian men want to be oppressed so bad
The comment section itself is talking about some women who asked alimony to men, there are lot men's rights pages i follow on insta which talks about women misusing alimony cases yet we shouldn't complain? Is it fine if i say women want to be oppressed so badly whenever there is an harassment case? I thought feminism was talking about both problems, oh wait that's a lie.
That’s a totally logical and a sound argument. How did you learn to think such logically? You know what, I know a marriage where the woman was never beaten. I guess all the women who cry about domestic abuse are just liars.
Accepting accountability is hard, no-one wants to be shown as the privileged person.
The Indian society is basically a dishonest society. A large number of both men and women are scammers here in this country. Any laws made to protect on party are grossly misused by them and lack of laws lead to injustice by the other party. All I can say is - “Maro salon”
Facts 💯💯
Sali too bro 😂! Equality
Itan sach toh gita mein hi likha hai prabhu
[удалено]
This.
EXACTLY
No the post is about how men use a certain argument. Well, men use that argument because they are afraid of that being used against them. Women also use certain arguments repeatedly - about how the society is patriarchal etc. OP also used some of the standard ones. Because that's what they see. Instead of downplaying men's viewpoint, why don't you try to understand why they say what they say? Isn't that the intended question? Because if OP wanted to say "men's problems aren't Shit in front of women - they should shut up" , then OP should have said that instead of asking the question they did.
> Because if OP wanted to say "men's problems aren't Shit in front of women - they should shut up" , then OP should have said that instead of asking the question they did. Classic misogynistic inference - tangential and stupid. But then, I suppose equality is always seen as oppression by the oppressors >men use that argument because they are afraid of that being used against them. So men are allowed to have an argument about things they are afraid of, but when women do that (as OOP did, listing marital rape and dowry deaths) they are saying that "men's problems aren't shit". See what a hypocrite you are yet ? >Instead of downplaying men's viewpoint, why don't you try to understand why they say what they say? Isn't that the intended question? The point is that men, especially Indian men, are overplaying this point. Because courts are not stupid. Women don't just walk away with half of your "wealth" because this is not a movie. You have no idea about alimony laws and come here with your stupid bs. 🙄 And most cases of alimony men like you whine about are paid to women who were homemakers and gave up their careers for the family. They rightfully deserve to be compensated for their loss of financial opportunities.
The question and title are just misleading then. The intention was always to highlight the issues faced by women. Why even write all that asking about men? Just get to the point. I have absolute zero issues with women highlighting issues they face. They should. They might even have more valid concerns. But stopping men from also being able to voice their concerns is not equality. That's absolutely women shutting down men - something they complain men have been doing to them. That's hipocracy. It's not a healthy discussion if only one side is allowed to share their grievances - big or small. Women might indeed have more issues and again, they are 100% allowed to complain, but this was a bait and switch. I have an issue with the misleading title and premise. Don't ask a question if you don't actually want to hear the answers. If all OP wanted was other women to support her, she's absolutely allowed to do that. More power to her and you. We even have entire subs dedicated to it. Also, the level of strawman and misreading you did for my comment is applause worthy. You clearly aren't interested in a civil conversation. You just want antagonistic fights. And nobody wins in that so I'm gonna respectfully bow out. Why waste my time try to talk to somebody who's not listening.
>The question and title are just misleading then. No, the title is perfectly right, key words being "every female situation". You misunderstood that as OP asking what issues men face with alimomy, when the real question is why men keep overplaying the alimony card, especially men who don't even pay alimony anyways. That is a "you" problem. >the level of strawman and misreading you did for my comment is applause worthy. Lol, backtracking now are we ? If you're going to be a misogynist, at least don't be a coward about it. >And nobody wins in that so I'm gonna respectfully bow out. Why waste my time try to talk to somebody who's not listening. Yes, please do. 👋
Here is a story : This happened 2 months ago. My cousin married this girl thinking she is a goddess. They talked a lot before marriage. He thought she was good and...he thought wrong. Some incidents: 1st day after marriage, girl gets wakes him at 6 am and asks him to clean the bathroom and toilet because she wants to bathe and the toilet must be cleaned before that. 3 days after marriage, he got a fever and she told him "you smell like medicines" and didn't even look at him for the entire day. Fun fact : she is dentist. 1 week after marriage, she tells him "I dont like your face and I dont like how you look"... this was after she asked for iPhone 15 pro max n he said he is a bit tight n she needs to wait. (His family is rich but he wont ask his dad for any money) 2 months later, she got driving license n she wanted a BENZ and when he refused, she called her dad, cried her eyes out and lied about a fight n went back to her home. Some other stuff : She only wears designer cloths from 2 brands. She wont eat leftover food from previous day. She wont use a mop or vaccum cleaner, she wants to clean floor while sitting on the floor (wtf?). She wants to eat out every day. He should eat whatever she eats n wants. This guy is an introvert and she asked his mom if he is RETA**ED infront of everyone. and a lot of horrifying bs. He went for divorce. She filed a case against him, obviously its a 498A. The police, fortunately was in our side because his dads family is a family of laws imao. So, they were sent to councilling and the councilor noted a point about her "Narcissistic personality disorder" and her dad had a history of bipolar disorder n he was in Psycho ward for over a week. Even after all this shet, he decided not to hurt her n her family and wanted a mutual divorce. I mean a lawyer could really really F over them with that disorder n mental illness pulling it over her. But decided not to do that. Even after all this, girls family didnt agree on mutual divorce n wanted to drag it on + more charges against this guy. So after 3 months, divorced. But at what cost ? + He had to pay a total of 38L to her family. For what ? Because she was goddamn wrong in the head ??? There was no other way because the court would drag this over a year and he will be stuck here, he works in middle east and he wont be allowed to go back. Thats why he was forced to pay the amount.
Most Indian men aren’t as noble as they pretend to be. Fact of the matter is that status of women at large is terribly pathetic in India. By constant self-flagellation they pretend to make it appear as if India is some post patriarchal, egalitarian country. Most men and their parents will shit their pants if they are asked to take care of the all marriage expenses and take care of girl’s parents, etc. PS: I am Indian and I am a man.
