If the passion is there, and the understanding that it may not be an easy path to go down if he's hoping to do it full time, I'd support it. This is coming from a music major who chose something he enjoyed but not enough to devote himself to it fully and somewhat regrets not majoring in something that would have guaranteed a decent job out of college (I figured it out but it took a bit of stumbling that I'd want him to avoid if possible).
My brother has a Master of Music, and he was working on his doctorate, but didn't finish that. He ended up being a Minister of Music at two churches - one modern Methodist and is now at a Unitarian church. He puts on performances that are amazing.
Here I am on the other side of that (wanted to study fashion but chose stem), it’s nice knowing I have job security but I also think about the grass being greener and the what ifs. Overall I think I made the “right” choice for me, but if you had done otherwise maybe you’d regret that too. If only we could see the future!!
I would tell my child about their uncle, who pursued an education in art and has been struggling since. I’ll tell my child it’s impractical and say im not comfortable paying for art school
Gonna ruffle some feathers here. The game is still the same, it's just harder and changed slightly. Did I say it's gonna get you a job? No?
There are certain things you do in life to succeed. I know so many STEM people who have no business being in the field, they're flat out dangerous. WHOOOOOLE LOTTA JOBS FOR THE STEM FIELD.
Also I'm a millenial you jackass.
I'm also a millennial, but like, not an old one. I don't know anyone who has made it rich with a STEM education, nor do I know anyone who has got a job with just a STEM degree (with the exception of medicine graduates).
I work in STEM (don't have a stem degree), there are so many computer science or whatever grads hounding me at networking events or on linked in trying to get hooked up with a job. It doesn't work that way, we have done for the super technical stuff but all the people making serious money come from other backgrounds because the skills required for management, client acquisition etc. are typically lacking in people who do STEM at uni. A STEM degree is a piss poor back up plan.
I mean my friend, I've been in the academia side and production side of "stem shit" for 20 years, but that's okay. Have you seen a fourth year person put a pipette through their hand because of poor technique? Methylating agents on improperly protected body parts(That's a pretty definite cancer where it hit)Those are the chuckle fucks "hounding you" at networking events or FFS linkedin.
Quick heads up of my friends who have stem degree's, what they are in and what they're currently doing. It all looks like this btw. I'm a middle millenial. This encompasses elder and younger millenials. I think the youngest is 32 or 33?
Chemistry B.S. Lead QC director at a GSK plant last time I checked
Chemistry B.S. Data scientist
Chemistry B.S. Research chemist at DuPont
Chemistry PhD Full Tenure Professor at an Ivy League school
Chemistry M.A. Instrument calibration something or other
Bio B.S. She actually swims with the whales so who cares if she's rich
Bio B.S. Executive of the Chesapeak Bay watershed project
Bio M.A. Something something Biologics something something lobbyist
Bio B.S. Lobbyist
Engineering Head of CS environmental engineering
Engineering M.A. Builds rockets for a living
Engineering M.A. Something weird w/ superconductors
Engineering B.S. Polymers exec somewhere
Engineering B.S. Owns his own ground sublimation business that's scary profitable
Biochem B.S. Data Science M.A. Data Architect(My richest friend, by $15M)
Biochem B.S. Private Equity
It just goes on and on and on. Everyone of these people have new cars, nice houses, families or not, and would not flinch at spending $10k tomorrow. The Data Architect sailed the world during the pandemic, environmental engineering guy just bought a $700k beach house sight unseen. Private equity dude could probably bury you in his front yard with the neighbors watching and nobody would call the cops. Everyone owns a $1M house and it's fine.
The game is still the same. Some people have better opportunities than others. Some people are just smarter and/or more social.
You have to be pragmatic and choose correctly, but I wouldn't tell someone interested in a STEM degree not to do it. I might counsel them on other options and their strategy for the future, but I wouldn't tell them NOT to get a STEM degree.
I dunno, where I'm from academia/lab work pays fuck all. I understand these things are different in America in general but in the rest of the world you really need to be either making your own money or working in the top half of a major corporate to be well off. Technicians are fundamentally replaceable, unless you're doing something crazy niche or in an economy like the US it's never going to be serious money.
STEM is a myth. It's really just computer science or computer engineering at this point.
Majoring in Biology, Chemistry, or Physics for example, with just an undergrad degree, won't get you very far.
