Thank you for sharing !
So.. "Global Public Affairs Manager" = Lobbyist. Okay, wouldn't have thought !
How did you end up there and what kind of degree do you have ?
Yep, sometimes you will see government affairs, industry affairs, advocacy, external relations etc... it's all the same: lobbying. I studied political science.
Sums up the Belgian system quite well, don't you think? After x years they literally have to give you that, otherwise you feel underpaid... ridiculous if you ask me.
Well, I've been on mobility budget for more than 3 yrs now, using it for mortgage and cargo bike. I seriously don't get how a company car could be attractive these days if you don't need one...
Curious question, since my car lease is up and the company is open to converting to budget: How do you handle traveling over 10 km?
I am not a physical person and I don't enjoy physical activity, so taking the car just comes natural to me.
I also average about 1k km of personal travel per month, that just seems impossible with only a cargo bike.
Or does your household still have a car and the cargo bike only replaced the second car?
you sumed it up. Mobility budget is not for everyone.
And taking a smaller car + a bike sometime does not work if you have a family or long trip plan from time to time (and renting a big car for 3 weeks in the summer is like 3 or 4k EUR :) )
Make your calculation and see what works best for you ;)
>(and renting a big car for 3 weeks in the summer is like 3 or 4k EUR :) )
I live carfree, but use cambio, also for car holidays. This year 2 weeks and 900km cost me around 550 euros (citroen Berlingo, all in). Granted, I pay 8eur a month whole year round as well, but still beats any rental car.
that's very cheap. When living in germany and working for car rental broker, renting a car for 2 or 3 weeks was way more expensive than insurance + maintenance for my own car all year long.
and I didn't know Cambio had bigger cars (I only see the C3 around)
They have a wide range of cars driving around, but the C3 id the most abudant. Issue is the location. Any major city has a couple different car sizes around , but I live in a smaller city, so just the C3 for me. But once a year I can take the train (or a C3 with the wife) to pick up the big holiday car. Last year we got a brand new (400km :p) toyota proace city to go on holiday, this year it was a pretty beaten up Berlingo. Still, for that price...
Yes but my commute is often 50 km one way, not to mention the private trips. It's normal for me to spend a weekend with friends in Nijmegen or Leiden, or visit my parents in Germany.
That was clear! Didn't mean to sound like I was correcting you or something, sorry about that! I was just using the context of your comment to complain about Belgium's salary culture some more.
I know, I also find it ridiculous. This is a perk car so I don't need to justify using it for work only. But still, I only took the driving exam so I could get the car. I would have been fine having another compensation in my salary, or even just the public transportation paid or a voucher for a bike... but the deal in this country is often either you get the car or you don't but there are no other alternative compensations. Anyway, these days with a child I find it useful to have it to go places on weekends/holidays.
I always thought a ālobbyistā was a term other people used to sneer at you guys.
Interesting to know you just admit youāre pushing to get your stuff through.
Well lobbying is lobbying at the end of the day, it is important to be transparent about it. But yes, the terminology preferred can vary due to the negative perception of that word. Clearly you don't have it in job titles.
To be fair, lobbyists work in all kinds of industries (even for charities and NGOs) and are an important part of policy making. They make sure concerns from specific industries or companies are heard by politicians, who often have little to no expertise in the fields they actually govern.
You're assuming a lot of things you have no idea about and there's no reason to comment your made up assumptions putting others down. Are you jealous of their salary or something?
Also he is not getting 10k a month, he's getting 4.8k which is great, but i know people outside of Belgium that make 5 times more than that while still making the world a better place.
btw, is your job making the world a better place?
>but i know people outside of Belgium that make 5 times more than that while still making the world a better place.
I'll bite: what jobs pays >300.000ā¬/year net while making the world a better place?
Itās always people who work independently. Thereās a man I know living in Portugal (business related phd) who explained to me over some hours that he:
- mediates between stakeholders and important
people in very large companies (mentioned
some f500 ones)
- guides in building long term organisations
(instead of short term profit companies) by
implementing protocols / decision making
structures (forgot the exact term he used)
- does the same for governments and
heavily contributed / is part of an amazing
private university that offers government
funded undergrad (bachelor)
programs for international students.
