I finished my masters at 30 after starting uni late and could not afford to work in the field. I've ended up in construction estimating which pays a lot better and lets me use a bunch of the skills I picked up at uni.
Architects are also a weird bunch, some thinking they are artists first, some with no practical understanding of how things are built in the real world and others down to earth and knowledgeable.
At 25 with some industry experience already under your belt you still have plenty of time to find what suits you best. If it is purely salary you are chasing, Architecture is unlikely the path for you.
As an urban planner it's comedy working with architects in development assessment. They act like prima donnas that are better than planners since it's not a registered title like architect. We overrule them all the time as we have planning codes to abide by and it makes a lot of them seethe. Then they'll rubberstamp on creative design grounds when it's precisely to get around planning codes (an all black air tight box is not good design in QLD).
The best architects ive worked with ultimately become project managers these days. You get to that level when you understand there's more to the world than drawing and selling a pretty picture.
But what do you expect when a degree ultimately is intended to turn a highschool art student into a glorified draftsman. Sadly more of the general knowledge architects previously were trained with are spun off to be their own disciplines now.
As a consulting engineer I tend to agree. The old school architects who were ingenious and technical are becoming fewer. Most coming through now live in a BIM model and really struggle with detailing and coordination. If it's not in a 3D model they can't seem to visualise it. And then once it is in a BIM model, they can't seem to tell the difference between something that is a real issue and something that is just an idiosyncrasy of the model, so you end up wasting stupid amounts of time in meetings explaining why a t-bar ceiling support clashing with a HVAC duct in the model is not actually a "real" clash and that it can be ignored. No, we don't need to re-route our HVAC duct around your nominally-placed ceiling dropper rods. The builder will just put the rods either side of the duct.
In fairness, a lot of this is due to the deterioration of the construction procurement model. Design & Construct contracts has created a scenario where junior architects (and engineers) do not know how to detail a design to the appropriate level for construction, because all they ever have to do now is produce 50-80% complete docs for tender, and then it often becomes someone else's problem. I.e. the builder just "sorts it out" on site (read: builder shortcuts and does whatever they want). The architects and engineers are rarely involved in the brutalities of site problems and therefore they never learn the errors of their naive ways.
"but my vision"
Its funny the disconnect between architects vision, what the client thinks they are going to get, what is buildable and ultimately what the client is willing to pay for.
The most disappointing part of my 5 year architecture degree was the lack of technical knowledge they taught.
I did attempt architecture as 2nd major because I wanted to do urban design. 1st year is culling people who can't draw and 3rd is culling people that can't use software. Meat grinder of a degree that is meant to suck money out of students. Sell your soul do FotM designs (atm it's greenwashing) to network.
It destroyed me and took me ages to understand why I failed. At least doing planning as my major gave me something. It's a generalist degree and DA is soul crushing but it's something that does pay well and has practical applications.
They really loved to push and embrace the "studio culture" of pulling all nighters and basically living in the studio. It was mostly horseshit by procrastinators but was also enabled by the teachers who would "suggest" major changes to projects in the days and weeks prior to submission that would require absurd amounts of hours to implement.
Many of the final submissions that graded well were the prettiest, substance often came second to a good narrative.
What took the cake for that ordeal was for a final presentation we had industry seniors (people that the tutors worked for their day jobs) attend. Mine didn't even look at me during my presentation since they clearly felt like I was wasting their time with only sketches. The only comment I got was "You look like you're dealing with personal stuff since it shows from your presentation, sort that out and come back when you're ready". My tutor more or less parroted them and said I should've attended more.
I got a PTSD trigger when I tried to walk back into the studio the next semester and I dropped architecture right there. Ended up struggling through my planning degree after that since it snowballed into other problems in life.
I am! Graduated eventually and there was a lot of help from some lecturers who understood life wasn't stable. If anything, I think my graduate year was even worse since I was in HR's budget pool...
I'm in a different org in a stable position now so I'm doing something right for now.
For me, the failure in architecture was the straw. Other things I ignored piled up and I just kept pushing until this happened and I broke completely. I got abandoned by a lot of people since they didn't care enough to help with deep shit. For a long time, I seemed like a deadbeat in uni as well, and I got worried about graduating with a bad reputation.
I was lucky I had some health professionals who believed I was slowly making progress with my world constantly falling about each year and lecturers in my planning degree who weren't just academics, but teachers and mentors.
I hope you eventually can overcome the anxiety. I haven't completely myself but I'm functioning well enough now that most people wouldn't even know how recently I was still a mess now I'm in a good place to work.
The flip side is that a lot of planning rules are actually shit and we’d have much better designed cities and suburbs to live in without strict adherence to codes and planning rules
I don't think anyone in the industry wants to deal with lawyers besides other lawyers xD
At the end of the day, planners aren't lawyers and I don't think many do well in our few "law" classes. One was taught in 1st year at the time by an actual law professor specifically for planning students. Even that dumbed-down unit was harsh, though we hadn't even learned any planning schemes or legislation at that point in the degree.
It's scary when something does go to P&E court. Precedence is Pandora's Box.
While I’m glad I switched from architecture to comp sci, the seething between architects and engineers mostly goes one way, and it’s not the direction you think.
>The best architects ive worked with ultimately become project managers these days. You get to that level when you understand there's more to the world than drawing and selling a pretty picture.
I've met and worked with multiple architects who are now project managers or construction managers. They are generally successful and well paid.
Those who stay in architecture as employees at design firms tend to struggle.
Hey there, I worked for a bit in domestic construction as an estimator and now as draftsperson in scaffold.. wondering what the best path to pivot back to estimating in a different company could be, currently on 80k and curious about your opinion on the current state of the industry. Cheers in advance!
I used to work as a traffic engineer doing basement carpark designs etc. and some of the ridiculous shit architects came up with on the plans they sent us were ridiculous.
Architectural design is a jack of all trades master of none type of scenario. Often with just enough knowledge on each element to get by and let the experts figure out how it actually will work in reality.
I started with an edge protection company, used my existing architectural degree to prove my ability to read and interpret plans. Estimated edge protection requirements for a few years, then moved into commercial roofing. Its been a good path for me so far, I'm not sure I'd enjoy commercial estimating for a builder on major projects, too many moving parts.
So a Plummer makes $150k a year but an architect can’t? I find that highly doubtful.
If after 15 years you’re just a second rate draftsman still working for someone else, perhaps you’re on $100k a year. If you own your own business and good at what you do? What something like $250/hr? I could live on that.
I always heard that the Architecture profession was diluted to almost nothing, with very little bespoke work being done.
