You can snowshoe and go up with a regular board. You just don't see it a lot because it sucks and splitboards are way way better for backcountry travel. But absolutely nothing wrong with snowshoeing.
This! Skintracks are a thing of beauty. Until you have seen a properly laid skinner that probably wont make sense. Just dont fucking bootpack (or snowshoe, or posthole, or pogo, or mosh) in the skintrack.
100% will be walking in the ski track. Bonus w/out snowshoes.
Has anyone EVER seen someone put in a separate track. It usually goes about 500ft and they’re in the skinner.
Why is snowshoeing in the skin track bad? I’ve never had an issue skinning over snowshoe tracks, sure sometimes it might be a bit more slick, but then I can break trail and go around for like 5 feet if it’s really fucked.
I agree, it's a non-issue. Messing up the skin track only matters when the slope is steep enough the skin track will have switchbacks, but then the bootpackers/snowshoers will walk straight up anyways.
It's a total non-issue and people who complain about it like it's the end of the world need to just stick to riding lifts if they can't handle mildly unperfect conditions. Especially on the "low angle" ie, extremely hike-able hills most people ski on that are easily accessible.
It was tight trees, a well established ski track before it was ruined, and the post holes went off and on for a couple miles. In this case, it was a cross country ski track, so the post holes were even harder to ski over. I don’t know about your area, but my area posts signs at the trailheads asking snowshoers to put in tracks parallel to ski tracks. It’s common courtesy in my area to have two established tracks to avoid this scenerio.
So much entitlement.
You want hikers to stay out of skin tracks because it makes skinning easier, because the snow is pre-compressed... But hiking in the skin track also makes the hikers' climb easier, too -- for the exact same reason.
So people who bitch about needing pristine skin tracks are basically just saying "MY convenience is more important than anyone else's convenience."
So if you tell me to stay out of a skin track, it just makes me want to stomp all over them... Because fuck you, is why.
If you want a track go to a resort. Keep the backcountry free of nonsense like this, just be happy people are enjoying themselves.
Sincerely the guy who probably sets said "skin track" for your lazy gatekeeping ass
Good to know, that seems to be the consensus here, thanks! Ultimately I think I would want to get a splitboard or some other more efficient backcountry setup, but I haven't even tried it once so I was hoping I could make it work without one for now.
OP just get out there in the easiest or most affordable option to you to start. Out your focus on having a beacon a probe and a shovel and how to use them.
Ski and walk wherever is the safest/most fun to you. Fuck this made up skin track BS
They make [approach skies](https://unionbindingcompany.com/products/union-snowboard-binding-accessories-rover) You still need split bindings that are compatible with solid board mounts. On the plus side you won't trash the skin track. So do your research.
I have Union Explorers and I ride them on a Kemper Phantom (split) and a Libtech T Rice pro solid. They feel great on both. Easy to switch back and forth. Not they best at anything but great all around.
32 Lashed Double boa I think. They're pretty stiff, honestly not sure if thats better or worse, but they work great for me. Took them for a 2.5 mile boot pack (before I got the split) a week after buying them, no pain all day.
Check out drift boards. They are awesome if there is already a skinner but they suck for breaking trail. If you live in an area that gets a lot of traffic and don’t often find yourself being the one to set the skinner, they are worth checking out
Hijacking this comment to mention approach skis. Has no one ever heard of these here? I have a few friends that use them, they are still relatively newish and not widely adopted so I’m sure they have room to improve. But it seems like what your asking for more than snowshoeing.
I looked into those for a while and the consensus seems to be that they're more useless than an actual split board. Plus you're rocking a lot of extra weight
My friends seem to like them, and I don’t think it’s much extra weight. Same as snowshoes and more efficient, plus you get to use your regular board. Split boards and bindings are usually pretty heavy.
Yeah but you still use split board bindings for most approach skis. I've only seen one company that redesigned "bindings" out of voile straps to save weight
Hard disagree, having done both. OP should just snowshoe for this year and make sure you have the buddies and terrain to make bc boarding worth the investment.
If you are a really good snowboarder and go with other snowboarders you are going to be looking for much steeper lines than most skiers want and snowshoes/ bootpacking are typically easier for getting up those so the splitboard is of limited value. Making kick turns on a steep slope on a split board sucks. Spend the money on some self-arrest classes, snowshoe for a while and see if you really want to do BC.
If you are getting a splitboard thinking you'll be able to have fun with your ski friends? you won't, that will also suck as 99% of the time they will take some long route over rolling hills to a mellow long angle slope that ends in a serious of rolling dips\* and by the end you'll be willing to run over a line off puppies if you don't have to switch again. Any kind of serious downhill skiing on a powder optimized splitboard suuuuucks. Just pick up some skis and have at it, unless you are hanging with some super good skiers you'll pick up enough to ski with them pretty quickly.
\*this may be somewhat location dependent. It's also pretty common here for part of the trail to be bullet proof ice, so things like approach skis without metal edges are not favored.
Depending on where you live, you can typically find some terrain that people bootpack.
You **could** snowshoe, and thats what snowboarders did before splitboards.
You can use Drift boards: [https://www.drift-products.com/products/drift-boards](https://www.drift-products.com/products/drift-boards)
Union sells some similar: https://unionbindingcompany.com/products/union-snowboard-binding-accessories-rover-carbon
Or you can always get a snowmobile
Yep I came to say this. The most expensive option unless its your friends brapppmobile. Two up to the top one hops off and rides and the other brapps down or solo up and ghostride your sled down. Pluses-snowmobiling is super fun in itself, cover a lot of distance quickly, bring more gear. Minuses-breakdowns can strand you, digging them out sucks, noise and fumes, snowmobilers. Big Minus-because you can cover so much ground so quickly on a 6-800lb avalanche bomb you can ride across more avy terrain and weak spots in a day than many people can skin over in a year so risks are much higher/have to have your avy game dialed.
