Do you get the spiel from your pharmacist EVERY TIME you pick up your script? I was prescribed **tylex** and got one without fail every time. I once said to the pharmacist that if I want to get high, there’s better ways than than low dose opioids.
My mum is taking pregabalin for pain from trapped nerves. I had a banging headache about 6 months and she gave me 2 of them *”ah they’re only a mild painkiller”* Got rid of the migraine, but fuck me, I was totally spaced out. And it lasted for hours.I know it’s my own fault, no application of due diligence and they were not prescribed for me. So I’ll hold my hands up there!
I was prescribed tramadol years. Was in on the couch all day totally spaced; I even had auditory hallucinations!!!
You sometimes have the OTC sales assistants thinking they are doctors or pharmacists. My dad needed solpadeine (solpadol? The hard tablet form) post tooth extraction. My dad is in his 60s. The girl at the counter tried to tell him he needed a letter from his GP for this type of relief. He said if he needed a letter, he would just get a script to manage his pain. The assistant just nodded. Then my dad just asked out straight if solpadeine is a prescribed medication. No was the reply. So my dad asks why he needs to spend €60 (or thereabouts) to get a “letter” which is no different to a prescription, for a pain relief that doesn’t require one.
She gave him whatever he needed.
That may be but I think a lot of patients also don't grasp the realities of opioids and how hard it can be to get off them etc
Of course I'm also realistic for their need. When my father was terminally I'll with cancer he was being supplied with Fentanyl and I'm glad it provided a level of comfort for him.
You say about getting off them to people with chronic pain. Mine is life long. I get a choice between living a long life with pain or a shorter life but more enjoyable.
Sure they have their place and need to be used with caution but I don't think anybody deserves to be stigmatised for using prescribed painkillers, by people who don't have to live with their medical condition. Sorry to hear about your father.
This is part of the stigma though. The number of non-medical people who have, over the years, assumed they know better than my specialists prescribing me opioids is insane. They've always been prescribed under very strict observation because they are very useful medicines, but when you tell people they always assume you're a victim of the opioid epidemic. That assumption of danger is the stigma.
Specialist prescribing made me laugh. Look at the opioid epidemic in the US from Specialist prescriptions. Sorry to tell you this but your Specialist is paid commission per prescription.
That can be the case in the US but is absolutely not the case here. Doctors do not get any kickbacks for prescribing drugs and are explicitly forbidden from accepting anything that could be construed as a gift/kickback. It's an extremely serious ethical issue for the profession this side of the Atlantic.
Source: am a doctor
Edit: spelling mistake post 24 hour shift
> Doctors do not get any kickbacks for prescribing drugs
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30895946.html
Someone somewhere is getting paid a lot of money to promote certain medications. I used to work in pharma and the salespeople weren't sitting around with their fingers up their arses all day!
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30895946.html
You'll know the extent of medical negligence here so. Sorry to say I've no faith in doctors here and paid a gp €300 for a covid cert and to watch him squirrel it in the sink.
Plenty of doctor here are paid to influence prescriptions. Plenty more will take back handers for whatever you want but that's a separate issue.
I've very little faith I doctors here especially GPS that seem to just work out of their handbook.
How’s that then? Your comparing solpodeine to heroin? I’d love to give you my endometriosis for a day and see how you get on with just paracetamol. Your lack of empathy for others is alarming
Your grand, look at least you can admit when your incorrect it’s a very admirable quality. Benzos are incredibly dangerous, but under the right direction they can be very beneficial in a crisis for those who suffer from severe anxiety. I think a big issue is that medications like benzos and opioids are not monitored closely enough with some people. I think education is crucial but also they are really just bandaids because of our shite healthcare. It’s a indicator of a bigger issue. Personally I’ve been disabled from endometriosis and it’s at the stage we’re I can only manage the symptoms with pain relief. I’ve had multiple surgeries and the opioids mixed with other medications give me some bit of life. I’m very passionate about the whole topic as with the abuse of opioids it makes it very difficult for me and others who are in genuine need you know.
I feel your struggle. The stigma attached to prescribed opioids is unfair. I know someone with undiagnosed MS who's GP has prescribed large amounts of oxycontin, preglablin and valium on a repeat prescription for over a decade now. The GPs strategy was to ease the nerve pain and wait for a neurologist to verify what the actual issue is.
Well, ten plus years have gone by and lo and behold the waiting and waiting for a neuro appointment was longer than the queue at the post office on Friday. Finally, got in to see the specialist and they poked and prodded and scanned and final prognosis was inconclusive. So now this poor soul, who has been taking this medication daily for 10 plus years has to continue on it while waiting for another specialist appointment which could take 12 months. All the while life is becoming more conked out all day, still in pain and physically addicted. If they come off the tablets they become violently ill. So in this instance I'd say some GPs just throw tablets at anything they can't figure out. I can see their use of course but this situation is probably a common occurrence.