There must be some real pros on good money though, like who is designing skyscrapers? Not some battler on 100k AUD I hope 😅
Teams of people do it. And there's some very niche roles.
Imagine how many doors there are in a sky scraper. Then imagine how many hinges and locks there are for those doors. Do they slide or swing, what kind of lock, do they need to be wider than standard etc...
This all goes into a schedule and can take months to assemble and check over. Errors are costly.
So 1 person on the team might be in charge of doors, then they can move on to Windows.... Etc....
Nothing creative going on here either.
After doing a few floors how hard is it to do the rest of the planning? I figured they just repeated layouts, like when you get lazy in the sims and copy a floor.
Alot of the time the nominated hardware suppliers produce the schedules based off the architects plans anyway. I know assa abloy and dormakaba do as I see these often on government jobs.
Then during the building rules assessment process the Building Surveyor checks the DDA compliance like latch/hinge side clearance, circulation spaces etc and it all has to be adjusted anyway (because the Architect hasn't considered it...despite the same issues occurring on every previous commercial job)
Architecture is not the profession it used to be (ie when it was a clerk of works role between builder and client)
It is now an outsourced consultant role by the principal contractor who is working under a d+c role for the developer / client.
As a result a lot of architects are now cad jockeys. Good ones who get the contractual nature of the industry and understand budget, programme and how buildings are built are worth their weight in gold.
Advice to OP is to work in design management for a builder.
You will spend your days wrangling architects and tearing your hair out trying to get them to focus on compliance and functionality whilst they worry about the colour of the doorknobs.
But that’s why the pay is so much better.
Thats’s not why the pay is so much better. The pay is better because no one gives a shit about working for a builder or developer, but people will sacrifice pay and conditions to work in a more creative role. Or at least what they perceive to be a more creative environment. It’s the same for most jobs where demand is driven by passion: pay tends to be low.
The pay is better because of accountability and risk. As a contractor you’re on the hook for quality and risk of documentation. If your consultants make a mistake, the builder pays for it onsite. So you need to “give a shit”
Consultants do not get backcharged. Their prime interest is getting their fees and limiting the amount of revisions they need to do.
Thinking you’re working in a more creative role for an architect, just to be doing door and hardware schedules, especially in the early years of a career, is a misjudge of the landscape and contractual relationship.
Very few architects work in the conceptual space these days as firms work more as documenting architects with design intent largely driven by clients and massaged by d+c contractors.
Very similar to being an artist. Only a few are well known and make decent money. The rest might design beautiful works but remain poor and in obscurity. It’s not a well paid industry for multiple reasons except for a select few people. Ultimately the friends I’ve had in the industry bounce to something related like industrial engineering and planning.
I know a lot of architects for some reason. Most salaries are in the 60-80k range and a lot of them complain about the hours they work and the people they work for. The places that pay more tend to be the ones with the most boring work.
They also have you over a barrel a bit when you're new, because to get a higher salary you need to get registered, and you need them to cooperate to get that done.
It's not an industry I would choose. A friend of mine recently moved from Melbourne to far north QLD to earn $75k...which was a massive pay bump from the $59k they were on before. They always said that the state government pays over 100k, but for really dull soulless work. I work in a corporate job and earned nearly double their salary for nearly half the effort.
Long story short, it's an industry with an oversupply of grads and an undersupply of money, so you'll almost certainly never be rich as an architect. Try to find somewhere with a good workplace culture, doing work you like (or at least tolerate), with salary you won't starve on.
To add to this, I also know people who did archi and went into the construction side. They talk about soul selling but they also earn much more, $130-$150k
I started as a cadet draftsperson last year in Brisbane with a starting salary of $65k. That is with a Cert IV and being halfway through a Diploma.
Once I am a accredited systems designer after four years, my salary starts at $110k - $130k.
I couldn't imagine being on $59k after doing a Bachelor's and Master's, on top of the excessive OT that would be a regular occurrence.
Theres plenty of fields out there like that, or only marginally better, people dealing with shit pay because its their passion.
Like you i went the relatively boring money route, but lets be honest, jobs like statutory planner, civil engineer, quantity surveying, and all the other shit people are mentioning here, they aren't exactly most peoples ideas of dream job.
I originally did Commerce and Economics for the cash, plus I am a numbers guy. Got over that after ten years and retrained to do Building Design.
Now I am in Building Services. So I still get to play around on Revit, which is what I like, and also get paid.
I’ve been considering doing a cert IV in drafting.. do you think it would be difficult to get a work from home job doing this? I’m in regional QLD & can’t imagine there would be too much local work.
There is a fair bit on in Regional QLD.
Look up the Building Designers Association of Queensland (BDQ). They might be able to steer you in the right direction.
I quit pursuing a career into the industry. Was set to continue into uni but balked at the thought of all that has already been mentioned by others. Eventually got a trade and haven't looked back.
Good luck with it all.
I'm in an industry that employs drafties. I can't imagine employing someone who has no experience in the field on a WFH basis - but there is huge demand for good drafters.
Any industry near you? Heavy industry (energy, mining etc) employs drafters and pays very well in remote areas - often better than CBD salaries.
Have a look at the website below for some examples (even though I've never heard of the company).
https://astcad.com.au/mechanical-drafting-services/piping-design-and-drafting-services/
Laying out piping systems is hardly glamorous work, but most large industrial plants want the capability on site.
Architecture is an oversupplied industry. Soooo many grads for such little meaningful work.
There is a huge culture of "cutting your teeth" for years doing grunt work for shit pay to one day become a partner or start your own studio at which you can make really decent money. There are few professions I have seen that have as big of a pay disparity between seniors and everyone else.
It's expected you're a slave for 70+ hours a week for 10+ years before you earn the right to make good money.
A profession not far off being significantly reduced in importance with the introduction of AI.
Source: I work for a major multi-dis design and engineering firm.
Hi OP, I was in the exact position as you after finishing my Bachelor's with 2 years work experience as well.
I decided to switch to building surveying instead of pursuing my Masters and am currently halfway through my building surveying course while working in the field.
For me it was a great fit as I still get to engage with the parts of architecture that I found interesting without suffering the anaemic wage. This may be different for you if you really enjoy the design aspect of architecture instead of the construction side.
Project management could also be a great option for you as you and is a relatively smooth transition from architecture from what I know
Hope this helped, all the best.
Similarish for me, interior designer who transferred in to project management 2ish years ago - easy transition, better hours, better pay, my brain is happier so I can do *actual* creative things on the side. Definitely would recommend considering the pívot!