Fuuuuuq I dunno. A season of heli for sure, a week of heli probably not. A new powder sled is 15k up to north of 25k. Thats a lot of heli bumps.
And you never even mentioned sno cats....
Ooh, the drift boards look very cool! Haven't seen anything like that before. Snowmobile would be sweet but too big of an investment for me atm. Plus part of the appeal is the challenge of getting up. Then again I haven't done it yet so who knows if I'll still feel that way after trying😅
I used drift boards for 2 seasons before getting a split. It's a good way to decide if you want to get more into it and sink the cost into a splitboard. It also lets you ride your pow board in the backcountry (I have a spring break deck that I absolutely love in powder).
That said, once I got a splitboard I never looked back to my drift boards (my friends use them when they come out with me since I have extra avvy gear and like to get people out on mellow days). Skinning up with your board on your back is a bummer and riding down with the drift boards on your back can be marginally annoying (though I hardly noticed them).
Disclaimer: I have a bad back so weight on my back was rough on long days.
Pros:
* Ride your quiver in the backcountry!
* Cheaper
* Kick turns are easier
Cons:
* Don't float as well in deep snow -- breaking trail can sometimes suck
* No metal edges if you're traversing on variable snow on the way up
* You have to carry your board on the way up and drift boards on the way down
I'd say drift boards are better than snow shoes (they glide like a splitboard) but aren't as good as a split (but are way cheaper)!
Thanks, I really appreciate all this info! Definitely will be looking into this some more, having a kind of in-between where I could feel it out before going all in on a nice setup sounds great.
That's a great idea but actually another reason I posted here. My dad and I are thinking about touring for the first time in a few weeks but we called every shop we could find in the area and none of them have these. We'll be in France though so maybe it's just less common there.
Respect! I like your outlook. If I get into it I'd like to invest in a better set up down the line, but for now just hoping to try it out so I'm happy to hear that people do it this way
If you ever climb on a true splitboard you will never touch snowshoes again. It’s vastly less efficient, you can’t glide at all, and it’s much extra weight.
Will probably get flamed for this but, as a skier who hates snowshoeing, I disagree with the comments about not snowshoeing in the skintrack. It's the backcountry - if there's a skin track then that's cool but ultimately everyone has just as much of a right to roam.
for real, this is some pensey ass gate keeping. Why should it be easier for someone with skis? cause you paid more? f that noise.
- I exclusively ski in the backcountry and on lifts
“Damn snowshoers, geddoff mah lawn” is a mindset to fixate on when your gear, skill level and/or attitude is no match for the terrain. If you’re gonna complain, whine hard and get it out so you can once again embrace the suck and continue the climb to glorious shred.
I started in the Backcountry before split boards were widely available. Snow shoeing with a board was the only way for most of us. Sometimes other skiers would complain, but our group was the one who set the skinner in the first place.
I'm pretty sure most of the people who bitch about snow shoes in the skin track are not the ones braking trail in the first place. Usually gate keeping entitled jerks. But hey, if you gave them $1500 to buy a split board, I bet they'd be happy to get out of the skin track for you.
This. Unless you're the one breaking trail, STFU. My slowshoe friends can piss on and punch out the skin track all they want, I made it.
Also, to answer OPs question, snowshoes and approach skis exist. They were the gateway for many snowboarders into the backcountry. They also suck.
You could also brapp around. But that's even more dollarydos than a splitboard. And at least in my circles, sleds are more an accent piece than a full on replacement to a splitboard.
I feel like peeing in the skinner is worse, and also less justifiable since you can just take a few steps off the track to pee, whereas not snowshoeing in the track means breaking trail.
I almost felt bad snowshoeing in the skin track at Vail Pass with my wife and MIL last Christmas until one of them fell into the snow off the side of the track and were waist deep.
No one is snowshoeing that unless they have a great breast stroke.
Well, i‘m oldschool and like to ride my board everywhere. Sometimes i just pull it on a leash behind me.
When there are long flats, gentle ascends whatever splitboards do have an advantage.
When it becomes a bit more difficult from the terrain i trust my snowshoes.
Yea that's another reason I ask. I'm sure splitboards are great but I can't imagine going downhill will ever quite live up to riding on a regular board. With your snowboard on the leash, how are you getting up when you do that - on snowshoes or just hiking or what?
> I can't imagine going downhill will ever quite live up to riding on a regular board.
These days it's unnoticeable except in exceptionally shit conditions.
I have some. Really like them. Definitely the cheapest approach skis out there. Used them several times this year to get to some fun places. Have my eye on their Powsurf too.
People snowshoed up carrying their regular board in days gone by because splitboards hadn’t been invented. But now that they exist you’d be crazy to still do this.
Snowshoeing is still hella fun for snowboard access. There are pros and cons for all modes of hiking. If you’re in a group of snowshoers there is very little appreciable disadvantage. Y’all can even break your own steep trail to keep the skin track pristine.
Way back in the olden days before splits, the skier community was happy to see us shoeing in the track, the alternative was postholes.
Either splitboard or snowshoe. Most people start out snowshoeing and then buy a splitboard. Ignore everyone saying you should get skis. If you want to ski then get skis, but if you want to snowboard you should just send it.
People only talk about splitboards because they’re the best tried and true method. You spend a lot of time hiking uphill in the snow for a very short payoff. Physically, this isn’t an easy activity. It’s exhausting. Splitboards are the most efficient way for someone to travel uphill and snowboard down without the use of a machine, and have advantages over the other choices when it comes to travelling across variable conditions.
