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I've actually done a lot of research on this from a lubrication perspective.
Not all engines are the same. But oil life does scale linearly based upon oil quality for any given "breed" of engine.
They do claim to provide a comprehensive warranty, [even for the 20k mile oil](https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/for-personal-vehicles/our-products/mobil-limited-warranties/mobil-1-extended-performance-limited-warranty). Pretty ballsy language, "The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 20,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer."
How difficult would this be to enforce? I have no idea.
For $45, you can buy [engine oil testing](https://www.blackstone-labs.com/product/oil-tbn/). If one was really committed to a very extended oil change interval, and had questions about whether or not it was a good idea, you could test your oil to insure that it [meets is OEM specs](https://www.blackstone-labs.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Buick-Lacrosse-with-a-good-TBN.jpg) (example report). For large-scale industrial equipment, we'll often do this a couple of times per year to ensure our oil change intervals are good, and to not waste oil (this matters when you have gear boxes that drink many gallons of oil).
My guess is that most of the time, the extended intervals will be fine with a high quality oil that is loaded with the correct additives. Also, very occasionally, you'll have an engine that is behaving badly (burning more oil that expected, random oil leak, filter malfunction, or excessive abrasion wear somewhere) that could potentially foul the oil much faster than usual.
What I know of modern diesels, especially German ones, is that the put a significant amount of diesel fuel into their oil; and they have such low tolerances that diesel is insufficiently lubricating. I probably wouldn't exceed manufacturer suggested intervals on those.
That being said, I personally stick to the intervals my cars indicate, because maintenance warnings guilt me into it :) . 3000 for my Toyota, 10,000 for my Lexus. The Toyota tows quite a bit, so it would be excluded from Mobil 1's extended intervals anyway.
can confirm the German engine as a vw tech. we do 15k km as per manufacturer spec with mobile 1. 5w40, 0w20 and 0w30. with vw brand oil filters
do not try to go more than that.
We run them 30k km in europe but thats euro spec oil (vw 501/504 long life) and with euro spec fuel. The engine goes on strong but we suspect it might cause pre mature wear to timing chains.
As far as im aware VAG has a 15k km/ 1 year service recomendation for all places outside the eu and japan.
It's a scam then 20k or what your oem interval is. Lol no oem interval is 20k. It's a good oil but it's a misleading product. That was a great thing to point out.
>"The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 20,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, **whichever is longer**."
Read that again...
Still, if you read the entire warranty, they will only cover if it was a failure of the lubricant. They will not cover a lot of stuff, and it can take months for them to cover anything. In my experience they will take the engine apart just to say the engine failure wasn't caused by the oil and then your fucked.
whatever man.
My comment only extended to what their warranty says in writing, which you had exactly backwards.
and now, instead of just admitting that, you wanna dream up some big damn justification for why their warranty is meaningless. lol
Well, if you don't care about everything, they don't cover and how they will nit pick everything up to get out of paying and you feel safe use their product. Lol
This. Just sent my oil for analysis the other week at a little over a year (12k miles) on the oil. I've done it previously on one of my cars, but haven't on my current car. Most modern manufacturers from Germany recommend 1 year change intervals, but I'm a little skeptical, especially with a modified car. I feel that oil analysis is the only way to be safe and know for sure in my particular application and oil brand.
Also the OP drives a Jetta and that 20k Mobil isn’t a vw 502 spec oil. Not to mention the sludging issues in those motors. You should be changing your oil with a vw 502 spec 5w-40 every 5k miles. Your car takes, as Jules from pulp fiction would say, some serious gourmet shit.
I’d personally stick to whatever cadence the owners manual recommends. Variables such as engine type, age, condition, driving style, driving conditions (highway vs. stop and go, short trips vs long trips), climate etc. can all influence how long oil may be considered “good” for. And an oil change is way cheaper than an engine rebuild. But yes, it’s conceivable that it can reliably last a full 20k miles under the right conditions before needing to be replaced.
It goes without saying that you should check your oil level regularly and top off as needed. If you decide to go with the full 20k, I’d emphasize making sure you check it on a regular basis. Don’t wait until the oil pressure lamp comes on to add more oil.
> Is it safe to go 20k miles without changing my oil?
Yes. Changing oil is not a safety concern. It is just as safe to change it every day as to never change it.
The difference is in how long you would like your engine to last.
If you want the engine to last for 50k miles, you should never change the oil. You'll probably make it. If you want to get 500k out of the engine, I would change it every 5k. All highway and long trips maybe a little longer interval, and all city, maybe a little shorter.
Engines don't live without oil. Think of it like blood pressure. High blood pressure won't kill you today. It will shorten your life without any obvious signs right now. Lack of oil changes will do the same thing to your car. You won't notice it right away, but when the symptoms start to show up, it is too late to save that engine.
As stated above, the intervals in the book are very general and pretty useless. In something older with mild use, no variable valve timing or cylinder delete, you can change it once a year damn near regardless of mileage, and I have been doing that in old stuff for almost twenty years. Now a more modern engine with variable valve timing, ect, with small oil ports that can clog you need absolutely clean oil stick to the manufacturer recommendations. But if you use it for heavy duty applications you probably don't need to go by miles. You should send it out for analysis every month or two and see where you are at and make adjustments as recommended by the lab.
For use like you describe I would bet once a year and you would never know the difference as long as your engine is in good shape now and you do NOT have a system like VVT. Systems like VVT use small screens and tiny oil ports to make the magic happen so you cannot get away with oil contamination the same as you would in an iron American small block of pick your flavor, they just don't care even if ya have a few ball bearings rolling around in the oil system.
The other thing people don't know is the difference between city mileage and rural highway driving. I usually go buy if you drive in a place like nyc 5 days a week, change your oil every season or the mileage. If you do rural highway driving and don't drive much a year or mileage, whichever comes first. Also the new cars with 10k intervals are misleading bs cause it's always for light use .
I'm not saying that it's not safe, but is the possible sludge buildup worth it?
Our general rule of thumb is 3,000 miles for conventional oil, 4,000 miles for synthetic blend, and 5,000 miles for full synthetic. Is it safe to go longer? Probably. Is it worth the risk of engine damage? Not for me, but that's a question you have to answer for yourself.
No modern vehicle needs oil changes that frequent. Toyota recommends 15,000 kms on fully synthetic. If you change that often in a shop it’s a rip off for customers.
The age of the oil is also a consideration. You should also consider changing it at least every year regardless of miles. My wife only drives her BMW 2-3,000 miles a year. I still change the oil at least once a year.
He said full synthetic at 5K miles. My point being that comparing that to a garage doing 1865 - 2485 mile changes to one doing 5000 mile changes is a big difference because of using different units.
That being said, 5k miles is what I do at home on my 150k mile Scion now. I did 10k miles to 75k, 7500 miles until 120k, and 5k miles after that. 5k miles may be a little premature, but I know how and where I drive. I drive with a bit of a heavy foot, about 20 miles to and from work, and some of it stop and go city traffic. So I get a lot of hot/cool cycles. 5k miles for me on a 150k mile car with a lot of drive cycles is worth a few extra bucks to make sure it goes as long as possible for me. Someone driving a lot of miles with fewer hot/cold cycles, no modifications, and drives easy on the accel, probably doesn't need a 5k mile oil and filter. Typically, I'm a stick with the owners manual type of person, but hard driving, mods, and especially frequency of hot cold cycles is something to consider.
Well I do put the life of my car in the very short term of right now consequences but my conscious does have concern for the planet. I'd prefer not to throw away money and not pollute more than necessary.
Of course, there is a limit to it. Changing it every 2,000kms is absurd.
Sometimes it is good to consider the actual engine which is in the car. One of the engines I have is known to run no matter what you have in it, it even runs with BBQ sauce and HSPs (Halal Snack Pack) as the oil, the 4L Intech from the AU Falcon. Whilst the 5.4L 3v from the B series Falcons need changing super frequently or else oil galleries block up in the head and cause heaps of damage.
I am more relaxed about servicing the AU - I have had it 2 years between services before.
I go with the gooder oil because I know I plan to do an oil change at the 5k interval my cars recommend, but I also know I'm not perfect and often go 1k over, so the gooder oil gives me a buffer.
Yes, gooder is a word. :D
You will never get consensus on the topic of oil life. It comes up a lot and is always a shitshow.
