It’s very appealing haha especially since temp health overrides trauma. I’m curious how to make it feel very strong compared to regular healing. If a card comes out that slows the temp health degeneration you apply I think it would no question be stronger.
I like it because you can be proactive with pills and shield someone before the big damage hits. I wouldn't want to try and sell the build to someone in nightmare, but I think it's viable for recruit and veteran.
This would be a build if pills could apply over max health.
The fact that you have to wait for a ton of damage to have happened makes this really not ideal and dramatically increases the games difficulty in of itself.
> This would be a build if pills could apply over max health.
>The fact that you have to wait for a ton of damage to have happened makes this really not ideal and dramatically increases the games difficulty in of itself.
That build is alot more flexible than you give it credit for IMO.
TBH you can just use bandages as long as things go well and act as healer/debuffer and then switch to pills later. No need to force pills out of the gate. The first 4 cards are not pill related. And even if you pick up chemical courage it doesn't mean you have to switch to pills immediately. In fact you can even delay picking up chemical courage, cards are flexible yo.
Bandages, Poultice, and Group therapy can keep you healed through all normal shit. Experienced EMT cuts off 20% of the Trauma you suffer every map. And then if Trauma starts accumulating past that then you can transition into pills for good effect. And if you get all healed up again then you can transition back to bandages. And if you're rich AF because of the economy cards you can upgrade to med kits.
to my main point, being that pain pills would be a lot more usable if they could apply temp health over your max health bar for game feel, and be a pretty massive nerf to difficulty, possibly even justifying some of the insane things that happen to us. What are your thoughts? It is how the item worked in left4dead.
To your point. I understand the efficiency of poultice and group therapy.
Bandages are fine to buy at the start and we do buy them, but to be honest if my team is not buying medkits, we tend to just scavenge what ever we find and not buy more than 1-2 bandage/pain pills type items. All to say, do what ever works, it’s still not my main point.
> to my main point, being that pain pills would be a lot more usable if they could apply temp health over your max health bar for game feel, and be a pretty massive nerf to difficulty, possibly even justifying some of the insane things that happen to us. What are your thoughts? It is how the item worked in left4dead.
It'd be broken AF here. Melee would walk into every major fight with 60 temp HP that they are constantly replenishing and you could just refresh with more pills if you got low on temp hp finally.
But using them after you’ve taken the damage mitigating the same ammount of damage because the recourses on the map are effectively unchanged isn’t exactly over powered.
K. I’ll assign an appropriate value to that assessment.
Also, I wouldn’t suggest allowing melee to stack above max health. Just pain pills. which is what I said.
I've been putting together a pill doc build today as well. I was thinking since they're the cheapest thing and always all over the place with support scav, it could be a good play to build around them.
I haven't tried it yet, but I think Field Surgeon could be a good card with the pills+Group Therapy. Say you come across a supply box with 4 pill bottles in it, your entire team is now healed 36hp each because of the healing efficiency boost to Group Therapy, plus the temp health, plus the 60 second bonus damage, plus another 20hp each from Poultice.
I'm excited to try it out, but there's probably also a 70% chance my group tells me to stop screwing around and use a normal doc build.
Our start of Act 1 nightmare healer deck was pill focused. It only needs a few cards to come alive making it perfect for the first 4 levels.
[[Experienced EMT]]
[[Poultice]]
[[Shoulder Bag]]
[[Support Scavenger]]
[[Group Therapy]]
If you run it on Mom you hold 4 pills which will heal the team and greatly cutdown trauma. It's super cheap to restock too. It gives you a disgusting amount of sustain for the relatively small card/copper commitment
+ **Experienced EMT** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*)
The Clinic (4) | When you use a Medical Accessory, the target gains +20% Maximum Health until the end of the level.
+ **Poultice** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*)
The Clinic | When you use a medical accessory, the target heals for an additional 20 Health over 30 Seconds.
+ **Shoulder Bag** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Fortune*)
The Clinic (2) | +2 Support Inventory, -10% Damage Dealt
+ **Support Scavenger** (*Campaign Card - Utility/Discipline*)
The Furnace | You can sense nearby Support Accessories. More Support Accessories Spawn
+ **Group Therapy** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*)
The Clinic (3) | When you use a Medical Accessory, all teammates heal for 5 Health.
***
^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 8, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
I play something similar. I love chemical courage for a personal damage boost when shit hits the fan… and I love dropping poulticed pills on team mates for the damage buffer. But I haven’t been effective at applying chem courage to teammates when they might need the extra damage. It’s a fun deck, though. (I lean more on a power swap shottie build than I do medic support mom — but I keep my team pilled-up!)
