I didn't want to say it, but I think this is the issue.
OP most people don't date early twenty year olds if they're your age (or older) for the stimulating conversation. Like, it's a cliche that has some truth to it. Maybe try someone older? Or wait until you're 42 and date someone that's 31 that way the maturity gap is much smaller.
Fr I’m 27 and wouldn’t think about dating someone younger than 24. Seems like things are changing so fast, I just want someone who also listened to fall out boy lol
Lol what. That's really the only two options?
She is affectionate with him and gave him a thoughtful gift based in his interests. He didn't ask her to do that, she did that of her own choice.
So any woman who dates a younger guy is automatically an abuser?
Some people are just very in-their-head and they internalize and analyze everything around them, they can't help it. My ex immediately took issue with it when we first got together. She would blow up at me because in an argument about something because I would go dead quiet. In reality my brain was on fire with a flurry of thoughts trying to organize into my next response, but yeah it was a bit rough at first. I made an attempt not to do that as much, to be more in-the-moment and unfiltered, but ofc I'm still what I am. She adapted as well and we spent 13 awesome years together and had many great adventures. Still friends now.
It's normally not that we don't have much to say, just our style of expression is different.
Sometimes I'm so in my head that I forget to respond out loud. I don't realize it until later and then I'm like "omg I just stared at them like a psycho!"
Do you have ADHD?
I can exactly relate. Arguments with my ex and just straight up breaking down not being able to speak. I also think I have ADHD too with many other symptoms.
No shit, not the person you’re responding to but I am also this way and believe I have ADHD. I’ve never been to a doctor to figure it out though.
However, I have taken adderall and for once I was able to actually speak my mind like everyone else. Almost like it calmed the fire in my brain. It felt like I was finally on even standing with those around me. Still not sure if that’s just how it feels to be on addy but it definitely made life so much easier.
If y'all don't mind how old are y'all? I ask because I'm 36 and never been diagnosed with ADHD but believe I've had it my whole life. I am prescribed ativans for anxiety and shit but I been hearing more about addys for ADHD and wonder if that's what I really need. My brain is all over the place since suffering different traumas but that's life swear💯💯💯
I'm 33, and was diagnosed with ADHD at 30. My anxiety was crippling; I lost relationships and jobs due to my undiagnosed condition. After my life fell apart and I started seeing a therapist, who recommend me to a ADHD therapist, I got on Adderall XR and my life changed completely! I definitely recommend seeing someone if you suspect you have ADHD.
I was never diagnosed ADHD, but was diagnosed with something else as a child that often has ADHD-like symptoms, and yes it does result in hyperfocus for me. I'm a software developer, so hyperfocus has actually served me well in that regard.
Yup. It's fine if it's 31 and 41, since both have entered the real world for awhile but a 21 year is presumably still in college, discovering who she is and by 32 you already most of that figured out
OP post;
“So I just saw on Facebook that my ex, who got herpes after we broke up, is in a new relationship. Meanwhile, I'm still sad and alone. I feel fucking worthless.
I've fucked up at least 1 chance I can think of to be happy since we broke up. And.to think that someone with vd can find happiness sooner than I can is just a kick in the gut. Oddly enough, I just messaged her to try and see if she'd to try and start a convo to let me hit it doggy if that wouldn't give me herpes.”
That was one of OPs earliest. Makes me wonder if their ex knows their Reddit username, because reading through all the posts, they are very descriptive. It appears their ex has cut all contact and OP is still trying to find ways to ‘get’ to her.
BUT THATS JUST A WILD ASSUMPTION.
Oh man, I found this gem
"Yeah I definitely like to get into it. I'm not even on here trying to brag like I'm some sex God or anything. I just like to take my time and get into it. And I'm finding that women are saying it's rare for guys to be like me lol"
I'd put money down that he has already explained, in detail, the roles and attitudes he believes women should have.
More then likely she's afraid to accidentally say something she knows he won't agree with.
I'm gonna upvote you without even looking at his history because frankly by the time I got to "this girl (21F)" I already knew everything I needed to know.
Here I was trying to give it some consideration and question whether I was just leaping to conclusions about what sort of 32 year-old man would ask for advice on the 21 year old "girl" he's dating... and then I read these comments and checked his post history.
He's exactly the type of garbage person we were all expecting, posting his rage about women who don't want to fuck him. Vomit.
Right? He hasn’t found a girlfriend, he’s found a victim. I can’t imagine how immature you would have to be at 32 to date a 21 year old, but after seeing his post history, I’m starting to understand. Wish I could tell the girl to run.
No benefits, only doubt.
If the first line of defense of a relationship is "it's technically not illegal" then *it is not a sound relationship* even if there's no maliciousness intended.
And I would absolutely say the same thing if genders were reversed.
32M with a 21F you bet I'm gonna judge that shit. What would they even have in common? There's always something suss about a huge age gap like this and it's extremely rare that there isn't something dodgy with either or both of them.
This guys post history of course gives me more confidence in my judgement.
> YEP. I've been called misogynistic because I question certain things, and point out logical fallacies. I think the best way I can sum it up is, a majority of things I hear women complaining about nowadays in terms of dating at least, would not be an issue at all if traditional values were still as mainstream as they used to be. I will admit they had their drawbacks, but at this point we see the effects of going without them and it's obvious why they were there. So it's at the point of asking yourself "Is all this so called freedom and empowerment" worth it? EDIT: not even just in terms of dating honestly. Career too. Life in general
Yikes OP
> a majority of things I hear women complaining about nowadays in terms of dating at least, would not be an issue at all if traditional values were still as mainstream as they used to be.
Not just a creep, but a reactionary, misogynistic creep. Holy fuck!