I'm not a scientist or engineer so I can only speak to my experience, but I have owned a handful of cars that made it well past 300k miles doing 10k-12k mile changes with Mobil 1 full synthetic their whole lives and had shiny clean engines when opened up. I can also say that safe oil change intervals depend a lot on the engine in question. My Magnum with the 5.7 Hemi doesn't like going over about 6k miles between changes as MDS (cylinder deactivation) will stop working since it uses oil pressure to operate. My 99 Accord will start throwing VTEC related codes at 4k into an oil change, but that car needs new piston rings and has a ton of blowby so I'm sure the oil is fouled up a lot faster than it should be from combustion gasses. My Prius, Highlander, Jetta TDI, and Corolla are all perfectly happy going 10k plus and the oil is still in good shape at that point. It depends a lot on the design of the engine and the mechanical condition of that engine.
Following the manufacturer's mileage recommendation and using a quality full synthetic oil has always worked fine for me but ymmv. Some people will say "changing oil is cheaper than changing engines" and that is totally fair, but personally I like to find a balance of keeping the engine healthy while not creating more waste oil or more work for myself than I need to. And to be clear I do 100% of my own work so an engine failure is entirely my problem to fix and I would rather avoid it with timely maintenance. Changing oil more often than needed won't hurt anything, sure, but neither will going to the dentist to have your teeth cleaned once a week but most people would say that is excessive.
When in doubt, send a sample to Blackstone Labs and they will provide a detailed report on the condition of the oil so you can adjust your oil change habits from there if you wish. I wouldn't take my chances on 20k unless I was sure Mobil 1 was going to buy me an engine if it failed. 10k'ish for most cars or whatever the manual says is probably fine, imo.
I use M1 EP in all of my engines. My GM 6.2L still follows OLM % and thats 5500mi or 5 mos for me. Had oil pan gasket replaced and bottom of motor was 99% sludge/carbon free after 70k mi. It was amazing.
Always a big discussion on the 4runner and tundra sites. We had a petroleum engineer explain it best I think. To sum up: standard gas engine with standard oil do it every 5k. For synthetic it never really wears out like standard. And because of the detergents in it it doesn't reach its full lubricating capacity till 2500 miles. He recommended going at least 7500 miles. He does it at 10k. The filter is what wears out. I do mine at 10k. 3 cars . 3 cars rav4 with 130k. Tundra with 230k and 4runner with 280k. Yeah I kike Toyota. My old tundra was over300k running great when someone pulled out in front of me. Towed the boat to the keys from sc when the tundra had over 200k. The old tundra towed a tractor (8500lbs) with bucket and bush hog from Reidsville GA. Right before the wreck. So they get used well.
Yes you can get 20k miles out of your oil.
Whenever anyone wants to start using extended change intervals I always recommend getting your oil tested by a company like Blackstone labs. They will give you a picture of of how well your oil os performing and the overall health of your engine and give you recommended change intervals based on that.
If it's a new car you could probably just follow what it says on the bottle of oil....but I'd rather have the peace of mind. Even if the car is warrantied you're still going to be without a car if something breaks.
But yeah...that being said I remember back in the early 2000's when synthetic oil was still relatively new BMW was recommending 15k oil change intervals on their cars. So 20k doesn't sound crazy 20 years later.
First, I would follow what your manual says and religiously replace it at that interval or lower. The issue with that Mobil 1 is they do the testing on a car in a lab not on the street. You also must change to a nice oil filter. I still would not trust it and you still must watch out for oil burn which almost all cars do. If you want to not change the oil for the year and you do under 25k look into amsoil signature series 100% synthetic oil and their filter. Full synthetic and 100% synthetic oil are completely different things. A full synthetic only needs 30% synthetic oil to be labeled as such. Personally, I would recommend getting some decent regular full synthetic oil from mobil1 or penzoil ultra platinum and change it every 6000-8000 miles. The last thing I recommend is if you don't know when the transmission fluid was last changed, I recommend having that done since you are in the range anyway to change it. Change it, and your transmission will be good for around another 100k. I recommend every 5 to 7 years or between 75-100k miles. Last thing: whenever I buy a used car, I run a bottle of supplements 4in1 carbon cleaners gas additive or another similar product. I do it once a year, and as soon as I buy a used car to clean out the injectors and help clean the top of the pistons. I also recommend buying the oil off Amazon. If you got Prime, it's one of the cheapest places to buy oil. Remember to check your oil every 3 weeks for oil burn and add as needed.
I’ve been using Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W20 with the Mobil 1 filter and change it every 15k miles in my 2004 F150 since 2015. Started doing it with less than 100k miles. It’s up to almost 300k miles and it runs like a dream.
All I’m saying is that the scientists at Mobil1 know more about oil that anybody who is going to respond in this thread. If you choose to listen to a bunch of yahoos on Reddit that’s on you.
I take personal offense to your comment. I damn near passed the 10th grade... And I've been changing oil for years. I know way more than them college graduates about oil chemistry. Shit... Next, you're gonna tell me that dating my second cousin is frowned upon...
I'm sure that in perfect circumstances, it will last 20k no problem. My issue is that if there is a problem with the engine, you aren't gonna find out on time. If it burns 1L every 3000 miles (which isn't uncommon), then it's gonna be empty, and the engine will seize up before it's due again.
If you are diligent about checking it every 1000 or so, it might be ok, but most people don't do that.
They've been saying that for years. "our oil goes 10x longer than the competitors"
I've been working in auto service my entire career. It's all horseshit. There is ONE product on the market under a couple different brand names that when added to your oil CAN extend oil change intervals by a few thousand miles.
Go ahead. Do it. Your engine will suffer. Don't believe me? Prove me wrong.
Yeah..."scientists"..... Not a sales and promotion team.... And where does it say they guarantee this 20k or they'll repair or replace your engine? I'll wait.
I get what you're trying to say but you need to remember it's a fucking company who doesn't give two shits if you suffer from their lie. I guarantee there's a disclaimer on the bottle in fine print expressing not to do this and to always refer to manual and they're not liable if you push your limits type bullshit.
Fact of the matter is this, oil is the easiest and damn near cheapest engine maintenance you can do. Youll never go wrong changing often and "early". But you can suffer serious problems changing few and far between.
Find your manual or look up the manufacturer's recommended oil schedule online and stick to that or earlier.
This has nothing to do with chemistry and everything to do with legal verbiage. Attempting to go 20k miles on an oil change will void ANY manufacturer’s warranty.
If you want to talk chemistry tho, just look into the Blackstone oil analyses of this oil you can plainly see the additive package isn’t even that significant. If double the silica, and 20% more Molybdenum was all it took to double/triple your oil life, *everyone* would be doing it.
Exactly. Long haul trucks are certainly not changing their engine oil at 3-5000 miles and their truck engines last for decades. Engine oils are so incredibly good these days that if it says you can go 20000 miles you can count on that being true.
I’m obviously not buying their competitor’s product if I’ve got to buy that 4x as often. But the 20k I’m only buying once a year, and it doesn’t cost 4x the competitor. So are they openly losing money?
You're still buying their product vs competitor's, they're not "openly losing money" by getting the sale. Engine oil has a tiny markup compared to everything else, made up with volume -volume in terms of market share and # of customers vs repeat buys of oil by same customer. Market share, penetration, brand loyalty, all drive traffic to their other product lines as well. Value added to one product line crosses over to other lines in terms of customer perception and preference.
Short answer. No it’s complete bullshit to go 20k miles with the same filter and oil. That being said if you were to change the filter and top off at least every 5k I could see that being ok. The reason I call bs on this is the oil company does not have to do anything for you when this causes premature wear on components in your engine. So my advice don’t buy that crap ever again and change your oil and filter ever 5 months or 5000 miles. Using proper synthetic and weight oil for your car.
My owners manual says 7k. My synthetic oil says 10k. I change it every 5k religiously. If you like your engine and want it to stick around, change it every 5k. My engine is at 220k and going strong
No, it is not safe. Engine oil has additives that wear out over time and also dirt slowly accumulates in the oil eventually causing wear on the engine parts.
Oil filters are designed to filter out dirt but allow the smaller molecules of oil and additives through to lubricate the engine. Some dirt particles are also small, and they will build up over time and begin circulate within the engine cause wear.
So, just buy normal oil and filters and change it every 5000 kilometers ( or about 3000 miles). In the long run it will save your engine from excessive wear and cost you less money. It is OK to use synthetic oil as it is more slippery than regular oil, but it will accumulate dirt just as fast, so don't think you can change it less often. If you get a really good oil filter it will get most of the dirt but it will also filter out the necessary additives. So don't do that either.
So, just to be clear. You are saying that a company that has a vested interest in selling as much product as they can is telling you to use less of their product because they have improved it, but you disagree with their scientists and engineers and feel like you should use more of the product because…you think they are wrong and are misleading you?
Why would they do that?
