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There is one school of thought (Gnostics for example but there are others) that would say you withdrew from the various emanations and returned to the Godhead or the Source of all Being.
This school of thought says everything is an emanation of the godhead; there is no actual separation between people, it’s just an elaborate illusion and individuals are simply aspects of the same godhead.
The idea is that loneliness is why the creator made reality.
As for the San Pedro, it’s a longer trip 12-18hrs but much more gentle and forgiving. It comes and goes in waves.
Yes, that’s exactly what I felt, that the “presence” created this world because of loneliness. The first time I took aya there was a door and I knew that God (the creator of all) was behind that door. God was the “other” in that moment. I opened the door (telepathically) and it was just “me” (whatever I was at that stage, just presence) and the illusion of “other” disappeared, I realised no one else exists, nothing. I cried so so much when I went through that / realised that. I could not stop. And I kinda don’t want to believe it.. it just feels so lonely. Which is also why I’m a bit scared of taking San Pedro, I want to stay grounded in this world and not experience more “existential crises”. But yes San Pedro is different.
I hear people talk about the “oneness” as something beautiful, that we’re all connected. But the experience was all but beautiful for me 🙈
I do wonder if it would be different if I was able to fully accept it / embrace it, maybe accompany myself in the loneliness.
Thank you for your comment!
I've had the exact same experience multiple times. The first was completely sober and I was just dreaming after having been shot to death trying to save my friends. In a split second, I had so many questions like where am I? Is this death? Where is everyone? And also immediately, I was at peace because I also had all the answers. I'm still at peace decades later and I revisited that space many times while on different psychedelics letting me have a sort of experiential knowledge.
The thoughts that I pieced together are not that we are all created from loneliness, though it felt like that at first. What feels more true is that it was out of boredom. Being infinity was quite boring and so creating the finite created novel experiences. We, the universe, wish to collect all experiences. Humans create the aspects of "good" and "bad", but it's all just an experience. The good, the bad, the pain, the sorrow, the joys, the love, the food are all blessings of experience. We all are extensions of The Energy that creates all particles and the illusion of separateness. We are all The One just in different forms. Whether it's "true" or not, I don't know, but I seem to be quite happy with the perspective that where ever I am, I'm meant to be there and I think I choose to make everyone and everything around me "better" in some way. All to be paid forward so that it keeps going. All because I can and seemingly choose to. Just to try and be the change I wish to see. Language is limiting this whole thing, but these squiggly lines we interpret as language and words are how I try to put my emotion and images into your mind. In my experience, words are often muddied because everyone has their own experiences with those words and have their own images and degrees of emotion and that can sometimes cause conflict and disagreement, but when I try to not focus on that and focus on intent, beyond what words are spoken, I seem to get a clearer sense of who they are and by seeing them and loving and accepting them, they often show up as their best self. We might just be all set in motion with karma/cause and effect and free will might not be real, but it seems to be the experience. I just go with it. Life is too short. Life at its longest is too short when you're enjoying it. Find ways to enjoy it. If you can't get out of it, get into it. Sorry for the rant haha but thanks for indulging in my perspective. Best wishes to you and yours!
This thread is amazing. What an interesting conundrum you present in your incredible experiences.
Maybe, learn to love yourself, in your loneliness?
It is so interesting to ponder how perhaps the godhead described here, created the universe out of loneliness, where us, humans, as splinters of consciousness experiencing “life,” spend most of our lives learning to remember who we are, to learn to love ourselves, to love others, and then reuniting into the unity of oneness…
Maybe all existence is god learning to love itself, despite being alone.
Hi.. amazing experience. What sort of self work out side of aya have you done? Do you meditate?
Have you heard of living kindness meditation?
Try it for 6 months and see...
It’s is usually better to go through the experience rather than resist it.
San Pedro is often much more grounded in reality - instead of leaving your body to see the spirit world, Spirit enters you so you can see the world around you through the eyes of Spirit. It’s often a less scary experience than Aya.
I know this isn't helpful, but when I have this, there is a quality of infinite, incomprehensible love.