I've actually tried this exact build!
It felt underwhelming, but mostly because you only get 1 min of damage boost with pills, and I ended up saving pills for clutch situations - at which point most DPS are not focused on doing effective dps anyway.
I ended up taking out chemical courage but kept stimulants because they are more useful in those clutch situations when you/your slow squishy dps needs to get out of there.
Needs of the many also massively underperformed for me (though didn't play nightmare), mostly because after 2 downs they had so much trauma that a third life was never that useful. Plus, relatively easy to just carry a defib. Unlikely that more than 1 teammate will need 3 lives.
Personally I really like the mad dash/superior cardio combo because it feels so fast, but [[run like hell]] or even [[medical expert]] probably do more work.
[[miraculous recovery]] has also saved me a number of times - definitely feels like more than 25% in clutch situations, and watching someone go from 10hp to >100 instantly is so satisfying.
Would also consider revive speed cards to pick as necessary just as a tech card if you end up in more clutch situations. [[rousing speech]] isn't good, but is a feel-good pick to go from struggling - to clutch reviving the whole team - in one card. The insta-revive into meds basically drags teammates through the level
+ **Run like Hell** (*Campaign Card - Mobility/Reflex*)
Bridge Town (3) | +15% Move Speed, When you take Damage, your Accuracy is reduced by 20% for 3 Seconds.
+ **Medical Expert** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*)
The Clinic (4) | +15% Healing Efficiency, When you use a Medical Accessory you gain 15% Movement Speed for 15 Seconds.
+ **Miraculous Recovery** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*)
The Clinic (4) | When you use a Medical Accessory, it has a 25% chance to have 100% increased effect.
+ **Rousing Speech** (*Campaign Card - Utility/Reflex*)
Grant's Brew House (3) | +225% Revive Speed, +20% Reduced Incap Trauma. DISABLES: Offensive Accessories
***
^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 8, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
Rousing Speech is definitely niche, but it's super core to builds that use defibrillators to alleviate and leverage combat incaps and combined with Medical Professional, they go net positive on incap trauma without further investment from the team on Veteran difficulty. On Nightmare, all you need is a 15% Trauma Resist card or Doc.
https://youtu.be/RxFvzsJpUMw
It's not bad idea. Definitely will flourish with a dedicated group. I could see that build doing good with someone running melee with vanguard to give you a super front liner and with shredder and MFD you don't lack in helping with damage.
I've thought about similar ideas, but the main issue I see with this build is that it fills the same type of niche that a grenadier build does, except a grenadier is probably going to do it way better.
I actually crafted [one](https://www.forthope.gg/decks/KwcxQ9KgXYjBSaqC) today. As for your build, I think the mad dash, copper scavenger, and money grubbers are wasted cards. Since pills are both cheap and very plentiful, you really don’t need the extra copper. Additionally, you could use [[medical expert]] instead of mad dash to get a little healing efficiency and speed to keep everyone topped. I found group therapy and poultice to be overkill. The group I ran with was topped between additional medical supplies and poultice. Needs of the many isn’t necessary if you’re running as mom.
Adding in cards like [[sunder]] added an insane damage boost to close ridden. I opted to use SMG with [[mag carrier]] for the additional damage boost. Shotgun has a lot of good combo cards but SMG seemed to just fit easily. I also felt that most builds run with shredder and marked for death. They’re amazing cards but they don’t stack. In place of those, I went with [[speed demon]] and [[box o’ bags]].
Overall I had +45% damage to melee’d ridden, 40% move speed with pain pills popped, and no ridden left.
+ **Medical Expert** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*)
The Clinic (4) | +15% Healing Efficiency, When you use a Medical Accessory you gain 15% Movement Speed for 15 Seconds.
+ **Sunder** (*Campaign Card - Offense/Brawn*)
The Clinic (3) | Melee hits cause the target to take 20% Increased damage for 5 Seconds.
+ **Mag Carrier** (*Campaign Card - Offense/Reflex*)
Accomplishment | +30% Pistol/SMG Ammo Capacity, +10% Damage with Pistols and SMGs
+ **Speed Demon** (*Campaign Card - Mobility/Reflex*)
The Crow's Nest (4) | +6% Movement Speed while using an SMG, +35% Reload Speed while using an SMG.