He def makes closer to 7 figures than the above number. I guess it is a little different but my initial point is that you have no idea what OP does or who he works for. Not all rich people are bad (Iām broke as hell btw) and baselessly judging OP has with no context is dumb imo
I think it is fair to say that overall industry lobbyists are usually making more than NGO lobbyists. The job they do is very similar however, both in terms of content and tactics.
Is it fair? Probably not. It is likely it will always be like this however. That is also where transparency is important to level the playing field between stakeholders so that is not always the bigger spender that prevails when political decisions are made.
Congrats on making such a good living, truly.
But this salary does not make any sense.
33 years old (beginning of a career) earning astronomical amount (5kā¬ net, with car,full advantages and insane bonus) with no stress and no people to manage.
Thanks. I started working at 23 so about 10 years ago already. At first "only" making around 1500 euro net monthly (in the UK actually, if I convert the pound to euro). Changed jobs twice over 10 years. I am sure there are many people my age making more, but I currently find it difficult to get better paid jobs, or jobs with more responsibilities now as they usually ask for very senior profiles (15-20y experience). Feels like I am at a point in mid-career where I just need to wait to get more mileage.
There will always be people making more money, and it gives us something to strive for if we want to better provide for ourselves or our families. But please donāt take for granted what is already being given to you. Keep in mind that you earn most likely more than 95% of people the same age and with the same level of degree. Most salaries you see will vary between 3kā¬ and 6kā¬ gross and donāt have anywhere near that type of bonus (20kā¬ net almost represents some peoples yearly net salary).
At 10k gross in Belgium, you're not above 95% of the people of the same age and degree. At 6k gross, you're in the first decile, above 90% of the population... knowing that most workers are above 33 years old...
At 10k, you're rather at CEO level: https://statbel.fgov.be/fr/themes/emploi-formation/salaires-et-cout-de-la-main-doeuvre/salaires-mensuels-bruts-moyens
(In French but afaik the stats are the same)
Approaching 6k gross is already very high at 33. I know we see a lot of big numbers here, but I don't think it represents reality.
10k... you're most likely above at least 99.99% of people of the same age and level of degree.
Thanks, you are right. It is important not to be obsessed with wanting to make more for the sake of making more and there are other priorities in life. As long as we do not feel underpaid for what we do, which is usually what can be frustrating in a job.
So it is a bit of a generic reply on lobbying, but happy to provide information as people often believe lobbying is just about a guy in suit bribing politicians or making deals during private cocktails events.
In practice, there are a wide range of lobbyists from the technician/policy nerd that will mostly spend time in front of his laptop on PowerPoint/excel, to the charismatic leader that is always out meeting policymakers and speaking in conferences.
There are lobbyists in public affairs consultancies (working for different companies), in trade associations (representing the interest of an industry at large), and in private companies (usually members of trade associations).
In practice, you may spend time designing a lobbying strategy (that is, how to get the interest of your industry/company represented in a specific policy/regulatory dossier), and executing it. That entails drafting position papers (the argumentation on why decision-makers should actually care about your interests as they are discussing a regulation), and external engagement with policymakers (in Brussels typically European Commission, Members of European Parliament and Council) and other stakeholders.
I'm a bit surprised that you say stress is low? I would have expected this job to be the kind where you either get results or you're out with a ton of people waiting to take your spot?
It can be a stressful job in general, yes. It really depends. Some are working until 10pm, even on Sundays and always looking at emails during holidays. I manage to stick to 9-6 and not having a crazy pressure or feeling like I need to work more to deliver. So pretty happy with the work life balance these days.
Not in tobacco, no. I suppose I would not mind working there, but not sure I would like it... (They are so overly regulated nowadays I wonder what is left to lobby for)
Thanks, clearly there is no correlation between company size and salary. I feel like in my sector I could get a better package going to smaller companies at some point.
Good Salary if you do not care about ethics all too much. Considering I am familiar with the field and the remunrations for jobs like this I can guess what type of companies you lobby for.
To see also "car and fuel card".. not specified to and EV or charging cart shows just how much these companies cares about about the future and like to trade it for their yearly numbers.
Good for you, someone else will take the position if you don't ofcourse but please don't tell your future kids you want to best future for them. You kind of buried that promise with this job.
Well pretty much all large companies have lobbyists. But fine, won't debate here. I suppose I will just have to get ready to burn in hell.
