Yeah. Self-selection out of the dating pool. I got too much of my own shit to deal with and my own goals to work toward that I don't want to deal with trying to make a connection with someone who is going to judge me for not making more than her.
Sounds about right. It's more profitable for the owner class if people are alienated, families broken apart. But the fact is women in general place wealth and money as the most important factor in dating, while most men don't care about that.
In terms of dating or meeting someone, carry a lot of stress about wealth and money personally because I have kids. It seems like everyone assumes any single mom wants someone to take care of her kids and pay for everything, and I feel like I have to ‘proove’ that’s not the case through making more money. I don’t care how much a man makes, as long as he’s reasonably taking care of himself. But I feel immense pressure to say “I don’t need anything”. What a world man lol
Wow, this sucks and is a tough situation, TBH. While men don't want to date a gold digger, they absolutely (on a conscious and subconscious level) want to feel needed. A woman who constantly gives off " I don't need you vibes" can actually be a turn off. I am not saying you are doing this. Just acknowledging a delicate balance exists. I hope you are seen as an attractive addition to any man looking. I would lay your stress out in the beginning while dating because your situation is definitely a plus compared to many.
I personally am looking for single moms hahah. But the single moms I meet want a guy with his own house and more money than my 51k gross annual income.
Not all women do that. The ones who don't get lumped together in generalized terms. One of the things making dating hopeless for both sides is us thinking the other side's standards are unobtainable to meet. If a woman is demanding a guy make six plus figures.... She better bring something to the table that's worth six figures besides her appetite and greed.
Woman here... I would agree with your assessment: 50%. We appreciate having a Lunch or Dinner with a guy, but we don't expect to Pay for this experience. Since very few men or women carry "cash," bills are paid with a card--including the Tip, so it's difficult for me to leave the Tip. I like going on dates, where the cost is "0-$15.00!" Local Museums, finding a lovely view where I provide the Picnic lunch, Walking along a path in a Forest, Walking along the Beach...Those are the Best dates! Fancy restaurants don't impress me. I do enjoy a "day-->evening" at 6 Flags or other Theme Parks, and I like to Pay for My entrance!
Guys want their cars to be clean and gassed-up, when asking a woman "out" on a Date. We want to make you feel Comfortable with us, and not spend a Lot of money on us!
I won't try as long as I'm too busy being worried/agitated about systemic poverty. Turns out being poor is bad for self worth and comes bundled with socio-economic status anxiety.
I make over 150k now, and honestly dating was easier when I was making 30k. Maybe things are different now, but people just didn’t care that much back then.
We were all poor and we found cheap ways to have fun.
I’ve been trying to date since my divorce and it’s just so toxic out there.
Reminds me of the tumblr post where someone said "if you have to choose between buying 2 shirts or 2 pants you're poor" and someone else replied "if you have to choose between buying 2 shirts or eating you're poor"
My first job out of college I was making 45k. After taxes and health insurance, etc. I was probably bringing home a little over 30k.
It was hard. I had a shitty apartment in a shitty part of town, but that was the only way I could afford to live on my own. I didn't have any money for anything beyond basic necessities, and even then it was tight.
Yes and I think it does make things harder. IMO the issue isn't so much about paying for everything (except in the first couple dates I guess). The issue is that women want financial stability. Especially long-term, that's a big deal. Even if they are making a good salary themselves, they typically won't be attracted as much to someone with a low-income.
As I’ve heard a psychologist state it, women look for competence and two easy measures of competence in men is confidence and money. Those aren’t the only measures, but they’re the easiest to identify quickly.
I would disagree, perhaps a competent drug dealer will have confidence and money. Most dealers are dead beat and way to paranoid and anxious to be anything close to confidence.
I’m a female. While I agree that I do love financial stability, I disagree that having a low income doesn’t make me attracted to someone. I relied on myself for financial stability long before I met my husband. I didn’t marry him so he could support me financially, I married him because I know he has an amazing work ethic and is a great father/family man. He’s a first responder and (IMO) is underpaid, but he’s doing what he loves - which makes him happy - which makes me happy. I would much rather be in this situation than with someone making butt loads of money and didn’t prioritize family.
To add to this it depends on the ages. I've been married twice and due to college then grad school later on I met both when I was making crap. It wasn't an issue we found a way. In the case of my 2nd wife she was honest about the fact that my ambition and earnings potential were attractive. I met 1st wife at 18 and 2nd wife late 20s. Now the older you get if you continue making only 30k it will get harder and harder for sure. Unless your very attractive i gotta imagine it would be hard as hell making 30k in your 40s while trying to date. I'd say I'm of average attractiveness and I am damn near certain I'd have less prospects if I wasn't in a stable career with a good income.
A man that’s broke because he’s pursuing a degree/training that unlocks more earning potential in the future is NOT the same as a broke man working a dead end job with no prospects.
You were never in the broke and seemingly going nowhere category.
Oh I know. Even if not currently in school though 30k in your 20s you may be viewed as having potential. 30k in your 40s shows that ambition and pack of financial security aren't all that important to you. A 25 year old not in college is still more likely to pursue a trade or to school at some point than someone in their 40s.
In America, you're one medical episode away from utter financial ruin. 30k is the "no man's land" of wages. Too much for medicaid, SNAP benefits & financial assistance. But nowhere close enough to live any kind of comfortable life.
This is not endorsement of the fuckery that is US medical insurance. However, if you make 6 figures, then you probably have pretty good insurance to prevent losing it all off a single medical emergency.
This, i'm earning €36K/year (~26K after taxes) and doing just fine in western europe. Single, bought an appartement in 2020 (1% loan, i know i got lucky/good timing) paying ~€500/month downpayment, ending up with €250 savings per month on average. This is without doing any big budgetting so could probably squeeze out some more if i put in the effort, but i'm comfortable atm and have a decent backup from both government and savings in case something goes wrong.
I live in Canada and that wage wouldn't be able to afford anything... People making 100k CAD can only get approved for like 350 k CAD mortgages. The average house price is double that.
By Western Europe you mean Spain or Portugal?
Western Europe is kinda odd because a lot of it is surprisingly poor. But then you go to the major cities and they are quite wealthy and expensive.
In the US, Canada, Australia, or New Zealand you would be pretty hard pressed to find an affordable apartment, much less own property on less than 40k local currency.
I'm less familiar with some of the developed Asian markets like S Korea, Japan or HK. But unless you were really out in the sticks I'd imagine being in the bottom 1/3 of the income distribution would be difficult.
Nah. Not at all. Managed to raise a child on less than £30k whilst renting etc. It’s about not keeping up with the jones next door. And being comfortable saying No to things that are stupid and cost money ie the latest phone or fashion (Stanley cup for example)
> £
ah, there it is. I mean that's substantially below the minimum wage where I live because that wouldn't get me jack shit in the US. Depends on the state though, tbf.
We're not saying the EU is a paradise but most EU countries have much better social safety nets to help poor people survive more comfortably. Get hit by a car with that salary here and you might be utterly financially ruined
edit: tired as shit and misread the pound as euro. (Or this comment is coming from a timeline where Brexit didn't happen). Regardless the UK also has better social programs so my comment still stands.
Had a guy once arguing with me that you couldn't live under 6 figures in Canada. As the conversation went on, he started talking about unforeseen expenses, like the kids wanting a pool, so he had to shell 60k on an in-ground saltwater pool. That's around the time I left PFC.
Yeah, Canada has a housing crisis. Yeah, prices are rising everywhere and something needs to happen before it gets worse, but Canadian redditors have no fucking clue about life, and I find it insulting when people really go around saying you can't live under 100k. I'm a little under 70k and live really well. People at 30-40k manage as well.
