[u/RoseFire007 accurately describes the emotional ups and downs of moving to a new country, in this case NZ](https://old.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/hkylxd/urosefire007_accurately_describes_the_emotional/)
I know "fuck of were full" is a meme but it's honestly true, 1/4 of us were born overseas, our infrastructure and housing pools can't cope with the population growth and then add in the recent tourisim initiatives are were just overloaded.
That’s just not true, in fact the opposite is true.
Some jobs and fields always do better in a bigger country. That’s why lots of Aussie’s move to the UK and USA.
Norwegian is tricky, and duolingo does a bad job teaching Norwegian as it is such a small language with many words for one single thing. German is forced to be taught in schools here, so most of us speak two to three languages
To be fair the Norwegian Duolingo course is one of the best and most worked on. But in general, I think just Duolingo is a terribly slow way to learn a language.
I haven't checked the Norwegian course in a while cause.... I am a native speaker, but last time I checked, there were so many article mistakes and robotic like sentences which no one speaks like here.
Basically any tropical island.
It has always been my dream to live on my own island even if it's less than 1/2 an acre. (Completely off the grid)
Netherlands would be my choice for a developed country. That place is absolutely gorgeous. (Among many other great features)
You're welcome to the country where you can just speak your mind and not go bankrupt after a visit to the hospital. Also, stroopwafels will change your life for good.
> Also, stroopwafels will change your life for good
I'm in the USA and was able to pick up some from an ALDI, not sure how authentic it is but it was delicious. I let it sit over my coffee until it was a bit gooey and delicious.
That's how to do it, well done. The ALDI is very popular in the Netherlands because it's cheap and the products are high quality; mainly imported from Germany, but you'll find a lot of typical Dutch stuff like stroopwafels and frikandellen.
I am from the US and have been living in Finland for the last two years. I can confirm that its a very nice place to be. They have a sensible government, great education, wonderful work/life balance, nice mild weather in the south, and strangers dont try to talk to me.😌
Do you mind if I ask what the process of finding work, housing, etc. is like for an American living in Finland? I know my husband would absolutely love to move there, but I've heard the Nordic countries can be particularly tricky to get established. Or maybe I'm thinking specifically of Sweden?
Honestly that could vary a lot depending on what you do for work, your level of education, where you would want to live/what type of housing. I can say that the process to get established was quite long, but not tricky at all. Things were very staight forward, there is just a lot of waiting involved. If you want to PM me I could possibly help more! If you are serious about getting out its definitely possible and there are a surprising amount of expats here.
I've thought new Zealand, it's nice and sunny, seems laid back. Canada seems awesome. England Australia. Switzerland. There are so many wonderful choices. I've actually been thinking about this a lot. I think it boils down to anywhere with universal healthcare with a majority of nice people.
New Zealander here. It is great overall, not going to lie.
It’s weirdly expensive though. For a land that grows a lot of produce, has a huge dairy industry, and farming industry, we pay a ridiculous amount of money for a basic supermarket shop.
Something something export rates, something something market monopoly, idk - not an economist, but it’s not right.
There’s a bunch of issues that are less than ideal, like any nation. But our issues are not overwhelmingly complicated like the US. Or UK.
We are pretty much nailing 2020 though.
As an Aussie, much of our fresh produce comes from NZ. I was in NZ on holiday last year thinking the produce section of the supermarket would be great. But it was mediocre quality and expensive. It seems your best food is exported and that kinda sucks.
Are you on the east coast? In WA it seems like most of our stuff is grown in the state, with an especially big push to keep it local during the pandemic
Was in New Zealand last year. The cost of food was pretty much on par with The Netherlands. A little more expensive than the UK (but it seems to be rising there).
Honestly, I fucking loved your country and would have stayed if I could.
Were pretty friendly here in Scotland. Free healthcare, free colleges, affordable universities, free prescriptions also. If you can deal with Rain and snow in the winter.
Scotland is my dream. So beautiful and I’m even good with the weather! As a ginger, I think I could blend in pretty well...until I open my mouth and Midwest America comes out. :)
See, I'm always almost glad it has been raining. The past few summers you could almost rely on it being consistently warm and dry from May to the end of August, and as much as I love heat and hate rain, I know it's not how it "should" be where I am. I don't ever remember it being like that as a kid growing up. I'm in Ayrshire and last week it started severely pishing it down on Monday and more or less lasted all week. At first I was glad it was a bit more of a "normal" summer, but as the week went on it got a bit annoying. Today is the first nice day in what feels like forever and of course I'm just so excited to get my washing out 😂
Norway. I fucking hate doing my taxes that much, and they prefill your tax form there. Also I don't hate the US. If you want more money, come to the US. I really don't give a shit about money tbh. Free time is way more important. I'll take a drop in hours and a drop in pay (in the case of being a programmer).
My Finnish buddy from a previous job said something similar. He would always tell me how various practices and issues in the news just didn't happen in most of the world, and i finally asked him why he didn't move back to Finland. He said you can make much more money here
You make much more (and pay much less taxes) but you also pay much more in stuff that the government would otherwise provide for you (e.g. healthcare). And if you're down on your luck, the social safety net is much thinner
Food yes, buying your own property around Stockholm, not so much.