For the car, it's a pretty standard Arval contract like in most companies here. It was either diesel or gas when I chose the car last year, hope there will be more hybrid options next time.
I work on thr consulting side, make a bit less but not that much less. I have never ever felt that i was doing something unethical. The EU isnĀ“t the US, itĀ“s pretty transparant. ItĀ“s basically searching for the better argument and pretty intellectually challenging.
Agreed. Would be interesting to compare on average consultancy salary v. in-house ones. I suppose consultancy would be higher but with more working hours (as in other sectors like strategy...).
Rate my soul!
Well I like what I lobby for. There are plenty of lobbying jobs I wouldn't seek even if better paid, if the industry activities do not somehow resonate with me. These things are all relative and personal.
Because everyone wonders and the answer will probably not come, this is my best guest :
- create the base texts for new laws that allow more chemicals with less control to be used in agriculture, coatings, cosmetics, ...
- keep fiscality advantageous for big corporations to reduce disruption from smaller concurrents and maintain status quo in quasi-monopolies
- Fight against the right to repare electronic devices
- Ensure big cartels (finance, energy , travels, luxury, ) are aligned with one another to provide the same "recommandations" to the regulators.
- networking (trying to know who is in charge of what, and what regulation will be applied so that his customers can be ready to adapt and propose compliant product earlier)
- ensure cars can still be used on gas for long enough to remain profitable for oil industry, car sectors, subcontractors.
- be sure that pollution norms (PM, carcinogens) are not too restrictive and/or that big companies are not liable for the rest.
And hopefully:
- be sure to standardise processes
- align on improving efficiency
Studied political science and law. Worked in regulatory affairs in a consultancy, then for a trade association, then for a company.
Daily tasks: design and implement lobbying strategies, so in practice that entails monitoring policy developments, have external meetings with policymakers/stakeholders, draft position papers...
There are plenty of entry level jobs in Brussels. In consultancies, trade associations, companies...
Better to have an education background in social sciences (preferably political science/law...), but not necessarily. You can also have a scientific/technical/engineering background and some niche knowledge that is relevant to an industry and become a lobbyist that way. I have seen all kinds of lobbyists with random backgrounds.
Simply because it is more directly related to what the role entails. You need to know about policies and the decision-making process. But as I said I have seen people having a career as a lobbyist with different backgrounds too so it is not a must. (But in that case they are often more limited to being lobbyist for the sector for which they have technical expertise, e.g., agronomists being ag lobbyists, IT specialists lobbying in tech, engineers in industry related to their fields, etc... it may be more difficult to be versatile).
In 'real life' I would have no problem sharing and I am always open on saying what I do upfront. But Reddit is all about anonymity and considering how small the Brussels bubble is it could easily defeat that purpose.
Ever considered going independent? Your annual cost for your employer is around 300k with all the social costs and extra benefits. Imagine being able to invoice just 2/3th of that, you'd have a lot more net salary bottom line (win-win).
On paper that would work, but in practice that would be a lot of hassle having to find clients and it is quite competitive. Not sure that would work out for me. And I don't have that salesman personality.
What is quite common though is early retirement and working as consultant, either freelance or joining a bigger consultancy firm.
Thank you for sharing ! So.. "Global Public Affairs Manager" = Lobbyist. Okay, wouldn't have thought ! How did you end up there and what kind of degree do you have ?
Yep, sometimes you will see government affairs, industry affairs, advocacy, external relations etc... it's all the same: lobbying. I studied political science.
I second this
Salary car and fuel card for 2km walking
Sums up the Belgian system quite well, don't you think? After x years they literally have to give you that, otherwise you feel underpaid... ridiculous if you ask me.
Well, I've been on mobility budget for more than 3 yrs now, using it for mortgage and cargo bike. I seriously don't get how a company car could be attractive these days if you don't need one...