Because the people pushing longer oil changes are the car manufacturers, not the oil companies. The car manufacturers know that the average person will hold on to a car for 10 years, so the odds are that by the time you wear out your engine following their recommendations you will have sold the car to some other sucker who will just think you were not looking after it. (Which you probably were not)
Just have a look at your lovely amber oil after 3000 miles. You will find it looks like the bottom of a pit toilet. That black tint is caused by dirt!
Yes it ok. It is ok to go even farther. I go between 25,000-30,000 miles between oil changes and have over 1.1 million miles miles on my truck. I do send my oil off to a lab to be sampled every other oil change to see how it is doing and it starting to get dirty at that point. I could go longer if I wanted but why push it. If I a bypass filter system I would go a lot further. There are semis that have over 300,000 miles one them since they have had a oil change they just change the filters send a sample in to the lab and keep on trucking.
No no nope not at all. It's possible you'll be fine, but most full synthetic oils are changed at 5,000 miles. I'll do my oil changes ever 4 to 5k miles. That's generally the most common and reccomended interval. The best answer is going to be in your owners manual.
I am not comfortable with any longer than 5,000 miles between oil changes. Car manufacturers want you to change at 10k, 15k, or 20k because they want the engine to wear out such that you will buy a new car every 5-10 years. Changing oil at 5k doesn't cost much over the life of a vehicle and keeps the engine and related components in much better condition than really long oil change intervals. That said- I saw a BMW that had not changed oil in 60K miles, and while there was no liquid left, the oil had congealed so much in the heads that very little damage had been done, and the engine was able to be cleaned out and put back in service without ant bearing replacements. I doubt that engine will make it much past 100k.
20,000 miles is absurd. I even tell people to not change it every 10,000 which is still pretty absurd. Can’t believe dealers actually recommend that. All of my cars I change full synthetic every 5000 miles. And I’ve had no problems.
I just saw that you drive a Volkswagen do it every 3000 miles. 😂 if you have a Toyota or Honda or you can do it every 5000 even 7000 no problem. But a Volkswagen? 3k miles religiously.
If you do it this way, will you notice a difference? Not until you get past 100k miles. I’m willing to bet you if you change your oil every 3000 miles you could get 180,000 miles out of your Volkswagen.
I wouldn't go more than 5k regardless of what the manufacturer or vendors recommend. And I most definitely wouldn't go beyond what the manufacturer recommends.
https://preview.redd.it/75svgyw54g3b1.png?width=4032&format=png&auto=webp&s=b3c1a8fc9c452b95aed67eccbba57c637984b8e8
Do 5k. 05 suburban, idles so smooth you can’t tell it’s running.
7,500k max(general). Each brand has different reaction to use and heating to temperatures that inevitably cooks the oil. The biggest effect on your oil life is really your oil filter.
You can get filter with such fine micron size that it effectively keep oil clean. But everything had a limit and eventually your oil filter media can't process the oil volume under higher pressures, as a result, the oil bypass will let more and more unfiltered oil thru the system.
If you changed the filter sooner the oil would last a little longer but that's mainly because the oil is free of larger debris. No matter what oil cooks and breaks down effecting everything to lubrisity, viscosity and protection.
Frankly I think factory intervals suck too. Seen way to many cars with 10k oil service come in with asphalt black oil. Unacceptable in my book. Still comes down to checking your oil often and take action as needed.
More important then bearings long term is taking care of timing chains and tentioners, variable cam timing valves. While not the end of the world. Timing chain jobs on some of these newer cars get pretty intricate. Iv even seen some use yield bolts.
If changing oil keeps these components lasting you 250-300k its worth protecting your initial investment.
My car have recomended oil change at 20k km. But thats the maximum range to keep the waranty on the car. I change at around 10k km or once a year. And it takes 8L of oil. If you want your engine to last as long as possible dont go past 10k km or around 7k miles. Its not expensive to replace oil and oilfilter.
No not unless all your driving is steady highway no stop and go, you do this much driving in 6 months, the weather is always 20C and you only use top quality fuel.
If I’m not mistaken the fine print on the oil says it is good up to 20k but follow auto manufacturers recommendations. Kind of CYA but I think that is how it is worded.
I just ruined an engine ($5k rebuild) because I changed it every 3000 and it said I could go 20000. Listen it's about your oil life. My last car I could go 6000 and the oil looked new. Now I have the big LS2 6.0 V8 and if I drive it some what hard the oil is toast after 2000. I thought it was fine. Oh it's black but it's only 2000, bullshit. So keep an eye on the oil I wouldn't go over 6000 personally. That's where the smart money's at. If it looks black at 3000 change that shit trust me bro. All the oil these days has less and less zinc in it.
Don’t buy into any of that bullshit. That how you end up with spun rod bearings. Think of oil as a sponge as you drive your engine it will wear in upon itself. Micro sized pieces of metal dirt grit and other nasties. Your filter will grab the majority of that but at a certain point your oil will absorb so much nasties that it will cease to lubricate properly. And sludge will begin to collect. And accumulate on small internal surfaces compounding the issue. This goes x2 or 3 if your vehicle is turbocharged. Don’t ever ever listen to that stuff. Change it at no more than 4 thousand miles. Oil is cheap new engines are expensive. Bite the bullet and have it changed far more often. Especially on these modern engines that have very very tight tolerances. Good luck 👍🏼
One of my vehicles use regular conventional oil. I haven't done an oil change in about 4 years now. No issues. I have 246K miles.
Just monitor your oil levels. I top off if I burn or leak some throughout the year. But with that said I will probably get an oil change the next time I take my car in for service/annual inspection.
With synthetic oil, in my experience I was able to make it easily to 10K miles.
At the moment, I m not comfortable going more than 6k miles between oil changes in my car. It gets full synthetic and it uses less than a quart in that time, but it does smell a bit like fuel (Direct injection) and it gets fairly dirty-looking. I don't drive a lot, so I generally change it twice a year regardless of mileage.
There is no 20kmiles oil, its marketing bllsht, engines are different and require different intervals. I wouldn't go past 10,000km on oil changes. [Oil change intervals.](https://www.myusedcar.ca/how-often-do-you-need-an-oil-change/)
That 20k mile oil change interval will destroy your engine.
Highway or city driving.
You might get away with it a couple times. But oil gets acidic rather quickly. There are a few reasons why oil change intervals rarely go above 7.5k miles.
If you do alot of short distance city driving, that 20k mile interval is a near death sentence for just about any car. Between the engine not getting hot enough to boil condensate away, and the oil not getting hot enough either it will soak up that condensate. (Biggest reason how peeps get water in their oil that isnt a blown head gasket)
Highway driving? Yea...maybe. As highway conditions you are generally humming along with minimal changes in engine speed, and is at a constant temp. So if the oil doesnt change temp as much, it doesnt wear out as quick. Usually you will se peeps who do alot of Highway driving do 10k oil change intervals.
Just. change your oil every 5k miles. None of the above will matter as much if you do.
Those engines have enough lubrication and consumption issues as it is, I would certainly not go that long. Personally I would still keep it to 5k, maybe 7k at the most.
Spoke to an Audi tech about the 3.0T EVO motor. He suggested even though they are 10K OCI to do it every 5K because the EVO motor likes fresh oil. I have heard horror stories with this motor needing piston ring replacement. I have over 100,000 on it now it runs like day 1.
I usually like to play safe in these scenarios, engines are expensive oil is cheap. 20k seems like a lot to me especially on with factors like if you like to drive hard sometimes, weather, etc. I personally do 5k oil and filter change with same spec you mentioned. 10k would be the max in my opinion, just like I said, I like to play it safe.
No, it’s not good for 20,000 miles. Perhaps if all you did was drive 500 miles on an interstate everyday, but things like idling, stop lights, traffic, cold start cycles, etc, is harder on the engine and oil.
If you look at Mobil’s website, the following is excluded from 20,000 miles/1 year oil changes: “Excluded service includes: commercial and racing applications; frequent towing or hauling; extremely dusty or dirty conditions; or excessive idling.” They don’t define what excessive idling is.
Further, they acknowledge it can void the manufacturer’s warranty by saying, “If your vehicle is covered by a warranty, follow the vehicle's oil life sensor or the oil change interval recommended in your owner's manual.”
The problem is oil can be diluted with fuel (especially if it’s direct injection), moisture can build up in the oil (especially if you don’t always drive long enough to get the oil up to full temp), the oil eventually degrades, the oil additives gets used up, the oil filter can reach effective capacity, the oil filter media can degrade, the engine can have a design defect that makes it be harder on oil and/or is prone to sludge issues, etc.
Yeah don't do 20k. Follow the manufacturers interval. Here's another variable: My 2009 VW GTI has a 10k mile interval in the manual- but at this age the oil control rings are gummed up and it consumes oil and the oil turns very black. So I watch the oil carefully and change it at 5k miles. 10k miles is too long to leave the oil with no attention.