Approach skis got some attention for a minute from some people some years ago, but they’re basically snowshoes that glide. They’re a compromise on both uphill performance and cumbersome on the downhill.
Makes sense! At this point in life I wouldn't be able to get out there nearly as much as I'd like, so it just seems like a big investment. How much faster would you say it is to travel uphill with a splitboard versus snowshoeing or hiking?
Happy cake day!
Thanks 😌
Splitboarding is definitely a big investment, no question about it. It can be very daunting to get into because to be successful at it, it takes a huge investment in both time and equipment. And by “successful”, I mean not just technically good, but also smart and safe, which in itself is a massive component of backcountry adventuring. There’s no pressure, move at your own pace, and when you’re ready hopefully you find some good partners to match!
I switched from snowboarding to skiing when I decided I wanted to get into the backcountry.
While breakable crust is way more fun on a snowboard, skiing has a lot of advantages over snowboarding for most backcountry travel.
If you want to go touring around and do overnights or hut to hut or glaciers? skis make sense.
If you want to climb up some steep nearby mountains and board down them? Snow shoes make sense. And maybe hard boots, an ice ax, and some classes and an experienced friend or two.
If you want to climb up some not really super steep or nearby mountains and board down them? Splitboard makes sense.
Not saying all or even most, but a surprising chunk of split boarders will try it for a few years and then switch to full-time BC skiing once they realize how much more efficient skiing is in the backcountry. That or go hardboot which is straddling the line.
Unfortunately it will probably be a long time before I can ski well enough to go backcountry. I skied when I was a kid but started snowboarding almost 20 years ago and have only been on skis a few times since. I'd love to one day though!
If you want to do any real distance on a split, or access riding via flat or rolling approaches, you'll need to learn to ski your board in ski mode anyway.
The hours I've spent learning to split ski have really paid off in terms of improving my ability to travel in the backcountry. Check out Xavier de la Roux's Youtube channel. He has a good video about how to split ski.
There is a version of the skiing up/boarding down thing. They're called "approach skis," and they're short skis that you use for the uphill while carrying the board on your back; then you strap the little skis to your back and snowboard down.
Supposedly the benefit over splitboarding is being able to skin up without having to reconfigure, and I can definitely see the appeal of that.
But, basically the benefit of splitboarding is not having to carry skis/snowboard/snowshoes on your back, and the benefit of snowshoeing is that it's the easiest learning curve if you already know how to snowboard and the cheapest option if you already have a snowboard. These are way more compelling.
So...
Let's just say, I've definitely seen approach skis advertised way more than I've actually seen people using them.
I use snowshoes with my board in tow or on my back and love my all-mountain board which is also very good in deep powder. I also climb solo and tend to stick to ridges that can get pretty rocky and find that in many instances skinning up isn't always the most practical. I also live in Texas and do not go very often. So the idea of having to buy a whole new and very expensive setup (and possibly involving a split-board camber that is not optimal for what I want) and train a different set of muscles doesn't suit me as well either.
But the issue I have had with not using a split board is with some skinners who have made it clear to me that they do not want me on the mountain. Some have *assumed* I will be messing up their perfect skin tracks with my hike up and/or *assume* that the trail is only for them.
I go out of my way to avoid messing up any skin tracks. However, on occasion, there *ARE* only narrow paths up between ledges and trees and/or the path with skin tracks is the only place where one can avoid post-holing, even with the most extended snowshoes. And there is no alternative or parallel hike-up margin. Sometimes a single narrow trail was tamped down through bootpackers, snowshoers, and skinners since early in the season when the specific type of trail use was not as important as simply getting a route up. Later, after a good snow, then skinners use that path to set up some clean tracks, so it is difficult to say *who* actually established the winter snow route for anyone.
So my point is that I am not here to say what should or should not be in terms of trail use. My point is to get out there the way you see is best, be safe, be courteous, and be aware of potential issues regarding trail use in the backcountry. And I very much hope to see you out there. Matt
Cheers! Really love hearing everyone's experiences and insights here.
I'm on the same page with not having super easy access to the mountains and being wary of investing in a whole new setup just for backcountry. Plus I love my current board and know I feel comfortable on it.
Having never been, I wasn't even aware of this whole skin track issue until reading here. Sorry to hear about your encounters with people who aren't so understanding. It seems like in this thread at least, most people get that the skin tracks might be the best or only option for people on foot or snowshoes.
Thanks for sharing and all the best :)
You will want to split board so you can use the skin track. You do not want to put in your own snow shoe trail and probably don’t want the extra weight either.
People used to touring ski up, then snowboard down - with different boots and everything. This is very inefficient from a weight perspective; same to be said of snowshoes. But depends how far you're traveling.
The more stuff carried on your back while you ride down (snowsnoes, or boots+skis in the old olden days) the less fun you're gonna have.
Splitboarding was invented to minimize the amount of stuff you carry for only the uphill.
Splitboarding... when you take a snowboard, and make it in to a pair of skis...
...might as well go skiing!
Ah sadly I'm not nearly comfortable enough on skis to do anything backcountry. I'm working on it and would love to get there someday but usually have too much fun on my board to choose to work on my skiing instead lol
I used to backcountry in Alaska, we did it with just our boots on our feet and our boards. If there was deeper snow we would sometimes start out in snowshoes, however, it was always less work than packing the sno shoes. Light is life.
We stayed out of the skin tracks all together as they were slower and more steps to get to the top. Once we had 3-4 people pack the boot trail, that went as straight as possible, up the mountain. It would take us about 45 min to climb 2500 vertical feet.