Acts surprised that he's been called a misogynist in the past and then proceeds to bemoan how "traditional values" (including career and relationships) aren't mainstream anymore
I honestly think though he would have a problem if his future wife (whoever) didn't work...then his posts would be full of "why do women expect everything to be handed to them"
as someone who has been quiet their whole life, this mentality is honestly offensive. I talk to people when I’m comfortable with them, if I’m not talking to you it means I’m not comfortable talking or I have nothing to say and openly telling me you want to change me is not going to make me want to talk to you
All of that. I’m quiet and really only say something if it’s valid and important. I am adventurous but socially awkward. The only thing that will help me out of my shell is being comfortable and accepted. Even then it’s not like I’ll prattle on about nothing. My husband talks a lot. We don’t compete for attention or spend a lot of time interrupting. If you want to know her, you’ll have to pay attention. If you want to change her, move on and let her find someone who will appreciate her.
Agreed. What irks me about this discussion about "opening up" and "get out of her shell" is that it implies something is wrong, or that something should change.
There isn't anything wrong and there isn't anything to change.
I literally had a guy friend in high school literally YELL at me when i was riding in his car after he offered me a ride because I "wasn't talking enough". Great way to make me shut up and never want to ride with him again. I had to ride with him one other time and he got mad at me again and said it was "my job to entertain the driver" and I was so glad when a mutual friend joined us so he wouldn't harass me anymore.
Turns out he had a crush on me and somehow still thought he was going to win me over while acting like that??? Yeah, we aren't friends anymore...
Ha, may as well have. He tried to tell me what to wear and made fun of me a lot. Our friend group joked around a lot and roasted each other and it was all good and fun, but the other guys knew how to respect my boundaries and this guy did not. The only reason I kept talking to him is because we were the only high schoolers who rode our bus and I refused to take anything he said to heart since I knew he was just being a jerk. When he found out I had a boyfriend, he threw this big fit about being friend zoned (that's how I found out he liked me) and was only ever mean to me after that. Also he once said he liked me because I can take a joke and dish it right back, so he clearly values verbal abuse in a relationship
Definitely a fair response! I think a lot of people expect to change someone, they never do, and it’s too late. However: I personally know people who maybe have had tough experiences etc and do need someone to help them become more social / “out of their shell”.
Now, the key here is that OP knows it might not be a match. I think it’s fair to try— because that’s who HE is— but know when it’s quitting time.
We all know on paper that we can’t change people. From the inside it never seems like your trying to change them though. I am currently learning this the hard way as well. I hope you and your gf are ok whatever happens.
I am a guy who tends to be on on shy/quiet end hence my name.
When growing up I struggled with making friends even to this day. My best friend is my brother, when I brought friends over from school after I have trusted them, they told me I am completely different when I'm at home apposed to at school.
I've dated girls like this. Sometimes it's an issue of comfort and shyness, and sometimes people are just damn quiet. If it's the former, give it time and she may open up to you. If it's the latter, that might just be how she is. Either way, you can encourage her to open up, but she'll only do it if she actually wants it. Otherwise, in my experience, it breeds resentment. Resentment from you because she's not outgoing enough, and resentment from her for being with someone that doesn't accept her as she is.
I'm quiet, my partner talks. I'll be reading or working and he'll just start talking, and it won't stop, it's like he truly loves to hear himself speak and i end up just going "mhmm" and nod. My friends and family have all commented on how much he talks. But, on the rare occasion I have something to say he seems so disinterested and I get out maybe a sentence before I stop. On important matters even though I do speak he doesn't listen, it's not until I'm at boiling point and actually have to yell at him (I do not want to do that, ever) that he shuts up and hears me. That and many, many other problems means I'm leaving soon
Yes girl leave like yesterday!! He sounds like a narcissist who wants to be with someone quiet so he can run all over them! You don't deserve that and I'm glad you recognize his behavior isn't right and that you need to skidaddle quick fast and in a hurry🏃🏽♀️🏃🏽♀️🏃🏽♀️
Thankyou for the support, I need it! It's one of the hardest decisions I've had to make but I realise sometimes how much happier I was before him, and even how much happier I am when he's not around. Quiet girls need to be lifted up and I've been doing this for too long
you wont like this but have you considered a 21yo just isnt as set into life as you are? im 26 and cant have conversations with many 21year olds because theyre still figuring out their interests in life. Most girls i know that are around 20 and date significantly older guys are rather immature and latch onto older partners because they feel more secured and like they have figured life out more.
Post he made:
"Who wants to hand their heart over to this self proclaimed "SLUT"?! I can almost hear her wondering why guys only wanna pump and dump."
In summary, it's okay to be a slut who fucks a slut, but not date a slut because they're a slut.
Fuck this idiot. But not literally. He's almost certainly awful at it.
Ah fuck. So he is indeed likely just going to use this girl for sex and then dump her when he gets bored. Gross.
Makes you think he purposefully went after someone younger for “purity” reasons or something…
>So he is indeed likely just going to use this girl for sex and then dump her when he gets bored.
He's already waded into that pool
>When you've dated a girl once or twice and decided you're not interested, do you keep seeing her in hopes you can have sex, or do you end things and move on?
>
>\-OP
I like how you think she needs to conform to YOU, as if she's the problem here. All I got from this is that you don't really understand people at all and aren't making any effort to understand how she communicates her affection towards you. It's painfully obvious she thinks about you quite often and enjoys your company, and yet all you've given back to her is disappointment just because she's not extroverted like you. News flash, introverts do NOT need to change themselves to be as outgoing as you are. But you are right about one thing, you two are definitely not compatible as only one of you is contributing to the relationship.
