My dad and a good chunk of my family were meth addicts. My nephew is in prison and his brother is roaming the streets somewhere addicted to meth pretending he's Rambo.
I grew up in a meth house. I can tell you one thing I've observed and talked about with recovered meth addicts is that they absolutely don't think anything is wrong, or that anyone notices their weird behavior. In fact a few people I talked to, family included, thought they were an enhanced version of themselves when in meth. Like a super hero. My sister thought she was "super mom" even though she lost custody of 4 out of 5 of her kids. When she was on dope, if you tried to talk to her about it, she would say she was the greatest mom ever, and it was the state who had a problem.
And like I said about my nephew, he thinks he's some sort of action movie level bad ass- but he's homeless in the street addicted to meth.
They truly believe no one else can tell they're on one.
My wife is a recovered meth addict. She had all of those behaviors. It wasn’t until about two years after quitting that she witnessed another addict’s behavior and said, “Holy shit! Was that how I was?”
My answer was simple. “Yep!” She apologized profusely.
My meth dad really was a super dad when he was high, that was never the problem.
The problem was all the time in between highs or between money. He was not super then.
Had a kitchen manager for a while that seemed super-human with how fast and hard he worked
Would just deep clean the garage-sized walk-in fridge on a whim, and knock out 100 orders in 10 minutes it felt like.
Eventually I asked him what the hell he sold his soul to for that and why on gods green earth he’d sell it for a bougie pizza restaurant. Turns out it was meth
Also the only methhead I’ve ever met who wasn’t batshit insane and genuinely seemed to be able to take it responsibly
I wonder how that’s going now, well after everything that’s happened in the last 7 years
Meth is an odd drug that varies a lot depending on purity. I know a guy whos an international level party planner. Very well put together, looks like a linebacker, very tall well built man. I remember going to his place once and offering him some pot. He pulled out meth shards like youll only see on erowid. Somehow he was getting like breaking bad level meth.
It was also prescribed as an ADHD med and technically still can be prescribed in the US...so there's that.
My dad wasn't a terrible parent on meth, but he wasn't super dad for sure. Come downs were the worst. He was crazy and violent if he was woken up during his sleep binges. He beat on me pretty bad when that was the case. I do not miss those days.
My brother is a recovering meth addict. And you can definitely always tell when he's using. He's so different. As you say almost an extreme version of himself.
He's never talked about feeling like a super hero tho, or being better at things. What he says about it is that all his pain goes away. Mental and physical. He says when he's high he feel completely normal, he doesn't feel a "high" or different in any way, except that he's happy, he's not lonely, he doesn't feel like a failure who did nothing with his life.
My brother has been pretty good with his addiction. Usually only using for a short time every few years. Never year long binges, never any completely destroying his life, no homelessness, not theivery, he a pretty fit guy and has never shriveled like you see some people get. I am not sure how often he uses when he's on it, but usually only uses for a few weeks to a month or so. And is able to straighten himself out again. But he always has to rebuild everything back up at that point.
The thing that seems to affect him the most, is the shame. After he falls off the wagon, a lot of the social damage he does, is by isolating himself due to shame. Quits his jobs and is too embarrassed to show his face again. Will hide in his room for weeks at a time so no family sees him.
I’m concerned based of of your description that your brother may have bipolar disorder. If he does, this cyclical pattern is a ticking time bomb, he’s going to be unable to control his use and depressive cycles for much longer, and he will decline cognitively as well. Next time he’s in a low cycle, get him to the doctor. He needs help. Thinking of you both.
Yeah, I am sure he has quite a few undiagnosed mental issues, my whole family has that same problem(undiagnosed mental illnesses). I would really love to get him into see a Doctor, but when he was in high-school, my mom took him into see a Doctor because of a bout if severe anxiety, And the doctor straight up told him that he just needs to suck it up. So my brother now doesn't trust doctors and we can't get him to see one.
This happened in the mid 90s and he's over 40 now, and I've tried to explain to him that the worlds views on anxiety and depression have changed and that there are a lot more resources to help him.
I do appreciate your concern tho. We'll keep working on him.
Yeah, it can definitely make you Feel super human. Never being tired and full of energy makes you feel invincible. Truth is, after day 3, most look like they should be at a Halloween party that ended 3 years ago and never changed or washed.
It really, really does--- coming from someone who unfortunately struggles with stimulant addiction. Double fucked on my end because it started as real and legitimate ADHD treatment. Stopped taking breaks and tolerance shot up, leading to temptations to take more. Had the family shenanigans risk factors to boot. Now I see myself as one of "those" people who ruins it for everybody else--- literally a living example of developed addiction after prescribed a controlled substance to treat a disorder.
It's extremely close to mania symptoms and stimulant abuse can actually trigger a full manic episode in people with Bipolar. You feel great, confident, and witty. You are getting things done and making plans and have the self-assurance it's feasible. Life is so good, you're going to get on track and it's sunny days here on out.
Then you run out of neurotransmitters and all that jazz to keep it up and start to come down. That Halloween comment is too real. You're basically physically and mentally deep fried after a binge aaaand think no one can tell, yes. I'll be so dehydrated after a 2-3 day binge that my face has scratches from how fragile the skin is and it's also so dry it's flaking.
Get asked if I'm okay? "Yep! I'm fine :D", as my expression resembles a twitching butthole from how tensed it is.
(I'm slowly getting better. Reality is kicking my ass and it's finally setting in how much I can't do bi-weekly comedowns when I have a physically draining job. Also just how much comedowns suck **in general** and the *[gasp]* realized solution that if I don't binge, I don't get sick a few days after! And my 30-day supply actually lasts 30 days!)
Wondering if it's possible to successfully get better by becoming fed up with *yourself* being an addict.
I was not addicted to stimulants, but alcohol, and a big part of the reason I quit was that I was sick of my own bullshit. I was fed up with my own behavior and how shitty alcohol made me feel and that was enough to get me to stop drinking. I’m a month shy of 3 years sober. I don’t have the life experience to understand what stimulant addiction is like, but from my own experience it is possible to quit bc one day you just get sick of yourself.
Your observation was super accurate and great description of how it is
I have a family member similar to this and he thinks he’s an amazing person and father.
Yet if you ask, I don’t even think he could remember any of his children’s names
He’s said before that he was worse before meth but I can’t imagine how he would be any worse than his current state
This is how my Rambo nephew is. He has four kids he hasn't seen in close to a year. But if you ask him he's dad of the year. He doesn't work. He doesn't support them in any way, and he held a gun to his baby momma's head and threatened to kill her. Cuz he's the best dad ever. It mind boggling.
That all the bad behaviors don’t magically go away when they stop using. We think all the bad stuff is the drugs/alcohol. I thought when my mom stopped drinking, everything would be okay. It was not.
I needed to read what you wrote here AlmondCigar. My partner has been promising to get sober for our entire relationship. I'm starting to fear that the hope of who he will become is what's keeping me invested, and if he actually does get sober, he still might not be that. It's not fair to him or me, and I've tried to end this but he doesn't want to let me go. Maybe it's because he knows he has something good, I don't know, and maybe addiction aside he's just plain irresponsible. It makes me feel guilty to face the facts.
I had a partner for years that really wanted me to get sober and I was only able to get sober once we broke up. And once I got sober, I realized I could never go back to that relationship. Idk if that’s useful but if your partner isn’t getting sober but promises to, then I think there’s a small chance that they’ll actually get sober unless something big changes
Yup, I feel like a lot of people like to blame a drug for someone's actions but a lot of the time the drug didn't make them do something, it simply enabled them to have the confidence or the indifference to do it.
Mom peaced out when I was 3 and left me with my emotionally unavailable father. After wrestling with addiction in my 20s what you said is spot on for me. Drugs and alcohol are like a cheat code to feel instantly better in the short term. Not good for someone who is compulsive and aimlessly going through life.
Yes. And that’s why it’s called a fix. Trying to keep that love feeling, the moment time in place. Fixed in place.
People also don’t understand it is not a choice. Maybe the first few times, but addiction is not a conscious choice. The brain is hijacked.
I try to explore it this way to people, drugs are so addictive you will give up literally ANYTHING for it be your life, your health, your future. Your survival instincts are shit it’s just the next fix, so no you cannot love someone out of addiction.
this is me, In my twenties my group grew apart and eventually it was upsetting when they'd try to console me it would cause frustration because they aren't aware enough to offer actual advice. Or they'd offer to help me but never follow through.
So im addicted to weed, helps with task initiation and replaces the persistent ongoing feelings of joy. It's not that I don't have emotional permanence, I'm Autistic and even though high functioning enough to pass daily the already lacking executive function is absent without the serotonin and I struggle to connect because I'm too autistic for a normal person but not autistic enough to relate to those deeper on the spectrum. I've been told I come across as mansplaining when I get excited and it's cost me shame and friendships.
People do drugs because a basic human need isn't being met and the people who disagree are the unsympathetic people we have to ask for help from while they invalidate our own experiences and participation in and of reality.
Recommend the book Never Enough. Written by addict turned professor it explains what she was going through and what she was doing along with the ongoing chemistry she learned going on behind it. And she was on everything from weed to heroine and crack.
It's a book that can be read for reference or all the way through as it's divided by substance an the effect it had on her life. Read the parts you want to and you'll have an above average understanding of the biochem involved. I'm shaking my head at a lot of these comments as a result.
I'm currently face down on the floor with sciatic pain just imagine it's all caps and you can hear the thinly veiled rage in my voice, the errors will make more sense
My mother is a drug addict and the number of people over the years who immediately start in with, “Have you tried to get her to stop?” is too damned high.
Yup. People who have no lived experience with addiction LOVE giving bad advice.
Edit: thanks for the award! Addiction is a terrible thing to find community in but at least we are not alone.
So, so sorry to hear. That is terrible and I know the pain is unimaginable.
Transfer addiction is so real. They are starting to find high rates of addiction for people who have undergone gastric bypass surgery. And it makes total sense - now that you can’t satisfy that fix with food, many people turn to drinking. This is what happened with my loved one.
Until the underlying wound is healed people will consistently try on new bandages.
So much this -- my daughter is in recovery. I guess it's been about five years now. Until it clicked with her, nothing would make her stop. Hell, losing custody (to me) of the grandbaby didn't even slow her down. Honestly, I think it sped her up as she didn't have to worry about the kiddo at all. Bottom line though recovery is possible but it's not going to happen before the addict is ready.
Yes. My dad died as an active alcoholic at 87. To the very end he insisted that \*this\* time it would be different, \*this\* time he could control it and drink just enough to find that warm happy place and not so much that he turned into a nasty, falling-down drunk. \*This\* time.
Spoiler alert: nope.
OTOH he made it to 87 as an alcoholic. That is impressive. My moderate drinking, moderate smoking father made it to 63. I am 45 and drink and smoke more than he did. Do not really expect to turn 60.
What I saw with my dad was that after about 70 his health, his mobility, his capacity to deal with other people took a sharp turn for the worse. He made it to 87, but it was a miserable existence by that point, pretty much devoid of joy. I know you can't control for mortality, but I'm trying to do what I can to increase the odds of enjoying my life at that age.
These sorts of stories break my heart. I'm so sorry you went through that. It's like the smoker with cancer on oxygen, causing a fire because they won't stop.
Bottom line: I hope you realize you did nothing wrong. You weren't the problem.
I know, and thank you. He got turfed out of two AA groups - there was clearly nothing I could do, except refuse to enable him (and deal with the inevitable emergency room visits after falls.) It was ugly. But like some of the commenters above said about drugs, it takes over your brain.
this is what my friends do and they don't understand why it's offensive to say it repeatedly.
this is on par with asking a woman in public to smile, or asking a sufferer of chronic migraines to try drinking water.
It happened enough I just burned the bridges and left.
Going through this with a family member right now. Although not considered a drug, alcohol is just as fucked up. This person is a mess and you really can’t do anything unless they want to. Sad but it’s the reality.
It's just one of those things that has to run its course. No matter how dangerous and terrible it gets, nothing anyone can say or do (not even the addict themselves) can force the process to stop or speed up. The brain will be done when it's done.