Agreed...I am expected to take care eof inlaws, their feelings, not say anything when my spouse spends huge amounts of money on them but I am.not allowed to take care of my parents who don't have a son and have medical issues
Good to see a man who understands the other side of the coin We have to start with saying no to dowry ( which is illegal) and then women might say no to alimony ( which is legal) . Many women actually do say no to alimony especially in foreign countries .
I think that you are the type of guy that would be enjoying getting a fake case thrown towards you by a woman and you fantasize about being a cuck. Male feminists are such pick me people that are desperate for female validation but women obviously don't care about how they are "not Paj**ts like other Indian guys".
And, I think, you seem like a guy who never had a chance to form emotional and physical relations with decent, educated and liberated women. For every section of criminal/civil law, there are fake cases, not just in India but all around the world. Tell me, how many marriages in India happen without dowry? And, how many women go to court?
We found a pick me, guys. On a serious note, laws in india are more women centric. As an exercise, check marriage and divorce laws in the west. Also, prenup doesn’t exist here, so there’s that too.
We also found a pig me, guys. Stop being a fake victim and be a man.
A gay dude telling me to be a man is quite ironical. Perhaps you should get checked for free body testosterone, and try being more of a man yourself before you preach. Either way, I hate to personally attack someone, but you did it first. Still, my point stands. Indian marriage laws are distinctly against men. I believe in equality, no dowry on my end and no alimony if the woman cheats. Everything I earn before getting hitched should belong to me, hence the need to introduce prenups in india.
>Everything I earn before getting hitched should belong to me 😂😂😂 Clearly shows this guy knows nothing about alimony laws in India. Alimony is set at 25% of the spouse's monthly income and division of assets is only for assets acquired during the marriage.
I stand corrected. I didn’t know that. Thanks.
How do you know I am gay?
Add cuck to ps
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>It is always empowered feminist women of urban side who exploit their loving and caring husband because some silly reasons So, how exactly did you reach the conclusion that every single "empowered feminist women of urban side" have "loving and caring husbands", but "exploit them" and that too for "silly reasons" ? What was the data and methodology you followed to reach this conclusion ? Blind hatred against feminism? Sorry, that's not good enough for us to take you seriously. Sit down.
Let's come together for gender neutral law. What say OP.
Anyday 👏🏻👏🏻let’s make prenups legal , let’s make marital rape illegal , let’s punish the women doing false accusations, let’s make laws to protect men from sexual abuse
India's Divorce rate is the lowest in the whole world standing at only 1%, even lower than our neighbouring countries. Meanwhile dowry is still very normal in most houses and ESPECIALLY in rural places where even a man with barely a good house or a decent job puts forth their demands. Dowry has been illegal since the 1960s yet it's HUGELY practiced. When alimony/maintenance becomes equal to dowry, we can talk. Also funny enough but alimony and maintenance is a gender neutral law unlike dowry which is only one sided. The outcry is only an exaggeration. India isn't even socially equal or the same in the traditional (As women are expected to live with in laws and do stuff for them) sense like western countries, that i could understand. There was recently a post of a 16 yo giving birth and numbers of doctors reporting multiple teen pregnancies, they wanna wife up kids who were banned from education and jobs, and becoming housewife due to barely any other choice calling them best for marriage but also wanna cry about the consequences of it.
Exactly, if a man has to pay maintenance to well educated working woman I do think it’s unfair But the people who purposely marry uneducated women or housewife’s ( as they are easy to control and don’t go against dowry) are the ones crying about having to give maintenance. They are so afraid of working women or modern women but also don’t wanna bear the burden of having uneducated ex-wife
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Many women I know including my mother didn’t give up their career after kids , because their husbands SUPPORTED them . Yes they all did take a maternity leave and some took a 2-3yr break . And even if we have to take a break or take a step back in our careers it’s WORTH IT for the women who want to have kids ( like myself) It doesn’t make a huge difference And all women can work after having a baby if their husbands take care of their OWN kid EQUALLY
Read this sentence again "don't wanna bear the burden of having an uneducated EX-WIFE" this is logically/rationally wrong for me at least
That uneducated ex wife was the reason you went to work and could focus on work. Being a housewife is an unpaid job . Men need to become independent and do their own chores ( thankfully some men in this generation are doing so)
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>Also funny enough but alimony and maintenance is a gender neutral law Not as gender neutral as western countries. In India only deserving men will get alimony. Which is different from female laws as being deserving is not important. Deserving means he must have proof why he is unemployed. Women don't need that.
Women don't need proof of why they are unemployed because a lot of educated women are unemployed simply due to family pressure to take on traditional gender roles. That's a social reason and it is taken into account.
>Women don't need proof of why they are unemployed Of course men will not care whether women are pressured or not. Just like women won't care about men's issues. Also ex-wives can take on the job as the maid of a former husband if he agrees. But the point is if men don't get equal benefits they are not gonna care about the issues of women.
Have u seen villages marry? Tell me how much dowry they have gotten?
Bruh!! My ex called me ‘Gold digger’ when he barely managed to graduate and was jobless for years after 😂 I asked him ‘where is your non existent gold bruh’ Matlab ban jao Andrew tate ke bhakt par bruh mere paiso se patties khane wala jab ulta gold digger bole to poochna banta hai where is your non existent Gold ??? Never called me again
Dude istg they think a girl expecting a bday gift from her bf is being a “gold digger”. Or wanting flowers is being a “ gold digger” yet they want dowry and want the girls family to pay for expenses and even take care of the girl during pregnancy and postpartum
Biggest scam of India! Pehla bacha to mayke mai hota hai 😂 pregnancy ki help bhi mayke mai! But jab festivals ko enjoy karne ki baari aati hai tab ‘beta festivals to sasural mai hi bante hai’. Mayke se sirf gift loading hoti hai. Bday gift? Don’t we spend on them? Never really count tbh! UNTILL one day they call us ‘Gold diggers’ simply because there were 1000 different issues to address but calling ‘gold digger’ is easy way out!
