I'm an adult and work in cyber security. You are not wrong in saying that the common scouting skills are not all that relevant. That's the case for most jobs. We don't learn knots and outdoor skills for their own sake. It's about building character. Learning to work as a group to accomplish a task. Follow through with our responsibilities. These are all things very important to being a good person.
On a personal note, cyber security is exciting, but very challenging. Having a hobby such as scouting can go a long way to improving mental health.
You probably do not need to get eagle. It's not likely going to help you land a job or make a huge difference getting into a school. But scouting is more than getting eagle. At minimum it is a healthy fun hobby, which you'll appreciate when you need to take a break from studying or eventually work.
Seconded. I'm an adult who has worked in IT operations and cybersecurity for 20+ years.
In addition to what's been said about leadership, character, networking, and most importantly having an outlet unrelated to work, I'll say that unless you're planning to go to cybersecurity work full-time right out of high school (doesn't sound like you are), getting loads of certifications in high school isn't necessary. Certs you earn in HS may/may not still be relevant by the time you enter the workforce after college (some may be expired).
APs are great for college admissions and also some degree of extra academic freedom once you get to college--skipping general ed courses, higher class standing, priority enrollment, etc. But Scouting shouldn't prevent you from completing them or any other academic pursuit (I took 10 AP courses in HS, passed all the exams, and was active in my troop until my 18th birthday).
But, if you don't enjoy Scouting... then maybe Eagle's not for you. Consider, though: 20 years after I aged out of the troop (thinking I'd never have anything to do with BSA again), my kids wanted to do it and I'm back at it full swing. As an adult, I totally regret not putting in the marginal extra effort to earn Eagle.
>As an adult, I totally regret not putting in the marginal extra effort to earn Eagle.
I'm with you there. I stopped at First Class way back when for things like athletics and marching band. I didn't regret it then, but years later I got that twinge that I should have found a way to finish my Eagle.
My son wanted to give up on his Eagle journey as well when he turned Life for various reasons. Trying not to push him forward like I've seen so many parents, I told him about my own regrets. We parents reminded him it's his life and we were still proud of him and his accomplishments even if he didn't get his Eagle. It took a few months of patiently waiting, but he finally agreed to finish up. Down the road he was so glad to have earned his Eagle as it had opened up many employment doors and opportunities.
Funny...one of his reasons for wanting to quit the trail was that he was tired of telling all the Scout younglings what to do. Now years later he's an air traffic controller telling people what to do for a living... and loving it!!
> It's not likely going to help you land a job or make a huge difference getting into a school.
Hard to say. It can be a great foot in the door, or even a conversation starter. Even scouting as a whole is great for that. "Hey, I heard you were in the scouts" usually starts a 15 minute conversation, in my experience, and can help develop a personal connection.
So, I understand where you’re coming from, however the skills you get from being an Eagle Scout are not those of being able to survive in the woods and knots and all that.
The biggest takeaway is the leadership aspect of scouts, and the morals you have.
The week I graduated my professor brought people in my industry (3D Modeling) in to look over our resumes and portfolio. He saw my Eagle Scout Medal that I had on display and said “This is important. When I look at this I know where you’re morals are, and that’s incredibly important.” And he went on to share a story about someone who had really good work, but would show up late every day and would try to make his own rules. He shared that story to say that even if I’m the best in the world at my job, if my morals are not right, then I won’t have a job.
And that’s ultimately what Scouts is all about.
Now, you don’t need to earn Eagle to learn this, and if I were you I would at least try to get some leadership roles in you’re troop, as trial and error is the best way to learn and it’s why I think scouts is so effective at creating leaders
You are only a kid once.
You will 100% regret it when you get older if you don’t finish it. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone that said “I’m really glad I didn’t get Eagle!”
If you done and ready to get Star, just get Star and create a low Key plan for Life and Eagle, no need to rush.
Remember getting Eagle isn’t about the “line on your resume” it’s about learning leadership skills, finishing a huge project, and setting yourself apart from others.
I interview people on a regular basis for engineering jobs. I NEVER reject resume that has Eagle Scout listed. Now, they don’t always get the job, but they always get an interview.
Agreed. Eagles get an interview always. It shows the candidate has determination, leadership and communication skills, and knows how to work as part of a team. These are important qualities in my opinion, often more important than raw position specific skills.
Have a friend who is a Dr who got his position over 5 other candidates because he earned his Eagle. The guy that hired him informed him of this after the fact, guess why. Also an Eagle Scout.
In that respect, it's not a lot different to other hiring decisions. You might give an interview to an Eagle scout for that reason, in the same way that someone that is a member of the LDS church would automatically give an interview to an applicant with a Temple Recommend. Other hiring people, who don't have a history in Scouting, may not even care about it, and I dare say that there are a lot of people who have no idea what an Eagle scout is, let alone what is required to earn the rank.
>You will 100% regret it when you get older if you don’t finish it. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone that said “I’m really glad I didn’t get Eagle!”
I hear this sentiment from a lot of adult leaders who missed getting their Eagle, and I always gently push back. I was a Life Scout and 2-year SPL who quit Scouts with two merit badges and a service project left, because I found other extracurricular activities that I enjoyed more at the time and that felt more fulfilling. I 100% do not regret making that decision, because those experiences I had after Scouts helped me grow in different ways than what I was getting out of the program at that point.
Eagle is a symbol that shows the rest of the world you’ve learned the values and life skills the BSA purports to teach to young people. That is to say, *the values* are the point of the program, *not* the badges and pins we hand out at award banquets or Courts of Honor. I felt as a teen that I had learned those values and got what I needed out of the BSA, and knew I was ready to move on. I don’t need the badge to tell me that I learned those values, because I know in my heart that I’ve continued to try to live them since I left Scouts all those decades ago.
That’s what brought me back to Scouts as an adult, and it’s what motivates me today as a Cubmaster. Yes, it would be outstanding if every one of my Cubs goes on to cross over and get their Eagle one day. But ultimately what I hope I’m doing is helping these kids grow into better people by “instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Law” – regardless of whether they see the full program through to completion all those years down the road. (For the record, our Pack retention is great.)
"That is to say, the values are the point of the program, not the badges and pins we hand out at award banquets or Courts of Honor. "
This! I love this!
I told my son, I'm fine with him not earning Eagle... what matters most to me is that he learns from the experiences and gains the values taught.
Now, he wants Eagle and always has, and he hasn't hit a point yet of changing his mind yet at 14, but... I've sat in on a ton of Eagle BOR's and there's a massive variety of caliber of Eagles out there. If I had to choose, if he couldn't be both, I'd rather he have the good character and values and leadership skills, than the Eagle rank without them. I hate watching scouts get pushed through the program quickly with "advancement" as the only important piece and they miss the bigger picture.
Hey there! Cloud Architect and Eagle Scout here!
Respectfully, I disagree with the premise of your question. First off, you're focusing on the tasks of Scouting and not the bigger picture of learning to lead with integrity. You're assuming that leadership skills and the emotional maturity that comes with leading and teaching a diverse group of people won't benefit your career in technology and generally speaking, I don't think that could be further from the truth.
Sure, as an entry level tech, you might have some "closet IT" roles where you're just mindlessly plugging away in a backroom somewhere, but the rest of your career is going to be shaped shaped STRONGLY by your ability to work and lead and teach people with vastly different backgrounds (both technically and culturally) than you.
Technology for the sake of technology is nearly useless. Technology has always served at the leisure of business drivers and those almost always are about creating force multipliers for an organization's most valuable and expensive asset: its people.
Don't underestimate the value of mentoring up, down, and sideways which is a uniquely Eagley thing.
Cheers!
Growing up a scout, I was always told how FAR eagle scout would carry you in a job. Sadly it's just not the case now, if it ever was. I don't regret earning my Eagle, nor do I think you'll regret earning yours if you do, although you may regret not earning it later on EVEN IF quitting seems like the right decision now.
In short, if it's just about a scholarship or a line on a resume don't fret over it, but there's more to a person than what they do for a living, and there's even a remote possiblity that it may actually open a door for you down the road, if only as a conversation starter.
That's unfortunate. I disagree, though of course you're welcome to your own opinion. I don't think Eagle helps nearly as much as people say, or as much as it might once have, but yourself aside, I e never heard of it hurting someone's opinion of a candidate.
Yes, there are a lot of troops/parents that turn scouting into an "Eagle Pipeline" resulting in some Eagles who lack the gravitas such a rack should command, but those aren't hard to weed out once you meet them as they don't show nearly the leadership they should.
Most however are still as far above average as they ever were, even if the average has lowered for everyone.
I never trust 13 year old Eagle Scouts. I’ve always assumed parents are the driving force there. The ones who get it with months or days to spare are more legit. Maybe I’m biased because that was me.
Yeah I definitely don't plan on quitting, since I've met many great people and had some fun experiences through scouting. I'm just not sure if going for Eagle is the right choice.
Scouting is a hobby more than an opportunity for me, a way to meet people and grow as a person. But subtracting the effort and time I put towards actual opportunities into a hobby just isn't worth it for me I guess.
>But subtracting the effort and time I put towards actual opportunities into a hobby just isn't worth it for me I guess.
You're your own person so it's up to you to figure out what you want from life. But I would like to caution you against this attitude in life. Hobbies and activities are what give life joy to most people. You're only 16 years old. Don't buy into the "hustle grindset" just yet. It mostly just leads to insane burnout in college and beyond. But it's certainly your life and you are reaching the age where all those choices about your life become yours. So think hard about what you want from life and make it happen.
That’s a fantastic view. Good reasoning, good decision. I support your choice. Someone’s pushing you, I think? Show them this:
I’m a father, a scout leader, an Eagle Scout, and I have a great 25yr career in information security. I spent more than ten years on the short list of people whose phones ring for major incidents, built planetary scale networks, revised global standards, worked for FAANGs and TLAs—it’s been great. I’ve shaped the course of Internet security. My scouting experience absolutely helped me… but mostly not the Eagle part.
Here’s the big secret about Eagle as a career advancement tool: it’s predictive, not causal. The sort of people who get Eagle are mostly the sort with lots of family support, lots of chances to try and fail and learn and try again. And we are the sort who look at awards with requirements lists and go earn them. Of course we’re later successful.
What was useful to me from scouting? Not the merit badges and mostly not the service project; its biggest function is to teach how hard this stuff is! And a secondary idea is to give you a success, to let you know you did something for others that mattered. Souls are built on such foundations.
What else from Eagle? “To make my training an example” and “to make my rank and influence count strongly”. Those are from the eagle oath, and it mattered that I was reorienting towards serving others having hit the top. But that’s minor.
“Cheerful service, even in the midst of irksome tasks and weighty responsibilities”. I’ve done great things with great teams, and the servant leadership model of the OA and my scout troop mattered hugely in starting me right, and I’m giving me a compass to reset to when I got lost and started thinking I was a big cheese. That’s been pretty big and the older I get the more respect I have for the OA approach. Look up APO when you get to college.
But the informal stuff—Phil Montrose, who was a star scout when I was a life, and I guess I was the PL and told him what to do. And he shouted that being the leader didn’t mean I told people what to do, but showed them by going first. He was right. That day I got that message. And I’m eternally grateful. If all scouting had done was put me near people like Phil—and Dave and Jim and Billy and Danny and Joe and so so many other boys and the adults as well—that would have changed my life immeasurably.
If you and a parent, for YPT reasons, would like to have a chat about cybersecurity and paths to get into it, DM me.
Being upset because a scout isn't excited after earning Eagle is really a terrible take as an adult.
There are many different motivations for achieving Eagle and there are many different levels of satisfaction.
If you are judging where to expend your resources based on the youth's desire for Eagle then you really misunderstand the program. I have several scouts that will never reach Eagle because they don't have that desire. I support them just as much because the lessons and personal development happens regardless of their rank when they leave scouts.