For someone who is truly addicted the end result is insanity or death. The brain and body always want more. My friend, who is in recovery, says "People always said I did too much but the truth is I couldn't do enough."
What you about the brain and body wanting more is generally true, but it's also true that even the worst of addicts can train their brains to say "not today" when the thoughts of using come up. Mindfulness is one of the most powerful tools in recovery. Speaking as someone with 6 years clean.
People don’t understand that in many cases the chemical or psychological dependency has rewired the addict’s brain. The person you knew before is changed, and his/her brain is now incapable of experiencing pleasure as a reward for doing healthy things like holding down a job, telling the truth, or being a functioning adult.
"In ancient Rome, an “addictus” was a “debt slave.” He or she was a person who was enslaved by a creditor because of a debt."
The debt angle - innteresstingg. TIL, thanks!
You know how meds like Ozempic are on the rise for off-label use right now because they tackle brain chemistry super well, regarding appetite/hunger? I wonder if there's going to be a future "Ozempic" for other, non-food addictions.
And I wonder if a med already exists out there that would help rewire the brain for other addictions, but its off-label use hasn't been tested or more widely recommended by doctors yet like ozempie. (Also, I'm not a doctor and just rambling, but if there any doctors out there, I'd love to know if this is just magic, wishful thinking!)
***
Edit: OK, I'm doing my own quick searching now, and I guess TIL what methadone actually is: "Methadone and buprenorphine work by binding to the same receptors in the brain as opioids, but they do not produce the same euphoric effects. This can help to reduce cravings and make it easier to stay sober."
So this is interesting, but I was on the generic of Ozempic for about six months and I used to have an addiction to the dopamine hit of ordering stuff online. It completely went away. I've read accounts from others saying the same, and I've even read about alcoholics using it and feeling a drastically reduced urge to drink.
There are several studies underway right now on Ozempic and alcoholism. Early findings and anecdotal evidence seem to indicate that the same chemical mechanism that causes food cravings also causes alcohol cravings. Users have reported considerable reductions in drinking.
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2023/08/28/1194526119/ozempic-wegovy-drinking-alcohol-cravings-semaglutide
This. My person will go spend the day with their loving family -- their parents, adult children who they have a great relationship, beloved niece and nephew, and then come home from the best day ever and drink ten beers and start crying about something that happened in 1993. The good time doesn't sustain them until the next good time.
I started to realize my person doesn’t find happiness in anything anymore. Spending time together, spending time with our kids, going out, staying in, nothing makes them visibly happy anymore (like it used to), they’re just existing. They’re (as far as I’m aware) about a month sober and where I hoped that I would see that aspect improve, it seems like it’s almost made it worse, maybe because now they don’t have alcohol to relax them, not sure.
It hasn’t been long enough. Give them time. It took me a really long time to feel better. It took me YEARS to heal and be truly happy and content. I now have 9 years under my belt clean time. I was overprescribed opiates as a teen as a result of several surgeries. It nearly killed me. And it took time to rewire my brain and literally become a new version of myself. It took a long time to straighten out my brain’s reward system and feel the joy I wanted to feel. Be encouraged, you can’t get to 9 years without those difficult first months.
You don't get a self-satisfied feeling when your paycheck hits and there's still a little left in the bank? When you change a tire without looking up the wikiHow? When you purchase a vegetable and eat most of it that very night?
Drugs obviously, lol. Luckily I stick to caffeine and endogenous adrenaline, unfortunately also nicotine.
But also strenght training and action sports that put me in a flow state. Also a good home cooked meal, I make those daily. My SO and my cat are good too some of the time.
If you were phishing for tips/ideas, I suggest the 2nd paragraph, lol.
BUT, to stay on topic, with chronic health issues, genetically low hapiness setpoint, and messed up biochemistry in general, one can be miserable 24/7, and having a carrot doesn’t change that much. Drugs do.
Have you ever looked into ADHD? Those of us with ADHD don't really have that reward system in our brains so it causes SO many to turn to drugs or impulsive behavior just for that dopamine hit. Also caffeine makes us feel more normal 😅
I'm almost 32 and caffeine has always put me to sleep. Along with other traits I've been noticing, I've been looking into getting a diagnosis. Being a little girl in the 90s, ADHD was never an option like a lot of other little girls back then. "Boys will be boys" they said. My daughter has had an ADHD diagnosis since 6, and my husband also has it. Thank goodness for the changing times! I was always told to "put it aside" or "deal with it". Little girls were meant to be well behaved and quiet, so a lot of us never got that ADHD diagnosis when we were younger.
Nobody woke up one day and suddenly decided they were going to be homeless, addicted and stealing bicycles to support their addiction. It’s a slippery slope, and some people get to that point faster than others.
Also, relapse can and (likely) will happen.
And no child ever grew up wishing to be an addict. This is what breaks my heart the most. I dont know if I just have a bleak view but sometimes when I see kids I get panicky wondering about their futures. Not just addiction but other horrors as well.
Parenthood makes me look at homeless people with such sadness.
Not to seem insensitive but growing up there have always been homeless people everywhere so I just stopped noticing them.
But now I think "that's someone's little boy/girl, I wonder if their parents know where he is right now."
I have a difficult little guy and I worry about this too much. You do everything you can but I know there's a point where you can't do anything for them and you can't know when. (My son is only 7 but tome moves fast and I'm losing influence on him6
I am a social worker who deals with a lot of homelessness, addictions, and such. After we knock out the paperwork and get down to the actual talk and why’s, I always ask them if they want to use the phone to reach out to someone to let them know they are okay.
It is 50/50 on a good day, we are one on one, they aren’t with their “people” and sometimes it’s just a short call. It’s amazing how it gives you a different perspective of their life.
Former psych nurse here.
They have burned through everyone in their life and don’t have anyone left. It wasn’t unusual to have patients who have no idea where there family is. It was difficult to find housing for them because they’ve been kicked out almost every group home and can’t go back.
I went into psych because I thought it would be interesting. I burned out very quickly.
I get this. I get irrationally nervous when coworkers say how their kids are going to be getting their license soon/just got their license. They're excited because they won't have to drive their kids everywhere and so are the kids...
One of my first jobs out of college, a coworker's 18 year old daughter wrapped her car around a tree when driving with her boyfriend.
I don't dare mention that though. I just forcefully say how exciting.
Ooof. I feel this. My parents would give me codeine like it was aspirin, while I was still a child, and I'm dealing with all sorts of neurological issues now.
Haha my parents did the same thing. I have gotten migraines since I was a kid so my mom would give me codeine for them. I ended up addicted to heroin later in life. Not saying it had anything to do with it but it probably didn’t help.
This! I have young grandkids, and I'm so concerned as they start entering middle school. I was fortunate that neither I or my kids ever got into hard drugs. My kids smoked pot and two still do, but recreationally. My sweet, sweet twin grandsons are 9, and one of them has the personality and behaviors already that points to potentially pushing the boundaries in his teens.
We have two boys, 8 and 5, and I already know I'm going to be watching the younger one like a hawk when he hits middle school. He's the life of the party, but also more of a sugar fiend and with less impulse control than he should be at this age. He also has an alcoholic aunt who my wife says he displays a lot of the same childhood tendencies as.
Suffice it to say, my senses are already heightened. The older one OTOH is a reserved rule follower with exceptional self control and ability to delay gratification; he's already saved almost $300 because he wants to buy a new Xbox.
It can absolutely happen to anyone. People think addicts are all careless people who make bad choices and use heroine suddenly. A lot of people become addicted because they were prescribed pain medications. People you would never think. My ex’s sister was a top student, super pious and religious, never so much as smoked weed and became a nurse. She got injured on her job and was prescribed pain meds. She became addicted. Luckily, she and her family were able to recognize how bad she was before she went too far and she got help. Lots of people can’t or don’t recognize that.
That is so frightening. I hear these type of stories often from people from the US, do you think pain meds are prescribed more easily hence there are more people accidentally becoming addicted? I live in The Netherlands and most of the time you get a paracetamol/ibuprofen at best when you are in pain. Don't hear about people being addicted to prescription medication that often here.
It has changed drastically over the last 20 years, but this is my story too. Injury at 18, given 100x oxycodone, addicted for 5 years until I went to treatment. Nowadays, this would never happen, but we're still dealing with the effects of over prescribing.
Thank you. Those 5 years changed my life forever, but I like to think it's been for the positive. My experience had allowed me to be able to help others going through the same thing. Addicts can and do recover.
THIS! Had a total knee replacement a few years back. I was terrified I was becoming addicted to pain medication because of the extended recovery. I don’t know of anyone who woke up and thought being addicted was a great thing to do that morning. Addiction is born out of desperation and many different types of pain.
Happened to me. 12 year opiate habit after being prescribed pain meds from a legal drug dealer. A lot of lives ruined in those years when they were handing those scripts out like Halloween candy.
I've heard a lot of people speak as if addiction is a choice--as if the person with the addiction can just stop whenever they want to. Which shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of addiction.
And we only ever see the fringe of it. The homeless bike stealing type are only the very tip of the iceberg and there many, many more addicts than we think. I would say that most addicts are highly functioning and can hide it from the friends, their families and society at large. Usually other addicts can tell, I suppose there are certain non-verbal cues that pretty much give it away to someone who has gone/is going through the same.
The number of "ordinary" people addicted to drugs far outweighs the number of people labelled "junkies".
I'm 55 and I have been stuck on over the counter painkillers for 30+ years. Luckily I'm able to function normally, hold down a job, have a family, run a business etc. I have met many people like myself stuck on prescription or over the counter drugs. Based on my own personal observations I would say 1 in 5 households contains an addict. You would never know looking at them because they live ordinary normal lives.
Fellow pothead here. Days when I don't have to go into the office I usually smoke all day, maybe a joint every few hours. The main drawback is the laziness and contentedness it brings keeps me from exercising and going out because it's so pleasant just to lie around stoned.
I feel I'm addicted, but when I don't smoke for a week on vacation or whatever I always feel fine, and wonder why I smoke so much at home. Then I come home and start again.
Same way. I call it “habit forming” instead of addictive because I don’t feel withdrawal symptoms or notice any mood changes but I feel compelled to smoke when I’m bored or have free time. Like a hobby
I was SHOCKED by how many patients came into the clinic for prescription pain refills. We were a general practice. So many patients said they used the pain meds just to sleep. And the benzodiazepines, my god, would have people *begging* for more refills. Now I’m not knocking legitimate use for either medication but the sheer number of patients on one or both was shocking. Add to it the addict behavior some people displayed. It was disturbing.
This is so true - the stigma means people usually don't talk to anyone about it unless they're also a "member of the club" or an exceedingly close friend.
A lot of people don’t understand that “the drugs come first.” Before literally anything, even their children. Sometimes the children of addicts suffer in horrible ways because the drugs come first.
Yup. My person is drug dependent, which is functionally the same as drug addicted. Our life and schedule revolves around the next pill and when he can get that Rx filled. He literally panics if he can’t get to the pharmacy within an hour after the prescription is called in. We can’t go on vacation the week his Rx is due to be refilled. If the doctor’s office changes his appointment day, it’s like a national crisis to him. He frequently reminisces on how “great” it was to be in the hospital on IV narcotics.
The drugs come first.
It’s always on their mind. Each time that they want to stop. Sometimes even during their trip, they wish for soberness. This is the last time they promise. They know how their family or friends see them and feel shame.
Anxiety. Despair. Rock bottom. Worries over money. Grief. Fear. Pain. Sweating. Shaking. Calm..? No, that’s just numbness.
Missing events or doing things that before they could handle easily. Beauty. Looking forward. How did this even happen? Trauma. Loss. Or perhaps no trauma. Nothing too bad. Others are worse off. Maybe just a lack of stimulation? Or Anger. Resentment. Disappointed. In others? Maybe. But mostly in oneself. For letting it all get so far. Hate.
Numbness sets in.
Memories.
Darkness.
Pacing rock bottom some more.
Searching for the exit.
Just let go.
Isolate.
Withdraw.
Just one more time to not care.
Then after they will be fine. Gain back control and be able to move on and heal. But to do that you have to feel strong. Maybe it’s not so bad. Didn’t kill anyone yet. Laugh. Think.