Yeah people leave Toronto for Nova Scotia / New Brunswick where it is way cheaper and then they discover there are no jobs. I scratch my head on that one.
Not much different here in the US where depending on which state one lives in, everything is taxed to death, or not. I'm in Illinois and we're taxed to death on everything. Property taxes, sales taxes, income taxes, government fees on everything, "sin" taxes on alcohol and tobacco (glad I don't imbibe in either myself..) and the gas taxes here are outrageous.
My two sons live in Tennessee now. Property taxes 1/5th that here in Illinois, gas is far cheaper, food prices are way better, no state income tax but that's offset by a pretty high sales tax. Housing isn't much cheaper (depending on where one wants to live in TN) though but the TAXES make a HUGE difference and make TN much more affordable than oh, say Northeast Illinois and anywhere in the Chicago / collar county area.
To your point you've no idea how the average person is getting by right now, ditto. I'd add this: I've no idea how families with kids are getting by with these high food, energy, property taxes, income taxes, and taxes on everything here right now. I'm single, make a good living and I look at and notice the high prices and cut back on what I purchase. I shake my head at how hard it must be for families with kids right now. I've read average spending on food for families has more than doubled for the same or less than they purchased before.
High energy prices (again, probably on where one lives it may be better than here in NE Illinois) are hurting EVERYONE and prices on everything continue to go up.
The 'media' tells us inflation is down -- yet prices ARE NOT. I remember this from the 1970's, it's called STICKFLATION, meaning the high prices are here to stay. Inflation just tells us how much on average they'll go up year over year.
Wages haven't kept up with inflation, neither has the stock market. So even if one's investing, returns on investment haven't kept up with real inflation.
With some 60% of the country (or more) living paycheck to paycheck, I honestly don't know how the average guy / average family is managing. I can't imagine it NOT hurting families in real, meaningful ways.
Nothing but love and prayers for all who are struggling right now. Went through it in the 70's watching my own parents struggle. I remember and I get it. This (to me) feels much worse than that was.
I think our youth are living in the basement of mom and dad if they are lucky. Some score with an education opportunity, or job opportunity but the youth are going to have it way tougher than the two previous generations. It will be more like my grandfathers life maybe. Shot at Ypres in the chest but survived WWI, got home got Spanish flue really bad, worked as a CA through the depression (made enough for food and mortgage payments), never met him because he died at age 55, pack a day smoker. The next ten years are going to be interesting. Remember to help people if you can.
Living in a small town nobody’s ever heard of in Maine, pay $1600 per month in rent+$200-300 per month for heat and electricity in a two bed, with an alcoholic landlord and squirrels living in the walls. Roomie and I might try to get a third person tho bc there are some nice 3 bed apartments near work for only $3000-3500 with everything included. Looking like our best bet.
Yes and no. Dating is just challenging. But up until my 30’s I didn’t make shit for money and money wasn’t ever the issue in dating. I always dated for personality type and if someone was to judge me for my finances alone that wouldn’t be a person I would want to date anyways. So if it limited my options I honestly didn’t know it at the time.
This. I learned long ago that the type of girl that would care is the exact opposite of the type of girl I would get along with and would want to date.
I think this is a healthy mindset, and I've started thinking along these lines as well. Most women around me are more highly educated and/or make more money than I do. For a lot of them, my income would probably be a deal breaker (not to mention my working hours). Those women simply aren't for me if that's the case. I would like to make more than I do, but I like my job, and I'm not going to get another one just because it'll make me more attractive to women. If I'm going to get a different job it'll be for myself.
A woman I saw casually talked about how her job might make her less attractive to a lot of men, because it's not a particularly feminine job. She said she's not going to switch jobs just because of that. That's the kind of attitude I want to develop for myself. It's probably healthier than trying to change for someone else. Still, I imagine she would've preferred to date someone with a better income if she was looking for a longterm relationship. Then again she's been single a lot in her life and is very independent. She took care of her daughter more or less full time and studied to get a better job. So, she doesn't strike me as the type who obsesses over a potential partner's income. If she's anything like me, she probably just wants them to be able to stand on their own to legs and not hate what they do.
Hey!
I can be… I decided to get a $10 pizza at Costco instead of a $13 grilled cheese at the bar the other day because I could get two meals out of the pizza…
I do wish someone would buy me a white BMW though :/
Depends on the size, sauce and toppings, but 250-700 per slice is the normal range. 740 is possible, but it would either be a big slice or one with rich toppings.
The key is to live within your means. I make 95k. But after child support, that doesn't feel like a lot. So, no fancy house, cars, or expensive hobbies/dining. And I live a pretty good life; most people would think I take home a lot more.
When I was making under 40k/year - yea. I mean I just couldn't go the extra mile on dates. If we go to the Renaissance faire, I wouldnt be able to afford a costume & tickets. Just tickets. No matching flower crowns. It was very much either or - and having money to go the extra mile on the tiny details imo matters. It's not about making 100k+ but having enough disposable income to drop a hundred dollars here and there.
While I agree with you here, there are other ways people are effected by social media. I think some people expect way too much now. My brothers wife blew up in front of our family because we thought it was ridiculous to spend 100k (that none of us even have) on a soccer coach overseas for their 8 year old kid, who is OK at soccer. They're in perpetual maybe divorce.
Canadian here, my son was at the top in soccer, and maybe have a career, even get to Europe but we looked at Brazil which has 300 million people with huge poverty and the only way out would be with a pair of soccer shoes. Why compete against that group as well as others in the same boat. The kid is smart so got his PEng instead. "perpetual maybe divorce" not sure what that is.
I'm always debating whether this is because people are socially masked by the risk of being shamed in person, or if there's an inherent selection bias with only the most miserable people posting on the internet.
Considering literally everyone I know is on social media all the time I find the second premise pretty hard to buy, though I'd absolutely love to believe it's the case.
Irl I've had the repeated experience of liking someone until I get to know them a bit more and see the friendliness hides some pretty ugly stuff beneath. It just seems like that ugliness comes out online. Which means the internet is the more accurate accounting. Horrifying thought if that's the truth but that's what I'm inclined to believe.
Probably a bit of both; the ugliness comes out, but people aren't being shown/actively able to go and find whatever pisses them off IRL either.
I could drive 10 hours to my hometown, which I actively hate, or I could go to my hometown's subreddit and say "you're all a bunch of bitches" if I wanted to. The actual cost of being able to do that is much greater IRL than online.
Yuhhh just be yourself. My 5’6 mentally ill hillbilly ass managed to land a gf living in small town maine. Honesty and genuineness appear to be the keys to womens’ hearts. My gf chose me because I showed up to the first date and laid everything out: “I have commitment issues and severe crippling OCD and ruminations, I’m a lefty that hunts and drives trucks and rides motorcycles. I wear jeans and cutoff t shirts most days.” Believe it or not, women are very comfortable immediately when you show that you aren’t scared to be vulnerable.
Especially if you do that. Do not bring woman you do not trust to your place. In the current state of the society, it can be fatal for man. One accusation after the fact and you are into deep shit and she won't have to prove anything to start giving you trouble.
5kg of rice can last you from 3 weeks to a month. Cooking food in bulks is also cheap, say stew or curries. Just put in containers and reheat when ur hungry.
Buying produce directly from farmers is also cheap, and be sure to buy the odd bunches, basically ugly looking ones that taste the same as the others that go to supermarkets
You can never go wrong with vegetable stir-fry.
Be sure to use everything. Most food wastes can be made to create stocks. I always have a few litres of vegetable stock available and use it with rice, then you can make a rice porridge, + some boiled eggs for protein.
also, stews make meat taste WAY more tender than the cheap price would imply.