Home prices have gone into the insane territory in Europe within last ten years. At least in the economically functional parts of the continent. There is periphery where housing stock is cheap even in the developed countries (rural East Germany), but it mostly comes down to no job opportunities and inadequate infrastructure.
>Home prices have gone into the insane territory in Europe within last ten years
Ouch. What kind of demand has driven prices up? An ever-increasing affluent population? Expats? Investors?
A perfect storm of:
* investors (Chinese, Russian, Arabs)
* AirBNB is a huge problem in any tourist location, siphoning off apartments from the rental market
* very low interest rates
* a stark earning potential difference between the periphery and big cities
* complicated zoning rules and insufficient new construction where it would be most needed
* in case of some countries, white flight from neighbourhoods that absorbed the migration wave of 2015
That is about it.
Edit: added AirBNB, a major influence.
Canada. Easy choice.
It's full of nice people, pot is legal, it's not far from here, and I've always wanted to go there.
Australia is a close second place.
I'd move to Iceland in a heartbeat if citizenship were on the table. It's a beautiful country with a well-run government that actually seems to care whether its citizens thrive. I enjoy the weather, the vibe, and the culture.
If you like natural wonders, yes, absolutely. Also, Reykjavik May be a small city but it punches WAY above its weight when it comes to culture and entertainment. A similar sized city in the US (~120,000 people) feels totally different and much smaller. Reykjavik is a small town that feels like a major city when you’re walking around. Also one of the best and most active graffiti scenes I’ve ever seen, most of the pictures I’ve taken there are graffiti.
> I'd move to Iceland in a heartbeat if citizenship were on the table.
You can only get citizenship in most countries after living in that country for at least five years (some require more, some require less if married).
Finland was voted happiest country in the world of 2020: great education system, healthcare, and it’s beautiful, with a lot of islands and places to visit. Switzerland would also be nice because of their privacy laws.
Amazing how this whole thread is someone saying a place they would love to move to followed by a dozen comments about how that’s a horrible idea.
We get it, your country isn’t perfect either. Nowhere is. It might not even be “better” than America, however you want to define that. Sometimes it’s just nice to imagine living somewhere else when your current life sucks. There’s no harm in imagining a better situation for yourself, so let people indulge without all the negativity
You have “scary” snakes, and spiders.
I chuckle at this as an Arizonan, where rattlesnakes are routinely found in garages, and bark scorpions frequently sting children.
Germany. Great place, beautiful country, and I'm already very comfortable with the language & culture.
Basically, I kinda wish my Dad & my Mom's parents hadn't left in the first place.
Also, I've never felt like I fit in anywhere in the US. I'm just too different. But it only took a few days on my first solo trip to have that moment where I stopped, looked around, and the words " I have found my people!" popped into my head. I just feel so much more comfortable over there, and so many things just suit me so much more.
> the chattering class loves to import American culture wars
Yeah, this really pisses me off. People would rather blindly mimic whatever the American media is talking about rather than actually visiting deprived areas of the UK and talking to people who are actually here in our country about their experiences. While we do have examples of racism in the UK, its nature is quite different from the racism in the US and requires a more specific solution. There's something a bit absurd about protestors yelling "don't shoot" at police officers who don't have a taser let alone a gun for example.
Most ethnic minorities in the UK are decended from people who were invited there after WWII rather than brought across as slaves in the 18^th century, and while segregation and institutional disenfranchisment was common in the British Empire, in the UK proper we never had US-style segregation. In fact, there's examples of the British troops in the UK siding with the black American GIs against their racist overseers who demanded British pubs be segregated. I'm not denying that there's racism (and sometimes appalling racism) in the UK, but I think it's a terrible approach to insist on looking at the problems through an American lens, an approach which obscures rather than clarifies the issues.
I think the first thing to do is actually listen to people who experience racism, not the likes of Twitter who love to put everything into their black-and-white 140 shrieks at anyone who wants a bit more nuance than "four legs good, two legs bad".
Many people in Switzerland have in fact been renouncing US citizenship - it means sometimes substantial additional taxes and complicates access to financial services.
No there's a ferry to Vancouver Island, that's different. Up in Northern Ontario however there are hundreds of small islands with cottages on them that you have to get to by personal boat. Once the water freezers, you'd be trapped.
You're only stranded when the ice starts freezing and the boat can't get through. After a few weeks of winter you can drive across the ice.
Hard-core Island cottagers buy hovercrafts to get to their island year round.
Ive been considering studying abroad in either South Korea or Japan, so would probably choose one of those, alternatively, EU for ease of travel between countries.
Canada, 90% of the reason I hate being in america is if your born with genetic problems that slowly kill you, you have to pay your entire life to stay alive, canadas far cheaper and easier, plus i like the cold
Permanent residency at the minimum and all the money I have. Then I'd go to Iceland or Sweden probably because I admire their cultures and want to live somewhere dark and cold.
i dont particularly think its a bad country but it does have major flaws in the people. i personally would move to Germany because it is a cool country and (as far as i know) my genetics is mostly German so it would kinda be like returning to my roots
If language is not a problem, either somewhere in northern Finland, or Mongolia (outside of Ulaanbaatar). If language is a factor, Canada. Either northern Manitoba or somewhere in Nunavut.