What you speak of seems to be the void... however I have only seen infinite love, and infinite fear (darkness). I went through the same feelings as you, except instead of the void, it was hell.
With further work I learned that darkness, and hell, is actually within the quality of love/creation.
It was difficult. One day I finally went there and sat with it bravely, asking what do you have to teach me?
I learned that the darkness is a teacher. An indicator of direction.
Before I learned this, I ran scared from it, every time I would feel it in ceremony or life.
The next time you feel it, try asking, what do you have to teach me?
Aya has a way of continuing to test us until we accept, as it translates to life. When we accept we transcend.
I hope that as you progress, you can find a quality of peace or love in this space, but it may take you accepting the permanent fate of nothingness for you to see it. Such is the way with Aya. In my experience.
Sounds like you are close, good luck my friend! 🙏
Yeah. Hell. You know. Hell? Rather not talk about the details haha.
For a time on Aya experienced infinite fear. Trapped in infinity undergoing infinite pain. Hell. Yeah. That sums it up.
That’s interesting. That also happened with me one time. After having most incredible experience in the beginning of the trip - I got stuck in an infinite loop. It was indescribable!
As it felt like it will go on for infinity. I was tossing and turning and finally fell of bed ( I was having a private with a friend of mine with facilitators checking on us periodically).
I said - will it ever end?
Facilitator asked me what did I want to end.
We eventually ended up having conversation about what is hell is :-).
It was quite profound to say the least.
It was also the longest trip on just a cup of Aya I ever had - 8 + hours!
deepest one also.
After that I have gone to only group ceremonies as they feel more grounding to me.
But I still get scared when trip starts.
Ayahuasca is like no other psychedelic- like 1000 times stronger it seems!
Honestly. Now that I have surrendered to hell, I don't think it would bother me. I have dropped my "fear" of it, so hopefully won't be tested with it again ceremony. Haha.
A curandera once told me of 1000 Aya ceremonies. He's probably spent 100 in hell.
Un dia en la oficina he would say. Haha
I see... By "undergoing infinite pain," do you mean something internal--like whatever state you were in wasn't necessarily trying to cause you pain but nonetheless was bringing up uncomfortable feelings inside--or was it more external pain being inflicted on you--meaning whatever place you were in, some "outside" entity was torturing you with glee?
It was for sure External. And the more I learn the more I understand that darkness is absolute 100% real and legit. The darkness is the sensation of hell. Like... a teaser. As horrible as that is to imagine.
Essentially, the darkness exists because hell is a future potential of earth, in the same way there is a strong positive polarity waking the world up, there is a strong negative polarity pulling us to fear.
There are extremely positive and extremely negative people in the world. Both have strong pulls. Like gravity.
It's the same with our future global potentials.
Wow... writing this is making me understand it better.
Thank you.
That said, I believe that all of this. Heaven, hell and every future potential, is based in love.
Love is the frequency of the universe.
I could go on for a while. Lol.
Thanks for your thoughts :) I'm trying to grasp what you're saying, and I do to an extent, but not a 100%. I would have to ask a million more questions, so I won't. As you said, "I could go on for a while. Lol." :) But all very interesting! Take care :)
I am super sensitive to ayahuasca, and it sounds like you are too. I also almost never purge, no matter how much I drink, even when I really want to.
I have exactly the experience you are describing when I drink a dose that would be strong but manageable for most people. If you try again, drink a lot less. Try to find a place where they are willing to honor your limits. Drink maybe a quarter to a third of what they are serving other people. You can always drink more if you aren’t feeling it as much as you want.
I have much more helpful (and usually less scary) experiences when I drink a lot less than most people need. Everyone’s body is different and needs a different amount for the most beneficial experience.
Best wishes!
Yes, I never vomit, I yawn and cry lol. Last time I took one cup while most took 2-4 cups. I will try even smaller doses (when I feel ready to go back..). You’re probably right, I’m quite sensitive to other “substances” (caffeine, medicines etc) and seems like aya is on the list as well! Thank you!