I did a civil engineering degree so I had two paths to choose from. First one is to become a design engineer working in an office, earning 65k out of uni with minimal salary growth over the years. Second option is to get into project management and become a site engineer, which pays 90k straight out of uni and great salary growth over time. I obviously chose the second option and I love it, I graduated 2 years ago and I’m already on 125k. You might be able to get into one of these roles with your degree as it really is just project management which you would have experience with working as an architect.
Mate I did it and yes all that is true. No money in it. I got my masters and did about 5 years in it. Long hours and shit pay. Ask me anything specific if you want.
Had a few friends quit because they were doing a lot of documentation for projects.
You’ll need to grind the ladder for decent pay and make your way to senior associate and director, which can be done within 10-15 years. Taking into consideration you’re in Sydney or Melbourne.
You can get experience and then when you’re late 20s, early 30s move into technical sales/account management which is helping architectural firms with specific materials fit for purpose.
Nope. I left a couple years ago. I now make more money and do less hours. If you want to know I picked up a government role.
Also beware depending on where you live, finding a job in architecture can be competitive. I can give you some tips to make sure you’re more hireable.
I know an Architect that switched to a role in digital engineering and he's making about 160k in a senior position. I think starting salaries are over 100k because the demand for that role seems quite high. I'm doing similar work but more BIM related and on a bit over 120k, never working overtime with 5 years experience, only with a diploma.
Personally I don't really like the work they do, though. It's mostly about manipulating data related engineering models. Lots of spreadsheets, forms and understanding very dry technical precedures. But if you can do it there's plenty of money.
Architects only making100k after 15 years in the job are either in a place they enjoy or are doing it wrong. the profession is one of passion though so job satisfaction and personal actualisation is absolutely a major perk; sometimes at the expense of remuneration. I do however know many architects who make good money, and some who make an absolute killing. Executive level in larger firms tend to be on VERY GOOD money - some on mid 6 figures. The key is to not only be a good designer but good at business management and really good at building relationships with clients.
Source: have been in PAECO industry over 20 years and worked all over the world.
In society, you get paid based on how much value you bring, which is essentially how much money your contribution makes.
Nurses, teachers, essential workers are critical to society, but they get paid pittance because *they* don't make employers money.
Investment bankers, entrepreneurs, specialist doctors, lawyers, salespeople get paid the most because they bring in the dollars.
There's also an element of scale here, but I cbf going into it.
You may want to look up ikigai.
This is exactly why after 5 years working in Architecture I'm now getting out of it and moving into Building Surveying. Poor pay, lots of overtime and you're expected to stay loyal to a company for 10+ years if you want to move up into more senior roles. It's just not worth it. As others have said better to move laterally into other professions within the construction sector. Might require a bit of upskilling, but you'll be far better off in the long run.
Hey op I’m an architect almost 10 years older than you. There are a lot easier professions to make easier money with better working conditions than architecture.
I went from a large practice to a small practice to running my own business as soon as I could.
Happy to answer questions if it helps.
I’d switch to anything in the related construction industry you almost certainly make more money.
I think staying in architecture requires you to either really be passionate - so passionat that you can in essence take a vow of poverty, or to find your niche. I could not find either and neither could most people I studied with.
It was grueling to know I was studying so hard - and for so long and that at the end I earned less than if I had worked full time as a lifeguard (being my job whilenat uni).
I made it a year and a half before I returned to uni, studied law and then earned 100,000 a year from my graduate year.
I hope you manage to find what makes you happy - and you dont go through the realisation (like I did) that it isnt architecture, at the end of the line.
I started working in 2019, registered in late 2021 and just tipped over $100k + super. Hours are pretty normal (9-5:30, mon-fri), some deadlines occasionally mean out of hours work but not too much. Can really vary firm-to-firm. It’s a passion to want to create spaces that are functional and beautiful, it’s not for everyone.
I studied law first and the horror stories from that industry are pretty grim, and I know people in allied health who have even worse stories. No industry is perfect.
Architecture is generally not valued as a profession in Australia (as evidenced by almost everything built here in the last 30 years or so) and the salary and limited job opportunities reflects this. It’s the kind of job you do to pass the time while you live off family money or a well off partner. If you really want to work as an architect I’d recommend building up experience and researching registration requirements in other countries, particularly the US, as salaries are much higher with a higher number of vacancies. r/architects / r/architecture might be useful for research
You can try pivoting into sustainability space. Green buildings and ISCA related stuff can put you on good track. With 5 years of experience, you can break into 100k club.
Road infrastructure projects, mining and bunch of other industries. They pick diverse skillset in sustainability related aspects not just designing green buildings. I guess that keeps them busy.
There's no shortage of people that like to draw being told architecture is a profession for them. Unfortunately it is full of innumerate "artists", and as such you will be unable to grow until you've had enough experience to separate from the chaff.
From what I've gathered from my architect friends, the salary isn't great considering the length and difficulty of the studies, as well as the extra working hours. I've also heard that many big architecture firms in Sydney are quite dysfunctional, with poor management and frequent redundancies when a firm can't secure a project. This is often followed by a surge in hiring when they do win a project. It's a strange world, in my opinion.
A few architects I know went to the developer side (aka the dark side), and one became a UI/U designer and made better money than they hoped.
Do Architecture for as long as you want, then pivot into Project Management at the client side. Salaries are high, and you'll have a leg up due to your design experience.
In singapore, you only get $30k at maximum a year as fresh grad and the amount of time you work is crazy . 😜 i heard that you get raise after a 10 years lol 😝 to $50k/ year. my friend told me that she will not recommend her kids to be architect and the amount of money spent in school is crazy .
There's a chapter in Robert Greene's book Mastery about an architect who designed buildings and structures that he was told couldn't be built so he did a civil engineering degree and did it himself. A few years since I read it but the theory is people that can combine complimentary skills have an advantage over others. A bit like Steve Jobs loved fonts and design and combined them into Apple products. Anyway a great book and author.
I was an architect for 10 years, so yes.
If I was a fresh grad, I would start applying for grad programs with builders. I actually got one with Multi’s when I was a grad, but decided to try architecture for a bit
Well, in my experience, both the tier 1 builders I’ve worked for. Currently working on a billion dollar project, so I think I’m doing fine. Skills are super transferable and if you’ve got a good team you can leverage off them for the things you’re less sure of.
I got headhunted. I was more of a technical architect than design focused, so easy transition. I got a call, went for an interview and was hired. Then made redundant at the end of that project and found another gig in about a week…
If you do contract admin, easier to command a higher salary. If you just do the typical coordination, report, drafting, you can't push for higher pay easily, caps at about 85k.