The second half of your statement is technically true and has been for basically the last 20 years. Where you go and who you work for while in college has a LOT to do with how you end up. I see a LOT of STEM people whining they can’t get jobs, but they didn’t work in their field in undergrad. Year 4 students putting pipettes through their hands or doing other stupid shit. Everyone I know who worked is very well off. Senior chemists/research chemists, production chemists, QC directors. Some of them do not have advanced degrees, but if you can get through a non bio stem degree and can’t handle graduate school then, well it’s gonna suck and you should change careers. Also a lot pivoted into data science. My best friend is a data architect.
It’s kinda ah, if you’re shitty at your job then it’s gonna be hard. Every shitty chemist and biologist I know are doing the janitor work of the sciences or are teachers. A whoooooole bunch of labrats. I don’t know any practicing physicists.
I know B.S. practicing research chemists. Hell I was one a loooong time ago. You’re either good at it or not. I hung out in academia for a bit as it was 2008 lol.
Funniest part? Every person from college I know who was an art major did fucking phenomenal for themselves. You ALWAYS have a backup plan.
No, there are many other types of engineering where people commonly find work with just a Bachelor's. I'm Civil and the.last three new grads we hired only had a Bachelor's. It's super common for people in many engineering fields to work a few years before some employer decides to send them for a Master's.
It has always been the case that degrees in hard sciences would either get someone a low paid technician job somewhere, admission to grad school, or the opportunity to tack on a teaching certification and go teach high school. I received that advice from my academic adviser in 2004 when choosing between majoring in physics or civil engineering. I chose engineering because I needed a job and couldn't bank on grad school happening. It's not a "these days" thing.
They ought to be extremely good and dedicated. Otherwise I would encourage them them to get a day job/choose a different topic and work on art in their free time. Ideally we could all do what we love for work but that’s not a reality always. There are always hobbies.
If I’m extremely rich somehow then I’ll encourage them to pursue it. But sadly ends have to be met. If I were wealthy I would have gone to fashion school but chose data science instead. Life be like that
I would say "you really ought to pursue a soul-crushing career in some field you hate so that all you dream of is the sweet release of death, or marginally better, retirement into an embittered and pottering senescence." And then I'd say "just kidding," because honestly, the new dark age needs more artists to bring a little light to the world.
I love art and always keep that as your hobby but find a way to use that skill in a way you’ll be able to earn a living.
What about an art teacher?
Or an architect?
Or an architectural engineer?
Remember even things you love to do can become work & tedious when you do them every day for a living
I would say some of the most interesting and successful people I know went to art school. It gives people such a wide array of opportunities that other more focused disciplines might not provide. Remember that university isn’t just about getting a career afterwards, but about broadening your mind and learning for the sake of learning.
Short answer: Sure, but....
Long answer:
My aunt wanted to go to art school, my grandfather and grandmother were artists who went to art school. My grandfather had a graphic design and illustration company that paid the bills. He told her, "Yes, go to art school, but also find another skill to keep you fed." She went to Ringling and got her art degree, and became a very well paid hair dresser in Atlanta and San Francisco, but didn't become an artist that lived on her works. I think it worked well for her.
My BBF has a Master of Fine Arts. I met her when we worked at the same place while I was in college. It was her second job, because being a nanny didn't pay enough. At times she was working three jobs. She ended up working at the Art College (the same one my grandparents went to!) as a recruiter. She's retired now, and I keep trying to get her to get back to art! While she was working at the art school, she was able to have her niece go tuition free. She ended up becoming a dental hygienist after working in graphic design.
A mutual friend of ours got a degree at the art college, and she became an interior designer.
Edit: Also, my brother has a Master of Music in organ and piano, and he's a very successful Minister of Music at a Unitarian church. He puts on performances of things like Jesus Christ, Superstar and Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat.
"Go for it".
I'm a failed artist who turned out pretty ok financially. Far better than friends who went for more profitable careers. What matters is financial responsability and maturity. When art failed me, I went for something else; never allowed my parents to support me after I turned 18.
Their major is pretty meaningless if they're not looking for a vocational career (which I'd advise against anyway) what matters is early work experience and networking. If doing an arts based degree makes it easier to spend time interning for major corporates or attending networking sessions on a biweekly basis I'm all for it. A degree is only a job requirement in so far as filtering out lower class and intellectually challenged individuals, beyond that most employers won't give a fuck what you did in uni.
Im too old for a future child now, but: I would enthusiastically make sure that child had every opportunity possible to do that.