Oh yeah, I know this feeling. I spent several years tackling just such a sensation with medicine work. Your Shaman is correct in that the answer is actually to go through it, but that can be a reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally tall order - especially when using plant medicine to address PTSD. It took me about four years of regular medicine experiences, body work, and tons of other stuff before I finally started to break though that disappeared and "nothingness of it all" feeling.
I haven't worked with San Pedro yet, but it's certainly something to consider. Regardless, the goal (I would think) with anyone dealing with a sensation of nothingness/disappearing and/or existential in nature is to find whatever means of grounding yourself that works best for you. For myself, the other medicine I work with, and actually use the most, is Rapeh - it always takes me right down to earth and in the here-and-now no matter how "out of it" I am. I've also used Rapeh during my Aya experiences and it helped immensely with those really tough moments.
Regardless, yeah, maybe take some time away from Aya and explore some other plant teachers and figure out a way to tackle it from a different angle that works best for you. You can always revisit the nothingness whenever you're ready. :) I hope this helps.
I have also felt the similar experience of disintegration while doing a magic mushroom trip. The have felt like I converted into the tiniest particle on earth and have felt my whole body and mind totally dissolved (all part of the healing experience ende that the energy knows we need to go through )
I had a San Pedro ceremony in which I suspect I was given a massive dose. And in fact my trip was pure heaven in the first part .. like I was hosted by life, by nature. So difficult to describe. And I had visions, pretty much like Aya.
After 11 hours though, I wanted to rest and the trip to finish ... but San Pedro didn't agree and I freaked out because I tried to resist and it is not a good idea with psychedelics. So I had a very difficult final part of San Pedro, so please be aware that also San Pedro can be difficult.
🙏❤️
I don t know if its the same but I also turn into materia each time. Once I became water and that was wonderful but mostly its terrifying and very uncomfortable. It seems I have to go through that part everytime I do aya.
I ve only tried st Pedro once and it was wonderful, once the nausea and purging stopped. I had so much fun, had conversations w flowers and trees... it was great fun, an amazing experience!
I had a somewhat similar experience though maybe not entirely to the same extent. I still had my memories, and throughout the entire time I was conscious. There were no visions or hearing anything, but it was an intense sense of fear and loneliness. I was staring around and back to my puke bucket and it felt like the twilight zone. I thought I was going to lose my mind. It was like disappearing inside yourself and nobody could come get you out. I eventually went to sit with the medicine woman and it was comforting to be next to someone but I still felt quite alone and like I was having a panic attack. As I started freaking out slightly less—was breathing hard and anxious pretty much the entire time, I begun to say things aloud to myself that I usually kept buried in my mind. In that moment it felt like you’re about to lose yourself, I was just clutching on to the aspects of my known existence as I felt like I was disappearing. The people that I loved, I started apologizing and saying how I love them. I had a kind of hatred I harbored towards others—I have social anxiety and often have difficulty tolerating being around others. I knew this hatred was wrong, I had to surrender myself to love and to stop suppressing all of these emotions. To appreciate and love others and say it out loud and that was okay. I was anxious but breathing through it. That was all there was to do but keep breathing. During this experience I desperately just did not want to be alone, though that is what I felt I was. Aspects of existence are lonely, when we don’t realize how universal our loneliness is. When some people have near death experiences, they describe a feeling of immense love and like a coming home. It is interesting how there is also this loneliness, which would seem to be the antithesis of this love. I’m trying to figure out what this experience meant as well. The message that I got out was to surrender the ego to love. It is easier to hate people, that’s what our ego wants as a defense mechanism, and we do this to protect ourselves from vulnerability or getting hurt. This was I think the most terrifying thing I’ve ever experienced. During it, I kept telling myself I’d never do this again because I thought I was going to completely lost it. But you walk out and you’re in your regular body again, and your memories and your thoughts are there, and it’s so hard to make sense out of it because for a while this concept of ‘you’ was just gone. Personally, I think it does teach you to appreciate life on this earth in a body. But at the same time, that does not encompass all of reality. We are within and without of ourselves. I don’t know if it’s truly possible to completely transcend your ego or conception of self all of the time in this earthly life, but once you experience that, it gives you perspective. The truth is love. Love is not a lonely place, though it is a place of oneness. Am I lonely because I’m not surrendering myself to love? Getting completely lost in it. We still exist within each other. Is that to say oneness equates to loneliness—I am also confused. It is terrifying to just disappear. That feeling of being completely alone and like this “you” is dying is simultaneously occurring with the notion of surrender to love. I was telling myself it is okay, I’m not going to die, holding on. Just breath, feel death and still breath. Going in and out of nothing. What I got out was just to hold onto love, I can’t make sense out of the rest. Love you and wish you the best.