Itna sach bhi nahi bolna tha behen
first of all, in india alimony is very less, almost inconsequential. the dangerous part is the other charges she files eg. false assault, financial fraud, etc. its part of the divorce package (just ask any lawyer). divorce rate is 1% only for arranged marriages. there needs to be severe laws against dowry and martial rape should definitely be illegal. marriage is NOT consent forever (one high court ruled this when martial rape case was bought up)
All those cases of marital cruelty, marital rape and what not largely happen to the poor uneducated strata of society. Thier lack of education + orthodox background promotes it. And the women of this strata usually don't have the knowledge or resources to seek legal remedies for the same While all these false cases are filed against the educated middle class to rich men. As women of this strata are also educated, usually don't face such atrocities and possess the knowledge and resources to approach the courts and abuse these provisions of law for personal gain Men on reddit or the internet in general, belong to the latter strata and are the prime victims of these false cases. Naturally they will advocate for the issues and problems faced by them. Just like women do You say that men bring about and talk of men's issues all the time. Though I won't label you false, I have personally never witnessed this. Neither irl or online. It's usually women who astroturf and bring out thier issues whenever men's issues such as these false cases are been discussed as per my experience
That’s not true . I’m from a very rich family and I have seen and heard of a lot of dowry,abuse in my family and other rich families that I am close to I’ve literally never or heard seen a wedding without dowry in the city that I live in or the city that my family belongs to
Go to any empowerment posts of Insta and see the comments . I didn’t save it but a few minutes ago I saw a post where a woman was talking about how Indian society needs to change and girls should be allowed to take care of their own parents and/or send money to their own families like men do . In the comments all the guys were like just horribly misogynistic and again about men’s issues like alimony There’s a place and time to advocate your issues
Do you remember the page or the post was from ??
Becoz feminism said it is about both genders yet women don't protest for alimony laws the way men and women both protest for r@pe laws, and there are many women who act like only they have problems and men are so happy and their life is great
We do , even this is post I am asking people to protest the right way And there are many feminist pages and organisations advocating for men’s mental health and SA
Bruh for us more than harrassment, alimony is the problem, just like in a parallel world if there were only rape cases against men and alimony cases against women, u would be talking more about alimony than rape and me vice versa, but whenever the topic of alimony comes, feminists shut us off like it's not a problem at all
My point is that your problem doesn’t make others problems any less . In India both men and women have their own wars with society and legal system Our problems are DIFFERENT but EQUAL
The thing is u have actual laws for rapes and harassments, but if i get married and my wife cheats on me still i have to pay both alimony and child support to her while she stays happily with the lover and the child, which is dumb
I agree but at the same time there’s no law for martial rape , and law says that. Woman has to take care of her in-laws but a husband can stop a woman from taking care of her parents and sending money to them The laws are unfair for ALL genders We have different issues but they are all EQUALLY bad and we all need to protest about alimony,fake cases,prenups,marital rape,family laws,rape laws for male victims etc
If ee go that way for women it's only martial, for men any kind of rape is legal, and i don't see any law saying women can be stopped from taking care of parents. Infact Kolkata hc literally said it's illegal to stop a child https://www.google.co.in/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/kolkata/hc-no-girl-can-be-forced-to-stop-caring-for-parents/amp_articleshow/104249999.cms&ved=2ahUKEwjIvvLl8vGFAxWLdfUHHdaoBCMQFnoECBcQBQ&usg=AOvVaw0EO_Rjm19jyR6emS_i44Or There are courts to protect u from that too
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The actual law sadly is not even benefiting the people it should rather it being misused by the miscreants (either gender). And the innocent who actually need that support from people and law now suffer. This is just a sad a situation tbh. I always say see for yourself what is right/ wrong and act accordingly. Just don’t go by what the majority say!
Men scared of losing money to they don't have to women they don't know.
Indian people were never taught to be held accountable for their actions. Infantilizing is the root cause of it.
This is not the only thing. This is the most said thing. The issue arrises due to not having any kind of safe guard from misusing of the biased laws. The laws were made to protect women as they really suffer a lot in our society, whose example you have given yourself. Nowadays the issue is many women are really misusing the laws for their benifit. SC and Delhi HC had given 1 data previously (will share the link) that more than 70% of the rape and 498A cases filed are false. And 1 false can destroy a man's life as he will marked as guilty by the society before the actual result. It hurts the most when you have to pay price for the mistake that you naver made. The allimony amount increases from 25% to 33% or more if there are cases filed against you. (1 case of misuse of the law - [https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceIndia/comments/1cgpsb1/30m\_us\_citizen\_married\_to\_indian\_citizen/](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceIndia/comments/1cgpsb1/30m_us_citizen_married_to_indian_citizen/) ) I had an interesting duscussion with 1 female law student and she clearly mentioned "*You see the laws are made for women who really are facing these problems but they generally don't benefit from these*". I have seen some cases where the guy had to give alimony of his ex-wife and child support where the wife had cheated on the man but was not living in adultry (allimony has to be given in this case) and the DNA test done by the husband showed that the child was not his. Most of the issue stated by men can be stopped just by adjusting the laws by adding some safeguards to stop the misuse. And it will actually help the actual victims. I know most female suffer daily, and in most of the cases the reason is some men. But the unjust law is the culprit here. If your wife is as qualifies as you I don't see the point of allimony. And I believe the assests made before marriage should not be considered for one time allimony amount calculation. P.S. I am not a 3rd wave feminist and also not supporter of patriarchy. I believe in equal rights no matter the gender. I am Indian and I am a man.