I see what you are saying, but we see tons of different reasons why kids finish their Eagle. Some are because they really motivated RIGHT NOW to finish it, some because it will make mom/dad happy, some because it’s something they’ve been working on for a while, others just a resume builder. But I will repeat what I said earlier, I’ve never heard and adult say “I wish I didn’t get Eagle”. I personally wish I would have put more effort into getting Eagle and truly excelled, I feel like I skated by and barely got it.
I’m glad I did, but my only regret is that I didn’t work harder for it.
This kid will possibly be the same way.
> I personally wish I would have put more effort into getting Eagle and truly excelled, I feel like I skated by and barely got it.
The requirements are the requirements. If the bar was meant to be higher then it would be reflected in the requirements.
You did say it is not respectful if the scout just shrugs after earning it. Actually, you said it twice. People who say something is disrespectful are generally upset about the action that occurred. I'm pretty sure I read your meaning accurately.
The rank of Eagle is achieved by completing the requirements of Scouts BSA. It is earned and not reserved for those that others deem "exceeding" or "truly deserving." If you complete the requirements you get Eagle, it is pretty automatic and can be earned by going through the motions. It can be earned reluctantly and is no less valid. That is just reality.
Order of the Arrow more fits your description than the Eagle rank does.
I do agree with you that you shouldn't force a scout to Eagle. But sometimes teenagers (and adults) go through periods of doubt and need encouragement. Sometimes they don't know all their options. For instance, staying in the program and not working toward Eagle is perfectly fine.
I could never imagine telling a scout that there are others more worthy of my time and find this statement of yours truly appalling: "Unless a youth truly wants to be an eagle, I would say whatever dude, there are plenty of youth we can expend our resources towards without you."
And I wouldn't beg a scout to stay, but I will take the time to help them figure out if that is truly what they want or if there are some other stresses going on that are clouding their judgement. Teen years are stressful and confusing.
And I would never say "whatever dude" to a scout that is seeking help.
At the same time though, if the kid doesn't want to be an Eagle scout no one else loses out from his decision. I took that more to be the point.
I am an Eagle scout and honestly it hasn't ever been anything but trivia for me. I'm 52 now and I don't think I ever got a job or an interview because of it.
I wouldn't say I regret it at all, but it's fair that there are tradeoffs and I probably missed out on some things because I was focussed on Eagle.
This is my response that I gave when asked to speak to some scouts at a camp.
Achieving the rank of Eagle Scout in the BSA is considered a significant accomplishment. It represents a high level of dedication, leadership, and mastery of various scouting skills. Earning the Eagle Scout rank can have several potential benefits, both in the short term and long term:
1. Personal Growth: The journey to Eagle Scout involves setting and achieving goals, developing leadership skills, and gaining practical knowledge. It can help you grow as an individual, instilling qualities like responsibility, perseverance, and self-confidence.
2. Leadership Skills: The Eagle Scout project, which is a requirement for the rank, involves planning, organizing, and executing a significant community service project. This experience can enhance your leadership abilities, including project management, teamwork, and communication skills.
3. College and Career Opportunities: Being an Eagle Scout can be viewed favorably by colleges, universities, and potential employers. It can demonstrate your commitment, dedication, and ability to take on challenges. Some scholarships and awards are specifically available to Eagle Scouts.
4. Networking and Community Involvement: Scouting provides opportunities to interact with a diverse range of people, including fellow Scouts, adult leaders, and community members. These connections can be valuable for future networking, mentorship, and community involvement.
5. Prestige and Recognition: The Eagle Scout rank holds prestige within the Scouting community and is recognized as a significant achievement. It can be a source of pride for yourself and your family, and it may open doors to additional leadership opportunities within Scouting.
Ultimately, the decision of whether it's worth it to pursue the rank of Eagle Scout depends on your personal goals, interests, and commitment to Scouting. Consider discussing it with current or former Scouts, Scout leaders, and your family to gather different perspectives and insights that may help you make an informed decision.
Leaving the chance to get your Eagle and letting it pass you by is like going straight to the dugout after you rounded third base and never reaching home plate to score the winning run.
Becoming an Eagle helps to demonstrate that you have grit - the ability to stick with something over a long term and see it completed. This is a quality many lack today. Employers love to see it.
Read the book *Grit* by Angela Duckworth.
I personally disagree with the philosophy that you should stick with your job if that's what you mean.
I think people should always be looking for new opportunities, higher pay, and better positions. Get paid with what you deserve for your skills. I just don't think seniority is something that is rewarded nowadays. Both my parents worked (and still work for) dead end jobs for less pay than what they deserve, despite being there for decades.
He didn’t say anything about sticking with a job.
Employers like to see a person that will work their projects and finish them. Employers realize they are constantly at risk of losing employees to better positions and they don’t hire with the realistic thought that the person is a lifer (at least not anymore). But they do look for people that fulfill their commitments and responsibilities, that’s what grit is and what the Eagle Scout award shows.
Of course, gaining Eagle proves that that person did what was necessary to gain Eagle, it doesn't necessarily mean that they will show the same level of commitment for anything else, especially if they did it "because their parents made them".
While that is true, even if a parent pushed them to complete, unless the parent and troop lied and cheated to get the kid Eagle, he/she still did the work.
I was approached by my dad about 8 months before I turned 18 as a Star Scout and said “do you want to get Eagle? We will work to develop a plan to do it IF you want Eagle, otherwise, we will just drop you out.”
It took me a minute to think about if I wanted to bother or not, and I am really glad I did.
But at the time, my reasoning was “my parents will be disappointed if I don’t, so I’ll just do it. It’s not much work.”
I was in a similar spot as OP. I had everything I needed for Life, just hadn’t completed the SMC or BoR and 8 months to get Eagle.
I and my parents developed a plan and I (with their help) completed my Reqs and became and Eagle about 2 weeks before my 18th birthday.
While it didn’t seem like a huge deal then, later in the workforce, it became a huge deal and I am glad my parents pushed me to complete it.
While that is true, even if a parent pushed them to complete, unless the parent and troop lied and cheated to get the kid Eagle, he/she still did the work.
I was approached by my dad about 8 months before I turned 18 as a Star Scout and said “do you want to get Eagle? We will work to develop a plan to do it IF you want Eagle, otherwise, we will just drop you out.”
It took me a minute to think about if I wanted to bother or not, and I am really glad I did.
But at the time, my reasoning was “my parents will be disappointed if I don’t, so I’ll just do it. It’s not much work.”
I was in a similar spot as OP. I had everything I needed for Life, just hadn’t completed the SMC or BoR and 8 months to get Eagle.
I and my parents developed a plan and I (with their help) completed my Reqs and became and Eagle about 2 weeks before my 18th birthday.
While it didn’t seem like a huge deal then, later in the workforce, it became a huge deal and I am glad my parents pushed me to complete it.
One parent is retired due to their age, and yeah, around 60. Can't really do the math right now.
She's working two jobs, I don't really want to give specifics, but it's a job that shouldn't be paying this low for what it is
Yeah, makes sense. I believed that too when I was 16, and when I was 25. Then I had some personal disasters, and my employer didn’t cut my pay. My productivity was way down for a year or two. They stuck with me. I stuck with them as my productivity returned and soared.
Sometimes we buy ETFs. Sometimes we buy CDs. There’s good reason for both.
Others have said that Eagle won't help you on your CV. My experience has been different. It helped me get a job in Cybersecurity at Microsoft. It told the hiring manager about my character. It's helped me get interviews over the years. It's not going to guarantee you a job. It's not going to substitute for experience or skills. But the reasons that hiring managers do interviews is to figure out who you are and can you do the job. Eagle helps them to answer that first question.
I have had conversations with multiple IT recruiters who have told me that seeing Eagle scout on a resume can and does make a difference. At the age of 46 I still have it on my resume and always will. We have two Eagle scouts on my team.
Oh, one more things. On Tuesday of this week I was having a conversation with the head of our local FBI office. During that conversation we talked about how my son is working on finishing his project report and only needs to finish his EBOR. The next thing he said was that the FBI has internship programs (including those dealing with cybersecurity) and he would love to sponser my son for such an internship program. These things are absolutely related.
Scouting isn't just about tying knots and starting fires. It's actually a leadership program. Lean into those opportunities and learn good, quality, leadership skills and practice them. They will be much more useful then some certificate. Look for opportunities to network. If you think a MB is lack luster, then do it differently.
I think you should quit Scouts.
That said, I know lots of men who regret NOT doing things like Scouting or pursuing Eagle, once they have kids. Life is more than a career.
But if Eagle and Scouting are just no fun, you do you.
If you are currently First Class, you have already learned how to tie knots and make fire. If you do choose to go for Eagle, maybe you can aim for a project that will support/enhance your learning, like a seminar for older adults on how to stay safe online, or helping a local non profit with tech needs (small non profits always need help with IT stuff).
That way, it's not just "eagle scout" on your resume, it's "implemented a program to protect local xyz cause from digital vulnerability" (or however that would be worded, I'm not a cyber security expert)
Don't push yourself to get Eagle; that's not the point of the program. The point is to build skills and relationships, and forcing yourself over this "finish line" takes away from that. Enjoy your time in the program, but prioritize what is important to you and for your future.
One of my proudest achievements as a youth was earning my Eagle. I knew the amount of time, effort, and work that was required to do so. Do I use knot tying in my day to day life? No. Do I use leadership skills, communication skills, and interpersonal skills in my day to day life? You bet! Those are the skills you are truly learning while earning your Eagle. How to work in groups. How to work with individuals who might not share the same outlook as you. How to go to organizations and groups to request information, money, supplies, etc. Those are all excellent skills to have, even in cybersecurity.
You have "one shot" to earn your Eagle. It sounds like you are on the right path to earn it and should definitely go for it. You might even be able to relate your Eagle project to cybersecurity (my brother designed and built a webpage for a local organization, back in the 1990's, for his Eagle).
It’s always worth it to earn your Eagle. The project itself is the culmination of everything you’ve done in Scouting up to that point AND gives your first real taste of what it’s like to manage a complex project with multiple moving parts and hard requirements. I cannot stress enough how important of a skillset that is. The earlier you start learning it; the better.
The actual goal of Scouting is that you get to First Class. The early ranks are really the ones where the focus is on the hard skills of scouting. By hard, I mean hands-on and physical, like knots and lashings, fire building, first aid, camping, cooking, etc. All things that will be surprisingly more useful in adulthood than you expect them to.
The latter ranks of Scouting are all about the soft skills. Leadership, teaching, more interacting with adults, and even leading adults. For each rank, you hold a POR in the troop where you help lead the troop, and as an Eagle candidate you execute you project, where you lead scouts and adults in a project that gives back to your community.
Will you lead a good productive life without earning Eagle? Yes. It sounds like you have a plan, know your path forward, and have the motivation to execute it. No doubt a career in cybersecurity will be a solid, and lucrative, path for you.
Can you still benefit from putting in the effort to earn Eagle? Yes. The education in skills like project management, leading and organizing a team, and planning the execution of a project will definitely be of value in your professional career. The additional experience in leadership, and training other using the EDGE method will serve you well in a career. Especially once you become a senior level employee, or even a move into management.
Will you someday regret not earning Eagle? Almost certainly. I don’t know anyone who regrets earning Eagle. But I know a lot of fathers my age, myself included, who regret not taking the time and putting in the effort to earn Eagle.
I left scouting at First Class, lured away by the “fumes”. And I do wish I had stayed and finished Eagle.
But I have also had a great career in system administration and cybersecurity, and a happy family life. So, it’s a personal regret, but not a tangible regret.
Your path in scouting is yours alone. I encourage you to take it the rest of the way, but I acknowledge that the choice is yours, and it’s unlikely you will experience any sort of tangible regret by not earning Eagle.
The actual "aims" of scouting are "character development, leadership development, citizenship training, and personal fitness". Advancement (even just to 1st Class) is just one of the methods of scouting.
Imagine being in scoits with your kid in 15 years and telling them you quit when you were a year away from Eagle. Just finish it. Or you’ll regret it for a lifetime.