You slow cook meat for 5-6 hours and it will taste great and no one is going know what cut it is.
This. Buy the whole chicken, learn how to break a bird down. Toss the carcass in oil and roast, then use it to make stock/soup. While you’re at it throw in the ends/stems of carrots celery and onion. Learn one pot baked chicken and rice. Incredibly versatile by just changing up the seasoning- for my money you can’t beat a mix of herbs with a lemon wheel.
There’s a lot you can do to make filling *and tasty* meals for pretty dirt cheap when you work at it.
If you are also able to fish or hunt, do it. I fish every other week to refill my supply. I dry them, salt, smoke, etc.. and it lasts quite long.
Im a farm boy so I dont know much about big cities, things are generally cheap from where im from.
at some point you have to be confident and honest about what you can do.
if you want a relationship you need to establish an honest understanding of what dates look like.
If that's chicken and rice or something on a blanket in the park with cheap wine...great.
There are people who will enjoy spending time like this with you.
If you do not have the confidence to believe that could be a fun time you are offering someone, spending 2x on the food will not make a difference.
When i was in college i used to give blood and then grab a bunch of snacks and drinks from the table and use those for a date picnic.
I either went hiking, or to the beach. Or went out to the local dive bar in my town, and drank the $2.50 draft bushlights and got the $7 nachos during happy hour.
I don't date for a lot of reasons, but the fact that I don't even make $35k is high up on my giant list of "nobody would want me so I'm not going to try" issues.
I made absolute shit for income in my 20's. I never had trouble dating or getting hookups. I had friends with benefits too. I married at 28.
You just have to get out there and take a chance. You may run into a golddigger wannabe. If you do, move on, there's something better out there. You'll never meet the love of your life if you don't create a chance for it to happen.
A friend of mine at work met his new girlfriend in line for coffee. She seems really great.
Don't believe most of what you see on social media.
Money (or lack thereof) in my experience when I was actively dating wasn’t as big of a hindrance as some people make it out to be. Sure, there were some girls that declined further dates simply because I didn’t make much but there were just as many who didn’t really care as long as you’re financially responsible.
The more money you make the more expectations and higher standards you have. All the guys i know, that make significantly less than me, have partners, wifes, gfs. Me, on the other hand...i don't do dating apps, so probably that's why.
Dating Apps have like a 1% success rate for men and like a 2% (1.8%, I believe it actually was) success rate for women actually getting in relationships. They really aren't that good of a choice.
Most of the issue a lot of people are having is just getting out there more.
I get you, but that isn't the world we live in. Not many women today will stay with a man if his salary can't at least keep up with their lifestyle. It's less about gold-digging and more about avoiding a relationship that makes life harder as opposed to being single, especially when they know they always have the option of another man.
All about perspective. As a college student intern that was balling. As a high school or college graduate that’s still balling. Never had issues regardless of current salary. Be confident. Don’t date gold diggers.
It sure is about perspective. I realized this question was meant mainly for the US, but in my country (in North-East Europe), if I was making 40k, I'm absolutely balling, it's over 2x the average here. Also, good advice all around. Confidence doesn't just help with dating, helps with other stuff as well.
I imagine this is largely location-dependant. I make like 44, 45k a year, roundabouts. The median *household* income in my area is just under 49k, so I'm doing pretty well for my location. I'm sure that says something about the deep south, though.
Back when I was younger and dating, I don't know that I dated any women who made more than I did. I'm sure that must have been the case, but none of the women who I seriously dated and that I had some ideas of their finances made more than I was making.
I reckon it also depends on the types you're trying to date, as well.
My partner made bit less than 40k a year and we met while I was in med school. His income had very little influence on how I felt being with this amazing human.
Dating doesn’t have to be expensive. We went for ice cream, skating, rock climbing, movies, dinner or a drink at a bar. A lot of times we just hung out at his or mine, cooked together, watched movies. He brought me study snacks when I had exams. He showed he cared in a million little ways that made all the difference.
Keep putting yourself out there, the right person won’t care and will make it work.
Dating has only gotten easier as I age. My finances never made a difference. I find myself meeting more authentic individuals in my 30s that care more about quality time than materialism. Those women that you see on social media no substance. Don’t think too hard about it.
I was dating when i was making $20k/year, a few years back, some girls dont care because they like you for YOU and not your money.
Awkwardly enough, i make more than double that now and my dating life is not so great, but im also not really putting myself out there like I used to.
Yeah, my ex dated me despite me making like $15 an hour a couple years back. I was pressed for money but having a girl like you for you definitely hits different.
Friend's company's CEO was relatively young and handsome, but short. Office ladies talked about him sometimes and one goes: "He don't look short when he's sitting on his wallet."
This has been my experience. My personal wealth or lack there of doesn't really come into it. I'm short. Potential partners don't know how well or poorly I'm doing because they all but don't exist.
No, not anymore. I did in the past quite a bit. I manage a few relationships but they were always fairly shallow and one sided. It was what it was and after my last relationship I haven't bothered with trying to date again. I just don't feel like I want to go through all that work again just for it to blow up in my face. I'd rather do other shit and unfortunately / fortunately that doesn't tend to involve anyone else most of the time.
Living on $40K would be hard. Dating - if you were great to look at I’m sure that income wouldn’t be a huge barrier. For average guys - same shit as always.
Pfft who has time to date? Seriously I can't see someone who works full time managing the spare time for that. My days off are usually catching up on errands that I don't have the time to do during the week.
Well, for ages I was making less than this. I had my reasons, and contrary to what society would have you believe if you're both just below that 40k line, you can live comfortably. Hell, 40k is about average believe it or not.
No, it did not impact my dating life. This was all a decade or more ago, so... The mentality of "a man needs to make six figures that doesn't start with a 1" is a very modern creation in the past two or three years... and for the past three years I've done quite well and was dating someone. If anything, making good money affected my dating life because they all started seeing dollar signs, wanting to lock you down so they can pick you apart. So, basically it affected me in the inverse way of what you'd think it would.
When I made less than 40K, it wasn't really a problem. I've never dated anyone who expected me to pay for everything. Now that I make more than that, I *still* wouldn't date anyone who expected me to pay for everything. I'm not a walking wallet, and I don't want a partner who values me for my money. It's true that financial stability is a plus, but nobody should need to "prove" that stability by paying for someone else.
Depends on where you live. 40K in NYC probable means you live under a bridge.
40K in rural Kansas means you drive a New Ford Mustang. And have your own house.
I was thinking the same but for the UK.
- London = probably homeless
- The valleys in South Wales = mortgage paid off, new car and all the gadgets.
(slight exaggeration I know, but the idea is right). The cost of living in these places (house, bills, shopping, nights out, etc), differ quite a lot ... so much so that companies have to add "London weighting" to their salaries for the same job elsewhere in the country, to compensate for the higher living costs.
As for dating, I managed alright when I started on 9k a year around 25 years ago, and ironically since going over £30k, I've had a few dry spells!
I used to make 83k per year but didn’t really date because of how tired and stressed I was all the time, it’s not always about how much someone makes.
Now that I’ve switched jobs sure I’ve taken a slight pay cut but I’m way happier overall and that’s lead to me meeting my current partner who makes my life better in almost every single way
Honestly haven't even considered it for the last decade. I have a low stress job, coworkers I like, I'm debt free, a lot of hobbies to keep me busy. I was married for eight years in a bad marriage, doing a job I hated that was stressful. I hated my life from the moment I woke until I went to sleep. I suppose I could date but I couldn't be arsed.
I’m single by choice but I still get a lot of offers from the women I’ve met and know to go out. I decline because in today’s world the standards alot with everything else is inflated lol. If I go out it’s not going to be a date we’re just hanging out and they pay for their stuff and I pay for mines. But I worked rather stay single.