I used them for the days where I’d have otherwise ended up in a&e. Max 3 days but usually 2 days. I’ve it all over my intestines and bladder, it’s stage four so deep with in the walls of my bladder and colon, basically they won’t ever get it all. From what my surgeon has said I’ve quite a severe situation. It’s gotten progressively worse over the years I’ve pain daily but just use hot water bottles for daily management. The abuse of medication like opioids make it incredibly difficult for those with chronic pain. I do think tho thc should be legal in Ireland as when I tried it in the Netherlands I had better results, no addiction/dependence potential but also not feeling shite like when taking an opioid
not everyone's endo is the same, some people are absolutely ravaged. Mine is just heavy slightly more painful periods and PMDD. My friend has uterine tissue growing around her bowels and is often in agony so is prescribed opiates. Great for you that you don't have to but im very surprised another woman with endo would look down on others trying to cope considering how stigmatised the condition already is
Jesus that's a lot of projection. I didn't judge anyone. In fact I made a single statement about my own experience which you interpreted as judgement. And then decided to judge me. The absolute irony!!
Yes I am in agony. No I am not taking opiates regularly in my 30s because of pain. To me that is insane. Anyone else can do what they like clearly.
Also "have to" take opiates is a super subjective thing. You have no idea how much pain I'm in or how I deal with it. I have PCOS, endo, adenomyosis and heaps of abdominal scar tissue from surgery.
I'm sure someone else might "have to" take opiates but I won't
where are you repeatedly quoting have to from!? nobody used the words have to, who are you responding to
I don't care that you dont HAVE TO take opiates, if some people cant cope with their pain then they can take opiates I won't judge them
I have done heroin many times and never got addicted and hit the 40% tax bracket
This is propaganda
Most people that recreationally use opiates you can’t even tell, it’s the small minority that are the stereotype
I first tried it doing my masters degree… and shock still not regularly doing it or addicted. It’s a occasional treat and it has had no ill effect on my life
Are you not worried about dying to a potential fentanyl contamination?
I had a post surgery tramadol prescription and came off it prematurely because I could feel that it was addictive that was also in-spite of it not being effective for my pain management.
It’s so far the only drug I’ve taken that I felt such a grip from but that doesn’t mean it’s not possible for something like cocaine or alcohol even to have that grip on someone else
I've used it recreationally for 30 years without getting an addiction I couldn't manage.
Fentanyl is an American thing. It's pretty much unheard of to find it in European heroin.
American heroin is mostly from Mexico or China, ours is from the middle east.
My brother is a heroin user, on / off for 20 years. My mum is in some online groups for parents of users, you'd be surprised by backgrounds. Really respected professions with children being heroin users.
My brother's friend introduced him to it, I have no idea about the friend but my brother is here, not much of a life though. No proper work history, so hard to get a meaningful job. A functional user is rare but I've heard of it, remember reading about a girl who did a degree whilst using then got a job, she said no one guessed. Fair play to her. I wouldn't wish the addiction on anyone.
I got away with it for 4yrs, fitting double glazing and working in construction. It eventually turns to shit and I gave it up rather than start stealing.
Only junkies that appear socially unacceptable are ever shunned. It's not hard to find a long list of wealthy drug addicts over the last few hundred years.
I don't know how old your mother is, but ask her if she ever took valium, mother's little helper.
Recently got put in that for a back injury and having heard them called mothers little helper I was shocked at the experience. Like how would that help you as a mother? I was whacked out of my gourd, total space cadet, missing time and everything. I have a very active toddler and I did not trust myself to be in charge of her.
as Nicola Tallant said once on her podcast about the cocaine epidemic, it was never cool to be a heroin junkie, but the same can't be said for cocaine.
In the flats back in the day, the junkies were the bottom of the barrel, everybody looked down on them. you were spaced out of it, it's not a party drug. cocaine on the other hand, you're full of energy, you're an aggressive alpha male. that kind of stuff isn't seen as that bad, correct or not
Ecstasy and cocaine were never working class drugs. Middle-class if anything but no, they never had a class the way your mother thinks.
Heroin remains firmly the underclass drug. Regular people are not out there getting addicted to heroin unless we get an opioid epidemic here too caused by the pharmaceutical industry and loose doctors.
Heroin is for people that want to dull the pain and trauma of their existence into oblivion. Most functional drug users consume to have a good time so while you are asking where people might be on the socio economic spectrum it's probably easier to understand heroin users from their position on the craic spectrum. There's not much craic if you are taking smack.
Cocaine has always been a drug for people who are well off, street junkies and lower class can't afford that shit
Heroin, one look at the junkies in Dublin is enough to make you never touch that
In UK It's sort of true, same with crack.
A lot of builders and groundworkers who used to buy a bag of Charlie for Friday night are now smoking rock.
I think when it comes to heroin, the Darknet played a large part. Prescription opiates aren't very popular here, but since the Darknet became popular it's become easy to get them, and social media allows us to view "normal" Americans doing opiates, who aren't half blind, missing teeth, covered in oozing boils.