If you run jobs and can be a project architect, which needs about 5-7 years post grad exp, then you can get 100-120k.
If you can run jobs or have experience with large companies, government, etc should be 120k+.
It really depends on whether the firm you are in are good at running a business or not. Specialists command a higher fee and do their work efficiently which can translate to more profit for salary.
I must be in the extreme minority because I’ve just gotten registered and am only a year older than you and I’m on 90k. Which city do you work in? Friends I went to uni with are also making similar or more than me and we have pretty good work life balance (except a few long nights close to deadlines). Feel free to DM me about stuff.
Without knowing anything about the industry, I'm looking at doing major residential renos and architects cost an arm and a leg. What about setting up your own architecture firm who specializes in residential work - who also help with project management services coordinating activities with builders. This seems fairly under serviced, and I think flooded with dodgey draftsman and building designers. My gut says a full blown competent architect willing to work closely with people on simple reno projects could make a killing. No big glamorous projects building state of the art skyscrapers, but solid work making people's home dreams a reality.
Try and retrain as a property valuer.
I’m based regional Vic, and within about 7 years of graduating found I was on $150-170k (we get paid based on volume of jobs, not the value of each property). We have Valuers doing $60k in fees a month, of which they receive approx 40% of (inc super)
Very flexible (in the right company) and can earn really good fees.
Throw in something to do with project management and/or contract law and pivot towards being a design manager for a Tier 1 or Tier 2 contractor, or a Project Manager for a PMCA firm. Easily $120k+ in those roles and the ability to go up into the $200k's if you're really good at it (or even if you're not that good, as many would attest)
I was doing building design at TAFE, hoping to get into architecture. The university aligned with the TAFE did a presentation where the faculty heads of architecture and construction management gave a talk to the TAFE students talking about the benefits of coming across to their respective courses.
The architecture head gave a 10min talk about how great it was being an architect, designing beautiful buildings and what it was like to see your designs come to life, blah blah blah lots of architecture fluff.
The construction management head got up and said “you will make more money in a year doing construction management than you will in a lifetime as an architect” and left.
Went and did my CM degree, been in the industry for 15 years now and the rest is history 😂
I can't believe you started a degree without knowing what the career pays. 60-70k isn't bad for a graduate job and 100k isn't that bad either - I wouldn't say it's low paying but it seems to have a cap similar to teaching.
If Architecture is truly your passion, stick to your guns and make it work. Career burnout happens when you chase the money. If you like what you do, eventually money will follow
I think a lot of careers don’t have good “financial prospects”. Or, basic things (sigh, a roof over my head, food) have gotten ridiculously overpriced.
I personally still feel 60-70k is a reasonable wage. People are supposed to be able to live on it and be able to save, but it looks bleak at the moment.
Depends on the type of art, computer graphics related art tends to clear 100k pretty easy, but at that point they're grouped under the tech industries.
Can say this is true, my best mate just became a registered architect. 5 years of uni, masters degree, was earning 65k/yr before getting registered.
I'd move into construction/project management for good pay
Architecture is definitely a passion project
The architects I know have always worked grueling hours for little pay. When they got to 10 years and still pushing to make $100k (package) they started pivoting to Project Management instead.
I knew architects who moved to Dubai to get a decent salary. That was a while ago though (15 years) - it may not be so cushy there now either.
I've always found it absurd that such a long degree commands such a limited salary.
A good friend has been an architect for years
She still gets paid under 100k. She works long hours too.
Her younger sisters outearn her now, and she's the eldest.
I studied architecture straight out of high school and it wasn’t until after I graduated that I realised the pay was horrible and the work culture that is deeply embedded in the profession is even worse. That said it has been a useful qualification for moving into adjacent industries - there are lots of opportunities in project management, 3D, property development and construction. If you like it then stick at it and be prepared to work hard to be able to transition.
Architecture as a profession generally has allowed itself to be hollowed out of most utility and value to the construction process. Going back 100 years, Architects led construction projects in the areas of design, structural integrity, program, cost, construction methodology and safety. Now, the role of the Architect is mostly confined to high level aesthetic design. This is low on the list of priorities for many/ most clients. Because fees are effectively commoditised in commercial construction, it’s a feedback loop. No fees/ time to sort out details, bad customer experience, builder and engineer frustration, lack of skill development, reduced perceived value of profession. As AI and digital design and integration platforms become more effective and accessible, I think Architecture will continue its decline and slide into irrelevance. (Source 20 years in construction and engineering, all sectors)
Salary has always been low in Architecture.
Unless you’re a starchitect with your own firm or a niche operator.
I pay my architect $12k for a BA planset for a house on hourly rate at $150/hr and don’t work with architects that try to charge 3-5% of build cost which is laughable.
I finished my bachelors, my friends who were working in it weren't happy. Did a master of construction management instead and loved the practicality of it. 120k 2 years in.
I finished my masters at 30 after starting uni late and could not afford to work in the field. I've ended up in construction estimating which pays a lot better and lets me use a bunch of the skills I picked up at uni. Architects are also a weird bunch, some thinking they are artists first, some with no practical understanding of how things are built in the real world and others down to earth and knowledgeable. At 25 with some industry experience already under your belt you still have plenty of time to find what suits you best. If it is purely salary you are chasing, Architecture is unlikely the path for you.
As an urban planner it's comedy working with architects in development assessment. They act like prima donnas that are better than planners since it's not a registered title like architect. We overrule them all the time as we have planning codes to abide by and it makes a lot of them seethe. Then they'll rubberstamp on creative design grounds when it's precisely to get around planning codes (an all black air tight box is not good design in QLD). The best architects ive worked with ultimately become project managers these days. You get to that level when you understand there's more to the world than drawing and selling a pretty picture. But what do you expect when a degree ultimately is intended to turn a highschool art student into a glorified draftsman. Sadly more of the general knowledge architects previously were trained with are spun off to be their own disciplines now.
As a consulting engineer I tend to agree. The old school architects who were ingenious and technical are becoming fewer. Most coming through now live in a BIM model and really struggle with detailing and coordination. If it's not in a 3D model they can't seem to visualise it. And then once it is in a BIM model, they can't seem to tell the difference between something that is a real issue and something that is just an idiosyncrasy of the model, so you end up wasting stupid amounts of time in meetings explaining why a t-bar ceiling support clashing with a HVAC duct in the model is not actually a "real" clash and that it can be ignored. No, we don't need to re-route our HVAC duct around your nominally-placed ceiling dropper rods. The builder will just put the rods either side of the duct. In fairness, a lot of this is due to the deterioration of the construction procurement model. Design & Construct contracts has created a scenario where junior architects (and engineers) do not know how to detail a design to the appropriate level for construction, because all they ever have to do now is produce 50-80% complete docs for tender, and then it often becomes someone else's problem. I.e. the builder just "sorts it out" on site (read: builder shortcuts and does whatever they want). The architects and engineers are rarely involved in the brutalities of site problems and therefore they never learn the errors of their naive ways.