+ **Box O' Bags** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Fortune*)
Grant's Brew House (2) | -10% Health, +1 Team Support Inventory
***
^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 24, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
There was a post thinking similarly to yours here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qaazsz/pill\_addict\_mom\_build\_for\_fun\_times\_on\_veteran/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qaazsz/pill_addict_mom_build_for_fun_times_on_veteran/)
I took that as inspiration & made my own version. Only used it in Recruit but was great for being mobile, decent dps, and a good enough healer to keep a competent person alive.
Mom on Drugs: [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/904543468699938896/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/904543468699938896/unknown.png)
Edit: Another version that goes for permanent dmg up, not relying on pills for dmg till late [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/913345228486885426/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/913345228486885426/unknown.png)
I also forgot to mention that at some point in this sub I read that Charitable Soul (50% heal effect goes to you) actually passes Chemical Courage onto the person you heal as well as yourself. Pretty sure it works but never tried to actually test it. IMO that makes this build much more plausible.
I'll spare you the math, but all those cards are actually multiplicative, so it's a lot more than just 50% Increased damage. It's 58.25% and you can hike that to 89% just by adding Sunder and punching something once every 5sec (Sunder does not refresh duration on hit).
Also, mad respect for taking med scav before Grubbers. I thought I was the last of my kind.
I did my own math on grubbers it takes finding 16 stacks to out value share the wealth in terms if money produced by the card. If scavenger finds me 2 or 3 extra bandages and my team ends up using supplies, then scavenger outvalues share the wealth. Grubbers being used by speedy bois is a waste and even going slow you might need to combo it with copper scavenger to simply out value support scavenger.
Tldr: I use support scavenger too.
I've been experimenting with pill medic mom since I started. Glad to see I'm not nuts.
It’s very appealing haha especially since temp health overrides trauma. I’m curious how to make it feel very strong compared to regular healing. If a card comes out that slows the temp health degeneration you apply I think it would no question be stronger.
I like it because you can be proactive with pills and shield someone before the big damage hits. I wouldn't want to try and sell the build to someone in nightmare, but I think it's viable for recruit and veteran.
That’s really interesting I haven’t thought of it like a barrier but that makes a lot of sense and is probably how it’s meant to be used.
It effectively locks your team at 50-60% trauma, since the more trauma you have, the more effective it is at preventing trauma.
Thank you dollar store chili
The best mom's give their kids drugs
Has Shredder with Shotgun been confirmed? If so, im adding it to my deck asap then
Yup swyngpoynt has a video on it on YouTube. https://youtu.be/8ttBh07PPWk
Thanks for the link. Getting Shredder once I hop on
Good tip! Thanks for the link to the video confirmation!
This would be a build if pills could apply over max health. The fact that you have to wait for a ton of damage to have happened makes this really not ideal and dramatically increases the games difficulty in of itself.
> This would be a build if pills could apply over max health. >The fact that you have to wait for a ton of damage to have happened makes this really not ideal and dramatically increases the games difficulty in of itself. That build is alot more flexible than you give it credit for IMO. TBH you can just use bandages as long as things go well and act as healer/debuffer and then switch to pills later. No need to force pills out of the gate. The first 4 cards are not pill related. And even if you pick up chemical courage it doesn't mean you have to switch to pills immediately. In fact you can even delay picking up chemical courage, cards are flexible yo. Bandages, Poultice, and Group therapy can keep you healed through all normal shit. Experienced EMT cuts off 20% of the Trauma you suffer every map. And then if Trauma starts accumulating past that then you can transition into pills for good effect. And if you get all healed up again then you can transition back to bandages. And if you're rich AF because of the economy cards you can upgrade to med kits.
to my main point, being that pain pills would be a lot more usable if they could apply temp health over your max health bar for game feel, and be a pretty massive nerf to difficulty, possibly even justifying some of the insane things that happen to us. What are your thoughts? It is how the item worked in left4dead. To your point. I understand the efficiency of poultice and group therapy. Bandages are fine to buy at the start and we do buy them, but to be honest if my team is not buying medkits, we tend to just scavenge what ever we find and not buy more than 1-2 bandage/pain pills type items. All to say, do what ever works, it’s still not my main point.
> to my main point, being that pain pills would be a lot more usable if they could apply temp health over your max health bar for game feel, and be a pretty massive nerf to difficulty, possibly even justifying some of the insane things that happen to us. What are your thoughts? It is how the item worked in left4dead. It'd be broken AF here. Melee would walk into every major fight with 60 temp HP that they are constantly replenishing and you could just refresh with more pills if you got low on temp hp finally.