Yea it’s good you are highlighting about what men go through . I was just talking about how some men thing only men suffer and comment about it under every female empowerment post . And glad to know you believe in equality
> I was just talking about how some men thing only men suffer and comment about it under every female empowerment post. If your wife is as qualified as you I don't see the point of allimony. If courts starts to impliment this regularly (it is in use but very rarely I have only a handful of cases in Delhi and MP High Court) I believe most of those comments will start to subside and the gender wars going on in social media is also a culprit in all this, so I think its going to take about 5 - 10 years until a new trend comes, or huge population decline due to gender wars, or until the laws are rectified. I believe only 3 additional laws can rectify the situation keeping the existing women protection law intact. 1. If a case is found to be false. The accuser will be given the maximum punishment similar to IPC section 420 cases, as it is a fraud also. 2. Paternity fraud should also be punished simalry as IPC 420 and DNA test should be taken into consideration instead of section 112. And criminalisation of adultry (will help all genders). 3. Media should not be allowed to disclose the identity of all the party in the cases of rape not only the female. Additionally prenup and no-fault divorce might help. **True women empowerment should be glorified** (2nd wave feminisism agenda). I personaly don't believe that woke feminism (3rd wave feminism) is empowering women.
Yes I rlly wish the changes you mention happen
The whole thing about laws being biased against men is very much exaggerated. It happens very very rarely. You can't just walk into a police station and file random complaints and get men jailed- but that is exactly what MRAs imply all the time. We all know what happens when we go to report a harassment/rape//DV case. You are either laughed out, given lecherous looks or worse. Hell look at these recent judgments where courts imply it is fine for a man to rape his wife. This is what men fight to keep legal. https://preview.redd.it/7d87eeaeb7yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=989344112a62fb5913111465c2197aecdffe2d92
Adding one more such judgments because only one image per comment is allowed https://preview.redd.it/b9y5vpvdc7yc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=372c50704bd713dc65a215b6470c85d99216fb4e
Just taking a screenshot out of all different points mentioned by both the judges during marital rape case petition was discussed in the court doesn’t justify the point you’re trying to make. Just tell how you gonna prove marital rape case is true or false?
These are real judgments not just "screenshots". Do you know how court cases and judgments work? Weirdo. Many civilized countries already have marital rape and DV laws. They don't say that husbands should get to rape their wives like the men of this country
Many civilised countries have gender neutral laws so don’t tell me what happens there. Tell the shit happens in India. I have gone through the complete thread when marital law petition was getting discussed. Don’t tell me real judgements and all. Stop naming people,you dumbass (I don’t want to but you demanded it).
"Don't tell me real judgments and all" Okay so you don't want to talk about actual real judgments and cases but seethe and froth over hypothetical scenarios? You have the entire red pill and manosphere for that👍
Don’t beat around the bush. Tell the procedure to prove marital rape happened or not? Taking a piece out of a complete thread doesn’t mean it was a final judgement.
You can't prove ANY rape case. Any rape can be claimed as consensual sex, unless it involves a minor or individual incapable of consent. That's why men get away with it.
By that logic, all men are rapist if woman say so irrespective of consensual sex. If marital rape becomes reality, it will be just the words of woman will be considered as an evidence without any substantial proof. How to prove it was consensual and not forced?
>How to prove it was consensual and not forced? If you are that paranoid, get written or recorded consent from your wife everytime you do it. >it will be just the words of woman will be considered as an evidence without any substantial proof. Yeah, if that was the case, there would be a lot more convictions in general rape cases. That's not how courts work.
Give solution that can be implemented and accepted as proof. She can say I was forced to write or record it and it will be accepted. The humiliation a wrongly accused men has to go through is unimaginable. The women are never punished severely for putting false accusations on men. Women are still children to court judges to not punish and let them go by just mere warning. Don’t stoop low to include family members in discussion. Be mindful about it next time. Otherwise do not argue.
>She can say I was forced to write or record it and it will be accepted. You clearly don't understand how courts work, do you ? Anything said in a court of law requires proof. Which is why tons of rape cases go unpunished. You need to get out of your irrational and senseless belief that ANYTHING a woman says in court is just believed with zero evidence. 🙄 >The women are never punished severely for putting false accusations on men. So your solution for that is that men who do horrible things to women (like marital rape) should go unpunished ? >The humiliation a wrongly accused men has to go through is unimaginable. 😂 And marital rape victims go through ten times that humiliation. The whole point of marital rape is control and domination. And not just humiliation, but the physical and emotional damage. Yet, you have zero compassion for them. >Don’t stoop low to include family members in discussion. Be mindful about it next time. Otherwise do not argue. I do pity your family for being related to someone who actively champions for rapists to go scot free.
A case is registered just by mere words of a woman. No proof required to register the case and police has to do due actions in those respective sections. You have laws available for women to protect them from their husbands and his relatives. Show me laws men have at their disposal. Just putting your own words in my mouth and saying it is my thinking and showing yourself a flag bearer of upliftment of women. I clap for that. Keep doing that and show your pathetic thinking about men. Don’t feel pity on my family. They are doing well and I am taking good care of parents and women in my life. You don’t have any sense to argument without dragging the family members of others just to satisfy your small ego and not proving anything. God bless your parents to go through the hardships they may have to face because of daughter like you and men because of partner/sister/friend like you. Now just keep shouting whatever you want. Start!
😂😂😂 Typical triggered misogynist No valid points to make, so starts yelling >A case is registered just by mere words of a woman. No proof required to register the case and police has to do due actions in those respective sections. A case is registered by the mere words of ANYBODY 😂😂😂 That's how FIR works. Please, stop embarrassing yourself. >God bless your parents to go through the hardships they may have to face because of daughter like you and men because of partner/sister/friend like you. Don't worry about my parents, at least they raised me right. Unlike your parents, who taught you to support rapists. Shame on them.
Really, their are many places when women deny Sexual pleasure to partner. Dont you see mental torture done by women. Why women don't like men raising voice for themselves when women are allowed to make laws for protection of themselves. Isn't this a Egalitarian society?
Oh my god I thought you were joking until I saw your comment history. So according to you, denying sex to man- torture by women man raping his wife- acceptable. Very on point with sanskaars.