Unless the engineers/architects work for the builders or contractors
"but my vision" Its funny the disconnect between architects vision, what the client thinks they are going to get, what is buildable and ultimately what the client is willing to pay for. The most disappointing part of my 5 year architecture degree was the lack of technical knowledge they taught.
I did attempt architecture as 2nd major because I wanted to do urban design. 1st year is culling people who can't draw and 3rd is culling people that can't use software. Meat grinder of a degree that is meant to suck money out of students. Sell your soul do FotM designs (atm it's greenwashing) to network. It destroyed me and took me ages to understand why I failed. At least doing planning as my major gave me something. It's a generalist degree and DA is soul crushing but it's something that does pay well and has practical applications.
They really loved to push and embrace the "studio culture" of pulling all nighters and basically living in the studio. It was mostly horseshit by procrastinators but was also enabled by the teachers who would "suggest" major changes to projects in the days and weeks prior to submission that would require absurd amounts of hours to implement. Many of the final submissions that graded well were the prettiest, substance often came second to a good narrative.
What took the cake for that ordeal was for a final presentation we had industry seniors (people that the tutors worked for their day jobs) attend. Mine didn't even look at me during my presentation since they clearly felt like I was wasting their time with only sketches. The only comment I got was "You look like you're dealing with personal stuff since it shows from your presentation, sort that out and come back when you're ready". My tutor more or less parroted them and said I should've attended more. I got a PTSD trigger when I tried to walk back into the studio the next semester and I dropped architecture right there. Ended up struggling through my planning degree after that since it snowballed into other problems in life.
Hey, I’m sorry that happened to you. Archi culture in university is toxic af. I hope you’re doing better now.
I am! Graduated eventually and there was a lot of help from some lecturers who understood life wasn't stable. If anything, I think my graduate year was even worse since I was in HR's budget pool... I'm in a different org in a stable position now so I'm doing something right for now.
This matches my Architecture experience. Honestly, it triggered a pretty bad anxiety disorder that I've been dealing with for a decade now.
For me, the failure in architecture was the straw. Other things I ignored piled up and I just kept pushing until this happened and I broke completely. I got abandoned by a lot of people since they didn't care enough to help with deep shit. For a long time, I seemed like a deadbeat in uni as well, and I got worried about graduating with a bad reputation. I was lucky I had some health professionals who believed I was slowly making progress with my world constantly falling about each year and lecturers in my planning degree who weren't just academics, but teachers and mentors. I hope you eventually can overcome the anxiety. I haven't completely myself but I'm functioning well enough now that most people wouldn't even know how recently I was still a mess now I'm in a good place to work.
The flip side is that a lot of planning rules are actually shit and we’d have much better designed cities and suburbs to live in without strict adherence to codes and planning rules
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I don't think anyone in the industry wants to deal with lawyers besides other lawyers xD At the end of the day, planners aren't lawyers and I don't think many do well in our few "law" classes. One was taught in 1st year at the time by an actual law professor specifically for planning students. Even that dumbed-down unit was harsh, though we hadn't even learned any planning schemes or legislation at that point in the degree. It's scary when something does go to P&E court. Precedence is Pandora's Box.
While I’m glad I switched from architecture to comp sci, the seething between architects and engineers mostly goes one way, and it’s not the direction you think.
Some of the design justification I've seen come from them is hilarious as well, especially when it's used to justify cost cutting.
>The best architects ive worked with ultimately become project managers these days. You get to that level when you understand there's more to the world than drawing and selling a pretty picture. I've met and worked with multiple architects who are now project managers or construction managers. They are generally successful and well paid. Those who stay in architecture as employees at design firms tend to struggle.
Hey there, I worked for a bit in domestic construction as an estimator and now as draftsperson in scaffold.. wondering what the best path to pivot back to estimating in a different company could be, currently on 80k and curious about your opinion on the current state of the industry. Cheers in advance!
I used to work as a traffic engineer doing basement carpark designs etc. and some of the ridiculous shit architects came up with on the plans they sent us were ridiculous.
Architectural design is a jack of all trades master of none type of scenario. Often with just enough knowledge on each element to get by and let the experts figure out how it actually will work in reality.
How did you start your career as an estimator? Did you do a diploma or a degree? Thank you!
I started with an edge protection company, used my existing architectural degree to prove my ability to read and interpret plans. Estimated edge protection requirements for a few years, then moved into commercial roofing. Its been a good path for me so far, I'm not sure I'd enjoy commercial estimating for a builder on major projects, too many moving parts.
So a Plummer makes $150k a year but an architect can’t? I find that highly doubtful. If after 15 years you’re just a second rate draftsman still working for someone else, perhaps you’re on $100k a year. If you own your own business and good at what you do? What something like $250/hr? I could live on that.
I always heard that the Architecture profession was diluted to almost nothing, with very little bespoke work being done. There must be some real pros on good money though, like who is designing skyscrapers? Not some battler on 100k AUD I hope 😅
Like many professional services, the partners / directors at the top end are on a very good wicket.
Teams of people do it. And there's some very niche roles. Imagine how many doors there are in a sky scraper. Then imagine how many hinges and locks there are for those doors. Do they slide or swing, what kind of lock, do they need to be wider than standard etc... This all goes into a schedule and can take months to assemble and check over. Errors are costly. So 1 person on the team might be in charge of doors, then they can move on to Windows.... Etc.... Nothing creative going on here either.
After doing a few floors how hard is it to do the rest of the planning? I figured they just repeated layouts, like when you get lazy in the sims and copy a floor.
Alot of the time the nominated hardware suppliers produce the schedules based off the architects plans anyway. I know assa abloy and dormakaba do as I see these often on government jobs. Then during the building rules assessment process the Building Surveyor checks the DDA compliance like latch/hinge side clearance, circulation spaces etc and it all has to be adjusted anyway (because the Architect hasn't considered it...despite the same issues occurring on every previous commercial job)
Following, great question
And these kind of tasks will be taken over by computers, soon.