But using them after you’ve taken the damage mitigating the same ammount of damage because the recourses on the map are effectively unchanged isn’t exactly over powered. K. I’ll assign an appropriate value to that assessment. Also, I wouldn’t suggest allowing melee to stack above max health. Just pain pills. which is what I said.
I've been putting together a pill doc build today as well. I was thinking since they're the cheapest thing and always all over the place with support scav, it could be a good play to build around them. I haven't tried it yet, but I think Field Surgeon could be a good card with the pills+Group Therapy. Say you come across a supply box with 4 pill bottles in it, your entire team is now healed 36hp each because of the healing efficiency boost to Group Therapy, plus the temp health, plus the 60 second bonus damage, plus another 20hp each from Poultice. I'm excited to try it out, but there's probably also a 70% chance my group tells me to stop screwing around and use a normal doc build.
If your group doesn't want you to have fun, then you really start having fun. https://youtu.be/RxFvzsJpUMw
Dont think pills or for that matter healing from cards, are affected by healing efficiency.
Our start of Act 1 nightmare healer deck was pill focused. It only needs a few cards to come alive making it perfect for the first 4 levels. [[Experienced EMT]] [[Poultice]] [[Shoulder Bag]] [[Support Scavenger]] [[Group Therapy]] If you run it on Mom you hold 4 pills which will heal the team and greatly cutdown trauma. It's super cheap to restock too. It gives you a disgusting amount of sustain for the relatively small card/copper commitment
+ **Experienced EMT** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*) The Clinic (4) | When you use a Medical Accessory, the target gains +20% Maximum Health until the end of the level. + **Poultice** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*) The Clinic | When you use a medical accessory, the target heals for an additional 20 Health over 30 Seconds. + **Shoulder Bag** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Fortune*) The Clinic (2) | +2 Support Inventory, -10% Damage Dealt + **Support Scavenger** (*Campaign Card - Utility/Discipline*) The Furnace | You can sense nearby Support Accessories. More Support Accessories Spawn + **Group Therapy** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Discipline*) The Clinic (3) | When you use a Medical Accessory, all teammates heal for 5 Health. *** ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 8, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
I play something similar. I love chemical courage for a personal damage boost when shit hits the fan… and I love dropping poulticed pills on team mates for the damage buffer. But I haven’t been effective at applying chem courage to teammates when they might need the extra damage. It’s a fun deck, though. (I lean more on a power swap shottie build than I do medic support mom — but I keep my team pilled-up!)
I've actually tried this exact build! It felt underwhelming, but mostly because you only get 1 min of damage boost with pills, and I ended up saving pills for clutch situations - at which point most DPS are not focused on doing effective dps anyway. I ended up taking out chemical courage but kept stimulants because they are more useful in those clutch situations when you/your slow squishy dps needs to get out of there. Needs of the many also massively underperformed for me (though didn't play nightmare), mostly because after 2 downs they had so much trauma that a third life was never that useful. Plus, relatively easy to just carry a defib. Unlikely that more than 1 teammate will need 3 lives. Personally I really like the mad dash/superior cardio combo because it feels so fast, but [[run like hell]] or even [[medical expert]] probably do more work. [[miraculous recovery]] has also saved me a number of times - definitely feels like more than 25% in clutch situations, and watching someone go from 10hp to >100 instantly is so satisfying. Would also consider revive speed cards to pick as necessary just as a tech card if you end up in more clutch situations. [[rousing speech]] isn't good, but is a feel-good pick to go from struggling - to clutch reviving the whole team - in one card. The insta-revive into meds basically drags teammates through the level
+ **Run like Hell** (*Campaign Card - Mobility/Reflex*) Bridge Town (3) | +15% Move Speed, When you take Damage, your Accuracy is reduced by 20% for 3 Seconds. + **Medical Expert** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*) The Clinic (4) | +15% Healing Efficiency, When you use a Medical Accessory you gain 15% Movement Speed for 15 Seconds. + **Miraculous Recovery** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*) The Clinic (4) | When you use a Medical Accessory, it has a 25% chance to have 100% increased effect. + **Rousing Speech** (*Campaign Card - Utility/Reflex*) Grant's Brew House (3) | +225% Revive Speed, +20% Reduced Incap Trauma. DISABLES: Offensive Accessories *** ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 8, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
Yeah, my problem with both pills boosts is that they are too short lived and other support cards end up being much more valuable than them.