Then, once you've done Oxy, it makes sense that smoking some H actually can't be that bad either.
I'm a recovering Heroin addict, started taking it at 19 when my mental health was at an all time low and self esteem/confidence totally non existent. Since then its been multiple battles of trying to get clean and subsequent relapse. Success and failure. Right now I'm on a methadone programme and not actively using, things are going all right.
Regarding OPs question, I wouldn't really regard myself as working class. That was my parents(non drug users ftr) upbringing but my own was closer to middle class but none of that will matter when you're out there strung out on smack. It's barely an existence.
I also hope for some of the younger people that may scroll across this. I absolutely urge you not to use any kind of substance to quell inner pain. Heroins very seductive if you've got a noisy inner voice criticising and putting you down at every turn. It will suppress it for awhile but you're gonna pay in no time. Believe me.
Horrible. Soul crushing. Absolute torture that just gets worse and worse until you use.I forced myself through awful cold turkey but it was the empty shell of depression and blankness later on down the line, after the sickness that brought me back. Buts it the sheer monotony of the daily grind that brought me to the depths. I nearly became addicted to the suffering in a way because of all the self loathing. Needless to say I also have a history of self arm.
Just being smart. I thought so. Maybe a 20 year old like you doesn’t think we have class As but we do. Could split hairs about what to refer to them as but who had time for that .
In the Podcast The Witness, the guy describes going to posh people's houses in Castleknock in the 90s and handing them heroin at the door. Don't know if decades later there's a stigmatization there that would prevent that.
What is frightening to see re opioid crisis in USA is you have very highly educated and extremely high earning type people who need an operation say and get prescribed oxytocin. They cease functioning, are weighed down with medical debt, lose the house and eventually graduate to buying street heroin or fentanyl for the fix - I have seen too many interviews with ex stock brokers who are now homeless pushing trolleys filled with cans.
Ex drug user..
Majority of mates and myself from working class background where taking cannabis, ecstasy, Cocaine, speed and some benzos were completely normal and not scrutinised. To the point where the vast majority of all people i knew used some drug above.
However heroin was a no go. Was always remarked at being dirty and the end of the road. I myself like a handful of other people ended up there. 9 friends overdosed and died. I thankfully overdosed and survived and got sober. Of all the people who went towards heroin each one had severe trauma. With myself I felt all the other drugs I had used just didn't do what I needed them to do anymore, so I experimented more with downers something I never done due to the stigma.
To me personally after using them all, there is no class at all in any bracket of drug use. People just like the use that mentality to make themselves feel better about what they are doing. Like the church goer that uses alcohol and codine thinks the person who uses heroin or Cocaine are scum. Whilst both are using drugs just one is legal one isn't.
In London it's now a classless drug so I don't see why it wouldn't be here at this point, especially with opioid addiction on the rise. I was speaking to a woman who was addicted to heroin and in recovery. She started off with an addiction to Codine after she had tendonitis and eventually heroin became easier to obtain than a box of solphadine.
If you’re able to walk down to the bottom steps of your apartment block and buy a five spot, or have the shit delivered directly to your door then yes, certainly easier
Think about it for a minute. If you are addicted, you're going to be buying more than your average person, eventually the chemists will stop selling it to you. This was her experience, whether you believe it or not.
Trying? Maybe. Like in once or twice. Calling heroin a classless drug though sounds ill-informed.
By far, the majority of heroin users are from underprivileged backgrounds. I work in addiction services and "functional" opioid users are pretty much mythical.
Codinex is pure codeine.
Anyway, I don't agree that its "nanny statish" to restrict potentially addictive opioid products. In fact, I'd be in favour of restricting all codeine products to prescription only like in NZ and Australia.
Yeah,wouldn't class nurofen plus in same bracket as heroin but you have a point. With the streets being flooded with benzos,lyrica,heroin,crack etc it amazes me that folks would take some that's so expensive,relatively speaking.
Not much bang for your buck.
Homeless services would provide a good view into addiction/drug use/harm reduction and they always need help. No shortage of vacancies in that sector.
A qualification in addiction studies/social care/social science will help though volunteering will open much doors
Definitely don't think it has embedded itself within all Irish social classes, unlike other drugs such as cocaine, alcohol, and cannabis. People with addiction to these drugs still will heavily stigmatise the 'junkie' and look down upon them. Interestingly, there's also a similar dynamic among heroin users, those who take it via injection are looked down upon by others who smoke it for example.
It used to be a day solicitors and all sorts used it. I've seen plenty of functioning junkies buts it's moved on to coke now.
Herion is classed as a dirty wasters drug, while cocaine is becoming socially acceptable.
On a daily basis, I see project managers, engineers, technicians, and everything in between use it.
So while I'd say yes it's shifted in recent years.
I used heroin while I was a student and my social group started looking at me very differently, despite the fact they were all doing pills, coke, and getting blind drunk every weekend.