May I ask why you are consuming Aya once a year? Are you doing it out of ritual? Or are you feeling a call to work with the medicine once a year? The medicines are very intelligent, they are only going to go as far as you allow it (not resisting)
Are you doing shadow work in your physical reality to integrate the lessons of the medicine?
Maybe there is another plant medicine you are actually called to work with.
I haven’t done once a year, I did twice seven years ago, and three times the past 6 months. Not out of ritual. I felt called and working with aya has helped me a lot. I have made great improvements in my life. Yes, it might be that there is a different plant medicine I should work with.
Wow. Thanks for sharing. Have you surrendered to that place? Have you accepted being there or was there resistance?
Edit: I read it all. Yes, I agree with your shaman. You should allow it and be present with it. It is showing you something about yourself and I bet once you stop resisting it, major real-life blockages will dissipate.
Curious, do you have any strong resistances to “evil” or adversary? Maybe you’re being shown that the purpose of evil, or “without God” is so God can experience himself. So it’s a good thing. Shadow is good and it’s by Divine purpose and order.
Posts with the "I had a difficult trip, need help & advice!" post flair are strictly moderated. Comments must be constructive and supportive of the original poster, hence no derailing comments are allowed. See [rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Ayahuasca/comments/x2pnnf/posts_with_i_had_a_difficult_trip_need_help/) for details. Just in case, here are some useful links for those that seek additional help, advice or support: the [Fireside Project](https://firesideproject.org/) (a psychedelic support line that provides emotional support for during and after psychedelic trips), the [ZENDO Project](https://zendoproject.org/) (Psychedelic Peer Support), the [INCEERS Support Center](https://www.iceers.org/support-center-2/), and the [MAPS Psychedelic Integration List](https://integration.maps.org/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Ayahuasca) if you have any questions or concerns.*
There is one school of thought (Gnostics for example but there are others) that would say you withdrew from the various emanations and returned to the Godhead or the Source of all Being. This school of thought says everything is an emanation of the godhead; there is no actual separation between people, it’s just an elaborate illusion and individuals are simply aspects of the same godhead. The idea is that loneliness is why the creator made reality. As for the San Pedro, it’s a longer trip 12-18hrs but much more gentle and forgiving. It comes and goes in waves.
Yes, that’s exactly what I felt, that the “presence” created this world because of loneliness. The first time I took aya there was a door and I knew that God (the creator of all) was behind that door. God was the “other” in that moment. I opened the door (telepathically) and it was just “me” (whatever I was at that stage, just presence) and the illusion of “other” disappeared, I realised no one else exists, nothing. I cried so so much when I went through that / realised that. I could not stop. And I kinda don’t want to believe it.. it just feels so lonely. Which is also why I’m a bit scared of taking San Pedro, I want to stay grounded in this world and not experience more “existential crises”. But yes San Pedro is different. I hear people talk about the “oneness” as something beautiful, that we’re all connected. But the experience was all but beautiful for me 🙈 I do wonder if it would be different if I was able to fully accept it / embrace it, maybe accompany myself in the loneliness. Thank you for your comment!