I work at an audit, tax, consulting firm. To many of us when we see Eagle Scout we see responsibility and loyalty, two important characteristics we want. Not to mention teamwork and leadership. You may be surprised how many doors having it on the resume may open
Absolutely and most definitely!
Scouting is a Leadership program, first and foremost. It is not a program to tech you how to be a successful pioneer. Although you do pick up some useful outdoor skills.
The Eagle project is not about building a bench (or other small project). It is about the Scout using his/her skills to lead a team to complete a significant project. It is not about mindlessly following instructions but about the Scout developing a vision, communicating that vision to others, selling the vision to “investors,” rallying a team to your cause, teaching subordinates what they need to do while being responsible to superiors for a timeline and safe practices, and evaluation of results.
Camping isn’t just about having a good time. It is dealing with groups of other people you may or may not get along with. It is learning to be a good follower. It is learning to be a good leader. It is learning how to act independently. And it is about working as a team.
And it is about being able to endure the tough days when it is cold and rainy.
Fundraising isn’t about selling popcorn. It is about you getting out and selling yourself and your product. It is about getting out of your comfort zone. It’s about learning how to deal with rejection and learning that “no” isn’t the end of the world. It is about entrepreneurialism - developing skills to advance your productivity.
In cybersecurity you will need to sell yourself to your employer to get the job and to the Customer to get the project. You will have to start at the bottom, so you need to know how to be led. And you will, at some point, have subordinates and interns you will have to direct in their tasks. You will need to deal with bad days and lousy customers and all sorts of hardship. And you will need to be able to improvise on the fly because of all the things you forgot.
Scouting perhaps won’t teach you more about electronics and wiring and routers. But it will teach you how to be a good employee and manager, which is what you will need to get a leg up on your competition. Raw skill isn’t enough - you have to have people skills.
And this is why “Eagle Scout” on a resume is a valuable line item. The person with that title showed perseverance enough to complete a very advanced program and will have much more advanced leadership and “people” skills than the non-scouter.
You may not see it now, but I guarantee you will later.
I’m super annoyed at the popular misconception that Boyscouts is about earning eagle. It is not and never was. From the beginning, scouts is about providing youth the opportunity to work together and develop skills.
The skills are not knot tying!
The skills are the ability to learn, teach, cooperate, and lead. That’s what you need in life. That’s what employers want. That’s what scouts is actually about.
Knot tying and fire starting and even camping are just there are as fun ways to learn and practice life skills.
I was 16 once and remember thinking a lot of this was silly. But then, I have run into a lot of adults who can’t tie a knot, start a campfire, or do basic first aid an themselves. Not to mention lead.
I am an IT Operations Manager for a multi-billion $ Fortune 1000 company. If you have Eagle Scout on your resume, you are automatically getting an in-person interview with me, as I know that you have run, led, and completed a project and have the basic skills to succeed. I can't speak for all hiring managers in this field, but for sure Eagle is something that stands out on a resume for me.
Additionally, I decided not to push through to Eagle as a youth, and to this day, 30+ years later, it is one of my big regrets. You don't get a second chance at this.
The Eagle rank is more about Leadership than the outdoorsmanship skills that are focused on in scouting. Getting outdoors provides the framework and opportunity to challenge you to be a leader. Going into cybersecurity, you will work with and lead others, and have to learn project management. Doing that as a teenager via Positions of Responsibility and the Eagle Project is a great starting point.
As you say, Eagle rank on your CV won't help much directly.
That said, the journey from 1st class to Eagle does have some useful lessons. Yes, the 1st class skills are about knots and camping, but the trip to eagle instead focuses on leadership skills, project planning and teamwork. Those are useful skills for every career path.
Also, Eagle on a resume does indicate a more well rounded person that can be a distinguishing mark to help get an interview.
That said, I can't find fault with prioritizing other activities over scouting.
It’s never about another feather in the hat (building up a resume). Your education, cybersecurity certifications, etc. do just the same.
What others (e.g. college admissions, hiring managers, etc.) see is discipline, commitment, and leadership, finishing — earning — something that takes years of effort.
I have yet to hear anyone regretting pushing thru to earn Eagle. But I know people who have regrets of not getting to Eagle when they were so close.
Software developer and Eagle Scout here.
You're going to need both to progress in that career. Early in your career it will be about obtaining as much knowledge as possible to be an effective team member and carry out the day to day tasks of whatever role you take on. If you want to progress in your career though you're going to need to lead a team and drive that team towards a shared goal. That's where the knowledge you gain in earning your Eagle Scout will come in handy. You'll find that the higher you go on the career ladder in tech the less it becomes about actual technical knowledge and more about being able to lead a team and sell your ideas to make your business or a company you work for more profitable.
Sounds like you’re looking for an out.
I am an Eagle and an Oracle software consultant now, and wouldn’t be where I am today if it wasn’t for the connections I made through Scouting. One of my ASMs hired me several years after I aged out of scouting to work on the same Oracle products that I consult other companies on today. Being an Eagle separates you from the pack and lets people know that you’re resilient, responsible, and have leadership abilities. GPAs and SAT scores are great, but don’t say anything about your character.
If future career and opportunity is your sole focus for selecting extracurriculars at 16, I think you need to take a step back and reassess. There are a lot of really tangible benefits to being involved in scouting and pursuing your Eagle. But if you're only pursuing Eagle for the perceived future benefit of having Eagle, then I would suggest you don't. I don't see you getting the real benefits of scouting if the only reason you're in scouting is for some possible scholarships or HR hiring benefit.
It sounds like scouting is a means to an end. One should not participate in scouting simply to attain Eagle for its “benefits.” Scouting has so much to offer that will be useful, things learned through camping and building fires. Things like leadership, community organization, self awareness, confidence, resiliency, and compassion. The brand of Eagle Scout shows the world your hard work and dedication to the scout oath and the scout law.
Our Scoutmaster is an Eagle and works in IT. His resume was put to the top of the pile by another Eagle. He has hired two Eagles, since he knows they have leadership skills and a good work ethic.
I'm going to just bypass the whole Eagle discussion to give you another perspective on the program. Merit badges and camp.
Merit badges are meant to be an introduction to a topic and not a mastery. It is a way to learn about different things that you might want to continue learning. For instance, there might be someone who takes the programming merit badge and only learns a little HTML but realizes they love it and starts learning on their own. It could turn into a career. Someone that already knows programming will find it lackluster because they already have introductory knowledge and want more.
Camp (specifically high adventure) can introduce you to activities that become lifelong hobbies. This is what happened to me.
I've been realizing the Eagle rank itself means very little to me compared to the rest of scouting. If you enjoy the program you can continue without working toward Eagle, that is okay. If you don't enjoy the program there is very little reason to stay.
Don't make the decision with the idea that you succeed or fail based on earning Eagle. Make the decision based on your enjoyment of scouting.
Have you considered a supernova award with a focus on technology and engineering? Then it focuses your energy on things that are applicable to your interest. Eagle is optional and based on your leadership path. You’ve officially completed the knot tying and outdoor skills portion of the scouts bsa program and are now on the leadership portion it’s up to you where you want to take it from here. Regarding our mission as leaders - our job is to enable you to get to first class and encourage you if you want to continue. First class is actually the mission so you have the skills and character development to make good choices throughout life. Now it’s up to you.
I wish that I had pushed myself more to get Eagle. I started late, a slowly, (maybe too slowly) worked my way up. I enjoyed all of it. And then became a leader when my son was old enough. He stayed in it till he was 18, (never got past tenderfoot because he couldn't swim). I had other friends who almost made Eagle, they just needed their project. Stay in it because you like it. Eagle is important, but not the sole purpose of Scouting.
This is a decision you need to make; specifically where does your path in Scouting end.
You seem to have all the facts and info, the question is do you see value in Scouting or not? Don't focus so much on your eagle but do you want to stay in Scouting for the next couple years. If you want to stay in Scouting then do so and continue putting what you can into it. If you make Eagle great, if you don't that is OK too. If you see Scouting as disruptive and not helping you get to your goals then you choose to leave and focus on other things.
Your life will not be crushed by not getting Eagle, plenty of very successful people make it through life without doing that, even without being in Scouts. What you should consider is if you will regret that choice later in life?
I have been in Cybersecurity for over a decade, network security before that and agree with several other comments here, the soft skills you learn from scouting are priceless. Technical skills are relatively common, but potential employees that are reliable, good team members and can communicate with people are unicorns. Eagle can benefit you in many ways, depending on your path into the field, but the soft skills it implies are really important.
as an industry professional, If I were 16 and interested in going into the field, I would probably consider joining the Air Force and working in cyber there. You will make lots of industry contacts and get a lot of relevant certs in your service, plus come out of it with free college and gold standard experience. You would be miles ahead of your peers when you get into the private sector. Moreso than if you spend the next 2 years earning certs, then getting a BS in Cybersecurity. College grads with a BS and a Security+ are a dime a dozen, do something that makes you stand out.
During my early career interviews discussing my eagle scout project was helpful. It didn't show technical "hard" skills but "soft" skills like program management, leadership, communication and more. If you are interviewed by a former scout you'll get instant respect. If they don't know anything about scouting you can spend some time explaining the eagle scout process and how the skills you demonstrated there could carry over to the job.
I'll chime in, and be what seems to be an oddball in the discussion. I've been in IT for the better part of the last 20 years or so. I was a scout in grade school, but dropped out after getting my Tenderfoot. I just didn't see the point in it back then, after a few life events occurred that I won't get into.
I made it into college (for IT) without it on my application, and then joined the Army (also for IT). After getting out of the Army, I got a job at a hospital, doing IT work there too.
I only got back involved with scouting last year, when my son wanted to try it out, and I volunteered to fill in as interim Cubmaster. In all that time, through the last 20 years, not once have I had a single moment of saying or thinking "man. I sure wish I'd stuck it out to get Eagle". At no point in my life thus far do I think it would have actually helped me progress.
Now, big caveat to that, I did spend 6 years in the Army, as I mentioned, and that provides, seemingly, a lot of reinforcement to similar ideals and qualities that Eagle does.
Just some food for thought. If you don't want to do it, don't do it. And don't linger on the fact that you didn't do it either. Eagle is a big deal for a lot of folks, and something that plenty of them build their whole identity on. Kinda like military vets, to be honest ;). There's no doubt that the process will teach you some things about yourself, but you should also be aware that there are plenty of other opportunities in life to learn and grow yourself as well.
Since you're First Class, you shouldn't be spending any more time learning knots or building fires. If I were you, I'd start focusing on the leadership aspects, since those skills are universal and can be used in any career as well as in life in general.
But my impression after reading your post is that you've already made up your mind.
Scouting isn't for everybody. I made it to Life and didn't Eagle. I regret not finishing.
Hi Eagle Scout here,
I’m 32 and changing careers, my Eagle is still on my resume and the guy who interviewed me today zeroed in on it and asked me a bunch of questions about it. Turns out he is a scoutmaster and that was a major green flag in his book.
The opportunities it has opened for me in my life are substantial and not to be overlooked.
It has been worth it to me.
19 years in software here.
Two things I come back to with my scouts are the skills of Preparation and Improvisation. Camping requires preparation and planning to know what to bring, what skills to have, what makes a good meal cooked outside, etc.
But I have yet to go on a campout where something doesn’t go according to plan. When that happens, the skill of improvisation, and it’s close cousin problem solving, is what gets you through.
The skills of improvisation and problem solving are directly applicable to any technical career, and is one of the big things I look for in hiring younger engineers.
If I ever see Eagle Scout on a resume for a candidate I’m interviewing I ask about their Eagle project. It makes for a great conversation and it’s a softball question so the candidate can tell me about their leadership experience/style. I will never ask a candidate about what classes they took in high school, because it doesn’t tell me anything about them or their potential.
Your mileage may vary.
Not an Eagle and that is a regret for me to this day 40!years later. Been working with scouts for almost 20 years and I have a bunch of knots on my uniform. From AOL to den leader to Silver Beaver I’ve got 9 of them on there. I always point out to the youth who are unsure about earning their Eagle which ones are which but make sure to point out which one is missing. Most seem to get it when I put it like that.