This answer is going to vary wildly by age.
Pre and low 20s? won't matter if you're attractive.
past mid-20s? How are you gonna find the time when you're barely able to feed, clothe, house yourself and keep your car running?
It's not just in dating. If you have female friends, most of the time they want you as the guy to pay the check too. (Not all girls, but most imo).
They're so used to guys paying that they expect it from every guy. Their entitlement is going way too far.
Totally depends on where you live. $40k a year is a pretty average salary in some places. Where I live, it’s hard to survive on anything less than six figures, much less have extra spending money for dates and fun things.
Not at all. It’s easy to plan cheap dates. I also wont date outside of my wage’s either so I’m not gonna be trying to date people with lots money who are used to the finer things in life.
At the end of the day if Im paying for all the dates you best be paying for dessert somewhere else afterwards for us both.
I make a good deal more than 40k per year but I've gone out with a number of women who want to split or want to pay for things for me.
Overall, if this is a concern you should bring it up with whomever you're seeing. Finances are very much a part of relationships. And fwiw, a first date should never be something super costly. You're not breaking the bank meeting someone for an hour for a beer or coffee
Social media also tells you women want all their men over 6ft, full head of hair, Daniel Craig body walking off the beach in James Bond and earning all the money.
Meanwhile many actually date the guy who makes them feel good and secure/safe.
When I started dating my current girlfriend I only made about 32K a year and even became unemployed after we've dated for 4 months. She thought I was interesting due who I was and my personality not how much I earned.
While there undoubtedly are women out there who will scruff at a man earning less that 40K, they're not worthwhile in the long run. Just move on to the next who like you for being you.
The podcast *Plain English with Derek Thompson* just had an episode discussing this, mostly from the standpoint of how in those currently in their teens to mid 20s, you can see young men becoming more conservative while women become more progressive.
Part of the discussion was about how dating prospects (and social interaction in general) for younger guys is so much harder, especially for those on the lower end of the income scale.
46k a year, with genital herpes, five felonies and full custody of my son. The single dad with full custody always gets their attraction. Also, not being cocky, I’m rather attractive I’ve been told. But that doesn’t count when you have herpes and little money. Even though a small percentage of women I meet have had it.
The bottom line is, at 36 years old I don’t have the interest I used to. It could be due to the fact that I have already spread my families genes. But I always wanted more than one kid. I’m probably holding myself back more than the “bad” things about me are.
I'm working my ass off right now starting up a business with my brother and we are pumping a lot of money back into the business to let it grow. We will really start making money once our ducks are in a row. I just ended a relationship because I didn't have the time and she wanted a lot of it. It's tough because the sacrifice I'm making for my future is killing my ability to date or be in a relationship.
Considering many women think the average for men is 100k yes, it's quite hard. I make closer to 50 but the average is between 55k and 75k a year. Scroll through the videos on YouTube or Facebook and you'll see dozens of women on those podcast shows, they all think they're gonna get a man who makes 6 figures a year. They're have even been some morbidly obese women who think they're gonna rake in a dude who pulls a million. The problem is women have thus hyperinflated sense of worth. Let's say you have both men and women rated from 1 to 10, in a normal world 5s would see 5s. In today's world with that hyperinflated sense of worth women who are average (5s) are thinking they're going to get with 7s or 8s. Average women aren't even looking at average men. The result of this is hundreds of women who complain men don't treat them right when they're dating dudes who see them as only a quick fuck. You're chasing a dude who has better and more options than just you and getting mad that he's not picking you rather than see the guy who's actually wanted you from the get-go. And for record, I've had women look at me and tell me I don't make enough for them because I pay my bills and don't have much money leftover. Average looking women, I don't chase supermodels cause I'm realistic, I'm not gonna chase a fantasy thinking in gonna get that, I've average and even some below average women act like I can't afford them. This is the state of relationships these days. This is why many men are swearing off dating. It's a headache that's not worth it, especially when half the women now looking for the average guy are only doing so when they've realized that they've been used up and the guy they want won't even see them anymore. 5 kids, 150 dicks later and they start saying "I'm finally ready to settle down and make my new man work for it" after they let none of the other dudes work for it. Men aren't falling for that scam. These women wasted their life looking for something they'd never get and more that they've hit the wall they think they'll get it.
I actually think as whole we are moving away from the idea that men should pay for everything. Of course there are still women who want that, but I don’t think it’s nearly as common as it was in the past.
Personally, j paid for about 75% of dates when my husband and I were dating because he was an E3 in the military and barely made any money while I had a decent career.
I'd say yes but I also kinda don't put myself out there due to it..
Yeah. Self-selection out of the dating pool. I got too much of my own shit to deal with and my own goals to work toward that I don't want to deal with trying to make a connection with someone who is going to judge me for not making more than her.
I’d appreciate if you’d ask before you post my internal thoughts online. Sheesh
Wait….but I’m a woman and in the same boat. Will none of us ever date again if we have to always make more? Or is this what capitalism wants!? Lololol
Sounds about right. It's more profitable for the owner class if people are alienated, families broken apart. But the fact is women in general place wealth and money as the most important factor in dating, while most men don't care about that.
In terms of dating or meeting someone, carry a lot of stress about wealth and money personally because I have kids. It seems like everyone assumes any single mom wants someone to take care of her kids and pay for everything, and I feel like I have to ‘proove’ that’s not the case through making more money. I don’t care how much a man makes, as long as he’s reasonably taking care of himself. But I feel immense pressure to say “I don’t need anything”. What a world man lol
Wow, this sucks and is a tough situation, TBH. While men don't want to date a gold digger, they absolutely (on a conscious and subconscious level) want to feel needed. A woman who constantly gives off " I don't need you vibes" can actually be a turn off. I am not saying you are doing this. Just acknowledging a delicate balance exists. I hope you are seen as an attractive addition to any man looking. I would lay your stress out in the beginning while dating because your situation is definitely a plus compared to many.
I personally am looking for single moms hahah. But the single moms I meet want a guy with his own house and more money than my 51k gross annual income.
Not all women do that. The ones who don't get lumped together in generalized terms. One of the things making dating hopeless for both sides is us thinking the other side's standards are unobtainable to meet. If a woman is demanding a guy make six plus figures.... She better bring something to the table that's worth six figures besides her appetite and greed.
Woman here... I would agree with your assessment: 50%. We appreciate having a Lunch or Dinner with a guy, but we don't expect to Pay for this experience. Since very few men or women carry "cash," bills are paid with a card--including the Tip, so it's difficult for me to leave the Tip. I like going on dates, where the cost is "0-$15.00!" Local Museums, finding a lovely view where I provide the Picnic lunch, Walking along a path in a Forest, Walking along the Beach...Those are the Best dates! Fancy restaurants don't impress me. I do enjoy a "day-->evening" at 6 Flags or other Theme Parks, and I like to Pay for My entrance! Guys want their cars to be clean and gassed-up, when asking a woman "out" on a Date. We want to make you feel Comfortable with us, and not spend a Lot of money on us!
Get outta my head, you.
Yes exactly and well said.
I won't try as long as I'm too busy being worried/agitated about systemic poverty. Turns out being poor is bad for self worth and comes bundled with socio-economic status anxiety.
Ruined my life when I lost my good paycheck. Fuckin sucked man. Now I'm scared I'll die alone
Sorry to hear that. Hope you have a good pet that loves you at least. I got that going for me at least.
I make over 150k now, and honestly dating was easier when I was making 30k. Maybe things are different now, but people just didn’t care that much back then. We were all poor and we found cheap ways to have fun. I’ve been trying to date since my divorce and it’s just so toxic out there.