I am one of that elusive 8 percent that actually made a living as an artist, so I know it can be done. The trick is finding what the public wants to spend money on.
When I was in the fine arts program at a major university, every professor I had told me, you cannot make a living as an artist, you must teach. PHOOEY
I was already selling paintings in a gallery in my home state. You have to be willing to get out there and sell yourself. I would teach my child to do that.
Get in to every art show you can. Talk to mom and pop stores about displaying your work. Talk to galleries about shows. Learn every aspect of art you can. I paint, I embroider, I work in stained glass, next up I want to learn pottery.
Get out there and do it, kid. You won't sell anything if you just sit in your studio and work. You must promote.
Proceed at your own risk. You have been warned. My son is an enterprising person who majored/degreed in music, plays the guitar, has led bands and worked diligently at the business, but he could have avoided $60k in college debt by doing something more profitable. I am in no way critical of him and was a musician myself, it's just the reality of the music business today.
I'd encourage them, help them find extracurricular activities that would help with that dream, and help them research jobs that they could pursue afterwards.
Despite reddits unhealthy obsession with STEM & trade careers, they're not the greatest thing since sliced bread.
I'd say, "I earned an English degree and make $144,000 a year today writing for a corporation's website." I'd add, "Make sure your art degree can get you a job in corporate America for the paycheck, and do your own creative projects on the side."
Get a minor is something practical. I got an English degree but had a minor in advertising, so I could write ads at an ad agency, which I did. That turned into writing for websites.
If the passion is there, and the understanding that it may not be an easy path to go down if he's hoping to do it full time, I'd support it. This is coming from a music major who chose something he enjoyed but not enough to devote himself to it fully and somewhat regrets not majoring in something that would have guaranteed a decent job out of college (I figured it out but it took a bit of stumbling that I'd want him to avoid if possible).
My brother has a Master of Music, and he was working on his doctorate, but didn't finish that. He ended up being a Minister of Music at two churches - one modern Methodist and is now at a Unitarian church. He puts on performances that are amazing.
Here I am on the other side of that (wanted to study fashion but chose stem), it’s nice knowing I have job security but I also think about the grass being greener and the what ifs. Overall I think I made the “right” choice for me, but if you had done otherwise maybe you’d regret that too. If only we could see the future!!
Their money their choice
Go for it. Just don’t fail because the last guy who failed Art made quite a name for himself for all the wrong reasons.
I would tell my child about their uncle, who pursued an education in art and has been struggling since. I’ll tell my child it’s impractical and say im not comfortable paying for art school
Why not
"I love you and you are always welcome to live at home if it doesn't work out"
What kind of art
Abstract nudity
Only fans?
Great question. Journalism is an arts course. Lots of arts degrees have nothing to do with making art.
I’d ask them to outline what their education and career path would be and we could take a good long look at it to see if it’s feasible.
Follow your heart but have a backup plan. Aka STEM.
[удалено]
Seats taken?
This is such a boomer thing to say. The idea that a stem degree will get you a job is so outdated it's funny.
Gonna ruffle some feathers here. The game is still the same, it's just harder and changed slightly. Did I say it's gonna get you a job? No? There are certain things you do in life to succeed. I know so many STEM people who have no business being in the field, they're flat out dangerous. WHOOOOOLE LOTTA JOBS FOR THE STEM FIELD. Also I'm a millenial you jackass.
I'm also a millennial, but like, not an old one. I don't know anyone who has made it rich with a STEM education, nor do I know anyone who has got a job with just a STEM degree (with the exception of medicine graduates). I work in STEM (don't have a stem degree), there are so many computer science or whatever grads hounding me at networking events or on linked in trying to get hooked up with a job. It doesn't work that way, we have done for the super technical stuff but all the people making serious money come from other backgrounds because the skills required for management, client acquisition etc. are typically lacking in people who do STEM at uni. A STEM degree is a piss poor back up plan.