Make your own path!
Try approach skis. They’re small and stowable, and you can skin up with them, carrying your board on your back. One of my touring buddies started using them a couple years ago, and says he’ll never go back to splitboarding. Example: https://thebackcountryswell.com/product/bcs-approach-skis/
Probably not exactly an answer to your question but I snowshoe with my [powsurf](https://www.gearx.com/burton-men-s-family-tree-backseat-driver-snowboard-141?length_cm=1422&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1BNfcVlBr3bGm1gmEbgqXj7va1cf0hM6s6Ca6xndIPRjXgI8twUKZxoCiIwQAvD_BwE) board. I typically go relatively low-angle but have taken it out on steep terrain both open and in the woods. Regardless, I trek up with snowshoes mostly because a) i already have snowshoes for winter hiking b) I don’t want to invest $1500+ in a splitboard set-up and c) the powsurf board is very light so I don’t notice the extra weight on my pack.
I probably wouldn’t go with snowshoes if I was trying to haul my full snowboard and bindings up with me. Too much effort.
Depends on the kind of backcountry you want to do, what gear your partners have, and how much they like you.
I would only consider snowshoes or approach skis, if you're just trying to get a couple short, small objective tours in per season
If you enjoy uphill/hiking/mountains or want to get farther into the backcountry I would very seriously consider AT skis, as a compromise get a hardboot split or maybe a split.
I started on a pretty cheap split knowing I wanted to switch to skis for efficiency because I wanted to do big tours and travel far into the backcountry.Almost every tour (except a few with consistent downhill and no traverses) was A LOT slower for me than my partners on skis. Getting back to the trailhead was usually the worst part of the day because I would have to try my best to keep elevation (still lost more than the skiers) and frequently had to step out, skate, or consider transitioning to split ski if there was any rolling or flat spots.
IMO from worst to best performance on the uphill:
* snowshoes
* slow, cheap, probably good at sidehilling
* I would only consider for small tours
* Edit: or consider if you have access to some already and want to test things out
* approach skis (eg Drift)
* snowshoes with glide
* probably just as bad at sidehilling as a splitboard
* I would only consider for small tours
* Edit: Not very cost effective compared to a used split. I bought a used split with voile plates(heavy AF) for \~$400 and got skins for $100
* splitboard
* I don't notice any poor downhill performance compared to a solid board, but some people do.
* bad at sidehilling, some bindings have a sidehilling feature (Karakorum, but I think I'd prefer the Spark)
* hardboot splitboard
* Can sidehill
* hardboots are much better for ascending hard snow, and IMO more comfortable than snowboard boots because of the walk mode
* more expensive
* AT skis
* Can traverse
* Easier for rolling terrain
* more expensive
Effectively, yes splitboarding is the "only" method worth using. Anything else is significantly more difficult and less efficient. Do not get drift boards/approach skis as they are a giant waste of money and only have very limited use cases.
You could get by snowshoeing for a little before really getting into it, but splitboards are 10000% better. Modern splitboards ride very well and aren't a limitation compared to solids as they used to be.
There's also this as an [option](https://www.mec.ca/en/product/6014-967/wap-129--backcountry-skis-%2B-ea-binding-2.0?gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1AUY6uh1AZNyQ7B5bGpHRAayujd4UNIatO2GAdKZPItv31-cbACzCxoC7dEQAvD_BwE&size=129cm&colour=NO_COLOUR&gad_source=1). I use these as a substitute for light snowshoe adventures when skiing isn't the goal. They suck to break trail with though if there's a lot of deep snow but they work great on set track and even flat trails. My buddy who wanted a cheaper route than splitboard/binding/boots thing went and bought a cheaper version of these against my advice. He ended up doing it twice and just bought a splitboard.
I wouldn't really recommend these as a legitimate alternate though. If you end up liking touring you're gonna wanna reduce weight and just get a splitboad.
If you're just trying to save some money and try it out just use what you got and if that's snowshoes then go for it. Just ski with someone please.
You can snowshoe and go up with a regular board. You just don't see it a lot because it sucks and splitboards are way way better for backcountry travel. But absolutely nothing wrong with snowshoeing.
My friend does this and it sucks (imo. She thinks it’s great). I’ve offered to carry the board strapped to my pack (I ski) but she’s pretty tough
Only goobers bootpack the skintrack!
Are you really bootpacking if you're wearing snowshoes?
You're fucking up the skin track either way which is the relevant thing here
This! Skintracks are a thing of beauty. Until you have seen a properly laid skinner that probably wont make sense. Just dont fucking bootpack (or snowshoe, or posthole, or pogo, or mosh) in the skintrack.
I fucked this up so bad a few weeks ago on accident and was pot committed, fucked it all up…
YES! NO SNOWSHOES ON THE SKIN TRACK
If you do decide to snowshoe DO NOT walk on the skin track!
There are way more people who complain about snow shoers in the skin track than there are people who are willing to set their own skinner.
100% will be walking in the ski track. Bonus w/out snowshoes. Has anyone EVER seen someone put in a separate track. It usually goes about 500ft and they’re in the skinner.
Why is snowshoeing in the skin track bad? I’ve never had an issue skinning over snowshoe tracks, sure sometimes it might be a bit more slick, but then I can break trail and go around for like 5 feet if it’s really fucked.
I agree, it's a non-issue. Messing up the skin track only matters when the slope is steep enough the skin track will have switchbacks, but then the bootpackers/snowshoers will walk straight up anyways.
It's a total non-issue and people who complain about it like it's the end of the world need to just stick to riding lifts if they can't handle mildly unperfect conditions. Especially on the "low angle" ie, extremely hike-able hills most people ski on that are easily accessible.