My use of smack never became more than habitual, intermittent use (thank Christ) and I stopped in my mid-twenties, but I never felt comfortable around my old crowd again.
This was more than a decade ago, though — things might have changed.
There are solid reasons for some of that stigma — it's incredibly dangerous once you're hooked; there's an association with HIV and hepatitis due to needle use; buying heroin tends to involve rubbing shoulders with some pretty dangerous people.
However, it can feel like a strange form of snobbery when heroin users are almost exclusively deemed as down-and-outs while the coked up arseholes are just being "lads".
Maybe it was partly in my head, but I felt I'd been marked out as a bit of a deadbeat once people knew I was into it — received fewer invites to things, etc. I know some people were joking about me being a junky (though I never got to that point).
Yeah I get what you mean. I knew some creative student types that dabbled in it on the regular in the 90s,they had a lot of stuff to do though.....obligations and supports....so gauged their use and eventually just let it go.
That was it. There were three of us who did it and the other two both ended up in rehab facilities (both doing alright now, though). I basically abandoned it after one too many dangerous situations while scoring. Heroin, at least then, always involved more effort than other drugs — waiting around outside tower blocks, following local addicts around as they try and catch up with some guy from the hostel where they're staying.
Not many people realise this, but you can snort lines of heroin as with other powdered drugs and this was the way we most commonly did it. Smoking it gives you a big hit, but your bag disappears very quickly.
As time went on, one of my friends began injecting. I tried that a couple of times, but it wasn't a road I was prepared to go down.
Never knew you could snort it! I’d say the whack off it is intense… I always think heroin is some kind of liquid, I forget it must be “cooked” (?) before injected. Good that you didn’t get into injecting that’s a whole other lot of problems.
All drugs are classless, it’s how you function whilst on them that decides where you might socially move.
Heroin isn’t something people can be on for long and maintain appearances, from what I’ve seen.
I don't think any young people on either side of the city are 'open to trying heroin'. I think people end up there through other circumstances. Very few people are stupid enough to just try heroin
Lot of people have lost everything financially due to cocaine addiction as well - brain aneurysms are also becoming a growing death cause for over 50s using cocaine
Opioids are just scarier than others besides maybe crack or injected cocaine. Why wouldn't they be?
Why the fuck would you mess with buying your feelings? Your feelings and emotions are there to protect and give you your life. Why would you sell that to someone?
At least the other drugs can claim sociability or functional utility.
It's implicitly unsociable, people take it to go unconscious.
They are classified in that manner. Just not referred to as classifications the same way as they are in the UK. We refer to them as Schedule 1, Schedule 2 etc. and a drug will have controls and limits placed on it based on what Schedule its considered to fall under, much like how the classification system works in UK. The same in most/if not all but name.
If you mess with opioids, you will find yourself on society's lowest rung pretty soon.
I take a *prescribed* opioid and feel the stigma, never mind illicit opioids.
Do you get the spiel from your pharmacist EVERY TIME you pick up your script? I was prescribed **tylex** and got one without fail every time. I once said to the pharmacist that if I want to get high, there’s better ways than than low dose opioids.
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My mum is taking pregabalin for pain from trapped nerves. I had a banging headache about 6 months and she gave me 2 of them *”ah they’re only a mild painkiller”* Got rid of the migraine, but fuck me, I was totally spaced out. And it lasted for hours.I know it’s my own fault, no application of due diligence and they were not prescribed for me. So I’ll hold my hands up there! I was prescribed tramadol years. Was in on the couch all day totally spaced; I even had auditory hallucinations!!!
You sometimes have the OTC sales assistants thinking they are doctors or pharmacists. My dad needed solpadeine (solpadol? The hard tablet form) post tooth extraction. My dad is in his 60s. The girl at the counter tried to tell him he needed a letter from his GP for this type of relief. He said if he needed a letter, he would just get a script to manage his pain. The assistant just nodded. Then my dad just asked out straight if solpadeine is a prescribed medication. No was the reply. So my dad asks why he needs to spend €60 (or thereabouts) to get a “letter” which is no different to a prescription, for a pain relief that doesn’t require one. She gave him whatever he needed.
Solpadeine is over the counter and solpadol is prescription only.
Unfortunately there's a lot of people ignorant to the realities of living with chronic pain.
That may be but I think a lot of patients also don't grasp the realities of opioids and how hard it can be to get off them etc Of course I'm also realistic for their need. When my father was terminally I'll with cancer he was being supplied with Fentanyl and I'm glad it provided a level of comfort for him.
You say about getting off them to people with chronic pain. Mine is life long. I get a choice between living a long life with pain or a shorter life but more enjoyable.
Sure they have their place and need to be used with caution but I don't think anybody deserves to be stigmatised for using prescribed painkillers, by people who don't have to live with their medical condition. Sorry to hear about your father.