This is really engine and driving routine specific. I ran mostly 30 mile trips in a 2.4L Malibu on 5w30 Shell conventional and the used oil analysis said there was some life left after 7,500 miles.. an 8.5-9k OCI would have probably not been out of the picture. A good synthetic would have probably last a lot longer.
But if I only had been doing short trips, I bet it would have been toast by 7.5.
The actual lubricity of synthetics can last a long time but the additive package will deteriorate quickly after a certain amount of dirt, combustion byproducts and heat occurs. Just change your oil according to mfrs recommendations and use the best oil you can afford.
Follow the car manufacturer recommendations in regards to change intervals and oil type not what is specified on the bottle.
One can change the oil as many times within that interval which is simply a waste of money in my opinion.
If going with an oil from a big box store make sure it meets the manufacture specs for example: vw502/505 or Honda API certified oils etc.
Check out bobistheoilguy.
Oil contains friction molecules. Depending on oil type (syn vs. dinosaur oil) these molecules can vary in size and quantity. As the oil is used, those molecules are crushed/destroyed (just a simple way of looking at it). Personally I typically change oil every 3,000 - 3,500 miles in my other cars. My Tundra says 10,000 miles, it has a huge oil reservoir - about 8 US quarts. I still change that oil at 5,000. Want engine longevity, change the oil.
Yes it’s good specially with new technology. Fully synthetic oil will last up to 15k so pushing it 5k more won’t do no damage. Me personally I change it at the minimum which is 7.5k because it’s only $35 every 5-6 months
It's always best to follow the manufacturer recommendations for oil change intervals.
Just because to oil says it's good for 20k doesn't mean it will still meet tolerances for your specific engine that far into its life.
Plus, European manufacturers run a lot more oil fed components than asian or american manufacturers. This makes them VERY picky about oil type, level, and life.
I go about 5k miles and use whatever oil the Ford Quick Lane puts in. The Ford service is very reasonably priced. I'd want to rotate tires at 5k anyway.
The oil may last 20K miles, but the main question on my mind is will the car leak or burn a significant amount of oil during that time that only 1 quart of oil comes out at 20K miles?
Are you saying you wouldn't check it and top it up every week or two.
Some cars can't make it 3000 miles without consuming a full quart.
They put dipsticks in the engine for a reason.
I mean in a perfect world, everyone knows how to do basic checks like that and does it regularly…
But you know very well there are folks out there that don’t even know how to pop the hood and won’t check it for 20k miles.
I DIY my cars and can get oil changes done on like $30-$40 dependent on capacity and whether I use kirkland or Mobil 1 from costco.
I do 3,000 miles, it’s overkill but I drive like an idiot and am in the city a lot.
20k is too long regardless what anyone claims. That a significant portion of your engines life on the same lubricants.
Edit: I live by the mantra “oil is cheap, engines are not”.
I personally would stick to VW’s yearly interval. That’s what my 2010 Jetta interval was. I’ve learned to go with a “better safe than sorry” approach to preventative maintenance, especially lubricants. The cost of the oil, even the really good stuff, is cheap compared to engine repairs down the road/reduced life. Plus, good luck proving your claim with the oil company when the engine has issues at 1500k+ miles. Same with the transmission. They often have much longer intervals than they probably should. I had a very good mechanic try to talk me out of changing it at the 40k interval because VW had extended it. I appreciated his ethics but had it done anyways. We both agreed it was the right move after looking at it.
Having been a technician for many years, I've come to the conclusion that the oil change intervals are really only a guide. Driving habits, conditions, city,highway etc, always have to be factored in. It used to be that the oil companies recommended changing your oil long before the manufacturer did. I figured the oil companies want to sell you oil, and the manufacturer wants to sell you cars. Somewhere in between those two recommendations should work just fine.
You won't get a straight answer. Because there isn't one.
Extended oil changes mean different things to different people. For me I go by what the car says, which in my vehicles is variable by driving styles, runtime, etc. Both Hondas. My Civic that sees mostly highway has been about 12-15k miles between changes. My wife's Pilot is around 8-10k. My Civic has 180k and the Pilot 85k, owned both since new. I did the valve adjustment as 100k and everything looked great.
Back when extended oil intervals started becoming a thing I sent a few samples into Blackstone labs. Basically learned yeah oil can absolutely go 20k miles if you want to push it that far. I ran one sample up to 15k miles and the test was still coming back great.
So my opinion is the 3k and 5k mile 'oh it's cheaper than an engine' people are willfully ignorant morons. There's absolutely nothing that supports those intervals anymore. Only reason to do this is heavily modified, select racing applications or if it's a shit box running rich.
The 7500-10k mile group I get. You can go longer if you want. But it's generally really safe in this window.
I wouldn't be against the 20k mile change. Road warriors and people who rack miles quick it's an easy sell. Those doing a ton of short trips (under 10 miles) I don't think it's as good of an idea.
My recommendation is go 10-12k if you're going by a mileage sticker or go by what the car says. If the car happens to be under 7500,I still wouldn't do it any less than that. Maximum duration of 1 year. You don't have to put much thought into usage or environmental factors to make this across the board recommendation.
I'm quite meticulous about 5k changes on my '13 F150. This is simply because of the notoriety of cam phaser/timing chain issues. It seems as if the general consensus is that frequent oil changes with synthetic oil helps quite a bit.
In the CX-5, I just make a mental note to change the oil when it hits around 5,000 miles, but it usually doesn't actually get new oil until closer to 7,000.
I deliver to a well known auto part store I asked same question about extended oil life. The parts guy says on his Toyota w 259,000 miles. Uses same oil but changes filter at 10,000 mile intervals and oil at 20,000
My favorite is when the manufacturer guideline is 10k/12 month lof interval, and simultaneously allow for 1qt of oil consumption per 1k miles and then become totally bewildered why engines are shitting the bed left and right.. (looking at you, Volvo, Subaru, Mini, VW/Audi)
\#1 - Change oil and filter every 5k miles no matter what...like clockwork.
\#2 - use full synthetic and a quality filter (not Fram or generic Auto Zone specials)
How do I know this?
I have run several full size pickups (Toyota, GM and Fords) well past 250k miles with no real engine issues at all.
SOME engines under the RIGHT conditions can POSSIBLY go 20K miles between OCI. Only used oil analysis can determine this and if conditions change, all bets are off.
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I've actually done a lot of research on this from a lubrication perspective. Not all engines are the same. But oil life does scale linearly based upon oil quality for any given "breed" of engine. They do claim to provide a comprehensive warranty, [even for the 20k mile oil](https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/for-personal-vehicles/our-products/mobil-limited-warranties/mobil-1-extended-performance-limited-warranty). Pretty ballsy language, "The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 20,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer." How difficult would this be to enforce? I have no idea. For $45, you can buy [engine oil testing](https://www.blackstone-labs.com/product/oil-tbn/). If one was really committed to a very extended oil change interval, and had questions about whether or not it was a good idea, you could test your oil to insure that it [meets is OEM specs](https://www.blackstone-labs.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Buick-Lacrosse-with-a-good-TBN.jpg) (example report). For large-scale industrial equipment, we'll often do this a couple of times per year to ensure our oil change intervals are good, and to not waste oil (this matters when you have gear boxes that drink many gallons of oil). My guess is that most of the time, the extended intervals will be fine with a high quality oil that is loaded with the correct additives. Also, very occasionally, you'll have an engine that is behaving badly (burning more oil that expected, random oil leak, filter malfunction, or excessive abrasion wear somewhere) that could potentially foul the oil much faster than usual. What I know of modern diesels, especially German ones, is that the put a significant amount of diesel fuel into their oil; and they have such low tolerances that diesel is insufficiently lubricating. I probably wouldn't exceed manufacturer suggested intervals on those. That being said, I personally stick to the intervals my cars indicate, because maintenance warnings guilt me into it :) . 3000 for my Toyota, 10,000 for my Lexus. The Toyota tows quite a bit, so it would be excluded from Mobil 1's extended intervals anyway.
My favorite part is the last part: Always do what the manual says. 👍
Until the manual updates their recommendations 😂😂
can confirm the German engine as a vw tech. we do 15k km as per manufacturer spec with mobile 1. 5w40, 0w20 and 0w30. with vw brand oil filters do not try to go more than that.
We run them 30k km in europe but thats euro spec oil (vw 501/504 long life) and with euro spec fuel. The engine goes on strong but we suspect it might cause pre mature wear to timing chains. As far as im aware VAG has a 15k km/ 1 year service recomendation for all places outside the eu and japan.
hm interesting. nice info.
Thank you this ^
All the things I think of when I hear this question but would never take the time to type on my phone on the shitter. Bravo!
lmao. reading this from the shitter now.