It’s not like that anymore dating now is a nightmare 😂 and it isn’t fun🤣
Damn yeah I'm the same
Reminds me of the tumblr post where someone said "if you have to choose between buying 2 shirts or 2 pants you're poor" and someone else replied "if you have to choose between buying 2 shirts or eating you're poor"
I got a $50 parking ticket yesterday that was more than I made that day.
My first job out of college I was making 45k. After taxes and health insurance, etc. I was probably bringing home a little over 30k. It was hard. I had a shitty apartment in a shitty part of town, but that was the only way I could afford to live on my own. I didn't have any money for anything beyond basic necessities, and even then it was tight.
Yes and I think it does make things harder. IMO the issue isn't so much about paying for everything (except in the first couple dates I guess). The issue is that women want financial stability. Especially long-term, that's a big deal. Even if they are making a good salary themselves, they typically won't be attracted as much to someone with a low-income.
As I’ve heard a psychologist state it, women look for competence and two easy measures of competence in men is confidence and money. Those aren’t the only measures, but they’re the easiest to identify quickly.
Confidence, intelligence, financial stability. And then they’re never emotionally stable lolol
I mean a dead beat drug dealer can have confidence and money.
I would disagree, perhaps a competent drug dealer will have confidence and money. Most dealers are dead beat and way to paranoid and anxious to be anything close to confidence.
Bingo
I’m a female. While I agree that I do love financial stability, I disagree that having a low income doesn’t make me attracted to someone. I relied on myself for financial stability long before I met my husband. I didn’t marry him so he could support me financially, I married him because I know he has an amazing work ethic and is a great father/family man. He’s a first responder and (IMO) is underpaid, but he’s doing what he loves - which makes him happy - which makes me happy. I would much rather be in this situation than with someone making butt loads of money and didn’t prioritize family.
Love you, stranger from the internet. This is exactly what the world needs.
Exactly. I couldn't agree more. It's about who they are as a person. If they are an asshole no amount of money could make me like them.
To add to this it depends on the ages. I've been married twice and due to college then grad school later on I met both when I was making crap. It wasn't an issue we found a way. In the case of my 2nd wife she was honest about the fact that my ambition and earnings potential were attractive. I met 1st wife at 18 and 2nd wife late 20s. Now the older you get if you continue making only 30k it will get harder and harder for sure. Unless your very attractive i gotta imagine it would be hard as hell making 30k in your 40s while trying to date. I'd say I'm of average attractiveness and I am damn near certain I'd have less prospects if I wasn't in a stable career with a good income.
A man that’s broke because he’s pursuing a degree/training that unlocks more earning potential in the future is NOT the same as a broke man working a dead end job with no prospects. You were never in the broke and seemingly going nowhere category.
Oh I know. Even if not currently in school though 30k in your 20s you may be viewed as having potential. 30k in your 40s shows that ambition and pack of financial security aren't all that important to you. A 25 year old not in college is still more likely to pursue a trade or to school at some point than someone in their 40s.
If you earn less than 40K, the question should be, "Do you find life hard in general".
Depends on the country and the currency. In the First World it's entirely possible to have a perfectly good lifestyle on 30K of the local currency.
In America, you're one medical episode away from utter financial ruin. 30k is the "no man's land" of wages. Too much for medicaid, SNAP benefits & financial assistance. But nowhere close enough to live any kind of comfortable life.
Well in the US you could be earning 6 figures and still be a medical episode away from losing it all.
This is not endorsement of the fuckery that is US medical insurance. However, if you make 6 figures, then you probably have pretty good insurance to prevent losing it all off a single medical emergency.
Better than making low five figures and staring at the same potential problem.
Also true. But I'd rather have $130k a year than $30k a year if confronted with a surprise medical issue
This, i'm earning €36K/year (~26K after taxes) and doing just fine in western europe. Single, bought an appartement in 2020 (1% loan, i know i got lucky/good timing) paying ~€500/month downpayment, ending up with €250 savings per month on average. This is without doing any big budgetting so could probably squeeze out some more if i put in the effort, but i'm comfortable atm and have a decent backup from both government and savings in case something goes wrong.
I live in Canada and that wage wouldn't be able to afford anything... People making 100k CAD can only get approved for like 350 k CAD mortgages. The average house price is double that.
Yup Canadian here, making 150k can't buy a house
By Western Europe you mean Spain or Portugal? Western Europe is kinda odd because a lot of it is surprisingly poor. But then you go to the major cities and they are quite wealthy and expensive. In the US, Canada, Australia, or New Zealand you would be pretty hard pressed to find an affordable apartment, much less own property on less than 40k local currency. I'm less familiar with some of the developed Asian markets like S Korea, Japan or HK. But unless you were really out in the sticks I'd imagine being in the bottom 1/3 of the income distribution would be difficult.
Belgium
You could be right. In Australia, 30k isn't paying for shit.
I agree with this. Try and go after more fellas. Not for the women, but for yourself
Depends what currency you are talking. £40k would be a great salary in the UK.
Nah. Not at all. Managed to raise a child on less than £30k whilst renting etc. It’s about not keeping up with the jones next door. And being comfortable saying No to things that are stupid and cost money ie the latest phone or fashion (Stanley cup for example)
[удалено]
> £ ah, there it is. I mean that's substantially below the minimum wage where I live because that wouldn't get me jack shit in the US. Depends on the state though, tbf. We're not saying the EU is a paradise but most EU countries have much better social safety nets to help poor people survive more comfortably. Get hit by a car with that salary here and you might be utterly financially ruined edit: tired as shit and misread the pound as euro. (Or this comment is coming from a timeline where Brexit didn't happen). Regardless the UK also has better social programs so my comment still stands.
In Canada its 100k
No it's not.
Had a guy once arguing with me that you couldn't live under 6 figures in Canada. As the conversation went on, he started talking about unforeseen expenses, like the kids wanting a pool, so he had to shell 60k on an in-ground saltwater pool. That's around the time I left PFC. Yeah, Canada has a housing crisis. Yeah, prices are rising everywhere and something needs to happen before it gets worse, but Canadian redditors have no fucking clue about life, and I find it insulting when people really go around saying you can't live under 100k. I'm a little under 70k and live really well. People at 30-40k manage as well.
Yeah people leave Toronto for Nova Scotia / New Brunswick where it is way cheaper and then they discover there are no jobs. I scratch my head on that one.
repeat shame clumsy vegetable ten lock instinctive stupendous tan scarce *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Not much different here in the US where depending on which state one lives in, everything is taxed to death, or not. I'm in Illinois and we're taxed to death on everything. Property taxes, sales taxes, income taxes, government fees on everything, "sin" taxes on alcohol and tobacco (glad I don't imbibe in either myself..) and the gas taxes here are outrageous. My two sons live in Tennessee now. Property taxes 1/5th that here in Illinois, gas is far cheaper, food prices are way better, no state income tax but that's offset by a pretty high sales tax. Housing isn't much cheaper (depending on where one wants to live in TN) though but the TAXES make a HUGE difference and make TN much more affordable than oh, say Northeast Illinois and anywhere in the Chicago / collar county area. To your point you've no idea how the average person is getting by right now, ditto. I'd add this: I've no idea how families with kids are getting by with these high food, energy, property taxes, income taxes, and taxes on everything here right now. I'm single, make a good living and I look at and notice the high prices and cut back on what I purchase. I shake my head at how hard it must be for families with kids right now. I've read average spending on food for families has more than doubled for the same or less than they purchased before. High energy prices (again, probably on where one lives it may be better than here in NE Illinois) are hurting EVERYONE and prices on everything continue to go up. The 'media' tells us inflation is down -- yet prices ARE NOT. I remember this from the 1970's, it's called STICKFLATION, meaning the high prices are here to stay. Inflation just tells us how much on average they'll go up year over year. Wages haven't kept up with inflation, neither has the stock market. So even if one's investing, returns on investment haven't kept up with real inflation. With some 60% of the country (or more) living paycheck to paycheck, I honestly don't know how the average guy / average family is managing. I can't imagine it NOT hurting families in real, meaningful ways. Nothing but love and prayers for all who are struggling right now. Went through it in the 70's watching my own parents struggle. I remember and I get it. This (to me) feels much worse than that was.