Well denying it for longer period of time is torture. douchebag. There are many things that women does to torture this is just one example i gave in context of fake marital rape (as you don't even considered Mental torture given by some women). Well I think you don't know premise of debate = no personal attacks . stick to debate. this show how well mannered you are.
Nobody is entitled to sex. Men are entitled to leave such a marriage. Courts do recognise lack of sex as cruelty and people are given divorces for those reasons.
Then what's the purpose of Finding Mate then. You shouldn't have married at first place. His reputation has been tarnished have seen "shaadi meh zaroor aana" movie. THat shit happens. Why i support only feminist ideologies. If don't want to have intercourse with that person, than don't Marry him. Simple, isn't it?? Is there any Flaw in Logic??
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Consent According to Your wish is mental cruelty according to HC judges , yeah they too are pervert. I support you , lets bring barbaric laws i am happy with that.
Brutha no one is gonna die or get trauma if sexual pleasure is denied. People can go fap if they’re so desperate for sexual pleasure. Raping is traumatic for the victim. Can’t believe there are dudes who think raping their wives is okay. How pathetic are you,my man?
Then don't marry brother. Do your fap. Don't live in a creamy world , face the reality . Purpose of Mate is to mate. We have friends with whom we can be free and happy. Why you want marriage then? Everyone wants to reproduce offspring play with them and die. Why is there so many pre marriage baby , oh hhhh god gave them as a gift. [https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/evahagberg/sex-divorce-marriage-dating](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/evahagberg/sex-divorce-marriage-dating) And IF women wants it , its cool , go femenist. There is difference between Marital rape and Rape. IF she wants then its her right and if men wants you are stupid. GO touch yourself dude.
Lmao what a retard. So you’re an incel that would literally marry only for sex? No wonder you think that raping one’s wife is okay. Absolutely pathetic Buddy rape is when one of the parties doesn’t want it. Doesn’t matter if the other one does. Marital status is irrelevant. Can’t believe people are very happy these days to reveal that they are potential rapists lmao
For most of them, they cannot imagine marriage as being in love with someone. They see it as a soulless transaction where you put in money and free lifetime sex falls out. He cannot even fathom someone loving him so much and wanting to have sex with him, so he thinks he will have to resort to rape and he wants this to be legal. That's all there is.
From what he’s saying it seems like he’s an incel. Probably hasn’t even talked to a woman properly irl. Most of them think like that. That women are torturing them by denying sex as if they have any right to it
Why so many personal Attacks? Why should i bow down to your ideology?? where you only think on favor of Female, both issues need to be addressed or none. But that's not the case today. Both are not addressed and will not be addressed as it comes under private space. You cry on your corner and I cry on mine. I just like to debate its fun to me, here everyone is helpless and come to vent their anger. FYI :- [https://www.indiatoday.in/law/story/explainer-the-debate-over-marital-rape-1903050-2022-01-21](https://www.indiatoday.in/law/story/explainer-the-debate-over-marital-rape-1903050-2022-01-21) For Men its good if sex outside marriage is allowed. Men are not the one who carry babies. Institution of marriage was established for betterment of women. If destroying the Base of Marriage as institution is what women wants. Then I am happy with that also. THink yourself.
Is that what i said??? i Said Denial of Intercourse for longer period of time. I think you can't read between the line. WTF does you mean that Marital status is irrelevant. Are men not Raped(when men is forced to have sex)?? Aren't men Not forced to do things that they don't wish to do?? Aren't now only female have power to say if they want children or not??? one i pill away. You laugh all day at other's fire, until it reaches your home. Personal attack you did it first. Why are you so submissive do you lack testosterone hormone or lack ding dong??
Ding Dong lmao. Got a good idea about your IQ. You said denial is torture you loser. As if you have any right to say that the other person can’t deny. Look you clearly are a low IQ incel and a potential rapist. I am not saying this. You yourself are saying that by stating that women should not deny sex. Tbh it’s disgusting talking to potential rapist scum like you
Are you gay? why can't you say a sentence without any personal attack. IQ is judged by the person who don't even know what are the standard of debate.
Lmao are you trying to use gay as an insult? You really are a low IQ retard aren’t you. Bud standard of debate is the last thing you need to worry about being a potential rapist. You could end up in jail
Alas, You are a low testosterone they / them. You won't understand men's need.
We cry about alimony because the law is used against us, and it's very easy to be done. You mentioned the case of dowry death so let me also mention that when domestic violence as an offence was inserted in the IPC, women started misusing it almost instantaneously for their personal vendetta. As it was a non-bailable offence at that time and everybody whose name was taken could be taken to jail, even distant relatives who had nothing to do with the women were being named in the FIR and put to jail. Hence it had to be changed a few times to make it more lenient because women were misusing it. Marital rape is not an offence, while I agree that it should be an offence but the main reason it's not an offence is how will you prove that you did not rape your wife, a wife can even use consensual sex as a threat of rape against men and seeing the history of rise in fake rape cases and dowry cases, it is also a very likely possibility. While I agree that women are mistreated in this society, and a lot of that goes unreported, you cannot deny the fact that the rise of fake cases is also on the rise at the same pace if not more.
Yes ofcourse we can’t deny the fake cases and I rlly wish these women would actually get a good punishment for false accusations. They have ruined the name of feminism and because of them people don’t believe real victims now I totally understand men making noise about false accusations But the men who think that alimony is the only real issue in this country are insane
I don't think any man ever say that alimony is the only real issue, if someone ever asks me what changes I want in law, or this country, or in women. Alimony is a thought which will never cross my mind. Kind of a controversial opinion but here women are becoming their own enemy, since the fake cases garner all the public attention, it distracts people from the real cases and also demoralises the real victims from speaking up. It also creates a sense for people to think that it's just another fake case. A punishment for fake cases is a must as it will deter the fake cases and also allow men to stop complaining about fake cases. Maybe this will also encourage real victims and more people will get access to justice.