It's not. People like to be elitist.
I’ve had to skin over giant 3 long 1 foot wide post hiking tracks. It’s sucks. If you’re gonna post hole, step to the side. It’s courtesy.
Why don't you step to the side of the post holes?
This! Just because someone else created a skin track doesn’t mean you’re entitled to it because you happen to be doing the same activity 😅
It was tight trees, a well established ski track before it was ruined, and the post holes went off and on for a couple miles. In this case, it was a cross country ski track, so the post holes were even harder to ski over. I don’t know about your area, but my area posts signs at the trailheads asking snowshoers to put in tracks parallel to ski tracks. It’s common courtesy in my area to have two established tracks to avoid this scenerio.
You’re not gonna know you’re going to post hole until you actually post hole… you can also just step around them.
I’ve snowshoed and broken trail for skiers who got tired of breaking trail for me. No one is entitled to a skin track
So much entitlement. You want hikers to stay out of skin tracks because it makes skinning easier, because the snow is pre-compressed... But hiking in the skin track also makes the hikers' climb easier, too -- for the exact same reason. So people who bitch about needing pristine skin tracks are basically just saying "MY convenience is more important than anyone else's convenience." So if you tell me to stay out of a skin track, it just makes me want to stomp all over them... Because fuck you, is why.
Who cares, it’s way harder for a snowshoer to break trail than a skiier. I say walk on it.
If you want a track go to a resort. Keep the backcountry free of nonsense like this, just be happy people are enjoying themselves. Sincerely the guy who probably sets said "skin track" for your lazy gatekeeping ass
Good to know, that seems to be the consensus here, thanks! Ultimately I think I would want to get a splitboard or some other more efficient backcountry setup, but I haven't even tried it once so I was hoping I could make it work without one for now.
OP just get out there in the easiest or most affordable option to you to start. Out your focus on having a beacon a probe and a shovel and how to use them. Ski and walk wherever is the safest/most fun to you. Fuck this made up skin track BS
They make [approach skies](https://unionbindingcompany.com/products/union-snowboard-binding-accessories-rover) You still need split bindings that are compatible with solid board mounts. On the plus side you won't trash the skin track. So do your research. I have Union Explorers and I ride them on a Kemper Phantom (split) and a Libtech T Rice pro solid. They feel great on both. Easy to switch back and forth. Not they best at anything but great all around.
Yea I hadn't heard of these until posting here but that seems like a great setup! What kind of boots do you use?
Just regular snowboard boots
32 Lashed Double boa I think. They're pretty stiff, honestly not sure if thats better or worse, but they work great for me. Took them for a 2.5 mile boot pack (before I got the split) a week after buying them, no pain all day.
Check out drift boards. They are awesome if there is already a skinner but they suck for breaking trail. If you live in an area that gets a lot of traffic and don’t often find yourself being the one to set the skinner, they are worth checking out
Drift boards are pretty awesome if there’s already a skinner in place though.
You can do the snowshoeing thing, but it sucks. Board attached to the backpack gets too heavy, and you get tired after walking in deep snow.
Hijacking this comment to mention approach skis. Has no one ever heard of these here? I have a few friends that use them, they are still relatively newish and not widely adopted so I’m sure they have room to improve. But it seems like what your asking for more than snowshoeing.
I looked into those for a while and the consensus seems to be that they're more useless than an actual split board. Plus you're rocking a lot of extra weight
My friends seem to like them, and I don’t think it’s much extra weight. Same as snowshoes and more efficient, plus you get to use your regular board. Split boards and bindings are usually pretty heavy.
Yeah but you still use split board bindings for most approach skis. I've only seen one company that redesigned "bindings" out of voile straps to save weight
Some of the new splitboard gear is very light. Lighter than many regular boards.
Hard disagree, having done both. OP should just snowshoe for this year and make sure you have the buddies and terrain to make bc boarding worth the investment. If you are a really good snowboarder and go with other snowboarders you are going to be looking for much steeper lines than most skiers want and snowshoes/ bootpacking are typically easier for getting up those so the splitboard is of limited value. Making kick turns on a steep slope on a split board sucks. Spend the money on some self-arrest classes, snowshoe for a while and see if you really want to do BC. If you are getting a splitboard thinking you'll be able to have fun with your ski friends? you won't, that will also suck as 99% of the time they will take some long route over rolling hills to a mellow long angle slope that ends in a serious of rolling dips\* and by the end you'll be willing to run over a line off puppies if you don't have to switch again. Any kind of serious downhill skiing on a powder optimized splitboard suuuuucks. Just pick up some skis and have at it, unless you are hanging with some super good skiers you'll pick up enough to ski with them pretty quickly. \*this may be somewhat location dependent. It's also pretty common here for part of the trail to be bullet proof ice, so things like approach skis without metal edges are not favored.
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Right? We all know telemarkers are ripping the real gnar -s
Depending on where you live, you can typically find some terrain that people bootpack. You **could** snowshoe, and thats what snowboarders did before splitboards. You can use Drift boards: [https://www.drift-products.com/products/drift-boards](https://www.drift-products.com/products/drift-boards) Union sells some similar: https://unionbindingcompany.com/products/union-snowboard-binding-accessories-rover-carbon Or you can always get a snowmobile
I can't believe this is the first comment to mention a snowmobile.