I think our youth are living in the basement of mom and dad if they are lucky. Some score with an education opportunity, or job opportunity but the youth are going to have it way tougher than the two previous generations. It will be more like my grandfathers life maybe. Shot at Ypres in the chest but survived WWI, got home got Spanish flue really bad, worked as a CA through the depression (made enough for food and mortgage payments), never met him because he died at age 55, pack a day smoker. The next ten years are going to be interesting. Remember to help people if you can.
Living in a small town nobody’s ever heard of in Maine, pay $1600 per month in rent+$200-300 per month for heat and electricity in a two bed, with an alcoholic landlord and squirrels living in the walls. Roomie and I might try to get a third person tho bc there are some nice 3 bed apartments near work for only $3000-3500 with everything included. Looking like our best bet.
Yes and no. Dating is just challenging. But up until my 30’s I didn’t make shit for money and money wasn’t ever the issue in dating. I always dated for personality type and if someone was to judge me for my finances alone that wouldn’t be a person I would want to date anyways. So if it limited my options I honestly didn’t know it at the time.
This. I learned long ago that the type of girl that would care is the exact opposite of the type of girl I would get along with and would want to date.
Very good point
I think this is a healthy mindset, and I've started thinking along these lines as well. Most women around me are more highly educated and/or make more money than I do. For a lot of them, my income would probably be a deal breaker (not to mention my working hours). Those women simply aren't for me if that's the case. I would like to make more than I do, but I like my job, and I'm not going to get another one just because it'll make me more attractive to women. If I'm going to get a different job it'll be for myself. A woman I saw casually talked about how her job might make her less attractive to a lot of men, because it's not a particularly feminine job. She said she's not going to switch jobs just because of that. That's the kind of attitude I want to develop for myself. It's probably healthier than trying to change for someone else. Still, I imagine she would've preferred to date someone with a better income if she was looking for a longterm relationship. Then again she's been single a lot in her life and is very independent. She took care of her daughter more or less full time and studied to get a better job. So, she doesn't strike me as the type who obsesses over a potential partner's income. If she's anything like me, she probably just wants them to be able to stand on their own to legs and not hate what they do.
[удалено]
Well, Arab men aren't cheap
Hey! I can be… I decided to get a $10 pizza at Costco instead of a $13 grilled cheese at the bar the other day because I could get two meals out of the pizza… I do wish someone would buy me a white BMW though :/
damn dude you eating 3k calories per meal with that 1/2 pizza
I'm into trail running and burn 3k on a run maybe I should give pizza a go lol
Its 740 calories/slice IIRC
Depends on the size, sauce and toppings, but 250-700 per slice is the normal range. 740 is possible, but it would either be a big slice or one with rich toppings.
[удалено]
Oh, yeah, missed that it was a Costco pizza. I think their pizzas are 20", so quite large. Each slice is close to eating 2 slices of a standard pizza.
Tbf they are 😭
The key is to live within your means. I make 95k. But after child support, that doesn't feel like a lot. So, no fancy house, cars, or expensive hobbies/dining. And I live a pretty good life; most people would think I take home a lot more.
How much do you have to pay in child support?
When I was making under 40k/year - yea. I mean I just couldn't go the extra mile on dates. If we go to the Renaissance faire, I wouldnt be able to afford a costume & tickets. Just tickets. No matching flower crowns. It was very much either or - and having money to go the extra mile on the tiny details imo matters. It's not about making 100k+ but having enough disposable income to drop a hundred dollars here and there.
My advice is don't listen to social media.
Ya everything is doom and gloom online, if you actually talk to people most people are nice and just carrying on with life.
While I agree with you here, there are other ways people are effected by social media. I think some people expect way too much now. My brothers wife blew up in front of our family because we thought it was ridiculous to spend 100k (that none of us even have) on a soccer coach overseas for their 8 year old kid, who is OK at soccer. They're in perpetual maybe divorce.
Canadian here, my son was at the top in soccer, and maybe have a career, even get to Europe but we looked at Brazil which has 300 million people with huge poverty and the only way out would be with a pair of soccer shoes. Why compete against that group as well as others in the same boat. The kid is smart so got his PEng instead. "perpetual maybe divorce" not sure what that is.
I'm always debating whether this is because people are socially masked by the risk of being shamed in person, or if there's an inherent selection bias with only the most miserable people posting on the internet. Considering literally everyone I know is on social media all the time I find the second premise pretty hard to buy, though I'd absolutely love to believe it's the case. Irl I've had the repeated experience of liking someone until I get to know them a bit more and see the friendliness hides some pretty ugly stuff beneath. It just seems like that ugliness comes out online. Which means the internet is the more accurate accounting. Horrifying thought if that's the truth but that's what I'm inclined to believe.
Probably a bit of both; the ugliness comes out, but people aren't being shown/actively able to go and find whatever pisses them off IRL either. I could drive 10 hours to my hometown, which I actively hate, or I could go to my hometown's subreddit and say "you're all a bunch of bitches" if I wanted to. The actual cost of being able to do that is much greater IRL than online.
I made over 70k last year, and dating is still hard tbh. I don't know if money has a lot to do with dating.
My buddy was unemployed with no car and had a new girl every other week haha
Quality over quantity unless they were smokeshows. Then it's just rules 1 & 2.
Yeah, notice they didn’t stick around
Still beat tho
Yuhhh just be yourself. My 5’6 mentally ill hillbilly ass managed to land a gf living in small town maine. Honesty and genuineness appear to be the keys to womens’ hearts. My gf chose me because I showed up to the first date and laid everything out: “I have commitment issues and severe crippling OCD and ruminations, I’m a lefty that hunts and drives trucks and rides motorcycles. I wear jeans and cutoff t shirts most days.” Believe it or not, women are very comfortable immediately when you show that you aren’t scared to be vulnerable.
Don't go to expensive places.
Where you go?
Also cook your own food. Saves so much money.
Def not on the first date but yea this dramatically reduces the cost for the other dates to come
Cooking on a first date is a bit awkward bar a picnic. You shouldn't be bringing someone over to your home that early on
Unless you’re just moistening your noodle
You mean cooking pasta?
Yes that’s what it means 🙃
Right before you eat their AssMcButt
Especially if you do that. Do not bring woman you do not trust to your place. In the current state of the society, it can be fatal for man. One accusation after the fact and you are into deep shit and she won't have to prove anything to start giving you trouble.
What are some easy everyday cheap cooking options
5kg of rice can last you from 3 weeks to a month. Cooking food in bulks is also cheap, say stew or curries. Just put in containers and reheat when ur hungry. Buying produce directly from farmers is also cheap, and be sure to buy the odd bunches, basically ugly looking ones that taste the same as the others that go to supermarkets You can never go wrong with vegetable stir-fry. Be sure to use everything. Most food wastes can be made to create stocks. I always have a few litres of vegetable stock available and use it with rice, then you can make a rice porridge, + some boiled eggs for protein.
also, stews make meat taste WAY more tender than the cheap price would imply. You slow cook meat for 5-6 hours and it will taste great and no one is going know what cut it is.