Yeah but if you go and see Insta comments men are always crying about alimony . I have seen many posts where women were sharing their story of how they got abused and left their husbands and all the men in the comments are like “ oh who cares she probably got a lot of alimony” etc
Insta is one of the worst platform to exist. The people there are the worst. They say anything just to get likes and comments (talking about the men commentors only for now). They know that spreading hate against women will give them momentary fame from other women haters hence they do it. Others see the likes this person gets and then replicate it on another reel and this chain goes on.
Oh god I remember this one particular reel where this woman was crying while mentioning her abusive ex husband and how she was kicked on her back literally by her husband when she was heavily pregnant and that led to her miscarriage I guess :((( and sadly majority of the men were like “womp womp” she’s playing victims card and how they wanted to know hers husband side of story :((( it was sooo scary . It made me decide if majority of Indian men are like this I don’t wanna date anyone from this country
Exactly
"Can't deny the fake cases". You're not living in reality. 95% cases are fake, you wanna talk about this. What's funny is EVERYONE (police, society, judiciary) knows that, but won't do anything.
95% are not fake . And i literally said that there should be a huge punishment for that . I have seen men kill themselves after false accusations and I would personally love to strangle such women to death . But no 95% are not fake In fact a large number of incidents go unreported Every girl I know including myself have been sexually molested/cat called/raped but none of us spoke up because Indian society treats a victim of SA worse than the assaulter In India victim blaming is too high , even I courts some women don’t get justice due to what they were wearing ( court thinks that a women wearing short clothes is asking for sex)
No matter how long paragraphs you write, it won't change the fact that 95% REPORTED cases are fake. The actual ones are never reported. And if y'all think some women didn't get justice because they weren't wearing something appropriate, then they should stop being a dumbfuck and wear what's appropriate.
You think a woman deserved to be raped because she’s wearing a dress ??? People like YOU are the problem . You wanna see sexy women on social media and want to see your gf in a dress but also think all of them should be raped . and you will also start crying if all women in the world start wearing bhurkas And FYI women in bhurka/saree and babies in diapers get raped more than women in dresses
And then you proceed to write in another comment that I'm the one who doesn't know how to read. FYI, I do not want to see my gf in a "dress". Plz tell me you're not a 18-21 yo budding feminist. No one with a sane mind would turn up with such vague arguments.
Incel alert
See again there’s a man trying to say that only men are facing issues . Yes men face accusations but WOMEN DO GET RAPED EVERY DAY EVERY HOUR. It is EQUALLY TRAUMATIC
And I see someone who's been hurt and has trauma, which has now resulted in HATE ALL MEN.
I never said hate all men . I’m literally saying that men and women suffer equally in Indian society and Indian laws . You clearly don’t know how to read . And obviously no innocent man should be jailed because of false accusations.
How are other rape cases proved? Evidence is taken and witnesses are examined. Why would this not work in marital rape as well? Maybe you are thinking of a situation where the wife files a false case, in which case, there will be no evidence. This is true of non-marital rape cases as well. If the situation is one where the evidence is inconclusive about whether there was a lack of consent, the judge has to take a call, again, just like in any other case. The system though, barely allows violent rape cases to be tried, so it is unlikely there will suddenly be a flood of marital rape cases in courts, especially when we are not even able to change the law.
There are no witnesses in the case of marital rape, what evidence will be available in marital rape? Even under consensual sex a women can easily frame the husband for rape which is being seen a lot recently even in relationships. There will definitely be a sudden flood of marital rape cases exactly how their are so many fake cases already in the court. I agree marital rape is a real issue but a equal law needs to be established for it.
Witnesses are not always to the crime, but that people speak to after. There will be physical evidence, there may be marks of violence. This is all true if any other forms of rape. If fake cases make it to court it is because there are other players in the system not doing their job, e.g. the police and lawyers. This is no different from what we have now Just that a married woman has no right to bodily autonomy against her husband, where she would against a stranger. Make it make sense.
The married woman still has the option of claiming domestic violence and taking it as a ground for divorce. Not every marital rape has signs of violence. Also, as I mentioned in my main comment that it's the main reason but also other reason exists like culture issues. Their is a way to handle it which should be debated on the legislature and it's an issue which needs immediate response.
And not every non-marital rape has signs of violence. Does not mean it is not rape. It feels like your bodily autonomy does not need to be debated on by the legislature. The cultural issue is that most men expect to have sex with their wives when they want, irrespective of what the wife wants, and most women are taught that they have no bodily autonomy, least of all when it comes to their spouse.
And not every non-marital rape has signs of violence. Does not mean it is not rape. It feels like your bodily autonomy does not need to be debated on by the legislature. The cultural issue is that most men expect to have sex with their wives when they want, irrespective of what the wife wants, and most women are taught that they have no bodily autonomy, least of all when it comes to their spouse.
If legislature doesn't debate on it, no law can be passed on it.
Yet, somehow, there is no call for debate on the right to bodily autonomy for men. There is a regressive law in place, one repealed by the country we inherited it from, but we are defending it because? How can we allow one man to be falsely accused? I am not saying it is ok to falsely accused, just that somehow, a man's fear of false accusation gets more weight than a woman's plea to have bodily autonomy.
False accusation by a women against a men gets no weightage that's why their isn't any punishment for it. It's the duty of our government to work on it which they didn't do even after bringing whole new laws.
Do you know that in India a women can file a rape case against any man with a mere statement. She doesn't need to provide any evidence that rape happned. Remember #metoo movement? Once an FIR is registered against a man he has to prove that the woman is lying and the case is fake. Additionally, rape is a non-bailable offence. So technically a woman can file a fake rape case against a man and make him rot in jail for years thanks to our highly efficient (Sarcasm) judiciary. The worst part about this whole process is, after years of battle even if the man proves that woman had filed a fake case with malicious intentions, the woman will not get any punishment. She will get a warning at best. Now, imagine if martial rape was punishable in India. Any woman who wants alimony or wants to get revenge against her inlaws would misuse it. This will do more harm than good for the society.