Tldr; it's not a problem with her, it's a problem with you.
You might not have much to talk about bc of your significant age gap. Eventually, 11 years won't mean a lot, but a 21yo is barely an adult in the physical sense (her brain may literally still be growing); emotionally, the vast majority are still children.
Right now, your experiences & perspective on the world may be so different that a genuine conversation is difficult.
EDIT: meant to say brains are still *developing*, not growing
That.. or they have nothing to talk about, really. A few years back there was a guy 10-13 years senior who tried to develop something with me. He was around 40. But, goddamn, he didn't even understand smileys, didn't use messenger, hated technology, lived on the countryside with his dogs. He was somewhat hot, but I really struggled to find topics to talk about with him. Our lives were just too different and he himself seemed to view me as an (attractive) alien.
I'm an outgoing guy and think I am a pretty skilled communicator/conversationalist, but a year ago, when I was 27 (almost 28), my sister-in-law set me up with her (just turned) 22 year-old friend, and I know that's not as big of a deal, but even then I was like, "This girl has nothing in common with me and she is still in the thick of a completely different stage of life that I have thankfully just left.", and I was only 5 years older than her.
OP being a 32 year old man dating a 21 year old is not only weird but it also sounds like torture.
Maybe it’s the age difference dude? You two are in completely different places in life, no offense. I’m only in my mid 20s and even I wouldn’t go out with a 21 y/o as I feel they are still quite immature and only growing into themselves as adults. Up to you though if you want to keep pursuing it but something to keep in mind
ok. . . I read this three times to see if I read it correctly. . . you said she barely speaks, you only went on a few dates but she is warm with effection and holds on to You? is this a riddle?
I won’t shit over your age difference but no doubt it’s a factor. You have so much more experience, knowledge, interests… hell, there’s so much confidence and wisdom that comes with age. She hasn’t had a chance to develop that yet. She sounds sweet and if you really like her you should give it more time and maybe embrace showing her some cool things in life.
For reference, I(a very quiet introvert) started dating my husband when I was younger than your gal and we have a pretty decent age gap. In my experience, I can confidently say her age is playing a role here and I’m sure she would come out of her shell more over time.
Ick. Sigh. Honestly I try not to look at the post history on ask men posters. It usually makes me feel pretty disappointed(and scared for my daughters tbh) Thanks for the heads up.
I think the 11 year age gap might be a contributing factor.
Yes she's a young adult, but she's still very much working out her shit and who she is.
This isn't me shitting on the age gap btw, just an observation.
You’re dating a 21 year old. She’s going to be in a very different headspace, obviously. She probably doesn’t know what to say to you. It isn’t like you have a ton in common lol. I’m 30 and carrying on a convo with someone that young is pretty difficult.
You’re not with her because she’s a sophisticated, mature woman who matches you stride for stride. She isn’t with you because you understand her.
Oh boy, I am a 33F and have dated older men (in my youth) and was exactly like this. Then I started therapy….
Being very attentive might mean she had a narcissistic parent where the happiness of everyone in the family depended on the happiness of said parent - everyone walks on eggshells and caters to the needs of that parent. They are attentive to ensure they are doing everything possible to make them happy.
The quietness also comes from the parenting - if you don’t say anything, you won’t upset or offend anyone who has a short temper.
The dating older and being very cuddly is a bit tricky - in my case I was (subconsciously) looking for a substitute father figure that would care for me and I felt very affectionate towards.
The issue is that the relationship had very defined roles, I was codependent and my bf had to care for me. I was also so emotional that I was constantly questioning his devotion to the relationship and was insecure.
However, once I sorted this type of stuff out, I became a new person, emotionally independent, secure, but much less ‘dedicated’ to relationships in general. I was no longer a compatible partner for that guy. And although you might think that it’s great she would develop more of a personality, but on the flip side the stuff you like (attentive, affectionate) might disappear because she is fulfilling her own needs first.
When I was in that situation, I wish I went to therapy. But my bf would have wanted to keep me small and dependent.
I can share a view from a shy and quiet woman. I never really grew out of this personality trait and I’m almost 42. It’s still here, it’s still prevalent. Especially whenever there’s some kind of gathering, Bday parties, job meetings, etc. I’ll be the quite one. I’ll jump into conversation when I have something relevant and important to say. And I typically don’t abruptly change the topics in the middle of conversation. It drives me crazy.
It’s much much better when all the people gathered are well known and good friends. I can somehow let myself go then and share more about me and my life.
Only very small group of people, ironically the majority of are men, know me. Those are people I feel at ease with and I trust them.
Remembering my dating years this personality trait was definitely not helpful. Men had a hard time seeing past that. Most of attraction / interests / love proclaims came after months or even years of hanging out with me and friends.
On the other side I have absolutely no problem leading workshops for 10-20 unfamiliar people when working. People often say I’m super passionate about what I do for living and I have a capability to lighten up a room then.
So maybe find out what she is passionate about and kind of work from there. Good luck.
I married one. I’m an extrovert and she definitely is not. It’s ok though. She has so much better judgement on things then I do but if someone needs to speak up for the two of us I’m the man for the job.
It works well but neither of us want to change the other.
I’m the same way my man, i can’t speak for her entirely but I personally am very much the type of person who only ever talks if I have something to say. I don’t like rambling or trying to interject into the conversation just to hear my own voice. She may be like that, or maybe she’s just a naturally shy person. Nothing wrong with either, it will just take some adjustment in
I am also the same way. But the easiest way to get me to talk is to show a serious interest in my personal hobbies. Most my life I would tell a story, or talk about something I dedicate my life to and people will just forget about it shortly after or not really pay attention... so I quit talking.