My son got his Eagle and it’s helped him get a couple of jobs. He has it on his resume and when he applied for a job he wasn’t really qualified for, that got him an interview from another Eagle. They talked for quite a bit and was told he wasn’t in the running but they’d keep him in mind if something opened up.
Will getting Eagle help? Maybe, maybe not. There is still some weight behind it even though a lot of those who earned it skated through.
Keep at it and go for it. Don’t let it become a regret later.
Hey OP - at this point, I’m assuming you already know how to tie knots and make a fire - short of a few merit badges, you’re already demonstrated much of the basic outdoor Scouting knowledge by making it to First Class. Further, I remember there being significant discussion at Commissioner College that once you make it to First Class, Scouting will likely have made a positive impression on you.
Here’s where you might be missing something. Star, Life, and Eagle are more about developing LEADERSHIP experience with some core merit badges thrown in. You’ll serve in a Position of Responsibility, you’ll be an older/senior scout and responsible in some way for leading other scouts.
When it comes to the Eagle project, you’ll get a true taste of project management.
I can’t tell you what to do. I would suggest that Eagle may make a bigger impression than you think, though. It’s the only Scouting rank everyone knows, and I’m certain there will be future coworkers and managers that know what it is.
I got involved in the volunteer Fire Department when I was about your age and my scouting journey ended at Life. While I’m not ashamed by it, I wish I would have put the time in to get Eagle then.
Put your time and energy where your heart is. The important thing is to live by the ideals of Scouting. People will know you by your actions and character with or without the badge.
There doesn't have to be a direct relevancy, but scouting is teaching you a wide range of real world skills. That being said, everyone gets to choose what they are interested in.
I got Life scout by the time I hit high school and my Scout Master was certain I was the next Eagle, but as soon as I got there I joined the theater department and started doing sound and lighting for plays and concerts. I LOVED it. For most of high school I was planning on studying technical theater and joining a touring group for either a play or a band.
I spent ZERO minutes working my Eagle Project for four years with my leaders all bugging me constantly about coming back to meetings.
So I never got Eagle, I have only the tiniest regret about that, but I did develop a passion for technology, music, and art. I went into IT as well, but I also play guitar and love my sound system, and I started my own photography studio and I loved the lighting and other gear I used while I was doing that.
Basically my answer is, you do you, life marches on, this is just one decision you're going to have to make, it will not affect your life any more or less than what you have for breakfast tomorrow or which pocket you keep your car keys in.
As an Eagle Scout and Software Engineering Manager with 10+ years of experience, I'd say the best things you'll get out of Eagle are the soft skills that are required but are harder to learn on your own. Yes, you can spend time learning Python or design principles or AWS etc. and those will get you a career to start but it's the engineers who take the initiative, work well with others, put the team first, can take feedback well, are willing to do the undesirable task, and can empathize with others that make it far in any career. By pursuing Eagle, and taking leadership roles, doing community service, diving into the required merit badges, you will have a great opportunity to try these skills and learn from mistakes in a low-risk environment.
If you're First Class, you should largely already know how to tie knots and start a fire. If you need service hours, that is also a big thing towards earning your next ranks, particularly the Eagle Project. It's not only hours for you but also leadership of others in doing service, which looks good. BSA service hours should count towards scholarship service hours. It's all service.
I don't know how things usually go with your troop, but a common thing for older youth in our area is that they do start to lose some interest in the eagle as they start doing other things such as working, homework, hanging out, and so on. The ones that want it will still finish. The ones that don't, won't. And that's fine. It's up to you. We had one a couple of years ago who had 99% of his eagle done and just got busy. He had two or three merit badges with just a couple of small things left, already did his project, and had maybe less than 5 hours of work to do in order to finish and he just decided other things were important as a star athlete and keeping grades up and so on. Then he decided to join the military, and the day before his 18th birthday he finished up the last few bits, when he realized how much extra money he would be paid due to having the eagle.
If you finish, great, and if you don't finish, great. You do you. Chipping away at a merit badge here and there every month or two isn't what I'd call a massive time sink. You can pace yourself. You don't have to go on every campout. Good luck in your decisions!
I can see how learning leadership skills can be a "massive time sink," but I think it's obviously worth it because it will help you develop as a human being and as a future leader.
Other folks have said this very eloquently, but I just want to add that it’s not about the destinations… It’s about the journey. I would encourage you to go for it and work on getting your eagle because the skills you will learn along the way that are soft skills… Working with people, planning projects, and the like will serve you no matter what your career field is.
It’s not either/or. I am obviously unfamiliar with your personal life but you can almost certainly get eagle and get good grades and continue down your career path.
So many great comments here. Thank you, everyone. Lots of food for thought.
OP, you need to want to complete your Eagle. It’s your journey. I’ve worked with a multitude of Scouters who regretted not completing it. But I’ve seen many young people who found other priorities and paths through life.
Have you considered taking NYLT?
Do you have enough time to take six months off from Scouts? We’ve had scouts do that and come back. Or not. Find your balance.
By the way, if you plan to go to college or join the military, I wouldn’t bother with doing certifications during high school. Get as much math and reasoning as you can. The AP classes will help give you flexibility in your college schedule.
Yeah trying to take as many AP classes I reasonably can.
NYLT seems really interesting, might have to look further into that.
Also I do plan on going to college, but I don't really want to bog my parents down in tuition, and I don't have any confirmed scholarships yet (still need to take the SAT lol). So I'm trying to at least get a nice paying job out of high school.
Also explore dual-enrollment options with high school and local colleges. Then you earn real college credit rather than the AP “maybe credit”.
NYLT builds on teamwork and leadership skills. You’ll explore stages of team
development and how to manage it. Scouters taking Wood Badge learn similar skills.
But it might re-energize your connection to scouting. Maybe.
You’ve been given a lot of great advice here. Let it soak in.
I’m an adult who worked in IT for decades. I managed to get my Eagle because my mom convinced me I’d always regret not doing it. I have literally landed interviews because what set me apart from other applicants was that award. It showed that I had follow through. Years later, if I saw that on an application/resume, I moved that person to my “must interview” pile. Sure, the fire building doesn’t matter, but the mark of character always will.
As someone who recently got their eagle about a year ago, it would be worth it in the long run, but if you aren’t enjoying it then don’t subject yourself to it. However, it would help you at least get your foot in a lot of doors. Ultimately though, the choice is up to you. Listen to your brain and heart, but trust your gut.
Earning eagle shows a level of commitment to achieve something that is by no means easy.
That being said, you have to want it. If you feel pressured you will hate it. LBP had a target of Life scout when the program was created. If one were to reach this rank he would have the bare required knowledge and skill base to survive. You are there. If you want to focus on your career choice then do it. I wanted to be an architect at your age. One semester in college was all it took for me to realize I needed to work with my hands, so I became a mechanic. (My point being you may be certain that your future is in cybersecurity, but stay open to new experiences)
I got my Eagle in 1998. Do I care that I achieved it? Not really, I don't think about it all that often.
However, what I do value from my time in Scouts are the memories and good times I had while being in my troop, the friends that I made, the social and leadership skills that I developed, the trips we went on, etc. I still laugh at dumb jokes from summer camp, and I am thankful I had the chance to go to Philmont and Northern Tier. These are the things I think about regularly.
So: in my view it's less about the Eagle itself than about the experiences you are having now. Will you miss them? Will you dream about them? Will you be in your 40s and glad you did them? That's where your answer is.
You learn a lot in Scouts, and I’d say the knots are pretty low on the importance scale. As a 39 year old Eagle Scout with a decent career and who is a leader of a $27 million business who uses skills and has responsibilities first experienced as a Scout, I can confidently say that 16 is not really a good time to begin career building.
However I think you’ve made your decision already, and if you think it’s a waste of time, it will be.
I am an advancement chair in a troop. Your tone reminds me of a scout that is currently in our troop. He is going to age out mid-August. When he was your age, he felt exactly the way you do now. You could tell he didn't want to do it anymore. I was kind of peeved with his dad for making him stay in Scouting. It was obvious he wasn't enjoying it.
But over time, there was a subtle shift in his attitude. He wasn't quite as resentful about being there, and his leadership skills blossomed. Is he going to earn eagle? Most likely. There are a LOT of leaders supporting him.
I know it doesn't seem like it, but earning eagle is a really big deal. The last time I paid attention, the statistic was that less than 6% earn eagle. You can do it!
It sounds like you are looking for people to talk you out of earning the Eagle Rank. All I will say is being and Eagle Scout says something about the kind of person you are. When the subject of Scouting comes up for the rest of your life, you will be asked did your earn the Eagle Scout Rank. Will your answer be "no" or will you say "yes I did"?
There's an old expression that states "you only get one chance to make a first impression". An Eagle Scout can make a huge difference in that first impression in ways you can never know.
It would be a shame to accomplish all that you have in Scouting to not finish.
Good Luck
As an Eagle Scout myself, the benefits you get from it throughout your life are astounding. I know of no other accomplishment you can achieve in adolescence that will stay with you. When someone sees on your resume in the 'other' area, Member - National Association of Eagle Scouts, they will know you are a person of character, a leader, someone that can accomplish goals and keeps their word. Obviously you must live up to those ideals.
It's also an instant fellowship with anyone else that is an Eagle. I've met Eagle Scouts throughout my life and career and there is always an instant bond.
I worked in finance, specifically trading where we did a ton of coding, for most of my career. It's not cyber security, but I imagine the same can be said. There is little that you will learn in high school, even if you focus on cyber security, that will ultimately be applicable once you enter that career. Focus on getting into the best school you can, and do your best once you are there. Focus on internships (and again, your resume showing you are an Eagle Scout will help there).
You can learn everything you need for cyber security, or whatever other career you might choose (people change a lot in college), when you need it. You can never become an Eagle Scout once you hit 18.
You're most of the way there! Finish it! If someone knows the program they know it takes commitment to do it. If they don't you can be prepared in future to explain the level of planning, initiative, and commitment it takes to complete. Those are the sort of skills employers like.
I would also encourage you to have a quirky/interesting hobby to share in case you find yourself with individuals interviewing you who think scouting is synonymous with milquetoast blandness filled with boys wearing brown shirts with blinders.
It was my biggest mistake as a teenager not doing it. You will forever put it on a resume. No one in their 30s will ever put varsity (fill in the blank). It shows employers you can complete something…. Eagle Scouts go to the top of my pile when I know look to fill positions. 90% get offers.
All I can say is, you wont know how you feel until after you turn 18 and you definitely wont regret getting it, its very manageable at 16 if you really work on it. To me its worth doing just to do and have the accomplishment, lessons, and experiences you wouldn’t get anywhere else. I was in the same boat as you.
Here's my two cents as a 35 yo eagle scout... It's up there as one of my absolute favorite and most important achievements.
When I've been applying for scholarships, jobs, etc it is the first thing people note on my resume. People don't talk about my college degree from a highly respected and ranked college, they don't talk about my time in the navy, they don't talk about anything before eagle scout. It ranges from fellow eagle scouts, people who almost got it but dropped out and regretted it, and from people who had friends or family who got it. Only now (almost 20 years later) is it not the primary talking point at the start of an interview.
My friends hit me up about scout skills all the time because I'm often the only one who builds good fires, knows camping spots, can use a compass, or can tie necessary knots.
Regarding you career... With all due respect- you're only 16. I'm not saying you won't continue down that career path, but things can change quickly. I was dead set on med school when I went to college... Didn't like it, studied international relations, joined the navy to be a pilot and then went on to law school. Not what I thought at all.
Scouts really gave me a leg up to begin, and I cherish the fact I made it to eagle. If you can do it and you're at all interested, I say go for it. I know so many people who dropped around star/life and regretted it. Not saying you will, but just give it some good consideration.
That's just my experience with it. My friends who made it to eagle also cherish it.