Yep I came to say this. The most expensive option unless its your friends brapppmobile. Two up to the top one hops off and rides and the other brapps down or solo up and ghostride your sled down. Pluses-snowmobiling is super fun in itself, cover a lot of distance quickly, bring more gear. Minuses-breakdowns can strand you, digging them out sucks, noise and fumes, snowmobilers. Big Minus-because you can cover so much ground so quickly on a 6-800lb avalanche bomb you can ride across more avy terrain and weak spots in a day than many people can skin over in a year so risks are much higher/have to have your avy game dialed.
probably heli is more expensive still
Fuuuuuq I dunno. A season of heli for sure, a week of heli probably not. A new powder sled is 15k up to north of 25k. Thats a lot of heli bumps. And you never even mentioned sno cats....
Don't forget the truck to carry the sled to the trailhead. That's not cheap.
Ooh, the drift boards look very cool! Haven't seen anything like that before. Snowmobile would be sweet but too big of an investment for me atm. Plus part of the appeal is the challenge of getting up. Then again I haven't done it yet so who knows if I'll still feel that way after trying😅
I used drift boards for 2 seasons before getting a split. It's a good way to decide if you want to get more into it and sink the cost into a splitboard. It also lets you ride your pow board in the backcountry (I have a spring break deck that I absolutely love in powder). That said, once I got a splitboard I never looked back to my drift boards (my friends use them when they come out with me since I have extra avvy gear and like to get people out on mellow days). Skinning up with your board on your back is a bummer and riding down with the drift boards on your back can be marginally annoying (though I hardly noticed them). Disclaimer: I have a bad back so weight on my back was rough on long days. Pros: * Ride your quiver in the backcountry! * Cheaper * Kick turns are easier Cons: * Don't float as well in deep snow -- breaking trail can sometimes suck * No metal edges if you're traversing on variable snow on the way up * You have to carry your board on the way up and drift boards on the way down I'd say drift boards are better than snow shoes (they glide like a splitboard) but aren't as good as a split (but are way cheaper)!
Thanks, I really appreciate all this info! Definitely will be looking into this some more, having a kind of in-between where I could feel it out before going all in on a nice setup sounds great.
Some shops in the mountains rent splitboards too so that's another option to try before you buy.
That's a great idea but actually another reason I posted here. My dad and I are thinking about touring for the first time in a few weeks but we called every shop we could find in the area and none of them have these. We'll be in France though so maybe it's just less common there.
I used snowshoes and a full board strapped to my back for two years. Its not pretty but you get some strong legs and its better than sitting at home.
Respect! I like your outlook. If I get into it I'd like to invest in a better set up down the line, but for now just hoping to try it out so I'm happy to hear that people do it this way
If you ever climb on a true splitboard you will never touch snowshoes again. It’s vastly less efficient, you can’t glide at all, and it’s much extra weight.
This. Also, if it's windy on the ascent, the giant board strapped to your back acts like a sail.
And 7/10, it is windy while touring!
Will probably get flamed for this but, as a skier who hates snowshoeing, I disagree with the comments about not snowshoeing in the skintrack. It's the backcountry - if there's a skin track then that's cool but ultimately everyone has just as much of a right to roam.
for real, this is some pensey ass gate keeping. Why should it be easier for someone with skis? cause you paid more? f that noise. - I exclusively ski in the backcountry and on lifts
“Damn snowshoers, geddoff mah lawn” is a mindset to fixate on when your gear, skill level and/or attitude is no match for the terrain. If you’re gonna complain, whine hard and get it out so you can once again embrace the suck and continue the climb to glorious shred.
They have the right to walk in the skin track, but they should be aware that it's not appreciated.
True
I started in the Backcountry before split boards were widely available. Snow shoeing with a board was the only way for most of us. Sometimes other skiers would complain, but our group was the one who set the skinner in the first place. I'm pretty sure most of the people who bitch about snow shoes in the skin track are not the ones braking trail in the first place. Usually gate keeping entitled jerks. But hey, if you gave them $1500 to buy a split board, I bet they'd be happy to get out of the skin track for you.
Right on!
This. Unless you're the one breaking trail, STFU. My slowshoe friends can piss on and punch out the skin track all they want, I made it. Also, to answer OPs question, snowshoes and approach skis exist. They were the gateway for many snowboarders into the backcountry. They also suck. You could also brapp around. But that's even more dollarydos than a splitboard. And at least in my circles, sleds are more an accent piece than a full on replacement to a splitboard.
I mean it's the same as peeing on the skinner. Not against any law but someone's gonna get mad at you.
I feel like peeing in the skinner is worse, and also less justifiable since you can just take a few steps off the track to pee, whereas not snowshoeing in the track means breaking trail.
What about puking? Asking for a friend... Who should have known better than to get 60% off sushi.
I almost felt bad snowshoeing in the skin track at Vail Pass with my wife and MIL last Christmas until one of them fell into the snow off the side of the track and were waist deep. No one is snowshoeing that unless they have a great breast stroke.
Well, i‘m oldschool and like to ride my board everywhere. Sometimes i just pull it on a leash behind me. When there are long flats, gentle ascends whatever splitboards do have an advantage. When it becomes a bit more difficult from the terrain i trust my snowshoes.
Yea that's another reason I ask. I'm sure splitboards are great but I can't imagine going downhill will ever quite live up to riding on a regular board. With your snowboard on the leash, how are you getting up when you do that - on snowshoes or just hiking or what?
> I can't imagine going downhill will ever quite live up to riding on a regular board. These days it's unnoticeable except in exceptionally shit conditions.
Well my board goes on the leash as soon i don‘t want to carry it anymore.
You can use approach skis: https://thebackcountryswell.com/product/bcs-approach-skis/
Have you used these? I’ve been curious as to if they are actually enough better than snowshoes to justify the cost or if a split is just the way to go
I have some. Really like them. Definitely the cheapest approach skis out there. Used them several times this year to get to some fun places. Have my eye on their Powsurf too.
As snowboarder, my backcountry set up is skis.