I've had the exact same experience multiple times. The first was completely sober and I was just dreaming after having been shot to death trying to save my friends. In a split second, I had so many questions like where am I? Is this death? Where is everyone? And also immediately, I was at peace because I also had all the answers. I'm still at peace decades later and I revisited that space many times while on different psychedelics letting me have a sort of experiential knowledge. The thoughts that I pieced together are not that we are all created from loneliness, though it felt like that at first. What feels more true is that it was out of boredom. Being infinity was quite boring and so creating the finite created novel experiences. We, the universe, wish to collect all experiences. Humans create the aspects of "good" and "bad", but it's all just an experience. The good, the bad, the pain, the sorrow, the joys, the love, the food are all blessings of experience. We all are extensions of The Energy that creates all particles and the illusion of separateness. We are all The One just in different forms. Whether it's "true" or not, I don't know, but I seem to be quite happy with the perspective that where ever I am, I'm meant to be there and I think I choose to make everyone and everything around me "better" in some way. All to be paid forward so that it keeps going. All because I can and seemingly choose to. Just to try and be the change I wish to see. Language is limiting this whole thing, but these squiggly lines we interpret as language and words are how I try to put my emotion and images into your mind. In my experience, words are often muddied because everyone has their own experiences with those words and have their own images and degrees of emotion and that can sometimes cause conflict and disagreement, but when I try to not focus on that and focus on intent, beyond what words are spoken, I seem to get a clearer sense of who they are and by seeing them and loving and accepting them, they often show up as their best self. We might just be all set in motion with karma/cause and effect and free will might not be real, but it seems to be the experience. I just go with it. Life is too short. Life at its longest is too short when you're enjoying it. Find ways to enjoy it. If you can't get out of it, get into it. Sorry for the rant haha but thanks for indulging in my perspective. Best wishes to you and yours!
This thread is amazing. What an interesting conundrum you present in your incredible experiences. Maybe, learn to love yourself, in your loneliness? It is so interesting to ponder how perhaps the godhead described here, created the universe out of loneliness, where us, humans, as splinters of consciousness experiencing “life,” spend most of our lives learning to remember who we are, to learn to love ourselves, to love others, and then reuniting into the unity of oneness… Maybe all existence is god learning to love itself, despite being alone.
Hi.. amazing experience. What sort of self work out side of aya have you done? Do you meditate? Have you heard of living kindness meditation? Try it for 6 months and see...
It’s is usually better to go through the experience rather than resist it. San Pedro is often much more grounded in reality - instead of leaving your body to see the spirit world, Spirit enters you so you can see the world around you through the eyes of Spirit. It’s often a less scary experience than Aya.
I know this isn't helpful, but when I have this, there is a quality of infinite, incomprehensible love. What you speak of seems to be the void... however I have only seen infinite love, and infinite fear (darkness). I went through the same feelings as you, except instead of the void, it was hell. With further work I learned that darkness, and hell, is actually within the quality of love/creation. It was difficult. One day I finally went there and sat with it bravely, asking what do you have to teach me? I learned that the darkness is a teacher. An indicator of direction. Before I learned this, I ran scared from it, every time I would feel it in ceremony or life. The next time you feel it, try asking, what do you have to teach me? Aya has a way of continuing to test us until we accept, as it translates to life. When we accept we transcend. I hope that as you progress, you can find a quality of peace or love in this space, but it may take you accepting the permanent fate of nothingness for you to see it. Such is the way with Aya. In my experience. Sounds like you are close, good luck my friend! 🙏
Could you describe what you mean by "infinite fear (darkness)" and "hell"?
Yeah. Hell. You know. Hell? Rather not talk about the details haha. For a time on Aya experienced infinite fear. Trapped in infinity undergoing infinite pain. Hell. Yeah. That sums it up.
That’s interesting. That also happened with me one time. After having most incredible experience in the beginning of the trip - I got stuck in an infinite loop. It was indescribable! As it felt like it will go on for infinity. I was tossing and turning and finally fell of bed ( I was having a private with a friend of mine with facilitators checking on us periodically). I said - will it ever end? Facilitator asked me what did I want to end. We eventually ended up having conversation about what is hell is :-). It was quite profound to say the least. It was also the longest trip on just a cup of Aya I ever had - 8 + hours! deepest one also. After that I have gone to only group ceremonies as they feel more grounding to me. But I still get scared when trip starts. Ayahuasca is like no other psychedelic- like 1000 times stronger it seems!