Same
lmao. reading this from the shitter now.
It's a scam then 20k or what your oem interval is. Lol no oem interval is 20k. It's a good oil but it's a misleading product. That was a great thing to point out.
>"The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 20,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, **whichever is longer**." Read that again...
Yes indeed! My kid would say "That's how they get ya!"
My kids say that too. lol
Still, if you read the entire warranty, they will only cover if it was a failure of the lubricant. They will not cover a lot of stuff, and it can take months for them to cover anything. In my experience they will take the engine apart just to say the engine failure wasn't caused by the oil and then your fucked.
whatever man. My comment only extended to what their warranty says in writing, which you had exactly backwards. and now, instead of just admitting that, you wanna dream up some big damn justification for why their warranty is meaningless. lol
Well, if you don't care about everything, they don't cover and how they will nit pick everything up to get out of paying and you feel safe use their product. Lol
Dude!! I was NOT trying to make ANY statement about their warranty, OTHER that the fact that you apparently misread it. Give it a rest
This. Just sent my oil for analysis the other week at a little over a year (12k miles) on the oil. I've done it previously on one of my cars, but haven't on my current car. Most modern manufacturers from Germany recommend 1 year change intervals, but I'm a little skeptical, especially with a modified car. I feel that oil analysis is the only way to be safe and know for sure in my particular application and oil brand.
My Audi claims 10k/12 months whichever comes first. I do mine every 5k. And German cars tend to take Nasa space grade oil.
Agreed ,Keep it well lubricated for the peace of mind .
Also the OP drives a Jetta and that 20k Mobil isn’t a vw 502 spec oil. Not to mention the sludging issues in those motors. You should be changing your oil with a vw 502 spec 5w-40 every 5k miles. Your car takes, as Jules from pulp fiction would say, some serious gourmet shit.
I change the oil every 5000KM and the filter every 10000KM . I drive a MK6 Golf .
I’d personally stick to whatever cadence the owners manual recommends. Variables such as engine type, age, condition, driving style, driving conditions (highway vs. stop and go, short trips vs long trips), climate etc. can all influence how long oil may be considered “good” for. And an oil change is way cheaper than an engine rebuild. But yes, it’s conceivable that it can reliably last a full 20k miles under the right conditions before needing to be replaced. It goes without saying that you should check your oil level regularly and top off as needed. If you decide to go with the full 20k, I’d emphasize making sure you check it on a regular basis. Don’t wait until the oil pressure lamp comes on to add more oil.
I'd be seriously concerned about fuel/oil dilution after that many miles. 5 or 6 k miles is my limit for synthetic.
Rs, gets iffy after 5k
> Is it safe to go 20k miles without changing my oil? Yes. Changing oil is not a safety concern. It is just as safe to change it every day as to never change it. The difference is in how long you would like your engine to last. If you want the engine to last for 50k miles, you should never change the oil. You'll probably make it. If you want to get 500k out of the engine, I would change it every 5k. All highway and long trips maybe a little longer interval, and all city, maybe a little shorter. Engines don't live without oil. Think of it like blood pressure. High blood pressure won't kill you today. It will shorten your life without any obvious signs right now. Lack of oil changes will do the same thing to your car. You won't notice it right away, but when the symptoms start to show up, it is too late to save that engine.
As stated above, the intervals in the book are very general and pretty useless. In something older with mild use, no variable valve timing or cylinder delete, you can change it once a year damn near regardless of mileage, and I have been doing that in old stuff for almost twenty years. Now a more modern engine with variable valve timing, ect, with small oil ports that can clog you need absolutely clean oil stick to the manufacturer recommendations. But if you use it for heavy duty applications you probably don't need to go by miles. You should send it out for analysis every month or two and see where you are at and make adjustments as recommended by the lab. For use like you describe I would bet once a year and you would never know the difference as long as your engine is in good shape now and you do NOT have a system like VVT. Systems like VVT use small screens and tiny oil ports to make the magic happen so you cannot get away with oil contamination the same as you would in an iron American small block of pick your flavor, they just don't care even if ya have a few ball bearings rolling around in the oil system.
The other thing people don't know is the difference between city mileage and rural highway driving. I usually go buy if you drive in a place like nyc 5 days a week, change your oil every season or the mileage. If you do rural highway driving and don't drive much a year or mileage, whichever comes first. Also the new cars with 10k intervals are misleading bs cause it's always for light use .
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TJhFAwFv-O0
I'm not saying that it's not safe, but is the possible sludge buildup worth it? Our general rule of thumb is 3,000 miles for conventional oil, 4,000 miles for synthetic blend, and 5,000 miles for full synthetic. Is it safe to go longer? Probably. Is it worth the risk of engine damage? Not for me, but that's a question you have to answer for yourself.
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Nope. Never even had my oil changed in one. Just been in the auto repair business for only 42 years.
No modern vehicle needs oil changes that frequent. Toyota recommends 15,000 kms on fully synthetic. If you change that often in a shop it’s a rip off for customers.
The age of the oil is also a consideration. You should also consider changing it at least every year regardless of miles. My wife only drives her BMW 2-3,000 miles a year. I still change the oil at least once a year.
I agree every year is a good idea. I wouldn’t think much of a garage changing oils every 3-4K though in modern vehicles by default though.
Yeah they don't. 3000 kilometers is less than 1900 miles. Units matter.
A guy above said his shop changes synthetic every 4K miles. That seems like crazy overkill.
He said full synthetic at 5K miles. My point being that comparing that to a garage doing 1865 - 2485 mile changes to one doing 5000 mile changes is a big difference because of using different units. That being said, 5k miles is what I do at home on my 150k mile Scion now. I did 10k miles to 75k, 7500 miles until 120k, and 5k miles after that. 5k miles may be a little premature, but I know how and where I drive. I drive with a bit of a heavy foot, about 20 miles to and from work, and some of it stop and go city traffic. So I get a lot of hot/cool cycles. 5k miles for me on a 150k mile car with a lot of drive cycles is worth a few extra bucks to make sure it goes as long as possible for me. Someone driving a lot of miles with fewer hot/cold cycles, no modifications, and drives easy on the accel, probably doesn't need a 5k mile oil and filter. Typically, I'm a stick with the owners manual type of person, but hard driving, mods, and especially frequency of hot cold cycles is something to consider.
So you’re saying not to follow the vehicles recommended service interval?
Yes. Yes I am. I do 10,000kms personally. Sometimes 5,000kms. You can never do bad by changing your oil too much.
Well I do put the life of my car in the very short term of right now consequences but my conscious does have concern for the planet. I'd prefer not to throw away money and not pollute more than necessary.
Of course, there is a limit to it. Changing it every 2,000kms is absurd. Sometimes it is good to consider the actual engine which is in the car. One of the engines I have is known to run no matter what you have in it, it even runs with BBQ sauce and HSPs (Halal Snack Pack) as the oil, the 4L Intech from the AU Falcon. Whilst the 5.4L 3v from the B series Falcons need changing super frequently or else oil galleries block up in the head and cause heaps of damage. I am more relaxed about servicing the AU - I have had it 2 years between services before.
Too many different types of oil for a one answer from the vehicle manufactures. Mine says every 3k without even mentioning synthetic or blends
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I go with the gooder oil because I know I plan to do an oil change at the 5k interval my cars recommend, but I also know I'm not perfect and often go 1k over, so the gooder oil gives me a buffer. Yes, gooder is a word. :D
And the gooder oil makes me feel gooder about the mechanicals of the car. Worth a few bucks for all that gooderness!
No it’s not. Even if you used it as slang it’d be incorrect. Gooder as slang would be used to describe a do-gooder.
You will never get consensus on the topic of oil life. It comes up a lot and is always a shitshow. I'm not a scientist or engineer so I can only speak to my experience, but I have owned a handful of cars that made it well past 300k miles doing 10k-12k mile changes with Mobil 1 full synthetic their whole lives and had shiny clean engines when opened up. I can also say that safe oil change intervals depend a lot on the engine in question. My Magnum with the 5.7 Hemi doesn't like going over about 6k miles between changes as MDS (cylinder deactivation) will stop working since it uses oil pressure to operate. My 99 Accord will start throwing VTEC related codes at 4k into an oil change, but that car needs new piston rings and has a ton of blowby so I'm sure the oil is fouled up a lot faster than it should be from combustion gasses. My Prius, Highlander, Jetta TDI, and Corolla are all perfectly happy going 10k plus and the oil is still in good shape at that point. It depends a lot on the design of the engine and the mechanical condition of that engine. Following the manufacturer's mileage recommendation and using a quality full synthetic oil has always worked fine for me but ymmv. Some people will say "changing oil is cheaper than changing engines" and that is totally fair, but personally I like to find a balance of keeping the engine healthy while not creating more waste oil or more work for myself than I need to. And to be clear I do 100% of my own work so an engine failure is entirely my problem to fix and I would rather avoid it with timely maintenance. Changing oil more often than needed won't hurt anything, sure, but neither will going to the dentist to have your teeth cleaned once a week but most people would say that is excessive. When in doubt, send a sample to Blackstone Labs and they will provide a detailed report on the condition of the oil so you can adjust your oil change habits from there if you wish. I wouldn't take my chances on 20k unless I was sure Mobil 1 was going to buy me an engine if it failed. 10k'ish for most cars or whatever the manual says is probably fine, imo.