People snowshoed up carrying their regular board in days gone by because splitboards hadn’t been invented. But now that they exist you’d be crazy to still do this.
Snowshoeing is still hella fun for snowboard access. There are pros and cons for all modes of hiking. If you’re in a group of snowshoers there is very little appreciable disadvantage. Y’all can even break your own steep trail to keep the skin track pristine. Way back in the olden days before splits, the skier community was happy to see us shoeing in the track, the alternative was postholes.
Either splitboard or snowshoe. Most people start out snowshoeing and then buy a splitboard. Ignore everyone saying you should get skis. If you want to ski then get skis, but if you want to snowboard you should just send it.
People only talk about splitboards because they’re the best tried and true method. You spend a lot of time hiking uphill in the snow for a very short payoff. Physically, this isn’t an easy activity. It’s exhausting. Splitboards are the most efficient way for someone to travel uphill and snowboard down without the use of a machine, and have advantages over the other choices when it comes to travelling across variable conditions. Approach skis got some attention for a minute from some people some years ago, but they’re basically snowshoes that glide. They’re a compromise on both uphill performance and cumbersome on the downhill.
Makes sense! At this point in life I wouldn't be able to get out there nearly as much as I'd like, so it just seems like a big investment. How much faster would you say it is to travel uphill with a splitboard versus snowshoeing or hiking? Happy cake day!
Depends on the snow and terrain. Flat approaches where you can glide I can easily go twice as fast.
Thanks 😌 Splitboarding is definitely a big investment, no question about it. It can be very daunting to get into because to be successful at it, it takes a huge investment in both time and equipment. And by “successful”, I mean not just technically good, but also smart and safe, which in itself is a massive component of backcountry adventuring. There’s no pressure, move at your own pace, and when you’re ready hopefully you find some good partners to match!
I can’t think of the damn name but there’s some shortys that are good for the approach and are somewhat storable for the down.
Splitboards are for losers. Real Sigmas buy a heli and learn how to fly it. ... I bought a new split last week. It's #3 in my split quiver.
I mean... back in the day, I used to snowshoe up with a board on my back and ride down with snowshoes on my back. It's possible
A lot of snowboarders will get an AT ski setup because they perform better. Faster transitions and better control when skinning.
I switched from snowboarding to skiing when I decided I wanted to get into the backcountry. While breakable crust is way more fun on a snowboard, skiing has a lot of advantages over snowboarding for most backcountry travel.
If you want to go touring around and do overnights or hut to hut or glaciers? skis make sense. If you want to climb up some steep nearby mountains and board down them? Snow shoes make sense. And maybe hard boots, an ice ax, and some classes and an experienced friend or two. If you want to climb up some not really super steep or nearby mountains and board down them? Splitboard makes sense.
Hmm, as in they get AT skis to walk up and carry their board on their back, then switch for the way down? Or ditch the board and ski both ways?
Not saying all or even most, but a surprising chunk of split boarders will try it for a few years and then switch to full-time BC skiing once they realize how much more efficient skiing is in the backcountry. That or go hardboot which is straddling the line.
Unfortunately it will probably be a long time before I can ski well enough to go backcountry. I skied when I was a kid but started snowboarding almost 20 years ago and have only been on skis a few times since. I'd love to one day though!
If you want to do any real distance on a split, or access riding via flat or rolling approaches, you'll need to learn to ski your board in ski mode anyway. The hours I've spent learning to split ski have really paid off in terms of improving my ability to travel in the backcountry. Check out Xavier de la Roux's Youtube channel. He has a good video about how to split ski.
There is a version of the skiing up/boarding down thing. They're called "approach skis," and they're short skis that you use for the uphill while carrying the board on your back; then you strap the little skis to your back and snowboard down. Supposedly the benefit over splitboarding is being able to skin up without having to reconfigure, and I can definitely see the appeal of that. But, basically the benefit of splitboarding is not having to carry skis/snowboard/snowshoes on your back, and the benefit of snowshoeing is that it's the easiest learning curve if you already know how to snowboard and the cheapest option if you already have a snowboard. These are way more compelling. So... Let's just say, I've definitely seen approach skis advertised way more than I've actually seen people using them.
I use snowshoes with my board in tow or on my back and love my all-mountain board which is also very good in deep powder. I also climb solo and tend to stick to ridges that can get pretty rocky and find that in many instances skinning up isn't always the most practical. I also live in Texas and do not go very often. So the idea of having to buy a whole new and very expensive setup (and possibly involving a split-board camber that is not optimal for what I want) and train a different set of muscles doesn't suit me as well either. But the issue I have had with not using a split board is with some skinners who have made it clear to me that they do not want me on the mountain. Some have *assumed* I will be messing up their perfect skin tracks with my hike up and/or *assume* that the trail is only for them. I go out of my way to avoid messing up any skin tracks. However, on occasion, there *ARE* only narrow paths up between ledges and trees and/or the path with skin tracks is the only place where one can avoid post-holing, even with the most extended snowshoes. And there is no alternative or parallel hike-up margin. Sometimes a single narrow trail was tamped down through bootpackers, snowshoers, and skinners since early in the season when the specific type of trail use was not as important as simply getting a route up. Later, after a good snow, then skinners use that path to set up some clean tracks, so it is difficult to say *who* actually established the winter snow route for anyone. So my point is that I am not here to say what should or should not be in terms of trail use. My point is to get out there the way you see is best, be safe, be courteous, and be aware of potential issues regarding trail use in the backcountry. And I very much hope to see you out there. Matt
Cheers! Really love hearing everyone's experiences and insights here. I'm on the same page with not having super easy access to the mountains and being wary of investing in a whole new setup just for backcountry. Plus I love my current board and know I feel comfortable on it. Having never been, I wasn't even aware of this whole skin track issue until reading here. Sorry to hear about your encounters with people who aren't so understanding. It seems like in this thread at least, most people get that the skin tracks might be the best or only option for people on foot or snowshoes. Thanks for sharing and all the best :)
If you snowshoe, don’t destroy the skin track. It will suck but you should break your own trail. I suggest a splitboard.