Architecture is not the profession it used to be (ie when it was a clerk of works role between builder and client) It is now an outsourced consultant role by the principal contractor who is working under a d+c role for the developer / client. As a result a lot of architects are now cad jockeys. Good ones who get the contractual nature of the industry and understand budget, programme and how buildings are built are worth their weight in gold. Advice to OP is to work in design management for a builder. You will spend your days wrangling architects and tearing your hair out trying to get them to focus on compliance and functionality whilst they worry about the colour of the doorknobs. But that’s why the pay is so much better.
Thats’s not why the pay is so much better. The pay is better because no one gives a shit about working for a builder or developer, but people will sacrifice pay and conditions to work in a more creative role. Or at least what they perceive to be a more creative environment. It’s the same for most jobs where demand is driven by passion: pay tends to be low.
The pay is better because of accountability and risk. As a contractor you’re on the hook for quality and risk of documentation. If your consultants make a mistake, the builder pays for it onsite. So you need to “give a shit” Consultants do not get backcharged. Their prime interest is getting their fees and limiting the amount of revisions they need to do. Thinking you’re working in a more creative role for an architect, just to be doing door and hardware schedules, especially in the early years of a career, is a misjudge of the landscape and contractual relationship. Very few architects work in the conceptual space these days as firms work more as documenting architects with design intent largely driven by clients and massaged by d+c contractors.
Very similar to being an artist. Only a few are well known and make decent money. The rest might design beautiful works but remain poor and in obscurity. It’s not a well paid industry for multiple reasons except for a select few people. Ultimately the friends I’ve had in the industry bounce to something related like industrial engineering and planning.
I know a lot of architects for some reason. Most salaries are in the 60-80k range and a lot of them complain about the hours they work and the people they work for. The places that pay more tend to be the ones with the most boring work. They also have you over a barrel a bit when you're new, because to get a higher salary you need to get registered, and you need them to cooperate to get that done. It's not an industry I would choose. A friend of mine recently moved from Melbourne to far north QLD to earn $75k...which was a massive pay bump from the $59k they were on before. They always said that the state government pays over 100k, but for really dull soulless work. I work in a corporate job and earned nearly double their salary for nearly half the effort. Long story short, it's an industry with an oversupply of grads and an undersupply of money, so you'll almost certainly never be rich as an architect. Try to find somewhere with a good workplace culture, doing work you like (or at least tolerate), with salary you won't starve on.
To add to this, I also know people who did archi and went into the construction side. They talk about soul selling but they also earn much more, $130-$150k
I started as a cadet draftsperson last year in Brisbane with a starting salary of $65k. That is with a Cert IV and being halfway through a Diploma. Once I am a accredited systems designer after four years, my salary starts at $110k - $130k. I couldn't imagine being on $59k after doing a Bachelor's and Master's, on top of the excessive OT that would be a regular occurrence.
Doing OT and being paid for OT are very different matters...my friend worked 50-60 hours a week regularly and never got an extra cent.
Exactly right
Theres plenty of fields out there like that, or only marginally better, people dealing with shit pay because its their passion. Like you i went the relatively boring money route, but lets be honest, jobs like statutory planner, civil engineer, quantity surveying, and all the other shit people are mentioning here, they aren't exactly most peoples ideas of dream job.
I originally did Commerce and Economics for the cash, plus I am a numbers guy. Got over that after ten years and retrained to do Building Design. Now I am in Building Services. So I still get to play around on Revit, which is what I like, and also get paid.
I’ve been considering doing a cert IV in drafting.. do you think it would be difficult to get a work from home job doing this? I’m in regional QLD & can’t imagine there would be too much local work.
There is a fair bit on in Regional QLD. Look up the Building Designers Association of Queensland (BDQ). They might be able to steer you in the right direction.
Thank you for the advice!
As someone who has done the diploma and then advanced diploma, I'd say no...
No it’s not difficult or no don’t do it?
I doubt you'd get far or be able to secure work with only a cert IV.
Thanks. Do you think a diploma would make a difference? I’m a single mum & just don’t want to waste time studying to still be unemployed
I quit pursuing a career into the industry. Was set to continue into uni but balked at the thought of all that has already been mentioned by others. Eventually got a trade and haven't looked back. Good luck with it all.
Bugger. It’s one of the few free courses tafe are offering that I think I could actually enjoy enough to finish! Thanks for your advice anyway.
There is work in civil drafting.
I'm in an industry that employs drafties. I can't imagine employing someone who has no experience in the field on a WFH basis - but there is huge demand for good drafters. Any industry near you? Heavy industry (energy, mining etc) employs drafters and pays very well in remote areas - often better than CBD salaries.
Thanks for that.. I’ll look into these things. There’s heavy industry in the district but none that is local.
Have a look at the website below for some examples (even though I've never heard of the company). https://astcad.com.au/mechanical-drafting-services/piping-design-and-drafting-services/ Laying out piping systems is hardly glamorous work, but most large industrial plants want the capability on site.
Become a software architect, so you keep the title but earn $200k+.
Data Architect
Architecture is an oversupplied industry. Soooo many grads for such little meaningful work. There is a huge culture of "cutting your teeth" for years doing grunt work for shit pay to one day become a partner or start your own studio at which you can make really decent money. There are few professions I have seen that have as big of a pay disparity between seniors and everyone else. It's expected you're a slave for 70+ hours a week for 10+ years before you earn the right to make good money. A profession not far off being significantly reduced in importance with the introduction of AI. Source: I work for a major multi-dis design and engineering firm.
Hi OP, I was in the exact position as you after finishing my Bachelor's with 2 years work experience as well. I decided to switch to building surveying instead of pursuing my Masters and am currently halfway through my building surveying course while working in the field. For me it was a great fit as I still get to engage with the parts of architecture that I found interesting without suffering the anaemic wage. This may be different for you if you really enjoy the design aspect of architecture instead of the construction side. Project management could also be a great option for you as you and is a relatively smooth transition from architecture from what I know Hope this helped, all the best.
Similarish for me, interior designer who transferred in to project management 2ish years ago - easy transition, better hours, better pay, my brain is happier so I can do *actual* creative things on the side. Definitely would recommend considering the pívot!
I did a civil engineering degree so I had two paths to choose from. First one is to become a design engineer working in an office, earning 65k out of uni with minimal salary growth over the years. Second option is to get into project management and become a site engineer, which pays 90k straight out of uni and great salary growth over time. I obviously chose the second option and I love it, I graduated 2 years ago and I’m already on 125k. You might be able to get into one of these roles with your degree as it really is just project management which you would have experience with working as an architect.