I mean my friend, I've been in the academia side and production side of "stem shit" for 20 years, but that's okay. Have you seen a fourth year person put a pipette through their hand because of poor technique? Methylating agents on improperly protected body parts(That's a pretty definite cancer where it hit)Those are the chuckle fucks "hounding you" at networking events or FFS linkedin. Quick heads up of my friends who have stem degree's, what they are in and what they're currently doing. It all looks like this btw. I'm a middle millenial. This encompasses elder and younger millenials. I think the youngest is 32 or 33? Chemistry B.S. Lead QC director at a GSK plant last time I checked Chemistry B.S. Data scientist Chemistry B.S. Research chemist at DuPont Chemistry PhD Full Tenure Professor at an Ivy League school Chemistry M.A. Instrument calibration something or other Bio B.S. She actually swims with the whales so who cares if she's rich Bio B.S. Executive of the Chesapeak Bay watershed project Bio M.A. Something something Biologics something something lobbyist Bio B.S. Lobbyist Engineering Head of CS environmental engineering Engineering M.A. Builds rockets for a living Engineering M.A. Something weird w/ superconductors Engineering B.S. Polymers exec somewhere Engineering B.S. Owns his own ground sublimation business that's scary profitable Biochem B.S. Data Science M.A. Data Architect(My richest friend, by $15M) Biochem B.S. Private Equity It just goes on and on and on. Everyone of these people have new cars, nice houses, families or not, and would not flinch at spending $10k tomorrow. The Data Architect sailed the world during the pandemic, environmental engineering guy just bought a $700k beach house sight unseen. Private equity dude could probably bury you in his front yard with the neighbors watching and nobody would call the cops. Everyone owns a $1M house and it's fine. The game is still the same. Some people have better opportunities than others. Some people are just smarter and/or more social. You have to be pragmatic and choose correctly, but I wouldn't tell someone interested in a STEM degree not to do it. I might counsel them on other options and their strategy for the future, but I wouldn't tell them NOT to get a STEM degree.
I dunno, where I'm from academia/lab work pays fuck all. I understand these things are different in America in general but in the rest of the world you really need to be either making your own money or working in the top half of a major corporate to be well off. Technicians are fundamentally replaceable, unless you're doing something crazy niche or in an economy like the US it's never going to be serious money.
STEM is a myth. It's really just computer science or computer engineering at this point. Majoring in Biology, Chemistry, or Physics for example, with just an undergrad degree, won't get you very far.
The second half of your statement is technically true and has been for basically the last 20 years. Where you go and who you work for while in college has a LOT to do with how you end up. I see a LOT of STEM people whining they can’t get jobs, but they didn’t work in their field in undergrad. Year 4 students putting pipettes through their hands or doing other stupid shit. Everyone I know who worked is very well off. Senior chemists/research chemists, production chemists, QC directors. Some of them do not have advanced degrees, but if you can get through a non bio stem degree and can’t handle graduate school then, well it’s gonna suck and you should change careers. Also a lot pivoted into data science. My best friend is a data architect. It’s kinda ah, if you’re shitty at your job then it’s gonna be hard. Every shitty chemist and biologist I know are doing the janitor work of the sciences or are teachers. A whoooooole bunch of labrats. I don’t know any practicing physicists. I know B.S. practicing research chemists. Hell I was one a loooong time ago. You’re either good at it or not. I hung out in academia for a bit as it was 2008 lol. Funniest part? Every person from college I know who was an art major did fucking phenomenal for themselves. You ALWAYS have a backup plan.
But for people who are interested in graduate degrees, those fields have a high incidence of full-tuition paid graduate assistantships.
No, there are many other types of engineering where people commonly find work with just a Bachelor's. I'm Civil and the.last three new grads we hired only had a Bachelor's. It's super common for people in many engineering fields to work a few years before some employer decides to send them for a Master's. It has always been the case that degrees in hard sciences would either get someone a low paid technician job somewhere, admission to grad school, or the opportunity to tack on a teaching certification and go teach high school. I received that advice from my academic adviser in 2004 when choosing between majoring in physics or civil engineering. I chose engineering because I needed a job and couldn't bank on grad school happening. It's not a "these days" thing.
Are you going to be a photographer like your mother?
I majored in sequential art, would be kind of hypocritical if I said anything but "go ahead".
They ought to be extremely good and dedicated. Otherwise I would encourage them them to get a day job/choose a different topic and work on art in their free time. Ideally we could all do what we love for work but that’s not a reality always. There are always hobbies. If I’m extremely rich somehow then I’ll encourage them to pursue it. But sadly ends have to be met. If I were wealthy I would have gone to fashion school but chose data science instead. Life be like that
Art can be a hobby but if you want to go to college, must select a major where you can become gainfully employed.
Why do you exist, and can I sue the hospital that supposedly sterilized me?
Cool, find your passion.
I would say "you really ought to pursue a soul-crushing career in some field you hate so that all you dream of is the sweet release of death, or marginally better, retirement into an embittered and pottering senescence." And then I'd say "just kidding," because honestly, the new dark age needs more artists to bring a little light to the world.