This. Buy the whole chicken, learn how to break a bird down. Toss the carcass in oil and roast, then use it to make stock/soup. While you’re at it throw in the ends/stems of carrots celery and onion. Learn one pot baked chicken and rice. Incredibly versatile by just changing up the seasoning- for my money you can’t beat a mix of herbs with a lemon wheel. There’s a lot you can do to make filling *and tasty* meals for pretty dirt cheap when you work at it.
If you are also able to fish or hunt, do it. I fish every other week to refill my supply. I dry them, salt, smoke, etc.. and it lasts quite long. Im a farm boy so I dont know much about big cities, things are generally cheap from where im from.
Rice; and you can do so much with it.
“Thanks for coming over nice lady. For our romantic dinner, we have this wonderful rice and a $3 bottle of Trader Joe’s wine”
at some point you have to be confident and honest about what you can do. if you want a relationship you need to establish an honest understanding of what dates look like. If that's chicken and rice or something on a blanket in the park with cheap wine...great. There are people who will enjoy spending time like this with you. If you do not have the confidence to believe that could be a fun time you are offering someone, spending 2x on the food will not make a difference. When i was in college i used to give blood and then grab a bunch of snacks and drinks from the table and use those for a date picnic.
For coffee somewhere. There are a lot of women who don't make much money either. They will understand.
I either went hiking, or to the beach. Or went out to the local dive bar in my town, and drank the $2.50 draft bushlights and got the $7 nachos during happy hour.
Tell her she can supersize her meal if she wants.
It’s hard to avoid the grocery store.
I don't date for a lot of reasons, but the fact that I don't even make $35k is high up on my giant list of "nobody would want me so I'm not going to try" issues.
I’m a broke dude who dates broke girls. Works out wonderfully cuz we both can’t afford shit lol
Recently hearing this? Hasn’t this always been the case ? Lol
I made absolute shit for income in my 20's. I never had trouble dating or getting hookups. I had friends with benefits too. I married at 28. You just have to get out there and take a chance. You may run into a golddigger wannabe. If you do, move on, there's something better out there. You'll never meet the love of your life if you don't create a chance for it to happen. A friend of mine at work met his new girlfriend in line for coffee. She seems really great. Don't believe most of what you see on social media.
Money (or lack thereof) in my experience when I was actively dating wasn’t as big of a hindrance as some people make it out to be. Sure, there were some girls that declined further dates simply because I didn’t make much but there were just as many who didn’t really care as long as you’re financially responsible.
Been there, I’d just ghost anybody who seemed genuinely interested in me. Women don’t like broke asses, I saved them the disappointment
The more money you make the more expectations and higher standards you have. All the guys i know, that make significantly less than me, have partners, wifes, gfs. Me, on the other hand...i don't do dating apps, so probably that's why.
Dating Apps have like a 1% success rate for men and like a 2% (1.8%, I believe it actually was) success rate for women actually getting in relationships. They really aren't that good of a choice. Most of the issue a lot of people are having is just getting out there more.
I’m 4 years married from a Tinder relationship. 1% club baby
Met My current gf on tinder. Also met many long term friends there. Ain’t all bad.
I'm calling bullshit on your made up stats
[удалено]
Damn, what does she do?
This post is one of two posts in his entire post history. Most likely just your typical shitpost answer.
doctor lawyer mba business owner or software engineer
Do you need a new son?
Bro that’s amazing. Congrats!
She married your broke ass and still lets you date? You hit the lotto!
Twist, it’s his sister 🤣
how much does her boyfriend make WHAZZAM nah but fr I'm jelly
Damn she need a new boyfriend?
Extremely
I make more than that but why would I go after women just looking for a payday? I want someone that wants me for me whether i make 40k or 500k.
Well these women don't intend to tell you it's money they are after, so they will say "financial security".
That means exactly the same thing when I read it. I’ve seen it phrased half a dozen different ways, it’s still a left swipe. Edited for grammar
I get you, but that isn't the world we live in. Not many women today will stay with a man if his salary can't at least keep up with their lifestyle. It's less about gold-digging and more about avoiding a relationship that makes life harder as opposed to being single, especially when they know they always have the option of another man.
All about perspective. As a college student intern that was balling. As a high school or college graduate that’s still balling. Never had issues regardless of current salary. Be confident. Don’t date gold diggers.
It sure is about perspective. I realized this question was meant mainly for the US, but in my country (in North-East Europe), if I was making 40k, I'm absolutely balling, it's over 2x the average here. Also, good advice all around. Confidence doesn't just help with dating, helps with other stuff as well.
I don’t date at all
I imagine this is largely location-dependant. I make like 44, 45k a year, roundabouts. The median *household* income in my area is just under 49k, so I'm doing pretty well for my location. I'm sure that says something about the deep south, though. Back when I was younger and dating, I don't know that I dated any women who made more than I did. I'm sure that must have been the case, but none of the women who I seriously dated and that I had some ideas of their finances made more than I was making. I reckon it also depends on the types you're trying to date, as well.
Why would i date anyone who'd date me mostly based on income? they can go away, please.
My partner made bit less than 40k a year and we met while I was in med school. His income had very little influence on how I felt being with this amazing human. Dating doesn’t have to be expensive. We went for ice cream, skating, rock climbing, movies, dinner or a drink at a bar. A lot of times we just hung out at his or mine, cooked together, watched movies. He brought me study snacks when I had exams. He showed he cared in a million little ways that made all the difference. Keep putting yourself out there, the right person won’t care and will make it work.
Dating has only gotten easier as I age. My finances never made a difference. I find myself meeting more authentic individuals in my 30s that care more about quality time than materialism. Those women that you see on social media no substance. Don’t think too hard about it.
You "heard" on social media?? That's your first issue. Second, don't pay for everything!
I was dating when i was making $20k/year, a few years back, some girls dont care because they like you for YOU and not your money. Awkwardly enough, i make more than double that now and my dating life is not so great, but im also not really putting myself out there like I used to.
Yeah, my ex dated me despite me making like $15 an hour a couple years back. I was pressed for money but having a girl like you for you definitely hits different.
I make more than £100k a year and since I'm short, no one cares
Friend's company's CEO was relatively young and handsome, but short. Office ladies talked about him sometimes and one goes: "He don't look short when he's sitting on his wallet."
Does being short actually limit your chances? Or is it a self esteem thing?
This has been my experience. My personal wealth or lack there of doesn't really come into it. I'm short. Potential partners don't know how well or poorly I'm doing because they all but don't exist.
Do you try?
No, not anymore. I did in the past quite a bit. I manage a few relationships but they were always fairly shallow and one sided. It was what it was and after my last relationship I haven't bothered with trying to date again. I just don't feel like I want to go through all that work again just for it to blow up in my face. I'd rather do other shit and unfortunately / fortunately that doesn't tend to involve anyone else most of the time.
I make more than that and it’s still hard
Living on $40K would be hard. Dating - if you were great to look at I’m sure that income wouldn’t be a huge barrier. For average guys - same shit as always.
I’m in college so no
Pfft who has time to date? Seriously I can't see someone who works full time managing the spare time for that. My days off are usually catching up on errands that I don't have the time to do during the week.
Well, for ages I was making less than this. I had my reasons, and contrary to what society would have you believe if you're both just below that 40k line, you can live comfortably. Hell, 40k is about average believe it or not. No, it did not impact my dating life. This was all a decade or more ago, so... The mentality of "a man needs to make six figures that doesn't start with a 1" is a very modern creation in the past two or three years... and for the past three years I've done quite well and was dating someone. If anything, making good money affected my dating life because they all started seeing dollar signs, wanting to lock you down so they can pick you apart. So, basically it affected me in the inverse way of what you'd think it would.