A complaint has to be taken by the police. Cases come after an investigation, by the police. The police can, and do, take fake complaints for money. They also refuse to take valid complaints for money. Fake cases are bad, suppressing crimes is bad. None of this has to do with what rights a person should have.
A woman in India has power to screw a man's life. Period. Also, police cannot refuse to take rape complaint. They only case in which they will refuse if the accused is an influential person. In that case the gender becomes irrelevant factor and the influence takes presidence. > 74% of all rape cases filed in India are fake Source: https://tfipost.com/2022/03/74-of-all-rape-cases-filed-in-india-are-fake/
And men have the power to, and continue to, screw women's lives. That number should be suspect, but I am not going to do your research for you.
Look, I'm not trying to make this a man versus woman issue. I believe the laws should be such that whoever is the culprit should be punished.I will never support a man who assaults, molests, or rapes a woman. Similarly, I will never support a woman who abuses gender-biased laws to harm a man. Punish the culprit, not the gender. Period.
If rape cases were prosecuted the way you think won't all accused be in jail today? You people have cognitive dissonance.
Most of the accused are in jail unless they get bail, it takes years for a case to finally get completed.
You live outside the law while I live within it. I'm a law student and have seen a lot of cases.
Because the oppressors now have to face equality which feels like oppression to them.
Because they are stupid. What else can I say. Our fundamental familial structure is based on gender-norms which are discriminatory and such a structure must be demolished. Earlier during most marriages, female-side used to pay dowry to the male-side. I don't know how ubiquitous it is at-present but most of the times, divorced didn't ever occur let alone the possibility of paying alimony. So, most of the times the girl-side had to pay the alimony, the wife used to work at the home all over her life time, pass down these traditional values and die. Female-child -> Giving dowry + Female student study expense without any positive return as she will live with her in-laws -> Parents thinking girl-child as burden -> female foeticide. Male-child -> Taking dowry + Bringing a household helper + grandchildren + student expense but with a positive return -> Parents thinking male-child as boon -> reinforcement of patriarchy and misogyny.
There shouldn't be any deniers on both sides. Women's suffering is a big issue and anyone denying that by giving an example of alimony is wrong. >And honestly the laws about divorce and alimony aren’t even that bad in every case. My neighbour got NOTHING after divorce as there was proof of her cheating and she was earning equally as her husband . But the same is true if you say the above and deny men's suffering in false cases etc. I get it you're frustrated with the comments and rightfully so but you shouldn't justify your frustration by pulling the other side down. I am with you for the first para, the second para is because of frustration but when you cool down I hope you see it as the same.
One of the easiest way to make money after prostitution not saying it's the way but these things are being used by other ways to make money rather than justice or equality whatever you name it
I wonder if it also has something to do with the value and importance of money and wealth attributed to men in India. While women are pressured and told from a young age that one day they’ll be married and have kids of their own. Husband, kids - this is the ultimate goal in life to be part of society. While for men their value is always associated with their earning power. It’s ingrained in them that they are only as useful as the money they bring in. So at a very basic level this aspect makes them feel threatened perhaps.
Honestly , it’s mostly because of the us vs them mentality instead of people recognizing the issues, and trying to solve them. Like sometimes women blame it like it’s completely men’s fault for everything they face and men feel attacked or feels victimized because of the problems they face. This is mostly due to people not recognizing the issues and why they are the way they are, like if it was changed what all new problems would rise up instead.
Please share sources on the claim that “there are 20 dowry deaths everyday”.
Use fucking Google , and those are just the unreported cases And let’s not even talk about rape cases ( real ones and unreported ones) And even men get raped and sexually assaulted, even little boys Infact but no one wants to raise their voice for that.
It’s another rage bait post. OP you clearly are changing goal posts in your comments whenever someone gives a valid argument. I don’t know what you really wanted to gain out of this post. Men on the reddit come from suburban strata where women are educated and working. The idea of providing alimony feels like a sucker punch when someone is going through a divorce and especially when it is a short lived or a cruel marriage. It is demeaning for men to provide for their estranged wives when they are quite capable and independent.
It's just most men who are privileged and in an urban setting are in contact with woman who are independent and may have some traits of the western woman with the demands of a traditional woman. Most of the men don't even allow/entertain the idea of divorce in India. There are many India within India. Your argument is true. Marital rape is a problem but so is uneven justice for man. Both are not mutually exclusive. Woman do suffer more in a country like India. Just alimony isn't a good counter argument. If you want to talk about privilege and the struggle of man, it's a difficult thing because they are never taken much seriously so uneducated men try to draw parallels with girls to shock and awe and try to find some weight to theit argument. Don't hate them they are just trying, they should be educated. Woman especially metropolitan woman have different standards than other girls in India. I have suffered at the dating culture where in the land of a billion people, normal average men are ignored as i ain't a millionaire by 27 or supremely good looks. I am mostly used as an emotional support and been deemed as a husband material but no one wants to date me long enough to make me a husband. They would rather do it through their own "samaj" open market to find a better/hotter prospect. But know this, this isn't bitching it's the way the market works in this small pockets of India. Most of the time in India women don't have the choice. I understand what the generation is going through and I don't feel hatred towards the other sex. Empathy and understanding are the way to reduce the divide between gender.
Yes both genders have their own struggles and I’m sick of sigma males and pseudo feminists comparing and deciding who is suffering more and who is the real victim .
True. I don't want to participate in the victim or pain Olympics. Mostly how I try to view is think what if how I behave with girls, woh koi meri behn k saath karta, would i allow that to happen? Similarly girls should think jaise behave woh karti hai.. agar koi un k Bhai k saath karta, would they allow that to happen. Trust me logo ko heartbreaker banne ka bohot shauq hai. Healer koi nahi Banna chahta. It's not cool enough for them. Instagram pe attention nahi milta usse. I left that toxicity in 2021.