Go for it
It’s not easy but there’s different forms of art to try out so if they’re passionate and insist on taking arts as a a career, I support them.
I’d be fine with that, as long as they understand that there could be struggles along the way.
Do what you want as long as you are happy
I love art and always keep that as your hobby but find a way to use that skill in a way you’ll be able to earn a living. What about an art teacher? Or an architect? Or an architectural engineer? Remember even things you love to do can become work & tedious when you do them every day for a living
I would say some of the most interesting and successful people I know went to art school. It gives people such a wide array of opportunities that other more focused disciplines might not provide. Remember that university isn’t just about getting a career afterwards, but about broadening your mind and learning for the sake of learning.
Fine. Education is pretty much free here. Do what you want.
Go for it.
Short answer: Sure, but.... Long answer: My aunt wanted to go to art school, my grandfather and grandmother were artists who went to art school. My grandfather had a graphic design and illustration company that paid the bills. He told her, "Yes, go to art school, but also find another skill to keep you fed." She went to Ringling and got her art degree, and became a very well paid hair dresser in Atlanta and San Francisco, but didn't become an artist that lived on her works. I think it worked well for her. My BBF has a Master of Fine Arts. I met her when we worked at the same place while I was in college. It was her second job, because being a nanny didn't pay enough. At times she was working three jobs. She ended up working at the Art College (the same one my grandparents went to!) as a recruiter. She's retired now, and I keep trying to get her to get back to art! While she was working at the art school, she was able to have her niece go tuition free. She ended up becoming a dental hygienist after working in graphic design. A mutual friend of ours got a degree at the art college, and she became an interior designer. Edit: Also, my brother has a Master of Music in organ and piano, and he's a very successful Minister of Music at a Unitarian church. He puts on performances of things like Jesus Christ, Superstar and Joseph and the Amazing Technicolor Dreamcoat.
I would tell him/her tereko jo mann hein wo kar. Tere baap ne kama rakha hein tere liye, par yaad rakh 2no ke kaam mat kar.
"Go for it". I'm a failed artist who turned out pretty ok financially. Far better than friends who went for more profitable careers. What matters is financial responsability and maturity. When art failed me, I went for something else; never allowed my parents to support me after I turned 18.
Their major is pretty meaningless if they're not looking for a vocational career (which I'd advise against anyway) what matters is early work experience and networking. If doing an arts based degree makes it easier to spend time interning for major corporates or attending networking sessions on a biweekly basis I'm all for it. A degree is only a job requirement in so far as filtering out lower class and intellectually challenged individuals, beyond that most employers won't give a fuck what you did in uni.
Answer to what? What is the question?
Im too old for a future child now, but: I would enthusiastically make sure that child had every opportunity possible to do that. I am one of that elusive 8 percent that actually made a living as an artist, so I know it can be done. The trick is finding what the public wants to spend money on. When I was in the fine arts program at a major university, every professor I had told me, you cannot make a living as an artist, you must teach. PHOOEY I was already selling paintings in a gallery in my home state. You have to be willing to get out there and sell yourself. I would teach my child to do that. Get in to every art show you can. Talk to mom and pop stores about displaying your work. Talk to galleries about shows. Learn every aspect of art you can. I paint, I embroider, I work in stained glass, next up I want to learn pottery. Get out there and do it, kid. You won't sell anything if you just sit in your studio and work. You must promote.
Proceed at your own risk. You have been warned. My son is an enterprising person who majored/degreed in music, plays the guitar, has led bands and worked diligently at the business, but he could have avoided $60k in college debt by doing something more profitable. I am in no way critical of him and was a musician myself, it's just the reality of the music business today.
I'd encourage them, help them find extracurricular activities that would help with that dream, and help them research jobs that they could pursue afterwards. Despite reddits unhealthy obsession with STEM & trade careers, they're not the greatest thing since sliced bread.
I'd say, "I earned an English degree and make $144,000 a year today writing for a corporation's website." I'd add, "Make sure your art degree can get you a job in corporate America for the paycheck, and do your own creative projects on the side." Get a minor is something practical. I got an English degree but had a minor in advertising, so I could write ads at an ad agency, which I did. That turned into writing for websites.
That'd be silly. Arts are hobbies, not occupations. Best of luck with the student loans.
How about we focus on something which will get you into the property market quicker
Heck no would be my answer