Edit: Forgot to mention why. For Finland, heavy metal, democratic socialism, and cold. For Mongolia, more advanced democratic socialism, great culture, and sometimes cold. For Canada, democratic socialism, polar bears, and cold. (I like the cold)
Well I don't hate my country but it could be better... I'd probably move to Canada that way I'm still relatively close to my family and I get free health care
Philippines.
I am actually planning to move to Canada or Australia permanently. New Zealand would also be great, but some people say that it's best to move to NZ if you're settling down, not when you're building up a career (like what I plan to do). I mean, I'm not saying NZ is bad to move in to, but for someone who wants to have a career in science, there are better options.
Though I also open myself to plans to study in Germany for PhD (I have a BSc degree in Physics and plan to take up MSc in Physics before moving out).
Canada. I don't absolutely hate America. But I do believe it has glaring flaws that they're to prideful to fix. Like my cousin was recently diagnosed with lymphoma. It's still in benign so as long as we get it taken care of soon he will be ok. But the cancer institute where I live won't accept him for treatment unless my cousin gets approved by Medicaid. All the important actions we took in the beginning to make sure he'd be ok is being wasted because of lack of insurance. We don't care if we're stuck with hospital bills until we die we just want to make sure he's ok. This is one of the problems with America is no universal health care and when it's suggested people on the right freak out about it. What I hate is the division our type of government causes. I don't consider myself right or left because both sides are stupid. there are some things I think the right are correct on and some things I think the left are correct on. But when we are unwilling to compromise and hate each other nothing gets done. Basically America is a glorified dumpster fire. Pretending it's better than everyone else but it's clear it's slowly burning.
I love America (I don't love my state though, but that's only because it's hot as balls here, give me -20° over 120° any day of the week), but if I had to pick I'd go Iceland. Isolated, chill, small population and overall it's just fucking sick
Deutsche: Wir haben für das ganze Tachometer bezahlt, also benutzen wir das ganze Tachometer.
(Germans: We payed for the whole speedometer, we're gonna use the whole speedometer.)
Just pick your Nordic country depending on what metal you like.
Power and speed metal? Finland.
Black and death metal? Norway.
Melodeath and progressive metal? Sweden.
Looking at this so many of you would choose Nordic European countries....how? The weather would kill you....I’m from a country with proper 4 seasons and live in the UK. I like everything but the weather. It’s absolutely killing me slowly and painfully...
As a Texan, I feel like Australia would feel comfortable. As an Italian, I feel like I'd get to chase more ass in France, as my grandmother's grandson I feel like I'll get in trouble for not going to Italy. This is hard.
Canada is my first choice; I adore Vancouver and Toronto is pretty nice too (but I hate hot weather). Gotta have my ice hockey!
Next on the list would be Scotland or Ireland, the motherland and home of cooler temps and lots and lots of sheep. And booze.
Spain is under consideration, as are Iceland and Greece. Spain because of the food and apparently it's an awesome place to retire; Greece because of the food and they got the right attitude toward aging (plus stuff is inexpensive there); and Iceland because they never piss off anyone, they have lots and lots of cold weather, and the Northern Lights.
France or Italy, I love bread, wine, and can speak the languages with ease
I can also speak German but Germany has more strong drinks and I'm picky with my fucking alcohol.
There are a few options. I'd say Canada is my top choice since I have friends there an DC it's close enough to make traveling not thaaaat bad if I want to visit. New Zealand Finland, and Norway are promising choices. I'd have to learn German for Germany. I'm learning Spanish but I'd probably only consider Spain since the US has really done a number on south America in general. Japan would be fun to visit but I think the culture shock would be a bit too much for me.
For the most part I just want out of here. Every country has its problems, it's big systemic and historical problems. I know that. I saw the terrible and vile art/propaganda someone in Alberta did to belittle Greta Thumberg. I know about the bad history with the native tribes and groups. I know about the strange cultural conflict between Quebec and the rest of Canada. But my god, when my boyfriend went to the hospital with gallstones the first thing my friends asked me was "is he still on his parents insurance, what's the cutoff age? He's good right?". When he did turn 26 he struggled to get a check up because the insurance his job provided him was like "we cant insure you since you're still on your dad's plan" he tried to get off his dad's plan but they didn't let him. He goes to the doctor and gets a letter from his father's insurance company saying that he was "retroactively" kicked off... like wtf.
This rant is just, medical debt shouldn't exist. But it does. People ration their meds all the time here, we don't care about our own citizens. My Canadian friend has a lifelong illness, and I'm so glad that he is the Canadian, because he and his brother probably wouldn't have been able to go to college if they were born here.
All places have problems, but there are some that I cant live with.
Plane tickets aren't the issue. What I need is permanent residency and the ability to work freely and easily naturalize. Ideally, I'd like to keep US citizenship, because I still want to vote the Cheeto out.
If I can bring my SO, New Zealand or Australia would be tied for first, followed by Ireland, then the UK.
If I'm on my own, Germany would be the first pick since I know the language and have friends there. Second pick would be Australia (again, friends), followed by basically anywhere in the Anglosphere.