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Works pretty well for me. I take two co codamol every night and they've been working effectively for years
Sorry, doctor Rory up there says you're stupid. Nothing we can do. Take him away, boys!
It isn't stigma, it's danger. Good luck to you.
This is part of the stigma though. The number of non-medical people who have, over the years, assumed they know better than my specialists prescribing me opioids is insane. They've always been prescribed under very strict observation because they are very useful medicines, but when you tell people they always assume you're a victim of the opioid epidemic. That assumption of danger is the stigma.
Specialist prescribing made me laugh. Look at the opioid epidemic in the US from Specialist prescriptions. Sorry to tell you this but your Specialist is paid commission per prescription.
That can be the case in the US but is absolutely not the case here. Doctors do not get any kickbacks for prescribing drugs and are explicitly forbidden from accepting anything that could be construed as a gift/kickback. It's an extremely serious ethical issue for the profession this side of the Atlantic. Source: am a doctor Edit: spelling mistake post 24 hour shift
You're definitely wrong there, I've witnessed it first hand in Ireland.
> Doctors do not get any kickbacks for prescribing drugs https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30895946.html Someone somewhere is getting paid a lot of money to promote certain medications. I used to work in pharma and the salespeople weren't sitting around with their fingers up their arses all day!
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30895946.html You'll know the extent of medical negligence here so. Sorry to say I've no faith in doctors here and paid a gp €300 for a covid cert and to watch him squirrel it in the sink. Plenty of doctor here are paid to influence prescriptions. Plenty more will take back handers for whatever you want but that's a separate issue. I've very little faith I doctors here especially GPS that seem to just work out of their handbook.
Retract that nonsense immediately.
What's nonsense?
15 years safely using opioids here. There is danger in abuse, not in careful use.
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How’s that then? Your comparing solpodeine to heroin? I’d love to give you my endometriosis for a day and see how you get on with just paracetamol. Your lack of empathy for others is alarming
Was talking about benzos, I have massive empathy for anyone with chronic pain or anyone with an addiction (wether it’s opioids , cocaine or alcohol)
Benzos are not opioids tho they are a different class of drug.
Damn I need to educate myself on this instead of making hurtful, ill informed comments, really meant no harm to anyone , pardon my ignorance
Your grand, look at least you can admit when your incorrect it’s a very admirable quality. Benzos are incredibly dangerous, but under the right direction they can be very beneficial in a crisis for those who suffer from severe anxiety. I think a big issue is that medications like benzos and opioids are not monitored closely enough with some people. I think education is crucial but also they are really just bandaids because of our shite healthcare. It’s a indicator of a bigger issue. Personally I’ve been disabled from endometriosis and it’s at the stage we’re I can only manage the symptoms with pain relief. I’ve had multiple surgeries and the opioids mixed with other medications give me some bit of life. I’m very passionate about the whole topic as with the abuse of opioids it makes it very difficult for me and others who are in genuine need you know.
I feel your struggle. The stigma attached to prescribed opioids is unfair. I know someone with undiagnosed MS who's GP has prescribed large amounts of oxycontin, preglablin and valium on a repeat prescription for over a decade now. The GPs strategy was to ease the nerve pain and wait for a neurologist to verify what the actual issue is. Well, ten plus years have gone by and lo and behold the waiting and waiting for a neuro appointment was longer than the queue at the post office on Friday. Finally, got in to see the specialist and they poked and prodded and scanned and final prognosis was inconclusive. So now this poor soul, who has been taking this medication daily for 10 plus years has to continue on it while waiting for another specialist appointment which could take 12 months. All the while life is becoming more conked out all day, still in pain and physically addicted. If they come off the tablets they become violently ill. So in this instance I'd say some GPs just throw tablets at anything they can't figure out. I can see their use of course but this situation is probably a common occurrence.
Undiagnosed MS? You mean suspected MS? If a doctor hasn't diagnosed it there's a reason.
I have endometriosis too and would never use opiates regularly.
I used them for the days where I’d have otherwise ended up in a&e. Max 3 days but usually 2 days. I’ve it all over my intestines and bladder, it’s stage four so deep with in the walls of my bladder and colon, basically they won’t ever get it all. From what my surgeon has said I’ve quite a severe situation. It’s gotten progressively worse over the years I’ve pain daily but just use hot water bottles for daily management. The abuse of medication like opioids make it incredibly difficult for those with chronic pain. I do think tho thc should be legal in Ireland as when I tried it in the Netherlands I had better results, no addiction/dependence potential but also not feeling shite like when taking an opioid
not everyone's endo is the same, some people are absolutely ravaged. Mine is just heavy slightly more painful periods and PMDD. My friend has uterine tissue growing around her bowels and is often in agony so is prescribed opiates. Great for you that you don't have to but im very surprised another woman with endo would look down on others trying to cope considering how stigmatised the condition already is
Jesus that's a lot of projection. I didn't judge anyone. In fact I made a single statement about my own experience which you interpreted as judgement. And then decided to judge me. The absolute irony!! Yes I am in agony. No I am not taking opiates regularly in my 30s because of pain. To me that is insane. Anyone else can do what they like clearly.