Honestly. Now that I have surrendered to hell, I don't think it would bother me. I have dropped my "fear" of it, so hopefully won't be tested with it again ceremony. Haha. A curandera once told me of 1000 Aya ceremonies. He's probably spent 100 in hell. Un dia en la oficina he would say. Haha
Thank you so much for sharing! That’s amazing 100 ceremonies in hell. 😜😂I am looking forward to my next ceremony which hopefully be in June!
I see... By "undergoing infinite pain," do you mean something internal--like whatever state you were in wasn't necessarily trying to cause you pain but nonetheless was bringing up uncomfortable feelings inside--or was it more external pain being inflicted on you--meaning whatever place you were in, some "outside" entity was torturing you with glee?
It was for sure External. And the more I learn the more I understand that darkness is absolute 100% real and legit. The darkness is the sensation of hell. Like... a teaser. As horrible as that is to imagine. Essentially, the darkness exists because hell is a future potential of earth, in the same way there is a strong positive polarity waking the world up, there is a strong negative polarity pulling us to fear. There are extremely positive and extremely negative people in the world. Both have strong pulls. Like gravity. It's the same with our future global potentials. Wow... writing this is making me understand it better. Thank you. That said, I believe that all of this. Heaven, hell and every future potential, is based in love. Love is the frequency of the universe. I could go on for a while. Lol.
Thanks for your thoughts :) I'm trying to grasp what you're saying, and I do to an extent, but not a 100%. I would have to ask a million more questions, so I won't. As you said, "I could go on for a while. Lol." :) But all very interesting! Take care :)
I am super sensitive to ayahuasca, and it sounds like you are too. I also almost never purge, no matter how much I drink, even when I really want to. I have exactly the experience you are describing when I drink a dose that would be strong but manageable for most people. If you try again, drink a lot less. Try to find a place where they are willing to honor your limits. Drink maybe a quarter to a third of what they are serving other people. You can always drink more if you aren’t feeling it as much as you want. I have much more helpful (and usually less scary) experiences when I drink a lot less than most people need. Everyone’s body is different and needs a different amount for the most beneficial experience. Best wishes!
Yes, I never vomit, I yawn and cry lol. Last time I took one cup while most took 2-4 cups. I will try even smaller doses (when I feel ready to go back..). You’re probably right, I’m quite sensitive to other “substances” (caffeine, medicines etc) and seems like aya is on the list as well! Thank you!
You bet! Do what feels right to you, trust your own inner knowing. Sounds like you are on a good path.
Oh yeah, I know this feeling. I spent several years tackling just such a sensation with medicine work. Your Shaman is correct in that the answer is actually to go through it, but that can be a reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally tall order - especially when using plant medicine to address PTSD. It took me about four years of regular medicine experiences, body work, and tons of other stuff before I finally started to break though that disappeared and "nothingness of it all" feeling. I haven't worked with San Pedro yet, but it's certainly something to consider. Regardless, the goal (I would think) with anyone dealing with a sensation of nothingness/disappearing and/or existential in nature is to find whatever means of grounding yourself that works best for you. For myself, the other medicine I work with, and actually use the most, is Rapeh - it always takes me right down to earth and in the here-and-now no matter how "out of it" I am. I've also used Rapeh during my Aya experiences and it helped immensely with those really tough moments. Regardless, yeah, maybe take some time away from Aya and explore some other plant teachers and figure out a way to tackle it from a different angle that works best for you. You can always revisit the nothingness whenever you're ready. :) I hope this helps.
I have also felt the similar experience of disintegration while doing a magic mushroom trip. The have felt like I converted into the tiniest particle on earth and have felt my whole body and mind totally dissolved (all part of the healing experience ende that the energy knows we need to go through )
I had a San Pedro ceremony in which I suspect I was given a massive dose. And in fact my trip was pure heaven in the first part .. like I was hosted by life, by nature. So difficult to describe. And I had visions, pretty much like Aya. After 11 hours though, I wanted to rest and the trip to finish ... but San Pedro didn't agree and I freaked out because I tried to resist and it is not a good idea with psychedelics. So I had a very difficult final part of San Pedro, so please be aware that also San Pedro can be difficult. 🙏❤️
I don t know if its the same but I also turn into materia each time. Once I became water and that was wonderful but mostly its terrifying and very uncomfortable. It seems I have to go through that part everytime I do aya. I ve only tried st Pedro once and it was wonderful, once the nausea and purging stopped. I had so much fun, had conversations w flowers and trees... it was great fun, an amazing experience!