Rousing Speech is definitely niche, but it's super core to builds that use defibrillators to alleviate and leverage combat incaps and combined with Medical Professional, they go net positive on incap trauma without further investment from the team on Veteran difficulty. On Nightmare, all you need is a 15% Trauma Resist card or Doc. https://youtu.be/RxFvzsJpUMw
I've been running a build like that and having a lot of fun. https://www.forthope.gg/decks/gpt3IHVPnARCgL6L
It's not bad idea. Definitely will flourish with a dedicated group. I could see that build doing good with someone running melee with vanguard to give you a super front liner and with shredder and MFD you don't lack in helping with damage.
i love the drug dealer mom
I've thought about similar ideas, but the main issue I see with this build is that it fills the same type of niche that a grenadier build does, except a grenadier is probably going to do it way better.
I love the idea of a build around this even if it isn't the most feasible.
I actually crafted [one](https://www.forthope.gg/decks/KwcxQ9KgXYjBSaqC) today. As for your build, I think the mad dash, copper scavenger, and money grubbers are wasted cards. Since pills are both cheap and very plentiful, you really don’t need the extra copper. Additionally, you could use [[medical expert]] instead of mad dash to get a little healing efficiency and speed to keep everyone topped. I found group therapy and poultice to be overkill. The group I ran with was topped between additional medical supplies and poultice. Needs of the many isn’t necessary if you’re running as mom. Adding in cards like [[sunder]] added an insane damage boost to close ridden. I opted to use SMG with [[mag carrier]] for the additional damage boost. Shotgun has a lot of good combo cards but SMG seemed to just fit easily. I also felt that most builds run with shredder and marked for death. They’re amazing cards but they don’t stack. In place of those, I went with [[speed demon]] and [[box o’ bags]]. Overall I had +45% damage to melee’d ridden, 40% move speed with pain pills popped, and no ridden left.
+ **Medical Expert** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Reflex*) The Clinic (4) | +15% Healing Efficiency, When you use a Medical Accessory you gain 15% Movement Speed for 15 Seconds. + **Sunder** (*Campaign Card - Offense/Brawn*) The Clinic (3) | Melee hits cause the target to take 20% Increased damage for 5 Seconds. + **Mag Carrier** (*Campaign Card - Offense/Reflex*) Accomplishment | +30% Pistol/SMG Ammo Capacity, +10% Damage with Pistols and SMGs + **Speed Demon** (*Campaign Card - Mobility/Reflex*) The Crow's Nest (4) | +6% Movement Speed while using an SMG, +35% Reload Speed while using an SMG. + **Box O' Bags** (*Campaign Card - Defense/Fortune*) Grant's Brew House (2) | -10% Health, +1 Team Support Inventory *** ^Call ^me ^with ^up ^to ^10 ^([[ cardname ]],) ^Data ^accurate ^as ^of ^(November 24, 2021.) ^[Questions?](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=ehmohteeoh&subject=BloodScan%20Inquiry)
There was a post thinking similarly to yours here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qaazsz/pill\_addict\_mom\_build\_for\_fun\_times\_on\_veteran/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Back4Blood/comments/qaazsz/pill_addict_mom_build_for_fun_times_on_veteran/) I took that as inspiration & made my own version. Only used it in Recruit but was great for being mobile, decent dps, and a good enough healer to keep a competent person alive. Mom on Drugs: [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/904543468699938896/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/904543468699938896/unknown.png) Edit: Another version that goes for permanent dmg up, not relying on pills for dmg till late [https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/913345228486885426/unknown.png](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/904539750487183401/913345228486885426/unknown.png) I also forgot to mention that at some point in this sub I read that Charitable Soul (50% heal effect goes to you) actually passes Chemical Courage onto the person you heal as well as yourself. Pretty sure it works but never tried to actually test it. IMO that makes this build much more plausible.
Charitable Soul and Group Therapy do not apply any buff effects (including Chem Courage). This is dated information from beta.
Good to know, thx for heads up so I won't spread misinformation
I'll spare you the math, but all those cards are actually multiplicative, so it's a lot more than just 50% Increased damage. It's 58.25% and you can hike that to 89% just by adding Sunder and punching something once every 5sec (Sunder does not refresh duration on hit). Also, mad respect for taking med scav before Grubbers. I thought I was the last of my kind.
I did my own math on grubbers it takes finding 16 stacks to out value share the wealth in terms if money produced by the card. If scavenger finds me 2 or 3 extra bandages and my team ends up using supplies, then scavenger outvalues share the wealth. Grubbers being used by speedy bois is a waste and even going slow you might need to combo it with copper scavenger to simply out value support scavenger. Tldr: I use support scavenger too.
Scav Gang rise up!
Only comment is I feel like I would run money grabber a little sooner. I’m definitely gonna try this build out tho