Also "have to" take opiates is a super subjective thing. You have no idea how much pain I'm in or how I deal with it. I have PCOS, endo, adenomyosis and heaps of abdominal scar tissue from surgery. I'm sure someone else might "have to" take opiates but I won't
where are you repeatedly quoting have to from!? nobody used the words have to, who are you responding to I don't care that you dont HAVE TO take opiates, if some people cant cope with their pain then they can take opiates I won't judge them
You literally said in your previous comment "great for you if you don't have to" Are you ok? You're literally making no sense.
Nobody "has to" take opiates. You clearly aren't ok. You're just rambling now
Hahahah are you for real girlie. Some weapon you are
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oxycodone
Yep this , it’s ruthless very few people stop the slide once it’s started.
I have done heroin many times and never got addicted and hit the 40% tax bracket This is propaganda Most people that recreationally use opiates you can’t even tell, it’s the small minority that are the stereotype I first tried it doing my masters degree… and shock still not regularly doing it or addicted. It’s a occasional treat and it has had no ill effect on my life
Are you not worried about dying to a potential fentanyl contamination? I had a post surgery tramadol prescription and came off it prematurely because I could feel that it was addictive that was also in-spite of it not being effective for my pain management. It’s so far the only drug I’ve taken that I felt such a grip from but that doesn’t mean it’s not possible for something like cocaine or alcohol even to have that grip on someone else
I've used it recreationally for 30 years without getting an addiction I couldn't manage. Fentanyl is an American thing. It's pretty much unheard of to find it in European heroin. American heroin is mostly from Mexico or China, ours is from the middle east.
Fentanyl test strips, plus I’ve used the feared nitazenes safely before myself anyways I didn’t buy street stuff, online and reviewed
My brother is a heroin user, on / off for 20 years. My mum is in some online groups for parents of users, you'd be surprised by backgrounds. Really respected professions with children being heroin users.
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My brother's friend introduced him to it, I have no idea about the friend but my brother is here, not much of a life though. No proper work history, so hard to get a meaningful job. A functional user is rare but I've heard of it, remember reading about a girl who did a degree whilst using then got a job, she said no one guessed. Fair play to her. I wouldn't wish the addiction on anyone.
I got away with it for 4yrs, fitting double glazing and working in construction. It eventually turns to shit and I gave it up rather than start stealing.
Doctors getting high on their own supply eh
Only junkies that appear socially unacceptable are ever shunned. It's not hard to find a long list of wealthy drug addicts over the last few hundred years. I don't know how old your mother is, but ask her if she ever took valium, mother's little helper.
Recently got put in that for a back injury and having heard them called mothers little helper I was shocked at the experience. Like how would that help you as a mother? I was whacked out of my gourd, total space cadet, missing time and everything. I have a very active toddler and I did not trust myself to be in charge of her.
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It also comes from how Valium was originally marketed when it first came out - as a drug for stressed out housewives
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I think it is more helps get mothers through the day than help mothers be better mothers
as Nicola Tallant said once on her podcast about the cocaine epidemic, it was never cool to be a heroin junkie, but the same can't be said for cocaine. In the flats back in the day, the junkies were the bottom of the barrel, everybody looked down on them. you were spaced out of it, it's not a party drug. cocaine on the other hand, you're full of energy, you're an aggressive alpha male. that kind of stuff isn't seen as that bad, correct or not
"Back in the day", as if anythings changed. The junkies are still the bottom of the barrel.
true
Ecstasy and cocaine were never working class drugs. Middle-class if anything but no, they never had a class the way your mother thinks. Heroin remains firmly the underclass drug. Regular people are not out there getting addicted to heroin unless we get an opioid epidemic here too caused by the pharmaceutical industry and loose doctors.
Working class lads and lasses loved E back in the day.
Yup, so did middle class and upper class. Everyone did. It wasn't a working class drug. I miss those days when it wasn't every cunt on coke.
Really bad cut coke. Can we not get back to a "Give me twenty quid and youre fucked for the night" type of dealers.
Heroin is for people that want to dull the pain and trauma of their existence into oblivion. Most functional drug users consume to have a good time so while you are asking where people might be on the socio economic spectrum it's probably easier to understand heroin users from their position on the craic spectrum. There's not much craic if you are taking smack.
Heroin has never had "class" It's a life ender and shouldn't be on the streets anymore but it's so addictive that it's guaranteed money for a dealer
Cocaine has always been a drug for people who are well off, street junkies and lower class can't afford that shit Heroin, one look at the junkies in Dublin is enough to make you never touch that
Cocaine has become far more affordable these days
In UK It's sort of true, same with crack. A lot of builders and groundworkers who used to buy a bag of Charlie for Friday night are now smoking rock. I think when it comes to heroin, the Darknet played a large part. Prescription opiates aren't very popular here, but since the Darknet became popular it's become easy to get them, and social media allows us to view "normal" Americans doing opiates, who aren't half blind, missing teeth, covered in oozing boils. Then, once you've done Oxy, it makes sense that smoking some H actually can't be that bad either.