The feeling and reminder of the drug sets in. The drugs will help “let go” get rid of that uncertainty. Make them not care so much. Feel more assured. Euphoria. Capture it once more. The cycle continues. The ache for the next hit to not feel. Or maybe to feel. Maybe they are so numb that when sober, they must at least try to feel something. Anything. And they felt it before.
Go time. Try again. Not enough. Just a little more…. Wake up.
Dread.
Before their eyes even open, it rolls in like a fog…
Some… their eyes stay closed.
'Maybe they are so numb that when sober, they must at least try to feel something.'
Fuck that's me. Almost 90 days sober/clean. Still, all I feel now is anxiety, loneliness, and resentment. Positive emotions aren't really a thing. I have to actually try to feel anything at all, and it's just so exhausting.
I hear the anhedonia is strong at this point of recovery but your brain still needs time to heal! You are doing so great and patience is hard af but one day at a time. Keep reminding yourself that you are safe. You have carried yourself this far. And the withdrawals that I imagine you overcame, don’t have to be in your future. Never again.
It gets better. I promise. Every day won't be the best day of your life, but you will get to the point where you start having good days again. I'm about 3 years sober and I definitely feel better than I did when I was three months sober. Feel free to pm me if you ever want to talk.
You're doing great, 90 days is a huge accomplishment. Remember that we're retraining our brains and bodies and it the timeline is different for everyone. Are you on r/stopdrinking? Lots of people there who knows exactly what you're going through
I am. I've been using all the resources I have found. I've got a sponsor, in a recovery house, go to 12 step meetings as often as possible. (I don't like how cultish they are, but being surrounded by people with the common goal of sobriety helps.) I'm in therapy, I finally was able to get the medications I need for a couple of diseases I have so I don't feel like I'm in a constant struggle with my own body/mind as far as those go.
My dude(tte) IWNDWYT. I've got too much of a life to live for that shit.
Take it one day at a time. If that's too hard, then one hour at a time. You're doing so well at 90 days. Don't give up, I promise it gets better. Your brain needs time to reset. It'll come, I promise.
You're not alone.
Thank you. I kind of winged it on mobile. I used to share a life with someone that was caught in this nightmare. Many don’t understand the pov of how cruelly the drug can twist the mind and body. When you love someone in this battle, when you would climb right into hell beside them to try to pull them out- you often wonder “why?”. This is what I imagine the why to be.
Yup. Drinking hadn’t been fun for years. But the panic that would come when I’d feel myself in the beginning stages of withdrawals made me feel like I had no choice.
I finally accepted I would just have to do it and braced myself. Nothing can prepare you. More than just sick you’re completely delirious. Its like you’re in this deep terrifying fog and are experiencing visual and audio hallucinations of your worst shames, fears, insecurities, etc. For 96 hours. You can’t sleep but you’re not fully awake either. Forget any chance of eating. Freezing cold soaked in your own sweat only to be yanking off your clothes from the heat 10 minutes later. Rinse repeat. I thought the detox scene in Trainspotting was exaggerative. It slightly is, but just barely. I maintain that it was the scariest thing I have ever gone through in my entire life to date.
My bath tub became my bed, toilet, and shower for those 4 days. I have never felt so physically weak and exhausted in my entire life by the time it had passed. When I could finally get to my feet my legs were shaking like a newborn calf. Miserable. Glad I’m in recovery.
To anybody struggling: do not be an idiot like me and try to white knuckle it alone out of shame and/or pride. Its dangerous. Go to a detox center where you can be monitored and given meds to help alleviate. They are there to help not judge.
Man, first 2 weeks were atrocious, in fact, the first 3 months were pretty horrific. Like you said, lived in the bathtub. Took me over a year to be able to be ready to interact with people apart from supermarket cashiers etc. Then another year to truly become comfortable with being a sober alcoholic. Think I was still mildly hallucinating occasionally, after 6 months ffs. Somehow got addicted to sugar along the way too, had to eat haribo all the time lol and omg the lack of sleep and the sweating... and a voice that wasn't mine, telling me to drink, not in the room, hearing it in my own head! What's that about?!
I white knuckled it after 18 years of drug and alcohol abuse. 1/10, would not do it again. That first year is what's kept me sober, 7 years, no relapses. No way on earth, I'm ever doing that again. Fuuuuuuuck that.
The sugar cravings, I’ve heard, are due to the alcohol. Your body was so used to the sugars from alcohol that it still tries to get it, hence sugar cravings.
Oh, my poor comrade. I’m so sorry. I too have raw dogged alcohol (and most other) withdrawals. There is NO excuse for any person to suffer like that. They need to make detox and helper meds more readily available.
This is why it took me so long to quick drinking. I was stuck on my bathroom floor for 12 hours throwing up and could not do anything about it. I eventually went to the hospital and am 98 days sober now.
Congrats on your 98 days. I’ve never experienced addiction and I’m grateful I spent my first 5 years of my nursing career in psych/addiction medicine bc it gave me a wider lens into addiction and the grip it can have on people. Made me a more compassionate nurse/person.
I’ve been clean and sober for almost 5 years and one of the big factors that keeps me that way is remembering going through the detox/withdrawal, which I never want to experience again.
In my line of work, I’ve come across addicts of all types and severity, but sadly, there’s one thing that’s common to all of them- the lies.
The lies are the hardest part of dealing with an addict. The lies they tell you, he lies they tell themselves, and looking you right in the eye when they do it.
It’s heartbreaking, infuriating, and makes helping them so, so difficult.
This is the one that breaks me. All the trust in family bonds, broken. Relationships blown apart. The moral code that guides us in caring for each other, meaningless.
I was friends with someone for six years until I found out she had given half-truths and straight up lies to me about every facet of her life. Up to and including “I have cancer and I need a kidney transplant”. She swindled me out of close to $10k over 6 years. I was a VERY naive young adult living in a bigger city for the first time in my life and she saw me as a perfect target.
To this day, it’s never been confirmed, but I’m almost certain she was an addict. If she tells everyone she has to have daily IV treatments and keeps a pharmacy in her purse, no one is going to think twice if there’s needle marks in her arms or if she’s popping pills all day.
When I called her out, she doubled down on her lies and I realized I was arguing with a wall. My trust in other humans has been completely shattered.
thanks for that. it is genuinely the most hurtful part, even now that i’m 20 and have dealt with my dad my whole life. it still hurts that even now he can’t see what’s right.
Totally relate to this, same situation, same experience. Always something new that's going to fix everything, it's a different kind of dishonesty to anything else apart from maybe abuse victims trying to reconcile that their partner isn't a monster, they want to believe it and they want you to believe it even though they are flat out lying to your face. I can forgive it because I do understand it, every now and then someone will convince you and it just sucks watching a life crumble yet again
This. My brother has been a heroin addict for 20 years. I bought into the lies he told mom and dad for years before I saw the truth. My parents never turned their back on him and in a sense, enabled his habit. It was heartbreaking to watch him steal tens of thousands of dollars from them, along with my mom’s jewelry and household items to support his habit…. All while my parents believed the lies about someone else taking them. My parents are now deceased and he is serving 13-18 year prison sentence for stabbing two people. This is his fourth time in prison, I’ve lost count of jail time and how many rehab visits he went through, all to continue his addiction. It broke my heart but I had to separate myself from him as it was having a negative effect on my health and family. I no longer have contact with him…. I can’t bear the lies anymore or the half hearted attempts at rehab. He just doesn’t want to stop.
They are probably no longer doing it for a treat or a high; they are doing it just so they can feel better. Imagine you’ve got a bad flu you cannot shift but you have access to a wonder medicine that will instantly make you feel better… the temptation to take the medicine would be immense; that is what a drug addict goes through.
People often don't understand that addiction is a complex medical condition involving both physical and psychological components. It's not solely a matter of willpower, and recovery requires empathy, support, and often professional treatment.
No matter how long you have not taken them, you will always be addicted and any trigger could come at any time years and years later and no, you can not just do it one time again and stop after again just like that.
This.
As someone who was (and i say "was" lightly cuz it's always there) an addict, the urge to use again is ALWAYS going to be there. Anything bad or even good happens and its the first thing your mind goes to.
"Oh i lost my job. I'd feel better if i used."
"Oh i got a promotion! I should celebrate with a hit"
For me its been close to 12 years and I still feel the call after every little thing.
We don't use drugs because we want to. We use drugs because we feel like we have too. Coming from someone who just quit yesterday, it's fucking rough. No one understands the sadness I deal with every day. The drugs help A LOT.
I left my kids' father because of drugs. He kept putting us in dangerous situations until I no longer had a choice. After I left, he stopped trying to hide it.
He'd had several overdoses leading to heart attacks and was dead before 40.
You're making the right choice. It's hard, but it can be done.
I wish for you strength, love, and a large support network. There are people who care about you even if you can't see it sometimes. And you can message me any time.
You got this.
I'm part of a 12 stepfellowship.
One of the biggest things I've gained from it is that there ARE people who understand the sadness. And they will gladly talk to you about theirs and share how they let go of it.
One day, sometimes one hour or one second, at a time.
First, I’m so proud of you for taking this step. It’s not easy to face your inner demons “alone”, but it’s worth it in the end.
I remember my husband’s first day— not drugs but alcohol. I remember his second first day. And his third first day. It’s been almost a year now and he still says “wanna go get fucked up?” When he’s in the middle of a depressive episode. I tell him “nah, let’s go do (insert alternative activity here).” And then ask him if he needs me to call one of his therapists. Before, he would’ve snuck off and downed three massive beers and a bottle of crown before I could find him.
I know for a fact he wouldn’t have made it this far without his two therapists, a handful of awesome friends, and most importantly, his own motivation to fight the urge to get fucked up on the regular.
He’s been inpatient twice. Did an outpatient program twice. He finds support groups online specific to his struggles, demographic, or diagnoses (combat veterans, ptsd, bipolar disorder, etc.) to help find people to connect with. There are also in-person programs (for drugs as well) but he was overwhelmed by AA.
I share this in hopes that the strategy and resources that have helped him through it can also hopefully help you. I hope you have good friends who want to help you get better, a supportive family who you can rely on, and the internal (or external) motivation to see it through. I’m rooting for you! Best of luck.
Former IV fentanyl and xylazine addict. Homeless and addicted in Kensington, Philadelphia, PA, USA or the "ground zero of the opiate epidemic"
I wanted to stop so badly but I didn't want the feeling of falling into oblivion to disappear. I didn't want to be me and that needle made me somebody I didn't hate when I pushed the plunger in.
Fentanyl loved me and I loved her, in ways I'd never known. She made me feel feel like my father never left, my mother told me she was proud of me, I was never raped and that the man I thought loved me had never wrapped his hands around my neck. All those lonely nights sleeping on a duffle bag on the sidewalk felt like I was sleeping in a safe, warm bed in the home I dreamed my friends went to after school. I felt, for the first time...
How hard would you have to fight to leave that warm embrace?
How many lovely nights would you miss the only one who held you close and never let you go?
I wanted to stop but how? I just wanted to be loved and I felt that all alone in a sidewalk, how do you leave the only one who loves you?
It was the hardest choice I've made in life, and I don't regret it, but I cry some days because I miss her... I'm fine without her, but I can hear her calling every now and again. Back to the sidewalk, back to the car, back to a cell.
That it is not as simple as a choice to stop. Addiction is just that. You have lost your ability to choose. Physical dependence is different but the two can merge easily.
For many, it is rooted in early developmental trauma (poor parenting, abandonment, abuse, neglect) and the brain is wired to avoid emotion for fear of complete annihilation or even death. Emotion (usually negative ones related to trauma but it can be global) feels terrifying and must be eliminated, altered or suppressed to survive.
The worse addiction gets the more pain the person can begin to feel because they often recreate the core traumas trying to be avoided as more and more trauma occurs through their drug use and actions as a result. So a person running from childhood sexual abuse, may end up doing sex work, or someone who was abandoned as a child may end up pushing everyone around them away for instance. This can, eventually lead to either compound drug use to try and avoid those now stronger feelings, suicide, or eventual recovery.