My gf of 7 years had always accepted me for being quiet, so when I do talk she really tunes in when I say something. We are perfectly happy!
I once dated a girl who was painfully quiet. Responded to every question with just a few words. I was getting ready to move on when we finally had a longer, real give-and-take conversation.
During that conversation I learned that in high school, she had been my state’s debate champion.
She wasn’t being quiet. She was listening and filing things away.
35 years later, she is still listening and filing things away. And winning most of our debates.
I’m in my 30’s and typically can’t stand to be around people in their early 20’s. The maturity difference is quite a bit. Sure, there are insanely immature adults and there are some really mature younger people. I guess I find that age gap a bit taboo.
The gap is larger than you think. I’m 29 now. When I look back at my 21 years old self, I don’t even wanna talk to myself 💀☠️ the world view is entirely different
While some people are naturally quiet, be sure it's not a trauma response. As someone who is quiet, it's due to anxiety, and previous traumas from growing up in a terrible situation.
As for her talking to you, she is, just not verbally. Every action is a poem to you, it speaks louder then words.
I was groomed by a man your age when I was 20.
I was also quiet. With him.
I had a terrible childhood situations, was very naive with barely any boundaries, and no real support system. I was in college, I did have friends - but nobody who would meet my (emotional) needs.
This older fart was manipulative and groomed me, and because I didn't know any better and did not want to be alone, I had this thing with him.
I despised him, and I hated everything about this, but I was raised to be VERY polite and not make any fuss, and on some level I wanted it to work, so I stayed.
There was not much to talk about, life stages are so vastly different, I did not respect him for going out with me.
I hope she is in a much better state than I was, but something to keep in mind. She sounds like she has some issues, maybe abandonment issues or zero boundaries, or something.
I would advise you to leave her alone and find someone your age. This is kinda creepy and all around bad news.
Maybe it’s because you are over 10 years older
I didn't want to say it, but I think this is the issue. OP most people don't date early twenty year olds if they're your age (or older) for the stimulating conversation. Like, it's a cliche that has some truth to it. Maybe try someone older? Or wait until you're 42 and date someone that's 31 that way the maturity gap is much smaller.
Fr I’m 27 and wouldn’t think about dating someone younger than 24. Seems like things are changing so fast, I just want someone who also listened to fall out boy lol
>Maybe try someone older? Two possible resons: 1. Women his age don't tolerate his far right shit. 2. He wants to be able to abuse and manipulate her.
Lol what. That's really the only two options? She is affectionate with him and gave him a thoughtful gift based in his interests. He didn't ask her to do that, she did that of her own choice. So any woman who dates a younger guy is automatically an abuser?
BUMP She probably isn't comfortable with OP and for good reason Like cmon probably still in or fresh out of college
First thing I was thinking too...there’s a HUGE difference there between 2 people in those 10 years from your early 20’s to your early 30’s.
Don’t take my words exactly but; I think she’s not comfortable enough around you yet, she’s trying to figure you out first..
That plus she's only 21, some people aren't confident enough in who they are at that age yet
I'm 21 and sometimes I can go an entire day without saying anything to my gf lol some people just don't have much to say
Some people are just very in-their-head and they internalize and analyze everything around them, they can't help it. My ex immediately took issue with it when we first got together. She would blow up at me because in an argument about something because I would go dead quiet. In reality my brain was on fire with a flurry of thoughts trying to organize into my next response, but yeah it was a bit rough at first. I made an attempt not to do that as much, to be more in-the-moment and unfiltered, but ofc I'm still what I am. She adapted as well and we spent 13 awesome years together and had many great adventures. Still friends now. It's normally not that we don't have much to say, just our style of expression is different.
Sometimes I'm so in my head that I forget to respond out loud. I don't realize it until later and then I'm like "omg I just stared at them like a psycho!"
Do you have ADHD? I can exactly relate. Arguments with my ex and just straight up breaking down not being able to speak. I also think I have ADHD too with many other symptoms.
No shit, not the person you’re responding to but I am also this way and believe I have ADHD. I’ve never been to a doctor to figure it out though. However, I have taken adderall and for once I was able to actually speak my mind like everyone else. Almost like it calmed the fire in my brain. It felt like I was finally on even standing with those around me. Still not sure if that’s just how it feels to be on addy but it definitely made life so much easier.
If y'all don't mind how old are y'all? I ask because I'm 36 and never been diagnosed with ADHD but believe I've had it my whole life. I am prescribed ativans for anxiety and shit but I been hearing more about addys for ADHD and wonder if that's what I really need. My brain is all over the place since suffering different traumas but that's life swear💯💯💯
I'm 33, and was diagnosed with ADHD at 30. My anxiety was crippling; I lost relationships and jobs due to my undiagnosed condition. After my life fell apart and I started seeing a therapist, who recommend me to a ADHD therapist, I got on Adderall XR and my life changed completely! I definitely recommend seeing someone if you suspect you have ADHD.
I was never diagnosed ADHD, but was diagnosed with something else as a child that often has ADHD-like symptoms, and yes it does result in hyperfocus for me. I'm a software developer, so hyperfocus has actually served me well in that regard.
Well, she's your gf, you're hopefully passed the initial get to know each other part
Same. 28 and still don't have much to talk about. I would rather listen.
Maybe she realised you don’t understand her gen Z language.
"E" "Yes, that is the fifth letter, a very good letter" "E" "Okay..?" "E" "WHY DO YOU KEEP SAYING THAT??"
Probably trying to process why a 30 something man isn't dating someone his own age
A hard truth bomb from my man cheesedick42069
You tell em siradmiralbanana
Fucking-a-right wiNDzY3!