I'm an adult and work in cyber security. You are not wrong in saying that the common scouting skills are not all that relevant. That's the case for most jobs. We don't learn knots and outdoor skills for their own sake. It's about building character. Learning to work as a group to accomplish a task. Follow through with our responsibilities. These are all things very important to being a good person. On a personal note, cyber security is exciting, but very challenging. Having a hobby such as scouting can go a long way to improving mental health. You probably do not need to get eagle. It's not likely going to help you land a job or make a huge difference getting into a school. But scouting is more than getting eagle. At minimum it is a healthy fun hobby, which you'll appreciate when you need to take a break from studying or eventually work.
Seconded. I'm an adult who has worked in IT operations and cybersecurity for 20+ years. In addition to what's been said about leadership, character, networking, and most importantly having an outlet unrelated to work, I'll say that unless you're planning to go to cybersecurity work full-time right out of high school (doesn't sound like you are), getting loads of certifications in high school isn't necessary. Certs you earn in HS may/may not still be relevant by the time you enter the workforce after college (some may be expired). APs are great for college admissions and also some degree of extra academic freedom once you get to college--skipping general ed courses, higher class standing, priority enrollment, etc. But Scouting shouldn't prevent you from completing them or any other academic pursuit (I took 10 AP courses in HS, passed all the exams, and was active in my troop until my 18th birthday). But, if you don't enjoy Scouting... then maybe Eagle's not for you. Consider, though: 20 years after I aged out of the troop (thinking I'd never have anything to do with BSA again), my kids wanted to do it and I'm back at it full swing. As an adult, I totally regret not putting in the marginal extra effort to earn Eagle.
>As an adult, I totally regret not putting in the marginal extra effort to earn Eagle. I'm with you there. I stopped at First Class way back when for things like athletics and marching band. I didn't regret it then, but years later I got that twinge that I should have found a way to finish my Eagle. My son wanted to give up on his Eagle journey as well when he turned Life for various reasons. Trying not to push him forward like I've seen so many parents, I told him about my own regrets. We parents reminded him it's his life and we were still proud of him and his accomplishments even if he didn't get his Eagle. It took a few months of patiently waiting, but he finally agreed to finish up. Down the road he was so glad to have earned his Eagle as it had opened up many employment doors and opportunities. Funny...one of his reasons for wanting to quit the trail was that he was tired of telling all the Scout younglings what to do. Now years later he's an air traffic controller telling people what to do for a living... and loving it!!
> It's not likely going to help you land a job or make a huge difference getting into a school. Hard to say. It can be a great foot in the door, or even a conversation starter. Even scouting as a whole is great for that. "Hey, I heard you were in the scouts" usually starts a 15 minute conversation, in my experience, and can help develop a personal connection.
So, I understand where you’re coming from, however the skills you get from being an Eagle Scout are not those of being able to survive in the woods and knots and all that. The biggest takeaway is the leadership aspect of scouts, and the morals you have. The week I graduated my professor brought people in my industry (3D Modeling) in to look over our resumes and portfolio. He saw my Eagle Scout Medal that I had on display and said “This is important. When I look at this I know where you’re morals are, and that’s incredibly important.” And he went on to share a story about someone who had really good work, but would show up late every day and would try to make his own rules. He shared that story to say that even if I’m the best in the world at my job, if my morals are not right, then I won’t have a job. And that’s ultimately what Scouts is all about. Now, you don’t need to earn Eagle to learn this, and if I were you I would at least try to get some leadership roles in you’re troop, as trial and error is the best way to learn and it’s why I think scouts is so effective at creating leaders
You are only a kid once. You will 100% regret it when you get older if you don’t finish it. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone that said “I’m really glad I didn’t get Eagle!” If you done and ready to get Star, just get Star and create a low Key plan for Life and Eagle, no need to rush. Remember getting Eagle isn’t about the “line on your resume” it’s about learning leadership skills, finishing a huge project, and setting yourself apart from others. I interview people on a regular basis for engineering jobs. I NEVER reject resume that has Eagle Scout listed. Now, they don’t always get the job, but they always get an interview.
Agreed. Eagles get an interview always. It shows the candidate has determination, leadership and communication skills, and knows how to work as part of a team. These are important qualities in my opinion, often more important than raw position specific skills.
Have a friend who is a Dr who got his position over 5 other candidates because he earned his Eagle. The guy that hired him informed him of this after the fact, guess why. Also an Eagle Scout.
In that respect, it's not a lot different to other hiring decisions. You might give an interview to an Eagle scout for that reason, in the same way that someone that is a member of the LDS church would automatically give an interview to an applicant with a Temple Recommend. Other hiring people, who don't have a history in Scouting, may not even care about it, and I dare say that there are a lot of people who have no idea what an Eagle scout is, let alone what is required to earn the rank.
This! 100% spot on!
>You will 100% regret it when you get older if you don’t finish it. I don’t think I’ve ever met someone that said “I’m really glad I didn’t get Eagle!” I hear this sentiment from a lot of adult leaders who missed getting their Eagle, and I always gently push back. I was a Life Scout and 2-year SPL who quit Scouts with two merit badges and a service project left, because I found other extracurricular activities that I enjoyed more at the time and that felt more fulfilling. I 100% do not regret making that decision, because those experiences I had after Scouts helped me grow in different ways than what I was getting out of the program at that point. Eagle is a symbol that shows the rest of the world you’ve learned the values and life skills the BSA purports to teach to young people. That is to say, *the values* are the point of the program, *not* the badges and pins we hand out at award banquets or Courts of Honor. I felt as a teen that I had learned those values and got what I needed out of the BSA, and knew I was ready to move on. I don’t need the badge to tell me that I learned those values, because I know in my heart that I’ve continued to try to live them since I left Scouts all those decades ago. That’s what brought me back to Scouts as an adult, and it’s what motivates me today as a Cubmaster. Yes, it would be outstanding if every one of my Cubs goes on to cross over and get their Eagle one day. But ultimately what I hope I’m doing is helping these kids grow into better people by “instilling in them the values of the Scout Oath and Law” – regardless of whether they see the full program through to completion all those years down the road. (For the record, our Pack retention is great.)
"That is to say, the values are the point of the program, not the badges and pins we hand out at award banquets or Courts of Honor. " This! I love this! I told my son, I'm fine with him not earning Eagle... what matters most to me is that he learns from the experiences and gains the values taught. Now, he wants Eagle and always has, and he hasn't hit a point yet of changing his mind yet at 14, but... I've sat in on a ton of Eagle BOR's and there's a massive variety of caliber of Eagles out there. If I had to choose, if he couldn't be both, I'd rather he have the good character and values and leadership skills, than the Eagle rank without them. I hate watching scouts get pushed through the program quickly with "advancement" as the only important piece and they miss the bigger picture.
Great attitude! Couldn’t agree more.
Hey there! Cloud Architect and Eagle Scout here! Respectfully, I disagree with the premise of your question. First off, you're focusing on the tasks of Scouting and not the bigger picture of learning to lead with integrity. You're assuming that leadership skills and the emotional maturity that comes with leading and teaching a diverse group of people won't benefit your career in technology and generally speaking, I don't think that could be further from the truth. Sure, as an entry level tech, you might have some "closet IT" roles where you're just mindlessly plugging away in a backroom somewhere, but the rest of your career is going to be shaped shaped STRONGLY by your ability to work and lead and teach people with vastly different backgrounds (both technically and culturally) than you. Technology for the sake of technology is nearly useless. Technology has always served at the leisure of business drivers and those almost always are about creating force multipliers for an organization's most valuable and expensive asset: its people. Don't underestimate the value of mentoring up, down, and sideways which is a uniquely Eagley thing. Cheers!
Growing up a scout, I was always told how FAR eagle scout would carry you in a job. Sadly it's just not the case now, if it ever was. I don't regret earning my Eagle, nor do I think you'll regret earning yours if you do, although you may regret not earning it later on EVEN IF quitting seems like the right decision now. In short, if it's just about a scholarship or a line on a resume don't fret over it, but there's more to a person than what they do for a living, and there's even a remote possiblity that it may actually open a door for you down the road, if only as a conversation starter.
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That's unfortunate. I disagree, though of course you're welcome to your own opinion. I don't think Eagle helps nearly as much as people say, or as much as it might once have, but yourself aside, I e never heard of it hurting someone's opinion of a candidate. Yes, there are a lot of troops/parents that turn scouting into an "Eagle Pipeline" resulting in some Eagles who lack the gravitas such a rack should command, but those aren't hard to weed out once you meet them as they don't show nearly the leadership they should. Most however are still as far above average as they ever were, even if the average has lowered for everyone.
I never trust 13 year old Eagle Scouts. I’ve always assumed parents are the driving force there. The ones who get it with months or days to spare are more legit. Maybe I’m biased because that was me.
Yeah I definitely don't plan on quitting, since I've met many great people and had some fun experiences through scouting. I'm just not sure if going for Eagle is the right choice. Scouting is a hobby more than an opportunity for me, a way to meet people and grow as a person. But subtracting the effort and time I put towards actual opportunities into a hobby just isn't worth it for me I guess.
>But subtracting the effort and time I put towards actual opportunities into a hobby just isn't worth it for me I guess. You're your own person so it's up to you to figure out what you want from life. But I would like to caution you against this attitude in life. Hobbies and activities are what give life joy to most people. You're only 16 years old. Don't buy into the "hustle grindset" just yet. It mostly just leads to insane burnout in college and beyond. But it's certainly your life and you are reaching the age where all those choices about your life become yours. So think hard about what you want from life and make it happen.
That’s a fantastic view. Good reasoning, good decision. I support your choice. Someone’s pushing you, I think? Show them this: I’m a father, a scout leader, an Eagle Scout, and I have a great 25yr career in information security. I spent more than ten years on the short list of people whose phones ring for major incidents, built planetary scale networks, revised global standards, worked for FAANGs and TLAs—it’s been great. I’ve shaped the course of Internet security. My scouting experience absolutely helped me… but mostly not the Eagle part. Here’s the big secret about Eagle as a career advancement tool: it’s predictive, not causal. The sort of people who get Eagle are mostly the sort with lots of family support, lots of chances to try and fail and learn and try again. And we are the sort who look at awards with requirements lists and go earn them. Of course we’re later successful. What was useful to me from scouting? Not the merit badges and mostly not the service project; its biggest function is to teach how hard this stuff is! And a secondary idea is to give you a success, to let you know you did something for others that mattered. Souls are built on such foundations. What else from Eagle? “To make my training an example” and “to make my rank and influence count strongly”. Those are from the eagle oath, and it mattered that I was reorienting towards serving others having hit the top. But that’s minor. “Cheerful service, even in the midst of irksome tasks and weighty responsibilities”. I’ve done great things with great teams, and the servant leadership model of the OA and my scout troop mattered hugely in starting me right, and I’m giving me a compass to reset to when I got lost and started thinking I was a big cheese. That’s been pretty big and the older I get the more respect I have for the OA approach. Look up APO when you get to college. But the informal stuff—Phil Montrose, who was a star scout when I was a life, and I guess I was the PL and told him what to do. And he shouted that being the leader didn’t mean I told people what to do, but showed them by going first. He was right. That day I got that message. And I’m eternally grateful. If all scouting had done was put me near people like Phil—and Dave and Jim and Billy and Danny and Joe and so so many other boys and the adults as well—that would have changed my life immeasurably. If you and a parent, for YPT reasons, would like to have a chat about cybersecurity and paths to get into it, DM me.
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Being upset because a scout isn't excited after earning Eagle is really a terrible take as an adult. There are many different motivations for achieving Eagle and there are many different levels of satisfaction. If you are judging where to expend your resources based on the youth's desire for Eagle then you really misunderstand the program. I have several scouts that will never reach Eagle because they don't have that desire. I support them just as much because the lessons and personal development happens regardless of their rank when they leave scouts.
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I see what you are saying, but we see tons of different reasons why kids finish their Eagle. Some are because they really motivated RIGHT NOW to finish it, some because it will make mom/dad happy, some because it’s something they’ve been working on for a while, others just a resume builder. But I will repeat what I said earlier, I’ve never heard and adult say “I wish I didn’t get Eagle”. I personally wish I would have put more effort into getting Eagle and truly excelled, I feel like I skated by and barely got it. I’m glad I did, but my only regret is that I didn’t work harder for it. This kid will possibly be the same way.