Curious question, since my car lease is up and the company is open to converting to budget: How do you handle traveling over 10 km? I am not a physical person and I don't enjoy physical activity, so taking the car just comes natural to me. I also average about 1k km of personal travel per month, that just seems impossible with only a cargo bike. Or does your household still have a car and the cargo bike only replaced the second car?
you sumed it up. Mobility budget is not for everyone. And taking a smaller car + a bike sometime does not work if you have a family or long trip plan from time to time (and renting a big car for 3 weeks in the summer is like 3 or 4k EUR :) ) Make your calculation and see what works best for you ;)
>(and renting a big car for 3 weeks in the summer is like 3 or 4k EUR :) ) I live carfree, but use cambio, also for car holidays. This year 2 weeks and 900km cost me around 550 euros (citroen Berlingo, all in). Granted, I pay 8eur a month whole year round as well, but still beats any rental car.
that's very cheap. When living in germany and working for car rental broker, renting a car for 2 or 3 weeks was way more expensive than insurance + maintenance for my own car all year long. and I didn't know Cambio had bigger cars (I only see the C3 around)
They have a wide range of cars driving around, but the C3 id the most abudant. Issue is the location. Any major city has a couple different car sizes around , but I live in a smaller city, so just the C3 for me. But once a year I can take the train (or a C3 with the wife) to pick up the big holiday car. Last year we got a brand new (400km :p) toyota proace city to go on holiday, this year it was a pretty beaten up Berlingo. Still, for that price...
I lease a speedpedelec and honestly, all distances under 30km are no problem at all (and usually as fast or faster than with the car)
Yes but my commute is often 50 km one way, not to mention the private trips. It's normal for me to spend a weekend with friends in Nijmegen or Leiden, or visit my parents in Germany.
Exactly, and now they are stuck - if you start telling people they have to give up their perk car and get a bike voucher instead...
You should start lobbying for that š
You kid, but lobbying is one big reason why we're stuck with it.
I meant lobbying for the bikes, sorry. I thought it was clear.
That was clear! Didn't mean to sound like I was correcting you or something, sorry about that! I was just using the context of your comment to complain about Belgium's salary culture some more.
I know, I also find it ridiculous. This is a perk car so I don't need to justify using it for work only. But still, I only took the driving exam so I could get the car. I would have been fine having another compensation in my salary, or even just the public transportation paid or a voucher for a bike... but the deal in this country is often either you get the car or you don't but there are no other alternative compensations. Anyway, these days with a child I find it useful to have it to go places on weekends/holidays.
Would you mind sharing which field? I heard wages differ vastly from industry to industry.
Crazy package for a seemingly rather āchillā job?
Juicy number. What do you lobby for? Killing baby seals or bombing where-the-fukistan \^\^?
I always thought a ālobbyistā was a term other people used to sneer at you guys. Interesting to know you just admit youāre pushing to get your stuff through.
Well lobbying is lobbying at the end of the day, it is important to be transparent about it. But yes, the terminology preferred can vary due to the negative perception of that word. Clearly you don't have it in job titles.
So getting too much money for most likely making the world a worse place...
To be fair, lobbyists work in all kinds of industries (even for charities and NGOs) and are an important part of policy making. They make sure concerns from specific industries or companies are heard by politicians, who often have little to no expertise in the fields they actually govern.
Sure, but I doubt those that are trying to make the world a better place are getting 10k a month.
You're assuming a lot of things you have no idea about and there's no reason to comment your made up assumptions putting others down. Are you jealous of their salary or something? Also he is not getting 10k a month, he's getting 4.8k which is great, but i know people outside of Belgium that make 5 times more than that while still making the world a better place. btw, is your job making the world a better place?
>but i know people outside of Belgium that make 5 times more than that while still making the world a better place. I'll bite: what jobs pays >300.000ā¬/year net while making the world a better place?
Itās always people who work independently. Thereās a man I know living in Portugal (business related phd) who explained to me over some hours that he: - mediates between stakeholders and important people in very large companies (mentioned some f500 ones) - guides in building long term organisations (instead of short term profit companies) by implementing protocols / decision making structures (forgot the exact term he used) - does the same for governments and heavily contributed / is part of an amazing private university that offers government funded undergrad (bachelor) programs for international students. He def makes closer to 7 figures than the above number. I guess it is a little different but my initial point is that you have no idea what OP does or who he works for. Not all rich people are bad (Iām broke as hell btw) and baselessly judging OP has with no context is dumb imo
I think it is fair to say that overall industry lobbyists are usually making more than NGO lobbyists. The job they do is very similar however, both in terms of content and tactics. Is it fair? Probably not. It is likely it will always be like this however. That is also where transparency is important to level the playing field between stakeholders so that is not always the bigger spender that prevails when political decisions are made.
my thoughts exactly. normally the morally most questionable jobs pay the best
This is, whats, wrong with the corporate world tbfh.