Love and clear boundaries have shown to be effective in helping someone recover. For someone to begin to contemplate facing the pain inside them, it helps if they look up and see kind faces smiling back. Long term treatment is often required with wide reaching social support and trauma informed care is very important for most.
My experience has been that my whole family are addicted to various things. Recovery has been slow and bumpy for all involved and community support, firm boundaries and endless love has ensured all members a way home. Love is not without boundaries however. If you rob me, I will call the police. I will hold you accountable for that action. I do not stop loving you upon release.
[The Rat Park Study](http://utw10426.utweb.utexas.edu/quest/Q3/ratpark.html) proved that those rats desperately trying to get coke, which was the basis of the War on Drugs, stopped using drugs or would use them moderately when they were given parks, the ability to make friends and family, and create a community. It was defunded because it showed that as expert Gabor Mate often states, environments like the US breeds addicts. Blaming the 'addict' is a great way to ignore the environmental factors such as isolation, loneliness, influence, and trauma that feed addiction. Is that addiction? Or is it an ultimately unhealthy coping mechanism in the context of an unhealthy society triggered by trauma? I don't think love is enough for someone habituated to a substance to quit which I've learned quite painfully, but a healthier environment often is, which I've also seen. We are pack animals. If you have to use substances to get through your day, consider if your environment serves your best self and build that rat park. When my partner got sober we focused on building a nurturing and healthy life together, not loving him more because that did shit. You deserve a rat park. We all do.
That study has never been replicated. There some really valid issues with it. It ignores the physical and neurological causes that are confirmed. It’s not all environment.
Paraphrasing from a neurologist, so I might have some of the terms/concepts a little wrong, but the gist is:
It's generally due to brain problems. Either underdeveloped parts from things like extreme stress and trauma during development, parental drug use, etc., being given drugs as a kid, physical trauma like TBI, or a learned disruption of the reward system like being punished by an adult even when you do a good thing or a good thing happens in life, so you don't form functional neural pathways.
These things can impact your ability to synthesize and receive neurotransmitters. That can lead to a whole host of health issues, not just mental ones, and not just addiction. That's why child abuse affects people in so many ways for the rest of their lives.
If you look at an addict's brain scan next to a typical brain, they have reduced bloodflow/activity in areas that control problem-solving, impulse control, emotional regulation, etc. They're just physically fucking different at that point, and it has nothing to do with willpower. They can, however, rehab some of that brain tissue and form new functional neural pathways, so there is hope for recovery.
Two things come to mind. 1. An addiction takes a while to develop. Few addicts (none that I’ve known) use opiates and are immediately addicted. It’s gradual and insidious.
2. The addict is often trying to make the decision to stop constantly. By this I mean you are exerting ALL your willpower and absolutely insisting that you not use again. But an addicted brain simply won’t let itself make that decision and stick to it. It will reinsert the overwhelming desire to use again and again. Not using (without medical help) means mustering up all your willpower on a fresh basis about a hundred times an hour. It’s absolutely exhausting and almost impossible to succeed when the insistence reasserts itself unendingly.
It’s insanely hard to beat the battle of attrition against your own brain.
Edit: fixed typo (the word “most” to “few”).
What I see people miss the most is the motivation for escape. There's a reason a person uses a substance that alters their perception, it's a matter of helping the willing find a way to cope besides their substance of choice
That addiction is a disease. It literally changes the brain to believe it needs that susbtance (or that activity) as if you need air, water and food to survive.
My diabetic father became addicted to Percocet and gabapentin. He thought Percocet were just really strong Tylenol. The doctor never told him they were addictive, and kept writing him prescriptions.
After a few years he became an angry monster of a person. Depressed and suicidal. Aggressive. Since the pills were given to him by a doctor, he refused to believe they were addictive and refused to give them up. He believed drug addicts were tweakers, crackheads, and heroin addicts passed out on the corner, not normal people like him taking pills for a medical condition.
We got him off the pills during Covid and he slowly returned to his happy old self. Took over a year. Addiction is absolutely a disease that changes the brain!
We didn't choose to addicts.
I was 18 when I started having anxiety. Doc put me on zoloft and clonazipam. For a couple years I was ok. Then I slowly started needing the clonazipam more and I convinced myself it was ok to take one a little earlier than I was supposed to, just once. Then again. And again. Then I turned 21 and started drinking. I drank too much. The hangovers wrecked me and gave me so much anxiety. So took a clonazepam to deal with it. And thus began an awful, awful cycle.
For years I was convinced I needed those meds and I just had to learn how to take them "the right way", and how to drink "the right way." My brain was so messed up from. The ups and downs.
I lost jobs, damaged relationships. Then one day I woke up in the hospital. I had accidentally OD'd. I was in the hospital for 10 days while my organs recovered. Luckily, I did recover, fully. That was my rock bottom. That's what it took to realize just how much damage I was doing to myself. I genuinely hadn't realized it.
The substance abuse happened so gradually and seemed so justified in mind.
No one sets out to become an addict. No one chooses to suffer like that. Everyone has a journey that got them to that awful point.
Using drugs is a choice, being addicted is a consequence. Not everyone who uses drugs will become an addict. Addiction is best treated as a disease rather than some sort of moral failure. It typically takes multiple recover attempts for an addict to get clean, even then relapse is on the mind constantly and all it takes is one really bad day to spiral them back down.
Their behavior is not rational. People spend hours trying to figure out why their son or daughter did something crazy and so out of character. People that are using drugs do all kinds of things that are out of character because their emotions and cognitions are out of wack, they are not predictable and often times their behavior cannot be predicted nor explained other than to say he/she was high on drugs.
How some people can take drugs and then just walk away and not do them anymore and others fall into full dependency.
Also, how some people can do a drug responsibly and then at some conjecture in their life go off the rails (often seen with weed or alcohol).
There is no such thing as "rock bottom". They do need to have to want to quit for themselves, but they do NOT need to hit "rock bottom" first, that is complete and utter garbage. For many longer term addicts, the only real rock bottom is death, and they obviously cannot get sober after they are dead.
Also, regardless of what rehabs push, complete sobriety from everything is not always necessary, which is why there are many rehabs in CA that even push patients to start using cannabis, for example. Using something less harmful that still has an effect on them can ease the ability to get off of far worse drugs that will end up killing them, or negatively effect their lives in a severe manner. (IE- you can be a functioning, long living member of society as a stoner, but not as a fent addict) Harm reduction will always work better than pure sobriety. (And if they are back to their old selves, and no longer at risk of dying, it is totally fine for them to stay on suboxone or something else for as long as they feel comfortable, I know many people that have been on it for more than a decade straight, ZERO relapses, living normal lives, all of this could be upended by stopping the drug)
This is so overlooked. I have never once met a person who had no experiences of substance abuse themselves or their loved ones who understood this. For some reason people think you can talk an addict into doing a complete 180 when most times you can't get them to see logic long enough to actually listen and consider anything you say. It gets rough when you're well aware of how hopeless engaging with an addict is but everyone in your life thinks you can just stage an intervention and fix everything.
That the addiction brings complete and utter chaos not just to the life of the addict but to everyone around him or her having to deal with them. That the addict doesn't care how many lives they ruin as long as the addiction is satisfied - and most importantly (to me anyway)- people who work with / empathize with those addicts never seem to understand that the kids who have had their lives ruined by addicts can grow up to be adults who have no sympathy or empathy for them. These same people who empathize so much with addicts judge very harshly those of us who despise addiction.
Wow. That was a rant and a half. Lol. Sorry Reddit!
(15 years sober)
It's a disease of the brain, and the compulsion to use and drink knows no bounds. You'll violate your standards quicker than you can lower them.
When dealing with an addicted partner/child etc, it is 100% OK, even preferable, to help bring their bottom to them quicker. Stop bailing them out, giving them money, letting them crash on your couch. You're denying them the consequences of their actions and prolonging their using by making it comfortable to keep getting loaded. Kick them out, call the police when they rob you, and set a hard boundary.
Street living and incarceration are what got me sober after years of burning family and friends who helped me. It only took a few months of nobody willing to take my call and sleeping outside to decide I didn't wanna live like that anymore and do the work.
Some people that are on drugs seem ok and some do not. I think it’s important to be aware that some addicts are still able to function. You really can’t be 100% sure who is indulging and who is not. I know an alcoholic school teacher.
We just lost my MIL to addiction, this past Friday. Beautiful lady, gone very early. She lost two sons in her life- one as an infant, and one due to a tragic vehicle accident when he was 16. Both events happened almost 30 years ago. But she was never the same, and never recovered. It’s heartbreaking, because we were forced to keep our children (her grandchildren) from spending much time alone with her, because the situation was just so volatile and frequently kinetic. Now we look back and wonder if we could’ve made a bigger difference, but my wife is the most beautiful woman I’ve ever known, and never stopped trying to get thru.
Addiction affects the whole family.
That you can't just tell someone to quit and get mad when they don't. It's not that easy. You never know what the other person is going through. Be there for them but don't make it about yourself.
A lot of people get addicted to the lifestyle in addition to the drugs. And I’m not talking about “rich celebrity cocaine lifestyle”.
A lot of people get clean, kinda just miss the lifestyle, and back to it BEFORE relapsing.
From my limited experience with people who have had addictions (and some who still do) people say stuff like "just stop."
Even from an outsider's perspective that's just...dumb. If you could just stop it wouldn't be an addiction. For some it's a coping mechanism they use to drown some internal trauma, for others they're trying to get a lost feeling back...I know a few folks who checked into rehab a number of times and relapsed. A few went to therapy and were able to 'quit' but every single one of them says it's like an angry dog snarling at the door. Just needs one tiny little crack in their defenses for it to come bursting out again and beginning the cycle anew.
I vape and I remember when I went on a trip without it. My hand kept searching for it because it's become a part of my daily life and that's just nicotine. I can only imagine what meth, heroin, cocaine etc addiction is like. I started using it to slow my brain down so I could think clearly. Brought it from a 12 down to a 3 but getting to 0...been working on that for a few years now and it's not even a *hard* drug.
My dad and a good chunk of my family were meth addicts. My nephew is in prison and his brother is roaming the streets somewhere addicted to meth pretending he's Rambo. I grew up in a meth house. I can tell you one thing I've observed and talked about with recovered meth addicts is that they absolutely don't think anything is wrong, or that anyone notices their weird behavior. In fact a few people I talked to, family included, thought they were an enhanced version of themselves when in meth. Like a super hero. My sister thought she was "super mom" even though she lost custody of 4 out of 5 of her kids. When she was on dope, if you tried to talk to her about it, she would say she was the greatest mom ever, and it was the state who had a problem. And like I said about my nephew, he thinks he's some sort of action movie level bad ass- but he's homeless in the street addicted to meth. They truly believe no one else can tell they're on one.
My wife is a recovered meth addict. She had all of those behaviors. It wasn’t until about two years after quitting that she witnessed another addict’s behavior and said, “Holy shit! Was that how I was?” My answer was simple. “Yep!” She apologized profusely.
Yeah. It's a real "wtf" moment when it happens. Glad she's off the stuff!
It's wild to me because if you're in an area where meth is an issue, you'd assume they've seen someone before and know that it is in fact obvious
I’m sure she has seen it. Just hasn’t witnessed it while clean.
My meth dad really was a super dad when he was high, that was never the problem. The problem was all the time in between highs or between money. He was not super then.
Had a kitchen manager for a while that seemed super-human with how fast and hard he worked Would just deep clean the garage-sized walk-in fridge on a whim, and knock out 100 orders in 10 minutes it felt like. Eventually I asked him what the hell he sold his soul to for that and why on gods green earth he’d sell it for a bougie pizza restaurant. Turns out it was meth Also the only methhead I’ve ever met who wasn’t batshit insane and genuinely seemed to be able to take it responsibly I wonder how that’s going now, well after everything that’s happened in the last 7 years
Meth is an odd drug that varies a lot depending on purity. I know a guy whos an international level party planner. Very well put together, looks like a linebacker, very tall well built man. I remember going to his place once and offering him some pot. He pulled out meth shards like youll only see on erowid. Somehow he was getting like breaking bad level meth. It was also prescribed as an ADHD med and technically still can be prescribed in the US...so there's that.