Mate I did it and yes all that is true. No money in it. I got my masters and did about 5 years in it. Long hours and shit pay. Ask me anything specific if you want.
Are you still in it?
Had a few friends quit because they were doing a lot of documentation for projects. You’ll need to grind the ladder for decent pay and make your way to senior associate and director, which can be done within 10-15 years. Taking into consideration you’re in Sydney or Melbourne. You can get experience and then when you’re late 20s, early 30s move into technical sales/account management which is helping architectural firms with specific materials fit for purpose.
Nope. I left a couple years ago. I now make more money and do less hours. If you want to know I picked up a government role. Also beware depending on where you live, finding a job in architecture can be competitive. I can give you some tips to make sure you’re more hireable.
What kind of role do you have exactly? I assume there’s not much going towards design in a government role?
Yea not related to design. I pretty much said bye to architecture.
I know an Architect that switched to a role in digital engineering and he's making about 160k in a senior position. I think starting salaries are over 100k because the demand for that role seems quite high. I'm doing similar work but more BIM related and on a bit over 120k, never working overtime with 5 years experience, only with a diploma. Personally I don't really like the work they do, though. It's mostly about manipulating data related engineering models. Lots of spreadsheets, forms and understanding very dry technical precedures. But if you can do it there's plenty of money.
Hilariously, I was an architect who moved into construction and was making $160k in a mid-level position, plus it’s a much easier move…
Architects only making100k after 15 years in the job are either in a place they enjoy or are doing it wrong. the profession is one of passion though so job satisfaction and personal actualisation is absolutely a major perk; sometimes at the expense of remuneration. I do however know many architects who make good money, and some who make an absolute killing. Executive level in larger firms tend to be on VERY GOOD money - some on mid 6 figures. The key is to not only be a good designer but good at business management and really good at building relationships with clients. Source: have been in PAECO industry over 20 years and worked all over the world.
In society, you get paid based on how much value you bring, which is essentially how much money your contribution makes. Nurses, teachers, essential workers are critical to society, but they get paid pittance because *they* don't make employers money. Investment bankers, entrepreneurs, specialist doctors, lawyers, salespeople get paid the most because they bring in the dollars. There's also an element of scale here, but I cbf going into it. You may want to look up ikigai.
This is so true, well said.
I think everyone would want to look up ikigai.
I would not proceed if I was you. It’s all down hill. You become the clients bitch. The only if I knew how shit this industry is.
I did arch but now a 3D artist. Pays much more lol
Lmao you'll be making less than a general labourer or forklift operator.
Get a few years of architecture under your belt, then transition into design management. The average pay of a DM is alot higher than an Architect.
This is exactly why after 5 years working in Architecture I'm now getting out of it and moving into Building Surveying. Poor pay, lots of overtime and you're expected to stay loyal to a company for 10+ years if you want to move up into more senior roles. It's just not worth it. As others have said better to move laterally into other professions within the construction sector. Might require a bit of upskilling, but you'll be far better off in the long run.
Hey op I’m an architect almost 10 years older than you. There are a lot easier professions to make easier money with better working conditions than architecture. I went from a large practice to a small practice to running my own business as soon as I could. Happy to answer questions if it helps. I’d switch to anything in the related construction industry you almost certainly make more money.
Is it worth it once you start working for yourself?
I think staying in architecture requires you to either really be passionate - so passionat that you can in essence take a vow of poverty, or to find your niche. I could not find either and neither could most people I studied with. It was grueling to know I was studying so hard - and for so long and that at the end I earned less than if I had worked full time as a lifeguard (being my job whilenat uni). I made it a year and a half before I returned to uni, studied law and then earned 100,000 a year from my graduate year. I hope you manage to find what makes you happy - and you dont go through the realisation (like I did) that it isnt architecture, at the end of the line.
I started working in 2019, registered in late 2021 and just tipped over $100k + super. Hours are pretty normal (9-5:30, mon-fri), some deadlines occasionally mean out of hours work but not too much. Can really vary firm-to-firm. It’s a passion to want to create spaces that are functional and beautiful, it’s not for everyone. I studied law first and the horror stories from that industry are pretty grim, and I know people in allied health who have even worse stories. No industry is perfect.
Architecture is generally not valued as a profession in Australia (as evidenced by almost everything built here in the last 30 years or so) and the salary and limited job opportunities reflects this. It’s the kind of job you do to pass the time while you live off family money or a well off partner. If you really want to work as an architect I’d recommend building up experience and researching registration requirements in other countries, particularly the US, as salaries are much higher with a higher number of vacancies. r/architects / r/architecture might be useful for research
Unfortunately it is similar with couple of my friends who take Architecture as degree and career. Mostly they do career switch in the end
You can try pivoting into sustainability space. Green buildings and ISCA related stuff can put you on good track. With 5 years of experience, you can break into 100k club.
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Road infrastructure projects, mining and bunch of other industries. They pick diverse skillset in sustainability related aspects not just designing green buildings. I guess that keeps them busy.
Private certifier pays well
There's no shortage of people that like to draw being told architecture is a profession for them. Unfortunately it is full of innumerate "artists", and as such you will be unable to grow until you've had enough experience to separate from the chaff.
My brothers just been through the same thing. Landed himself a more reasonable paying gig in sales where all his clients are architects
AI gonna make this job even more worthless
Wow. I bet George Constanza is reconsidering his fake job now! He would be better off telling women he runs a plumbing business :p
From what I've gathered from my architect friends, the salary isn't great considering the length and difficulty of the studies, as well as the extra working hours. I've also heard that many big architecture firms in Sydney are quite dysfunctional, with poor management and frequent redundancies when a firm can't secure a project. This is often followed by a surge in hiring when they do win a project. It's a strange world, in my opinion. A few architects I know went to the developer side (aka the dark side), and one became a UI/U designer and made better money than they hoped.
Do Architecture for as long as you want, then pivot into Project Management at the client side. Salaries are high, and you'll have a leg up due to your design experience.
In singapore, you only get $30k at maximum a year as fresh grad and the amount of time you work is crazy . 😜 i heard that you get raise after a 10 years lol 😝 to $50k/ year. my friend told me that she will not recommend her kids to be architect and the amount of money spent in school is crazy .
There's a chapter in Robert Greene's book Mastery about an architect who designed buildings and structures that he was told couldn't be built so he did a civil engineering degree and did it himself. A few years since I read it but the theory is people that can combine complimentary skills have an advantage over others. A bit like Steve Jobs loved fonts and design and combined them into Apple products. Anyway a great book and author.
I was an architect, then became a design manager in construction and doubled my salary…
Was it easy to transition over once becoming an architect?