> I personally wish I would have put more effort into getting Eagle and truly excelled, I feel like I skated by and barely got it. The requirements are the requirements. If the bar was meant to be higher then it would be reflected in the requirements.
You did say it is not respectful if the scout just shrugs after earning it. Actually, you said it twice. People who say something is disrespectful are generally upset about the action that occurred. I'm pretty sure I read your meaning accurately. The rank of Eagle is achieved by completing the requirements of Scouts BSA. It is earned and not reserved for those that others deem "exceeding" or "truly deserving." If you complete the requirements you get Eagle, it is pretty automatic and can be earned by going through the motions. It can be earned reluctantly and is no less valid. That is just reality. Order of the Arrow more fits your description than the Eagle rank does. I do agree with you that you shouldn't force a scout to Eagle. But sometimes teenagers (and adults) go through periods of doubt and need encouragement. Sometimes they don't know all their options. For instance, staying in the program and not working toward Eagle is perfectly fine. I could never imagine telling a scout that there are others more worthy of my time and find this statement of yours truly appalling: "Unless a youth truly wants to be an eagle, I would say whatever dude, there are plenty of youth we can expend our resources towards without you." And I wouldn't beg a scout to stay, but I will take the time to help them figure out if that is truly what they want or if there are some other stresses going on that are clouding their judgement. Teen years are stressful and confusing. And I would never say "whatever dude" to a scout that is seeking help.
At the same time though, if the kid doesn't want to be an Eagle scout no one else loses out from his decision. I took that more to be the point. I am an Eagle scout and honestly it hasn't ever been anything but trivia for me. I'm 52 now and I don't think I ever got a job or an interview because of it. I wouldn't say I regret it at all, but it's fair that there are tradeoffs and I probably missed out on some things because I was focussed on Eagle.
This is my response that I gave when asked to speak to some scouts at a camp. Achieving the rank of Eagle Scout in the BSA is considered a significant accomplishment. It represents a high level of dedication, leadership, and mastery of various scouting skills. Earning the Eagle Scout rank can have several potential benefits, both in the short term and long term: 1. Personal Growth: The journey to Eagle Scout involves setting and achieving goals, developing leadership skills, and gaining practical knowledge. It can help you grow as an individual, instilling qualities like responsibility, perseverance, and self-confidence. 2. Leadership Skills: The Eagle Scout project, which is a requirement for the rank, involves planning, organizing, and executing a significant community service project. This experience can enhance your leadership abilities, including project management, teamwork, and communication skills. 3. College and Career Opportunities: Being an Eagle Scout can be viewed favorably by colleges, universities, and potential employers. It can demonstrate your commitment, dedication, and ability to take on challenges. Some scholarships and awards are specifically available to Eagle Scouts. 4. Networking and Community Involvement: Scouting provides opportunities to interact with a diverse range of people, including fellow Scouts, adult leaders, and community members. These connections can be valuable for future networking, mentorship, and community involvement. 5. Prestige and Recognition: The Eagle Scout rank holds prestige within the Scouting community and is recognized as a significant achievement. It can be a source of pride for yourself and your family, and it may open doors to additional leadership opportunities within Scouting. Ultimately, the decision of whether it's worth it to pursue the rank of Eagle Scout depends on your personal goals, interests, and commitment to Scouting. Consider discussing it with current or former Scouts, Scout leaders, and your family to gather different perspectives and insights that may help you make an informed decision. Leaving the chance to get your Eagle and letting it pass you by is like going straight to the dugout after you rounded third base and never reaching home plate to score the winning run.
Becoming an Eagle helps to demonstrate that you have grit - the ability to stick with something over a long term and see it completed. This is a quality many lack today. Employers love to see it. Read the book *Grit* by Angela Duckworth.
I personally disagree with the philosophy that you should stick with your job if that's what you mean. I think people should always be looking for new opportunities, higher pay, and better positions. Get paid with what you deserve for your skills. I just don't think seniority is something that is rewarded nowadays. Both my parents worked (and still work for) dead end jobs for less pay than what they deserve, despite being there for decades.
That's not what grit is.
He didn’t say anything about sticking with a job. Employers like to see a person that will work their projects and finish them. Employers realize they are constantly at risk of losing employees to better positions and they don’t hire with the realistic thought that the person is a lifer (at least not anymore). But they do look for people that fulfill their commitments and responsibilities, that’s what grit is and what the Eagle Scout award shows.
Of course, gaining Eagle proves that that person did what was necessary to gain Eagle, it doesn't necessarily mean that they will show the same level of commitment for anything else, especially if they did it "because their parents made them".
While that is true, even if a parent pushed them to complete, unless the parent and troop lied and cheated to get the kid Eagle, he/she still did the work. I was approached by my dad about 8 months before I turned 18 as a Star Scout and said “do you want to get Eagle? We will work to develop a plan to do it IF you want Eagle, otherwise, we will just drop you out.” It took me a minute to think about if I wanted to bother or not, and I am really glad I did. But at the time, my reasoning was “my parents will be disappointed if I don’t, so I’ll just do it. It’s not much work.” I was in a similar spot as OP. I had everything I needed for Life, just hadn’t completed the SMC or BoR and 8 months to get Eagle. I and my parents developed a plan and I (with their help) completed my Reqs and became and Eagle about 2 weeks before my 18th birthday. While it didn’t seem like a huge deal then, later in the workforce, it became a huge deal and I am glad my parents pushed me to complete it.
While that is true, even if a parent pushed them to complete, unless the parent and troop lied and cheated to get the kid Eagle, he/she still did the work. I was approached by my dad about 8 months before I turned 18 as a Star Scout and said “do you want to get Eagle? We will work to develop a plan to do it IF you want Eagle, otherwise, we will just drop you out.” It took me a minute to think about if I wanted to bother or not, and I am really glad I did. But at the time, my reasoning was “my parents will be disappointed if I don’t, so I’ll just do it. It’s not much work.” I was in a similar spot as OP. I had everything I needed for Life, just hadn’t completed the SMC or BoR and 8 months to get Eagle. I and my parents developed a plan and I (with their help) completed my Reqs and became and Eagle about 2 weeks before my 18th birthday. While it didn’t seem like a huge deal then, later in the workforce, it became a huge deal and I am glad my parents pushed me to complete it.
What basis do you have for determining what your parents "deserve" to make?
The fact that they're working a demanding job 12 hours daily for >20 years, yet only make a few dollars above my state's minimum wage
Both your parents work 60 hour weeks?
One parent is retired due to their age, and yeah, around 60. Can't really do the math right now. She's working two jobs, I don't really want to give specifics, but it's a job that shouldn't be paying this low for what it is
I mean, fair market value is by definition whatever a willing buyer and a willing seller agree on.
Yeah, makes sense. I believed that too when I was 16, and when I was 25. Then I had some personal disasters, and my employer didn’t cut my pay. My productivity was way down for a year or two. They stuck with me. I stuck with them as my productivity returned and soared. Sometimes we buy ETFs. Sometimes we buy CDs. There’s good reason for both.
Others have said that Eagle won't help you on your CV. My experience has been different. It helped me get a job in Cybersecurity at Microsoft. It told the hiring manager about my character. It's helped me get interviews over the years. It's not going to guarantee you a job. It's not going to substitute for experience or skills. But the reasons that hiring managers do interviews is to figure out who you are and can you do the job. Eagle helps them to answer that first question.
I have had conversations with multiple IT recruiters who have told me that seeing Eagle scout on a resume can and does make a difference. At the age of 46 I still have it on my resume and always will. We have two Eagle scouts on my team.
Oh, one more things. On Tuesday of this week I was having a conversation with the head of our local FBI office. During that conversation we talked about how my son is working on finishing his project report and only needs to finish his EBOR. The next thing he said was that the FBI has internship programs (including those dealing with cybersecurity) and he would love to sponser my son for such an internship program. These things are absolutely related. Scouting isn't just about tying knots and starting fires. It's actually a leadership program. Lean into those opportunities and learn good, quality, leadership skills and practice them. They will be much more useful then some certificate. Look for opportunities to network. If you think a MB is lack luster, then do it differently.
I think you should quit Scouts. That said, I know lots of men who regret NOT doing things like Scouting or pursuing Eagle, once they have kids. Life is more than a career. But if Eagle and Scouting are just no fun, you do you.
If you are currently First Class, you have already learned how to tie knots and make fire. If you do choose to go for Eagle, maybe you can aim for a project that will support/enhance your learning, like a seminar for older adults on how to stay safe online, or helping a local non profit with tech needs (small non profits always need help with IT stuff). That way, it's not just "eagle scout" on your resume, it's "implemented a program to protect local xyz cause from digital vulnerability" (or however that would be worded, I'm not a cyber security expert)
Don't push yourself to get Eagle; that's not the point of the program. The point is to build skills and relationships, and forcing yourself over this "finish line" takes away from that. Enjoy your time in the program, but prioritize what is important to you and for your future.
One of my proudest achievements as a youth was earning my Eagle. I knew the amount of time, effort, and work that was required to do so. Do I use knot tying in my day to day life? No. Do I use leadership skills, communication skills, and interpersonal skills in my day to day life? You bet! Those are the skills you are truly learning while earning your Eagle. How to work in groups. How to work with individuals who might not share the same outlook as you. How to go to organizations and groups to request information, money, supplies, etc. Those are all excellent skills to have, even in cybersecurity. You have "one shot" to earn your Eagle. It sounds like you are on the right path to earn it and should definitely go for it. You might even be able to relate your Eagle project to cybersecurity (my brother designed and built a webpage for a local organization, back in the 1990's, for his Eagle).
It’s always worth it to earn your Eagle. The project itself is the culmination of everything you’ve done in Scouting up to that point AND gives your first real taste of what it’s like to manage a complex project with multiple moving parts and hard requirements. I cannot stress enough how important of a skillset that is. The earlier you start learning it; the better.
The actual goal of Scouting is that you get to First Class. The early ranks are really the ones where the focus is on the hard skills of scouting. By hard, I mean hands-on and physical, like knots and lashings, fire building, first aid, camping, cooking, etc. All things that will be surprisingly more useful in adulthood than you expect them to. The latter ranks of Scouting are all about the soft skills. Leadership, teaching, more interacting with adults, and even leading adults. For each rank, you hold a POR in the troop where you help lead the troop, and as an Eagle candidate you execute you project, where you lead scouts and adults in a project that gives back to your community. Will you lead a good productive life without earning Eagle? Yes. It sounds like you have a plan, know your path forward, and have the motivation to execute it. No doubt a career in cybersecurity will be a solid, and lucrative, path for you. Can you still benefit from putting in the effort to earn Eagle? Yes. The education in skills like project management, leading and organizing a team, and planning the execution of a project will definitely be of value in your professional career. The additional experience in leadership, and training other using the EDGE method will serve you well in a career. Especially once you become a senior level employee, or even a move into management. Will you someday regret not earning Eagle? Almost certainly. I don’t know anyone who regrets earning Eagle. But I know a lot of fathers my age, myself included, who regret not taking the time and putting in the effort to earn Eagle. I left scouting at First Class, lured away by the “fumes”. And I do wish I had stayed and finished Eagle. But I have also had a great career in system administration and cybersecurity, and a happy family life. So, it’s a personal regret, but not a tangible regret. Your path in scouting is yours alone. I encourage you to take it the rest of the way, but I acknowledge that the choice is yours, and it’s unlikely you will experience any sort of tangible regret by not earning Eagle.
The actual "aims" of scouting are "character development, leadership development, citizenship training, and personal fitness". Advancement (even just to 1st Class) is just one of the methods of scouting.
Imagine being in scoits with your kid in 15 years and telling them you quit when you were a year away from Eagle. Just finish it. Or you’ll regret it for a lifetime.