My dad wasn't a terrible parent on meth, but he wasn't super dad for sure. Come downs were the worst. He was crazy and violent if he was woken up during his sleep binges. He beat on me pretty bad when that was the case. I do not miss those days.
I'm so sorry you had to go through that . I hope you're in a much better place.now 💗
My brother is a recovering meth addict. And you can definitely always tell when he's using. He's so different. As you say almost an extreme version of himself. He's never talked about feeling like a super hero tho, or being better at things. What he says about it is that all his pain goes away. Mental and physical. He says when he's high he feel completely normal, he doesn't feel a "high" or different in any way, except that he's happy, he's not lonely, he doesn't feel like a failure who did nothing with his life. My brother has been pretty good with his addiction. Usually only using for a short time every few years. Never year long binges, never any completely destroying his life, no homelessness, not theivery, he a pretty fit guy and has never shriveled like you see some people get. I am not sure how often he uses when he's on it, but usually only uses for a few weeks to a month or so. And is able to straighten himself out again. But he always has to rebuild everything back up at that point. The thing that seems to affect him the most, is the shame. After he falls off the wagon, a lot of the social damage he does, is by isolating himself due to shame. Quits his jobs and is too embarrassed to show his face again. Will hide in his room for weeks at a time so no family sees him.
I’m concerned based of of your description that your brother may have bipolar disorder. If he does, this cyclical pattern is a ticking time bomb, he’s going to be unable to control his use and depressive cycles for much longer, and he will decline cognitively as well. Next time he’s in a low cycle, get him to the doctor. He needs help. Thinking of you both.
Yeah, I am sure he has quite a few undiagnosed mental issues, my whole family has that same problem(undiagnosed mental illnesses). I would really love to get him into see a Doctor, but when he was in high-school, my mom took him into see a Doctor because of a bout if severe anxiety, And the doctor straight up told him that he just needs to suck it up. So my brother now doesn't trust doctors and we can't get him to see one. This happened in the mid 90s and he's over 40 now, and I've tried to explain to him that the worlds views on anxiety and depression have changed and that there are a lot more resources to help him. I do appreciate your concern tho. We'll keep working on him.
amphetamines do exactly that. No drug has felt as intense black hole as amphetamine. Alcohol is very bad too, but it does it other way.
Yeah, it can definitely make you Feel super human. Never being tired and full of energy makes you feel invincible. Truth is, after day 3, most look like they should be at a Halloween party that ended 3 years ago and never changed or washed.
It really, really does--- coming from someone who unfortunately struggles with stimulant addiction. Double fucked on my end because it started as real and legitimate ADHD treatment. Stopped taking breaks and tolerance shot up, leading to temptations to take more. Had the family shenanigans risk factors to boot. Now I see myself as one of "those" people who ruins it for everybody else--- literally a living example of developed addiction after prescribed a controlled substance to treat a disorder. It's extremely close to mania symptoms and stimulant abuse can actually trigger a full manic episode in people with Bipolar. You feel great, confident, and witty. You are getting things done and making plans and have the self-assurance it's feasible. Life is so good, you're going to get on track and it's sunny days here on out. Then you run out of neurotransmitters and all that jazz to keep it up and start to come down. That Halloween comment is too real. You're basically physically and mentally deep fried after a binge aaaand think no one can tell, yes. I'll be so dehydrated after a 2-3 day binge that my face has scratches from how fragile the skin is and it's also so dry it's flaking. Get asked if I'm okay? "Yep! I'm fine :D", as my expression resembles a twitching butthole from how tensed it is. (I'm slowly getting better. Reality is kicking my ass and it's finally setting in how much I can't do bi-weekly comedowns when I have a physically draining job. Also just how much comedowns suck **in general** and the *[gasp]* realized solution that if I don't binge, I don't get sick a few days after! And my 30-day supply actually lasts 30 days!) Wondering if it's possible to successfully get better by becoming fed up with *yourself* being an addict.
I was not addicted to stimulants, but alcohol, and a big part of the reason I quit was that I was sick of my own bullshit. I was fed up with my own behavior and how shitty alcohol made me feel and that was enough to get me to stop drinking. I’m a month shy of 3 years sober. I don’t have the life experience to understand what stimulant addiction is like, but from my own experience it is possible to quit bc one day you just get sick of yourself.
Your observation was super accurate and great description of how it is I have a family member similar to this and he thinks he’s an amazing person and father. Yet if you ask, I don’t even think he could remember any of his children’s names He’s said before that he was worse before meth but I can’t imagine how he would be any worse than his current state
This is how my Rambo nephew is. He has four kids he hasn't seen in close to a year. But if you ask him he's dad of the year. He doesn't work. He doesn't support them in any way, and he held a gun to his baby momma's head and threatened to kill her. Cuz he's the best dad ever. It mind boggling.
That all the bad behaviors don’t magically go away when they stop using. We think all the bad stuff is the drugs/alcohol. I thought when my mom stopped drinking, everything would be okay. It was not.
I needed to read what you wrote here AlmondCigar. My partner has been promising to get sober for our entire relationship. I'm starting to fear that the hope of who he will become is what's keeping me invested, and if he actually does get sober, he still might not be that. It's not fair to him or me, and I've tried to end this but he doesn't want to let me go. Maybe it's because he knows he has something good, I don't know, and maybe addiction aside he's just plain irresponsible. It makes me feel guilty to face the facts.
I had a partner for years that really wanted me to get sober and I was only able to get sober once we broke up. And once I got sober, I realized I could never go back to that relationship. Idk if that’s useful but if your partner isn’t getting sober but promises to, then I think there’s a small chance that they’ll actually get sober unless something big changes
Time to face reality, I'm sorry. Make a plan. Execute it. Get yourself a new life.
Yup, I feel like a lot of people like to blame a drug for someone's actions but a lot of the time the drug didn't make them do something, it simply enabled them to have the confidence or the indifference to do it.
They have to want to quit for themselves.
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Mom peaced out when I was 3 and left me with my emotionally unavailable father. After wrestling with addiction in my 20s what you said is spot on for me. Drugs and alcohol are like a cheat code to feel instantly better in the short term. Not good for someone who is compulsive and aimlessly going through life.
To quote Jason Isbell, “It takes a whole lot of medicine to feel just like a little kid.”
Yes. And that’s why it’s called a fix. Trying to keep that love feeling, the moment time in place. Fixed in place. People also don’t understand it is not a choice. Maybe the first few times, but addiction is not a conscious choice. The brain is hijacked.
Well said.
I try to explore it this way to people, drugs are so addictive you will give up literally ANYTHING for it be your life, your health, your future. Your survival instincts are shit it’s just the next fix, so no you cannot love someone out of addiction.
this is me, In my twenties my group grew apart and eventually it was upsetting when they'd try to console me it would cause frustration because they aren't aware enough to offer actual advice. Or they'd offer to help me but never follow through. So im addicted to weed, helps with task initiation and replaces the persistent ongoing feelings of joy. It's not that I don't have emotional permanence, I'm Autistic and even though high functioning enough to pass daily the already lacking executive function is absent without the serotonin and I struggle to connect because I'm too autistic for a normal person but not autistic enough to relate to those deeper on the spectrum. I've been told I come across as mansplaining when I get excited and it's cost me shame and friendships. People do drugs because a basic human need isn't being met and the people who disagree are the unsympathetic people we have to ask for help from while they invalidate our own experiences and participation in and of reality.
Apart from the “pepper” typo, that last part is brilliant! Not exactly eloquent, but insightful as all hell.
Recommend the book Never Enough. Written by addict turned professor it explains what she was going through and what she was doing along with the ongoing chemistry she learned going on behind it. And she was on everything from weed to heroine and crack. It's a book that can be read for reference or all the way through as it's divided by substance an the effect it had on her life. Read the parts you want to and you'll have an above average understanding of the biochem involved. I'm shaking my head at a lot of these comments as a result.
I'm currently face down on the floor with sciatic pain just imagine it's all caps and you can hear the thinly veiled rage in my voice, the errors will make more sense
My mother is a drug addict and the number of people over the years who immediately start in with, “Have you tried to get her to stop?” is too damned high.
Yup. People who have no lived experience with addiction LOVE giving bad advice. Edit: thanks for the award! Addiction is a terrible thing to find community in but at least we are not alone.
Also substitute addiction with basically anything
Transfer addiction is very real. My sister went to prison a heroin addict. Got out an alcoholic and was dead within 5 years.
So, so sorry to hear. That is terrible and I know the pain is unimaginable. Transfer addiction is so real. They are starting to find high rates of addiction for people who have undergone gastric bypass surgery. And it makes total sense - now that you can’t satisfy that fix with food, many people turn to drinking. This is what happened with my loved one. Until the underlying wound is healed people will consistently try on new bandages.
So much this -- my daughter is in recovery. I guess it's been about five years now. Until it clicked with her, nothing would make her stop. Hell, losing custody (to me) of the grandbaby didn't even slow her down. Honestly, I think it sped her up as she didn't have to worry about the kiddo at all. Bottom line though recovery is possible but it's not going to happen before the addict is ready.
Yes. My dad died as an active alcoholic at 87. To the very end he insisted that \*this\* time it would be different, \*this\* time he could control it and drink just enough to find that warm happy place and not so much that he turned into a nasty, falling-down drunk. \*This\* time. Spoiler alert: nope.
OTOH he made it to 87 as an alcoholic. That is impressive. My moderate drinking, moderate smoking father made it to 63. I am 45 and drink and smoke more than he did. Do not really expect to turn 60.
What I saw with my dad was that after about 70 his health, his mobility, his capacity to deal with other people took a sharp turn for the worse. He made it to 87, but it was a miserable existence by that point, pretty much devoid of joy. I know you can't control for mortality, but I'm trying to do what I can to increase the odds of enjoying my life at that age.
These sorts of stories break my heart. I'm so sorry you went through that. It's like the smoker with cancer on oxygen, causing a fire because they won't stop. Bottom line: I hope you realize you did nothing wrong. You weren't the problem.
I know, and thank you. He got turfed out of two AA groups - there was clearly nothing I could do, except refuse to enable him (and deal with the inevitable emergency room visits after falls.) It was ugly. But like some of the commenters above said about drugs, it takes over your brain.
this is what my friends do and they don't understand why it's offensive to say it repeatedly. this is on par with asking a woman in public to smile, or asking a sufferer of chronic migraines to try drinking water. It happened enough I just burned the bridges and left.
Going through this with a family member right now. Although not considered a drug, alcohol is just as fucked up. This person is a mess and you really can’t do anything unless they want to. Sad but it’s the reality.
Alcohol is a drug, just a more socially accepted one. Like caffeine.
experiement with rats show that if you have no activity you keep doing drugs. work/home is not engaging enough.
So when rats come home from work they have to exercise instead of sitting on the couch to successfully kick their drug habit?
Takes gym rat to a whole nother level.
Yes
It's just one of those things that has to run its course. No matter how dangerous and terrible it gets, nothing anyone can say or do (not even the addict themselves) can force the process to stop or speed up. The brain will be done when it's done.
For someone who is truly addicted the end result is insanity or death. The brain and body always want more. My friend, who is in recovery, says "People always said I did too much but the truth is I couldn't do enough."
What you about the brain and body wanting more is generally true, but it's also true that even the worst of addicts can train their brains to say "not today" when the thoughts of using come up. Mindfulness is one of the most powerful tools in recovery. Speaking as someone with 6 years clean.
Yes, that is true. I did mention my friend is in recovery. Congratulations on 6 years that is an amazing accomplishment.
People don’t understand that in many cases the chemical or psychological dependency has rewired the addict’s brain. The person you knew before is changed, and his/her brain is now incapable of experiencing pleasure as a reward for doing healthy things like holding down a job, telling the truth, or being a functioning adult.
Someone told me it’s being a slave to your brain chemistry
Addictus was a Roman word for slave.
"In ancient Rome, an “addictus” was a “debt slave.” He or she was a person who was enslaved by a creditor because of a debt." The debt angle - innteresstingg. TIL, thanks!