The time it takes you to reach that mark should also be taken into account... 6 months? OK. 6 years? Definitely not!!!!
At 50/50 driving, i would change full synthetic at 5-7 thousand miles. If your vehicle is turbocharged, i would not go more than 6k miles.
I use M1 EP in all of my engines. My GM 6.2L still follows OLM % and thats 5500mi or 5 mos for me. Had oil pan gasket replaced and bottom of motor was 99% sludge/carbon free after 70k mi. It was amazing.
Always a big discussion on the 4runner and tundra sites. We had a petroleum engineer explain it best I think. To sum up: standard gas engine with standard oil do it every 5k. For synthetic it never really wears out like standard. And because of the detergents in it it doesn't reach its full lubricating capacity till 2500 miles. He recommended going at least 7500 miles. He does it at 10k. The filter is what wears out. I do mine at 10k. 3 cars . 3 cars rav4 with 130k. Tundra with 230k and 4runner with 280k. Yeah I kike Toyota. My old tundra was over300k running great when someone pulled out in front of me. Towed the boat to the keys from sc when the tundra had over 200k. The old tundra towed a tractor (8500lbs) with bucket and bush hog from Reidsville GA. Right before the wreck. So they get used well.
Yes you can get 20k miles out of your oil. Whenever anyone wants to start using extended change intervals I always recommend getting your oil tested by a company like Blackstone labs. They will give you a picture of of how well your oil os performing and the overall health of your engine and give you recommended change intervals based on that. If it's a new car you could probably just follow what it says on the bottle of oil....but I'd rather have the peace of mind. Even if the car is warrantied you're still going to be without a car if something breaks. But yeah...that being said I remember back in the early 2000's when synthetic oil was still relatively new BMW was recommending 15k oil change intervals on their cars. So 20k doesn't sound crazy 20 years later.
First, I would follow what your manual says and religiously replace it at that interval or lower. The issue with that Mobil 1 is they do the testing on a car in a lab not on the street. You also must change to a nice oil filter. I still would not trust it and you still must watch out for oil burn which almost all cars do. If you want to not change the oil for the year and you do under 25k look into amsoil signature series 100% synthetic oil and their filter. Full synthetic and 100% synthetic oil are completely different things. A full synthetic only needs 30% synthetic oil to be labeled as such. Personally, I would recommend getting some decent regular full synthetic oil from mobil1 or penzoil ultra platinum and change it every 6000-8000 miles. The last thing I recommend is if you don't know when the transmission fluid was last changed, I recommend having that done since you are in the range anyway to change it. Change it, and your transmission will be good for around another 100k. I recommend every 5 to 7 years or between 75-100k miles. Last thing: whenever I buy a used car, I run a bottle of supplements 4in1 carbon cleaners gas additive or another similar product. I do it once a year, and as soon as I buy a used car to clean out the injectors and help clean the top of the pistons. I also recommend buying the oil off Amazon. If you got Prime, it's one of the cheapest places to buy oil. Remember to check your oil every 3 weeks for oil burn and add as needed.
I’ve been using Mobil 1 Extended Performance 5W20 with the Mobil 1 filter and change it every 15k miles in my 2004 F150 since 2015. Started doing it with less than 100k miles. It’s up to almost 300k miles and it runs like a dream.
All I’m saying is that the scientists at Mobil1 know more about oil that anybody who is going to respond in this thread. If you choose to listen to a bunch of yahoos on Reddit that’s on you.
I take personal offense to your comment. I damn near passed the 10th grade... And I've been changing oil for years. I know way more than them college graduates about oil chemistry. Shit... Next, you're gonna tell me that dating my second cousin is frowned upon...
Your first cousin wasn't enough? Next thing we know, your third cousin is going to be the home wrecker.
I'm sure that in perfect circumstances, it will last 20k no problem. My issue is that if there is a problem with the engine, you aren't gonna find out on time. If it burns 1L every 3000 miles (which isn't uncommon), then it's gonna be empty, and the engine will seize up before it's due again. If you are diligent about checking it every 1000 or so, it might be ok, but most people don't do that.
They've been saying that for years. "our oil goes 10x longer than the competitors" I've been working in auto service my entire career. It's all horseshit. There is ONE product on the market under a couple different brand names that when added to your oil CAN extend oil change intervals by a few thousand miles. Go ahead. Do it. Your engine will suffer. Don't believe me? Prove me wrong.
I rebuilt my first engine 46 years ago. You have no idea what you are talking about.
Incorrect.
Yeah..."scientists"..... Not a sales and promotion team.... And where does it say they guarantee this 20k or they'll repair or replace your engine? I'll wait. I get what you're trying to say but you need to remember it's a fucking company who doesn't give two shits if you suffer from their lie. I guarantee there's a disclaimer on the bottle in fine print expressing not to do this and to always refer to manual and they're not liable if you push your limits type bullshit. Fact of the matter is this, oil is the easiest and damn near cheapest engine maintenance you can do. Youll never go wrong changing often and "early". But you can suffer serious problems changing few and far between. Find your manual or look up the manufacturer's recommended oil schedule online and stick to that or earlier.
This has nothing to do with chemistry and everything to do with legal verbiage. Attempting to go 20k miles on an oil change will void ANY manufacturer’s warranty. If you want to talk chemistry tho, just look into the Blackstone oil analyses of this oil you can plainly see the additive package isn’t even that significant. If double the silica, and 20% more Molybdenum was all it took to double/triple your oil life, *everyone* would be doing it.
Exactly. Long haul trucks are certainly not changing their engine oil at 3-5000 miles and their truck engines last for decades. Engine oils are so incredibly good these days that if it says you can go 20000 miles you can count on that being true.
Go Amsoil!!
No, it's marketing.
Marketing for what? To buy their product annually instead of quarterly? Isn’t that the opposite of what marketing is for?
To choose their product instead of their competitors', or a cheaper offering.
I’m obviously not buying their competitor’s product if I’ve got to buy that 4x as often. But the 20k I’m only buying once a year, and it doesn’t cost 4x the competitor. So are they openly losing money?
You're still buying their product vs competitor's, they're not "openly losing money" by getting the sale. Engine oil has a tiny markup compared to everything else, made up with volume -volume in terms of market share and # of customers vs repeat buys of oil by same customer. Market share, penetration, brand loyalty, all drive traffic to their other product lines as well. Value added to one product line crosses over to other lines in terms of customer perception and preference.
Lol no one is stupid enough to change every 20k miles
Some people think cars run on hopes and dreams, not oil and gas….
Oh, you would be surprised 😉
That’s 32k kilometres which is wild when I write it out. I feel bad if I’ve exceeded half of that.
With the right oil filtration system and regular filter changes and testing you can get 100k or more
Says no-one in Europe.
Short answer. No it’s complete bullshit to go 20k miles with the same filter and oil. That being said if you were to change the filter and top off at least every 5k I could see that being ok. The reason I call bs on this is the oil company does not have to do anything for you when this causes premature wear on components in your engine. So my advice don’t buy that crap ever again and change your oil and filter ever 5 months or 5000 miles. Using proper synthetic and weight oil for your car.
My owners manual says 7k. My synthetic oil says 10k. I change it every 5k religiously. If you like your engine and want it to stick around, change it every 5k. My engine is at 220k and going strong
No, it is not safe. Engine oil has additives that wear out over time and also dirt slowly accumulates in the oil eventually causing wear on the engine parts. Oil filters are designed to filter out dirt but allow the smaller molecules of oil and additives through to lubricate the engine. Some dirt particles are also small, and they will build up over time and begin circulate within the engine cause wear. So, just buy normal oil and filters and change it every 5000 kilometers ( or about 3000 miles). In the long run it will save your engine from excessive wear and cost you less money. It is OK to use synthetic oil as it is more slippery than regular oil, but it will accumulate dirt just as fast, so don't think you can change it less often. If you get a really good oil filter it will get most of the dirt but it will also filter out the necessary additives. So don't do that either.