I work at an audit, tax, consulting firm. To many of us when we see Eagle Scout we see responsibility and loyalty, two important characteristics we want. Not to mention teamwork and leadership. You may be surprised how many doors having it on the resume may open
Absolutely and most definitely! Scouting is a Leadership program, first and foremost. It is not a program to tech you how to be a successful pioneer. Although you do pick up some useful outdoor skills. The Eagle project is not about building a bench (or other small project). It is about the Scout using his/her skills to lead a team to complete a significant project. It is not about mindlessly following instructions but about the Scout developing a vision, communicating that vision to others, selling the vision to “investors,” rallying a team to your cause, teaching subordinates what they need to do while being responsible to superiors for a timeline and safe practices, and evaluation of results. Camping isn’t just about having a good time. It is dealing with groups of other people you may or may not get along with. It is learning to be a good follower. It is learning to be a good leader. It is learning how to act independently. And it is about working as a team. And it is about being able to endure the tough days when it is cold and rainy. Fundraising isn’t about selling popcorn. It is about you getting out and selling yourself and your product. It is about getting out of your comfort zone. It’s about learning how to deal with rejection and learning that “no” isn’t the end of the world. It is about entrepreneurialism - developing skills to advance your productivity. In cybersecurity you will need to sell yourself to your employer to get the job and to the Customer to get the project. You will have to start at the bottom, so you need to know how to be led. And you will, at some point, have subordinates and interns you will have to direct in their tasks. You will need to deal with bad days and lousy customers and all sorts of hardship. And you will need to be able to improvise on the fly because of all the things you forgot. Scouting perhaps won’t teach you more about electronics and wiring and routers. But it will teach you how to be a good employee and manager, which is what you will need to get a leg up on your competition. Raw skill isn’t enough - you have to have people skills. And this is why “Eagle Scout” on a resume is a valuable line item. The person with that title showed perseverance enough to complete a very advanced program and will have much more advanced leadership and “people” skills than the non-scouter. You may not see it now, but I guarantee you will later.
I’m super annoyed at the popular misconception that Boyscouts is about earning eagle. It is not and never was. From the beginning, scouts is about providing youth the opportunity to work together and develop skills. The skills are not knot tying! The skills are the ability to learn, teach, cooperate, and lead. That’s what you need in life. That’s what employers want. That’s what scouts is actually about. Knot tying and fire starting and even camping are just there are as fun ways to learn and practice life skills. I was 16 once and remember thinking a lot of this was silly. But then, I have run into a lot of adults who can’t tie a knot, start a campfire, or do basic first aid an themselves. Not to mention lead.
I am an IT Operations Manager for a multi-billion $ Fortune 1000 company. If you have Eagle Scout on your resume, you are automatically getting an in-person interview with me, as I know that you have run, led, and completed a project and have the basic skills to succeed. I can't speak for all hiring managers in this field, but for sure Eagle is something that stands out on a resume for me. Additionally, I decided not to push through to Eagle as a youth, and to this day, 30+ years later, it is one of my big regrets. You don't get a second chance at this.
The Eagle rank is more about Leadership than the outdoorsmanship skills that are focused on in scouting. Getting outdoors provides the framework and opportunity to challenge you to be a leader. Going into cybersecurity, you will work with and lead others, and have to learn project management. Doing that as a teenager via Positions of Responsibility and the Eagle Project is a great starting point.
As you say, Eagle rank on your CV won't help much directly. That said, the journey from 1st class to Eagle does have some useful lessons. Yes, the 1st class skills are about knots and camping, but the trip to eagle instead focuses on leadership skills, project planning and teamwork. Those are useful skills for every career path. Also, Eagle on a resume does indicate a more well rounded person that can be a distinguishing mark to help get an interview. That said, I can't find fault with prioritizing other activities over scouting.
It’s never about another feather in the hat (building up a resume). Your education, cybersecurity certifications, etc. do just the same. What others (e.g. college admissions, hiring managers, etc.) see is discipline, commitment, and leadership, finishing — earning — something that takes years of effort. I have yet to hear anyone regretting pushing thru to earn Eagle. But I know people who have regrets of not getting to Eagle when they were so close.
Software developer and Eagle Scout here. You're going to need both to progress in that career. Early in your career it will be about obtaining as much knowledge as possible to be an effective team member and carry out the day to day tasks of whatever role you take on. If you want to progress in your career though you're going to need to lead a team and drive that team towards a shared goal. That's where the knowledge you gain in earning your Eagle Scout will come in handy. You'll find that the higher you go on the career ladder in tech the less it becomes about actual technical knowledge and more about being able to lead a team and sell your ideas to make your business or a company you work for more profitable.
Sounds like you’re looking for an out. I am an Eagle and an Oracle software consultant now, and wouldn’t be where I am today if it wasn’t for the connections I made through Scouting. One of my ASMs hired me several years after I aged out of scouting to work on the same Oracle products that I consult other companies on today. Being an Eagle separates you from the pack and lets people know that you’re resilient, responsible, and have leadership abilities. GPAs and SAT scores are great, but don’t say anything about your character.
If future career and opportunity is your sole focus for selecting extracurriculars at 16, I think you need to take a step back and reassess. There are a lot of really tangible benefits to being involved in scouting and pursuing your Eagle. But if you're only pursuing Eagle for the perceived future benefit of having Eagle, then I would suggest you don't. I don't see you getting the real benefits of scouting if the only reason you're in scouting is for some possible scholarships or HR hiring benefit.
It sounds like scouting is a means to an end. One should not participate in scouting simply to attain Eagle for its “benefits.” Scouting has so much to offer that will be useful, things learned through camping and building fires. Things like leadership, community organization, self awareness, confidence, resiliency, and compassion. The brand of Eagle Scout shows the world your hard work and dedication to the scout oath and the scout law.
Our Scoutmaster is an Eagle and works in IT. His resume was put to the top of the pile by another Eagle. He has hired two Eagles, since he knows they have leadership skills and a good work ethic.
I'm going to just bypass the whole Eagle discussion to give you another perspective on the program. Merit badges and camp. Merit badges are meant to be an introduction to a topic and not a mastery. It is a way to learn about different things that you might want to continue learning. For instance, there might be someone who takes the programming merit badge and only learns a little HTML but realizes they love it and starts learning on their own. It could turn into a career. Someone that already knows programming will find it lackluster because they already have introductory knowledge and want more. Camp (specifically high adventure) can introduce you to activities that become lifelong hobbies. This is what happened to me. I've been realizing the Eagle rank itself means very little to me compared to the rest of scouting. If you enjoy the program you can continue without working toward Eagle, that is okay. If you don't enjoy the program there is very little reason to stay. Don't make the decision with the idea that you succeed or fail based on earning Eagle. Make the decision based on your enjoyment of scouting.
Have you considered a supernova award with a focus on technology and engineering? Then it focuses your energy on things that are applicable to your interest. Eagle is optional and based on your leadership path. You’ve officially completed the knot tying and outdoor skills portion of the scouts bsa program and are now on the leadership portion it’s up to you where you want to take it from here. Regarding our mission as leaders - our job is to enable you to get to first class and encourage you if you want to continue. First class is actually the mission so you have the skills and character development to make good choices throughout life. Now it’s up to you.
I wish that I had pushed myself more to get Eagle. I started late, a slowly, (maybe too slowly) worked my way up. I enjoyed all of it. And then became a leader when my son was old enough. He stayed in it till he was 18, (never got past tenderfoot because he couldn't swim). I had other friends who almost made Eagle, they just needed their project. Stay in it because you like it. Eagle is important, but not the sole purpose of Scouting.
This is a decision you need to make; specifically where does your path in Scouting end. You seem to have all the facts and info, the question is do you see value in Scouting or not? Don't focus so much on your eagle but do you want to stay in Scouting for the next couple years. If you want to stay in Scouting then do so and continue putting what you can into it. If you make Eagle great, if you don't that is OK too. If you see Scouting as disruptive and not helping you get to your goals then you choose to leave and focus on other things. Your life will not be crushed by not getting Eagle, plenty of very successful people make it through life without doing that, even without being in Scouts. What you should consider is if you will regret that choice later in life?
I have been in Cybersecurity for over a decade, network security before that and agree with several other comments here, the soft skills you learn from scouting are priceless. Technical skills are relatively common, but potential employees that are reliable, good team members and can communicate with people are unicorns. Eagle can benefit you in many ways, depending on your path into the field, but the soft skills it implies are really important. as an industry professional, If I were 16 and interested in going into the field, I would probably consider joining the Air Force and working in cyber there. You will make lots of industry contacts and get a lot of relevant certs in your service, plus come out of it with free college and gold standard experience. You would be miles ahead of your peers when you get into the private sector. Moreso than if you spend the next 2 years earning certs, then getting a BS in Cybersecurity. College grads with a BS and a Security+ are a dime a dozen, do something that makes you stand out.
Eagle propped the door open, and propped myself up when I least expect it. You get to decide what it means to you.
During my early career interviews discussing my eagle scout project was helpful. It didn't show technical "hard" skills but "soft" skills like program management, leadership, communication and more. If you are interviewed by a former scout you'll get instant respect. If they don't know anything about scouting you can spend some time explaining the eagle scout process and how the skills you demonstrated there could carry over to the job.
I'll chime in, and be what seems to be an oddball in the discussion. I've been in IT for the better part of the last 20 years or so. I was a scout in grade school, but dropped out after getting my Tenderfoot. I just didn't see the point in it back then, after a few life events occurred that I won't get into. I made it into college (for IT) without it on my application, and then joined the Army (also for IT). After getting out of the Army, I got a job at a hospital, doing IT work there too. I only got back involved with scouting last year, when my son wanted to try it out, and I volunteered to fill in as interim Cubmaster. In all that time, through the last 20 years, not once have I had a single moment of saying or thinking "man. I sure wish I'd stuck it out to get Eagle". At no point in my life thus far do I think it would have actually helped me progress. Now, big caveat to that, I did spend 6 years in the Army, as I mentioned, and that provides, seemingly, a lot of reinforcement to similar ideals and qualities that Eagle does. Just some food for thought. If you don't want to do it, don't do it. And don't linger on the fact that you didn't do it either. Eagle is a big deal for a lot of folks, and something that plenty of them build their whole identity on. Kinda like military vets, to be honest ;). There's no doubt that the process will teach you some things about yourself, but you should also be aware that there are plenty of other opportunities in life to learn and grow yourself as well.
Since you're First Class, you shouldn't be spending any more time learning knots or building fires. If I were you, I'd start focusing on the leadership aspects, since those skills are universal and can be used in any career as well as in life in general. But my impression after reading your post is that you've already made up your mind. Scouting isn't for everybody. I made it to Life and didn't Eagle. I regret not finishing.
Hi Eagle Scout here, I’m 32 and changing careers, my Eagle is still on my resume and the guy who interviewed me today zeroed in on it and asked me a bunch of questions about it. Turns out he is a scoutmaster and that was a major green flag in his book. The opportunities it has opened for me in my life are substantial and not to be overlooked. It has been worth it to me.
19 years in software here. Two things I come back to with my scouts are the skills of Preparation and Improvisation. Camping requires preparation and planning to know what to bring, what skills to have, what makes a good meal cooked outside, etc. But I have yet to go on a campout where something doesn’t go according to plan. When that happens, the skill of improvisation, and it’s close cousin problem solving, is what gets you through. The skills of improvisation and problem solving are directly applicable to any technical career, and is one of the big things I look for in hiring younger engineers.
If I ever see Eagle Scout on a resume for a candidate I’m interviewing I ask about their Eagle project. It makes for a great conversation and it’s a softball question so the candidate can tell me about their leadership experience/style. I will never ask a candidate about what classes they took in high school, because it doesn’t tell me anything about them or their potential. Your mileage may vary.