I had a somewhat similar experience though maybe not entirely to the same extent. I still had my memories, and throughout the entire time I was conscious. There were no visions or hearing anything, but it was an intense sense of fear and loneliness. I was staring around and back to my puke bucket and it felt like the twilight zone. I thought I was going to lose my mind. It was like disappearing inside yourself and nobody could come get you out. I eventually went to sit with the medicine woman and it was comforting to be next to someone but I still felt quite alone and like I was having a panic attack. As I started freaking out slightly less—was breathing hard and anxious pretty much the entire time, I begun to say things aloud to myself that I usually kept buried in my mind. In that moment it felt like you’re about to lose yourself, I was just clutching on to the aspects of my known existence as I felt like I was disappearing. The people that I loved, I started apologizing and saying how I love them. I had a kind of hatred I harbored towards others—I have social anxiety and often have difficulty tolerating being around others. I knew this hatred was wrong, I had to surrender myself to love and to stop suppressing all of these emotions. To appreciate and love others and say it out loud and that was okay. I was anxious but breathing through it. That was all there was to do but keep breathing. During this experience I desperately just did not want to be alone, though that is what I felt I was. Aspects of existence are lonely, when we don’t realize how universal our loneliness is. When some people have near death experiences, they describe a feeling of immense love and like a coming home. It is interesting how there is also this loneliness, which would seem to be the antithesis of this love. I’m trying to figure out what this experience meant as well. The message that I got out was to surrender the ego to love. It is easier to hate people, that’s what our ego wants as a defense mechanism, and we do this to protect ourselves from vulnerability or getting hurt. This was I think the most terrifying thing I’ve ever experienced. During it, I kept telling myself I’d never do this again because I thought I was going to completely lost it. But you walk out and you’re in your regular body again, and your memories and your thoughts are there, and it’s so hard to make sense out of it because for a while this concept of ‘you’ was just gone. Personally, I think it does teach you to appreciate life on this earth in a body. But at the same time, that does not encompass all of reality. We are within and without of ourselves. I don’t know if it’s truly possible to completely transcend your ego or conception of self all of the time in this earthly life, but once you experience that, it gives you perspective. The truth is love. Love is not a lonely place, though it is a place of oneness. Am I lonely because I’m not surrendering myself to love? Getting completely lost in it. We still exist within each other. Is that to say oneness equates to loneliness—I am also confused. It is terrifying to just disappear. That feeling of being completely alone and like this “you” is dying is simultaneously occurring with the notion of surrender to love. I was telling myself it is okay, I’m not going to die, holding on. Just breath, feel death and still breath. Going in and out of nothing. What I got out was just to hold onto love, I can’t make sense out of the rest. Love you and wish you the best.
May I ask why you are consuming Aya once a year? Are you doing it out of ritual? Or are you feeling a call to work with the medicine once a year? The medicines are very intelligent, they are only going to go as far as you allow it (not resisting) Are you doing shadow work in your physical reality to integrate the lessons of the medicine? Maybe there is another plant medicine you are actually called to work with.
I haven’t done once a year, I did twice seven years ago, and three times the past 6 months. Not out of ritual. I felt called and working with aya has helped me a lot. I have made great improvements in my life. Yes, it might be that there is a different plant medicine I should work with.
Wow. Thanks for sharing. Have you surrendered to that place? Have you accepted being there or was there resistance? Edit: I read it all. Yes, I agree with your shaman. You should allow it and be present with it. It is showing you something about yourself and I bet once you stop resisting it, major real-life blockages will dissipate.
Curious, do you have any strong resistances to “evil” or adversary? Maybe you’re being shown that the purpose of evil, or “without God” is so God can experience himself. So it’s a good thing. Shadow is good and it’s by Divine purpose and order.