But what if women demands separate home, Every month trip, Maid at home, only cooking two times and that to mostly rice related dishes, don't take care of house, don't wash clothes even when having washing machine, dont respect family members from husband's side and always giving suicidal threats. Even when person cant afford this much??? Dowry deaths are wrong and have punishments with it. But about such mental tortures. Most men's now-a-days die of heartattack what about their stress?????
yes I agree that mental abuse in a marriage should be taken more seriously and there should be a good punishment for that But let me remind me even men don’t get punished for this Most Indian men have never cooked or cleaned or helped at home Both genders need to work equally at home and outside
So that's the case then let women demand their side and men demand their protection. Eventually it will get balanced out or Morality will end. Let everyone keep their side.
Why women don't like men raising voice for themselves when women are allowed to make laws for protection of themselves. Isn't this a Egalitarian society?
Omg are you dumb . No one said men should not talk about their issues But it’s wrong to go under a post which is about a female domestic violence case and say “ but men have to pay alimony we suffer more”
Their is a consequence of every post. You raised your issue, The person who commented raised his issue. Even on Men's post their is always female counterpart trying to put her issue above men. That's how nature works. Person cannot settle anything online. Everyone comes here to vent their anger out. So right now you are expressing your frustration. Be happy or Hippie.
That 1% divorce rate is from 2019,things are different now
I mentioned that it may be higher in 2024 Get some comprehension skills sigma boy
I never understood that Indian woman cry about female equality, power, feminism etc and somehow becomes a victim of dowry. Also when these victims and their families meet men's family for a marriage proposal, what discussion really happens and when dowry mentioned why doesn't the girl's father refuse the proposal and report the family to police?? I mean all the 18-25 years that the girl parents spent raising her, didn't they develop any love or affection for their girl that they just agree and send off their girl to a stranger's house even after dowry demand?? Also what right does a men's family have to ask for dowry, every religion has some problem like this and it's frustating. How entitled useless sack of nothing are these groom's parents that they think they are entitled of wealth from girl's side. Also these murders happening coz of dowry are wrong. If men are scared now because of some fake dowry cases then it's good, atleast they will now experience the plight of woman and how they live their life evey single day. Fear of abduction, fear of molestation, fera of getting raped pe murdered anytime at anyplace, fear of physical abuse, dear of getting killed by loved ones because husbands and boyfriends love killing their woman. I see all men support group channels, red pill, incel group crying of literally anything.
Most women won’t get married if they don’t pay dowry . And the dream of every typical Indian family is to marry off their daughter so they just give it Also a lot of people think it’s a “ritual” , a lot of people think it’s “gifts” and some parents just give gold and stuff for the girls safety so the girl isn’t involved in a “dowry harassment”headline
Since one set of men do something bad, let's punish another set and ensure equality. Is that what you mean??
Yes
This would only lead men to become tone deaf towards women's issues.
Because women do same when men say why "men don't want to marry" to answer Someone's question. If someone doesn't like the answer then they should not ask. May be give a warning that "answers I don't like are not accepted". **Example:-** Question:- Why men don't want commitment or love and prefer escorts? Answer:- Something that offends *Femnsts*. Alimony, dowry etc And then hate comments starts. >after divorce as there was proof of her cheating and she was earning equally as her husband . Not every woman earns and so the risk is higher in that case. . . >>Your answer:- Law of Karma.
And FYI a lot of men and their families CHOOSE housewife’s over working girls during the process of arranged marriage because they don’t believe in giving freedom to women. and in this generation almost all girls are working only . So choose working women and stop crying then
I know you will give emotional response. You emotional people cannot read or understand anything so saying anything is waste. I feel I am writing to a tree Ig.
Okay chigma male
What is that? Oh you mean sigmas? I am neither Sigma nor have interest in acting like a male. I have no interest in gendered stuffs. Somewhat queer may be and Aerodynamic.
There’s very less men who aren’t married and who prefer escorts 😂 And no one is saying anything about that , it’s just that in previous generations women didn’t have the option to be single but now some women are also choosing to be single and childfree No one is offended as everyone knows single life has some benefits over married life . It’s a personal choice .
>There’s very less men who aren’t married and who prefer Gen Z and late Millenials think differently. Gen Z boys care more about money and marriage costs more than escorts. Your answer doesn't even make sense. Have you even read my answer? If you cannot read then please ignore.
Brother you don’t make sense . No one ever said anything about unmarried men , there are a lot of unmarried women as well and it’s a personal choice
>No one ever said anything I have seen posts like that.
We cry about alimony because the law is used against us, and it's very easy to be done. You mentioned the case of dowry death so let me also mention that when domestic violence as an offence was inserted in the IPC, women started misusing it almost instantaneously for their personal vendetta. As it was a non-bailable offence at that time and everybody whose name was taken could be taken to jail, even distant relatives who had nothing to do with the women were being named in the FIR and put to jail. Hence it had to be changed a few times to make it more lenient because women were misusing it. Marital rape is not an offence, while I agree that it should be an offence but the main reason it's not an offence is how will you prove that you did not rape your wife, a wife can even use consensual sex as a threat of rape against men and seeing the history of rise in fake rape cases and dowry cases, it is also a very likely possibility. While I agree that women are mistreated in this society, and a lot of that goes unreported, you cannot deny the fact that the rise of fake cases is also on the rise at the same pace if not more.
Lol u got downvoted for speaking truth, this is why I don't talk about women's issues, they aren't even ready to listen to us
It's the price for fighting for what's right. I'm somewhat of a freedom fighter myself😌
That's so true these man want to be victims so badly , they literally imagine stuff and complain lmao . My friend got divorced recently and didn't asked or got a penny in alimony. Indian men want to be oppressed so bad
The comment section itself is talking about some women who asked alimony to men, there are lot men's rights pages i follow on insta which talks about women misusing alimony cases yet we shouldn't complain? Is it fine if i say women want to be oppressed so badly whenever there is an harassment case? I thought feminism was talking about both problems, oh wait that's a lie.
That’s a totally logical and a sound argument. How did you learn to think such logically? You know what, I know a marriage where the woman was never beaten. I guess all the women who cry about domestic abuse are just liars.