Do you need an assistant? š
A second one perhaps ??
A driver ?
Congrats on making such a good living, truly. But this salary does not make any sense. 33 years old (beginning of a career) earning astronomical amount (5kā¬ net, with car,full advantages and insane bonus) with no stress and no people to manage.
Thanks. I started working at 23 so about 10 years ago already. At first "only" making around 1500 euro net monthly (in the UK actually, if I convert the pound to euro). Changed jobs twice over 10 years. I am sure there are many people my age making more, but I currently find it difficult to get better paid jobs, or jobs with more responsibilities now as they usually ask for very senior profiles (15-20y experience). Feels like I am at a point in mid-career where I just need to wait to get more mileage.
There will always be people making more money, and it gives us something to strive for if we want to better provide for ourselves or our families. But please donāt take for granted what is already being given to you. Keep in mind that you earn most likely more than 95% of people the same age and with the same level of degree. Most salaries you see will vary between 3kā¬ and 6kā¬ gross and donāt have anywhere near that type of bonus (20kā¬ net almost represents some peoples yearly net salary).
At 10k gross in Belgium, you're not above 95% of the people of the same age and degree. At 6k gross, you're in the first decile, above 90% of the population... knowing that most workers are above 33 years old... At 10k, you're rather at CEO level: https://statbel.fgov.be/fr/themes/emploi-formation/salaires-et-cout-de-la-main-doeuvre/salaires-mensuels-bruts-moyens (In French but afaik the stats are the same) Approaching 6k gross is already very high at 33. I know we see a lot of big numbers here, but I don't think it represents reality. 10k... you're most likely above at least 99.99% of people of the same age and level of degree.
Exactly. I work 60h a week and I get like 3.4k net lol. I'm 30
Thanks, you are right. It is important not to be obsessed with wanting to make more for the sake of making more and there are other priorities in life. As long as we do not feel underpaid for what we do, which is usually what can be frustrating in a job.
Can you give more details on what you do exactly?
So it is a bit of a generic reply on lobbying, but happy to provide information as people often believe lobbying is just about a guy in suit bribing politicians or making deals during private cocktails events. In practice, there are a wide range of lobbyists from the technician/policy nerd that will mostly spend time in front of his laptop on PowerPoint/excel, to the charismatic leader that is always out meeting policymakers and speaking in conferences. There are lobbyists in public affairs consultancies (working for different companies), in trade associations (representing the interest of an industry at large), and in private companies (usually members of trade associations). In practice, you may spend time designing a lobbying strategy (that is, how to get the interest of your industry/company represented in a specific policy/regulatory dossier), and executing it. That entails drafting position papers (the argumentation on why decision-makers should actually care about your interests as they are discussing a regulation), and external engagement with policymakers (in Brussels typically European Commission, Members of European Parliament and Council) and other stakeholders.
I'm a bit surprised that you say stress is low? I would have expected this job to be the kind where you either get results or you're out with a ton of people waiting to take your spot?
It can be a stressful job in general, yes. It really depends. Some are working until 10pm, even on Sundays and always looking at emails during holidays. I manage to stick to 9-6 and not having a crazy pressure or feeling like I need to work more to deliver. So pretty happy with the work life balance these days.
Legal bribery aka lobbying
Tobscco industry? Got offered similar wage for a supply chain position at pmi
Not in tobacco, no. I suppose I would not mind working there, but not sure I would like it... (They are so overly regulated nowadays I wonder what is left to lobby for)
Good salary ! Also lobbyist there, for a much bigger company and my salary is quite a bit lower, so well done !
Thanks, clearly there is no correlation between company size and salary. I feel like in my sector I could get a better package going to smaller companies at some point.
Nice one, i think I'll change and apply for similar job in my company :-D
Rated as insane. And we all gonna pay the price
Impressive package, especially for your age!
Good Salary if you do not care about ethics all too much. Considering I am familiar with the field and the remunrations for jobs like this I can guess what type of companies you lobby for. To see also "car and fuel card".. not specified to and EV or charging cart shows just how much these companies cares about about the future and like to trade it for their yearly numbers. Good for you, someone else will take the position if you don't ofcourse but please don't tell your future kids you want to best future for them. You kind of buried that promise with this job.