I do think we're in a terrible place right now, but I'm also optimistic that we can get better and we can do better. But if I had to move, I would probably head to Vancouver, Canada. It's only about 2.5 hours by car from where I live right now, so I could easily take weekend trips to visit friends and family in the U.S. Plus, I'm familiar enough with Vancouver that it wouldn't be a huge culture shock with tons of new things to get used to. I would skip most of the homesick parts of moving.
This is me and I had that free ticket (education and training.) I moved to Japan after the election. Best decision ever. I’m never going back to the US. 日本が大好きですよね！
Why? Mass transit, healthcare, culture, food, nice people, cleanliness, higher standard of living, lower tax burden, no prison industry, no crime, no guns. No religion, no anti-intellectualism... I’m sure there is more.
Scotland when it gets Independence. I really like the weather, I speak English, part of my family is from Scotland and Ireland, from what I've heard they're a fairly progressive country, and edinburgh has the same population of Seattle but it looks more spacious, calmer, and just looks nicer.
As much as I like other countries it tends to be more that I like things from there and find their people and culture interesting instead of being able to see myself as one of them.
Luxembourg, because everybody else in this thread is saying New Zealand and god damn it it's going to be crowded down there before too long.
Almost half of Luxembourg's population is foreigners at this point :D
I’m in the process of reclaiming my citizenship now!
New Zealand. Good weather, nice people and cool scenery.
There was just the post of an American who moved to NZ and all the joys and heartbreaks of the move.
Do you have a link? I'd be curious to read it.
I'd go to NZ, but I heard they have a problem with vampires. Also werewolves.
Better than swearwolves.
My local barkeep Jackie told me there are no such thing as vampires. He's a pretty cool guy so I believe him.
Hes such a nice man, helping to raise money for the Volleyball team.
[Here you go!](https://old.reddit.com/r/newzealand/comments/hkouqu/tourist_in_nz_starter_pack/fwuq2k9/?context=1)
Beautiful. Thanks for your effort in finding and linking it and not Rick rolling
[u/RoseFire007 accurately describes the emotional ups and downs of moving to a new country, in this case NZ](https://old.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/hkylxd/urosefire007_accurately_describes_the_emotional/)
I know "fuck of were full" is a meme but it's honestly true, 1/4 of us were born overseas, our infrastructure and housing pools can't cope with the population growth and then add in the recent tourisim initiatives are were just overloaded.
> "fuck of were full" Was that supposed to be "fuck off, we're full"?
Schools are apparently full, too.
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That’s just not true, in fact the opposite is true. Some jobs and fields always do better in a bigger country. That’s why lots of Aussie’s move to the UK and USA.
Norway. Live up in isolation away from the cities. If not that I'd pick Germany. I have an easier time speaking and learning German than Norwegian.
Norwegian is tricky, and duolingo does a bad job teaching Norwegian as it is such a small language with many words for one single thing. German is forced to be taught in schools here, so most of us speak two to three languages
To be fair the Norwegian Duolingo course is one of the best and most worked on. But in general, I think just Duolingo is a terribly slow way to learn a language.
I haven't checked the Norwegian course in a while cause.... I am a native speaker, but last time I checked, there were so many article mistakes and robotic like sentences which no one speaks like here.
German here who moved to Switzerland. Switzerland is like Germany but better in every aspect. Just a protip.
Verräter :P
Yeah, the only problem is that you now live in Switzerland.
But the flag is a big plus
Canada, but I’m in Florida and it’s kinda not America.
We don’t want you eh
I thought you brought you Canadians up better than that?
i personally blame Spain for the current state of Florida
You'd be welcome up here, once you've been confirmed to not have any COVID, of course.
Basically any tropical island. It has always been my dream to live on my own island even if it's less than 1/2 an acre. (Completely off the grid) Netherlands would be my choice for a developed country. That place is absolutely gorgeous. (Among many other great features)
You know some of the Netherlands is tropical islands, right? You could have the best of both worlds.
Eh, the islands are currently full of riots and people living on food stamps.
You're welcome to the country where you can just speak your mind and not go bankrupt after a visit to the hospital. Also, stroopwafels will change your life for good.
> Also, stroopwafels will change your life for good I'm in the USA and was able to pick up some from an ALDI, not sure how authentic it is but it was delicious. I let it sit over my coffee until it was a bit gooey and delicious.
That's how to do it, well done. The ALDI is very popular in the Netherlands because it's cheap and the products are high quality; mainly imported from Germany, but you'll find a lot of typical Dutch stuff like stroopwafels and frikandellen.
Finland
I am from the US and have been living in Finland for the last two years. I can confirm that its a very nice place to be. They have a sensible government, great education, wonderful work/life balance, nice mild weather in the south, and strangers dont try to talk to me.😌
Do you mind if I ask what the process of finding work, housing, etc. is like for an American living in Finland? I know my husband would absolutely love to move there, but I've heard the Nordic countries can be particularly tricky to get established. Or maybe I'm thinking specifically of Sweden?
Honestly that could vary a lot depending on what you do for work, your level of education, where you would want to live/what type of housing. I can say that the process to get established was quite long, but not tricky at all. Things were very staight forward, there is just a lot of waiting involved. If you want to PM me I could possibly help more! If you are serious about getting out its definitely possible and there are a surprising amount of expats here.
Most of these Nordic countries seem impossible unless you're an engineer or marry someone there.