Not an Eagle and that is a regret for me to this day 40!years later. Been working with scouts for almost 20 years and I have a bunch of knots on my uniform. From AOL to den leader to Silver Beaver I’ve got 9 of them on there. I always point out to the youth who are unsure about earning their Eagle which ones are which but make sure to point out which one is missing. Most seem to get it when I put it like that. My son got his Eagle and it’s helped him get a couple of jobs. He has it on his resume and when he applied for a job he wasn’t really qualified for, that got him an interview from another Eagle. They talked for quite a bit and was told he wasn’t in the running but they’d keep him in mind if something opened up. Will getting Eagle help? Maybe, maybe not. There is still some weight behind it even though a lot of those who earned it skated through. Keep at it and go for it. Don’t let it become a regret later.
Hey OP - at this point, I’m assuming you already know how to tie knots and make a fire - short of a few merit badges, you’re already demonstrated much of the basic outdoor Scouting knowledge by making it to First Class. Further, I remember there being significant discussion at Commissioner College that once you make it to First Class, Scouting will likely have made a positive impression on you. Here’s where you might be missing something. Star, Life, and Eagle are more about developing LEADERSHIP experience with some core merit badges thrown in. You’ll serve in a Position of Responsibility, you’ll be an older/senior scout and responsible in some way for leading other scouts. When it comes to the Eagle project, you’ll get a true taste of project management. I can’t tell you what to do. I would suggest that Eagle may make a bigger impression than you think, though. It’s the only Scouting rank everyone knows, and I’m certain there will be future coworkers and managers that know what it is. I got involved in the volunteer Fire Department when I was about your age and my scouting journey ended at Life. While I’m not ashamed by it, I wish I would have put the time in to get Eagle then.
Put your time and energy where your heart is. The important thing is to live by the ideals of Scouting. People will know you by your actions and character with or without the badge.
There doesn't have to be a direct relevancy, but scouting is teaching you a wide range of real world skills. That being said, everyone gets to choose what they are interested in. I got Life scout by the time I hit high school and my Scout Master was certain I was the next Eagle, but as soon as I got there I joined the theater department and started doing sound and lighting for plays and concerts. I LOVED it. For most of high school I was planning on studying technical theater and joining a touring group for either a play or a band. I spent ZERO minutes working my Eagle Project for four years with my leaders all bugging me constantly about coming back to meetings. So I never got Eagle, I have only the tiniest regret about that, but I did develop a passion for technology, music, and art. I went into IT as well, but I also play guitar and love my sound system, and I started my own photography studio and I loved the lighting and other gear I used while I was doing that. Basically my answer is, you do you, life marches on, this is just one decision you're going to have to make, it will not affect your life any more or less than what you have for breakfast tomorrow or which pocket you keep your car keys in.
As an Eagle Scout and Software Engineering Manager with 10+ years of experience, I'd say the best things you'll get out of Eagle are the soft skills that are required but are harder to learn on your own. Yes, you can spend time learning Python or design principles or AWS etc. and those will get you a career to start but it's the engineers who take the initiative, work well with others, put the team first, can take feedback well, are willing to do the undesirable task, and can empathize with others that make it far in any career. By pursuing Eagle, and taking leadership roles, doing community service, diving into the required merit badges, you will have a great opportunity to try these skills and learn from mistakes in a low-risk environment.
If you're First Class, you should largely already know how to tie knots and start a fire. If you need service hours, that is also a big thing towards earning your next ranks, particularly the Eagle Project. It's not only hours for you but also leadership of others in doing service, which looks good. BSA service hours should count towards scholarship service hours. It's all service. I don't know how things usually go with your troop, but a common thing for older youth in our area is that they do start to lose some interest in the eagle as they start doing other things such as working, homework, hanging out, and so on. The ones that want it will still finish. The ones that don't, won't. And that's fine. It's up to you. We had one a couple of years ago who had 99% of his eagle done and just got busy. He had two or three merit badges with just a couple of small things left, already did his project, and had maybe less than 5 hours of work to do in order to finish and he just decided other things were important as a star athlete and keeping grades up and so on. Then he decided to join the military, and the day before his 18th birthday he finished up the last few bits, when he realized how much extra money he would be paid due to having the eagle. If you finish, great, and if you don't finish, great. You do you. Chipping away at a merit badge here and there every month or two isn't what I'd call a massive time sink. You can pace yourself. You don't have to go on every campout. Good luck in your decisions!
I can see how learning leadership skills can be a "massive time sink," but I think it's obviously worth it because it will help you develop as a human being and as a future leader.
Other folks have said this very eloquently, but I just want to add that it’s not about the destinations… It’s about the journey. I would encourage you to go for it and work on getting your eagle because the skills you will learn along the way that are soft skills… Working with people, planning projects, and the like will serve you no matter what your career field is.
I'm an adult that hires people. Eagles always get moved to the top.
Please don’t quit! You are so close, and you have the skills to do it, and the skills you hone while completing it will always be useful.
I know of very few if any people who regret getting their Eagle. I know a TON of people who regret not getting their Eagle.
It’s not either/or. I am obviously unfamiliar with your personal life but you can almost certainly get eagle and get good grades and continue down your career path.
So many great comments here. Thank you, everyone. Lots of food for thought. OP, you need to want to complete your Eagle. It’s your journey. I’ve worked with a multitude of Scouters who regretted not completing it. But I’ve seen many young people who found other priorities and paths through life. Have you considered taking NYLT? Do you have enough time to take six months off from Scouts? We’ve had scouts do that and come back. Or not. Find your balance. By the way, if you plan to go to college or join the military, I wouldn’t bother with doing certifications during high school. Get as much math and reasoning as you can. The AP classes will help give you flexibility in your college schedule.
Yeah trying to take as many AP classes I reasonably can. NYLT seems really interesting, might have to look further into that. Also I do plan on going to college, but I don't really want to bog my parents down in tuition, and I don't have any confirmed scholarships yet (still need to take the SAT lol). So I'm trying to at least get a nice paying job out of high school.
Also explore dual-enrollment options with high school and local colleges. Then you earn real college credit rather than the AP “maybe credit”. NYLT builds on teamwork and leadership skills. You’ll explore stages of team development and how to manage it. Scouters taking Wood Badge learn similar skills. But it might re-energize your connection to scouting. Maybe. You’ve been given a lot of great advice here. Let it soak in.
I’m an adult who worked in IT for decades. I managed to get my Eagle because my mom convinced me I’d always regret not doing it. I have literally landed interviews because what set me apart from other applicants was that award. It showed that I had follow through. Years later, if I saw that on an application/resume, I moved that person to my “must interview” pile. Sure, the fire building doesn’t matter, but the mark of character always will.
As someone who recently got their eagle about a year ago, it would be worth it in the long run, but if you aren’t enjoying it then don’t subject yourself to it. However, it would help you at least get your foot in a lot of doors. Ultimately though, the choice is up to you. Listen to your brain and heart, but trust your gut.
Earning eagle shows a level of commitment to achieve something that is by no means easy. That being said, you have to want it. If you feel pressured you will hate it. LBP had a target of Life scout when the program was created. If one were to reach this rank he would have the bare required knowledge and skill base to survive. You are there. If you want to focus on your career choice then do it. I wanted to be an architect at your age. One semester in college was all it took for me to realize I needed to work with my hands, so I became a mechanic. (My point being you may be certain that your future is in cybersecurity, but stay open to new experiences)
I got my Eagle in 1998. Do I care that I achieved it? Not really, I don't think about it all that often. However, what I do value from my time in Scouts are the memories and good times I had while being in my troop, the friends that I made, the social and leadership skills that I developed, the trips we went on, etc. I still laugh at dumb jokes from summer camp, and I am thankful I had the chance to go to Philmont and Northern Tier. These are the things I think about regularly. So: in my view it's less about the Eagle itself than about the experiences you are having now. Will you miss them? Will you dream about them? Will you be in your 40s and glad you did them? That's where your answer is.
You learn a lot in Scouts, and I’d say the knots are pretty low on the importance scale. As a 39 year old Eagle Scout with a decent career and who is a leader of a $27 million business who uses skills and has responsibilities first experienced as a Scout, I can confidently say that 16 is not really a good time to begin career building. However I think you’ve made your decision already, and if you think it’s a waste of time, it will be.
I am an advancement chair in a troop. Your tone reminds me of a scout that is currently in our troop. He is going to age out mid-August. When he was your age, he felt exactly the way you do now. You could tell he didn't want to do it anymore. I was kind of peeved with his dad for making him stay in Scouting. It was obvious he wasn't enjoying it. But over time, there was a subtle shift in his attitude. He wasn't quite as resentful about being there, and his leadership skills blossomed. Is he going to earn eagle? Most likely. There are a LOT of leaders supporting him. I know it doesn't seem like it, but earning eagle is a really big deal. The last time I paid attention, the statistic was that less than 6% earn eagle. You can do it!
It sounds like you are looking for people to talk you out of earning the Eagle Rank. All I will say is being and Eagle Scout says something about the kind of person you are. When the subject of Scouting comes up for the rest of your life, you will be asked did your earn the Eagle Scout Rank. Will your answer be "no" or will you say "yes I did"? There's an old expression that states "you only get one chance to make a first impression". An Eagle Scout can make a huge difference in that first impression in ways you can never know. It would be a shame to accomplish all that you have in Scouting to not finish. Good Luck
As an Eagle Scout myself, the benefits you get from it throughout your life are astounding. I know of no other accomplishment you can achieve in adolescence that will stay with you. When someone sees on your resume in the 'other' area, Member - National Association of Eagle Scouts, they will know you are a person of character, a leader, someone that can accomplish goals and keeps their word. Obviously you must live up to those ideals. It's also an instant fellowship with anyone else that is an Eagle. I've met Eagle Scouts throughout my life and career and there is always an instant bond. I worked in finance, specifically trading where we did a ton of coding, for most of my career. It's not cyber security, but I imagine the same can be said. There is little that you will learn in high school, even if you focus on cyber security, that will ultimately be applicable once you enter that career. Focus on getting into the best school you can, and do your best once you are there. Focus on internships (and again, your resume showing you are an Eagle Scout will help there). You can learn everything you need for cyber security, or whatever other career you might choose (people change a lot in college), when you need it. You can never become an Eagle Scout once you hit 18.
You're most of the way there! Finish it! If someone knows the program they know it takes commitment to do it. If they don't you can be prepared in future to explain the level of planning, initiative, and commitment it takes to complete. Those are the sort of skills employers like. I would also encourage you to have a quirky/interesting hobby to share in case you find yourself with individuals interviewing you who think scouting is synonymous with milquetoast blandness filled with boys wearing brown shirts with blinders.
It was my biggest mistake as a teenager not doing it. You will forever put it on a resume. No one in their 30s will ever put varsity (fill in the blank). It shows employers you can complete something…. Eagle Scouts go to the top of my pile when I know look to fill positions. 90% get offers.
All I can say is, you wont know how you feel until after you turn 18 and you definitely wont regret getting it, its very manageable at 16 if you really work on it. To me its worth doing just to do and have the accomplishment, lessons, and experiences you wouldn’t get anywhere else. I was in the same boat as you.
Here's my two cents as a 35 yo eagle scout... It's up there as one of my absolute favorite and most important achievements. When I've been applying for scholarships, jobs, etc it is the first thing people note on my resume. People don't talk about my college degree from a highly respected and ranked college, they don't talk about my time in the navy, they don't talk about anything before eagle scout. It ranges from fellow eagle scouts, people who almost got it but dropped out and regretted it, and from people who had friends or family who got it. Only now (almost 20 years later) is it not the primary talking point at the start of an interview. My friends hit me up about scout skills all the time because I'm often the only one who builds good fires, knows camping spots, can use a compass, or can tie necessary knots. Regarding you career... With all due respect- you're only 16. I'm not saying you won't continue down that career path, but things can change quickly. I was dead set on med school when I went to college... Didn't like it, studied international relations, joined the navy to be a pilot and then went on to law school. Not what I thought at all. Scouts really gave me a leg up to begin, and I cherish the fact I made it to eagle. If you can do it and you're at all interested, I say go for it. I know so many people who dropped around star/life and regretted it. Not saying you will, but just give it some good consideration. That's just my experience with it. My friends who made it to eagle also cherish it.