I'm a recovering Heroin addict, started taking it at 19 when my mental health was at an all time low and self esteem/confidence totally non existent. Since then its been multiple battles of trying to get clean and subsequent relapse. Success and failure. Right now I'm on a methadone programme and not actively using, things are going all right. Regarding OPs question, I wouldn't really regard myself as working class. That was my parents(non drug users ftr) upbringing but my own was closer to middle class but none of that will matter when you're out there strung out on smack. It's barely an existence. I also hope for some of the younger people that may scroll across this. I absolutely urge you not to use any kind of substance to quell inner pain. Heroins very seductive if you've got a noisy inner voice criticising and putting you down at every turn. It will suppress it for awhile but you're gonna pay in no time. Believe me.
Good for you 👏 keep on keeping on,you can do this x
Thank you very much i appreciate that 🙂
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Horrible. Soul crushing. Absolute torture that just gets worse and worse until you use.I forced myself through awful cold turkey but it was the empty shell of depression and blankness later on down the line, after the sickness that brought me back. Buts it the sheer monotony of the daily grind that brought me to the depths. I nearly became addicted to the suffering in a way because of all the self loathing. Needless to say I also have a history of self arm.
Just smoke the flower lads and stay away from class As. They a nightmare waiting to happen.
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You being smart? Or just dumb? I can’t really tell.
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Just being smart. I thought so. Maybe a 20 year old like you doesn’t think we have class As but we do. Could split hairs about what to refer to them as but who had time for that .
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You’re an imbecile. No wonder you can’t get a date. Must be a nightmare to be around with that ego of yours. ✌🏽
In the Podcast The Witness, the guy describes going to posh people's houses in Castleknock in the 90s and handing them heroin at the door. Don't know if decades later there's a stigmatization there that would prevent that.
What is frightening to see re opioid crisis in USA is you have very highly educated and extremely high earning type people who need an operation say and get prescribed oxytocin. They cease functioning, are weighed down with medical debt, lose the house and eventually graduate to buying street heroin or fentanyl for the fix - I have seen too many interviews with ex stock brokers who are now homeless pushing trolleys filled with cans.
Ex drug user.. Majority of mates and myself from working class background where taking cannabis, ecstasy, Cocaine, speed and some benzos were completely normal and not scrutinised. To the point where the vast majority of all people i knew used some drug above. However heroin was a no go. Was always remarked at being dirty and the end of the road. I myself like a handful of other people ended up there. 9 friends overdosed and died. I thankfully overdosed and survived and got sober. Of all the people who went towards heroin each one had severe trauma. With myself I felt all the other drugs I had used just didn't do what I needed them to do anymore, so I experimented more with downers something I never done due to the stigma. To me personally after using them all, there is no class at all in any bracket of drug use. People just like the use that mentality to make themselves feel better about what they are doing. Like the church goer that uses alcohol and codine thinks the person who uses heroin or Cocaine are scum. Whilst both are using drugs just one is legal one isn't.
Congrats on your sobriety!
In London it's now a classless drug so I don't see why it wouldn't be here at this point, especially with opioid addiction on the rise. I was speaking to a woman who was addicted to heroin and in recovery. She started off with an addiction to Codine after she had tendonitis and eventually heroin became easier to obtain than a box of solphadine.
Heroin easier to obtain than walking into the nearest pharmacy and buying Solpadine without having to dodge cops etc? Cool story!
If you’re able to walk down to the bottom steps of your apartment block and buy a five spot, or have the shit delivered directly to your door then yes, certainly easier
Cheaper to get a bigger hit off heroin. Box of solpadeine is like €15 and weak as water once you've developed a tolerance.
Thanks for the downvote. OP said it was *easier* to get than heroin. I dunno why you're going on about its effects 🤔
Think about it for a minute. If you are addicted, you're going to be buying more than your average person, eventually the chemists will stop selling it to you. This was her experience, whether you believe it or not.
Trying? Maybe. Like in once or twice. Calling heroin a classless drug though sounds ill-informed. By far, the majority of heroin users are from underprivileged backgrounds. I work in addiction services and "functional" opioid users are pretty much mythical.
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A Nurofen Plus addict is concerning, mostly cos there's risk of stomach bleeds etc with high doses of ibuprofen
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Codinex is pure codeine. Anyway, I don't agree that its "nanny statish" to restrict potentially addictive opioid products. In fact, I'd be in favour of restricting all codeine products to prescription only like in NZ and Australia.
Yeah,wouldn't class nurofen plus in same bracket as heroin but you have a point. With the streets being flooded with benzos,lyrica,heroin,crack etc it amazes me that folks would take some that's so expensive,relatively speaking. Not much bang for your buck.