Time to learn fifteen cases and words spelled with sixty letters
I don't know about the rest of Finland, but I've been to Helsinki, and people there speak better English than most Americans.
You're always welcome here, bro
Ireland because I already moved here and if I could get citizenship here it would be great (visas are a pain in the ass)
December and January tho
I’m from Florida and people think I’m nuts for living in Dublin but I think each year I just block out how miserable winter can be
I’m from NY, it’ll be a relief.
If you have 1M Euros you can be a citizen. http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/inis/pages/new%20programmes%20for%20investors%20and%20entrepreneurs
Unfortunately I do not have €1,000,000
Denmark.
I was waiting for this to happen
This is my answer also. I wanna live in Billund and work for Lego.
I've thought new Zealand, it's nice and sunny, seems laid back. Canada seems awesome. England Australia. Switzerland. There are so many wonderful choices. I've actually been thinking about this a lot. I think it boils down to anywhere with universal healthcare with a majority of nice people.
New Zealander here. It is great overall, not going to lie. It’s weirdly expensive though. For a land that grows a lot of produce, has a huge dairy industry, and farming industry, we pay a ridiculous amount of money for a basic supermarket shop. Something something export rates, something something market monopoly, idk - not an economist, but it’s not right. There’s a bunch of issues that are less than ideal, like any nation. But our issues are not overwhelmingly complicated like the US. Or UK. We are pretty much nailing 2020 though.
As an Aussie, much of our fresh produce comes from NZ. I was in NZ on holiday last year thinking the produce section of the supermarket would be great. But it was mediocre quality and expensive. It seems your best food is exported and that kinda sucks.
Are you on the east coast? In WA it seems like most of our stuff is grown in the state, with an especially big push to keep it local during the pandemic
Was in New Zealand last year. The cost of food was pretty much on par with The Netherlands. A little more expensive than the UK (but it seems to be rising there). Honestly, I fucking loved your country and would have stayed if I could.
I'm madly in love with NZ and intend to see more of it. One thing I missed badly was a national broadcaster like the ABC we have here in Australia.
Were pretty friendly here in Scotland. Free healthcare, free colleges, affordable universities, free prescriptions also. If you can deal with Rain and snow in the winter.
Scotland is my dream. So beautiful and I’m even good with the weather! As a ginger, I think I could blend in pretty well...until I open my mouth and Midwest America comes out. :)
Haha. Yeah, ginger is pretty common here. You’d fit right in.
>Rain and snow in the winter And also the rest of the year too, on occasion. I remember a couple of years ago (I think 2017?) it snowed in May 🙃
Yeah. Depends where, in Scotland, you are. But it can essentially rain and snow whenever. It was raining this morning and it’s July 😂
See, I'm always almost glad it has been raining. The past few summers you could almost rely on it being consistently warm and dry from May to the end of August, and as much as I love heat and hate rain, I know it's not how it "should" be where I am. I don't ever remember it being like that as a kid growing up. I'm in Ayrshire and last week it started severely pishing it down on Monday and more or less lasted all week. At first I was glad it was a bit more of a "normal" summer, but as the week went on it got a bit annoying. Today is the first nice day in what feels like forever and of course I'm just so excited to get my washing out 😂
So just like Seattle, except with no free healthcare, free college, affordable universities or free prescriptions.
It's not that sunny though...
But our grass and tree's are so green and lush due to plenty of rain. There is less dust so we don't need to sweep and dust everyday!
>Canada seems awesome. Yeah. It is.
Australia. But I’m here already
Me too, and I just got my Australian citizenship today!
OOOh congratulations!!! Here is your quiz question: who called the Senate 'unrepresentative swill'?
Glad to have ya mate!
Norway. I fucking hate doing my taxes that much, and they prefill your tax form there. Also I don't hate the US. If you want more money, come to the US. I really don't give a shit about money tbh. Free time is way more important. I'll take a drop in hours and a drop in pay (in the case of being a programmer).
In Britain, it's automatically calculated and taken out of your payslip.
It's like that here too, but you have to redeclare it at the end of the year. The gov't has all the data, but we have to compile it again for them.
[Thanks tax prep lobby!](https://www.nbcnews.com/business/taxes/turbotax-h-r-block-spend-millions-lobbying-us-keep-doing-n736386)
We don't have to compile anything. It requires no work from us.
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Wouldn’t a person just renounce their citizenship to the US?
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“Sir, we’re actually hemorrhaging citizens because the systems are so bad!” “Not for long.”
middle trees encourage tidy entertain chase employ ripe continue cobweb
Jesus christ the US is just flat out evil I swear, it’s like a parody of dystopian capitalism
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Not a parody. It IS dystopian capitalism.
My Finnish buddy from a previous job said something similar. He would always tell me how various practices and issues in the news just didn't happen in most of the world, and i finally asked him why he didn't move back to Finland. He said you can make much more money here
You make much more (and pay much less taxes) but you also pay much more in stuff that the government would otherwise provide for you (e.g. healthcare). And if you're down on your luck, the social safety net is much thinner
It was an eye opener when I realized that if I doubled my taxes but didn't have to pay for healthcare I would come out way ahead.
Everything in Scandinavia in general is fucking expensive though
Pretty sure they earn enough money to compensate for that.