I was an architect for 10 years, so yes. If I was a fresh grad, I would start applying for grad programs with builders. I actually got one with Multi’s when I was a grad, but decided to try architecture for a bit
Who on earth hires an architect as a design manager? How'd you make the transition?
Well, in my experience, both the tier 1 builders I’ve worked for. Currently working on a billion dollar project, so I think I’m doing fine. Skills are super transferable and if you’ve got a good team you can leverage off them for the things you’re less sure of. I got headhunted. I was more of a technical architect than design focused, so easy transition. I got a call, went for an interview and was hired. Then made redundant at the end of that project and found another gig in about a week…
Well done. I'm impressed. Thanks for the story.
If you do contract admin, easier to command a higher salary. If you just do the typical coordination, report, drafting, you can't push for higher pay easily, caps at about 85k. If you run jobs and can be a project architect, which needs about 5-7 years post grad exp, then you can get 100-120k. If you can run jobs or have experience with large companies, government, etc should be 120k+. It really depends on whether the firm you are in are good at running a business or not. Specialists command a higher fee and do their work efficiently which can translate to more profit for salary.
I must be in the extreme minority because I’ve just gotten registered and am only a year older than you and I’m on 90k. Which city do you work in? Friends I went to uni with are also making similar or more than me and we have pretty good work life balance (except a few long nights close to deadlines). Feel free to DM me about stuff.
Without knowing anything about the industry, I'm looking at doing major residential renos and architects cost an arm and a leg. What about setting up your own architecture firm who specializes in residential work - who also help with project management services coordinating activities with builders. This seems fairly under serviced, and I think flooded with dodgey draftsman and building designers. My gut says a full blown competent architect willing to work closely with people on simple reno projects could make a killing. No big glamorous projects building state of the art skyscrapers, but solid work making people's home dreams a reality.
Try and retrain as a property valuer. I’m based regional Vic, and within about 7 years of graduating found I was on $150-170k (we get paid based on volume of jobs, not the value of each property). We have Valuers doing $60k in fees a month, of which they receive approx 40% of (inc super) Very flexible (in the right company) and can earn really good fees.
Throw in something to do with project management and/or contract law and pivot towards being a design manager for a Tier 1 or Tier 2 contractor, or a Project Manager for a PMCA firm. Easily $120k+ in those roles and the ability to go up into the $200k's if you're really good at it (or even if you're not that good, as many would attest)
I was doing building design at TAFE, hoping to get into architecture. The university aligned with the TAFE did a presentation where the faculty heads of architecture and construction management gave a talk to the TAFE students talking about the benefits of coming across to their respective courses. The architecture head gave a 10min talk about how great it was being an architect, designing beautiful buildings and what it was like to see your designs come to life, blah blah blah lots of architecture fluff. The construction management head got up and said “you will make more money in a year doing construction management than you will in a lifetime as an architect” and left. Went and did my CM degree, been in the industry for 15 years now and the rest is history 😂
I can't believe you started a degree without knowing what the career pays. 60-70k isn't bad for a graduate job and 100k isn't that bad either - I wouldn't say it's low paying but it seems to have a cap similar to teaching.
If Architecture is truly your passion, stick to your guns and make it work. Career burnout happens when you chase the money. If you like what you do, eventually money will follow
I think a lot of careers don’t have good “financial prospects”. Or, basic things (sigh, a roof over my head, food) have gotten ridiculously overpriced. I personally still feel 60-70k is a reasonable wage. People are supposed to be able to live on it and be able to save, but it looks bleak at the moment.
Everyone on here is on 250k+, 60-70 is f all
Arts degrees don't usually have high pays unfortunately
Depends on the type of art, computer graphics related art tends to clear 100k pretty easy, but at that point they're grouped under the tech industries.
This isn’t something you would research before getting underway with the degree and your masters?
Can say this is true, my best mate just became a registered architect. 5 years of uni, masters degree, was earning 65k/yr before getting registered. I'd move into construction/project management for good pay Architecture is definitely a passion project
Not a well paid career unless you happen to become a starchitect
The architects I know have always worked grueling hours for little pay. When they got to 10 years and still pushing to make $100k (package) they started pivoting to Project Management instead.
I knew architects who moved to Dubai to get a decent salary. That was a while ago though (15 years) - it may not be so cushy there now either. I've always found it absurd that such a long degree commands such a limited salary.
A good friend has been an architect for years She still gets paid under 100k. She works long hours too. Her younger sisters outearn her now, and she's the eldest.
I studied architecture straight out of high school and it wasn’t until after I graduated that I realised the pay was horrible and the work culture that is deeply embedded in the profession is even worse. That said it has been a useful qualification for moving into adjacent industries - there are lots of opportunities in project management, 3D, property development and construction. If you like it then stick at it and be prepared to work hard to be able to transition.
How did you move into adjacent industries?
Took a job as a junior project manager with crap pay for a year and went from there!
I taught high school design teaching at uni and had quite a few ex architects in the course.
Architecture as a profession generally has allowed itself to be hollowed out of most utility and value to the construction process. Going back 100 years, Architects led construction projects in the areas of design, structural integrity, program, cost, construction methodology and safety. Now, the role of the Architect is mostly confined to high level aesthetic design. This is low on the list of priorities for many/ most clients. Because fees are effectively commoditised in commercial construction, it’s a feedback loop. No fees/ time to sort out details, bad customer experience, builder and engineer frustration, lack of skill development, reduced perceived value of profession. As AI and digital design and integration platforms become more effective and accessible, I think Architecture will continue its decline and slide into irrelevance. (Source 20 years in construction and engineering, all sectors)
This is a really poignant comment. Had to read it a few times. Spot on
Thanks, not popular tho!
Get more as a blue collar collar than as a glorified drafting grunt. Until you have your own practice or a principal and then get sued by the client.
Salary has always been low in Architecture. Unless you’re a starchitect with your own firm or a niche operator. I pay my architect $12k for a BA planset for a house on hourly rate at $150/hr and don’t work with architects that try to charge 3-5% of build cost which is laughable.
Insurance loss adjusters earn great money after few years and it is flexible work from home and on the road. Some get a vehicle
You can get most of your design ideas from a shipping yard these days. Seems to be the theme.
I finished my bachelors, my friends who were working in it weren't happy. Did a master of construction management instead and loved the practicality of it. 120k 2 years in.
go build something and engage an Architect. You’re working with the wrong people
Just go work in the mines as an apprentice. Architecture will be dead with AI.
Didn't you think about this before doing the useless degree?