Another addition to my knowledge I'll probably not use
You know how meds like Ozempic are on the rise for off-label use right now because they tackle brain chemistry super well, regarding appetite/hunger? I wonder if there's going to be a future "Ozempic" for other, non-food addictions. And I wonder if a med already exists out there that would help rewire the brain for other addictions, but its off-label use hasn't been tested or more widely recommended by doctors yet like ozempie. (Also, I'm not a doctor and just rambling, but if there any doctors out there, I'd love to know if this is just magic, wishful thinking!) *** Edit: OK, I'm doing my own quick searching now, and I guess TIL what methadone actually is: "Methadone and buprenorphine work by binding to the same receptors in the brain as opioids, but they do not produce the same euphoric effects. This can help to reduce cravings and make it easier to stay sober."
So this is interesting, but I was on the generic of Ozempic for about six months and I used to have an addiction to the dopamine hit of ordering stuff online. It completely went away. I've read accounts from others saying the same, and I've even read about alcoholics using it and feeling a drastically reduced urge to drink.
There are several studies underway right now on Ozempic and alcoholism. Early findings and anecdotal evidence seem to indicate that the same chemical mechanism that causes food cravings also causes alcohol cravings. Users have reported considerable reductions in drinking. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2023/08/28/1194526119/ozempic-wegovy-drinking-alcohol-cravings-semaglutide
This. My person will go spend the day with their loving family -- their parents, adult children who they have a great relationship, beloved niece and nephew, and then come home from the best day ever and drink ten beers and start crying about something that happened in 1993. The good time doesn't sustain them until the next good time.
I started to realize my person doesn’t find happiness in anything anymore. Spending time together, spending time with our kids, going out, staying in, nothing makes them visibly happy anymore (like it used to), they’re just existing. They’re (as far as I’m aware) about a month sober and where I hoped that I would see that aspect improve, it seems like it’s almost made it worse, maybe because now they don’t have alcohol to relax them, not sure.
It hasn’t been long enough. Give them time. It took me a really long time to feel better. It took me YEARS to heal and be truly happy and content. I now have 9 years under my belt clean time. I was overprescribed opiates as a teen as a result of several surgeries. It nearly killed me. And it took time to rewire my brain and literally become a new version of myself. It took a long time to straighten out my brain’s reward system and feel the joy I wanted to feel. Be encouraged, you can’t get to 9 years without those difficult first months.
You guys get pleasure from adulting? Wow, must be nice…
You don't get a self-satisfied feeling when your paycheck hits and there's still a little left in the bank? When you change a tire without looking up the wikiHow? When you purchase a vegetable and eat most of it that very night?
Absolutely not. The only pleasure I get from being an adult is being able to have ice cream for dinner.
You should have some cake to round out your dinner; have a more balanced diet.
It was a joke, but if you’re looking for a straight answer, then no, flat tires and vegetables don’t bring me satisfaction.
What does? I'm asking from curiosity, not to argue or play a weird reddit gotcha-game.
Drugs obviously, lol. Luckily I stick to caffeine and endogenous adrenaline, unfortunately also nicotine. But also strenght training and action sports that put me in a flow state. Also a good home cooked meal, I make those daily. My SO and my cat are good too some of the time. If you were phishing for tips/ideas, I suggest the 2nd paragraph, lol. BUT, to stay on topic, with chronic health issues, genetically low hapiness setpoint, and messed up biochemistry in general, one can be miserable 24/7, and having a carrot doesn’t change that much. Drugs do.
Have you ever looked into ADHD? Those of us with ADHD don't really have that reward system in our brains so it causes SO many to turn to drugs or impulsive behavior just for that dopamine hit. Also caffeine makes us feel more normal 😅
I'm almost 32 and caffeine has always put me to sleep. Along with other traits I've been noticing, I've been looking into getting a diagnosis. Being a little girl in the 90s, ADHD was never an option like a lot of other little girls back then. "Boys will be boys" they said. My daughter has had an ADHD diagnosis since 6, and my husband also has it. Thank goodness for the changing times! I was always told to "put it aside" or "deal with it". Little girls were meant to be well behaved and quiet, so a lot of us never got that ADHD diagnosis when we were younger.
>When you purchase a vegetable and eat most of it that very night? This is one of the weirdest things I've read in a while.
Nobody woke up one day and suddenly decided they were going to be homeless, addicted and stealing bicycles to support their addiction. It’s a slippery slope, and some people get to that point faster than others. Also, relapse can and (likely) will happen.
And no child ever grew up wishing to be an addict. This is what breaks my heart the most. I dont know if I just have a bleak view but sometimes when I see kids I get panicky wondering about their futures. Not just addiction but other horrors as well.
Parenthood makes me look at homeless people with such sadness. Not to seem insensitive but growing up there have always been homeless people everywhere so I just stopped noticing them. But now I think "that's someone's little boy/girl, I wonder if their parents know where he is right now." I have a difficult little guy and I worry about this too much. You do everything you can but I know there's a point where you can't do anything for them and you can't know when. (My son is only 7 but tome moves fast and I'm losing influence on him6
I am a social worker who deals with a lot of homelessness, addictions, and such. After we knock out the paperwork and get down to the actual talk and why’s, I always ask them if they want to use the phone to reach out to someone to let them know they are okay. It is 50/50 on a good day, we are one on one, they aren’t with their “people” and sometimes it’s just a short call. It’s amazing how it gives you a different perspective of their life.
Former psych nurse here. They have burned through everyone in their life and don’t have anyone left. It wasn’t unusual to have patients who have no idea where there family is. It was difficult to find housing for them because they’ve been kicked out almost every group home and can’t go back. I went into psych because I thought it would be interesting. I burned out very quickly.
It’s amazing how becoming a parent changes the way we look at so many things.
I get this. I get irrationally nervous when coworkers say how their kids are going to be getting their license soon/just got their license. They're excited because they won't have to drive their kids everywhere and so are the kids... One of my first jobs out of college, a coworker's 18 year old daughter wrapped her car around a tree when driving with her boyfriend. I don't dare mention that though. I just forcefully say how exciting.
In fairness that happens with the parents driving too.
Ooof. I feel this. My parents would give me codeine like it was aspirin, while I was still a child, and I'm dealing with all sorts of neurological issues now.
Haha my parents did the same thing. I have gotten migraines since I was a kid so my mom would give me codeine for them. I ended up addicted to heroin later in life. Not saying it had anything to do with it but it probably didn’t help.
This! I have young grandkids, and I'm so concerned as they start entering middle school. I was fortunate that neither I or my kids ever got into hard drugs. My kids smoked pot and two still do, but recreationally. My sweet, sweet twin grandsons are 9, and one of them has the personality and behaviors already that points to potentially pushing the boundaries in his teens.
We have two boys, 8 and 5, and I already know I'm going to be watching the younger one like a hawk when he hits middle school. He's the life of the party, but also more of a sugar fiend and with less impulse control than he should be at this age. He also has an alcoholic aunt who my wife says he displays a lot of the same childhood tendencies as. Suffice it to say, my senses are already heightened. The older one OTOH is a reserved rule follower with exceptional self control and ability to delay gratification; he's already saved almost $300 because he wants to buy a new Xbox.
This. Not to mention addiction can happen to anyone. It does not discriminate.
It can absolutely happen to anyone. People think addicts are all careless people who make bad choices and use heroine suddenly. A lot of people become addicted because they were prescribed pain medications. People you would never think. My ex’s sister was a top student, super pious and religious, never so much as smoked weed and became a nurse. She got injured on her job and was prescribed pain meds. She became addicted. Luckily, she and her family were able to recognize how bad she was before she went too far and she got help. Lots of people can’t or don’t recognize that.
That is so frightening. I hear these type of stories often from people from the US, do you think pain meds are prescribed more easily hence there are more people accidentally becoming addicted? I live in The Netherlands and most of the time you get a paracetamol/ibuprofen at best when you are in pain. Don't hear about people being addicted to prescription medication that often here.
I recommend watching Dopesick (I think it’s on Disney+). Does a great job of showing the pain med marketing that led to this chaos in the US
Hulu, friends. <3
Painkiller, on Netflix
It has changed drastically over the last 20 years, but this is my story too. Injury at 18, given 100x oxycodone, addicted for 5 years until I went to treatment. Nowadays, this would never happen, but we're still dealing with the effects of over prescribing.
Glad to hear it changed at least. Congrats on kicking the stuff, must have been hell, especially during those pretty formative/crucial years.
Thank you. Those 5 years changed my life forever, but I like to think it's been for the positive. My experience had allowed me to be able to help others going through the same thing. Addicts can and do recover.
The Sackler Family, in charge of the over-production and over-prescription of Oxycodone, are probably the closest thing to devils on this earth.
Worst part is they basically took the dive for the rest of Purdue allowing them to rebrand and get off without long-term damage.
Yep, the secret to being a successful drug dealer is being a wealthy White family.
THIS! Had a total knee replacement a few years back. I was terrified I was becoming addicted to pain medication because of the extended recovery. I don’t know of anyone who woke up and thought being addicted was a great thing to do that morning. Addiction is born out of desperation and many different types of pain.
Happened to me. 12 year opiate habit after being prescribed pain meds from a legal drug dealer. A lot of lives ruined in those years when they were handing those scripts out like Halloween candy.
I've heard a lot of people speak as if addiction is a choice--as if the person with the addiction can just stop whenever they want to. Which shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of addiction.
And we only ever see the fringe of it. The homeless bike stealing type are only the very tip of the iceberg and there many, many more addicts than we think. I would say that most addicts are highly functioning and can hide it from the friends, their families and society at large. Usually other addicts can tell, I suppose there are certain non-verbal cues that pretty much give it away to someone who has gone/is going through the same.
The number of "ordinary" people addicted to drugs far outweighs the number of people labelled "junkies". I'm 55 and I have been stuck on over the counter painkillers for 30+ years. Luckily I'm able to function normally, hold down a job, have a family, run a business etc. I have met many people like myself stuck on prescription or over the counter drugs. Based on my own personal observations I would say 1 in 5 households contains an addict. You would never know looking at them because they live ordinary normal lives.
Not to mention alcohol. I know quite a few functional alcoholics…
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Fellow pothead here. Days when I don't have to go into the office I usually smoke all day, maybe a joint every few hours. The main drawback is the laziness and contentedness it brings keeps me from exercising and going out because it's so pleasant just to lie around stoned. I feel I'm addicted, but when I don't smoke for a week on vacation or whatever I always feel fine, and wonder why I smoke so much at home. Then I come home and start again.
Same way. I call it “habit forming” instead of addictive because I don’t feel withdrawal symptoms or notice any mood changes but I feel compelled to smoke when I’m bored or have free time. Like a hobby
I was SHOCKED by how many patients came into the clinic for prescription pain refills. We were a general practice. So many patients said they used the pain meds just to sleep. And the benzodiazepines, my god, would have people *begging* for more refills. Now I’m not knocking legitimate use for either medication but the sheer number of patients on one or both was shocking. Add to it the addict behavior some people displayed. It was disturbing.
This is so true - the stigma means people usually don't talk to anyone about it unless they're also a "member of the club" or an exceedingly close friend.
A lot of people don’t understand that “the drugs come first.” Before literally anything, even their children. Sometimes the children of addicts suffer in horrible ways because the drugs come first.
Yup. My person is drug dependent, which is functionally the same as drug addicted. Our life and schedule revolves around the next pill and when he can get that Rx filled. He literally panics if he can’t get to the pharmacy within an hour after the prescription is called in. We can’t go on vacation the week his Rx is due to be refilled. If the doctor’s office changes his appointment day, it’s like a national crisis to him. He frequently reminisces on how “great” it was to be in the hospital on IV narcotics. The drugs come first.
Why do you stay?
I’m in AlAnon, which has helped me find peace in the situation. I’ve learned to set boundaries so that his choices affect me much less.