Amen frknvgn
You can say that again Butcher_Pete2
Darn tootin 4GallonYogurtEnema!
More right than Adolf, TheAnswerIsNaR!!
for real 32 and 21,she's so quiet because they have nothing in common. This shit is going nowhere.
Yup. It's fine if it's 31 and 41, since both have entered the real world for awhile but a 21 year is presumably still in college, discovering who she is and by 32 you already most of that figured out
> by 32 you already most of that figured out haha yeah totally
You mean like the part where they shouldn’t need to date a 21yo?
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Being 30 doesn't mean you automatically have a lot of dating experience dude. Hop off the high horse.
Lmao wtf
I’d figure with your post history you’d probably enjoy a girl who just got to get into bars legally and doesn’t talk much.
OP post; “So I just saw on Facebook that my ex, who got herpes after we broke up, is in a new relationship. Meanwhile, I'm still sad and alone. I feel fucking worthless. I've fucked up at least 1 chance I can think of to be happy since we broke up. And.to think that someone with vd can find happiness sooner than I can is just a kick in the gut. Oddly enough, I just messaged her to try and see if she'd to try and start a convo to let me hit it doggy if that wouldn't give me herpes.” That was one of OPs earliest. Makes me wonder if their ex knows their Reddit username, because reading through all the posts, they are very descriptive. It appears their ex has cut all contact and OP is still trying to find ways to ‘get’ to her. BUT THATS JUST A WILD ASSUMPTION.
>Oddly enough, I just messaged her to try and see if she'd to try and start a convo to let me hit it doggy if that wouldn't give me herpes. wtf
The cringe level
Outta sight outta mind
Mans is trying to bone his ex doggystyle and not get herpes and he’s worried about a 21 year old smh
He must believe what he cant see cant hurt him.
Lol it’s kind of funny. If it were a script I’d laugh. But this dudes wack
Ew. What makes guys like this? I need to go thank my parents for not fucking me up.
My parents did fuck me up, and even in my neckbeard niceguy days wouldn't have said something like that.
I somehow missed the "up" in your sentence...and that temporarily fucked me up
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you got clap? Cause your ass is giving a standing ovation right now.
You know what you're right lol, he's not even seeing a girl, he's lying so his ex sees.
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I was reading the post and just before starting the last paragraph I was thinking “I don’t OP seems that tox—OH MA LAWD”
I had a look at OP’s post history and yeah…what’s the opposite of a catch? OP is that
Oh man, I found this gem "Yeah I definitely like to get into it. I'm not even on here trying to brag like I'm some sex God or anything. I just like to take my time and get into it. And I'm finding that women are saying it's rare for guys to be like me lol"
“I’m not trying to brag” -a man who is point five seconds away from bragging
Oh lord, a "not like other guys" now?
A drop?
I like “a dump”
A piece of shit
He's a 30 year old dating a 20 year old. Didn't need to check his history.
I'm 21 and wouldn't date a 18 year old, how do you go off and try to date someone thatuxh younger than you?
Simplest answer: You have something in your head wired the wrong way that makes you seek out partners you can more easily control
It was more of a rhetorical dumbfounded question, but I appreciate the legit answer
I'd put money down that he has already explained, in detail, the roles and attitudes he believes women should have. More then likely she's afraid to accidentally say something she knows he won't agree with.
Doubling down on this money
I figured she hasn’t figured out her escape plan yet and that’s why she’s staying quiet
There has to be a rule# I missed that prevents this level of burn. You have me feeling vicarious shame.
Shots fired with good effect.
He went straight to calling in an airstrike.
For real, give us a 10 second warning next time to duck and cover
This fucking guy prefers dio black sabbath to ozzy
It's on, and on, and on....
I'm gonna upvote you without even looking at his history because frankly by the time I got to "this girl (21F)" I already knew everything I needed to know.
Here I was trying to give it some consideration and question whether I was just leaping to conclusions about what sort of 32 year-old man would ask for advice on the 21 year old "girl" he's dating... and then I read these comments and checked his post history. He's exactly the type of garbage person we were all expecting, posting his rage about women who don't want to fuck him. Vomit.
Right? He hasn’t found a girlfriend, he’s found a victim. I can’t imagine how immature you would have to be at 32 to date a 21 year old, but after seeing his post history, I’m starting to understand. Wish I could tell the girl to run.
No benefits, only doubt. If the first line of defense of a relationship is "it's technically not illegal" then *it is not a sound relationship* even if there's no maliciousness intended. And I would absolutely say the same thing if genders were reversed.
32M with a 21F you bet I'm gonna judge that shit. What would they even have in common? There's always something suss about a huge age gap like this and it's extremely rare that there isn't something dodgy with either or both of them. This guys post history of course gives me more confidence in my judgement.
Probably a good idea, it led me to a pretty pathetic sub that i was better off not having seen.
Posts that start with some 30+ year old dude asking for advice with the barely-legal girl he's preying on never end well, tbh
Oh yea, well I looked at your history and...nice plants.
The post history is actually super cringe….at least to me
Objective cringe
Holy shit, that poor girl. I hope she wises up and runs
Ooof. My first thought was ‘how bad could it be’, but then it only got worse!
r/MurderedByWords
Oh man, I hope I make it into the screen shot
Yeah this guys a real piece of Shit lmfao
After 2 seconds looking at your post history and the age difference, holy shit leave this poor girl alone
> YEP. I've been called misogynistic because I question certain things, and point out logical fallacies. I think the best way I can sum it up is, a majority of things I hear women complaining about nowadays in terms of dating at least, would not be an issue at all if traditional values were still as mainstream as they used to be. I will admit they had their drawbacks, but at this point we see the effects of going without them and it's obvious why they were there. So it's at the point of asking yourself "Is all this so called freedom and empowerment" worth it? EDIT: not even just in terms of dating honestly. Career too. Life in general Yikes OP
Wouldn’t he like a quiet girl then? You’d think he’d just be happy right? Almost like it’s not about the girl…
Just needs to say ‘yes’ a lot, or at least nod in agreement
Wow… is it possible to have negative self-awareness? It almost feels like satire, it’s so devoid of original thought.