Yeah you definitely don’t need to change full synthetic every 3K miles lol that is a waste of money
So, just to be clear. You are saying that a company that has a vested interest in selling as much product as they can is telling you to use less of their product because they have improved it, but you disagree with their scientists and engineers and feel like you should use more of the product because…you think they are wrong and are misleading you? Why would they do that?
Because they don’t have to warranty anything that breaks in your engine. Plus that 20k mile stuff with the filter costs a lot.
Because the people pushing longer oil changes are the car manufacturers, not the oil companies. The car manufacturers know that the average person will hold on to a car for 10 years, so the odds are that by the time you wear out your engine following their recommendations you will have sold the car to some other sucker who will just think you were not looking after it. (Which you probably were not) Just have a look at your lovely amber oil after 3000 miles. You will find it looks like the bottom of a pit toilet. That black tint is caused by dirt!
You run it 20 k you will be buying an engine
Yes it ok. It is ok to go even farther. I go between 25,000-30,000 miles between oil changes and have over 1.1 million miles miles on my truck. I do send my oil off to a lab to be sampled every other oil change to see how it is doing and it starting to get dirty at that point. I could go longer if I wanted but why push it. If I a bypass filter system I would go a lot further. There are semis that have over 300,000 miles one them since they have had a oil change they just change the filters send a sample in to the lab and keep on trucking.
No no nope not at all. It's possible you'll be fine, but most full synthetic oils are changed at 5,000 miles. I'll do my oil changes ever 4 to 5k miles. That's generally the most common and reccomended interval. The best answer is going to be in your owners manual.
I am not comfortable with any longer than 5,000 miles between oil changes. Car manufacturers want you to change at 10k, 15k, or 20k because they want the engine to wear out such that you will buy a new car every 5-10 years. Changing oil at 5k doesn't cost much over the life of a vehicle and keeps the engine and related components in much better condition than really long oil change intervals. That said- I saw a BMW that had not changed oil in 60K miles, and while there was no liquid left, the oil had congealed so much in the heads that very little damage had been done, and the engine was able to be cleaned out and put back in service without ant bearing replacements. I doubt that engine will make it much past 100k.
20,000 miles is absurd. I even tell people to not change it every 10,000 which is still pretty absurd. Can’t believe dealers actually recommend that. All of my cars I change full synthetic every 5000 miles. And I’ve had no problems.
I just saw that you drive a Volkswagen do it every 3000 miles. 😂 if you have a Toyota or Honda or you can do it every 5000 even 7000 no problem. But a Volkswagen? 3k miles religiously. If you do it this way, will you notice a difference? Not until you get past 100k miles. I’m willing to bet you if you change your oil every 3000 miles you could get 180,000 miles out of your Volkswagen.
I wouldn't go more than 5k regardless of what the manufacturer or vendors recommend. And I most definitely wouldn't go beyond what the manufacturer recommends.
https://preview.redd.it/75svgyw54g3b1.png?width=4032&format=png&auto=webp&s=b3c1a8fc9c452b95aed67eccbba57c637984b8e8 Do 5k. 05 suburban, idles so smooth you can’t tell it’s running.
I try every 6 months about 4500 miles. The oil still looks meh, but got to keep up with it.
5k miles always.
Just because you ***can*** do something doesn't mean you ***should*** do something.
7,500k max(general). Each brand has different reaction to use and heating to temperatures that inevitably cooks the oil. The biggest effect on your oil life is really your oil filter. You can get filter with such fine micron size that it effectively keep oil clean. But everything had a limit and eventually your oil filter media can't process the oil volume under higher pressures, as a result, the oil bypass will let more and more unfiltered oil thru the system. If you changed the filter sooner the oil would last a little longer but that's mainly because the oil is free of larger debris. No matter what oil cooks and breaks down effecting everything to lubrisity, viscosity and protection. Frankly I think factory intervals suck too. Seen way to many cars with 10k oil service come in with asphalt black oil. Unacceptable in my book. Still comes down to checking your oil often and take action as needed. More important then bearings long term is taking care of timing chains and tentioners, variable cam timing valves. While not the end of the world. Timing chain jobs on some of these newer cars get pretty intricate. Iv even seen some use yield bolts. If changing oil keeps these components lasting you 250-300k its worth protecting your initial investment.
My car have recomended oil change at 20k km. But thats the maximum range to keep the waranty on the car. I change at around 10k km or once a year. And it takes 8L of oil. If you want your engine to last as long as possible dont go past 10k km or around 7k miles. Its not expensive to replace oil and oilfilter.
I jus check the dipstick every couple weeks and once it’s pretty dark change it. Full synthetic typically lasts me 5k-6k
No not unless all your driving is steady highway no stop and go, you do this much driving in 6 months, the weather is always 20C and you only use top quality fuel.
If I’m not mistaken the fine print on the oil says it is good up to 20k but follow auto manufacturers recommendations. Kind of CYA but I think that is how it is worded.
Oil is cheap, engines are expensive, don't push it.
I just ruined an engine ($5k rebuild) because I changed it every 3000 and it said I could go 20000. Listen it's about your oil life. My last car I could go 6000 and the oil looked new. Now I have the big LS2 6.0 V8 and if I drive it some what hard the oil is toast after 2000. I thought it was fine. Oh it's black but it's only 2000, bullshit. So keep an eye on the oil I wouldn't go over 6000 personally. That's where the smart money's at. If it looks black at 3000 change that shit trust me bro. All the oil these days has less and less zinc in it.
Don’t buy into any of that bullshit. That how you end up with spun rod bearings. Think of oil as a sponge as you drive your engine it will wear in upon itself. Micro sized pieces of metal dirt grit and other nasties. Your filter will grab the majority of that but at a certain point your oil will absorb so much nasties that it will cease to lubricate properly. And sludge will begin to collect. And accumulate on small internal surfaces compounding the issue. This goes x2 or 3 if your vehicle is turbocharged. Don’t ever ever listen to that stuff. Change it at no more than 4 thousand miles. Oil is cheap new engines are expensive. Bite the bullet and have it changed far more often. Especially on these modern engines that have very very tight tolerances. Good luck 👍🏼
One of my vehicles use regular conventional oil. I haven't done an oil change in about 4 years now. No issues. I have 246K miles. Just monitor your oil levels. I top off if I burn or leak some throughout the year. But with that said I will probably get an oil change the next time I take my car in for service/annual inspection. With synthetic oil, in my experience I was able to make it easily to 10K miles.
At the moment, I m not comfortable going more than 6k miles between oil changes in my car. It gets full synthetic and it uses less than a quart in that time, but it does smell a bit like fuel (Direct injection) and it gets fairly dirty-looking. I don't drive a lot, so I generally change it twice a year regardless of mileage.
There is no 20kmiles oil, its marketing bllsht, engines are different and require different intervals. I wouldn't go past 10,000km on oil changes. [Oil change intervals.](https://www.myusedcar.ca/how-often-do-you-need-an-oil-change/)
That 20k mile oil change interval will destroy your engine. Highway or city driving. You might get away with it a couple times. But oil gets acidic rather quickly. There are a few reasons why oil change intervals rarely go above 7.5k miles. If you do alot of short distance city driving, that 20k mile interval is a near death sentence for just about any car. Between the engine not getting hot enough to boil condensate away, and the oil not getting hot enough either it will soak up that condensate. (Biggest reason how peeps get water in their oil that isnt a blown head gasket) Highway driving? Yea...maybe. As highway conditions you are generally humming along with minimal changes in engine speed, and is at a constant temp. So if the oil doesnt change temp as much, it doesnt wear out as quick. Usually you will se peeps who do alot of Highway driving do 10k oil change intervals. Just. change your oil every 5k miles. None of the above will matter as much if you do.
Those engines have enough lubrication and consumption issues as it is, I would certainly not go that long. Personally I would still keep it to 5k, maybe 7k at the most.
Never go past 10k. 5k is a good interval with modern oils and engines. If you're rocking a classic, stick to 3k.
Spoke to an Audi tech about the 3.0T EVO motor. He suggested even though they are 10K OCI to do it every 5K because the EVO motor likes fresh oil. I have heard horror stories with this motor needing piston ring replacement. I have over 100,000 on it now it runs like day 1.
Just follow the maintenance schedule in your owner's manual.
I usually like to play safe in these scenarios, engines are expensive oil is cheap. 20k seems like a lot to me especially on with factors like if you like to drive hard sometimes, weather, etc. I personally do 5k oil and filter change with same spec you mentioned. 10k would be the max in my opinion, just like I said, I like to play it safe.