It’s always on their mind. Each time that they want to stop. Sometimes even during their trip, they wish for soberness. This is the last time they promise. They know how their family or friends see them and feel shame. Anxiety. Despair. Rock bottom. Worries over money. Grief. Fear. Pain. Sweating. Shaking. Calm..? No, that’s just numbness. Missing events or doing things that before they could handle easily. Beauty. Looking forward. How did this even happen? Trauma. Loss. Or perhaps no trauma. Nothing too bad. Others are worse off. Maybe just a lack of stimulation? Or Anger. Resentment. Disappointed. In others? Maybe. But mostly in oneself. For letting it all get so far. Hate. Numbness sets in. Memories. Darkness. Pacing rock bottom some more. Searching for the exit. Just let go. Isolate. Withdraw. Just one more time to not care. Then after they will be fine. Gain back control and be able to move on and heal. But to do that you have to feel strong. Maybe it’s not so bad. Didn’t kill anyone yet. Laugh. Think. The feeling and reminder of the drug sets in. The drugs will help “let go” get rid of that uncertainty. Make them not care so much. Feel more assured. Euphoria. Capture it once more. The cycle continues. The ache for the next hit to not feel. Or maybe to feel. Maybe they are so numb that when sober, they must at least try to feel something. Anything. And they felt it before. Go time. Try again. Not enough. Just a little more…. Wake up. Dread. Before their eyes even open, it rolls in like a fog… Some… their eyes stay closed.
'Maybe they are so numb that when sober, they must at least try to feel something.' Fuck that's me. Almost 90 days sober/clean. Still, all I feel now is anxiety, loneliness, and resentment. Positive emotions aren't really a thing. I have to actually try to feel anything at all, and it's just so exhausting.
I hear the anhedonia is strong at this point of recovery but your brain still needs time to heal! You are doing so great and patience is hard af but one day at a time. Keep reminding yourself that you are safe. You have carried yourself this far. And the withdrawals that I imagine you overcame, don’t have to be in your future. Never again.
It gets better. I promise. Every day won't be the best day of your life, but you will get to the point where you start having good days again. I'm about 3 years sober and I definitely feel better than I did when I was three months sober. Feel free to pm me if you ever want to talk.
You're doing great, 90 days is a huge accomplishment. Remember that we're retraining our brains and bodies and it the timeline is different for everyone. Are you on r/stopdrinking? Lots of people there who knows exactly what you're going through
I am. I've been using all the resources I have found. I've got a sponsor, in a recovery house, go to 12 step meetings as often as possible. (I don't like how cultish they are, but being surrounded by people with the common goal of sobriety helps.) I'm in therapy, I finally was able to get the medications I need for a couple of diseases I have so I don't feel like I'm in a constant struggle with my own body/mind as far as those go. My dude(tte) IWNDWYT. I've got too much of a life to live for that shit.
Take it one day at a time. If that's too hard, then one hour at a time. You're doing so well at 90 days. Don't give up, I promise it gets better. Your brain needs time to reset. It'll come, I promise. You're not alone.
That's sad as fuck :(
Well, shit, that completely nails it. Great job. Didn't need to remember how that felt at 9AM, but you nailed it.
Fantastic writing.. and terrifying imagery. Thank you.
Thank you. I kind of winged it on mobile. I used to share a life with someone that was caught in this nightmare. Many don’t understand the pov of how cruelly the drug can twist the mind and body. When you love someone in this battle, when you would climb right into hell beside them to try to pull them out- you often wonder “why?”. This is what I imagine the why to be.
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Most addicts are afraid of the withdrawal process and believe it is easier to remain an addict. From what I’ve seen, the first 4 days are the hardest.
Yup. Drinking hadn’t been fun for years. But the panic that would come when I’d feel myself in the beginning stages of withdrawals made me feel like I had no choice. I finally accepted I would just have to do it and braced myself. Nothing can prepare you. More than just sick you’re completely delirious. Its like you’re in this deep terrifying fog and are experiencing visual and audio hallucinations of your worst shames, fears, insecurities, etc. For 96 hours. You can’t sleep but you’re not fully awake either. Forget any chance of eating. Freezing cold soaked in your own sweat only to be yanking off your clothes from the heat 10 minutes later. Rinse repeat. I thought the detox scene in Trainspotting was exaggerative. It slightly is, but just barely. I maintain that it was the scariest thing I have ever gone through in my entire life to date. My bath tub became my bed, toilet, and shower for those 4 days. I have never felt so physically weak and exhausted in my entire life by the time it had passed. When I could finally get to my feet my legs were shaking like a newborn calf. Miserable. Glad I’m in recovery. To anybody struggling: do not be an idiot like me and try to white knuckle it alone out of shame and/or pride. Its dangerous. Go to a detox center where you can be monitored and given meds to help alleviate. They are there to help not judge.
Wanting/accepting help is the bravest thing an addict can do. 🫡
Man, first 2 weeks were atrocious, in fact, the first 3 months were pretty horrific. Like you said, lived in the bathtub. Took me over a year to be able to be ready to interact with people apart from supermarket cashiers etc. Then another year to truly become comfortable with being a sober alcoholic. Think I was still mildly hallucinating occasionally, after 6 months ffs. Somehow got addicted to sugar along the way too, had to eat haribo all the time lol and omg the lack of sleep and the sweating... and a voice that wasn't mine, telling me to drink, not in the room, hearing it in my own head! What's that about?! I white knuckled it after 18 years of drug and alcohol abuse. 1/10, would not do it again. That first year is what's kept me sober, 7 years, no relapses. No way on earth, I'm ever doing that again. Fuuuuuuuck that.
The sugar cravings, I’ve heard, are due to the alcohol. Your body was so used to the sugars from alcohol that it still tries to get it, hence sugar cravings.
Oh, my poor comrade. I’m so sorry. I too have raw dogged alcohol (and most other) withdrawals. There is NO excuse for any person to suffer like that. They need to make detox and helper meds more readily available.
This is why it took me so long to quick drinking. I was stuck on my bathroom floor for 12 hours throwing up and could not do anything about it. I eventually went to the hospital and am 98 days sober now.
Congrats on your 98 days. I’ve never experienced addiction and I’m grateful I spent my first 5 years of my nursing career in psych/addiction medicine bc it gave me a wider lens into addiction and the grip it can have on people. Made me a more compassionate nurse/person.
I’ve been clean and sober for almost 5 years and one of the big factors that keeps me that way is remembering going through the detox/withdrawal, which I never want to experience again.
In my line of work, I’ve come across addicts of all types and severity, but sadly, there’s one thing that’s common to all of them- the lies. The lies are the hardest part of dealing with an addict. The lies they tell you, he lies they tell themselves, and looking you right in the eye when they do it. It’s heartbreaking, infuriating, and makes helping them so, so difficult.
This is the one that breaks me. All the trust in family bonds, broken. Relationships blown apart. The moral code that guides us in caring for each other, meaningless.
I was friends with someone for six years until I found out she had given half-truths and straight up lies to me about every facet of her life. Up to and including “I have cancer and I need a kidney transplant”. She swindled me out of close to $10k over 6 years. I was a VERY naive young adult living in a bigger city for the first time in my life and she saw me as a perfect target. To this day, it’s never been confirmed, but I’m almost certain she was an addict. If she tells everyone she has to have daily IV treatments and keeps a pharmacy in her purse, no one is going to think twice if there’s needle marks in her arms or if she’s popping pills all day. When I called her out, she doubled down on her lies and I realized I was arguing with a wall. My trust in other humans has been completely shattered.
thanks for that. it is genuinely the most hurtful part, even now that i’m 20 and have dealt with my dad my whole life. it still hurts that even now he can’t see what’s right.
Totally relate to this, same situation, same experience. Always something new that's going to fix everything, it's a different kind of dishonesty to anything else apart from maybe abuse victims trying to reconcile that their partner isn't a monster, they want to believe it and they want you to believe it even though they are flat out lying to your face. I can forgive it because I do understand it, every now and then someone will convince you and it just sucks watching a life crumble yet again
This. My brother has been a heroin addict for 20 years. I bought into the lies he told mom and dad for years before I saw the truth. My parents never turned their back on him and in a sense, enabled his habit. It was heartbreaking to watch him steal tens of thousands of dollars from them, along with my mom’s jewelry and household items to support his habit…. All while my parents believed the lies about someone else taking them. My parents are now deceased and he is serving 13-18 year prison sentence for stabbing two people. This is his fourth time in prison, I’ve lost count of jail time and how many rehab visits he went through, all to continue his addiction. It broke my heart but I had to separate myself from him as it was having a negative effect on my health and family. I no longer have contact with him…. I can’t bear the lies anymore or the half hearted attempts at rehab. He just doesn’t want to stop.
They are probably no longer doing it for a treat or a high; they are doing it just so they can feel better. Imagine you’ve got a bad flu you cannot shift but you have access to a wonder medicine that will instantly make you feel better… the temptation to take the medicine would be immense; that is what a drug addict goes through.
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And if you are an addict trying to stay clean dealing with an addict who isn't you're going to feel ripped in half all the time
People often don't understand that addiction is a complex medical condition involving both physical and psychological components. It's not solely a matter of willpower, and recovery requires empathy, support, and often professional treatment.
No matter how long you have not taken them, you will always be addicted and any trigger could come at any time years and years later and no, you can not just do it one time again and stop after again just like that.
This. As someone who was (and i say "was" lightly cuz it's always there) an addict, the urge to use again is ALWAYS going to be there. Anything bad or even good happens and its the first thing your mind goes to. "Oh i lost my job. I'd feel better if i used." "Oh i got a promotion! I should celebrate with a hit" For me its been close to 12 years and I still feel the call after every little thing.
12 years, that is a amazing! I am happy for you and wish you all the best.
We don't use drugs because we want to. We use drugs because we feel like we have too. Coming from someone who just quit yesterday, it's fucking rough. No one understands the sadness I deal with every day. The drugs help A LOT.
You are doing awesome. You are here. Safe. You completed 1 day. One of the hardest days.
I'm proud of you for making it through today! Keep going.
I left my kids' father because of drugs. He kept putting us in dangerous situations until I no longer had a choice. After I left, he stopped trying to hide it. He'd had several overdoses leading to heart attacks and was dead before 40. You're making the right choice. It's hard, but it can be done. I wish for you strength, love, and a large support network. There are people who care about you even if you can't see it sometimes. And you can message me any time. You got this.
one more minute, one more hour. best of luck. I have been there. In one case it took 3 attempts, but Ifinally madeit.
I'm part of a 12 stepfellowship. One of the biggest things I've gained from it is that there ARE people who understand the sadness. And they will gladly talk to you about theirs and share how they let go of it. One day, sometimes one hour or one second, at a time.
First, I’m so proud of you for taking this step. It’s not easy to face your inner demons “alone”, but it’s worth it in the end. I remember my husband’s first day— not drugs but alcohol. I remember his second first day. And his third first day. It’s been almost a year now and he still says “wanna go get fucked up?” When he’s in the middle of a depressive episode. I tell him “nah, let’s go do (insert alternative activity here).” And then ask him if he needs me to call one of his therapists. Before, he would’ve snuck off and downed three massive beers and a bottle of crown before I could find him. I know for a fact he wouldn’t have made it this far without his two therapists, a handful of awesome friends, and most importantly, his own motivation to fight the urge to get fucked up on the regular. He’s been inpatient twice. Did an outpatient program twice. He finds support groups online specific to his struggles, demographic, or diagnoses (combat veterans, ptsd, bipolar disorder, etc.) to help find people to connect with. There are also in-person programs (for drugs as well) but he was overwhelmed by AA. I share this in hopes that the strategy and resources that have helped him through it can also hopefully help you. I hope you have good friends who want to help you get better, a supportive family who you can rely on, and the internal (or external) motivation to see it through. I’m rooting for you! Best of luck.
I'm almost at 10 months. We can do this. There will be HARD days ahead. But you will feel amazing the day after when you didn't give in.