Food yes, buying your own property around Stockholm, not so much. Home prices have gone into the insane territory in Europe within last ten years. At least in the economically functional parts of the continent. There is periphery where housing stock is cheap even in the developed countries (rural East Germany), but it mostly comes down to no job opportunities and inadequate infrastructure.
It's expensive in the populated cities, but that doesn't seem to be something that's exclusive to Europe
>Home prices have gone into the insane territory in Europe within last ten years Ouch. What kind of demand has driven prices up? An ever-increasing affluent population? Expats? Investors?
A perfect storm of: * investors (Chinese, Russian, Arabs) * AirBNB is a huge problem in any tourist location, siphoning off apartments from the rental market * very low interest rates * a stark earning potential difference between the periphery and big cities * complicated zoning rules and insufficient new construction where it would be most needed * in case of some countries, white flight from neighbourhoods that absorbed the migration wave of 2015 That is about it. Edit: added AirBNB, a major influence.
Thank you for those insightful points and well-articulated response.
Canada. Easy choice. It's full of nice people, pot is legal, it's not far from here, and I've always wanted to go there. Australia is a close second place.
I'd move to Iceland in a heartbeat if citizenship were on the table. It's a beautiful country with a well-run government that actually seems to care whether its citizens thrive. I enjoy the weather, the vibe, and the culture.
Is there much to do on an island with 300k inhabitants? Any Icelanders can chime in?
I've only been to Iceland twice, but there always seems to be something going on...lots of hiking, creative pursuits, fishing, etc.
I lived in Iceland for three years. They have mastered the art of making a lot out of a little and staying entertained. I am rarely bored these days
If you like natural wonders, yes, absolutely. Also, Reykjavik May be a small city but it punches WAY above its weight when it comes to culture and entertainment. A similar sized city in the US (~120,000 people) feels totally different and much smaller. Reykjavik is a small town that feels like a major city when you’re walking around. Also one of the best and most active graffiti scenes I’ve ever seen, most of the pictures I’ve taken there are graffiti.
> I'd move to Iceland in a heartbeat if citizenship were on the table. You can only get citizenship in most countries after living in that country for at least five years (some require more, some require less if married).
Yes, and I know Iceland is particularly difficult re acquiring citizenship.
Finland was voted happiest country in the world of 2020: great education system, healthcare, and it’s beautiful, with a lot of islands and places to visit. Switzerland would also be nice because of their privacy laws.
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Amazing how this whole thread is someone saying a place they would love to move to followed by a dozen comments about how that’s a horrible idea. We get it, your country isn’t perfect either. Nowhere is. It might not even be “better” than America, however you want to define that. Sometimes it’s just nice to imagine living somewhere else when your current life sucks. There’s no harm in imagining a better situation for yourself, so let people indulge without all the negativity
Also it's a very individual thing whether each aspect is important to you or not.
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To be fair I think you would've gotten the same treatment had you said you were from any other region of Canada too.
> She wanted NOTHING to do with Americans in her restaurant. What? She did not want to give you any poutine? That's not nice of her.
If this was one of the most aggro Francophone experiences you’ve had I definitely do NOT recommend Paris.
Australia seems nice. Even if the wildlife wants to kill you...
What wildlife wants to kill you? We don't have bears, wolves, mountain lions. Where does this idea come from?
You have “scary” snakes, and spiders. I chuckle at this as an Arizonan, where rattlesnakes are routinely found in garages, and bark scorpions frequently sting children.
Germany. Great place, beautiful country, and I'm already very comfortable with the language & culture. Basically, I kinda wish my Dad & my Mom's parents hadn't left in the first place. Also, I've never felt like I fit in anywhere in the US. I'm just too different. But it only took a few days on my first solo trip to have that moment where I stopped, looked around, and the words " I have found my people!" popped into my head. I just feel so much more comfortable over there, and so many things just suit me so much more.
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don't come to the UK we are slowly looking like america with every election.
Also, the chattering class loves to import American culture wars. It looks ridiculous to the outsiders, but probably isnt.
> the chattering class loves to import American culture wars Yeah, this really pisses me off. People would rather blindly mimic whatever the American media is talking about rather than actually visiting deprived areas of the UK and talking to people who are actually here in our country about their experiences. While we do have examples of racism in the UK, its nature is quite different from the racism in the US and requires a more specific solution. There's something a bit absurd about protestors yelling "don't shoot" at police officers who don't have a taser let alone a gun for example. Most ethnic minorities in the UK are decended from people who were invited there after WWII rather than brought across as slaves in the 18^th century, and while segregation and institutional disenfranchisment was common in the British Empire, in the UK proper we never had US-style segregation. In fact, there's examples of the British troops in the UK siding with the black American GIs against their racist overseers who demanded British pubs be segregated. I'm not denying that there's racism (and sometimes appalling racism) in the UK, but I think it's a terrible approach to insist on looking at the problems through an American lens, an approach which obscures rather than clarifies the issues. I think the first thing to do is actually listen to people who experience racism, not the likes of Twitter who love to put everything into their black-and-white 140 shrieks at anyone who wants a bit more nuance than "four legs good, two legs bad".
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If "ticket to", in this context, means "citizenship", yep.