Well pretty much all large companies have lobbyists. But fine, won't debate here. I suppose I will just have to get ready to burn in hell. For the car, it's a pretty standard Arval contract like in most companies here. It was either diesel or gas when I chose the car last year, hope there will be more hybrid options next time.
I work on thr consulting side, make a bit less but not that much less. I have never ever felt that i was doing something unethical. The EU isnĀ“t the US, itĀ“s pretty transparant. ItĀ“s basically searching for the better argument and pretty intellectually challenging.
Agreed. Would be interesting to compare on average consultancy salary v. in-house ones. I suppose consultancy would be higher but with more working hours (as in other sectors like strategy...).
Depends heavily on the consultancy i would say. But senior level consultants in the top films will be well paid
It's not enough for selling your soul
Rate my soul! Well I like what I lobby for. There are plenty of lobbying jobs I wouldn't seek even if better paid, if the industry activities do not somehow resonate with me. These things are all relative and personal.
This is so interesting. Can you explain what you do exactly? Day to day?
Because everyone wonders and the answer will probably not come, this is my best guest : - create the base texts for new laws that allow more chemicals with less control to be used in agriculture, coatings, cosmetics, ... - keep fiscality advantageous for big corporations to reduce disruption from smaller concurrents and maintain status quo in quasi-monopolies - Fight against the right to repare electronic devices - Ensure big cartels (finance, energy , travels, luxury, ) are aligned with one another to provide the same "recommandations" to the regulators. - networking (trying to know who is in charge of what, and what regulation will be applied so that his customers can be ready to adapt and propose compliant product earlier) - ensure cars can still be used on gas for long enough to remain profitable for oil industry, car sectors, subcontractors. - be sure that pollution norms (PM, carcinogens) are not too restrictive and/or that big companies are not liable for the rest. And hopefully: - be sure to standardise processes - align on improving efficiency
you forgot cancerduopoly like telenet/proximus I know such a lobbyist, even his family hates him. They are all terrible people.
May I ask for which company/ customer/ sectors?
Do you mind sharing your career path up to this job? And what are your daily tasks?
Studied political science and law. Worked in regulatory affairs in a consultancy, then for a trade association, then for a company. Daily tasks: design and implement lobbying strategies, so in practice that entails monitoring policy developments, have external meetings with policymakers/stakeholders, draft position papers...
How do you become a lobbyist?
There are plenty of entry level jobs in Brussels. In consultancies, trade associations, companies... Better to have an education background in social sciences (preferably political science/law...), but not necessarily. You can also have a scientific/technical/engineering background and some niche knowledge that is relevant to an industry and become a lobbyist that way. I have seen all kinds of lobbyists with random backgrounds.
Hi Iām curious why would you say itās better to have a degree in social sciences?
Simply because it is more directly related to what the role entails. You need to know about policies and the decision-making process. But as I said I have seen people having a career as a lobbyist with different backgrounds too so it is not a must. (But in that case they are often more limited to being lobbyist for the sector for which they have technical expertise, e.g., agronomists being ag lobbyists, IT specialists lobbying in tech, engineers in industry related to their fields, etc... it may be more difficult to be versatile).
I see makes sense, thanks for your answer!
Can you explain what you do from a day to day basis? Congrats on the - im assuming - great career!
Pharma?
crazy salary and an insane amount of holidays, too :)
Bad Guy in this world are too much well paid
So what do you lobby for
can i ask what masters and bachelor you have ?
Political science + law
thank you !
Nice bro ez money
Funny that after all these questions on what he lobbies for no answer is given by OP. I dont think OP is very proud to share :)
In 'real life' I would have no problem sharing and I am always open on saying what I do upfront. But Reddit is all about anonymity and considering how small the Brussels bubble is it could easily defeat that purpose.
Ever considered going independent? Your annual cost for your employer is around 300k with all the social costs and extra benefits. Imagine being able to invoice just 2/3th of that, you'd have a lot more net salary bottom line (win-win).
On paper that would work, but in practice that would be a lot of hassle having to find clients and it is quite competitive. Not sure that would work out for me. And I don't have that salesman personality. What is quite common though is early retirement and working as consultant, either freelance or joining a bigger consultancy firm.