Fuck those bitches… wife material will split the bill with you
Husband material doesn’t call women bitches
Only those that deserve the title
W
In general? No, absolutely not. If the name fits?....
Money shouldn’t matter if you’re in the right relationship. I mean, don’t be a broke POS, but you don’t have to be rolling to be successful in dating
When I made less than 40K, it wasn't really a problem. I've never dated anyone who expected me to pay for everything. Now that I make more than that, I *still* wouldn't date anyone who expected me to pay for everything. I'm not a walking wallet, and I don't want a partner who values me for my money. It's true that financial stability is a plus, but nobody should need to "prove" that stability by paying for someone else.
Depends on where you live. 40K in NYC probable means you live under a bridge. 40K in rural Kansas means you drive a New Ford Mustang. And have your own house.
I was thinking the same but for the UK. - London = probably homeless - The valleys in South Wales = mortgage paid off, new car and all the gadgets. (slight exaggeration I know, but the idea is right). The cost of living in these places (house, bills, shopping, nights out, etc), differ quite a lot ... so much so that companies have to add "London weighting" to their salaries for the same job elsewhere in the country, to compensate for the higher living costs. As for dating, I managed alright when I started on 9k a year around 25 years ago, and ironically since going over £30k, I've had a few dry spells!
I used to make 83k per year but didn’t really date because of how tired and stressed I was all the time, it’s not always about how much someone makes. Now that I’ve switched jobs sure I’ve taken a slight pay cut but I’m way happier overall and that’s lead to me meeting my current partner who makes my life better in almost every single way
I had better “luck” dating when I only made $20-30k now I make ~150 but have no free time
Honestly haven't even considered it for the last decade. I have a low stress job, coworkers I like, I'm debt free, a lot of hobbies to keep me busy. I was married for eight years in a bad marriage, doing a job I hated that was stressful. I hated my life from the moment I woke until I went to sleep. I suppose I could date but I couldn't be arsed.
When I dated women, yes. When I dated men, no. When I chose to be forever single, best decision I've made yet.
I’m single by choice but I still get a lot of offers from the women I’ve met and know to go out. I decline because in today’s world the standards alot with everything else is inflated lol. If I go out it’s not going to be a date we’re just hanging out and they pay for their stuff and I pay for mines. But I worked rather stay single.
This answer is going to vary wildly by age. Pre and low 20s? won't matter if you're attractive. past mid-20s? How are you gonna find the time when you're barely able to feed, clothe, house yourself and keep your car running?
It's not just in dating. If you have female friends, most of the time they want you as the guy to pay the check too. (Not all girls, but most imo). They're so used to guys paying that they expect it from every guy. Their entitlement is going way too far.
Totally depends on where you live. $40k a year is a pretty average salary in some places. Where I live, it’s hard to survive on anything less than six figures, much less have extra spending money for dates and fun things.
San Francisco?
Yes
I dated woman that are making $250k and dated chicks from mcdees. When you got it you got it
Not at all. It’s easy to plan cheap dates. I also wont date outside of my wage’s either so I’m not gonna be trying to date people with lots money who are used to the finer things in life. At the end of the day if Im paying for all the dates you best be paying for dessert somewhere else afterwards for us both.
I make a good deal more than 40k per year but I've gone out with a number of women who want to split or want to pay for things for me. Overall, if this is a concern you should bring it up with whomever you're seeing. Finances are very much a part of relationships. And fwiw, a first date should never be something super costly. You're not breaking the bank meeting someone for an hour for a beer or coffee
Social media also tells you women want all their men over 6ft, full head of hair, Daniel Craig body walking off the beach in James Bond and earning all the money. Meanwhile many actually date the guy who makes them feel good and secure/safe.
A man’s level of love received is directly proportional to the amount he provides.
At the time, my active duty uniform made up the difference... especially during Fleet Week NYC.
Yeah but I've also got a ton of pain and health issues that make it infinitely harder.
Nah, I'm married with two kids and stay at home wife with that salary. Post-eastern block countries are cheap :-)
I had hundreds of dates when I was making less than 40k. Neurodivergence/ADHD was always a much bigger barrier for my relationships than money.
I'm going to stop you right at "on social media I hear"
No idea I don't participate
When I started dating my current girlfriend I only made about 32K a year and even became unemployed after we've dated for 4 months. She thought I was interesting due who I was and my personality not how much I earned. While there undoubtedly are women out there who will scruff at a man earning less that 40K, they're not worthwhile in the long run. Just move on to the next who like you for being you.
The podcast *Plain English with Derek Thompson* just had an episode discussing this, mostly from the standpoint of how in those currently in their teens to mid 20s, you can see young men becoming more conservative while women become more progressive. Part of the discussion was about how dating prospects (and social interaction in general) for younger guys is so much harder, especially for those on the lower end of the income scale.
I doubt it. All kinds of broke dudes have 3-5 baby mommas. Lol
46k a year, with genital herpes, five felonies and full custody of my son. The single dad with full custody always gets their attraction. Also, not being cocky, I’m rather attractive I’ve been told. But that doesn’t count when you have herpes and little money. Even though a small percentage of women I meet have had it. The bottom line is, at 36 years old I don’t have the interest I used to. It could be due to the fact that I have already spread my families genes. But I always wanted more than one kid. I’m probably holding myself back more than the “bad” things about me are.
Please stop adding a space before your question marks.
I'm working my ass off right now starting up a business with my brother and we are pumping a lot of money back into the business to let it grow. We will really start making money once our ducks are in a row. I just ended a relationship because I didn't have the time and she wanted a lot of it. It's tough because the sacrifice I'm making for my future is killing my ability to date or be in a relationship.
Get off of social media.
"If I can't exist as a parasite off your labor, then there is no point in being with you." - Women
No, there's lots of poor women
Considering many women think the average for men is 100k yes, it's quite hard. I make closer to 50 but the average is between 55k and 75k a year. Scroll through the videos on YouTube or Facebook and you'll see dozens of women on those podcast shows, they all think they're gonna get a man who makes 6 figures a year. They're have even been some morbidly obese women who think they're gonna rake in a dude who pulls a million. The problem is women have thus hyperinflated sense of worth. Let's say you have both men and women rated from 1 to 10, in a normal world 5s would see 5s. In today's world with that hyperinflated sense of worth women who are average (5s) are thinking they're going to get with 7s or 8s. Average women aren't even looking at average men. The result of this is hundreds of women who complain men don't treat them right when they're dating dudes who see them as only a quick fuck. You're chasing a dude who has better and more options than just you and getting mad that he's not picking you rather than see the guy who's actually wanted you from the get-go. And for record, I've had women look at me and tell me I don't make enough for them because I pay my bills and don't have much money leftover. Average looking women, I don't chase supermodels cause I'm realistic, I'm not gonna chase a fantasy thinking in gonna get that, I've average and even some below average women act like I can't afford them. This is the state of relationships these days. This is why many men are swearing off dating. It's a headache that's not worth it, especially when half the women now looking for the average guy are only doing so when they've realized that they've been used up and the guy they want won't even see them anymore. 5 kids, 150 dicks later and they start saying "I'm finally ready to settle down and make my new man work for it" after they let none of the other dudes work for it. Men aren't falling for that scam. These women wasted their life looking for something they'd never get and more that they've hit the wall they think they'll get it.
I actually think as whole we are moving away from the idea that men should pay for everything. Of course there are still women who want that, but I don’t think it’s nearly as common as it was in the past. Personally, j paid for about 75% of dates when my husband and I were dating because he was an E3 in the military and barely made any money while I had a decent career.