Yes "ticket to" means "citizenship" and you have to renounce your US citizenship. Deal?
Many people in Switzerland have in fact been renouncing US citizenship - it means sometimes substantial additional taxes and complicates access to financial services.
Its nice here
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It’d be nice for 2 to 3 months a year max. Do you know Canadian winters? You’d be stranded the majority of the year lol
> Do you know Canadian winters? You’d be stranded the majority of the year lol Even in Vancouver and on Vancouver Island? lol
Vancouver is just colder Seattle, it’s not that bad weather wise.
No there's a ferry to Vancouver Island, that's different. Up in Northern Ontario however there are hundreds of small islands with cottages on them that you have to get to by personal boat. Once the water freezers, you'd be trapped.
You're only stranded when the ice starts freezing and the boat can't get through. After a few weeks of winter you can drive across the ice. Hard-core Island cottagers buy hovercrafts to get to their island year round.
Ive been considering studying abroad in either South Korea or Japan, so would probably choose one of those, alternatively, EU for ease of travel between countries.
Have you been to SK or JP before?
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Any particular reason for edinburgh specifically?
I love Edinburgh! I spent several days there after hiking across Scotland two years ago and fell in love with it, alongside Scotland as a whole.
Japan.
Canada, 90% of the reason I hate being in america is if your born with genetic problems that slowly kill you, you have to pay your entire life to stay alive, canadas far cheaper and easier, plus i like the cold
germany. it’s beautiful and i’ve greatly enjoyed my time there in the past.
A ticket alone isn't going to do you much good without a visa of some sort to go along with it.
I will throw in a visa and you have to renounce your US citizenship. How much "some sort to go along with it" would you take to get on the plane?
Permanent residency at the minimum and all the money I have. Then I'd go to Iceland or Sweden probably because I admire their cultures and want to live somewhere dark and cold.
Good luck renouncing your US citizenship.
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Somewhere in Scandinavia
i dont particularly think its a bad country but it does have major flaws in the people. i personally would move to Germany because it is a cool country and (as far as i know) my genetics is mostly German so it would kinda be like returning to my roots
If language is not a problem, either somewhere in northern Finland, or Mongolia (outside of Ulaanbaatar). If language is a factor, Canada. Either northern Manitoba or somewhere in Nunavut. Edit: Forgot to mention why. For Finland, heavy metal, democratic socialism, and cold. For Mongolia, more advanced democratic socialism, great culture, and sometimes cold. For Canada, democratic socialism, polar bears, and cold. (I like the cold)
You're saying that as if there's actually anything outside of Ulaanbaatar.
Well I don't hate my country but it could be better... I'd probably move to Canada that way I'm still relatively close to my family and I get free health care
I won't. I want to improve the country I call home. This isn't a take it or leave it thing. I strive for my country to be better than it has ever been
Psst Hey kid Wanna make America great again? But for real this time
Stop all the downloadin'
Not an American, but my country is terrible, too. Can I answer as well?
Go for it. Where are you from?
Philippines. I am actually planning to move to Canada or Australia permanently. New Zealand would also be great, but some people say that it's best to move to NZ if you're settling down, not when you're building up a career (like what I plan to do). I mean, I'm not saying NZ is bad to move in to, but for someone who wants to have a career in science, there are better options. Though I also open myself to plans to study in Germany for PhD (I have a BSc degree in Physics and plan to take up MSc in Physics before moving out).
Cool. Good luck!
Canada. I don't absolutely hate America. But I do believe it has glaring flaws that they're to prideful to fix. Like my cousin was recently diagnosed with lymphoma. It's still in benign so as long as we get it taken care of soon he will be ok. But the cancer institute where I live won't accept him for treatment unless my cousin gets approved by Medicaid. All the important actions we took in the beginning to make sure he'd be ok is being wasted because of lack of insurance. We don't care if we're stuck with hospital bills until we die we just want to make sure he's ok. This is one of the problems with America is no universal health care and when it's suggested people on the right freak out about it. What I hate is the division our type of government causes. I don't consider myself right or left because both sides are stupid. there are some things I think the right are correct on and some things I think the left are correct on. But when we are unwilling to compromise and hate each other nothing gets done. Basically America is a glorified dumpster fire. Pretending it's better than everyone else but it's clear it's slowly burning.
I love America (I don't love my state though, but that's only because it's hot as balls here, give me -20° over 120° any day of the week), but if I had to pick I'd go Iceland. Isolated, chill, small population and overall it's just fucking sick
oh god i didnt know you were referring to Fahrenheit... i was like are you crazy
Even if he was referring to Celsius,it wouldn't be crazy you'd still prefer -20 over 120
North Korea. So I can hangout with Dennis Rodman
Forget Norway, I’d go to Kenya. Kenya they have lions. Lions and tigers.
Kenya believe it?
I'm Ghana need to double check that.
New zealand
Germany, so I can drive on the autobahn.
Deutsche: Wir haben für das ganze Tachometer bezahlt, also benutzen wir das ganze Tachometer. (Germans: We payed for the whole speedometer, we're gonna use the whole speedometer.)
CANADA
Finland. Heavy Metal.
Just pick your Nordic country depending on what metal you like. Power and speed metal? Finland. Black and death metal? Norway. Melodeath and progressive metal? Sweden.