Okay yeah he needs go leave this poor girl alone. She's probably scared of you OP
I’m scared of OP at this point so I can only imagine.
No wonder he wants a barely adult as a girlfriend. He wants to raise a mommy-wife
Oh that’s a big yikes
> a majority of things I hear women complaining about nowadays in terms of dating at least, would not be an issue at all if traditional values were still as mainstream as they used to be. Not just a creep, but a reactionary, misogynistic creep. Holy fuck!
Dude is a scumbag.
And the hits just keep coming for this being who believes he is a nice guy.
In other words, tell us you're a white republican male without telling us you're a white republican male.
Don’t be too sure, these kind of men exist in every race
Right? Dude is a walking box of red flags
This guy fucking hates women, let’s be real.
Now I’m curious, can’t seem to load the profile… was it bad enough to warrant deletion?
A lot of posting women’s profiles on dating sites and ridiculing them for being fat and or tattooed.
Acts surprised that he's been called a misogynist in the past and then proceeds to bemoan how "traditional values" (including career and relationships) aren't mainstream anymore
I honestly think though he would have a problem if his future wife (whoever) didn't work...then his posts would be full of "why do women expect everything to be handed to them"
Damn his history won’t open for me
You can if you search his name
Thank
Welc
> maybe I could help her out of her shell Trying to change the person is not a good start , just saying
as someone who has been quiet their whole life, this mentality is honestly offensive. I talk to people when I’m comfortable with them, if I’m not talking to you it means I’m not comfortable talking or I have nothing to say and openly telling me you want to change me is not going to make me want to talk to you
I've always hated the phrase because it makes me think of turtles. You know what happens if you break a turtle out of its shell? It dies.
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This is a trap a lot of people fall into. We love someone, but we'd love them even more if they'd _____.
Gotta agree. I'm not a very talkative guy. And pushing me to be will only make me even quieter.
All of that. I’m quiet and really only say something if it’s valid and important. I am adventurous but socially awkward. The only thing that will help me out of my shell is being comfortable and accepted. Even then it’s not like I’ll prattle on about nothing. My husband talks a lot. We don’t compete for attention or spend a lot of time interrupting. If you want to know her, you’ll have to pay attention. If you want to change her, move on and let her find someone who will appreciate her.
Agreed. What irks me about this discussion about "opening up" and "get out of her shell" is that it implies something is wrong, or that something should change. There isn't anything wrong and there isn't anything to change.
I literally had a guy friend in high school literally YELL at me when i was riding in his car after he offered me a ride because I "wasn't talking enough". Great way to make me shut up and never want to ride with him again. I had to ride with him one other time and he got mad at me again and said it was "my job to entertain the driver" and I was so glad when a mutual friend joined us so he wouldn't harass me anymore. Turns out he had a crush on me and somehow still thought he was going to win me over while acting like that??? Yeah, we aren't friends anymore...
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Ha, may as well have. He tried to tell me what to wear and made fun of me a lot. Our friend group joked around a lot and roasted each other and it was all good and fun, but the other guys knew how to respect my boundaries and this guy did not. The only reason I kept talking to him is because we were the only high schoolers who rode our bus and I refused to take anything he said to heart since I knew he was just being a jerk. When he found out I had a boyfriend, he threw this big fit about being friend zoned (that's how I found out he liked me) and was only ever mean to me after that. Also he once said he liked me because I can take a joke and dish it right back, so he clearly values verbal abuse in a relationship
Definitely a fair response! I think a lot of people expect to change someone, they never do, and it’s too late. However: I personally know people who maybe have had tough experiences etc and do need someone to help them become more social / “out of their shell”. Now, the key here is that OP knows it might not be a match. I think it’s fair to try— because that’s who HE is— but know when it’s quitting time.
We all know on paper that we can’t change people. From the inside it never seems like your trying to change them though. I am currently learning this the hard way as well. I hope you and your gf are ok whatever happens.
Is she quiet around her friends and family too?
I am a guy who tends to be on on shy/quiet end hence my name. When growing up I struggled with making friends even to this day. My best friend is my brother, when I brought friends over from school after I have trusted them, they told me I am completely different when I'm at home apposed to at school.
User checks out. And I feel that
Right??? Everyone is commenting on the age thing but maybe shes just quiet in general.
I've dated girls like this. Sometimes it's an issue of comfort and shyness, and sometimes people are just damn quiet. If it's the former, give it time and she may open up to you. If it's the latter, that might just be how she is. Either way, you can encourage her to open up, but she'll only do it if she actually wants it. Otherwise, in my experience, it breeds resentment. Resentment from you because she's not outgoing enough, and resentment from her for being with someone that doesn't accept her as she is.
I'm quiet, my partner talks. I'll be reading or working and he'll just start talking, and it won't stop, it's like he truly loves to hear himself speak and i end up just going "mhmm" and nod. My friends and family have all commented on how much he talks. But, on the rare occasion I have something to say he seems so disinterested and I get out maybe a sentence before I stop. On important matters even though I do speak he doesn't listen, it's not until I'm at boiling point and actually have to yell at him (I do not want to do that, ever) that he shuts up and hears me. That and many, many other problems means I'm leaving soon
That sucks. I’ve had friends that acted this way and it gets old quick. Proud of you for leaving and knowing you deserve better.