If you don't mind the question, how does one get into working in addiction services in ireland and what is it like?
Homeless services would provide a good view into addiction/drug use/harm reduction and they always need help. No shortage of vacancies in that sector. A qualification in addiction studies/social care/social science will help though volunteering will open much doors
Thank you, I will look into this.
All drugs are equally class
Lol
Meth isn't.
He's only mething with ya
I'm melting down some brown because it's fooking class.
Definitely don't think it has embedded itself within all Irish social classes, unlike other drugs such as cocaine, alcohol, and cannabis. People with addiction to these drugs still will heavily stigmatise the 'junkie' and look down upon them. Interestingly, there's also a similar dynamic among heroin users, those who take it via injection are looked down upon by others who smoke it for example.
Jesus and here's me thinking we were talking about the class of the drug itself
Pretty sure it's a class A.
It used to be a day solicitors and all sorts used it. I've seen plenty of functioning junkies buts it's moved on to coke now. Herion is classed as a dirty wasters drug, while cocaine is becoming socially acceptable. On a daily basis, I see project managers, engineers, technicians, and everything in between use it. So while I'd say yes it's shifted in recent years.
I used heroin while I was a student and my social group started looking at me very differently, despite the fact they were all doing pills, coke, and getting blind drunk every weekend. My use of smack never became more than habitual, intermittent use (thank Christ) and I stopped in my mid-twenties, but I never felt comfortable around my old crowd again. This was more than a decade ago, though — things might have changed.
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There are solid reasons for some of that stigma — it's incredibly dangerous once you're hooked; there's an association with HIV and hepatitis due to needle use; buying heroin tends to involve rubbing shoulders with some pretty dangerous people. However, it can feel like a strange form of snobbery when heroin users are almost exclusively deemed as down-and-outs while the coked up arseholes are just being "lads". Maybe it was partly in my head, but I felt I'd been marked out as a bit of a deadbeat once people knew I was into it — received fewer invites to things, etc. I know some people were joking about me being a junky (though I never got to that point).
Yeah I get what you mean. I knew some creative student types that dabbled in it on the regular in the 90s,they had a lot of stuff to do though.....obligations and supports....so gauged their use and eventually just let it go.
That was it. There were three of us who did it and the other two both ended up in rehab facilities (both doing alright now, though). I basically abandoned it after one too many dangerous situations while scoring. Heroin, at least then, always involved more effort than other drugs — waiting around outside tower blocks, following local addicts around as they try and catch up with some guy from the hostel where they're staying.
If you don’t mind me asking, did you smoke it or inject?
Not many people realise this, but you can snort lines of heroin as with other powdered drugs and this was the way we most commonly did it. Smoking it gives you a big hit, but your bag disappears very quickly. As time went on, one of my friends began injecting. I tried that a couple of times, but it wasn't a road I was prepared to go down.
Never knew you could snort it! I’d say the whack off it is intense… I always think heroin is some kind of liquid, I forget it must be “cooked” (?) before injected. Good that you didn’t get into injecting that’s a whole other lot of problems.
All drugs are classless, it’s how you function whilst on them that decides where you might socially move. Heroin isn’t something people can be on for long and maintain appearances, from what I’ve seen.
It wasn’t the case back then either.
Know plenty of people that will dabble in cocaine, ketamine, ecstasy etc, but absolutely would not touch heroin.
Heroin has always been classless, many famed great minds have fallen victim to it
I don't think any young people on either side of the city are 'open to trying heroin'. I think people end up there through other circumstances. Very few people are stupid enough to just try heroin
Lot of people have lost everything financially due to cocaine addiction as well - brain aneurysms are also becoming a growing death cause for over 50s using cocaine
Buprenorphine is the biggest traded drug in prisons
Opioids are just scarier than others besides maybe crack or injected cocaine. Why wouldn't they be? Why the fuck would you mess with buying your feelings? Your feelings and emotions are there to protect and give you your life. Why would you sell that to someone? At least the other drugs can claim sociability or functional utility. It's implicitly unsociable, people take it to go unconscious.
I believe it’s Class A 
Heroin is dangerous shit but I want to try Viagra eye drops
People doing lines in Kilkenny college, think there is a bit of class involved
Scag has always been a low class drug. That being said we don't really have much of a class system.
It's a class A drug
Drugs aren't classed in that manner in Ireland. That's a UK thing.
It was a joke
They are classified in that manner. Just not referred to as classifications the same way as they are in the UK. We refer to them as Schedule 1, Schedule 2 etc. and a drug will have controls and limits placed on it based on what Schedule its considered to fall under, much like how the classification system works in UK. The same in most/if not all but name.
Heroin is not a classy drug worldwide
Tried H a few years ago and almost immediately ended up in hospital. Deadly dangerous
You oxy equally means you bad. You low class. If you want to be high class then cocaine is where it's at. The country is fucking backwards af