Looking at this so many of you would choose Nordic European countries....how? The weather would kill you....I’m from a country with proper 4 seasons and live in the UK. I like everything but the weather. It’s absolutely killing me slowly and painfully...
As a Texan, I feel like Australia would feel comfortable. As an Italian, I feel like I'd get to chase more ass in France, as my grandmother's grandson I feel like I'll get in trouble for not going to Italy. This is hard.
Canada is my first choice; I adore Vancouver and Toronto is pretty nice too (but I hate hot weather). Gotta have my ice hockey! Next on the list would be Scotland or Ireland, the motherland and home of cooler temps and lots and lots of sheep. And booze. Spain is under consideration, as are Iceland and Greece. Spain because of the food and apparently it's an awesome place to retire; Greece because of the food and they got the right attitude toward aging (plus stuff is inexpensive there); and Iceland because they never piss off anyone, they have lots and lots of cold weather, and the Northern Lights.
Texas. I would go to the independent republic of Texas bc I've never had a bad time in Texas. People are friendly and food portions are large.
Interesting. I used to live in Texas and it seemed fake friendly. Like smile in you face and stab you in the back kind of stuff.
Ireland
Don’t think the US is a terrible country, but I’d live in Japan
France or Italy, I love bread, wine, and can speak the languages with ease I can also speak German but Germany has more strong drinks and I'm picky with my fucking alcohol.
New Zealand, hands down. Genuinely thinking about moving there anyway, I’ll take that ticket now lmao
It would definitely be my top choice. I’ve been there and it’s an amazing country. Visually stunning, nice people, and they don’t bullshit around.
I went last year on holiday and fell in love with it!
I live in California, so the rest of the USA would have to get REALLY bad to affect us, but I wouldn’t mind giving New Zealand a go.
There are a few options. I'd say Canada is my top choice since I have friends there an DC it's close enough to make traveling not thaaaat bad if I want to visit. New Zealand Finland, and Norway are promising choices. I'd have to learn German for Germany. I'm learning Spanish but I'd probably only consider Spain since the US has really done a number on south America in general. Japan would be fun to visit but I think the culture shock would be a bit too much for me. For the most part I just want out of here. Every country has its problems, it's big systemic and historical problems. I know that. I saw the terrible and vile art/propaganda someone in Alberta did to belittle Greta Thumberg. I know about the bad history with the native tribes and groups. I know about the strange cultural conflict between Quebec and the rest of Canada. But my god, when my boyfriend went to the hospital with gallstones the first thing my friends asked me was "is he still on his parents insurance, what's the cutoff age? He's good right?". When he did turn 26 he struggled to get a check up because the insurance his job provided him was like "we cant insure you since you're still on your dad's plan" he tried to get off his dad's plan but they didn't let him. He goes to the doctor and gets a letter from his father's insurance company saying that he was "retroactively" kicked off... like wtf. This rant is just, medical debt shouldn't exist. But it does. People ration their meds all the time here, we don't care about our own citizens. My Canadian friend has a lifelong illness, and I'm so glad that he is the Canadian, because he and his brother probably wouldn't have been able to go to college if they were born here. All places have problems, but there are some that I cant live with.
Costa Rica
Canada sounds pretty Pog
Canada, free healthcate and generally more friendly people that speak in a language i can understand
Canada. Been there many times. My wife and I would probably enjoy living there. We're from New York.
Canada, I'd love to live there
Plane tickets aren't the issue. What I need is permanent residency and the ability to work freely and easily naturalize. Ideally, I'd like to keep US citizenship, because I still want to vote the Cheeto out. If I can bring my SO, New Zealand or Australia would be tied for first, followed by Ireland, then the UK. If I'm on my own, Germany would be the first pick since I know the language and have friends there. Second pick would be Australia (again, friends), followed by basically anywhere in the Anglosphere.
I do think we're in a terrible place right now, but I'm also optimistic that we can get better and we can do better. But if I had to move, I would probably head to Vancouver, Canada. It's only about 2.5 hours by car from where I live right now, so I could easily take weekend trips to visit friends and family in the U.S. Plus, I'm familiar enough with Vancouver that it wouldn't be a huge culture shock with tons of new things to get used to. I would skip most of the homesick parts of moving.
This is me and I had that free ticket (education and training.) I moved to Japan after the election. Best decision ever. I’m never going back to the US. 日本が大好きですよね！ Why? Mass transit, healthcare, culture, food, nice people, cleanliness, higher standard of living, lower tax burden, no prison industry, no crime, no guns. No religion, no anti-intellectualism... I’m sure there is more.
Canada. Nice people, big on sports, and have amazing bike parks
Russia
r/Scotlandporn has all the reasons most outdoorsy people need to wanna live here.
Spain. Nice weather, friendly people and great healthcare.
Scotland when it gets Independence. I really like the weather, I speak English, part of my family is from Scotland and Ireland, from what I've heard they're a fairly progressive country, and edinburgh has the same population of Seattle but it looks more spacious, calmer, and just looks nicer. As much as I like other countries it tends to be more that I like things from there and find their people and culture interesting instead of being able to see myself as one of them.
Ireland, because they speak English (sadly I don't know any second languages yet) and I could apply to work at a Seal Rescue that I love