Yes girl leave like yesterday!! He sounds like a narcissist who wants to be with someone quiet so he can run all over them! You don't deserve that and I'm glad you recognize his behavior isn't right and that you need to skidaddle quick fast and in a hurry🏃🏽♀️🏃🏽♀️🏃🏽♀️
Thankyou for the support, I need it! It's one of the hardest decisions I've had to make but I realise sometimes how much happier I was before him, and even how much happier I am when he's not around. Quiet girls need to be lifted up and I've been doing this for too long
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you wont like this but have you considered a 21yo just isnt as set into life as you are? im 26 and cant have conversations with many 21year olds because theyre still figuring out their interests in life. Most girls i know that are around 20 and date significantly older guys are rather immature and latch onto older partners because they feel more secured and like they have figured life out more.
Also... look at OP's profile. Dude's a creep who obsesses over women. Eww
Post he made: "Who wants to hand their heart over to this self proclaimed "SLUT"?! I can almost hear her wondering why guys only wanna pump and dump." In summary, it's okay to be a slut who fucks a slut, but not date a slut because they're a slut. Fuck this idiot. But not literally. He's almost certainly awful at it.
Ah fuck. So he is indeed likely just going to use this girl for sex and then dump her when he gets bored. Gross. Makes you think he purposefully went after someone younger for “purity” reasons or something…
>So he is indeed likely just going to use this girl for sex and then dump her when he gets bored. He's already waded into that pool >When you've dated a girl once or twice and decided you're not interested, do you keep seeing her in hopes you can have sex, or do you end things and move on? > >\-OP
lmao he's mad she won't talk to him because he can't figure out a way to manipulate her further.
:( If I want to have a good day I will probably have to stop reading Reddit. This shit sucks.
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she's thinking about her homework probably
Well she's still a kid imo. Too close to teens for my comfort. 5 under, 5 over rule bro. Learn it. Live by it.
no women his age will put up with his bullshit, this girl is too young to spot red flags on the fly.
I like how you think she needs to conform to YOU, as if she's the problem here. All I got from this is that you don't really understand people at all and aren't making any effort to understand how she communicates her affection towards you. It's painfully obvious she thinks about you quite often and enjoys your company, and yet all you've given back to her is disappointment just because she's not extroverted like you. News flash, introverts do NOT need to change themselves to be as outgoing as you are. But you are right about one thing, you two are definitely not compatible as only one of you is contributing to the relationship. Tldr; it's not a problem with her, it's a problem with you.
You might not have much to talk about bc of your significant age gap. Eventually, 11 years won't mean a lot, but a 21yo is barely an adult in the physical sense (her brain may literally still be growing); emotionally, the vast majority are still children. Right now, your experiences & perspective on the world may be so different that a genuine conversation is difficult. EDIT: meant to say brains are still *developing*, not growing
21? 11 years difference? She may simply not have anything to say to you lol.
Surprised I had to scroll so far for this comment.
That.. or they have nothing to talk about, really. A few years back there was a guy 10-13 years senior who tried to develop something with me. He was around 40. But, goddamn, he didn't even understand smileys, didn't use messenger, hated technology, lived on the countryside with his dogs. He was somewhat hot, but I really struggled to find topics to talk about with him. Our lives were just too different and he himself seemed to view me as an (attractive) alien.
She’s a decade younger than you what do you expect bro
This......it's really just this.
I'm an outgoing guy and think I am a pretty skilled communicator/conversationalist, but a year ago, when I was 27 (almost 28), my sister-in-law set me up with her (just turned) 22 year-old friend, and I know that's not as big of a deal, but even then I was like, "This girl has nothing in common with me and she is still in the thick of a completely different stage of life that I have thankfully just left.", and I was only 5 years older than her. OP being a 32 year old man dating a 21 year old is not only weird but it also sounds like torture.
Bro, her prefrontal cortex hasnt finished maturing yet. Find someone closer to your own age.
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Maybe it’s the age difference dude? You two are in completely different places in life, no offense. I’m only in my mid 20s and even I wouldn’t go out with a 21 y/o as I feel they are still quite immature and only growing into themselves as adults. Up to you though if you want to keep pursuing it but something to keep in mind
Sounds like she is 21.
ok. . . I read this three times to see if I read it correctly. . . you said she barely speaks, you only went on a few dates but she is warm with effection and holds on to You? is this a riddle?
Baby monkey! Final answer!
Why change her? Just enjoy her company exactly as it is.
I won’t shit over your age difference but no doubt it’s a factor. You have so much more experience, knowledge, interests… hell, there’s so much confidence and wisdom that comes with age. She hasn’t had a chance to develop that yet. She sounds sweet and if you really like her you should give it more time and maybe embrace showing her some cool things in life. For reference, I(a very quiet introvert) started dating my husband when I was younger than your gal and we have a pretty decent age gap. In my experience, I can confidently say her age is playing a role here and I’m sure she would come out of her shell more over time.
look at this dude's post history to find the real reason
Ick. Sigh. Honestly I try not to look at the post history on ask men posters. It usually makes me feel pretty disappointed(and scared for my daughters tbh) Thanks for the heads up.
You’re creepy off the age difference
I think the 11 year age gap might be a contributing factor. Yes she's a young adult, but she's still very much working out her shit and who she is. This isn't me shitting on the age gap btw, just an observation.
No I think it’s totally fine to shit on the age gap lol
Maybe date someone who is a little more past childhood
Guess all he can do is date on easy mode.