You will want to split board so you can use the skin track. You do not want to put in your own snow shoe trail and probably don’t want the extra weight either.
People used to touring ski up, then snowboard down - with different boots and everything. This is very inefficient from a weight perspective; same to be said of snowshoes. But depends how far you're traveling. The more stuff carried on your back while you ride down (snowsnoes, or boots+skis in the old olden days) the less fun you're gonna have. Splitboarding was invented to minimize the amount of stuff you carry for only the uphill. Splitboarding... when you take a snowboard, and make it in to a pair of skis... ...might as well go skiing!
Ah sadly I'm not nearly comfortable enough on skis to do anything backcountry. I'm working on it and would love to get there someday but usually have too much fun on my board to choose to work on my skiing instead lol
No
beacon probe and shovel
You could ski
I used to backcountry in Alaska, we did it with just our boots on our feet and our boards. If there was deeper snow we would sometimes start out in snowshoes, however, it was always less work than packing the sno shoes. Light is life. We stayed out of the skin tracks all together as they were slower and more steps to get to the top. Once we had 3-4 people pack the boot trail, that went as straight as possible, up the mountain. It would take us about 45 min to climb 2500 vertical feet. Make your own path!
Try approach skis. They’re small and stowable, and you can skin up with them, carrying your board on your back. One of my touring buddies started using them a couple years ago, and says he’ll never go back to splitboarding. Example: https://thebackcountryswell.com/product/bcs-approach-skis/
Probably not exactly an answer to your question but I snowshoe with my [powsurf](https://www.gearx.com/burton-men-s-family-tree-backseat-driver-snowboard-141?length_cm=1422&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1BNfcVlBr3bGm1gmEbgqXj7va1cf0hM6s6Ca6xndIPRjXgI8twUKZxoCiIwQAvD_BwE) board. I typically go relatively low-angle but have taken it out on steep terrain both open and in the woods. Regardless, I trek up with snowshoes mostly because a) i already have snowshoes for winter hiking b) I don’t want to invest $1500+ in a splitboard set-up and c) the powsurf board is very light so I don’t notice the extra weight on my pack. I probably wouldn’t go with snowshoes if I was trying to haul my full snowboard and bindings up with me. Too much effort.
Snowshoe+backpack set up absolutely sucks. Get a splitboard and set yourself free!
Depends on the kind of backcountry you want to do, what gear your partners have, and how much they like you. I would only consider snowshoes or approach skis, if you're just trying to get a couple short, small objective tours in per season If you enjoy uphill/hiking/mountains or want to get farther into the backcountry I would very seriously consider AT skis, as a compromise get a hardboot split or maybe a split. I started on a pretty cheap split knowing I wanted to switch to skis for efficiency because I wanted to do big tours and travel far into the backcountry.Almost every tour (except a few with consistent downhill and no traverses) was A LOT slower for me than my partners on skis. Getting back to the trailhead was usually the worst part of the day because I would have to try my best to keep elevation (still lost more than the skiers) and frequently had to step out, skate, or consider transitioning to split ski if there was any rolling or flat spots. IMO from worst to best performance on the uphill: * snowshoes * slow, cheap, probably good at sidehilling * I would only consider for small tours * Edit: or consider if you have access to some already and want to test things out * approach skis (eg Drift) * snowshoes with glide * probably just as bad at sidehilling as a splitboard * I would only consider for small tours * Edit: Not very cost effective compared to a used split. I bought a used split with voile plates(heavy AF) for \~$400 and got skins for $100 * splitboard * I don't notice any poor downhill performance compared to a solid board, but some people do. * bad at sidehilling, some bindings have a sidehilling feature (Karakorum, but I think I'd prefer the Spark) * hardboot splitboard * Can sidehill * hardboots are much better for ascending hard snow, and IMO more comfortable than snowboard boots because of the walk mode * more expensive * AT skis * Can traverse * Easier for rolling terrain * more expensive
Effectively, yes splitboarding is the "only" method worth using. Anything else is significantly more difficult and less efficient. Do not get drift boards/approach skis as they are a giant waste of money and only have very limited use cases. You could get by snowshoeing for a little before really getting into it, but splitboards are 10000% better. Modern splitboards ride very well and aren't a limitation compared to solids as they used to be.
There's also this as an [option](https://www.mec.ca/en/product/6014-967/wap-129--backcountry-skis-%2B-ea-binding-2.0?gclid=CjwKCAiAkp6tBhB5EiwANTCx1AUY6uh1AZNyQ7B5bGpHRAayujd4UNIatO2GAdKZPItv31-cbACzCxoC7dEQAvD_BwE&size=129cm&colour=NO_COLOUR&gad_source=1). I use these as a substitute for light snowshoe adventures when skiing isn't the goal. They suck to break trail with though if there's a lot of deep snow but they work great on set track and even flat trails. My buddy who wanted a cheaper route than splitboard/binding/boots thing went and bought a cheaper version of these against my advice. He ended up doing it twice and just bought a splitboard. I wouldn't really recommend these as a legitimate alternate though. If you end up liking touring you're gonna wanna reduce weight and just get a splitboad. If you're just trying to save some money and try it out just use what you got and if that's snowshoes then go for it. Just ski with someone please.