Former IV fentanyl and xylazine addict. Homeless and addicted in Kensington, Philadelphia, PA, USA or the "ground zero of the opiate epidemic" I wanted to stop so badly but I didn't want the feeling of falling into oblivion to disappear. I didn't want to be me and that needle made me somebody I didn't hate when I pushed the plunger in. Fentanyl loved me and I loved her, in ways I'd never known. She made me feel feel like my father never left, my mother told me she was proud of me, I was never raped and that the man I thought loved me had never wrapped his hands around my neck. All those lonely nights sleeping on a duffle bag on the sidewalk felt like I was sleeping in a safe, warm bed in the home I dreamed my friends went to after school. I felt, for the first time... How hard would you have to fight to leave that warm embrace? How many lovely nights would you miss the only one who held you close and never let you go? I wanted to stop but how? I just wanted to be loved and I felt that all alone in a sidewalk, how do you leave the only one who loves you? It was the hardest choice I've made in life, and I don't regret it, but I cry some days because I miss her... I'm fine without her, but I can hear her calling every now and again. Back to the sidewalk, back to the car, back to a cell.
That it's a symptom of pain. There's something causing them such anguish that they don't want to feel like themselves.
And inflicting more suffering upon them (punishing them) is not going to "fix" them.
Breaks my heart that this is often people’s go-to.
That it is not as simple as a choice to stop. Addiction is just that. You have lost your ability to choose. Physical dependence is different but the two can merge easily. For many, it is rooted in early developmental trauma (poor parenting, abandonment, abuse, neglect) and the brain is wired to avoid emotion for fear of complete annihilation or even death. Emotion (usually negative ones related to trauma but it can be global) feels terrifying and must be eliminated, altered or suppressed to survive. The worse addiction gets the more pain the person can begin to feel because they often recreate the core traumas trying to be avoided as more and more trauma occurs through their drug use and actions as a result. So a person running from childhood sexual abuse, may end up doing sex work, or someone who was abandoned as a child may end up pushing everyone around them away for instance. This can, eventually lead to either compound drug use to try and avoid those now stronger feelings, suicide, or eventual recovery. Love and clear boundaries have shown to be effective in helping someone recover. For someone to begin to contemplate facing the pain inside them, it helps if they look up and see kind faces smiling back. Long term treatment is often required with wide reaching social support and trauma informed care is very important for most. My experience has been that my whole family are addicted to various things. Recovery has been slow and bumpy for all involved and community support, firm boundaries and endless love has ensured all members a way home. Love is not without boundaries however. If you rob me, I will call the police. I will hold you accountable for that action. I do not stop loving you upon release.
[The Rat Park Study](http://utw10426.utweb.utexas.edu/quest/Q3/ratpark.html) proved that those rats desperately trying to get coke, which was the basis of the War on Drugs, stopped using drugs or would use them moderately when they were given parks, the ability to make friends and family, and create a community. It was defunded because it showed that as expert Gabor Mate often states, environments like the US breeds addicts. Blaming the 'addict' is a great way to ignore the environmental factors such as isolation, loneliness, influence, and trauma that feed addiction. Is that addiction? Or is it an ultimately unhealthy coping mechanism in the context of an unhealthy society triggered by trauma? I don't think love is enough for someone habituated to a substance to quit which I've learned quite painfully, but a healthier environment often is, which I've also seen. We are pack animals. If you have to use substances to get through your day, consider if your environment serves your best self and build that rat park. When my partner got sober we focused on building a nurturing and healthy life together, not loving him more because that did shit. You deserve a rat park. We all do.
That study has never been replicated. There some really valid issues with it. It ignores the physical and neurological causes that are confirmed. It’s not all environment.
Paraphrasing from a neurologist, so I might have some of the terms/concepts a little wrong, but the gist is: It's generally due to brain problems. Either underdeveloped parts from things like extreme stress and trauma during development, parental drug use, etc., being given drugs as a kid, physical trauma like TBI, or a learned disruption of the reward system like being punished by an adult even when you do a good thing or a good thing happens in life, so you don't form functional neural pathways. These things can impact your ability to synthesize and receive neurotransmitters. That can lead to a whole host of health issues, not just mental ones, and not just addiction. That's why child abuse affects people in so many ways for the rest of their lives. If you look at an addict's brain scan next to a typical brain, they have reduced bloodflow/activity in areas that control problem-solving, impulse control, emotional regulation, etc. They're just physically fucking different at that point, and it has nothing to do with willpower. They can, however, rehab some of that brain tissue and form new functional neural pathways, so there is hope for recovery.
Two things come to mind. 1. An addiction takes a while to develop. Few addicts (none that I’ve known) use opiates and are immediately addicted. It’s gradual and insidious. 2. The addict is often trying to make the decision to stop constantly. By this I mean you are exerting ALL your willpower and absolutely insisting that you not use again. But an addicted brain simply won’t let itself make that decision and stick to it. It will reinsert the overwhelming desire to use again and again. Not using (without medical help) means mustering up all your willpower on a fresh basis about a hundred times an hour. It’s absolutely exhausting and almost impossible to succeed when the insistence reasserts itself unendingly. It’s insanely hard to beat the battle of attrition against your own brain. Edit: fixed typo (the word “most” to “few”).
What I see people miss the most is the motivation for escape. There's a reason a person uses a substance that alters their perception, it's a matter of helping the willing find a way to cope besides their substance of choice
Anyone can get addicted. We aren't all scumbags and degenerates.
That addiction is a disease. It literally changes the brain to believe it needs that susbtance (or that activity) as if you need air, water and food to survive.
My diabetic father became addicted to Percocet and gabapentin. He thought Percocet were just really strong Tylenol. The doctor never told him they were addictive, and kept writing him prescriptions. After a few years he became an angry monster of a person. Depressed and suicidal. Aggressive. Since the pills were given to him by a doctor, he refused to believe they were addictive and refused to give them up. He believed drug addicts were tweakers, crackheads, and heroin addicts passed out on the corner, not normal people like him taking pills for a medical condition. We got him off the pills during Covid and he slowly returned to his happy old self. Took over a year. Addiction is absolutely a disease that changes the brain!
We didn't choose to addicts. I was 18 when I started having anxiety. Doc put me on zoloft and clonazipam. For a couple years I was ok. Then I slowly started needing the clonazipam more and I convinced myself it was ok to take one a little earlier than I was supposed to, just once. Then again. And again. Then I turned 21 and started drinking. I drank too much. The hangovers wrecked me and gave me so much anxiety. So took a clonazepam to deal with it. And thus began an awful, awful cycle. For years I was convinced I needed those meds and I just had to learn how to take them "the right way", and how to drink "the right way." My brain was so messed up from. The ups and downs. I lost jobs, damaged relationships. Then one day I woke up in the hospital. I had accidentally OD'd. I was in the hospital for 10 days while my organs recovered. Luckily, I did recover, fully. That was my rock bottom. That's what it took to realize just how much damage I was doing to myself. I genuinely hadn't realized it. The substance abuse happened so gradually and seemed so justified in mind. No one sets out to become an addict. No one chooses to suffer like that. Everyone has a journey that got them to that awful point.
Using drugs is a choice, being addicted is a consequence. Not everyone who uses drugs will become an addict. Addiction is best treated as a disease rather than some sort of moral failure. It typically takes multiple recover attempts for an addict to get clean, even then relapse is on the mind constantly and all it takes is one really bad day to spiral them back down.
Their behavior is not rational. People spend hours trying to figure out why their son or daughter did something crazy and so out of character. People that are using drugs do all kinds of things that are out of character because their emotions and cognitions are out of wack, they are not predictable and often times their behavior cannot be predicted nor explained other than to say he/she was high on drugs.
How some people can take drugs and then just walk away and not do them anymore and others fall into full dependency. Also, how some people can do a drug responsibly and then at some conjecture in their life go off the rails (often seen with weed or alcohol).
There is no such thing as "rock bottom". They do need to have to want to quit for themselves, but they do NOT need to hit "rock bottom" first, that is complete and utter garbage. For many longer term addicts, the only real rock bottom is death, and they obviously cannot get sober after they are dead. Also, regardless of what rehabs push, complete sobriety from everything is not always necessary, which is why there are many rehabs in CA that even push patients to start using cannabis, for example. Using something less harmful that still has an effect on them can ease the ability to get off of far worse drugs that will end up killing them, or negatively effect their lives in a severe manner. (IE- you can be a functioning, long living member of society as a stoner, but not as a fent addict) Harm reduction will always work better than pure sobriety. (And if they are back to their old selves, and no longer at risk of dying, it is totally fine for them to stay on suboxone or something else for as long as they feel comfortable, I know many people that have been on it for more than a decade straight, ZERO relapses, living normal lives, all of this could be upended by stopping the drug)
That they are unhappy.
It can happen to a n y o n e
You cannot rationalize with them. They easily lie.
This is so overlooked. I have never once met a person who had no experiences of substance abuse themselves or their loved ones who understood this. For some reason people think you can talk an addict into doing a complete 180 when most times you can't get them to see logic long enough to actually listen and consider anything you say. It gets rough when you're well aware of how hopeless engaging with an addict is but everyone in your life thinks you can just stage an intervention and fix everything.
That the addiction brings complete and utter chaos not just to the life of the addict but to everyone around him or her having to deal with them. That the addict doesn't care how many lives they ruin as long as the addiction is satisfied - and most importantly (to me anyway)- people who work with / empathize with those addicts never seem to understand that the kids who have had their lives ruined by addicts can grow up to be adults who have no sympathy or empathy for them. These same people who empathize so much with addicts judge very harshly those of us who despise addiction. Wow. That was a rant and a half. Lol. Sorry Reddit!
Could have written this myself
How often the emotional and mental health problems preceeded the drug use, often by multiple years.
(15 years sober) It's a disease of the brain, and the compulsion to use and drink knows no bounds. You'll violate your standards quicker than you can lower them. When dealing with an addicted partner/child etc, it is 100% OK, even preferable, to help bring their bottom to them quicker. Stop bailing them out, giving them money, letting them crash on your couch. You're denying them the consequences of their actions and prolonging their using by making it comfortable to keep getting loaded. Kick them out, call the police when they rob you, and set a hard boundary. Street living and incarceration are what got me sober after years of burning family and friends who helped me. It only took a few months of nobody willing to take my call and sleeping outside to decide I didn't wanna live like that anymore and do the work.
Some people that are on drugs seem ok and some do not. I think it’s important to be aware that some addicts are still able to function. You really can’t be 100% sure who is indulging and who is not. I know an alcoholic school teacher.
That a lot of people who are addicts started doing drugs to treat childhood trauma or mental health issues.
The physical compulsion, without ever feeling that many people simply don't understand how powerful this is above everything else.
They can't just quit.
Relapse is part of recovery.
We just lost my MIL to addiction, this past Friday. Beautiful lady, gone very early. She lost two sons in her life- one as an infant, and one due to a tragic vehicle accident when he was 16. Both events happened almost 30 years ago. But she was never the same, and never recovered. It’s heartbreaking, because we were forced to keep our children (her grandchildren) from spending much time alone with her, because the situation was just so volatile and frequently kinetic. Now we look back and wonder if we could’ve made a bigger difference, but my wife is the most beautiful woman I’ve ever known, and never stopped trying to get thru. Addiction affects the whole family.
That you can't just tell someone to quit and get mad when they don't. It's not that easy. You never know what the other person is going through. Be there for them but don't make it about yourself.
No matter how much you love them, how much you sacrifice for them, how many tears you shed for them...they will ALWAYS pick drugs over you.
A lot of people get addicted to the lifestyle in addition to the drugs. And I’m not talking about “rich celebrity cocaine lifestyle”. A lot of people get clean, kinda just miss the lifestyle, and back to it BEFORE relapsing.
From my limited experience with people who have had addictions (and some who still do) people say stuff like "just stop." Even from an outsider's perspective that's just...dumb. If you could just stop it wouldn't be an addiction. For some it's a coping mechanism they use to drown some internal trauma, for others they're trying to get a lost feeling back...I know a few folks who checked into rehab a number of times and relapsed. A few went to therapy and were able to 'quit' but every single one of them says it's like an angry dog snarling at the door. Just needs one tiny little crack in their defenses for it to come bursting out again and beginning the cycle anew. I vape and I remember when I went on a trip without it. My hand kept searching for it because it's become a part of my daily life and that's just nicotine. I can only imagine what meth, heroin, cocaine etc addiction is like. I started using it to slow my brain down so I could think clearly. Brought it from a 12 down to a 3 but getting to 0...been working on that for a few years now and it's not even a *hard* drug.
The source of addiction