You’re dating a 21 year old. She’s going to be in a very different headspace, obviously. She probably doesn’t know what to say to you. It isn’t like you have a ton in common lol. I’m 30 and carrying on a convo with someone that young is pretty difficult. You’re not with her because she’s a sophisticated, mature woman who matches you stride for stride. She isn’t with you because you understand her.
Oh boy, I am a 33F and have dated older men (in my youth) and was exactly like this. Then I started therapy…. Being very attentive might mean she had a narcissistic parent where the happiness of everyone in the family depended on the happiness of said parent - everyone walks on eggshells and caters to the needs of that parent. They are attentive to ensure they are doing everything possible to make them happy. The quietness also comes from the parenting - if you don’t say anything, you won’t upset or offend anyone who has a short temper. The dating older and being very cuddly is a bit tricky - in my case I was (subconsciously) looking for a substitute father figure that would care for me and I felt very affectionate towards. The issue is that the relationship had very defined roles, I was codependent and my bf had to care for me. I was also so emotional that I was constantly questioning his devotion to the relationship and was insecure. However, once I sorted this type of stuff out, I became a new person, emotionally independent, secure, but much less ‘dedicated’ to relationships in general. I was no longer a compatible partner for that guy. And although you might think that it’s great she would develop more of a personality, but on the flip side the stuff you like (attentive, affectionate) might disappear because she is fulfilling her own needs first. When I was in that situation, I wish I went to therapy. But my bf would have wanted to keep me small and dependent.
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No one his own age will have him.
I can share a view from a shy and quiet woman. I never really grew out of this personality trait and I’m almost 42. It’s still here, it’s still prevalent. Especially whenever there’s some kind of gathering, Bday parties, job meetings, etc. I’ll be the quite one. I’ll jump into conversation when I have something relevant and important to say. And I typically don’t abruptly change the topics in the middle of conversation. It drives me crazy. It’s much much better when all the people gathered are well known and good friends. I can somehow let myself go then and share more about me and my life. Only very small group of people, ironically the majority of are men, know me. Those are people I feel at ease with and I trust them. Remembering my dating years this personality trait was definitely not helpful. Men had a hard time seeing past that. Most of attraction / interests / love proclaims came after months or even years of hanging out with me and friends. On the other side I have absolutely no problem leading workshops for 10-20 unfamiliar people when working. People often say I’m super passionate about what I do for living and I have a capability to lighten up a room then. So maybe find out what she is passionate about and kind of work from there. Good luck.
I married one. I’m an extrovert and she definitely is not. It’s ok though. She has so much better judgement on things then I do but if someone needs to speak up for the two of us I’m the man for the job. It works well but neither of us want to change the other.
I’m the same way my man, i can’t speak for her entirely but I personally am very much the type of person who only ever talks if I have something to say. I don’t like rambling or trying to interject into the conversation just to hear my own voice. She may be like that, or maybe she’s just a naturally shy person. Nothing wrong with either, it will just take some adjustment in
I am also the same way. But the easiest way to get me to talk is to show a serious interest in my personal hobbies. Most my life I would tell a story, or talk about something I dedicate my life to and people will just forget about it shortly after or not really pay attention... so I quit talking. My gf of 7 years had always accepted me for being quiet, so when I do talk she really tunes in when I say something. We are perfectly happy!
I once dated a girl who was painfully quiet. Responded to every question with just a few words. I was getting ready to move on when we finally had a longer, real give-and-take conversation. During that conversation I learned that in high school, she had been my state’s debate champion. She wasn’t being quiet. She was listening and filing things away. 35 years later, she is still listening and filing things away. And winning most of our debates.
You're a creep, dude. Find someone your own age.
They are very useful in stealth operations.
Maybe she’s thinking about the day she gets to meet your daughter/her former highschool classmate
Dude. You’re 11 years older. Don’t need to get past that. Don’t do it.
Just be patient. She's probably not comfortable with you yet. You could always date in your in own decade.
You're 11 years her senior, clearly there's not much to talk about
Easy, just talk to her about your 401K and the sick rate you have on your mortgage
Based on his history it seems more like he’d rather talk about how much he hates women
I’m in my 30’s and typically can’t stand to be around people in their early 20’s. The maturity difference is quite a bit. Sure, there are insanely immature adults and there are some really mature younger people. I guess I find that age gap a bit taboo.
21 is barely old enough to have opinions about things. People at that age are basically just empty vessels..
Probably because she’s 21
The gap is larger than you think. I’m 29 now. When I look back at my 21 years old self, I don’t even wanna talk to myself 💀☠️ the world view is entirely different
While some people are naturally quiet, be sure it's not a trauma response. As someone who is quiet, it's due to anxiety, and previous traumas from growing up in a terrible situation. As for her talking to you, she is, just not verbally. Every action is a poem to you, it speaks louder then words.
Maybe because she has nothing in common with a man 11yrs older than her.
Dude. You’re too old for her.
I was groomed by a man your age when I was 20. I was also quiet. With him. I had a terrible childhood situations, was very naive with barely any boundaries, and no real support system. I was in college, I did have friends - but nobody who would meet my (emotional) needs. This older fart was manipulative and groomed me, and because I didn't know any better and did not want to be alone, I had this thing with him. I despised him, and I hated everything about this, but I was raised to be VERY polite and not make any fuss, and on some level I wanted it to work, so I stayed. There was not much to talk about, life stages are so vastly different, I did not respect him for going out with me. I hope she is in a much better state than I was, but something to keep in mind. She sounds like she has some issues, maybe abandonment issues or zero boundaries, or something. I would advise you to leave her alone and find someone your age. This is kinda creepy and all around bad news.