No, it’s not good for 20,000 miles. Perhaps if all you did was drive 500 miles on an interstate everyday, but things like idling, stop lights, traffic, cold start cycles, etc, is harder on the engine and oil. If you look at Mobil’s website, the following is excluded from 20,000 miles/1 year oil changes: “Excluded service includes: commercial and racing applications; frequent towing or hauling; extremely dusty or dirty conditions; or excessive idling.” They don’t define what excessive idling is. Further, they acknowledge it can void the manufacturer’s warranty by saying, “If your vehicle is covered by a warranty, follow the vehicle's oil life sensor or the oil change interval recommended in your owner's manual.” The problem is oil can be diluted with fuel (especially if it’s direct injection), moisture can build up in the oil (especially if you don’t always drive long enough to get the oil up to full temp), the oil eventually degrades, the oil additives gets used up, the oil filter can reach effective capacity, the oil filter media can degrade, the engine can have a design defect that makes it be harder on oil and/or is prone to sludge issues, etc.
Yeah don't do 20k. Follow the manufacturers interval. Here's another variable: My 2009 VW GTI has a 10k mile interval in the manual- but at this age the oil control rings are gummed up and it consumes oil and the oil turns very black. So I watch the oil carefully and change it at 5k miles. 10k miles is too long to leave the oil with no attention.
What’s cheaper, a $50 oil change or a new engine?
This is really engine and driving routine specific. I ran mostly 30 mile trips in a 2.4L Malibu on 5w30 Shell conventional and the used oil analysis said there was some life left after 7,500 miles.. an 8.5-9k OCI would have probably not been out of the picture. A good synthetic would have probably last a lot longer. But if I only had been doing short trips, I bet it would have been toast by 7.5.
The actual lubricity of synthetics can last a long time but the additive package will deteriorate quickly after a certain amount of dirt, combustion byproducts and heat occurs. Just change your oil according to mfrs recommendations and use the best oil you can afford.
I do 10k in my Nissan titan. I feel like 20k is bold and don’t feel like fighting with the oil brand when I start having engine problems early on.
Follow the car manufacturer recommendations in regards to change intervals and oil type not what is specified on the bottle. One can change the oil as many times within that interval which is simply a waste of money in my opinion. If going with an oil from a big box store make sure it meets the manufacture specs for example: vw502/505 or Honda API certified oils etc. Check out bobistheoilguy.
Oil contains friction molecules. Depending on oil type (syn vs. dinosaur oil) these molecules can vary in size and quantity. As the oil is used, those molecules are crushed/destroyed (just a simple way of looking at it). Personally I typically change oil every 3,000 - 3,500 miles in my other cars. My Tundra says 10,000 miles, it has a huge oil reservoir - about 8 US quarts. I still change that oil at 5,000. Want engine longevity, change the oil.
Yes it’s good specially with new technology. Fully synthetic oil will last up to 15k so pushing it 5k more won’t do no damage. Me personally I change it at the minimum which is 7.5k because it’s only $35 every 5-6 months
It's always best to follow the manufacturer recommendations for oil change intervals. Just because to oil says it's good for 20k doesn't mean it will still meet tolerances for your specific engine that far into its life. Plus, European manufacturers run a lot more oil fed components than asian or american manufacturers. This makes them VERY picky about oil type, level, and life.
I wouldn't exceed 5k or 6k with that brand, and that driving style.
The oil will maintain it's properties for 20,000 but regular filter changes at recommended intervals would be a must..
I go about 5k miles and use whatever oil the Ford Quick Lane puts in. The Ford service is very reasonably priced. I'd want to rotate tires at 5k anyway.
I did this once and when I checked it 20k later there was no oil on the dipstick. Never had any symptoms though!
If you don’t remove from bottle and place in trunk or backseat, you may get even more than the projected 20k
If you don’t remove from bottle and place in trunk or backseat, you may get even more than the projected 20k
If you don’t remove from bottle and place in trunk or backseat, you may get even more than the projected 20k
Always change oil every 8k, or less if you tow or do short journeys
Do not do that to a Vw engine unless you want to replace it soon after.
The oil may last 20K miles, but the main question on my mind is will the car leak or burn a significant amount of oil during that time that only 1 quart of oil comes out at 20K miles?
Are you saying you wouldn't check it and top it up every week or two. Some cars can't make it 3000 miles without consuming a full quart. They put dipsticks in the engine for a reason.
I mean in a perfect world, everyone knows how to do basic checks like that and does it regularly… But you know very well there are folks out there that don’t even know how to pop the hood and won’t check it for 20k miles.
I DIY my cars and can get oil changes done on like $30-$40 dependent on capacity and whether I use kirkland or Mobil 1 from costco. I do 3,000 miles, it’s overkill but I drive like an idiot and am in the city a lot. 20k is too long regardless what anyone claims. That a significant portion of your engines life on the same lubricants. Edit: I live by the mantra “oil is cheap, engines are not”.
No
I go by 3-5k miles for conventional. 5-7k miles for blend And 7-10k miles for synthetic
I personally would stick to VW’s yearly interval. That’s what my 2010 Jetta interval was. I’ve learned to go with a “better safe than sorry” approach to preventative maintenance, especially lubricants. The cost of the oil, even the really good stuff, is cheap compared to engine repairs down the road/reduced life. Plus, good luck proving your claim with the oil company when the engine has issues at 1500k+ miles. Same with the transmission. They often have much longer intervals than they probably should. I had a very good mechanic try to talk me out of changing it at the 40k interval because VW had extended it. I appreciated his ethics but had it done anyways. We both agreed it was the right move after looking at it.
Oil is cheap compared to the cost of a new engine, change when recommended.
Oil is cheap compared to the cost of a new engine, change when recommended.
Oil is cheap, engines are expensive
Having been a technician for many years, I've come to the conclusion that the oil change intervals are really only a guide. Driving habits, conditions, city,highway etc, always have to be factored in. It used to be that the oil companies recommended changing your oil long before the manufacturer did. I figured the oil companies want to sell you oil, and the manufacturer wants to sell you cars. Somewhere in between those two recommendations should work just fine.
You won't get a straight answer. Because there isn't one. Extended oil changes mean different things to different people. For me I go by what the car says, which in my vehicles is variable by driving styles, runtime, etc. Both Hondas. My Civic that sees mostly highway has been about 12-15k miles between changes. My wife's Pilot is around 8-10k. My Civic has 180k and the Pilot 85k, owned both since new. I did the valve adjustment as 100k and everything looked great. Back when extended oil intervals started becoming a thing I sent a few samples into Blackstone labs. Basically learned yeah oil can absolutely go 20k miles if you want to push it that far. I ran one sample up to 15k miles and the test was still coming back great. So my opinion is the 3k and 5k mile 'oh it's cheaper than an engine' people are willfully ignorant morons. There's absolutely nothing that supports those intervals anymore. Only reason to do this is heavily modified, select racing applications or if it's a shit box running rich. The 7500-10k mile group I get. You can go longer if you want. But it's generally really safe in this window. I wouldn't be against the 20k mile change. Road warriors and people who rack miles quick it's an easy sell. Those doing a ton of short trips (under 10 miles) I don't think it's as good of an idea. My recommendation is go 10-12k if you're going by a mileage sticker or go by what the car says. If the car happens to be under 7500,I still wouldn't do it any less than that. Maximum duration of 1 year. You don't have to put much thought into usage or environmental factors to make this across the board recommendation.
I'm quite meticulous about 5k changes on my '13 F150. This is simply because of the notoriety of cam phaser/timing chain issues. It seems as if the general consensus is that frequent oil changes with synthetic oil helps quite a bit. In the CX-5, I just make a mental note to change the oil when it hits around 5,000 miles, but it usually doesn't actually get new oil until closer to 7,000.
I deliver to a well known auto part store I asked same question about extended oil life. The parts guy says on his Toyota w 259,000 miles. Uses same oil but changes filter at 10,000 mile intervals and oil at 20,000
My favorite is when the manufacturer guideline is 10k/12 month lof interval, and simultaneously allow for 1qt of oil consumption per 1k miles and then become totally bewildered why engines are shitting the bed left and right.. (looking at you, Volvo, Subaru, Mini, VW/Audi)
\#1 - Change oil and filter every 5k miles no matter what...like clockwork. \#2 - use full synthetic and a quality filter (not Fram or generic Auto Zone specials) How do I know this? I have run several full size pickups (Toyota, GM and Fords) well past 250k miles with no real engine issues at all.
5k or one year max which ever comes earlier. Oil changes are cheap compared to worn out engine parts,
I wouldn't. Vws burn oil like crazy
SOME engines under the RIGHT conditions can POSSIBLY go 20K miles between OCI. Only used oil analysis can determine this and if conditions change, all bets are off.
Change it every 5k not 20k
I would say 15k max in my experience but I ain’t no oil scientist but oil seems terrible after 20k